From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jul 10 05:28:48 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AASla07970 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 05:28:47 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:28:18 +0200 Message-Id: <20020710102818.12546@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Welcome Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Welcome - this is just a test to check that things work. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 10 09:16:35 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AEGZa20088 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:16:35 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.10.2/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6AEGS300416 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:16:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6AEGSD05999; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:16:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:16:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020710101628.AAB5990@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] 9th Annual Tcl Conference registration now open Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The Tcl'2002 Conference, September 16-20, in Vancouver, BC, Canada, is now taking registrations. Tcl'2002 is a forum to: - bring together Tcl/Tk researchers and practitioners - publish and present current work involving Tcl/Tk - learn about the latest developments in Tcl/Tk - plan for future Tcl/Tk related developments The conference covers a full week, with two days of Tutorial Sessions and three days of Technical Sessions. Space is limited so register early! For more information, see . -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jul 10 10:53:08 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AFr6a25219; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:53:07 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: announce , Starkit Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:52:55 +0200 Message-Id: <20020710155255.25270@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack kick-off Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Starkits and Starpacks are two new names for existing concepts - "scripted documents" and "custom tclkits", respectively. Those last two terms are now obsolete, finished, dead. A quick summary, taken from http://wiki.tcl.tk/starkit: >A Starkit is a single file packaging of Tcl scripts, platform specific >compiled code and application data; designed to facilitate simple >deployment of cross platform applications. The name comes from STandAlone >Runtime. > >Starkits are interpreted using TclKit - a single file Tcl/Tk interpreter. >You will need a version of TclKit for each platform that you want to run >a Starkit on. Have a look at the TclKit download area where there are >versions for over a dozen platforms. > >A Starpack is a single (platform specific) executable file containing >both TclKit and a Starkit. They are useful when you want to deploy a >single executable for an application. Starpacks can be built ON any >platform supporting TclKit, FOR any platform supporting TclKit. > >The Starkit home page is http://www.equi4.com/starkit/ The runtime for all this is TclKit (now based on Tcl/Tk 8.4b1). The use and construction of starkits and starpacks has been simplified quite a bit in the past weeks, so if you're using sdx.bin, or kitten.bin, make sure to visit the above website and download the latest versions (several URLs have changed). In a day or two, I'll announce on comp.lang.tcl - but it should all be ready and working right now. Please test and yell if anything doesn't work as expected or if something on the website is not clear enough. There's bound to be some rough edges as everything transitions to the new names and setup... please help get things right. Somewhat tangential to this topic: if you're into wiki's, there's a new wiki *about* wikit development, at . It's still being set up - and, being a wiki, anyone can help do so. -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Jul 10 11:06:49 2002 Received: from smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AG6na26152 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:06:49 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17SJzK-000Loi-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:06:46 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020710170520.01b762e0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:06:46 +0100 To: Starkit From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack kick-off In-Reply-To: <20020710155255.25270@triqs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 05:52 PM 7/10/2002 +0200, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >Starkits and Starpacks are two new names for existing concepts - >"scripted documents" and "custom tclkits", respectively. Those last two >terms are now obsolete, finished, dead. > >A quick summary, taken from http://wiki.tcl.tk/starkit I don't see any reference to where I can download a starpack on that site! So it's a bit hard to get started. cheers, Vince. From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 10 11:16:48 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AGGma26762 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:16:48 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.10.2/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6AGGf313400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:16:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6AGGfu07794; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:16:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:16:41 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020710121641.AAB7785@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack kick-off In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20020710170520.01b762e0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> of Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:06:46 +0100 To: Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: One thing I discovered - when I visited and saw kitten.kit listed, I downloaded it - and found that it required a different tclkit than I had installed (mine was about a week old). -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jul 10 11:32:59 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AGWwa27848 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:32:58 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack kick-off Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:32:41 +0200 Message-Id: <20020710163242.6412@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020710121641.AAB7785@cas.org> References: <20020710121641.AAB7785@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >One thing I discovered - when I visited >and saw kitten.kit listed, I downloaded it - and found that it required >a different tclkit than I had installed (mine was about a week old). Yes... there's no way around this. Starkits no longer do a "package require scripdoc", they now do "package require starkit" (and for a reason: internally, several things have changed in the startup). So while old scripted docs still will work, everything built with the new version of sdx requires a new tclkit. I guess I should put a comment somewhere that in the tclkit you use puts $tcl_platform(vfs) must return "200207.004" or larger. This is exactly what I meant by rough edges... I see no way to avoid this. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 10 11:46:52 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AGkpa28744 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:46:51 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.10.2/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6AGkj322478 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:46:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6AGkj608504; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:46:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:46:45 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020710124644.AAB8488@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack kick-off In-Reply-To: <20020710163242.6412@triqs.com> of Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:32:41 +0200 To: Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If there's anything rough about this it would just be figuring out what needs said. It looks to me like the starkit wiki is a read only affair - is that right? Just wondering. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jul 11 05:26:27 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BAQQa08887 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:26:27 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:23:10 +0200 Message-Id: <20020711102310.26519@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Getting started Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The issue has come up in private email as to whether the new starkit/ starpack terms are easy to get started with. It's too confusing, I'm being told. I was under the impression that either of the following URLs were quite clear for newcomers (mostly Tcl people for now, I'd assume): http://wiki.tcl.tk/starkit http://www.equi4.com/starkit/ And I know some people reacted very positively, but now I'm wondering whether it's good enough, really. I'm about to announce starkits on comp.lang.tcl, but if there is a way to reduce confusion further, *now* is the time to get it right - i.e. *before* people start reading and browsing about all this. Do the new starkit web pages need to be simplified, or extended with specific instructions, or more cross-linked, or simply re-ordered, or perhaps merged further? Please let me know - I'm afraid that by now I'm unable to reflect more on this. This is a one-time opportunity to get a clear message out, and help people start off with a suitable model in their minds of what this is all about. -jcw From steve@digital-smarties.com Thu Jul 11 05:31:44 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@i219-066.nv.iinet.net.au [203.59.219.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6BAVha09145 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:31:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 5996 invoked by uid 8); 11 Jul 2002 10:31:41 -0000 Received: from ibook.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "[192.168.1.3]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdm5LKEn; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:31:30 EDT From: Steve Landers To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:31:28 +0800 Message-Id: <20020711103128.13778@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20020711102310.26519@triqs.com> References: <20020711102310.26519@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, >The issue has come up in private email as to whether the new starkit/ >starpack terms are easy to get started with. It's too confusing, I'm >being told. May I ask who said this? Steve From steve@digital-smarties.com Thu Jul 11 05:32:44 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@i219-066.nv.iinet.net.au [203.59.219.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6BAWha09227 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:32:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 6015 invoked by uid 8); 11 Jul 2002 10:32:41 -0000 Received: from ibook.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "[192.168.1.3]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpd6j6pel; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:32:39 EDT From: Steve Landers To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:32:37 +0800 Message-Id: <20020711103237.25013@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20020711103128.13778@mail.digital-smarties.com> References: <20020711103128.13778@mail.digital-smarties.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC >>The issue has come up in private email as to whether the new starkit/ >>starpack terms are easy to get started with. It's too confusing, I'm >>being told. > >May I ask who said this? I should qualify this - what type of person? A person familiar with SD's or someone coming new to the concepts. Just trying to get a handle on the issue? Steve From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Jul 11 05:39:59 2002 Received: from smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BAdwa09689 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:39:58 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17SbLs-0003jw-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:39:12 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020711113305.029014d0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:39:12 +0100 To: Starkit From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started In-Reply-To: <20020711103128.13778@mail.digital-smarties.com> References: <20020711102310.26519@triqs.com> <20020711102310.26519@triqs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 06:31 PM 7/11/2002 +0800, Steve Landers wrote: >May I ask who said this? It was me. The speed and ease with which one can go to the starkit main web page and get a tclkit and one impressive starkit on your hard drive (and running), is not ideal, IMHO. Here's an excerpt from my email to JCW: >>> Nearly. Here's my problem. I go to http://www.equi4.com/starkit/ and I see a bunch of links, so, I click on the first one ('Purpose'), and I can swiftly get down a tangled web of very detailed information. Hopefully I am sensible and just go 'back' to the toplevel and click on the next link ("Where to find starkits"), and I get whisked away to an archive with millions of starkits --- all very impressive, but rather bewildering and information overloading. Hopefully I go 'back' again (twice), and then click on "How to use a starkit", that hopefully takes me to download a tclkit but then I have to decide to go back and find a starkit. But which one? There's just so much information there. I think you really should add an "idiots' guide", or "getting started" page which doesn't overload you with information. On the very first page add a link near the top saying "Never used a starkit? Click to test drive one right now" or something like that... >>> Once people are over that first hurdle, I think the website is very very good. cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jul 11 05:50:36 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BAoZa10596 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:50:35 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:49:59 +0200 Message-Id: <20020711104959.8806@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20020711113305.029014d0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> References: <5.1.1.5.0.20020711113305.029014d0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: >Nearly. Here's my problem. I go to http://www.equi4.com/starkit/ and I >see a bunch of links, so, I click on the first one ('Purpose'), and I can >swiftly get down a tangled web of very detailed information. Hopefully I >am sensible and just go 'back' to the toplevel and click on the next link >("Where to find starkits"), and I get whisked away to an archive with >millions of starkits --- all very impressive, but rather bewildering and [...] Bingo, it took me a while to see this but you're 100% right. There's also the fact that wikit has no sidebar, so there's no way to keep some sort of global context on the page. I guess a "quick start" of some sort with precise instructions can indeed solve this. Plus a more careful ordering of links, and perhaps more cross-linking at the end of pages. So the next question is: what example to use? Preferably pure Tcl, so it works on any platform. How about Richard Suchenwirth's zoomable world map? -jcw From steve@digital-smarties.com Thu Jul 11 05:52:45 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@i219-066.nv.iinet.net.au [203.59.219.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6BAqia10807 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:52:44 -0500 Received: (qmail 6098 invoked by uid 8); 11 Jul 2002 10:52:42 -0000 Received: from ibook.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "[192.168.1.3]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdsVOBmN; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:52:39 EDT From: Steve Landers To: Vince Darley , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:52:37 +0800 Message-Id: <20020711105237.3956@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20020711113305.029014d0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> References: <5.1.1.5.0.20020711113305.029014d0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Vince, >There's just so much information there. I think you really should add an >"idiots' guide", or "getting started" page which doesn't overload you with >information. ... >Once people are over that first hurdle, I think the website is very very good. OK - I see where you are coming from. To paraphrase - it's not a fundamental issue about content/concepts but rather presentation. No arguments from me :-) Steve From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Thu Jul 11 13:27:13 2002 Received: from rilex06.riley.army.mil (emh1.riley.army.mil [144.246.219.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BIRCa13740 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:27:12 -0500 Received: by emh1.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:25:24 -0500 Message-ID: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EE0@rilex11.riley.army.mil> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:30:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_000_01C22909.1304A070" Subject: [Starkit] Starkits or SD's for retail distribution. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_000_01C22909.1304A070 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C22909.1304A070" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C22909.1304A070 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I got a hint from Cameron Laird that TclKit has a way of using an encryption-key to either allow, or not, execution of a SD, that was before I read about StarKits. Same question still applies. Commercial retail distribution and protecting the source code? Or any way to not allow it to be unwrapped?. Michael E. Collins DOIM, Senior Network Tech. 200 Henry Ave. Ft. Riley, KS 66442 mike.collins@riley.army.mil Phone: 785-239-3662 DSN: 856-3662 Fax: 785-239-0555 Online Fax: 785-239-6660 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C22909.1304A070 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I = got a hint=20 from Cameron Laird that TclKit has a way of using an encryption-key to = either=20 allow, or not, execution of a SD, that was before I read about=20 StarKits.
 
Same question=20 still applies. Commercial retail distribution and protecting the source = code? Or=20 any way to not allow it to be unwrapped?.
 
 
 
Michael E. Collins
DOIM, Senior Network = Tech.
200 Henry Ave.
Ft. Riley, KS 66442
mike.collins@riley.army.mil<= /A>
Phone: = 785-239-3662         DSN:=20 856-3662
Fax:=20 785-239-0555          =   =20 Online Fax:=20 785-239-6660
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v482) From: Mark Roseman To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EE0@rilex11.riley.army.mil> Message-Id: <78148611-94FE-11D6-97C0-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.482) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g6BIkEa15352 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'd posted this on comp.lang.tcl, but it might have got buried in the thread. Here's an easy way to protect your sources - use TclPro's "procomp" utility to generate byte-compiled versions of your code. Then pack those into the StarKit, as well as the "tbcload" shared libraries for any platforms you want to support. Load the appropriate tbcload on startup, and then source in your byte-compiled code. Mark On Thursday, July 11, 2002, at 02:30 PM, Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > I got a hint from Cameron Laird that TclKit has a way of using an > encryption-key to either allow, or not, execution of a SD, that was > before I read about StarKits. >   > Same question still applies. Commercial retail distribution and > protecting the source code? Or any way to not allow it to be unwrapped?. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Roseman mark@markroseman.com http://www.markroseman.com From eduardo@bfi.com.cu Thu Jul 11 19:08:17 2002 Received: from astaro.bfi.com.cu ([63.170.172.252]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6C08Ea32653 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:08:15 -0500 Received: (qmail 22674 invoked by uid 505); 11 Jul 2002 20:19:35 -0000 Received: from eduardo@bfi.com.cu by astaro.bfi.com.cu with qmail-scanner- http://www.astaro.com (Version 3.0build 135|Known records: 56050. . Clean.); 11/07/2002 20:19:28 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.bfi.com.cu) (172.16.0.4) by astaro.bfi.com.cu with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 20:19:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 486 invoked by uid 505); 12 Jul 2002 00:07:58 -0000 Received: from eduardo@bfi.com.cu by mail.bfi.com.cu with qmail-scanner-0.96 (. Clean. Processed in 1.770131 secs); 12 Jul 2002 00:07:58 -0000 Received: from segbfi.bfi.com.cu (HELO bfi.com.cu) (10.1.0.4) by 0 with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 00:07:56 -0000 Received: from SEGBFI/SpoolDir by bfi.com.cu (Mercury 1.47); 11 Jul 02 20:07:56 -0500 Received: from SpoolDir by SEGBFI (Mercury 1.47); 11 Jul 02 20:07:54 -0500 From: "Eduardo Rodriguez Abreu" Organization: Banco Financiero Internacional S.A To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:07:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v3.12a) Message-ID: <68C51A175A6@bfi.com.cu> Subject: [Starkit] Not found tk command Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello Tcl'ers, I have a problem migrating an application to a new .kit project. In fact didn't find a tkTabToWindow command. I'm using tclkit-win32.upx.exe to Win NT platform. Any suggestion about this ? Thanks in advance. Ed From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jul 11 19:15:54 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6C0Fra00498 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:15:54 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Not found tk command Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:15:00 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712001500.25039@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Eduardo Rodriguez Abreu wrote: > Hello Tcl'ers, I have a problem migrating an application to a new >.kit project. In fact didn't find a tkTabToWindow command. > I'm using tclkit-win32.upx.exe to Win NT platform. > Any suggestion about this ? (This is probably going to become a FAQ) Have you done a "package require Tk"? -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jul 11 19:22:57 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6C0Mua00898 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:22:56 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits or SD's for retail distribution. Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:22:01 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712002201.29659@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EE0@rilex11.riley.army.mil> References: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EE0@rilex11.riley.army.mil> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: >I got a hint from Cameron Laird that TclKit has a way of using an >encryption-key to either allow, or not, execution of a SD, that was before I >read about StarKits. > >Same question still applies. Commercial retail distribution and protecting >the source code? Or any way to not allow it to be unwrapped?. Until Mark Roseman's very recent success with tbcloader, the best answer I could give was essentially that you can include an extension such as Blowfish to encrypt, and perhaps another C extension to bury the key and eval a source script given to it. Nothing is failsafe, but the above approach has been used in a few projects. Now that bytecodes seem to work and be doable (not sure how easy it is to get all the pieces working), that is clearly a better scheme to try to get right. With bytecodes, a few things that are in source code simply no longer exist in the deployed system (comments, local var names) - so even reverse compilation would be partial at best. -jcw From dgporter@erols.com Thu Jul 11 22:07:50 2002 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6C37oa04616; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:07:50 -0500 Received: from 66-44-2-148.s656.apx1.lnh.md.dialup.rcn.com ([66.44.2.148] helo=there) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with smtp (Exim 3.35 #5) id 17Sqmb-0000yq-00; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 23:07:50 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Don Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Not found tk command Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 23:03:33 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] References: <20020712001500.25039@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020712001500.25039@triqs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Eduardo Rodriguez Abreu wrote: > >.kit project. In fact didn't find a tkTabToWindow command. Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > (This is probably going to become a FAQ) Yes. > Have you done a "package require Tk"? ...but not that one. Starkit is based on Tcl/Tk 8.4. Tk 8.3 defined a private command [tkTabToWindow]. Tk 8.4 no longer does. It was never a public interface, and when you use private interfaces you risk getting caught by changes like this. Quick workaround. Add this to your script: tk::unsupported::ExposePrivateCommand tkTabToWindow That will restore the existence of the [tkTabToWindow] command. If you've used other private commands you will need to do the same for each of them. Longer term, you should re-write your script so that it doesn't make use of Tk's private commands. If you find that this is too limiting, and access to the private commands is necessary, then get to work making a TIP proposal for Tk to provide that functionality in a public way: http://purl.org/tcl/tip/ -- | Don Porter dgporter@erols.com | | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" | | -- Adam West as BATMAN | |______________________________________________________________________| From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Fri Jul 12 03:37:53 2002 Received: from meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (mail@meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.57]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6C8bra14836 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:37:53 -0500 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.04) id 17Svw0-0007Bi-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:37:52 +0200 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 17Svvz-0005UV-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:37:51 +0200 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6C8bph28988 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:37:51 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:37:51 +0200 (MEST) From: Guenther Fischer To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, first of all thank's to JWC - great work. And now my questions: 1. in kitten I found so many extensions: - what is the best way to find documentations about it, how to use it, examples ... 2. if I want to use only one ore two packages from it ind my own warped file - what to do: sdx unwrap kitten.kit cp -r kitten.kit/lib/ myprog.vfs/lib and only a package require in my script? 3. I want to use jpeg's in my application - there was some trouble with using libjpeg in older tclkit's Is there a better chance now? Can we put it into kitten? Thank's -- ~Guenther Fischer From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 12 05:29:16 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CATFa19572 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 05:29:15 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:28:32 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712102832.21591@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Guenther Fischer wrote: >1. in kitten I found so many extensions: > - what is the best way to find documentations about it, > how to use it, examples ... Ah, yes, I knew someone would bring it up... For now, all I can suggest is to go to the web, google, etc. Kitten is a proof-of-concept package. It works fine, but it was mostly done to find out what technical issues there would be (not many, in fact). There are plans to address things like docs, demos, examples, test suites - but for now it's not much more than that. >2. if I want to use only one ore two packages from it ind my > own warped file - what to do: > sdx unwrap kitten.kit > cp -r kitten.kit/lib/ myprog.vfs/lib > and only a package require in my script? Exactly. >3. I want to use jpeg's in my application - there was some trouble > with using libjpeg in older tclkit's > Is there a better chance now? Can we put it into kitten? The trouble has always been loading shared libs which depend on other shared libs AFAIK. That can be worked around by doing things like: catch { load /some/path/libjpeg.so } Which will fail but leaves the lib loaded anyway - after that other extensions (I assume Img) can be loaded and should link properly. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jul 12 06:08:51 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CB8oa21181 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:08:51 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6CB8iO21057 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:08:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6CB8il18570; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:08:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:08:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020712070843.AAB18559@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... In-Reply-To: <20020712102832.21591@triqs.com> of Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:28:32 +0200 To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>3. I want to use jpeg's in my application - there was some trouble >> with using libjpeg in older tclkit's >> Is there a better chance now? Can we put it into kitten? > >The trouble has always been loading shared libs which depend on other >shared libs AFAIK. That can be worked around by doing things like: > catch { load /some/path/libjpeg.so } >Which will fail but leaves the lib loaded anyway - after that other >extensions (I assume Img) can be loaded and should link properly. I don't recall hearing about this. Is this something that occurs when shared library dependencies are not expressed at link time, or is it a general problem with dynamic library loading? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 12 06:24:46 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CBOia21958 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:24:44 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 13:23:54 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712112355.19459@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020712070843.AAB18559@cas.org> References: <20020712070843.AAB18559@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >>The trouble has always been loading shared libs which depend on other >>shared libs AFAIK. That can be worked around by doing things like: >> catch { load /some/path/libjpeg.so } >>Which will fail but leaves the lib loaded anyway - after that other >>extensions (I assume Img) can be loaded and should link properly. > >I don't recall hearing about this. Is this something that occurs when >shared library dependencies are not expressed at link time, or is it >a general problem with dynamic library loading? It's an issue that only rears it head with VFS loading: - extension A needs shlib B (not necessarily a Tcl ext) - normally, the dynamic loader "just does it" - in VFS, load of A means: copy to temp real file, *then* load - unfortunately, VFS has no idea that A needs B - so when the dynamic loaded gets A, it can't find B The workaround is based on the fact that "load anything.so" will fail if it's not a Tcl extension, but the shared lib will be left loaded. So what you do to force things is: - "catch { load B }" - it fails, but B does end up loaded - "load A" - not succeeds, because B is present and resolving syms In both lines above, VFS will copy to temp, load, and clean up. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jul 12 06:32:46 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CBWka22385 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:32:46 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6CBWeO25499 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:32:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6CBWds18944; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:32:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:32:39 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020712073239.AAB18935@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... In-Reply-To: <20020712070843.AAB18559@cas.org> of Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:08:44 -0400 (EDT) To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At least on SunOS, dlopen() will search the directory for all dependencies that a shared library has. I would think that Windows does something similar. If all the .so files were written out before the first dlopen, would that take care of things? It might mean that one had to 'register' all the .so files during the creation of the starkit so that tclkit knew where they all were. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 12 06:48:12 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CBmBa23177 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:48:11 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 13:47:18 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712114718.26907@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020712073239.AAB18935@cas.org> References: <20020712073239.AAB18935@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >At least on SunOS, dlopen() will search the directory for all dependencies >that a shared library has. I would think that Windows does something >similar. If all the .so files were written out before the first dlopen, >would that take care of things? It might mean that one had to 'register' >all the .so files during the creation of the starkit so that tclkit knew >where they all were. That would be an option. But it would also mean writing all of them out, because one does not know which depends on which. Then again, if that dependency were explicit, it might indeed work nicely. perhaps a global array with entries: if load A, then please make sure B and C are on the disk too? Yep, might simplify the logic. It means that one could refine existing pkgIndex.tcl packages, such that when trying to satisfy a "package require" it'd define such dep's, then source/load. Needs a bit more thought with multi-platform, bet then again so does the load mechanism itself. -jcw From mark@markroseman.com Fri Jul 12 07:07:12 2002 Received: from fep8.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CC7Ba24188 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:07:11 -0500 Received: from localhost (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep8.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7FAC3714; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:07:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:07:10 -0400 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits or SD's for retail distribution. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v482) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Nicolas Boretos From: Mark Roseman In-Reply-To: <3D2E8B6A.9080706@maich.gr> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.482) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday, July 12, 2002, at 03:55 AM, Nicolas Boretos wrote: > Is there any tbcload available for the Mac? Last I checked (year and a > half)there was not. you bet, see http://sourceforge.net/projects/tclpro i've been using the os x version here. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Roseman mark@markroseman.com http://www.markroseman.com From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 12 07:50:10 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CCo9a26498 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:50:09 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit, kitten, ... Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:49:07 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712124907.1942@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: To follow up on my own post: Guenther Fischer wrote: >2. if I want to use only one ore two packages from it ind my > own warped file - what to do: > sdx unwrap kitten.kit > cp -r kitten.kit/lib/ myprog.vfs/lib > > and only a package require in my script? You can probably do it even easier from Tcl nowadays (untested): source kitten.kit file copy kitten.kit/lib/ myprog.vfs/lib The logic being that "source kitten.kit" leaves it VFS-mounted. So from within Tcl you can do a recursive file copy. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 12 10:57:24 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CFvNa04604; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:57:23 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Metakit , Starkit Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 17:55:39 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712155539.13891@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Away 19-7 through 20-8 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Just a little note to say that I'll be away from July 19th through August 20th. Arrangements are being made to take care of the basics, like website access emergencies, but for a while you'll be far more likely to find me on faraway beaches, mountains, treetops, deserts, and seas... than on the net :) -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Fri Jul 12 15:55:41 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CKtfa21993 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 15:55:41 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id g6CKsnn26934 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 15:54:58 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 15:55:41 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0031_01C229BC.9321C6D0" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [Starkit] TclKit crashes on NT Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0031_01C229BC.9321C6D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I *think* this is the proper place for tclKit questions? If not, just point me elsewhere... I am finding it quite easy to generate "crash on exit" issues with the latest tclKit (for tcl 8.4b1 containing mk4tcl version 2.4.7). Now, these aren't serious issues as they seem to be caused only by my misuse of some of the mk4tcl commands, but should I be getting on-exit crashes? As an example, from time to time I tend to reference a view by it's name (like "user") instead of its path (like "db.user"). If I do this: mk::view info user instead of this: mk::view info db.user nothing is returned - including an error of any sort. I can go about my business OK, but when I exit, I am presented with the dreaded Dr. Watson error dialog stating that "An application error has occurred and an application error log is being generated - tclkit-win32.up.exe - access violation". I can reproduce this simply by opening a new database, creating a view, (incorrectly) using the mk::view info command (as above), and exiting. I think other "misuses" also cause similar problems, but this one was easily reproduced. Also, these aren't unique to the latest tclkit, the NT version has had this problem since I have used it - (for about 1 year or so?). What do you think? Thanks, Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA (800) 523-4744 jgodfrey@optinest.com ------=_NextPart_000_0031_01C229BC.9321C6D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I = *think* this is=20 the proper place for tclKit questions?  If not, just point me=20 elsewhere...
 
I am = finding it=20 quite easy to generate "crash on exit" issues with the latest = tclKit  (for=20 tcl 8.4b1 containing mk4tcl version 2.4.7).  Now, these aren't = serious=20 issues as they seem to be caused only by my misuse of some of the mk4tcl = commands, but should I be getting on-exit crashes?  As an example, = from=20 time to time I tend to reference a view by it's name (like "user") = instead of=20 its path (like "db.user").
 
If I = do=20 this:
 
mk::view info=20 user
 
instead of=20 this:
 
mk::view info=20 db.user
 
nothing is returned=20 - including an error of any sort.  I can go about my business OK, = but when=20 I exit, I am presented with the dreaded Dr. Watson error dialog stating = that "An=20 application error has occurred and an application error log is being=20 generated  - tclkit-win32.up.exe - access = violation".
 
I can = reproduce this=20 simply by opening a new database, creating a view, (incorrectly) using = the=20 mk::view info command (as above), and exiting.
 
I = think other=20 "misuses" also cause similar problems, but this one was easily = reproduced. =20 Also, these aren't unique to the latest tclkit, the NT version has had = this=20 problem since I have used it - (for about 1 year or so?).  What do = you=20 think?
 
Thanks,

Jeff Godfrey
Optimation USA
(800)=20 523-4744
jgodfrey@optinest.com =

 

 
------=_NextPart_000_0031_01C229BC.9321C6D0-- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 12 16:21:47 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6CLLja23325 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 16:21:46 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKit crashes on NT Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 23:21:25 +0200 Message-Id: <20020712212125.32601@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: >I *think* this is the proper place for tclKit questions? If not, just point >me elsewhere... Perfect spot, as far as I'm concerned. >I am finding it quite easy to generate "crash on exit" issues with the >latest tclKit (for tcl 8.4b1 containing mk4tcl version 2.4.7). Now, these >aren't serious issues as they seem to be caused only by my misuse of some of >the mk4tcl commands, but should I be getting on-exit crashes? As an >example, from time to time I tend to reference a view by it's name (like >"user") instead of its path (like "db.user"). > >If I do this: > >mk::view info user > >instead of this: > >mk::view info db.user > >nothing is returned - including an error of any sort. I can go about my >business OK, but when I exit, I am presented with the dreaded Dr. Watson >error dialog stating that "An application error has occurred and an >application error log is being generated - tclkit-win32.up.exe - access >violation". Thanks, you have found a bug which is probably easily fixed. Hmm, this delayed behavior might explain quite a few crashes in the past, that would make this a really good catch. >I can reproduce this simply by opening a new database, creating a view, >(incorrectly) using the mk::view info command (as above), and exiting. Will look into it. >I think other "misuses" also cause similar problems, but this one was easily >reproduced. Also, these aren't unique to the latest tclkit, the NT version >has had this problem since I have used it - (for about 1 year or so?). What >do you think? Please post more of these whenever you can. They are bugs in error handling, not quite as critical, but extremely useful to get right. A crash caused by scripts is a booboo in my book. -jcw From will@wjduquette.com Sat Jul 13 10:54:10 2002 Received: from swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net (swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.123]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6DFsAa26923 for ; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 10:54:10 -0500 Received: from pool0053.cvx12-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.226.53] helo=duquette.wjduquette.com) by swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17TPDl-00001v-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 08:54:09 -0700 Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20020713155857.030c7920@mail.wjduquette.com> X-Sender: duquette@mail.wjduquette.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 15:59:22 +0000 To: "starkit-equi4.com" From: Will Duquette Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] SDX/Startool vs. All-In-One Tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Howdy! I've been discussing a few issues with Jean-Claude, and he asked if I'd bring them to the mailing list. To begin, I suggested that a better name for SDX would be "Startool", that being the thing you use to create Starkits and Starpacks. He didn't disagree, but passed along some comments from somebody else suggesting that SDX should go away altogether; the functionality should be rolled into Tclkit instead. I have some concerns about that, mostly involving the use of Tclkit/Tclkitsh as a drop-in replacement for wish/tclsh. That seems good to me. If SDX is wrapped up in Tclkit, that will affect the command line, and might hinder this. For example, JCW suggested that "Tclkit -wrap" might invoke the SDX functionality. Question: wish normally reads a bunch of X11 options from the command line before the script gets a chance at them. Does Tclkit do this? And if so, when? When you say "package require Tk"? I presume it doesn't do this if you're using it run a non-GUI script. With wish, it's always been the case that Tk gets first crack at the command line. With tclsh, that's not the case. If I'm writing a non-GUI app as a Starkit (and I could easily deliver Expand that way) then I want Expand to have first crack at the command line. So, in a nutshell, I'm concerned about the affect on the invocation semantics of having the SDX functionality delivered in this way. It might not, practically speaking be a problem, in which case I'd drop my objections. Will Duquette --------------------------------------------------- Will Duquette | Jane Duquette will@wjduquette.com | jane@wjduquette.com --------------------------------------------------- Ex Libris Book Reviews -- http://www.wjduquette.com From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jul 13 12:56:47 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6DHuga29255 for ; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 12:56:43 -0500 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "starkit-equi4.com" Subject: Re: [Starkit] SDX/Startool vs. All-In-One Tclkit Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 19:54:52 +0200 Message-Id: <20020713175452.1377@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20020713155857.030c7920@mail.wjduquette.com> References: <5.0.2.1.0.20020713155857.030c7920@mail.wjduquette.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Will Duquette wrote: [...] >For example, JCW suggested that "Tclkit -wrap" might invoke the SDX >functionality. My preference that a tclkit without args do something other than bring up an interactive tcl session is that this does not work well for end-users. In the case of 2-file deployment (a starkit + tclkit), launching that second one, say by clicking on the wrong file, even just accidentally, creates a support issue ("what do I do now?"). It's not as far-fetched as it seems - an entire company, i.e. Apple, was built on the concept of *not* having a command line in end user contexts. Even today, Mac OSX (which is Unix) buries the command shell in a "Utilities" directory. Even just having tclkit complain and exit when launched without args would be greatly preferable, from where I stand. The fact that I haven't done it yet, is mostly because there have been more ideas on what to make it do on startup, and until that is sorted out, I'd rather not close off any avenues. Keep in mind that starkits, although now presented to the Tcl community, are really aimed far far further - I expect that perhaps a year from now, there will be tons of packages distributed to the masses with this sort of technology inside (simply because Tcl/Tk can be such an effective way to build so many things). It's already happening. The success of this may never become apparent, because the whole point is to *hide* Tcl from end users. Do you care who manufactured the parts of your car engine? I don't, I buy a car as a brand - it's under-the-hood, and I'm grateful. It'll be "Tcl Inside", and having a Tcl prompt pop up is the last thing many of us would want to see, I expect. I have to admit that the relevance of all this is relative, since starpacks are one way to get rid of the whole issue. So much for this micro-rant :) The other argument, which a few others have brought up, is that getting tclkit and then having to figure out where to get sdx (Startool *is* a nice name, btw) just adds to the hassle. As time passes, misplacing sdx on one's local disk may again become a minor issue. If at least wrapping is all-in-one, it'd cover the key usage scenario for developers. One could make a case that unwrapping should *not* be part of tclkit, btw. >Question: wish normally reads a bunch of X11 options from the command line >before the script gets a chance at them. Does Tclkit do this? And if so, >when? When you say "package require Tk"? I presume it doesn't do this if >you're using it run a non-GUI script. I think it does this when "package require Tk" is executed. >So, in a nutshell, I'm concerned about the affect on the invocation semantics >of having the SDX functionality delivered in this way. It might not, >practically speaking be a problem, in which case I'd drop my objections. Note that your may well have pointed to the solution for all this. An embedded sdx-type function such as "-wrap" does not need a GUI, it just wraps and exits. So the two scenarios can probably coexist without any problem at all. Last point to note is that the whole issue of "-display" options being gobbled up by Tk_Init is largely untested. TclKit's startup is still a bit rough, and may need bug-fixing to get everything right. Once it is decided what that is :) -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Jul 15 05:06:10 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6FA69a05294 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:06:09 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6FA62O14030 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:06:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6FA62U27408; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:06:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:06:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020715060602.AAB27374@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] SDX/Startool vs. All-In-One Tclkit In-Reply-To: <20020713175452.1377@triqs.com> of Sat, 13 Jul 2002 19:54:52 +0200 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I myself find access to a tcl interpreter in some easy form critical, since under MacOS 7, that's the only way so far I've been successful in getting Tcl applications to launch - start a tclkit, wait for a while until tclkit gets loaded and running, then at the tcl prompt source in the application. I also find myself using the tclkit interactive prompt on Windows to get things done on a regular basis and I occasionally test out tcl frags from comp.lang.tcl via my unix tclkit. So I sure would not want the ability to get to this to disappear altogether. And I know that's not being proposed - just that the way to get to the prompt change. If the command line interface to tclkit is going to evolve, perhaps adding a -console option or something is possible (with that being the default on a Mac). -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From nicolasb@maich.gr Mon Jul 15 05:25:40 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6FAPda08257 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:25:39 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Mon Jul 15 13:51:40 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D32A3C7.1060808@maich.gr> Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:28:23 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] SDX/Startool vs. All-In-One Tclkit References: <20020715060602.AAB27374@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I myself find access to a tcl interpreter in some easy form critical, since Same here > I also find myself using the tclkit interactive prompt on Windows to get > things done on a regular basis and I occasionally test out tcl frags from > comp.lang.tcl via my unix tclkit. Ditto > > So I sure would not want the ability to get to this to disappear altogether. > And I know that's not being proposed - just that the way to get to the > prompt change. > > If the command line interface to tclkit is going to evolve, perhaps adding > a -console option or something is possible (with that being the default on > a Mac). > Ditto regards, nicolas boretos From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jul 15 11:17:36 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6FGHZa24381 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:17:35 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA11099 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:16:35 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA12431 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:17:34 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id MRC53N4S; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:17:32 -0700 Message-ID: <3D32F59B.C9D6FDA6@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:17:31 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: "starkit-equi4.com" Subject: Re: [Starkit] SDX/Startool vs. All-In-One Tclkit References: <5.0.2.1.0.20020713155857.030c7920@mail.wjduquette.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > To begin, I suggested that a better name for SDX would be "Startool", > that being the thing you use to create Starkits and Starpacks. He didn't > disagree, but passed along some comments from somebody else > suggesting that SDX should go away altogether; the functionality should > be rolled into Tclkit instead. My opinion is that "Startool" should be reserved for a release of SDX that is easier to use and understand. I think the objective should be that a user could use Startool to create a starkit or starpack without having any prior knowledge. Currently SDX is just a bag full of tools that don't give a user much help in understanding on how to use them to create a starkit. I am would prefer that this new "Startool" functionality not be included into a tclkit because I view the purpose of Startool as a developer tool and not part of a distribution. I think that the Startool should have both a faceless and GUI based interface. The GUI based interface you provide a way to walk new developers through the steps required to build a starkit and could also result in a file that contains a "packing list" file that could be reused when running Startool from a build script with out the GUI. I also think that the Startool application should include the existing genkit functionality and additional functionality designed to build and manage extensions. I believe there is a need for build support based on my current these personal observation about the existing kitten archive: 1) Kitten is large and contains a larger number of extensions 2) Most of the kitten extensions can not be used by me because they aren't built for my platform 3) There are many extensions that I would like to uses that are not in kitten 4) The process of developing extensions should be encouraged by providing standards and not reserved for specialists (this is really an opinion :-) I believe there is a need for management support because I think there need to be tools that conveniently extract and package extensions into starpacks. I view here is Startool needs to include the capability to extract extensions from a Kitten like object and include the extensions in a target starkit or starpack. As a postscript to the above, I have a personal goal to develop such an application to facilitate the development work that I am doing. Regards, Tom K. From jgodfrey@optinest.com Tue Jul 16 16:53:01 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6GLr0a04534 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:53:01 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id g6GLpxn16164 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:52:02 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:52:58 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C22CE9.3D72A1C0" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Subject: [Starkit] mk4tcl view name problems Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C22CE9.3D72A1C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi All, I am trying to create several views whose properties are named by their "view name" and "property name" using the familiar TK "dot" notation, like: user.name (view "user", property "name") user.descr (view "user", property "descr") I am finding that I cannot create views using this notation as it seems to crash tclkit during the mk::view layout command. For instance, the following will crash (the latest) tclkit (on NT anyway) --> mk::view layout db.user {user.name user.descr} After doing some reading, I decide that the above "dot" notation may be confusing mk4tcl due to the similar syntax of path and cursor definitions. Well, I like the dot notation (it's familiar), but don't *have* to have it, so I thought I'd just use a different separator character. Most other "common" characters either crash or cause other problems - most notably, the property name I originally create with the layout command is not exactly the property name that is returned by the layout command. For instance: --> mk::view layout db.user {user-name user-descr} seems to work, but then: --> mk::view layout db.user returns: --> user name user descr Hmmmm..... now that I am verifying the above at a tclkit command line, it seems to work exactly as described above *sometimes* and crashes other times - weird... Anyway, 2 questions: 1. Why do non alphanumeric characters in property names cause crashes? If this is a necessary limitation, should the property names be scanned for valid format? At the very least, there should probably be some mention of this in the documentation. 2. Is there an accepted (normal, workable, useable?) naming convention for providing both the view and property name within the property name itself? Basically, I may use a property from one view within another view (as a foreign key) and this naming style seems to make sense for making a programmatic jump back to the original view. BTW, I am no database expert, so my thinking could be all wrong, but shouldn't it work anyway? Thanks for any input. Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA (800) 523-4744 jgodfrey@optinest.com ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C22CE9.3D72A1C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi=20 All,
 
I am = trying to=20 create several views whose properties are named by their "view name" and = "property name" using the familiar TK "dot" notation, = like:
 
user.name (view=20 "user", property "name")
user.descr (view=20 "user", property "descr")
 
I am = finding that I=20 cannot create views using this notation as it seems to crash tclkit = during the=20 mk::view layout command.  For instance, the following will crash = (the=20 latest) tclkit (on NT anyway)
 
--> = mk::view=20 layout db.user {user.name user.descr}
 
After = doing some=20 reading, I decide that the above "dot" notation may be confusing mk4tcl = due to=20 the similar syntax of path and cursor definitions.  Well, I like = the dot=20 notation (it's familiar), but don't *have* to have it, so I thought I'd = just use=20 a different separator character.  Most other "common" characters = either=20 crash or cause other problems - most notably, the property name I = originally=20 create with the layout command is not exactly the property name that is = returned=20 by the layout command.  For instance:
 
--> = mk::view=20 layout db.user {user-name user-descr}
 
seems = to work, but=20 then:
 
--> = mk::view=20 layout db.user
 
returns:
 
--> = user name=20 user descr
 
Hmmmm..... now that=20 I am verifying the above at a tclkit command line, it seems to = work=20 exactly as described above *sometimes* and crashes other times -=20 weird...
 
Anyway, 2=20 questions:
 
1.  Why do non=20 alphanumeric characters in property names cause crashes?  If this = is a=20 necessary limitation, should the property names be = scanned for=20 valid format?  At the very least, there should probably be some = mention of=20 this in the documentation.
 
2.  Is there = an accepted=20 (normal, workable, useable?) naming convention for providing both the = view and=20 property name within the property name itself?  Basically, I = may use a=20 property from one view within another view (as a foreign key) and this = naming=20 style seems to make sense for making a programmatic jump back to the = original=20 view.  BTW, I am no database expert, so my thinking could be all = wrong, but=20 shouldn't it work anyway?

Thanks for any=20 input.
 
 

Jeff = Godfrey
Optimation USA
(800) 523-4744
jgodfrey@optinest.com=20

 

 
------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C22CE9.3D72A1C0-- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jul 16 18:41:37 2002 Received: from smtpzilla5.xs4all.nl (smtpzilla5.xs4all.nl [194.109.127.141]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6GNfaa09663 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:41:37 -0500 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by smtpzilla5.xs4all.nl (8.12.0/8.12.0) with ESMTP id g6GNfZrZ030644 for ; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 01:41:35 +0200 (CEST) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit-Equi4.Com" Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl view name problems Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 01:40:14 +0200 Message-Id: <20020716234014.27235@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: >the following will crash (the latest) tclkit (on NT anyway) > >--> mk::view layout db.user {user.name user.descr} [...] >1. Why do non alphanumeric characters in property names cause crashes? >If this is a necessary limitation, should the property names be scanned >for valid format? At the very least, there should probably be some >mention of this in the documentation. It's a limitation. Note that MetaKit gets used in C++ and Python as well, where this alpha-numeric-only convention is in fact probably the norm. I agree 100% on MK being too lenient in letting this crash, and on the docs needing to be updated to mention this. >2. Is there an accepted (normal, workable, useable?) naming convention >for providing both the view and property name within the property name >itself? >Basically, I may use a property from one view within another view (as a >foreign key) and this naming style seems to make sense for making a >programmatic jump back to the original view. It's the first time I see someone do it this way. It never occured to me, since from my perspective, a "person" has a "name", not a "person-name". It's very unlikely that MK will be adjusted to support such more elaborate identifiers, given that the plan is really to work more towards having view expressions and property expressions. The only "special" character you get is the underscore, so "user_name" would be one way out. Allowing more would intefere with possible future algebraic notations. But hey, this is Tcl, you can mold it in any way you like. How about this (untested) approach: proc propseq {} { global _propseq if {![info exists _propseq]} { set _propseq 0 } return p[incr _propseq] } set user.name [propseq] set user.descr [propseq] mk::view layout db.user [list ${user.name} ${user.descr}] This would introduce names p1, p2, etc, yet allow you to use longer and more descriptive names in your code. Note that in Tcl too, you will need the braces to deal with the embedded dot. But if you ask me, I wouldn't bother... just use "simple" identifiers. -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Wed Jul 17 08:18:39 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6HDIca09383; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:18:38 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id g6HDHGn18329; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:17:26 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit-Equi4.Com" Subject: RE: [Starkit] mk4tcl view name problems Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:18:23 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20020716234014.27235@triqs.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2002 6:40 PM > To: Starkit-Equi4.Com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl view name problems > > > Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > >2. Is there an accepted (normal, workable, useable?) naming convention > >for providing both the view and property name within the property name > >itself? > [... LOTS OF GOOD ADVICE FROM JCW ...] > But if you ask me, I wouldn't bother... just use "simple" identifiers. > > -jcw The limitation of "no special chars" in view identifier names is not really going to be a problem for me - I can live without them. I just wanted to understand why I was getting the crashes. After rethinking my design based on your suggestions, I decided that I was over complicating things anyway. I am just going to go back to simple, basic identifiers and get on with it. Thanks for the input! Also, is there a way for Joe Public (me...) to assist you with documentation modifications? I would be happy to try to document the mentioned naming convention limitations, but I'm not sure how to go about it. Best regards, Jeff Godfrey From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jul 18 10:18:59 2002 Received: from smtpzilla1.xs4all.nl (smtpzilla1.xs4all.nl [194.109.127.137]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6IFIwa09428 for ; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:18:59 -0500 Received: from [10.0.1.194] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by smtpzilla1.xs4all.nl (8.12.0/8.12.0) with ESMTP id g6IFIvqS042211 for ; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:18:58 +0200 (CEST) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit-Equi4.Com" Subject: RE: [Starkit] mk4tcl view name problems Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:18:44 +0200 Message-Id: <20020718151844.22841@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: >Thanks for the input! Also, is there a way for Joe Public (me...) to assist >you with documentation modifications? I would be happy to try to document >the mentioned naming convention limitations, but I'm not sure how to go >about it. My suggestions would be to either email document text to this mailing list (might work as long as it's not an entire treatise), or to set up a number of pages on the metakit wiki, which has been around for some time: http://www.equi4.com/metakit/wiki.cgi/ To add a page: - pick an existing page - press "edit" - add a line containing say "... [My new page] ..." - save - click on the brackets (which are in fact tiny hyperlinks) - that's... you'll be in a window ready to fill in the name page - save (I need to document this better too, my goodness: a *recursive* doc issue!) Please feel free to add and adjust as much as you like. Disk space is just about the cheapest resource on earth these days. -jcw From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Jul 19 05:28:22 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6JASLa05450 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:28:21 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA04841 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:28:19 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:28:18 +0100 (GMT/BST) Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] startup failures Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Further to the thread on clt re. encoding startup failures with symbolic links, the latest official tclkit build for Linux throws an error on startup regardless of whether it's called via a symbolic link: application specific initialization failure: couldn't open setup.tcl; no such file or directory This in response to a simple call from the command line with or without a tcl script being named. Haven't got a suitable starkit to hand to test that right this minute. -- Steve Blinkhorn From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 19 05:41:41 2002 Received: from smtpzilla3.xs4all.nl (smtpzilla3.xs4all.nl [194.109.127.139]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6JAfea05953 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:41:40 -0500 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by smtpzilla3.xs4all.nl (8.12.0/8.12.0) with ESMTP id g6JAfbec057672 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:41:38 +0200 (CEST) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] startup failures Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:41:20 +0200 Message-Id: <20020719104120.30485@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> References: <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Blinkhorn wrote: >Further to the thread on clt re. encoding startup failures with >symbolic links, the latest official tclkit build for Linux throws an >error on startup regardless of whether it's called via a symbolic >link: > >application specific initialization failure: couldn't open setup.tcl; >no such file or directory > >This in response to a simple call from the command line with or without a >tcl script being named. Haven't got a suitable starkit to hand to test >that right this minute. If it's the .upx.exe version: ignore it, UPX failed on it for some reason beyond my comprehension. Use the .gz version, unpack to use it. There are newer (again!) builds in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ which I think fix this issue. They also may address problems with long dirs containing spaces, because Tcl is being tweaked to address some recent issues - see http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/CHANGES There are /pub/tk/older* directories to fall back to if needed. FYI, the August build of tclkit will be available end of that month. The September build of tclkit will be generated as soon as Tcl/Tk 8.4 reaches final. Please keep pounding hard on things, because otherwise two months from now you'll regret you didn't... -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Jul 19 05:48:09 2002 Received: from smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6JAm8a06287 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:48:09 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17VVIs-000FKG-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:48:06 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020719114534.02d19a40@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:48:05 +0100 To: From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] startup failures In-Reply-To: <20020719104120.30485@triqs.com> References: <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >There are newer (again!) builds in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ >which I think fix this issue. They also may address problems with long >dirs containing spaces, because Tcl is being tweaked to address some >recent issues - see http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/CHANGES I'm glad to see you've updated to latest Tcl cvs head. It is _very_ important that these tclkits get tested on Win95/98 to see if the old '30 second startup' problem has returned. This is because the latest cvs head got rid of the use of short path names on those platforms (which we had used to solve the 30-second problem). Short paths do not have consistent semantics, so long paths must be used. However, the new long-path code should be much faster than the old. cheers, Vince. From gay@sfu.ca Fri Jul 19 12:43:50 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6JHhna30799 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:43:50 -0500 Received: from ian.chem.sfu.ca (ian.chem.sfu.ca [142.58.209.2]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3/SFU-6.0H) with SMTP id g6JHhkmD012711 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:43:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.20020719104346.3f37286a@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Sender: gay@mailserver.sfu.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:43:46 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Ian Gay Subject: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have got some exit crashes on Win98 which are not quite the same as those described in the thread [Starkit] TclKit crashes on NT. On exiting from the program I sometimes get Invalid page fault in TCLKIT.EXE at 0177:0042f7be (always same address). This doesn't always occur, and so far I only get it with starkits that contain home-brewed C extensions. (Sounds suspicious, but scripts+extensions work under wish with no problems). Sometimes the crash occurs when the program is terminated by clicking the window close button, and not when an exit command is run. However, in other programs, exit causes the crash too. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Jul 19 20:09:04 2002 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6K194a26160 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 20:09:04 -0500 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACBA3B7E.ipt.aol.com [172.186.59.126]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AIH08098 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:09:31 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020720020814.01bc7b10@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:08:58 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] startup failures In-Reply-To: <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, The symbolic link startup problem has now been fixed. Requires update to latest cvs head of tcl and vfs trees. cheers, Vince. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Sat Jul 20 03:40:20 2002 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6K8eJa03667 for ; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 03:40:19 -0500 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB4DE3E.ipt.aol.com [172.180.222.62]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AIH68236 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 20 Jul 2002 09:40:48 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020720092722.01bc4ee0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 09:40:15 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] startup failures In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20020720020814.01bc7b10@mail.wolfbusiness.com> References: <200207191028.LAA04841@sole.prd.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 02:08 AM 7/20/2002 +0100, Vince Darley wrote: >The symbolic link startup problem has now been fixed. Requires update to >latest cvs head of tcl and vfs trees. I should clarify one subtlety. If you have 'tclkitsh' and './foo' as a link to tclkitsh then both: >./tclkitsh and >./foo work just fine. However, the way I've set things up right now, in both cases the new filesystem mount point is [file normalize ./tclkitsh]. This means that some uses of 'foo' as a directory will fail. More precisely: Any deep use of 'foo' as a directory is ok -- anything where 'foo' is not the last path element: % cd foo/bin % pwd /path/to/tclkitsh/bin all ok! But: % cd foo couldn't change directory to ... not a directory. % glob -dir foo * no files matched glob pattern etc. Is this behaviour ok? To some extent it has to be like that, because Tcl will transparently replace any deep use of 'foo' by the corresponding path with 'tclkitsh' in it, and so it has to be the case that tclkitsh is the thing that is mounted by tclvfs. However, it does mean that: 'cd [info nameof]' will fail for symlinks. Of course you can workaround with: if {[catch {file link [info nameof]} to]} { cd [info nameof] } else { cd $to } or, in case there are multiple symlinks (foo->bar->blah->tclkit): cd [vfs::filesystem fullynormalize [info nameof]] Actually a simpler workaround altogether would be to use: [file dirname [file normalize [file join [info nameof] dummyName]]] instead of [info nameof] Any thoughts? Vince. From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Mon Jul 22 08:02:09 2002 Received: from rilex06.riley.army.mil (emh1.riley.army.mil [144.246.219.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MD26a19055 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 08:02:07 -0500 Received: by emh1.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 08:00:11 -0500 Message-ID: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EFD@rilex11.riley.army.mil> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 08:06:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Instructions of using startkits. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Do we still have to modify our "source" statements to package up starkits? The instructions don't explicitly say to but that's the only way I could get it to work. Actually I think the instructions don't mention anything about the source statements. Michael E. Collins DOIM, Senior Network Tech. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Mon Jul 22 08:05:50 2002 Received: from smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MD5oa19340 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 08:05:50 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17Wcsm-000O1y-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 14:05:48 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020722140441.02aed008@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 14:05:47 +0100 To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Instructions of using startkits. In-Reply-To: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EFD@rilex11.riley.arm y.mil> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I don't know exactly what you mean, but no, you shouldn't need to modify anything to package up starkits. Perhaps if you provided some more detail? Vince. At 08:06 AM 7/22/2002 -0500, Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: >Do we still have to modify our "source" statements to package up starkits? > >The instructions don't explicitly say to but that's the only way I could get >it to work. Actually I think the instructions don't mention anything about >the source statements. > > > >Michael E. Collins >DOIM, Senior Network Tech. >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From nicolasb@maich.gr Mon Jul 22 09:34:10 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6MEY8a27913 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:34:09 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Mon Jul 22 18:00:15 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D3C18A1.9020702@maich.gr> Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:37:21 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" CC: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Instructions of using startkits. References: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EFD@rilex11.riley.army.mil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, What I usually do is the following. Put all files to be source (at one point or other) in your bin directory Then incude the following in your main.tcl file set mybin [file join $scripdoc::self bin] or this even works set mybin [file join [info script] bin] Then files are then sourced as source [file join $mybin my_file.tcl] regards, nicolas boretos Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > Do we still have to modify our "source" statements to package up starkits? > > The instructions don't explicitly say to but that's the only way I could get > it to work. Actually I think the instructions don't mention anything about > the source statements. From nicolasb@maich.gr Mon Jul 22 09:55:19 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6MEtIa28890 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:55:18 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Mon Jul 22 18:21:25 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D3C1D98.60402@maich.gr> Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:58:32 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" CC: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Instructions of using startkits. References: <73C2ED40DAD3D311934E00500400935F03951EFD@rilex11.riley.army.mil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, What I actually wanted to point out was that we set the bin directory relative to either the scripted document, or the file system, depending as to whether we scripdoc or not. set mybin [pwd] set mybin {c:/test.vfs/bin} etc. or set mybin [file join $scripdoc::self bin] regards nicolas From gay@sfu.ca Mon Jul 22 11:00:34 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MG0Xa31945 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 11:00:33 -0500 Received: from ian.chem.sfu.ca (ian.chem.sfu.ca [142.58.209.2]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3/SFU-6.0H) with SMTP id g6MG0VmD001212 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:00:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Sender: gay@mailserver.sfu.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:00:29 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Ian Gay Subject: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well, the win98 exit crash doesn't arise from my incompetence at building extensions. It seems like any binary extension will do. (I haven't seen this crash with any all-tcl starkit). Here's a minimal example using Tktable - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------ D:\tcl\tclkit>sdx lsk crash.kit crash.kit: dir lib/ 114 02/07/20 18:54 main.tcl crash.kit/lib: dir Tktable2.7/ 258 02/07/20 19:01 crash.tcl crash.kit/lib/Tktable2.7: 336756 02/07/20 19:03 Tktable.dll 152 02/01/25 08:36 pkgIndex.tcl 21517 02/01/25 08:36 tkTable.tcl D:\tcl\tclkit>type crash.vfs\main.tcl package require starkit starkit::startup source [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib crash.tcl] D:\tcl\tclkit>type crash.vfs\lib\crash.tcl # This provokes the crash if you exit with the X button # if you comment out the following statement there's no crash package require Tktable pack [button .b -width 12 -text Quit -font {arial 10} -command exit] # no crash if you press this button D:\tcl\tclkit> From andreask@ActiveState.com Mon Jul 22 11:04:18 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MG4Ia32197 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 11:04:18 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MG4BW12314; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:04:11 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6MG4B223692; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:04:11 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Ian Gay" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:04:11 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Importance: Normal X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Does it also happen with binary extensions which are not Tk related ? IOW with a binary extension not providing a widget ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join Tcl'2002 in Vancouver http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ ** Registration is open ** > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Ian Gay > Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 9:00 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 > > > Well, the win98 exit crash doesn't arise from my incompetence at building > extensions. It seems like any binary extension will do. (I haven't seen > this crash with any all-tcl starkit). > > Here's a minimal example using Tktable - > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---------- > ------------------------ > > D:\tcl\tclkit>sdx lsk crash.kit > > crash.kit: > dir lib/ > 114 02/07/20 18:54 main.tcl > > crash.kit/lib: > dir Tktable2.7/ > 258 02/07/20 19:01 crash.tcl > > crash.kit/lib/Tktable2.7: > 336756 02/07/20 19:03 Tktable.dll > 152 02/01/25 08:36 pkgIndex.tcl > 21517 02/01/25 08:36 tkTable.tcl > > > D:\tcl\tclkit>type crash.vfs\main.tcl > > package require starkit > starkit::startup > source [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib crash.tcl] > > D:\tcl\tclkit>type crash.vfs\lib\crash.tcl > # This provokes the crash if you exit with the X button > > # if you comment out the following statement there's no crash > package require Tktable > > pack [button .b -width 12 -text Quit -font {arial 10} -command exit] > # no crash if you press this button > > > D:\tcl\tclkit> > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Mon Jul 22 11:39:47 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MGdka01349 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 11:39:46 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id RAA16089 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:39:40 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200207221639.RAA16089@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:39:40 +0100 (GMT/BST) Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Starkit crashes - possible insight Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have suddenly started having significant problems which yield the same error message as the infamous crash-on-exit bug we've struggled with. It started last week when a starkit tclhttpd server that had been running perfectly for several weeks started to crash after delivering the first page it was asked for (a simple static html page). We have had no success in getting it to start and stay running since, checking on three different machines, NT4.0, win2000 Professional and Win200 Server. We have tried multiple versions of tclkit and tclkitsh, some of which are in constant production use here (as is most of the starkit tclhttpd on a BSD/OS box). We were coming to the conclusion that the problem was date-related, or clock clicks related, then remembered we had had a similar problem last November, when we found the only way to get things going was to run from a floppy (sic - yes seriously). But that didn't help either. So I unwrapped the starkit back into a .vfs and ran from that, and so far, fingers crossed, it's running OK. So we seem to have something that is related to the fact that we're running a starkit, that's Windows related (we don't see it on BSD/OS), that isn't usage related (new copies fall over), that isn't a defect in a particular version of tclkit (we've tried everything up to an including the pre-release versions), and that could well be date-related (it started out of the blue last week, and now is universal on the various machines we can muster). I'll go on trying to narrow this down, but if other people are having crash problems again, some of the above may help. Meanwhile, all suggestions gratefully received. -- Steve Blinkhorn From mike@eolas.com Mon Jul 22 17:17:01 2002 Received: from www.iomas.com (65-85-54-210.client.dsl.net [65.85.54.210]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MMH0a18418 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:17:01 -0500 Received: from gimr0.eolas.com [65.85.54.221] by www.iomas.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.04) id A45B39F101EE; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:16:59 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20020722171418.04200790@mail.eolas.com> X-Sender: mike@mail.eolas.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:17:01 -0500 To: From: Mike Doyle Subject: RE: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 09:04 AM 7/22/2002 -0700, Andreas Kupries wrote: >Does it also happen with binary extensions which are not Tk related ? >IOW with a binary extension not providing a widget ? I'm getting crash-on-exit with the latest upx'ed win32 tclkit.exe and wikit.kit, under Windows 2000. --Mike From fandom@retemail.es Mon Jul 22 18:54:39 2002 Received: from tnetmx1.mail.isp ([213.4.129.135]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6MNsca23468 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 18:54:39 -0500 Received: from Shire.Asturias.es ([80.24.194.172]) by tnetmx1.mail.isp (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15 tnetmx1 Mar 14 2002 21:29:48) with ESMTP id GZOD2Z00.DKL for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 01:54:35 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Andr=E9s=20Garc=EDa?= To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 01:54:33 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.1 References: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200207230154.33980.fandom@retemail.es> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, And if you do something like: wm protocol . WM_DELETE_WINDOW { exit } Do you get a crash when closing the window? Not that I know what the cause may be, but it could be an easy workaround. Andres From gay@sfu.ca Mon Jul 22 19:05:07 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6N057a23943 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 19:05:07 -0500 Received: from ian.chem.sfu.ca (ian.chem.sfu.ca [142.58.209.2]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3/SFU-6.0H) with SMTP id g6N054mD022221; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:05:04 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.20020722170504.406f1734@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Sender: gay@mailserver.sfu.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 17:05:04 To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?_Garc=EDa?= , starkit@equi4.com From: Ian Gay Subject: Re: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 In-Reply-To: <200207230154.33980.fandom@retemail.es> References: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g6N057a23943 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 01:54 23/07/02 +0200, Andrés García wrote: >Hi, > >And if you do something like: > > wm protocol . WM_DELETE_WINDOW { > exit > } > >Do you get a crash when closing the window? > >Not that I know what the cause may be, but it could >be an easy workaround. > >Andres That will prevent the crash in this particular case. However, as I mentioned in my first post, there are some cases where exit will also cause the crash. I haven't reduced this to a simple example yet. Ian From jgodfrey@optinest.com Tue Jul 23 08:18:32 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6NDIWa21976 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:18:32 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id g6NDIVp07404 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:18:34 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:19:09 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020722170504.406f1734@mailserver.sfu.ca> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Ian Gay > Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:05 PM > To: Andrés García; starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 > > > That will prevent the crash in this particular case. However, as I > mentioned in my first post, there are some cases where exit will > also cause > the crash. I haven't reduced this to a simple example yet. > > Ian That's been my experience also - the problem seems to be very elusive. Sometimes "exit" causes it, sometimes not. Sometimes clicking on the "X" to close the program causes it, sometimes not - although this tends to cause it more often than exit. Also, the exact same simple steps that sometimes cause the problem don't consistently cause it.... Jeff From gay@sfu.ca Tue Jul 23 10:52:33 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6NFqWa03794 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 10:52:33 -0500 Received: from ian.chem.sfu.ca (ian.chem.sfu.ca [142.58.209.2]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3/SFU-6.0H) with SMTP id g6NFqNmD014422; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:52:24 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.20020723085220.36671d52@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Sender: gay@mailserver.sfu.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:52:20 To: "Andreas Kupries" , From: Ian Gay Subject: RE: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 09:04 22/07/02 -0700, Andreas Kupries wrote: > >Does it also happen with binary extensions which are not Tk related ? >IOW with a binary extension not providing a widget ? > Looks like maybe not. Using the same kit framework as my previous example, I get the crash when I load Tktable, Tkhtml or snack. I _don't_ get a crash if I load the registry or dde pacjkages. But note you only have to load the package to get the crash, you don't have to use it in any way. Why should Tk be different at this level? Ian From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jul 23 11:03:24 2002 Received: from smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6NG3Oa04644 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 11:03:24 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17X286-0001Ac-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 17:03:18 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020723170048.034f1608@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 17:03:17 +0100 To: From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Crash on exit with Win98 In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020723085220.36671d52@mailserver.sfu.ca> References: <3.0.6.16.20020722090029.09cf0ef8@mailserver.sfu.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 08:52 AM 7/23/2002 +0000, Ian Gay wrote: >At 09:04 22/07/02 -0700, Andreas Kupries wrote: > > > >Does it also happen with binary extensions which are not Tk related ? > >IOW with a binary extension not providing a widget ? > > >Looks like maybe not. Using the same kit framework as my previous example, >I get the crash when I load Tktable, Tkhtml or snack. I _don't_ get a crash >if I load the registry or dde pacjkages. I believe dde and registry are statically compiled in (so there is no actual loading to do --- just a 'load {} dde') so they aren't the same case (you can use "info loaded" to find out). Is there a non-static Tcl-only extension available to test with Vince. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jul 24 10:05:03 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OF53a04242; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:05:03 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA08969; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:05:06 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA16344; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:05:02 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id MRC538P8; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:05:01 -0700 Message-ID: <3D3EC21D.6E0A7FC2@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:05:01 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: "Starkit-Equi4.Com" Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl view name problems References: <20020718151844.22841@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm having problem getting the latest version mk to build on SunOS and HP. I fixed the problem on HP, but I can't figure out what the problem is on SunOS. The out/mk file is shown below. It seems to be complaining about the g++ compiler but the compiler exists and is being detected. Any suggestions? RUN: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/home/rna020/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/NEWtclVer/noarch --exec-prefix=/home/rna020/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/NEWtclVer/install/dmisvr --with-tcl=/home/rna020/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/NEWtclVer/src/tcl/generic checking for Python configuration... not enabled checking for Tcl headers... found /home/rna020/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/NEWtclVer/src/tcl/generic/tcl.h checking for g++... g++ checking for C++ compiler default output... a.out checking whether the C++ compiler works... configure: error: cannot run C++ compiled programs. If you meant to cross compile, use `--host'. ERROR: child process exited abnormally while executing "run sh ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/home/rna020/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/NEWtclVer/noarch --exec-prefix=/home/rna020/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/NEWtclVer/install/..." ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list run sh [file join ../../../src $dir configure] --prefix=$::P/noarch --exec-prefix=$::P/install/$::H] $args" (procedure "config" line 2) invoked from within "config mk/unix --with-tcl=$P/src/tcl/generic" ("mk" arm line 2) invoked from within "switch $target { tcl { config tcl/unix --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries libraries file mkdir $P/i..." From contact_mel@yahoo.com Wed Jul 24 11:47:42 2002 Received: from web12301.mail.yahoo.com (web12301.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.99]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6OGlga10293 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 11:47:42 -0500 Message-ID: <20020724164741.11745.qmail@web12301.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [151.202.103.132] by web12301.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:47:41 PDT Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:47:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Mel To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: like the document said, i do 'kitten.kit -l' and i do not see itk or itcl listed! am i missing something? Yours, Mel __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 24 11:55:32 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OGtVa10735 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 11:55:31 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6OGtPO22970 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:55:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6OGtP808159; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:55:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:55:25 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020724125525.AAB8150@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:47:41 -0700 (PDT) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I believe itcl/itk are built into tclkit . -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jul 24 12:10:50 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OHAna11739 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:10:49 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (motgate4 2.1) with ESMTP id KAA03676 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:10:49 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA08044 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:11:04 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id MRC53886; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:10:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3D3EDF97.93548D3A@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:10:47 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) References: <20020724164741.11745.qmail@web12301.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > like the document said, i do 'kitten.kit -l' and i do not see itk or > itcl listed! > > am i missing something? Itcl is include in tclkit but Itk is not include. -tjk From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 24 12:35:30 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OHZUa13436 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:35:30 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6OHZOO04191 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 13:35:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6OHZNa08804; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 13:35:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 13:35:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020724133523.AAB8762@cas.org> In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:10:47 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Re: Where did itk go =? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Shoot - I just tried to do a kitten.kit -u and tclkit core dumped on me! Platform: SPARC Solaris 8 The stack trace says: $ dbx $(whence tclkit) core Reading tclkit dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_DerivedSeqR11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_PropertyRC11c4_Property' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_FileMark' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__14c4_SaveContextR11c4_StrategybiP9c4_DifferP12c4_Allocator' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_TclStreamP12Tcl_Channel_' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_SortSeqR11c4_SequenceP11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_HashViewerR11c4_SequenceiP11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_StorageR11c4_Strategybi' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16__user_type_infoPCc' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_JoinViewerR11c4_SequenceRC7c4_ViewT2b' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_BlockedViewerR11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_OrderedViewerR11c4_Sequencei' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_GroupByViewerR11c4_SequenceRC7c4_ViewRC11c4_Property' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_PersistR11c4_Strategybi' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_FileMarklbT2' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__17__class_type_infoPCcPCQ217__class_type_info9base_infoUi' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_Strategy' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__17c4_StreamStrategyP9c4_Stream' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_ProductViewerR11c4_SequenceRC7c4_View' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_Allocator' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_StorageRC7c4_View' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__14__si_type_infoPCcRC16__user_type_info' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_PropertycPCc' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_FilterSeqR11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_CustomHandlerRC11c4_PropertyP12c4_CustomSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatFRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__17c4_JoinPropViewerR11c4_SequenceRC11c4_ViewPropb' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__15c4_CustomViewer' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_CustomSeqP15c4_CustomViewer' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__15c4_ConcatViewerR11c4_SequenceRC7c4_View' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_PairViewerR11c4_SequenceRC7c4_View' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatXRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeqi' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_HandlerSeqR13c4_HandlerSeqP10c4_Handler' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_StoragePCci' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11c4_FileMarkli' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_ProjectSeqR11c4_SequenceT1bP11c4_Sequence' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_FileStreamP4FILEb' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__15c4_RenameViewerR11c4_SequenceRC11c4_PropertyT2' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatBRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatSRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_HandlerRC11c4_Property' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatVRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_Storage' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatLRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__14c4_SliceViewerR11c4_Sequenceiii' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_FilterSeqR11c4_SequenceG9c4_CursorT2' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__18c4_RemapWithViewerR11c4_SequenceRC7c4_View' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_FormatHandlerRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_BaseArray' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__16c4_IndexedViewerR11c4_SequenceT1RC7c4_Viewb' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13c4_HandlerSeqP10c4_Persist' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__13bad_exception' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11TclSelectorP10Tcl_InterpRC7c4_View' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10c4_FormatDRC11c4_PropertyR13c4_HandlerSeq' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__15c4_FileStrategyP4FILE' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__17c4_StreamStrategyl' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__11MkWorkspaceP10Tcl_Interp' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__10bad_typeid' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__12c4_ColOfIntsP10c4_Persisti' dbx: warning: cannot demangle '__15c4_Dependencies' core file header read successfully Reading ld.so.1 Reading libdl.so.1 Reading libsocket.so.1 Reading libnsl.so.1 Reading libm.so.1 Reading libc.so.1 Reading libmp.so.2 Reading libc_psr.so.1 program terminated by signal BUS (invalid address alignment) 0x00073ed4: Tcl_NotifyChannel+0x0014: ld [%i0], %l1 (dbx 1) where =>[1] Tcl_NotifyChannel(0x7, 0x10, 0xc79979, 0x3, 0x0, 0xffbe8f50), at 0x73ed4 [2] 0x39a60(0x2f8bb0, 0x39a54, 0x0, 0x3, 0x0, 0xffbe8fc0), at 0x39a5f [3] 0x907a0(0x41e420, 0x15d1d0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x135a44, 0xffbe8f80), at 0x9079f [4] Tcl_ServiceEvent(0xfffffffd, 0xfffffffd, 0x9066c, 0x61, 0x5eadc, 0xffbe9124), at 0x82378 [5] Tcl_DoOneEvent(0xfffffffd, 0x41de80, 0x61, 0x5eadc, 0xffbe9124, 0xffbe9124), at 0x826b4 [6] Tcl_VwaitObjCmd(0x1, 0x1364b8, 0x41de80, 0x1368e4, 0x5e9c8, 0xff1c1acc), at 0x5ea50 [7] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x2, 0x1368e4, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [8] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0x1a, 0x1e7df0, 0x0, 0x169b65, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [9] TclCompEvalObj(0x1364b8, 0x15f738, 0x1368dc, 0x0, 0xf87c8, 0x0), at 0x5f490 [10] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x15f738, 0x0, 0x1, 0x100ae0, 0x1e8728), at 0x3ca98 [11] TclObjInterpProc(0x1, 0x1364b8, 0x0, 0x1368dc, 0xffbe9458, 0x1364b8), at 0x8aee0 [12] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x2, 0x1368dc, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [13] 0x5fd80(0x0, 0x18, 0x6d88f0, 0x147f98, 0x11e0d8, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [14] TclCompEvalObj(0x1364b8, 0x1c2998, 0x4, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x5f490 [15] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x1c2998, 0x0, 0x0, 0x59, 0x0), at 0x3ca98 [16] TclObjInterpProc(0x2, 0x1364b8, 0x0, 0x1368c4, 0x6dbaf0, 0x1364b8), at 0x8aee0 [17] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x6, 0x1368c4, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [18] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0x16, 0x136788, 0x0, 0xffbea1b0, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [19] TclCompEvalObj(0x1364b8, 0x1bcdd8, 0xffbea1b0, 0x0, 0x122580, 0xff1c294c), at 0x5f490 [20] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x1bcdd8, 0x0, 0x1, 0x100ae0, 0x17dcd8), at 0x3ca98 [21] TclObjInterpProc(0x2, 0x1364b8, 0x0, 0x1368b8, 0xffbea018, 0x1364b8), at 0x8aee0 [22] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x3, 0x1368b8, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [23] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0x10, 0x136788, 0x0, 0xffbea560, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [24] TclCompEvalObj(0x1364b8, 0x556f70, 0x6b450, 0x0, 0xffbea608, 0xffbea60c), at 0x5f490 [25] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x556f70, 0x0, 0x0, 0xa090920, 0x2d000000), at 0x3ca98 [26] Tcl_SwitchObjCmd(0x3, 0x1364b8, 0x54c, 0x43ed08, 0x4b194, 0xffbea7a4), at 0x4b560 [27] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x3, 0x1368ac, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [28] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0xd, 0x136788, 0x0, 0x0, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [29] TclCompEvalObj(0x1364b8, 0x150220, 0x0, 0x557648, 0x0, 0xadf78), at 0x5f490 [30] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x150220, 0x0, 0x557648, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3ca98 [31] Tcl_ForeachObjCmd(0x0, 0x1364b8, 0xffbeaa08, 0x1, 0xffbeaa18, 0xffbeaa48), at 0x43328 [32] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x4, 0x13689c, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [33] 0x5fd80(0x0, 0xa, 0x0, 0x0, 0xffbeacac, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [34] TclCompEvalObj(0x0, 0x1e2e40, 0x0, 0x1364b8, 0xf8fa0, 0x0), at 0x5f490 [35] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x1e2e40, 0x0, 0x0, 0xa202020, 0x2d000000), at 0x3ca98 [36] Tcl_SwitchObjCmd(0x1, 0x1364b8, 0x54c, 0x1e4908, 0x4b194, 0x0), at 0x4b560 [37] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x5, 0xffbeaf18, 0x1f2900, 0x1b00, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [38] Tcl_EvalEx(0x0, 0x1f0538, 0x3ece, 0xffbeb060, 0x0, 0x1), at 0x3c644 [39] Tcl_FSEvalFile(0x1364b8, 0x16a9e0, 0x136894, 0x136788, 0x200, 0x0), at 0x787fc [40] Tcl_SourceObjCmd(0x0, 0x1364b8, 0x2, 0x136894, 0x48e84, 0x1364b8), at 0x48ea4 [41] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x2, 0x136894, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [42] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0x6, 0x55304, 0x0, 0xa, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [43] TclCompEvalObj(0x0, 0x16a4d0, 0x0, 0x1364b8, 0xf8fa0, 0x0), at 0x5f490 [44] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x16a4d0, 0x0, 0x0, 0xa202020, 0x2d000000), at 0x3ca98 [45] Tcl_SwitchObjCmd(0x1, 0x1364b8, 0x54c, 0x1b8d78, 0x4b194, 0x0), at 0x4b560 [46] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x4, 0xffbeb7e8, 0x1b7d9c, 0x613, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [47] Tcl_EvalEx(0x0, 0x1b7d20, 0x68f, 0xffbeb8f0, 0x0, 0x1), at 0x3c644 [48] Tcl_FSEvalFile(0x1364b8, 0x16a398, 0xffbebd08, 0x136788, 0x6c, 0x165888), at 0x787fc [49] Tcl_SourceObjCmd(0x0, 0x1364b8, 0x2, 0xffbebd08, 0x48e84, 0xadf78), at 0x48ea4 [50] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x2, 0xffbebd08, 0x17dfd0, 0x32, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [51] Tcl_EvalEx(0x0, 0x17dfd0, 0x32, 0xffbebdd0, 0x0, 0x1), at 0x3c644 [52] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x15fb40, 0x40000, 0x17a558, 0x0, 0xffbeb9b4), at 0x3ca74 [53] Tcl_UplevelObjCmd(0x0, 0x1364b8, 0x1, 0x136890, 0x8a898, 0xff1c1acc), at 0x8a964 [54] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x2, 0x13688c, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [55] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0x4, 0x17a558, 0x0, 0x236a8, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [56] TclCompEvalObj(0x1364b8, 0x16b4a0, 0x1, 0x0, 0xffbec568, 0xffbec56c), at 0x5f490 [57] Tcl_EvalObjEx(0x1364b8, 0x16b4a0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x19, 0x0), at 0x3ca98 [58] TclObjInterpProc(0x2, 0x1364b8, 0x0, 0x136880, 0xffbec328, 0x1364b8), at 0x8aee0 [59] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x3, 0x136880, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [60] 0x5fd80(0x1364b8, 0x2, 0x1515d8, 0x1c, 0xffbecfb8, 0x136880), at 0x5fd7f [61] Tcl_ExprObj(0x0, 0x1515d8, 0xffbed024, 0x0, 0x11e314, 0x9a5f0), at 0x5f224 [62] Tcl_ExprBooleanObj(0x1364b8, 0x1515d8, 0xffbed09c, 0x136788, 0xa, 0x13e028), at 0x3d224 [63] Tcl_IfObjCmd(0x0, 0x1364b8, 0x3, 0xffbed198, 0x4401c, 0xffbed108), at 0x44074 [64] TclEvalObjvInternal(0x0, 0x3, 0xffbed198, 0x154fb0, 0xcf, 0x0), at 0x3bdac [65] Tcl_EvalEx(0x0, 0x154fb0, 0xcf, 0xffbed280, 0x0, 0x1), at 0x3c644 [66] Tcl_FSEvalFile(0x1364b8, 0x13e8f8, 0xfe2c8, 0x1, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x787fc [67] Tcl_Main(0x2, 0xffbed7b0, 0x38f38, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x7e290 [68] main(0x3, 0xffbed7ac, 0xffbed7bc, 0x133064, 0x0, 0x0), at 0x39c5c (dbx 2) ----- I went and directly downloaded the latest kitten.kit, reran the kitten.kit -u and got a legit update . I've no idea what happened there... However, I do note that I was wrong - tclkit does NOT have Itk in it. In point of fact, some change to either kitten or tclkit in the past few weeks has now resulted in Iwidgets not being usable within tclkit (because of the missing Itk). Hopefully someone will be able to figure out what happened and recover things by the time JCW returns from holiday. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Wed Jul 24 12:45:53 2002 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OHjqa14287; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:45:53 -0500 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id TAA07833 (8.8.8/1.13); Wed, 24 Jul 2002 19:45:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3D3EE814.2040409@hccnet.nl> Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 19:47:00 +0200 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-GB; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-gb MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@EQUI4.COM CC: Jean-Claude Wippler Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] StarKit deployment in a networked environment. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: L.S. I'm developing a network-aware application (*), which I originally meant to distribute as a TclKit-StarKit combination. (*) Every user launches the same executable, and the application takes care of user-specific data flow. However, once mounted by the first user, a VFS appears to be locked and is inaccessible for a second launch. Is there some way to work around this or do I need to revert to another deployment strategy? Thanks for advice, Erik Leunissen ============== From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jul 24 13:25:14 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OIPEa17193; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 13:25:14 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate4.mot.com (motgate4 2.1) with ESMTP id LAA24935; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 11:25:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA06737; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 11:25:12 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id MRC539GX; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 11:25:12 -0700 Message-ID: <3D3EF108.BA740EAA@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 11:25:12 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mel , starkit@equi4.com, metakit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) References: <20020724180247.44688.qmail@web12305.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > > itk3.2 is included in the kitten library! > whay to i have to do to include it in my kitten application? > > many thanks > Mel > --- Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > like the document said, i do 'kitten.kit -l' and i do not see itk > > or > > > itcl listed! > > > > > > am i missing something? > > > > Itcl is include in tclkit but Itk is not include. > > > > -tjk I don't know :-( , I'm still trying to get tclkit to build on Solaris. MetaKit seems to be broken on Solaris. I downloaded metakit-2.4.7-37 from the MetaKit site and it doesn't build so there is a problem with MetaKit. The error looks like this: % ../unix/configure checking for Python configuration... not enabled checking for Tcl headers... not enabled checking for g++... g++ checking for C++ compiler default output... a.out checking whether the C++ compiler works... configure: error: cannot run C++ compiled programs. If you meant to cross compile, use `--host'. On HP I got tclkit to build and I can create a starkit with script that work, but as soon as I try to load a shared object the os complains /usr/lib/dld.sl: Call to mmap() failed - TEXT /var/tmp/tcla02761 /usr/lib/dld.sl: Permission denied 200704couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tcla02761": permission denied while executing "load [file join $root lib Tktable2.7 Tktable.sl.2.7]" (file "test/main.tcl" line 24) invoked from within "source test/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" Any help on either of these problems would be appreciated. Tom K. From mel@redolive.com Wed Jul 24 14:58:15 2002 Received: from igoods.com (IDENT:qmailr@[67.40.211.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6OJwEa23819 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 14:58:15 -0500 Received: (qmail 10741 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 19:56:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO redolive2000) (67.40.211.10) by 67.40.211.9 with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 19:56:26 -0000 Message-ID: <002101c2334c$e6bad450$a5c809c0@redolive2000> From: "Mel" To: Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:01:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2332B.5F79E6F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Subject: [Starkit] GUYS! HELP !!!!!! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2332B.5F79E6F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i am trying to use starkit out of the box as advertised. i can see = itk3.2 package and iwidgets=20 when i try to use iwidgets, i get the message itk3.2 can not be found! what's the deal? anyone else seen this? Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2332B.5F79E6F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i am trying to use starkit out of the = box as=20 advertised. i can see itk3.2 package and iwidgets
 
when i try to use iwidgets, i get the = message=20 itk3.2 can not be found!
 
what's the deal? anyone else seen=20 this?
 
Yours, Mel
------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2332B.5F79E6F0-- From acollin1@csc.com Wed Jul 24 16:56:18 2002 Received: from pony-express2 (ponyexpress2.csc.com [208.219.64.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6OLuIa01170 for ; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:56:18 -0500 Received: from csc.com (va-fch32.csc.com [20.6.39.233]) by pony-express2.csc.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) with ESMTP id <0GZR004IDWG2YN@pony-express2.csc.com> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 17:45:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:45:53 -0700 From: Alan E Collins To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.4a July 24, 2000 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on VA-FCH32/SRV/CSC(Release 5.0.8 |June 18, 2001) at 07/24/2002 05:46:00 PM Subject: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack startup howto Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When starting an application wrapped in a starpack, is their a way to keep the startup code from sourcing files listed on the commandline. The application is an editor which may be started by double clicking an associated file or dropping a file on its desktop shortcut in windows. Alan Collins acollin1@csc.com From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jul 25 05:55:17 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PAtHa03743 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 05:55:17 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6PAtAO13778 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:55:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6PAtAp26207; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:55:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:55:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020725065510.AAB26178@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] GUYS! HELP !!!!!! In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:01:29 -0400 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel, here's what I see when I use tclkit: $ tclkit % package require Itcl; 3.3 % package names http pwb rechan zipvfs tcltest opt mk4vfs vfslib msgcat scripdoc zlib starkit Tcl Itcl Mk4tcl vfs Tk % source kitten.kit % package names OAP::Utils uuencode smtpd counter Extral pwb soapinterop::base SOAP::smtp xmlswitch opt tcltest wcb Tablelist vfslib msgcat dyncall Mentry Iwidgets lzrw1 mathf uri::urn md5c SOAP::CGI math::calculus ftp expat gk Tclx SOAP::beep autoproxy tdom report comm rpcvar textutil::expander dommap Mk4tcl HTML_Parse SOAP::Service nntp htmlparse soapinterop::B SOAP::https math sgml soapinterop::C textutil SOAP::xpath csv cmdline dom::tclgeneric Widget xml::tclparser xpath cgi2dom ihash math::fuzzy ClassyTk Tktable sgmlparser xml::c mime autoscroll Wikit::Gui SOAP::ftp ncgi ftp::geturl Expect math::geometry xmldefs profiler cgi gbutton hexdump Tkhtml puretclparser rchan Wikit::Utils html HTML irc fileutil Class xml::expat SOAP::Domain stats javascript Tk vfs tclparser xml::tcl scratch http control tcllib zipvfs cksum Wcb tablelist Supertext pop3d::udb pop3d SOAP::http mentry mkWidgets zlib critcl calendar switched mvec stooop exif sum dom::libxml2 pop3d::dbox Modify uri dom::generic recha! n xerces xmldep pop3 tls SOAP mk4v fs Metawidget struct dns crc32 narray Web XMLRPC md5 BWidget yencode dom::tcl scripdoc Wikit dom xml log starkit Tcl smtp Itcl Mpexpr Trf Wikit::Format Tix sha1 base64 ascenc mclistbox ftpd blowfish dom::c Notice there is no Itk present there - even though there is an Iwidgets. Somehow Itk got lost from the Solaris build. Try the same steps and see if you see Itk. If so, then type package versions Itk and see what version is reported. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jul 25 05:56:18 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PAuIa03815 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 05:56:18 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6PAuBO13875 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:56:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6PAuBZ26220; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:56:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:56:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020725065611.AAB26211@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack startup howto In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:45:53 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've never built a starkit/starpack. But I am wondering - what if you invoked your application as: myeditor -- file.tcl Does the file still get sourced in? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jul 25 08:53:30 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PDrTa14993 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 08:53:29 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6PDrMO05657 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:53:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6PDrNM28140; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:53:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:53:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020725095323.AAB28085@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] GUYS! HELP !!!!!! To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Mel > Thanks, Larry; > its not just Solaris, i am using it on WinDoze2000 and get the same > problem, i am stuck here guys :-( Mel, when I do sdx.kit kitten.kit I see a directory of all the pieces of kitten.kit. It contains the shared library info for itk 3.2 for Windows and Linux. I don't have either system on hand to test right now. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jul 25 09:30:30 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PEUTa17395 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:30:29 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6PEUMO17444 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:30:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6PEUM229018; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:30:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:30:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020725103022.AAB28985@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have started a page for gathering tips and suggestions regarding issues that a developer needs to address when adding extensions to Kitten, but in reality, they probably are really general issues for generating starkits. The page is at http://mini.net/tcl/3795 Please feel free to either discuss issues here or on that web page. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Jul 25 11:38:00 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PGc0a26636 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 11:38:00 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA23815 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:37:59 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA00649 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:37:59 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8H27; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:37:37 -0700 Message-ID: <3D402951.72953540@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:37:37 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <20020725103022.AAB28985@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I have started a page for gathering tips and > suggestions regarding issues that a developer needs to address when adding > extensions to Kitten, but in reality, they probably are really general > issues for generating starkits. The page is at > > http://mini.net/tcl/3795 My understanding is that Kitten is just a prototype so I'm inclined not to spend much time on figuring out how to make it work. It has many problems, not the least of which is that there is no defined structure either for Kitten itself or the packages it contains. I think our time needs to be spent on gathering documenting information about how to build a starkit and make it work. So far I have had no success in this regard. A build system that can walk a user through the process is sorely needed. I also think there will be an need for defining some standard testing for something like Kitten. From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Thu Jul 25 12:11:22 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PHBLa29010 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 12:11:21 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA09352; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 18:11:14 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207251711.SAA09352@sole.prd.co.uk> To: Tom Krehbiel cc: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com, steve@sole.prd.co.uk Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:37:37 PDT." <3D402951.72953540@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 18:11:13 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>Tom Krehbiel said: > > I have started a page for gathering tips and > > suggestions regarding issues that a developer needs to address when adding > > extensions to Kitten, but in reality, they probably are really general > > issues for generating starkits. The page is at > > > > http://mini.net/tcl/3795 > > My understanding is that Kitten is just a prototype so I'm inclined not to s pend much time on figuring out how to make it work. It > has many problems, not the least of which is that there is no defined struct ure either for Kitten itself or the packages it > contains. I think our time needs to be spent on gathering documenting inform ation about how to build a starkit and make it work. So > far I have had no success in this regard. A build system that can walk a use r through the process is sorely needed. I also think > there will be an need for defining some standard testing for something like Kitten. It would help us help you if you could be a bit more specific about the difficulties you have encountered building starkits. A minimal starkit is a single tcl script called main.tcl in a directory called [mykitname].vfs. Then: tclkit sdx.kit wrap mykitname or, if tclkit is installed somewhere in your path, just sdx.kit wrap mykitname will leave you with a file called either mykitname or mykitname.kit (depends on your platform, AFAIK). You may need to change the permissions on the starkit file to make it executable, again depending on whether tclkit is in your path. The fun starts when you want your scripts to load other scripts, or libraries or whatever from inside the starkit file. You have to get used to idioms like: file join [file dirname [info script]] myscript.tcl for relative pathnames, unless you are absolutely sure of what your script is called and where it will live in your directory hierarchy (one of the neater tricks with starkits is making them behave differently depending on the name they have). Kitten is nothing more than a large number of extensions bundled up in a starkit for convenience. One of the attractions of starkits is that they make deployment manageable by keeping everything in a wrapper, rather than distributed in several places in a file system. Kitten makes it easy to select the extensions you need for a particular piece of work - I don't think in general one would choose to use it as it stands as part of a finished project. In my experience (we've been using starkits under their previous name of scripted documents for a couple of years now, and we use them exclusively for delivering software onto naive users' desktops), the things you have to be careful with are idioms for referring to files within the starkit, and ensuring that pkgIndex.tcl files are correct and correctly placed. If you want to try a live public system delivered in this way, www.careerdemon.com is a careers guidance assessment system, where the server is tclhttpd wrapped up in a starkit with some custom code, and the client is a starkit whose content changes over time in conversation with the server. But don't try unwrapping the client - you'll find that various bits of the innards are encrypted. This way, the user only has two files to deal with or delete, and we treat the starkit as a container whose contents change from time to time. There is great ingenuity in the way the starkit method has been put together, and also great simplicity - it's the only way I know of putting a complete web server on a single floppy in two files. From acollin1@csc.com Thu Jul 25 17:59:36 2002 Received: from amer-mta02.csc.com (amer-mta02.csc.com [20.137.2.248]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PMxZa18138 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 17:59:35 -0500 Received: from amer-mta02.csc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by amer-mta02.csc.com (Switch-2.2.2/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g6PN1H215877 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 19:01:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from csc.com (va-fch32.csc.com [20.6.39.233]) by amer-mta02.csc.com (Switch-2.2.2/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g6PN1H215871 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 19:01:17 -0400 (EDT) To: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.4a July 24, 2000 Message-ID: From: "Alan E Collins" Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:35:20 -0700 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on VA-FCH32/SRV/CSC(Release 5.0.8 |June 18, 2001) at 07/25/2002 06:49:15 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Starkit/Starpack startup howto Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I tried that method of invocation (myeditor -- file.tcl) with the same result. I read in the wiki, that the starpack searches for a main.tcl script in the directory with the boot.tcl script on startup. This is suppose to characterize a custom tclkit (starpack). If found, control is relinquished to the main.tcl script. This is not happening with my application. Alan Collins acollin1@csc.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Jul 25 18:40:26 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6PNeQa19643 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 18:40:26 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (motgate4 2.1) with ESMTP id QAA21210 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:40:25 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA06887 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:40:41 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC82S4; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:40:22 -0700 Message-ID: <3D408C66.C8DF3E7@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:40:22 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Blinkhorn CC: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com, steve@sole.prd.co.uk Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <200207251711.SAA09352@sole.prd.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Thanks for the reply. First I am building on Solaris and HP (not Windos,Linux or MacOS) which means I'm sort of on the edge of where things work and Kitten is useless to me. My work is aimed at first developing a build environment where I can down load an extension, build it and add it to a Kitten like metakit for use by other developers, and second to convert existing applications to the starkit approach. Existing applications use tcl/tk/itcl/itk/iwidgets/tclx. The difficulties I am having continue to change as I solve one problem and new ones show up. About half of them are related to tclkit, starkit, etc. while the other half is related to my environment. The first round of problems was getting all the packages to build on HP (i.e. tcl8.4/tk8.4/itcl/kit/vfs/zlib). This was a problem because the genkit doesn't support HP and there was a bug in the tcl.m4. I have reported the bug and I believe it has been fixed. I expected the Solaris build to work since it was supported but the mk build failed during configure. I finally (just today) traced it back to g++ shared library problem on our network (we don't normally do C++ coding so g++ is seldom used). Back on the HP side. Creating a minimal script is not a problem. The test case I used was the BWidget demo. A this point I thought I had an understanding of path resolution but there were still surprizes. I tried to do a "package require Itk" and got a "can't find package Itk". The code was installed in lib just like the BWidgets package so I thought it should work but it didn't. I decided to run with out wrapping to figure out what was happening. I determined that "lappend auto_path [file join $root lib itk3.3]" needed to be added to the code so it would find the package. With this added to the code I then got a "Can't find a usable itk.tcl in the <..snip..>set the environment variable ITK_LIBRARY<..snip..>" so I added "set env(ITK_LIBRARY) [file join $root lib itk3.3]". At this point the tclkit executable loaded the Itk package from the .vfs tree and seemed to work ok with the Iwidgets catalog application. Thinking that I now had something that should work I wrapped the .vfs into a starkit and tried running it which resulted in the following error. /usr/lib/dld.sl: Call to mmap() failed - TEXT /var/tmp/tcla20568 /usr/lib/dld.sl: Permission denied Apparently the loading of the shared object isn't working after it is wrapped. This is as far as I have gotten. I now need to rebuild gcc on the Solaris systems, get tclkit to build and seed it the load command works on solaris. There are still many issues that need to be resolved with the tclkit, starkit, starpack system but that has not damped my enthusiasm for the starkit project. I hope this helps you understand some of my issues. Best regards, Tom Krehbiel From nicolasb@maich.gr Fri Jul 26 02:34:33 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6Q7YWa04135 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 02:34:33 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Fri Jul 26 11:00:41 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D40FC4A.9070803@maich.gr> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:37:46 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tom Krehbiel CC: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <20020725103022.AAB28985@cas.org> <3D402951.72953540@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I've put up some instructions that walk someone through building startkit/packs under the following url http://www.maich.gr/starkit Hope this helps a bit...I'll try to put it up on the wiki if I have a chance, or someone else feel free.... regards, nicolas boretos > My understanding is that Kitten is just a prototype so I'm inclined not to spend much time on figuring out how to make it work. It > has many problems, not the least of which is that there is no defined structure either for Kitten itself or the packages it > contains. I think our time needs to be spent on gathering documenting information about how to build a starkit and make it work. So > far I have had no success in this regard. A build system that can walk a user through the process is sorely needed. I also think > there will be an need for defining some standard testing for something like Kitten. > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > . > > From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Jul 26 04:53:41 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6Q9rea09242 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 04:53:40 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA11507; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:53:28 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207260953.KAA11507@sole.prd.co.uk> To: Tom Krehbiel cc: Steve Blinkhorn , "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:40:22 PDT." <3D408C66.C8DF3E7@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:53:28 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Do you have or can you get access to a machine with one of the well-supported OSs? I think you may be hitting two different sorts of problem, one connected to building tclkit, the other to do with building starkits. The Windows, Linux and BSD/OS builds I know to be solid enough out of the box, and building tclkit manually is tricky until you get the hang of it. I think getting some experience with starkits on a known-good platform would be time well spent. However, it does look to me that the starkit-related problems you are having are in the general area where I have experienced difficulties myself. So here are some suggestions of things to try. 1. Put any "package require" statements in the main.tcl script in the top level of the VFS. Always "package require starkit" and "package require Tk". If you have a standard Tcl/Tk installation on your system, you can sometimes find that you are accessing files from there when you test before wrapping which are not visible to the wrapped starkit. 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. 3. Make very sure your pkgIndex.tcl files are correct (running "pkg_mkIndex ." works for me). 4. Always test by running "tclkit mystarkit.vfs/main.tcl" from the directory where mystarkit.vfs sits. That way you are more likely to get sensible error messages. 5. If you find it necessary to do 'puts debugging', use a disk file (i.e. outside the starkit) for your debugging messages, and always flush every message to disk straight away - it's easy to write inside the starkit by accident, and then you will think your file is lost. 6. Remember that hardly any other programs you have are VFS-aware: trying to exec some program or other that is in or refers to files inside the starkit will fail. You need to write them out as real disk files first. 7. Don't do a mega-starkit with lots of bells and whistles as your first project. It takes a little time (and humility too) to get an intuitive understanding of how the whole thing works. Start small, with perhaps just one script and one extension, learn how to use the method that way, then gradually extend. 8. Make a note of the insights you have as you gain experience and post them on the list. I'm one of the people who have been quite closely involved in getting the whole tclkit/starkit/starpack project to its present state, and we realise that there are things we take for granted that may stump a newcomer, but we can't know what they are unless you tell us - we're just too close to it all. Be reassured that starkits are not flakey and untried, some quite complex ones are in daily widespread use, though most of the people using them will never have heard of them. We have had problems that seem to resurface now and then - crash-on-exit under NT4.0 plagued me for a while - but once you get the hang of them starkits make life very much easier. I can't remember when I last used an ordinary Tcl/Tk installation, which says quite a lot. Having said that, it is the case that most of the development work was done on Linux, with significant attention to Win32, and my use has been on BSD/OS for development and Win32 for target systems. It is always possible that other Unices have problems we have not seen yet. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jul 26 05:17:24 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QAHOa10323 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 05:17:24 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6QAHGO13330 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 06:17:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6QAHH628822; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 06:17:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 06:17:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020726061717.AAB28102@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-Reply-To: <200207260953.KAA11507@sole.prd.co.uk> of Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:53:28 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (Probably not necessary to keep Cc'ing people - I know it results in me getting two copies of everything...) From: Steve Blinkhorn > 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - > this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in > a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. The default auto_path for tclkit is EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib What is the directory structure , from the program's point of view, of code in a starkit ? This is one of the basic issues that confuses me - to build tcl code, you have to specify the directory from which the extension is going to be executed - I don't know what to specify for --prefix and --exec_prefix . -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jul 26 11:12:23 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QGCNa26032 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:12:23 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA00594 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:12:22 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA17172 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:12:21 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8JHY; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:12:21 -0700 Message-ID: <3D4174E5.28ADA8D5@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:12:21 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Blinkhorn CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <200207260953.KAA11507@sole.prd.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, The directory structure I am using looks like this: test.vfs -> main.tcl (file) -> bin (dir) -> demos (dir) -> bwidget (dir) -> demo.tcl (file) -> iwidgets (dir) -> catalog (file) -> include (dir) -> itk.h (file) -> itkDecls.h (file) -> lib (dir) -> bwidget (dir) -> {lots of files + pkgIndex.tcl} -> itk3.3 (dir) -> Archetype.itk (file) -> Widget.itk (file) -> libitk3.3.sl (file) -> pkgIndex.tcl (file) -> Toplevel.itk (file) -> itk.tcl (file) -> libitkstub3.3.a (file) -> tclIndex (file) > Do you have or can you get access to a machine with one of the > well-supported OSs? No. > 1. Put any "package require" statements in the main.tcl script in the My main.tcl script is where I put package requires. > top level of the VFS. Always "package require starkit" and "package I was not aware that I need a "package require starkit". I started up tclkit and did package require starkit and it returned 1.0. I then added it to my main.tcl, wrapped it and got a "can't find package starkit". > require Tk". If you have a standard Tcl/Tk installation on your > system, you can sometimes find that you are accessing files from there > when you test before wrapping which are not visible to the wrapped > starkit. I'm aware of this problem, have had it in the past but haven't fully tested for it yet with tclkit/starkit. > 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - > this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in > a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. As you can see from above that is what I have done but it doesn't seem to be searching lib. > 3. Make very sure your pkgIndex.tcl files are correct (running > "pkg_mkIndex ." works for me). I haven't created any other than those that come with the packages. > 4. Always test by running "tclkit mystarkit.vfs/main.tcl" from the > directory where mystarkit.vfs sits. That way you are more likely to > get sensible error messages. This is what I have been doing. After I get the code working "unwrapped" I then wrap it and it gives me the load problem. The load problem (on HP, haven't got mk built on Sun yet) is strange since critcl was working a few weeks back. > 5. If you find it necessary to do 'puts debugging', use a disk file > (i.e. outside the starkit) for your debugging messages, and always > flush every message to disk straight away - it's easy to write inside > the starkit by accident, and then you will think your file is lost. Haven't had a need for this yet since I can't load the shared libraries. > 6. Remember that hardly any other programs you have are VFS-aware: > trying to exec some program or other that is in or refers to files > inside the starkit will fail. You need to write them out as real > disk files first. ditto > 7. Don't do a mega-starkit with lots of bells and whistles as your > first project. It takes a little time (and humility too) to get an > intuitive understanding of how the whole thing works. Start small, > with perhaps just one script and one extension, learn how to use the > method that way, then gradually extend. This is what I am doing. > 8. Make a note of the insights you have as you gain experience and > post them on the list. I'm one of the people who have been quite > closely involved in getting the whole tclkit/starkit/starpack project > to its present state, and we realise that there are things we take for > granted that may stump a newcomer, but we can't know what they are > unless you tell us - we're just too close to it all. Your help and advice is appreciated. > Be reassured that starkits are not flakey and untried, some quite > complex ones are in daily widespread use, though most of the people > using them will never have heard of them. We have had problems that > seem to resurface now and then - crash-on-exit under NT4.0 plagued me > for a while - but once you get the hang of them starkits make life > very much easier. I can't remember when I last used an ordinary > Tcl/Tk installation, which says quite a lot. I really like the vfs/metakit method of solving the wrapping problem because it opens up so many other doors. I am commited to making it work if it can be done. > Having said that, it is the case that most of the development work was > done on Linux, with significant attention to Win32, and my use has > been on BSD/OS for development and Win32 for target systems. It is > always possible that other Unices have problems we have not seen yet. This issue isn't just at the tclkit/metakit level it also exists at the tcl/tk and extentions level which is part of my difficulty (am never quite sure where the problem is coming from). Thanks for your reply. Tom Krehbiel. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jul 26 11:23:30 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QGNUa26630 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:23:30 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA01652 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:22:19 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA02422 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:22:02 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8JJF; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:23:29 -0700 Message-ID: <3D417781.60AEC662@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:23:29 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <20020726061717.AAB28102@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - > > this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in > > a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. > > The default auto_path for tclkit is > EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib > > What is the directory structure , from the program's point of view, of code > in a starkit ? This is one of the basic issues that confuses me - to build > tcl code, you have to specify the directory from which the extension is > going to be executed - I don't know what to specify for --prefix and > --exec_prefix . My assumption is that it doesn't make any difference providing the the package that is being built populates "lib" under the prefix. Larry's question is valid however because this is an assumption that needs to be clarified by someone who knows. My current method of adding an extension to a .vfs is to build the extension using some convenient prefix (I don't use --exec_prefix) and then copy the results into the .vfs tree. If this is not the correct way to do things then I would like to know what the correct procedure is. Regards, Tom Krehbiel From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Jul 26 11:36:01 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QGa0a27160 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:36:01 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA13190; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 17:35:58 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207261635.RAA13190@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com cc: steve@prd.co.uk Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 26 Jul 2002 06:17:17 EDT." <20020726061717.AAB28102@cas.org> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 17:35:58 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>"Larry W. Virden" said: > (Probably not necessary to keep Cc'ing people - I know it results in me > getting two copies of everything...) Agreed, but incoming stuff only has the list ID in the cc: field, so sometimes inadvertence triumphs over economy... > > > From: Steve Blinkhorn > > > 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - > > this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in > > a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. > > The default auto_path for tclkit is > EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib > > What is the directory structure , from the program's point of view, of code > in a starkit ? This is one of the basic issues that confuses me - to build > tcl code, you have to specify the directory from which the extension is > going to be executed - I don't know what to specify for --prefix and > --exec_prefix . > -- Yes, this is probably the single most slippery thing about the whole starkit enterprise. Don't take what follows as definitive - I'm really only another user - but I think I have it right. 1. Simple filenames, i.e. with no leading path information, are interpreted as belonging in the current directory. Depending on whether you explicitly cd in the course of execution this may be either a real directory (your current directory when you issued your command line, or the equivalent if you're running from a Win32 desktop) or a directory in the VFS. You have to keep track of where you are, and relative pathnames can be awkward at times. 2. To specify a pathname inside a starkit you can: a) file join [file dirname [info script]], which should return the path to the directory in which the script currently executing resides, but be careful when using 'source'. b) file join [file dirname [info nameofexecutable]], which should return the directory in which a starpack (single file) resides. c) early in the execution of main.tcl, just do [pwd] to find where you are in absolute terms on the machine you are running on. So far as tclkit is concerned, your starkit is just an extension to your directory tree (but remember other programs are not VFS-aware).. So mystarkit looks like a directory rather than a plain file in my Unix file system so far as tclkit is concerned. /usr/home/steve/mystarkit/main.tcl is the script that runs, /usr/home/steve/mystarkit/lib/myextension.so is a shared library containing a binary extension. And so on. Is this the clarification you're looking for, or is it something else? 3. So far as extensions are concerned, use the package mechanism. For instance, in one of my starkits, my main code runs from a bin subdirectory, which has next to it a lib subdirectory. To make sure the extensions are picked up, I run pkg_mkIndex inside the lib subdirectory before wrapping, and ensure that it is seen by this line: lappend auto_path [file join [file dirname [info script]] .. lib] We're beginning to see some local culture emerge slowly concerning what to put where, but one of the recent simplifications is that there must always be a main.tcl in the top-level of the VFS which is the script that is run on startup. bin and lib subdirectories are obvious additions, and I daresay we'll see image and etc subdirectories becoming commonplace. From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Jul 26 11:48:02 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QGm1a27735 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:48:01 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA13256 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 17:48:00 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207261648.RAA13256@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 26 Jul 2002 09:23:29 PDT." <3D417781.60AEC662@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 17:48:00 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>Tom Krehbiel said: > > > 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - > > > this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in > > > a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. > > > > The default auto_path for tclkit is > > EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib > > > > What is the directory structure , from the program's point of view, of cod e > > in a starkit ? This is one of the basic issues that confuses me - to buil d > > tcl code, you have to specify the directory from which the extension is > > going to be executed - I don't know what to specify for --prefix and > > --exec_prefix . > > My assumption is that it doesn't make any difference providing the the packa ge > that is being built populates "lib" under the prefix. Larry's question is > valid however because this is an assumption that needs to be clarified by > someone who knows. > > My current method of adding an extension to a .vfs is to build the extension > using some convenient prefix (I don't use --exec_prefix) and then copy the > results into the .vfs tree. If this is not the correct way to do things then > I would like to know what the correct procedure is. > This is where I may be at a disadvantage - I don't have experience of the problem. The extensions I typically use include BWidgets, various stuff from tcllib, all the stuff in tclhttpd, and some binary extensions of my own that I load explicitly to provide things like encryption. I haven't come across the need to use --prefix and --exec_prefix, so I wonder what I'm missing. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jul 26 12:10:42 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QHAga28982 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 12:10:42 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id KAA22895 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:10:45 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA06689 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:10:40 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8JQC; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:10:38 -0700 Message-ID: <3D41828E.752CFF83@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:10:38 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <200207261648.RAA13256@sole.prd.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Do you mean you run configure with out using the option (i.e. you have root access and use the default locations) or you just don't built any extentions (which you seem to imply)? Tom Krehbiel > > >>>Tom Krehbiel said: > > > > 2. Explicitly "lappend auto_path" the locations of any extensions - > > > > this ought not to be strictly necessary if you put your extensions in > > > > a lib subdirectory in the VFS, but it doesn't do any harm. > > > > > > The default auto_path for tclkit is > > > EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 EXECUTABLE_DIR/tclkit/lib > > > > > > What is the directory structure , from the program's point of view, of cod > e > > > in a starkit ? This is one of the basic issues that confuses me - to buil > d > > > tcl code, you have to specify the directory from which the extension is > > > going to be executed - I don't know what to specify for --prefix and > > > --exec_prefix . > > > > My assumption is that it doesn't make any difference providing the the packa > ge > > that is being built populates "lib" under the prefix. Larry's question is > > valid however because this is an assumption that needs to be clarified by > > someone who knows. > > > > My current method of adding an extension to a .vfs is to build the extension > > using some convenient prefix (I don't use --exec_prefix) and then copy the > > results into the .vfs tree. If this is not the correct way to do things then > > I would like to know what the correct procedure is. > > > > This is where I may be at a disadvantage - I don't have experience of > the problem. The extensions I typically use include BWidgets, > various stuff from tcllib, all the stuff in tclhttpd, and some binary > extensions of my own that I load explicitly to provide things like > encryption. I haven't come across the need to use --prefix and > --exec_prefix, so I wonder what I'm missing. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jul 26 12:26:39 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QHQda29898 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 12:26:39 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6QHQVO12088 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 13:26:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6QHQWW03919; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 13:26:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 13:26:32 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020726132632.AAB3886@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 26 Jul 2002 10:10:38 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: --prefix, ... The configure has a default value for --prefix if one isn't specified at configuration time. During the configuration, the prefix is just just one more value that is expanded into the Makefiles. Then, depending on what the author of the extension does, that value may be embedded into the shared library, into the pkgIndex.tcl, or just used by the Makefile as a target destination. Sounds like to me that most people building starkits are not worrying about that value, and that they then, by hand, move the pieces around into the appropriate directory, hand generate the pkgIndex.tcl, etc. Is that pretty much the picture? Nothing wrong with that I guess - just wasn't clear from the pages how that should happen. For instance, an alternative would be to point the configure via --prefix to the program.vfs directory, build the code, then run make install and let the Makefile put things where they expect to be within the .vfs directory. I'm kind of leaning towards that method - except that I probably will use a really weird directory name so that I can then look through what was installed to see what pieces have the pathname embedded into them. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jul 26 13:05:58 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QI5wa32216 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 13:05:58 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id LAA00686 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:06:00 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA04390 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:04:27 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8JWW; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:05:54 -0700 Message-ID: <3D418F82.F1D053C2@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 11:05:54 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <20020726132632.AAB3886@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > The configure has a default value for --prefix if one isn't specified > at configuration time. During the configuration, the prefix is just just one > more value that is expanded into the Makefiles. Then, depending on > what the author of the extension does, that value may be embedded into the > shared library, into the pkgIndex.tcl, or just used by the Makefile as > a target destination. If the shared library has imbedded paths then I don't think there is any way to fix the problem, this is why the stubs interface stuff was introduced into tcl. It is ofcourse possible to write an extension that doesn't use stubs in which case it wouldn't work. > Sounds like to me that most people building starkits are not worrying about > that value, and that they then, by hand, move the pieces around into the > appropriate directory, hand generate the pkgIndex.tcl, etc. I don't think that it is neccessary to mess with the pkgIndex.tcl file because it uses a variable "dir" that is set at run time. As far as I can tell The stuff in Kitten was just copied into the .vfs. This point however needs to be clarified when Jean-Claude returns from vacation. > Is that pretty much the picture? Nothing wrong with that I guess - just > wasn't clear from the pages how that should happen. > > For instance, an alternative would be to point the configure via --prefix > to the program.vfs directory, build the code, then run make install and > let the Makefile put things where they expect to be within the .vfs directory. > > I'm kind of leaning towards that method - except that I probably will > use a really weird directory name so that I can then look through what > was installed to see what pieces have the pathname embedded into them. I don't want to use the above method because if I have many different applications, I only want to build the extensions once per platform. Regards, Tom Krehbiel From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Jul 26 13:31:03 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QIV2a01257 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 13:31:02 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id TAA13657; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:30:59 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200207261830.TAA13657@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? To: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com (Tom Krehbiel) Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:30:59 +0100 (GMT/BST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <3D418F82.F1D053C2@motorola.com> from "Tom Krehbiel" at Jul 26, 2 11:05:54 am Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Larry, > > > The configure has a default value for --prefix if one isn't specified > > at configuration time. During the configuration, the prefix is just just one > > more value that is expanded into the Makefiles. Then, depending on > > what the author of the extension does, that value may be embedded into the > > shared library, into the pkgIndex.tcl, or just used by the Makefile as > > a target destination. > > If the shared library has imbedded paths then I don't think there is any way to fix the problem, this is why the stubs interface > stuff was introduced into tcl. It is ofcourse possible to write an extension that doesn't use stubs in which case it wouldn't work. > > > Sounds like to me that most people building starkits are not worrying about > > that value, and that they then, by hand, move the pieces around into the > > appropriate directory, hand generate the pkgIndex.tcl, etc. Well, the way I do it is to assemble the files in the .vfs directory by hand, then run pkg_mkIndex as appropriate. I don't think you should be compiling extensions, as it were, direct into the .vfs - it never occurred to me that one would want to do that. I'm getting quite puzzled by this whole thread: perhaps we need a single, simple concrete example rather than something modelled on kitten which is far from typical. Treat a lib subdirectory inside a starkit the way you would treat /usr/local/lib, put the .so there, put any scripts in a suitable subdirectory, create the pkgIndex.tcl to suit and take it from there. > > I don't think that it is neccessary to mess with the pkgIndex.tcl file because it uses a variable "dir" that is set at run time. As > far as I can tell The stuff in Kitten was just copied into the .vfs. This point however needs to be clarified when Jean-Claude > returns from vacation. > > > Is that pretty much the picture? Nothing wrong with that I guess - just > > wasn't clear from the pages how that should happen. > > > > For instance, an alternative would be to point the configure via --prefix > > to the program.vfs directory, build the code, then run make install and > > let the Makefile put things where they expect to be within the .vfs directory. > > > > I'm kind of leaning towards that method - except that I probably will > > use a really weird directory name so that I can then look through what > > was installed to see what pieces have the pathname embedded into them. > > I don't want to use the above method because if I have many different applications, I only want to build the extensions once per > platform. > > Regards, > Tom Krehbiel > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Steve Blinkhorn From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jul 26 13:36:55 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QIasa01571 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 13:36:55 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6QIalO02897 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 14:36:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6QIalI04964; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 14:36:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 14:36:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020726143647.AAB4948@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? In-Reply-To: <200207261830.TAA13657@sole.prd.co.uk> of Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:30:59 +0100 (GMT/BST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Steve Blinkhorn > I'm getting > quite puzzled by this whole thread: perhaps we need a single, simple > concrete example rather than something modelled on kitten which is far > from typical. Treat a lib subdirectory inside a starkit the way you > would treat /usr/local/lib, put the .so there, put any scripts in a > suitable subdirectory, create the pkgIndex.tcl to suit and take it > from there. And there's my point of confusion - I would NEVER put .so's, scripts, etc. into /usr/local/lib by hand - I would use the make install, because I have seen too many times Tcl install scripts do all sorts of bizarre things (sed scripts hacking in paths into the .so files, etc.) ... -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Jul 26 16:09:29 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QL9Sa09191 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:09:28 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id WAA14123 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:09:27 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200207262109.WAA14123@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:09:26 +0100 (GMT/BST) In-Reply-To: <20020726143647.AAB4948@cas.org> from "Larry W. Virden" at Jul 26, 2 02:36:47 pm Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > > From: Steve Blinkhorn > > > I'm getting > > quite puzzled by this whole thread: perhaps we need a single, simple > > concrete example rather than something modelled on kitten which is far > > from typical. Treat a lib subdirectory inside a starkit the way you > > would treat /usr/local/lib, put the .so there, put any scripts in a > > suitable subdirectory, create the pkgIndex.tcl to suit and take it > > from there. > > And there's my point of confusion - I would NEVER put .so's, scripts, etc. > into /usr/local/lib by hand - I would use the make install, because I have > seen too many times Tcl install scripts do all sorts of bizarre things > (sed scripts hacking in paths into the .so files, etc.) ... And I don't trust make install unless I've worked out in detail just what it's going to do - it doesn't come with any guarantee of safety, and it may not suit the way my machine is organised. I'm genuinely intrigued by this: I'd always rather do installation a piece at a time by hand so I know how the whole is organised. If I make my own extension, I have to sort out the installation details, so it seems neither strange nor dangerous to keep control of a starkit by arranging the files manually and using tools like pkg_mkIndex to stitch it all together. However, I suppose there's no good reason why you shouldn't specify places in the .vfs hierarchy as the targets for the installation, but you need to be very sure that absolute pathnames aren't thereby inserted into the configuration. You really do have to specify paths relative to the place the starkit is installed (which could be anywhere in principle), hence the need for constructs like file join [file dirname [info script]] ..., which, which when called from the top level main.tcl gives you just that information. There's no reason extension designers will have taken that into account when they built their installation scripts, so you have to do it for them. I suppose it may become normal for there to be a special installation option for starkits, but I can't see it any time soon. I don't recall this issue arising when jcw, Steve Landers and I were discussing what basic information a newcomer would need to get going, and I suspect it's an unspoken set of assumptions we hadn't anticipated. The critical issue is whether the installation process inserts absolute pathnames, or indeed pathnames relative to anywhere on a real disk. If it does, you're sunk. The whole point of the tclkit+starkit combination is that it's self-contained and can go anywhere whereas classic Tcl/Tk deployment assumes that everything is stored in known places. Think of it like this. You can put a typical starkit and tclkit on a floppy, take them to any machine running a compatible OS, put them anywhere on that machine's file system - or indeed leave them on the floppy -and run without difficulty or the need for any other supporting files. Tclkit knows where its own extensions live (tclkit is itself a starkit), your starkit needs to know where its extensions live, there is no presupposition about how those files are arranged other than that the top level main.tcl is to be interpreted at launch, unlike some other wrapping methods there isn't an enforced or assumed layout. So you have to get the pkgIndex.tcl scripts right, by hand if need be, if you want to use the package mechanism. Sorry to go on at such length, I just want to make sure I explain myself well. It's perfectly possible to build a starkit with no subdirectory structure, i.e. with everything in the top level of the .vfs before wrapping, or with a complex and sophisticated subdirectory structure: your choice. Nothing is mandated by default except that main.tcl script. We thought that was an advantage.... -- Steve Blinkhorn From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jul 26 18:08:33 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6QN8Xa13493 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 18:08:33 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id QAA12034 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:08:32 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA00341 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:07:04 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8KRZ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:08:10 -0700 Message-ID: <3D41D65A.69727344@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:08:10 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? References: <200207262109.WAA14123@sole.prd.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Blinkhorn wrote: > > > > > > > From: Steve Blinkhorn > > > > > I'm getting > > > quite puzzled by this whole thread: perhaps we need a single, simple > > > concrete example rather than something modelled on kitten which is far > > > from typical. Treat a lib subdirectory inside a starkit the way you > > > would treat /usr/local/lib, put the .so there, put any scripts in a > > > suitable subdirectory, create the pkgIndex.tcl to suit and take it > > > from there. > > > > And there's my point of confusion - I would NEVER put .so's, scripts, etc. > > into /usr/local/lib by hand - I would use the make install, because I have > > seen too many times Tcl install scripts do all sorts of bizarre things > > (sed scripts hacking in paths into the .so files, etc.) ... > > And I don't trust make install unless I've worked out in detail just > what it's going to do - it doesn't come with any guarantee of safety, Installs using the gnu tools is normally safe now days. You have indicated that you do your builds and installs as root which is a bad practice for two reasons. 1) The build and install can trash your system 2) It won't find problem that customers will have if they need to build your code. This of course is import for distribution to other developers and not so much for bound executables. > and it may not suit the way my machine is organised. I'm genuinely > intrigued by this: I'd always rather do installation a piece at a time > by hand so I know how the whole is organised. If I make my own > extension, I have to sort out the installation details, so it seems > neither strange nor dangerous to keep control of a starkit by > arranging the files manually and using tools like pkg_mkIndex to > stitch it all together. > > However, I suppose there's no good reason why you shouldn't specify > places in the .vfs hierarchy as the targets for the installation, but > you need to be very sure that absolute pathnames aren't thereby > inserted into the configuration. You really do have to specify paths > relative to the place the starkit is installed (which could be > anywhere in principle), hence the need for constructs like > file join [file dirname [info script]] ..., which, which when called from > the top level main.tcl gives you just that information. There's no reason > extension designers will have taken that into account when they built > their installation scripts, so you have to do it for them. I suppose > it may become normal for there to be a special installation option for > starkits, but I can't see it any time soon. > > I don't recall this issue arising when jcw, Steve Landers and I were > discussing what basic information a newcomer would need to get going, > and I suspect it's an unspoken set of assumptions we hadn't > anticipated. The critical issue is whether the installation process > inserts absolute pathnames, or indeed pathnames relative to anywhere > on a real disk. If it does, you're sunk. The whole point of the > tclkit+starkit combination is that it's self-contained and can go Actually tclkit and there for tclkit+starkit are not completely self contained. If you use ldd (or chatr on HP) you will see that the executable still contains hard paths to the OS libraries. This is normally not a problem but it is a potential source of confusion if you distribute to an environment that has a nonstandard OS installation. > anywhere whereas classic Tcl/Tk deployment assumes that everything is > stored in known places. Think of it like this. You can put a > typical starkit and tclkit on a floppy, take them to any machine > running a compatible OS, put them anywhere on that machine's file > system - or indeed leave them on the floppy -and run without > difficulty or the need for any other supporting files. Tclkit knows > where its own extensions live (tclkit is itself a starkit), your > starkit needs to know where its extensions live, there is no > presupposition about how those files are arranged other than that the > top level main.tcl is to be interpreted at launch, unlike some other > wrapping methods there isn't an enforced or assumed layout. So you > have to get the pkgIndex.tcl scripts right, by hand if need be, if you > want to use the package mechanism. > > Sorry to go on at such length, I just want to make sure I explain > myself well. It's perfectly possible to build a starkit with no > subdirectory structure, i.e. with everything in the top level of the > .vfs before wrapping, or with a complex and sophisticated subdirectory > structure: your choice. Nothing is mandated by default except that > main.tcl script. We thought that was an advantage.... From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jul 26 21:09:34 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@i219-066.nv.iinet.net.au [203.59.219.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g6R29Qa16922 for ; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 21:09:33 -0500 Received: (qmail 5694 invoked by uid 8); 27 Jul 2002 02:09:21 -0000 Received: from pc-00061 (192.168.1.61, claiming to be "[192.168.1.61]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdbeSKfp; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:09:15 EDT From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:08:51 +0800 Message-Id: <20020727020851.29317@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D41D65A.69727344@motorola.com> References: <3D41D65A.69727344@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0b3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: (I noticed the discussion, and though I'm on vacation and unable to follow closely and track things on a regular basis, I thought I'd jump in while I can...) >> > From: Steve Blinkhorn >> > >> > > I'm getting >> > > quite puzzled by this whole thread: perhaps we need a single, simple >> > > concrete example rather than something modelled on kitten which is far >> > > from typical. Treat a lib subdirectory inside a starkit the way you >> > > would treat /usr/local/lib, put the .so there, put any scripts in a >> > > suitable subdirectory, create the pkgIndex.tcl to suit and take it >> > > from there. One way to do that, is to follow the example on Then, look at the unwrapped hello.vfs/main.tcl and see how it works. Part of the confusion may be that things have changed in the last 3 weeks, and that kitten is indeed a one-off messy trial, no more. Let me try to clarify a few points: - the "scripdoc" package is still part of tclkit, but deprecated - likewise, "myapp.vfs/bin/main.tcl" can still be used but it's deprecated - the latest "sdx.kit" creates a slightly different file header, and works with a new package called "starkit" (no longer "package require scripdoc") - the new starkit package is much simpler and more powerful, it hinges on the fact that startup always goes through "myapp.vfs/main.tcl", whether launched as starkit, as starpack, or in unpacked mode - the first two lines of "myapp.vfs/main.tcl" are now usually: package require starkit if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return - the rest can be anything, but I tend to add a single line: package require app-myapp then put my own code in a package called "app-myapp" (s/myapp//) - the main effect of those first two lines is to extend auto_path with a directory "myapp.vfs/lib/", so packages there are found automatically The essential aspect of all these changes is that *all* uses of such a starkit, whether wrapped, starpacked, or unpacked, is that the code in main.tcl always gets executed, so you can rely on auto_path *always* being set up right. In a nutshell: if you use the latest CVS code of tclkit, and follow the above, you'll have the least confusing setup IMO. The old startup mode, the old "sdx.bin", and the "scripdoc" package are there just for backward compatibility reasons. Several more notes: - sdx.kit creates a read-only starkit by default now, use the new "- writable" option when running wrap if you want to be able to write into the VFS mounted starkit (this is why "kitten -u" is broken for the time being) - the read-only mounting of starkits is a new design choice, I'm looking into a way to re-mount starkits as r/w during use, but it's not there yet - the "if {[starkit::startup] ...} return" line is a trick so that one can source a starkit, and all it'll do is mount, set up auto_path, and return - hence make its packages available without actually running the starkit. - keep in mind that mounted starkits can end up being run anywhere, so *anything* that relies on fixed paths will break - it's a consequence of letting users decide where to run starkits (and it means shared libs can NOT assume anything, nor have fixed paths built in) - hard paths will need some serious work, if some platforms really need them (some sort of on-the-fly patching, while they get copied out to temp, perhaps) - building shared libs has not been well-defined yet, so far I just build in a special basic Tcl/Tk installation area I keep around on each platform, and then move things into my blah.vfs/lib/ areas, fixing pkgIndex.tcl files and such if the extensions were doing nasty things - the problems with itcl/itk/iwidgets are probably caused by the fact that tclkit includes itcl 3.3, while kitten still has old 3.2 builds - it'll be fixed once kitten gets re-done properly - the scripdoc::extendPath mechanism is still available, but deprecated, a new structure is being worked out, which meshes more with what CriTcl does - lastly, may I suggest that if you are wondering about specific aspects of what tclkits or starkits are doing, then please look inside... all you need to do is "cp tclkit tcopy; sdx unwrap tcopy" then look at "tcopy.vfs/lib/vfs/*.tcl" to see what is going on inside, it's all plain Tcl, no magic whatsoever >> anywhere whereas classic Tcl/Tk deployment assumes that everything is >> stored in known places. Think of it like this. You can put a >> typical starkit and tclkit on a floppy, take them to any machine >> running a compatible OS, put them anywhere on that machine's file >> system - or indeed leave them on the floppy -and run without >> difficulty or the need for any other supporting files. Tclkit knows >> where its own extensions live (tclkit is itself a starkit), your >> starkit needs to know where its extensions live, there is no >> presupposition about how those files are arranged other than that the >> top level main.tcl is to be interpreted at launch, unlike some other >> wrapping methods there isn't an enforced or assumed layout. So you >> have to get the pkgIndex.tcl scripts right, by hand if need be, if you >> want to use the package mechanism. >> >> Sorry to go on at such length, I just want to make sure I explain >> myself well. It's perfectly possible to build a starkit with no >> subdirectory structure, i.e. with everything in the top level of the >> .vfs before wrapping, or with a complex and sophisticated subdirectory >> structure: your choice. Nothing is mandated by default except that >> main.tcl script. We thought that was an advantage.... The above is worth repeating, IMO. All a starkit does, is contain a dir hierarchy (even if just a flat one) which gets "mounted". That mount point happens to be the same spot as the starkit itself - in other words, file "/path/to/my/starkit.kit" ends up becoming *dir* "/path/to/my/ starkit.kit/" while in use, with things like "/path/to/my/starkit.kit/ lib/" being a preferred place to put packages, because that's what "starkit::startup" will set up for you, but it's all 100% wide open and totally scripted/inspectable. The whole problem seems to be that things have become too flexible - we now seem to be moving to standardizing structures so it becomes less confusing. Please don't stop pushing boundaries and rattling the starkit cage, things really need to be worked out further. Nothing is set in stone, and even less has been properly documented. It'd be great if we can hit all the main issues and resolve them before the September 2002 build of what I hope will be Tcl/Tk 8.4 final. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jul 27 05:43:01 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6RAh0a22863 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 05:43:00 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6RAgrO03203 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:42:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6RAgsJ04440; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:42:54 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:42:54 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020727064254.AAB4400@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It appears that, at least in the current kitten, one of the issues that is being addressed is this: lib/extension_name/tcl_scripts lib/arch/Platformname/extension_name/pkgIndex.tcl and shared libraries This is a good construct. It saves you from having full copies of everything installed once for each machine. It does mean that one needs to be cautious about how the pkgIndex.tcl is constructed - you have to have some way of naming the platform that will work on any compatible deployment of that machine (the $::tcl_platform array name for the machine seems best here) and you may have to worry about what OS is being used, and even about incompatibility between OS versions as well. These are all issues for anyone deploying software - starkit doesn't solve the need to think about these things - and no one ever claimed it would. I just want to make certain that people doing this for the first time know to think about these things. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jul 27 05:52:01 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6RAq1a22976 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 05:52:01 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6RApsO04066 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:51:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6RAptF04536; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:51:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:51:55 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020727065155.AAB4530@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] some changes to kitten that I would suggest Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: 1. Move the tix8.2/pkgIndex.tcl into lib/arch/Linux/ directory 2. Move the lib/*.so files into the appropriate lib/arch/ subdirectory - are these Windows or Linux files? 3. Modify the corresponding pkgIndex.tcl files to reflect the move in item 2. This would bring a bit more consistency to the package layout. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From frank@canyon-medical.com Sat Jul 27 06:37:22 2002 Received: from mail3.centurytel.net (mail3.centurytel.net [209.142.136.99]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6RBbLa23418 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:37:21 -0500 Received: from aSqueakSystem (pppoe0005.sm.centurytel.net [209.142.160.134]) by mail3.centurytel.net (8.12.5/8.12.5) with SMTP id g6RBbKak000609 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:37:21 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <200207271137.g6RBbKak000609@mail3.centurytel.net> X-Mailer: Celeste 2.0.4599 Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 06:23:05 -0600 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone building kitten-like starkits? To: starkit@equi4.com From: Frank Sergeant Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Blinkhorn wrote: > Sorry to go on at such length, I just want to make sure I explain > myself well. No, no, that was great. Thank you. It helps me get a clearer picture of how it all works. -- Frank From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Sat Jul 27 16:38:58 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6RLcva30889 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 16:38:58 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id OAA27879 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 14:39:02 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA21344 for ; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 14:39:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (RNA020-D1 [172.16.100.122]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8L13; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 14:38:56 -0700 Message-ID: <3D4312EF.64FEED33@motorola.com> Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 14:38:56 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: Motorola Semiconductor Products Sector X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en]C-MOT45 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout References: <20020727064254.AAB4400@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > It does mean that one needs to be cautious about how the pkgIndex.tcl is > constructed - you have to have some way of naming the platform that will > work on any compatible deployment of that machine (the $::tcl_platform > array name for the machine seems best here) and you may have to worry > about what OS is being used, and even about incompatibility between OS > versions as well. It seems to me that a combination of tcl_platform(os) and tcl_platform(version) would be more appropreate than tcl_platform(machine), if that was what you were suggesting. Tom Krehbiel From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jul 29 11:22:22 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6TGMMa16041 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 11:22:22 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA07914 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:22:26 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA19517 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:22:20 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8MDL; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:22:16 -0700 Message-ID: <3D456BB8.EEAC9B87@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:22:16 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout References: <20020727064254.AAB4400@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > It appears that, at least in the current kitten, one of the issues that > is being addressed is this: > > lib/extension_name/tcl_scripts > lib/arch/Platformname/extension_name/pkgIndex.tcl and shared libraries > > This is a good construct. It saves you from having full copies of everything > installed once for each machine. I would like to propose the following changes to the directory structure. .vfs main.tcl --> bin --> .tcl --> doc --> --> ? ...? --> generic --> --> ? ...? --> lib --> noarch --> --> ? ...? --> --> --> ? ...? where: main.tcl = entry point for the application. Normally would do option processing etc. and then run a script in the bin directory. bin = contains any top level scripts used by the application. doc = Documentation organized on a per package basis. generic = This contains .c and .h source files that are used by the critcl system organized on a per package basis. lib/noarch = This contains platform independent tcl code organized on a per package basis. = "$tcl_platform(os)_$tcl_platform(osVersion)" / = This contains all platform specific files. One of the questions I have is, how do links work inside a starkit? This is an important question because it will be common for several platforms to share the same lib code. As an example: lib --> SunOS_5.7 --> myapp --> SunOS_5.8 --> myapp {link to lib/SunOS_5.7 } Regards, Tom Krehbiel From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Mon Jul 29 11:51:15 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6TGpFa18185 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 11:51:15 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id RAA26801 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:51:13 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200207291651.RAA26801@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:51:13 +0100 (GMT/BST) In-Reply-To: <3D456BB8.EEAC9B87@motorola.com> from "Tom Krehbiel" at Jul 29, 2 09:22:16 am Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, let me answer your question below here. Links *don't* work inside a starkit - not least because they won't work on Win32, so any starkits which, per impossibile, had links in them wouldn't be cross-platform, which rather defeats the object. Remember, starkit is essentially zip technology at the file level. So when you design the layout of a starkit, you do it in such a way that you minimise the number of copies of each file needed. That's why organising things on a per-platform basis should really only be done wrt shared libraries and the like. With binary extensions, for instance, I test for the current platform and tag the appropriate extension onto a filename to load it. So far as I can, I structure the starkit around the logical structure of the scripts, and make sure they do the work of finding and loading the right binaries. One place *symbolic* links are very handy in *building* a starkit was pointed out to me by Steve Landers. It's particularly helpful if you use RCS for revision control. Keep all your scripts, shared libraries etc, in the directory in which your .vfs file is going to live. Build your .vfs by adding symbolic links to the real files. Then when you wrap your .vfs, sdx.kit will make copies of the real files as it builds the tclkit. The *must* be symbolic links - doing this with hard links just causes problems. To build your starkit, write a little shell script like this: co main.tcl (symlinked to mykit.vfs/main.tcl) co mylib.so (symlinked to mykit.vfs/lib/mylib.so) co myscript.tcl (and so on) sdx wrap mykit rm main.tcl rm mylib.so rm myscript.tcl OK, so you wouldn't put mylib.so under RCS in quite that way, but you get the idea. It makes for clearer semantic space in your head and the relevant directory. > > Larry, > > > It appears that, at least in the current kitten, one of the issues that > > is being addressed is this: > > > > lib/extension_name/tcl_scripts > > lib/arch/Platformname/extension_name/pkgIndex.tcl and shared libraries > > > > This is a good construct. It saves you from having full copies of everything > > installed once for each machine. > > I would like to propose the following changes to the directory structure. > > .vfs > main.tcl > --> bin > --> .tcl > --> doc > --> > --> ? ...? > --> generic > --> > --> ? ...? > --> lib > --> noarch > --> > --> ? ...? > --> > --> > --> ? ...? > > where: > main.tcl = entry point for the application. Normally would do option processing etc. and then run a script in the bin directory. > bin = contains any top level scripts used by the application. > doc = Documentation organized on a per package basis. > generic = This contains .c and .h source files that are used by the critcl system organized on a per package basis. > lib/noarch = This contains platform independent tcl code organized on a per package basis. > = "$tcl_platform(os)_$tcl_platform(osVersion)" > / = This contains all platform specific files. > > One of the questions I have is, how do links work inside a starkit? This is an important question because it will be common for > several platforms to share the same lib code. As an example: > > lib > --> SunOS_5.7 > --> myapp > --> SunOS_5.8 > --> myapp {link to lib/SunOS_5.7 } > > Regards, > Tom Krehbiel > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Steve Blinkhorn From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jul 29 13:59:07 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6TIx7a27344 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 13:59:07 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id LAA13203 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 11:59:12 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA03621 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 11:57:34 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC8MWN; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 11:59:05 -0700 Message-ID: <3D459079.3D1B9ACA@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 11:59:05 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout References: <200207291651.RAA26801@sole.prd.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, > Tom, let me answer your question below here. Links *don't* work > inside a starkit - not least because they won't work on Win32, so any > starkits which, per impossibile, had links in them wouldn't be > cross-platform, which rather defeats the object. Remember, starkit > is essentially zip technology at the file level. So when you design > the layout of a starkit, you do it in such a way that you minimise the > number of copies of each file needed. That's why organising things > on a per-platform basis should really only be done wrt shared > libraries and the like. With binary extensions, for instance, I test > for the current platform and tag the appropriate extension onto a > filename to load it. So far as I can, I structure the starkit around > the logical structure of the scripts, and make sure they do the work > of finding and loading the right binaries. My link question need to be answered by the starkit developers. A starkit is not essentially zip technology, zip technology just makes the kit smaller. The heart of the starkit technology is the virtual file system (vfs) interface. This interface may or may not support links and has nothing to do with the os that is being used. I ran an experiment on my unix box and linking does work in starkits under unix at least. The root of my question has to do with how a starkit is processed when it is wrapped. My current understanding is that the contents of .vfs directory is placed in a MetaKit database (which compresses files using zip). The MetaKit is created so that it preserves knowledge of the directory structure. The starkit vfs interface is then used to mount the database and responses to all file system calls (through the mount point) as thought it were talking to a real file system. If links are detected at the time the MetaKit database is created, then it is possible for knowledge about them to be stored in the database and used by the vfs interface (note this is independent of the os). So the question is, does a starkit contain explicit link information? Regards, Tom K. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jul 30 04:25:12 2002 Received: from smarthost0.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost0.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6U9PBa07977 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 04:25:12 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost0.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17ZTFe-0003YF-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 10:25:10 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020730102208.03b3dc70@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 10:25:09 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout In-Reply-To: <200207291651.RAA26801@sole.prd.co.uk> References: <3D456BB8.EEAC9B87@motorola.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Tom, I'd like to add that links *don't* work inside a starkit now, but they could easily be made to work, if we so desire. This would, of course, depend on that underlying vfs-implementation supporting links. Adding link-support to tclvfs (i.e. vfs.c) would take only about 10 lines of code. Then it would be exposed to Tcl and if mk4vfs could support links then it can be done. So: can the mk4 'filesystem' (be modified to) support links? If it can, then starkits could _easily_ be made to support links. cheers, Vince. At 05:51 PM 7/29/2002 +0100, Steve Blinkhorn wrote: >Tom, let me answer your question below here. Links *don't* work >inside a starkit - not least because they won't work on Win32, so any >starkits which, per impossibile, had links in them wouldn't be >cross-platform, which rather defeats the object. Remember, starkit >is essentially zip technology at the file level. So when you design >the layout of a starkit, you do it in such a way that you minimise the >number of copies of each file needed. That's why organising things >on a per-platform basis should really only be done wrt shared >libraries and the like. With binary extensions, for instance, I test >for the current platform and tag the appropriate extension onto a >filename to load it. So far as I can, I structure the starkit around >the logical structure of the scripts, and make sure they do the work >of finding and loading the right binaries. > >One place *symbolic* links are very handy in *building* a starkit was >pointed out to me by Steve Landers. It's particularly helpful if you >use RCS for revision control. > >Keep all your scripts, shared libraries etc, in the directory in which >your .vfs file is going to live. Build your .vfs by adding symbolic >links to the real files. Then when you wrap your .vfs, sdx.kit will >make copies of the real files as it builds the tclkit. The *must* be >symbolic links - doing this with hard links just causes problems. >To build your starkit, write a little shell script like this: > >co main.tcl (symlinked to mykit.vfs/main.tcl) >co mylib.so (symlinked to mykit.vfs/lib/mylib.so) >co myscript.tcl (and so on) >sdx wrap mykit >rm main.tcl >rm mylib.so >rm myscript.tcl > >OK, so you wouldn't put mylib.so under RCS in quite that way, but you >get the idea. It makes for clearer semantic space in your head and >the relevant directory. > > > > Larry, > > > > > It appears that, at least in the current kitten, one of the issues that > > > is being addressed is this: > > > > > > lib/extension_name/tcl_scripts > > > lib/arch/Platformname/extension_name/pkgIndex.tcl and shared libraries > > > > > > This is a good construct. It saves you from having full copies of > everything > > > installed once for each machine. > > > > I would like to propose the following changes to the directory structure. > > > > .vfs > > main.tcl > > --> bin > > --> .tcl > > --> doc > > --> > > --> ? ...? > > --> generic > > --> > > --> ? ...? > > --> lib > > --> noarch > > --> > > --> ? ...? > > --> > > --> > > --> ? ...? > > > > where: > > main.tcl = entry point for the application. Normally would do option > processing etc. and then run a script in the bin directory. > > bin = contains any top level scripts used by the application. > > doc = Documentation organized on a per package basis. > > generic = This contains .c and .h source files that are used by the > critcl system organized on a per package basis. > > lib/noarch = This contains platform independent tcl code organized on a > per package basis. > > = "$tcl_platform(os)_$tcl_platform(osVersion)" > > / = This contains all platform specific files. > > > > One of the questions I have is, how do links work inside a starkit? > This is an important question because it will be common for > > several platforms to share the same lib code. As an example: > > > > lib > > --> SunOS_5.7 > > --> myapp > > --> SunOS_5.8 > > --> myapp {link to lib/SunOS_5.7 } > > > > Regards, > > Tom Krehbiel > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > >-- >Steve Blinkhorn >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 30 10:50:17 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6UFoGa01376 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 10:50:16 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA23774 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:50:22 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA14658 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:48:42 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC832W; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:50:15 -0700 Message-ID: <3D46B5B6.89373B95@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:50:14 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout References: <3D456BB8.EEAC9B87@motorola.com> <5.1.1.5.0.20020730102208.03b3dc70@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince, > I'd like to add that links *don't* work inside a starkit now, but they Hmm? When I ran the test on unix they seemed to work. I created a main.tcl that sourced a file linkfile.tcl that was really a link (created with ln -s). The linkfile.tcl link pointed to a file file.tcl that printed "hello world". This code worked after I wrapped it into a starkit. Am I missing something important or do links in starkits work on unix but not on windows (which is what I think is the case). > could easily be made to work, if we so desire. This would, of course, > depend on that underlying vfs-implementation supporting links. Adding > link-support to tclvfs (i.e. vfs.c) would take only about 10 lines of > code. Then it would be exposed to Tcl and if mk4vfs could support links > then it can be done. > > So: can the mk4 'filesystem' (be modified to) support links? If it can, > then starkits could _easily_ be made to support links. Your comments confirm what I suspected. I think that link support will be an absolutely essential feature to allow starkits to be built so they can support multiple platforms. If links aren't available then the uses of directory names that are tied to a platform type becomes pretty much useless because os versions are normally upwards compatible and therefore code can normally be used across a range of os versions so they can all be linked to the same code. However this is not always the case, 32 vs. 64 bit support is a good example. If the code is was written as a 32 bit application and then upgraded to 64 bit then 2 version would exist that would need to be selected based on the os version. Tom Krehbiel From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Wed Jul 31 06:30:05 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6VBU4a25582 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:30:04 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA05500 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 12:30:02 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200207311130.MAA05500@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 12:30:02 +0100 (GMT/BST) In-Reply-To: <3D46B5B6.89373B95@motorola.com> from "Tom Krehbiel" at Jul 30, 2 08:50:14 am Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Vince, > > > I'd like to add that links *don't* work inside a starkit now, but they > > Hmm? When I ran the test on unix they seemed to work. I created a main.tcl that sourced a file linkfile.tcl that was really a link > (created with ln -s). The linkfile.tcl link pointed to a file file.tcl that printed "hello world". This code worked after I wrapped > it into a starkit. Am I missing something important or do links in starkits work on unix but not on windows (which is what I think > is the case). Distinguish between links in the process of building a starkit and what's in the starkit. Add the -verbose flag when you wrap and you'll see that sdx is taking a copy of the file the link refers to (which is why the technique of building a .vfs out of symlinks works). The same happens with hard links. Each directory entry in the .vfs results in a copy of a file being added to the kit. 10 links in the .vfs turns into 10 copies of the file. Test with a very short text file, then just cat the kit onto your screen and you'll see the content twice. > > > could easily be made to work, if we so desire. This would, of course, > > depend on that underlying vfs-implementation supporting links. Adding > > link-support to tclvfs (i.e. vfs.c) would take only about 10 lines of > > code. Then it would be exposed to Tcl and if mk4vfs could support links > > then it can be done. > > > > So: can the mk4 'filesystem' (be modified to) support links? If it can, > > then starkits could _easily_ be made to support links. > > Your comments confirm what I suspected. I think that link support will be an absolutely essential feature to allow starkits to be > built so they can support multiple platforms. If links aren't available then the uses of directory names that are tied to a platform > type becomes pretty much useless because os versions are normally upwards compatible and therefore code can normally be used across > a range of os versions so they can all be linked to the same code. However this is not always the case, 32 vs. 64 bit support is a > good example. If the code is was written as a 32 bit application and then upgraded to 64 bit then 2 version would exist that would > need to be selected based on the os version. > > Tom Krehbiel > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Steve Blinkhorn From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 31 08:21:33 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6VDLXa32139 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:21:33 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g6VDLQO06341 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:21:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g6VDLQO09379; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:21:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:21:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020731092126.AAB9352@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout In-Reply-To: <200207311130.MAA05500@sole.prd.co.uk> of Wed, 31 Jul 2002 12:30:02 +0100 (GMT/BST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've started a wiki page to discuss a proposed install directory structure (where a tcl application or extension would reside). This directory structure might be very close to a starkit's directory structure. Feel free to chime in with opinions. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Aug 8 11:45:14 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g78GjEa19016 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 11:45:14 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA14993 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 09:45:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA03133 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 09:45:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC80CT; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 09:45:12 -0700 Message-ID: <3D52A018.2FE771C7@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 08 Aug 2002 09:45:12 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com References: <20020731092126.AAB9352@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Test Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Test message. Tom Krehbiel From lvirden@cas.org Thu Aug 8 11:54:35 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g78GsYa19778 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 11:54:34 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g78GsRO08215 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 12:54:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g78GsRK28603; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 12:54:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2002 12:54:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020808125427.AAB28590@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Test In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 08 Aug 2002 09:45:12 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Your test was successful - Apparently no one has much to say right now. And things were going so well there for a few days... -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Aug 8 12:19:40 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g78HJea21787 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 12:19:40 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id KAA18282 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:19:39 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA21696 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:17:54 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC80H4; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:19:38 -0700 Message-ID: <3D52A82A.6A979AC3@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 08 Aug 2002 10:19:38 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com, andreask@ActiveState.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Test References: <20020808125427.AAB28590@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The list got so quite that I began wandering if I was still signed up. Does anyone know when JCW is returning from vacation? I quit working on some of the problems I was having because I needed to get some other work done but I will start up again when he returns. -tjk From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Aug 8 12:22:47 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g78HMla22051 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 12:22:47 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g78HMZu03859; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:22:35 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g78HMZ222751; Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:22:35 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Tom Krehbiel" , "Larry W. Virden" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Test Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2002 10:22:35 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: <3D52A82A.6A979AC3@motorola.com> X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JCW should be back around Aug 19. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join Tcl'2002 in Vancouver http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ ** Registration is open ** > -----Original Message----- > From: rna020@pobox4.mot.com [mailto:rna020@pobox4.mot.com]On Behalf Of > Tom Krehbiel > Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 10:20 AM > To: Larry W. Virden > Cc: starkit@equi4.com; andreask@ActiveState.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Test > > > The list got so quite that I began wandering if I was still > signed up. Does anyone know when JCW is returning from vacation? I quit > working on some of the problems I was having because I needed to > get some other work done but I will start up again when he returns. > > -tjk > From nicolasb@maich.gr Fri Aug 9 06:08:20 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g79B8Ja12916 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 06:08:19 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Fri Aug 09 14:35:42 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D53A383.6000202@maich.gr> Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 14:12:03 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, Have tried to update a tclkit based app from an OLD version of tclkit (8.4a1 based), I believe from ~September 2000 to the latest version, but getting alot of crashes. I've narrowed it down to the fact that the OLD tclkit did not mind calls to a non-existing db.table, and did not crash on exit. The new tclkits still do not mind the above calls, but crash on exit. ##Test crash on exit % mk::file open exe C:/scripdoc-utils/tclkit.exe % set c [mk::view size test.table] 0 % exit Bad coding aside, this approach made it very convenient to initialize application variables to point to the begining of tables, without worrying whether the file was newley created (existing) or not. So my question is basically whether this is considered normal/designed behavior in the newer releases. regards, nicolas boretos From lvirden@cas.org Fri Aug 9 06:37:23 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g79BbNa14003 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 06:37:23 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g79BbGO20657 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 07:37:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g79BbHx25963; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 07:37:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 07:37:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020809073717.AAB25954@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 09 Aug 2002 14:12:03 +0300 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've seen discussion around the Tcl community about crashes on exit. I think that an upgrade of the tclkit to the latest tcl/tk may fix that problem. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Aug 9 06:45:41 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g79Bjfa14400 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 06:45:41 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id MAA15056 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 12:45:38 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200208091145.MAA15056@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 12:45:38 +0100 (GMT/BST) In-Reply-To: <20020809073717.AAB25954@cas.org> from "Larry W. Virden" at Aug 9, 2 07:37:17 am Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > I've seen discussion around the Tcl community about crashes on exit. > I think that an upgrade of the tclkit to the latest tcl/tk may fix that > problem. > -- The tclkit crash-on-exit problem that haunted us for a long time only occurred on Windows NT, and we *believe* that it has been fixed with the arrival of the latest VFS code, but we're not altogether sure, because we thought it had been eliminated a couple of times before. I'm not aware of any discussion of crash-on-exit being related to this sort of thing - we did see it in the context of files in the VFS and had to code very carefully (and empirically) for a while. -- Steve Blinkhorn From nicolasb@maich.gr Fri Aug 9 07:07:22 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g79C7Ka15448 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 07:07:21 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Fri Aug 09 15:34:44 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D53B159.8070801@maich.gr> Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 15:11:05 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? References: <20020809073717.AAB25954@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I've seen discussion around the Tcl community about crashes on exit. > I think that an upgrade of the tclkit to the latest tcl/tk may fix that > problem. Hi, I'm not sure I understand. It is the recent version that causes the crash I am experiencing. And BTW, this is on WinXP and Win2K regards, nicolas From lvirden@cas.org Fri Aug 9 07:44:58 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g79Ciwa17230 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 07:44:58 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g79CipO06114 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 08:44:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g79CiqY26645; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 08:44:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 08:44:52 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020809084451.AAB26636@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 09 Aug 2002 15:11:05 +0300 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: most recent version causing problem What I am saying is that it may be that the latest tclkit has a bug in it, and that a new release of tclkit is required. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Aug 9 09:57:23 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g79EvMa24834 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:57:22 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id PAA15550 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 15:57:21 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200208091457.PAA15550@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 15:57:20 +0100 (GMT/BST) Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It may just be that you've put your finger on one of the circumstances in which crash-on-exit happens that wasn't spotted before. It needs Jean-Claude's attention, though. The more you can tie down which versions of tclkit do what the better: so far as I have been able to tell, crash-on-exit never did any harm, but it wasn't pretty and you don't want users in general to have to tolerate that sort of thing. -- Steve Blinkhorn From gay@sfu.ca Fri Aug 9 11:53:51 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g79Grpa01063 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 11:53:51 -0500 Received: from fraser.sfu.ca (gay@fraser.sfu.ca [142.58.101.25]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3/SFU-6.0H) with ESMTP id g79GrnmC007797 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:53:49 -0700 (PDT) From: "Ian D. Gay" Received: (from gay@localhost) by fraser.sfu.ca (8.9.2/8.9.2/SFU-5.0C) id JAA08334 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:53:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200208091653.JAA08334@fraser.sfu.ca> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? (fwd) To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 09:53:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL4] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Forwarded message: > > > > I've seen discussion around the Tcl community about crashes on exit. > > I think that an upgrade of the tclkit to the latest tcl/tk may fix that > > problem. > > -- > > The tclkit crash-on-exit problem that haunted us for a long time only > occurred on Windows NT, and we *believe* that it has been fixed with > the arrival of the latest VFS code, but we're not altogether sure, > because we thought it had been eliminated a couple of times before. > I'm not aware of any discussion of crash-on-exit being related to this > sort of thing - we did see it in the context of files in the VFS and > had to code very carefully (and empirically) for a while. > > -- > Steve Blinkhorn A while back I reported crash-on-exit problems when a kit contained a binary extension. At that time I had only tried Win98. I can now say that the same crash occurs on ME, but _not_ on NT. Haven't tried 2k or XP yet. All tests done with the latest tclkit - 8.4b2, (8.4b1 also crashed on win98). From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Aug 9 12:07:36 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g79H7Za01996 for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 12:07:35 -0500 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id SAA15929 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 9 Aug 2002 18:07:33 +0100 (GMT/BST) From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200208091707.SAA15929@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit Normal Behavior? (fwd) To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 18:07:28 +0100 (GMT/BST) In-Reply-To: <200208091653.JAA08334@fraser.sfu.ca> from "Ian D. Gay" at Aug 9, 2 09:53:48 am Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > A while back I reported crash-on-exit problems when a kit contained a > binary extension. At that time I had only tried Win98. I can now say > that the same crash occurs on ME, but _not_ on NT. Haven't tried 2k or > XP yet. All tests done with the latest tclkit - 8.4b2, (8.4b1 also > crashed on win98). > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > I can't remember if I'm repeating myself here, but the presence or absence of binary extensions is not something I have seen make a difference. I assume that Windows ME is basically 98 with a few extra bugs added (we have endless trouble with ME and InstallShield-generated self-extracting .exe files which we use to put starkits on desktops), so that would make some sense. We *never* saw crash-on-exit on 98 or 95, but haven't tried with the latest tclkit on any kind of scale. At one stage I assumed that NT was more fastidious about releasing memory or some such, then wondered about memory alignment. Perhaps changing the length of a file by one or two bytes might make a difference. I think the truth of the matter may be that it is not a single cause, just a single error message. The more people can demonstrate this behaviour the better, but I have never made it happen with a simple starkit, only one with many files. -- Steve Blinkhorn From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Mon Aug 12 12:37:19 2002 Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7CHbJa24907 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 2002 12:37:19 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0H0Q00201RLWBO@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 12 Aug 2002 13:37:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0H0Q0013CRLRW0@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 12 Aug 2002 13:37:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from argon.jhuapl.edu (argon.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.48]) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g7CHb3Y02532 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 2002 13:37:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by argon.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g7CHb3q04841 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 2002 13:37:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 13:37:03 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu X-Sender: jhz@argon.jhuapl.edu To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: argon.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Subject: [Starkit] Adding Itk 3.2 to Kitten Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have a moderate size Iwidgets application I would like to package for Linux and SunOS. I got kitten from http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/kitten.kit and it was missing the Itk 3.2 shared library for Sunos. I had the library from Active state so I decided to add it by unwrapping kitten.kit, inserting libitk3.2.so and a file pkgIndex.tcl in the directory structure, and rewrapping it. I could not make the Itk package visible by doing this. In detail: - With sdx I unwrapped kitten to kitten.vfs. The arch subdirectory under kitten.vfs/lib looked like: |-itcl3.2--- |-Linux-------|-itk3.2---- | |-tix8.2---- | |-tkhtml0.0- |-arch-| |-SunOS-sparc-|-itcl3.2--- | |-tkhtml0.0- | | |-itcl3.2--- |-Windows-----|-itk3.2---- |-tkhtml0.0- - Then I made the missing directory kitten.vfs/lib/arch/SunOS-sparc/itk3.2. - Then I placed a copy of the Active state libitk3.2.so in kitten.vfs/lib/arch/SunOS-sparc/tk3.2 - Then I created pkgIndex.tcl in kitten.vfs/lib/arch/SunOS-sparc/tk3.2. It contains: # Tcl package index file, version 1.0 set env(ITK_LIBRARY) [file join $dir ../../../itk3.2] package ifneeded Itk 3.2 [list load [file join $dir libitk3.2.so] Itk] - The The arch subdirectory under kitten.vfs/lib now looks like: |-itcl3.2---|-libitcl3.2.so | |-pkgIndex.tcl | |-itk3.2----|-libitk3.2.so |-Linux-------| |-pkgIndex.tcl | | | |-tix8.2----|-libtix8.2.so | | | |-tkhtml0.0-|-pkgIndex.tcl | |-tkhtml.so | | |-itcl3.2---|-libicl3.2.so | | |-pkgIndex.tcl | | |-arch-|-SunOS-sparc-|-itk3.2----|-libitk3.2.so | | |-pkgIndex.tcl | | | |-tkhtml0.0-|-pkgIndex.tcl | |-tkhtml.so | | |-itcl3.2---|-itcl32.dll | | |-pkgIndex.tcl | | |-Windows-----|-itk3.2----|-itk32.dll | |-pkgIndex.tcl | |-tkhtml0.0-|-pkgIndex.tcl |-tkhtml.dll - Then I wrapped kitten.kit again. My application in 'hello.tcl' is: source kitten.kit package require Tk package require Iwidgets pack [button .b -text "Hello World!" -command bell] When I run it I get: jhz[aplexus.jhuapl.edu:(~/downloads/tclkit_dir)]209: tclkit hello.tcl can't find package Itk 3.2 while executing "package require Itk 3.2" (file "/home/u8/jhz/downloads/tclkit_dir/kitten.kit/lib/iwidgets3.0.1/iwidgets.tcl" line 19) invoked from within "source /home/u8/jhz/downloads/tclkit_dir/kitten.kit/lib/iwidgets3.0.1/iwidgets.tcl" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require Iwidgets" (file "hello.tcl" line 3) I don't fully understand the package loading/sourcing operation of Tcl, but would appreciate any immediate observations on what I am doing wrong while I am delving into that subject... Is the sdx unwrap/wrap symetric, for instance? ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From lvirden@cas.org Tue Aug 13 05:27:50 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7DARoa11980 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 2002 05:27:50 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g7DARiO27312 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 2002 06:27:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g7DARiT21681; Tue, 13 Aug 2002 06:27:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 06:27:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020813062743.AAB21430@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Adding Itk 3.2 to Kitten In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 12 Aug 2002 13:37:03 -0400 (EDT) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu > so I decided to add it by unwrapping kitten.kit, > inserting libitk3.2.so and a file pkgIndex.tcl in the directory structure, > and rewrapping it. I could not make the Itk package visible by doing this. 1. Kitten is an experiment. Starkits in general are evolving and you should expect to see something similar, but with a better organization in the upcoming days. 2. Is the sdx unwrap/wrap symetric, for instance? As far as I am aware, the actions are symetric. As for why it isn't working, I am uncertain. I know that the questions I have asked in the past regarding kitten have generally been answered with "be patient - some additional work on this concept is coming after Jean-Claude returns refreshed from summer holidays." -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Fri Aug 16 08:32:38 2002 Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7GDWca23098 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 08:32:38 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0H0X00401UY4ME@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 09:32:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0H0X0041UUXYHU@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 09:32:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from argon.jhuapl.edu (argon.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.48]) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g7GDWMY10593 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 09:32:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by argon.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g7GDWMX08279 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 09:32:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2002 09:32:22 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu X-Sender: jhz@argon.jhuapl.edu To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: argon.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Subject: [Starkit] Problems using Iwidgets, Itk with tclkit (guide needed) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have an application that uses the Iwidgets package. I now run it successfully under the ActiveCD Tcl/Tk installation. I am much taken with the tclkit/scripted document concept and now I want to package my application to run with tclkit (as a scripted document, or starkit). I think Iwidgets is a script-only package, and it needs Itk which needs Itcl. Itcl is in tclkit, but Itk is not. What approach to use to add Itk and Iwidgets? Should I try to package Itk and Iwidgets with my application (which would make it platform dependent since Itk seems to be a binary library) or try to add them both to tclkit (I have successfully built tclkit on linux and SunOS) or some combination of these? I am in the middle of trying to add Itk to tclkit and Iwidgets to my scripted document by modifying genkit, but it might take me some time to understand the genkit script and get it right. Previouusly I tried to add Itk and Iwidgets to my scripted document by placing the ActiveCD versions in the lib directory, but ran into version compatibility problems. I need to revisit this again with a better understanding of how the package verisons are related. It might be very useful to write a guide to adding extensions to tclkit via genkit, and I would be willing to help if there is interest in this. ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From lvirden@cas.org Fri Aug 16 11:39:18 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7GGdIa00382 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 11:39:18 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g7GGdAO29596 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 12:39:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g7GGdBW29722; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 12:39:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2002 12:39:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020816123911.AAB29711@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems using Iwidgets, Itk with tclkit (guide needed) In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 16 Aug 2002 09:32:22 -0400 (EDT) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It is my understanding that the preference is to add Itk and Iwidgets to one's starkit. However, having reproducible steps for how to do that would be, I agree, a wonderful thing. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Aug 16 12:03:44 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7GH3ha01798 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 12:03:43 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA14416 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 18:03:37 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200208161703.SAA14416@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems using Iwidgets, Itk with tclkit (guide needed) In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Aug 2002 12:39:11 EDT." <20020816123911.AAB29711@cas.org> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2002 18:03:36 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>"Larry W. Virden" said: > It is my understanding that the preference is to add Itk and Iwidgets to > one's starkit. > > However, having reproducible steps for how to do that would be, I agree, a > wonderful thing. I haven't got round to using Iwidgets yet, but certainly at present I would advise against building special versions of tclkit, and put extensions in the starkit instead. Starpacks, with everything in one file, may be a good way to go if you don't need to write inside your VFS. I know how frustrating it can seem at first, and it's extra-specially frustrating when you're doing it on a system that already has a standard installation, but the basics just require a trip back to first principles. 1. If what you want to load or require isn't in somewhere referred to by auto_list, you need to lappend the location of the package or extension or whatever. 2. tclkit has beliefs about where relative paths are relative to. It's worth experimenting with a one-liner to see what happens when tclkit and the starkit are resident in the same directory or in different direcotries, and playing with the [file dirname [info script]] and [file dirname [info nameofexecutable]] idioms to get your sea legs, so to speak. I'm quite serious about this: starkits can be quite disorienting when all your programming life you've been dealing with real file systems rather than virtual files systems. There's no substitute for experience, and learning to walk before you can run is highly recommended. It takes very little time and effort, and pays off in grand style. 3. Find a suitable binary extension, and try loading it. If it refuses, from the main.tcl at the top level in your starkit try load [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib myextension.dll], with the dll sitting in the lib subdirectory. 4. Reconcile yourself to this sort of idiom 5. By this time, you should be convinced that it is possible to load a binary extension and make it work. Now get to grips with auto_list and review your understanding of pkgIndex.tcl. Write short scripts to find out what's in your auto_load list, compare the output with what you think you've put in the starkit, and try to reconcile tclkit's idea of what is there with your own. I really do think there's no substitute for this sort of basic tinkering to get your bearings. Remember that the only libraries and so forth you can depend on are those that are part of tclkit, or that you have added explicitly to a starkit. I found it confusing for a long time, too, but I don't think a single concrete rule set is helpful in the long term. From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Fri Aug 16 14:42:48 2002 Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7GJgma10292 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:42:48 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0H0Y00H01C31EF@houston.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 15:42:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0H0Y00DC3C2VU5@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 15:42:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from argon.jhuapl.edu (argon.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.48]) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g7GJgVY12957; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 15:42:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by argon.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g7GJgU908329; Fri, 16 Aug 2002 15:42:31 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2002 15:42:30 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems using Iwidgets, Itk with tclkit (guide needed) In-reply-to: <200208161703.SAA14416@sole.prd.co.uk> X-Sender: jhz@argon.jhuapl.edu To: Steve Blinkhorn Cc: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: argon.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Following your suggestions I've gotten so far as to be able to 'load' one binary, Tclx, when I build it into my starkit (not tclkit). It does not work completely (some commands work, some do not...) due to a 'file too big' error. Details: My app. is hello and the vfs I wrap looks like: |-hello.tcl | |-mypak-----|-pack.tcl | |-pkgIndex.tcl | | |-autoload.tcl | |-buildidx.tcl |-hello.vfs-|-lib------| |-libtclx8.3.so | |-tclX8.3---|-pkgIndex.tcl | |-tcl.tlib | |-tcl.tndx | |-tclXAppInit.c | |-tclx.tcl |-main.tcl 'hello.tcl' looks like: =========== hello.tcl ============ # Try loading binary extension Tclx set tclxpath [file join [file dirname [info script]] tclX8.3 libtclx8.3.so] puts $tclxpath load $tclxpath # Try some Tclx commands: puts "Min 1 2 3: [min 1 2 3]" puts "cos 1.0: [cos 1.0]" =========== End hello.tcl ============ Some basic Tclx commands work fine, but ones that use the tcl.tlib fail. Here's the output of running hello (wrapped as a starkit): =========== Program STDOUT =============== ./hello/lib/tclX8.3/libtclx8.3.so 1 error accessing: hello.vfs/lib/tclX8.3/tcl.tlib: file too big while executing "auto_load_pkg TclX-fmath" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel #0 $auto_index($name)" (procedure "auto_load" line 26) invoked from within "auto_load $name [uplevel 1 {::namespace current}]" (autoloading "cos") invoked from within "cos 1.0" invoked from within "puts "cos 1.0: [cos 1.0]" " (file "./hello/lib/hello.tcl" line 6) invoked from within "source [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib hello.tcl] " (file "./hello/main.tcl" line 4) invoked from within "source ./hello/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" =========== End of STDOUT ============== I can't figure out why the 'file too big' error. The 'cos' command is implemented in that file. On Fri, 16 Aug 2002, Steve Blinkhorn wrote: > >>>"Larry W. Virden" said: > > It is my understanding that the preference is to add Itk and Iwidgets to > > one's starkit. > > > > However, having reproducible steps for how to do that would be, I agree, a > > wonderful thing. > > I haven't got round to using Iwidgets yet, but certainly at present I > would advise against building special versions of tclkit, and put > extensions in the starkit instead. Starpacks, with everything in one > file, may be a good way to go if you don't need to write inside your > VFS. > > I know how frustrating it can seem at first, and it's extra-specially > frustrating when you're doing it on a system that already has a > standard installation, but the basics just require a trip back to > first principles. > > 1. If what you want to load or require isn't in somewhere referred to > by auto_list, you need to lappend the location of the package or > extension or whatever. > > 2. tclkit has beliefs about where relative paths are relative to. > It's worth experimenting with a one-liner to see what happens when > tclkit and the starkit are resident in the same directory or in > different direcotries, and playing with the [file dirname [info script]] > and [file dirname [info nameofexecutable]] idioms to get your sea > legs, so to speak. I'm quite serious about this: starkits can be > quite disorienting when all your programming life you've been dealing > with real file systems rather than virtual files systems. > There's no substitute for experience, and learning to walk before you > can run is highly recommended. It takes very little time and effort, > and pays off in grand style. > > 3. Find a suitable binary extension, and try loading it. If it > refuses, from the main.tcl at the top level in your starkit try > load [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib myextension.dll], > with the dll sitting in the lib subdirectory. > > 4. Reconcile yourself to this sort of idiom > > 5. By this time, you should be convinced that it is possible to load a > binary extension and make it work. Now get to grips with auto_list > and review your understanding of pkgIndex.tcl. Write short scripts > to find out what's in your auto_load list, compare the output with what > you think you've put in the starkit, and try to reconcile tclkit's > idea of what is there with your own. > > I really do think there's no substitute for this sort of basic > tinkering to get your bearings. Remember that the only libraries and > so forth you can depend on are those that are part of tclkit, or that > you have added explicitly to a starkit. I found it confusing for a > long time, too, but I don't think a single concrete rule set is > helpful in the long term. > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Aug 20 10:45:13 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7KFjDa32529 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 10:45:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 52346 invoked by uid 0); 20 Aug 2002 15:54:26 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 2002 15:54:26 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24977 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:45:11 -0400 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g7KFjC618695 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:45:12 -0400 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200208201545.g7KFjC618695@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:45:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Img and Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, Here's a report of what I've done, and a request for other suggestions. The goal is to wrap a starpack that uses the Img extension. The ultimate goal is to create a Windows executable that uses the Img extension on my linux box. The trivial test: ###################### package require Tk package require Img set photo(imgName) [tk_getOpenFile -defaultextension .jpg \ -filetypes {{all *} {jpeg .jpg} {gif .gif}} \ -initialdir "." \ -title "Select one image" ] grid [canvas .c] set im [image create photo -file $photo(imgName)] .c create image 0 0 -image $im ###################### I downloaded the current versions of tclkit, etc from equi4: -rw-r--r-- 1 clif users 1498918 Aug 19 22:30 tclkit-linux-x86.gz -rw-r--r-- 1 clif users 1039116 Aug 19 22:33 tclkit-win32.exe.gz -rw-r--r-- 1 clif users 45733 Aug 19 22:36 sdx.kit Wrapped the package sdx qwrap tst.tcl Unwrapped: sdx unwrap tst.kit copied the .so files from ActiveState release for Tcl/Tk 8.3 to the tst.vfs/lib directory: -r-xr-xr-x 1 clif users 169530 Aug 20 02:01 libimg1.2.so -rw-r--r-- 1 clif users 269 Aug 20 02:03 pkgIndex.tcl -rw-r--r-- 1 clif users 313 Aug 20 02:04 tst.tcl and created a starkit with sdx wrap tst -runtime tclkit-linux-x86 When I run ./tst, I get an immediate Segment Fault and core dump, apparently in the tk_getOpenFile call. I suspect when it tries to creat an image for the folder markers. I noticed that the ActiveState stuff I've got is for Tcl8.3, and the tclkit identifies itself as 8.4. So, I rebuilt libimg1.2.so using the Tcl8.4a4 release, and copied the new libimg1.2.so into my lib directory. At this point, the tk_getOpenFile will display, but the application segment faults on "set im [image create photo -file $photo(imgName)]". FWIW, running fully interpreted with the Active State distro, the test does run. My suspicion is that there are problems in the Img code. I tried running a test using my compiled-against-tcl8.4a4 library, and it core dumps if I use the wish8.3, but will load images if I use wish8.4 (and core dumps when I try to write an image.) I see some mentions of STUBS in the libImg source, but I haven't looked at the code hard yet. Clif From dgporter@erols.com Tue Aug 20 10:54:20 2002 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7KFsJa00740 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 10:54:20 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVZTflFg2aWqebUFwjYp4d/Iei93eGPm2oH/tQau/AXRwtEbjTPDykHYvm37cdMinR8= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #6) id 17hBKh-00059n-00; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:54:15 -0400 Message-ID: <3D626623.1070005@erols.com> Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:54:11 -0400 From: Donald G Porter User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.1b) Gecko/20020812 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Clif Flynt CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit References: <200208201545.g7KFjC618695@clif.cflynt.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif Flynt wrote: > At this point, the tk_getOpenFile will display, but the application > segment faults on "set im [image create photo -file $photo(imgName)]". You are probably running into Bug 571827 of the tkImg project. http://sf.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=571827&group_id=52039&atid=465492 patch available at that link. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Tue Aug 20 11:06:37 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7KG6aa01712 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:06:36 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA26553; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:06:24 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200208201606.RAA26553@sole.prd.co.uk> To: Clif Flynt cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:45:11 EDT." <200208201545.g7KFjC618695@clif.cflynt.com> Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:06:23 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>Clif Flynt said: > Hi, > Here's a report of what I've done, and a request for other suggestions. > > The goal is to wrap a starpack that uses the Img extension. The ultimate > goal is to create a Windows executable that uses the Img extension > on my linux box. > Is it possible that the Img extension wants to write a file of some kind inside the starpack (which *won't* work)? I'm not familiar with Img's workings, but does the "image create" command involve writing, say, a temporary file? Try the starkit approach, i.e. a two-file solution, and make sure the starkit is wrapped with the right flags to make it writable. If that works, there's the problem. From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Aug 20 11:47:41 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7KGlfa04880 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:47:41 -0500 Received: (qmail 72541 invoked by uid 0); 20 Aug 2002 16:56:46 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 2002 16:56:46 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA25178 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:47:31 -0400 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g7KGlW021314 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:47:32 -0400 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200208201647.g7KGlW021314@clif.cflynt.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:47:32 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Donald G Porter" at Aug 20, 2002 11:54:11 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Don Porter Wrote > > You are probably running into Bug 571827 of the tkImg project. > > http://sf.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=571827&group_id=52039&atid=465492 > > patch available at that link. Hi, Thanks, that was one problem. Applying the patch allows my libimg.so to work with wish8.3 and wish8.4. Unfortunagely, using the patched library didn't change the behavior of the starkit. I added a global version variable to my libImg: imgInit.c: Tcl_SetVar(interp, "img_version", "1.2a", TCL_GLOBAL_ONLY); to confirm that I'm loading the file I think I'm loading, and this indicates that I'm not being confused by loading the wrong shared lib. I tried downloading the files in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ and building an sdx and tclkit from scratch (so I could add debugging info), but the sdx I created lacked the qwrap command, leading me to suspect that the files in that directory aren't the files that generated the sdx (and perhaps tclkit) executable I'm using. Clif From lvirden@cas.org Tue Aug 20 12:04:08 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7KH47a06290 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:04:07 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_MAIL_HUB-1.15) with ESMTP id g7KH40O25661 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:04:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g7KH40Q04746; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:04:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:04:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020820130400.AAB4737@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit In-Reply-To: <200208201647.g7KGlW021314@clif.cflynt.com> of Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:47:32 -0400 (EDT) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There is some expectation that Jean-Claude will re-emerge from holiday shortly. Until that point, perhaps someone else who has some successful experience building a starkit might make some suggestions? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Aug 20 12:08:08 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7KH87a06637 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:08:08 -0500 Received: (qmail 80003 invoked by uid 0); 20 Aug 2002 17:17:12 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 2002 17:17:12 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA25263 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:07:57 -0400 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g7KH7w221454 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:07:58 -0400 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200208201707.g7KH7w221454@clif.cflynt.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:07:58 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Steve Blinkhorn" at Aug 20, 2002 05:06:23 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Steven Blinkhorn: > > Is it possible that the Img extension wants to write a file of some > kind inside the starpack (which *won't* work)? I don't *think* Img is trying to write a temp file. I haven't checked all the code to be certain. I tried ./sdx wrap tst ./tclkit.linux ./tst and again, the application segment faulted when it tried to create the image. I think that's the two file solution you suggested. The kit made without the -runtime flag is about 2 Meg smaller. Clif Flynt From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Tue Aug 20 12:16:03 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7KHG3a07299 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 12:16:03 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA26913; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 18:15:57 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200208201715.SAA26913@sole.prd.co.uk> To: Clif Flynt cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 20 Aug 2002 13:07:58 EDT." <200208201707.g7KH7w221454@clif.cflynt.com> Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 18:15:57 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>Clif Flynt said: > > Steven Blinkhorn: > > > > Is it possible that the Img extension wants to write a file of some > > kind inside the starpack (which *won't* work)? > > I don't *think* Img is trying to write a temp file. I haven't checked > all the code to be certain. > > I tried > > ./sdx wrap tst > ./tclkit.linux ./tst > > and again, the application segment faulted when it tried to create the > image. > > I think that's the two file solution you suggested. The kit made without > the -runtime flag is about 2 Meg smaller. > That's right, the two file solution is tclkit separate from the starkit, the single file (or starpack) has tclkit wrapped up inside it. But the default for starkits at present is that they are readonly - there's a command-line argument you need to use if you're going to write inside the starkit, you'll need to check on the equi4 site for what it is (I think the current help built into sdx is wrong about this). This happened relatively recently. Someone else shout if they can remember what it is... From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Aug 21 10:31:54 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7LFVra19727 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 10:31:53 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA29400 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 08:31:59 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA13926 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 08:31:52 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC94RV; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 08:31:51 -0700 Message-ID: <3D63B267.F3C3F0C4@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 08:31:51 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit References: <200208201647.g7KGlW021314@clif.cflynt.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, I'm with Larry on waiting for Jean-Claude to return, there are just to many questions. I also had problems with the code at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ however sdx is written in tcl so you can just use what is at the starkit repository location (providing you have a working tclkit) Tom Krehbiel > > > Don Porter Wrote > > > > You are probably running into Bug 571827 of the tkImg project. > > > > http://sf.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=571827&group_id=52039&atid=465492 > > > > patch available at that link. > > Hi, > Thanks, that was one problem. Applying the patch allows my libimg.so > to work with wish8.3 and wish8.4. > > Unfortunagely, using the patched library didn't change the behavior of > the starkit. I added a global version variable to my libImg: > > imgInit.c: Tcl_SetVar(interp, "img_version", "1.2a", TCL_GLOBAL_ONLY); > > to confirm that I'm loading the file I think I'm loading, and this > indicates that I'm not being confused by loading the wrong shared lib. > > I tried downloading the files in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ > and building an sdx and tclkit from scratch (so I could add debugging > info), but the sdx I created lacked the qwrap command, leading me > to suspect that the files in that directory aren't the files that > generated the sdx (and perhaps tclkit) executable I'm using. > > Clif > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Wed Aug 21 11:22:48 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7LGMma23223 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 11:22:48 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA29766 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 17:22:41 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200208211622.RAA29766@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 17:22:41 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Subject: [Starkit] encoding on Win95 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm getting reports of problems on some Windows 95 boxes, where instead of the intended characters only black squares appear. This is on a project where several dozen users on a range of machines from Win 95 to XP are not having a problem. My first guess is that these people lack a file that tclkit assumes is present, presumably some sort of character encoding file. I saw some traffic on encodings some weeks back, but can't track it down. Ring any bells? From steve@digital-smarties.com Wed Aug 21 17:53:39 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7LMrca13852 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 17:53:38 -0500 Received: (qmail 19695 invoked by uid 8); 21 Aug 2002 22:53:36 -0000 Received: from pc-00061 (192.168.1.61, claiming to be "[192.168.1.61]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdVR6FMY; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 18:53:29 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Tom Krehbiel" Cc: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 06:53:26 +0800 Message-Id: <20020821225326.13231@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <3D63B267.F3C3F0C4@motorola.com> References: <3D63B267.F3C3F0C4@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, Clif, Larry and others, >I'm with Larry on waiting for Jean-Claude to return, there are just to >many questions. I also had problems with the code at http:// >www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ however sdx is written in tcl so you >can just use what is at the starkit repository location (providing >you have a working tclkit) JCW is going to be out of action for a little longer, so I thought I'd jump in here. To get the latest sdx go to http://www.equi4.com/starkit follow the "How to assemble a Starkit" link (or just click on http://www.equi4.com/ starkit/39 :-)) The sdx you get from there contains qwrap. As Tom said, sdx is just a Starkit so you can unwrap it - but I'm not sure if you can unwrap a new Starkit with the old sdx. I'm not sure what is going on with pub/tk/tars - I guess there's some old links in there. This will all get cleanup up eventually, thanks for being patient. BTW, in case it isn't obvious, TclKit is also just a Starkit, so you can unwrap that too. TclKit really is just Tcl/Tcl + Itcl + MetaKit + zlib + a little bit of startup code Back to writing the Starkit paper for Vancouver (which hopefully will clear a lot of this stuff up) Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@digital-smarties.com Perth, Western Australia www.digital-smarties.com From steve@digital-smarties.com Wed Aug 21 18:17:30 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7LNHTa14381 for ; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 18:17:29 -0500 Received: (qmail 19781 invoked by uid 8); 21 Aug 2002 23:17:27 -0000 Received: from pc-00061 (192.168.1.61, claiming to be "[192.168.1.61]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdJA7TnU; Wed, 21 Aug 2002 19:17:23 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Steve Blinkhorn" , "Clif Flynt" Cc: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Img and Starkit Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 07:17:21 +0800 Message-Id: <20020821231722.12619@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <200208201715.SAA26913@sole.prd.co.uk> References: <200208201715.SAA26913@sole.prd.co.uk> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Clif, et al >But the default for starkits at present is that they are readonly - >there's a command-line argument you need to use if you're going to >write inside the starkit, you'll need to check on the equi4 site for >what it is (I think the current help built into sdx is wrong about >this). This happened relatively recently. Someone else shout if >they can remember what it is... With the change from Scripted Documents to Starkits, the default behaviour went from writable to readonly. This makes sense, since it mimics the behaviour of normal binaries (many users can run the starkit concurrently). Anyway, the latest sdx (the one available under http://equi4.com/starkit which also contains the qwrap command) implements this. If you do want to make the Starkit writable (for example, if your application needs to read/write into the Starkit VFS) use the -writable flag when you wrap it. Steve From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Aug 30 16:42:29 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7ULgTa30071 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:42:29 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id OAA26143 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 14:42:40 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA15511 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 14:40:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC0GQV; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 14:42:27 -0700 Message-ID: <3D6FE6C3.F2171D30@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 14:42:27 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com References: <3D41D65A.69727344@motorola.com> <20020727020851.29317@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm trying get the Tktable widget to work on HP-UX11. I built the package as a shared library and then tested it using tclkit retjobmon.vfs/main.tcl and the application works as expected. However, when I wrap it into a starpack using sdx I get the error shown below. I have check the /var/tmp directory and it is wide open so it's not a directory permissions problem and since the executable works in the above test case it doesn't seem to be a problem with the library. Anyone have an idea of what might be going wrong? 200704 couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tcla27219": permission denied while executing "load /home/rna020/work/retjobmon/src/retjobmon/lib/Tktable2.8/libTktable2.8.sl Tktable" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require Tktable" (file "retjobmon/main.tcl" line 24) invoked from within "source retjobmon/main.tcl" <...snip...> Tom Krehbiel From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Aug 30 17:37:40 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UMbea00490 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 17:37:40 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id PAA22287 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:37:39 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA11272 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:38:08 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id PSDC0GWR; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:37:38 -0700 Message-ID: <3D6FF3B2.AE8080D4@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:37:38 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP References: <3D41D65A.69727344@motorola.com> <20020727020851.29317@triqs.com> <3D6FE6C3.F2171D30@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I receieved input from Andreas that "HP requires that shared libraries are marked executable." Does anyone know if the starkit 'load' command marks the files placed in the /var/tmp directory as executable? Tom Krehbiel > I'm trying get the Tktable widget to work on HP-UX11. I built the package as a shared library and then tested it using > > tclkit retjobmon.vfs/main.tcl > > and the application works as expected. However, when I wrap it into a starpack using sdx I get the error shown below. I have check > the /var/tmp directory and it is wide open so it's not a directory permissions problem and since the executable works in the above > test case it doesn't seem to be a problem with the library. Anyone have an idea of what might be going wrong? > > 200704 > couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tcla27219": permission denied > while executing > "load /home/rna020/work/retjobmon/src/retjobmon/lib/Tktable2.8/libTktable2.8.sl Tktable" > ("package ifneeded" script) > invoked from within > "package require Tktable" > (file "retjobmon/main.tcl" line 24) > invoked from within > "source retjobmon/main.tcl" > <...snip...> From jcw@equi4.com Fri Aug 30 17:55:55 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UMtsa01592 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 17:55:55 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 00:55:51 +0200 Message-Id: <20020830225551.31459@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D6FF3B2.AE8080D4@motorola.com> References: <3D6FF3B2.AE8080D4@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >I receieved input from Andreas that "HP requires that shared libraries >are marked executable." Does anyone know if the starkit >'load' command marks the files placed in the /var/tmp directory as executable? Don't think so - see generic/tclIOUtil.c, line 2580 in the Tcl core. -jcw From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Aug 30 17:59:59 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UMxxa01841; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 17:59:59 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UMxqa08321; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:59:52 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7UMxqi21764; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:59:52 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:59:52 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20020830225551.31459@triqs.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC what about the code which copies the library out of the VFS to the real disk ? Shouldn't the 'chmod' happen there ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join Tcl'2002 in Vancouver http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ ** Registration is open ** > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Friday, August 30, 2002 3:56 PM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP > > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > >I receieved input from Andreas that "HP requires that shared libraries > >are marked executable." Does anyone know if the starkit > >'load' command marks the files placed in the /var/tmp directory as > executable? > > Don't think so - see generic/tclIOUtil.c, line 2580 in the Tcl core. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From jcw@equi4.com Fri Aug 30 18:08:17 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UN8Ga02379 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 18:08:16 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 01:08:13 +0200 Message-Id: <20020830230813.4737@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas Kupries wrote: >JC what about the code which copies the library out of the VFS to the >real disk ? Shouldn't the 'chmod' happen there ? It can't: starkits do not maintain file modes (in the current mk4vfs.tcl driver anyway) - nor file owners and other OS-specific details. Given that one can create starkits on Win32, I don't see how we could make this work properly in cross-platform-generating scenario's :( But given that "load" copies for a very specific purpose, and that some platforms have very specific needs for a +x bit - why not just activate the code in the comments? (I'm hoping Vince steps in here, he must have thought it through...) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Aug 30 18:26:22 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UNQKa03333 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 18:26:21 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on starkit directory layout Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 01:23:32 +0200 Message-Id: <20020830232332.18136@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020727064254.AAB4400@cas.org> References: <20020727064254.AAB4400@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >It appears that, at least in the current kitten, one of the issues that >is being addressed is this: > >lib/extension_name/tcl_scripts >lib/arch/Platformname/extension_name/pkgIndex.tcl and shared libraries > >This is a good construct. It saves you from having full copies of >everything installed once for each machine. Yes, but - in hindsight - I consider "arch/" to be sub-optimal... Basically, we are storing a matrix: X packages versus Y platform binaries (not necessarily complete - the matrix is likely to be sparsely filled). With hierarchical storage, we can either do: packageX/platformY/blah or packageX/ + arch/platformY/packageX/blah Both solutions are similar. The latter has the disadvantage that one tends to forget grabbing the platformY/ files when copying around platformX for use in various projects. I'd rather copy too *much* than too little, i.e. copy all platforms accidentally even if only one is needed. That is one of the reasons why critcl has turned the structure around to storing all package data related to X in packageX/ and subdirs. And why I would vote for doing the same in kitten, sdarchive, etc. Kitten needs to be brought up to the latest conventions, but I'm afraid I won't be able to make that happen this month. >Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ There will be two presentations in Vancouver touching on these issues, i.e. "future tclkit directions" and "critcl". If it's within your options to go there, please do consider bringing the discussion over there... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Aug 30 18:26:24 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UNQNa03338 for ; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 18:26:23 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] GUYS! HELP !!!!!! Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 01:26:11 +0200 Message-Id: <20020830232611.15031@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020725065510.AAB26178@cas.org> References: <20020725065510.AAB26178@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >Mel, here's what I see when I use tclkit: > >$ tclkit >% package require Itcl; >3.3 >% package names >http pwb rechan zipvfs tcltest opt mk4vfs vfslib msgcat scripdoc zlib >starkit Tcl Itcl Mk4tcl vfs Tk >% source kitten.kit >% package names >OAP::Utils uuencode smtpd counter Extral pwb soapinterop::base SOAP::smtp >xmlswitch opt tcltest wcb Tablelist vfslib msgcat dyncall Mentry Iwidgets >lzrw1 mathf uri::urn md5c SOAP::CGI math::calculus ftp expat gk Tclx >SOAP::beep autoproxy tdom report comm rpcvar textutil::expander dommap >Mk4tcl HTML_Parse SOAP::Service nntp htmlparse soapinterop::B SOAP::https >math sgml soapinterop::C textutil SOAP::xpath csv cmdline dom::tclgeneric >Widget xml::tclparser xpath cgi2dom ihash math::fuzzy ClassyTk Tktable >sgmlparser xml::c mime autoscroll Wikit::Gui SOAP::ftp ncgi ftp::geturl >Expect math::geometry xmldefs profiler cgi gbutton hexdump Tkhtml >puretclparser rchan Wikit::Utils html HTML irc fileutil Class xml::expat >SOAP::Domain stats javascript Tk vfs tclparser xml::tcl scratch http >control tcllib zipvfs cksum Wcb tablelist Supertext pop3d::udb pop3d >SOAP::http mentry mkWidgets zlib critcl calendar switched mvec stooop >exif sum dom::libxml2 pop3d::dbox Modify uri dom::generic recha! >n xerces xmldep pop3 tls SOAP mk4v >fs Metawidget struct dns crc32 narray Web XMLRPC md5 BWidget yencode >dom::tcl scripdoc Wikit dom xml log starkit Tcl smtp Itcl Mpexpr Trf >Wikit::Format Tix sha1 base64 ascenc mclistbox ftpd blowfish dom::c > > > >Notice there is no Itk present there - even though there is an Iwidgets. >Somehow Itk got lost from the Solaris build. Try the same steps and see >if you see Itk. If so, then type > >package versions Itk > >and see what version is reported. It may be something as silly as a 3.2 vs. 3.3 mismatch - note that recent tclkits all have itcl 3.3 included, whereas kitten still lags with builds of itcl/itk/iwidgets 3.2 ... Might be an idea to package require itcl 3.2 with the "-exact" flag after sourcing kitten, and *then* trying to package require itk etc. Then again, maybe this doesn't work (itcl 3.3 is statically linked). -jcw From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Aug 30 18:32:12 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UNWCa03613; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 18:32:12 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UNW6a12007; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:32:06 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7UNW6i27463; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:32:06 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , Cc: "Jeff Hobbs" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:32:06 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20020830230813.4737@triqs.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Friday, August 30, 2002 4:08 PM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP > > > Andreas Kupries wrote: > > >JC what about the code which copies the library out of the VFS to the > >real disk ? Shouldn't the 'chmod' happen there ? > > It can't: starkits do not maintain file modes (in the current mk4vfs.tcl > driver anyway) - nor file owners and other OS-specific details. Given > that one can create starkits on Win32, I don't see how we could make this > work properly in cross-platform-generating scenario's :( > > But given that "load" copies for a very specific purpose, and that some > platforms have very specific needs for a +x bit - why not just activate > the code in the comments? Just looked at generic/tclIOUtil.c, line 2580. Yes, this seems to be what is needed. Maybe conditional compiled in on HP's. > (I'm hoping Vince steps in here, he must have thought it through...) -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join Tcl'2002 in Vancouver http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ ** Registration is open ** From JeffH@ActiveState.com Fri Aug 30 18:41:46 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UNfka04050; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 18:41:46 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7UNfea13093; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:41:40 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.186]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g7UNfei28787; Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:41:40 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Andreas Kupries'" , "'Jean-Claude Wippler'" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 16:41:38 -0700 Message-ID: <01b401c2507e$c9d29e00$ba03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > But given that "load" copies for a very specific purpose, and that some > > platforms have very specific needs for a +x bit - why not just activate > > the code in the comments? > > Just looked at generic/tclIOUtil.c, line 2580. Yes, this seems to be what is > needed. Maybe conditional compiled in on HP's. I don't think this should go into the core implementation of Tcl_FSLoadFile - it belongs in the vfs implemtetations, like that for starkit. The Tcl core should not be modifying files when 'load' is called on them. You might also hit further complications because you are making another vfs call, one that perhaps can validly throw an error where a normal load is OK. You don't want to get into this in the core - the handling of this belongs upstream. Jeff From vince.darley@eurobios.com Mon Sep 2 04:10:28 2002 Received: from smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g829ASa18242 for ; Mon, 2 Sep 2002 04:10:28 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17lnE2-000D0j-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 02 Sep 2002 10:10:26 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020902100739.02654c28@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2002 10:10:20 +0100 To: From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tktable problem on HP In-Reply-To: <20020830230813.4737@triqs.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >(I'm hoping Vince steps in here, he must have thought it through...) I would suggest activating the code in the comments. I thought about this problem, but found that the code seemed to work on multiple unixes without any chmod call, so simply left that code in comments rather than complicate the load from vfs functionality unnecessarily. However it does now appear to be necessary. I leave it up to the unix experts to decide whether this should be conditional on hp-ux or not. I agree with jcw that Jeff's comments are a red-herring here. 'load' doesn't modify any file that the user knows about, whether it does a chmod or not. Vince. From lvirden@cas.org Sat Sep 7 05:17:05 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g87AH5a17912 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2002 05:17:05 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g87AGwV3003977 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2002 06:16:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g87AGwm20680; Sat, 7 Sep 2002 06:16:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2002 06:16:58 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020907061658.AAB20675@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Anyone have a Mac Icon for Starkits? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I didn't know if anyone on the list was a Mac user with creative tendencies and who might have created an distinguished icon for starkits - maybe a star and feather or something? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Sun Sep 8 17:23:01 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g88MMxa27271; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 17:22:59 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit , announce Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2002 00:22:34 +0200 Message-Id: <20020908222234.3233@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: To whom it may concern... There are 23 new builds of TclKit on the website: http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ (That's 9 hardware platforms and 10 OS's, in various combinations) These builds are all based on the totally new Tcl/Tk 8.4.0 - yeehah! If you use TclKit, please update to these builds. One month from now I intend to put all prior versions to rest (for now, they are in /pub/tk/ older-*). There is one major change, in that the $tcl_platform(vfs) item has been dropped. Instead, the "200209" VFS release number is now stored as $vfs::tclkit_version. Unfortunately, this change will break scripts which relied on that setting. -jcw From bryan@bitmover.com Sun Sep 8 20:05:37 2002 Received: from lakemtao08.cox.net (lakemtao08.cox.net [68.1.17.113]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8915ba29927; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 20:05:37 -0500 Received: from bigmac.bitmover.com ([68.0.123.253]) by lakemtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20020909010526.DXMH1344.lakemtao08.cox.net@bigmac.bitmover.com>; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 20:05:26 -0500 Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2002 20:05:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v543) Cc: Starkit To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" From: Bryan Oakley In-Reply-To: <20020908222234.3233@triqs.com> Message-Id: <3AF61F6E-C390-11D6-959F-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.543) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sunday, September 8, 2002, at 05:22 PM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > To whom it may concern... > > There are 23 new builds of TclKit on the website: > http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ > (That's 9 hardware platforms and 10 OS's, in various combinations) ... Is the macosx port still without Tk support? I get an error when I try to "package require Tk". --bryan From steve@digital-smarties.com Sun Sep 8 20:13:06 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g891D5a30077 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 20:13:05 -0500 Received: (qmail 24327 invoked by uid 8); 9 Sep 2002 01:13:05 -0000 Received: from pc-00061 (192.168.1.61, claiming to be "[192.168.1.61]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdan167m; Sun, 08 Sep 2002 21:12:56 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Bryan Oakley" , "Jean-Claude Wippler" Cc: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2002 09:12:54 +0800 Message-Id: <20020909011254.16550@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <3AF61F6E-C390-11D6-959F-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> References: <3AF61F6E-C390-11D6-959F-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brain, >On Sunday, September 8, 2002, at 05:22 PM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > >> To whom it may concern... >> >> There are 23 new builds of TclKit on the website: >> http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ >> http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ >> (That's 9 hardware platforms and 10 OS's, in various combinations) >... > >Is the macosx port still without Tk support? I get an error when I try >to "package require Tk". The MacOS X version of TclKit requires X11 - i.e. the AquaTk version of TclKit hasn't been released as yet (although it is definitely on the horizon). I suspect you haven't got XonX/Xdarwin running? If so, you'll get a message from "package require Tk" like: couldn't load library "/Users/steve/Desktop/tclkit-darwin-ppc/lib/tk8.4/ libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory If you haven't already set up X11, grab OroborOSX from oroborosx.sourceforge.net - it is a rootless window manager that nicely integrates with Aqua. Even when AquaTk matures, I'll still use this for displaying remote X11 applications. HTH Steve From bryan@bitmover.com Sun Sep 8 21:19:04 2002 Received: from lakemtao05.cox.net (lakemtao05.cox.net [68.1.17.116]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g892J4a31142 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 21:19:04 -0500 Received: from bigmac.bitmover.com ([68.0.123.253]) by lakemtao05.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20020909021901.MXU8982.lakemtao05.cox.net@bigmac.bitmover.com>; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 22:19:01 -0400 Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2002 21:19:00 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v543) Cc: Starkit To: "Steve Landers" From: Bryan Oakley In-Reply-To: <20020909011254.16550@mail.digital-smarties.com> Message-Id: <80E31ACE-C39A-11D6-959F-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.543) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sunday, September 8, 2002, at 08:12 PM, Steve Landers wrote: > > The MacOS X version of TclKit requires X11 - i.e. the AquaTk version of > TclKit hasn't been released as yet (although it is definitely on the > horizon). > > I suspect you haven't got XonX/Xdarwin running? If so, you'll get a > message from "package require Tk" like: > > couldn't load library > "/Users/steve/Desktop/tclkit-darwin-ppc/lib/tk8.4/ > libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory Yep. I have X11, but had just recently rebooted and hadn't fired up X11 yet. Sweet! I'm a very happy camper. Thanks for letting me know, and thanks for all your work. --bryan From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 9 03:34:10 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g898Y9a05873 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 03:34:09 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2002 10:34:07 +0200 Message-Id: <20020909083407.9050@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <80E31ACE-C39A-11D6-959F-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> References: <80E31ACE-C39A-11D6-959F-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan Oakley wrote: [Steve Landers] >> I suspect you haven't got XonX/Xdarwin running? If so, you'll get a >> message from "package require Tk" like: >> >> couldn't load library >> "/Users/steve/Desktop/tclkit-darwin-ppc/lib/tk8.4/ >> libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory Which is a pretty confusing msg, btw. What happens is that load "" Tk fails because Tk refused to init without X11, the error gets caught, and tclkit retries a load [file join $dir libtk8.4.so] That then fails because in a statically linked tclkit there is no such file. Summary: "lib/tk8.4/pkgIndex.tcl" could do with some improvement :) >Yep. I have X11, but had just recently rebooted and hadn't fired up X11 >yet. Sweet! I'm a very happy camper. Thanks for trying it out. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 9 11:04:04 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g89G44a29700; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 11:04:04 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA05430; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 09:04:20 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA10001; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 09:04:04 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id SRFRDCBF; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 09:04:03 -0700 Message-ID: <3D7CC673.A90DCD9E@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2002 09:04:03 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) References: <20020908222234.3233@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: EXCELLENT!! Thanks for the HP-UX build. I'll try out the new builds on HP and SPARC (sunos) today. I'm also starting to work on Windows but am confused by "1014k gzip 899k upx-exe" what is the deference between these two? Tom Krehbiel. Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > To whom it may concern... > > There are 23 new builds of TclKit on the website: > http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ > (That's 9 hardware platforms and 10 OS's, in various combinations) > > These builds are all based on the totally new Tcl/Tk 8.4.0 - yeehah! > > If you use TclKit, please update to these builds. One month from now I > intend to put all prior versions to rest (for now, they are in /pub/tk/ > older-*). > > There is one major change, in that the $tcl_platform(vfs) item has been > dropped. Instead, the "200209" VFS release number is now stored as > $vfs::tclkit_version. Unfortunately, this change will break scripts > which relied on that setting. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 9 13:20:37 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g89IKaa10034; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 13:20:36 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Tom Krehbiel" Cc: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2002 20:20:28 +0200 Message-Id: <20020909182028.17936@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7CC673.A90DCD9E@motorola.com> References: <3D7CC673.A90DCD9E@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >EXCELLENT!! > >Thanks for the HP-UX build. I'll try out the new builds on HP and >SPARC (sunos) today. I'm also starting to work on Windows but am >confused by "1014k gzip 899k upx-exe" what is the deference between >these two? Both work. The .gz needs unpacking but launches quicker (important for say CGI use), the .upx.exe runs out of the box (decompresses at run time). The latter can be useful to fit a substantial application with the tclkit runtime onto a floppy. >> There are 23 new builds of TclKit on the website: >> http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ Make that 26, a few more added with the help of Reinhard Max @ SuSE. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 9 14:57:59 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g89Jvxa19351 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 14:57:59 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id MAA29571 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 12:58:00 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id MAA14197 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 12:58:00 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id SRFRDC71; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 12:58:00 -0700 Message-ID: <3D7CFD47.971C456B@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2002 12:57:59 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) References: <20020908222234.3233@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The HP-UX build appears to have a problem when loading a shared library. I just wrapped my application on HP and it generates the following error. /usr/lib/dld.sl: Call to mmap() failed - TEXT /var/tmp/tcla13535 /usr/lib/dld.sl: Permission denied The application works ok when it is not wrapped on HP and it works on solaris eather wrapped or unwrapped. I have had this problem before and have not yet determined a fix. Is the HP-UX build known to load a shared library correctly? I don't seem to be having any success. Tom Krehbiel Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > To whom it may concern... > > There are 23 new builds of TclKit on the website: > http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ > (That's 9 hardware platforms and 10 OS's, in various combinations) > > These builds are all based on the totally new Tcl/Tk 8.4.0 - yeehah! > > If you use TclKit, please update to these builds. One month from now I > intend to put all prior versions to rest (for now, they are in /pub/tk/ > older-*). > > There is one major change, in that the $tcl_platform(vfs) item has been > dropped. Instead, the "200209" VFS release number is now stored as > $vfs::tclkit_version. Unfortunately, this change will break scripts > which relied on that setting. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 9 15:13:46 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g89KDja20951 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 15:13:46 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2002 22:13:23 +0200 Message-Id: <20020909201323.17835@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7CFD47.971C456B@motorola.com> References: <3D7CFD47.971C456B@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >The HP-UX build appears to have a problem when loading a shared >library. I just wrapped my application on HP and it generates >the following error. > >/usr/lib/dld.sl: Call to mmap() failed - TEXT /var/tmp/tcla13535 >/usr/lib/dld.sl: Permission denied > >The application works ok when it is not wrapped on HP and it works >on solaris eather wrapped or unwrapped. > >I have had this problem before and have not yet determined a fix. >Is the HP-UX build known to load a shared library correctly? I >don't seem to be having any success. Ah, yes - ouch. This was being hashed out (I remember Andreas and Jeff and Vince getting involved) over the summer. Vaguely remember a discussion on allowing the fix which is currently in the Tcl core but in comments (most compilers ignore those ). Might even be a bug report on SF's tcl, I can't remember clearly. Solution: - get the the fix into Tcl (around line 2580 in tclIOUtil.c) - rebuild tclkit (note that MK builds on HP have been improved) I won't have time this month. If it's in by end September, I can do the build (using the HP/Compaq compile farm) in the October round of tclkit builds. Let me add that I will not be able to keep up all monthly build rounds indefinitely (well, not without some sort of payback or license structure anyway). The current crop was just a major push to get 8.4.0 out. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 9 15:35:54 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g89KZsa23068 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 15:35:54 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id NAA13961 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 13:34:02 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA26943 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 13:35:55 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id SRFRDDAQ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 13:35:54 -0700 Message-ID: <3D7D062A.6BFC407D@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2002 13:35:54 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) References: <3D7CFD47.971C456B@motorola.com> <20020909201323.17835@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JWC, Does the http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ site have all the 8.4.0 updates? If so I would like to do a build with the tclIOUtil.c file fixed to see if that fixes the problem. Tom K. Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > >The HP-UX build appears to have a problem when loading a shared > >library. I just wrapped my application on HP and it generates > >the following error. > > > >/usr/lib/dld.sl: Call to mmap() failed - TEXT /var/tmp/tcla13535 > >/usr/lib/dld.sl: Permission denied > > > >The application works ok when it is not wrapped on HP and it works > >on solaris eather wrapped or unwrapped. > > > >I have had this problem before and have not yet determined a fix. > >Is the HP-UX build known to load a shared library correctly? I > >don't seem to be having any success. > > Ah, yes - ouch. This was being hashed out (I remember Andreas and Jeff > and Vince getting involved) over the summer. Vaguely remember a > discussion on allowing the fix which is currently in the Tcl core but in > comments (most compilers ignore those ). Might even be a bug > report on SF's tcl, I can't remember clearly. > > Solution: > - get the the fix into Tcl (around line 2580 in tclIOUtil.c) > - rebuild tclkit (note that MK builds on HP have been improved) > > I won't have time this month. If it's in by end September, I can do the > build (using the HP/Compaq compile farm) in the October round of tclkit > builds. > > Let me add that I will not be able to keep up all monthly build rounds > indefinitely (well, not without some sort of payback or license structure > anyway). The current crop was just a major push to get 8.4.0 out. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 9 15:43:11 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g89Kh9a23712 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 15:43:10 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2002 22:42:42 +0200 Message-Id: <20020909204242.16136@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7D062A.6BFC407D@motorola.com> References: <3D7D062A.6BFC407D@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, >Does the http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ site have all the >8.4.0 updates? If so I would like to do a build with the >tclIOUtil.c file fixed to see if that fixes the problem. Yep, the pub/tk/tars/ area was used for all the recent builds. I had to add a symlink on hpux to get the genkit build to complete: cd builds/`hostname`/mk ln -s libmk4tcl.sl libmk4tcl.so Then redo the failed builds: "sh genkit B mk kitsh kit". (Well, something like that - sorry: lost my notes on that one) -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 10 04:36:14 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8A9aEa07474 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 04:36:14 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8A9a94i027497 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 05:36:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8A9a9k22219; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 05:36:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 05:36:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020910053608.AAB22184@cas.org> Subject: HP-UX tclkit failure [Was Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209)] In-Reply-To: <20020909204242.16136@triqs.com> of Mon, 9 Sep 2002 22:42:42 +0200 To: Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>Does the http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ site have all the >>8.4.0 updates? If so I would like to do a build with the >>tclIOUtil.c file fixed to see if that fixes the problem. > >Yep, the pub/tk/tars/ area was used for all the recent builds. Tom, when you wrote the above, did you mean "does the tars site have the tcl/vfs/starkit changes to allow HP-UX to operate correctly" or did you merely mean "is the version of the source used to generate the latest round of tclkit executables on the tar site" Because it was my understanding that the fixes for hp-ux in the vfs extension hadn't occurred yet. One issue this summer was this - on hp-ux, dynamic libraries have to have the file's executable bit set to be able to be loaded. There was various disagreements over whose responsibility it was to set those permissions; I saw 3 varients discussed - tcl core, vfs, and the application. In _my_ mind, the changes seem necessary to tcl if tcl is going to attempt to support dynamic loading of extensions on hp-ux. But then, never using hp-ux, I wasn't certain I understood the issues correctly. Now, I don't know whether the problem you are seeing is related to this issue or if that issue finally was resolved. Anyone know for certain? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From pieper@bwh.harvard.edu Mon Sep 9 20:49:48 2002 Received: from clifford.bwh.harvard.edu (clifford.bwh.harvard.edu [134.174.9.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8A1nla16368 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 20:49:47 -0500 Received: from bwh.harvard.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clifford.bwh.harvard.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.11.0) with ESMTP id g8A1nnu08207 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 21:49:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3D7D4FB7.80105@bwh.harvard.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2002 21:49:43 -0400 From: Steve Pieper User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] command line arg handling on win32 starpack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi - I'm running into a difference in the way command line arguments to tclkit are handled between unix and windows. On unix (solaris and linux) the arguments are passed through to the tcl argv variable as expected, but on windows my starpack tries to interpret the args as filenames of a tcl script and gives me "error in startup script". The starpacks for each of the platforms are generated identically, all using the 200209 versions of the tclkits. I believe the unix behavior is correct but the win32 behavior (or my usage?) is incorrect. I've downloaded the genkit materials and will try building my own tclkit-win32.exe tomorrow to do some debugging, but I thought I'd ask if anyone has a suggestion...? Thanks in advance for any hints/help! -Steve p.s. I'm making a very simple starpack 'launcher' for our application that uses [info script] to determine the root directory of a directory full of stuff (scripts, cross platform shared libs, images, docs, etc). Eventually this may all get wrapped up inside the starpack, but for now almost the entire script is included below (only a license dialog box is removed for clarity). slicer2.vfs/main.tcl: ===================== set env(SLICER_HOME) [file dir [file dir [info script]]] if {$tcl_platform(platform) == "unix"} { eval exec $env(SLICER_HOME)/slicer $argv & } else { # must be win32 eval exec $env(SLICER_HOME)/slicer.bat $argv & } exit ===================== From Lee.Elms@oracle.com Tue Sep 10 07:10:52 2002 Received: from inet-mail3.oracle.com (inet-mail3.oracle.com [148.87.2.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ACAqa17516 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 07:10:52 -0500 Received: from inet-mail3.oracle.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by inet-mail3.oracle.com (Switch-2.2.3/Switch-2.2.3) with ESMTP id g8ACAnP02615 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 05:10:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgmgw5.us.oracle.com (rgmgw5.us.oracle.com [138.1.191.14]) by inet-mail3.oracle.com (Switch-2.2.3/Switch-2.2.3) with ESMTP id g8ACAmR02607 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 05:10:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from oracle.com (DHCP-Data-Centre-222-90.uk.oracle.com [138.3.222.90]) by rgmgw5.us.oracle.com (Switch-2.1.3/Switch-2.1.0) with ESMTP id g8ACAlr23518 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 06:10:47 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3D7DE144.2090600@oracle.com> Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 13:10:44 +0100 From: Lee Elms Organization: Oracle Corporation User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.tcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Accessing ('open' etc.) files contained in a 'Starkit' ... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've read through all the documentation I can locate, but can't locate an answer to what I hope is a simple question: how do I access (i.e. use the Tcl 'open' command etc.) a file contained in a 'Starkit' ? (I know how to build / update / add Tcl extensions to Startkit's, but can't find any docs. on to do the above). Thanks ... -- Lee From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 10 07:26:16 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ACQEa18561; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 07:26:15 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Steve Pieper" , Subject: Re: [Starkit] command line arg handling on win32 starpack Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:25:33 +0200 Message-Id: <20020910122533.24142@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7D4FB7.80105@bwh.harvard.edu> References: <3D7D4FB7.80105@bwh.harvard.edu> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Pieper wrote: (Post manually approved, as sender has not - yet - subscribed) >I'm running into a difference in the way command line arguments to >tclkit are handled between unix and windows. On unix (solaris and >linux) the arguments are passed through to the tcl argv variable as >expected, but on windows my starpack tries to interpret the args as >filenames of a tcl script and gives me "error in startup script". The >starpacks for each of the platforms are generated identically, all using >the 200209 versions of the tclkits. > >I believe the unix behavior is correct but the win32 behavior (or my >usage?) is incorrect. I've downloaded the genkit materials and will try >building my own tclkit-win32.exe tomorrow to do some debugging, but I >thought I'd ask if anyone has a suggestion...? Glad you asked. This same issue was emailed to me by Steve Landers a few days ago. We found out that you can insert a bogus "--" arg on the command line to prevent the starpack from using the args. There will be a fix for this, it clearly is a bug in tclkit. -jcw From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Sep 10 07:27:11 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8ACRAa18637 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 07:27:10 -0500 Received: (qmail 28637 invoked by uid 8); 10 Sep 2002 12:27:11 -0000 Received: from pc-00061 (192.168.1.61, claiming to be "[192.168.1.61]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdi6C76K; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 08:27:01 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Steve Pieper" , Subject: Re: [Starkit] command line arg handling on win32 starpack Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 20:26:56 +0800 Message-Id: <20020910122656.30012@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7D4FB7.80105@bwh.harvard.edu> References: <3D7D4FB7.80105@bwh.harvard.edu> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Steve, >I'm running into a difference in the way command line arguments to >tclkit are handled between unix and windows. On unix (solaris and >linux) the arguments are passed through to the tcl argv variable as >expected, but on windows my starpack tries to interpret the args as >filenames of a tcl script and gives me "error in startup script". The >starpacks for each of the platforms are generated identically, all using >the 200209 versions of the tclkits. I hit the same problem myself last week. My workaround (after discussion with JCW) is to prefix any arguments with "--" and I put this in my application code if {[lindex $argv 0] eq "--"} { set argv [lrange $argv 1 end] } Given that this particular Starpack was being called from a script, it isn't a big deal for me. But I acknowledge that it is a problem that needs to be looked into longer term. HTH Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@digital-smarties.com Perth, Western Australia www.digital-smarties.com From pieper@bwh.harvard.edu Tue Sep 10 07:56:56 2002 Received: from clifford.bwh.harvard.edu (clifford.bwh.harvard.edu [134.174.9.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ACuta20758; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 07:56:55 -0500 Received: from bwh.harvard.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clifford.bwh.harvard.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.11.0) with ESMTP id g8ACuru14168; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 08:56:53 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3D7DEC0E.2010704@bwh.harvard.edu> Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 08:56:46 -0400 From: Steve Pieper User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Landers , Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] command line arg handling on win32 starpack References: <3D7D4FB7.80105@bwh.harvard.edu> <20020910122656.30012@mail.digital-smarties.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Steve and Jean-Claude - Thanks for the quick answers! Sounds like a useful workaround, but won't actually work for my case since I need all platforms to work the same (unix and windows) so can't have the user typing "--" everytime. I started to work on compiling my own tclkit-win32.exe, but I only have msvc7 (.NET) here so I got kind of bogged down. Then I realized that for my simple task freewrap would do the trick, so I'm now using starpacks for linux and solaris and freewrap for windows. But I'll really look forward to a newer tclkit-win32.exe in the future to unify everything. Thanks also for all the hard work. I've been using Mk4tcl in another project and have been watching the evolution of tclkit for a while and think its all amazing stuff. Best, Steve Steve Landers wrote: > Hi Steve, > > >>I'm running into a difference in the way command line arguments to >>tclkit are handled between unix and windows. On unix (solaris and >>linux) the arguments are passed through to the tcl argv variable as >>expected, but on windows my starpack tries to interpret the args as >>filenames of a tcl script and gives me "error in startup script". The >>starpacks for each of the platforms are generated identically, all using >>the 200209 versions of the tclkits. > > > I hit the same problem myself last week. > > My workaround (after discussion with JCW) is to prefix any arguments with > "--" and I put this in my application code > > if {[lindex $argv 0] eq "--"} { > set argv [lrange $argv 1 end] > } > > Given that this particular Starpack was being called from a script, it > isn't a big deal for me. But I acknowledge that it is a problem that > needs to be looked into longer term. > > HTH > > Steve > From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 10 08:52:17 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ADqHa24522 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 08:52:17 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8ADqC4i009790 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:52:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8ADqCv25103; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:52:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:52:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020910095212.AAB25084@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] command line arg handling on win32 starpack In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 10 Sep 2002 08:56:46 -0400 To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Using the -- before application flags is a pretty common convention in Tk applications. It should work on both platforms. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Sep 10 11:12:10 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8AGCAa04545 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 11:12:10 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA27034 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:10:18 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA29379 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:12:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id SRFRD13P; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:12:12 -0700 Message-ID: <3D7E19DC.CEB5E72F@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:12:12 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit Subject: Re: HP-UX tclkit failure [Was Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS 200209)] References: <20020910053608.AAB22184@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, What I have done so far is: 1) worked with JCW on getting the latest version of tclkit 2) unpacked the tcl.tar.gz file 3) made the following modification to the generic/tclIOUtil.c file (see line 2573) /* * Do we need to set appropriate permissions * on the file? This may be required on some * systems. On Unix we could loop over * the file attributes, and set any that are * called "-permissions" to 0777. Or directly: * * Tcl_Obj* perm = Tcl_NewStringObj("0777",-1); * Tcl_IncrRefCount(perm); * Tcl_FSFileAttrsSet(NULL, 2, copyToPtr, perm); * Tcl_DecrRefCount(perm); * */ Tcl_LoadHandle newLoadHandle = NULL; Tcl_FSUnloadFileProc *newUnloadProcPtr = NULL; FsDivertLoad *tvdlPtr; int retVal; /* vvvvv code added by - tjk */ Tcl_Obj* perm = Tcl_NewStringObj("0777",-1); Tcl_IncrRefCount(perm); Tcl_FSFileAttrsSet(NULL, 2, copyToPtr, perm); Tcl_DecrRefCount(perm); /* ^^^^^ */ 4) modified line 20 in the genkit file to be HP-UX { array set X {gcc cc g++ g++ -static ""} } This was necessary because my installation of SoftBench doesn't have aCC. 5) ran the following build command tclsh genkit A tclsh genkit B tcl sh genkit B tcl itcl mk cd build/`hostname`/mk/.libs ln -s libmk4tcl.sl libmk4tcl.so cp libmk4tcl.a ../. cd ../../../.. sh genkit B 6) tested the result on my application which uses the tktable extention. The result produces the following error on the command line: /usr/lib/dld.sl: Call to mmap() failed - TEXT /var/tmp/tcla21132 /usr/lib/dld.sl: Permission denied and the following "Fatal error" popup. 200704couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tcla21132": permission denied while executing "load /home/rna020/work/retjobdat/src/retjobdat/lib/Tktable2.8/libTktable2.8.sl Tktable" ("package ifneeded" script) ... COMMENTS: a) I tried using using gcc for the cc compiler and that resulted in build errors during the kit build b) The use of g++ seems to work. I'm not smart enough know if it is a problem. c) My next step will be to comment out the code that removes the file from the tmp directory so I can see what it looks like and what its permissions are after it has been placed in tmp. e) I am doing this work not to define a solution but to locate the problem I am having. > >>Does the http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ site have all the > >>8.4.0 updates? If so I would like to do a build with the > >>tclIOUtil.c file fixed to see if that fixes the problem. > > > >Yep, the pub/tk/tars/ area was used for all the recent builds. > > Tom, when you wrote the above, did you mean > "does the tars site have the tcl/vfs/starkit changes to allow HP-UX to > operate correctly" > or did you merely mean > "is the version of the source used to generate the latest round of tclkit > executables on the tar site" > > Because it was my understanding that the fixes for hp-ux in the vfs extension > hadn't occurred yet. > > One issue this summer was this - on hp-ux, dynamic libraries have to have > the file's executable bit set to be able to be loaded. There was various > disagreements over whose responsibility it was to set those permissions; > I saw 3 varients discussed - tcl core, vfs, and the application. > > In _my_ mind, the changes seem necessary to tcl if tcl is going to attempt > to support dynamic loading of extensions on hp-ux. But then, never using > hp-ux, I wasn't certain I understood the issues correctly. > > Now, I don't know whether the problem you are seeing is related to this > issue or if that issue finally was resolved. > > Anyone know for certain? From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 10 13:55:18 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8AItHa20095 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 13:55:18 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8AItD4i028881 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8AItCg28928; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:55:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:55:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020910145511.AAB28906@cas.org> Subject: Re: HP-UX tclkit failure [Was Re: [Starkit] ANN: Tclkit 8.4.0 (VFS In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 10 Sep 2002 09:12:12 -0700 To: Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: You might check with Jeff Hobbes and see if this rings any bells with him - I'd guess he is pretty familar with the pains of hp-ux dynamic loading. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Sep 10 16:25:35 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ALPZa02772; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 16:25:35 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id OAA22328; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:25:38 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA18542; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:23:08 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YQYJ7; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:25:37 -0700 Message-ID: <3D7E6351.2A705B88@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 14:25:37 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit References: <20020910145511.AAB28906@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] HP-UX build of tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, SUCCESS!!! The information I posted to Larry actually does work, I had a problem with my testing method. To recap what needs to be done. 1) modify the generic/tclIOUtil.c; if you go to line 2573 my modification look like the following /* * Do we need to set appropriate permissions * on the file? This may be required on some * systems. On Unix we could loop over * the file attributes, and set any that are * called "-permissions" to 0777. Or directly: * * Tcl_Obj* perm = Tcl_NewStringObj("0777",-1); * Tcl_IncrRefCount(perm); * Tcl_FSFileAttrsSet(NULL, 2, copyToPtr, perm); * Tcl_DecrRefCount(perm); * */ Tcl_LoadHandle newLoadHandle = NULL; Tcl_FSUnloadFileProc *newUnloadProcPtr = NULL; FsDivertLoad *tvdlPtr; int retVal; /* vvvvv code added by - tjk */ Tcl_Obj* perm = Tcl_NewStringObj("0777",-1); Tcl_IncrRefCount(perm); Tcl_FSFileAttrsSet(NULL, 2, copyToPtr, perm); Tcl_DecrRefCount(perm); /* ^^^^^ */ 2) modified line 20 in the genkit file to be HP-UX { array set X {gcc cc g++ g++ -static ""} } It appears to be necessary to use the SoftBench cc compiler but the gnu c++ seems to work ok in place of the aCC compiler. I don't have the aCC compiler so couldn't use it. 3) Run the following build command. The cd,ln,cp,cd sequence fixes a bug in the genkit script. tclsh genkit A tclsh genkit B tcl sh genkit B tcl itcl mk cd build/`hostname`/mk/.libs ln -s libmk4tcl.sl libmk4tcl.so cp libmk4tcl.a ../. cd ../../../.. sh genkit B cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.bin >tclkit chmod +x tclkit 4) At this point you can use the tclkit to build a starkit. I built a starkit that uses the Tktable extension (built by me) and it loaded ok. I monitored the /var/tmp directory and found that the files are not removed because they are locked while they are in use and when the application exits they are not cleaned up. I thing this is the intended behavior but I thought it was worth noting. I also built a starpack from the same source and it worked. The only thing unusual that I found was that I needed two copies of the tclkit to build the starpack. If I tried to do a command that looks like this: ./tclkit sdx.kit wrap myapp -runtime ./tclkit Then I get an error that looks like this: file in use, cannot be prefix: ./tclkit which meant I had to copy ./tclkit to ./tclkit2 and do ./tclkit sdx.kit wrap myapp -runtime ./tclkit2 DISCUSSION: ============ It appears that an HP specific change to the tclIOUtil.c file is required to resolve this problem. I would recommend that the code be ifdef'd with an HP specific symbol but this is really an issue for the TCT to discuss. Regards, Tom Krehbiel From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 10 16:57:14 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ALvDa05863 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 16:57:13 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] HP-UX build of tclkit Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 23:57:14 +0200 Message-Id: <20020910215714.20109@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7E6351.2A705B88@motorola.com> References: <3D7E6351.2A705B88@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >SUCCESS!!! I take it you can now load extensions on a HP-UX tclkit. Terrific. >To recap what needs to be done. [...] Thanks for summarizing this. I'm sure that once the dust clears for a couple of us involved in all sorts of projects, we'll be able to settle it and make it go into the core in some form. >4) At this point you can use the tclkit to build a starkit. I built a >starkit that uses the Tktable extension (built by me) and it >loaded ok. I monitored the /var/tmp directory and found that the files >are not removed because they are locked while they are in use >and when the application exits they are not cleaned up. I thing this is >the intended behavior but I thought it was worth noting. Hm, they should be. Cleanup is not yet optimal. It used to be that tclkit would leave them around, as cache - but that presents a security issue, and some people don't like the unbounded clutter it can lead to. >I also built a starpack from the same source and it worked. The only >thing unusual that I found was that I needed two copies of the >tclkit to build the starpack. If I tried to do a command that looks like this: > >./tclkit sdx.kit wrap myapp -runtime ./tclkit > >Then I get an error that looks like this: > >file in use, cannot be prefix: ./tclkit Good. You tested a new check I had built in. >which meant I had to copy ./tclkit to ./tclkit2 and do > >./tclkit sdx.kit wrap myapp -runtime ./tclkit2 Perfect conclusion. For now, it has to be that way. I think I have a way to improve this in the future (while mounted on itself, a starkit file looks like a dir, and tclkit itself is a starkit too - no way to copy that as a file, yet). >DISCUSSION: >============ > >It appears that an HP specific change to the tclIOUtil.c file is required >to resolve this problem. I would recommend that the code >be ifdef'd with an HP specific symbol but this is really an issue for the >TCT to discuss. FWIW, I'll do my best to bring it up in Vancouver. -jcw PS. I've been making really good progress on TclKit for MacOS X - *Aqua*. Due to the great advances made recently by Vince, Daniel, and Jim, I've managed to build almost all the pieces into a self-contained package. The only missing part left to do is now zlib, and moving a few scripts around - so TclKit/Aqua may be available much sooner than originally anticipated. With full starkit support, of course. From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 10 18:34:47 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ANYka13014; Tue, 10 Sep 2002 18:34:46 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Lee Elms" , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Accessing ('open' etc.) files contained in a 'Starkit' ... Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 01:34:46 +0200 Message-Id: <20020910233447.3301@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D7DE144.2090600@oracle.com> References: <3D7DE144.2090600@oracle.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Lee Elms wrote: (Post manually approved, as sender has not - yet - subscribed) >I've read through all the documentation I can locate, but can't locate >an answer to what I hope is a simple question: > > how do I access (i.e. use the Tcl 'open' command etc.) a file >contained in a 'Starkit' ? > >(I know how to build / update / add Tcl extensions to Startkit's, but >can't find any docs. on to do the above). Hm, the following search did indeed not report much help: The trick is to "mount". You have a starkit called xyz.kit - to use it, you mount it. The convention is to mount the *file* xyz.kit over itself. The result is that it becomes a *directory* xyz.kit/ while mounted. Then you can open files in it, and even make changes (unless mounted read-only). Example mounts: vfs::mk4::Mount xyz.kit xyz.kit vfs::mk4::Mount xyz.kit xyz.kit -readonly Then you can do things like: cd xyz.kit puts [glob *] set fd [open haha] mkdir hurray To unmount (also done automatically on program exit), use: vfs::unmount xyz.kit If changes were made, they will be flushed before unmounting. In fact, changes are also flushed periodically (5s, see $mk4vfs::flush). Try this: cd [info nameofexecutable] cd lib cd tcl8.4 puts [glob *] FYI, you're looking inside the (mounted) tclkit executable. To see all mounted filesystems, do "vfs::filesystem info". The "vfs::filesystem" command is part of the TclVFS extension. That's just the start of what VFS is about. You can also mount zip files, ftp servers, http servers, even webdav servers. And anything else people care to write a VFS driver for (in Tcl or C). Would it make sense to be able to mount /etc/passwd, or the DNS lookup system, or the Tcl proc/var/namespace domains, or a tar file, or a .o's symbol table? Sure, why not - what /proc did for the OS kernel, VFS could do as well... all it would take is a bit of scripting. But I digress :) - I hope the above answers your question. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 11 10:42:41 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8BFgfa04214 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 10:42:41 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8BFga4i000424 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 11:42:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8BFgal02636; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 11:42:36 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 11:42:36 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020911114236.AAB2620@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] can someone explain how to install tclvfs's vfslib ? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When I look in tclkit.vfs, I see a lib/vfs that contains what appears to be most of tclvfs's vfs library. However, I don't see the libvfs shared library. I'm trying to get tclvfs to work on my platform for normal tclsh and when I do the make install, only the libvfs*.so file and a pkgIndex.tcl to load it get installed. So I'm trying to figure out where the vfslib goes... -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 11 11:00:58 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8BG0va05657 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 11:00:58 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] can someone explain how to install tclvfs's vfslib ? Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 18:00:47 +0200 Message-Id: <20020911160047.18175@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020911114236.AAB2620@cas.org> References: <20020911114236.AAB2620@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >When I look in tclkit.vfs, I see a lib/vfs that contains what appears >to be most of tclvfs's vfs library. > >However, I don't see the libvfs shared library. > >I'm trying to get tclvfs to work on my platform for normal tclsh and >when I do the make install, only the libvfs*.so file and a pkgIndex.tcl >to load it get installed. > >So I'm trying to figure out where the vfslib goes... Yes, I noticed that tclvfs (home at http://tclvfs.sf.net) did not have the proper logic in it for unix shared lib names, only Windows. I committed changes to fix that, but also noted what you describe: the *.tcl files in the vfs/library/ source tree don't seem to get copied into the vfs1.0/ directory where the extension is installed. Trying things out manually, I just copied all the library/*.tcl to vfs1.0/ and things seem to work (on MacOS X, btw). It looks like the TEA-based config setup in TclVFS is either broken or was never completed fully. I hesitate to bother Vince darley with this, I think we both tend to twitch madly when we hear the word "tea" in the same sentence as "installation" :) My hope (and plea ) is that a Tcl/Tea guru will step forward and fix up the logic of the tclvfs build process. I have not had a need for this, given that tclvfs has always been included statically in tclkit, along with the scripts - but there is definitely a good use now that 8.4.0 is out. With all of Vince's VFS magic at last securely in the core, TclVFS + memchan (or rechan) + trf (or zlib) + Mk4tcl would be all one needs to run starkits from a standard Tcl/Tk distribution, such as ActiveTcl. All prior trickery, such as the obscure "pink" extension, is gone for good now. -jcw From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Sep 11 11:04:59 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8BG4wa06027 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 11:04:59 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8BG4ua07890 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 09:04:56 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8BG4ui22227 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 09:04:56 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] can someone explain how to install tclvfs's vfslib ? Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 09:04:56 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20020911160047.18175@triqs.com> X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 9:01 AM > To: Starkit > Subject: Re: [Starkit] can someone explain how to install tclvfs's > vfslib ? > I hesitate to bother Vince darley with this, I think we both tend to > twitch madly when we hear the word "tea" in the same sentence as > "installation" :) > My hope (and plea ) is that a Tcl/Tea guru will step forward and > fix up the logic of the tclvfs build process. I have not had a need for > this, given that tclvfs has always been included statically in tclkit, > along with the scripts - but there is definitely a good use now that > 8.4.0 is out. > With all of Vince's VFS magic at last securely in the core, TclVFS + > memchan (or rechan) + trf (or zlib) + Mk4tcl would be all one needs to > run starkits from a standard Tcl/Tk distribution, such as ActiveTcl. All > prior trickery, such as the obscure "pink" extension, is gone for > good now. pink ? Do I want to know what this did ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join Tcl'2002 in Vancouver http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ ** Registration is open ** From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 11 11:20:38 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8BGKca07093 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 11:20:38 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8BGKY4i011636 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 12:20:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8BGKYp03453; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 12:20:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 12:20:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020911122034.AAB3429@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] can someone explain how to install tclvfs's vfslib ? In-Reply-To: <20020911160047.18175@triqs.com> of Wed, 11 Sep 2002 18:00:47 +0200 To: Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >> So I'm trying to figure out where the vfslib goes... > but also noted what you describe: the > *.tcl files in the vfs/library/ source tree don't seem to get copied into > the vfs1.0/ directory where the extension is installed. Trying things > out manually, I just copied all the library/*.tcl to vfs1.0/ and things > seem to work (on MacOS X, btw). I thought about just copying the files there - but then that replaces the pkgIndex.tcl that is already there that says: package ifneeded vfs 1.0 [list load [file join $dir ../libvfs1.0g.so]] with this line: package ifneeded vfs 1.0 [list loadvfs $file] That's okay to do? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From cferril@mchsi.com Wed Sep 11 23:48:57 2002 Received: from sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (sccmmhc01.mchsi.com [204.127.203.183]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8C4mva26165 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2002 23:48:57 -0500 Received: from suse80 ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20020912044856.LIMZ2075.sccmmhc01.mchsi.com@suse80> for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 04:48:56 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Chuck Ferril To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 23:56:10 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200209112356.10664.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g8C4mva26165 Subject: [Starkit] Old version of SDX Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have been trying to build a starkit but it always complains that main.tcl is missing. It appears to be looking in the root of the VFS and not in the bin directory where the file is actually located. I've been using the latest tclkit for linux-x86 (200209) with no luck. I tried older versions of tclkit with the same results. It finally started working once I went to the 'old' version of SDX. I'm guessing that I am doing something wrong...but I'm stumped. Here is my simple test using files from http://mini.net/sdarchive/: >./tclkit-linux-x86 sdx.kit unwrap clock.kit 4 updates applied >mv clock.kit clock.save >./tclkit-linux-x86 sdx.kit wrap clock.kit 4 updates applied >./tclkit-linux-x86 clock.kit couldn't read file "./clock.kit/main.tcl": no such file or directory while executing "source ./clock.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" This works when I used sdx-old.bin from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/examples/ Any suggestions? Thanks, Chuck From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 12 03:13:06 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8C8D5a02229; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 03:13:05 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Chuck Ferril" , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Old version of SDX Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 10:13:06 +0200 Message-Id: <20020912081306.16715@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <200209112356.10664.cferril@mchsi.com> References: <200209112356.10664.cferril@mchsi.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Chuck Ferril wrote: (Post manually approved, as sender has not - yet - subscribed) >I have been trying to build a starkit but it always complains that >main.tcl is >missing. It appears to be looking in the root of the VFS and not in the bin >directory where the file is actually located. I've been using the latest >tclkit for linux-x86 (200209) with no luck. I tried older versions of tclkit >with the same results. > >It finally started working once I went to the 'old' version of SDX. I'm >guessing that I am doing something wrong...but I'm stumped. > >Here is my simple test using files from http://mini.net/sdarchive/: > >>./tclkit-linux-x86 sdx.kit unwrap clock.kit > 4 updates applied >>mv clock.kit clock.save >>./tclkit-linux-x86 sdx.kit wrap clock.kit > 4 updates applied >>./tclkit-linux-x86 clock.kit > couldn't read file "./clock.kit/main.tcl": no such file or directory > while executing > "source ./clock.kit/main.tcl" > ("uplevel" body line 1) > invoked from within > "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" > >This works when I used sdx-old.bin from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/examples/ > >Any suggestions? This is caused by a recent change in SDX/TclKit handling of starkits, though I don't quite understand how. Here's what I know: The *OLD* SDX has commands like "fs2sd" and "sd2fs". I creates a starkit with a header that does "package require scripdoc". That package is inside all versions of tclkit and looks for the bin/main.tcl startup file. That file must do things like "[file dir [info source]]" to locate other files inside the starkit. Teh *NEW* SDX has commands like "wrap" and "unwrap". I creates a starkit with a header that does "package require starkit". That package is only in recent versions of tclkit (starting July 2002 or so) and looks for the ./main.tcl startup file. That file must do "starkit::startup" to set up things, and is generally more robust for use in a starpack and in unpacked mode. My thought was that this logic would not cause problems, because the only thing that could not work is using the new SDX with an old tclkit, but that would not happen since SDX itself is a new starkit, and would itself fail to run. I seem to have messed up something. I'll look into it. -jcw From Lee.Elms@oracle.com Thu Sep 12 07:33:17 2002 Received: from inet-mail1.oracle.com (inet-mail1.oracle.com [148.87.2.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8CCXHa17291 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 07:33:17 -0500 Received: from inet-mail1.oracle.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by inet-mail1.oracle.com (Switch-2.2.3/Switch-2.2.3) with ESMTP id g8CCXGe03623 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 05:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgmgw1.us.oracle.com (rgmgw1.us.oracle.com [138.1.191.10]) by inet-mail1.oracle.com (Switch-2.2.3/Switch-2.2.3) with ESMTP id g8CCXEC03593 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 05:33:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgmgw1.us.oracle.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rgmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-2.1.3/Switch-2.1.0) with ESMTP id g8CCXDv06842 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 06:33:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oracle.com (DHCP-Data-Centre-222-90.uk.oracle.com [138.3.222.90]) by rgmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-2.1.3/Switch-2.1.0) with ESMTP id g8CCXCf06789 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 06:33:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3D808985.5090309@oracle.com> Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 13:33:09 +0100 From: Lee Elms Organization: Oracle Corporation User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] How do I extend Tclkit to include some 'C' (i.e. not pure TCL) extensions ... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Assuming this is possible, can someone point me instructions as to how I extend Tclkit (I am particularly interested in doing this on HP/UX) to include a number of extensions such as 'tclx', 'oratcl' and 'expect' ... From lvirden@cas.org Thu Sep 12 07:41:12 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8CCfCa17895 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 07:41:12 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8CCf94i001119 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 08:41:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8CCf9F02113; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 08:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 08:41:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020912084109.AAB2074@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] How do I extend Tclkit to include some 'C' (i.e. not pure TCL) extensions In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 12 Sep 2002 13:33:09 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: how to extend tclkit There are two technical answers to your question 1. Yes, you can extend tclkit. You download the sdx.kit application, unwrap tclkit itself, plug the new code into the appropriate directories, wrap the tclkit back up, and you are golden. 2. No, the tclkit intent is that there be one standard set of options within tclkit. The way to use tclkit with more extensions is to build a starkit (see for more info) . Then you distribute either 2 or 3 files: a standard tclkit for the platform, a starkit containing your application, and a starkit containing the extra extensions. Of course, you could combine the last two of these into one starkit, or you could even create what is known as a starpack, which is a tclkit and one or more starkits , combined into one file. In fact, if you check out you will see an early experiment at this - kitten contains a couple of dozen extensions bundled together into a starkit. During next week's Tcl conference, there are going to be several sessions on starkits and tclkit. It is my understanding that at least one of these is going to be proposing a new format for a replacement of kitten - I don't know if a new sample is going to be available or not. -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From contact_mel@yahoo.com Thu Sep 12 09:07:42 2002 Received: from web12303.mail.yahoo.com (web12303.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8CE7ga23774 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:07:42 -0500 Message-ID: <20020912140746.12039.qmail@web12303.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [151.202.102.230] by web12303.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 07:07:46 PDT Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 07:07:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Mel To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Iwidgets and Incr Tcl in Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: i am desparate to integrate Iwidgets into a starkit application. Kitten does not work ! any pointers are appreciated Mel __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 12 09:18:00 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8CEHva24648 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:17:58 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Iwidgets and Incr Tcl in Starkit Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 16:17:55 +0200 Message-Id: <20020912141755.22612@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020912140746.12039.qmail@web12303.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20020912140746.12039.qmail@web12303.mail.yahoo.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: >i am desparate to integrate Iwidgets into a starkit application. > >Kitten does not work ! > >any pointers are appreciated The incrtl issue was reported recently on this mailing list. It looks like incrtcl/incrtk do not work in kitten because they are version 3.2, while tclkit includes incrtcl 3.3 (no incrtk). The solution IMO: unwrap kitten replace incrtl and incrtk with 3.3 builds wrap kitten up again I won't have time to deal with this now, nor during next week's Tcl/Tk conference, sorry. -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Thu Sep 12 09:18:58 2002 Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8CEIwa24752 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:18:58 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0H2B00501X3GQI@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 10:18:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0H2B00LJ8X3BNY@dallas.jhuapl.edu>; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 10:18:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g8CEIlh26067; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 10:18:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 10:18:47 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: Re: [Starkit] Iwidgets and Incr Tcl in Starkit In-reply-to: <20020912140746.12039.qmail@web12303.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Mel Cc: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I also need Iwidgets in my starkits. Some time ago I spent significant time trying to use kitten (no Iwidgets implementation for Solaris, as I remember) and then trying to build my own starkit adding the Iwidgets (and Itk) packages. The closest I got, and where I stopped, was to get some runtime complaints about Iwidgets requiring different versions of Itk or Tk. I could never get versions correct and gave up for the time being. I did succed in adding tclX and some other packages to my starkit, and they worked, mostly, but Iwidgets is problematic, maybe since it requires intermediate packages. On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, Mel wrote: > i am desparate to integrate Iwidgets into a starkit application. > > Kitten does not work ! > > any pointers are appreciated > > Mel > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! News - Today's headlines > http://news.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 12 09:31:14 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.190] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8CEVCa25739 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:31:13 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Iwidgets and Incr Tcl in Starkit Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 16:31:14 +0200 Message-Id: <20020912143114.11821@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: >I also need Iwidgets in my starkits. Some time ago I spent significant >time trying to use kitten (no Iwidgets implementation for Solaris, as I >remember) and then trying to build my own starkit adding the Iwidgets (and >Itk) packages. The closest I got, and where I stopped, was to get some >runtime complaints about Iwidgets requiring different versions of Itk or >Tk. I could never get versions correct and gave up for the time being. I >did succed in adding tclX and some other packages to my starkit, and they >worked, mostly, but Iwidgets is problematic, maybe since it requires >intermediate packages. I'm sorry to hear that - but this appears to confirm the versioning issue. Note that kitten has become a lot simpler to use. You can now simply do a "source kitten.kit" in your app, and you'll be able to package require everything stored in kitten after doing so. No more more "mounts", etc. This was one of the reasons to move from the scripdoc to the starkit package - the new design is simpler and more flexible. I would definitely advise re-trying things. It really need not be more than: sdx unwrap kitten.kit cp ... kitten.vfs/lib/... sdx wrap kitten.kit The issue being of course to have the proper build handy, and to make sure all scripts and binaries from itcl, itk, and iwidgets get copied to the right place - i.e. overwriting what there is now. You may need to avoid overwriting the pkgIndex.tcl files, they were tweaked to make itcl work with multiple platform builds of the shared libs. As I said, all I can do for now is help others along - which to be honest, is definitely a better long term solution than me being in the loop. Note that one of the plans is to revisit kitten soon, and make it conform to the new directory an dpackage structure, i.e. like other starkits. -jcw From rohan@rohanpall.com Wed Sep 18 15:16:40 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8IKGea24722 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 15:16:40 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8IKGnb30381 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 13:16:49 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:16:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2273.10.3.36.17.1032380209.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:16:49 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] writable and flushing to disk Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've got a writable starkit with my mindweb app in it. All its data is stored in the starkit. Its super easy to run on my friends computers. I wrote a little editor (thanks to tcltk) and it edits the source code, then tests the new version of mindweb in a new interp that I launch from my embedded tkcon. So now my development is all done from my starkit. Which is pretty cool. I just need a diff in tcl, and some bonuses to my editor and I'm laughing. But I'm getting a little problem. My changes are only saved when I quit the app - thats when the starkit is written to disk. I'm assuming that all my changes are done in memory, even when I close files that are part of the starkit. I'm worried that I'll be coding all day, making revisions to mindweb, saving it all in the starkit, and just generally having a ball - and then my win95 box will hang and I'll be outta luck since nothing got written to disk. There is no doubt in my mind that this issue will be resolved. I'm astounded by the capabilities of starkits. I can't bear the thought of returning to old development methods. I'm hooked to starkits - and whats more - I like it. From rohan@rohanpall.com Wed Sep 18 18:09:01 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8IN8ta29595 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 18:09:01 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8IN94b03505 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:09:04 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 19:09:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4650.10.3.36.17.1032390544.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 19:09:04 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] mysterious bytes Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm not using the embedded metakit database engine. When I unwrap my kit then rewrap it, the kit has shrinked in size. Every time I run the kit it grows a little itty bit. I'm curious as to what is happening. Not curious enough to go through genkit though ;) I'd appreciate it very much if you could shed some light on the darkness of my soul. ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo$ l total 448 drwx------ 2 ro users 4096 Sep 18 18:49 ./ drwx------ 4 ro users 8192 Sep 18 19:19 ../ -rwx--x--x 1 ro users 441091 Sep 18 19:15 info-tokyo.kit* ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo$ sdx unwrap info-tokyo.kit 236 updates applied ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo$ rm *kit ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo$ l total 16 drwx------ 3 ro users 4096 Sep 18 19:20 ./ drwx------ 4 ro users 8192 Sep 18 19:19 ../ drwx------ 6 ro users 4096 Sep 18 19:20 info-tokyo.vfs/ ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo$ sdx wrap info-tokyo.kit -writable 236 updates applied ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo$ l total 436 drwx------ 3 ro users 4096 Sep 18 19:20 ./ drwx------ 4 ro users 8192 Sep 18 19:19 ../ -rwx--x--x 1 ro users 424252 Sep 18 19:20 info-tokyo.kit* drwx------ 6 ro users 4096 Sep 18 19:20 info-tokyo.vfs/ ro@absorb:~/tcltk/programs/info-tokyo From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Sep 18 20:17:56 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8J1Hua00965 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 20:17:56 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id SAA25563 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 18:18:27 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id SAA23372 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 18:18:05 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRG2A; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 18:18:04 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 18:18:04 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com References: <3D63B267.F3C3F0C4@motorola.com> <20020821225326.13231@mail.digital-smarties.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Command Line Problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have just run into a problem that I don't understand (maybe a bug). I'm working on unix and I want to pass in arguments that contain spaces. My test case looks like this: test A "B C" The script (called 'main.tcl') looks like this. ------------------------------------------ #!/bin/sh # the next line restarts this file using a tcl shell \ exec tclsh "$0" ${1+"$@"} if { [lsearch -exact [package names] vfslib] != -1 } { package require starkit if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return set root [file dirname [vfs::normalize [info script]]] lappend auto_path [file join $root app] puts "(starkit run)" } else { set root [pwd] lappend auto_path [file join $root app] puts "(normal run)" } #puts [join $auto_path \n] package require Tcl puts "0: '$argv0'" set i 1 foreach arg $argv { puts "$i: '$arg'" incr i } -------------------------------------------- Here is the problem. When I cd into test.vfs and run the main.tcl file as a normal script it returns: % main.tcl A "B C" (normal run) 0: 'main.tcl' 1: 'A' 2: 'B C' If I then wrap the test.vfs directory into a starkit and run it, it returns: % test A "B C" (starkit run) 0: 'test' 1: 'A' 2: 'B' 3: 'C' If I then wrap the test.vfs directory into a starpack and run it, it returns: % test A "B C" (starkit run) 0: '/tmp/test/main.tcl' 1: 'A' 2: 'B C' The starkit command line parsing appears to have a bug, unless I did something stupid. Regards, Tom Krehbiel From rohan@rohanpall.com Wed Sep 18 20:50:22 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8J1oFa01460 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 20:50:22 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8J1oJk28410 for ; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 18:50:19 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Sep 2002 21:50:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 21:50:19 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> References: <3D63B267.F3C3F0C4@motorola.com> <20020821225326.13231@mail.digital-smarties.com> <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I haven't figured out why you had that problem, but I did want to comment on part of your code: > if { [lsearch -exact [package names] vfslib] != -1 } { > package require starkit > if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return > set root [file dirname [vfs::normalize [info script]]] Here you normalize the path using the vfs wrapper. I suggest you use the line set root [file normalize [file dirname [info script]]] since you know that you're in a starkit, and starkits have 8.4 > lappend auto_path [file join $root app] > puts "(starkit run)" > } else { > set root [pwd] I suggest that you do the same sort of getting the real path - you might be executing it from a different directory set root [file dirname [info script]] I don't suggest you use the 'file normalize' since you might not have 8.4 when running as a script. > lappend auto_path [file join $root app] > puts "(normal run)" > } > > #puts [join $auto_path \n] > > package require Tcl > > puts "0: '$argv0'" > set i 1 > foreach arg $argv { > puts "$i: '$arg'" > incr i > } > -------------------------------------------- > The starkit command line parsing appears to have a bug, unless I did > something stupid. Sure seems that way. Good luck and happy tcling! ro From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Sep 19 10:16:00 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JFG0a26478 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:16:00 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (motgate4 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA05838 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:16:09 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA05129 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:16:09 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRG42; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:16:08 -0700 Message-ID: <3D89EA38.B67A8D90@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:16:08 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem References: <3D63B267.F3C3F0C4@motorola.com> <20020821225326.13231@mail.digital-smarties.com> <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan, Thanks for the help on coding the search path. I'm spending most of my spare time just converting legacy code and my environment to do the tclkit, starkit and starpack thing, plus converting to 8.4 so I haven't yet worried to much about the right way to get the job done. Tom K. > > I haven't figured out why you had that problem, but I did want to comment > on part of your code: > > > if { [lsearch -exact [package names] vfslib] != -1 } { > > package require starkit > > if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return > > set root [file dirname [vfs::normalize [info script]]] > > Here you normalize the path using the vfs wrapper. I suggest you use the > line > set root [file normalize [file dirname [info script]]] > since you know that you're in a starkit, and starkits have 8.4 > > > lappend auto_path [file join $root app] > > puts "(starkit run)" > > } else { > > set root [pwd] > > I suggest that you do the same sort of getting the real path - you might > be executing it from a different directory > set root [file dirname [info script]] > I don't suggest you use the 'file normalize' since you might not have 8.4 > when running as a script. > > > lappend auto_path [file join $root app] > > puts "(normal run)" > > } > > > > #puts [join $auto_path \n] > > > > package require Tcl > > > > puts "0: '$argv0'" > > set i 1 > > foreach arg $argv { > > puts "$i: '$arg'" > > incr i > > } > > -------------------------------------------- > > > The starkit command line parsing appears to have a bug, unless I did > > something stupid. > > Sure seems that way. > > Good luck and happy tcling! > > ro From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 19 12:30:40 2002 Received: from [192.168.1.25] ([208.181.145.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHUda31480 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:30:39 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] writable and flushing to disk Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 07:44:06 -0700 Message-Id: <20020919144406.19923@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <2273.10.3.36.17.1032380209.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> References: <2273.10.3.36.17.1032380209.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan Pall wrote: [good stuff] >But I'm getting a little problem. My changes are only saved when I quit >the app - thats when the starkit is written to disk. I'm assuming that >all my changes are done in memory, even when I close files that are part >of the starkit. > >I'm worried that I'll be coding all day, making revisions to mindweb, >saving it all in the starkit, and just generally having a ball - and then >my win95 box will hang and I'll be outta luck since nothing got written >to disk. Starkits default to saving (i.e. comitting) changes to file every 5 seconds. Furthermore, closing the starkit of course also commits. You could alter the flush rate (see $mk4vfs::flush in mk4vfs.tcl), or perhaps we could expose the flush functionality in a decent way. But the question which comes to mind, is whether it is necessary to go that way. In the case of Unix, there is a similar issue: changes to files only get committed every once in a while. Unix offers sync and fsync system calls, but these are not normally uses in application code, as far as I know. My suggestion would be to try and make sure the 5s flush is functioning: edit your code, wait a bit, edit some more and kill the app. Then reopen and verify that the first change got in. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 19 12:30:41 2002 Received: from [192.168.1.25] ([208.181.145.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHUea31484 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:30:40 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] mysterious bytes Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:11:02 -0700 Message-Id: <20020919151102.32395@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <4650.10.3.36.17.1032390544.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> References: <4650.10.3.36.17.1032390544.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan Pall wrote: >I'm not using the embedded metakit database engine. Let me add that when you are using starkits, you are - under the hood. And when you are using starkits in -writable mode, you will see commits whenever files/dirs inside are modified. >When I unwrap my kit then rewrap it, the kit has shrinked in size. Every >time I run the kit it grows a little itty bit. I'm curious as to what is >happening. There used to be a bug (over 2 years ago), whereby commits would extend the database file, even when nothing was changed. As far as I know, this has been resolved. What does force a datafile to grow, is storing a growing number of rows of data. The columns of each view needs to be stored in unused space, and if columns keep getting bigger, then it is very plausible that there are not slots in the file to hold them, forcing an extend. Metakit does not collapse files by itself. The current approach is to occasionally do this your self. Here's an example that optimizes space usage: mk::file open db mydata.dat -readonly set fd [open newdata w] mk::file save db $fd close $fd mk::file close db file rename -force newdata mydata.dat If you are opening the starkit in writable mode and certain that no changes are being saved to it, and it still grows, then please do try to dig in and find out if you can create a small example I can debug. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 19 12:30:42 2002 Received: from [192.168.1.25] ([208.181.145.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHUfa31490 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:30:42 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:20:37 -0700 Message-Id: <20020919152037.25597@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> References: <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >I have just run into a problem that I don't understand (maybe a bug). Yes, it looks, walks, and quacks like a bug to me... >puts "0: '$argv0'" >set i 1 >foreach arg $argv { > puts "$i: '$arg'" > incr i >} [...] >If I then wrap the test.vfs directory into a starkit and run it, it returns: > >% test A "B C" >(starkit run) >0: 'test' >1: 'A' >2: 'B' >3: 'C' > >If I then wrap the test.vfs directory into a starpack and run it, it returns: > >% test A "B C" >(starkit run) >0: '/tmp/test/main.tcl' >1: 'A' >2: 'B C' > >The starkit command line parsing appears to have a bug, unless I did >something stupid. Thanks for exposing this problem so clearly. It'll help track this down. The tclkit main code does very nasty things to try to get all use scenario's right (see src/kitInit.c in the TclKit distribution). There is also the "eats first arg as script when used as starpack on windows" bug. I'll try to have a fix for this in the next tclkit builds - and perhaps even a way to work around it with the existing builds. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 19 12:30:43 2002 Received: from [192.168.1.25] ([208.181.145.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHUha31493 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:30:43 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:29:37 -0700 Message-Id: <20020919152937.7700@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> References: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan Pall wrote: >I haven't figured out why you had that problem, but I did want to comment >on part of your code: > >> if { [lsearch -exact [package names] vfslib] != -1 } { >> package require starkit >> if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return >> set root [file dirname [vfs::normalize [info script]]] > >Here you normalize the path using the vfs wrapper. I suggest you use the >line > set root [file normalize [file dirname [info script]]] >since you know that you're in a starkit, and starkits have 8.4 FYI, with the new starkit package, you also get the variable $::starkit::topdir - it is always set and normalized, so that last suggestion can now also be written as: set root $::starkit::topdir -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Sep 19 12:47:56 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHlua32320 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:47:56 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id KAA15298 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:48:06 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA15190 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:48:06 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRHFP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:48:05 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8A0DD5.C9AA51AF@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:48:05 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem References: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20020919152937.7700@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > FYI, with the new starkit package, you also get the variable > $::starkit::topdir - it is always set and normalized, so that last > suggestion can now also be written as: > set root $::starkit::topdir I like it :-). My work-a-round for the command line problem is to just use starpack's since that is what I ship anyway. Tom K. From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 12:58:11 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHwBa00409 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:58:11 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JHwLb28358 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:58:21 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:58:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3562.10.3.36.17.1032458301.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:58:21 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <20020919152937.7700@triqs.com> References: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20020919152937.7700@triqs.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler said: > Rohan Pall wrote: > >>Here you normalize the path using the vfs wrapper. I suggest you use >> the line >> set root [file normalize [file dirname [info script]]] >>since you know that you're in a starkit, and starkits have 8.4 > > FYI, with the new starkit package, you also get the variable > $::starkit::topdir - it is always set and normalized, so that last > suggestion can now also be written as: > set root $::starkit::topdir The reason why I go with setting the root manually instead of depending on $::starkit::topdir is more easily understood when you know my standard vfs layout: main.tcl lib/app-hello/hello.tcl lib/app-hello/pkgIndex.tcl I usually set the root in hello.tcl, that way I can execute hello.tcl with any tcltk interpreter (depending on available extensions, of course) including tclkit. I reserve main.tcl for tclkit. The value of this approach depreciates when I make more and more use of tclkit's standard features because then you nearly always will need tclkit, and will want to execute main.tcl. Come to think of it, maybe it would be better if I were to make main.tcl the entry point for any interpreter and do a case by case thing - it would be cool if someone who has thought of these issues could give me a suggestion ;) I'd rather not solve this time and time again. I'd like to figure out a standard way and write a little script to set up the vfs for me so I can start new projects without worrying about these things... as a project becomes more customized I might have to edit it manually, but for the easy things I'd like them to stay easy ;) Thanks for your help! ro P.S. Keep the wiki simple jcw! It works great! From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 13:03:17 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JI3Ga00721 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:03:16 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JI3Fb28528; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 11:03:16 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:03:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4745.10.3.36.17.1032458596.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:03:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] writable and flushing to disk From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <200209191746.NAA27520@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> References: Message from "Rohan Pall" <200209191746.NAA27520@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> Cc: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Kevin Kenny said: > > rohan@rohanpall.com said: >> I just need a diff in tcl [...] > > Does http://wiki.tcl.tk/3108 help? Sure looks like it will. Its marked on my list 'to examine in depth'. Oh and thanks for that in-depth article and exercise set on the 'after' command. Thats also on my list. ro From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 13:07:29 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JI7Ta00927 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:07:29 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JI7db28646 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 11:07:39 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:07:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1774.10.3.36.17.1032458859.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:07:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] mysterious bytes From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <20020919151102.32395@triqs.com> References: <4650.10.3.36.17.1032390544.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20020919151102.32395@triqs.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > If you are opening the starkit in writable mode and certain that no > changes are being saved to it, and it still grows, then please do try In my previous example I showed how I unwrapped the kit, then rewrapped it. The resulting kit is smaller than the original. Why is that? If any changes were being made to it that resulted in the vfs actually growing, then wouldn't rewrapping it not make any difference barring any caching that metakit does that I don't know about? Thanks! ro From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Thu Sep 19 12:46:49 2002 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHkna32254 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:46:49 -0500 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id g8JHkqQl014873; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:46:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id g8JHkjr2014383; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:46:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHkjb05665; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:46:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.9.3+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id NAA27520; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:46:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200209191746.NAA27520@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: "Rohan Pall" cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] writable and flushing to disk X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Rohan Pall" of "Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:16:49 EDT." <2273.10.3.36.17.1032380209.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:46:45 -0400 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: rohan@rohanpall.com said: > I just need a diff in tcl [...] Does http://wiki.tcl.tk/3108 help? -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Sep 19 15:22:58 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JKMwa05763; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:22:58 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id NAA06604; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:23:08 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA13256; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:23:08 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRHSR; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:22:22 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8A31FD.C81A30F3@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:22:21 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Command Line Problem References: <3D8925CC.1CCACEDB@motorola.com> <20020919152037.25597@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, Oops, I found the problem. The problem was with a script I use to select the correct tclkit to use based on the platform I'm currently on. That script wasn't properly handling the command line args which was why the second case was having a problem. Regards, Tom Krehbiel > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > >I have just run into a problem that I don't understand (maybe a bug). > > Yes, it looks, walks, and quacks like a bug to me... > > >puts "0: '$argv0'" > >set i 1 > >foreach arg $argv { > > puts "$i: '$arg'" > > incr i > >} > [...] > >If I then wrap the test.vfs directory into a starkit and run it, it returns: > > > >% test A "B C" > >(starkit run) > >0: 'test' > >1: 'A' > >2: 'B' > >3: 'C' > > > >If I then wrap the test.vfs directory into a starpack and run it, it returns: > > > >% test A "B C" > >(starkit run) > >0: '/tmp/test/main.tcl' > >1: 'A' > >2: 'B C' > > > >The starkit command line parsing appears to have a bug, unless I did > >something stupid. > > Thanks for exposing this problem so clearly. It'll help track this down. > The tclkit main code does very nasty things to try to get all use > scenario's right (see src/kitInit.c in the TclKit distribution). There > is also the "eats first arg as script when used as starpack on windows" > bug. I'll try to have a fix for this in the next tclkit builds - and > perhaps even a way to work around it with the existing builds. From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 15:56:15 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JKuEa07177 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:56:14 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JKuOk29516 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:56:24 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 16:56:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2365.10.3.36.17.1032468984.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 16:56:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] win95, win98 crashing -- bug isolated Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There is a bug when binary extensions are loaded in windows. It crashes on exit. See the following 'main.tcl' script. You could substitute any binary package loading for the ones that I chose. I chose these because the NewzPoint starkit works fine with windows - so I cut away the code until I found these two special lines. If any one of these two lines are commented out, you will witness a crashing on exit. ------------------------------ package require starkit starkit::startup package require Tk set topdir $starkit::topdir wm title . "Force Crash" load [file join $topdir libtkdnd.dll] source [file join $topdir tkDND_Utils.tcl] load [file join $topdir ffidl05.dll] ffidl load [file join $topdir optcl.dll] optcl # c r a s h e r set sock [socket -server {} 4395] # c r a s h e r wm protocol . WM_DELETE_WINDOW exit ------------------------------------------- Happy Tcl'ing! ro From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Sep 19 16:35:02 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JLZ2a08390 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 16:35:02 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate4.mot.com (motgate4 2.1) with ESMTP id OAA08863 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:35:12 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA13299 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:35:12 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRH5V; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:35:11 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8A430F.9CE86E6E@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:35:11 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com References: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20020919152937.7700@triqs.com> <3562.10.3.36.17.1032458301.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] sdx help Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I just noticed that the sdx help command (at least for wrap) wasn't updated when the last set of changes were made. Tom K. From steve@digital-smarties.com Thu Sep 19 16:47:57 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8JLlta08809 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 16:47:56 -0500 Received: (qmail 8383 invoked by uid 8); 19 Sep 2002 21:48:04 -0000 Received: from server.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.2, claiming to be "[192.168.1.22]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdL2Oraz; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 17:47:56 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Tom Krehbiel" Cc: Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx help Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:47:28 -0700 Message-Id: <20020919214728.12834@localhost:1025> In-Reply-To: <3D8A430F.9CE86E6E@motorola.com> References: <3D8A430F.9CE86E6E@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom >I just noticed that the sdx help command (at least for wrap) wasn't >updated when the last set of changes were made. Oops - trying to cram too much in before the conference. I'm doing an update to sdx at the moment (tidying up qwrap, changing to the recommended starkit directory structure, provision for an internal help wiki, etc). I'll look at the help messages at the same time. Thanks Steve From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 17:02:41 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JM2ea09292 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 17:02:40 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JM2nk32175 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:02:49 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:02:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3513.10.3.36.17.1032472969.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:02:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx help From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <20020919214728.12834@localhost:1025> References: <3D8A430F.9CE86E6E@motorola.com> <20020919214728.12834@localhost:1025> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Landers said: > I'm doing an update to sdx at the moment (tidying up qwrap, changing to > the recommended starkit directory structure, provision for an internal > help wiki, etc). I'll look at the help messages at the same time. The writable option is missing. It took me a fair amount of digging to find it since I didn't know it existed. On jcw's wiki is still says that starkits are read-only by default. I understand that you guys are busy, since you've done such excellent work. Thanks again. And Steve, your paper rocked! Thanks for uploading it ;) Rohan From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Sep 19 17:04:14 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JM4Da09363 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 17:04:13 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id PAA08848 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:04:23 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA14004 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:01:41 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRH9C; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:04:22 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8A49E6.A61C86E3@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:04:22 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Landers CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx help References: <3D8A430F.9CE86E6E@motorola.com> <20020919214728.12834@localhost:1025> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Since you're working on sdx please add a -suffix option that can be used to add a user defined suffix (like '.kit') to the output file. Also, I just tried using wikit and it failed with % error: unknown color name "darkgrey" (processing "-disabledfill" option) invoked from within "$canvas itemconfigure $tag1 -disabledfill $disabledfill" (object "::Wikit::gButton0" method "::gButton::new" body line 23) invoked from within "$b0 new Back " (procedure "Wikit::LocalInterface" line 58) invoked from within "Wikit::LocalInterface " After I changed the color to grey it worked ok. Colors and other setting should be handled through the tk option command so problems don't generate errors. I really like the wikit BTW. Tom K. > Tom > > >I just noticed that the sdx help command (at least for wrap) wasn't > >updated when the last set of changes were made. > > Oops - trying to cram too much in before the conference. > > I'm doing an update to sdx at the moment (tidying up qwrap, changing to > the recommended starkit directory structure, provision for an internal > help wiki, etc). I'll look at the help messages at the same time. From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 17:08:28 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JM8Ra09542 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 17:08:28 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JM8ck32342; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:08:38 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:08:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4413.10.3.36.17.1032473318.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:08:38 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020919143621.0ac7b08c@mailserver.sfu.ca> References: <3.0.6.16.20020919111624.3dc76db0@mailserver.sfu.ca> <3.0.6.16.20020919111624.3dc76db0@mailserver.sfu.ca> <3.0.6.16.20020919143621.0ac7b08c@mailserver.sfu.ca> Cc: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: Crash - partial workaround Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Here is some rather good bug-hunting that Ian Gay has been engaged in. He's found a work-around for that annoying crash-on-exit bug, that doesn't rely on those two ugly lines of code that I wrote about earlier. Ian Gay said: > At 17:05 19/09/02 -0400, you wrote: >>Ian Gay said: >>> When you load a dll, tclkit copies it from the vfs to $env(temp) and >>> loads the real file so produced. (And when you get the exit crash, >>> that doesn't get deleted & you build up lots of garbage in your TEMP >>> directory, since it uses a different name each time.) >>> >>> If you do it 'manually', e.g. do the copy yourself in main.tcl, and >>> specifically load the real file so produced, rather than loading from >>> the vfs, then there is no crash. >>> >>> This is not a complete workaround, since you then have no way of >>> deleting the file from within your tclkit (Windows thinks it's in >>> use, tcl has no unload command). >>> >>> But at least you can always save under the same name, so there's only >>> one file left in TEMP. >>> >>> Ian >> >>Could you please send this message to the starkit mailing list? >>starkit@equi4.com >> >>Or I could just forward it... these bugs REALLY need to be fixed ;) >> >>ro >> > > By all means forward it. What versions of windows have you tried? Your > post to the mailing list sounds rather generic. I find the crash on 95, > 98 and ME, but _not_ on NT. I haven't been able to test it on 2k or XP > yet. Does this agree with your experiences? I have seen the bug on an almost totally clean install of win95, and on win98, the first edition. The win98 box has a lot of software installed. ro From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Sep 19 17:14:30 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JMEUa09792 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 17:14:30 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8JMEek32519 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:14:40 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:14:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1389.10.3.36.17.1032473680.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:14:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <3D8A49E6.A61C86E3@motorola.com> References: <3D8A430F.9CE86E6E@motorola.com> <20020919214728.12834@localhost:1025> <3D8A49E6.A61C86E3@motorola.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] source'ing sdx & offer to help Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Since you're working on sdx please add a -suffix option that can be used > to add a user defined suffix (like '.kit') to the output file. On the subject of sdx, is it possible to call it from a tcl kit, by source'ing the kit file? I'd like to do wraps from my code without an exec (on windows doing the tclkitsh thing is annoying because of the terrible command shell). It looks to me like there is a lot of work to do. I would enjoy helping with making sdx source'able if it isn't already done. ro P.S. The future is bright when your way is lighted by a thousand starkits. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Sep 20 12:32:42 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8KHWfa11641; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 12:32:42 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id KAA16273; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 10:32:52 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA24722; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 10:32:52 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRJGV; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 10:32:05 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8B5B95.6971A928@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 10:32:05 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit@equi4.com References: <3977.10.3.36.17.1032400219.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20020919152937.7700@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Major problem with HP Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Yesterday I tried out wikit on my HP and discovered there is a serious problem on HP's. The problem occured when I tried to save the results of a wikit edit. As soon as the edit button was pressed the application hung. By this I mean it no longer responded to input and no longer updated the window. I hunted down the wikit process with ps and tried to kill the process with a -9 and it would not die!!! The process was not looping but it would not go away. I logged out and back in which removed the process. I then went to the directory where I had run wikit and did an ls. % ls wikit.lock wikit.tkd I decide to do an ls -l to look at the size of the wikit.tkd, the ls command hung!! I killed the shell, opened a new shell and did an ls -l on the wikit.lock file it worked but when I tried it on the wikit.tkd file it hung. I killed the shell, opened a new shell and tried to remove the wikit.tkd file with an rm -f but the rm command hung. At this point I rebooted my system and went back to the same directory. % ls -l total 8 -rw-r----- 1 rna020 mask 5 Sep 20 09:33 wikit.lock -rw-r----- 1 rna020 mask 32768 Sep 20 09:35 wikit.tkd % rm wikit.lock wikit.tkd % ls -l total 0 I don't know enough about tclkit/vfs/metakit/wikit to point a finger but my guess is that the problem is being caused by metakit when it is trying to write to the wikit.tkd file. Because of the seriousness of this problem we should probably place a warning on the http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ web page until the problem is fixed. Regards, Tom Krehbiel From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 20 13:09:43 2002 Received: from [192.168.1.25] ([208.181.145.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8KI9ga12987 for ; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:09:42 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Major problem with HP Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 09:09:47 -0700 Message-Id: <20020920160947.301@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D8B5B95.6971A928@motorola.com> References: <3D8B5B95.6971A928@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: [...] >I decide to do an ls -l to look at the size of the wikit.tkd, the ls >command hung!! I killed the shell, opened a new shell and did >an ls -l on the wikit.lock file it worked but when I tried it on the >wikit.tkd file it hung. I killed the shell, opened a new shell >and tried to remove the wikit.tkd file with an rm -f but the rm command >hung. At this point I rebooted my system and went back to >the same directory. First reaction: if a user app can hang an OS, then the OS has a problem. Second reaction: I have seen this happen on another system before. In that case, it pointed to a broken mmap implemementation. My suggestion would be to run the MetaKit regression test suite before doing anything else. It exercises quite a bit of the underlying core. -jcw From will@wjduquette.com Sat Sep 21 18:17:37 2002 Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8LNHba10354 for ; Sat, 21 Sep 2002 18:17:37 -0500 Received: from pool0832.cvx11-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.178.191.67] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17stVU-0003QE-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 21 Sep 2002 16:17:48 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20020921155852.009fb820@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 16:10:54 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Will Duquette Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] First steps on Windows ME Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Howdy! Prompted by Steve's presentation at Tcl 2002, I've finally started working with Starkit. I've now got Notebook running as a Starpack, but there was a certain amount of pain involved. I'm going to go back and re-read the traffic on this list to see if I can find any answers, but I wanted to record what happened, as indicative of the newbie's experience. * The command line issue: given I've created notebook.exe, I should be able to open a notebook like this: notebook.exe mynotebook.nbk Instead, this attempts to execute mynotebook.nbk as a script, which both doesn't work and results in weird errors. notebook.exe -- mynotebook.nbk works, but it's obscure, and I gather it's unneeded except on Windows. * Given that I now have an .exe file which can run .nbk files, I should be able to make .nbk files double-clickable on Windows. I tried this, and stumbled into the backslash problem. This isn't specific to Starkit, I don't believe; I suspect I simply hadn't run into it before. When I double-click on C:\work\notes\notes.nbk, I have Windows run "notebook.exe -- C:\work\notes\notes.nbk". This command line comes into my app as % set argv {C:\work\notes\notes.nbk} I've managed to normalize this using [string map] to dispose of the braces and change the backslashes to forward slashes, but I suspect there's a better solution. Can anyone tell me what it is? * If I create notebook.kit, execute it using tclkit.exe (the compressed one from the Tcl 2002 CD), and then suspend my PC (Windows ME), then when I wake up the computer notebook.kit halts with a Windows error. Interestingly, this doesn't happen with notebook.exe. * At this point I have a "main.tcl" like the one described in Steve's paper: package require starkit starkit::startup package require app-notebook I notice from the other e-mails on this list that most people are doing something a lot more complicated. Why is this? Thanks for any help! Will From bryan@bitmover.com Sat Sep 21 19:30:10 2002 Received: from pimout2-ext.prodigy.net (pimout2-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8M0UAa11790 for ; Sat, 21 Sep 2002 19:30:10 -0500 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-64-216-176-154.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [64.216.176.154]) by pimout2-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.3 da nor stuldap/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g8M0ULI5580368; Sat, 21 Sep 2002 20:30:21 -0400 Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 19:30:20 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] First steps on Windows ME Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Will Duquette From: Bryan Oakley In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020921155852.009fb820@pop.earthlink.net> Message-Id: <79FB6033-CDC2-11D6-BA38-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Saturday, September 21, 2002, at 06:10 PM, Will Duquette wrote: > specific to Starkit, I don't believe; I suspect I > simply hadn't run into it before. When I double-click on > C:\work\notes\notes.nbk, > I have Windows run "notebook.exe -- C:\work\notes\notes.nbk". This > command line > comes into my app as > > % set argv > {C:\work\notes\notes.nbk} This is what you should get, right? argv is an array. So all you really need is something like "set file [lindex $argv 0]", or "set file [file normalize [lindex $argv 0]]". From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 23 02:54:05 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8N7s4a12591 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 02:54:04 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] First steps on Windows ME Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 09:48:39 +0200 Message-Id: <20020923074839.25154@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020921155852.009fb820@pop.earthlink.net> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020921155852.009fb820@pop.earthlink.net> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Will Duquette wrote: >Howdy! Hi :) >* The command line issue: given I've created notebook.exe, I should be > able to open a notebook like this: > > notebook.exe mynotebook.nbk > > Instead, this attempts to execute mynotebook.nbk as a script, which > both doesn't work and results in weird errors. > > notebook.exe -- mynotebook.nbk > > works, but it's obscure, and I gather it's unneeded except on Windows. Yes. Bug. Needs fixing. Am aiming for the next release/build. > % set argv > {C:\work\notes\notes.nbk} Thanks, Bryan, for figuring this one out (i.e. lindex). >* If I create notebook.kit, execute it using tclkit.exe (the compressed one > from the Tcl 2002 CD), and then suspend my PC (Windows ME), then when I >wake up the > computer notebook.kit halts with a Windows error. Interestingly, this >doesn't happen > with notebook.exe. Ouch. That is a *strange* issue. Not sure where to look for a fix here. >* At this point I have a "main.tcl" like the one described in Steve's paper: > > package require starkit > starkit::startup > package require app-notebook > > I notice from the other e-mails on this list that most people are doing >something a > lot more complicated. Why is this? My hunch is: historical. The "package require starkit" approach is relatively new - and only as of a few months ago have things become so simple. TclKit will continue to support "package require scripdoc" for quite a while, but it's deprecated. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Sep 23 06:03:10 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NB39a22056 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 06:03:09 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8NB3F1G003136 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 07:03:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8NB3Fn03165; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 07:03:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 07:03:15 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020923070315.AAB3035@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Two starkit software distribution questions Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: As I am thinking over the implications of distributing software via starkits, there are some areas that have come to mind that I wanted to discuss. Let me preface these question/comments with the observation that I am aware that neither of these areas fall into starkit's target use. What I have been playing with is the idea of making starkit _the_ way that Tcl community software is distributed, as opposed to _one_ way. The question/comments that come to my so far are these: o for the distribution of one or more extensions in starkits, users will frequently desire at least a portion of the starkit 'burst' out into the flat environment. I don't want to imply here that I thought this a problem - it is an observation after talking this past week about the idea of distributing for instance an extension via starkit with the idea in my mind that it could server as an entire runtime format, without bursting/expansion. The area that seems likely to need expanded however are : documentation (most Windows/Unix users are going to want to access the documentation via the standard doc tools like tkman/man, WinHelp, etc.) include/link libraries (for applications or extensions with C API, access to the appropriate files by compilers is going to be necessary) demos/stand-alone executables (for extensions which also come with either tools or demonstrations) My point here is merely that while dropping a tclkit/starkit/starpack into a filesystem works in many cases, there are going to be exceptions and so developers need to consider these types of things to anticipate potential extra needs. o starkits are oriented towards tcl based applications, as well as tcl or binary extensions. However, it seems like there might be some place, during subsequent experience with starkits, for another kind of tcl related distribution - that of the binary application with Tcl embedded. I'm uncertain how this might work though - perhaps some sort of 'wrapper' tcl script which then invokes the binary application. If someone has experimented with this, I know I would appreciate hearing your experiences. o During the conference, while thinking about JC's paper on CriTcl, I was struck by the thought - I wonder how a comperable utility, based however on Java, rather than C, would work - that is to say, some kind of bundling of Tclblend code so that one would embed Java code into a Tcl script and get things to compile . Just a few random thoughts this morning as I struggle to get back up to speed at work... -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 23 10:37:37 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NFbba05781 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 10:37:37 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate4.mot.com (motgate4 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA07651 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 08:37:50 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA27404 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 08:37:49 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRLC8; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 08:37:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8F354C.C75DFF@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 08:37:48 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Two starkit software distribution questions References: <20020923070315.AAB3035@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, I think these are all ideas that are worth more consideration. I personally think that the Tcl community need _one_ way to distribute software and I am also currently working with the starkit approach to see how far it can take me. Previously I have worked with ProTcl (very good but not very _open_) and MkTclapp. Another area that I find needs some thought and might benefit from group discussion is the development environment. I use CVS for storing all my source and I have 3 application (plus variations on those) that I am supporting. It doesn't make any sense to store copies of same extensions in the lib directory for each project so I wrote some code that extracts the appropriate extensions from my installation directory and puts them in the lib directory when I check out the module. I thing this process should be standardized and the extraction should probably be done by a tool (like sdx) and that the extensions should be pulled form an archive like Kitten. If we are to have a developers distribution archive (like Kitten) I think it will also be necessary to work out the details of the directory structure so that automated tools can be used to extract extensions. The issues you raise below are examples of the kinds of issues that will need to be addressed. Tom Krehbiel > As I am thinking over the implications of distributing software via starkits, > there are some areas that have come to mind that I wanted to discuss. > > Let me preface these question/comments with the observation that I am > aware that neither of these areas fall into starkit's target use. What > I have been playing with is the idea of making starkit _the_ way that Tcl > community software is distributed, as opposed to _one_ way. > > The question/comments that come to my so far are these: > > o for the distribution of one or more extensions in starkits, users will > frequently desire at least a portion of the starkit 'burst' out into the > flat environment. I don't want to imply here that I thought this a problem - > it is an observation after talking this past week about the idea of distributing > for instance an extension via starkit with the idea in my mind that it could > server as an entire runtime format, without bursting/expansion. The > area that seems likely to need expanded however are : > > documentation (most Windows/Unix users are going to want to access > the documentation via the standard doc tools like tkman/man, > WinHelp, etc.) > > include/link libraries (for applications or extensions with C API, > access to the appropriate files by compilers is going to be > necessary) > > demos/stand-alone executables (for extensions which also come with > either tools or demonstrations) > > My point here is merely that while dropping a tclkit/starkit/starpack into > a filesystem works in many cases, there are going to be exceptions and so > developers need to consider these types of things to anticipate potential > extra needs. > > o starkits are oriented towards tcl based applications, as well as tcl or > binary extensions. However, it seems like there might be some place, during > subsequent experience with starkits, for another kind of tcl related > distribution - that of the binary application with Tcl embedded. I'm uncertain > how this might work though - perhaps some sort of 'wrapper' tcl script > which then invokes the binary application. If someone has experimented > with this, I know I would appreciate hearing your experiences. > > o During the conference, while thinking about JC's paper on CriTcl, I > was struck by the thought - I wonder how a comperable utility, based however > on Java, rather than C, would work - that is to say, some kind of bundling > of Tclblend code so that one would embed Java code into a Tcl script and > get things to compile . From lvirden@cas.org Mon Sep 23 13:13:28 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NIDSa16132 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:13:28 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8NIDY1G024818 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:13:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8NIDYI09224; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:13:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:13:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020923141333.AAB9198@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: During the Tcl conference, one of the discussions that was held was what should tclkit do when invoked as: $ tclkit (or whatever this is going to look like on Windows/MacOS/etc...) Currently, one gets a Tcl prompt. Alternatives that have been suggested include: o A development environment of some sort - tkcon or something o A wiki help system for Tclkit o A USAGE type statement What other alternatives should be considered? Also, should tclkit include some sort of "report your version" command line argument so that when trying to support tclkit and various starkits or starpacks, one has a chance of asking "okay, what version of the tclkit and starkit are you using"? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From bryan@bitmover.com Mon Sep 23 13:21:35 2002 Received: from pimout4-ext.prodigy.net (pimout4-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NILZa16794 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:21:35 -0500 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-64-216-176-154.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [64.216.176.154]) by pimout4-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.3 da nor stuldap/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g8NILi0N287848; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:21:44 -0400 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:21:43 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Bryan Oakley In-Reply-To: <20020923141333.AAB9198@cas.org> Message-Id: <500A4EEC-CF21-11D6-BCEB-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Monday, September 23, 2002, at 01:13 PM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > During the Tcl conference, one of the discussions that was held was > what should tclkit do when invoked as: > > $ tclkit > > > (or whatever this is going to look like on Windows/MacOS/etc...) > > Currently, one gets a Tcl prompt. Alternatives that have been > suggested > include: > > o A development environment of some sort - tkcon or something > o A wiki help system for Tclkit > o A USAGE type statement > > What other alternatives should be considered? Another option (not sure if I advocate it, though) is a file manager that lets you manage the files inside the tclkit. If it's not the default behavior, it'd be nice if it was available via an option (eg: tclkit --browse) --bryan From andreask@ActiveState.com Mon Sep 23 13:28:33 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NISVa17404 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:28:31 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NISbW31690; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 11:28:37 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8NISb508904; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 11:28:37 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Bryan Oakley" , "Larry W. Virden" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 11:28:37 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <500A4EEC-CF21-11D6-BCEB-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Bryan Oakley > Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 11:22 AM > To: Larry W. Virden > Cc: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? > > > > On Monday, September 23, 2002, at 01:13 PM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > > During the Tcl conference, one of the discussions that was held was > > what should tclkit do when invoked as: > > > > $ tclkit > > > > > > (or whatever this is going to look like on Windows/MacOS/etc...) > > > > Currently, one gets a Tcl prompt. Alternatives that have been > > suggested > > include: > > > > o A development environment of some sort - tkcon or something > > o A wiki help system for Tclkit > > o A USAGE type statement > > > > What other alternatives should be considered? > > Another option (not sure if I advocate it, though) is a file manager > that lets you manage the files inside the tclkit. If it's not the > default behavior, it'd be nice if it was available via an option (eg: > tclkit --browse) Actually this can/should be had via SDX I believe. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From bryan@bitmover.com Mon Sep 23 13:40:47 2002 Received: from pimout1-ext.prodigy.net (pimout1-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.77]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NIeka18338 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:40:46 -0500 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-64-216-176-154.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [64.216.176.154]) by pimout1-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.3 da nor stuldap/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g8NIexBd592200 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:40:59 -0400 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:40:59 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Bryan Oakley To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <00C9A128-CF24-11D6-BCEB-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Monday, September 23, 2002, at 01:28 PM, Andreas Kupries wrote: >> Another option (not sure if I advocate it, though) is a file manager >> that lets you manage the files inside the tclkit. If it's not the >> default behavior, it'd be nice if it was available via an option (eg: >> tclkit --browse) > > Actually this can/should be had via SDX I believe. Right, but it's very cumbersome, IMHO. Especially for people who live in a windows or mac world. What I'm thinking of is a browser (GUI) that lets you see the internal file structure and make it easy to add/remove files via button clicks. From jgodfrey@optinest.com Mon Sep 23 13:52:38 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NIqba19343 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:52:37 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8NIpLI15814; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:51:30 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Rohan Pall" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] sdx help Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:56:46 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3513.10.3.36.17.1032472969.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Rohan Pall > And Steve, your paper rocked! Thanks for uploading it ;) Is Steve's paper publicly available? If so, where? Thanks, Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 23 14:05:52 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NJ5oa20517 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:05:50 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Starkit Subject: RE: [Starkit] sdx help Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 21:03:47 +0200 Message-Id: <20020923190347.8497@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: >Is Steve's paper publicly available? If so, where? It'll probably soon be listed on the ActiveState site, along with other papers. I've added a link to Steve's paper on the http://www.equi4.com/ starkit/ page. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 23 16:02:40 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NL2da27471 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 16:02:39 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id OAA21058 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:02:52 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA14109 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:00:04 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRMGF; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:02:06 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8F814D.1D278E30@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 14:02:05 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Kupries CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > On Monday, September 23, 2002, at 01:13 PM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > > > > During the Tcl conference, one of the discussions that was held was > > > what should tclkit do when invoked as: > > > > > > $ tclkit > > > > > > > > > (or whatever this is going to look like on Windows/MacOS/etc...) > > > > > > Currently, one gets a Tcl prompt. Alternatives that have been > > > suggested > > > include: > > > > > > o A development environment of some sort - tkcon or something > > > o A wiki help system for Tclkit > > > o A USAGE type statement > > > > > > What other alternatives should be considered? > > > > Another option (not sure if I advocate it, though) is a file manager > > that lets you manage the files inside the tclkit. If it's not the > > default behavior, it'd be nice if it was available via an option (eg: > > tclkit --browse) > > Actually this can/should be had via SDX I believe. > > -- > Andreas Kupries I have been toying with the idea of creating a "Tcl Developers Tool Bar" (TDTB) to address two issues. First two improve the learning curve for new tcl developers and second to help with the Windows/MacOS/etc... interface problems. The TDTB would be a button box that contained tool buttons. Each tool in the tool box would provide a gui for the underlying tool along with access to a wikit help page for the tool. The TDTB would be a good place to access the SDX functionality. I'm not sure what is meant by "A wiki help system for Tclkit". If this means including wikit as part of tclkit then I could probably support it, but if this means to include help on tclkit through a wikit as part of tclkit then I would find that very dangerous and could not support it. My concern here would be that an application that is running in the background might try to provide help on an error and through a gui rather than through stdout. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 23 17:24:53 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8NMOqa31854 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 17:24:52 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id PAA23956 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 15:25:30 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA26781 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 15:25:05 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRM30; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 15:24:19 -0700 Message-ID: <3D8F9493.40256510@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 15:24:19 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: <20020923141333.AAB9198@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden" wrote: > Also, should tclkit include some sort of "report your version" command > line argument so that when trying to support tclkit and various starkits > or starpacks, one has a chance of asking "okay, what version of the > tclkit and starkit are you using"? Yes, I think it should. Should there also be a way to determine the versions of the tclkit components at runtime? For instance should it be possible to determine the MetaKit version? Tom K. From will@wjduquette.com Mon Sep 23 22:43:11 2002 Received: from snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8O3hBa08243 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 22:43:11 -0500 Received: from pool0489.cvx38-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.31.234] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17tgbK-0005W8-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 20:43:24 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20020923165956.00a02180@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 17:03:29 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] First steps on Windows ME In-Reply-To: <20020923074839.25154@triqs.com> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020921155852.009fb820@pop.earthlink.net> <5.1.1.6.0.20020921155852.009fb820@pop.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 09:48 AM 9/23/2002 +0200, JCW wrote: > > % set argv > > {C:\work\notes\notes.nbk} > >Thanks, Bryan, for figuring this one out (i.e. lindex). Actually, it was "file normalize" that I was needing. I use Cygwin, and so I always use Unix file naming conventions; I'd never run into the need for "file normalize" before. In other words, the braces in the above argv weren't list braces; if I'd passed C:\work\notes\notes.nbk foo to the program I'd have seen this: %set argv {C:\work\notes\notes.nbk} foo % Anyway, I've got it now. >My hunch is: historical. The "package require starkit" approach is >relatively new - and only as of a few months ago have things become so >simple. TclKit will continue to support "package require scripdoc" for >quite a while, but it's deprecated. Excellent! Thanks! Will From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Sep 24 02:20:53 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8O7Kpa13746 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 02:20:52 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Sep 24 10:50:27 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D901387.1050202@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:25:59 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: <20020923141333.AAB9198@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > During the Tcl conference, one of the discussions that was held was > what should tclkit do when invoked as: > > $ tclkit > > > (or whatever this is going to look like on Windows/MacOS/etc...) > > Currently, one gets a Tcl prompt. Alternatives that have been suggested > include: > > o A development environment of some sort - tkcon or something > o A wiki help system for Tclkit > o A USAGE type statement > Hi, I think the above are all valuable and could be additions to tkcon. So, tclkit could start as usual, and the developer could do a package req Tkcon and get the above functionality.... OTOH, wiki help should probably be available at the initial (current tclkit) level for novices... > What other alternatives should be considered? > > Also, should tclkit include some sort of "report your version" command > line argument so that when trying to support tclkit and various starkits > or starpacks, one has a chance of asking "okay, what version of the > tclkit and starkit are you using"? I am not clear here;-( regards, nicolas boretos From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Sep 24 02:23:01 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8O7N0a13859 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 02:23:00 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Sep 24 10:52:37 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D901409.2000304@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:28:09 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bryan Oakley CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: <00C9A128-CF24-11D6-BCEB-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan Oakley wrote: > > On Monday, September 23, 2002, at 01:28 PM, Andreas Kupries wrote: > >>> Another option (not sure if I advocate it, though) is a file manager >>> that lets you manage the files inside the tclkit. If it's not the >>> default behavior, it'd be nice if it was available via an option (eg: >>> tclkit --browse) >> >> >> Actually this can/should be had via SDX I believe. > > > Right, but it's very cumbersome, IMHO. Especially for people who live in > a windows or mac world. What I'm thinking of is a browser (GUI) that > lets you see the internal file structure and make it easy to add/remove > files via button clicks. > This sounds totally cool.... regards, nicolas boretos > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > . > From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 24 02:43:40 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8O7hca14527 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 02:43:39 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:43:43 +0200 Message-Id: <20020924074343.10242@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D901409.2000304@maich.gr> References: <3D901409.2000304@maich.gr> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Nicolas Boretos wrote: [Bryan Oakley] >> What I'm thinking of is a browser (GUI) that >> lets you see the internal file structure and make it easy to add/remove >> files via button clicks. >> >This sounds totally cool.... One way to go is to see whether TkDesk could be turned into a (pretty big) starkit. It would bring this option in for free via VFS, and much more. There's a tree demo in Bwidgets which shows disk contents, this would be simple to turn into a starkit which browses through VFS (also ZIP and FTP, btw). In fact, Tcl 8.4 based development tools all can benefit from being transparent in their treatment of starkits by VFS-mounting them. AlphaTk by Vince Darley already does, Source Navigator and "ML" (in sdarchive) could as well, maybe. Some work was done a while back to turn xotcl and an IDE for it into a starkit, I can try to find the email I got if anyone is interested. Closer to home, would be Tcl Dev Kit and even Komodo... The point is that with 8.4 being final, VFS provides transparent access to any Tcl-based app. Well, it is limited to TclKit for now, but getting TclVFS into shape to work out of the box with any Tcl setup is a top priority for me. The limiting issues are in fact not TclVFS but things like zlib and memchan/rechan. -jcw From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Sep 24 04:06:19 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8O96Ha17678 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 04:06:18 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Sep 24 12:35:54 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D902C3D.4000406@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 12:11:25 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: <3D901409.2000304@maich.gr> <20020924074343.10242@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, Getting excited 'bout vfs (again) and tried the samples on the wiki vfs::urltype::Mount http set fd [open http://sourceforge.net/projects/tcl] set contents [read $fd] ; close $fd Got an error pop-up "illegal seek mode specified" This is using the current vfs/memchan download (not cvs) from sourceforge. IIRC, the above tidbit worked (on XP both times) regards, nicolas boretos > > The point is that with 8.4 being final, VFS provides transparent access > to any Tcl-based app. Well, it is limited to TclKit for now, but getting > TclVFS into shape to work out of the box with any Tcl setup is a top > priority for me. The limiting issues are in fact not TclVFS but things > like zlib and memchan/rechan. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > . > From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 24 07:14:33 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OCEXa27598 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:14:33 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8OCEe1G019118 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:14:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8OCEeN05571; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:14:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:14:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020924081440.AAB5560@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 24 Sep 2002 12:11:25 +0300 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Nicolas Boretos > vfs::urltype::Mount http > set fd [open http://sourceforge.net/projects/tcl] > set contents [read $fd] ; close $fd >Got an error pop-up > >"illegal seek mode specified" Shoot - you got farther than I did! $ tclsh8.4 % package require vfs 1.0 % vfs::urltype::Mount http invalid command name "vfs::urltype::Mount" % -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 24 07:15:40 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OCFda27694 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:15:40 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8OCFk1G019345 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:15:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8OCFla05596; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:15:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:15:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020924081546.AAB5574@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 24 Sep 2002 12:11:25 +0300 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Just in case people say "oh, you have tclvfs installed wrong": $ tclkit % package require vfs 1.0 % vfs::urltype::Mount http invalid command name "vfs::urltype::Mount" % -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Tue Sep 24 07:32:27 2002 Received: from sputnik (c19216.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au [210.49.146.52]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OCWQa28821 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:32:27 -0500 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost.localdomain ident=steve) by sputnik with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 17tor8-0003ET-00 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 22:31:58 +1000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? From: Steve Cassidy To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20020924081440.AAB5560@cas.org> References: <20020924081440.AAB5560@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 24 Sep 2002 22:31:57 +1000 Message-Id: <1032870718.11839.5.camel@sputnik> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tue, 2002-09-24 at 22:14, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > From: Nicolas Boretos > > > vfs::urltype::Mount http > > set fd [open http://sourceforge.net/projects/tcl] > > set contents [read $fd] ; close $fd > >Got an error pop-up > > > >"illegal seek mode specified" > > Shoot - you got farther than I did! The problem is that the tcl code doesn't have package provides and isn't installed when you say make install. I've submitted a patch to the tclvfs project on sf.net to fix this (at least partially). My fixed version can do: sputnik > tclsh8.4 % package require vfs 1.0 % package require vfslib 1.3 % package require vfs.http 1.0 % package require vfs.urltype 1.0 % vfs::urltype::Mount http Mounted at "http://" % set fd [open http://localhost/] mem0 % set contents [read $fd]; close $fd ...and get the appropriate html content. You can get a version for linux at least on http://www.ics.mq.edu.au/~cassidy/cgi-bin/installer Steve From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Sep 24 08:05:27 2002 Received: from smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OD5Qa31087 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:05:27 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost4.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17tpNd-000Hxm-00; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 14:05:33 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924140327.026cbdc0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 14:05:31 +0100 To: Steve Cassidy , starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: <1032870718.11839.5.camel@sputnik> References: <20020924081440.AAB5560@cas.org> <20020924081440.AAB5560@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 10:31 PM 9/24/2002 +1000, Steve Cassidy wrote: >sputnik > tclsh8.4 >% package require vfs >1.0 >% package require vfslib >1.3 >% package require vfs.http >1.0 >% package require vfs.urltype >1.0 >% vfs::urltype::Mount http >Mounted at "http://" Is this what everyone wants (I'm completely open-minded here). The alternative is just that 'package require vfs' places the relevant directory on the auto_path so that 'vfs::urltype::Mount http' works directly. One difference between these two approaches, of course, is that 'package require vfs.xxx' should of course ensure that all required other packages are loaded (e.g. memchan or equivalent, trf, etc). happy to put whatever everyone wants in tclvfs... Vince. From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 24 08:05:58 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OD5wa31135 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:05:58 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8OD641G010172 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:06:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8OD64p07756; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:06:04 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:06:04 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020924090604.AAB7721@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: <1032870718.11839.5.camel@sputnik> of 24 Sep 2002 22:31:57 +1000 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: In tclkit, apparently vfs.http and vfs.urltype packages can't be found either. Looks like some work is needed here. Be aware also that Friday someone mentioned that Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 is coming within a week or two - perhaps when those bugs are fixed we can get the fixed tclvfs in as well? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Tue Sep 24 08:20:12 2002 Received: from sputnik (c19216.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au [210.49.146.52]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ODKBa32106 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:20:11 -0500 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost.localdomain ident=steve) by sputnik with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 17tpbH-0003FK-00; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 23:19:39 +1000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? From: Steve Cassidy To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20020924090604.AAB7721@cas.org> References: <20020924090604.AAB7721@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 24 Sep 2002 23:19:38 +1000 Message-Id: <1032873579.11839.16.camel@sputnik> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tue, 2002-09-24 at 23:06, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > In tclkit, apparently vfs.http and vfs.urltype packages can't be found either. > I made up these names since these files didn't have any (or not reliably, I can't recall). I wasn't completely thorough in putting in package require's where needed obviously. In the current cvs I see: mk4vfs.tcl:package provide mk4vfs 1.5 pkgIndex.tcl:if {[package provide Tcl] < 8.4} { starkit.tcl:package provide starkit 1.0 vfslib.tcl:package provide vfslib 1.3 zipvfs.tcl:package provide zipvfs 1.0 I note that tclkit provides zipvfs, it would be good to have a standard way of naming these if they're to be separate packages, eg vfs::zip, vfs::mk4, vfs::http. The alternative is to have 'package require vfs' load the whole lot but the other approach is more flexible in terms of adding new fs types in the future. Steve From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Sep 24 08:27:58 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8ODRva32585 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:27:57 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Sep 24 16:57:34 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3D906991.5020803@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:33:05 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Cassidy CC: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: <20020924090604.AAB7721@cas.org> <1032873579.11839.16.camel@sputnik> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: > On Tue, 2002-09-24 at 23:06, Larry W. Virden wrote: > >>In tclkit, apparently vfs.http and vfs.urltype packages can't be found either. >> > > > I made up these names since these files didn't have any (or not > reliably, I can't recall). I wasn't completely thorough in putting in > package require's where needed obviously. > > In the current cvs I see: > > mk4vfs.tcl:package provide mk4vfs 1.5 > pkgIndex.tcl:if {[package provide Tcl] < 8.4} { > starkit.tcl:package provide starkit 1.0 > vfslib.tcl:package provide vfslib 1.3 > zipvfs.tcl:package provide zipvfs 1.0 > I think this is a good start as one could call specifically the functionality required > I note that tclkit provides zipvfs, it would be good to have a standard > way of naming these if they're to be separate packages, eg vfs::zip, > vfs::mk4, vfs::http. The alternative is to have 'package require vfs' > load the whole lot but the other approach is more flexible in terms of > adding new fs types in the future. > > Steve > > > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > . > From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Sep 24 08:28:52 2002 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ODSpa32679 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:28:52 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17tpkO-0001DU-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 14:29:04 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924142723.026ec388@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 14:29:03 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: <1032873579.11839.16.camel@sputnik> References: <20020924090604.AAB7721@cas.org> <20020924090604.AAB7721@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 11:19 PM 9/24/2002 +1000, Steve Cassidy wrote: >I note that tclkit provides zipvfs, it would be good to have a standard >way of naming these if they're to be separate packages, eg vfs::zip, >vfs::mk4, vfs::http. The alternative is to have 'package require vfs' >load the whole lot but the other approach is more flexible in terms of >adding new fs types in the future. Given the actual code is standardized in the namespaces vfs::zip vfs::http vfs::ftp etc, why don't we use that as the package names? If anyone wishes to email me a replacement library directory (easier than a patch on my end, for this), I'll check in the changes. cheers, Vince. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Sep 24 09:25:19 2002 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OEPIa04089 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:25:18 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17tqcu-0006zS-00; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:25:24 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924152123.0270d6b0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:25:23 +0100 To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20020924101854.AAB8843@cas.org> References: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924142723.026ec388@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm in two minds myself... On the one-hand it would be good just to have 'package require vfs' do everything, but on the other hand, that might not work, because when you try to use 'vfs::ftp' you find the 'ftp' package isn't available, and 'vfs::ftp::Mount' fails, etc. I would lean towards the following: 'package require vfs' isn't used by the end-user very much. Instead the end-user does 'package require vfs::foo' to use the 'foo' vfs. This automatically does a package require vfs behind the scenes (and a 'package require' for whatever other packages 'foo' needs). That way the user only needs one package require for each filesystem type they want to use, and new filesystem types (not distributed with tclvfs) can behave identically to the distributed ones. Vince. At 10:18 AM 9/24/2002 -0400, you wrote: >As for seperate package requires, for _me_, personally, I don't mind >seeing package require vfs creating all the commands, but if >seperate packages is something people want, I would just like to see >things simplified so that only one package require is necessary rather >than 3 or 4 package requires to get the package to work. From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 24 09:29:49 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OETma04386 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:29:49 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8OETt1G012775 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:29:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8OETtB09115; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:29:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:29:55 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020924102955.AAB9106@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924152123.0270d6b0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> of Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:25:23 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince, that probably is best. However, will there be reference pages for each of the commands, so that one can do a "man vfs::http" for instance and get the appropriate docs? -- Tcl'2002 Sept 16, 2002, Vancouver, BC http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2002/ Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 24 09:59:13 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OExCa06133 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:59:12 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:59:07 +0200 Message-Id: <20020924145907.15115@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924152123.0270d6b0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> References: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924152123.0270d6b0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: >I'm in two minds myself... On the one-hand it would be good just to have >'package require vfs' do everything, but on the other hand, that might not >work, because when you try to use 'vfs::ftp' you find the 'ftp' package >isn't available, and 'vfs::ftp::Mount' fails, etc. (Could be solved with "vfs::mount ftp a.b.c/d/e/f haha", see below) >I would lean towards the following: > >'package require vfs' isn't used by the end-user very much. Instead the >end-user does 'package require vfs::foo' to use the 'foo' vfs. This >automatically does a package require vfs behind the scenes (and a 'package >require' for whatever other packages 'foo' needs). > >That way the user only needs one package require for each filesystem type >they want to use, and new filesystem types (not distributed with tclvfs) >can behave identically to the distributed ones. Is there a precedent for the abc::def package naming scheme? If not, I'd be more inclined to vote for something such as "package require vfs.ftp". As for what to require: there may be some more complexity ahead of us. As a developer, it might be useful to have an "all" version, and in fact stay away from explicitly requiring just sub-packages, perhaps: package require vfs vfs::schemes auto all or vfs::schemes auto {http ftp} Which would in turn generate the necessary require's. There may be some risk in exposing everything-and-the-kitchen-sink, given that schemes become recognized by the [open] command in any spot (and interp?). There seem to be two basic VFS mechanisms: schemes ("http://...", etc) and mount points. I don't fully understand the issues yet. The mount mechanism in turn has a bit of cruft which might be cleaned up before things become too widespread: - case mixing: lower "vfs", lower scheme name, then "Mount" :( - the fact that a gets mounted on b, with a often the same as b Would it be an idea to move towards a slightly different naming structure? Perhaps: vfs::mount ftp a.b.c/d/e/f haha vfs::mount zip abc.zip And on the closing down side: vfs::unmount haha vfs::unmount abc.zip Perhaps even use the above as a model for "auto-scheme support": vfs::mount ftp://a.b.c/d/e/f haha vfs::mount zip:abc.zip (The latter is not "zip://...", because abc.zip refers to current "."?) Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing the "vfs::type" namespaces reserved for implementations, i.e. making them internal details as far as vfs usage is concerned. There are no doubt many other hairy details to consider. What about mounting a zip residing on a remote FTP server? Is that supported? Probably not now, but it could be - and so could even much further reaching plan9-like mechanisms, such as mounting a remote process, or even inspecting its Tcl var/proc namespaces. It may not happen soon, but the path we embark on now needs to try to keep options open as much as possible, IMO. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Tue Sep 24 10:03:21 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OF3Ka06451 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:03:20 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8OF3R1G023010 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 11:03:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8OF3R309882; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 11:03:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 11:03:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020924110327.AAB9872@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: <20020924145907.15115@triqs.com> of Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:59:07 +0200 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: What about the possibility of an 'unknown' type setup - so that once someone did a package require vfs, attempts to access specific vfs features would either be in memory, or be autoloaded, unless literally not on the system... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Sep 24 10:05:34 2002 Received: from smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OF5Xa06651 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:05:33 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17trFw-0008Z3-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:05:44 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924155233.026d7d38@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:05:43 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? In-Reply-To: <20020924102955.AAB9106@cas.org> References: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924152123.0270d6b0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 10:29 AM 9/24/2002 -0400, Larry W. Virden wrote: >Vince, that probably is best. However, will there be reference pages >for each of the commands, so that one can do a "man vfs::http" for >instance and get the appropriate docs? If someone writes them, they'll be there, but otherwise they won't... I know this isn't a great answer, but that's the way it is... At this point I should say: I did write tclvfs, but I don't consider myself to be its long-term maintainer. I've pushed it out into the open world of Tcl... It emerged out of a need to make tclkit and the new vfs support in Tcl8.4 meet somewhere. That meeting point was constrained by the historical interfaces of tclkit, and the old 'vfs in tcl' code written by numerous others. This means it isn't necessarily the best design in the world, but neither is it awful, and it does work (subject to the various bugs/issues which we're discussing on this list, it seems). On top of that, there are quite a few others who have a lot more practical experience with using vfs's than I do, so that's another reason for me just to be a happy bystander here. What this does mean is that all of these issues we are discussing are 100% open to everyone to contribute to (whether by word or code), and I am certainly not going to veto or otherwise get in the way. Hopefully we'll come to some good answers and some good code which everyone can use. hope that clarifies my position, Vince. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Sep 24 10:29:28 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OFTSa08636 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:29:28 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA02280 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:29:42 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA11034 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:29:42 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRNMK; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:29:41 -0700 Message-ID: <3D9084E5.13B2A6F2@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:29:41 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? References: <5.1.1.5.0.20020924152123.0270d6b0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> <20020924145907.15115@triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >I'm in two minds myself... On the one-hand it would be good just to have >'package require vfs' do everything, but on the other hand, that might not >work, because when you try to use 'vfs::ftp' you find the 'ftp' package >isn't available, and 'vfs::ftp::Mount' fails, etc. FWIW, The tcllib index provides for both a "package ifneeded tcllib" that loads everything and individual "package ifneeded ..." for each package. However, the loading of package dependencies is not support, it is left as a surprise for the developer. Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 24 12:45:16 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OHjEa19304; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 12:45:14 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: , "Michael Jacobson" Cc: "Jeff Hobbs" , "Starkit mailing list" Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 19:45:18 +0200 Message-Id: <20020924174518.14430@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D90A1D4.4000109@mail.northgrum.com> References: <3D90A1D4.4000109@mail.northgrum.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Jacobson wrote: (Also CC'd to the Starkit mailing list) >Hello everyone...I have a quick question about using a dll in a Starkit >that reads a file in the Starkit. > >Does using winico in a Starkit work? I was trying to wrap a application >that used winico and I found that winico would not load a icon inside >the Starkit. Is this a known issue? (I know that that 8.4 has icon >support but this was for placing a icon in the windows tool tray ~ which >is only in winico does). > >I am including a simple application, tknotepad.kit, to show this >problem. At the console that is displayed try the following (or >uncomment the last 2 lines in the tknotepad.tcl file). > >(tknotepad.kit) 1 % glob "[file join $starkit_top icons]/*.*" >C:/np2/tknotepad.kit/icons/notepad.ico >(tknotepad.kit) 2 % file exist [file join $starkit_top icons notepad.ico] >1 >(tknotepad.kit) 3 % set ico [winico createfrom [file join $starkit_top >icons notepad.ico]] >Error Opening File for Readingreading of >C:/np2/tknotepad.kit/icons/notepad.ico failed! > >Any ideas? > >Michael Jacobson That's right, winico uses read() system calls which are not aware of the VFS environment which Tcl scripts see. I once hacked up a winico to use equivalent Tcl channel calls, to support winico in starkits (scripted docs then), but now that more icon support is in std Tk, I no longer use it. >P.S. Nice presentation on Tclkit/Starkit/Starpack at Tcl2k2 (I checked >out your slides) also Steve's paper was very good (I have been send it >around to our Tcl developers). Great - spread the word :) -jcw From david@davudsplace.net Tue Sep 24 15:31:50 2002 Received: from restofus (dsl093-039-044.pdx1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.93.39.44]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OKVna01808 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:31:50 -0500 Received: from lagniappe.davudsplace.net (lagniappe [192.168.1.66]) by restofus (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A7501F64F for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:30:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by lagniappe.davudsplace.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 30B94C045; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:31:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15760.52157.972187.746468@davudsplace.net> Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:31:57 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailer: VM 7.03 under Emacs 21.2.1 Reply-To: david@davudsplace.net From: david@davudsplace.net (david may) Subject: [Starkit] loading extensions into Tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have had this problem with a number of extensions I have created. They will load and work fine with tclsh. But I get a segv when I try and load them into a tclkit. Today I tried critcl.kit from steve's site and ther same problem occurs. Seems if there is a reference to an external .so, in this case /usr/lib/libpq.so, the critcl code crashes tclkit. But I can load .so that critcl compiles into tclsh8.4 and it runs flawlessly. This is some kind of ld.so magic I suppose. I have tried a bunch of compile flags and librariy flags, including -lpq but no joy.. can any one enlighten me? thanks, davud david@davudsplace.net From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 24 16:02:42 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OL2ca04023 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:02:38 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] loading extensions into Tclkit Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 23:02:39 +0200 Message-Id: <20020924210239.22438@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <15760.52157.972187.746468@davudsplace.net> References: <15760.52157.972187.746468@davudsplace.net> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: david may wrote: >I have had this problem with a number of extensions I have >created. They will load and work fine with tclsh. But >I get a segv when I try and load them into a tclkit. > >Today I tried critcl.kit from steve's site and ther same >problem occurs. Seems if there is a reference to an external >.so, in this case /usr/lib/libpq.so, the critcl code crashes tclkit. >But I can load .so that critcl compiles into tclsh8.4 and >it runs flawlessly. This is some kind of ld.so magic I suppose. > >I have tried a bunch of compile flags and librariy flags, >including -lpq but no joy.. can any one enlighten me? The usual culprit is not compiling the .so(s) with stubs enabled. There may be a problem also when compiling with 8.4a* tcl headers. Reason: the .so will load against the installed tcl/tk shared libs, which is wrong when run under tclkit (or any other version of tcl than is installed). When used against the installed tclsh, things work because calls can be resolved without stubs. If "load blah.so" fails, then please check the output of "ldd blah.so" or "nm -g blah.so". If there is a reference to libtcl*.so in there (ldd), or an undefined Tcl_* routine (nm), then the extension was not properly built with stubs. What version do you have of tclsh8.4 (i.e. "info patchlevel")? Can you successfully run a basic critcl example? -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 24 16:04:59 2002 Received: from [10.0.1.193] (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OL4wa04197 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:04:59 -0500 From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 23:05:03 +0200 Message-Id: <20020924210503.30023@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <3D9084E5.13B2A6F2@motorola.com> References: <3D9084E5.13B2A6F2@motorola.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >The tcllib index provides for both a "package ifneeded tcllib" that loads >everything and individual "package ifneeded ..." for each >package. However, the loading of package dependencies is not support, it >is left as a surprise for the developer. As I understand it, tcllib's top level package is deprecated. The idea is to require the modules you want to use, and they will require the underlying packages they in turn need. Come to think of it, this matches what Vince Darley has suggested for vfs. -jcw From dgporter@erols.com Tue Sep 24 16:33:29 2002 Received: from smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.62]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8OLXSa05992; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:33:29 -0500 Received: from 66-44-2-230.s738.apx1.lnh.md.dialup.rcn.com ([66.44.2.230] helo=there) by smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net with smtp (Exim 3.35 #7) id 17txJN-0000jA-00; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:33:42 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Don Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit mailing list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] what should tclkit's default action be? Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:28:10 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] References: <3D9084E5.13B2A6F2@motorola.com> <20020924210503.30023@triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020924210503.30023@triqs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tuesday 24 September 2002 17:05, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > As I understand it, tcllib's top level package is deprecated. The > idea is to require the modules you want to use, and they will require > the underlying packages they in turn need. That's the only sane way to do modular work. As the author of some bit of software, you are expected to know what commands you are using. If some of those are coming from another package, it's your job to gain access to that package ([package require]). It's not your job to know the internals of that package in order to set things up for it. If each module takes care of it's own direct requirements, then the system will hold together fine, and concerns will be properly separated, and module development can independently proceed. (To be precise, I'm talking about runtime responsibility within the code itself. Packaging/deployment is another matter. A packager of a complete system (starkit or otherwise) does need to see that all the pieces are included.) This ain't C++. -- | Don Porter dgporter@erols.com | | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" | | -- Adam West as BATMAN | |______________________________________________________________________| From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Sep 24 18:06:37 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8ON6aa10668 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 18:06:37 -0500 Received: (qmail 15610 invoked by uid 8); 24 Sep 2002 23:06:49 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdLegPjb; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 19:06:45 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 07:06:43 +0800 Message-Id: <20020924230643.18388@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20020924174518.14430@triqs.com> References: <20020924174518.14430@triqs.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Jacobson wrote: >>Does using winico in a Starkit work? I was trying to wrap a application >>that used winico and I found that winico would not load a icon inside >>the Starkit. Is this a known issue? Jean-Claude Wippler replied: >That's right, winico uses read() system calls which are not aware of the >VFS environment which Tcl scripts see. I once hacked up a winico to use >equivalent Tcl channel calls, to support winico in starkits (scripted >docs then), but now that more icon support is in std Tk, I no longer use it. On occasion I use winico for system tray stuff, but I just copy the icon files into a temporary file in the native filesystem before pointing winico at them. The name of the temporary directory/folder used by VFS used to be available, but I'm not sure if this is still the case. I'll have to check. If it isn't, then maybe tclvfs should expose it. Steve From gay@sfu.ca Tue Sep 24 18:21:16 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ONLGa11737 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 18:21:16 -0500 Received: from ian.chem.sfu.ca (ian.chem.sfu.ca [142.58.209.2]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.5/8.12.5/SFU-5.0H) with SMTP id g8ONLINt027489; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:21:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.20020924155415.0fbfc1fe@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Sender: gay@mailserver.sfu.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:54:15 To: "Steve Landers" , "Starkit mailing list" From: Ian Gay Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit In-Reply-To: <20020924230643.18388@mail.digital-smarties.com> References: <20020924174518.14430@triqs.com> <20020924174518.14430@triqs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 07:06 25/09/02 +0800, Steve Landers wrote: >Michael Jacobson wrote: > >>>Does using winico in a Starkit work? I was trying to wrap a application >>>that used winico and I found that winico would not load a icon inside >>>the Starkit. Is this a known issue? > >Jean-Claude Wippler replied: > >>That's right, winico uses read() system calls which are not aware of the >>VFS environment which Tcl scripts see. I once hacked up a winico to use >>equivalent Tcl channel calls, to support winico in starkits (scripted >>docs then), but now that more icon support is in std Tk, I no longer use it. > >On occasion I use winico for system tray stuff, but I just copy the icon >files into a temporary file in the native filesystem before pointing >winico at them. > >The name of the temporary directory/folder used by VFS used to be >available, but I'm not sure if this is still the case. I'll have to >check. If it isn't, then maybe tclvfs should expose it. I agree. (looks like it uses $env(TEMP) on windoze, but what does it do if that's not set, and what on other platforms?). Another use for this directory is to copy out programs from the starkit that you want to exec. From andreask@ActiveState.com Tue Sep 24 18:44:59 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ONiwa12854 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 18:44:59 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8ONj7Q07064 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:45:07 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8ONj7529521 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:45:07 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:45:07 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020924155415.0fbfc1fe@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Ian Gay > Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 3:54 PM > To: Steve Landers; Starkit mailing list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit > > > At 07:06 25/09/02 +0800, Steve Landers wrote: > >Michael Jacobson wrote: > > > >>>Does using winico in a Starkit work? I was trying to wrap a > application > >>>that used winico and I found that winico would not load a icon inside > >>>the Starkit. Is this a known issue? > > > >Jean-Claude Wippler replied: > > > >>That's right, winico uses read() system calls which are not aware of the > >>VFS environment which Tcl scripts see. I once hacked up a winico to use > >>equivalent Tcl channel calls, to support winico in starkits (scripted > >>docs then), but now that more icon support is in std Tk, I no > longer use it. > > > >On occasion I use winico for system tray stuff, but I just copy the icon > >files into a temporary file in the native filesystem before pointing > >winico at them. > > > >The name of the temporary directory/folder used by VFS used to be > >available, but I'm not sure if this is still the case. I'll have to > >check. If it isn't, then maybe tclvfs should expose it. > > I agree. (looks like it uses $env(TEMP) on windoze, but what does it do if > that's not set, and what on other platforms?). Another use for this > directory is to copy out programs from the starkit that you want to exec. While I know that [load] copies out automatically, does [exec] the same if the application happens to be in a non-native file system ? IMHO it should. Ditto [open "|..."]. [exec] is actually an [open "|"] in disguise where the std* channels are not made accessible as channels to the script, but consumed internally to make them the returned result of [exec]. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From mjacobson@northropgrumman.com Tue Sep 24 21:10:35 2002 Received: from xcgmd810.northgrum.com (xcgmd810.northgrum.com [155.104.240.104]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8P2AZa20074 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 21:10:35 -0500 Received: by xcgmd810.northgrum.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) id ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:24:05 -0700 Message-ID: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E46@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> From: "Jacobson, Michael P." To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:24:53 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > (Also CC'd to the Starkit mailing list) Sorry I forgot to send it to the list. (my bad) > That's right, winico uses read() system calls which are not aware of the > VFS environment which Tcl scripts see. I once hacked up a winico to use > equivalent Tcl channel calls, to support winico in starkits (scripted > docs then), but now that more icon support is in std Tk, I no longer use it. > -jcw There is more in Winico than is in the std Tk8.4 (Tip 8). I know programs like SnackAmp uses the tool tray functionality of Winico. This means that applications using (or desiring) these Winico features will not be using Starkits for distrubutions. I see a couple possible solutions. The first is modifing an existing application to write the icon out of the VFS and then use winico to load this file (should work but not tested). The second would be to update the the Winico package to support reading from channels. Has any work been done on this package? The last updates I saw were for the TclPro (winico04.dll) but they never appeared back on Peter Brueckner site. The third is to have Tclkit include it a VFS aware version Winico as part of the standard distrubition. It looks like adding Winico to the TclKit distro would add about 10k (based on upx compression of winico03.dll). Fourth do nothing ;-) Mike Jacobson From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Sep 24 21:33:28 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8P2XRa21172 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 21:33:27 -0500 Received: (qmail 16061 invoked by uid 8); 25 Sep 2002 02:33:40 -0000 Received: from pc-00062 (192.168.1.62, claiming to be "[192.168.1.62]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpd190e6J; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 22:33:37 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Jacobson, Michael P." , "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 10:33:35 +0800 Message-Id: <20020925023335.20445@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E46@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> References: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E46@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Michael, >I see a couple possible solutions. > >The first is modifing an existing application to write the icon out of the >VFS and then use winico to load this file (should work but not tested). Will work - a suitable short term solution >The second would be to update the the Winico package to support reading from >channels. Has any work been done on this package? The last updates I saw >were for the TclPro (winico04.dll) but they never appeared back on Peter >Brueckner site. This would be my recommended solution. As JCW mentioned, there was a version floating around that was channel aware. I'll look through my source/mail archive and see if I've got a copy around. >The third is to have Tclkit include it a VFS aware version Winico as part of >the standard distrubition. It looks like adding Winico to the TclKit distro >would add about 10k (based on upx compression of winico03.dll). I'd rather not go this route - if you need the added winico functionality then it would be better adding it to the Starkit. >Fourth do nothing ;-) I don't like this option :-) Steve From cferril@mchsi.com Wed Sep 25 01:05:47 2002 Received: from sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (sccmmhc01.mchsi.com [204.127.203.183]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8P65la30238 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 01:05:47 -0500 Received: from suse80 ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20020925060556.ZIKK3589.sccmmhc01.mchsi.com@suse80> for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 06:05:56 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Chuck Ferril To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 01:13:55 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200209250113.55543.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g8P65la30238 Subject: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, Even though I think I was the only one to raise my hand at Tcl2002 when Jeff asked about those still developing Mac OS 9 applications; the company I work for does develop for OSX as well, but... I'm trying to get a tclkit for OSX that has Tk using the Aqua interface. When I use tclkit-darwin-ppc on OSX, it dies loading Tk complaining that it can't find the X libraries. Is there something I'm doing wrong? I know I could install the X libraries; but I need to have the aqua look and feel and be able to deliver software to customers without them needing to install X. I am not a Mac person myself; so I'm probably sitting on the answer...but I don't see it. I have a hard time keeping up with Apple's versions... but I'm sure we are running the latest version of OSX (maybe 10.2.1, or even 10.3.X since we are Apple developer members). ...so then I tried building a tclkit from scratch, but metakit fails to build properly complaining about being unable to find libSystem or libC and needing to use option -dlopen or something like that. (I'm not at the office right now so I don't have the details on that now; sorry) Thanks for any suggestions, Chuck P.S. ...for what it's worth; I just like to say 'great job' with the whole tclkit/critcl/starkit/starpack projects. I can hardly wait to migrate off my 'home grown' runtime/wrapper. From steve@digital-smarties.com Wed Sep 25 01:27:32 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8P6RVa31318 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 01:27:31 -0500 Received: (qmail 16827 invoked by uid 8); 25 Sep 2002 06:27:43 -0000 Received: from pc-00062 (192.168.1.62, claiming to be "[192.168.1.62]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdxYavMW; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 02:27:35 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Chuck Ferril" , "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 14:27:33 +0800 Message-Id: <20020925062733.11544@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <200209250113.55543.cferril@mchsi.com> References: <200209250113.55543.cferril@mchsi.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Chuck, >I'm trying to get a tclkit for OSX that has Tk using the Aqua interface. > When I use tclkit-darwin-ppc on OSX, it dies loading Tk complaining that it can't >find the X libraries. Is there something I'm doing wrong? I know I could >install the X libraries; but I need to have the aqua look and feel and be >able to deliver software to customers without them needing to install X. There isn't yet a "perfect" TclKit solution on MacOS X. The X11 version has been around for over a year, is feature complete and integrates reasonably well with Aqua using OroborOSx. It's performance is a little sluggish. OTOH, the aqua TclKit is *very* close - JCW has a working version but it has a couple of hardcoded paths that need to be removed. Having said this, there are still a few problems with the Aqua Tk port that might make it unsuitable for delivering to customers. I suggest you wait a little time and see how the Aqua TclKit looks, then make your decision based on which works the best with your application. HTH Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@digital-smarties.com Perth, Western Australia www.digital-smarties.com From akupries@shaw.ca Wed Sep 25 01:35:20 2002 Received: from pd4mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8P6ZJa31744 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 01:35:19 -0500 Received: from pd2mr3so.prod.shaw.ca (pd2mr3so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.108]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H2Z0022UEB50P@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 00:35:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml6so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml6so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.150]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H2Z0086WEB5NQ@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 00:35:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluepeak (h24-77-106-58.vc.shawcable.net [24.77.106.58]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0H2Z00GJ0EB46L@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 00:35:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17u5cf-0005zS-00; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 23:26:09 -0700 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 23:26:09 -0700 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? In-reply-to: Message from Chuck Ferril "of Wed, 25 Sep 2002 01:13:55 CDT." <200209250113.55543.cferril@mchsi.com> To: Chuck Ferril Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <200209250113.55543.cferril@mchsi.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Hello, > > Even though I think I was the only one to raise my hand at Tcl2002 when Jeff > asked about those still developing Mac OS 9 applications; the company I work > for does develop for OSX as well, but... > > I'm trying to get a tclkit for OSX that has Tk using the Aqua interface. When > I use tclkit-darwin-ppc on OSX, it dies loading Tk complaining that it can't The conference CD should contain an aqua version too. ... A moment ... file:///your/path/to/cdrom/here/tclkits/index.html#getit (Download section) And then file:///your/path/to/cdrom/here/tclkits/darwin/ppc/TclTkAqua-8.4.0.dmg file:///your/path/to/cdrom/here/tclkits/darwin/ppc/TclTkAquaStandalone-8.4. 0.dmg -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From steve@digital-smarties.com Wed Sep 25 01:50:42 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8P6ofa32585 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 01:50:41 -0500 Received: (qmail 16915 invoked by uid 8); 25 Sep 2002 06:50:54 -0000 Received: from pc-00062 (192.168.1.62, claiming to be "[192.168.1.62]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdKonAq2; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 02:50:51 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Andreas Kupries" , "Chuck Ferril" Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 14:50:49 +0800 Message-Id: <20020925065049.16478@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas wrote ... >The conference CD should contain an aqua version too. ... A moment ... > >file:///your/path/to/cdrom/here/tclkits/index.html#getit (Download section) > >And then > file:///your/path/to/cdrom/here/tclkits/darwin/ppc/TclTkAqua-8.4.0.dmg > file:///your/path/to/cdrom/here/tclkits/darwin/ppc/ >TclTkAquaStandalone-8.4.0.dmg Note that these are Tcl/Tk packages - not TclKit. As I said, TclKit has been demonstrated and I'm sure it isn't far off (modulo JCW's workload) Cheers Steve From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Wed Sep 25 03:05:05 2002 Received: from frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.20.107]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8P854a03966 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 03:05:04 -0500 Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g8P85B4v024912; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 18:05:12 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 18:05:10 +1000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=Apple-Mail-23-946819389 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" To: Chuck Ferril From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <200209250113.55543.cferril@mchsi.com> Message-Id: <833204FA-D05D-11D6-A801-003065E46D0C@maths.mq.edu.au> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Apple-Mail-23-946819389 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Chuck, a tkaqua wish with all the bits embedded so that it can deal with starkits is very close, and that will be useable as a tclkit equivalent. Note however that this won't be a single file executable, but an OSX application bundle with tcl/tk frameworks and extensions embedded. There are some Carbon issues that need to be worked out with single file tkaqua wish/tclkit, currently it doesn't do event handling correctly... On Wednesday, Sep 25, 2002, at 16:13 Australia/Sydney, Chuck Ferril wrote: > metakit fails to build > properly complaining about being unable to find libSystem or libC and > needing > to use option -dlopen or something like that. I fixed this the other day, and set a patch to JC, but it's not checked into cvs yet. essentially you need to update the libtool and autoconf files: ln -fs /usr/share/libtool/{config.guess,config.sub,ltmain.sh} metakit/unix/scripts ln -fs /usr/share/aclocal/libtool.m4 metakit/unix/aclocal.m4 and apply the attached patch (the DESTDIR changes are unrelated and can be omitted if you like). Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now to something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** --Apple-Mail-23-946819389 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=metakit.diff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: application/text; x-unix-mode=0644; x-mac-type=54455854; name="metakit.diff" Index: unix/Makefile.in =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/metakit/unix/Makefile.in,v retrieving revision 1.37 diff -u -w -r1.37 Makefile.in --- unix/Makefile.in 2002/09/03 08:59:10 1.37 +++ unix/Makefile.in 2002/09/25 07:58:38 @@ -53,6 +53,12 @@ INSTALL_DATA = $L --mode=install @INSTALL_DATA@ INSTALL_PROGRAM = $L --mode=install @INSTALL_PROGRAM@ +LIBTOOL_FLAGS = @LIBTOOL_FLAGS@ + +STRIP_FLAGS = @STRIP_FLAGS@ + +DESTDIR = + #---------- Do not change, shorthand only CXX_SWITCHES = $(CXXFLAGS) \ @@ -77,9 +83,9 @@ core: Makefile libmk4.la $(DEMOS) -tcl: Makefile Mk4tcl.so +tcl: Makefile Mk4tcl@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ -python: Makefile Mk4py.so +python: Makefile Mk4py@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ test: Makefile libmk4.la regress test -d tests || mkdir tests @@ -94,21 +100,21 @@ install: @MK_INSTALL@ install-mk: libmk4.la - -$(INSTALL) -d $(includedir) $(libdir) + -$(INSTALL) -d $(DESTDIR)$(includedir) $(DESTDIR)$(libdir) $(INSTALL_DATA) $(srcdir)/../include/mk4.h \ $(srcdir)/../include/mk4.inl \ $(srcdir)/../include/mk4str.h \ - $(srcdir)/../include/mk4str.inl $(includedir) - $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) libmk4.la $(libdir) + $(srcdir)/../include/mk4str.inl $(DESTDIR)$(includedir) + $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) libmk4.la $(DESTDIR)$(libdir) -install-tcl: Mk4tcl.so - -$(INSTALL) -d $(tcllibdir)/Mk4tcl - $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) Mk4tcl.so $(tcllibdir)/Mk4tcl - echo 'package ifneeded Mk4tcl 2.4.7 [list load [file join $$dir Mk4tcl.so] Mk4tcl]' >$(tcllibdir)/Mk4tcl/pkgIndex.tcl - -install-python: Mk4py.so - $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) Mk4py.so $(pylibdir) - $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) $(srcdir)/../python/metakit.py $(pylibdir) +install-tcl: Mk4tcl@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ + -$(INSTALL) -d $(DESTDIR)$(tcllibdir)/Mk4tcl + $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) Mk4tcl@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ $(DESTDIR)$(tcllibdir)/Mk4tcl + echo 'package ifneeded Mk4tcl 2.4.7 [list load [file join $$dir Mk4tcl@SHLIB_SUFFIX@] Mk4tcl]' >$(DESTDIR)$(tcllibdir)/Mk4tcl/pkgIndex.tcl + +install-python: Mk4py@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ + $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) Mk4py@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ $(DESTDIR)$(pylibdir) + $(INSTALL_PROGRAM) $(srcdir)/../python/metakit.py $$(DESTDIR)(pylibdir) clean: $L rm -f *.la *.o *.lo @@ -130,26 +136,26 @@ cd $(srcdir) && autoconf libmk4.la: $(LIBOBJS) - $L --mode=link $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) -module -avoid-version \ + $L --mode=link $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) $(LIBTOOL_FLAGS) -avoid-version \ -rpath $(libdir) $(SHLOBJS) -Mk4tcl.so: libmk4tcl.la - cp .libs/libmk4tcl.so $@ - -strip $@ 2>/dev/null +Mk4tcl@SHLIB_SUFFIX@: libmk4tcl.la + cp .libs/libmk4tcl@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ $@ + -strip $(STRIP_FLAGS) $@ 2>/dev/null libmk4tcl.la: mk4tcl.o mk4too.o $(LIBOBJS) - $L --mode=link $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) -module -avoid-version \ + $L --mode=link $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) $(LIBTOOL_FLAGS) -avoid-version \ -rpath $(libdir) mk4tcl.lo mk4too.lo $(SHLOBJS) -Mk4py.so: libmk4py.la - cp .libs/libmk4py.so $@ - -strip $@ 2>/dev/null +Mk4py@SHLIB_SUFFIX@: libmk4py.la + cp .libs/libmk4py@SHLIB_SUFFIX@ $@ + -strip $(STRIP_FLAGS) $@ 2>/dev/null libmk4py.la: $(PYOBJS) $(LIBOBJS) - $L --mode=link $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) -module -avoid-version \ + $L --mode=link $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) $(LIBTOOL_FLAGS) -avoid-version \ -rpath $(libdir) $(SPYOBJS) $(SHLOBJS) -Mk4lua.so: mk4lua.o libmk4.la +Mk4lua@SHLIB_SUFFIX@: mk4lua.o libmk4.la $(CXX) -o $@ $(CXX_SWITCHES) -shared mk4lua.lo $(SHLOBJS) \ -L$(libdir) -llua -llualib Index: unix/configure.in =================================================================== RCS file: /home/cvs/metakit/unix/configure.in,v retrieving revision 1.12 diff -u -w -r1.12 configure.in --- unix/configure.in 2002/03/14 15:36:20 1.12 +++ unix/configure.in 2002/09/25 07:58:38 @@ -57,9 +57,22 @@ # Checks for library functions. AC_CHECK_FUNCS(mmap memmove bcopy) +SHLIB_SUFFIX=".so" +STRIP_FLAGS= +LIBTOOL_FLAGS=-module + +if test "`uname -s`" = "Darwin" ; then + SHLIB_SUFFIX=".dylib" + LIBTOOL_FLAGS= + STRIP_FLAGS=-S +fi + AC_SUBST(MK_TARGETS) AC_SUBST(MK_INSTALL) AC_SUBST(TCL_INCLUDE_DIR) AC_SUBST(EXEEXT) +AC_SUBST(SHLIB_SUFFIX) +AC_SUBST(LIBTOOL_FLAGS) +AC_SUBST(STRIP_FLAGS) AC_OUTPUT(Makefile) --Apple-Mail-23-946819389-- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Sep 25 05:13:59 2002 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PADwa11018 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 05:13:58 -0500 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com ([62.159.235.3]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id ALI83748 (AUTH vincedarley); Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:12:02 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20020925111228.0261f4e8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:14:14 +0100 To: "Starkit mailing list" From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: Question about using Winico in a Starkit In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020924155415.0fbfc1fe@mailserver.sfu.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 04:45 PM 9/24/2002 -0700, Andreas Kupries wrote: >While I know that [load] copies out automatically, does [exec] the same if >the application happens to be in a non-native file system ? IMHO it should. >Ditto [open "|..."]. [exec] is actually an [open "|"] in disguise where the >std* channels are not made accessible as channels to the script, but >consumed >internally to make them the returned result of [exec]. No, it doesn't. Please see the patch (sorry no location right now) accessible throught the Wiki pages on 'pipes and exec and vfs'. I could never get the test suite to pass 100% with that patch in place (got down to 4 minor errors). The first step is that 'TclFile' must be replaced by Tcl_Channel internally, after that the rest should be pretty easy (and would allow a lot of pretty cool new functionality). If someone wants to give this a go, it would be great! cheers, Vince. From cferril@mchsi.com Wed Sep 25 08:18:11 2002 Received: from sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (sccmmhc01.mchsi.com [204.127.203.183]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PDIAa23940 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 08:18:10 -0500 Received: from suse80 ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20020925131820.YUJ3589.sccmmhc01.mchsi.com@suse80>; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 13:18:20 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Chuck Ferril To: "Daniel A. Steffen" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 08:26:21 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" References: <833204FA-D05D-11D6-A801-003065E46D0C@maths.mq.edu.au> In-Reply-To: <833204FA-D05D-11D6-A801-003065E46D0C@maths.mq.edu.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200209250826.21833.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g8PDIAa23940 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks! I'll see what I can get running. Chuck On Wednesday 25 September 2002 3:05 am, Daniel A. Steffen wrote: > Chuck, > > a tkaqua wish with all the bits embedded so that it can deal with > starkits is very close, and that will be useable as a tclkit equivalent. > Note however that this won't be a single file executable, but an OSX > application bundle with tcl/tk frameworks and extensions embedded. > There are some Carbon issues that need to be worked out with single > file tkaqua wish/tclkit, currently it doesn't do event handling > correctly... > > On Wednesday, Sep 25, 2002, at 16:13 Australia/Sydney, Chuck Ferril > > wrote: > > metakit fails to build > > properly complaining about being unable to find libSystem or libC and > > needing > > to use option -dlopen or something like that. > > I fixed this the other day, and set a patch to JC, but it's not checked > into cvs yet. > > essentially you need to update the libtool and autoconf files: > > ln -fs /usr/share/libtool/{config.guess,config.sub,ltmain.sh} > metakit/unix/scripts > ln -fs /usr/share/aclocal/libtool.m4 metakit/unix/aclocal.m4 > > and apply the attached patch (the DESTDIR changes are unrelated and can > be omitted if you like). > > Cheers, > > Daniel From michael@cleverly.com Wed Sep 25 12:26:16 2002 Received: from mgr1.xmission.com (mgr1.xmission.com [198.60.22.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PHQGa15076 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:26:16 -0500 Received: from [198.60.22.200] (helo=mail.xmission.com) by mgr1.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17uFvj-000462-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:26:31 -0600 Received: from [166.70.107.99] (helo=gibraltar.deseretbook.net) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 17uFvj-0002FU-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:26:31 -0600 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:26:21 -0600 (MDT) From: "Michael A. Cleverly" To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] application-specific initialization failed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Now that I've caught up with things after getting back from Vancouver, I'm excited to try Starkits out. I went to http://www.equi4.com/starkit/, chose the "Getting started on Unix" link and followed the instructions to get TclWorld running (on Linux x86). I downloaded: * http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tclkit-linux-x86.gz * http://mini.net/sdarchive/tclworld.kit When I try and run the demo I get the following: [michael@guarana downloads]$ tclkit tclworld.kit application-specific initialization failed: unknown encoding "iso8859-1" This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ while executing "error $e" invoked from within "if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -readonly }]} { set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit..." (file "tclworld.kit" line 4) Aren't the encoding files included in either the tclkit binaries vfs or in the .kit file? Thanks in advance, Michael From rohan@rohanpall.com Wed Sep 25 12:27:42 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PHRfa15249 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:27:41 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8PHRuk08156 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 10:27:56 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 13:27:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <53964.10.3.36.17.1032974876.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 13:27:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] vfs commits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've noticed that when writing files to the vfs, they don't get flushed to disk until the starkit exits. This behaviour is on Windows98 1st ed, Windows 95, and Linux. Try this: In the console open a file, write something to the file handle, then close the file. Wait 10 minutes (the 5s timer should have flushed by now), and notice that the file has not changed size or modification time. Exit your starkit. Notice that the file has been modified and increased in size. Does anyone know where I should look in the code to debug this problem? Thanks a million! Ro From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 25 12:38:41 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PHcea16279 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:38:40 -0500 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 19:38:51 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] application-specific initialization failed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael, > Now that I've caught up with things after getting back from Vancouver, > I'm > excited to try Starkits out. > > I went to http://www.equi4.com/starkit/, chose the "Getting started on > Unix" link and followed the instructions to get TclWorld running (on > Linux > x86). I downloaded: > > * http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tclkit-linux-x86.gz > * http://mini.net/sdarchive/tclworld.kit > > When I try and run the demo I get the following: > > [michael@guarana downloads]$ tclkit tclworld.kit > application-specific initialization failed: unknown encoding > "iso8859-1" > This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ Yikes, encodings hit again. What do you get as output from the following two commands when typed into a tclkit session started without cmd-line args? encoding system encoding names Or does that fail as well? Just to be sure, please also try the latest tclkit at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 25 12:42:10 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PHgAa16627 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:42:10 -0500 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 19:42:21 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs commits Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <53964.10.3.36.17.1032974876.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Message-Id: <24C7B01A-D0AE-11D6-8FA9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan Pall wrote: > I've noticed that when writing files to the vfs, they don't get > flushed to > disk until the starkit exits. This behaviour is on Windows98 1st ed, > Windows 95, and Linux. > > Try this: > In the console open a file, write something to the file handle, then > close > the file. > Wait 10 minutes (the 5s timer should have flushed by now), and notice > that > the file has not changed size or modification time. > Exit your starkit. Hm... did you create the starkit? Note that the default is to open r/o nowadays - though in that case it's a bug if this action does not generate an error. > Does anyone know where I should look in the code to debug this problem? TclKit source distribution, kitsh.vfs/lib/vfs/mk4vfs.tcl - $flush variable. -jcw From rohan@rohanpall.com Wed Sep 25 13:05:44 2002 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (root@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PI5ia19115 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 13:05:44 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8PI5xk09501 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:05:59 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 14:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <36384.10.3.36.17.1032977159.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 14:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs commits From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <24C7B01A-D0AE-11D6-8FA9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <53964.10.3.36.17.1032974876.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <24C7B01A-D0AE-11D6-8FA9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Hm... did you create the starkit? Note that the default is to open r/o > nowadays - though in that case it's a bug if this action does not > generate an error. Yes, its -writable I'll see what I can do with that $flush variable, thanks. Ro From david@davudsplace.net Wed Sep 25 13:07:56 2002 Received: from restofus (dsl093-039-044.pdx1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.93.39.44]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PI7ta19351 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 13:07:56 -0500 Received: from lagniappe.davudsplace.net (lagniappe [192.168.1.66]) by restofus (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46E1A1F64F for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:06:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by lagniappe.davudsplace.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9AF3CC045; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:08:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15761.64388.107239.61573@davudsplace.net> Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:08:04 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] loading extensions into Tclkit In-Reply-To: <20020924210239.22438@triqs.com> References: <15760.52157.972187.746468@davudsplace.net> <20020924210239.22438@triqs.com> X-Mailer: VM 7.03 under Emacs 21.2.1 Reply-To: david@davudsplace.net From: david@davudsplace.net (david may) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It seems that loading my extensions fails ONLY when they have external .so dependancies. Such as oracle libs or Postgresql libs I made a test file and tried commenting out and uncommenting the conn = PQsetdb(pghost, pgport, pgoptions, pgtty, dbName); statement. It works in tclsh8.4 both ways. But loading into tclkit fails if I try and do the database connection. I am sure this is some loader flad I need but I have tried almost every one on the man page.. >>>>> "Jean-Claude" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: Jean-Claude> david may wrote: >> I have had this problem with a number of extensions I have >> created. They will load and work fine with tclsh. But I get a >> segv when I try and load them into a tclkit. >> >> Today I tried critcl.kit from steve's site and ther same >> problem occurs. Seems if there is a reference to an external >> .so, in this case /usr/lib/libpq.so, the critcl code crashes >> tclkit. But I can load .so that critcl compiles into tclsh8.4 >> and it runs flawlessly. This is some kind of ld.so magic I >> suppose. >> >> I have tried a bunch of compile flags and librariy flags, >> including -lpq but no joy.. can any one enlighten me? Jean-Claude> The usual culprit is not compiling the .so(s) with Jean-Claude> stubs enabled. There may be a problem also when Jean-Claude> compiling with 8.4a* tcl headers. Reason: the .so Jean-Claude> will load against the installed tcl/tk shared libs, Jean-Claude> which is wrong when run under tclkit (or any other Jean-Claude> version of tcl than is installed). When used against Jean-Claude> the installed tclsh, things work because calls can be Jean-Claude> resolved without stubs. Jean-Claude> If "load blah.so" fails, then please check the output Jean-Claude> of "ldd blah.so" or "nm -g blah.so". If there is a Jean-Claude> reference to libtcl*.so in there (ldd), or an Jean-Claude> undefined Tcl_* routine (nm), then the extension was Jean-Claude> not properly built with stubs. Jean-Claude> What version do you have of tclsh8.4 (i.e. "info Jean-Claude> patchlevel")? Jean-Claude> Can you successfully run a basic critcl example? Jean-Claude> -jcw Jean-Claude> _______________________________________________ Jean-Claude> starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com Jean-Claude> http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From michael@cleverly.com Wed Sep 25 13:17:30 2002 Received: from mgr1.xmission.com (mgr1.xmission.com [198.60.22.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PIHUa20238; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 13:17:30 -0500 Received: from [198.60.22.200] (helo=mail.xmission.com) by mgr1.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17uGjJ-0005qM-00; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:17:45 -0600 Received: from [166.70.107.99] (helo=gibraltar.deseretbook.net) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 17uGjI-0005Xq-00; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:17:44 -0600 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 12:17:35 -0600 (MDT) From: "Michael A. Cleverly" To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] application-specific initialization failed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wed, 25 Sep 2002, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Yikes, encodings hit again. What do you get as output from the > following two commands when typed into a tclkit session started without > cmd-line args? > > encoding system > encoding names Here is what I get: [michael@guarana michael]$ tclkit application-specific initialization failed: unknown encoding "iso8859-1" % encoding system identity % encoding names utf-8 identity unicode % > Or does that fail as well? Just to be sure, please also try the latest > tclkit at > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ I downloaded http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/linux-i686.gz and it works: [michael@guarana downloads]$ ./linux-i686 % encoding system iso8859-1 % encoding names iso8859-2 utf-8 cp1252 ascii macRoman identity unicode iso8859-1 % and TclWorld runs fine. There isn't a macos-68k version in /pub/tk/newer, though there is a tclkit-macos-68k.bin (dated Sept 9th) in /pub/tk. Are the encodings compiled in or could they be added to the vfs w/o recompilation? Thanks, Michael From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 25 14:01:45 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PJ1ha24289 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 14:01:43 -0500 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 21:01:54 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] application-specific initialization failed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <420822D4-D0B9-11D6-8FA9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael A. Cleverly wrote: The "current" tclkit release (I assume, i.e. /pub/tk/) gives: > [michael@guarana michael]$ tclkit > application-specific initialization failed: unknown encoding > "iso8859-1" > % encoding system > identity > % encoding names > utf-8 identity unicode > % The /pub/tk/newer/ build - which I do just to track changes whenever I can: > [michael@guarana downloads]$ ./linux-i686 > % encoding system > iso8859-1 > % encoding names > iso8859-2 utf-8 cp1252 ascii macRoman identity unicode iso8859-1 > % > > and TclWorld runs fine. This is surprising in fact - I checked, both have the same encoding calls in boot.tcl - which is what was changed on July 11 (see newer/CHANGES). There is no logic in seeing one fail and the other succeed w.r.t. encodings... > There isn't a macos-68k version in /pub/tk/newer, though there is a > tclkit-macos-68k.bin (dated Sept 9th) in /pub/tk. Are the encodings > compiled in or could they be added to the vfs w/o recompilation? Apart from what you ran into, encoding "ought" to work by now, including all Sep 2002 builds. So the tclkit-macos-68k.bin one should in fact be ok - no? Note that all recent encoding issues appear to be related to a fundamental startup issue in the tcl core - tclkit needs to create an interp to set up the tclvfs-based logic, which is based on Tcl scripts (i.e. vfs.tcl and mk4vfs.tcl), and only *after* that are the encoding files available for Tcl to pick up. But to create the interp, one seems to need to call Tcl_FindExecutable first (which also deals with encodings). It's a bit of a catch-22, requiring extra C code right now (in src/pwb.c) in tclkit to be able to adjust the librarypath in tcl. I wish I could understand it well enough to figure out a solution :( - I still fail to understand why Tcl can't just meddle without encodings (i.e. the default binary or utf-8), and then adjusts a few things internally when proper encoding paths are supplied to it (in VFS). -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Wed Sep 25 15:04:14 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PK4Da28571 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 15:04:14 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8PK3Li02709 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 15:03:30 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 15:09:03 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I have just recently started experimenting with Starkits again - fueled somewhat by Steve Lander's excellent paper entitled "Beyond TclKit - Starkits, Starpacks and other *stuff". Anyway, I am working with WinNT and have what I believe is the latest starkit utilities - just downloaded today from equi4.com (tclkit, tclkitsh, and sdx). Anyway, when I follow the hello.tcl example in Steve's paper, I don't end up with the directory structure as depicted there. I have a "main.tcl" and "lib" in the root level of "hello.vfs" - so far so good. If I cd into "lib", I have only "hello.tcl", not a directory called "app-hello" containing "hello.tcl" and a pkgIndex.tcl file. I'm guessing that what I see is an "older" directory structure? If so, do I need newer utilities, or is the structure presented in Steve's paper not yet official? Also, the "main.tcl" program is "sourcing" the hello.tcl script instead of using [package require] as specified in the paper. I couldn't get the qwrap, unwrap, wrap sequence to work out of the box with a more complex app, so I started making some manual changes. Ultimately, I was able to wrap a more complex app up into a StarPack - complete with several tcl-only extensions, but it was a somewhat frustrating experience. I created directory structures to match those in Steve's paper by hand, and placed most files by hand. I also had to add the package require and package provide commands by hand and create several pkgIndex.tcl files. In the end, all is now working - but where did I go wrong? Any suggestions are welcomed. Thanks, Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA Phone: 816.836.2000 Fax : 816.836.8589 Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com Fabtech is coming!!! For information on how to receive FREE tickets to the Fabtech show, log on to our web-site. http://www.optimation.com From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 25 17:19:59 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8PMJwa04999 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 17:19:59 -0500 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 00:20:08 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit mailing list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > I have just recently started experimenting with Starkits again - fueled > somewhat by Steve Lander's excellent paper entitled "Beyond TclKit - > Starkits, Starpacks and other *stuff". Anyway, I am working with > WinNT and > have what I believe is the latest starkit utilities - just downloaded > today > from equi4.com (tclkit, tclkitsh, and sdx). Anyway, when I follow the > hello.tcl example in Steve's paper, I don't end up with the directory > structure as depicted there. All problems are probably caused by sdx.kit on the web not being up to date. I'll coordinate with Steve Landers to make sure we get a proper setup out there ASAP, to match the paper - which is now the reference for all *stuff... > In the end, all is now working - but where did I go wrong? You didn't. We are consolidating right now... sorry to hear you had to struggle that much, -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Thu Sep 26 09:42:45 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QEgja18020; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 09:42:45 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8QEfUi08438; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 09:41:56 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 09:47:20 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, Thanks. I kind of figured Steve's paper was just a little ahead of what was publicly available. Will we receive notification of the updated sdx.kit file on this list, or do I need to keep checking the dates of the sdx files on equi4.com? Jeff > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 5:20 PM > To: Starkit mailing list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles > > > Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > > I have just recently started experimenting with Starkits again - fueled > > somewhat by Steve Lander's excellent paper entitled "Beyond TclKit - > > Starkits, Starpacks and other *stuff". Anyway, I am working with > > WinNT and > > have what I believe is the latest starkit utilities - just downloaded > > today > > from equi4.com (tclkit, tclkitsh, and sdx). Anyway, when I follow the > > hello.tcl example in Steve's paper, I don't end up with the directory > > structure as depicted there. > > All problems are probably caused by sdx.kit on the web not being up to > date. I'll coordinate with Steve Landers to make sure we get a proper > setup out there ASAP, to match the paper - which is now the reference > for all *stuff... > > > In the end, all is now working - but where did I go wrong? > > You didn't. We are consolidating right now... sorry to hear you had to > struggle that much, > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 26 10:48:45 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QFmia23862; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 10:48:44 -0500 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:48:56 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: "Starkit mailing list" To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <77328B4A-D167-11D6-BD3E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, all, > Thanks. I kind of figured Steve's paper was just a little ahead of > what was > publicly available. Will we receive notification of the updated > sdx.kit > file on this list, or do I need to keep checking the dates of the sdx > files > on equi4.com? Pling! The "sdx.kit" tool you requested has been updated :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 26 11:01:35 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QG1Xa25075 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 11:01:34 -0500 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 18:01:45 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit mailing list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <77328B4A-D167-11D6-BD3E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-Id: <41C0FCAA-D169-11D6-BD3E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Whoops! > Pling! The "sdx.kit" tool you requested has been updated :) It might help to sync the server to what I have here (thanks, Larry). Computers: never a dull moment... -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Thu Sep 26 12:11:56 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QHBta30990; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:11:55 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8QHAci10144; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:10:57 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" Cc: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:16:33 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <77328B4A-D167-11D6-BD3E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, I grabbed the new sdx.kit file and all is now well in the land of Starkits. Everything followed along with Steve's paper perfectly. My Starkit build experience with the new sdx.kit file was *much* more agreeable than my previous attempts. Thanks for the update, and keep up the good work. This is exciting stuff! Jeff > -----Original Message----- > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 10:49 AM > To: Jeff Godfrey > Cc: Starkit mailing list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit build troubles > > > Jeff, all, > > > Thanks. I kind of figured Steve's paper was just a little ahead of > > what was > > publicly available. Will we receive notification of the updated > > sdx.kit > > file on this list, or do I need to keep checking the dates of the sdx > > files > > on equi4.com? > > Pling! The "sdx.kit" tool you requested has been updated :) > > -jcw From david@davudsplace.net Thu Sep 26 15:45:25 2002 Received: from restofus (dsl093-039-044.pdx1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.93.39.44]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QKjOa18372 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 15:45:24 -0500 Received: from lagniappe.davudsplace.net (lagniappe [192.168.1.66]) by restofus (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C53F1F654 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:44:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by lagniappe.davudsplace.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id A5A2BC046; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:45:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15763.29166.483362.218053@davudsplace.net> Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:45:34 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailer: VM 7.03 under Emacs 21.2.1 Reply-To: david@davudsplace.net From: david@davudsplace.net (david may) Subject: [Starkit] starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: before I download and learn how to build a tclkit executable, perhaps someone already has one built with debuging enabled? Gdb does not seem to like the stock tclkit. I am trying to build and extension that used the postgresql libpq. A test doing only a PQconnectdb("dbname=template"); in a simple stubs enabled extension, works fine in tclsh8.4.0 but segfaults tclkit after loading when I try and execute my new command It works fine up untill the call out to PQconnect. Apparently something in PQconnect is trashing tclkit or vice versa. thanks davud From jcw@equi4.com Thu Sep 26 18:17:42 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QNHfa30512 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 18:17:42 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 01:17:53 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <15763.29166.483362.218053@davudsplace.net> Message-Id: <2E986F06-D1A6-11D6-8D49-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: David, > before I download and learn how to build a tclkit > executable, perhaps someone already has one built with > debuging enabled? Gdb does not seem to like the stock tclkit. There's a script "Mg.sh" in the tclkit source distribution (also in CVS) which builds with debugging enabled. I've placed a fresh build at pub/tk/newer/tclkitg-linux86.gz (created with Mg.sh). Good luck with debugging - I have no idea why tclkit won't work with your extension... wait - hang on: try building wish statically - it might be easier to debug that way if it fails as well. -jcw From cferril@mchsi.com Thu Sep 26 23:10:16 2002 Received: from sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (sccmmhc01.mchsi.com [204.127.203.183]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8R4AGa14522 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 23:10:16 -0500 Received: from suse80 ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20020927041027.TCTL3589.sccmmhc01.mchsi.com@suse80>; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 04:10:27 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Chuck Ferril To: "Steve Landers" , "Andreas Kupries" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 23:18:33 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" References: <20020925065049.16478@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20020925065049.16478@mail.digital-smarties.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200209262318.33056.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g8R4AGa14522 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Andreas wrote ... > > file:///your_cdrom/tclkits/darwin/ppc/TclTkAqua-8.4.0.dmg > > file:///your_cdrom/tclkits/darwin/ppc/TclTkAquaStandalone-8.4.0.dmg > > Note that these are Tcl/Tk packages - not TclKit. Thanks for all the help, At this point I've settled on using Tclkit's for Linux and Windows; and the TclTkAquaStandalone bundle for our OSX solution, at least until a Tclkit is working on OSX Aqua. (should I be calling these StarKits?) I've found that the 'bundled' TclTk app on the Mac allows me to somewhat simulate a Tclkit, in that I can put it all into a virtual disk (dmg) and deliver to customers that way. Not ideal; but fine for now. I have also made some tweaks to critcl to get it running on the Mac; mainly quoting of paths to allow spaces (Mac users love those spaces), and will be posting those somewhere after it gets a little more testing. > Steve Landers wrote: > > As I said, TclKit has been demonstrated and I'm sure it isn't far off > (modulo JCW's workload) > If JCW would like some help on the Tclkit Mac 'port'...please let me know, as I'm sure I could get some time to work on it. Again; thanks to all involved for such a great set of tools! I had started down the path to build my own 'batteries-included' runtime with all the extensions that I generally used; although it was nowhere near as elegant at StarKits. Now I just need to figure out a good use for my old tclmonster.com address... :-) Chuck From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 27 01:31:18 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8R6VHa20304 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 01:31:17 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 08:31:30 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is there a tclkit for Mac OSX with an aqua version of tk? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200209262318.33056.cferril@mchsi.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Chuck Ferril wrote: > At this point I've settled on using Tclkit's for Linux and Windows; > and the > TclTkAquaStandalone bundle for our OSX solution, at least until a > Tclkit is > working on OSX Aqua. (should I be calling these StarKits?) No, starkits are the apps: starkit + tclkit = working solution. Starpack = starkit + tclkit combined into one file. > I've found that the 'bundled' TclTk app on the Mac allows me to > somewhat > simulate a Tclkit, in that I can put it all into a virtual disk (dmg) > and > deliver to customers that way. Not ideal; but fine for now. My first goal is to have a "tclkit-aqua" working asap, in exactly the form you describe: packaged as tclkit.app framework, and shipped as .tar.gz (or .dmg, whatever). That approach needs to be able to run starkits, so the same app can be used on all platforms, including MacOS X Aqua (MacOS XonX and MacOS Classic are already covered - boy there's a lot of new ground to cover for the Mac, unfortunately). Later, I'm hoping Daniel Steffen and I can figure out a way to create a single-file exectable for Aqua - or if not, that I can at least find a way to generate starpacks for Aqua on other platforms (packaging as .tar.gz if .dmg x-platform generation is too hard). Note that a similar issue still needs to be addressed for MacOS Classic as well (7.5.5..9.2.2, 68k and ppc): there is currently no way to create a starpack for it, other than *on* the Mac, but it looks quite doable to work out a few details (altering a MacBinary file). > I have also made some tweaks to critcl to get it running on the Mac; > mainly > quoting of paths to allow spaces (Mac users love those spaces), and > will be > posting those somewhere after it gets a little more testing. Thanks - most timely: yesterday, I placed CriTcl into CVS, see bottom of http://mini.net/tcl/2523 Went through a few file path quoting issues myself, please compare and let me know which cases I missed. There's now an updated critcl.kit in http://mini.net/sdarchive/. [tclkit aqua] > If JCW would like some help on the Tclkit Mac 'port'...please let me > know, as > I'm sure I could get some time to work on it. Very much appreciated, Chuck. The one remaining issue seems to be critcl-related. The shared libs it generates appear to have a path dependency left in them. I'll investigate in a moment, but you can try things yourself: just use "critcl -pkg ..." on OSX, and remove the generated temp files from your $HOME/.critcl/ area. In my case, zlib and rchan (both needed in tclkit) seemed to stop functioning once moved around. Apart from that, I think I have a single tclkit.app/ working, running a copy of the Tcl'ers Wiki as demo, so we should be nearly there. I'll get in touch if I can't fix it quickly, thanks. > Again; thanks to all involved for such a great set of tools! I had > started > down the path to build my own 'batteries-included' runtime with all the > extensions that I generally used; although it was nowhere near as > elegant at > StarKits. Now I just need to figure out a good use for my old > tclmonster.com > address... :-) :) -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Fri Sep 27 08:56:23 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RDuNa20075 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 08:56:23 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8RDtBr16574 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 08:55:36 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:01:12 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I've done some *very* basic experimentation with a "writable" Starkit / Starpack, but can't seem to get the expected results. I am using the latest (as of yesterday) sdx.kit file on WinNT. Here's what I've done... - create a simple tcl file --> myfile.tcl - sdx qwrap myfile.tcl - sdx unwrap myfile.kit - sdx wrap myfile.kit -writable - sdx wrap myfile.exe -runtime tclkit_copy.exe -writable - Run the app - ./myfile.exe - Open a console - "cd" to myfile.exe/lib - [glob *] to see the content of my lib directory - [file copy c:/sometextfile.txt .] - [glob *] to verify that my copied file is in my virtual "lib" directory - [exit] - Now, I run my app again and "cd" to myfile.exe/lib - [glob *] to see the contents of my lib directory - everything is as it should be, except "sometextfile.txt" is missing... Should this have worked, or am I misunderstanding something? Thanks, Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA Phone: 816.836.2000 Fax : 816.836.8589 Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com Fabtech is coming!!! For information on how to receive FREE tickets to the Fabtech show, log on to our web-site. http://www.optimation.com From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 27 09:17:20 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8REHJa22009; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:17:19 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 16:17:31 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: "Starkit mailing list" To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > I've done some *very* basic experimentation with a "writable" Starkit / > Starpack, but can't seem to get the expected results. I am using the > latest > (as of yesterday) sdx.kit file on WinNT. Here's what I've done... > > - create a simple tcl file --> myfile.tcl > - sdx qwrap myfile.tcl > - sdx unwrap myfile.kit > - sdx wrap myfile.kit -writable So far so good. > - sdx wrap myfile.exe -runtime tclkit_copy.exe -writable No, this won't work, unfortunately. A starpack, which is what you are creating here, is read-only as far as its embedded VFS is - this is an OS limitation: you cannot write to an executable file while it is running, and that includes whatever data is at the end of it. > - Run the app - ./myfile.exe > - Open a console > - "cd" to myfile.exe/lib > - [glob *] to see the content of my lib directory > - [file copy c:/sometextfile.txt .] > - [glob *] to verify that my copied file is in my virtual "lib" > directory > - [exit] The file copy and check appear to work, in fact they do make a copy - but only in memory. The commit of the MK datafile, every 5s as well as on exit - will fail. The bug here seems to be that you should have received either a bgerror - if the 5s commit timer fires and commit fails, or an exit error. I'm not sure why this "fails to fail". > - Now, I run my app again and "cd" to myfile.exe/lib > - [glob *] to see the contents of my lib directory > - everything is as it should be, except "sometextfile.txt" is > missing... This is as expected - only starkits, and only if created by sdx as "-writable", can be modified. If you *really* want to achieve such "self-modifying executable" behavior, you could create a new starpack and rename underneath yourself (it's quite tricky, but it can be done). -jcw From jgodfrey@optinest.com Fri Sep 27 09:25:11 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8REPBa22758; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:25:11 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8RENur16886; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:24:01 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" Cc: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:29:57 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, Thanks for the quick response. So, it seems that the Star*pack* was the problem, but a Star*kit* should work as expected. I'll try that out. That's what I needed to know. Thanks, Jeff Godfrey > -----Original Message----- > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 9:18 AM > To: Jeff Godfrey > Cc: Starkit mailing list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? > > > Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > > I've done some *very* basic experimentation with a "writable" Starkit / > > Starpack, but can't seem to get the expected results. I am using the > > latest > > (as of yesterday) sdx.kit file on WinNT. Here's what I've done... > > > > - create a simple tcl file --> myfile.tcl > > - sdx qwrap myfile.tcl > > - sdx unwrap myfile.kit > > - sdx wrap myfile.kit -writable > > So far so good. > > > - sdx wrap myfile.exe -runtime tclkit_copy.exe -writable > > No, this won't work, unfortunately. A starpack, which is what you are > creating here, is read-only as far as its embedded VFS is - this is an > OS limitation: you cannot write to an executable file while it is > running, and that includes whatever data is at the end of it. > > > - Run the app - ./myfile.exe > > - Open a console > > - "cd" to myfile.exe/lib > > - [glob *] to see the content of my lib directory > > - [file copy c:/sometextfile.txt .] > > - [glob *] to verify that my copied file is in my virtual "lib" > > directory > > - [exit] > > The file copy and check appear to work, in fact they do make a copy - > but only in memory. The commit of the MK datafile, every 5s as well as > on exit - will fail. > > The bug here seems to be that you should have received either a bgerror > - if the 5s commit timer fires and commit fails, or an exit error. > > I'm not sure why this "fails to fail". > > > - Now, I run my app again and "cd" to myfile.exe/lib > > - [glob *] to see the contents of my lib directory > > - everything is as it should be, except "sometextfile.txt" is > > missing... > > This is as expected - only starkits, and only if created by sdx as > "-writable", can be modified. > > If you *really* want to achieve such "self-modifying executable" > behavior, you could create a new starpack and rename underneath > yourself (it's quite tricky, but it can be done). > > -jcw From rohan@rohanpall.com Fri Sep 27 09:45:57 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [64.70.42.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8REjva24531 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:45:57 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id g8REkBh17334 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 07:46:11 -0700 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:46:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <35331.10.3.36.17.1033137971.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:46:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey said: > Thanks for the quick response. So, it seems that the Star*pack* was the > problem, but a Star*kit* should work as expected. I'll try that out. Hey Jeff, I was having some problems with the commit. Could you please let us know what happens when you write to the vfs in a star*kit* - do the changes get saved when you close the file in the vfs, or only after the starkit exits? Thanks a lot. Ro From jgodfrey@optinest.com Fri Sep 27 10:10:30 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RFAUa26687 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:10:30 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id g8RF8br17463; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:09:03 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Rohan Pall" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:14:38 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <35331.10.3.36.17.1033137971.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hmmm... I'm not sure how to tell. I have verified that a "-writable" starkit works correctly under these circumstances (WinNT): - sdx wrap mykit.kit -writable - tclkit mykit.kit - cd mykit.kit - file copy c:/text.txt . - [glob *] to verify "text.txt" exists - exit - tclkit mykit.kit - cd mykit.kit - [glob *] to verify "text.txt" exists - exit Since, according to JCW, an in-memory copy of the file is created - which shows up with [glob *] whether it has been committed or not, how do I know if it has been officially committed to the filesystem without exiting and restarting the starkit? And if I exit, which automatically commits the file changes, how do I know if the 5 second timer committed the change or my [exit] committed the change? I'm not sure... If you can tell me how to better test this, I'll be happy to do it... Thanks, Jeff > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Rohan Pall > Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 9:46 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? > > > Jeff Godfrey said: > > > Thanks for the quick response. So, it seems that the Star*pack* was the > > problem, but a Star*kit* should work as expected. I'll try that out. > > Hey Jeff, I was having some problems with the commit. Could you please > let us know what happens when you write to the vfs in a star*kit* - do the > changes get saved when you close the file in the vfs, or only after the > starkit exits? Thanks a lot. > > Ro > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Sep 27 11:31:01 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RGV1a01620 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:31:01 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA17456 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:29:06 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA29432 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:31:17 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YR4AF; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:31:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3D9487D5.800F180B@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:31:17 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list References: <3.0.6.16.20020924155415.0fbfc1fe@mailserver.sfu.ca> <5.1.1.5.0.20020925111228.0261f4e8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Suffix handling? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I would like to see the 'sdx wrap' command add '.kit' when it creates a starkit and leave it off when it creates a starpack. This would help standardize on '.kit' as the extension and also help with systematically distinguish between the two types of output. Would this create a problem for anyone? Tom Krehbiel From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Sep 27 11:36:11 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RGaBa02128 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:36:11 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RGaMQ08235 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:36:22 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.183]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8RGaL506511 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:36:21 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Suffix handling? Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:36:21 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3D9487D5.800F180B@motorola.com> X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On windows starpacks should have the .exe extension Beyond that I see no fault with the proposal -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Tom Krehbiel > Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 9:31 AM > Cc: Starkit mailing list > Subject: [Starkit] Suffix handling? > > > I would like to see the 'sdx wrap' command add '.kit' when it > creates a starkit and leave it off when it creates a starpack. This > would help standardize on '.kit' as the extension and also help > with systematically distinguish between the two types of output. > Would this create a problem for anyone? > > Tom Krehbiel > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 27 12:33:10 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RHX9a07467; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:33:09 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 19:33:21 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: Jim Ingham To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <37EB5A66-D23F-11D6-BC9E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] TclKit for Mac OS X Aqua - status report Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There's a first build of TclKit for Apple's Aqua native GUI on Macitosh OS X. This is based on recent Tk sources by Daniel Steffen, Vince Darley, and Jim Ingham: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/tclkit-macosx-aqua.app.tar.gz Note that this is a 10.2 (Jaguar) build, it won't run on 10.0 or 10.1, for now. Unpack and you end up with a double-clickable "TclKit.app". This includes the same extensions as other tclkit builds, and should run starkits as is (there is no single-file wrap, i.e. starpack, capability yet). There are plenty of gotcha's for now (beyond the fact that Tk itself is work in progress): * dragging doesn't work, you can't drop "wikit.kit" on "TclKit.app" yet * startup is quite different, given that tclkit is not using VFS itself * run from the command line as "./TclKit.app/Contents/MacOS/Wish Shell" I've been thinking a bit on how to deal with the 3 (!) different tclkit builds there are now for the Apple macintosh platform, longer term: * Classic, i.e. OS 7.5.5 .. 9.2.2, for 68k and ppc: remains as is, a "fat" binary, with also separate builds for 68k and ppc, simply to also have smaller packages Will need MacBinary-aware file manip to support starpacks. Also need to support MacBinary unpack for extensions inside. Current build is 8.4.0, but IncrTcl is not yet in the build. I will continue to maintain this build with CodeWarrior 6.3. * XDarwin, i.e. OSX with an XFree86 port, a.k.a. XonX (+ Oroborosx) has been around for some time now, as std unix build display is a bit slow, and not very Mac-like but X11 This build is now easy, and done as all others, using "genkit". Supports all features, starpacks can be created on any system. Current release is 8.4.0, next builds will use gcc 3.1 i.s.o. 2.95. It is very useful, because it supports remote X servers. * Aqua, the latest and greatest, but still a rough diamond for now Builds are based on Daniel Steffen's latest scripts and CVS head Added incrtcl, metakit, tclvfs, zlib, rechan, as normal extensions in the TclKit.app/Contents/lib/ directory. This build is using the OS X way: packaged as application framework, i.e. a dir which *looks* like a file to OSX because of its structure and .app suffix. One idea would be to rename the xdarwin build to "tclkitsh", because it works fine even without X installed, as long as there is no "package require Tk" (which requires an X server, either locally or remotely). Then, the aqua build could be called "tclkit" - with hopefully one day a single-file build which supports apps being packaged as starpack. For the the near future, the above Aqua dir-as-app packaging approach is all there is, so if you want to deploy for Mac OS X Aqua, you can only do so using a separate starkit. Then again, you can of course put everything into a compressed disk image and ship it as a .dmg file. -jcw PS. I've also checked in a few tweaks to critcl to work on osx. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 27 13:06:30 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RI6Ta10334 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 13:06:29 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 20:06:42 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > I'm not sure how to tell. I have verified that a "-writable" starkit > works > correctly under these circumstances (WinNT): > > - sdx wrap mykit.kit -writable > - tclkit mykit.kit > - cd mykit.kit > - file copy c:/text.txt . > - [glob *] to verify "text.txt" exists > - exit > > - tclkit mykit.kit > - cd mykit.kit > - [glob *] to verify "text.txt" exists > - exit > > Since, according to JCW, an in-memory copy of the file is created - > which > shows up with [glob *] whether it has been committed or not, how do I > know > if it has been officially committed to the filesystem without exiting > and > restarting the starkit? And if I exit, which automatically commits > the file > changes, how do I know if the 5 second timer committed the change or my > [exit] committed the change? I'm not sure... Should have thought of this before: vfs mount passes flags to Mk4tcl, so you can mount with the "-nocommit" flag. That stops the commit-on-exit. The periodic commit is independent, that timer is started as soon as a change is made (on "open ... w", I think, but it might be done on close - I haven't checked the mk4vfs.tcl logic). -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Sep 27 13:11:07 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RIB7a10692 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 13:11:07 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id LAA25630 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:11:23 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA02937 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:11:23 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YR4KR; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:10:36 -0700 Message-ID: <3D949F1D.3948884C@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:10:37 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] package require critcl question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I down loaded critcl from the starkit archive and am trying to run the first example. The first line of the example is "package require critcl" and I realized this is a dilemma because just downloading a starkit doesn't provide a package. Do I have to unpack the critcl starkit and move the appropriate stuff to a location on my search path. Or does tclkit know how to resolve package require commands directly from a starkit? Tom Krehbiel From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 27 13:34:07 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RIY4a12559; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 13:34:05 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 20:34:16 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] package require critcl question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: Starkit mailing list To: Tom Krehbiel From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3D949F1D.3948884C@motorola.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I down loaded critcl from the starkit archive and am trying to run the > first example. Which example is that? > The first line of the example is "package > require critcl" and I realized this is a dilemma because just > downloading a starkit doesn't provide a package. Do I have to unpack > the critcl starkit and move the appropriate stuff to a location on my > search path. Or does tclkit know how to resolve package require > commands directly from a starkit? Either way works: do "source critcl.kit", and it'll mount and extend auto_path to make all packages inside it available. Or unwrap it and copy the critcl.vfs/lib/critcl/ package to wherever your setup wants it. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Sep 27 14:16:24 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RJG7a15939 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 14:16:23 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (motgate 2.1) with ESMTP id MAA29108 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:16:18 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id MAA28537 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:13:24 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YR4P1; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:16:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3D94AE81.C86D1D89@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:16:17 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] package require critcl question References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > > I down loaded critcl from the starkit archive and am trying to run the > > first example. > > Which example is that? Tutorial 1 (found in the wikit help) > > The first line of the example is "package > > require critcl" and I realized this is a dilemma because just > > downloading a starkit doesn't provide a package. Do I have to unpack > > the critcl starkit and move the appropriate stuff to a location on my > > search path. Or does tclkit know how to resolve package require > > commands directly from a starkit? > > Either way works: do "source critcl.kit", and it'll mount and extend > auto_path to make all packages inside it available. Or unwrap it and > copy the critcl.vfs/lib/critcl/ package to wherever your setup wants it. There is an undocumented 'pkgIndex' command in sdx. Will it generate and appropreate pkgIndex.tcl for '.kit' files in a directory. This would really be usesful. I could just down load starkit's to a directory, run sdx pkgIndx in the directory and then add the directory to my tclkit path when I start it up. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Sep 27 14:20:58 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RJKra16437 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 14:20:58 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id MAA00762 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:21:03 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id MAA25830 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:21:03 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YR4PK; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:21:02 -0700 Message-ID: <3D94AF9E.79133006@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:21:02 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] package require critcl question References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > Either way works: do "source critcl.kit", and it'll mount and extend > auto_path to make all packages inside it available. Or unwrap it and > copy the critcl.vfs/lib/critcl/ package to wherever your setup wants it. Bad news, "source critcl.kit" doesn't work because the critcl wikit help is displayed when it is sourced, and when you kill it tclkit exits. bummer. Tom Krehbiel From mark@markroseman.com Fri Sep 27 14:29:11 2002 Received: from fep4.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RJTBa17186 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 14:29:11 -0500 Received: from markroseman.com (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep4.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B6B96D3D for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:29:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:29:38 -0400 Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKit for Mac OS X Aqua - status report Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Mark Roseman To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <37EB5A66-D23F-11D6-BC9E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-Id: <76431C82-D24F-11D6-90E4-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > For the the near future, the above Aqua dir-as-app packaging approach > is all there is, so if you want to deploy for Mac OS X Aqua, you can > only do so using a separate starkit. Then again, you can of course > put everything into a compressed disk image and ship it as a .dmg > file. FWIW, with my (non-Tk for now) stuff, I've been taking the approach of building a single-file starpack, and then dropping the result into an application bundle (i.e. into Contents/MacOS subdir of the .app). This certainly has its appeal (though of course with application frameworks and such the need for starpacks is somewhat reduced in general). What do others think of the idea of trying to get to a true single file Tclkit on OS X, accompanied by a script which would take the Tclkit/Starpack and package it into an application bundle? Mark p.s. you can run an app from the command line via e.g. "open TclKit.app" From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 27 15:39:40 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RKdZa22508 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:39:40 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 22:39:43 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] package require critcl question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3D94AF9E.79133006@motorola.com> Message-Id: <4089F57A-D259-11D6-BC9E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > Bad news, "source critcl.kit" doesn't work because the critcl wikit > help is displayed when it is sourced, and when you kill it tclkit > exits. bummer. Sure you have the latest critcl.kit? It's in http://mini.net/sdarchive/ -jcw From mhankyson@hotmail.com Sat Sep 28 08:39:39 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f37.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.37]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8SDdda31889 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 08:39:39 -0500 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 06:39:51 -0700 Received: from 203.32.142.5 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 13:39:50 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.32.142.5] From: "Michael Hankinson" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2002 23:39:50 +1000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Sep 2002 13:39:51.0823 (UTC) FILETIME=[858981F0:01C266F4] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I am having the same problem with the 5 second commit on a wrapped version of Tclhttpd on Debian Linux. I used the -writable flag and got a Segmentation fault when I downloaded the first page. I wrapped again with -writable and -nocompress, everything appeared to run perfectly but any changes I made and also any file I uploaded to the webserver were not saved to disk but appeared to be in memory. The starkit size didn't increase at all while the Tclhttpd starkit was running or when I exited. Also I don't think I am stopping Tclhttpd correctly while wrapped in a starkit that's probably why it did not get saved on exit. I use Control C or kill -TERM pid. Regards Michael Jeff Godfrey said: >Thanks for the quick response. So, it seems that the Star*pack* was the >problem, but a Star*kit* should work as expected. I'll try that out. Hey Jeff, I was having some problems with the commit. Could you please let us know what happens when you write to the vfs in a star*kit* - do the changes get saved when you close the file in the vfs, or only after the starkit exits? Thanks a lot. Ro _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From larry@wildopensource.com Sat Sep 28 13:21:30 2002 Received: from smith-house.org (dsl.smith-house.mv.com [207.22.21.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8SILUa09174 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 13:21:30 -0500 Received: from wildopensource.com (ozma.smith-house.org [207.22.48.146]) by smith-house.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8SHUgN11888 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 13:30:42 -0400 Message-ID: <3D95F386.D991BC3B@wildopensource.com> Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2002 14:23:02 -0400 From: Larry Smith Organization: Wild Open Source Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.18-10smp i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------8FF224498A745E08F73933D0" Subject: [Starkit] [Fwd: kitten bug] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------8FF224498A745E08F73933D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jean-Claude, here's the message per your request. I've also joined the list. regards, -- .-. .-. .---. .---. .-..-. | Wild Open Source Inc. | |__ / | \| |-< | |-< > / | "Making the bazaar just a `----'`-^-'`-'`-'`-'`-' `-' | little more commonplace." home: www.smith-house.org | work: www.wildopensource.com --------------8FF224498A745E08F73933D0 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from trixie.triqs.com (trixie.triqs.com [216.110.36.111]) by smith-house.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RKHZN05932 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 16:17:35 -0400 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8RL7ga24619; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 16:07:48 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 23:07:44 +0200 Subject: Re: kitten bug Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Larry Smith From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3D94C79E.4070401@smith-house.org> Message-Id: <2A83E7DA-D25D-11D6-BC9E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 Larry Smith wrote: > I just downloaded the latest starkit "stuff" from equi4.com > and tried the kitten.kit -u updating function. It segfaulted: > > > kitten.kit -u > > May 2002: updating now works, using the latest kitten and tclkit. > For more details, see the http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ home page. > The current update code uses slow MD5 logic, one moment please... > Segmentation fault > > I'm not sure where to even start debugging this. > > uname info: > > uname -a > Linux ozma.smith-house.org 2.4.18-10smp #1 SMP Wed Aug 7 11:17:48 EDT > 2002 i686 unknown > > > cat /etc/redhat-release > Red Hat Linux release 7.3 (Valhalla) > > Are there known issues w/Valhalla? No, I can probably explain - but before I do: would you be willing to resend this to the starkit mailing list? I'd like to get these issues in front of several dozen people - just to make sure we deal with in properly: http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit If not, I'll reply privately - of course. -jcw --------------8FF224498A745E08F73933D0-- From jcw@equi4.com Sat Sep 28 17:24:49 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8SMOma16055 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 17:24:48 -0500 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 00:25:05 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <238DE59C-D331-11D6-8657-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] Win32 starpack 1st arg now ok Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FYI, I've uploaded new tclkit builds to http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/. This fixes a recently reported problem, in which starpacks tried to gobble the first arg as script and then failed. The fix (in src/kitInit.c) was simply to have win32 do the same as unix... doh. Starpacks are not script interpreters, all args are now passed in as $argv. Note that "tclkit blah.tcl" has: $argv0 ==> blah.tcl info nameofexe ==> /tclkit.exe Whereas the same packed up as starpack has: $argv0 ==> /blah.exe/main.tcl info nameofexe ==> /blah.exe -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sat Sep 28 17:58:34 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8SMwXa17013 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 17:58:34 -0500 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 00:58:51 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] [Fwd: kitten bug] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3D95F386.D991BC3B@wildopensource.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry Smith wrote: > I just downloaded the latest starkit "stuff" from equi4.com > and tried the kitten.kit -u updating function. It segfaulted: > > > kitten.kit -u > > May 2002: updating now works, using the latest kitten and tclkit. > For more details, see the http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ home page. > The current update code uses slow MD5 logic, one moment please... > Segmentation fault > > I'm not sure where to even start debugging this. > > uname info: > > uname -a > Linux ozma.smith-house.org 2.4.18-10smp #1 SMP Wed Aug 7 11:17:48 EDT > 2002 i686 unknown > > > cat /etc/redhat-release > Red Hat Linux release 7.3 (Valhalla) > > Are there known issues w/Valhalla? No, I'm not aware of any RH 7.3 problems (thanks for reposting this). The update functionality of starkits was effectively rendered inoperable by the latest switch to "package starkit", which defaults to opening in read-only mode. The solution is to repack kitten.kit in writable mode (but read on first, please): sdx unwrap kitten.kit sdx wrap kitten.kit -writable The self-updating capability of kitten is experimental, essentially just proof of concept - though it used to work. I'm not sure I will continue on precisely this path - since there is a lot more infrastructure to put in place before all this makes sense, which may in turn interfere with others working towards a package repository. Having said that, I'm committed towards providing package collections as starkits, and making them very easy to update. Hm, I can reproduce this bug, even with the -writable starkit, and even in unpacked mode. It looks like I have messed up something pretty badly. I'll look into this. To show you what the idea is, you can do the following to achieve the same results: sdx unwrap kitten.kit cd kitten.vfs sdx httpdist "@http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/kitten.vfs/" cd .. sdx wrap kitten.kit This workaround uses an unpacked tree as you can see - as I said, I'll investigate... There's a reasonably sophisticated syncing-over-http algorithm underneath all this, which may not be quite as clever as rsync, but it still does a decent job (all in plain Tcl). Summary: kitten urgently needs to be revised and updated. And fixed, of course. -jcw From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Sun Sep 29 05:45:04 2002 Received: from sputnik (c19216.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au [210.49.146.52]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8TAj3a08016; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 05:45:03 -0500 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=localhost.localdomain ident=steve) by sputnik with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 17vbYE-0003Si-00; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 20:43:50 +1000 Subject: starkit repository, was Re: [Starkit] [Fwd: kitten bug] From: Steve Cassidy To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 29 Sep 2002 20:43:49 +1000 Message-Id: <1033296230.1917.31.camel@sputnik> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sun, 2002-09-29 at 08:58, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > The self-updating capability of kitten is experimental, essentially > just proof of concept - though it used to work. I'm not sure I will > continue on precisely this path - since there is a lot more > infrastructure to put in place before all this makes sense, which may > in turn interfere with others working towards a package repository. > Having said that, I'm committed towards providing package collections > as starkits, and making them very easy to update. It shouldn't be hard to merge this functionality with CANTCL since what it stores is just what you need. How hard would it be to turn the packages in kitten into the appropriate structure for CANTCL, ie. add DESCRIPTION.txt, put scripts in the tcl directory and any docs in the doc directory. Do you have scripts to generate the kitten packages now? IMHO instead of kitten.kit we should have a 'build your own kitten' application which takes a list of packages, downloads them and starkits them perhaps along with your local files. In fact, this is what I _really_ want CANTCL to be able to do since just now, I have to manually grab tcllib etc to bundle with my app, I want to be able to write a make target (or script) to do it for me. I want the update thing too but I'd be reasonably happy if the granularity was at the package level -- ie, there's a new bwidgets out, grab it and install it in this starpack. Steve From jcw@equi4.com Sun Sep 29 15:16:38 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8TKGca23896 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 15:16:38 -0500 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 22:16:56 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Win32 starpack 1st arg now ok Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <238DE59C-D331-11D6-8657-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-Id: <66E53FE8-D3E8-11D6-A6C5-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sunday, Sep 29, 2002, at 00:25 Europe/Amsterdam, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > FYI, I've uploaded new tclkit builds to > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/. And thanks to Will Duquette, the new uploads (minutes ago) ought to be right this time around - this required a change to Tk's tkMain.c, now submitted as tk bug #616245. Yesterday's change did fix the logic in tclkitsh (easier/quicker to debug), but I forgot to verify tclkit - and let me add that it's a big ugly hack: the standard startup code first does things wrong, tclkit(sh) then fixes up things after the fact in the TclKit_AppInit code (src/kitInit.c). The current state is that args get passed, never used as script, in starpacks - but that a leading "--" arg still gets eaten up *somewhere* in Tk (probably as it looks for -display). So don't expect a leading "--" arg to get passed through to a starpack :) -jcw From will@wjduquette.com Sun Sep 29 16:24:19 2002 Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8TLOJa25720 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 16:24:19 -0500 Received: from pool0536.cvx12-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.228.26] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17vlYK-0006w0-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 14:24:37 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20020929142000.00a1a660@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 14:22:17 -0700 To: Starkit list From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] Win32 starpack 1st arg now ok In-Reply-To: <66E53FE8-D3E8-11D6-A6C5-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <238DE59C-D331-11D6-8657-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, This time it works just fine! Will At 10:16 PM 9/29/2002 +0200, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >On Sunday, Sep 29, 2002, at 00:25 Europe/Amsterdam, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > >>FYI, I've uploaded new tclkit builds to http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/. > >And thanks to Will Duquette, the new uploads (minutes ago) ought to be >right this time around - this required a change to Tk's tkMain.c, now >submitted as tk bug #616245. > >Yesterday's change did fix the logic in tclkitsh (easier/quicker to >debug), but I forgot to verify tclkit - and let me add that it's a big >ugly hack: the standard startup code first does things wrong, tclkit(sh) >then fixes up things after the fact in the TclKit_AppInit code (src/kitInit.c). > >The current state is that args get passed, never used as script, in >starpacks - but that a leading "--" arg still gets eaten up *somewhere* in >Tk (probably as it looks for -display). So don't expect a leading "--" >arg to get passed through to a starpack :) > >-jcw > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Sun Sep 29 16:24:23 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8TLOMa25724 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 16:24:22 -0500 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 23:24:41 +0200 Subject: Re: starkit repository, was Re: [Starkit] [Fwd: kitten bug] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1033296230.1917.31.camel@sputnik> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: > It shouldn't be hard to merge this functionality with CANTCL since what > it stores is just what you need. How hard would it be to turn the > packages in kitten into the appropriate structure for CANTCL, ie. add > DESCRIPTION.txt, put scripts in the tcl directory and any docs in the > doc directory. Do you have scripts to generate the kitten packages > now? Not hard, I imagine. No scripts, kitten was a quick hack, me throwing in as many builds as I could muster of some longer period of time. > IMHO instead of kitten.kit we should have a 'build your own kitten' > application which takes a list of packages, downloads them and starkits > them perhaps along with your local files. In fact, this is what I > _really_ want CANTCL to be able to do since just now, I have to > manually > grab tcllib etc to bundle with my app, I want to be able to write a > make > target (or script) to do it for me. This is also what the SEAL (Standalone Executable Assembly Line) idea is, which has been floating around for a few years. And what SDarchive wants to move to. I'm not suggesting they should, it looks like now might be a good time to start getting a few people together and discussing The Proper Way Forward (TM). I'm sure Jeff Hobbs also has lots of ideas on where he & ActiveState want to go. > I want the update thing too but I'd be reasonably happy if the > granularity was at the package level -- ie, there's a new bwidgets out, > grab it and install it in this starpack. Yes, though file-level updates would improve on bandwidth, which may quickly become an issue when there is a good sync setup. I use Gentoo Linux on one of my machines, which supports trivial latest-package info updates based on the stunningly efficient rsync, and it was almost predictable that by making it so easy, they were essentially opening floodgates and very very frequent connections. The trick will probably be to find *some* way to balance convenience and central server load (even when mirrored, that just disguises the issue). There has to be some deterrent in doing a check + update, or people will just start setting up 5-minute cron job cycles... As I said, lots of issues to think through - even if many are probably not technical ones. Besides, we don't only want "get latest", we also may want "get latest stable", or get specific version, or even get a specific verified *combination* of package versions. It may well be that the hardest part of a repository is how to deal with meta information (which will probably evolve over time), and how to make The One Right Way (TM) most attractive so people will be gently pushed into playing along with a certain set of conventions. But I fully agree with you that much of the mechanism of actual delivery & packaging can/should probably be done on the fly - there's a model people see, and there's an implementation on the server underneath - two very different things IMO. I just had a look at cantcl, and grabbed cgi1.4.zip as example. Aha, DESCRIPTION.txt, and mime headers. Ok. This is for ready-to-run extensions, right? If there is compiled code involved, you want it supplied as shared lib? Do you enforce a naming structure? Shucks, I can't get to TIP#55, i.e. http://www.tcl.tk right now (nor AS, conn refused), can you elaborate (or point me to some docs/pages)? How do you see the flow of from sources -> how/where to get them -> doing a build -> placing the results into CanTcl -> wrapping things up as starkit or zip? Will it be possible to pick a subset of platforms? Will it be possible to ask for docs / examples / test suites, or in fact ask for them to be left out? Inquiring minds want to know :) - though perhaps this mailing list is not the best spot for such discussions? -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 30 10:20:26 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8UFKQa03487 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 10:20:26 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA27173 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:20:44 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA20270 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:20:44 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRW2L; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:20:43 -0700 Message-ID: <3D986BCB.B76CEB93@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:20:43 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] package require critcl question References: <4089F57A-D259-11D6-BC9E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > > Bad news, "source critcl.kit" doesn't work because the critcl wikit > > help is displayed when it is sourced, and when you kill it tclkit > > exits. bummer. > > Sure you have the latest critcl.kit? It's in http://mini.net/sdarchive/ Apparently not, when I did a fresh download this morning it worked. Tom Krehbiel From lvirden@cas.org Mon Sep 30 11:40:34 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8UGeXa08826 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 11:40:33 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g8UGejZ0007263 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:40:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g8UGei004714; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:40:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:40:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20020930124044.AAB4652@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] [Fwd: kitten bug] In-Reply-To: of Sun, 29 Sep 2002 00:58:51 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Summary: kitten urgently needs to be revised and updated. And fixed, > of course. Over the past months, particular during the week of the conference, I '''thought''' I had heard people imply that kitten was an experiment whom, perhaps it might be said, has seen its better days and thus it might not be worth spending time updated. On the other hand, until all the infrastructure to dynamically create starkits containing various extensions, kitten is about all we have for use in a 'batteries included' sort of system relating to starkit. I'm wondering what is next with regards to starkits/starpacks/batteries included and so forth. I look at kitten's current contents , as well as comments here on the list, and some of the things I believe are currently in need, if kitten is to continue, include: o correcting the kitten.kit code so that it is usable with the latest tclkit o reorganizing the contents of directories so that binary code all resides within the arch subdirectory o figuring out what is needed for itk to work within the kitten/tclkit framework o updating at the very least the tclxml/tcldom/tclsoap to the latest version. Perhaps there are some other issues as well - for instance, I see two itcl directories in kitten. I see md5.tcl as well as some .so files at the same level as the other extension directories. Are there other issues that need to be resolved? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Sep 30 13:40:28 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8UIeSa15593 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 13:40:28 -0500 Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id LAA26018 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 11:38:32 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA02521 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 11:37:49 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YRXBJ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 11:40:46 -0700 Message-ID: <3D989AAE.A8D62CFF@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 11:40:46 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] [Fwd: kitten bug] References: <20020930124044.AAB4652@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, Maybe it is just me but I think the original kitten concept is broken because it lacks symmetry with the rest of the starkit concept. Let me explain what I mean. 1) It seems reasonable that extension developers would develop starkit's for there extensions. This means that packages like tclxml/tcldom/tclsoap etc. would exist and be updated as starkits. 2) Given that number (1) is likely to occur then a kitten package should just be a wrapping of the starkits which results in a directory structure that looks something like this: kitten/ kitten/lib/ kitten/lib/pkgIndex.tcl kitten/lib/tclxml.kit kitten/lib/tcldom.kit kitten/lib/tclsoap.kit kitten/lib/<...>.kit The only problem that needs to be solved for the above (that I'm aware of) is the generation of the pkgIndex.tcl file. The pre-wrapped '.kit' files should be able to be sourced from the pkgIndex.tcl file. 3) Advantages to the above approach are: * Maintenance of a kitten archive becomes trivial. When a new version of a package is released all that needs to be done is to download the new version of the package from the starkit distribution archive and replace the old version with the new version in kitten. * Issues associated with platform specific code are left to the individual package developers, although it would of course be most convenient to follow the starkit guidelines. * At development time a developer can place kitten in the auto_path and let the code evolve to uses whatever packages are necessary. When it comes time to distribute the code all that needs to be done is put a copy of the starkit's that were uses in the the .vfs/lib directory and update the pkgIndex.tcl. This symmetry will help eliminate surprises when the developer creates a distribution. Tom Krehbiel > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > > > Summary: kitten urgently needs to be revised and updated. And fixed, > > of course. > > Over the past months, particular during the week of the conference, I > '''thought''' I had heard people imply that kitten was an experiment > whom, perhaps it might be said, has seen its better days and thus it > might not be worth spending time updated. > > On the other hand, until all the infrastructure to dynamically create > starkits containing various extensions, kitten is about all we have for > use in a 'batteries included' sort of system relating to starkit. > > I'm wondering what is next with regards to starkits/starpacks/batteries > included and so forth. > > I look at kitten's current contents , as well as comments here on the list, > and some of the things I believe are currently in need, if kitten is to > continue, include: > > o correcting the kitten.kit code so that it is usable with the latest > tclkit > > o reorganizing the contents of directories so that binary code > all resides within the arch subdirectory > > o figuring out what is needed for itk to work within the kitten/tclkit > framework > > o updating at the very least the tclxml/tcldom/tclsoap to the latest > version. > > Perhaps there are some other issues as well - for instance, I see two > itcl directories in kitten. I see md5.tcl as well as some .so files > at the same level as the other extension directories. > > Are there other issues that need to be resolved? From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 1 02:24:27 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g917OQa15099; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 02:24:27 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 09:24:46 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: Starkit list To: "Ubhay Kumar" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <205C5F16CA92F94484F054E94520F4D709AF62@mail.in.firstrain.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Re: Metakit concurrency urgent Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tuesday, Oct 1, 2002, at 09:06 Europe/Amsterdam, Ubhay Kumar wrote: > Hi Jean... > Thanx for the reply ... but i still have some doubts ... >> >>> If answer to above is true, will that mean, even >> synchronizing the >>> "write" access using some locks (mutex etc) >>> between t1 and t2 would not suffice. >> >> Yes - because the write would be ok, but read access would not be safe >> while such writes are taking place. >> > First let me explain what is my requirement: > > I want to have a pool of worker threads, where each thread can > "read/write" the > same datafile. The datafile would be opened/created only once by a > thread in the pool > (As we assume that opening and closing for each "read/write" will be > expensive) in a global scope > so that every other worker thread can use it. > > 1. Can i achieve this by synchronizing ALL "read"/"write" access (by > using some application level lock) > between worker threads, i.e, ensuring no TWO threads read or write > simultaneously on a datafile? > As you said above "synchronized writes are ok" then synchronized > "read/write" should also be ok. Yes. > 2. If the answer to above is "Yes" then i have a confusion: > >> 1. Is it true, that, in a multithreaded application if thread t1 >> "created/opened" >> a database then ONLY t1 can "modify/update" the database. All other >> threads (like >> t2) needs to send request to t1 for any "modification/update". > >>> Yes. > > What does the above mean if answer to question 1 is true. > Because here it is clearly stated that only thread which can write on > the > database is the "creater/opener" thread of the datafile? With a monolithic (app-level) lock, it does not matter. Without locking the above applies. > Thanx again in advance, > Regrads, > Ubhay. -jcw From mjacobson@northropgrumman.com Tue Oct 1 09:13:34 2002 Received: from xcgmd811.northgrum.com (xcgmd811.northgrum.com [155.104.240.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91EDYa03456 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 09:13:34 -0500 Received: by xcgmd811.northgrum.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) id ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 07:10:30 -0700 Message-ID: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E59@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> From: "Jacobson, Michael P." To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 07:07:11 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have been using the lastest Starkit layout (based on Steve's paper) with the lastest sdx generated main.tcl. First, I usually develop and debug an application with wish. Then I wrap the application for use/distribution as a starkit or starpack. I like to do this without changing any code in my application. Currently, the main.tcl that us generated by sdx qwrap looks this this: ### main.tcl package require starkit starkit::startup package require app-name ### When you run this outside of a starkit it gives you a error that "starkit package not found". I realize that main.tcl is for the generic case and meant to only run in the starkit. But this is easy to fix so that the default main.tcl will work either way. My slightly modified main.tcl is below both starkit and wish environments without change. ### main.tcl if {![catch {package require starkit}]} { starkit::startup if {[catch {cd $argv0}]} { cd [file dirname $argv0] } ;# your pwd is now set to the directory were the kit resides } else { lappend auto_path [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib] ;# case where you are running with wish } package require app-name ### Any thoughts on something like this become a standard feature of the qwrap generated main.tcl. Michael Jacobson From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 1 09:39:18 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91EdHa05315 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 09:39:17 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:39:37 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E59@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> Message-Id: <9C0EDE84-D54B-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jacobson, Michael P. wrote: > First, I usually develop and debug an application with wish. Then I > wrap > the application for use/distribution as a starkit or starpack. [...] > When you run this outside of a starkit it gives you a error that > "starkit > package not found". [...] > if {![catch {package require starkit}]} { [...] I've been trying hard to simplify main.tcl, so that different uses (and there are quite a few by now) can be dealt with in a single location: package starkit. That lets us evolve/improve things once, instead of in each individual starkit. It may not have been mentioned before, but the starkit package is in tclvfs on SourceForge. Things are not quite perfect yet w.r.t tclvfs packaging, but my goal is to allow it to work fully independent of tclkit - it already does, but also to support starkits without tclkit. This means a number of packages need to be in place, but the mix will vary depending on whether things are stored wrapped or in a dir tree, zipped vs. metakit, etc. So "package require starkit" is not just a way to make them work wrapped, but also a way to introduce conventions - such as auto_path ./lib, and documentation, and eventually examples, test suites, etc. One good example is platform naming: $tcl_platform holds all sorts of info, but they are not quite suited to build file paths with (win NT vs 98, etc). For packages to easily work when a number of shared lib builds are present, one needs code to disambiguate, as CriTcl does. It might be a good choice to put such logic in the starkit package. There really is much more to deal with, and I *sure* don't have all the answers, but again - instead of copying logic to each starkit, I'd be inclined to try to place such policy issues in the "starkit" package. There will be yet more deployment scenario's once we get to web-cgi type uses, and the plug-in, and... How about pushing forward a bit with tclvfs, to make sure it works for everyone, simply by adding it to their own tclsh/wish setup? In fact, Jeff Hobbs has recently completely re-done the build system of tclvfs (now TEA2), so it seems to me that we really are getting very close to that point. FWIW, recent tclkit-for-mac-osx-aqua builds have helped clear up a few more issues with running starkits when the executable itself isn't one. I agree with you that one key point of starkits is that one must be able to develop them in unpacked mode, and then wrap them up with absolutely no change - and with absolutely minimal impact on their operation. This is central to simplifying deployment. -jcw From mjacobson@northropgrumman.com Tue Oct 1 10:22:33 2002 Received: from xcgtx811.northgrum.com (xcgtx811.northgrum.com [208.20.220.57]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91FMXa08384 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 10:22:33 -0500 Received: by xcgtx811.northgrum.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 08:17:24 -0700 Message-ID: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E5B@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> From: "Jacobson, Michael P." To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 08:14:05 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Does this mean that in the future that "starkit" will be a core Tcl package? Or do I have to install some form of it when I want to run the script in wish. If not how do we accomplish having "to develop them in unpacked mode, and then wrap them up with absolutely no change". Sorry if it sounds like I and missing the boat but its still a little fuzzy to me. Michael Jacobson From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 1 10:50:06 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91Fo5a10416; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 10:50:06 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 17:50:25 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" To: "Jacobson, Michael P." From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1E5B@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> Message-Id: <80092EDA-D555-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael, > Does this mean that in the future that "starkit" will be a core Tcl > package? > Or do I have to install some form of it when I want to run the script > in > wish. I would hope that tclvfs becomes a core package, but it's not my call. It's not even my call whether tclvfs becomes part of ActiveTcl, but from what I hear this is definitely being considered - perhaps Jeff or Andreas can elaborate on this. My thought was that you will normally install tclvfs. If that is not an option, then there would be a fallback option to install just the pure-tcl starkit package. That is enough to develop with main.tcl as it is today. In fact, considering that there are also a pure-tcl "fake" implementations of vfs and metakit (readkit, i.e. read-only), my hope is that the pieces can be combined in such ways that all useful scenario's can be covered. Btw, if main.tcl is not suitable as is, have you considered adding a main2.tcl next to it which avoid the package require starkit call? As I described, I think this will ultimately not be a good solution, once the starkit package contains things you want to use as well. But it's a quick way out for now. > If not how do we accomplish having "to develop them in unpacked mode, > and > then wrap them up with absolutely no change". Wrapping up requires tclkit of course (or m4tcl and zlib and rechan, as individual packages). Let me make sure I don't confuse you further - there are different was to work with starpacks: - run unwrapped (also develop), needs just "package require starkit" - running wrapped, needs starkit, tclvfs, mk4tcl, zlib or trf,rechan or trf - running wrapped will one day be possible with activetcl, I hope - running wrapped may even become possible with readkit + zlib + rechan - unwrapping a starkit requires either tclkit or the tclvfs/mk4tcl/etc mix above - alternately, can unwrap in pure tcl using readkit (needs zlib/trf, or an unzip cmd) - creating a starkit require either tclkit or the tclvfs/mk4tcl/etc mix above There are probably silly mistakes (all mine) in the above, but that's the general idea anyway. Once one or more of the above packages make it into "the" core, or even first into activetcl, things will start to become much easier to use. We're getting there IMO... but gradually! -jcw From dgporter@erols.com Tue Oct 1 11:09:46 2002 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91G9ka11856; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:09:46 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVaGruC54SGRKCpJ0O/ASa0NSZUyAKG1YhDWRJOx3XPHwZpAiNQEKWhKQHUq9jhdaoU= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17wPb3-0002Gx-00; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:10:05 -0400 Message-ID: <3D99C8DB.7070401@erols.com> Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:10:03 -0400 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020719 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: "Jacobson, Michael P." , "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl References: <80092EDA-D555-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >> Does this mean that in the future that "starkit" will be a core Tcl >> package? > I would hope that tclvfs becomes a core package, but it's not my call. Forgive the intrusion, but I think you guys are talking past each other and bringing up issues that don't really matter. As I understand the starkit packaging philosophy; one wants to package up a system that is an exact copy of what exists in development, so there are no surprises arising from the "installed" version of an application being different in subtle ways from the version the developer works on and tests. Everybody sees the same thing. Given that, I think it's a mistake to be using the wish application to do development. The "installed" starkit is going to have tclkit as its execution engine, not wish, so do your development with tclkit. As I understand it, the standard main.tcl script in a starkit is very simple: package require starkit starkit::startup package require app-name ;# (Yuck! on that last line :-)) and Michael was proposing something much more complex just because he has the "starkit" package installed in ./lib and not in a directory on the auto_path for wish. The simple solution is to be sure to use tclkit instead of wish for development, and make sure that tclkit adds the directory ./lib to its auto_path. I think that takes care of things, and it has nothing to do with what packages are part of what distributions. If I'm way off base let me know. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 1 11:22:56 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91GMua12949 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:22:56 -0500 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 18:23:15 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3D99C8DB.7070401@erols.com> Message-Id: <166037D0-D55A-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Don, > package require starkit > starkit::startup Actually, the preferred incantation is now: if {[starkit::startup] == "sourced"} return > package require app-name ;# (Yuck! on that last line :-)) Just like a C string point is called "main" and lives in a source file just as everything else, so it is with this starkit layout - everything is a package, one of the packages happens to be the one that gets launched first. It has a distinctive name to be allow combining apps. If your objection is the fact that "package require" starts actual work, I agree that "app-name::start" or some such ought to have been added. Then again, one could argue that apps do little more than set up definitions and bindings, and events drive the real work. Oh well, whatever. > I think that takes care of things, and it has nothing to do with what > packages are part of what distributions. Correct :) I was taking advantage of this opportunity to paint a picture of things ahead... -jcw From dgporter@erols.com Tue Oct 1 11:37:34 2002 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91GbXa14139; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:37:33 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYl6XCvqCMlUgC8WQIGtiSn4G0JXxyJ0dIl3WKgPTJqLEcaXkJBxeU/zq/oZnczOKw= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17wQ1x-0006Uf-00; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:37:53 -0400 Message-ID: <3D99CF5C.8050807@erols.com> Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:37:48 -0400 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020719 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl References: <166037D0-D55A-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >> package require app-name ;# (Yuck! on that last line :-)) Shouldn't have started it; can't completely finish the discussion now. > Just like a C string point is called "main" and lives in a source file > just as everything else, so it is with this starkit layout - everything ^^^^^^^^^ > is a package, one of the packages happens to be the one that gets ^^^^^^^^^^^^ > launched first. It has a distinctive name to be allow combining apps. Nonsense. The very fact that you've given these app "packages" distinctive names shows that you recognize they are something other than real packages. Why not just have the last line be: source ./bin/app.tcl (or whatever the appropriate relative path should be) rather than abuse [package require]? What important thing do you think [package require] is doing for you? Just providing a search path? -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From cferril@mchsi.com Tue Oct 1 18:59:02 2002 Received: from sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (sccmmhc01.mchsi.com [204.127.203.183]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g91Nx1a06299 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 18:59:02 -0500 Received: from suse80 ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20021001235917.LCBY3589.sccmmhc01.mchsi.com@suse80> for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 23:59:17 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Chuck Ferril To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 19:07:34 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 References: <166037D0-D55A-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <3D99CF5C.8050807@erols.com> In-Reply-To: <3D99CF5C.8050807@erols.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200210011907.34818.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g91Nx1a06299 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: All, I'd like to share my experience on the package application stuff... > Why not just have the last line be: > > source ./bin/app.tcl Like you; I had the same reaction to the 'package require app-example'...but now I really like the package approach. I'll describe how I am using it and the why I've grown to like it. I have built a simple web based application creator that makes StarPacks from a library of packages. I can specify what applications I want in the StarPack (choosing from a list of app-* packages) and libraries (all other packages) and it gets the latest version from cvs and wraps them up for me and sends it back to the browser. This is simply a tool I put together to give me StarPacks; all in one applications for delivery to customers for my company...although, I think others may be interested in it too. Anyway, by using packages for applications, I can request several of them to be wrapped up in the same StarPack. With a simple change to my startup (main.tcl); I check to see if there is an app-* that matches the name of my binary; and then simply requests that package. For example: if the binary was renamed to 'foobar' (or foobar.exe on Windows), the package app-foobar would be required. If there was no app-foobar package; my code would display a list of all application avaliable in the StarPack (app-* packages) for the user to select from. (this is a great easter-egg for our sales folks, renaming our apps to tetris or whatever; also great for debugging :-) This type of thing would be very difficult to do with a list of .tcl files to look at. This is probably a fairly silly contraption; but it has saved me a great deal of time; both from not having to build releases for others, as well as giving me a handy set of 'packages' to choose from...both libraries and applications to easily pull from. All this runs on a Linux server, building Linux and Windows StarPacks, and controls a MacOSX system that builds the MacOSXAqua StarPacks into virtual drives (.dmg files) for easy delivery. The main thing is that my StarPacks are truly static (main.tcl, AppMain.tcl and all), I simply wrap packages; libraries and applications, to get the desired functionality. Sorry to ramble on so much; the point was that the app-example package may not be such a bad idea...at least not in my experience. It is very convenient to be able to pick up a package (that is an application) and move it into another project without having to find all the parts to go with it. Chuck From akupries@shaw.ca Tue Oct 1 22:04:01 2002 Received: from pd4mo2so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g92340a13627 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 22:04:01 -0500 Received: from pd5mr1so.prod.shaw.ca (pd5mr1so-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.232]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H3C00IAK373D6@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 21:04:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml5so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml5so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.149]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H3C0044N3736C@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 21:04:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluepeak (h24-78-89-27.vc.shawcable.net [24.78.89.27]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0H3C00LKU372C3@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 21:04:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17wZcP-0002Qv-00 for ; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 19:52:09 -0700 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 19:52:08 -0700 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl In-reply-to: Message from Jean-Claude Wippler "of Tue, 01 Oct 2002 16:39:37 +0200." <9C0EDE84-D54B-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <9C0EDE84-D54B-11D6-B063-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jacobson, Michael P. wrote: > > It may not have been mentioned before, but the starkit package is in > tclvfs on SourceForge. > How about pushing forward a bit with tclvfs, to make sure it works for > everyone, simply by adding it to their own tclsh/wish setup? In fact, > Jeff Hobbs has recently completely re-done the build system of tclvfs > (now TEA2), so it seems to me that we really are getting very close to > that point. FWIW, recent tclkit-for-mac-osx-aqua builds have helped > clear up a few more issues with running starkits when the executable > itself isn't one. Just a note: The tclvfs CVS head currently builds on all platforms (and variants) I have available to me here at ActiveState. Which are Linux/ix86, Linux/IA-64, Solaris/Sparc, Solaris/Sparc 2.8, FreeBSD/ix86, Aix/PowerPC, Win32/ix86, HPUX/PA-RISC, HPUX/IA-64 (This does not include Metakit. For several platforms I have to figure how to get the C++ compiler to work. Jean-Claude gave me some hints, but I wasn't able to act on them yet (2/3 of today was spent on installing software on the new windows workstation I got. The remainder I squished stupid oversights of mine in the TEA 2 for tkhtml, tbcload, and trf. Metakit is scheduled for tomorrow :). -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From cferril@mchsi.com Wed Oct 2 10:26:42 2002 Received: from sccmmhc02.mchsi.com (sccmmhc02.mchsi.com [204.127.203.184]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g92FQga23583; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:26:42 -0500 Received: from suse80 ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc02.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20021002152657.SMOS7903.sccmmhc02.mchsi.com@suse80>; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 15:26:57 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Chuck Ferril To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sdx qwrap generated main.tcl Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:35:22 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 References: <0E5243BA-D5FA-11D6-B29D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <0E5243BA-D5FA-11D6-B29D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200210021035.22555.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g92FQga23583 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, > FWIW, one plan Steve and I have been discussing for some time, is to > provide an effective central clearing-house for getting extensions, > renaming sdarchive to "Starchive" once we reach a decent stage. This > can remain quite independent of *where* files actually reside, IMO - > with as option for companies to use the same toolset for in-house > packaging/deployment scenario's. Excellent idea. I have wanted to set up a 'critcl farm' that takes a StarKit with critcl code in it and returns the same but with some specified platform binary builds in it; in my case, Linux, Windows and MacOSX. It would be great to be able to request a StarKit from a central place and get back one that includes the binaries for your platform or maybe a selection of platforms. > You seem to have addressed a great number of issues already, so I'm > wondering to what extent you would be willing (and allowed) to share > what you have set up. With a bit of luck we may just find out that > many independent initiatives are going to fit really well together. I fully plan to share all of my work once it gets a bit more mature; that and I get past a development effort that is in high gear right now for the next month or so. > Note that there are some 2 dozen tclkit builds (also > included on the Tcl/Tk 2002 conference CD), more than have ever been > available before. So the pieces are there to let people deploy for > lots of architectures. My system has a 'runtimes' directory that houses the TclKits for the platforms to build for. MacOSX is my only special case since I had to tweak some stuff. For now, I only need Linux, Windows, and MacOSX, but I can simply add another TclKit runtime to the directory and it magically gets used along with the others. > It's great to see that you've automated the OS X side of things (I am > moving much of my own work to OS X these days). Hopefully, OS X will > one day also be a system we can generate for from Linux or Win32 - > since that is where most people will be coming from. ...and what fun that was... :-) I tried soooooo hard to build the OSX runtime on my Linux server. I was pretty close, but I don't have the time to continue that effort. I'm not a Mac user myself; but the company I work for is in the graphics arts industry and so most of the company and our clients are Mac users. We have a couple of really great Mac programmers; but they are still a little skeptical of Tcl as an application level development platform...but I think I'm showing it's power. One of our main applications is written in Tcl and has proven to be very solid and flexible; even editing 200 meg images (although I did have to write a few extentions that I may be able to release as critcl/starkits someday). I would be very happy to provide whatever I've learned about building self contained Tcl applications to whomever is willing to listen; or can actually stand to listen to me (as the case may be :-) Up until now I have been using a version of mktclapp that I modified to wrap our applications for Windows and Mac OS-9 platforms; but it's StarPacks from now on! As I said above; I am now in a really tight development schedule (so, what's new) and will have only have bits of time here and there for the next couple of months. Some of the issues I have to work out yet in my system are related to automating critcl and some sort of 'obfuscation' of the source code. Chuck From clif@clif.cflynt.com Wed Oct 2 23:26:29 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g934QTa05429 for ; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 23:26:29 -0500 Received: (qmail 38448 invoked by uid 0); 3 Oct 2002 04:32:37 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 04:32:37 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA09978 for ; Thu, 3 Oct 2002 00:26:47 -0400 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g934Qlj29827 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 3 Oct 2002 00:26:47 -0400 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200210030426.g934Qlj29827@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 00:26:47 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Ferril" at Oct 02, 2002 10:35:22 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Packages, automated builds, etc Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, While this is not the charter for this mailing list, this is where a discussion started... Don Porter and I have been exchanging mail, mostly with me describing what I want to be able to do in package. For example, the package command is currently an organizing command (to group sets of files into a package with 'package provide'), and a script loading command (with 'package require'). Our final conclusion is that the 'package' command is too many different things to too many people, and there should be a new command to do some of this stuff. This is currently a 'module' command. I'm thinking that we may want several new commands or 'packages' to do things like: Update my .c and .h code files. Update my .tcl files. Build extensions (or make package index files). Load a module from disk (as with current 'package require'). Load a module from a remote site. Load a module from a vfs file. If anyone wants to help assemble a wish list, I'll be happy to start collecting them. If there's already a wiki page discussing this, let me know, and I'll add information there. (I didn't find one in my quick scan of the Wiki.) Clif ........................... Clif Flynt .......................... ... Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide - Academic Press Professional ... --- Available March 2003 --- .... http://www.cflynt.com ............ clif@cflynt.com .... . In theory there is no difference between theory and practice . ........................ In practice, there is. ................. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 3 06:07:15 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g93B7Ea27600; Thu, 3 Oct 2002 06:07:14 -0500 Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 13:07:36 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Packages, automated builds, etc Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Clif Flynt From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <200210030426.g934Qlj29827@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: <52E1987C-D6C0-11D6-B29D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif Flynt wrote: > While this is not the charter for this mailing list, this is where a > discussion started... Which was probably not a good idea.. (too many non-starkit/-tclkit aspects) [...] > If there's already a wiki page discussing this, let me know, > and I'll add information there. (I didn't find one in my quick scan > of the Wiki.) I'd say create one. These discussions tend to just re-iterate opinions, which is not helping us getting much further, I'm afraid. With a wiki page, one can collect, list, summarize, reflect, and erase... Personally, I think packages, source files, namespaces, arrays, directories, scopes are all nothing but One Big Misguided Plot To Drive Us Crazy (TM) ... :) -jcw From albrecht_mucha@web.de Fri Oct 4 06:59:38 2002 Received: from smtp.web.de (smtp01.web.de [194.45.170.210]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g94Bxca07818 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 06:59:38 -0500 Received: from [80.134.4.241] (helo=linux) by smtp.web.de with smtp (WEB.DE(Exim) 4.75 #2) id 17xR7a-0004s9-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 04 Oct 2002 13:59:54 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: A Mucha To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 14:10:09 +0200 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02100414100900.07445@linux> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] problem with delete Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Jean-Claude Thanks for metakit and starpack. This Every Thing In One Place approach will make it much easyer to distribute programs. While playing around with metakit I got a question: How do I _best_ delete a specific selection of rows? my first try : mk::file open db test.mk mk::view layout db.test {file size} for {set n 0 } {$n < 10} {incr n} { mk::row append db.test file file$n size $n } mk::set db.test!5000 size -1 mk::file commit db puts "there are [mk::view size db.test] rows" foreach i [mk::select db.test -exact file ""] { mk::row delete db.test!$i } brings the folloing error: there are 5011 rows view index is out of range while executing "mk::row delete db.test!$i" ("foreach" body line 2) invoked from within "foreach i [mk::select db.test -exact file ""] { mk::row delete db.test!$i } " (file "t1.tcl" line 9) should i sort the list descending and so start deleting at the end? this immediate deleting (with freeing the rows) before a commit surprised me a bit. It would be best to show the solution in the examples of mk::row delete in http://www.equi4.com/metakit/tcl.html Thanks Albrecht Mucha * Bad Salzdetfurth * Germany From jcw@equi4.com Sun Oct 6 14:02:28 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g96J2La16494; Sun, 6 Oct 2002 14:02:22 -0500 Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 21:02:45 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] problem with delete Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: A Mucha From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <02100414100900.07445@linux> Message-Id: <32B467BB-D95E-11D6-B815-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: A Mucha wrote: > Thanks for metakit and starpack. This Every Thing In One Place > approach will > make it much easyer to distribute programs. Glad you like it - I agree! > While playing around with metakit I got a question: > How do I _best_ delete a specific selection of rows? [...] > foreach i [mk::select db.test -exact file ""] { > mk::row delete db.test!$i > } > brings the folloing error: > > there are 5011 rows > view index is out of range [...] Yes, views are like lists - delete an item and the next ones will move down. > should i sort the list descending and so start deleting at the end? Exactly, probably something like: foreach i [lsort -integer -decreasing [mk::select ...]] { ... } > It would be best to show the solution in the examples of mk::row delete > in http://www.equi4.com/metakit/tcl.html Good point. Another item for my bulging todo list... :( -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 7 09:50:53 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97Eoqa22644 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 09:50:52 -0500 Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:51:20 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <3DD33C18-DA04-11D6-8313-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] win32 crash-on-exit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Could someone who has been seeing consistent crash-on-exit problems with tclkit do a quick to see whether the latest builds are an imporvment? The new code is at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ A bug was fixed in the "rechan" extension which caused it to crash with files open in VFS - this is a general enough change that it may well have been at the root of other issues, such as this one. -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Mon Oct 7 16:20:48 2002 Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97LKma20741 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:20:48 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0H3M00D01RB333@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 17:21:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0H3M003MTRAXUU@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 07 Oct 2002 17:21:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g97LKvY19697 for ; Mon, 07 Oct 2002 17:20:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 17:20:57 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Subject: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have had a problem with tclkit for linux when running on an SGI computer with Redhat linux. It seems to run fine, but then when I exit it hangs, and leaves processes that can't be killed without rebooting. I just downloaded a new tclkit from equi4 and the behavior is the same as the older ones: jhz[\H:(~)]8: ./tclkit-linux-x86 % exit At this point I can't ctrl-c or ctrl-z. Here's a process list, with several old processes hanging around from months ago: jhz[\H:(~)]3: all jhz 17454 1 0 Aug12 ? 00:00:00 [tclkit-linux-x8] jhz 17484 1 0 Aug12 ? 00:00:00 [tclkit-linux-x8] jhz 17521 1 0 Aug12 ? 00:00:00 [tclkit] jhz 20636 1 0 Aug23 ? 00:00:00 [3] jhz 21486 1 0 Aug23 ? 00:00:00 [3] jhz 14526 1 0 Sep11 ? 00:00:00 [bash] jhz 14545 14526 0 Sep11 ? 00:00:00 [hello] jhz 5386 1 0 17:11 ? 00:00:00 -bash jhz 5412 5386 0 17:12 ? 00:00:00 ./tclkit-linux-x86 root 5417 5416 0 17:15 pts/5 00:00:00 login -- jhz jhz 5418 5417 0 17:15 pts/5 00:00:00 -bash jhz 5441 5418 0 17:17 pts/5 00:00:00 ps -Af jhz 5442 5418 0 17:17 pts/5 00:00:00 -bash Can't kill -9 either. Any ideas? ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 7 16:48:48 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97Lmla22308; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:48:47 -0500 Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 23:49:15 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: MetaKit mailing list To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <9F8A5256-DA3E-11D6-8313-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: > I have had a problem with tclkit for linux when running on an SGI > computer > with Redhat linux. It seems to run fine, but then when I exit it hangs, > and leaves processes that can't be killed without rebooting. I just > downloaded a new tclkit from equi4 and the behavior is the same as the > older ones: > > jhz[\H:(~)]8: ./tclkit-linux-x86 > % exit > > At this point I can't ctrl-c or ctrl-z. [...] > Can't kill -9 either. Ouch, that is a major bug. You're not the first one to run into it, nor is it limited to Linux. First let's get this straight: a user-mode program which causes the OS to leave it in an uniterruptable state is an *OS* bug. So the most *accurate* advice I can give is: report this as a major bug to your OS vendor, RedHat in this case. I cannot repeat this enough: a user-mode program, not using any root permissions, and doing nothing but publicly documented system calls, should not be able to cause this. If I had mischief in mind, I could probably use this flaw as DOS-attack: just launch processes forever, each hitting this OS bug... Unfortunately, this all comes down to the simple fact that MK is triggering a serious bug on three different OS'es so far (RH, HPUX, OSX), so I have no option other than try and find a workaround. The world is too big, wheels turn too slowly, and MK is not likely to make anyone change things - even when a reproducible hard bug like this proves them to be causing it. Sigh... Ok, next step is for *me* to be able to reproduce this. 1) What version of RedHat are you using? If I can grab a copy of it somewhere, I'll set up a machine and repeat your runs. 2) What is the size/date of the tclkit executable you are using, and also: what does the Tcl command "puts $vfs::tclkit_version" return? With a bit of luck, your hang may be one I can reproduce - *then* I can start digging in. -jcw PS. FWIW, the problem seems to be related to having a datafile open, writing to it, even extending it at times, while there is a mmap on it (which is R/O) and with some of the writes using pointers into that map as data. With page-size allocations, a write to a page using data from that same page (never overlapping) may well mightily confuse an imperfect OS, as it tries to copy-on-write perhaps, page-faulting with a lock pending on the write while the read is in use. Whatever. I may even try to create a small example in an attempt to force OS vendors to fix this after all... But first, I need a setup to reproduce this behavior. As if there isn't enough work... :) From Murat_Berk@bmc.com Mon Oct 7 16:58:41 2002 Received: from creeper.bmc.com (firebird.bmc.com [198.207.223.228]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97Lwfa22808; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:58:41 -0500 Received: from ec02-hou.bmc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by creeper.bmc.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g97LvbH15902; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:57:37 -0500 (CDT) Received: by ec02-hou.bmc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:57:51 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Berk, Murat" To: "'Jean-Claude Wippler'" , Starkit list Cc: MetaKit mailing list Subject: RE: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavio r Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:57:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is the data on NFS mounted directories? We used to have this kind of problems also where we build some databases as part of build process into NFS. Some memory access patterns was causing big problems to us between Auspex NFS server and Solaris workstations (Solaris NFS server was OK) THen we had similar problems on other ones. (we used to go infinite loop and take 100% on the build machine the whole night) I think mmap across nfs was creating some problems which we never saw under very heavy load using local databases. This might be totally unrelated. I hope the above will be helpfull as a datapoint for this kind of issues... Murat -----Original Message----- From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 5:49 PM To: Starkit list Cc: MetaKit mailing list Subject: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: > I have had a problem with tclkit for linux when running on an SGI > computer > with Redhat linux. It seems to run fine, but then when I exit it hangs, > and leaves processes that can't be killed without rebooting. I just > downloaded a new tclkit from equi4 and the behavior is the same as the > older ones: > > jhz[\H:(~)]8: ./tclkit-linux-x86 > % exit > > At this point I can't ctrl-c or ctrl-z. [...] > Can't kill -9 either. Ouch, that is a major bug. You're not the first one to run into it, nor is it limited to Linux. First let's get this straight: a user-mode program which causes the OS to leave it in an uniterruptable state is an *OS* bug. So the most *accurate* advice I can give is: report this as a major bug to your OS vendor, RedHat in this case. I cannot repeat this enough: a user-mode program, not using any root permissions, and doing nothing but publicly documented system calls, should not be able to cause this. If I had mischief in mind, I could probably use this flaw as DOS-attack: just launch processes forever, each hitting this OS bug... Unfortunately, this all comes down to the simple fact that MK is triggering a serious bug on three different OS'es so far (RH, HPUX, OSX), so I have no option other than try and find a workaround. The world is too big, wheels turn too slowly, and MK is not likely to make anyone change things - even when a reproducible hard bug like this proves them to be causing it. Sigh... Ok, next step is for *me* to be able to reproduce this. 1) What version of RedHat are you using? If I can grab a copy of it somewhere, I'll set up a machine and repeat your runs. 2) What is the size/date of the tclkit executable you are using, and also: what does the Tcl command "puts $vfs::tclkit_version" return? With a bit of luck, your hang may be one I can reproduce - *then* I can start digging in. -jcw PS. FWIW, the problem seems to be related to having a datafile open, writing to it, even extending it at times, while there is a mmap on it (which is R/O) and with some of the writes using pointers into that map as data. With page-size allocations, a write to a page using data from that same page (never overlapping) may well mightily confuse an imperfect OS, as it tries to copy-on-write perhaps, page-faulting with a lock pending on the write while the read is in use. Whatever. I may even try to create a small example in an attempt to force OS vendors to fix this after all... But first, I need a setup to reproduce this behavior. As if there isn't enough work... :) _______________________________________________ metakit mailing list - metakit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/metakit From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Oct 7 18:16:34 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97NGYa26109; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 18:16:34 -0500 Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id QAA12813; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:17:02 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA00286; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:16:58 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YSD5S; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:16:57 -0700 Message-ID: <3DA215E9.9F4D2CD2@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 16:16:57 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list , MetaKit mailing list Subject: Re: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior References: <9F8A5256-DA3E-11D6-8313-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, <..snip..> > Unfortunately, this all comes down to the simple fact that MK is > triggering a serious bug on three different OS'es so far (RH, HPUX, > OSX), so I have no option other than try and find a workaround. The > world is too big, wheels turn too slowly, and MK is not likely to make > anyone change things - even when a reproducible hard bug like this > proves them to be causing it. > > Sigh... > > Ok, next step is for *me* to be able to reproduce this. > > 1) What version of RedHat are you using? If I can grab a copy of it > somewhere, I'll set up a machine and repeat your runs. > > 2) What is the size/date of the tclkit executable you are using, and > also: > what does the Tcl command "puts $vfs::tclkit_version" return? > > With a bit of luck, your hang may be one I can reproduce - *then* I can > start digging in. > > -jcw > > PS. FWIW, the problem seems to be related to having a datafile open, > writing to it, even extending it at times, while there is a mmap on it > (which is R/O) and with some of the writes using pointers into that map > as data. With page-size allocations, a write to a page using data from > that same page (never overlapping) may well mightily confuse an > imperfect OS, as it tries to copy-on-write perhaps, page-faulting with > a lock pending on the write while the read is in use. Whatever. I may > even try to create a small example in an attempt to force OS vendors to > fix this after all... My sysadmin has been out the passed couple of days. When he returns I'm going to ask him if there are any patches for mmap bugs for my HP. It is possible that the bug has been reported and fixed but my system hasn't been patch since the strategy here is "never patch a working system". I'll let you know what I find out when he returns. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Oct 7 18:22:46 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97NMja26397; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 18:22:45 -0500 Received: [from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate2.mot.com (motgate2 2.1) with ESMTP id QAA16161; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:23:13 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA10644; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:23:09 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YSD6P; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:23:09 -0700 Message-ID: <3DA2175D.27740634@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 16:23:09 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: "'Jean-Claude Wippler'" , Starkit list , MetaKit mailing list Subject: Re: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Berk, > Is the data on NFS mounted directories? > > We used to have this kind of problems also where we build some databases > as part of build process into NFS. > > Some memory access patterns was causing big problems to us between > Auspex NFS server and Solaris workstations (Solaris NFS server was OK) > THen we had similar problems on other ones. (we used to go infinite loop > and take 100% on the build machine the whole night) > > I think mmap across nfs was creating some problems which we never saw under > very heavy load using local databases. > > This might be totally unrelated. I hope the above will be helpfull as a > datapoint for this kind of issues... Interesting :-/ The problem on my HP showed up when I was doing a save from wikit. The problem is stable. All my files are on a file server an I thought there was the possibility of a problem between NFS as implemented on HP and NFS as implemented on the file server. Can I test the hypothesis by storing the db in /tmp on the host? I thought about trying it but haven't done it yet. Tom K. From gay@sfu.ca Mon Oct 7 18:53:44 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g97Nria27564 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 18:53:44 -0500 Received: from sfu.ca (fs171.dialin.sfu.ca [142.58.74.171]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.5/8.12.5/SFU-5.0H) with ESMTP id g97Ns5gB016369 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 16:54:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3DA21EE8.8090508@sfu.ca> Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 16:55:20 -0700 From: Ian Gay User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.1a) Gecko/20020611 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Win98 exit crash Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JCW wrote: Could someone who has been seeing consistent crash-on-exit problems with tclkit do a quick to see whether the latest builds are an imporvment? The new code is at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ A bug was fixed in the "rechan" extension which caused it to crash with files open in VFS - this is a general enough change that it may well have been at the root of other issues, such as this one. -jcw ---------------- Alas, it still crashes. But is that the correct tclkit there? I downloaded the Oct. 7 UPX version, but ::vfs::tclkit_version has the value 200209.011. From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Oct 8 01:55:44 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g986tha17519 for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 01:55:43 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Oct 08 10:25:28 2002 +0300 Message-ID: <3DA282B5.6080902@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 10:01:09 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list , MetaKit mailing list Subject: Re: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior References: <9F8A5256-DA3E-11D6-8313-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Sigh... > > Ok, next step is for *me* to be able to reproduce this. > > 1) What version of RedHat are you using? If I can grab a copy of it > somewhere, I'll set up a machine and repeat your runs. > > 2) What is the size/date of the tclkit executable you are using, and also: > what does the Tcl command "puts $vfs::tclkit_version" return? > Hi, I have a RH 7.1 server and could run some tests... regards, nicolas boretos From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Tue Oct 8 08:44:49 2002 Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g98Dina09654; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 08:44:49 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0H3O002010V3LV@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 09:45:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0H3O00FHG0UXPP@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 09:45:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g98Diua08154; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 09:44:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 09:44:56 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior In-reply-to: <9F8A5256-DA3E-11D6-8313-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list , MetaKit mailing list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, I have included the information you wanted in-line with your email text. I agree that the OS should not allow such things to happen. Since it is linux, there is a chance we could even fix the bug, but I have neither the time or familiarity with linux internals to tackle this at this time. I will look into letting the linux community and RedHat know about this. Might help improve their system. Even as 'su' the process could not be killed. Maybe it has to do with the SGI SMP aspects... By the way, you and the other developers deservemany thanks for the fine work and ideas you have contributed to bring the starkit concept and implementation to this point. On Mon, 7 Oct 2002, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: > > > I have had a problem with tclkit for linux when running on an SGI > > computer > > with Redhat linux. It seems to run fine, but then when I exit it hangs, > > and leaves processes that can't be killed without rebooting. I just > > downloaded a new tclkit from equi4 and the behavior is the same as the > > older ones: > > > > jhz[\H:(~)]8: ./tclkit-linux-x86 > > % exit > > > > At this point I can't ctrl-c or ctrl-z. > [...] > > Can't kill -9 either. > > Ouch, that is a major bug. You're not the first one to run into it, > nor is it limited to Linux. > > First let's get this straight: a user-mode program which causes the OS > to leave it in an uniterruptable state is an *OS* bug. So the most > *accurate* advice I can give is: report this as a major bug to your OS > vendor, RedHat in this case. > > I cannot repeat this enough: a user-mode program, not using any root > permissions, and doing nothing but publicly documented system calls, > should not be able to cause this. If I had mischief in mind, I could > probably use this flaw as DOS-attack: just launch processes forever, > each hitting this OS bug... > > Unfortunately, this all comes down to the simple fact that MK is > triggering a serious bug on three different OS'es so far (RH, HPUX, > OSX), so I have no option other than try and find a workaround. The > world is too big, wheels turn too slowly, and MK is not likely to make > anyone change things - even when a reproducible hard bug like this > proves them to be causing it. > > Sigh... > > Ok, next step is for *me* to be able to reproduce this. > > 1) What version of RedHat are you using? If I can grab a copy of it > somewhere, I'll set up a machine and repeat your runs. Trying 128.244.28.62... Connected to ardana.jhuapl.edu. Escape character is '^]'. Red Hat Linux release 6.2 (Zoot) Kernel 2.2.15-3SGI_39smp on an i686 login: jhz Password: Last login: Mon Oct 7 17:15:17 from aplexus.jhuapl.edu > > 2) What is the size/date of the tclkit executable you are using, and > also: > what does the Tcl command "puts $vfs::tclkit_version" return? jhz[\H:(~)]1: recent total 57892 -rwxr-xr-x 1 jhz users 2864054 Oct 7 17:11 tclkit-linux-x86* jhz[\H:(~)]1: sum tclkit-* 47402 2797 jhz[\H:(~)]4: ./tclkit-linux-x86 % puts $vfs::tclkit_version 200209 > > With a bit of luck, your hang may be one I can reproduce - *then* I can > start digging in. > > -jcw > > PS. FWIW, the problem seems to be related to having a datafile open, > writing to it, even extending it at times, while there is a mmap on it > (which is R/O) and with some of the writes using pointers into that map > as data. With page-size allocations, a write to a page using data from > that same page (never overlapping) may well mightily confuse an > imperfect OS, as it tries to copy-on-write perhaps, page-faulting with > a lock pending on the write while the read is in use. Whatever. I may > even try to create a small example in an attempt to force OS vendors to > fix this after all... > > But first, I need a setup to reproduce this behavior. > > As if there isn't enough work... :) > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Tue Oct 8 08:47:54 2002 Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g98Dlsa09935; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 08:47:54 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0H3O0030110894@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 09:48:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0H3O00FGN100EI@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 09:48:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id g98Dm0308291; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 09:48:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 09:48:00 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: RE: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavio r In-reply-to: X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: "Berk, Murat" Cc: "'Jean-Claude Wippler'" , Starkit list , MetaKit mailing list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Mon, 7 Oct 2002, Berk, Murat wrote: > Is the data on NFS mounted directories? All the files are on the local disk: jhz[\H:(~)]4: df Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on /dev/scsi/host0/bus0/target0/lun0/part5 4134900 2506264 1418588 64% / /dev/scsi/host0/bus0/target0/lun0/part1 31079 8412 21063 29% /boot /dev/scsi/host0/bus0/target0/lun0/part6 13227316 7121508 5433892 57% /home > > We used to have this kind of problems also where we build some databases > as part of build process into NFS. > > Some memory access patterns was causing big problems to us between > Auspex NFS server and Solaris workstations (Solaris NFS server was OK) > THen we had similar problems on other ones. (we used to go infinite loop > and take 100% on the build machine the whole night) > > I think mmap across nfs was creating some problems which we never saw under > very heavy load using local databases. > > This might be totally unrelated. I hope the above will be helpfull as a > datapoint for this kind of issues... > > Murat > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 5:49 PM > To: Starkit list > Cc: MetaKit mailing list > Subject: [Metakit] Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior > > > john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: > > > I have had a problem with tclkit for linux when running on an SGI > > computer > > with Redhat linux. It seems to run fine, but then when I exit it hangs, > > and leaves processes that can't be killed without rebooting. I just > > downloaded a new tclkit from equi4 and the behavior is the same as the > > older ones: > > > > jhz[\H:(~)]8: ./tclkit-linux-x86 > > % exit > > > > At this point I can't ctrl-c or ctrl-z. > [...] > > Can't kill -9 either. > > Ouch, that is a major bug. You're not the first one to run into it, > nor is it limited to Linux. > > First let's get this straight: a user-mode program which causes the OS > to leave it in an uniterruptable state is an *OS* bug. So the most > *accurate* advice I can give is: report this as a major bug to your OS > vendor, RedHat in this case. > > I cannot repeat this enough: a user-mode program, not using any root > permissions, and doing nothing but publicly documented system calls, > should not be able to cause this. If I had mischief in mind, I could > probably use this flaw as DOS-attack: just launch processes forever, > each hitting this OS bug... > > Unfortunately, this all comes down to the simple fact that MK is > triggering a serious bug on three different OS'es so far (RH, HPUX, > OSX), so I have no option other than try and find a workaround. The > world is too big, wheels turn too slowly, and MK is not likely to make > anyone change things - even when a reproducible hard bug like this > proves them to be causing it. > > Sigh... > > Ok, next step is for *me* to be able to reproduce this. > > 1) What version of RedHat are you using? If I can grab a copy of it > somewhere, I'll set up a machine and repeat your runs. > > 2) What is the size/date of the tclkit executable you are using, and > also: > what does the Tcl command "puts $vfs::tclkit_version" return? > > With a bit of luck, your hang may be one I can reproduce - *then* I can > start digging in. > > -jcw > > PS. FWIW, the problem seems to be related to having a datafile open, > writing to it, even extending it at times, while there is a mmap on it > (which is R/O) and with some of the writes using pointers into that map > as data. With page-size allocations, a write to a page using data from > that same page (never overlapping) may well mightily confuse an > imperfect OS, as it tries to copy-on-write perhaps, page-faulting with > a lock pending on the write while the read is in use. Whatever. I may > even try to create a small example in an attempt to force OS vendors to > fix this after all... > > But first, I need a setup to reproduce this behavior. > > As if there isn't enough work... :) > > _______________________________________________ > metakit mailing list - metakit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/metakit > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Oct 8 09:50:36 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g98EoZa14247 for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 09:50:35 -0500 Received: (qmail 9664 invoked by uid 8); 8 Oct 2002 14:50:58 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdaH9dZj; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 10:50:52 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: , "Jean-Claude Wippler" Cc: "Starkit list" , "MetaKit mailing list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange SGI Linux tclkit exit behavior Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:50:49 +0800 Message-Id: <20021008145049.12430@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: John, > Even as 'su' the process could not be >killed. Maybe it has to do with the SGI SMP aspects... That would not suprise me ... I'll be having a look at this tomorrow to see if it occurs on RedHat 7.2 Steve From wliao@generationec.com Wed Oct 9 18:46:52 2002 Received: from mail2.intermedia.net (mail2.intermedia.net [206.40.48.152]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g99Nkqa09227 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 18:46:52 -0500 Received: from generationec.com (unverified [216.198.69.129]) by mail2.intermedia.net (Rockliffe SMTPRA 4.5.4) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 16:47:17 -0700 Received: by generationec.com (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Wed, 9 Oct 2002 18:47:17 -0500 Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 18:47:17 -0500 From: Wenchi Liao To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <20021009234717.GA1712@generationec.com> Mail-Followup-To: starkit@equi4.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Subject: [Starkit] wikit and suid Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hey, all. I had a thread about this on clt, but work intervened... So here's the run down: I'm running tclkit (hot off of the ftp server as of today) on NetBSD/alpha. [puts $vfs::tclkit_version] results in 200209. The web server is apache 1.3.something. In general, tclkit seems fine: I can make silly cgi's that call tclkit, and it is executed properly. When I try to run a wiki, however, only tclkit suid will work. (BTW, this isn't my machine, so the amount of experimentation I can do is limited....). This seems to point to permissions, but I can't figure it out. Here's the script I'm using to start the cgi: $ cat wiki.cgi #!/bin/sh - umask 022 BASE=/arpa/tz/w/wliao/html/wiki BIN=/arpa/tz/w/wliao/html/bin WIKIT_BASE=http://wliao.freeshell.org/wiki/wiki.cgi/ export WIKIT_BASE WIKIT_DUMP=$BASE/wiki.log export WIKIT_DUMP exec $BIN/tclkit $BASE/wikit.kit $BASE/1.tkd Here's how ownership works out: $ ls -l wikit.kit 1.tkd ../bin/tclkit -rwxr-xr-x 1 wliao users 3838070 Oct 9 17:05 ../bin/tclkit* -rwxrwxrwx 1 wliao users 20358 Aug 30 18:03 1.tkd* -rwxr-xr-x 1 wliao users 53197 Aug 27 10:55 wikit.kit* When trying to run this, I get the dreaded internal service error message. The error.log reports premature end of script headers. If I use a tclkit suid to me, then the wiki shows up and everything is fine. Running this suid myself isn't that bad. What is bad is if I change 1.tkd to mode 700 or 744, I lose the ability to edit the wiki...which I do need. There seems to be a check in wikit/lib/wikit/utils.tcl:88 to check the writable status, but I haven't been able to track this particular bit down. Any ideas? WL From mhankyson@hotmail.com Wed Oct 9 21:44:45 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f11.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9A2ija19113 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 21:44:45 -0500 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:45:05 -0700 Received: from 203.32.142.5 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 02:45:04 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.32.142.5] From: "Michael Hankinson" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 12:45:04 +1000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Oct 2002 02:45:05.0660 (UTC) FILETIME=[0A1DC3C0:01C27007] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I have been looking into the 5 second commit problem. I made a change to line 264 in the mk4vfs.tcl file in tclkit from this if { $flush } { to this if { $flush == 0 } { and now it appears to be working. I am new to tcl and programming so I am not confident in what I am doing. Can someone please check this to see if it really does fix the problem? Regards Michael >From: "Michael Hankinson" >To: starkit@equi4.com >Subject: RE: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? >Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2002 23:39:50 +1000 > >Hi all, > >I am having the same problem with the 5 second commit on a wrapped version >of Tclhttpd on Debian Linux. I used the -writable flag and got a >Segmentation fault when I downloaded the first page. I wrapped again with >-writable and -nocompress, everything appeared to run perfectly but any >changes I made and also any file I uploaded to the webserver were not saved >to disk but appeared to be in memory. The starkit size didn't increase at >all while the Tclhttpd starkit was running or when I exited. > >Also I don't think I am stopping Tclhttpd correctly while wrapped in a >starkit that's probably why it did not get saved on exit. I use Control C >or kill -TERM pid. > >Regards > >Michael > > > >Jeff Godfrey said: > >>Thanks for the quick response. So, it seems that the Star*pack* was the >>problem, but a Star*kit* should work as expected. I'll try that out. > >Hey Jeff, I was having some problems with the commit. Could you please >let us know what happens when you write to the vfs in a star*kit* - do the >changes get saved when you close the file in the vfs, or only after the >starkit exits? Thanks a lot. > >Ro _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com From mike@eolas.com Wed Oct 9 21:52:03 2002 Received: from www.iomas.com (65-85-54-210.client.dsl.net [65.85.54.210]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9A2q2a19433 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 21:52:03 -0500 Received: from mike.eolas.com [65.85.54.221] by www.iomas.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.04) id AB605F040342; Wed, 09 Oct 2002 21:52:16 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20021009215117.041718a8@mail.eolas.com> X-Sender: miked@mail.eolas.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 21:52:27 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Mike Doyle Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] Kitten docs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone compiled a set of docs, or at least links to docs, for the 130 packages now included in Kitten.kit ? --Mike From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 10 04:11:16 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9A9BGa07491 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 04:11:16 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9A9BZok015909 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 05:11:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9A9BZv06056; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 05:11:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 05:11:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021010051135.AAB6045@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 10 Oct 2002 12:45:04 +1000 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Michael Hankinson" >I have been looking into the 5 second commit problem. I made a change to >line 264 in the mk4vfs.tcl file in tclkit >from this > if { $flush } { > >to this > if { $flush == 0 } { > >and now it appears to be working. I am new to tcl and programming so I am >not confident in what I am doing. Can someone please check this to see if it >really does fix the problem? Weird - changing the condition for that code from 'do when flush is needed' to 'do when flush is not needed' fixed the delay? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 10 05:13:01 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9AAD0a12383; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 05:13:00 -0500 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 12:13:27 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <20021010051135.AAB6045@cas.org> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > From: "Michael Hankinson" > >> I have been looking into the 5 second commit problem. [...] >> if { $flush == 0 } { >> and now it appears to be working. [...] > Weird - changing the condition for that code from 'do when flush is > needed' > to 'do when flush is not needed' fixed the delay? No, this won't do it, I'm afraid - it causes a single commit as far as I can tell. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 10 10:06:10 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9AF6Aa04772 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:06:10 -0500 Received: from srv13.cas.org (srv13 [134.243.65.81]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9AF6Tok027317 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:06:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by srv13.cas.org (8.8.8+Sun/m4_8.8.8/CAS_CLIENT-1.16) id LAA11685; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:06:29 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:06:29 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021010110628.AAB10483@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] File extensions - .bin vs .kit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Across the wikit and elsewhere I see references to things like sdx.bin and critcl.kit . Are the extensions arbitrary or meant to convey info? The .bin ones seem to me to be less useful, as it seems more likely that something called '.bin' is being used elsewhere. Just wondering whether a convention of using .kit for starkits (and I guess .exe for starpacks) might be useful to agree upon and use in general. Or are the references to things like sdx.bin older reference which just need updated? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 10 10:16:08 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9AFG7a05923 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:16:07 -0500 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 17:16:37 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] File extensions - .bin vs .kit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021010110628.AAB10483@cas.org> Message-Id: <4515D96D-DC63-11D6-B9B9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Across the wikit and elsewhere I see references to things like > sdx.bin and critcl.kit . Thanks for bringing this up - the .bin is old, obsolete. There needs to be something - without extension som browsers decide it is text and apply CR/LF conversion, or worse: decide to dump the contents on the screen. Both .tkd and .bin are leftovers from the past, as far as I'm concerned. Let's track those down and change to .kit everywhere. Starpacks are trickier - I'm using .exe for win32 code, and gzip compressing all the rest (including tclkits), then storing them as ,gz > Or are the references to things like sdx.bin older reference which > just need updated? Bot reference and instances need to be updated - please do so as you see fit, and let me know where there are files with old naming conventions still lying around. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Oct 10 10:35:18 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9AFZIa08117 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:35:18 -0500 Received: [from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id IAA11321 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 08:33:18 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA20203 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 08:35:44 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2654.52) id S47YS2XW; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 08:35:43 -0700 Message-ID: <3DA59E4F.F40BF9A3@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 08:35:43 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com References: <20021009234717.GA1712@generationec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] wikit .tkd question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm trying to figure out how to use wikit as a help system for an application and would like to know if it is possible to unpack the .tkd file, edit the documents directly and then repack the .tkd. I found a copy of the wikitool.tcl but it crashes the wikit.tkd generated by my wikit. Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Oct 11 05:27:25 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9BAROa09068 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 05:27:25 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9BARiok017478 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 06:27:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9BARi721522; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 06:27:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 06:27:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021011062744.AAB21368@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Question about building tclkit from genkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: First, let me start out for the reason that I am even thinking about the stuff below. I'm thinking over what, if any, potential problems a user (of a binary tclkit that I build here) might have if attempting to use that binary on a compatible platform. I have no reports of problems. Everything might be just fine. I'm trying to anticipate where the problems might occur. My users tend to find those dark corners where others do not tread . Anyways, here's the scoop. All I am looking for is either confirmation that these things are normal and that people have found that it causes no problems. Or a response that no one else in the world has ever noticed or cared about it... I downloaded the genkit and associated tar files, etc. from the web site. I follow the examples, stumble over a problem where g++ on Solaris requires me apparently to put the libstdc++.so directory into my LD_LIBRARY_PATH (yuck!), and get something that appears to be a tclkit. However, the executable I have is different from the tclkit being distributed for sparc solaris. I don't know if this is an OS , site, platform, or personal environment difference. When I download the sparc solaris tclkit from the web site, I look to see what dynamic library dependencies exist: $ ldd tclkit libdl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libdl.so.1 libsocket.so.1 => /usr/lib/libsocket.so.1 libnsl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libnsl.so.1 libm.so.1 => /usr/lib/libm.so.1 libc.so.1 => /usr/lib/libc.so.1 libmp.so.2 => /usr/lib/libmp.so.2 /usr/platform/SUNW,Sun-Blade-100/lib/libc_psr.so.1 Dynamic library, socket, name resolution, math (regular and multiple precision), standard C , the c_psr is probably multi-processor C support. Now, I look at the version I built: $ ldd $(whence tclkit) libX11.so.4 => /usr/openwin/lib/libX11.so.4 libdl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libdl.so.1 libsocket.so.1 => /usr/lib/libsocket.so.1 libm.so.1 => /usr/lib/libm.so.1 libc.so.1 => /usr/lib/libc.so.1 libnsl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libnsl.so.1 libXext.so.0 => /usr/openwin/lib/libXext.so.0 libmp.so.2 => /usr/lib/libmp.so.2 libdga.so.1 => /usr/openwin/lib/libdga.so.1 /usr/platform/SUNW,Sun-Blade-100/lib/libc_psr.so.1 Notice the X11, Xext, and dga dependencies. The first two are X11 libraries. The last appears to be a direct graphics access library for Sparc frame buffers. Perhaps this is a Solaris 8 thing. I just can't tell. Since I just followed the instructions, I don't know if this is normal or what. Another question is that of embedded path names. For instance, when I go searching the binary of tclkit, I see at least 4 paths in the executable that are local directories. 3 are related to the basic location where tclkit is building. The other is in a list of library paths to look for libraries. I didn't enter any of these. Doesn't seem like that -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Oct 11 06:03:52 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9BB3pa11616 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 06:03:51 -0500 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 13:04:21 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question about building tclkit from genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021011062744.AAB21368@cas.org> Message-Id: <31A12F48-DD09-11D6-B9B9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I'm thinking over what, if any, potential problems > a user (of a binary tclkit that I build here) might have if attempting > to use > that binary on a compatible platform. Great thinking :) Binary distribution is common on Win32 and OSX, and also Linux, but the rest of the Unix world has not yet latched on to it - unfortunately. In fact, standard Unix folklore seems to be to advise against doing this. So TclKit is often going in unchartered areas there... > I have no reports of problems. Everything might be just fine. > I'm trying to anticipate where the problems might occur. My users > tend to find those dark corners where others do not tread . Real life users do. > I downloaded the genkit and associated tar files, etc. from the web > site. > I follow the examples, stumble over a problem where g++ on Solaris > requires me apparently to put the libstdc++.so directory into my > LD_LIBRARY_PATH (yuck!), and get something that appears to be a tclkit. Yuck indeed. Gcc on solaris wants to link to a static lib and cannot find it otherwise (sdtc++ IIRC). > However, the executable I have is different from the tclkit being > distributed > for sparc solaris. I don't know if this is an OS , site, platform, or > personal environment difference. Solaris has always caused me trouble, because it does not have all code available in .a libs, hence I cannot use the "-static" flag for gcc linkage. That option is what makes tclkit on Linux *fully* self contained, and runnable on every ELF-enabled Linux there is. It has no dependencies on anything other than system calls. With Solaris (and HP-UX, and OSF1, and OSX), this is not an option (yet?). This means there is bound to be trouble - we may have to keep a couple of binaries around - or even ask people to build tclkit for their shlib-mix-du-jour. I see no resolution - but hope things end up working most of the time without such steps. On Solaris, that is also the reason why I build on 5.7 - which runs on 5.8, but not vice versa. > Now, I look at the version I built: [...] > Notice the X11, Xext, and dga dependencies. The first two are X11 > libraries. The last appears to be a direct graphics access library for > Sparc frame buffers. That's the other linkage issue. There's tclkitsh (no X11), and tclkit in two variations: with X11 linked into it, or with tk loaded from VFS dynamically. I tend to pick the last of the two when static linkage is not fully possible, as on Solaris, whereas static linkage for tclkitsh is. That means Tcl will start up properly on any machine, but Tk may fail if the shared runtime libs are causing trouble, a better fallback than not having tclkit run at all. > Perhaps this is a Solaris 8 thing. I just can't tell. Since I just > followed the instructions, I don't know if this is normal or what. My hunch is that the diff is 7 vs 8. > Another question is that of embedded path names. For instance, > when I go searching the binary of tclkit, I see at > least 4 paths in the executable that are local directories. 3 are > related to the basic location where tclkit is building. The > other is in a list of library paths to look for libraries. I didn't > enter any of these. It would be very very useful to try and find a way to get rid of these. As I said, with fully static builds, there are no external paths. When -static is not available, it would be great to at least limit all remaining dependencies. First place to look is in tclsh, which genkit builds as part of the process: ldd install/`hostname`/bin/tclsh8.4 Once those dependencies are minimized, it would be good to try fixing the rest in genkit, when it builds kit and kitsh. Comments, suggestions, fixes, patches are - as always - most welcome. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Oct 11 09:59:04 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9BEx4a31018 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:59:04 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9BExOok027691 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 10:59:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9BExNe14489; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 10:59:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 10:59:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021011105923.AAB632@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question about building tclkit from genkit In-Reply-To: <31A12F48-DD09-11D6-B9B9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Fri, 11 Oct 2002 13:04:21 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > It would be very very useful to try and find a way to get rid of these. > As I said, with fully static builds, there are no external paths. > When -static is not available, it would be great to at least limit all > remaining dependencies. Okay, here's what I found regarding the paths. My build right now is going on a small local disk with a unique path name. So from the top level directory I typed: $ gfind . -type f -print | xargs gegrep -l /ldatae ./out/lwv26awu/tcl ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/config.log ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/config.status ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/Makefile ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/dltest/Makefile ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/tclConfig.sh ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/tclUnixInit.o ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/libtcl8.4.a ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/tclsh ./install/lwv26awu/lib/libtcl8.4.a ./install/lwv26awu/lib/tclConfig.sh ./install/lwv26awu/bin/tclsh8.4 This is the list of files which make reference to my unique path name. The places which concern me, seeing these, are: ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/tclConfig.sh ./build/lwv26awu/tcl/tclUnixInit.o The first is that many of the configuration values have full paths in them. I wonder if relative paths could/should be used in most of these cases, at least for tclkit. The second item said to me that some -D when compiling tclUnixInit had the path in it. So I checked the out/hostname/tcl file and found: gcc -pipe -c -O -Wall -Wconversion -Wno-implicit-int -fPIC -I../../../src/tcl/un ix/../generic -I../../../src/tcl/unix -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_LIMITS_H=1 -DTCL_ WIDE_INT_TYPE=long\ long -DHAVE_STRUCT_DIRENT64=1 -DHAVE_STRUCT_STAT64=1 -DHAVE_ TYPE_OFF64_T=1 -DWORDS_BIGENDIAN=1 -DHAVE_GETCWD=1 -DHAVE_OPENDIR=1 -DHAVE_STRST R=1 -DHAVE_STRTOL=1 -DHAVE_STRTOLL=1 -DHAVE_STRTOULL=1 -DHAVE_TMPNAM=1 -DHAVE_WA ITPID=1 -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_SYS_PARAM_H=1 -DUSE_TERMIOS=1 -DHAVE_SYS_TIME_H =1 -DTIME_WITH_SYS_TIME=1 -DHAVE_TZNAME=1 -DHAVE_GMTIME_R=1 -DHAVE_LOCALTIME_R=1 -DHAVE_TIMEZONE_VAR=1 -DHAVE_ST_BLKSIZE=1 -Dstrtod=fixstrtod -DSTDC_HEADERS=1 - DNO_UNION_WAIT=1 -DHAVE_SIGNED_CHAR=1 -DHAVE_LANGINFO=1 -DSTATIC_BUILD=1 -D_REEN TRANT=1 -D_POSIX_PTHREAD_SEMANTICS=1 -DHAVE_SYS_IOCTL_H=1 -DHAVE_SYS_FILIO_H=1 -DTCL_SHLIB_EXT=\".so\" -DTCL_LIBRARY=\"/ldatae/tclkit/noarch/lib/tcl8.4\ " \ -DTCL_PACKAGE_PATH="\"/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib /ldatae/tclkit/noarch/ lib\"" \ ../../../src/tcl/unix/../unix/tclUnixInit.c And there are the sources of the situation: TCL_LIBRARY and TCL_PACKAGE_PATH values. In a Tclkit situation, I wonder - should these values be set to some path that is going to be inside the VFS? >First place to look is in tclsh, which genkit builds as part of the >process: > ldd install/`hostname`/bin/tclsh8.4 >Once those dependencies are minimized, it would be good to try fixing >the rest in genkit, when it builds kit and kitsh. $ ldd install/lwv*/bin/tclsh8.4 libdl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libdl.so.1 libsocket.so.1 => /usr/lib/libsocket.so.1 libm.so.1 => /usr/lib/libm.so.1 libc.so.1 => /usr/lib/libc.so.1 libnsl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libnsl.so.1 libmp.so.2 => /usr/lib/libmp.so.2 /usr/platform/SUNW,Sun-Blade-100/lib/libc_psr.so.1 Those look pretty much like the original list, as far as I can tell. Just a note. I just tried out the tclkit and even with those full paths, the things tested (a simple tcl command and a package require) seem to work just fine - so it doesn't seem like it is an urgent situation. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Oct 11 18:03:30 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9BN3Sa06101 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 18:03:28 -0500 Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 01:04:01 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question about building tclkit from genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021011105923.AAB632@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >> It would be very very useful to try and find a way to get rid of >> these. >> As I said, with fully static builds, there are no external paths. >> When -static is not available, it would be great to at least limit all >> remaining dependencies. > > Okay, here's what I found regarding the paths. [...] The only one that matters is tclUnixInit.o - the rest are either build by-products or based on it. > The second item said to me that some -D when compiling tclUnixInit had > the path > in it. So I checked the out/hostname/tcl file and found: [...] > -DTCL_SHLIB_EXT=\".so\" > -DTCL_LIBRARY=\"/ldatae/tclkit/noarch/lib/tcl8.4\ > " \ > -DTCL_PACKAGE_PATH="\"/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib > /ldatae/tclkit/noarch/ > lib\"" \ [...] > And there are the sources of the situation: TCL_LIBRARY and > TCL_PACKAGE_PATH > values. Yes - I've argued (forgot with whom, someone from the TCT, IIRC) about this. A lib should not embed a build path - it was argued, that it is in there to allow Tcl to find its init.tcl file. I'm not convinced - this same path is what masks problems I (still) have with encoding startup. At best, as you say, one would expect a relative path - though with TclKit it would still not work. > In a Tclkit situation, I wonder - should these values be set to some > path > that is going to be inside the VFS? There are some nasty nasty nasty chicken-and-egg issues with TclKit startup and VFS. TclKit needs a working Tcl interpreter to activate its VFS logic (part of which is coded in Tcl). That interpreter cannot access VFS while it is being created. Hence it has no way to find anything, not even init.tcl or encodings before it has run the VFS scripts. I would hope that the problem is resolvable - I can make sure that all files until final VFS init are in pure UTF-8 form (they are plain scripts, after all), hence encodings are not yet needed. And I can work around init.tcl, which it too is not essential to run the VFS tcl scripts. Now you may wonder how I even *get* those VFS Tcl scripts, since "source" into VFS is not yet possible... ah, that's a trick TclKit plays on startup in kitInit.c: it accesses a few files inside the MK datafile with plain C/C++ calls, then evals the resulting strings. As I said, this area is full of tricky issues. Hopefully, everything gets resolved as more and more experience is gained and Tcl startup gets streamlined further. One interesting idea (by Kevin Kenny, IIRC) is to implement an "internal VFS" file system, which is always available to Tcl. That could store the key files to get the rest going. BTW, this is very similar to an OS booting, not having disk access, mounting a boot partition, reading in the kernel, then installing a RAM disk, pulling some more things out of that, and finally ending up with a clean file system setup. In fact, once we get this right, one could consider building a restricted tclkit, which has *no* native disk access. It would merely have R/O access to its VFS-at-end-of-exe runtime files, and things like sockets. Such a "diskless app" can run safely on any machine, with a high degree of security - it could not read or write anything off local or mounted disks, an attractive deployment option for some cases. >> Once those dependencies are minimized, it would be good to try fixing >> the rest in genkit, when it builds kit and kitsh. > > $ ldd install/lwv*/bin/tclsh8.4 > libdl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libdl.so.1 > libsocket.so.1 => /usr/lib/libsocket.so.1 > libm.so.1 => /usr/lib/libm.so.1 > libc.so.1 => /usr/lib/libc.so.1 > libnsl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libnsl.so.1 > libmp.so.2 => /usr/lib/libmp.so.2 > /usr/platform/SUNW,Sun-Blade-100/lib/libc_psr.so.1 > > Those look pretty much like the original list, as far as I can tell. Last line I don't understand, it;s not in the "a => b" form... > Just a note. I just tried out the tclkit and even with those > full paths, the things tested (a simple tcl command and a package > require) > seem to work just fine - so it doesn't seem like it is an urgent > situation. Yes, we're sailing a bit close to the edge at times, but it does work :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Oct 11 18:21:51 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9BNLoa07103 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 18:21:50 -0500 Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 01:22:24 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit .tkd question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DA59E4F.F40BF9A3@motorola.com> Message-Id: <4CA7B11C-DD70-11D6-B9B9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I'm trying to figure out how to use wikit as a help system for an > application and would like to know if it is possible to unpack the > .tkd file, edit the documents directly and then repack the .tkd. I > found a copy of the wikitool.tcl but it crashes the wikit.tkd > generated by my wikit. Wikitool crashing is a bug - is that http://www.equi4.com/wikit/wikitool ? You say "unpack the .tkd", by which I assume you mean the wikit datafile. Note that wikit.kit (the app) is a starkit, but wikit.tkd is a MetaKit datafile which is *not* a VFS filesystem, but a MetaKit datafile with other database views. The reason is performance - full text search needs direct access to MK's data, i.e. uses mk::select, etc. For now, I would suggest taking critcl.kit apart (from the sdarchive) and examining how it sets up a help system. See also Kevin Kenny's "Dots and Boxes", http://mini.net/tcl/4211, in which he added the same online help system (i.e. a wikit.tkd file stored inside a starkit. Last but not least - the latest wikit.kit has image support, see recent posts on the TclersWiki mailing list at Yahoo groups. Sorry, I should probably have cross-posted this. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TclersWiki/ Oops, I see it is not readable for non-subscribers. Attached a copy of that post. -jcw > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Date: Sun Oct 6, 2002 16:14:41 Europe/Amsterdam > To: TclersWiki@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [TclersWiki] Wikit embedded images > Reply-To: TclersWiki@yahoogroups.com > > Yours truly penned: > [...] >> Using this, I've implemented the start of a new mechanism to bring >> inlined images into the wikit datafile. The first goal is merely to >> pull them in and display them in local mode [...] > > The change is now complete - local-mode embedded images are supported > (only .gif, since that's the only one Tk supports without further > extensions - bummer...). This is particularly useful for embedded help > systems, which can now include images/graphics. > >> There are a number of new commands, all for use from the command-line: > > They have changed - here is the updated summary: > > tclkit wikit.kit -images scan wikit.tkd > scans all pages, updating an "image cache" inside the wikit.tkd > datafile (this does not fetch images, it just updates that cache) > repeated calls are incremental: adds new / deletes unused items > > tclkit wikit.kit -images list wikit.tkd > lists all entries currently in the image cache, with fetch/file dates > > tclkit wikit.kit -images get wikit.tkd > this goes through the image cache and fetches any entries which have > not been successfully fetched before (only images <= 100 Kb) > > tclkit wikit.kit -images local wikit.tkd > goes through caches, storing all images it can find in [pwd], i.e. > updates and replaces what is in the cache with local file copies > (can be used to add/replace, and to store images > 100 Kb) > > tclkit wikit.kit -images clear wikit.tkd > clear the image cache > (does not compact the wikit datafile, but space willl be re-used > > Another major change is that a title-name cache was added - this > dramatically improves search performance and "rendering" speed of pages > with lots of cross-page links. It turns out that searching and > rendering were in fact already both quite good, but that all time was > lost in looking up page titles for each page reference (the price of > using quick-and-dirty linear MK searches, it's now hashed and instant). > > As a result you will see that the Tcl'ers Wiki has become quite snappy > in local mode, including searches and display of things like the > "Recent Changes" page. > > Please try and bang on this (in CVS and in > http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/wikit.kit). The improvements are such that > I really would like to switch the Tcl'ers Wiki to this new code ASAP. > > -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sun Oct 13 11:27:03 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9DGR2a30109; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 11:27:02 -0500 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 18:27:40 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Michael Hankinson" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Hankinson wrote: [... in response to several preceding posts ...] > I am having the same problem with the 5 second commit on a wrapped > version > of Tclhttpd on Debian Linux. I used the -writable flag and got a > Segmentation fault when I downloaded the first page. I wrapped again > with > -writable and -nocompress, everything appeared to run perfectly but any > changes I made and also any file I uploaded to the webserver were not > saved > to disk but appeared to be in memory. The starkit size didn't increase > at > all while the Tclhttpd starkit was running or when I exited. The crash was caused by a bug in the "rechan" package which is part of TclKit, as reported before. The latest builds resolved this, see /pub/tk/newer/CHANGES and tclkit CVS (src/rechan.c). I had some time to look into the "5 second flush" problem, but cannot reproduce it. Below is a small "flushtest.tcl" script I used (Linux, pub/tk/newer/linux-i686,gz build). Running this, and watching the "haha" test file in another window, I see consistent changes to the file within 5 secs each time, and no changes otherwise. Note that old versions of file contents *will* show up in the file dump - MK will re-use all free space after each commit. If you do find a case where flushes do not happen, please adjust the test script below and send it back along with the platform you are using - so I can reproduce this behavior. The only case where changes do not make it back to the disk, is with starkits not created with sdx's "-writable" flag. Note also that I've fixed sdx's help to document this properly. FYI, sdx is in sdarchive, which in turn points to http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/sdx.kit -jcw package require Tk vfs::mk4::Mount haha haha pack [button .b -text go -command write] set seq 100 proc write {} { set fd [open haha/abcdefgh_[incr ::seq] w] puts $fd [clock seconds] close $fd } From akupries@shaw.ca Sun Oct 13 13:23:36 2002 Received: from pd3mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9DINaa32254 for ; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 13:23:36 -0500 Received: from pd2mr3so.prod.shaw.ca (pd2mr3so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.108]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H3X00B4FMZNJF@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 12:21:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml10so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml10so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.80]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H3X0061IMZNS0@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 12:21:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluepeak (h24-78-89-27.vc.shawcable.net [24.78.89.27]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0H3X002UUMZMML@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 12:21:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from aku by bluepeak with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 180nGO-0000UI-00 for ; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 11:14:52 -0700 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 11:14:52 -0700 From: Andreas Kupries To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: <87adlinr37.fsf@bluepeak.home> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_aESW8VFCERUzLTNnTuERtQ)" User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 Lines: 55 Subject: [Starkit] [comp.lang.tcl] Tcl 8.4 & VFS and an interesting problem on Windows :-) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Boundary_(ID_aESW8VFCERUzLTNnTuERtQ) Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thought that this is of general interest to users of starkits/packs. --Boundary_(ID_aESW8VFCERUzLTNnTuERtQ) Content-type: message/rfc822 Path: bluepeak.shaw.ca!news2.calgary.shaw.ca!pd2nf2so.cg.shawcable.net!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!news-out.newsfeeds.com!propagator2-maxim!news-in.spamkiller.net!news.shlink.de!mango.news.easynet.net!easynet.net!proxad.net!isdnet!news.internetia.pl!newsfeed.tpinternet.pl!news.tpi.pl!not-for-mail X-Trace: news.tpi.pl 1034328204 12752 217.96.105.122 (11 Oct 2002 09:23:24 GMT) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 11:19:06 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan Subject: Tcl 8.4 & VFS and an interesting problem on Windows :-) Message-id: Organization: tp.internet - http://www.tpi.pl/ X-Complaints-to: usenet@tpi.pl MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT NNTP-posting-date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:23:24 +0000 (UTC) X-Accept-Language: pl, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 03:23:44 MDT (news2.calgary.shaw.ca) Newsgroups: comp.lang.tcl Lines: 26 NNTP-posting-host: hesus.nowiny.net Xref: bluepeak.shaw.ca comp.lang.tcl:140816 Hello. This one is weird and :-) I wanted to use tkMC to edit things wrapped in a starpack. So I pressed the edit button and then wanted to save it back - there only is "Save as" which pops up a tk_GetSaveFile requester. I mounted the archive at L:/, so I wrote L:\lib\something\pkgIndex.tcl - and got an error from the requester. This is quite interesting - if I mount something inside Tcl, then Windows requesters could cause problems. I fixed tkMC, but the problem may come back in the future. The only thing I came up with is that Windows requesters could have another button called 'Select using Tk request' or something similar - so when I want to save it to a file visible only to Tcl/Tk, I press the button and get the Tk requester I know from Unix. -- WK (written at Stardate 56778.4) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram --Boundary_(ID_aESW8VFCERUzLTNnTuERtQ) Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT -- Sincerely, Andreas Kupries Developer @ Private ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --Boundary_(ID_aESW8VFCERUzLTNnTuERtQ)-- From jcw@equi4.com Sun Oct 13 14:24:43 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9DJOga00686 for ; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 14:24:42 -0500 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:25:19 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <82D2665E-DEE1-11D6-8014-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] itk/iwidgets and self-updates fixed in kitten Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mea culpa. It turns out that the failure to load itk and iwidgets in kitten was not at all related to 3.2/3.3 version issues after all. It was simply a massively botched and half-baked attempt by yours truly to bring kitten's structure in line with starkit layouts, a few months back. Well, this should be fixed now - the updated starkit can be found at sdarchive and here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/kitten.kit Linux and Win32 should be ok, Solaris probably needs some more tweaking. The self-updating "feature" (kitten -u) was still not correct in the last release, but now that several bugs have been squashed in both kitten and tclkit, things work at last. Unfortunately, there's a chicken-and-egg issue here so you will have to first re-fetch kitten.kit in full before you get proper update capability - but after doing it once things should be ok. Long live "kitten -u"! My apologies for all the inconvenience this itk/iwidget failure has caused everyone. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sun Oct 13 14:55:18 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9DJtHa01229; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 14:55:17 -0500 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:55:54 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Kitten docs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Mike Doyle From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20021009215117.041718a8@mail.eolas.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mike Doyle wrote: > Has anyone compiled a set of docs, or at least links to docs, for the > 130 packages now included in Kitten.kit ? Don't think so. Excellent idea, IMO. We also probably need to point to licenses... Note that kitten now uses wikit as embedded help system. You can reach the contents by unwrapping, it's in kitten.vfs/doc/kitten.tkd - run "tclkit wikit.kit kitten.vfs/doc/kitten.tkd" to add pages, make changes, etc via local-mode Tk access, then wrap it up again. Keep in mind that "kitten -u" is blissfully ignorant of this, so an online upfate will "restore" the file... We could put a "master" copy of kitten.tkd on the web, and have everyone add to it :) I've refrained from doing this so far, because it may not lead to the best results if everyone starts adjusting pages in an ad-hoc manner, but I'll gladly put such a thing up if someone is willing to take charge and keep the general structure and content eh... focused, I guess. -jcw PS. I've updated the wikit package in kitten to the latest rev (to support images). From mhankyson@hotmail.com Sun Oct 13 23:55:20 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f111.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.111]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9E4tHa12971; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 23:55:17 -0500 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:55:41 -0700 Received: from 203.32.142.5 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 04:55:40 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.32.142.5] From: "Michael Hankinson" To: jcw@equi4.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack - how to? Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 14:55:40 +1000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_37c3_6ed7_4f27" Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Oct 2002 04:55:41.0645 (UTC) FILETIME=[F2612FD0:01C2733D] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_37c3_6ed7_4f27 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Hi all, >[... in response to several preceding posts ...] >>I am having the same problem with the 5 second commit on a wrapped version >>of Tclhttpd on Debian Linux. I used the -writable flag and got a >>Segmentation fault when I downloaded the first page. I wrapped again with >>-writable and -nocompress, everything appeared to run perfectly but any >>changes I made and also any file I uploaded to the webserver were not >>saved >>to disk but appeared to be in memory. The starkit size didn't increase at >>all while the Tclhttpd starkit was running or when I exited. > >The crash was caused by a bug in the "rechan" package which is part of >TclKit, as reported before. The latest builds resolved this, see >/pub/tk/newer/CHANGES and tclkit CVS (src/rechan.c). > The "rechan" fix has fixed my "segmentation fault" problem. Thanks! >I had some time to look into the "5 second flush" problem, but cannot >reproduce it. Below is a small "flushtest.tcl" script I used (Linux, >pub/tk/newer/linux-i686,gz build). > >Running this, and watching the "haha" test file in another window, I see >consistent changes to the file within 5 secs each time, and no changes >otherwise. Note that old versions of file contents *will* show up in the >file dump - MK will re-use all free space after each commit. > >If you do find a case where flushes do not happen, please adjust the test >script below and send it back along with the platform you are using - so I >can reproduce this behavior. > The 5 second commit problem still occurs. I don't run X on my Linux server therefore your test script will not work in my case (I think). I have attached a standard Tclhttpd starkit that has a file upload utility which saves files in a directory within the starkit. Click on the "Starkit File Upload" at the bottom of the main page. You can upload files and delete them. The file size of the starkit doesn't increase or the modify time change. If I kill the process the files I have uploaded are not saved. However if make the modification to mk4vfs.tcl in tclkit (line 264 if { $flush == 0 } { ) mentioned in my previous post everything is working as expected. Even the modification time on the starkit changes regardless if I upload a file or not. Regards Michael _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------=_NextPart_000_37c3_6ed7_4f27 Content-Type: text/plain; name="starweb.kit"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="starweb.kit" #!/bin/sh # \ exec tclkit "$0" ${1+"$@"} if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -nocommit }]} { set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" error $e } ################################################################JL     R‡æ!aùuYì%&¯§e3™†1.^åyR”µMe“L͈&Éÿ7·Õ,s.+ ü¢³´¼?2›0DZuUæ˳û.ɳá~SåXÎqr2Ñ„>WùìÈçâ¢p5í ?+ið)íR4»ªœ%WôæÆ%¿æ¥­—Ùa3‰‡—_öma†¹M\É‹JMÁÛŸhúaŒ3Ü›|¾þ¸<çQVÙ´ŽÇ=ã_îhö×2Sš³kæó²ªu謘„Q°G<‘«ŸÖ£2uûS“Ò2験Ïó‘©-oº}šç& ”u`nÉØšº©¬ÛÚ:R¢>ú·)QƒŽ¬³É£­èhy¹eÑY‹k&ëjÑhLPKgˆtÛW$)þ×Ñ@¦æÑæ¦f1‰ìsY-Â0C;.iU3›™ mibª²! _ùÙ¯sÆsIO 者s[ðÞÏ›ºC:*è1Ñi+"s¬ŸwÄšŠvKDóý¿ò`–V“N2YÍ»ì‰VsõËÍ-¶eæè´’ß²bT>:Pü£%†¬°±ù‚æY'Í<Œ$Ç9ÏæLÀr´ÃyU† Ùšä+SkF¶Ú–# 37•¡“ZÞáy^š‘LëSs:¦'OÜ5=üŽŽäB˜çK>Ø ²Ež¸àõàÍà0ºw˜û¼=¸sPØÇcâÛÜòÝiÕŒëpÿ ÈjX$0ú˜ ‘µçŸeÙ1«sÓÇ%~¸£¿y'ä_×4B½ü`6£çèª;Vv1óyž¥ ²ÿÔ/\Ÿ¶ôiÑ'n(I6Ž³IK"‡?þ"‘ÌæB$I ç˜c²ªnH±LKb^b¦1QŽ!ÏH1ÉI/[uˆƒh]´Rü¨ci75E’ôÐœô­Z… BªoÜäIÆŒ²HðÔï«“ÂÌèù<3Ngg =ZÒMÕàkëàÙ¹´a#(#L’VB:cL« Úõj’¸´Êæu–òn&*PË‚$4Ie¿ñÛÞñŽÐòÎ.ˆøÜͽ…0 ˲ƕ‰~’Êib$îIœv¼w´Eµ!uðXV÷´Ù‘X8xý’3bôÊu1î{k£“Ñ‚•7y¾±ÔJ’×o’O4ï`Ð95UAad“VÔ˜ºX?Wç¥5:ƒu´„eÿ*„ðè@Îd™~:ÛYæ˜<í9ëuz<š‚t^wis²'Ltû)_”÷¨è¼T©‰A^! 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Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Whoops, I manually let the previous post through the Mailman list manager - thinking it was 40+ Kb, but it was actually 400+ Kb that got sent over 60 times! I'm sorry, will look better next time... -jcw From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Mon Oct 14 02:38:37 2002 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9E7cZa17094; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 02:38:36 -0500 Received: from krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (root@krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.12]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9E7d2609014; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 17:39:02 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2002101417390216387 ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 17:39:02 +1000 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9E7d0r09010; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 17:39:00 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Kitten docs From: Steve Cassidy To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Mike Doyle , starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 14 Oct 2002 17:38:50 +1000 Message-Id: <1034581132.7953.260.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Mon, 2002-10-14 at 05:55, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Mike Doyle wrote: > > > Has anyone compiled a set of docs, or at least links to docs, for the > > 130 packages now included in Kitten.kit ? > > Don't think so. Excellent idea, IMO. We also probably need to point > to licenses... > > Note that kitten now uses wikit as embedded help system. Wonderful though wikit is, I think this is the wrong way to approach this problem. Most of these packages already have some kind of documentation and those that don't would benifit from it in general. If effort were to be put into generating documentation, it would be worthwhile doing it in a way that's useable both in the tclkit world and outside. Of course this is all related to the fact that there isn't a standard help format for Tcl and that different packages deliver help in different formats. However, what if starkits could let you view help written in AK's doctools format, this would be an incentive to deliver help this way. Then this effort could go into developing this format of documentation for various packages and everyone benifits. If all the packages in kitten (or any starkit) were TIP55 compliant they'd have a doc directory. All we need is a module which can index these directories and render the help when asked. Voila we have an automatically updated help system for Tcl! -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 14 03:05:42 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9E85fa18260 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 03:05:42 -0500 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:06:20 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Kitten docs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1034581132.7953.260.camel@climie> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: > On Mon, 2002-10-14 at 05:55, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >> Mike Doyle wrote: >> >>> Has anyone compiled a set of docs, or at least links to docs, for the >>> 130 packages now included in Kitten.kit ? >> >> Don't think so. Excellent idea, IMO. We also probably need to point >> to licenses... >> >> Note that kitten now uses wikit as embedded help system. > > Wonderful though wikit is, I think this is the wrong way to approach > this problem. Most of these packages already have some kind of > documentation and those that don't would benifit from it in general. Ah, sorry... yes please, let's support what there is. What I meant was the kitten help itself, the part which explains how to use kitten, how to take it further, and what is inside it. It's just a few pages, and it's in there right now. Note again that kitten is not a goal in itself, I'll be happy to see it get subsumed by new initiatives such as sdarchive and cantcl. > All we need is a module which can index these directories and > render the help when asked. Voila we have an automatically > updated help system for Tcl! AFAIK, Andreas can (or will soon) generate wiki markup *from* doctools. At which point wikit can be that tool, both in local mode Tk and for web CGI use. No need to use it if you prefer other solutions - but it's there and works on all platforms today. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Oct 14 07:35:06 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9ECZ6a31348 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 07:35:06 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9ECZRqT025393; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:35:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9ECZRj07246; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:35:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:35:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden, x2487" Message-Id: <10210140835.AA7245@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] : comp.lang.tcl: Frusterated with Starkit !!!! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Path: news.cas.org!odin.oar.net!malgudi.oar.net!news.cis.ohio-state.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed.news.qwest.net!news.uswest.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Mel" Newsgroups: comp.lang.tcl Subject: Frusterated with Starkit !!!! Lines: 12 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4920.2300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4920.2300 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 05:08:18 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 67.40.211.12 X-Trace: news.uswest.net 1034413592 67.40.211.12 (Sat, 12 Oct 2002 04:06:32 CDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 04:06:32 CDT Xref: news.cas.org comp.lang.tcl:199080 can someone please send me a kit that uses: Incr Tcl Iwidgets Itk (does not work in kitten !) + Bonus BLT? and i will be his slave for the longest :-) Yours, Mel -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 14 09:13:25 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EEDOa04596 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 09:13:24 -0500 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 16:14:05 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <3251C6B9-DF7F-11D6-BF7F-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] win9x crash-on-exit (fixed?) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The spurious crash-on-exit of tclkit in Win9x has finally become reproducible, at least on my Win98se setup. As far as I have been able to determine, it's all due to encodings being used during exit handling at a time when they are no longer valid. Encoding files live in VFS, and at some point that machinery gets shut down. The problem did not show up on NT4. It also did not show up if I leave the system encoding set to "identity", instead of switching to cp1252 (on my Win98se setup). The current workaround is a change in tcl's generic/tclEvent.c to not call encodings cleanup, i.e. TclFinalizeEncodingSubsystem. It passes all my tests and is fully consistent - I would appreciate it if you can run the latest build on your machine and report how things go. See the win32*.* files in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ as always. If this works for everyone, then this closes the last big hole in tclkit I am currently aware of. One which has been playing tricks for over a year, btw. -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Mon Oct 14 09:23:39 2002 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EENda05318 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 09:23:39 -0500 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 18168e-0007as-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 15:24:08 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20021014152028.026c3218@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 15:24:04 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] win9x crash-on-exit (fixed?) In-Reply-To: <3251C6B9-DF7F-11D6-BF7F-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 04:14 PM 10/14/2002 +0200, you wrote: >The spurious crash-on-exit of tclkit in Win9x has finally become >reproducible, at least on my Win98se setup. As far as I have been able to >determine, it's all due to encodings being used during exit handling at a >time when they are no longer valid. I think, though, once encodings are loaded, they don't need to exist on disk, so, the correct close-down sequence should be: shut-down vfs (can make use of whatever encodings it wants) shut-down encodings (doesn't need to access disk at all, this is just in-memory cleanup) this is, of course, the opposite of what was in Tcl.... >Encoding files live in VFS, and at some point that machinery gets shut >down. I don't think that matters at all. The problem seems to be the other way around. The encoding machinery is shut-down, and vfs still needs it. cheers, Vince. From akupries@shaw.ca Mon Oct 14 09:36:08 2002 Received: from pd5mo1so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EEa8a06184 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 09:36:08 -0500 Received: from pd5mr4so.prod.shaw.ca (pd5mr4so-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.168]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H3Z006MT78W4Q@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:36:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml4so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml4so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.148]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H3Z001CI78W8Q@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:36:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluepeak (h24-78-89-27.vc.shawcable.net [24.78.89.27]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0H3Z0066G78VX8@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:36:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1816Co-0002lJ-00; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 07:28:26 -0700 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 07:28:25 -0700 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Kitten docs In-reply-to: Message from Jean-Claude Wippler "of Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:06:20 +0200." To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > What I meant was the kitten help itself, the part which explains how to > use kitten, how to take it further, and what is inside it. It's just a > few pages, and it's in there right now. Note again that kitten is not > a goal in itself, I'll be happy to see it get subsumed by new > initiatives such as sdarchive and cantcl. > > > All we need is a module which can index these directories and > > render the help when asked. Voila we have an automatically > > updated help system for Tcl! > > AFAIK, Andreas can (or will soon) generate wiki markup *from* doctools. The code to generate wiki markup from doctools format is available from the CVS head of tcllib. > At which point wikit can be that tool, both in local mode Tk and for > web CGI use. No need to use it if you prefer other solutions - but > it's there and works on all platforms today. -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Oct 14 09:49:24 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EEnNa07087 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 09:49:23 -0500 Received: from srv13.cas.org (srv13 [134.243.65.81]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9EEnkqT018446 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:49:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by srv13.cas.org (8.8.8+Sun/m4_8.8.8/CAS_CLIENT-1.16) id KAA22986; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:49:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:49:46 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021014104946.AAB17424@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <82D2665E-DEE1-11D6-8014-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:25:19 +0200 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] Question about kitten [Was: Re: itk/iwidgets and self-updates fixed in kitten Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, I was wondering about some things in kitten.kit 1. how does kitten.vfs/lib/md5.tcl get used? There doesn't appear to be a corresponding kitten.vfs/lib/pkgIndex.tcl to do the loading. 2. In regards to : kitten.vfs/lib/ libClass1.0.so libexpat2.0.so libtclxml2.0.so libExtral2.0.so libtclexpat2.0.so the paper Steve wrote on Tclkit and starkit, in section 4.4 (Multi-platform binary extensions) seemed to suggest a directory layout of kitten.vfs/lib/ Class/ Linux/ libClass.so Extral/ Linux/ libExtral.so expat/ Linux/ libexpat.so tclexpat/ Linux/ libtclexpat.so 3. I was wondering about the future of kitten. I mean, do we want Solaris, Linux, and Windows binary libraries for all the included extensions? The file might triple in size... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Oct 14 09:55:47 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EEtka07508 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 09:55:46 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9EEu7qT022879 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:56:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9EEu7G08735; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:56:07 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:56:07 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021014105607.AAB8707@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Kitten docs In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 14 Oct 2002 07:28:25 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Andreas Kupries > The code to generate wiki markup from doctools format is available > from the CVS head of tcllib. Okay, wait. Does this mean that with a few more tools, kitten.kit could generate a wikit.tkd file that would include the 'man pages' for all the doctools format docs included in the package? That would be neat! A lot of work... Andreas, what are the current hurdles preventing the Tcl core software using doctools format files as the authority for documentation? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 14 10:06:56 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EF6ua08194 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:06:56 -0500 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 17:07:37 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question about kitten [Was: Re: itk/iwidgets and self-updates fixed in kitten Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021014104946.AAB17424@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > 1. how does kitten.vfs/lib/md5.tcl get used? There doesn't appear > to be a corresponding kitten.vfs/lib/pkgIndex.tcl to do the loading. Hack - sourced from kitten.vfs/main.tcl, when doing "kitten -u". Same for httpdist.tcl. In fact, md5.tcl is also in there as part of tcllib. > 2. In regards to : > > kitten.vfs/lib/ > libClass1.0.so libexpat2.0.so libtclxml2.0.so > libExtral2.0.so libtclexpat2.0.so Not yet converted. > kitten.vfs/lib/ > Class/ > Linux/ > libClass.so [etc] Correct, ultimately all packages need to end up this way. Internal structure is their own affair, though I would hope something like the above becomes the convention. > 3. I was wondering about the future of kitten. I mean, do we want > Solaris, Linux, and Windows binary libraries for all the included > extensions? The file might triple in size... No comment :) Seriously - as I said, kitten is there now, the recent changes were just to set a silly mistake straight (and getting rid of the arch/ hierarchy was a good side-effect). Splitting things up would just add to my workload. For now, I have no plans to spend any more time on kitten - the longer term goal has to be in the direction of repositories and good package distribution and maintenance practices. Even the self-update capability of kitten is disposable as far as I'm concerned, it just keeps us moving. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Oct 14 10:10:38 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EFAba08450 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:10:37 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9EFB0qT028454 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 11:11:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9EFB0L09068; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 11:11:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 11:11:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021014111100.AAB9046@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question about kitten [Was: Re: itk/iwidgets and self-updates fixed in kitten In-Reply-To: of Mon, 14 Oct 2002 17:07:37 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks. I was just wondering whether it was me spending time trying to fill in the gaps or to move ahead with other projects. I think that becoming involved with the repository work is more important as well. Your answers helped me make that decision. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From andreask@ActiveState.com Mon Oct 14 10:23:51 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9EFNpa09135 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 10:23:51 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id g9EFO6Rd029432; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:24:06 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9EFO5K02361; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:24:05 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Larry W. Virden" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Kitten docs Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 08:24:06 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <20021014105607.AAB8707@cas.org> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 X-Filtered-By: PerlMx makes it fast and easy. See http://www.ActiveState.com/Products/PerlMx/Header Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Larry W. Virden > Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 7:56 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Kitten docs > > > > From: Andreas Kupries > > > The code to generate wiki markup from doctools format is available > > from the CVS head of tcllib. > > Okay, wait. > > Does this mean that with a few more tools, kitten.kit could generate a > wikit.tkd file that would include the 'man pages' for all the doctools > format docs included in the package? That would be neat! A lot of > work... Yes, within reason. Like that wiki does not support nested lists [1], and doctools does. > Andreas, what are the current hurdles preventing the Tcl core software > using doctools format files as the authority for documentation? doctools is part of tcllib and relies on the textutil::expander module of tcllib. Usage of doctools for the core docs thus implies: * Distribution of tcllib with the tcl core (like for dde and registry) This might be very controversial. * A big effort to convert the existing manpages to doctools. (Possibly semi-automatic: nroff -> TMML (Joe English's work), and then TMML -> doctools. The latter converter does not exist, yet) [1] Yet :) -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From gay@sfu.ca Tue Oct 15 11:51:10 2002 Received: from rm-rstar.sfu.ca (root@rm-rstar.sfu.ca [142.58.120.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9FGp9a23705 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 11:51:09 -0500 Received: from ian.chem.sfu.ca (ian.chem.sfu.ca [142.58.209.2]) by rm-rstar.sfu.ca (8.12.5/8.12.5/SFU-5.0H) with SMTP id g9FGpcZ7012800 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:51:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.20021015092032.3e0f67d2@mailserver.sfu.ca> X-Sender: gay@mailserver.sfu.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:20:32 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Ian Gay Subject: [Starkit] win9x crash-on-exit (fixed?) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Yes! The Oct. 14 version passes all my crash tests. (On 98 - haven't tried 95 & ME yet) Thanks, J.-C.! Ian From wliao@generationec.com Tue Oct 15 17:12:41 2002 Received: from mail2.intermedia.net (mail2.intermedia.net [206.40.48.152]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9FMCfa13820 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:12:41 -0500 Received: from generationec.com (unverified [12.28.84.131]) by mail2.intermedia.net (Rockliffe SMTPRA 4.5.4) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 15:13:11 -0700 Received: by generationec.com (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:13:18 -0500 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:13:18 -0500 From: Wenchi Liao To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <20021015221317.GA2096@generationec.com> Mail-Followup-To: starkit@equi4.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Subject: [Starkit] tclkit dumps core on netbsd/alpha Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, all. There seems to be something wrong with the tclkit for netbsd/alpha. The version info is at the very end; I'm using the build from equi4.com. I saw this behavior with the previous release (pre ::vfs::tclkit_version) from equi4.com and one I built by hand. I haven't had a chance to build the most recent release by hand. Using the sdx.kit, I can interact with other kits: $ sdx lsk wikit.kit wikit.kit: 2411 02/10/14 22:55 ChangeLog 601 02/10/14 17:55 README dir doc/ dir lib/ 70 02/07/11 16:15 main.tcl [blah...] $ sdx unwrap wikit.kit 32 updates applied However, I can't seem to wrap anything. $ sdx wrap wikit.kit Memory fault (core dumped) The generated file just has the intro bits; $ cat wikit.kit #!/bin/sh # \ exec tclkit "$0" ${1+"$@"} if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -readonly }]} { set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" error $e } ################################################################$ I've placed the core file at http://wliao.freeshell.org/tclkit.core.gz if anybody wants to take a look. Running bt is the extent of my gdb skills, and tclkit seems to be stripped of symbols. WL % puts $tcl_patchLevel 8.4b1 % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version 200209 From jcw@equi4.com Wed Oct 16 05:42:22 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9GAgLa14105 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 05:42:21 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 12:42:54 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit / Starpack (solved?) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <070F54BC-E0F4-11D6-A0BD-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Hankinson wrote: > The 5 second commit problem still occurs Afte a private email exchange with Michael, we've at last figured it out... Short version: get the latest linux/win32 build from pub/tk/newer/ - it now works. Long version: it was indeed a bug in the mk4vfs.tcl logic. The new default of sdx to readonly starkits was also a change to "-nocommit" mode when using the "-writeable" flag. Then, upon the first file write, the autocommit mode gets set. What I forgot to do was launch the periodic commit timer as well. Hence "vfs::mk4::Mount haha haha" worked fine, but "vfs::mk4::Mount haha haha -nocommit" did not, as the new starkits did. I now realize that the change to mk4vfs is not yet complete, it must also start commit processing when a dir change is made, or a file is renamed/deleted. These changes will be in the next round of tclkit builds, and in CVS, as always. -jcw PS. Note that the VFS in a starkit *can* be modified, even when opened read-only. All "readonly" means in this context, is that the changes will not be committed to file. This may seem bizarre, but it's in fact useful in MetaKit - it allows you to make changes, even restructure a datafile, and have the code see the changed data (even with datafiles on a CD-ROM). One use for this is to read a datafile with an obsolete structure, converting it to the latest structure during open, and then running the rest of the app without having to deal with several datafile versions. You cannot commit back to the original file, but you *can* serialize the data to another file (in Tcl: "mk::file save db $fd"). From Bernd.Platzdasch@gmx.de Wed Oct 16 09:44:59 2002 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9GEiwa28337 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:44:59 -0500 Received: (qmail 16889 invoked by uid 0); 16 Oct 2002 14:45:23 -0000 Received: from a4956.pppool.de (HELO sisyphos) (213.6.73.86) by mail.gmx.net (mp001-rz3) with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 14:45:23 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Bernd Platzdasch To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:45:27 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200210161621.50932.Bernd.Platzdasch@gmx.de> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g9GEiwa28337 Subject: [Starkit] german umlaute Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I 've downloaded tclkit-linux-x86 and some starkits. Why are the German umlaute keys in all kits dead? I'am under SuSE 7.3/8.1. Bernd From lvirden@cas.org Wed Oct 16 09:50:25 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9GEoPa28772 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:50:25 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9GEomqT012265 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:50:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9GEom109280; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:50:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:50:48 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021016105048.AAB9258@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] german umlaute In-Reply-To: <200210161621.50932.Bernd.Platzdasch@gmx.de> of Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:45:27 +0200 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hmm - I don't know. I can get some special characters with my SPARC Solaris tclkit that I built myself. Hoever, I don't know the keysequence on a US keyboard (compose + something + letter) to get an umlaute. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mhankyson@hotmail.com Thu Oct 17 00:47:00 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f249.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9H5l0a23844 for ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 00:47:00 -0500 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:47:27 -0700 Received: from 203.32.142.5 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 05:47:26 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.32.142.5] From: "Michael Hankinson" To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 15:47:26 +1000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Oct 2002 05:47:27.0143 (UTC) FILETIME=[ACA3D370:01C275A0] Subject: [Starkit] -writable Starkit file size Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I have a -writable Tclhttpd Starkit with a file upload utility that allows me to upload and delete files, via a web interface, to a directory INSIDE the starkit. The original size of the starkit was about 900KB. I uploaded a 26.5MB file and the starkit increased to about 28MB. I then deleted the 26.5MB file in the starkit but the file size of the starkit remained at 28MB. I stopped the web server and restarted but the file size remained at 28MB. I uploaded a 5MB and then an 11MB file but the file size of the starkit remained at 28MB. I then uploaded the 26.5MB file again. Now I had 5MB, 11MB and 26.5MB files inside the starkit and the starkit file size increased to about 55MB. I deleted the 11MB and 26.5MB files but the starkit size stayed at 55MB. Are -writable Starkits meant to increase and decrease in size as conditions change or do they, as I am observing, "remember" their largest file size and stay at that size? Regards Michael _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 21 05:16:48 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9LAGla03221 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:16:48 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 12:17:37 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] german umlaute Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200210161621.50932.Bernd.Platzdasch@gmx.de> Message-Id: <5276B582-E4DE-11D6-8FCC-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bernd Platzdasch wrote: > I 've downloaded tclkit-linux-x86 and some starkits. Why are the > German > umlaute keys in all kits dead? I'am under SuSE 7.3/8.1. I don't know - I noticed the same, i.e. being unable to enter "special" characters. But given that the wiki shows them, my hunch is that it has to do with the input side of things (X11), not TclKit itself (for the same reason, it does not look like an encoding issue - iso8859-1 has special chars). All suggestions welcome... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 21 05:28:27 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9LASQa03724; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:28:27 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 12:29:16 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] -writable Starkit file size Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Michael Hankinson" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Hankinson wrote: > I have a -writable Tclhttpd Starkit with a file upload utility that > allows me to upload and delete files, via a web interface, to a > directory INSIDE the starkit. The original size of the starkit was > about 900KB. > > I uploaded a 26.5MB file and the starkit increased to about 28MB. I > then deleted the 26.5MB file in the starkit but the file size of the > starkit remained at 28MB. I stopped the web server and restarted but > the file size remained at 28MB. I uploaded a 5MB and then an 11MB file > but the file size of the starkit remained at 28MB. I then uploaded the > 26.5MB file again. Now I had 5MB, 11MB and 26.5MB files inside the > starkit and the starkit file size increased to about 55MB. I deleted > the 11MB and 26.5MB files but the starkit size stayed at 55MB. > > Are -writable Starkits meant to increase and decrease in size as > conditions change or do they, as I am observing, "remember" their > largest file size and stay at that size? Underneath starkits is MetaKit, a transacted database. It needs extra space to deal with recovery (for the curious: it uses a technique called "stable storage"). That means it is possible for MK datafiles to grow up to roughly twice the size of the underlying raw data. Then again, this compares very favorably against most other database systems. Extra space use is unavoidable to achieve transaction/fail-safe behavior, but the good news is of course that free space gets re-used, so the file really won't grow much further after this. There is no "compaction" logic in MK (yet). If you want to reduce a starkit to minimal size, the simplest way is to sdx-unwrap and sdx-wrap again. The same logic can be accomplished in Tcl with "mk::file save" at a lower level, but it needs some extra logic to make sure the starkit file header is kept intact (untested code): set ifd [open orig.kit] set ofd [open new.kit w] fconfigure $ifd -translation binary fconfigure $ofd -translation binary puts -nonewline $ofd [read $ifd 256] close $ifd mk::file open idb orig.kit -readonly mk::file save idb $ofd close $ofd mk::file close idb file rename -force new.kit orig.kit -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Oct 21 05:30:19 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9LAUIa03844 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:30:18 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9LAUkqT009202 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:30:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9LAUlV12437; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:30:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:30:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021021063046.AAB12338@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] german umlaute In-Reply-To: <5276B582-E4DE-11D6-8FCC-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Mon, 21 Oct 2002 12:17:37 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > But given that the wiki shows them, my hunch is that it > has to do with the input side of things (X11), not TclKit itself (for > the same reason, it does not look like an encoding issue - iso8859-1 > has special chars). I wonder if it is platform specific. Is é another of the keys you are finding you cannot input? I don't know the compose sequence for an umlaute. But I know that I can start up tclkit, press the keys for é, and the right character is shown at the tclkit prompt. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@digital-smarties.com Mon Oct 21 05:33:45 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9LAXha04022 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:33:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 23235 invoked by uid 8); 21 Oct 2002 10:34:15 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdiprwIo; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:34:06 EDT From: "Steve Landers" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] german umlaute Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 18:34:03 +0800 Message-Id: <20021021103403.14111@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20021021063046.AAB12338@cas.org> References: <20021021063046.AAB12338@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g9LAXha04022 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, >I wonder if it is platform specific. Is é another of the keys you >are finding you cannot input? I don't know the compose sequence for >an umlaute. But I know that I can start up tclkit, press the keys for >é, and the right character is shown at the tclkit prompt. On Solaris? Solaris uses dynamically linked X11, whereas most other Unices have statically linked X11. I wonder if this is the difference Steve From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 21 05:43:12 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9LAhCa04583 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:43:12 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 12:44:01 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] german umlaute Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" In-Reply-To: <20021021103403.14111@mail.digital-smarties.com> Message-Id: <02ADBAA6-E4E2-11D6-8FCC-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id g9LAhCa04583 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Landers wrote: [Larry Virden] >> I wonder if it is platform specific. Is é another of the keys you >> are finding you cannot input? I don't know the compose sequence for >> an umlaute. But I know that I can start up tclkit, press the keys for >> é, and the right character is shown at the tclkit prompt. > > On Solaris? > > Solaris uses dynamically linked X11, whereas most other Unices have > statically linked X11. I wonder if this is the difference Hm, that ought to be easy to verify... I've placed a static-linked linux build here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/linux-i686.gz And a build with X11 dynlinked (i.e. tk as loadable extension) here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/linux-i686-dyn.gz Please compare and see whether there is a difference w.r.t. special chars (or any other, for that matter). -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Oct 21 05:43:29 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9LAhSa04599 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:43:28 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9LAhuqT012392 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:43:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9LAhvh12781; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:43:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 06:43:57 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021021064356.AAB12772@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] german umlaute In-Reply-To: <20021021103403.14111@mail.digital-smarties.com> of Mon, 21 Oct 2002 18:34:03 +0800 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sorry - yes, I'm using Solaris SPARC. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Oct 22 10:06:35 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9MF6Ta06816 for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 10:06:35 -0500 Received: (qmail 38606 invoked by uid 0); 22 Oct 2002 15:19:45 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 15:19:45 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA26028; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 11:06:42 -0400 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g9MF6fh20174; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 11:06:41 -0400 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200210221506.g9MF6fh20174@clif.cflynt.com> To: lvirden@cas.org (Larry W. Virden) Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 11:06:41 -0400 (EDT) Cc: starkit@equi4.com (Starkit list) In-Reply-To: from "Larry W. Virden" at Oct 21, 2002 06:43:57 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Auto-starting CD-Rom Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, Part of getting the CD-ROM for the book ready is making it 'user friendly', and able to automaticly start on a variety of platforms. I've learned (and here report) how to make an autorun file to kick off a tclkit on Windows and Linux/Gnome (I think this also works with KDE). If anyone has hints for other OSs (Mac, Solaris, HP-UX, etc), I'll be happy to hear them. WINDOWS: The file is autorun.inf. Contents: There's a lot of custom commands, but the important one is OPEN, which starts a program. This autorun.inf will run a tclkit and kick off the octabug demo. type autorun.inf [autorun] OPEN=tclkits\tclkit-win32.exe tclkits\octabug.kit LINUX/GNOME The file is autorun Contents: A simple shell script. NOTE: Must have +x on autorun, and target executable files. Here's the equivalent for Linux/Gnome. cat autorun #!/bin/sh # # Autorun script for Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide # if [ -d /mnt/cdrom ]; then cd /mnt/cdrom fi tclkits/tclkit-linux-x86 tclkits/octabug.kit .... Happy Tcl'ing, Clif ........................... Clif Flynt .......................... ... Tcl/Tk for Real Programmers - Academic Press Professional ... .... http://www.cflynt.com ............ clif@cflynt.com .... . In theory there is no difference between theory and practice . ........................ In practice, there is. ................. From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Tue Oct 22 14:39:39 2002 Received: from frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.20.107]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9MJdca24932 for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 14:39:39 -0500 Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g9MJdWHD008749; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 05:39:33 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 05:39:31 +1000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Auto-starting CD-Rom Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: lvirden@cas.org (Larry W. Virden), starkit@equi4.com (Starkit list) To: Clif Flynt From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <200210221506.g9MF6fh20174@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, On Wednesday, Oct 23, 2002, at 01:06 Australia/Sydney, Clif Flynt wrote: > If anyone has hints for other OSs (Mac, Solaris, HP-UX, etc), I'll be > happy to hear them. I know MacOS can do this as well if you add a HFS filesystem to the CD (can be in addition to others already there i.e. hybrid). The filesystem has a field that gives the name of the file to open at startup and the MacOS version of "Roxio Toast" has an option to set that field. probably you'd need a macos tclkit that sources the appropriate file by default since you can't give any arguments. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now to something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From lvirden@cas.org Wed Oct 23 09:24:50 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9NEOoa01421 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 09:24:50 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9NEPJqT012579 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 10:25:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9NEPJN19524; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 10:25:19 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 10:25:19 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021023102519.AAB19508@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] genkit broken on solaris Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I downloaded the latest genkit and tar files, but find that genkit no longer works - the invocations of hostname -s cause Solaris hostname to fail thinking that you are wanting the local hostname changed to the name "-s" (sure hope no one is running this stuff as root!) -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 24 08:14:28 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9ODERa27822 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:14:28 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 15:15:25 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] genkit broken on solaris Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021023102519.AAB19508@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I downloaded the latest genkit and tar files, but find that genkit no > longer works - the invocations of > hostname -s > cause Solaris hostname to fail [...] Whoops - I've undone this change, and solved things another way. Thanks for letting me know. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 24 09:54:14 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9OEsCa03034 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 09:54:13 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9OEseqT002692 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:54:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9OEse602790; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:54:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:54:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021024105439.AAB2781@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] sdx.kit unwrap query Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone investigated what it would take for the sdx.kit unwrap operation to set the dates and times of the unwrapped files to the values they have within the starkit? My idea is this - by setting the flatfile attributes (permission modes, date/time, perhaps other things) then one can do an unwrap, take a look at the authority source to see what parts of the directory structure have chnaged, and know what to update. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Oct 24 10:22:05 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9OFM4a05109 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:22:04 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id g9OFMR9O021264; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:22:27 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9OFMRK26353; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:22:27 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Larry W. Virden" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] sdx.kit unwrap query Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:22:27 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <20021024105439.AAB2781@cas.org> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: AFAIK the metakit VFS does not store any attributes beyond the file/directory distinction (and the name of course). I.e. no permissions, not dates, etc. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Larry W. Virden > Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 7:55 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] sdx.kit unwrap query > > > Has anyone investigated what it would take for the sdx.kit unwrap > operation to set the dates and times of the unwrapped files to the values > they have within the starkit? > > My idea is this - by setting the flatfile attributes (permission modes, > date/time, perhaps other things) then one can do an unwrap, take a look > at the authority source to see what parts of the directory structure > have chnaged, and know what to update. > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden http://www.purl.org/NET/lvirden/> > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > -><- > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 24 10:24:00 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9OFNxa05238 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:23:59 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9OFOTqT013384 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:24:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9OFOSY03324; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:24:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:24:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021024112428.AAB3288@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx.kit unwrap query In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:22:27 -0700 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Andreas Kupries" > AFAIK the metakit VFS does not store any attributes beyond the > file/directory distinction (and the name of course). I.e. no > permissions, not dates, etc. Weird - how does this (look at date/time info) happen then? $ sdx.kit lsk /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit: 2569 02/10/21 11:53 ChangeLog 601 02/10/21 11:53 README dir doc/ dir lib/ 67 02/07/11 17:14 main.tcl /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/doc: 12223 02/10/21 11:53 wikidoc.tkd /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/lib: dir app-wikit/ dir autoscroll/ dir cgi/ dir gbutton/ dir wikit/ /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/lib/app-wikit: 72 02/05/28 03:54 pkgIndex.tcl 2253 02/10/22 20:54 start.tcl /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/lib/autoscroll: 4657 02/05/17 07:53 autoscroll.tcl 78 02/05/17 07:53 pkgIndex.tcl /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/lib/cgi: 65955 02/06/13 06:02 cgi.tcl 532 02/05/17 07:53 pkgIndex.tcl /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/lib/gbutton: 830 02/10/21 11:53 disabled.gif 1126 02/10/21 11:53 down.gif 6723 02/05/28 06:29 gbutton.tcl 72 02/05/28 06:29 pkgIndex.tcl 871 02/10/21 11:53 up.gif /ldatae/bin/wikit.kit/lib/wikit: 27617 02/10/21 10:50 format.tcl 14778 02/10/14 12:27 gui.tcl 5689 02/10/22 21:53 modify.tcl 461 02/10/22 20:53 pkgIndex.tcl 12496 02/10/21 06:03 utils.tcl 11056 02/10/21 11:15 web.tcl 686 02/07/10 15:01 wikit.tcl -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 24 10:31:26 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9OFVPa05828 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:31:26 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 17:32:25 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx.kit unwrap query Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas Kupries wrote: > AFAIK the metakit VFS does not store any attributes beyond the > file/directory distinction (and the name of course). I.e. no > permissions, not dates, etc. Close... Dates yes. Permissions no (there is no uniform permission model across platforms). (Note that given MK's on-the fly datafile restructuring feature, we could still add one after the fact - i.e. if we did, current starkits would still work - the issue here is theory... not practice) But dates are in there (for files, not for dirs). There's in fact logic in sdx somehere to sync changes. -jcw From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Thu Oct 24 21:55:57 2002 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9P2tua25133 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:55:56 -0500 Received: from krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (root@krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.12]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9P2uWe27837 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:56:32 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2002102512563113493 ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:56:31 +1000 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9P2uUE27833; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:56:31 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Auto-starting CD-Rom From: Steve Cassidy To: Clif Flynt Cc: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <200210221506.g9MF6fh20174@clif.cflynt.com> References: <200210221506.g9MF6fh20174@clif.cflynt.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 25 Oct 2002 12:55:46 +1000 Message-Id: <1035514547.23707.82.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wed, 2002-10-23 at 01:06, Clif Flynt wrote: > Hi, > Part of getting the CD-ROM for the book ready is making it 'user friendly', > and able to automaticly start on a variety of platforms. > LINUX/GNOME > #!/bin/sh > # > # Autorun script for Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide > # > > > if [ -d /mnt/cdrom ]; then > cd /mnt/cdrom > fi > > tclkits/tclkit-linux-x86 tclkits/octabug.kit Note that on debian linux systems the default mount point for the cdrom is /cdrom so you can't rely on the above working. Surely though it should work with relative path names, is the cd /mnt/cdrom ever needed? -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at Fri Oct 25 07:53:48 2002 Received: from ws01is01.highway.telekom.at (WS01IS01.highway.telekom.at [195.3.96.67]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9PCrla26197 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 07:53:48 -0500 Received: from b52.b.ssg.co.at (L0441P17.dipool.highway.telekom.at [62.46.119.17]) by ws01is01.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA41432; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 14:46:51 +0200 From: engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at Received: by b52.b.ssg.co.at (Sendmail (8.8.8) RTSX11/3, from userid 510) id 1000BD2EE; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 14:34:46 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by b52.b.ssg.co.at (Sendmail (8.8.8) RTSX11/3) with ESMTP id 05DF6D0DD; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 14:34:46 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 14:34:45 +0200 (CEST) X-X-Sender: To: Steve Cassidy Cc: Clif Flynt , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Auto-starting CD-Rom In-Reply-To: <1035514547.23707.82.camel@climie> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On 25 Oct 2002, Steve Cassidy wrote: > On Wed, 2002-10-23 at 01:06, Clif Flynt wrote: > > Hi, > > Part of getting the CD-ROM for the book ready is making it 'user friendly', > > and able to automaticly start on a variety of platforms. > > > LINUX/GNOME > > > #!/bin/sh > > # > > # Autorun script for Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide > > # > > > > > > if [ -d /mnt/cdrom ]; then > > cd /mnt/cdrom > > fi > > > > tclkits/tclkit-linux-x86 tclkits/octabug.kit > > > Note that on debian linux systems the default mount point for the cdrom > is /cdrom so you can't rely on the above working. Surely though it > should work with relative path names, is the cd /mnt/cdrom ever needed? on newer SuSEs it is /media/cdrom -- BINGO: be careful of mafia, the swindlers, the tour manager ... --- Engelbert Gruber -------+ SSG Fintl,Gruber,Lassnig / A6410 Telfs Untermarkt 9 / Tel. ++43-5262-64727 ----+ From marco.lovadina@iol.it Sun Oct 27 15:30:27 2002 Received: from smtp3.libero.it (smtp3.libero.it [193.70.192.127]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9RLUQa05841 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:30:26 -0600 Received: from Marco (151.29.210.54) by smtp3.libero.it (6.5.028) id 3DBAF12400075FF7 for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 22:31:00 +0100 Message-ID: <000b01c27e00$75ecfb00$36d21d97@Marco> From: "Marco Lovadina" To: Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 22:32:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] troubles in creating a starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm trying to pack a simple application using a Metakit database into a starkit, but there's something that doesn't work as I wish and I can't find the solution to my problem. I wrote a main.tcl file which I put in the test.vfs directory. I tested it with tclkit test.vfs\main.tcl and it behave as I wish. Then I create the starkit with "sdx wrap test". This command create either the test starkit and the test.bat file. Launching the batch file, results in the following error message: "file open failed while executing mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] (file "test/main.tcl" line 23). Is there anything I did that's wrong? (excluding the fact that I use Windows 2000 and other MS products!) Here is the content of file main.tcl: proc createDb {} { set pat [file dirname [info script]] mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] mk::view layout db.table {id field} mk::file close db } proc saveField {p} { global db puts [subst {mk::set db.table!$p id "id$p" field "field n° $p"}] mk::set db.table!$p id "id$p" field "field n° $p" } if {![file exists [file join [file dirname [info script]] database.db]]} { tk_messageBox -message "Create db" createDb} set pat [file dirname [info script]] mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] for {set i 0} {$i<=20} {incr i} { saveField $i} set mess "" for {set i 0} {$i<=20} {incr i} { set mess [concat $mess [mk::get db.table!$i]] } tk_messageBox -message $mess mk::file close db From jcw@equi4.com Sun Oct 27 16:18:40 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9RMIda06792 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 16:18:39 -0600 Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:19:19 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] troubles in creating a starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000b01c27e00$75ecfb00$36d21d97@Marco> Message-Id: <23423740-E9FA-11D6-AF3E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Marco Lovadina wrote: > I wrote a main.tcl file which I put in the test.vfs directory. I > tested it > with tclkit test.vfs\main.tcl and it behave as I wish. Ok. You are creating/using a MK datafile. > Then I create the starkit with "sdx wrap test". This command create > either > the test starkit and the test.bat file. > Launching the batch file, results in the following error message: > "file open failed while executing mk::file open db [file join $pat > database.db] (file "test/main.tcl" line 23). Now, you are creating/using a MK datafile inside a starkit. This is not supported. There is a way to load/dump a MK datafile from/to a file inside a starkit (the wikit help system does this), but you cannot open a MK datafile *inside* a starkit, which is itself again a database. > set pat [file dirname [info script]] > mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] That is inside the VFS area, i.e. next to this script inside test.vfs/. I suspect that this is not what you want. You can create a MK datafile *next* to the starkit, by changing to: set pat [file dirname $starkit::topdir] mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] > if {![file exists [file join [file dirname [info script]] > database.db]]} { > tk_messageBox -message "Create db" [...] Note that MK creates a file when there wasn't one, so extra logic to create it is usually not needed. Your code will work, but you could also simplify it to: mk::file open db ... mk::view layout ... In other words, first-time creation need not be a special case. (FWIW, the limitation of a MK datafile not being allowed inside VFS is not a hard one, in fact an older version of the Mk4tcl extension did support it, even though there is some complexity involved - but I broke it and never bothered to restore this capability...) -jcw From clif@clif.cflynt.com Mon Oct 28 11:37:50 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9SHbna23313 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:37:49 -0600 Received: (qmail 72177 invoked by uid 0); 28 Oct 2002 17:52:47 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 17:52:47 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA28371; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:38:29 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g9SHcSJ01558; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:38:28 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200210281738.g9SHcSJ01558@clif.cflynt.com> To: jcw@equi4.com (Jean-Claude Wippler) Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:38:28 -0500 (EST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Oct 27, 2002 11:19:19 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Looking for kittens in all the wrong places Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, The HREF's for kitten on http://mini.net/sdarchive/ http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/examples/kitten.tkl and http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/examples/kitten.README Lead to 404 errors. Typing kitten into the search field also gets no matches. Are the little lost kittens out searching for mittens, or did something get renamed or am I on the wrong server, or... Clif -- ........................... Clif Flynt .......................... ... Tcl/Tk for Real Programmers - Academic Press Professional ... .... http://www.cflynt.com ............ clif@cflynt.com .... . In theory there is no difference between theory and practice . ........................ In practice, there is. ................. From jcw@equi4.com Mon Oct 28 12:39:51 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9SIdpa27847 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:39:51 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 19:40:31 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for kittens in all the wrong places Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200210281738.g9SHcSJ01558@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, > http://mini.net/sdarchive/ > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/examples/kitten.tkl Whoops - both bad. I'll let Steve Landers fix the ref: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/kitten.kit > Typing kitten into the search field also gets no matches. Ah, well, you've hit a secret "feature" on www.equi4.com which was set up a few days ago - I'm in the process of turning the entire site into a wiki, or more accurately: I've set up wikit so it handles all missing pages on www.equi4.com, and plan to gradually replace pages with wikified ones. It turns out that wikit + error redirect is just right to do this, i.e. one can take an existing website, add wikit as error handler, and then *gradually* adjust the live site. The beauty is that pages which need special markup, such as a nice homepage, can remain static and use full HTML. Plus, as you've found out - it automatically adds search capability. I'll document how to do this once it all settles down and proves to work properly. The www.equi4.com site will remain read-only for public use, but it means I'll be able to maintain it far better than before. Well, as soon as I get to actually fix/extend my pages... > Are the little lost kittens out searching for mittens, or did > something get renamed or am I on the wrong server, or... A bit of each, all my fault of course... :) -jcw From steve@digital-smarties.com Mon Oct 28 18:12:26 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9T0CPa19374 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 18:12:25 -0600 Received: (qmail 9607 invoked by uid 8); 29 Oct 2002 00:13:05 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdCsnIPT; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 19:12:56 EST From: "Steve Landers" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for kittens in all the wrong places Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:12:53 +0800 Message-Id: <20021029001253.28247@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, et al >> http://mini.net/sdarchive/ >> http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/examples/kitten.tkl > >Whoops - both bad. I'll let Steve Landers fix the ref: > http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/kitten.kit Done Steve From marco.lovadina@iol.it Tue Oct 29 12:17:32 2002 Received: from omarmail.omarnet.it ([62.110.247.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9TIHUa20414 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 12:17:30 -0600 Received: by OMARMAIL with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 19:09:26 +0100 Received: from MARCO ([192.168.0.91]) by omarmail.omarnet.it with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id VQ9CWK95; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 19:09:24 +0100 From: Marco Lovadina To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <00ea01c27f77$d9fd09f0$5b00a8c0@Marco> References: <200210281801.g9SI16a25046@trixie.triqs.com> Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 19:20:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Re: troubles in creating a starkit (Jean-Claude Wippler) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:19:19 +0100 > Subject: Re: [Starkit] troubles in creating a starkit > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > To: > > Marco Lovadina wrote: > > > I wrote a main.tcl file which I put in the test.vfs directory. I > > tested it > > with tclkit test.vfs\main.tcl and it behave as I wish. > > Ok. You are creating/using a MK datafile. > > > Then I create the starkit with "sdx wrap test". This command create > > either > > the test starkit and the test.bat file. > > Launching the batch file, results in the following error message: > > "file open failed while executing mk::file open db [file join $pat > > database.db] (file "test/main.tcl" line 23). > > Now, you are creating/using a MK datafile inside a starkit. > > This is not supported. There is a way to load/dump a MK datafile > from/to a file inside a starkit (the wikit help system does this), but > you cannot open a MK datafile *inside* a starkit, which is itself again > a database. > > > set pat [file dirname [info script]] > > mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] > > That is inside the VFS area, i.e. next to this script inside test.vfs/. > > I suspect that this is not what you want. You can create a MK datafile > *next* to the starkit, by changing to: > set pat [file dirname $starkit::topdir] > mk::file open db [file join $pat database.db] > > > if {![file exists [file join [file dirname [info script]] > > database.db]]} { > > tk_messageBox -message "Create db" > [...] > > Note that MK creates a file when there wasn't one, so extra logic to > create it is usually not needed. Your code will work, but you could > also simplify it to: > mk::file open db ... > mk::view layout ... > In other words, first-time creation need not be a special case. > > (FWIW, the limitation of a MK datafile not being allowed inside VFS is > not a hard one, in fact an older version of the Mk4tcl extension did > support it, even though there is some complexity involved - but I broke > it and never bothered to restore this capability...) > > -jcw > First of all, thanks for your help. Now it works. Just another question: where can I find documentation about starkit? I didnt know that there exists the possibility to get the topdir of a starkit with starkit::topdir, so I'm afraid that there are more things I don't know. Thank you again Marco Lovadina From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Oct 29 17:08:22 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g9TN8La10977 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 17:08:21 -0600 Received: (qmail 11664 invoked by uid 8); 29 Oct 2002 23:09:01 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdzufDwt; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 18:08:59 EST From: "Steve Landers" To: "Marco Lovadina" , Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: troubles in creating a starkit (Jean-Claude Wippler) Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 07:08:57 +0800 Message-Id: <20021029230857.4676@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <00ea01c27f77$d9fd09f0$5b00a8c0@Marco> References: <00ea01c27f77$d9fd09f0$5b00a8c0@Marco> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Marco Lovadina wrote ... >First of all, thanks for your help. Now it works. Just another question: >where can I find documentation about starkit? I didnt know that there exists >the possibility to get the topdir of a starkit with starkit::topdir, so I'm >afraid that there are more things I don't know. Have a look at http://www.digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf Steve From lvirden@cas.org Wed Oct 30 08:25:26 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9UEPPa29678 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 08:25:25 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9UEQ0qT019212 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 09:26:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9UEQ0305719; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 09:26:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 09:26:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021030092600.AAB5701@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Question regarding the pwb 'package' in Tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Cameron Laird has been asking about the pwb package in Tclkit. Here's a portion of the chat: Cameron What is pwb? Cameron pwb is a package in TclKit. Cameron What is pwb? lvirden cameron, here's the only reference to pwb that _I_ see in tclkit: lvirden the following code only gets executed once on startup if {[info exists tcl_rcFileName]} { load {} pwb load {} vfs lvirden ah wait! lvirden Programmers Workbench.... lvirden pwb.c (from kitsh) has two functions: LibraryPathObjCmd() and Pwb_Init) which creates a librarypath command - there's a note about Vince adding encoding support lvirden $ tclkit % librarypath /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 % Cameron Hmmm! "package require pwb" leaves [info commands] invariant. lvirden perhaps because tclkit has already done the load at startup time Cameron Tclkit comes up with librarypath available. Apparently it ... Cameron No, I don't know what it does. lvirden Cameron, what problem are you trying to solve? Cameron Larry, now I'm just curious. I suspect that pwb and librarypath are purely internal to TclKit; there's no need for them to be visible to developers. I lvirden I agree - pwb is linked directly in, does not have a pkgIndex, etc. so I too believe it is for internal purposes only. Cameron have a mild interest in hearing Jean-Claude (or Vince?) confirm that. I should be doing other work, though ... lvirden I can pop a note over on the starkit mailing list if you would like -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Oct 30 08:59:49 2002 Received: from smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9UExma00346 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 08:59:49 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 186uKc-000Ndp-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:00:30 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20021030145703.01ee9e50@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:00:28 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question regarding the pwb 'package' in Tclkit In-Reply-To: <20021030092600.AAB5701@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: 'librarypath' allows the user from Tcl to set the C equivalent of tcl_libPath (which is where Tcl searches for encodings). This is needed because there is a bug in Tcl where changing the Tcl variable tcl_libPath doesn't actually do anything useful. See: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=463190&group_id=10894&atid=110894 It would be good if someone contributed code to fix this bug! I have no idea specifically about 'pwb'... Vince. At 09:26 AM 10/30/2002 -0500, Larry W. Virden wrote: >Cameron Laird has been asking about the pwb package in Tclkit. Here's a >portion of the chat: > > >Cameron What is pwb? >Cameron pwb is a package in TclKit. >Cameron What is pwb? >lvirden cameron, here's the only reference to pwb that _I_ see in tclkit: >lvirden the following code only gets executed once on startup > if {[info exists tcl_rcFileName]} { > load {} pwb > load {} vfs >lvirden ah wait! >lvirden Programmers Workbench.... >lvirden pwb.c (from kitsh) has two functions: LibraryPathObjCmd() and >Pwb_Init) which creates a librarypath command - there's a note about Vince >adding encoding support >lvirden $ tclkit > % librarypath > /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 > % >Cameron Hmmm! "package require pwb" leaves [info commands] invariant. >lvirden perhaps because tclkit has already done the load at startup time >Cameron Tclkit comes up with librarypath available. Apparently it ... >Cameron No, I don't know what it does. >lvirden Cameron, what problem are you trying to solve? >Cameron Larry, now I'm just curious. I suspect that pwb and librarypath >are purely internal to TclKit; there's no need for them to be visible to >developers. I >lvirden I agree - pwb is linked directly in, does not have a pkgIndex, >etc. so I too believe it is for internal purposes only. >Cameron have a mild interest in hearing Jean-Claude (or Vince?) confirm >that. I should be doing other work, though ... >lvirden I can pop a note over on the starkit mailing list if you would like >-- >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. >Larry W. Virden http://www.purl.org/NET/lvirden/> >Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should >be construed as representing my employer's opinions. >-><- >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 31 05:33:48 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VBXma23954 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:33:48 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9VBYOqT010186 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:34:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9VBYOO07477; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:34:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:34:24 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021031063424.AAB7367@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Starkit versioning info Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I was wondering whether others have been thinking about how to report versioning info from a starkit. What I mean is this - let's pretend that I am setting things up for developers. I give them a tclkit, sdx.kit, and, someday in the future, something like criticl that contains a stand alone compiler (so I dream big...) One day, I get a call from a developer. "I've got this problem - when I try to build a starpack, I get a core dump." In other situations, I would ask "what versions of tools are you using". I know I can say: $ tclkit % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version 200209 and have a sort of version (not too helpful though - because when I get the latest tars from the tclkit source distribution, it doesn't appear that version gets updated...). But how would I find out what version of sdx.kit the developer is using? With kitten, we have the -l flag that reports a version for each extension within it. Should each starkit have such a thing? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 31 05:35:32 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VBZWa24073 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:35:32 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9VBa8qT011363 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:36:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9VBa8f07524; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:36:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:36:08 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021031063608.AAB7515@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] error while building tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Platform: SPARC Solaris, gcc Latest source tar files from tclkit web site Should I be seeing this message? mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... FAILED: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- sh ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/vol/tclsrcsol/tcl84/tclkit/noarch --exec-prefix=/vol/tclsrcsol/tcl84/tclkit/install/srv13 --with-tcl=/vol/tclsrcsol/tcl84/tclkit/src/tcl/generic --disable-shared -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- ERROR: child process exited abnormally -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 31 05:43:00 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VBh0a24480 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:43:00 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9VBhaqT014994 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:43:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9VBhai07579; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:43:36 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:43:36 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021031064336.AAB7570@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] I apologize - I didn't do enough homework Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: After seeing the message, and scratching my head, and even looking in the directory and not finding a config.log, I tried the configure by hand, and saw the cryptic message that g++ was not working. After messing with it some more, I discovered the _true_ problem is one that Andreas and I had ran into before - g++ on Solaris and not installed in a standard location generates errors if you don't specify the directory where its shared libaries are located. I wonder if there is a better way for genkit to report problems - it seems to me that the config.log files were not even present which makes debugging a bit harder. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 31 05:51:06 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VBp5a24923 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:51:05 -0600 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 12:51:49 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] I apologize - I didn't do enough homework Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021031064336.AAB7570@cas.org> Message-Id: <23789B70-ECC7-11D6-AF3E-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I wonder if there is a better way for genkit to report problems - it > seems to me that the config.log files were not even present which > makes debugging a bit harder. Genkit is just a little launch/wrapper. The build output is in out/`hostname`/mk - that gives exact error details. The builds take place in build/`hostname`/mk/ - that's where the config.* etc live. You can go to that build and manually repeat the last command genkit reported. There really is not that much magic involved at all :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 31 05:55:17 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VBtGa25174 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:55:16 -0600 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 12:56:00 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question regarding the pwb 'package' in Tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20021030145703.01ee9e50@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > I have no idea specifically about 'pwb'... Pwb is "programmer's workbench", it was added by Matt Newman to collect a number of small utility extensions. I have dropped all those that were not strictly needed for tclkit itself, not that the starkit structure and extension mechanism has evolved further. The one remaining command in pwb is "librarypath". It will go away once the core deals with setting "tcl_libPath", so one can alter the spot where encoding files live. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 31 06:18:07 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VCI6a26422 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 06:18:06 -0600 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 13:18:48 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit versioning info Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021031063424.AAB7367@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I know I can say: > > $ tclkit > % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version > 200209 > > and have a sort of version (not too helpful though - because when I get > the latest tars from the tclkit source distribution, it doesn't appear > that version gets updated...). Oh, but it should - that version is (automatically) incremented whenever a new runtime VFS setup is generated on my machine. See the pub/tk/newer/ area for examples: $ tclkit % set vfs::tclkit_version 200209.051 % But the problem is really that there are different pieces - and each has its own way of dealing with versions. The runtime, is the mk-at-end-of-exe datafile, that gets added to every tclkit build. That runtime is essentially identical across platforms. I would think that to fully characterize a tclkit runtime, you will need at least: puts [info patchlevel] puts [package require Itcl] puts [package require vfs] puts [package require Mk4tcl] puts $vfs::tclkit_version Then again, I probably left out some detail... (some components, such as zlib, have no version number within easy reach from tcl). > But how would I find out what version of sdx.kit the developer is > using? > With kitten, we have the -l flag that reports a version for each > extension within it. Should each starkit have such a thing? This is a good point. There is a decision to make on whether all starkits should contain a certain amount of "utility functionality" such as kitten has, or whether it belongs in tclkit itself, or whether it is in fact best placed in a tool such as SDX (which may one day end up being called "startool"). So far, I tend to take the lazy way out of these issues: compare size (and possibly also mod date) with what is on the web, i.e. pub/sk/ and pub/tk/. That will tell you whether you have "the latest". This is far from satisfactory longer term - I understand that... I tend too shy away from version numbers, because they always lag w.r.t. reality (that little tweak, which matters yet no minor version bump was applied), A more automatic way to report the version of a starkit, might be to list each dir in lib/ (inside the starkit), and calculate say a 32-bit CRC over the files, traversed in sorted order (or even just dates/sizes, since these are normally reliable). That, plus a lookup database on the web giving more info when a pkgname+CRC is entered, might be more robust. But again, one single tweak and the CRC fails to match all known entries... Ok, reflecting on this for a moment - here's a refinement: for each lib/ entry in the starkit: traverse all files/subdirs in sorted order calculate a cumulative CRC over file sizes + dates remember the highest date encountered report three values: name of dir cumulative CRC latest mod date Then, on the web, a database which is keyed on but which can also report what versions are nearest to a value, in case there is no crc match. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Oct 31 07:15:09 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9VDF8a29444 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 07:15:09 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id g9VDFjqT007179 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:15:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id g9VDFiE08490; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:15:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:15:44 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021031081544.AAB8437@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit versioning info In-Reply-To: of Thu, 31 Oct 2002 13:18:48 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > > I know I can say: > > > > $ tclkit > > % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version > > 200209 > > > > and have a sort of version (not too helpful though - because when I get > > the latest tars from the tclkit source distribution, it doesn't appear > > that version gets updated...). > > Oh, but it should - that version is (automatically) incremented > whenever a new runtime VFS setup is generated on my machine. See the > pub/tk/newer/ area for examples: > > $ tclkit > % set vfs::tclkit_version > 200209.051 > % Weird - I have been downloading the tar files from the tclkit web site and I see the 200209 value only. Is there a step I am missing from genkit to get the incremental value? > But the problem is really that there are different pieces - and each > has its own way of dealing with versions. The runtime, is the > mk-at-end-of-exe datafile, that gets added to every tclkit build. That > runtime is essentially identical across platforms. Yes, that's true. > So far, I tend to take the lazy way out of these issues: compare size > (and possibly also mod date) with what is on the web, i.e. pub/sk/ and > pub/tk/. That will tell you whether you have "the latest". This is > far from satisfactory longer term - I understand that... Alas, mod date doesn't help since in many cases developers are going to be copying files around, which causes the date to change. Certainly some sort of checksum/etc. will tell the developer whether or not the file matches the web. > Then, on the web, a database which is keyed on but which can > also report what versions are nearest to a value, in case > there is no crc match. So when reporting a problem with sdx.kit, one would report a cumulative CRC for the top level directory? What I'm after, I think, is some way to quantify initial error reporting in a manner that gives the developer responsible for a starkit useful information as to whether the underlying software is current or not. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Fri Nov 1 16:00:19 2002 Received: from rildoimml02.riley.army.mil (rildoimml02.riley.army.mil [144.246.27.62]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA1M0Ja29934 for ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 16:00:19 -0600 Received: by rildoimml02.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 16:01:45 -0600 Message-ID: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0645@rildoimml05> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 15:59:59 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C281F2.05B80550" Subject: [Starkit] Testing Starkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C281F2.05B80550 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" When testing a StarKit, should the "source" command in the script, find any scripts you have stored in the *.vfs/lib directory? Michael Collins DOIM, Senior Network Technician ------_=_NextPart_001_01C281F2.05B80550 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

When testing a StarKit, should the “source” command = in the script, find any scripts you have stored in the *.vfs/lib = directory?

 

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<= font color=3Dblack>Michael = Collins=

DOIM, Senior Network = Technician=

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------_=_NextPart_001_01C281F2.05B80550-- From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Mon Nov 4 02:51:38 2002 Received: from tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA48pca05738 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 02:51:38 -0600 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 188cy8-0004A2-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 04 Nov 2002 09:52:24 +0100 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 188cy7-0002jI-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 04 Nov 2002 09:52:23 +0100 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA48qNr24543 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 09:52:23 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 09:52:23 +0100 (MET) From: Guenther Fischer To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -4.7 (----) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *188cy8-0004A2-00*9gzZfju43wU* Subject: [Starkit] tkhtml Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I'm using tkhtml in a starkit for the help function. It works fine if I use URL's pointing in my VFS dirs and once open a help window I can use URLs like ...document.htm#ancor to position insite this document. But I can't start a window with such an URL - the ancor will be ignored - I'm alway on the start of the document. Is there a trick to get this running or is it not implemented? -- ~Guenther Fischer From jcw@equi4.com Mon Nov 4 13:42:53 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA4JgFa16311; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 13:42:51 -0600 Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:42:54 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: rmax@users.sourceforge.net (Reinhard Max), Jacob Levy To: announce@equi4.com, Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <9C625906-F02D-11D6-B542-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.1 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is to announce the availability of a new pack of Tclkit builds, all based on the recently released Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 and MetaKit 2.4.8. HIGHLIGHTS - based on a Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 CVS snapshot of Oct 31, i.e. a few days after 8.4.1 - based on Metakit 2.4.8, which fixes a few bugs and works with more ports - based on new TclVFS release, with new TEA2 build by Jeff Hobbs (ActiveState) - fixed some important writable-starkit bugs (rechan bug and flushing) Detailed logs, apart from the Tcl/Tk/Incrtcl/Tclvfs ones on SourceForge, can be found at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/CHANGES http://www.equi4.com/metakit/CHANGES This release breaks new ground in the number of binaries available right away, i.e. over two dozen of them. With a big tip-o'-the-hat and thank you to Reinhard Max (SuSE Linux AG) and Steve Landers (Digital Smarties) for their help in getting these builds ready in time for this announcement. I would also like to acknowledge the help of Andreas Kupries, Tom Krehbiel, Donal Fellows, and Jacob Levy for working together to resolve a number of issues, mostly related to new ports, and help build things. FURTHER INFORMATION * What is Tclkit? Where can I get sources / binaries? http://www.equi4.com/tclkit * What is a starkit, what is sdx, what is metakit? http://www.equi4.com/ * Want an great introduction to it all? Then read Steve Landers' paper: http://www.digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf * Want to see lots of real examples, games, demo's, apps, utilities? http://mini.net/sdarchive/ AND NOW A PLEA... As you can see, Tclkit has become a pretty nifty multi-platform infrastructure - not so much because of what it adds itself, but because of what it brings together and helps deploy. We, and, that's little more than a small group of volunteers and enthusiastic supporters, deliver on what others can only promise. Look ma, no funds :) Which is fine. But we need to make optimal use of the scarce resources we have. That's why I ask that if you find problems, please try to solve them. If you cannot, there are several channels, such as the comp.lang.tcl newsgroup and the starkit mailing list, to report & ask further. But my plea is not about RTFM... it's about sharing what you do. If you ran into something and fixed it - please DO share your experiences. Others will be grateful. Even if you tried and gave up - please share. That too is important, more so perhaps - you may be encountering what many others are too. If things work like a charm, please stand up and tell others. This is the time to stop tinkering with installation details, and raise the bar by making "out-of-the-box" software experiences so commonplace, that people will cease to accept anything less. -jcw From will@wjduquette.com Mon Nov 4 22:57:03 2002 Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA54v3a23170; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 22:57:03 -0600 Received: from pool0822.cvx12-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.229.57] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 188vme-0007jw-00; Mon, 04 Nov 2002 20:57:49 -0800 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20021104201234.00a426a0@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 20:30:07 -0800 To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list From: Will Duquette In-Reply-To: <9C625906-F02D-11D6-B542-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Howdy! In the announcement for the Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 Tclkits, JCW made an impassioned (well, quietly impassioned, maybe) plea for us to shout to the rooftops about the things we've done to make our Starkits work well, and the successes we've had. Consider this one of the latter. I've been building my own private version of Notebook with Tclkit and SDX for several weeks now; since "crash-on-exit" bug was fixed, it's been working flawlessly. I've had no trouble, whatsoever. Since everybody else seems to having difficulties, I thought I'd share what I'm doing. 1. I'm not trying to write inside my starkit. Personally, I think it's a bad idea; code should be code, immutable, and data should be data, back-up-able. So I'm not having any problems relating to that. 2. I'm not trying to add additional binary extensions. 3. I *am*, however, adding in all of Tcllib and BWidgets, along with some of my own stuff. 4. Since Windows is my primary platform, I always create a Starpack for daily use; it acts like a Windows executable. I can double click on a Notebook file and have Notebook start up and execute it. Way cool. One qualm here--somewhere inside, the starpack contains some kind of Application Name string; it appears in the Windows control panel when you register the Starpack to handle a particular extension. The one in the Starpack always says something like "Tcl + Tk + Incr Tcl + ...." I dunno if anything can be done about that. 5. For development, my directory tree looks like this: /work/notebookkit Notebook Development Directory /work/notebookkit/lib Lib directory containing all Notebook sources as packages. /work/notebookkit/main.tcl Standard Starkit main.tcl: package require starkit starkit::startup package require app-notebook /work/notebookkit/test.tcl Development Notebook startup file Adds all needed directories to auto_path Requires app-notebook Works with wish84 or tclkit.exe /work/notebookkit/notebook.vfs Starkit build directory /work/notebookkit/Makefile GNU Makefile (using cygwin's make) Normally I just execute test.tcl. It uses the application code from /work/notebookkit/lib and other libraries (e.g., Tcllib and Snit) from whereever they happen to be on my disk. The Makefile builds a starkit and a starpack as follows: * Copy ./main.tcl to notebook.vfs * Copy ./lib to notebook.vfs * Copy all needed external package directories to ./notebook.vfs/lib * Use sdx to build the starkit and starpack. This is a very flexible way to do it. I can run with pretty much any interpreter that I choose, and build a starpack whenever I'm ready. And I don't end up with a bunch of weird things in my main.tcl. Will At 08:42 PM 11/4/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >This is to announce the availability of a new pack of Tclkit builds, all >based on the recently released Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 and MetaKit 2.4.8. > >HIGHLIGHTS > > - based on a Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 CVS snapshot of Oct 31, i.e. a few days after > 8.4.1 > - based on Metakit 2.4.8, which fixes a few bugs and works with more ports > - based on new TclVFS release, with new TEA2 build by Jeff Hobbs > (ActiveState) > - fixed some important writable-starkit bugs (rechan bug and flushing) > >Detailed logs, apart from the Tcl/Tk/Incrtcl/Tclvfs ones on SourceForge, >can be found at: > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/CHANGES > http://www.equi4.com/metakit/CHANGES > >This release breaks new ground in the number of binaries available right >away, i.e. over two dozen of them. With a big tip-o'-the-hat and thank >you to Reinhard Max (SuSE Linux AG) and Steve Landers (Digital Smarties) >for their help in getting these builds ready in time for this announcement. > >I would also like to acknowledge the help of Andreas Kupries, Tom >Krehbiel, Donal Fellows, and Jacob Levy for working together to resolve a >number of issues, mostly related to new ports, and help build things. > >FURTHER INFORMATION > > * What is Tclkit? Where can I get sources / binaries? > http://www.equi4.com/tclkit > * What is a starkit, what is sdx, what is metakit? > http://www.equi4.com/ > * Want an great introduction to it all? Then read Steve Landers' paper: > http://www.digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf > * Want to see lots of real examples, games, demo's, apps, utilities? > http://mini.net/sdarchive/ > >AND NOW A PLEA... > >As you can see, Tclkit has become a pretty nifty multi-platform >infrastructure - not so much because of what it adds itself, but because >of what it brings together and helps deploy. We, and, that's little more >than a small group of volunteers and enthusiastic supporters, deliver on >what others can only promise. Look ma, no funds :) > >Which is fine. > >But we need to make optimal use of the scarce resources we have. >That's why I ask that if you find problems, please try to solve them. >If you cannot, there are several channels, such as the comp.lang.tcl >newsgroup and the starkit mailing list, to report & ask further. But my >plea is not about RTFM... it's about sharing what you do. If you ran into >something and fixed it - please DO share your experiences. >Others will be grateful. Even if you tried and gave up - please >share. That too is important, more so perhaps - you may be encountering >what many others are too. > >If things work like a charm, please stand up and tell others. This is the >time to stop tinkering with installation details, and raise the bar by >making "out-of-the-box" software experiences so commonplace, that people >will cease to accept anything less. > >-jcw > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit ----------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | It's amazing what you can do http://www.wjduquette.com | with the right tools. From mhankyson@hotmail.com Tue Nov 5 00:07:23 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f82.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.82]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA567Na26837 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 00:07:23 -0600 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 22:08:05 -0800 Received: from 203.32.142.5 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 06:08:04 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.32.142.5] From: "Michael Hankinson" To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 17:08:04 +1100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 06:08:05.0272 (UTC) FILETIME=[B4789180:01C28491] Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.1 binaries HP-UX and Tru64 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, >share your experiences. Others will be grateful. Even if you tried and >gave up - please share. That too is important, more so perhaps - you may >be encountering what many others are too. > Great! OK I tried to test some Tclkit binaries on other platforms that I have access too. First on a couple of HP-UX boxes with "tclkit-hpux-9000" # uname -a HP-UX xxxhostnamexxx B.11.00 A 9000/777 2012362608 two-user license # ./tclkit % # uname -a HP-UX xxxhostnamexxx B.11.00 A 9000/785 2016702463 two-user license # ./tclkit % Seems to work fine on HP-UX :-) Then I tried "tclkit-tru64-alpha" on a couple of DEC/Compaq Alphas # uname -a OSF1 xxxhostnamexxx V4.0 878 alpha # ./tclkit 29895:./tclkit: /sbin/loader: Fatal Error: object libcxx.so from liblist in ./tclkit has version "cxx6.3", which does not match the found object: /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/libcxx.so (with version ":V4.0.1") # # uname -a OSF1 xxxhostnamexxx V5.1 732 alpha # ./tclkit 138550:./tclkit: /sbin/loader: Fatal Error: object libcxx.so from liblist in ./tclkit has version "cxx6.3", which does not match the found object: /usr/shlib/libcxx.so (with version "_null") # Doesn't seem to work on Tru64 :-( Is there anything I need to do to make this binary work? Regards Michael _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband.  Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Nov 5 00:31:05 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA56V4a28000 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 00:31:04 -0600 Received: (qmail 15984 invoked by uid 8); 5 Nov 2002 06:31:50 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpd61ALfw; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 01:31:49 EST From: "Steve Landers" To: "Michael Hankinson" , Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.1 binaries HP-UX and Tru64 Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 14:31:42 +0800 Message-Id: <20021105063142.29693@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Michael, >>share your experiences. Others will be grateful. Even if you tried and >>gave up - please share. That too is important, more so perhaps - you may >>be encountering what many others are too. >> > >Great! OK I tried to test some Tclkit binaries on other platforms that I >have access too. > >First on a couple of HP-UX boxes with "tclkit-hpux-9000" > ># uname -a >HP-UX xxxhostnamexxx B.11.00 A 9000/777 2012362608 two-user license ># ./tclkit >% > ># uname -a >HP-UX xxxhostnamexxx B.11.00 A 9000/785 2016702463 two-user license ># ./tclkit >% > >Seems to work fine on HP-UX :-) Good - I used the HP-UX C/aCC compilers and set the +DAportable flag (via the CCOPTS and CXXOPTS environment variables) so that it was portable across PA-RISC 1.1 and 2.0 >Then I tried "tclkit-tru64-alpha" on a couple of DEC/Compaq Alphas > ># uname -a >OSF1 xxxhostnamexxx V4.0 878 alpha ># ./tclkit >29895:./tclkit: /sbin/loader: Fatal Error: object libcxx.so from liblist in >./tclkit has version "cxx6.3", which does not match the found object: >/usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/libcxx.so (with version ":V4.0.1") ># > ># uname -a >OSF1 xxxhostnamexxx V5.1 732 alpha ># ./tclkit >138550:./tclkit: /sbin/loader: Fatal Error: object libcxx.so from liblist in >./tclkit has version "cxx6.3", which does not match the found object: >/usr/shlib/libcxx.so (with version "_null") ># Urk :-( >Doesn't seem to work on Tru64 :-( Is there anything I need to do to make >this binary work? Install CXX version 6.3 ;-) But seriously, I'll need to look at the build process and try to force the C++ runtime library to be statically linked. Cheers Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@digital-smarties.com Perth, Western Australia www.digital-smarties.com From steve@digital-smarties.com Tue Nov 5 04:30:06 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA5AU3a08104 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 04:30:04 -0600 Received: (qmail 16668 invoked by uid 8); 5 Nov 2002 10:30:44 -0000 Received: from pc-00060 (192.168.1.60, claiming to be "[192.168.1.60]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpd9TGrIv; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 05:30:35 EST From: "Steve Landers" To: "Michael Hankinson" , Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.1 binaries HP-UX and Tru64 Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 18:30:32 +0800 Message-Id: <20021105103032.20475@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20021105063142.29693@mail.digital-smarties.com> References: <20021105063142.29693@mail.digital-smarties.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Hankinson wrote ... >>Doesn't seem to work on Tru64 :-( Is there anything I need to do to make >>this binary work? > >Install CXX version 6.3 ;-) > >But seriously, I'll need to look at the build process and try to force >the C++ runtime library to be statically linked. I've done another build on Tru64 - this time totally static (X11, C, C++, everything), so it is much larger (4.7 Mb vs 1.9Mb) but it should run on all Tru64 5.1 alpha machines. FYI, you need the -non_shared flag on the "cxx" invocation ... but there's another gotcha too. The X11 library on Tru64 has DECnet support built in, so you also have to link against a dummy DECnet library (- ldnet_stub) when statically linking. Anyway, the new version is available at the Tclkit download area (look under http://www.equi4.com/tcl). I'd appreciate if those with access to Tru64 could try it and let me know how it goes. Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@digital-smarties.com Perth, Western Australia www.digital-smarties.com From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 5 05:22:19 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5BMJa10650 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 05:22:19 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gA5BN07a018365 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 06:23:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gA5BMx909338; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 06:22:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 06:22:59 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021105062259.AAB9316@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.1 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: One of the things that came up during the Tcl conference (and in fact has also come up on comp.lang.tcl) was a desire to be able to use tclkit with some flag that says "the following arguments are tcl - please execute these arguments as a tcl script and then exit". The idea was that one could then say something like: $ tclkit -x {puts [expr sin(30)]} -0.988031624093 where the text on the command line might be arbitrarily complex. I know that we can say: tclkit /path/to/tcl/script or tclkit /path/to/tcl/star.kit The idea was to make tclkit more like Bourne/Korn/Csh. Has anyone toyed with this idea yet - found pros and cons? I'm not totally convinced of the need yet, but I was thinking about it this morning and thought I would see what the other starkittens thought. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Nov 5 06:20:26 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5CKPa13348 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 06:20:26 -0600 Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 13:21:11 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20021104201234.00a426a0@pop.earthlink.net> Message-Id: <1230C874-F0B9-11D6-B542-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Will, Re writing inside starkits - I agree that it's usually a bad idea for an app to modify itself. Only exceptions I can think of are: - preference info (though $HOME/.blah or the registry are better at times) - a revision/upgrade mechanism But there's a lot to be said to keep different types of info separate - if only to have a clear separation of ownership / responsability / lifetimes. In the end, it's probably the deployment side of things that will determine what's best. The moment things are split up, you have to deal with versions (mis-) matching - sometimes that's good, sometimes all-in-one just solves it all. The main reason I mention writeable starkits, is to make it clear that this option is available (and safe, once bugs are gone - i.e. now!). > One qualm here--somewhere inside, the starpack contains some kind of > Application Name string; it appears in the Windows control panel > when you > register the Starpack to handle a particular extension. The one in > the > Starpack always says something like "Tcl + Tk + Incr Tcl + ...." I > dunno > if anything can be done about that. Hm, yes - so you're saying that description shows up as the document type of starkits? Could definitely be improved - what should it say: "Tclkit"? "Tclkit runtime"? "Starkit runtime"? It's a resource in the Windows exe. > 5. For development, my directory tree looks like this: [...] > The Makefile builds a starkit and a starpack as follows: > > * Copy ./main.tcl to notebook.vfs > * Copy ./lib to notebook.vfs > * Copy all needed external package directories to > ./notebook.vfs/lib > * Use sdx to build the starkit and starpack. > > This is a very flexible way to do it. I can run with pretty much > any interpreter that I choose, and build a starpack whenever I'm > ready. > And I don't end up with a bunch of weird things in my main.tcl. Thanks for describing this. There are some things one cannot graft from Unix to Windows and v.v. - and this seems to be such a case. In Unix, another option is to have notebook.vfs/ filled with symlinks to the different pieces, which then live next to it, instead of inside it. SDX traverses the symlinks and copies what they point to, so it effectively ends up "assembling" the pieces for you. I tend to put things in the final spot and test from there, unwrapped or wrapped, when possible. Note that one refinement to test.tcl (I dare not put the word "your" in front of that...) could be to place it at the top level, have it set up the auto_path stuff, and then end with "source notebook.vfs/main.tcl". That takes a bit of extra work, because you need to make starkit, tclvfs, zlib, etc available as std packages for wish84 - but it is likely to become easier (ActiveTcl is getting there AFAIK, see the latest 8.4.1 release). An advantage would be yet more similarity between test mode and deployed mode. Hopefully by the end of the year we will have collected and shared enough experiences to sit down and write up a few pages on what works well in practice. One for Windows, one for Unix, one for MacOS X - pulling in aspects that are generally useful, i.e. how./where to add extensions (pure tcl, pre-built, and critcl), how to get online help in there (tkhtml, wikit, etc), where to put static data such as images. And some newer things, such as using tbcload for handling proprietary scripts, and ways to work with pre-wrapped versions of tcllib and bwidgets (from sdarchive). A lot of this is touched upon in Steve Landers' paper - but that's just a start IMO. I'd also like to point out that all of this is open for improvement. SDX (or startool, as it will no doubt be called one day) can be tweaked / extended / simplified to better support "best practices". Finding out what works and then making sure our tools support that model well, is one of the great advantages of open source collaboration IMO. Thanks for sharing - made my day! -jcw From mjacobson@northropgrumman.com Tue Nov 5 10:18:43 2002 Received: from xcgmd811.northgrum.com (xcgmd811.northgrum.com [155.104.240.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5GIga29409 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 10:18:42 -0600 Received: by xcgmd811.northgrum.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) id ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 08:23:04 -0800 Message-ID: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1EBF@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> From: "Jacobson, Michael P." To: "'Will Duquette'" , Starkit list Subject: RE: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 08:18:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > From: Will Duquette [mailto:will@wjduquette.com] > In the announcement for the Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 Tclkits, JCW made an impassioned > (well, quietly impassioned, maybe) plea for us to shout to the rooftops about > the things we've done to make our Starkits work well, and the successes we've > had. Consider this one of the latter. I have been showing Tcl/Tk apps to my fellow programmers for a couple of years. But my biggest problem was having a them install a full distro of Tcl/Tk just to use try out the apps. But now with a Starkit/Starpack I tell them to just copy this one (or 2 files) on to their disk (or cdrom) and run it! I want to thanks Steve Landers for showing me how to turn NewzPoint into a Starkit (was Scripted Document). That was in February of this year and since then I have been converting all my Tcl apps into Starkits. Thanks to everyone involved with this project!!! > 4. Since Windows is my primary platform, I always create a Starpack for daily > use; it acts like a Windows executable. I can double click on a Notebook > file and have Notebook start up and execute it. Way cool. > > One qualm here--somewhere inside, the starpack contains some kind of > Application Name string; it appears in the Windows control panel when you > register the Starpack to handle a particular extension. The one in the > Starpack always says something like "Tcl + Tk + Incr Tcl + ...." I dunno > if anything can be done about that. I noticed the same thing and found a trick someone had posted about changing the programs resources of a freewraped Tcl script. The noted said that you can edits a executable programs resources with a application called "Resource Hacker", http://rpi.net.au/~ajohnson/resourcehacker . The only problem is that you can only edit non compressed versions of a exe file. I usually take the non-upx version of Tclkit and use ResHacker to change the program information, like "NewzPoint powered by TclKit". I also update the Tk icon with my own. Then I "upx -9" the updated TclKit executable. Finally, I make a starpack with this updated TclKit. This is not very automatic so sometimes I forget to do this operation and just leave it as the TclKit info. (I just noticed that I forgot to do this on my last release of NewzPoint.) I started adding some code in the sdx to call ResHacker with a resource script that was located in the vfs directory (not finished this yet). Maybe I will try and finish it up now that others may want to use it too. Michael Jacobson From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Tue Nov 5 11:07:41 2002 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk ([193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5H7Za00598 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 11:07:40 -0600 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id RAA05291; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 17:07:40 GMT Message-Id: <200211051707.RAA05291@sole.prd.co.uk> To: "Jacobson, Michael P." cc: Starkit list , steve@sole.prd.co.uk Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 05 Nov 2002 08:18:25 PST." <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1EBF@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 17:07:39 +0000 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>"Jacobson, Michael P." said: > > I noticed the same thing and found a trick someone had posted about changing > > the programs resources of a freewraped Tcl script. The noted said that you > can edits a executable programs resources with a application called > "Resource Hacker", http://rpi.net.au/~ajohnson/resourcehacker . The only The requested URL /~ajohnson/resourcehacker was not found on this server, quoth my browser :-( From jcw@equi4.com Tue Nov 5 11:32:44 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5HWha02591 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 11:32:44 -0600 Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 18:33:31 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Subject: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: A while back, I disabled threads and decided to build tclkit without them (it was one of the many things tried to nail down the elusive-but-now-squashed Win32 crash-on-exit problem). Then at some point, I seem to have broken something, because right now building with threads no longer works. To be honest, I have never needed threads - have been able to get a lot of mileage out of plain ol' multi-processing. But it is clear that the trade-off can be different for others. The question is - should tclkit be built with threads enabled again (i.e. chase/fix the bug)? Would it be important to get threads working everywhere? Is a mix of *with* threads on some, and *without* on others worth the hassle? Do I have to start maintaining both (sigh)? Would support for a shmem/mmap extension help if tclkit remains non-threaded? Is there life after death? Inquiring minds want to know... -jcw From rohan@rohanpall.com Tue Nov 5 11:44:53 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (root@chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5Hira03555 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 11:44:53 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id gA5HjeD07308 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 09:45:40 -0800 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 12:45:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <46944.10.3.36.17.1036518340.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 12:45:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <200211051707.RAA05291@sole.prd.co.uk> References: Your message of "Tue, 05 Nov 2002 08:18:25 PST." <200211051707.RAA05291@sole.prd.co.uk> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Theres a working link to the proggy http://www.users.on.net/johnson/resourcehacker/ Does this remind anyone of Borland Resource Workshop? Lots of love, Ro From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Nov 5 14:17:23 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5KHMa15891; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 14:17:23 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gA5KIA4d024216; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 13:18:10 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA18721; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 13:18:10 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XB051C; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 13:18:09 -0700 Message-ID: <3DC8279C.C42E225B@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 13:18:36 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, I don't currently need threads, and doubt that I will in the future. I think providing for threaded builds in the source distribution should be acceptable if a full set of unthreaded pre-built binaries is available. FYI, I notice that http://www.equi4.com/tcl is pointing to a tclflow.html page which I suspect is an error. Tom K. > > A while back, I disabled threads and decided to build tclkit without > them (it was one of the many things tried to nail down the > elusive-but-now-squashed Win32 crash-on-exit problem). Then at some > point, I seem to have broken something, because right now building with > threads no longer works. To be honest, I have never needed threads - > have been able to get a lot of mileage out of plain ol' > multi-processing. But it is clear that the trade-off can be different > for others. > > The question is - should tclkit be built with threads enabled again > (i.e. chase/fix the bug)? > > Would it be important to get threads working everywhere? Is a mix of > *with* threads on some, and *without* on others worth the hassle? Do I > have to start maintaining both (sigh)? Would support for a shmem/mmap > extension help if tclkit remains non-threaded? Is there life after > death? > > Inquiring minds want to know... > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From mhankyson@hotmail.com Tue Nov 5 17:14:54 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f85.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.85]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA5NEsa28877 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 17:14:54 -0600 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 15:15:36 -0800 Received: from 203.32.142.5 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 23:15:36 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.32.142.5] From: "Michael Hankinson" To: steve@digital-smarties.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.1 binaries HP-UX and Tru64 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 10:15:36 +1100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 23:15:36.0444 (UTC) FILETIME=[3F6EDBC0:01C28521] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, >I've done another build on Tru64 - this time totally static (X11, C, C++, >everything), so it is much larger (4.7 Mb vs 1.9Mb) but it should run on >all Tru64 5.1 alpha machines. > Seems to work fine now on my version 5.1 alpha machine:-) I tried it on version 4.0 just to see what happens but I didn't expect it to work. Below is what I saw # uname -a OSF1 xxxhostnamexxx V4.0 878 alpha # ./tclkit Bad system call(coredump) # Regards Michael _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp From will@wjduquette.com Tue Nov 5 19:16:55 2002 Received: from conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net (conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.54]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA61Gta04858; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 19:16:55 -0600 Received: from pool0051.cvx38-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.30.51] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 189EpB-0004gf-00; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 17:17:41 -0800 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20021105170941.00a44ec0@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 17:15:42 -0800 To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? In-Reply-To: <1230C874-F0B9-11D6-B542-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20021104201234.00a426a0@pop.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, At 01:21 PM 11/5/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >Re writing inside starkits - I agree that it's usually a bad idea for an >app to modify itself. Only exceptions I can think of are: > - preference info (though $HOME/.blah or the registry are better at times) > - a revision/upgrade mechanism Revision/upgrade makes a lot of sense--because what you're updating is the code. And I'm sure there are other obscure reasons to do it. But if I'm using an app, I want my data out where I can see it, not hidden in the executable. >> One qualm here--somewhere inside, the starpack contains some kind of >> Application Name string; it appears in the Windows control panel when you >> register the Starpack to handle a particular extension. The one in the >> Starpack always says something like "Tcl + Tk + Incr Tcl + ...." I dunno >> if anything can be done about that. > >Hm, yes - so you're saying that description shows up as the document type >of starkits? Could definitely be improved - what should it say: >"Tclkit"? "Tclkit runtime"? "Starkit runtime"? It's a resource in the >Windows exe. For Notebook, I want it to say "Notebook". :-) Perhaps this could be another option on the sdx wrap command? >Thanks for describing this. There are some things one cannot graft from >Unix to Windows and v.v. - and this seems to be such a case. In Unix, >another option is to have notebook.vfs/ filled with symlinks to the >different pieces, which then live next to it, instead of inside it. SDX >traverses the symlinks and copies what they point to, so it effectively >ends up "assembling" the pieces for you. Yeah, symlinks would be cool (sigh). But copying stuff doesn't take that long, either. >Note that one refinement to test.tcl (I dare not put the word "your" in >front of that...) could be to place it at the top level, have it set up >the auto_path stuff, and then end with "source notebook.vfs/main.tcl". >That takes a bit of extra work, because you need to make starkit, tclvfs, >zlib, etc available as std packages for wish84 - but it is likely to >become easier (ActiveTcl is getting there AFAIK, see the latest 8.4.1 >release). An advantage would be yet more similarity between test mode and >deployed mode. Actually, I kind of like knowing that I can make it run without Starkit. What can I say, I'm a conservative kind of guy. Will From jahbini@lava.net Tue Nov 5 20:48:47 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{Vbmz2rQG3BtOZl0TQylPPFlxV1DxVwux}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA62mka10500 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 20:48:46 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (1666 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 16:49:33 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3DC8833A.68A288A9@lava.net> Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 16:49:30 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm packing up a starkit to do some Video picture grabbing and automatic e-mailing and it must be done under the MS-Windos environment. It will use Video for Windows (VFWTCL.dll) and the Img extension package (img13.dll and her friends, jpeg62.dll png.dll tiff.dll and zlib.dll) as well as tcllib. When UNPACKED, everything goes quite well with the tclkit run-time. When packaged as a KIT, the load for VFWTCL.dll goes well, but IMG13.dll does not. Since the load of vfwtcl.dll goes OK, I take it that tclkit found it in the vfs, un-gzipped it and had Windos do the loading of the temporary file. However, since IMG13.dll wants to load it's friends jpeg62.dll and the rest, I'm wondering how to allow tclkit to know that it needs to unpack all those also. (or is that automagic, and is something else failing) The starkit structure for this application (lets call it postcard) is: postcard \ main.tcl bin \ img13.dll jpeg62.dll png.dll tiff.dll vfwtcl.dll zlib.dll lib \ pkgIndex.tcl Tcllib subdirs ... From will@wjduquette.com Tue Nov 5 21:12:35 2002 Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA63CZa11704 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 21:12:35 -0600 Received: from pool0824.cvx35-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.15.59] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 189Gd6-0005WL-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 19:13:21 -0800 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20021105175259.00a3b300@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 17:58:58 -0800 To: Starkit list From: Will Duquette In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20021105170941.00a44ec0@pop.earthlink.net> References: <1230C874-F0B9-11D6-B542-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <5.1.1.6.0.20021104201234.00a426a0@pop.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] Redirecting tclkit.exe's output to stdout Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm gratified to be able to release Notebook as a standalone .exe on Windows and other platforms; but it occurred to me today that there are benefits to the Notebook user to having the Notebook source code handy. For example, I have a number of external scripts that use Notebook packages to open, read, and process the data in a Notebook .nbk file. It seems to me that this should be available to folks who only have the Starpack. So I got a bright idea: notebook.exe mynotebookfile.nbk opens the notebook file, but notebook.exe -script myscript.tcl executes myscript.tcl, using the Tcl interpreter inside notebook.exe. None of the actual Notebook code is executed, but the script can package require anything it needs. And I've tried this, and it works (way cool). The only snag is that such scripts are usually command-line scripts, and you want to use "puts" to write to standard output. And on Windows, since notebook.exe is in some sense a "wish", that doesn't work unless you redirect notebook's standard output: notebook.exe -script myscript.tcl | cat I seem to recall somebody at Tcl 2002 telling me a way to do the same thing inside a script; does anybody know what it is? Will >Will ----------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | It's amazing what you can do http://www.wjduquette.com | with the right tools. From jahbini@lava.net Wed Nov 6 05:04:51 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{mIKAtuUwOJAQ4ukWo/mvZLeb1d0meCoZ}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6B4oa01725 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 05:04:51 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (2517 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 01:05:38 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3DC8F77F.DD3792FC@lava.net> Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 01:05:35 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit -- more confusion I bring to the table Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The inability to load the DLLs I reported below may not be due to MicroSoft at all (D'oh) In the main script, the DLL load's are supposed to be within postcard/bin. Unfortunatly, the CD into postcard/bin does not work, and tclkit pops up a big error window saying that the directory "postcard" does not exist. How can I tell if the vfs and scripdoc scaffolding is working properly? Especially, "$scripdoc::self" is an undefined quantity. Any hints on how I can tell if this part of the starkit mechanism has gotten turned on properly and is working? Jim ---TFM doesn't R very well. --- and while I'm at it, Which FM? ---------------------------------------------------- I'm packing up a starkit to do some Video picture grabbing and automatic e-mailing and it must be done under the MS-Windos environment. It will use Video for Windows (VFWTCL.dll) and the Img extension package (img13.dll and her friends, jpeg62.dll png.dll tiff.dll and zlib.dll) as well as tcllib. When UNPACKED, everything goes quite well with the tclkit run-time. When packaged as a KIT, the load for VFWTCL.dll goes well, but IMG13.dll does not. Since the load of vfwtcl.dll goes OK, I take it that tclkit found it in the vfs, un-gzipped it and had Windos do the loading of the temporary file. However, since IMG13.dll wants to load it's friends jpeg62.dll and the rest, I'm wondering how to allow tclkit to know that it needs to unpack all those also. (or is that automagic, and is something else failing) The starkit structure for this application (lets call it postcard) is: postcard \ main.tcl bin \ img13.dll jpeg62.dll png.dll tiff.dll vfwtcl.dll zlib.dll lib \ pkgIndex.tcl Tcllib subdirs ... _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 6 06:12:45 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6CCia05429 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 06:12:45 -0600 Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 13:13:30 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20021105170941.00a44ec0@pop.earthlink.net> Message-Id: <29CA1631-F181-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Will Duquette wrote: >>> One qualm here--somewhere inside, the starpack contains some kind >>> of >>> Application Name string; it appears in the Windows control panel >>> when you >>> register the Starpack to handle a particular extension. The one >>> in the >>> Starpack always says something like "Tcl + Tk + Incr Tcl + ...." >>> I dunno >>> if anything can be done about that. >> >> Hm, yes - so you're saying that description shows up as the document >> type of starkits? Could definitely be improved - what should it say: >> "Tclkit"? "Tclkit runtime"? "Starkit runtime"? It's a resource in >> the Windows exe. > > For Notebook, I want it to say "Notebook". :-) Perhaps this could be > another > option on the sdx wrap command? Ah, wait, I misread: starpack, not starkit. Yes - I see your point. I'll keep it in mind. >> Note that one refinement to test.tcl (I dare not put the word "your" >> in front of that...) could be to place it at the top level, have it >> set up the auto_path stuff, and then end with "source >> notebook.vfs/main.tcl". >> That takes a bit of extra work, because you need to make starkit, >> tclvfs, zlib, etc available as std packages for wish84 - but it is >> likely to become easier (ActiveTcl is getting there AFAIK, see the >> latest 8.4.1 release). An advantage would be yet more similarity >> between test mode and deployed mode. > > Actually, I kind of like knowing that I can make it run without > Starkit. What can I say, I'm a conservative kind of guy. Oh, I can understand the desire to be able to fall back to basics and reduce dependencies. Makes perfect sense to me. But what I meant was that all main.tcl does special is "package require starkit". That is a pure-Tcl extension (now part of tclvfs, in fact). So in unwrapped mode, you should be able to have just the 'starkit" package somewhere in the auto_path, and things ought to work. If they don't quite yet, then that's because I haven't finished my homework... Even for wrapped mode, I don't wish to impose a dependency on Metakit. Though Mk4tcl will be required to create starkits for the foreseeable future, let me briefly go into how the read-only side is evolving. I intend to support a range of wrapped -> unwrapped modes. For wrapped mode there is pure-Tcl code which can read the datafile - meaning one will be able to run a starkit soon, without having tclkit. This is what "readkit" is all about (and what http://www.equi4.com/203 has started to go into). The starkit file format, i.e. the Metakit file format, is relatively tricky, so readkit jumps through some nasty hoops to figure it all out (and it's not finished), because MK is a column-wise storage design (with some unusual properties). You don't need to wrap your mind around those details, you just need to be able to unwrap the contents of such datafiles, so to speak :) One key benefit is that starkits can be unpacked/decoded on *any* platform that supports plain Tcl (any Metakit datafile in fact, starkits are a subset). The starkit datafile format will not become a locked proprietary format nor a support nightmare in the future, because the unpacking code is pure scripting, and will run on whatever platforms one happens to have at that time. It may be stretching things a bit, but I consider MK datafiles as open and generic as ASCII text - just better suited for some things. There will always be an OSS path from that format to text, XML, whatever. Sorry for digressing a bit, but I just wanted to stress this :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 6 06:29:55 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6CTsa06421; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 06:29:54 -0600 Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 13:30:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit -- more confusion I bring to the table Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: Starkit list To: Jim Hinds From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3DC8F77F.DD3792FC@lava.net> Message-Id: <8F73BB73-F183-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jim Hinds wrote: > In the main script, the DLL load's are supposed to be within > postcard/bin. Unfortunatly, > the CD into postcard/bin does not work, and tclkit pops up a big error > window saying that > the directory "postcard" does not exist. How can I tell if the vfs and > scripdoc scaffolding is working properly? Especially, > "$scripdoc::self" > is an undefined quantity. To address that last comment first: "scripdo::self" is obsolete. Sorry, things have been racing to find a new equilibrium when the "starkit" name got introduced - and the "scripdoc" package has been dropped. It's still in tclkit for backward compatibility purposes, but when you wrap a starkti with a recent version of SDX (any one that uses "wrap", not "fs2sd"), then you are creating a starkit with the new format. Use "$starkit::topdir" instead, it's now official - everything that is described in Steve Landers' tclkit/starkit paper is, see http://digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf . But the snag you're hitting is the limitition of the VFS model: while things *look* like a file system from inside Tcl, they aren't really. So external programs, shells, compilers, editors - none of these can see inside the starkit and treat it like a directory of files. When you do "cd" at the shell level, it will fail. When you do it at the Tcl level, and the starkit has been "mounted", Tcl will put up the smoke and mirrors so it works, in a virtual sense. Try the following from tclkit to see the trickiness of this model: cd [info nameofexe] puts [pwd] puts [glob *] puts exec ls (or cmd /c dir, on windows) When you do "load $dir/blah.dll", it's Tcl's VFS layer that copies the .dll out to a temp file and then asks the OS to load that temp file. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 6 06:33:06 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6CX6a06663 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 06:33:06 -0600 Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 13:33:52 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <23E7181B-F182-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-Id: <01F3FE7A-F184-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Me penned... > Before anything else, may I suggest you try a nasty hack? Instead of > just doing "load $blah/img13.dll", try: > catch { load $blah/jpeg62.dll } > catch { load $blah/png.dll } > catch { load $blah/tiff.dll } > load $blah/jpeg62.dll Drat - that last line should have been: load $blah/img13.dll Sorry for the confusion. -jcw From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Nov 6 10:23:11 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6GNAa22435; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:23:10 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gA6GNrKf003388; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 08:23:53 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA6GNrK31459; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 08:23:53 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 08:23:53 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-reply-to: <01F3FE7A-F184-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 4:34 AM > To: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit > > > Me penned... For the non-german speakers (New to me that this is in Dutch too). 'pennen' is a slang/dialect word for 'to be asleep', and also describes the state of a person when a glitch happened to this person. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Wed Nov 6 11:52:37 2002 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6Hqaa28523 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 11:52:37 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id SAA07493 (8.8.8/1.13); Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:53:23 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DC96621.3010403@hccnet.nl> Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 19:57:37 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas Kupries wrote: >> >>Me penned... >> > > For the non-german speakers (New to me that this is in Dutch too). Do I miss a joke here or ... As far as I know this is not a Dutch expression, nor does it show signs of Dutch syntax. I'm from The Netherlands, but maybe I missed some important trendy expressions or curvatures in the language's syntax lately ..., or Jean Claude meant something different (which I didn't catch). Maybe it comes from yet another language? So, what does it mean ? Erik Leunissen ============== > > 'pennen' is a slang/dialect word for 'to be asleep', and also > describes the state of a person when a glitch happened to this > person. > From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Nov 6 12:04:45 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6I4ja29454 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:04:45 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gA6I5RKf013272; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:05:27 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA6I5NK12346; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:05:27 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Erik Leunissen" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:05:23 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-reply-to: <3DC96621.3010403@hccnet.nl> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It is a jumble of english and german dialect/slang. Expression when admitting a glitch Ich habe gepennt translate I was sleeping shorten Me sleeping and retranslate/jumble part of it Me penned (jumble: The phonetics of penned and ...pennt are identical) -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Erik Leunissen > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:58 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit > > > Andreas Kupries wrote: > > >> > >>Me penned... > >> > > > > For the non-german speakers (New to me that this is in Dutch too). > > > > Do I miss a joke here or ... > > As far as I know this is not a Dutch expression, nor does it show signs > of Dutch syntax. I'm from The Netherlands, but maybe I missed some > important trendy expressions or curvatures in the language's syntax > lately ..., or Jean Claude meant something different (which I didn't > catch). Maybe it comes from yet another language? > > So, what does it mean ? > > > Erik Leunissen > ============== > > > > > > 'pennen' is a slang/dialect word for 'to be asleep', and also > > describes the state of a person when a glitch happened to this > > person. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 6 12:06:40 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6I6ea29612 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:06:40 -0600 Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 19:07:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DC96621.3010403@hccnet.nl> Message-Id: <9B459D8C-F1B2-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Erik Leunissen wrote: >>> Me penned... [...] > Do I miss a joke here or ... It's rapidly turning into one! :) Me penned == funky way to say "I wrote" (I penned down) - I think? But yes, I did also sleep - Gernan: pennen = verschlafen (slang). And yes, in in Dutch too, I've heard that ("ik ga effe pennen"). > So, what does it mean ? It just means I goofed. Uh, oh... :) -jcw From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Nov 6 12:10:50 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6IAoa29919; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:10:50 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gA6IBXKf013787; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:11:33 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA6IBXK13191; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:11:33 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:11:33 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-reply-to: <9B459D8C-F1B2-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:07 AM > To: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit > > > Erik Leunissen wrote: > > >>> Me penned... > [...] > > Do I miss a joke here or ... > > It's rapidly turning into one! :) Right. Wow, a tri-lingual joke. > Me penned == funky way to say "I wrote" (I penned down) - I think? I believe 'jotting down' is nearer to this. > But yes, I did also sleep - Gernan: pennen = verschlafen (slang). > And yes, in in Dutch too, I've heard that ("ik ga effe pennen"). > > > So, what does it mean ? > > It just means I goofed. > > Uh, oh... :) -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jahbini@lava.net Wed Nov 6 12:43:14 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{UfP6TSJGx/hFObd9p8YgcZmDYtui/9Po}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6IhDa32280 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:43:14 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (3232 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 08:44:01 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3DC962EE.16154BFA@lava.net> Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 08:43:58 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit -- more confusion I bring to the table References: <8F73BB73-F183-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Yeah! after using $::starkit::topdir, I got a message saying that starkit::topdir didn't exist. Sooooo... I put in Package require starkit starkit ::startup and things started working as advertised, which is good. Thanks for the Info. Thanks for the whole kit thing. And, of course, thanks for the morning -- things seem better, brighter and more worthwhile than at 1AM when the compiler don't work and windows wants to freeze the mouse for 45 seconds each time I raise any window, tclkit is working for everyone in the civilized world except me and my son is freaking out because his friend on the mainland popped too many pills. (but vim still worked OK, so that should be enough.) Whew. Jim Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Jim Hinds wrote: > > > In the main script, the DLL load's are supposed to be within > > postcard/bin. Unfortunatly, > > the CD into postcard/bin does not work, and tclkit pops up a big error > > window saying that > > the directory "postcard" does not exist. How can I tell if the vfs and > > scripdoc scaffolding is working properly? Especially, > > "$scripdoc::self" > > is an undefined quantity. > > To address that last comment first: "scripdo::self" is obsolete. > Sorry, things have been racing to find a new equilibrium when the > "starkit" name got introduced - and the "scripdoc" package has been > dropped. It's still in tclkit for backward compatibility purposes, but > when you wrap a starkti with a recent version of SDX (any one that uses > "wrap", not "fs2sd"), then you are creating a starkit with the new > format. > > Use "$starkit::topdir" instead, it's now official - everything that is > described in Steve Landers' tclkit/starkit paper is, see > http://digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf . > > But the snag you're hitting is the limitition of the VFS model: while > things *look* like a file system from inside Tcl, they aren't really. > So external programs, shells, compilers, editors - none of these can > see inside the starkit and treat it like a directory of files. When > you do "cd" at the shell level, it will fail. When you do it at the > Tcl level, and the starkit has been "mounted", Tcl will put up the > smoke and mirrors so it works, in a virtual sense. > > Try the following from tclkit to see the trickiness of this model: > cd [info nameofexe] > puts [pwd] > puts [glob *] > puts exec ls (or cmd /c dir, on windows) > > When you do "load $dir/blah.dll", it's Tcl's VFS layer that copies the > .dll out to a temp file and then asks the OS to load that temp file. > > -jcw From jahbini@lava.net Wed Nov 6 12:53:03 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{OGCd/7S0m0zvJiZ9CzvQ8DsghOu58mUr}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6Ir3a00509 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:53:03 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (3823 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 08:53:51 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3DC9653C.CD79B153@lava.net> Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 08:53:48 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit -- more confusion I bring to the table References: <8F73BB73-F183-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <3DC962EE.16154BFA@lava.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: More ruminations... once the starkit::startup has been called to vfsmount my application kit, TCLKIT now crashes upon termination. I found that if I put in an unmount just before the final 'exit' TCLKIT terminates in a nice way rather than a crash. That's nice. Jim Hinds wrote: > Yeah! > after using $::starkit::topdir, I got a message saying that > starkit::topdir > didn't exist. > > Sooooo... I put in > > Package require starkit > starkit ::startup > > and things started working as advertised, which is good. > > Thanks for the Info. Thanks for the whole kit thing. > > And, of course, thanks for the morning -- things seem better, brighter > and > more worthwhile than at 1AM when the compiler don't work and windows > wants > to freeze the mouse for 45 seconds each time I raise any window, tclkit > is > working for everyone in the civilized world except me and my son is > freaking > out because his friend on the mainland popped too many pills. (but vim > still worked OK, so that should be enough.) > > Whew. > > Jim > > Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > > Jim Hinds wrote: > > > > > In the main script, the DLL load's are supposed to be within > > > postcard/bin. Unfortunatly, > > > the CD into postcard/bin does not work, and tclkit pops up a big error > > > window saying that > > > the directory "postcard" does not exist. How can I tell if the vfs and > > > scripdoc scaffolding is working properly? Especially, > > > "$scripdoc::self" > > > is an undefined quantity. > > > > To address that last comment first: "scripdo::self" is obsolete. > > Sorry, things have been racing to find a new equilibrium when the > > "starkit" name got introduced - and the "scripdoc" package has been > > dropped. It's still in tclkit for backward compatibility purposes, but > > when you wrap a starkti with a recent version of SDX (any one that uses > > "wrap", not "fs2sd"), then you are creating a starkit with the new > > format. > > > > Use "$starkit::topdir" instead, it's now official - everything that is > > described in Steve Landers' tclkit/starkit paper is, see > > http://digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf . > > > > But the snag you're hitting is the limitition of the VFS model: while > > things *look* like a file system from inside Tcl, they aren't really. > > So external programs, shells, compilers, editors - none of these can > > see inside the starkit and treat it like a directory of files. When > > you do "cd" at the shell level, it will fail. When you do it at the > > Tcl level, and the starkit has been "mounted", Tcl will put up the > > smoke and mirrors so it works, in a virtual sense. > > > > Try the following from tclkit to see the trickiness of this model: > > cd [info nameofexe] > > puts [pwd] > > puts [glob *] > > puts exec ls (or cmd /c dir, on windows) > > > > When you do "load $dir/blah.dll", it's Tcl's VFS layer that copies the > > .dll out to a temp file and then asks the OS to load that temp file. > > > > -jcw > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 6 15:19:07 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6LJ6a08584; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:19:07 -0600 Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 22:19:55 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) Cc: Starkit list To: MetaKit mailing list From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <015501c285c0$33256920$0180d241@quantex> Message-Id: <7EC72A2D-F1CD-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gA6LJ6a08584 Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Newest Mk4tcl.dll - another try Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > Where can I find the newest Mk4tcl.dll file for Windows.  I think it > should be either version 2.4.7 or 2.4.8.  I can't seem to find it on > the equi4 website (only 2.4.6, which still has the "crash-on-exit" > bug). (Mk4tcl 2.4.6 has no crash-on-exit, that's Tclkit AFAIK) Anyway... "your wish is my command": http://www.equi4.com/pub/mk/mk-2.4.8-win32/ I'll try to update Linux and MacOS soon as well. -jcw From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Nov 6 15:43:12 2002 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA6LhCa09943 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:43:12 -0600 Received: (qmail 12204 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:44:01 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-175.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.175) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:44:01 -0000 Message-ID: <001701c285dd$6a903ee0$0180d241@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "MetaKit mailing list" , "Jean-Claude Wippler" Cc: "Starkit list" References: <7EC72A2D-F1CD-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:42:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Newest Mk4tcl.dll - another try Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JCW, Thanks for the updated DLL. I currently *do* have an intermittent crash on exit bug with Mk4tcl. I'll cross my fingers and hope it goes away with the new version. I'll keep you posted... BTW, do you have any idea why my posts keep showing up in double? I got some kind of "Post by non-member to a members-only list" email today (I assume) because I have changed my email address, so I re-subscribed to the Metakit mailing list today. Do you think that's related? Thanks, Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "MetaKit mailing list" Cc: "Starkit list" Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 3:19 PM Subject: Re: [Metakit] Newest Mk4tcl.dll - another try Jeff Godfrey wrote: > Where can I find the newest Mk4tcl.dll file for Windows. I think it > should be either version 2.4.7 or 2.4.8. I can't seem to find it on > the equi4 website (only 2.4.6, which still has the "crash-on-exit" > bug). (Mk4tcl 2.4.6 has no crash-on-exit, that's Tclkit AFAIK) Anyway... "your wish is my command": http://www.equi4.com/pub/mk/mk-2.4.8-win32/ I'll try to update Linux and MacOS soon as well. -jcw _______________________________________________ metakit mailing list - metakit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/metakit From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Wed Nov 6 16:07:07 2002 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6M76a11326; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 16:07:06 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id XAA22019 (8.8.8/1.13); Wed, 6 Nov 2002 23:07:53 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DC9A1C7.9070403@hccnet.nl> Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 00:12:07 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit References: <9B459D8C-F1B2-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > It's rapidly turning into one! :) > I like this mixture/confusion. If we continue a bit more we turn this into a standard language for man pages new fuzzy logic like computer language TIP 99999 ;-) > Me penned == funky way to say "I wrote" (I penned down) - I think? > But yes, I did also sleep - Gernan: pennen = verschlafen (slang). > And yes, in in Dutch too, I've heard that ("ik ga effe pennen"). > I didn't hear of it in Dutch, lagging behind I think ,but this one's serious: "Ik really ga sleep jetzt". Erik Leunissen. ============== >> So, what does it mean ? > > > It just means I goofed. > > Uh, oh... :) > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Wed Nov 6 16:09:47 2002 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA6M9ka11508 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 16:09:47 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id XAA22933 (8.8.8/1.13); Wed, 6 Nov 2002 23:10:34 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DC9A268.8090308@hccnet.nl> Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 00:14:48 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL loading with starkit References: <9B459D8C-F1B2-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <3DC9A1C7.9070403@hccnet.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Erik Leunissen wrote: > > "Ik really ga sleep jetzt". > Err... I mean: pennen >> _______________________________________________ >> starkit mailing list >> starkit@equi4.com >> http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Nov 6 16:45:15 2002 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA6MjFa13434 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 16:45:15 -0600 Received: (qmail 14541 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 22:46:02 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-175.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.175) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 22:46:02 -0000 Message-ID: <007c01c285e6$156c8140$0180d241@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Cc: Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 16:44:30 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0079_01C285B3.C7386FC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Crash on exit bug with Mk4tcl and Wish84 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0079_01C285B3.C7386FC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All, JCW and I have had recent discussions on the Metakit mailing list about = a Windows crash-on-exit bug when using Wish84 and Mk4tcl (mk4tcl.dll). = It seemed very similar to the recent tclkit crash-on-exit bug some of us = reported. Indeed, JCW has confirmed for me that he thinks it is the = very same bug and that I need a (core) patch for Wish. He asked me to = report the problem here as some people (especially Vince Darley) would = be interested. He also asked me to verify that the latest Tclkit *does = not* exhibit the same bad behavior. I have not yet done this, but will = report back on my findings soon. I have attached some of the earlier = correspondence with JCW below in case it is of interest. This has also been copied to Jeff Hobbs at the request of JCW. Thanks, Jeff =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Jeff, Sorry for email yet more... >> Wish84 caused an invalid page fault in module MK4TCL.DLL at =20 >> 017f:012ab4f0 >> Registers: >> >>=20 >> Any info appreciated... Bingo! You need a patch to wish - this is indeed the crash-on-exit =20 that we solved in tclkit. I didn't look closely to see that you were =20 using wish... Please report to the starkit mailing list, and confirm that the latest =20 tclkit does *not* crash. Vince Darley, who is on the starkit mailing =20 list, will no doubt be interested in this. The bug fix that solves this is on SourceForge, see: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/=20 ?func=3Ddetail&aid=3D622441&group_id=3D10894&atid=3D110894 Please also tell Jeff Hobbs about your crash, as he was hesitant to put = the bug fix from tclkit into the core... In short: it's a cleanup-order issue when encoding files come from a =20 VFS filesystem. The filesystem is shut down before the last use of =20 encodings... -jcw =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Hi All, I was having an occasional "crash-on-exit" problem with Mk4tcl under = Windows (both Win98 and WinNT). I just upgraded from 2.4.6 to 2.4.8 = hoping that my problem might go away - unfortunately it did not. This = *seems* very similarly to the crash-on-exit bug some of us reported in = tclkit not so long ago. Like that problem, it seems very elusive - I = can't make it happen all the time. JCW seems unaware that this was = (is?) a problem with Mk4tcl. Has anyone else experienced this? I (sometimes) get something similar to the following on exit:=20 Wish84 caused an invalid page fault in module MK4TCL.DLL at = 017f:012ab4f0 Registers: Any info appreciated... Jeff ------=_NextPart_000_0079_01C285B3.C7386FC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi All,
 
JCW and I have had recent discussions = on the=20 Metakit mailing list about a Windows crash-on-exit = bug  when=20 using Wish84 and Mk4tcl (mk4tcl.dll).  It seemed very similar to = the recent=20 tclkit crash-on-exit bug some of us reported.  Indeed, JCW has = confirmed=20 for me that he thinks it is the very same bug and that I need a = (core)=20 patch for Wish.  He asked me to report the problem here as some = people=20 (especially Vince Darley) would be interested.  He also asked me to = verify=20 that the latest Tclkit *does not* exhibit the same bad behavior.  I = have=20 not yet done this, but will report back on my findings soon.  I = have=20 attached some of the earlier correspondence with JCW below in case it is = of=20 interest.
 
This has also been copied to Jeff Hobbs = at the=20 request of JCW.
 
Thanks,

Jeff
 
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
 
Jeff,

Sorry for email yet more...

>> Wish84 = caused an=20 invalid page fault in module MK4TCL.DLL at 
>>=20 017f:012ab4f0
>> Registers:
>> <a bunch of cryptic=20 stuff...>
>>
>> Any info=20 appreciated...


Bingo!  You need a patch to wish - this = is indeed=20 the crash-on-exit 
that we solved in tclkit.  I didn't = look=20 closely to see that you were 
using wish...

Please = report to the=20 starkit mailing list, and confirm that the latest 
tclkit does = *not*=20 crash.  Vince Darley, who is on the starkit mailing 
list, = will no=20 doubt be interested in this.

The bug fix that solves this is on=20 SourceForge, see:
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/<= /A>=20
?func=3Ddetail&aid=3D622441&group_id=3D10894&atid=3D11089= 4

Please=20 also tell Jeff Hobbs about your crash, as he was hesitant to put  =
the=20 bug fix from tclkit into the core...

In short: it's a = cleanup-order issue=20 when encoding files come from a 
VFS filesystem.  The = filesystem=20 is shut down before the last use of  =
encodings...

-jcw
 
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D
 
Hi All,
 
I was having an occasional = "crash-on-exit" problem=20 with Mk4tcl under Windows (both Win98 and WinNT).  I just upgraded = from=20 2.4.6 to 2.4.8 hoping that my problem might go away - unfortunately it = did=20 not.  This *seems* very similarly to the crash-on-exit bug some of = us=20 reported in tclkit not so long ago.  Like that problem, it seems = very=20 elusive - I can't make it happen all the time.  JCW seems unaware = that this=20 was (is?) a problem with Mk4tcl.  Has anyone else experienced=20 this?
 
I (sometimes) get something similar to = the=20 following on exit:
 
Wish84 caused an invalid page fault in = module=20 MK4TCL.DLL at 017f:012ab4f0
Registers:
<a bunch of cryptic = stuff...>
 
Any info appreciated...
 
Jeff
------=_NextPart_000_0079_01C285B3.C7386FC0-- From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Nov 6 17:20:38 2002 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA6NKba15508 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 17:20:37 -0600 Received: (qmail 1900 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 23:20:29 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-175.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.175) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 23:20:29 -0000 Message-ID: <001c01c285ea$f9dac220$0180d241@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Cc: References: <007c01c285e6$156c8140$0180d241@quantex> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Crash on exit bug with Mk4tcl and Wish84 Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 17:19:10 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I was able to find a way to consistently crash my app using Wish84 and Mk4tcl.dll on Windows. I just downloaded the latest tclkit build (8.4.1) (at JCW's request) and verified that it *does not* crash under the same circumstances. Ultimately, I don't see this as a problem for me as I will distro the app as a starkit anyway, but it does seem to indicate a problem with something (the wish84 app?). Thanks, Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeff Godfrey To: starkit@equi4.com Cc: jeffh@activestate.com Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 4:44 PM Subject: [Starkit] Crash on exit bug with Mk4tcl and Wish84 Hi All, JCW [... snip ... ] asked me to verify that the latest Tclkit *does not* exhibit the same bad behavior. [ ... snip ... ] Thanks, Jeff From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Thu Nov 7 05:12:35 2002 Received: from mailout04.sul.t-online.com (mailout04.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.18]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7BCZa13484 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 05:12:35 -0600 Received: from fwd06.sul.t-online.de by mailout04.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 189kbD-0006lT-0D; Thu, 07 Nov 2002 12:13:23 +0100 Received: from delphine.ibo.local (06081961070-0001@[217.2.15.94]) by fmrl06.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 189kb6-0wO8rgC; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:13:16 +0100 Received: by delphine.ibo.local (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id 7982028A4F; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:09:38 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.ibo.local (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id D90F330324 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:09:38 +0100 (MET) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:09:37 +0100 (MET) From: Harald Oehlmann X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Sender: 06081961070-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: [Starkit] COM port not recognised Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dear list, I have tried to move from Freewrap to Tclkit and friends. Amazing application which will make the break through for tcl deployment! I didn't try very hard but here is just my report why I failed: I encountered the following problem: - The vfs code handeld the command open "com1:" RDWR to open "com1:" a+ which gives an inaccessable mode error in the vfs code. This does not happen if you enter it in a freshly started tclkit window. But it happens in all my wrapped programs, where the open command is catched and withhin a namespace. I have reported this to vfs where the bug should be traced, I think. Versions: - Windows XP Home - tclkit for tcl8.4.1 Harald Oehlmann From jcw@equi4.com Thu Nov 7 05:59:34 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7BxXa15364 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 05:59:33 -0600 Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 13:00:20 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] COM port not recognised Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <7D3DB526-F248-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Harald Oehlmann wrote: > I encountered the following problem: > - The vfs code handeld the command > open "com1:" RDWR > to > open "com1:" a+ > which gives an inaccessable mode error in the vfs code. > > This does not happen if you enter it in a freshly started tclkit > window. > But it happens in all my wrapped programs, where the open command is > catched and withhin a namespace. > > I have reported this to vfs where the bug should be traced, I think. Thank you - yes, the tclvfs project on SF is exactly the right spot. Looks like the problem is that VFS thinks "com1:" is a relative path name. The workaround is to open "/com1:". Very nasty hack, but I hope it helps you further. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Nov 7 07:48:25 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7DmPa20380 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 07:48:25 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gA7Dn83a011727 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 08:49:08 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gA7Dn8H22385; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 08:49:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 08:49:08 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021107084907.AAB22376@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] tcltk 841 dokkit ? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I was wondering - do the tcl/tk 84 dok starkits reflect the current documentation? If not, then is there an explanation of how best to convert the current doc into the dok format? With appropriate tools, and the ability to submit the results, someone on the list might be able to contribute to the tclkit effort by keeping up with the documentation needs. (Wouldn't it be neat if tclkit had the dok for the included code as an internal help system?) -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Nov 7 12:13:47 2002 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7IDla08401 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:13:47 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB341AA.ipt.aol.com [172.179.65.170]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AMO64335 (AUTH vincedarley); Thu, 7 Nov 2002 18:12:30 GMT Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20021106154516.01f46140@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 18:14:37 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems, What Problems? In-Reply-To: <29CA1631-F181-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20021105170941.00a44ec0@pop.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 01:13 PM 11/6/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >>For Notebook, I want it to say "Notebook". :-) Perhaps this could be another >>option on the sdx wrap command? > >Ah, wait, I misread: starpack, not starkit. Yes - I see your point. >I'll keep it in mind. What I think we need for this kind of thing is a platform-specific simple application (perhaps an extended version of sdx, wrapped as a starpack/kit, of course) which allows us to set all this kind of information for an executable. For example: the icon, acceptable file types to be dropped on it, etc, etc. All those things that make an application a standard application. There's actually a page on the Wiki discussing what an application needs to do to "be native" on MacOS, Win, Unix etc. cheers, Vince. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Nov 7 12:29:48 2002 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7ITma09776 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:29:48 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB341AA.ipt.aol.com [172.179.65.170]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AMT34053 (AUTH vincedarley); Thu, 7 Nov 2002 18:30:02 GMT Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20021107182520.01f563e0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 18:30:37 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] COM port not recognised In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I added some comments to the bug report. But basically, the problem is that: file pathtype "com1:" returns "relative", which is, I suppose not true. To fix this problem properly, we need to understand what path names Windows treats as special. Some quick testing in a Tcl shell shows: % file exists com1: 1 (bin) 2 % file exists com1 1 (bin) 3 % glob co* no files matched glob pattern "co*" (bin) 4 % file exists com 0 (bin) 5 % file exists com2 1 (bin) 6 % file exists com3 1 (bin) 7 % file exists com5 1 (bin) 8 % file exists com9 1 (bin) 9 % file exists com9: 1 (bin) 10 % file exists com11 0 (bin) 11 % file exists com0 0 so files matching "com[1-9]:?" are special? Anything else? This is, of course, a bug in Tcl and a peculiarity in Windows as well. It seems to suggest it is impossible in windows to name a file "com1" or "com1:". In fact I just tried this and it is true, Windows gives you an error that a file with the name "com1" already exists if you try to rename in Windows explorer!! cheers, Vince. At 12:09 PM 11/7/2002 +0100, Harald Oehlmann wrote: >Dear list, > >I have tried to move from Freewrap to Tclkit and friends. Amazing >application which will make the break through for tcl deployment! >I didn't try very hard but here is just my report why I failed: > >I encountered the following problem: >- The vfs code handeld the command > open "com1:" RDWR >to > open "com1:" a+ >which gives an inaccessable mode error in the vfs code. > >This does not happen if you enter it in a freshly started tclkit window. >But it happens in all my wrapped programs, where the open command is >catched and withhin a namespace. > >I have reported this to vfs where the bug should be traced, I think. > >Versions: >- Windows XP Home >- tclkit for tcl8.4.1 > >Harald Oehlmann > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From jcw@equi4.com Thu Nov 7 12:59:17 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7IxGa12463 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:59:16 -0600 Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 20:00:05 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] COM port not recognised Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.5.0.20021107182520.01f563e0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <20B2DCEE-F283-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > file pathtype "com1:" > > returns "relative", which is, I suppose not true. To fix this problem > properly, we need to understand what path names Windows treats as > special. comN lptN (don't know what N) prn con nul aux (Try unpacking a tar with an aux/ dir in it... !!!) I'm not sure what relics from MS-DOS are left in newer versions of Windows, but these all definitely fail on Win9x and NT. Here's what a quick search on google turned up: http://cert.uni-stuttgart.de/archive/bugtraq/2001/07/msg00122.html It seems to indicate that any name can be added as device driver (which is indeed what I remember from a previous life w.r.t MSDOS TSR-chains). Here's another page, listing CLOCK$ and CONFIG$ as other names: http://www.e-secure-db.us/dscgi/ds.py/GetRepr/File-134/html Another page which indicates for the fixed names, this is about it: http://www.kitebird.com/pipermail/imake-talk/1996/000154.html Ah, wait, straight from the horse's mouth: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/fq00-017.asp Not sure how much of this funniness exists across the different incarnations of Win32, but even on a PDA with PocketPC 2002 (latest WinCE), "open com1:" in Tcl seems to open, eh, *something* ... -jcw From joachim.zaers@web.de Thu Nov 7 16:06:56 2002 Received: from mailout09.sul.t-online.com (mailout09.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.84]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7M6ua27306 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 16:06:56 -0600 Received: from fwd11.sul.t-online.de by mailout09.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 189uoS-0000P3-01; Thu, 07 Nov 2002 23:07:44 +0100 Received: from tokio (340091591805-0001@[217.2.205.36]) by fmrl11.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 189uoR-1QMCKeC; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 23:07:43 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Joachim Zaers Reply-To: joachim.zaers@web.de Organization: JoSoft Consulting To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 23:08:18 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200211072308.19415.joachim.zaers@web.de> X-Sender: 340091591805-0001@t-dialin.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gA7M6ua27306 Subject: [Starkit] BLT Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I'm trying to build a starkit containing BLT 2.4z, which is working without problems with 8.4.1. Inserting it into the starpack I receive the following errors: couldn't load file "/usr/lib/libBLTlite24.so": /usr/lib/libBLTlite24.so: undefined symbol: TclpAlloc while executing "load $library BLT" (procedure "LoadBLT" line 30) invoked from within "LoadBLT 2.4 /share/ikendi/projects/wa4-monitor.kit/lib/blt2.4" This error I could overcome by telling BLT not use the private but the usual mem management functions free and malloc. Although I'd love to use internal tcl ones (TclpAlloc, ...). After this fix I receive this: couldn't load file "/share/ikendi/projects/wa4-monitor.vfs/lib/libBLT24.so": /share/ikendi/projects/wa4-monitor.vfs/lib/libBLT24.so: undefined symbol: acos while executing "load $library BLT" (procedure "LoadBLT" line 30) invoked from within Any idea how to overcome this problem? The missing BLT starpack is currently stopping me from switching from freewrap to sdx. Thanks for any hints in advance. -- Joachim Zaers Grüntenweg 8a, D-86859 Igling Tel./Fax.: +49 8241 997 553/4 Tel. priv: +49 8241 997 555 Email : joachim.zaers@web.de From nicolasb@maich.gr Fri Nov 8 02:04:04 2002 Received: from mail-server (mail.maich.gr [193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gA8840a17623 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 02:04:03 -0600 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Fri Nov 08 10:35:35 2002 +0200 Message-ID: <3DCB716A.4000707@maich.gr> Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 10:10:18 +0200 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > A while back, I disabled threads and decided to build tclkit without > them (it was one of the many things tried to nail down the > elusive-but-now-squashed Win32 crash-on-exit problem). Then at some > point, I seem to have broken something, because right now building with > threads no longer works. To be honest, I have never needed threads - > have been able to get a lot of mileage out of plain ol' > multi-processing. But it is clear that the trade-off can be different > for others. > > The question is - should tclkit be built with threads enabled again > (i.e. chase/fix the bug)? > > Would it be important to get threads working everywhere? Is a mix of > *with* threads on some, and *without* on others worth the hassle? Do I > have to start maintaining both (sigh)? Would support for a shmem/mmap > extension help if tclkit remains non-threaded? Is there life after death? > > Inquiring minds want to know... > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > . > Hi JC, You gotta get off the coffee guy;-? While I cannot "un-equivocally" reply to most of your musings, I for one would like to see threads in tclkit. Does a thread enabled tclkit (default), create problems/issues when used "normally"? I guess also as a matter of (implied?) principle, I thought tclkit would ultimately be a drop-in replacement for tclsh/wish; no questions, or at least too many, questions asked... regards, nicolas From rohan@rohanpall.com Fri Nov 8 09:40:21 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (root@chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8FeKa03259 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 09:40:21 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id gA8Ff9J18943 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 07:41:09 -0800 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 10:41:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <52393.10.3.36.17.1036770069.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 10:41:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <3DCB716A.4000707@maich.gr> References: <3DCB716A.4000707@maich.gr> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The event loop has always fulfilled my desires, but if a thread enabled tclkit does not bloat tclkit or create problems in non-threaded programming, I don't see why not include it by default. I'm not well-versed in the issues around threading, but if it doesn't hurt, why not? > I guess also as a matter of (implied?) principle, I thought tclkit would > ultimately be a drop-in replacement for tclsh/wish; no questions, or at > least too many, questions asked... True, true. Ro From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Fri Nov 8 12:31:27 2002 Received: from rildoimml02.riley.army.mil (rildoimml02.riley.army.mil [144.246.27.62]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8IVPa19191 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 12:31:27 -0600 Received: by rildoimml02.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 12:32:55 -0600 Message-ID: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 12:30:59 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Would it prudent or possible to have a new switch added to SDX say "nounwrap" that would deny anybody from unwrapping a Starkit/pack. Which could help along the lines of limiting people from just opening up a starkit and having your source code readily available. Just a thought to add to the ongoing issue of protecting source code. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Nov 8 13:05:27 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8J5Ra21801 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 13:05:27 -0600 Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 20:06:15 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> Message-Id: <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > Would it prudent or possible to have a new switch added to SDX say > "nounwrap" that would deny anybody from unwrapping a Starkit/pack. > Which > could help along the lines of limiting people from just opening up a > starkit > and having your source code readily available. > Just a thought to add to the ongoing issue of protecting source code. It's not that easy to prevent this. Try this, as an example, from inside tclkit: vfs::mk4::Mount sdx.kit sdx.kit file copy sdx.kit mysdx (assuming you have sdx.kit in the current dir, but you could use any starkit) Then have look at what mysdx is/contains... If you want to protect your code, you're going to have to protect it at the script level - starkits are just a "filesystem sitting inside a file". One option which has been mentioned a few times is to use ProWrap's compiler and tbcload. -jcw From steve@sr-tech.com Fri Nov 8 13:55:14 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8Jt8a26491 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 13:55:08 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA8JsBT3020056 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:54:11 -0500 From: "steve" To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:54:11 -0500 Message-Id: <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 24.191.184.38 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 20:06:15 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote > Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > > > Would it prudent or possible to have a new switch added to SDX say > > "nounwrap" that would deny anybody from unwrapping a Starkit/pack. > > Which > > could help along the lines of limiting people from just opening up a > > starkit > > and having your source code readily available. > > Just a thought to add to the ongoing issue of protecting source code. > > It's not that easy to prevent this. Try this, as an example, from > inside tclkit: > vfs::mk4::Mount sdx.kit sdx.kit > file copy sdx.kit mysdx > (assuming you have sdx.kit in the current dir, but you could use any > starkit) > > Then have look at what mysdx is/contains... > > If you want to protect your code, you're going to have to protect it > at the script level - starkits are just a "filesystem sitting inside > a file". > > One option which has been mentioned a few times is to use ProWrap's > compiler and tbcload. > > -jcw I'be been looking into this subject this week as well. The problem with prowrap & tbcload is that, although obfuscated, access to individual components of a project are still available, along with the need to throw in a binary extention library... yuk. I read somewhere that someone has worked out an encryption scheme for starkits which would provide 3 benefits: no access to source no access to executable bytecode modules, which could run external to the starkit no ability to add to or modify the starkit Any attempt to obfuscate code can be reversed. Any variations are just different degrees of obscurity. Only a keyed encryption scheme can lock out prying eyes. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From rohan@rohanpall.com Fri Nov 8 14:06:55 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (root@chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8K6ta27545 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:06:55 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id gA8K7iJ31748 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 12:07:44 -0800 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:07:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:07:44 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > no access to executable bytecode modules, which could run external to > the > starkit I don't understand, what does this line mean? > Any attempt to obfuscate code can be reversed. Any variations are just > different degrees of obscurity. Only a keyed encryption scheme can lock > out prying eyes. Even a keyed encryption scheme can be broken, if the decryption scheme runs on hardware. ''Theres a crack in everything, thats how the light gets in.'' It's all about degrees of obscurity. And what about the children? Ro From steve@sr-tech.com Fri Nov 8 15:04:05 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8L42a32377 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:04:02 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA8L34T3021212 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:03:04 -0500 From: "steve" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:03:04 -0500 Message-Id: <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 24.191.184.38 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:07:44 -0500 (EST), Rohan Pall wrote > > no access to executable bytecode modules, which could run external to > > the > > starkit > > I don't understand, what does this line mean? For example, I have an app which consists of a gui.tcl and a driver.tcl. the driver can be sourced, and its procedures accessed from gui.tcl. In this case, driver.tcl can also be used standalone, as a console app, to send and recieve data from a piece of hardware. Nifty. By itself, the driver.tcl code is considered valuable intellectual property, so, we want to keep it from being distributed standalone for a competitor to use. We can use procomp to create driver.tbc, which will work in all the same ways as the source, except that the source is now obfuscated in the form of bytecodes. It still can be extracted from the starkit and used standalone. So, using bytecode doesnt help me here. If I just wanted to make the code hard to understand (as if it isnt obscure as it is) I could mangle all the variable names and squash it into one big line with frink. Id prefer not to mangle the code, just make it inaccessable as a component. > > Any attempt to obfuscate code can be reversed. Any variations are just > > different degrees of obscurity. Only a keyed encryption scheme can lock > > out prying eyes. > Even a keyed encryption scheme can be broken, if the decryption > scheme runs on hardware. ''Theres a crack in everything, thats how > the light gets in.'' Yes, but It would achieve my goal of keeping a starkit intact, as opposed to wide open. Its like locking your house when you go on vacation, sure, burglars may attempt to get in, but, having a security system of some type may thwart them. Right now starkits are a house with a big sign on it, "Hey, were on vacation, the doors are unlocked with no alarm system and lots of goodies inside". Im still looking into using the GPL as the protection device though. I really do want my source made available. But, since I code for a living in a specialized field, I need to protect my work from competitors. If anyone has any input on this subject Id be interested in discussing it. Of course I could just weild the DMCA! Just kidding :) > It's all about degrees of obscurity. And what about the children? Got me on that one, I have no clue! Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Nov 8 15:31:41 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8LVea02000 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:31:41 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gA8LWU8l021824 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:32:30 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA16123 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:32:29 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XB09P7; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:32:27 -0700 Message-ID: <3DCC2D89.822B94F9@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 14:32:57 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: steve , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: steve > On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:07:44 -0500 (EST), Rohan Pall wrote > > > no access to executable bytecode modules, which could run external to > > > the > > > starkit > > > > I don't understand, what does this line mean? > > For example, I have an app which consists of a gui.tcl and a driver.tcl. > the driver can be sourced, and its procedures accessed from gui.tcl. In > this case, driver.tcl can also be used standalone, as a console app, > to send and recieve data from a piece of hardware. Nifty. By itself, > the driver.tcl code is considered valuable intellectual property, so, > we want to keep it from being distributed standalone for a competitor > to use. We can use procomp to create driver.tbc, which will work in all > the same ways as the source, except that the source is now obfuscated in > the form of bytecodes. It still can be extracted from the starkit and used > standalone. When driver.tbc is extracted from the starkit it is still obfuscated so why doesn't bytecodeing help you as you state below? > So, using bytecode doesnt help me here. If I just wanted to make the code > hard to understand (as if it isnt obscure as it is) I could mangle all > the variable names and squash it into one big line with frink. > > Id prefer not to mangle the code, just make it inaccessable as a > component. > > > > Any attempt to obfuscate code can be reversed. Any variations are just > > > different degrees of obscurity. Only a keyed encryption scheme can lock > > > out prying eyes. > > > > Even a keyed encryption scheme can be broken, if the decryption > > scheme runs on hardware. ''Theres a crack in everything, thats how > > the light gets in.'' > > Yes, but It would achieve my goal of keeping a starkit intact, as > opposed to wide open. Its like locking your house when you > go on vacation, sure, burglars may attempt to get in, but, having > a security system of some type may thwart them. > > Right now starkits are a house with a big sign on it, "Hey, were > on vacation, the doors are unlocked with no alarm system and lots > of goodies inside". > > Im still looking into using the GPL as the protection device though. > I really do want my source made available. But, since I code for a > living in a specialized field, I need to protect my work from competitors. > If anyone has any input on this subject Id be interested in discussing it. > > Of course I could just weild the DMCA! Just kidding :) > > > It's all about degrees of obscurity. And what about the children? > > Got me on that one, I have no clue! > > Best Regards, > -- > Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com > SR Tech Secure Webmail > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From mark@markroseman.com Fri Nov 8 15:37:28 2002 Received: from fep7.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8LbSa02454 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:37:28 -0600 Received: from markroseman.com (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep7.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69F937289 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:37:51 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:38:24 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Mark Roseman To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> Message-Id: <68D52802-F362-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > [example of gui.tcl loading driver.tcl] Steve, Nothing says you can't pre-process your multiple scripts into a single script that contains all your code, and then byte-compile that. So if your main program was basically doing: source driver.tcl source gui.tcl start_my_gui You could add a small thing to your build process that would actually insert the current version of driver.tcl and gui.tcl into your main program, rather than sourcing them in. That way you have just a single file (main.tcl, producing main.tbc), and the driver piece can't be extracted separately. I used to use this approach in a previous system (using a different wrapping technology), and do some similar preprocessing for one part of the system in CourseForum, which does use starkit for final wrapping. Mark From steve@sr-tech.com Fri Nov 8 15:45:56 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8Ljma03084 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:45:51 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA8LioT3021759 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:44:50 -0500 From: "steve" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:44:50 -0500 Message-Id: <20021108214450.M92413@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <3DCC2D89.822B94F9@motorola.com> References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> <3DCC2D89.822B94F9@motorola.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 24.191.184.38 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, 08 Nov 2002 14:32:57 -0700, Tom Krehbiel wrote > > For example, I have an app which consists of a gui.tcl and a driver.tcl. > > the driver can be sourced, and its procedures accessed from gui.tcl. In > > this case, driver.tcl can also be used standalone, as a console app, > > to send and recieve data from a piece of hardware. Nifty. By itself, > > the driver.tcl code is considered valuable intellectual property, so, > > we want to keep it from being distributed standalone for a competitor > > to use. We can use procomp to create driver.tbc, which will work in all > > the same ways as the source, except that the source is now obfuscated in > > the form of bytecodes. It still can be extracted from the starkit and used > > standalone. > > When driver.tbc is extracted from the starkit it is still obfuscated > so why doesn't bytecodeing help you as you state below? Bytecode files will still run outside the starkit. Because the driver will still work standalone, and I cant allow the driver to be used for purposes other than what it was intended for, as its is used to control industrial machinery. In other words, I dont want someone to get killed because they used my code, binary or source, in a way that was not intended or tested by me. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From steve@sr-tech.com Fri Nov 8 15:50:47 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8Lofa03452 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 15:50:42 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA8LnLT3021817 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:49:21 -0500 From: "steve" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:49:21 -0500 Message-Id: <20021108214921.M55809@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <68D52802-F362-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> References: <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> <68D52802-F362-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 24.191.184.38 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:38:24 -0500, Mark Roseman wrote > Nothing says you can't pre-process your multiple scripts into a > single script that contains all your code, and then byte-compile > that. So if your main program was basically doing: Yes, I agree 100%. This is one viable solution, although a bit more maintenence overhead. In the short term, this may be the way to go. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From mark@markroseman.com Fri Nov 8 16:05:36 2002 Received: from fep3.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8M5Za04545 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:05:36 -0600 Received: from markroseman.com (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep3.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A6AD271C for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:06:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:06:56 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Mark Roseman To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021108214921.M55809@sr-tech.com> Message-Id: <653297D7-F366-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: presumably your final builds that assemble your starkits are going to be automated by a (tcl) script anyway... e.g. we have an autobuild which checks out everything fresh, runs our test suite, does any necessary preprocessing, runs procomp, deletes various admin files, and runs sdx to package the whole thing up, etc.. p.s. you should use the "-prefix" option of tbcload to put a big fat disclaimer/copyright/license/etc. at the top of your bytecoded files, so at least its clear to anyone trying to unpack/reverse engineer.. mark On Friday, November 8, 2002, at 04:49 PM, steve wrote: > On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:38:24 -0500, Mark Roseman wrote >> Nothing says you can't pre-process your multiple scripts into a >> single script that contains all your code, and then byte-compile >> that. So if your main program was basically doing: > > Yes, I agree 100%. This is one viable solution, although a bit more > maintenence overhead. In the short term, this may be the way to go. From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Fri Nov 8 16:30:51 2002 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8MUoa07070 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:30:50 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id XAA19023 (8.8.8/1.13); Fri, 8 Nov 2002 23:31:38 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DCC4A5C.8060809@hccnet.nl> Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2002 00:35:56 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: steve wrote: > > So, using bytecode doesnt help me here. If I just wanted to make the code > hard to understand (as if it isnt obscure as it is) I could mangle all > the variable names and squash it into one big line with frink. > Being unfamiliar with loading bytecode and issues regarding code-protection, the folllowing question came to mind: Suppose an application loads a byte compiled tcl script, containing various procedures that are believed to be protected. What happens if I connect to the interpreter using tkcon for example, and just issue the commands below: foreach proc [info procs] { puts [info args $proc] puts [info body $proc] } Or does the [info] command not work when byte code has been loaded? Greetings, Erik Leunissen ============== From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Fri Nov 8 16:31:14 2002 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8MVDa07126 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:31:13 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id XAA19082 (8.8.8/1.13); Fri, 8 Nov 2002 23:32:02 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DCC4A74.8060101@hccnet.nl> Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2002 00:36:20 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? References: <3DCB716A.4000707@maich.gr> <52393.10.3.36.17.1036770069.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan Pall wrote: > The event loop has always fulfilled my desires, but if a thread enabled > tclkit does not bloat tclkit or create problems in non-threaded > programming, I don't see why not include it by default. > > I'm not well-versed in the issues around threading, but if it doesn't > hurt, why not? > > I don't know the details, but I read postings in c.l.t. that mention a performance difference of many Tcl commands between threaded and non-threaded versions (order of magnitude: tens of percents). Depending on the exact figures and details (who can fill these in ...), this would be an important argument to me. Erik Leunissen ============== From rohan@rohanpall.com Fri Nov 8 16:56:33 2002 Received: from chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (root@chococat.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA8MuWa10247 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:56:32 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (dhapache@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.ex.dreamhost.com (8.11.0/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id gA8MvLJ07448 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:57:21 -0800 Received: from 10.3.36.17 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:57:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42266.10.3.36.17.1036796241.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:57:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <20021108214450.M92413@sr-tech.com> References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> <3DCC2D89.822B94F9@motorola.com> <20021108214450.M92413@sr-tech.com> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Because the driver will still work standalone, and I cant allow the > driver to be used for purposes other than what it was intended for, as > its is used to control industrial machinery. In other words, I dont want > someone to get killed because they used my code, binary or source, in a > way that was not intended or tested by me. Booya! 'Problem is that the universe keeps on inventing better fools... Ro From steve@sr-tech.com Sat Nov 9 10:26:44 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA9GQha17843 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 10:26:43 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA9GPhT3000831 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:25:43 -0500 From: "steve" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:25:43 -0500 Message-Id: <20021109162543.M11877@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <653297D7-F366-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> References: <20021108214921.M55809@sr-tech.com> <653297D7-F366-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 138.89.83.17 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:06:56 -0500, Mark Roseman wrote > presumably your final builds that assemble your starkits are going to > be automated by a (tcl) script anyway... e.g. we have an autobuild > which checks out everything fresh, runs our test suite, does any > necessary preprocessing, runs procomp, deletes various admin > files, and runs sdx to package the whole thing up, etc.. > > p.s. you should use the "-prefix" option of tbcload to put a big fat > disclaimer/copyright/license/etc. at the top of your bytecoded files, > so at least its clear to anyone trying to unpack/reverse engineer.. Excellent ideas. Have you had any issues as far as including the bytecode extention library in cross platform apps? Do you put the library in the tclkit, starkit or in a standalone starpack? It sounds like you've put a lot of though and use into your methods. Thank you for your insight. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From mark@markroseman.com Sat Nov 9 10:48:00 2002 Received: from fep5.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA9Gm0a18594 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 10:48:00 -0600 Received: from markroseman.com (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep5.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 235B287FD for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:48:50 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:49:24 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Mark Roseman To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021109162543.M11877@sr-tech.com> Message-Id: <33BC787A-F403-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: We ship everything as standalone executables (i.e. starpacks), including the Tbcload libraries. No issues there. The starkits and unpacked versions are used internally for testing and development. We have the need to support only a small number of platforms (though adding more would be easier if needed). People using our stuff certainly need not know its Tcl/Tclkit inside. Mark (see http://www.courseforum.com) On Saturday, November 9, 2002, at 11:25 AM, steve wrote: > On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:06:56 -0500, Mark Roseman wrote >> presumably your final builds that assemble your starkits are going to >> be automated by a (tcl) script anyway... e.g. we have an autobuild >> which checks out everything fresh, runs our test suite, does any >> necessary preprocessing, runs procomp, deletes various admin >> files, and runs sdx to package the whole thing up, etc.. >> >> p.s. you should use the "-prefix" option of tbcload to put a big fat >> disclaimer/copyright/license/etc. at the top of your bytecoded files, >> so at least its clear to anyone trying to unpack/reverse engineer.. > > Excellent ideas. Have you had any issues as far as including the > bytecode > extention library in cross platform apps? Do you put the library in the > tclkit, starkit or in a standalone starpack? It sounds like you've put > a lot > of though > and use into your methods. Thank you for your insight. From steve@sr-tech.com Sat Nov 9 10:48:19 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA9GmIa18623 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 10:48:18 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA9GlKT3001043 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:47:20 -0500 From: "steve" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:47:20 -0500 Message-Id: <20021109164720.M37457@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <3DCC4A5C.8060809@hccnet.nl> References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0666@rildoimml05> <27AFFD0E-F34D-11D6-A337-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <20021108195411.M84591@sr-tech.com> <38655.10.3.36.17.1036786064.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> <20021108210304.M50432@sr-tech.com> <3DCC4A5C.8060809@hccnet.nl> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 138.89.83.17 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sat, 09 Nov 2002 00:35:56 +0100, Erik Leunissen wrote > Being unfamiliar with loading bytecode and issues regarding > code-protection, the folllowing question came to mind: > > Suppose an application loads a byte compiled tcl script, containing > various procedures that are believed to be protected. What happens > if I connect to the interpreter using tkcon for example, and just > issue the commands below: > > foreach proc [info procs] { > puts [info args $proc] > puts [info body $proc] > } > > Or does the [info] command not work when byte code has been loaded? > Good questions. I havent gotten to the point of testing yet, but perhaps someone out there knows the answer. I believe there may be some techniques that allow code to be inserted into a starkit main.tcl which could intercept the sourcing of the main application, which could possibly expose details. Testing in this area needs to be done yet. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From mark@markroseman.com Sat Nov 9 11:54:35 2002 Received: from fep2.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA9HsZa21192 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:54:35 -0600 Received: from markroseman.com (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep2.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A3193921 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 12:55:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 12:55:58 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Mark Roseman To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021109164720.M37457@sr-tech.com> Message-Id: <806939F4-F40C-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: the [info body] command will return this for a proc loaded via tbcload: # Compiled -- no source code available error "called a copy of a compiled script" [info args] will return the arguments correctly mark From steve@sr-tech.com Sat Nov 9 13:14:20 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA9JEBa23436 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 13:14:13 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gA9JD0T3002598 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 14:13:00 -0500 From: "steve" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 14:13:00 -0500 Message-Id: <20021109191300.M43566@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <806939F4-F40C-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> References: <20021109164720.M37457@sr-tech.com> <806939F4-F40C-11D6-AC68-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 138.89.83.17 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sat, 9 Nov 2002 12:55:58 -0500, Mark Roseman wrote > the [info body] command will return this for a proc loaded via tbcload: > > # Compiled -- no source code available > error "called a copy of a compiled script" > > [info args] will return the arguments correctly Very good, Mark. Your technique addresses all of my current concerns. This will be my direction until an integrated encryption scheme is developed. Jean-Claude, should tbcload be considered for inclusion in tclkit? Possibly as a starkit for each platform, that can be incorporated into a current project. Heck, the starkit could also include the housekeeping scripts nessesary to build a bytecode starkit/starpack. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From jcw@equi4.com Sat Nov 9 14:47:23 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA9KlMa25784 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 14:47:22 -0600 Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 21:48:12 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v546) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021109191300.M43566@sr-tech.com> Message-Id: <8FB2E8C2-F424-11D6-BE6B-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.546) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Mark Roseman wrote >> the [info body] command will return this for a proc loaded via >> tbcload: >> >> # Compiled -- no source code available >> error "called a copy of a compiled script" >> >> [info args] will return the arguments correctly [Steve R] > Very good, Mark. Your technique addresses all of my current concerns. > This will be my direction until an integrated encryption scheme is > developed. I can't resist stating the obvious here... you can be the first on the block to have such a scheme! All it takes is a spoonful of initiative ... > Jean-Claude, should tbcload be considered for inclusion in tclkit? > Possibly > as a starkit for each platform, that can be incorporated into a current > project. Heck, the starkit could also include the housekeeping scripts > nessesary to build a bytecode starkit/starpack. I'm happy to support tbcload more - but note that there is a practical advantage in putting tbcload in the starkit, i.e. along with the application, not in tclkit itself: that way one can mix and match versions more easily - if tbcload is changed in incompatible ways, things wont break all over. In fact, one could even consider building *intentionally* modified versions of tbcload, and ship them with the app. Allow me to gently put my foot on the brakes, though - the decisions of what and what not to put inside tclkit should be considered mostly over, as far as I'm concerned. It is extremely important to me that tclkit represent a very very very stable infrastructure. Conservatively so, even. That is what will let us put a number of versioning issues well behind us, and deliver on that oh so tempting promise of "It Just Works (TM)". There will be future releases of course, to track major releases of the components inside. But it's taken some TWO years to make the jump from a very nice 8.2.2 release all the way to an even nicer 8.4.0, so it'd be good to build on top - not inside - for a while. Ok, having said that, let's me hit the gas pedal again: the best way forward, it seems to me is to create one or more starkits with such functionality as you ask for. We can consider SDX to be a pond full of experimental fish, from which we could take what works and start implementing a "startool" for developers, say. I know Steve Landers has been thinking and planning along those lines - and no doubt others too. Wrapping/unwrapping is the obvious base functionality, but code protection, in-place editing of starkits, tweaking icons, merging packages and/or starkits - there's a lot to dig in and take forward, clearly... and, hey, this is the stuff we developers LOVE to hack on! :) Anyway, having a starkit with a set of tbcload binaries, along with more conveniences to facilitate the creation of "modestly sealed" apps sounds like a great idea to me. I'm all for it. Let's also not forget ActiveState's new TclDevKit. It'd be great to see more synergy in that direction. After all, starkits are mostly a transparent 'wrapping choice" by now - many ideas can be taken further in a way which works well inside as well as outside this *stuff... tbcload is one example where procomp is the central tool, which starkits simply use in new ways. -jcw From jcollins@phpsource.net Sat Nov 9 18:26:08 2002 Received: from sandbox (jefm-147.dfw.tx.bbnow.net [24.219.87.147]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAA0Q8a32004 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 18:26:08 -0600 Received: from jcollins by sandbox with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18AeuW-0000fP-00 for ; Sat, 09 Nov 2002 17:21:04 -0600 Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 17:21:04 -0600 From: Jeremy Collins To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <20021109232104.GC1482@sandbox> Reply-To: Jeremy Collins Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Subject: [Starkit] mysqltcl inside starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anybody tried to put the mysqltcl extension inside a Starkit? It segfault on package require. I've made sure it was compiled with stubs enabled as well. Any help would be appreciated. Also is there a debug enabled version of tclkit available for download so I can backtrace this thing? If not maybe I'll spend the time trying to compile tclkit again. - Jeremy From franco.pozzer@infocamere.it Mon Nov 11 07:57:11 2002 Received: from dns01.infocamere.it (dns01.infocamere.it [193.70.148.50]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gABDvAa21521 for ; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 07:57:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 3817 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 13:57:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lxm03.icnet) (80.82.0.113) by 0 with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 13:57:54 -0000 Received: from infocamere.it (lxm03.icnet [1.5.24.80]) (authenticated bits=0) by lxm03.icnet (8.12.4/8.12.4) with ESMTP id gABDvrDn023573 for ; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 14:57:53 +0100 Message-ID: <3DCFB757.9E887DED@infocamere.it> Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 14:57:43 +0100 From: Franco Pozzer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] TclHttpd : support PHP as CGI ?????? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sorry if trouble you and sorry if write you directly. Sorry also for my english it is not so good. Thanks for time to spend to me and for read my msg. I am new of Tcl Tk and I try TclHttpd.Tcl for my porpose. I have make a stand alone application web_based with Apache and PHP. It work breakdown any desktop (Win32, Linux or Mac). It use XML structure with SAX ( XPath) The access of the XML are make with PHP Class XPtah download from sourceforge.net. I have make also a install procedure of my components and object (only application component not Apache and PHP) with Tcl Tk. If you like I can to send a prototype of appliation and package of install procedure. Write me if you want. I have discovered TclHttpd. It is a bettter for me to use it insted Apache. I like very much to distribute and install ONLY ONE PACKED build in web_server (TclHttpd) and my application (PHP script+XML+JavaScript+ and others). With this way my Users do not have installa Apache or others component but only TO EXECUTE A PGM Tcl. It is fantastic for my factory (www.infocamere.it) because I do not have control of the system environment of the User. With Tcl Tk I do not have many cost to assistance!!!!!! I have a question but to start I want to say : TclHttpd support PHP interpreter? and if it yes how to do? and again can I use PHP script that to access to XML strcture? I hope to responde of my question. please reply to me at the e-mail franco.pozzer@infocamere.it From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Nov 12 09:47:27 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gACFlQa25470; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 09:47:27 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id gACFmGw4003210; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:48:16 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA00877; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:48:07 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAAHA; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:48:06 -0700 Message-ID: <3DD122DA.13A17C41@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:48:42 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? References: <8FB2E8C2-F424-11D6-BE6B-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, <..snip..> > Ok, having said that, let's me hit the gas pedal again: the best way > forward, it seems to me is to create one or more starkits with such > functionality as you ask for. We can consider SDX to be a pond full of > experimental fish, from which we could take what works and start > implementing a "startool" for developers, say. I know Steve Landers > has been thinking and planning along those lines - and no doubt others > too. Wrapping/unwrapping is the obvious base functionality, but code > protection, in-place editing of starkits, tweaking icons, merging > packages and/or starkits - there's a lot to dig in and take forward, > clearly... and, hey, this is the stuff we developers LOVE to hack on! :) > > Anyway, having a starkit with a set of tbcload binaries, along with > more conveniences to facilitate the creation of "modestly sealed" apps > sounds like a great idea to me. I'm all for it. > > Let's also not forget ActiveState's new TclDevKit. It'd be great to > see more synergy in that direction. After all, starkits are mostly a > transparent 'wrapping choice" by now - many ideas can be taken further > in a way which works well inside as well as outside this *stuff... > tbcload is one example where procomp is the central tool, which > starkits simply use in new ways. <..snip..> $.02 - I would very much like to see (and I think it will be important to first time user acceptance) a "startool" that displays a tool bar and provides ready access to core documentation. A command line interface should also be supported for use in scripts. Customizing the tool bar should also be supported through an interface definition that allows easy addition or removal of applications and their documentation. Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 12 10:00:47 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gACG0la26802 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 10:00:47 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gACG1V3a002527 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 11:01:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gACG1Wk16914; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 11:01:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 11:01:32 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021112110132.AAB16882@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:48:42 -0700 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, can you expand on what you are asking for? JCW's idea was that startool would be a tool one would use to create starkits. I could not tell if you were talking about wanting a GUIfied version of such a tool, or a tool that provided a skeleton GUI from which one would then proceed to add one's own code to 'flesh it out'. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Nov 12 10:46:24 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gACGkNa31191 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 10:46:23 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id gACGlPw4019715 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 09:47:25 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA27234 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 09:47:16 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAAKA; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 09:46:29 -0700 Message-ID: <3DD13089.1C8EDF9@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 09:47:05 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? References: <20021112110132.AAB16882@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > Tom, can you expand on what you are asking for? JCW's idea was that > startool would be a tool one would use to create starkits. > > I could not tell if you were talking about wanting a GUIfied version > of such a tool, or a tool that provided a skeleton GUI from which one > would then proceed to add one's own code to 'flesh it out'. Actually both. My view is that startool should be a tool bar that contains a set of base functionality for doing tcl development and creating starkits. This functionality would be a permanent part of the startool. However I think the startool application should allow buttons to be added to the tool bar so that package demos, debuggers, gui builders, project management tools, etc. could be started from the tool bar. I is conceptually possible to separated the functionality of the startool from a gui that provides a tool bar but I think this would reduce the impact and acceptance of startool and the tclkit/starkit approach to development. Providing a visible interface for doing development will also provide a graphic for advertising. This may seem silly to you an me but to entry level users it can make a lot of difference. Tom K. From steve@sr-tech.com Tue Nov 12 14:53:14 2002 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (host19.srtech-highlandpark.cust.superlink.net [209.236.165.19] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gACKrCa19668 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 14:53:13 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/linuxconf) with ESMTP id gACKq7UP004259; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 15:52:07 -0500 From: "Steve Redler IV" To: Tom Krehbiel CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 15:52:07 -0500 Message-Id: <20021112205207.M22009@sr-tech.com> In-Reply-To: <3DD13089.1C8EDF9@motorola.com> References: <20021112110132.AAB16882@cas.org> <3DD13089.1C8EDF9@motorola.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.70 20020822 X-OriginatingIP: 24.191.184.38 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tue, 12 Nov 2002 09:47:05 -0700, Tom Krehbiel wrote > Actually both. My view is that startool should be a tool bar that > contains a set of base functionality for doing tcl development and > creating starkits. This functionality would be a permanent part of > the startool. However I think the startool application should allow > buttons to be added to the tool bar so that package demos, debuggers, > gui builders, project management tools, etc. could be started from > the tool bar. On the topic of integrated toolbar/gui, I have a preliminary starkit of SpecTcl which has a menu option to "build starkit" with one click. I switched from VisualTcl to SpecTcl for making gui's because Vtcl is way too quirky.. I've lost too many projects to it when It would refuse to save or reload a project file. SpecTcl isn't really an IDE, but I use it as one, and with a few more tweaks it could really be a useful starkit development tool. > I is conceptually possible to separated the functionality of the > startool from a gui that provides a tool bar but I think this would > reduce the impact and acceptance of startool and the tclkit/starkit > approach to development. Providing a visible interface for doing > development will also provide a graphic for advertising. This may > seem silly to you an me but to entry level users it can make a lot > of difference. On the note of tcl acceptance: I find preaching to others about tcl is similar to preaching Windows users about Linux. Folks need to figure it out for themselves. Regardless of how easy tcl is or isnt, Ive given up trying to cater to the "Joe Sixpack". On the other hand, I've shown a single page of tcl source to some fellow computer enthusiasts, and they immediately said "awesome", and proceded to follow me in the pursuit of pleasant programing in tcl. It seems to me like the person needs to be "ready" for tcl, perhaps because it provides a cross platform RAD thats hard to beat on any grounds, with a very low barrier to entry in terms of learning curve. Of course I still preach though :). I do agree, that by providing a gui environment for starkits/tcl, that you give the language a bit more magnetism and sense of completeness. This is an idea that needs to be further discussed. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, systems engineer sr-tech.com SR Tech Secure Webmail From jahbini@lava.net Tue Nov 12 23:12:28 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{MfKB8r613EUYZbAVRTD/AOntp5ne03vp}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAD5CSa20183 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 23:12:28 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (1176 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 19:13:18 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3DD1DF67.302E5D15@lava.net> Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 19:13:11 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gAD5CSa20183 Subject: [Starkit] starkit crash on exit (MS-Windows version) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have noticed that my starkit application will crash upon exit if the application terminates in any other directory than the startup directory. That is, if I set ::startupdir [pwd] cd $SomewhereElseDuringExecution at the beginning of the app and cd $:startupdir exit things go well at exit. If the final 'cd' is removed, the application will crash with one of those bogusly unhelpful windows alert boxes. Can any one else verify this behaviour? Jim From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 13 02:31:41 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAD8Vea27934 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 02:31:40 -0600 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 09:32:31 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit crash on exit (MS-Windows version) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DD1DF67.302E5D15@lava.net> Message-Id: <733FBB53-F6E2-11D6-834D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jim Hinds wrote: > I have noticed that my starkit application will crash upon exit if the > application terminates in any other directory than the startup > directory. > > That is, if I > set ::startupdir [pwd] > cd $SomewhereElseDuringExecution > at the beginning of the app and > cd $:startupdir > exit > things go well at exit. If the final 'cd' is removed, the application > will crash with one of those bogusly unhelpful windows alert boxes. > > Can any one else verify this behaviour? Does not happen with tclkit 200211.001 on NT4 or Win98 for me. What version of Windows are you seeing this crash on? Are you running off a file server, or off NTFS? Are there spaces in the dir name? -jcw From jahbini@lava.net Wed Nov 13 12:24:14 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{Jbc9dtiMrfeSYVsGDU/nWTVmT1vmeC9G}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADIO3a08263 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:24:14 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (2228 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 08:24:37 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3DD298E3.8E049B36@lava.net> Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 08:24:35 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit crash on exit (MS-Windows version) References: <733FBB53-F6E2-11D6-834D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gADIO3a08263 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: OS is Win98. Both application and tclkit are remote samba shares from Mandrake 8.1 Linux. Jim PS. I'm actually glad that you can't reproduce this problem. I'll reload Windows and pretend I'm having a good time! Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Jim Hinds wrote: > > > I have noticed that my starkit application will crash upon exit if the > > application terminates in any other directory than the startup > > directory. > > > > That is, if I > > set ::startupdir [pwd] > > cd $SomewhereElseDuringExecution > > at the beginning of the app and > > cd $:startupdir > > exit > > things go well at exit. If the final 'cd' is removed, the application > > will crash with one of those bogusly unhelpful windows alert boxes. > > > > Can any one else verify this behaviour? > > Does not happen with tclkit 200211.001 on NT4 or Win98 for me. > > What version of Windows are you seeing this crash on? > Are you running off a file server, or off NTFS? > Are there spaces in the dir name? > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Nov 13 13:50:47 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADJoja16513 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:50:46 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gADJpbCb017345 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:51:37 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id MAA02893 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:51:37 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCABYW; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:51:36 -0700 Message-ID: <3DD2AD6D.650E0AB9@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:52:13 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list References: <733FBB53-F6E2-11D6-834D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <3DD298E3.8E049B36@lava.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] wikit gif question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm trying to use wikit as the help system for an application. I've figured out how to include wikit in app.vfs and start it from the help menu. Now I want to add a picture to one of the pages but there doesn't seem to be any way to do it with out a server. Does anyone know how to get a gif to display in a wikit without having a server. The help documentation doesn't indicate that the file: URL is supported. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Nov 13 14:14:50 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADKEma18652 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 14:14:49 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gADKFdGE002136 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:15:39 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA16419 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:11:36 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCABZ3; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:14:53 -0700 Message-ID: <3DD2B2E2.59300919@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:15:30 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit gif question References: <733FBB53-F6E2-11D6-834D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <3DD298E3.8E049B36@lava.net> <3DD2AD6D.650E0AB9@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The "Adding Help to Scripted Documents" wiki page (http://mini.net/tcl/3433) indicates that it has been moved to http://www.equi4.com/wikit/11 but when I follow the link I end up at a "WOBBLE" page. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Nov 13 16:54:08 2002 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADMs7a02911 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 16:54:08 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB6E5F5.ipt.aol.com [172.182.229.245]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AMZ45935 (AUTH vincedarley); Wed, 13 Nov 2002 22:54:36 GMT Message-Id: <5.1.1.5.0.20021113225338.01eb1508@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 22:55:08 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] COM port not recognised In-Reply-To: <20B2DCEE-F283-11D6-BEE8-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <5.1.1.5.0.20021107182520.01f563e0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've checked a bug fix into *Tcl* (not tclvfs which isn't possible) to fix this serial port issue as per the information linked to below. Until that fix is propagated to tclkit, the previous workarounds given will be ok. cheers, Vince. At 08:00 PM 11/7/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >Vince Darley wrote: > >>file pathtype "com1:" >> >>returns "relative", which is, I suppose not true. To fix this problem >>properly, we need to understand what path names Windows treats as special. > >comN >lptN (don't know what N) >prn >con >nul >aux > >(Try unpacking a tar with an aux/ dir in it... !!!) > >I'm not sure what relics from MS-DOS are left in newer versions of >Windows, but these all definitely fail on Win9x and NT. > >Here's what a quick search on google turned up: > http://cert.uni-stuttgart.de/archive/bugtraq/2001/07/msg00122.html >It seems to indicate that any name can be added as device driver (which is >indeed what I remember from a previous life w.r.t MSDOS TSR-chains). > >Here's another page, listing CLOCK$ and CONFIG$ as other names: > http://www.e-secure-db.us/dscgi/ds.py/GetRepr/File-134/html > >Another page which indicates for the fixed names, this is about it: > http://www.kitebird.com/pipermail/imake-talk/1996/000154.html > >Ah, wait, straight from the horse's mouth: > http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/fq00-017.asp > >Not sure how much of this funniness exists across the different >incarnations of Win32, but even on a PDA with PocketPC 2002 (latest >WinCE), "open com1:" in Tcl seems to open, eh, *something* ... > >-jcw > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 13 17:08:52 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADN8qa04411 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:08:52 -0600 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 00:09:45 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit gif question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DD2B2E2.59300919@motorola.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > The "Adding Help to Scripted Documents" wiki page > (http://mini.net/tcl/3433) indicates that it has been moved to > http://www.equi4.com/wikit/11 but when I follow the link I end up at a > "WOBBLE" page. Whoops - yes, I found out that all explicit page references to things in www.equi4.com/wikit (and www.equi4.com/starkit) have broken down. Everything wiki-ish, i.e www.equi4.com/{jcw,starkit,wikit} is now in a single wiki. Most links work fine (in fact quite a few now work which never did before), but explicit links do not... This wiki is read-only btw, the Tclers' Wiki is the proper spot more most tcl-related comments. There is still the www.equi4.com/metakit/wiki.cgi area, but that is intended purely for Metakit information. That was the bad news (thanks for reminding me that it affects more pages). The good news, is that www.equi4,com is now searchable, so this lists the pages I need to look at and fix: http://www.equi4.com/equi4.com* Hm, wait - the problem is deeper - I can't find any of this "adding help" anymore. Ah, found a copy in wikit's *internal* help file. I've restored the page on mini.net and adjusted some of the details. Summary: * mini.net/tcl/ is THE Tclers' Wiki * www.equi4.com is Equi4 Software's "official" website * www.equi4.com/metakit/wiki.cgi is a public wiki for MK stuff (may change one day) -jcw From franco.pozzer@infocamere.it Tue Nov 12 01:52:18 2002 Received: from dns01.infocamere.it (dns01.infocamere.it [193.70.148.50]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAC7qHa24837 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 01:52:17 -0600 Received: (qmail 8143 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 07:53:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lxm03.icnet) (80.82.0.113) by 0 with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 07:53:01 -0000 Received: from infocamere.it (lxm03.icnet [1.5.24.80]) (authenticated bits=0) by lxm03.icnet (8.12.4/8.12.4) with ESMTP id gAC7r0Dn018510 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:53:00 +0100 Message-ID: <3DD0B34F.1114657F@infocamere.it> Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:52:47 +0100 From: Franco Pozzer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com References: <3DD0B28E.14EE0542@infocamere.it> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------EE0E0EDFA44E1DF271182374" Subject: [Starkit] Startkit: I have confusion in head... you can clear the ideas to me? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --------------EE0E0EDFA44E1DF271182374 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry if I trouble you and thanks for read my msg and for response. > I ask the courtesy makes me a little clarity because I creed you of > having of the confusion on Tcl Tk. > > I try to write this to you msg with of the demands for answer or > confirmations that I ask to you. > > I have installed in mine desktop interpreter Tcl Tk 8.3. > > I can write mine pgm Tcl Tk with a editor and therefore to execute > them launch the pgm because I have the interpreter. > > I could not need the interpreter in order to execute the pgm. In this > case I would have to use the wrapper freewrap.exe. > > This utility/tools concurs to obtain me from a source Tcl Tk and exec > Tcl Tk with extension exe. > > I can therefore generate from any Win32 system also those that do not > have interpreter Tcl Tk of the exec Tcl Tk that can be executed in > all the Win32 system. > > Hour we speak about STARtkit (Stand Alone Run Time kit). I make > reference to the examples because on this argument I have ideas is > confused. > > We take a sample as an example that I have unloaded the editor ml.kit. > > Startkit seems to have understood that it is one to me option of Tcl > tk 8.4. > > The option concurs to create in an only object kit an executed Tcl Tk > that has to its inside all the references of the rows and the path > system that it uses. > > In order to obtain a STARtkit it is necessary to have a wrapper that > TCLkit-win32 is called......... kit that once unloaded advises of > rename TclKit.exe. > > Of this wrapper of it it exists one for Win32 and one for Linux. I do > not know if it exists also for MAC OS X. > > With this wrapper it is possible to unzip kit in all the objects Tcl > Tk of which they are composed in theirs path and directory. > > In order to execute the examples of startkit as the editor I need > interpreter Tcl Tk (for some examples I must have to edge version 8,4 > in other cases enough the 8,3) and must have the wrapper tclkit.exe > for systema the Win32 (in mo the case) oppue Linux. > > The kit I can execute it from line cmd prompt Dos or I make a bat of > the type: > > @tclkit myappl.kit %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 where tclkit e' the wrapper in order > to execute sratkit > > > QUESTION VERY HARD: > > With some utility of the type sdx.kit and tclkitsh.kit they are in a > position to unzip and zip (like file VFS) the kit that I generate. I > obtain the sources Tcl Tk. > > I can "generate" from these sources that I create an only eseguibile > Tcl Tk with freewrap.exe. > > I can obtain NOT ONE STARTKIT but an exec TCL Tk that can to be used > in any emplacement without the necessity of to have installed the > interpreter? > > I stop myself because I would want to understand these things well. > > Thanks. Aspect yours. Ciao Franco. PS if it is possible write me directly --------------EE0E0EDFA44E1DF271182374 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry if I trouble you and thanks for read my msg and for response.
I ask the courtesy makes me a little clarity because I creed you of having of the confusion on Tcl Tk.

I try to write this to you msg with of the demands for answer or confirmations that I ask to you.

I have installed in mine desktop interpreter Tcl Tk 8.3.

I can write mine pgm Tcl Tk with a editor and therefore to execute them launch the pgm because I have the interpreter.

I could not need the interpreter in order to execute the pgm. In this case I would have to use the wrapper freewrap.exe.

This utility/tools concurs to obtain me from a source Tcl Tk and exec  Tcl Tk with extension exe.

I can therefore generate from any Win32 system also those that do not have interpreter Tcl Tk of the exec  Tcl Tk that can be executed  in all the Win32 system.

Hour we speak about STARtkit (Stand Alone  Run Time kit). I make reference to the examples because  on this argument I have ideas is confused.

We take a sample as an example that I have unloaded the editor ml.kit.

Startkit seems to have understood that it is one to me option of Tcl tk 8.4.

The option concurs to create in an only object kit  an executed Tcl Tk that has to its inside all the references of the rows and the path system that it uses.

In order to obtain a STARtkit it is  necessary to have a wrapper that TCLkit-win32 is called......... kit that once unloaded advises of rename TclKit.exe.

Of this wrapper of it it exists one for Win32 and one for Linux. I do not know if it exists also for MAC OS X.

With this wrapper it is possible to unzip kit in all the objects Tcl Tk of which they are composed in theirs path and directory.

In order to execute the examples of startkit as the editor I need interpreter Tcl Tk (for some examples I must have to edge version 8,4 in other cases enough the 8,3) and must have the wrapper tclkit.exe for systema the Win32 (in mo the case) oppue Linux.

The kit I can execute it from line cmd prompt Dos or I make a bat of the type:

@tclkit myappl.kit %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 where tclkit e' the wrapper in order to execute sratkit
 

QUESTION VERY HARD:

With some utility of the type sdx.kit and tclkitsh.kit they are in a position to unzip and zip (like file VFS)  the kit that I generate. I obtain the sources Tcl Tk.

I can "generate" from these sources that I create an only eseguibile Tcl Tk with freewrap.exe.

I can obtain NOT ONE STARTKIT but an exec TCL Tk that can to be used in any emplacement without the necessity of  to have installed the interpreter?

I stop myself  because I would want to understand these things well.

Thanks. Aspect yours. Ciao Franco.


PS if it is possible write me directly
  --------------EE0E0EDFA44E1DF271182374-- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 13 17:29:12 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADNTBa06415 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:29:11 -0600 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 00:30:04 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit gif question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DD2AD6D.650E0AB9@motorola.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I'm trying to use wikit as the help system for an application. I've > figured out how to include wikit in app.vfs and start it from > the help menu. Now I want to add a picture to one of the pages but > there doesn't seem to be any way to do it with out a server. Does > anyone know how to get a gif to display in a wikit without having a > server. The help documentation doesn't indicate that the file: > URL is supported. There was a change to wikit around 2002-10-02, which makes it possible to store images inside wikit for local (Tk/help) use. The mechanism was described on the tclerswiki mailing list on yahoo groups, around that same date. The logic is to get a wikit, make it scan for inline images, grab those images off the web and store them inside wikit.tkd (which is a MK datafile, but now a starkit/VFS structure). Local mode has been extended to look inside its local cache first, and to then present images inside the Tk text widget. It works, but only with gif images for now, because that is the only compressed format Tk understands without extra img extension. I've copied the yahoo groups email below - but it might be good to browse around, some details may have been covered in other followup posts. Note also that the wikit change log entry of 2002-10-08 adds support for file://... - but for local help use, this is not nearly as convenient, given that you will need relative paths to find such files inside a starkit, which file://... doe not support (currently, at least). Embedded images were added, in this somewhat experimental form so far, precisely to allow creating richer help systems. The current implementation reads the entire help file into memory during use (out of the starkit, that is), so I would not use it to create a 1000-image photo album just yet :) - but that's all a matter of time. (Time. Time? TIME???) If you can improve on this and make it work / work more effectively, and perhaps help get this documented a bit better, that'd be grand.. Patches and informal code suggestions always welcome. I'm actively tracking changes and making sure CVS, wikit.kit, and the Tclers' Wiki all stay in sync. -jcw > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Date: Sun Oct 6, 2002 16:14:41 Europe/Amsterdam > To: TclersWiki@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [TclersWiki] Wikit embedded images > Reply-To: TclersWiki@yahoogroups.com > > Yours truly penned: > [...] >> Using this, I've implemented the start of a new mechanism to bring >> inlined images into the wikit datafile. The first goal is merely to >> pull them in and display them in local mode [...] > > The change is now complete - local-mode embedded images are supported > (only .gif, since that's the only one Tk supports without further > extensions - bummer...). This is particularly useful for embedded help > systems, which can now include images/graphics. > >> There are a number of new commands, all for use from the command-line: > > They have changed - here is the updated summary: > > tclkit wikit.kit -images scan wikit.tkd > scans all pages, updating an "image cache" inside the wikit.tkd > datafile (this does not fetch images, it just updates that cache) > repeated calls are incremental: adds new / deletes unused items > > tclkit wikit.kit -images list wikit.tkd > lists all entries currently in the image cache, with fetch/file dates > > tclkit wikit.kit -images get wikit.tkd > this goes through the image cache and fetches any entries which have > not been successfully fetched before (only images <= 100 Kb) > > tclkit wikit.kit -images local wikit.tkd > goes through caches, storing all images it can find in [pwd], i.e. > updates and replaces what is in the cache with local file copies > (can be used to add/replace, and to store images > 100 Kb) > > tclkit wikit.kit -images clear wikit.tkd > clear the image cache > (does not compact the wikit datafile, but space willl be re-used > > Another major change is that a title-name cache was added - this > dramatically improves search performance and "rendering" speed of pages > with lots of cross-page links. It turns out that searching and > rendering were in fact already both quite good, but that all time was > lost in looking up page titles for each page reference (the price of > using quick-and-dirty linear MK searches, it's now hashed and instant). > > As a result you will see that the Tcl'ers Wiki has become quite snappy > in local mode, including searches and display of things like the > "Recent Changes" page. > > Please try and bang on this (in CVS and in > http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/wikit.kit). The improvements are such that > I really would like to switch the Tcl'ers Wiki to this new code ASAP. > > -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 13 17:48:25 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADNmOa08289 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:48:24 -0600 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 00:49:18 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <8605A1E0-F762-11D6-834D-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Subject: [Starkit] Critcl / SDX / Wikit - CVS and changelog Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: These three starkits all have CVS repositories, and can be browsed from the web. Both access mechanisms are described on http://www.equi4.com/wikit - replace "wikit" by sdx or critcl in the listed URLs for those projects. If nothing else, it will let everyone easily track changes (and send back accurate patches). I hope that all this activity and web-site transformation has the effect of making it *easier* to find things. If not, or if anything fell between the cracks, please let me know. Apart from fixups, I do not intend to mess with www.equi4.com much more. No time / need to move on. (Ah, if only wikit had a built-in link checker ... but sorry, don't expect anything from me ... I've got a couple of bigger fish to catch, fry, serve, and enjoy :) -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Nov 13 17:59:34 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gADNxYa09355; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:59:34 -0600 Received: from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id gAE00bw4009784; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:00:37 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id RAA13707; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:00:27 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCACHP; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 16:59:41 -0700 Message-ID: <3DD2E792.B45EF3D1@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:00:18 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit gif question References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, I added documentation to the wikit wiki site that explains how to load a gif into a wikit database. Tom K. > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > I'm trying to use wikit as the help system for an application. I've > > figured out how to include wikit in app.vfs and start it from > > the help menu. Now I want to add a picture to one of the pages but > > there doesn't seem to be any way to do it with out a server. Does > > anyone know how to get a gif to display in a wikit without having a > > server. The help documentation doesn't indicate that the file: > > URL is supported. > > There was a change to wikit around 2002-10-02, which makes it possible > to store images inside wikit for local (Tk/help) use. The mechanism > was described on the tclerswiki mailing list on yahoo groups, around > that same date. The logic is to get a wikit, make it scan for inline > images, grab those images off the web and store them inside wikit.tkd > (which is a MK datafile, but now a starkit/VFS structure). Local mode > has been extended to look inside its local cache first, and to then > present images inside the Tk text widget. > > It works, but only with gif images for now, because that is the only > compressed format Tk understands without extra img extension. > > I've copied the yahoo groups email below - but it might be good to > browse around, some details may have been covered in other followup > posts. > > Note also that the wikit change log entry of 2002-10-08 adds support > for file://... - but for local help use, this is not nearly as > convenient, given that you will need relative paths to find such files > inside a starkit, which file://... doe not support (currently, at > least). > > Embedded images were added, in this somewhat experimental form so far, > precisely to allow creating richer help systems. The current > implementation reads the entire help file into memory during use (out > of the starkit, that is), so I would not use it to create a 1000-image > photo album just yet :) - but that's all a matter of time. > > (Time. Time? TIME???) > > If you can improve on this and make it work / work more effectively, > and perhaps help get this documented a bit better, that'd be grand.. > Patches and informal code suggestions always welcome. I'm actively > tracking changes and making sure CVS, wikit.kit, and the Tclers' Wiki > all stay in sync. > > -jcw > > > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > > Date: Sun Oct 6, 2002 16:14:41 Europe/Amsterdam > > To: TclersWiki@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [TclersWiki] Wikit embedded images > > Reply-To: TclersWiki@yahoogroups.com > > > > Yours truly penned: > > [...] > >> Using this, I've implemented the start of a new mechanism to bring > >> inlined images into the wikit datafile. The first goal is merely to > >> pull them in and display them in local mode [...] > > > > The change is now complete - local-mode embedded images are supported > > (only .gif, since that's the only one Tk supports without further > > extensions - bummer...). This is particularly useful for embedded help > > systems, which can now include images/graphics. > > > >> There are a number of new commands, all for use from the command-line: > > > > They have changed - here is the updated summary: > > > > tclkit wikit.kit -images scan wikit.tkd > > scans all pages, updating an "image cache" inside the wikit.tkd > > datafile (this does not fetch images, it just updates that cache) > > repeated calls are incremental: adds new / deletes unused items > > > > tclkit wikit.kit -images list wikit.tkd > > lists all entries currently in the image cache, with fetch/file dates > > > > tclkit wikit.kit -images get wikit.tkd > > this goes through the image cache and fetches any entries which have > > not been successfully fetched before (only images <= 100 Kb) > > > > tclkit wikit.kit -images local wikit.tkd > > goes through caches, storing all images it can find in [pwd], i.e. > > updates and replaces what is in the cache with local file copies > > (can be used to add/replace, and to store images > 100 Kb) > > > > tclkit wikit.kit -images clear wikit.tkd > > clear the image cache > > (does not compact the wikit datafile, but space willl be re-used > > > > Another major change is that a title-name cache was added - this > > dramatically improves search performance and "rendering" speed of pages > > with lots of cross-page links. It turns out that searching and > > rendering were in fact already both quite good, but that all time was > > lost in looking up page titles for each page reference (the price of > > using quick-and-dirty linear MK searches, it's now hashed and instant). > > > > As a result you will see that the Tcl'ers Wiki has become quite snappy > > in local mode, including searches and display of things like the > > "Recent Changes" page. > > > > Please try and bang on this (in CVS and in > > http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/wikit.kit). The improvements are such that > > I really would like to switch the Tcl'ers Wiki to this new code ASAP. > > > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From Daniel.Sicard@criq.qc.ca Thu Nov 14 15:18:31 2002 Received: from criq.qc.ca (courriel-sf.criq.qc.ca [192.197.124.75]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAELIVa10567 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:18:31 -0600 Received: from GW_QUE-Message_Server by criq.qc.ca with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 16:21:42 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.6.1 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 16:21:10 -0500 From: "Daniel Sicard" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_643880F6.482947F6" Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit bug Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=_643880F6.482947F6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For Tclkit version : 200211 (doc_client) (Version number obtained from = puts $::vfs::tclkit_version) Tclkit does not start from a directory that has accented characters (like = those in the French language) but Tclkitsh does partially. tclkitsh-win32.exe, tclkitsh-win32.upx.exe, tclkit-win32.exe and tclkit-win= 32.upx.exe located in directory : C:\ex=E9cutable When trying to run tclkitsh-win32.exe and tclkitsh-win32.upx.exe the = following message is printed in the MS-DOS like windows: application-specific initialization failed: no such mount "C:/EX=DACUT= ABLE/TCLKITSH-WIN32.EXE" but the tcl shell is running at least party. When trying to run tclkit-win32.exe and tclkit-win32.upx.exe a message box = pops up with the following text: no such mount "C:/EX=DACUTABLE/TCLKITSH-WIN32.EXE" and then when clicking OK every thing vanishes. Daniel Sicard, ing. Centre de recherche industrielle du Qu=E9bec 8475, ave Christophe-Colomb Montr=E9al (Qu=E9bec) H2M 2N9 T=E9l (514) 383-1550, poste 3592 Fax (514) 383-3234 daniel.sicard@criq.qc.ca www.criq.qc.ca --=_643880F6.482947F6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

For Tclkit version : 200211 (doc_client)  = (Version number=20 obtained from puts $::vfs::tclkit_version)
 
Tclkit does not start from a directory that has = accented=20 characters (like those in the French language) but Tclkitsh does=20 partially.
 
tclkitsh-win32.exe, tclkitsh-win32.upx.exe,=20 tclkit-win32.exe and tclkit-win32.upx.exe located in directory :=20 C:\ex=E9cutable
 
When trying to run tclkitsh-win32.exe and=20 tclkitsh-win32.upx.exe the following message is printed in the MS-DOS = like=20 windows:
 
     application-specific = initialization=20 failed: no such mount "C:/EX=DACUTABLE/TCLKITSH-WIN32.EXE"
 
but the tcl shell is running at least party.
 
When trying to run tclkit-win32.exe and tclkit-win32.upx.exe a = message box=20 pops up with the following text:
 
     no such mount=20 "C:/EX=DACUTABLE/TCLKITSH-WIN32.EXE"
 
and then when clicking OK every thing vanishes.
 
 
 

 
 
 --=_643880F6.482947F6-- From franco.pozzer@infocamere.it Fri Nov 15 08:07:14 2002 Received: from dns01.infocamere.it (dns01.infocamere.it [193.70.148.50]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAFE7Da02634 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 08:07:13 -0600 Received: (qmail 24751 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 14:08:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lxm03.icnet) (80.82.0.113) by 0 with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 14:08:00 -0000 Received: from infocamere.it (lxm03.icnet [1.5.24.80]) (authenticated bits=0) by lxm03.icnet (8.12.4/8.12.4) with ESMTP id gAFE809t006806 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 15:08:00 +0100 Message-ID: <3DD4FFB9.FEC91B87@infocamere.it> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 15:07:53 +0100 From: Franco Pozzer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------ECE24245B11AE0251AE80387" Subject: [Starkit] how to assemble startkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --------------ECE24245B11AE0251AE80387 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit thanks for all for read my msg and thanks for help. I want to assemble a startkit of my application. My application it is a installer custom procedure Apache+PHP+my_app object like PHP script, XML files, JavaScript, CSS and so on. My application web_based must be executed into the desktop of the User's. It is web based breakdown application but stand alone application. After write this I have make for install all components (Apache package + PHP package + my application package) an installer.tcl procedure. The installer.tcl must to have same exernal file .ini like installer.ini, fileVersion.ini, licence.ini. Of course it must be present also Apache.exe and PHP.zip and My_appl.zip. I like very mutch to distributed all these components with only one file like My_appl.kit These kit My_appl.kit must be execute into the desktop in wich are not install the Tcl Tk interpreter. I have make same step in the W2000 where I do not have interpreter Tcl Tk: 1. dowload tclkit.exe 2. download tclkitsh.exe 3. download sdx.kit and sdx.bat 4. from prompt Dos executed cmd like: sdx wrap my_application.tcl 5. in the same path I have all files and all components that are call from my_application.tcl source code 6. sdx create a .kit like my_application.kit *but not a .bat like my_application.bat* 7. I can execute .kit like prompt Dos with this cmd: tclkit my_application.kit. or with .bat like cmd into .bat: @tclkit my_appl.kit%1 %2 %3 %4 %5 I have an error like can't find main.tcl............................... and .kit do not work Can anyone have idea where I have to mistake? Thanks for help and sorry for my english: it is not good. ciao Franco www.infocamere.it --------------ECE24245B11AE0251AE80387 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit thanks for all for read my msg and thanks for help.

I want to assemble a startkit of my application.

My application it is a installer custom procedure Apache+PHP+my_app object like PHP script, XML files, JavaScript, CSS and so on.

My application web_based must be executed into the desktop of the User's. It is web based breakdown application but stand alone application.

After write this I have make for install all components (Apache package + PHP package + my application package) an  installer.tcl procedure.

The installer.tcl must to have same exernal file .ini like installer.ini, fileVersion.ini, licence.ini. Of course it must be present also Apache.exe and PHP.zip and My_appl.zip.

I like very mutch to distributed all these components  with only one file like My_appl.kit

These kit My_appl.kit must be execute into the desktop in wich are not install the Tcl Tk interpreter.

I have make same step in the W2000 where I do not have interpreter Tcl Tk:

1. dowload tclkit.exe

2. download tclkitsh.exe

3. download sdx.kit and sdx.bat

4. from prompt Dos executed cmd like: sdx wrap my_application.tcl

5. in the same path I have all files and all components that are call from my_application.tcl source code

6. sdx create a .kit like my_application.kit *but not a .bat like my_application.bat*

7. I can execute .kit like prompt Dos with this cmd: tclkit my_application.kit. or with .bat like cmd into .bat: @tclkit my_appl.kit%1 %2 %3 %4 %5

I have an error like can't find main.tcl............................... and .kit do not work

Can anyone  have idea where I have to mistake?

Thanks for help and sorry for my english: it is not good.

ciao Franco

www.infocamere.it --------------ECE24245B11AE0251AE80387-- From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Nov 15 17:01:37 2002 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAFN1Za09619 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:01:36 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18CpTm-0006WK-00; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 00:02:26 +0100 Message-ID: <3DD57CFC.1090103@kocjan.org> Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 00:02:20 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Franco Pozzer CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] how to assemble startkit References: <3DD4FFB9.FEC91B87@infocamere.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: You might want to consider looking at http://installbase.sf.net/. It is a complete installation package, which you might find very useful. It is also written in Tcl, so AFAIR you can put Tcl scripts which will be run during the installation. If you want to build your own installer, then I'd do it this way: echo exit >install.tcl sdx.bat qwrap install.tcl sdx.bat unwrap install.kit Then you'll have a complete install.vfs dir, which you may want to expand in time. Then do sdx.bat wrap install.exe -runtime C:/starkit/tclkit.exe (or some other path to tclkit.exe :) -- WK (written at Stardate 56873.9) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Sun Nov 17 06:45:12 2002 Received: from meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.57]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAHCjBa13869 for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 06:45:11 -0600 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18DOoR-0005KO-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 13:46:07 +0100 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 18DOoR-0001tT-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 13:46:07 +0100 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAHCk7v04361 for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 13:46:07 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 13:46:07 +0100 (MET) From: Guenther Fischer To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -0.3 (/) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18DOoR-0005KO-00*9deHBIKl.sg* Subject: [Starkit] tclkit, kitten Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I treid to use tdom from kitten with tclkit. tclkit %source kitten.kit %package require tdom 387324couldn't load file "/tmp/tclbIXRg9": /tmp/tclbIXRg9: undefined symbol: Tcl_GetChannel What is wrong? -- ~Guenther Fischer From jcw@equi4.com Sun Nov 17 07:04:42 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAHD4fa14468 for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 07:04:41 -0600 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 14:05:36 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit, kitten Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <43767FC3-FA2D-11D6-BE01-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Guenther Fischer wrote: > I treid to use tdom from kitten with tclkit. > > tclkit > %source kitten.kit > %package require tdom > 387324couldn't load file "/tmp/tclbIXRg9": /tmp/tclbIXRg9: undefined > symbol: Tcl_GetChannel > > What is wrong? Whoops - looks like tdom has not been built with stubs enabled. If anyone has such a build (Linux, I suppose), please send it and I'll replace the one in Kitten. If not, it make take a while before I have time to do it myself :( -jcw From joachim.zaers@web.de Tue Nov 19 04:36:13 2002 Received: from mailout04.sul.t-online.com (mailout04.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.18]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJAaCa17208 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 04:36:12 -0600 Received: from fwd03.sul.t-online.de by mailout04.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18E5kj-0005Ww-04; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 11:37:09 +0100 Received: from tokio (520094259637-0001@[217.2.75.126]) by fmrl03.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18E5kS-0uMkYyC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 11:36:52 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Joachim Zaers Reply-To: joachim.zaers@web.de Organization: JoSoft Consulting To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 11:38:19 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200211191138.19494.joachim.zaers@web.de> X-Sender: 520094259637-0001@t-dialin.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gAJAaCa17208 Subject: [Starkit] Setup of auto_path during init/main.tcl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Starkitters! I ran into a strange problem which I thought should be solved by starkit initialization when using the -runtime option to build a starpack. I had to extend the main.tcl to add all my additional dirs in lib to the auto_path variable. Without this addition the starkit does not find the included script files. This is what I'm using right now: # main.tcl package require starkit package require Tk starkit::startup puts "auto_path 1: $auto_path" foreach iPath [glob -nocomplain [file join [info nameofexecutable] lib *]] { if { -1 == [lsearch $auto_path $iPath] } { lappend auto_path $iPath } } puts "auto_path 2: $auto_path" package require app-test # end of main.tcl The output looks like this: jz@tokio:/tmp> ./test.kit auto_path 1: /tmp/test.kit/lib/tcl8.4 /tmp/test.kit/lib /tmp/test.kit/lib/tk8.4 auto_path 2: /tmp/test.kit/lib/tcl8.4 /tmp/test.kit/lib /tmp/test.kit/lib/tk8.4 /tmp/test.kit/lib/BWidget-1.4.0 /tmp/test.kit/lib/app-test /tmp/test/lib/itcl3.3 /tmp/test.kit/lib/tablelist2.7 /tmp/test.kit/lib/vfs I think that I'm make a dumb mistake here. Any idea? All subdirectories have a pkgIndex.tcl and tclIndex. -- Joachim Zaers Email : joachim.zaers@web.de From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 19 07:59:12 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJDxBa28697 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 07:59:11 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAJDxu7e022679 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 08:59:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAJDxut01420; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 08:59:56 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 08:59:56 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021119085956.AAB1399@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Setup of auto_path during init/main.tcl In-Reply-To: <200211191138.19494.joachim.zaers@web.de> of Tue, 19 Nov 2002 11:38:19 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Joachim Zaers > I ran into a strange problem > Without this > addition the starkit does not find the included script > files. > I think that I'm make a dumb mistake here. Any idea? > All subdirectories have a pkgIndex.tcl and tclIndex. Can you do an ls -lR on the .vfs directory to show us what is being wrapped up into the .kit? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 19 14:02:36 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJK2Xa23891 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:02:36 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAJK3O7e005790 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:03:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAJK3Ne06301; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:03:23 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:03:23 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021119150323.AAB6212@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: One of the things that mull about in my head is user doc - I get users all the time trying to figure out how to use this tool or that tool. I was thinking today about how I myself use tclkit as the programming environment on an antique mac I have. The problem is that there is never any doc around. Then I thought about the tcl84dok.kit file, which is the man pages for an older release of tcl (and tk I believe) 8.4 . I began, however, wondering if a wikit might not be a better form for the docs - except how do you go about populating the wikit initially. Anyways, I just thought I would drop these ideas to the list to see whether anyone else had a common interest. P.S. I would still be happy to provide assistance in updating the dok.kit files, whenever I a) finally find out what needs to occur and b) get working tools to do it. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From joachim.zaers@web.de Tue Nov 19 14:21:07 2002 Received: from mailout04.sul.t-online.com (mailout04.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.18]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJKL5a25416 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:21:06 -0600 Received: from fwd09.sul.t-online.de by mailout04.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18EEsk-0002pX-08; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 21:22:02 +0100 Received: from tokio (340091591805-0001@[217.2.207.127]) by fmrl09.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18EEsc-1SQL7gC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 21:21:54 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Joachim Zaers Reply-To: joachim.zaers@web.de Organization: JoSoft Consulting To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Setup of auto_path during init/main.tcl Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 21:23:00 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200211192123.00671.joachim.zaers@web.de> X-Sender: 340091591805-0001@t-dialin.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gAJKL5a25416 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > Can you do an ls -lR on the .vfs directory to show us what is being > wrapped up into the .kit? Larry, thanks for the response. Application is packaged with "sdx wrap app-test.kit -runtime tclkit-linux" The application is running fine with the unchanged main.tcl, when using tclkit on main.tcl. Moving the wrapped binary to a different directory without changing main.tcl as previously described, breaks the application. It is an application using BWidgets and Tablelist. All pure Tcl. No binary extension so far (see my posting on BLT some days ago). Looks like this (slightly edited): xjz@tokio:~/projects> ls -lR app-test.vfs/ app-test.vfs/: total 16 -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 497 2002-11-07 21:57 Makefile drwxr--r-- 5 xjz users 4096 2002-11-19 10:38 lib -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 318 2002-11-19 11:39 main.tcl app-test.vfs/lib: total 12 drwxr--r-- 7 xjz users 4096 2002-11-18 12:43 BWidget-1.4.0 drwxr--r-- 2 xjz users 4096 2002-11-19 11:19 app-test drwxr--r-- 3 xjz users 4096 2002-11-18 12:41 tablelist2.7 app-test.vfs/lib/BWidget-1.4.0: SNIP: contains a full BWidget tree. app-test.vfs/lib/app-test: total 116 -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 290 2002-11-15 07:47 Makefile -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 8865 2002-11-06 17:16 crc16.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 614 2002-11-19 10:38 pkgIndex.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 5582 2002-11-19 10:38 tclIndex -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 5942 2002-11-18 12:37 test.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 24633 2002-11-18 10:16 test1.tcl app-test.vfs/lib/tablelist2.7: total 16 -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 491 2002-11-18 12:41 COPYRIGHT.txt -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 707 2002-11-18 12:41 pkgIndex.tcl drwxr--r-- 2 xjz users 4096 2002-11-18 12:41 scripts -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 1056 2002-11-18 12:41 tablelist.tcl app-test.vfs/lib/tablelist2.7/scripts: total 216 -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 9954 2002-11-18 12:41 mwutil.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 2058 2002-11-18 12:41 repair.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 1582 2002-11-18 12:41 tablelistSortByColumn.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 187121 2002-11-18 12:41 tablelistWidget.tcl -rwxr--r-- 1 xjz users 8646 2002-11-18 12:41 tclIndex Best regards, Jo. -- Joachim Zaers Email : joachim.zaers@web.de From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Nov 19 14:46:43 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJKkha27598 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:46:43 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gAJKlfEX010466 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:47:41 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA12566 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:43:29 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAGDT; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:47:40 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDAA399.86D7CD4F@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:48:25 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... References: <20021119150323.AAB6212@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, I have been thinking about how to setup a development environment for starkit development. There has been some discussion about developing something called startools that would contain the core functionality for developers. Part of this functionality should be manuals for tcl/tk and documentation on the startools included in the development kit. My current approach is to download the ASPN/ActiveTcl distribution and the reference documentation. I don't This distribution includes a large number of packages along with documentation that is valid for the distribution. I think it would be a waste of time to convert the documentation into a starkit. If wikit is used as the document viewing tool for startools then the startool app should start up an http server so it can access the ActiveTcl documentation (and potentially other documentation) directly. I would also like to point out that the XXXdok.kit's (from my point of view) are all broken because I can't do % tclkit tcl84dok.kit to view the documents. When I do I get the following error can't find package Tkhtml while executing "package require Tkhtml" (file "/home/rna020/local/starkit/tcl84dok.kit/main.tcl" line 8) invoked from within "source /home/rna020/local/starkit/tcl84dok.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" My believe is that a "true" starkit should include everything that is needed, not just some of the stuff. Regards, Tom K. > One of the things that mull about in my head is user doc - I get > users all the time trying to figure out how to use this tool or that tool. > > I was thinking today about how I myself use tclkit as the programming > environment on an antique mac I have. The problem is that there is never > any doc around. > > Then I thought about the tcl84dok.kit file, which is the man pages > for an older release of tcl (and tk I believe) 8.4 . > > I began, however, wondering if a wikit might not be a better form for > the docs - except how do you go about populating the wikit initially. > > Anyways, I just thought I would drop these ideas to the list to see whether > anyone else had a common interest. > > P.S. I would still be happy to provide assistance in updating the dok.kit > files, whenever I a) finally find out what needs to occur and b) get > working tools to do it. From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 19 15:32:04 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJLW4a31518 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:32:04 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAJLWs7e001302 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 16:32:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAJLWrt07710; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 16:32:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 16:32:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021119163253.AAB7661@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:48:25 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Tom Krehbiel > My current approach is to download the ASPN/ActiveTcl distribution and the reference documentation. I don't This distribution I would not want to make downloading ActiveTcl a prerequisite for getting tcl and tk doc. > I would also like to point out that the XXXdok.kit's (from my point of view) are all broken because I can't do > > % tclkit tcl84dok.kit > > to view the documents. When I do I get the following error Sounds to me like your platform isn't supported by the dok.kit - perhaps you could contribute the tkhtml binary files necessary to be added to the dok.kits so that it can work. > My believe is that a "true" starkit should include everything that is needed, not just some of the stuff. That's going to be pretty tough to get to work, since the source for a tclkit is going to be available for people to build it on all sorts of platforms. Only when those people also build tkhtml and make it available will that be possible, if we use dok.kit technology. On the other hand, wikit as far as I am aware runs on all the platforms. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Nov 19 16:58:19 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJMwJa06697 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 16:58:19 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gAJMxH7b020116 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:59:17 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA22982 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:59:17 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAGK3; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:59:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDAC26A.D99648E5@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:59:54 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... References: <20021119163253.AAB7661@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > > My current approach is to download the ASPN/ActiveTcl distribution and > > the reference documentation. I don't This distribution > > I would not want to make down loading ActiveTcl a prerequisite for getting > tcl and tk doc. The doc can be down loaded separately from the distribution. > > I would also like to point out that the XXXdok.kit's (from my point of > > view) are all broken because I can't do > > > > % tclkit tcl84dok.kit > > > > to view the documents. When I do I get the following error > > Sounds to me like your platform isn't supported by the dok.kit - perhaps > you could contribute the tkhtml binary files necessary to be added to > the dok.kits so that it can work. > > > My believe is that a "true" starkit should include everything that is > > needed, not just some of the stuff. > > That's going to be pretty tough to get to work, since the source for a > tclkit is going to be available for people to build it on all sorts of > platforms. Only when those people also build tkhtml and make it available > will that be possible, if we use dok.kit technology. On the other hand, > wikit as far as I am aware runs on all the platforms. I agree with you completely. My point wasn't that I wanted to use the tcl84dok.kit but that I didn't (for the reasons that you state). My point is that if we go down the wikit path we should also include tclhttpd support so that existing documentation can be used directly. I don't think tclhttpd an wikit are currently compatible but I think this is being worked on. No doubt there will be some platform issues with tclhttpd but wikit should still be functional even if a server can't be started. What isn't currently clear to me is whether the tclhttpd process can be made smart enough to look inside a vfs file for web pages (i.e. the same vfs that contains the wikit and tclhttpd code) Tom K. From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Tue Nov 19 22:05:10 2002 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK459a00883 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 22:05:09 -0600 Received: from krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (root@krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.12]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAK465e02397 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:06:05 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2002112015060412754 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:06:04 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK464E02390 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:06:04 +1100 (EST) From: Steve Cassidy To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 20 Nov 2002 15:05:49 +1100 Message-Id: <1037765149.15215.1445.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Starkit] Starlib? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've just come accross a barrier to my use of Starkits which is that I'd like to use the R (stats package) tcltk extension which allows me to run tcl code from within R. This requires the tcl83.dll and tk83.dll files to operate since it dynamically loads a dll that depends on them. If I deliver my app as a starkit, these dlls won't be around. I wondered whether the tclkit approach might work for building a dll as well as for a single file executable. Ie. could I build a tclkit.dll which had almost everything in it except for main() and which could be dyn.loaded into R. Of course you could also build a stub wish or tclsh which link against these too. Now, this goes away from the 'one file install' ideal but I don't see another way of achieving this goal of embedding tcl in a third party app while still using tclkit. Any thoughts? Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Nov 19 22:19:43 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAK4Jga01690 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 22:19:43 -0600 Received: (qmail 9043 invoked by uid 0); 20 Nov 2002 04:33:10 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 04:33:10 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA31401 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 23:20:39 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAK4KeU11200 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 23:20:40 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211200420.gAK4KeU11200@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 23:20:40 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm trying to create a starpack runtime for MacOS classic (9). I create a starpack under Linux (RH 7.3) like this: sdx wrap scrollHtml.bin -runtime tclkit-macos-ppc.bin When I FTP it over to the mac and double click it, it opens a wish window and console, instead of the application. Similar command (different runtime) for Linux and Windows works OK, and starts the application, as expected. The icon for the wrapped Application comes up labeled as tclkit-mac-ppc.1, instead of scrollHtml. Running file (under linux) *.bin says: scrollHtml.bin: Macintosh MacBinary data, type "APPL" (application), creator "TKd4" Any hints about what I'm doing stupid? Clif From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 03:27:46 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK9Rja20050 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 03:27:45 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:28:43 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starlib? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1037765149.15215.1445.camel@climie> Message-Id: <761B873A-FC6A-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: > I've just come accross a barrier to my use of Starkits which is that > I'd like to use the R (stats package) tcltk extension which allows me > to > run tcl code from within R. This requires the tcl83.dll and tk83.dll > files to operate since it dynamically loads a dll that depends on them. > If I deliver my app as a starkit, these dlls won't be around. > > I wondered whether the tclkit approach might work for building a dll as > well as for a single file executable. Ie. could I build a tclkit.dll > which had almost everything in it except for main() and which could be > dyn.loaded into R. Of course you could also build a stub wish or tclsh > which link against these too. Now, this goes away from the 'one file > install' ideal but I don't see another way of achieving this goal of > embedding tcl in a third party app while still using tclkit. > > Any thoughts? Shudder. And maintain 30 new binaries? Why not simply compile R with stubs enabled? A 2-line addition to the source, and a switch to the stubs lib in the makefile? It might be doable by passing a Tcl_Interp* address into R some way - though I don't know anything about the setup? Is there a place to investigate the sources for this? If nothing else works, I'd set up a sharing mechanism through pipes, sockets, or shared mem. There really is no that much difference between load an extension and running an app with an efficient I/O path between them. I'd definitely not go the route of a loadable "starlib" - even if you end up with something that is wrapped as a single unit, it'd be a maintenance concern... IMO. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 03:37:28 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK9bRa20678 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 03:37:27 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:38:25 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200211200420.gAK4KeU11200@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif Flynt wrote: > I'm trying to create a starpack runtime for MacOS classic (9). > > I create a starpack under Linux (RH 7.3) like this: > > sdx wrap scrollHtml.bin -runtime tclkit-macos-ppc.bin You're going to have to do this on the Mac. Reason: mac files have a "data fork" and a "resource fork". The .bin files are an exchange format which ties them together (along with a bit of "finder info"). Catenating anything a the end probably will simply be ignored on unpack - which is what happens once you take it to the mac and unpack through StuffIt Expander or some such (Mac browsers tend to do that automatically, right after download). > When I FTP it over to the mac and double click it, it opens a wish > window and console, instead of the application. Exactly. > Similar command (different runtime) for Linux and Windows works OK, > and starts the application, as expected. > > The icon for the wrapped Application comes up labeled as > tclkit-mac-ppc.1, > instead of scrollHtml. > > Running file (under linux) *.bin says: > scrollHtml.bin: Macintosh MacBinary data, type "APPL" (application), > creator "TKd4" Yes. If you do it on the Mac, while the forks are distcint, sdx will concatenate after the data fork. Then you can run it through StuffIt to create the transferable .bin version. Running SDX on the Mac takes some trickery, since SDX is command-line driven, and the Mac has only tclkit: 1. Launch tclkit 2. In its console, type: set argv [list wrap myapp -prefix mytclkit] source sdx.kit 3. The sdx starkit will perform its work (and exit, I think) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 03:47:57 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK9lua21354 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 03:47:56 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:48:54 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DDAC26A.D99648E5@motorola.com> Message-Id: <48585B10-FC6D-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >>> I would also like to point out that the XXXdok.kit's (from my point >>> of >>> view) are all broken because I can't do >>> >>> % tclkit tcl84dok.kit >>> >>> to view the documents. When I do I get the following error You're hitting the fact that tcl84dok.kit only include tkhtml for linux, solaris, and win32. And that the error you get is particularly unhelpful in making that clear, probably. [...] As fpr the rest of your post, I'm afraid I don't quite understand what you want to achieve. Have docs on all platforms? Have a way to read html docs from wikit? Note that Andreas Kupries has recently added wikit markup as one of the *generated* output formats from the tcl/tk docs. It's slightly limited because there are no tables, and no nested bullets. If you are looking for ways to read tcl/tk docs on any platforms, two options come to my mind: use html and a browser, or use wikit. Again, I'm not sure what the arguments made mean, because I don't (yet) understand where you're headed... > My point is that if we go down the wikit path we should also include > tclhttpd support so that existing documentation can be used directly. Ah, you mean - a starkit which runs wikit but integrates tclhttpd? No, wait, that doesn't solve it. Tclhttpd running wikit? No, sorry - I can't figure it out - help, please... > What isn't currently clear to me is whether the tclhttpd process can > be made smart enough to look inside a vfs file for web pages (i.e. the > same vfs that contains the wikit and tclhttpd code) Tclhttpd can mount any starkit of course, which then looks like a directory tree with files in it. In fact, it could do so today, with the tcl84dok.kit file - inside is an html/ subdir with a *verbatim* copy of the Activetcl documentation distribution... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 03:55:49 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK9tna21842 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 03:55:49 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:56:47 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Along the lines of hiding code in Starkit/pack? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DD122DA.13A17C41@motorola.com> Message-Id: <6216DBFC-FC6E-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > <..snip..> > > $.02 - I would very much like to see (and I think it will be important > to first time user acceptance) a "startool" that displays a tool bar > and provides ready access to core documentation. A command line > interface should also be supported for use in scripts. Customizing > the tool bar should also be supported through an interface definition > that allows easy addition or removal of > applications and their documentation. Are you saying you want an IDE-like system? Are TclDevKit, or even Komodo, of any use in this context? My point is not that it can't - or shouldn't - be done, but that it really is an issue that lies outside the domain of starkits. If you replace "starkit" with "directory", then perhaps it becomes clearer what I mean: "I would like to see a directory with scripts that do X, Y, and Z". My response to that would be "excellent, let's build it, go for it!". Starkits are a wrapping mechanism. Yes, by all means, lets create lots of practical structures for development - but as far as I can tell it really is something anyone can do at any time. Wrapping the whole thing up as a starkit is merely the last small step in that effort. Or am I missing something? -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 04:13:04 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKAD3a23311 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:13:03 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:14:02 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200211200531.KAA07052@odusv.oduurl.ru> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Aside feature question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ilja V.Levinson wrote: > Hello All, > > first, I would like to introduce a new port of the Metakit > library. It was successfully compiled and installed on > the OS-9/68k (http://www.microware.com) system. > > Note - it's a real time operating system, not Mac related OS! Great - congratulations! Did you have to make any changes? Anything that needs to be folded back into the basic distribution so you can rebuild future versions more easily? > [...] Unfortunatelly, aside strategy uses very much assitional space. > [...] Yes. The design of commit aside was to create a small difference set, but the code actually track differences and come up with a good small set of "change descriptions" has not been implemented so far. Commit aside was the spin-off of a project which was never fully completed, and for a long long time my focus has been to just get the new 2.3/2.4 file format and the rest of the code rock-solid again. > for small database (10000 records, ~200K) changing one field in one > row requires about 20K (10% of the full data size!) for *each*. Adding > one record uses full database size (100%!). The mechanism to store things efficiently is there. But right now, MK stores entire columns as "change sets", instead of offset/data pairs to describe differences. Finishing this code is not hard, but nevertheless a sizeable amount fo work to get right. I'm not sure when I'll be able to get to this. Then again, I do tend to accept paid work commissioned to me / Equi4 Software > May be, I should manually use some Differ() methods? You could store view insert/delete/modify requests and replay them on open - but that approach may lead to relatively high memory use, as changes cause all affected views to be loaded. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 04:17:23 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKAHNa23670 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:17:23 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:18:21 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Aside feature question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6567CA50-FC71-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ilja V.Levinson wrote: [...] > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/metakit Sorry about that silly mixup - it was intended for the Metakit mailing list :) -jcw From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Wed Nov 20 04:20:07 2002 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKAK5a23881; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:20:06 -0600 Received: from krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (root@krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.12]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAKAL3e00780; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:21:03 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2002112021210225007 ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:21:02 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKAL2E00774; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:21:02 +1100 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starlib? From: Steve Cassidy To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <761B873A-FC6A-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <761B873A-FC6A-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 20 Nov 2002 21:20:46 +1100 Message-Id: <1037787646.15218.1841.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wed, 2002-11-20 at 20:28, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Steve Cassidy wrote: > > I wondered whether the tclkit approach might work for building > > a dll as well as for a single file executable. Ie. could I > > build a tclkit.dll > Shudder. And maintain 30 new binaries? > > Why not simply compile R with stubs enabled? A 2-line addition to the > source, and a switch to the stubs lib in the makefile? It might be > doable by passing a Tcl_Interp* address into R some way - though I > don't know anything about the setup? Is there a place to investigate > the sources for this? No, R _loads_ tcl/tk in the same way that python loads it for tkinter, it's all about who's in charge and in this case it's R not tcl. You can see the sources at via www.r-project.org if you wish (the tcltk code is in library/tcltk/src/ in the tar file). What they have is a little library that provides an interface between R and Tcl which is linked against tcl.dll and tk.dll. It could link against the stubs libraries but the dlls would still be needed for loading into R. Before you ask, I've implemented a binding in the other direction (R can be built as a library) but there are event loop problems (R has it's own) which make it a bigger problem than I can solve just now. > If nothing else works, I'd set up a sharing mechanism through pipes, > sockets, or shared mem. That's more or less what I have now (via files and exec) and it's messy and error prone. I'd like to move everything in-process if possible. By calling tcl code from R I can manipulate sound files with Snack and access various DSP routines; I only have to write them once to access them from Tcl or R. Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 04:24:19 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKAOJa24187; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:24:19 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:25:17 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit, kitten Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <43767FC3-FA2D-11D6-BE01-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-Id: <5D3BB22E-FC72-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Guenther Fischer wrote: > >> I treid to use tdom from kitten with tclkit. >> >> tclkit >> %source kitten.kit >> %package require tdom >> 387324couldn't load file "/tmp/tclbIXRg9": /tmp/tclbIXRg9: undefined >> symbol: Tcl_GetChannel >> >> What is wrong? > > Whoops - looks like tdom has not been built with stubs enabled. FYI, Chuck Ferrill submitted a starkit with tdom in it on sdarchive: http://mini.net/sdarchive/ Look under the "Packages" section, it has just been added by Steve Landers. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 04:46:47 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKAkka25713 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:46:46 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:47:45 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starlib? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1037787646.15218.1841.camel@climie> Message-Id: <807DFE72-FC75-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: >> Why not simply compile R with stubs enabled? [...] > > No, R _loads_ tcl/tk in the same way that python loads it for tkinter, > it's all about who's in charge and in this case it's R not tcl. Ah, ok - understood. [...] > Before you ask, I've implemented a binding in the other direction (R > can > be built as a library) but there are event loop problems (R has it's > own) which make it a bigger problem than I can solve just now. > >> If nothing else works, I'd set up a sharing mechanism through pipes, >> sockets, or shared mem. > > That's more or less what I have now (via files and exec) and it's messy > and error prone. I'd like to move everything in-process if possible. > [...] That's why I didn't suggest files but pipes/sockets/shmem ... > calling tcl code from R I can manipulate sound files with Snack and > access various DSP routines; I only have to write them once to access > them from Tcl or R. Understand. Here's another approach - might be a little mind-twisting, but it should work: Firsto of all: R's tcltk_init() does "Tcl_CreateInterp()" as first step, then the rest of the logic - including all sorts of event-loop magic, right? So why not use tclkit's interp and do the rest just like R does it? 1) Tclkit launches, creates an interp, etc 2) It loads R as extension, passing it the Tcl_Interp* it already has 3) R takes over, doing all the stuff it does in tcltk.c and never returns to tclkit What does would do is never make tclkit set up event stuff nor even initialize Tk. The change needed is that "void tcltk_init(void) {...}" needs to get an extra arg, being the Tcl_interp* that tclkit passes to R. And that it omits the call to create its own interp. So the only thing that changes rom running R as main, is that it gets loaded from tclkit, and that R "rides" on the tcl_interp that has already been created by tclkit. After that R can consider itself fully in control - if that makes it happy. But because of stub linkage, R now calls things in the exe that loaded it, instead of pulling in stuff from yet another spot? -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Nov 20 05:16:38 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKBGca27612 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 05:16:38 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAKBHT7e019819 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAKBHUu01519; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:17:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:17:30 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021120061730.AAB1486@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... In-Reply-To: <48585B10-FC6D-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:48:54 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: What _I_ am after is a way for a single binary - a tclkit file - to be able to be used as a Tcl/Tk development tool without the developer needing to download and install a lot of other files. Note that I am not saying that I want the doc within the tclkit image. Just that someone using tclkit and starkits should have access to all the reference docs in a simple manner - either a dok.kit or a wi.kit . What I am hoping for is the ability to make use of the docs with just simple tools perhaps included with the startool - no requirements for web browsers or downloading lots of additional stuff. A nice addition would be the ability to annotate the docs and to write new documentation to fill in blanks as necessary. The wi.kit would provide the possibility of the developer adding personal annotations (though that might make updates more difficult if not designed carefully). The dok.kit should, in theory, be quicker to update from a central source. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Nov 20 05:21:20 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKBLKa27951 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 05:21:20 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAKBMB7e020360 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:22:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAKBMBa01560; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:22:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:22:11 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021120062211.AAB1537@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starlib? In-Reply-To: <1037787646.15218.1841.camel@climie> of 20 Nov 2002 21:20:46 +1100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It seems to me that we have to be careful not to fall into the trap of seeing the entire world as a nail, just because we have a nifty hammer called starkit. Starkits are designed as an application delivery system. Perhaps instead of trying to load starkits as if they were dlls, what you could do is write a trivial (hopefully) main.tcl that parses the command line arguments of the starkit invocation, then have it copy out the appropriate dll files from the VFS. That way, R makes the invocation, the starkit drops the appropriate platform dll into an argument provided location, then R dynamically loads it. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Nov 20 05:27:31 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKBRUa28350 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 05:27:30 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAKBSL7e021071 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:28:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAKBSMM01624; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:28:22 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:28:22 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021120062822.AAB1613@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit, kitten In-Reply-To: <5D3BB22E-FC72-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:25:17 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > FYI, Chuck Ferrill submitted a starkit with tdom in it on sdarchive: > http://mini.net/sdarchive/ > Look under the "Packages" section, it has just been added by Steve > Landers. So should tdom be removed from kitten then? If it doesn't work right in kitten, and it works right in a different starkit, then having it one place might be more useful. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 05:57:38 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKBvba30096 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 05:57:37 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 12:58:35 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit, kitten Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021120062822.AAB1613@cas.org> Message-Id: <66270C6E-FC7F-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >> FYI, Chuck Ferrill submitted a starkit with tdom in it on sdarchive: >> http://mini.net/sdarchive/ >> Look under the "Packages" section, it has just been added by Steve >> Landers. > > So should tdom be removed from kitten then? If it doesn't work right > in kitten, and it works right in a different starkit, then having it > one > place might be more useful. Yes, good point. Short answer: it should, if kitten were a maintained package. Long answer - I don't want to maintain the (false) illusion that kitten is a solution for anything or anyone. It was a proof of concept that happens to be used more often than expected because there seems to be a real need for such a collection. Which is fine, but if I keep fixing things in kitten, even just stripping bad stuff, it would continue to get used - which longer term is not going to work, I'm afraid. Despite all the fancy self-update stuff in there, I think it is best to consider kitten to *still* be no more than proof of concept, and perhaps a useful spot to pick some pre-built extensions from (or leave them in and mount, whatever is convenient). You're hereby invited to steal anything you like from it, and you can even feel good about it because nobody is going to call it stealing... There is a big, big, big (did I say BIG?) gaping hole w.r.t. a tcl repository. The SDarchive initiative keeps making that clear - but it also shows just how much more needs to be done to deal with submissions, documentation, sample code, wiki annotations, download urls, licensing, test suites, platform builds, version control, packaging variants, ... the list is endless, or at least huge. There's Cantcl, which also addresses several of these issues, and there are occasional noises from ActiveState about plans to have a repository - but I think it's fair to say that with all the plans and starter packs we now have, the task ahead is still too overwhelming and we're not likely to see a lot of results in the short term. Of course, the way to get from A to B it to start off an take it one step at the time. But I'm afraid I don't see any steps being taken now - everyone has a lot on their plate, and no one has the time it takes to actually be the "champion" and "ambassador" to make things actually happen. If Kitten is a source of inspiration for anyone, that's great - but the sooner we start calling it a junk yard, the better. The proper way forward is not about technology, that has been solved - with Tcl and Starkits able to handle a lot of use-scenario's IMO. The task ahead is an organizational one, one of consolidating the technology we have, of planning and laying out the path ahead, of making loud noises in public, of collaborating to make sure all good ideas are heard, and of building up momentum so lots of people can chip in and help in various ways. Tcl doesn't need a Kitten, it needs a CAT - a Coordinating Active Tcler :) -jcw From starkit-discuss@lists.webpub.net Wed Nov 20 07:05:11 2002 Received: from lists.webpub.net (smtpserver.junctionworld.com [203.42.97.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAKD59a01745 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 07:05:10 -0600 Received: from lists.webpub.net ([203.42.97.15]) by mailbox.junctionworld.com ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:06:06 -0000 From: "Julian M Noble" Reply-to: starkit-discuss@lists.webpub.net To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:06:06 GMT Subject: RE: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? Message-id: <3ddb88be.1d48.0@mailbox.junctionworld.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'd really like to see threads enabled by default. http://mini.net/tcl/1904 with respect to event-oriented programming contains the caveat: "if your code contains 'computing monoblocs' your program becomes unresponsive." which for me is no small caveat. I'm happy to use events where they fit, but I'm surprised more people don't seem to run into operations that block long enough to cause trouble - especially when doing network programming and interacting with other code modules/libraries that may not be under your control. The apparent general lack of enthusiasm for threads in TCL is a continual source of dismay for me.. The sooner it's enabled by default and extensions are thread-safe or thread-oblivious the better - heck, with a bit of mucking about I could even do satisfactory multithreading in Visual Basic 5 years ago. That said, I'm no expert on threaded programming - in fact from what I've read, I'm just the sort of programmer who should have shot myself in the foot with threads by now. Nevertheless, I find the threading paradigm well suited to my way of thinking about concurrent programming, especially on windows platforms where forking another process to get some real concurrency is a little less natural. In our small server system, 6 out of about 15 machines are dual CPU - and there'll presumably be a greater percentage of MP boxes in future. I had mispredicted that by 2002 machines running many (10's) CPUs would be cheaper and commonplace - but when/if this does eventuate, it'd be nice if TCL programmers could easily take advantage of this with a mature threading system. I just think if things aren't pushed a little with regards to threads in TCL - it'll take that much longer to get the remaining bugs out, and leave TCL further behind other languages in that area. I don't know what the issues are as far as running non-threaded programs in a thread enabled TCL - I've never noticed any problems, but I'd be interested to know what the effects are and if, as mentioned by Krik Leunissen it's a matter of performance; whether these effects are an inevitable consequence of thread-enabling or a temporary effect of the current implementation. Back to tclkit... wouldn't splitting things into a threaded and non-threaded version go against the idea of a "hassle-free runtime for Starkits" ? Cheers, Julian From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 07:56:04 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKDu4a04615 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 07:56:04 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 14:57:02 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] threaded tclkit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3ddb88be.1d48.0@mailbox.junctionworld.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Julian M Noble wrote: > I'd really like to see threads enabled by default. [...] And you make a lot of valid points to support that position... But let me add that multi-processing does not imply the need for threads. In one app I helped design, we had to drive hundreds of serial devices, all connected to a single machine. The initial solution was to fork and use pipes from a master process, but once that hit the 64-FD limit (an older Solaris setup), we switched to a master process (Tequila), driving any number of "satellites", each driving a 50 serial port processes. Don't laugh - it has scaled to tests of 500 connections, and performed abolutely fine. The production system runs for *years* uninterrupted on end, and has in fact delightfully practical "restartable subsystems". Processes can fail (even catastrophically and messing up memory) without bringing down an entire system, for example. Threads are great - processes can be great too. Evidently, each problem is different, and this is not a hammer for every nail. So I can definitely see cases where threads would be absolutely essential. I just wanted to present an example where threads would not have made a big impact. Threads introduce tricky parallelism/race issues of their own, they are not the panacea some people would like to make us all think they are. > "if your code contains 'computing monoblocs' your program becomes > unresponsive." At which point pre-emptive multi-processing - threads or tasks - is the solution. > The apparent general lack of enthusiasm for threads in TCL is a > continual source > of dismay for me.. The sooner it's enabled by default and extensions > are thread-safe > or thread-oblivious the better - heck, with a bit of mucking about I > could even > do satisfactory multithreading in Visual Basic 5 years ago. The "bit of mucking about" can be deceptive - look how long it takes to get some serious bits of code thread-safe (Tk?), and efficient (malloc?). > That said, I'm no expert on threaded programming - in fact from what > I've read, > I'm just the sort of programmer who should have shot myself in the > foot with > threads by now. Nevertheless, I find the threading paradigm well > suited to my > way of thinking about concurrent programming, especially on windows > platforms > where forking another process to get some real concurrency is a little > less > natural. I rarely make statements of this kind - but servers and Unix go together, eh, quite well... > In our small server system, 6 out of about 15 machines are dual CPU - > and there'll > presumably be a greater percentage of MP boxes in future. I had > mispredicted > that by 2002 machines running many (10's) CPUs would be cheaper and > commonplace Again, multi-CPU is not automatically tied to threads. Multi-processing includes multiple processes as solution... to repeat the obvious once more . > Back to tclkit... wouldn't splitting things into a threaded and > non-threaded > version go against the idea of a "hassle-free runtime for Starkits" ? Yes, that's where the sword cuts both ways - opposing a split is the main reason there is only one version of tclkit. Unfortunately, from your perspective, the side that ended up being picked was the non-threaded approach. I'm not saying this to down-play the significance of threads, nor even to oppose them in any way. In fact, by now it could be argued that a threaded build should be picked as the one-and-only standard choice for future tclkits. Tclkit is in a tough spot - it has to balance between being identical, and hence trailing, or being leading-edge, and hence varying between platforms. The reality of course, is never so clear cut - for example, on OSX threading is always on - apparently it is needed for the GUI. There is the issue of making sure all extensions are thread safe - which is a huge task, even just to verify. But there is also the middle ground of building tclkit thread-enabled, and then leaving it up to everyone to make sure they stuff they use works in the threading model they require. The good news is that I'm looking at the threading issues for tclkit right now. The least I want to do is make sure it can be built that way by anyone who wishes to do so. But I'll also add that the default tclkit builds will by necessity have to be extremely conservative in all choices made - I greatly prefer a common infrastructure which is *lower* in functionality, than a set of features which are tied to platforms, Tcl/Tk minor versions, etc. We currently have an extra-ordinary (and that is an understatement IMO) level of common Tcl/Tk functionality across a huge range of platforms, from several PDA's to several 64-bit and big-iron machines. It's by necessity "least common denominator", but look just how incredibly high that actually is: scripting, networking, OO, gui, database, VFS. Threading deserves a place, I agree. But we simply ain't there yet - and instead of pushing a square peg through what is currently a round hole, we can perhaps find solutions which are round and turn out to work quite nicely too. Tcl's lack of threading-everywhere support is not necessarily a sign that it isn't up to snuff - people just happen to look for other solutions, and come out ok. I'm still surprised that memory-mapped and shared-memory designs are not more commonplace - they offer high-bandwidth connectivity between processes. Being "OO" is a very similar discussion, BTW. Tcl is not as OO as some would like, but it has several aspects to it which help do things equivalently - though not purely OO. Each language has its own most effective idioms, IMO. But as I said, I'm looking at threading now, and will report here when things build properly again (they used to, but I seem to have messed up somewhere). -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Nov 20 11:25:23 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKHPNa19645; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:25:23 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id gAKHQXEt004331; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:26:34 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA09212; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:22:08 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAGY6; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:26:20 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDBC5EA.F11848E1@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:27:06 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... References: <48585B10-FC6D-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > Tom Krehbiel wrote: <..snip..> > As fpr the rest of your post, I'm afraid I don't quite understand what > you want to achieve. Have docs on all platforms? Have a way to read > html docs from wikit? I was responding to an earlier email and didn't have a clear end point in mind. The core of my comment is that I don't think starkit's should be used for documentation, I think the documentation should be included in a starkit with a facility (perhaps wikit) to display the documentation. > Note that Andreas Kupries has recently added wikit markup as one of the > *generated* output formats from the tcl/tk docs. It's slightly limited > because there are no tables, and no nested bullets. I was not aware of this this. Where is it availible? This would certainly simplify the problem. > If you are looking for ways to read tcl/tk docs on any platforms, two > options come to my mind: use html and a browser, or use wikit. > > Again, I'm not sure what the arguments made mean, because I don't (yet) > understand where you're headed... I'm not sure I can clear up all the confusion without an excessively long description of my vision. I will try here to clear up some of the points. My view of the world is that software development and delivered product are two seperate items and they both need documentation. The first needs documentation on tcl/tk/...etc. to perform the work required to develop software and the second needs dcoumentation on the developed product. It would be convinient (at least for me) to have both requirements met using the same system. I believe that wikit is close to this objective. On the issue of an IDE for tcl/tk development I am not particularly in favor of developing an IDE because I have had to many bad experences with supporting software that was developed in an IDE environment that is no longer availible. I don't have a problem depending on tcl/tk for the next 20 years but I'm not willing to commit to one IDE for that long. So, if I don't want an integrated environment then I must want a disintegrated environment, right? No, I want a tool kit environement. By this I mean a simple framework that provides all developers with easy access to the tools necessary to perform his/her job and any documentation that might be required. For convinence I will call this frame work startool. My vision is that startool would provide functions to do the following: 1) list all availible starkit extentions 2) view documentation on starkit extentions 3) run demo for any starkit extention 4) start any of the installed tools To perform these functions the startool framework would define a standard layout for starkit extentions and tools (you are already working on a standard structure for starkit extentions which will probabably be sufficent). The startool application would define the following set of path settings. 1) a path used to locate tclkit executables. This path would have a defined set of sub-directories for each of the possible platforms. 2) a path used to locate all starkit's With the above startool framework it would then be possible to down load a bwidgets starkit module into the starkits directory. Then use the startool application to display the documentation for bwidgets and run the bwidget demo's without any special knowledge. It would also be possible for anyone to develop a tool and add it to the startool's tool bar for convinent use during the develop process. Tool bar configuration would be done from a default in the users home dir and the local project dir so knowledge of project specific tools (a database browser for instance) would be kept with the project. > > My point is that if we go down the wikit path we should also include > > tclhttpd support so that existing documentation can be used directly. > > Ah, you mean - a starkit which runs wikit but integrates tclhttpd? No, > wait, that doesn't solve it. Tclhttpd running wikit? No, sorry - I > can't figure it out - help, please... > > > What isn't currently clear to me is whether the tclhttpd process can > > be made smart enough to look inside a vfs file for web pages (i.e. the > > same vfs that contains the wikit and tclhttpd code) > > Tclhttpd can mount any starkit of course, which then looks like a > directory tree with files in it. In fact, it could do so today, with > the tcl84dok.kit file - inside is an html/ subdir with a *verbatim* > copy of the Activetcl documentation distribution... I have only a limited understanding of wikit and no understanding of tclhttpd. I have used wikit enough to know that you can include url paths in a documents and wikit appears to "know" they are url's. When I click on the url, however, nothing occurs so I could only assume something was to happen and would it would be. My assumption was that the contents returned by the url would be displayed in the wikit. With this assumption I thought the wikit would behave as a browser (i.e. client) and the tclhttpd would act as a server. This assuption appears to be incorrect. If I understand what you are saying it sounds like you would use wikit like a cgi. Regards, Tom K. From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Nov 20 11:38:51 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKHcoa20917; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:38:50 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gAKHdiCk026041; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:39:44 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAKHdhO22484; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:39:44 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Tom Krehbiel" , "Jean-Claude Wippler" Cc: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:39:43 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3DDBC5EA.F11848E1@motorola.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jean-Claude, > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > <..snip..> > > > Note that Andreas Kupries has recently added wikit markup as one of the > > *generated* output formats from the tcl/tk docs. It's slightly limited > > because there are no tables, and no nested bullets. > > I was not aware of this this. Where is it availible? This would > certainly simplify the problem. Jean-Claude is refering to the doctools in tcllib, which contains an alpha-quality formatter for wiki-markup. I.e. Feed a manpage written in doctools into 'mpexpand -format wiki' and get wiki-markup as result. > On the issue of an IDE for tcl/tk development I am not > particularly in favor of developing an IDE because I have had to many bad > experences with supporting software that was developed in an IDE > environment that is no longer availible. I don't have a problem > depending on tcl/tk for the next 20 years but I'm not willing to > commit to one IDE for that long. What if the IDE is open and not restricting you to it ? F.e. Komodo IMHO. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Nov 20 12:56:48 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKIula27640 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 12:56:47 -0600 Received: from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gAKIvkYM007745 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:57:46 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA06377 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:57:45 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAHDR; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:56:59 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDBDB29.57225C0B@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:57:45 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Kupries CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas, > > Jean-Claude, > > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > > <..snip..> > > > > > Note that Andreas Kupries has recently added wikit markup as one of the > > > *generated* output formats from the tcl/tk docs. It's slightly limited > > > because there are no tables, and no nested bullets. > > > > I was not aware of this this. Where is it availible? This would > > certainly simplify the problem. > > Jean-Claude is refering to the doctools in tcllib, which contains an > alpha-quality formatter for wiki-markup. I.e. Feed a manpage written > in doctools into 'mpexpand -format wiki' and get wiki-markup as result. Thanks for the clarification. > > On the issue of an IDE for tcl/tk development I am not > > particularly in favor of developing an IDE because I have had to many bad > > experences with supporting software that was developed in an IDE > > environment that is no longer availible. I don't have a problem > > depending on tcl/tk for the next 20 years but I'm not willing to > > commit to one IDE for that long. > > What if the IDE is open and not restricting you to it ? F.e. Komodo IMHO. I must admit to a pretty high level of negative bias with regard to IDE's. This bias is based on my assumptions about what is meant by IDE and how IDE's are implemented. I'm not familiar enough with Komodo to know whether it is what I would call a tool kit or an IDE. The distinction in my mind is that IDE's store private information about a project that: 1) must be consistent with the project for continued use of the IDE 2) is required to perform builds and other critical operations on the project While a tool kit only: 1) stores context information for the project 2) provides access to a set of tools that are expected to be used by the work group when performing certain types of operations on a particular project. The tool kit approach doesn't do things like: 1) require the use of special editors so markup information can be stored and maintained in source files 2) provide a particular method for keeping track of source 3) provide a particular method for performing builds The bias I express above comes from experiences like the following. 1) A project that was developed with an IDE needed to be integrated into code that was not developed with the IDE or developed with a different IDE. 2) The cost structure associated with the IDE was changed so that management could no longer afford to license the IDE but the code still needed to be maintained. 3) Use of an IDE in prototyping went well but during product development a number of work-a-rounds were required that canceled any benefit provided by the use of the IDE. Tom K. From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Nov 20 13:13:36 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKJDaa29003 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:13:36 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gAKJETCk002613; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:14:30 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAKJETO04332; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:14:29 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Tom Krehbiel" Cc: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:14:29 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3DDBDB29.57225C0B@motorola.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Tom Krehbiel > Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 10:58 AM > To: Andreas Kupries > Cc: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Dok.kits vs wi.kits ... > > > Andreas, > > > > On the issue of an IDE for tcl/tk development I am not > > > particularly in favor of developing an IDE because I have had > to many bad > > > experences with supporting software that was developed in an IDE > > > environment that is no longer availible. I don't have a problem > > > depending on tcl/tk for the next 20 years but I'm not willing to > > > commit to one IDE for that long. > > > > What if the IDE is open and not restricting you to it ? F.e. > Komodo IMHO. > > I must admit to a pretty high level of negative bias with regard > to IDE's. This bias is based on my assumptions about what is meant > by IDE and how IDE's are implemented. I'm not familiar enough > with Komodo to know whether it is what I would call a tool kit or an Given the descriptions below I categorize Komodo as a toolkit and not an IDE. > IDE. The distinction in my mind is that IDE's store private > information about a project that: > > 1) must be consistent with the project for continued use of the IDE > 2) is required to perform builds and other critical operations on > the project > > While a tool kit only: > > 1) stores context information for the project > 2) provides access to a set of tools that are expected to be used > by the work group when performing certain types of operations on a > particular project. > > The tool kit approach doesn't do things like: > 1) require the use of special editors so markup information can > be stored and maintained in source files > 2) provide a particular method for keeping track of source > 3) provide a particular method for performing builds -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From clif@clif.cflynt.com Wed Nov 20 14:23:45 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAKKNia01769 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 14:23:44 -0600 Received: (qmail 38785 invoked by uid 0); 20 Nov 2002 20:37:08 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 20:37:08 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA02420; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:24:42 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAKKOg915506; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:24:42 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211202024.gAKKOg915506@clif.cflynt.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic To: jcw@equi4.com (Jean-Claude Wippler) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:24:42 -0500 (EST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com (Starkit list) In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Nov 20, 2002 10:38:25 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jean-Claude: > 1. Launch tclkit > 2. In its console, type: > set argv [list wrap myapp -prefix mytclkit] > source sdx.kit > 3. The sdx starkit will perform its work (and exit, I think) OK, no luck so far. Copied tclkit-mac-ppc.bin to the Mac and unpacked it. Copied the scrollHtml.vfs directory tree to the same folder. Copied sdx.kit to the folder. Launched tclkit-mac-ppc. In console typed: % set argv [list wrap scrollHtml -prefix tclkit-mac-ppc] % source sdx.kit The error messages is: couldn't read file ":sdx.kit:main.tcl": no such file or directory while executing "source :sdx.kit:main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" Am I missing something critical here? Clif From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 20 14:40:06 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKKe6a03029 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 14:40:06 -0600 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:41:04 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200211202024.gAKKOg915506@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: <635AA478-FCC8-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif Flynt wrote: > ":sdx.kit:main.tcl": no such file or Looks like an old version of sdx. I know that this will bring up comments about versions and how hard it is to track things with tclkit, sdx, etc at times - but all I can say is: the Tcl/Tk 2002 conference last September is the defining moment for just about everything related to tclkits and starkits. For the simple reason that it is the time when lots of tclkits were distributed on CD-ROM (i.e. the conference CD), and hence that version is going to be with us for quite some time, no doubt. If you're running older exe's and kits, please upgrade to anything after, say, half September... In the case of wikit, sdx, and critcl starkits - there is now another way to verify that you have the latest: unpack and look for a file called "ChangeLog". You can see the latest versions of these on the web by browsing to: http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/wikit/ ChangeLog?rev=HEAD http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/sdx/ ChangeLog?rev=HEAD http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/critcl/ ChangeLog?rev=HEAD -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Nov 20 14:45:22 2002 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKKjMa03440 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 14:45:22 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id gAKKkXEt026983 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:46:33 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA10497 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:46:21 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAHG8; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:46:20 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDBF4CA.386109DB@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:47:06 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Clif Flynt CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic References: <200211202024.gAKKOg915506@clif.cflynt.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, > > Jean-Claude: > > 1. Launch tclkit > > 2. In its console, type: > > set argv [list wrap myapp -prefix mytclkit] > > source sdx.kit > > 3. The sdx starkit will perform its work (and exit, I think) > > OK, no luck so far. > > Copied tclkit-mac-ppc.bin to the Mac and unpacked it. > Copied the scrollHtml.vfs directory tree to the same folder. > Copied sdx.kit to the folder. > > Launched tclkit-mac-ppc. > > In console typed: > % set argv [list wrap scrollHtml -prefix tclkit-mac-ppc] > % source sdx.kit > > The error messages is: > couldn't read file > ":sdx.kit:main.tcl": no such file or > directory > while executing > "source :sdx.kit:main.tcl" > ("uplevel" body line 1) > invoked from within > "uplevel [list source [file join $self > main.tcl]]" > > Am I missing something critical here? > > Clif Did you do a "puts [join [glob *] \n]" in the terminal to make sure sdx was visible to the shell prior to the source? Tom K. From clif@clif.cflynt.com Wed Nov 20 15:55:51 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAKLtpa08511 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:55:51 -0600 Received: (qmail 72591 invoked by uid 0); 20 Nov 2002 22:09:14 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 22:09:14 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA02848; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 16:56:47 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAKLumt16116; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 16:56:48 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211202156.gAKLumt16116@clif.cflynt.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic To: jcw@equi4.com (Jean-Claude Wippler) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 16:56:48 -0500 (EST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com (Starkit list) In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Nov 20, 2002 09:41:04 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks for the suggestions, but no cigars yet. > Clif Flynt wrote: > > > ":sdx.kit:main.tcl": no such file or > > Looks like an old version of sdx. I unwrapped the sdx.kit, and looked for a ChangeLog, but don't find one. The .tcl files in the unwrapped version are all timestamped Sep 27 15:23. My timestamp indicates I downloaded it in November 7. The tclkit-macos-ppc.bin is 2064000 bytes. I downloaded it on Nov 8. ... I checked with glob, and the sdx.kit file is present. ... I tried to fake this by copying a sdx.vfs directory tree to the Mac, and then starting a second copy of tclkit: Start tclkit-mac-ppc.1 % package require starkit 1.0 % starkit::startup sourced % set argv [list wrap scrollHtml -prefix tclkit-mac-ppc] wrap sdx -prefix tclkit-mac-ppc % lappend auto_path sdx.vfs:lib sdx.vfs % package require app-sdx Paused for a long while and exited. No change to the file system that I can see (no new scrollHtml application.) Any other suggestions? Anyone made this work? Clif From clif@clif.cflynt.com Wed Nov 20 21:19:05 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAL3J5a27521 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:19:05 -0600 Received: (qmail 82783 invoked by uid 0); 21 Nov 2002 03:32:24 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 03:32:24 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA03931; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:19:58 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAL3Jwx17346; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:19:58 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211210319.gAL3Jwx17346@clif.cflynt.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:19:58 -0500 (EST) Cc: steffen@maths.mq.edu.au In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Nov 20, 2002 09:41:04 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: A new interesting error - When I invoke the tclkit-mac-ppc kit, and type 'open foo w' into the console window, it fails to open a file with a "No Such File" error message. open [file join [pwd] foo] w also fails. The same open command typed from wish works OK, and creates an empty file. If the file exists, the open command works from the tclkit. Here's a procedure that almost works to generate a starpack (makes a starpack, but the starpack it makes won't run.) Copy an sdx.vfs directory tree to the Mac. Make a second copy of tclkit-mac-ppc. copy the scrollHtml.vfs tree to the Mac. These are all in the same folder: "Tcl/Tk Folder 8.4.1" Start wish set of [open scrollHtml w] close $of exit start tclkit-mac-ppc.1 package require starkit starkit::startup set argv [list wrap scrollHtml -runtime tclkit-mac-ppc] lappend auto_path sdx.vfs:lib sdx.vfs package require app-sdx This creates a scrollHtml binary that will start, and then seems to be trying to eval binary data - it fails with an illegal instruction message for Joy!peffpwpc (I find this string in the tclkit.) The UNIX strings output around the offending line is: tclkit-mac-ppc APPLTKd4! mBIN Joy!peffpwpc InterfaceLib MathLib ColorPickerLib Never a dull moment, Clif From jcw@equi4.com Thu Nov 21 03:55:26 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAL9tPa13351 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 03:55:25 -0600 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:56:24 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200211210319.gAL3Jwx17346@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: <7E8574AA-FD37-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif Flynt wrote: > A new interesting error - When I invoke the tclkit-mac-ppc kit, > and type 'open foo w' into the console window, it fails to > open a file with a "No Such File" error message. > > open [file join [pwd] foo] w > also fails. Baffling. Are there spaces in what [pwd] returns? Or non-ascii7 chars? > Here's a procedure that almost works to generate a starpack (makes a > starpack, but the starpack it makes won't run.) [...] > This creates a scrollHtml binary that will start, and then seems > to be trying to eval binary data - it fails with an illegal > instruction message > for Joy!peffpwpc (I find this string in the tclkit.) > > The UNIX strings output around the offending line is: > > tclkit-mac-ppc > APPLTKd4! > mBIN > Joy!peffpwpc > InterfaceLib > MathLib > ColorPickerLib Sounds like there is a .bin file in there - which shouldn't be. Ok, I think it's time for me to crank up good ol' mac classic again... sigh. Meanwhile - might I sheepishly ask whether creating a starkit on another platform and using that is an option? (It won't solve the write problem, alas) Nah, there seems to be no way out - it looks like I'll need to redo tclkit-mac-classic. Using Daniel's latest 8.4.1 and figuring out the problem - so far, it smells like a VFS issue. You probably won't mind if I postpone this to next year, right? (Just kidding) -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Nov 21 08:37:51 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gALEbpa28357 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 08:37:51 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gALEch7e025710 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:38:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gALEchu08339; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:38:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:38:43 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021121093843.AAB8313@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic In-Reply-To: <635AA478-FCC8-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:41:04 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > In the case of wikit, sdx, and critcl starkits - there is now another > way to verify that you have the latest: unpack and look for a file > called "ChangeLog". You can see the latest versions of these on the > web by browsing to: > http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/wikit/ > ChangeLog?rev=HEAD > http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/sdx/ ChangeLog?rev=HEAD > http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/*checkout*/critcl/ > ChangeLog?rev=HEAD Where do we find the sdx.kit that contains the changelog? The one on the sdarchive contains this: $ ls -R sdx.vfs sdx.vfs: doc lib main.tcl sdx.vfs/doc: sdx.tkd sdx.vfs/lib: app-sdx ftp gbutton wikit autoscroll ftpd md5 sdx.vfs/lib/app-sdx: addtoc.tcl httpd.tcl mkshow.tcl sdx.tcl wrap.tcl eval.tcl httpdist.tcl pkgIndex.tcl sync.tcl fetch.tcl ls.tcl qwrap.tcl tree.tcl ftpd.tcl lsk.tcl ratarx.tcl treetime.tcl help.tcl md5sum.tcl rexecd.tcl unwrap.tcl sdx.vfs/lib/autoscroll: autoscroll.tcl pkgIndex.tcl sdx.vfs/lib/ftp: ftp_lib.tcl pkgIndex.tcl sdx.vfs/lib/ftpd: ftpd.tcl pkgIndex.tcl sdx.vfs/lib/gbutton: disabled.gif down.gif gbutton.tcl pkgIndex.tcl up.gif sdx.vfs/lib/md5: md5.tcl pkgIndex.tcl sdx.vfs/lib/wikit: format.tcl modify.tcl utils.tcl wikit.tcl gui.tcl pkgIndex.tcl web.tcl -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Nov 21 13:41:47 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gALJfla21928 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:41:47 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id gALJgkxm006244 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:42:46 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id MAA08592 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:38:31 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA2H4; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:42:46 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDD3765.35A671E2@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:43:33 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list References: <635AA478-FCC8-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] path definition problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have just run into a problem defining the root path. In the main.tcl startup file I set the variable 'root' to the root path that is used at startup (either vfs root or [pwd]). In my lib directory I file that does a package provide an in this package I have a namespace that looks like this: namespace eval Images { global root image create photo myimg -format gif -file ${root}/lib/images/my.gif <..snip..> The problem I'm having is that when I do a pkg_mkIndex to build the pkgIndex.tcl the command fails with: warning: error while sourcing defaults.tcl: can't read "root": no such variable I can cure the problem by adding if { ! [info exists root] } { set root dummy } just after the global statement but this seems like a real hack just to get pkg_mkIndex to work properly. Is there something I'm missing? Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Nov 21 13:49:08 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gALJn7a22814; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:49:08 -0600 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:50:07 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] path definition problem Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: Starkit list To: Tom Krehbiel From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3DDD3765.35A671E2@motorola.com> Message-Id: <6F6ADF62-FD8A-11D6-A1E0-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I have just run into a problem defining the root path. > > In the main.tcl startup file I set the variable 'root' to the root > path that is used at startup (either vfs root or [pwd]). In my > lib directory I file that does a package provide an in this package I > have a namespace that looks like this: > > namespace eval Images { > global root [...] My suggestion is to take a slightly different route: - make sure main.tcl contains: package require starkit starkit::startup ... - then, anywhere in your app, you'll have "$::starkit::topdir" at your disposal The above works whether the starkit is launched or sourced, wrapped or unwrapped. It's a recent changed made when transitioning from stardocs to starkits, but it really gets rid of a lot of issues IMO. This works even without tclkit, i.e. when you run your code from tclsh or wish, all you need to do is make sure you have the "starkit.tcl" in the tclsh/wish library path as a package (i.e. with pkgIndex.tcl, yada yada). -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Nov 21 14:18:55 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gALKIta25815; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 14:18:55 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gALKJtDD016562; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:19:55 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA24549; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:19:54 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA2JS; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:19:53 -0700 Message-ID: <3DDD4019.B563F74F@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:20:41 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] path definition problem References: <6F6ADF62-FD8A-11D6-A1E0-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > > I have just run into a problem defining the root path. > > > > In the main.tcl startup file I set the variable 'root' to the root > > path that is used at startup (either vfs root or [pwd]). In my > > lib directory I file that does a package provide an in this package I > > have a namespace that looks like this: > > > > namespace eval Images { > > global root > [...] > > My suggestion is to take a slightly different route: > > - make sure main.tcl contains: > package require starkit > starkit::startup > ... > - then, anywhere in your app, you'll have "$::starkit::topdir" at your > disposal > > The above works whether the starkit is launched or sourced, wrapped or > unwrapped. It's a recent changed made when transitioning from stardocs > to starkits, but it really gets rid of a lot of issues IMO. > > This works even without tclkit, i.e. when you run your code from tclsh > or wish, all you need to do is make sure you have the "starkit.tcl" in > the tclsh/wish library path as a package (i.e. with pkgIndex.tcl, yada > yada). If I make the changes you suggest I (and remove the "info exists" check) I get warning: error while sourcing defaults.tcl: can't read "::starkit::topdir": no such variable If I then add the info exists check I get warning: error while sourcing defaults.tcl: can't set "::starkit::topdir": parent namespace doesn't exist The problem isn't with the setting of the path at runtime, it is with getting the pkg_mkIndex to work. Apparently when pkg_mkIndex process files it does variable expansion and since the variable ::starkit::topdir isn't defined (because it is defined in main.tcl which isn't in lib) an error is generated. It looks to me like ::starkit::topdir can't be used directly unless you hand code your pkgIndex.tcl file. Tom K. From clif@clif.cflynt.com Fri Nov 22 00:34:25 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAM6YPa23968 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 00:34:25 -0600 Received: (qmail 11083 invoked by uid 0); 22 Nov 2002 06:47:43 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 06:47:43 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09887 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 01:35:23 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAM6ZMu24571 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 01:35:22 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211220635.gAM6ZMu24571@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 01:35:22 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "Tom Krehbiel" at Nov 21, 2002 01:20:41 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Exec problem on CDROM Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I think I've got another tclkit strangness... This time with Windows (ME) I've installed tclkits on the CDROM, and a binary file unzip.exe. Running unzip.exe from a MS-DOS shell works OK. I start tclkit-win32.exe from the CDROM. From this console, (or a script running in this kit), I can "exec tclkit-win32.exe", and it works. However, if I try to "exec unzip.exe", I get a "no such file or directory" error. glob unzip.exe finds the file just fine and dandy. file attributes tclkit-win32.exe reports: -archive 0 -hidden 0 -longname D:/tclkits/tclkit-win32.exe -readonly 0 -shortname D:/TCLKITS/tclkit-win32.exe -system 0 -vfs 1 file attributes unzip.exe reports: -archive 0 -hidden 0 -lingname unzip.ee -readonly 1 -shortname UNZIP.EXE -system 0 The differences I see are that unzip.exe is not in vfs, and is on a readonly medium. From wish, the "exec unzip.exe" works fine. If I "file copy" the unzip.exe to the C: drive, it still fails to exec, with the same error message. Strangely enough, "file attributes" still shows the readonly flag being set. I guess retaining bogus attributes is common when copying files on Windows. Restarting tclkit, and cd'ing to the C: folder where I copied unzip.exe still won't exec unzip.exe, and the attributes still show readonly. I also tried full path as D:/bin/unzip.exe and D:\bin\unzip.exe, the relative path ./unzip.exe, and [file join [pwd] unzip.exe] I rebuilt the CD-ROM with the -x bit set on the unzip.exe. This *shouldn't* matter for windows, and, in fact, it didn't matter. Still won't exec. I can exec a previously installed wish.exe from the tclkit. Elchonon pointed out that I don't need an external unzip program if I've got a tclkit, so I've gotten around the immediate problem of unpacking zips, but the inability to exec programs is a bit perturbing. Clif -- ........................... Clif Flynt .......................... ... Tcl/Tk for Real Programmers - Academic Press Professional ... .... http://www.cflynt.com ............ clif@cflynt.com .... . In theory there is no difference between theory and practice . ........................ In practice, there is. ................. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Nov 22 09:30:51 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAMFUoa11972; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:30:51 -0600 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:31:50 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack for MacOS Classic Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <7E8574AA-FD37-11D6-A2B4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-Id: <8535C829-FE2F-11D6-95F4-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: [followin' up on me'own ramblings] > Nah, there seems to be no way out - it looks like I'll need to redo > tclkit-mac-classic. Using Daniel's latest 8.4.1 and figuring out the > problem - so far, it smells like a VFS issue. Ok, I've placed new mac classic builds in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ From what I can tell, the "open w" problem is gone (I haven't really tested the new builds in any substantial ways, just typed a few things in the console window). The build is based on Tcl/Tk 8.4.1 and MK 2.4.8. Please let me know how this one goes for you... -jcw PS. Below is the "kitcat.tcl" script I use (on the mac) to append a VFS datafile to an executable, FYI. This is the postlink-step to create the mac classic tclkits (since genkit cannot be used on this platform). After this I convert to macbinary, and then gzip it. set fd [open runtime-tk.bin] fconfigure $fd -translation binary set data [read $fd] close $fd proc doit {in out} { file copy -force $in $out set fd [open $out a] fconfigure $fd -translation binary puts -nonewline $fd $::data close $fd } doit kit "tclkit-mac-fat" doit kit-68k "tclkit-mac-68k" doit kit-ppc "tclkit-mac-ppc" From clif@clif.cflynt.com Fri Nov 22 20:21:58 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAN2Lwa09898 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 20:21:58 -0600 Received: (qmail 91395 invoked by uid 0); 23 Nov 2002 02:35:11 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 02:35:11 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA14131 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 21:22:55 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAN2MtT30299 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 21:22:55 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211230222.gAN2MtT30299@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 21:22:55 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Nov 22, 2002 04:31:50 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] MacOS Classic: New starkit not quite functional. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, Thanks for the new version of the starkit. Unfortunately, it's still a no-go. The inability to create a file is fixed, but I can't use sdx. What I tried: 1) Download tclkit-mac-ppc.bin.gz and ungzipped. 2) Moved tclkit-mac-ppc.bin to the Mac via FTP (fetch is my user agent). This created tclkit-mac-ppc on the Mac 3) Moved tclkit-mac-ppc.bin to the Mac via FTP (fetch is my user agent). This created tclkit-mac-ppc.1 on the Mac 4) sdx unwrap sdx.kit on Linux box, to create an sdx.vfs tree 5) FTP/Fetch the sdx.vfs tree to the Mac 6) Copy scrollHtml.kit to Mac (http://noucorp.com/~clif/scrollHtml.zip - a kit & html file) 7) Invoke tclkit-mac-ppc.1 8) In the console: package require starkit set argv {unwrap scrollHtml.kit} lappend auto_path sdx.vfs sdx.vfs:lib package require app-sdx This returned: 0 updates applied 2.0 This created a scrollHtml.vfs folder, but the folder is empty. Starting up the tclkit, and "source sdx.kit" gave me the "couldn't read file :sdx.kit:main.tcl": no such file or directory while executing "source :sdx.kit:main.tcl" ("uplevel" boyd line 1)... error message. Unpacking the scrollHtml kit into scrollHtml.vfs on the linux box, and moving that tree to the Mac, starting up tclkit-mac-ppc.1 on the Mac, and entering: package require starkit starkit::startup set argv [list wrap scrollHtml -runtime tclkit-mac-ppc] lappend auto_path sdx.vfs:lib sdx.vfs package require app-sdx This generated a scrollHtml application with a blue feather in a red rectangle Icon, but invoking this task generated the same "Illegal command: Joy::pfef..." message as before. Any other suggestions? Clif From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Sun Nov 24 19:53:12 2002 Received: from mailout03.sul.t-online.com (mailout03.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.81]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAP1r8x18566 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 19:53:12 -0600 Received: from fwd01.sul.t-online.de by mailout03.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18G8Rt-0003al-01; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 02:54:09 +0100 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[80.130.31.198]) by fmrl01.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18G8Rm-21BeSWC; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 02:54:02 +0100 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00AFD7BEF; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 19:25:11 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3DE18489.8080904@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 03:01:45 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: xotcl@alice.wu-wien.ac.at, starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: [Starkit] How to get library found with tclkit / Tclkit & XOTcl questions Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, i tried to use tclkit (8.4.1, windows) with XOTcl 1.0 and always get the annoying error message: "Cannot locate the XOTcl library on your system!" when i try to [package require xotcl] in tclkit. I read the source code, where the message seems to be generated and found that it is produced by some code that tries to modify the auto_path on loading of the xotcl**.dll. This seems to fail when loaded as a dll. What has to be done to get rid of the error message and to get the library found? At the moment i do: lappend auto_path [file join $xotcl-dir library] This seems to work, if xotcl-dir is set to the lib dir used by XOTcl. Other than those minor problems, are there any known problems using XOTcl 1.0 with Tclkit? Michael Schlenker From jcw@equi4.com Mon Nov 25 04:20:39 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAPAKcx31100 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 04:20:38 -0600 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:21:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to get library found with tclkit / Tclkit & XOTcl questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DE18489.8080904@uni-oldenburg.de> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael Schlenker wrote: > i tried to use tclkit (8.4.1, windows) with XOTcl 1.0 and always get > the annoying error message: > "Cannot locate the XOTcl library on your system!" > > when i try to [package require xotcl] in tclkit. > > I read the source code, where the message seems to be generated and > found that it is produced by some code that tries to modify the > auto_path on loading of the xotcl**.dll. This seems to fail when > loaded as a dll. Are you running xotcl from the file system or from a starkit? > Other than those minor problems, are there any known problems using > XOTcl 1.0 with Tclkit? Not that I know of. I remember seeing comments long ago that people have been using xotcl with tclkit before, also from starkits. -jcw From uwe.zdun@wu-wien.ac.at Mon Nov 25 04:49:44 2002 Received: from isis.wu-wien.ac.at (isis.wu-wien.ac.at [137.208.3.42]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAPAnhx32505 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 04:49:43 -0600 Received: from there (k2.wu-wien.ac.at [137.208.224.125]) by isis.wu-wien.ac.at (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA62884emf uwe.zdun@wu-wien.ac.at; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:46:29 +0100 Message-Id: <200211251046.LAA62884@isis.wu-wien.ac.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Uwe Zdun To: Michael Schlenker , xotcl@alice.wu-wien.ac.at, starkit@equi4.com Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:43:40 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <3DE18489.8080904@uni-oldenburg.de> In-Reply-To: <3DE18489.8080904@uni-oldenburg.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Xotcl] How to get library found with tclkit / Tclkit & XOTcl questions Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Michael, I've fixed recently a bug in which the same error message was reported, but there the xotcl lib was found correctly. perhaps you've encountered the same problem. Can you test this version please: http://wi.wu-wien.ac.at/~uzdun/xotcl-full-1.0-win-tcl8.4.1.zip and report your experiences? If it does not work, can you also test, whether XOTcl is loaded or not: % xotclsh ... > ::xotcl::Object o does this work (should not say "unknown command"). Thanks, Uwe On Monday 25 November 2002 03:01 am, Michael Schlenker wrote: > Hi, > > i tried to use tclkit (8.4.1, windows) with XOTcl 1.0 and always get the > annoying error message: > "Cannot locate the XOTcl library on your system!" > > when i try to [package require xotcl] in tclkit. > > I read the source code, where the message seems to be generated and > found that it is produced by some code that tries to modify the > auto_path on loading of the xotcl**.dll. This seems to fail when loaded > as a dll. > > What has to be done to get rid of the error message and to get the > library found? > > At the moment i do: > lappend auto_path [file join $xotcl-dir library] > > This seems to work, if xotcl-dir is set to the lib dir used by XOTcl. > > Other than those minor problems, are there any known problems using > XOTcl 1.0 with Tclkit? > > Michael Schlenker > > > > _______________________________________________ > Xotcl mailing list - Xotcl@alice.wu-wien.ac.at > http://alice.wu-wien.ac.at/mailman/listinfo/xotcl -- Uwe Zdun Department of Information Systems, Vienna University of Economics Phone: +43 1 313 36 4796, Fax: +43 1 313 36 746 zdun@{xotcl,computer,acm}.org, uwe.zdun@wu-wien.ac.at From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Mon Nov 25 06:33:40 2002 Received: from mailout01.sul.t-online.com (mailout01.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.80]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAPCXdx06159 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 06:33:39 -0600 Received: from fwd00.sul.t-online.de by mailout01.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18GIRl-0007bA-02; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:34:41 +0100 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[217.82.102.53]) by fmrl00.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18GIRS-0C7niCC; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:34:22 +0100 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7561A7BEF; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 20:49:48 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3DE21A92.5080107@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:41:54 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Uwe Zdun Cc: xotcl@alice.wu-wien.ac.at, starkit@equi4.com References: <3DE18489.8080904@uni-oldenburg.de> <200211251046.LAA62884@isis.wu-wien.ac.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Xotcl] How to get library found with tclkit / Tclkit & XOTcl questions Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Uwe Zdun wrote: >Hi Michael, > >I've fixed recently a bug in which the same error message was reported, but >there the xotcl lib was found correctly. perhaps you've encountered the same >problem. Can you test this version please: > > http://wi.wu-wien.ac.at/~uzdun/xotcl-full-1.0-win-tcl8.4.1.zip > >and report your experiences? If it does not work, can you also test, whether >XOTcl is loaded or not: > > Thanks. Now it works as expected (although the windows installer is a bit selective about it's invocation path). Tested against the download version from xotcl.org which doesn't work and your new version, which does work. XOTcl lib seems to work from within starkits and unwrapped now without the error message. (not tested extensivly yet though) (It did work before, but with the mentioned error message). Michael Schlenker From lvirden@cas.org Mon Nov 25 11:49:41 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAPHnex25836 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:49:40 -0600 Received: from srv13.cas.org (srv13 [134.243.65.81]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAPHoZlL028210 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 12:50:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by srv13.cas.org (8.8.8+Sun/m4_8.8.8/CAS_CLIENT-1.16) id MAA28152; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 12:50:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 12:50:37 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021125125036.AAB23536@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Starkits and licensing concerns Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Something came up today that I thought worth mentioning to you all. I found that at least one of the extensions in kitten is a GPL extension (that is TkHTML). This means, of course, that by making use of TkHTML in your application you have taken on, either intentionally or unintentionally, a gpl application.... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Nov 25 11:56:50 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAPHunx26296 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:56:49 -0600 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:57:50 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits and licensing concerns Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021125125036.AAB23536@cas.org> Message-Id: <699A1BFE-009F-11D7-ABD9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Something came up today that I thought worth mentioning to you all. > I found that at least one of the extensions in kitten is a GPL > extension > (that is TkHTML). This means, of course, that by making use of TkHTML > in your application you have taken on, either intentionally or > unintentionally, a gpl application.... Isn't Tkhtml Lesser/Library GPL (LGPL)? -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Nov 25 12:06:49 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAPI6nx27020 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 12:06:49 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAPI7hlL003275 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:07:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAPI7iA29541; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:07:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:07:44 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021125130744.AAB29520@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits and licensing concerns In-Reply-To: <699A1BFE-009F-11D7-ABD9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:57:50 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: yep, I misread the comment files. Still, starkit creators should be careful to include appropriate licensing info with any code included. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Mon Nov 25 18:36:30 2002 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQ0aTx18123 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:36:30 -0600 Received: from krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (root@krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.12]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAQ0bTe21410 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:37:29 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by krakatoa.ics.mq.edu.au (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2002112611372922321 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:37:29 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQ0bSE21401 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:37:29 +1100 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits and licensing concerns From: Steve Cassidy To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <20021125130744.AAB29520@cas.org> References: <20021125130744.AAB29520@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 26 Nov 2002 11:36:53 +1100 Message-Id: <1038271015.7672.2647.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tue, 2002-11-26 at 05:07, Larry W. Virden wrote: > yep, I misread the comment files. > > Still, starkit creators should be careful to include appropriate licensing info > with any code included. This would be a good reason to encourage the use of the DESCRIPTION.txt file as described in TIP55 inside Starkits et al. It would be nice if sdx qwrap would produce a template DESCRIPTION.txt file along with the rest of the structure. It could look like: Identifier: Version: 0.1 Title: Creator: Your Name Description: describe your package here indent extra lines with space or tab Rights: Architecture: tcl Note: see http://www.purl.org/tcl/tip/55.html for more details of this metadata format Adding this would make conversion between starpack and Cantcl package trivial (it's already trivial the other way around). Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Tue Nov 26 04:39:39 2002 Received: from tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQAddx10950 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 04:39:39 -0600 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18Gd8z-0002xL-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:40:41 +0100 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 18Gd8z-0005Me-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:40:41 +0100 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQAefM19806 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:40:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:40:41 +0100 (MET) From: Guenther Fischer To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -0.3 (/) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18Gd8z-0002xL-00*zpM3vPTGsuk* Subject: [Starkit] http::geturl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I got an error with my application using starpack but only on Win2000 Systems ... ... set tokens [http::geturl http://...] runs into error "expected integer but got " " while executing http::geturl http://... " The debug prints before the "set tokens [http" will do - the one after does not. Any idea? It runs on linux Win95/98/XP ... -- ~Guenther Fischer From jcw@equi4.com Tue Nov 26 04:45:27 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQAjQx11325; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 04:45:26 -0600 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:46:29 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Guenther Fischer From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <51C3F0F8-012C-11D7-ABD9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Guenther Fischer wrote: > I got an error with my application using starpack but only on Win2000 > Systems ... > > ... > set tokens [http::geturl http://...] > > runs into error > > "expected integer but got " " What does "puts [package require http]" return? > The debug prints before the "set tokens [http" will do - the one after > does not. Any idea? It runs on linux Win95/98/XP ... Can you add a catch and print $::errorInfo? It's a bit hard to say anything more without further details about what exactly is generating the error and where. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 26 05:38:49 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQBcnx14667 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 05:38:49 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAQBdjlL013878 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:39:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAQBdjF26595; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:39:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:39:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021126063945.AAB26577@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits and licensing concerns In-Reply-To: <1038271015.7672.2647.camel@climie> of 26 Nov 2002 11:36:53 +1100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: DESCRIPTION.txt I like this idea. Jean-Claude, is the sdx.kit available on the sdarchive the latest source? If Steve and I do an unwrap on it, and add the code for the DESCRIPTION.txt (and perhaps add the examples directory as defined in the TIP above) how would you want the modifications turned back over to you? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 26 05:39:35 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQBdYx14750 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 05:39:34 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAQBeUlL014018 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:40:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAQBeVi26622; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:40:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:40:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021126064031.AAB26613@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl In-Reply-To: <51C3F0F8-012C-11D7-ABD9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:46:29 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Also, can you show us the literal code you are trying to execute? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Tue Nov 26 06:17:17 2002 Received: from meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.57]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQCHHx17494 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:17:17 -0600 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18GefU-0005Xm-00; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:18:20 +0100 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 18GefT-00032v-00; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:18:19 +0100 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQCIJZ28995; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:18:19 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:18:18 +0100 (MET) From: Guenther Fischer To: "Larry W. Virden" cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl In-Reply-To: <20021126064031.AAB26613@cas.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -3.5 (---) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18GefU-0005Xm-00*aL2zNtbeTxs* Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok - this is the proc where it happend - again: only on W2000, not W95/98/XP not on linux. The package require http is ok and I get 2.4.2 (I tried the latest tclkit) and als the http::formatQuery does what I want. Could there be some kind of overflow which run into problems on one OS and not on the other - I thought this can't happen with tcl ? proc wdb_suche {} { global try db bezug firstseqno wkv wkvl iso_land dir seqno \ lastseqno only_exist kanzahl EID count such_name set such_name [.wein.buttons.such_e get] set search [ http::formatQuery Query $such_name start 0 last 1000] if {[catch {set token [ http::geturl \ http://wdb.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de/wein/wn.php3?$search]} err]} { status "$err/$::errorInfo" 1} #set token [ http::geturl \ http://wdb.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de/wein/wn.php3?$search] status "$search" 1 upvar #0 $token state status "$state(status)" 1 set answer $state(body) set HTML [file join [pwd] "PDIR" $such_name ] set print0 [ open "${HTML}.htm" w+ ] puts $print0 $answer close $print0 do_help "${HTML}.htm" } On Tue, 26 Nov 2002, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Also, can you show us the literal code you are trying to execute? > -- ~Guenther Fischer From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 26 06:38:34 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQCcYx18713 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:38:34 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAQCdUlL027162 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:39:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAQCdVd27417; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:39:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:39:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021126073931.AAB27406@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:18:18 +0100 (MET) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Guenther Fischer > Ok - this is the proc where it happend - again: only on W2000, not > W95/98/XP not on linux. > Could there be some kind of overflow which run into problems on one OS and > not on the other - I thought this can't happen with tcl ? There are several possibilities, the first of which is that there is something peculiar about the operating system - which Tcl can't do anything about. Let's let the mailing list readers take a look at the code and decide if there is a bug in your code, in starkit, tcl, or W2k ... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Tue Nov 26 07:17:16 2002 Received: from tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQDHGx20725 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:17:16 -0600 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18GfbW-00041u-00; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:18:18 +0100 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 18GfbW-0007Ii-00; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:18:18 +0100 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQDIIV02121; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:18:18 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:18:18 +0100 (MET) From: Guenther Fischer To: "Larry W. Virden" cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl In-Reply-To: <20021126073931.AAB27406@cas.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -3.5 (---) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18GfbW-00041u-00*wUbu1KXvMpE* Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If I take only the proc wdb_suche as send before - it runs on W2000. What kind of error I can do outside to get this simple proc/library call crashing? On Tue, 26 Nov 2002, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > From: Guenther Fischer > > > Ok - this is the proc where it happend - again: only on W2000, not > > W95/98/XP not on linux. > > > Could there be some kind of overflow which run into problems on one OS and > > not on the other - I thought this can't happen with tcl ? > > There are several possibilities, the first of which is that there is > something peculiar about the operating system - which Tcl can't do anything > about. > > Let's let the mailing list readers take a look at the code and decide if > there is a bug in your code, in starkit, tcl, or W2k ... > -- ~Guenther Fischer From lvirden@cas.org Tue Nov 26 07:20:46 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQDKkx20981 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:20:46 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gAQDLglL008873 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:21:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gAQDLg227964; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:21:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:21:42 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021126082142.AAB27953@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:18:18 +0100 (MET) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Guenther Fischer > If I take only the proc wdb_suche as send before - it runs on W2000. > > What kind of error I can do outside to get this simple proc/library call > crashing? Ah - so if you use _only_ the proc in question, then it works fine? But when you use it with the rest of the program, you then get a syntax error? Can you send along a copy of the _exact_ error message you are getting? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Nov 26 11:41:05 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAQHf4x05644; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:41:04 -0600 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 18:42:07 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] MacOS Classic: New starkit not quite functional. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: Starkit list To: Clif Flynt From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <200211231426.gANEQC900824@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: <622C0EC6-0166-11D7-ABD9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, Had a look at your scrollHtml kit stuff on Mac classic. >>> Same 'invalid command name "Joy!peffpwpc"' message. Yep, I see that too. So I did something else, I unpacked into scrollHtml.vfs, launched tclkit-mac, and entered: source scrollHtml.vfs/main.tcl What happened next is a "good" illustration of the issues ahead: note how the above uses "foo bar", and lo and behold, Tcl does the right thing. Not so in these lines: set im [image create photo -file $imgDir/scroll4.gif] set html(bgnd) [image create photo -file $imgDir/parchment.gif] In this case, $imgDir will contain a colon - at that point, slashes are trouble, You need to replace the above with: set im [image create photo -file [file join $imgDir scroll4.gif]] set html(bgnd) [image create photo -file [file join $imgDir parchment.gif]] If you examine the difference, you'll see that mixing colons and slashes can be tricky on the Mac. > The string is in the tclkit-mac-ppc, but not in my scrollHtml.kit. It's resource/data fork trouble, of some sort. I heven't figured it out. I'd say that you first need to get the rest right on the mac, and the way to do that is to have the starkit unpacked - and launch as I did. It'll let you debug things independent of the wrapping issues, edit files and tweak, and add salt to taste. There is a simple trick to make a starkit launch tclkit when double-clicked: - launch tclkit-mac - type "file attributes scrollHtml.kit -creator TKd4" - exit If you wrap on the mac using tclkit-mac, this will have been done for you by sdx. If the starkit comes from another machine, you may need to do it manually. Note that you can create a little Tcl script containing the above, apply the same trick to itself, and it'll become double-clickable. A recursive trick - how about that :) As to why wrapping as a starpack does not work - I'm not sure. I may never have tested it that far, but I know that I got double-clickable apps, i.e. starkits, are ok. You're not out of the woods yet, though - while trying to do things in your app, I ran into things like exec (which does not exist on Mac classic), and what I think is the html widget (tkhtml is not available for the Mac AFAIK). -jcw PS. CC'ing this back to the starkit list, just so the info gets into the archives - and perhaps snuggles between a few synapses as side-effect :) From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Nov 27 07:32:59 2002 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gARDWwx05774 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 07:32:59 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (cgey1.capgemini.se [193.234.247.50]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id ANE35216 (AUTH vincedarley); Wed, 27 Nov 2002 13:05:54 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127125559.01e22308@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 13:07:53 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <622C0EC6-0166-11D7-ABD9-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <200211231426.gANEQC900824@clif.cflynt.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've been exploring some issues around building/using Alphatk has a starkit and starpack... (e.g. ftp://ftp.ucsd.edu/pub/alpha/tcl/alphatk/alphatk.exe) However, mk4vfs.tcl doesn't return correct values for things like 'file writable'. This is because: proc access {db name mode} { # This needs implementing better. ::mk4vfs::stat $db $name sb } doesn't do the right thing. It basically just says whether the file exists. The .zip filesystem is the closest to a correct implementation: proc vfs::zip::access {zipfd name mode} { #::vfs::log "zip-access $name $mode" if {$mode & 2} { error "read-only" } # Readable, Exists and Executable are treated as 'exists' # Could we get more information from the archive? if {[::zip::exists $zipfd $name]} { return 1 } else { error "No such file" } } So, if we are in a starpack or if we are in a non-writable starkit, this should throw an error. It looks to me as if the 'open' implementation also needs to throw an error in this case... How can we accomplish this? Do we need something more refined which allows one to specify that the filesystem is actually writable (even if it is a starpack) and that we are going to take some special action to save all the changes later... (is there some standard code to do the 'copy starpack, update contents and replace-in-place' on exit?) cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 27 08:02:33 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gARE2Wx07481 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:02:33 -0600 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:03:35 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127125559.01e22308@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <051A78F3-0211-11D7-BA68-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > I've been exploring some issues around building/using Alphatk has a > starkit and starpack... (e.g. > ftp://ftp.ucsd.edu/pub/alpha/tcl/alphatk/alphatk.exe) Great :) > However, mk4vfs.tcl doesn't return correct values for things like > 'file writable'. This is because: > > proc access {db name mode} { > # This needs implementing better. > ::mk4vfs::stat $db $name sb > } > > doesn't do the right thing. It basically just says whether the file > exists. The .zip filesystem is the closest to a correct > implementation: [...] > So, if we are in a starpack or if we are in a non-writable starkit, > this should throw an error. It looks to me as if the 'open' > implementation also needs to throw an error in this case... > > How can we accomplish this? Do we need something more refined which > allows one to specify that the filesystem is actually writable (even > if it is a starpack) and that we are going to take some special action > to save all the changes later... (is there some standard code to do > the 'copy starpack, update contents and replace-in-place' on exit?) Is this similar to mounting a server as r/o and seeing the mode be writable? Is this the essential between access and stat? VFS in MK may be tricky to fit in there. As you can see, one can "write" into a r/o starpack/starkit, even on a CD-ROM, the changes are effective but are lost on unmount - unless the VFS is either copied out first, or the MK datafile is serialized to a separate file (mk::file save). It'll get even harder to figure this out once MK's "commit-aside" gets exposed: that lets you open a file r/o, and a second one r/w, with the second one getting all the changes. Open just the first, and you get the original state, open the second one "on top" (in a special way), and the whole thing switches to reflect the modified state again (one use for this would be to distribute change sets, think CDROM distribution with over-the-net updates, for example). What does writable mean? That I can save it? Sure anytime. That it outlasts an exit from my app? There's no way to tell - if a copy or serialize is done before exit, it will, otherwise it won't. Let's try this from the other side - what is the difference for your app - to what extent does the app (need to) care? -jcw From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Wed Nov 27 08:25:43 2002 Received: from meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.57]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAREPgx08790 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:25:42 -0600 Received: from pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.143] ident=mail) by meg.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18H39K-0008Fv-00; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:26:46 +0100 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by pat.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 3.32 #2) id 18H39J-0005tJ-00; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:26:45 +0100 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAREQjI13289; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:26:45 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:26:44 +0100 (MET) From: Guenther Fischer To: "Larry W. Virden" cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] http::geturl In-Reply-To: <20021126082142.AAB27953@cas.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -2.2 (--) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18H39K-0008Fv-00*XSfyAnLJXkE* Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Oh terrible - I found it ... It was not true that it runs under other window systems ... in truth. After W2000, I tried XP, NT, 98 - allways from scratch installation. It always get the same error - but w98 gives little bit more informations like cannot connct ... I has to say that it is possible to configure a proxy for the internet connection. And I got in this configuration a " "/{ } for proxyhost, a blank character. http::config -proxyhost $proxyhost -proxyport $proxyport -> http::config -proxyhost " " -proxyport " " and there was no controling in my program code but also not in http::config. I would also like it to have a better error message for the following http::geturl Now I understand a liitle bit more the error message "expected integer got " " this comes from the socket operation ... On Tue, 26 Nov 2002, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > From: Guenther Fischer > > > If I take only the proc wdb_suche as send before - it runs on W2000. > > > > What kind of error I can do outside to get this simple proc/library call > > crashing? > > Ah - so if you use _only_ the proc in question, then it works fine? But > when you use it with the rest of the program, you then get a syntax > error? > > Can you send along a copy of the _exact_ error message you are getting? > > -- ~Guenther Fischer From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Nov 27 15:07:20 2002 Received: from rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (rly-ip05.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gARL7Kx07980 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:07:20 -0600 Received: from logs-wc.proxy.aol.com (logs-wc.proxy.aol.com [205.188.193.5]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-1127160805; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:08:05 1900 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (AC85C5AE.ipt.aol.com [172.133.197.174]) by logs-wc.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id gARL7uD464704 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:07:56 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127210236.01de4c60@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 21:05:27 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <051A78F3-0211-11D7-BA68-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127125559.01e22308@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Apparently-From: Vincedarley@aol.com Subject: [Starkit] Crash in Win32 starpack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>ftp://ftp.ucsd.edu/pub/alpha/tcl/alphatk/alphatk.exe One unfortunate problem is that the above .exe has a tendency to crash for no good reason. Since the tclkit on which it is built is not a debug build, I have no idea where it is crashing. I can reproduce it like this: open alphatk.exe (wait 5-10 seconds until startup is complete), then use the 'Help' menu to open some of Alphatk's help files. Close and open several files. Somewhere between the first and the 10th such file you open, the application crashes... cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 27 20:13:54 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAS2Drx23744 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 20:13:54 -0600 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 03:14:56 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <307E903A-0277-11D7-BA68-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Subject: [Starkit] gcc version build trouble? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone seen the following behavior? It was reported in private email, and at first I dismissed it , but now I see the same trouble in my own builds... $ tclsh % info pat 8.3.3 % load ./Mk4tcl.so couldn't load file "./Mk4tcl.so": ./Mk4tcl.so: undefined symbol: _ZTVN10__cxxabiv120__si_class_type_infoE % ^D $ gcc --version gcc (GCC) 3.2.1 Both binaries were built with gcc 3.2.1, but tclsh is a pure C app, while Mk4tcl is C++. Changing the MK makefile line LINK_SPECIAL_FLAGS = to LINK_SPECIAL_FLAGS = -lstdc++ Seems to do the trick. It's not quite clear what causes this problem - did I change something? Did a gcc 3.2.1 regression occur? For some reason, the libstdc++.so lib was not being found. -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Nov 28 03:01:09 2002 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAS90xx04345 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 03:01:09 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (cgey1.capgemini.se [193.234.247.50]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id ANE52273 (AUTH vincedarley); Wed, 27 Nov 2002 14:32:07 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127142438.01dc92f8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 14:34:00 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable In-Reply-To: <051A78F3-0211-11D7-BA68-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127125559.01e22308@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 03:03 PM 11/27/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >What does writable mean? That I can save it? Sure anytime. That it >outlasts an exit from my app? There's no way to tell - if a copy or >serialize is done before exit, it will, otherwise it won't. > >Let's try this from the other side - what is the difference for your app - >to what extent does the app (need to) care? That's a good way of looking at it... I suppose there are two main issues: (i) in the same way as in the native operating system, if a file is marked as non-writable/locked, this gives the user the impression that they are not allowed to modify it --- this is useful feedback to the user. Of course in both cases (native and virtual) it might be possible for the user to work around the issue ('chmod', for example), but it provides a convenient, standard way of specifying that something is "fixed". (ii) assuming the user does write either a new or modified file to the virtual filesystem, presumably we would want either (a) want to tell them that their changes will be lost, or (b) take some special action to save those changes when we exit. For Alphatk particularly, I want the user to know whether a file is editable (whether it is inside Alphatk itself or inside a .kit the user is examining), and potentially to disallow the user from editing anything in it at all. Right now if I open a .kit which was built with '-writable' or not, it looks the same which is clearly not good! cheers, Vince. From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Nov 29 17:40:09 2002 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gATNe8x26029 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:40:09 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18Hukk-0005mA-00 for ; Sat, 30 Nov 2002 00:40:58 +0100 Message-ID: <3DE7FAF8.7000800@kocjan.org> Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 00:40:40 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi. For some time now I've been playing around with making TclKit include Itk, Threads and BLT. All of this on Unix (Linux in my case :) and Windows+MinGW (I don't have VC and don't want to have one :). I've improved the genkit script to use $env(BC*) so it is possible to write .bat/.sh scripts to compile TclKit to one's needs. Also, it is possible to compile TclKit with custom icons on Windows - this is a feature some people probably lacked (for example, me :) By default, I set things up to be compatible with TclKits compiled by JCW - after all, TclKits, in general, should provide some standard packages... Here's the default config: threads 0 incrtcl 1 incrtk 0 blt 0 res 0 strip 1 debug 0 Here's the .tar.gz of the things different. http://www.zoro2.org/tclkit-batteries-included.tar.gz Any comments? -- WK (written at Stardate 56915.0) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From clif@clif.cflynt.com Fri Nov 29 21:20:37 2002 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gAU3Kbx00974 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:20:37 -0600 Received: (qmail 99113 invoked by uid 0); 30 Nov 2002 03:37:11 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 03:37:11 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA20981; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:21:36 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id gAU3Lbo23420; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:21:37 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200211300321.gAU3Lbo23420@clif.cflynt.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] MacOS Classic: New starkit not quite functional. To: jcw@equi4.com (Jean-Claude Wippler) Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:21:37 -0500 (EST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com (Starkit list), clif@cflynt.com (Clif Flynt) In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Nov 26, 2002 06:42:07 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, Thanks for looking at this. My apology for being slow getting back to this one. > >>> Same 'invalid command name "Joy!peffpwpc"' message. > > Yep, I see that too. It's re-assuring that the problem isn't just me/this box. > So I did something else, I unpacked into scrollHtml.vfs, launched > tclkit-mac, and entered: > source scrollHtml.vfs/main.tcl > > What happened next is a "good" illustration of the issues ahead: note > how the above uses "foo bar", and lo and behold, Tcl does the > right thing. Not so in these lines: > > set im [image create photo -file $imgDir/scroll4.gif] > set html(bgnd) [image create photo -file $imgDir/parchment.gif] > ... Darn. I'd actually fixed those, but hadn't updated the zip file. I didn't mean to send you down that already-trod path. The code I've been using does work with the 'source scrollHtml.vfs/main' trick. > > It's resource/data fork trouble, of some sort. I heven't figured it > out. > > I'd say that you first need to get the rest right on the mac, and the > way to do that is to have the starkit unpacked - and launch as I did. > ... I took another approach, and wrote a dead simple Tk app: % cat test.tcl pack [button .b -text Quit -command exit] Packed it: % sdx qwrap test.tcl Unwrapped it: % sdx unwrap test.kit and Fetch/FTP'd test.vfs to the mac. ... On the Mac, I started up tclkit-mac-ppc.1 and using your "source test.vfs/main.tcl" trick confirmed that the application could work. The application displayed a single button, and clicking the button exited. Using my fake-out-the-Mac sdx wrap trick: Start tclkit-mac-ppc.1, and enter this text (Actually sourced from a file) package require starkit starkit::startup set argv [list wrap test -runtime tclkit-mac-ppc] lappend auto_path sdx.vfs [file join [pwd] sdx.vfs lib] package require app-sdx ... This created a 'test' application with the blue feather in a red box. Clicking this opened a Tcl console and empty TclKit graphics window, and again the old "Invalid command name "Joy!peffpwpc"" message. ... I don't know if this new data helps or not, but... Catch you later, Clif From jcw@equi4.com Sat Nov 30 15:27:32 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAULRVx31445 for ; Sat, 30 Nov 2002 15:27:32 -0600 Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 22:28:37 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] MacOS Classic: New starkit not quite functional. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200211300321.gAU3Lbo23420@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif, [...] > This created a 'test' application with the blue feather in a red box. > Clicking this opened a Tcl console and empty TclKit graphics window, > and > again the old "Invalid command name "Joy!peffpwpc"" message. Ok, I'm starting to understand. The "Joy!..." prefix is the start of the data fork, which contains powerpc code. The app is re-opening itself and trying to run it's data fork as a Tcl script. My hunch is that tclkit-on-mac doesn't yet have the correct startup logic to run as starpack. All I can suggest is creating a starkit and using that. If you run sdx on Mac classic (not OSX) to wrap, the result should work when double-clicking the starkit. You can then convert to MacBinary for distribution, or stuffit, etc. I've started adding logic in sdx to wrap with MacBinary files supplied as -runtime, on any platform, and I think that works - but it won't be much use for you, given that startpacks are not ok yet. -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Dec 2 01:35:38 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB27Zbx31796 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 01:35:37 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA12472 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 08:36:44 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA12341 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 08:36:40 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DEB0D88.B8A6FAA5@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 08:36:40 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problem with Wikit on Solaris Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I have a (small) problem with Wikit on SUN/Solaris. The default resources on the system that I run it on are such that Wikit shows a white text on a white background. This is a bit frustrating :). I managed to solve the problem in the following way: - Use xprop to see what WM_CLASS the Wikit window uses (so that I can set the X resources) - As this turned out to be "wikit.kit", I renamed the kit to "wikitkit" (not very inventive, but it works) - Then I used the command "echo wikitkit*foreground: black |xrdb -merge" to explicitly set the foreground colour. This works, but I would rather like Wikit to do this on its own. In general: Wikit should not rely on defaults like background and foreground colours for text. Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Dec 2 01:44:26 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB27iPx32057 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 01:44:25 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA24250 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 08:45:33 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA24099 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 08:45:29 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DEB0F99.7C1B1C9@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 08:45:29 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problem with Wikit on Windows NT Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I have a severe problem with Wikit on Windows NT. I have little other clues as to what is causing it than that it might have to do with "encodings", but the problems are only with Wikit (I can build other applications using tclkit/sdx, without a problem). The phenomenon: - I can view the contents of a local wiki - As soon as I try to edit it, the window's content becomes messed up, it shows the code (as a page header) sometimes, more often than not the text in the gelly buttons is corrupted too. Some details: - [encoding system] shows cp1252 - Regional settings shows: English (US) Number, etc: all American settings Is there anybody who might shed some light on this? Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Mon Dec 2 04:03:00 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB2A30x05135 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 04:03:00 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB2A40L7028606 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:04:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB2A40703654; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:04:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:04:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021202050400.AAB3643@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 30 Nov 2002 00:40:40 +0100 To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Wojciech Kocjan > For some time now I've been playing around with making TclKit include > Itk, Threads and BLT. All of this on Unix (Linux in my case :) and > Windows+MinGW (I don't have VC and don't want to have one :). > Any comments? I'd prefer to NOT see such an executable called a tclkit. In fact, my own preference would be to see Itk, threads, and BLT placed into their own starkit and mounted by applications which need them, leaving people with a standard tclkit. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Dec 2 04:06:08 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB2A68x05405 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 04:06:08 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB2A79L7029757 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:07:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB2A79403696; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:07:09 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 05:07:09 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021202050709.AAB3674@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with Wikit on Solaris In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 02 Dec 2002 08:36:40 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Arjen Markus > - As this turned out to be "wikit.kit", I renamed the kit to "wikitkit" > (not very inventive, but it works) In fact, in my opinion, having the name of the app be 'wikit.kit' is going to be a nuisance, because it seems to me that the X Resource Database processing (and perhaps Tk option database process) is going to try to treat that as an application of wikit with a widget of kit - and then not show developers what they expect. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Dec 2 04:19:05 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB2AJ4x06092 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 04:19:04 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id LAA10318 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 11:20:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA09821 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 11:20:04 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DEB33D4.EA35C1E0@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 11:20:04 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with Wikit on Solaris References: <20021202050709.AAB3674@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > From: Arjen Markus > > > - As this turned out to be "wikit.kit", I renamed the kit to "wikitkit" > > (not very inventive, but it works) > > In fact, in my opinion, having the name of the app be 'wikit.kit' is going > to be a nuisance, because it seems to me that the X Resource Database > processing (and perhaps Tk option database process) is going to try to treat > that as an application of wikit with a widget of kit - and then not > show developers what they expect. That is the reason I had to rename it! (In fact: this behaviour of the XRDB allowed me to convince my colleagues NOT to adopt the appalling but apparently necessary Windows convention of .exe as an extension for executables on UNIX too). Regards, Arjen From steve@digital-smarties.com Mon Dec 2 04:21:32 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB2ALVx06245 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 04:21:31 -0600 Received: (qmail 2826 invoked by uid 8); 2 Dec 2002 10:22:37 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "[192.168.1.3]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpd5UBPyd; Mon, 02 Dec 2002 05:22:27 EST From: "Steve Landers" To: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 18:22:23 +0800 Message-Id: <20021202102223.8494@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <20021202050400.AAB3643@cas.org> References: <20021202050400.AAB3643@cas.org> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Mon, 2 Dec 2002 Larry W. Virden wrote: >I'd prefer to NOT see such an executable called a tclkit. Likewise > In fact, my >own preference would be to see Itk, threads, and BLT placed into their own >starkit and mounted by applications which need them, leaving people with >a standard tclkit. I have no problem with ltk in its own starkit. I'd like to see tclkit become threads enabled when this happens with the default builds of the Tcl core. I've seen discussion that this might happen at some stage. And BLT, I'd like to see it made less intrusive on the Tcl/Tk core, and stubs enabled as well. I'd also like to see world peace, no children living in poverty and my football team win the playoffs ;-) Steve From wojciech@kocjan.org Mon Dec 2 04:24:44 2002 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB2AOhx06441 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 04:24:44 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18Inlm-0003Sh-00; Mon, 02 Dec 2002 11:25:42 +0100 Message-ID: <3DEB3513.5020809@kocjan.org> Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 11:25:23 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? References: <20021202050400.AAB3643@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >>For some time now I've been playing around with making TclKit include >>Itk, Threads and BLT. All of this on Unix (Linux in my case :) and >>Windows+MinGW (I don't have VC and don't want to have one :). >>Any comments? > I'd prefer to NOT see such an executable called a tclkit. Agreed. I called this itclkitt (Incrtk+tclkit+threads :) For now it's just my private testing anyway - I hoped on some opinions on getting the new genkit and the changes in src/kit/src/kitInit.c integrated. By defaults, it still builds with just Itcl. Also, I remember someone asking about threads enabled and so on - this could be useful to people (like me) who need to have either threads, BLT or custom icons on Windows. This is also quite useful when doing a cross-platform binaries, since I can set things up to compile automatically on Windows/Linux/whatever... (currently, it's only Windows/Linux :) > In fact, my own preference would be to see Itk, threads, and BLT placed > into their own starkit and mounted by applications which need them, > leaving people with a standard tclkit. I started, by actually removing Itcl, when JCW claimed that it's impossible to build Itk 3.3 - so I compiled without Itcl, then added itcl3.2 and itk3.2 in the runtime.vfs. When he said that it is possible, I tried the other way and compiled Itcl+Itk. Some time ago I needed to have a standalone executable with threads enabled for my project. So I took the genkit and improved it a bit. And BLT cannot be placed in the .vfs, since it is not stubs enabled. -- WK (written at Stardate 56920.4) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Dec 4 03:01:17 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB491Ax07537 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:01:16 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id KAA20022 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:02:19 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA19900 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:02:15 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DEDC497.9AFF30D1@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 10:02:15 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problem using Tkcon as the console Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I encountered a problem when I created a starkit that should use Tkcon as the console: - I explicitly source tkcon.tcl (from within the VFS system) - I do get the Tkcon console, but it does not contain the package (yet) from which I sourced it (though I do see the startup message in the window!) - When I load that package manually, tkcon opens a second (!) console. Any suggestions? I have not analysed it thoroughly, I should probably flesh out the essential bits first, but I thought that somebody might have experienced something similar. Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Dec 4 03:15:06 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB49F6x08621 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:15:06 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id KAA02877 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:16:14 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA02611 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:16:11 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DEDC7DA.94E595C0@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 10:16:11 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] How to exhibit demos and documents? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I have a "methodical" question about starkits. Let me first describe what I want to do: I have built a small "mathematical workbench", a bunch of scripts and a framework to use them so that you can easily solve differential equations or inspect the solutions of so-called diophantine equations or calculate with complex numbers. The set of scripts is accompanied by: - an article (a PDF-file) - demonstration scripts to show the usage How do I make these available to the user? Should I incorporate them into the starkit and have a command that extracts them (perhaps at first startup)? Or is there another, preferred, way to do it? I would like to know your thoughts about this! Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 4 04:46:35 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4AkYx15029 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 04:46:34 -0600 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 11:47:43 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20021202050400.AAB3643@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > From: Wojciech Kocjan Just to satisfy my own curiosity, and as someone with remote Polish roots - what is the pronunciation for your name, is it something like: "voy-check koh-chan"? >> For some time now I've been playing around with making TclKit include >> Itk, Threads and BLT. All of this on Unix (Linux in my case :) and >> Windows+MinGW (I don't have VC and don't want to have one :). [...] [Larry Virden] > I'd prefer to NOT see such an executable called a tclkit. In fact, my > own preference would be to see Itk, threads, and BLT placed into their > own > starkit and mounted by applications which need them, leaving people > with > a standard tclkit. Allow me to just re-iterate this point, now that the "genkit" build script makes it relatively easy to create variations. Please, please, PLEASE, do not call executables with a different feature set "tclkit". It is extremely important, especially longer term, to make Tclkit represent a single set of features, across all platforms and over the years. Note that SDX has a "-interp" option for wrap/qwrap to specify another executable for startup than the standard "tclkit" name. So there is no excuse: anyone can easily maintain a parallel universe... I've been removing all the irrelevant extensions before Tclkit went mainstream just for that reason - to make sure nobody starts relying on the presence of packages which just happened to be placed in earlier versions of tclkit, mostly for convenience. That "convenience" comes at a hefty price. That is why Tclkit today contains: Tcl, Tk, IncrTcl, Metakit, TclVFS. Tclkit also contains "zlib" and "rechan" commands - and they will both remain there, though perhaps one day as wrappers for slightly more standardized extensions. The "pwb" extension (librarypath cmd) is private, don't use it, it will one day be gone. As far as the rest goes, things are nearly 100% "standard" - the two differences which come to mind is that only a handful of encodings are included, and that not all VFS drivers are in TclVFS. Nor perfect, but anyway - that's how it is today. And that's it. As someone reminded me recently, Tclkit is not the place to innovate - it is on top of it that innovation can and should take place. When you see a tclkit executable, all you need to care about is what version it is - if it is too old, consider upgrading, because it will have upgraded components and/or bug fixes. A Starkit which works with Tclkit today, and which does not do tricky stuff, must also run on the Tclkit that is available three years from now. If it's pure scripting, then it will also run on Tclkit on any other platform. The promise of Tclkit is that this is possible, and the reality of Tclkit today is that it really, really, really delivers on that promise. In terms of decisions for Tclkit, let me summarize how I would like to see things go: - first of all, Tclkit is no longer "in development" - we're in fix-a-few-last-details mode - important releases/bugfixes of each of the packages in Tclkit will be incporporated - IncrTcl is in, because it is stable, very useful, small, and has a special Tcl-core status - for mostly similar reasons, no other extensions will be added to Tclkit - the "scripdoc" package (pure Tcl) is kept in Tclkit to support the pre-starkit world - no guarantees other than that support for starkits since Sep 2002 will be maintained - the SDX utility will grow and/or evolve into a new Startool (but don't hold your breath) - new options to deploy and maintain starkits over the web and on intranets - Tclkit will be built as threaded once it is safe to do so, no sooner than ActiveTcl To add to that last comment: I've recently made good progress with threads (Wojciech: please update your copy of MetaKit from CVS, and add "--enable-threads" to the MK build). The previous version did not actually enable the mutex code - and it had a deadlock bug in mk::loop. In other words, using the latest codebase, Tclkit can now be built with threads - I plan to look at Wojciech's changes and extend genkit to support such a build option (likewise for a debug build). I understand that BLT cannot currently be built as dynamic extension for use with Tclkit, because it is not stubs enabled. Likewise for Expect, though there are patches for that one. Both are from the pre-stubs era - so it is understandable that they need extra work to get there, and that their authors may need some extra encouragement/cajoling/bribes to make it happen . Unfortunately, there is very little I can do about it. If you require BLT, then you will either have to stick with "traditional" Tcl installations, such as ActiveTcl, or maintain a custom variation of Tclkit. Don't expect either of the above to ever go into tclkit - they are too big. All we can hope for, is that extensions like these are "stubbified" - making it trivial to use them in starkits, starpacks, etc. For everything else, don't forget that you can also deploy in a three-file mode: a standard Tclkit, a kitten-like set of extensions you always want to have around, and the main app as a starkit (or more than one, this is great for "application suites" as well). I'm having a ball doing just that for some custom work right now - highly recommended. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 4 04:48:06 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4Am6x15154 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 04:48:06 -0600 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 11:49:15 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem using Tkcon as the console Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DEDC497.9AFF30D1@wldelft.nl> Message-Id: <082C3E52-0776-11D7-B5AF-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen Markus wrote: > - I explicitly source tkcon.tcl (from within the VFS system) > - I do get the Tkcon console, but it does not contain the > package (yet) from which I sourced it (though I do see the > startup message in the window!) > - When I load that package manually, tkcon opens a second (!) > console. Sounds like package provides are not taking place in the proper order. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 4 04:54:32 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4AsWx15571 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 04:54:32 -0600 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 11:55:41 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to exhibit demos and documents? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <3DEDC7DA.94E595C0@wldelft.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id gB4AsWx15571 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen Markus wrote: > I have a "methodical" question about starkits. [mathematical workbench] > The set of scripts is accompanied by: > - an article (a PDF-file) > - demonstration scripts to show the usage > > How do I make these available to the user? > Should I incorporate them into the starkit and have > a command that extracts them (perhaps at first startup)? > Or is there another, preferred, way to do it? Good points. Similar issues can come up for test suites. It probably depends on what you want to achieve and how technological savvy your audience is. My first reaction would be to not overload the starkit packaging too much. How about: - provide (or point to) tclkit downloads - provide the PDF separately (people may just want to read, not run anything) - wrap your workbench à la kitten, i.e. "source" it to make packages available - wrap your demo as another starkit, source the workbench kit on startup That way you'd get pieces with a clear meaning and split of functionality/use. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 4 05:16:02 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4BG1x17021 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 05:16:01 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB4BH3L7003678 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 06:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB4BH4u06626; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 06:17:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 06:17:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021204061704.AAB6617@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to exhibit demos and documents? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 04 Dec 2002 10:16:11 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: how to read article Hmm - Perhaps your starkit could have a command line argument to retrieve PDF? Then the user could read it via their normal PDF method. Or you could convert it to something that you display via Tcl/Tk ala Wikit... Re: what to do about demos Again, perhaps you could have a rundemos command line argument . -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Dec 4 05:59:34 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4BxXx20179 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 05:59:33 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id NAA03892 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:00:42 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA03519 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:00:38 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DEDEE66.DEA0F9AC@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 13:00:38 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to exhibit demos and documents? References: <20021204061704.AAB6617@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > Re: how to read article > > Hmm - Perhaps your starkit could have a command line argument to retrieve > PDF? Then the user could read it via their normal PDF method. Or you > could convert it to something that you display via Tcl/Tk ala Wikit... > > Re: what to do about demos > > Again, perhaps you could have a rundemos command line argument . This is the sort of thing that came to my mind ... in several variations. Mind you, it is easy enough if the application has a "true" console. If it is a game (or something else with a user-interface), it might have to become an item in the Help menu. The idea that Jean-Claude described is interesting too. Perhaps it should be a separate part of the Starkit Archive: collect in-depth documentation or collect test scripts or demos from there... Regards, Arjen From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Dec 4 09:56:53 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4Fuqx07198; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:56:53 -0600 Received: from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gB4Fw1Un019688; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 08:58:01 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA26779; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 08:58:01 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAN7V; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 08:57:15 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEE261A.C4CD6B38@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 08:58:18 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, <...snip...> > For everything else, don't forget that you can also deploy in a > three-file mode: a standard Tclkit, a kitten-like set of extensions you > always want to have around, and the main app as a starkit (or more than > one, this is great for "application suites" as well). I'm having a > ball doing just that for some custom work right now - highly > recommended. Could you elaberate a little on the "three-file mode". I'm only familiar with the 2-file mode. What is the correct method for loading extentions from a third starkit. Tom K. From wojciech@kocjan.org Wed Dec 4 10:45:24 2002 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4GjNx11884; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:45:23 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18JcfO-0007gi-00; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 17:46:30 +0100 Message-ID: <3DEE3150.6020803@kocjan.org> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 17:46:08 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit CC: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >> From: Wojciech Kocjan > > > Just to satisfy my own curiosity, and as someone with remote Polish > roots - what is the pronunciation for your name, is it something > like: "voy-check koh-chan"? more or less 'voy-teck kotz-yan' :-) > Allow me to just re-iterate this point, now that the "genkit" build > script makes it relatively easy to create variations. Please, > please, PLEASE, do not call executables with a different feature set > "tclkit". Yes, this is what I said already. Any ideas on a name for such a build? Tclkitty? :) > It is extremely important, especially longer term, to make Tclkit > represent a single set of features, across all platforms and over the > years. Note that SDX has a "-interp" option for wrap/qwrap to > specify another executable for startup than the standard "tclkit" > name. So there is no excuse: anyone can easily maintain a parallel > universe... I thought it was -runtime. I build binaries this way :) > I've been removing all the irrelevant extensions before Tclkit went > mainstream just for that reason - to make sure nobody starts relying > on the presence of packages which just happened to be placed in > earlier versions of tclkit, mostly for convenience. That > "convenience" comes at a hefty price. This is obviously right. Tclkit provides a common set of features, when someone wants to use some other, he/she will include those in the .kit. However, I started using Tclkit and Starkit mostly as an alternative to prowrap/freewrap. > That is why Tclkit today contains: Tcl, Tk, IncrTcl, Metakit, TclVFS. > Tclkit also contains "zlib" and "rechan" commands - and they will > both remain there, though perhaps one day as wrappers for slightly > more standardized extensions. The "pwb" extension (librarypath cmd) > is private, don't use it, it will one day be gone. As far as the > rest goes, things are nearly 100% "standard" - the two differences > which come to mind is that only a handful of encodings are included, > and that not all VFS drivers are in TclVFS. Nor perfect, but anyway > - that's how it is today. Once the rest of VFS is more stable, could you include all of it? I remember having problems with using source http://www.somepage.com/script.tcl - resulted in core dump some time ago :( > In terms of decisions for Tclkit, let me summarize how I would like > to see things go: - first of all, Tclkit is no longer "in > development" - we're in fix-a-few-last-details mode Perhaps there should also be some development branch? Something similar to Tcl and Linux kernels? > - important releases/bugfixes of each of the packages in Tclkit will > be incporporated Cool. > - IncrTcl is in, because it is stable, very useful, small, and has a > special Tcl-core status ... and is used in the WiKiT ;-) > - for mostly similar reasons, no other extensions will be added to > Tclkit I still can't see why Itk hasn't made it in the core. It's under 50k. > - the "scripdoc" package (pure Tcl) is kept in Tclkit to support the > pre-starkit world Perhaps consider doing a .kit to convert scripdoc to starkit? Of course, this doesn't stop anybody from using scripdoc - but may help end-users switching to a starkit :) > - no guarantees other than that support for starkits since Sep 2002 > will be maintained :-) > - the SDX utility will grow and/or evolve into a new Startool (but > don't hold your breath) Cool. Any GUIs planned? ;-) > - new options to deploy and maintain starkits over the web and on intranets This is one of those things where I wish tclplugin was still alive :) > - Tclkit will be built as threaded once it is safe to do so, no > sooner than ActiveTcl Hmmm. Seems logical. However, it would be cool to test threaded builds, since there can be some subtle bugs in it - VFS, thread::transfer and so on... > To add to that last comment: I've recently made good progress with > threads (Wojciech: please update your copy of MetaKit from CVS, and > add "--enable-threads" to the MK build). The previous version did > not actually enable the mutex code - and it had a deadlock bug in > mk::loop. I do compile everything using --enable-threads - you'll notice that when you look at the genkit closer. I also wanted to do a complete debugging support, since I ran into several problems (like the one with VFS and Tcl_EvalFile() in another thread on Windows - it still seems to be open :(. But thanks, I'll check it out. > In other words, using the latest codebase, Tclkit can now be built > with threads - I plan to look at Wojciech's changes and extend genkit > to support such a build option (likewise for a debug build). I'll be happy to help. I think that many people want to use Tclkit in commercial apps, where you may want to do one or more of the following: (which cannot be solved without recompiling custom executable): 1/ use threads 2/ change/add custom icons (on Windows) 3/ use BLT 4/ easier builds of some extensions (like building Itk ...) For now, this cannot be done without building a custom executable. This is how I see my changes - if someone needs to, he/she can build it. Since it took me much time, I may save some for others :) So, all I'm asking for is to include genkit which allows that... > I understand that BLT cannot currently be built as dynamic extension > for use with Tclkit, because it is not stubs enabled. Likewise for > Expect, though there are patches for that one. Both are from the > pre-stubs era - so it is understandable that they need extra work to > get there, and that their authors may need some extra > encouragement/cajoling/bribes to make it happen . I sure hope this will happen anytime soon :) > Unfortunately, there is very little I can do about it. If you > require BLT, then you will either have to stick with "traditional" > Tcl installations, Yeap, and try to convince everybody in my university to install Tcl if they want to see my app? :( > such as ActiveTcl, or maintain a custom variation > of Tclkit. > Don't expect either of the above to ever go into tclkit - > they are too big. Right. That *wasn't* my intention! > All we can hope for, is that extensions like > these are "stubbified" - making it trivial to use them in starkits, > starpacks, etc. I really count on that one too :-) > For everything else, don't forget that you can also deploy in a > three-file mode: a standard Tclkit, a kitten-like set of extensions > you always want to have around, and the main app as a starkit (or > more than one, this is great for "application suites" as well). I'm > having a ball doing just that for some custom work right now - > highly recommended. Everything that is more than one file is harder to give away to the customer... One of the reasons prowrap built a single executable :) Also, one can re-wrap a binary and add custom dlls himself/herself, right? :-) -- WK (written at Stardate 56926.5) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Dec 4 10:55:45 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4Gtjx12907; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:55:45 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gB4Gus5p013366; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:56:54 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA23084; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:56:53 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA3AV; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:56:52 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEE3415.A6CF6CB4@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 09:57:57 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wojciech Kocjan CC: starkit , Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? References: <3DEE3150.6020803@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Wojciech, > > Allow me to just re-iterate this point, now that the "genkit" build > > script makes it relatively easy to create variations. Please, > > please, PLEASE, do not call executables with a different feature set > > "tclkit". > > Yes, this is what I said already. Any ideas on a name for such a build? > Tclkitty? :) 'tclpack' has a certain semitry with starkit and starpack. Tom K. From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Dec 4 11:48:53 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4Hmrx18105 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 11:48:53 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gB4Hnv76008982 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:49:57 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4Hnvp12626 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:49:57 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "starkit" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:49:57 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <3DEE3415.A6CF6CB4@motorola.com> Subject: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anybody ever tried to make a starkit the open command for a class of files ? I have a starkit XXX.tcl associated with .tpj files, and when double-clicking a file FOO.tpj I get the error message: 'FOO.tpj is not a valid win32 application'. I should note that the 'edit' command for .tpj's works correctly. Because of this I believe that the system also finds the 'open' command and barfs. IOW that the error message is misleading, oh hell, lying, and that it is actually XXX.tcl which is not recognized as win32 application. Second note: .tcl files are associated with tclsh as open command, and double-clicking on XXX.tcl by itself does work, i.e. Windows does invoke tclsh with the correct argument to run XXX.tcl. It seems that chaining of open commands does not work. Chaining = click FOO.tpj => Find open command XXX.tcl => Find open command tclsh -> Therefore run tclsh XXX.tcl FOO.tpj I guess a possible workaround is to make XXX.tcl a starpack, i.e. containing its own interpreter, which makes it a true .exe -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 4 12:06:28 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4I6Qx19852; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:06:26 -0600 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 19:07:34 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: starkit To: Tom Krehbiel From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3DEE261A.C4CD6B38@motorola.com> Message-Id: <434C80D6-07B3-11D7-B5AF-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > Could you elaberate a little on the "three-file mode". I'm only > familiar with the 2-file mode. What is the correct method for loading > extentions from a third starkit. It's what Kitten does. One file is tclkit, one file is the app starkit, and a third file contains a bunch of extensions, it could come from another source, or contain things want to have around in multiple projects anyway. Here's a quick summary of steps to create/use a separate starkit for extensions: - create myexts.vfs/main.tcl containing just these two lines (i.e. setup & return): package require starkit starkit::startup - place all your extensions inside myexts.vfs/lib/ - wrap it up using "sdx wrap myexts.kit" - to use these extensions, all you need to do is "source myexts.kit" A few possible refinements: - if you want it to work as above but also list all packages when launched, use: package require starkit if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return puts [lsort package names] # note that you'll also see other packages on auto_path - to source myexts.kit when it lives *next* to the launched app starkit: source [file join [file dirname $starkit::topdir] myexts.kit] - to avoid unwanted interaction between two starkits, perhaps make that: set savetop $starkit::topdir source [file join [file dirname $savetop] myexts.kit] set starkit::topdir $savetop -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 4 12:12:26 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4ICPx20360 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:12:26 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB4IDQL7029988 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB4IDR126961; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:13:27 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:13:27 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021204131327.AAB26912@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 04 Dec 2002 17:46:08 +0100 To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Wojciech Kocjan > > - for mostly similar reasons, no other extensions will be added to > > Tclkit > >I still can't see why Itk hasn't made it in the core. It's under 50k. Since Tk isn't even 'in the core', it doesn't seem likely that Itk would go there. As to the question about including Itk in the Tk distribution - that move awaits a 'champion' (or champions) to step forward to do the work... the same reason that Itcl still isn't in the Tcl tar distribution. > > and that their authors may need some extra > > encouragement/cajoling/bribes to make it happen . > >I sure hope this will happen anytime soon :) I believe that the version of Expect that is in ActiveTcl comes from http://expect.sf.net/ and that developers could be added so that one need not await bribery offers to see TEA / stubs appear in Expect. In fact, I'm rather surprised that those changes have not already appeared there. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Dec 4 12:16:34 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IGXx20719 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:16:33 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gB4IGH76011407; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:16:17 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4IGHp16929; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:16:17 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Kevin Kenny" Cc: "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:16:17 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <200212041812.NAA08679@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > andreask@activestate.com said: > > I have a starkit XXX.tcl associated with .tpj files, and when > > double-clicking a file FOO.tpj I get the error message: > > > 'FOO.tpj is not a valid win32 application'. > > Does it make a difference if you put '.tcl' on $env(PATHEXT)? Oh, I do have .tcl in my PATHEXT. Always. (Comes from installing ActiveTcl and TDK :) -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Dec 4 12:18:24 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IINx20915 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:18:24 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gB4IJK76011713; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:19:20 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4IJKp17434; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:19:20 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:19:20 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <20021204131327.AAB26912@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Larry W. Virden > Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 10:13 AM > To: starkit > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? > > > > From: Wojciech Kocjan > > > > - for mostly similar reasons, no other extensions will be added to > > > Tclkit > > > >I still can't see why Itk hasn't made it in the core. It's under 50k. > > Since Tk isn't even 'in the core', it doesn't seem likely that Itk would > go there. As to the question about including Itk in the Tk distribution - > that move awaits a 'champion' (or champions) to step forward to do the > work... the same reason that Itcl still isn't in the Tcl tar distribution. > > > > and that their authors may need some extra > > > encouragement/cajoling/bribes to make it happen . > > > >I sure hope this will happen anytime soon :) > > I believe that the version of Expect that is in ActiveTcl comes from > http://expect.sf.net/ Yes. > and that developers could be added so that one > need not await bribery offers to see TEA / stubs appear in Expect. > In fact, I'm rather surprised that those changes have not already > appeared there. I have Steve Launders stub-patches for expect. I plan in merging them at least into the code-base, maybe a branch first before the next release of TDK. Note that I mean a true release, not the upcoming alpha. Actually I should be able to do this in time for the beta coming after the alpha. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Wed Dec 4 12:11:56 2002 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IBux20311 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:11:56 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gB4ICYcG010924; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:12:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gB4ICRgu019489; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:12:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4ICQ817749; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:12:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.9.3+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id NAA08679; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:12:26 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200212041812.NAA08679@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: "Andreas Kupries" cc: "starkit" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Andreas Kupries" of "Wed, 04 Dec 2002 09:49:57 PST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 13:12:26 -0500 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: andreask@activestate.com said: > I have a starkit XXX.tcl associated with .tpj files, and when > double-clicking a file FOO.tpj I get the error message: > 'FOO.tpj is not a valid win32 application'. Does it make a difference if you put '.tcl' on $env(PATHEXT)? -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 4 12:21:17 2002 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4ILHx21189 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:21:17 -0600 Received: (qmail 28851 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 18:22:22 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-227.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.227) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 18:22:22 -0000 Message-ID: <00f801c29bc1$ef0b8c20$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:21:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C29B8F.9FB282A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] kittens, starkits, and starpacks oh my! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C29B8F.9FB282A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All, I am working on a rather large tcl project that I plan to distribute = using starkit / starpack technology. The application consists of = (roughly) 3 pieces: 1. A series of "agent" programs that perform specific tasks = (eventually, there will be lots of these...) 2. A "manager" program that allows agents to be assigned to, and set up = for, specific Users 3. A "front-end" that groups a User's "agents" into a neat little = launch-panel for easy access. I have completed #2 above (the manager) and currently have it packaged = as a starpack. I am now working on #3 above, and am finding that it = requires many of the "utility" level packages required by #2. I could = easily just include them in the starpack I will eventually create for = the launch-panel, but then I have them in 2 places. This will be = further complicated when I begin to flesh out all of the agent programs = themselves (#1 above), as they too will require (at least some of) the = utility packages I have already created. So, based on the above, what are some ideas on the cleanest way to = package all of this? My preference would be to package #2 and #3 above as starpacks, and all = #1's as starkits that get sourced into #2 and #3 as needed (as they are = not designed to run "stand-alone"), but this leaves me with the = duplicate code problem mentioned above. Should I take the necessary utility level code and package it as a = separate starkit (kind of like Kitten) and just source it as necessary = from the mentioned pieces of the system? =20 If I do that, is it prudent to still package the #2 and #3 as starpacks = even though they are no longer "stand-alone", or should they be made = into starkits also? If I package my utilities as a starkit, what should the internal layout = be? I've looked briefly at the internals of Kitten, but I don't = understand how "sourcing" the kitten.kit file makes the internal = packages available to the caller. I know it does, but I don't really = understand how... Well, that's enough questions for now. Any advice appreciated. Thanks, Jeff ------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C29B8F.9FB282A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi All,
 
I am working on a rather large tcl = project that I=20 plan to distribute using starkit / starpack technology.  The = application=20 consists of (roughly) 3 pieces:
 
1.  A series of "agent" programs = that perform=20 specific tasks (eventually, there will be lots of = these...)
2.  A "manager" program that = allows agents to=20 be assigned to, and set up for, specific Users
3.  A "front-end" that groups a = User's=20 "agents" into a neat little launch-panel for easy access.
 
I have completed #2 above (the manager) = and=20 currently have it packaged as a starpack.  I am now working on #3 = above,=20 and am finding that it requires many of the "utility" level packages = required by=20 #2.  I could easily just include them in the starpack I will = eventually=20 create for the launch-panel, but then I have them in 2 places.  = This will=20 be further complicated when I begin to flesh out all of the agent = programs=20 themselves (#1 above), as they too will require (at least some of) the = utility=20 packages I have already created.
 
So, based on the above, what are some = ideas on the=20 cleanest way to package all of this?
 
My preference would be to package #2 = and #3 above=20 as starpacks, and all #1's as starkits that get sourced into #2 and #3 = as needed=20 (as they are not designed to run "stand-alone"), but this leaves me with = the=20 duplicate code problem mentioned above.
 
Should I take the necessary utility = level code and=20 package it as a separate starkit (kind of like Kitten) and just source = it as=20 necessary from the mentioned pieces of the system? 
 
If I do that, is it prudent to still = package the #2=20 and #3 as starpacks even though they are no longer "stand-alone", or = should they=20 be made into starkits also?
 
If I package my utilities as a starkit, = what should=20 the internal layout be?  I've looked briefly at the internals of = Kitten,=20 but I don't understand how "sourcing" the kitten.kit file makes the = internal=20 packages available to the caller.  I know it does, but I don't = really=20 understand how...
 
Well, that's enough questions for = now.  Any=20 advice appreciated.
 
Thanks,
 
Jeff
 
------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C29B8F.9FB282A0-- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 4 12:27:34 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IRYx21722 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:27:34 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB4ISaL7006013 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:28:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB4ISaO27192; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:28:36 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:28:36 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021204132836.AAB27171@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? In-Reply-To: <434C80D6-07B3-11D7-B5AF-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> of Wed, 4 Dec 2002 19:07:34 +0100 To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Here's a quick summary of steps to create/use a separate starkit for > extensions: > - create myexts.vfs/main.tcl containing just these two lines (i.e. > setup & return): > package require starkit > starkit::startup > - place all your extensions inside myexts.vfs/lib/ > - wrap it up using "sdx wrap myexts.kit" > - to use these extensions, all you need to do is "source myexts.kit" Is this info documented on a Wiki some place? I can put it on if not. Also, someone doing something like this might think about adding kitten's use of a wikit for documentation and its -l and -u flags as well. Perhaps just unwrap kitten and replace the appropriate lib directories? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Wed Dec 4 12:25:15 2002 Received: from ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [216.35.73.165]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IPEx21513 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:25:14 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gB4IPHrd012187; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:25:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gB4IPBwg004324; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:25:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IPA823655; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:25:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.9.3+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id NAA08755; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:25:09 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200212041825.NAA08755@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: "Andreas Kupries" cc: "starkit" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Andreas Kupries" of "Wed, 04 Dec 2002 09:49:57 PST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 13:25:09 -0500 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: What I've done successfully, in pre-tclkit days, is to make the Open command for some file extension be: "drive:\path\to\wish.exe" "drive:\path\to\script.tcl" "%1" That's what http://wiki.tcl.tk/1074 does. I presume that ought also to work for starkits. -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Dec 4 12:37:26 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4IbPx22572 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:37:26 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gB4IWa76013106; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:32:36 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4IWap19822; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:32:36 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Kevin Kenny" Cc: "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:32:36 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <200212041825.NAA08755@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com > [mailto:kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com]On Behalf Of Kevin Kenny > Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 10:25 AM > To: Andreas Kupries > Cc: starkit > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command > > > > What I've done successfully, in pre-tclkit days, is to make the > Open command for some file extension be: > > "drive:\path\to\wish.exe" "drive:\path\to\script.tcl" "%1" > > That's what http://wiki.tcl.tk/1074 does. I presume that ought > also to work for starkits. Ah. Essentially we do the necessary chaining on our own, when registering the command. Checking ... Yes, that works. Thanks Kevin, for the idea. I obviously didn't see the forest in the mass of trees. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 4 12:51:17 2002 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4IpGx23660 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:51:16 -0600 Received: (qmail 32212 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 18:52:15 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-227.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.227) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 18:52:15 -0000 Message-ID: <013201c29bc6$24f28a60$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <00f801c29bc1$ef0b8c20$0101a8c0@quantex> Subject: Re: [Starkit] kittens, starkits, and starpacks oh my! Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:50:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_012F_01C29B93.C90F0DE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_012F_01C29B93.C90F0DE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey, I see that (at least part of) my answer arrived in the same = send/receive cycle that shipped my original email. Cool, JC answered it = before it was even posted - now that's service! So, now that I know = *how* to create a kitten like package, is this likely the best solution = to the packaging questions I posted earlier? (earlier post, same title). Thanks, Jeff ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jeff Godfrey=20 To: starkit@equi4.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 12:21 PM Subject: [Starkit] kittens, starkits, and starpacks oh my! Hi All, I am working on a rather large tcl project that I plan to distribute = using starkit / starpack technology. The application consists of = (roughly) 3 pieces: 1. A series of "agent" programs that perform specific tasks = (eventually, there will be lots of these...) 2. A "manager" program that allows agents to be assigned to, and set = up for, specific Users 3. A "front-end" that groups a User's "agents" into a neat little = launch-panel for easy access. I have completed #2 above (the manager) and currently have it packaged = as a starpack. I am now working on #3 above, and am finding that it = requires many of the "utility" level packages required by #2. I could = easily just include them in the starpack I will eventually create for = the launch-panel, but then I have them in 2 places. This will be = further complicated when I begin to flesh out all of the agent programs = themselves (#1 above), as they too will require (at least some of) the = utility packages I have already created. So, based on the above, what are some ideas on the cleanest way to = package all of this? My preference would be to package #2 and #3 above as starpacks, and = all #1's as starkits that get sourced into #2 and #3 as needed (as they = are not designed to run "stand-alone"), but this leaves me with the = duplicate code problem mentioned above. Should I take the necessary utility level code and package it as a = separate starkit (kind of like Kitten) and just source it as necessary = from the mentioned pieces of the system? =20 If I do that, is it prudent to still package the #2 and #3 as = starpacks even though they are no longer "stand-alone", or should they = be made into starkits also? If I package my utilities as a starkit, what should the internal = layout be? I've looked briefly at the internals of Kitten, but I don't = understand how "sourcing" the kitten.kit file makes the internal = packages available to the caller. I know it does, but I don't really = understand how... Well, that's enough questions for now. Any advice appreciated. Thanks, Jeff ------=_NextPart_000_012F_01C29B93.C90F0DE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey, I see that (at least part of) my = answer=20 arrived in the same send/receive cycle that shipped my original = email. =20 Cool, JC answered it before it was even posted - now that's = service!  So,=20 now that I know *how* to create a kitten like package, is this likely = the best=20 solution to the packaging questions I posted earlier? (earlier = post,=20 same title).
 
Thanks,
 
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Jeff=20 Godfrey
Sent: Wednesday, December 04, = 2002 12:21=20 PM
Subject: [Starkit] kittens, = starkits, and=20 starpacks oh my!

Hi All,
 
I am working on a rather large tcl = project that I=20 plan to distribute using starkit / starpack technology.  The = application=20 consists of (roughly) 3 pieces:
 
1.  A series of "agent" programs = that=20 perform specific tasks (eventually, there will be lots of=20 these...)
2.  A "manager" program that = allows agents=20 to be assigned to, and set up for, specific Users
3.  A "front-end" that groups a = User's=20 "agents" into a neat little launch-panel for easy access.
 
I have completed #2 above (the = manager) and=20 currently have it packaged as a starpack.  I am now working on #3 = above,=20 and am finding that it requires many of the "utility" level packages = required=20 by #2.  I could easily just include them in the starpack I will=20 eventually create for the launch-panel, but then I have them in 2=20 places.  This will be further complicated when I begin to flesh = out all=20 of the agent programs themselves (#1 above), as they too will require = (at=20 least some of) the utility packages I have already = created.
 
So, based on the above, what are some = ideas on=20 the cleanest way to package all of this?
 
My preference would be to package #2 = and #3 above=20 as starpacks, and all #1's as starkits that get sourced into #2 and #3 = as=20 needed (as they are not designed to run "stand-alone"), but this = leaves me=20 with the duplicate code problem mentioned above.
 
Should I take the necessary utility = level code=20 and package it as a separate starkit (kind of like Kitten) and just = source it=20 as necessary from the mentioned pieces of the system?  =
 
If I do that, is it prudent to still = package the=20 #2 and #3 as starpacks even though they are no longer "stand-alone", = or should=20 they be made into starkits also?
 
If I package my utilities as a = starkit, what=20 should the internal layout be?  I've looked briefly at the = internals of=20 Kitten, but I don't understand how "sourcing" the kitten.kit file = makes the=20 internal packages available to the caller.  I know it does, but I = don't=20 really understand how...
 
Well, that's enough questions for = now.  Any=20 advice appreciated.
 
Thanks,
 
Jeff
 
------=_NextPart_000_012F_01C29B93.C90F0DE0-- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Dec 4 14:51:35 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4KpZx00320 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 14:51:35 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gB4KqjWD016591 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:52:45 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA02967 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:52:45 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA3LZ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:52:44 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEE6B5C.B9A4F298@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 13:53:48 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit with batteries included? References: <20021204132836.AAB27171@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, I added it to my page, I'm keeping stuff there till I have time to do something with it that makes better sense. http://mini.net/tcl/3277.html Tom K. > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > > > Here's a quick summary of steps to create/use a separate starkit for > > extensions: > > - create myexts.vfs/main.tcl containing just these two lines (i.e. > > setup & return): > > package require starkit > > starkit::startup > > - place all your extensions inside myexts.vfs/lib/ > > - wrap it up using "sdx wrap myexts.kit" > > - to use these extensions, all you need to do is "source myexts.kit" > > Is this info documented on a Wiki some place? I can put it on > if not. > > Also, someone doing something like this might think about adding kitten's > use of a wikit for documentation and its -l and -u flags as well. > > Perhaps just unwrap kitten and replace the appropriate lib directories? > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > -><- > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 4 15:52:58 2002 Received: from lewey.iland.net (lewey.iland.net [205.242.230.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4Lqwx04972 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:52:58 -0600 Received: (qmail 17949 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 21:54:08 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-227.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.227) by lewey.iland.net with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 21:54:08 -0000 Message-ID: <01c901c29bdf$757f8960$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:52:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01C6_01C29BAD.268B3520" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01C6_01C29BAD.268B3520 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All, I am just starting to explore the possibilities of creating a help = system for my App using an internally stored Wikit. After some = experimentation, it looks simple enough. One (probably ill-informed) = question though: How does one go about creating the initial "tkd" file = containing the help text? Thanks for any tips... Jeff ------=_NextPart_000_01C6_01C29BAD.268B3520 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi All,
 
I am just starting to explore the = possibilities of=20 creating a help system for my App using an internally stored = Wikit.  After=20 some experimentation, it looks simple enough.  One (probably = ill-informed)=20 question though:  How does one go about creating the initial "tkd" = file=20 containing the help text?
 
Thanks for any tips...

Jeff
------=_NextPart_000_01C6_01C29BAD.268B3520-- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Dec 4 16:25:57 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4MPux07272 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:25:56 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gB4MR6cn010818 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:27:06 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA03009 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:27:06 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA3QV; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:26:19 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEE814B.6AACE672@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 15:27:23 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Godfrey , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system References: <01c901c29bdf$757f8960$0101a8c0@quantex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, If there isn't a .tkd file specified when wikit is started then it creates one. To creating the documentation just start editing the pages you see (after reading the help of course). Check http://mini.net/tcl/4579 for help on adding images to your .tkd Tom K. > I am just starting to explore the possibilities of creating a help system for my App using an internally stored Wikit. After some > experimentation, it looks simple enough. One (probably ill-informed) question though: How does one go about creating the initial > "tkd" file containing the help text? From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 4 16:54:10 2002 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4MsAx09093 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:54:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 2444 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 22:54:53 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-227.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.227) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 22:54:53 -0000 Message-ID: <021801c29be7$f12e76e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Tom Krehbiel" , References: <01c901c29bdf$757f8960$0101a8c0@quantex> <3DEE814B.6AACE672@motorola.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:52:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, Thanks for the reply. I have dl'd the latest wikit and have done some playing. As you said, it does create a fresh wikit.tkd file when started, but it also populates it with quite a lot of "stuff' that has no relevance to *my* help system. How does one go about getting a "blank" tkd file to begin editing? TIA for any additional pointers - even if they are to just RTFM! ;^) Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Krehbiel" To: "Jeff Godfrey" ; Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 4:27 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system > Jeff, > > If there isn't a .tkd file specified when wikit is started then it creates one. To creating the documentation just start editing the > pages you see (after reading the help of course). Check http://mini.net/tcl/4579 for help on adding images to your .tkd > > Tom K. > > > I am just starting to explore the possibilities of creating a help system for my App using an internally stored Wikit. After some > > experimentation, it looks simple enough. One (probably ill-informed) question though: How does one go about creating the initial > > "tkd" file containing the help text? > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Wed Dec 4 17:00:47 2002 Received: from ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [216.35.73.165]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4N0lx09526 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:00:47 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gB4N1mrd000731; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:01:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gB4N1gV2007451; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:01:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB4N1f708290; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:01:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.9.3+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id SAA12708; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:01:40 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: "Jeff Godfrey" cc: "Tom Krehbiel" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Jeff Godfrey" of "Wed, 04 Dec 2002 16:52:53 CST." <021801c29be7$f12e76e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 18:01:40 -0500 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: jeff_godfrey@pobox.com said: > Thanks for the reply. I have dl'd the latest wikit and have done some > playing. As you said, it does create a fresh wikit.tkd file when > started, but it also populates it with quite a lot of "stuff' that has > no relevance to *my* help system. How does one go about getting a > "blank" tkd file to begin editing? As far as I know, you can't, but you *can* edit the "stuff", including removing references to unused "stuff". In other words, simply go and blank out all the pages that you aren't using. If you really wanted to get fancy, you could start editing titles so that pages can be reused, but I've never bothered. If you use 'Search' in the help for dots.kit, you'll see some otherwise unreachable pages. -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From steve@digital-smarties.com Wed Dec 4 17:34:30 2002 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB4NYTx11475 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:34:30 -0600 Received: (qmail 4967 invoked by uid 8); 4 Dec 2002 23:35:37 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "[192.168.1.3]") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdU6omsd; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 18:35:27 EST From: "Steve Landers" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 07:35:26 +0800 Message-Id: <20021204233526.14012@mail.digital-smarties.com> In-Reply-To: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> References: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: CTM PowerMail 4.0.1 carbon MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="==_20021204233526.27216-1_==" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --==_20021204233526.27216-1_== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Wed, 4 Dec 2002 Kevin Kenny wrote: >jeff_godfrey@pobox.com said: >> Thanks for the reply. I have dl'd the latest wikit and have done some >> playing. As you said, it does create a fresh wikit.tkd file when >> started, but it also populates it with quite a lot of "stuff' that has >> no relevance to *my* help system. How does one go about getting a >> "blank" tkd file to begin editing? > >As far as I know, you can't, but you *can* edit the "stuff", including >removing references to unused "stuff". Don't forget that the wikit data files are just Metakit databases, so you can just write a script to delete pages 10 and upwards. Something like the attached ... use at your own risk :-) To use, run tclkit wikiclear.tcl oldwiki newwiki Newwiki mustn't exist, and oldwiki will be left intact. Cheers Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@digital-smarties.com Perth, Western Australia www.digital-smarties.com --==_20021204233526.27216-1_== Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="wikiclear.tcl"; x-mac-type="00000000"; x-mac-creator="00000000" Content-Disposition: attachment Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 cGFja2FnZSByZXF1aXJlIE1rNHRjbAoKbGFzc2lnbiAkYXJndiBpbmYgb3V0ZgppZiB7JGlu ZiA9PSAiIiB8fCAkb3V0ZiA9PSAiIn0gewogIHB1dHMgc3RkZXJyICJVc2FnZTogJGFyZ3Yw IGluZmlsZSBvdXRmaWxlIgogIGV4aXQgMQp9Cgptazo6ZmlsZSBvcGVuIGRiICRpbmYgLXJl YWRvbmx5CmlmIHtbZmlsZSBleGlzdHMgJG91dGZdfSB7CiAgICBwdXRzIHN0ZGVyciAiJGFy Z3YwOiBvdXRwdXQgZmlsZSBcIiRvdXRmXCIgYWxyZWFkeSBleGlzdHMiCiAgICBleGl0IDEK fQoKc2V0IHBhZ2VzIFtscmFuZ2UgW2xzb3J0IC1pbnRlZ2VyIFttazo6c2VsZWN0IGRiLnBh Z2VzXV0gMTAgZW5kXQpwdXRzIHN0ZGVyciAicGFnZXMgPSAkcGFnZXMiCmZvcmVhY2ggcGcg W2xzb3J0IC1kZWNyZWFzaW5nICRwYWdlc10gewogICAgbWs6OnJvdyBkZWxldGUgZGIucGFn ZXMhJHBnCn0KcHV0cyBzdGRlcnIgInBhZ2VzID0gW2xzb3J0IC1pbnRlZ2VyIFttazo6c2Vs ZWN0IGRiLnBhZ2VzXV0iCgpzZXQgZmQgW29wZW4gJG91dGYgd10KbWs6OmZpbGUgc2F2ZSBk YiAkZmQKY2xvc2UgJGZkCg== --==_20021204233526.27216-1_==-- From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 4 18:19:11 2002 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB50JAx14131 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:19:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 1149 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 00:20:07 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-202-135.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.202.135) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 00:20:07 -0000 Message-ID: <002601c29bf4$0b9f25e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Tom Krehbiel" , References: <01c901c29bdf$757f8960$0101a8c0@quantex> <3DEE814B.6AACE672@motorola.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:19:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: OK, I'm on my way. I've even played with some images, and had *mostly* good luck. There seems to be a problem with referencing the same image multiple times on the same page. All images end up stacked up at the location of the first reference. Is this a known issue, or am I doing something wrong? Thanks, Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Krehbiel" To: "Jeff Godfrey" ; Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 4:27 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system > Jeff, > > If there isn't a .tkd file specified when wikit is started then it creates one. To creating the documentation just start editing the > pages you see (after reading the help of course). Check http://mini.net/tcl/4579 for help on adding images to your .tkd > > Tom K. > > > I am just starting to explore the possibilities of creating a help system for my App using an internally stored Wikit. After some > > experimentation, it looks simple enough. One (probably ill-informed) question though: How does one go about creating the initial > > "tkd" file containing the help text? > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Dec 4 18:44:43 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB50igx15637 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:44:43 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id gB50jffw009314 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:45:41 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id RAA02366 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:45:41 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA3WC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:45:40 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEEA1F4.FD9BF88C@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 17:46:44 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Landers CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system References: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> <20021204233526.14012@mail.digital-smarties.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I added a wiki page on "How to create and clean up a Wikit .tkd file". http://mini.net/tcl/4856 Tom K. > > On Wed, 4 Dec 2002 Kevin Kenny wrote: > > >jeff_godfrey@pobox.com said: > >> Thanks for the reply. I have dl'd the latest wikit and have done some > >> playing. As you said, it does create a fresh wikit.tkd file when > >> started, but it also populates it with quite a lot of "stuff' that has > >> no relevance to *my* help system. How does one go about getting a > >> "blank" tkd file to begin editing? > > > >As far as I know, you can't, but you *can* edit the "stuff", including > >removing references to unused "stuff". > > Don't forget that the wikit data files are just Metakit databases, so you > can just write a script to delete pages 10 and upwards. > > Something like the attached ... use at your own risk :-) > > To use, run > > tclkit wikiclear.tcl oldwiki newwiki > > Newwiki mustn't exist, and oldwiki will be left intact. > > Cheers > > Steve From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 4 18:47:13 2002 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB50lDx15813 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:47:13 -0600 Received: (qmail 22955 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 00:47:51 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-202-135.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.202.135) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 00:47:51 -0000 Message-ID: <002e01c29bf7$ef6b28c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Steve Landers" , References: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> <20021204233526.14012@mail.digital-smarties.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:47:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Landers" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system [snip] > Don't forget that the wikit data files are just Metakit databases, so you > can just write a script to delete pages 10 and upwards. Ahhh, of course. I *know* this, but don't really think about the Wikit being stored as a standard Metakit database. Remembering this will probably go a long way (note to self...). I wrote a (fairly) nice GUI program for viewing, editing, general Metakit databases - I use it all the time for looking at the content of my database files during application development. Tempted by the fact that "wikit data files are just Metakit databases", I pointed my Metakit viewer app at a wikit.tkd file to see what I could see.... Well, under Windows 98, wish crashes quite handily with the following: WISH84 caused a general protection fault in module DIBENG.DLL at 0005:00003f2f. Registers: EAX=00c0c0c0 CS=03cf EIP=00003f2f EFLGS=00000202 EBX=000f0bab SS=6447 ESP=0000abf0 EBP=0000ad4a ECX=00000bab DS=5596 ESI=00000000 FS=6447 EDX=ffff0000 ES=5596 EDI=ffff2f1c GS=05f7 Bytes at CS:EIP: f3 ab 03 fa 81 eb 00 00 01 00 7d f1 c3 2c 3f 1a Stack dump: 00003c9c 03c700eb ad4a0000 61de0000 adb60000 78030000 00000001 00e39700 00ea374d 00e853f0 00754ba4 00754c18 00000006 00ea3fec 0000002c 00f7fa90 I assume that "DIBENG.DLL" is used for some type of rendering (Device Independent Bitmap Engine?). The crash likely stems from something in my code, but its shouldn't crash wish. I haven't started digging yet, but does this mean anything to anyone? I realize this is no longer Starkit related, but since the thread started here.... Jeff From will@wjduquette.com Wed Dec 4 18:53:17 2002 Received: from harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net (harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB50rHx16220 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:53:17 -0600 Received: from pool0013.cvx38-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.30.13] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18JkHT-0001W1-00; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 16:54:20 -0800 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20021204164428.00a60d90@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 16:49:32 -0800 To: "Andreas Kupries" , "starkit" From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command In-Reply-To: References: <3DEE3415.A6CF6CB4@motorola.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas, I've built Notebook as a starpack, and have successfully made the .nbk files clickable that way. But try this: relate your .tpj files to tclkit.exe, not XXX.tcl. Then, you can specify the specific command line used to execute tclkit.exe given FOO.tpj; you should be able to insert XXX.tcl in it just as you like. Then, clicking on a FOO.tpj will invoke tclkit to invoke XXX.tcl with FOO.tpj. I've not tried this, but I think it'll work. Will At 09:49 AM 12/4/2002 -0800, Andreas Kupries wrote: >Has anybody ever tried to make a starkit the open command for a class of >files ? > >I have a starkit XXX.tcl associated with .tpj files, and when >double-clicking >a file FOO.tpj I get the error message: > > 'FOO.tpj is not a valid win32 application'. > >I should note that the 'edit' command for .tpj's works correctly. Because of >this >I believe that the system also finds the 'open' command and barfs. IOW that >the >error message is misleading, oh hell, lying, and that it is actually XXX.tcl >which >is not recognized as win32 application. > >Second note: .tcl files are associated with tclsh as open command, and >double-clicking >on XXX.tcl by itself does work, i.e. Windows does invoke tclsh with the >correct >argument to run XXX.tcl. > >It seems that chaining of open commands does not work. Chaining = > click FOO.tpj > => Find open command XXX.tcl > => Find open command tclsh > -> Therefore run tclsh XXX.tcl FOO.tpj > >I guess a possible workaround is to make XXX.tcl a starpack, i.e. containing >its own >interpreter, which makes it a true .exe > > >-- > Andreas Kupries > Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit ----------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | It's amazing what you can do http://www.wjduquette.com | with the right tools. From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Dec 4 18:57:30 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB50vTx16485 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:57:30 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gB50wY76020737; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:58:34 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB50wYp19568; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:58:34 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Will Duquette" , "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:58:34 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20021204164428.00a60d90@pop.earthlink.net> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: Will Duquette [mailto:will@wjduquette.com] > Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 4:50 PM > To: Andreas Kupries; starkit > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Windows question, starkits as "open" command > > > Andreas, > > I've built Notebook as a starpack, and have successfully made the > .nbk files > clickable that way. > > But try this: relate your .tpj files to tclkit.exe, not XXX.tcl. Then, > you can specify the specific command line used to execute tclkit.exe given > FOO.tpj; you should be able to insert XXX.tcl in it just as you > like. Then, > clicking on a FOO.tpj will invoke tclkit to invoke XXX.tcl with FOO.tpj. > > I've not tried this, but I think it'll work. > > Will I believe that this is the same as Kevin suggested | What I've done successfully, in pre-tclkit days, is to make the | Open command for some file extension be: | | "drive:\path\to\wish.exe" "drive:\path\to\script.tcl" "%1" In my case "drive:\path\to\wish.exe" "drive:\path\to\prolaunch.tcl" "%1" -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Dec 5 02:08:14 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB588Dx02168 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 02:08:14 -0600 Received: (qmail 36672 invoked by uid 300); 5 Dec 2002 08:09:23 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 08:09:23 -0000 Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 02:09:23 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] TclKits and Starpacks Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've asked this question in several places to no avail. Perhaps someone here can answer me. Is there anyway to determine the header size (IE: the Tcl/Tk binary) of a TclKit or Starpack? Since both are basically a Tcl/Tk binary header on top of a MetaKit file, there should be some way to determine where the one starts and the latter begins. At the very least, is there any way I can wrap a new Starpack from a Starpack without including everything in the current Starpack? Thanks, Damon Courtney From jcw@equi4.com Thu Dec 5 05:08:07 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB5B86x11255 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 05:08:06 -0600 Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 12:09:16 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKits and Starpacks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > Is there anyway to determine the header > size (IE: the Tcl/Tk binary) of a TclKit or Starpack? Since both > are basically a Tcl/Tk binary header on top of a MetaKit file, there > should be some way to determine where the one starts and the latter > begins. There is one now - I've added a "mkinfo" option to SDX. You can unpack sdx.kit and look at sdx.vfs/lib/app-sdx/mkinfo.tcl to see how it is done. > At the very least, is there any way I can wrap a new Starpack from > a Starpack without including everything in the current Starpack? Tricky - tclkit is a compiled binary header, plus a VFS directory tree. What SDX does is copy all of that, then open the VFS and add more files into it. So the VFS tree is no longer just what tclkit needs. If it's a starpack, it will have a new "main.tcl" added, plus everything else SDX finds. The presence of "main.tcl" is what distinguishes a starpack from a plain tclkit. Assuming you know what SDX added, and nothing was overwritten, then technically speaking you could delete all those files to restore a clean tclkit. Or just take the existing starpack as staring point, and copy what you want to add into it, i.e. use sdx wrap -runtime again. If the main.tcl is overwritten, then that will take over and launch what you just added - ignoring the rest of things added in a previous cycle. The messy part of this, is that old cruft is not cleaned out that way. Starkits really act like directories. It's the same problem as trying to restore a directory tree to its previous state. For the general case, you need more info than starkits (currently) maintain. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Dec 5 05:18:37 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB5BIbx11702 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 05:18:37 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB5BJdL7004085 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 06:19:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB5BJeK23371; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 06:19:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 06:19:40 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021205061940.AAB23360@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:47:22 -0600 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Jeff Godfrey" > I wrote a (fairly) nice GUI program for > viewing, editing, general Metakit databases - I use it all the time for > looking at the content of my database files during application development. > Tempted by the fact that "wikit data files are just Metakit databases", I > pointed my Metakit viewer app at a wikit.tkd file to see what I could > see.... Well, under Windows 98, wish crashes quite handily with the > following: Where's the application? Perhaps someone either here or on the Metakit or on the Tclers Wiki mailing list can help you debug it. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Dec 5 09:23:54 2002 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB5FNsx24584 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:23:54 -0600 Received: from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id gB5FP4fw024292 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 08:25:04 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA15218 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 08:25:04 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCA38Z; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 08:24:18 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEF6FE3.6C105E85@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 08:25:23 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Godfrey CC: Steve Landers , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system References: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> <20021204233526.14012@mail.digital-smarties.com> <002e01c29bf7$ef6b28c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, <..snip..> > go a long way (note to self...). I wrote a (fairly) nice GUI program for > viewing, editing, general Metakit databases - I use it all the time for > looking at the content of my database files during application development. <..snip..> Yesterday it occured to me that a "Wikitool" would be very useful for maintaining .tkd files. At the time I was thinking about starting with Steve Landers Kitview but your code sounds like it is a little further along than his. Is the code available some were for download? What I'm thinking of for the Wikitool is a browse and edit tool that also supports the loading of graphics files for later linking and tools for maintaining .tkd files (such as broken link reports, etc.) Tom K. From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Thu Dec 5 09:35:55 2002 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB5FZtx25340 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:35:55 -0600 Received: (qmail 19774 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 15:36:58 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-28.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.28) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 15:36:58 -0000 Message-ID: <00f801c29c74$1d7f0c00$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> <20021204233526.14012@mail.digital-smarties.com> <002e01c29bf7$ef6b28c0$0101a8c0@quantex> <3DEF6FE3.6C105E85@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:36:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Metakit Viewer - (was Wikit style help system) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I've been asked by several people about the availability of my Metakit "viewer/editor" app. I've responded to several people privately, but I thought I'd respond here also... Although my code works well for me, it still has a few dark corners that need to be worked out. I've needed to clean things up for a while anyway, so maybe this'll be just the incentive I need to get it done... I'll try to do some work on it and make it available for those who are interested in the next week (?) or so. I'll keep you posted. Thanks, Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Krehbiel" To: "Jeff Godfrey" Cc: "Steve Landers" ; Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 9:25 AM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system > Jeff, > > <..snip..> > > > go a long way (note to self...). I wrote a (fairly) nice GUI program for > > viewing, editing, general Metakit databases - I use it all the time for > > looking at the content of my database files during application development. > > <..snip..> > > Yesterday it occured to me that a "Wikitool" would be very useful for maintaining .tkd files. At the time I was thinking about > starting with Steve Landers Kitview but your code sounds like it is a little further along than his. Is the code available some were > for download? What I'm thinking of for the Wikitool is a browse and edit tool that also supports the loading of graphics files for > later linking and tools for maintaining .tkd files (such as broken link reports, etc.) > > Tom K. > > From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Dec 5 10:17:22 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB5GHMx27974; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 10:17:22 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gB5GIWOI006724; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:18:32 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA28699; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:13:56 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAPAW; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:17:46 -0700 Message-ID: <3DEF7C6B.5A6E7640@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 09:18:51 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Godfrey , jcw@equi4.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system References: <200212042301.SAA12708@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> <20021204233526.14012@mail.digital-smarties.com> <002e01c29bf7$ef6b28c0$0101a8c0@quantex> <3DEF6FE3.6C105E85@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I just noticed that JCW has a "wikitool" application at http://www.equi4.com/wikit/1 (although it doesn't address the issues discussed below). It appearently does the following: Usage: wikitool.tcl -l list page titles wikitool.tcl -s extract all scripts to stdout wikitool.tcl -x ?num ...? extract specified (or all) pages to stdout However when I created a tkd by starting wikit an then tried the command, it crashes. % wikitool.tcl -l can't read "s": no such variable while executing "${mk}loop c db.pages 10 { array set a [${mk}get $c] if {[string length $a(page)] > 0} { set n [${mk}cursor pos c] set t [clock fo..." ("-l" arm line 3) invoked from within "switch -- [lindex $argv 0] { -l { ${mk}file open db wikit.tkd ${mk}loop c db.pages 10 { array set a [${mk}get $c] if {[string le..." (file "wikitool.tcl" line 473) > Jeff, > > <..snip..> > > > go a long way (note to self...). I wrote a (fairly) nice GUI program for > > viewing, editing, general Metakit databases - I use it all the time for > > looking at the content of my database files during application development. > > <..snip..> > > Yesterday it occured to me that a "Wikitool" would be very useful for maintaining .tkd files. At the time I was thinking about > starting with Steve Landers Kitview but your code sounds like it is a little further along than his. Is the code available some were > for download? What I'm thinking of for the Wikitool is a browse and edit tool that also supports the loading of graphics files for > later linking and tools for maintaining .tkd files (such as broken link reports, etc.) > > Tom K. From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Dec 5 14:39:51 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB5Kdpx16222 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:39:51 -0600 Received: (qmail 49731 invoked by uid 300); 5 Dec 2002 20:40:52 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 20:40:52 -0000 Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:40:52 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKits and Starpacks In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > There is one now - I've added a "mkinfo" option to SDX. You can unpack > sdx.kit and look at sdx.vfs/lib/app-sdx/mkinfo.tcl to see how it is > done. Thanks. I really appreciate this. It was exactly what I needed. > > At the very least, is there any way I can wrap a new Starpack from > > a Starpack without including everything in the current Starpack? > > Tricky - tclkit is a compiled binary header, plus a VFS directory tree. > What SDX does is copy all of that, then open the VFS and add more > files into it. So the VFS tree is no longer just what tclkit needs. > If it's a starpack, it will have a new "main.tcl" added, plus > everything else SDX finds. The presence of "main.tcl" is what > distinguishes a starpack from a plain tclkit. > > Assuming you know what SDX added, and nothing was overwritten, then > technically speaking you could delete all those files to restore a > clean tclkit. If you just deleted the files though, wouldn't the resulting file still be the same size? I didn't think MK recovered removed data sections. What I ended up doing when I re-wrote freeWrap was to actually pack a file manifest of what was in a blank file. IE: The Tcl/tk library files themselves. Then, when I built a new file from that, I would just simply start with the Tcl/Tk binary header and copy in the default files. I will probably end up doing the same unless you have a better suggestion I'm not thinking of. > Or just take the existing starpack as staring point, and copy what you > want to add into it, i.e. use sdx wrap -runtime again. If the main.tcl > is overwritten, then that will take over and launch what you just added > - ignoring the rest of things added in a previous cycle. The messy > part of this, is that old cruft is not cleaned out that way. Yeah. That's the rub. I'm using this for InstallBase, which can build huge installs. By just overwriting the main.tcl file, I still leave the entire application in the binary. I have another problem that I will eventually have to approach with TclKits. When I re-wrote freeWrap to use its own internal commands to build zip files instead of using a zip binary that was extracted, I copied zlib.c out of TclKit. The only problem I ran into was that I couldn't really handle extremely large files. This is because [zlib deflate] calls zlib's deflate2() in the way to compress the entire chunk of data at once. When you attempt to do that with a 50M file, the amount of memory allocated and used suddenly causes some severe problems. And I'm on a pretty decent system. To remedy this, I wrote a function that uses zlib's compression in a loop (which it was already built to do) and called it 'zlib fcopy'. Gave it the parameters of the fcopy command, and you can now copy from one file channel to another, and the data will compress along the way. Would you be interested in adding that to TclKit, or should I just build it into mine? Thanks again, Damon From jcw@equi4.com Thu Dec 5 15:19:32 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB5LJVx19272 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 15:19:32 -0600 Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 22:20:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKits and Starpacks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <67EE6230-0897-11D7-AED3-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: [using one starpack as starting point for another] Ah, now that you mention doing this for an installer - I think I see what you're after. >> Assuming you know what SDX added, and nothing was overwritten, then >> technically speaking you could delete all those files to restore a >> clean tclkit. > > If you just deleted the files though, wouldn't the resulting file > still be the same size? I didn't think MK recovered removed data > sections. That's correct. To compact to a MK datafile to minimal size, you need to serialize it to a *new* file, using "mk::file save". It's possible to do this with not too much intermediate copying, btw: - first make sure you have sourced all the scripts you need - now, you can start modifying the running installer itself - delete what is not needed, i.e. end up with a VFS which is "clean" - add whatever new files need to be in the new VFS dir tree - note that this can be done even though VFS is read-only - then, to generate a tclkit executable: - copy the header of the installer, i.e. the compiled code to new file - append the *current* VFS state to the end of it, using "mk::file save" It's like altering the directory tree under yourself, and saving a snapshot of that new state. Changes to VFS mounted read-only (and that includes starpacks) *are* allowed, and have effect on the memory-resident state - they just never get committed back to the unerlying file. In this case, I think it's exactly what is needed. > Yeah. That's the rub. I'm using this for InstallBase, which can > build huge installs. By just overwriting the main.tcl file, I still > leave the entire application in the binary. So the trick, is not to copy the VFS tree as file and then modify, but to alter the VFS tree while mounted read-only, and then save a serialized snapshot. This produces an optimally compacted datafile. > I have another problem that I will eventually have to approach with > TclKits. When I re-wrote freeWrap to use its own internal commands to > build zip files instead of using a zip binary that was extracted, I > copied > zlib.c out of TclKit. The only problem I ran into was that I couldn't > really handle extremely large files. I'm all for improving the zlib side of Tclkit. There are now several versions of zlib-wrappers for Tcl, the most recent being one which Andreas Kupries is splitting off from the "img" extension (now called tkimg - his changes are in CVS right now), so that png works. I'm hoping that tkimg's zlib wrapping will be small but also a good basis for exposing a channel interface (or some other way to do incremental compression). When that happens, it could be added to tclkit as static lib, and be usable for this improved VFS compression approach, as well as png. There's a lot of room for improvement on MK's side of VFS still, btw. I'm doing an awful lot via in-memory copying which can be done with memory-mapped files. The core MK engine has all the functionality, it's just the Mk4tcl wrapper which needs a little bit more machinery to expose things properly. Once incremental zlib compression (and decompression) on top is implemented, sequentially reading or writing would not need a temporary (uncompressed!) memory copy at all. Reasons for the current state are mostly historical - and because I used a small but dumb zlib wrapper. Pulling all of Trf into Tclkit was (still is) not an option, due to code size and build complexities. > This is because [zlib deflate] calls zlib's deflate2() in the way > to compress the entire chunk of data at once. When you attempt to do > that with a 50M file, the amount of memory allocated and used suddenly > causes some severe problems. And I'm on a pretty decent system. Is compression of a 50 Mb file a problem of responsiveness? Is memory consumption too high and do we need to introduce a way to bypass VFS decompression? In the first case, would threads help? In the second, I think there are more uses for this - I for one currently need to synchronize VFS across the net, and right now I have to jump through a decompress - transfer - compress hoop which is most unfortunate. So maybe we need a way to read and write "raw data" in VFS - hm, that would be doable in pure Tcl right now: using lower-level MK calls. > To remedy this, I wrote a function that uses zlib's compression in > a loop (which it was already built to do) and called it 'zlib fcopy'. > Gave it the parameters of the fcopy command, and you can now copy from > one file channel to another, and the data will compress along the way. I don't yet grasp how this solves things - is it because compression is done in smaller chunks? > Would you be interested in adding that to TclKit, or should I just > build it into mine? With the reservation that Tclkit needs to evolve in very robust and compatible ways, I'd definitely be interested to eventually bring such improvements to Tclkit - it could help solve more issue, I think. But there's no rush (and I'm a bit tied down right now) - perhaps first build it and use it yourself. Once you're happy with it we can reconsider and think about the next steps? -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Dec 5 17:40:15 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gB5NeFx27150 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 17:40:15 -0600 Received: (qmail 52670 invoked by uid 300); 5 Dec 2002 23:41:21 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 23:41:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 17:41:21 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKits and Starpacks In-Reply-To: <67EE6230-0897-11D7-AED3-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > [using one starpack as starting point for another] > > Ah, now that you mention doing this for an installer - I think I see > what you're after. Yeah. 0-] I need to be able to package an install but then be able to create an unpack binary on the target system from the binary and code already in the packed install. > That's correct. To compact to a MK datafile to minimal size, you need > to serialize it to a *new* file, using "mk::file save". It's possible > to do this with not too much intermediate copying, btw: > - first make sure you have sourced all the scripts you need > - now, you can start modifying the running installer itself > - delete what is not needed, i.e. end up with a VFS which is "clean" > - add whatever new files need to be in the new VFS dir tree > - note that this can be done even though VFS is read-only > - then, to generate a tclkit executable: > - copy the header of the installer, i.e. the compiled code to new file > - append the *current* VFS state to the end of it, using "mk::file > save" > It's like altering the directory tree under yourself, and saving a > snapshot of that new state. Changes to VFS mounted read-only (and that > includes starpacks) *are* allowed, and have effect on the > memory-resident state - they just never get committed back to the > unerlying file. In this case, I think it's exactly what is needed. > > So the trick, is not to copy the VFS tree as file and then modify, but > to alter the VFS tree while mounted read-only, and then save a > serialized snapshot. This produces an optimally compacted datafile. This sounds like a really good idea. It definitely sounds cleaner than what I had planned. I'll look into using this method. > > This is because [zlib deflate] calls zlib's deflate2() in the way > > to compress the entire chunk of data at once. When you attempt to do > > that with a 50M file, the amount of memory allocated and used suddenly > > causes some severe problems. And I'm on a pretty decent system. > > Is compression of a 50 Mb file a problem of responsiveness? Is memory > consumption too high and do we need to introduce a way to bypass VFS > decompression? In the first case, would threads help? In the second, > I think there are more uses for this - I for one currently need to > synchronize VFS across the net, and right now I have to jump through a > decompress - transfer - compress hoop which is most unfortunate. So > maybe we need a way to read and write "raw data" in VFS - hm, that > would be doable in pure Tcl right now: using lower-level MK calls. > > > To remedy this, I wrote a function that uses zlib's compression in > > a loop (which it was already built to do) and called it 'zlib fcopy'. > > Gave it the parameters of the fcopy command, and you can now copy from > > one file channel to another, and the data will compress along the way. > > I don't yet grasp how this solves things - is it because compression is > done in smaller chunks? Well, in looking at the MK VFS code, it looks like you're actually doing the compression when the file is closed (if MK is told to compress). So, basically you're doing this on a close: set data [read $fd] set cdata [vfs::zip -mode compress $data] set len [string length $data] set clen [string length $cdata] Now, take that as a 50M file. First, we allocate 50M of memory for the data variable. Then, we allocate even more for cdata. Zlib does the compression, and in so doing has to allocate at least like 50M + 12 bytes since it is doing its entire compression in memory. Then, assuming that all makes it through, we string count the length of the variable. It just seems like a lot going on. Zlib has the functionality built in to compress things in smaller chunks and write them out as the avail_out buffer becomes full. So, yeah. The actual compression allocates like 32k bytes (or whatever is specified by the -buffersize argument) for the compression and uses that memory buffer until it's full. When the avail_out buffer fills up, it writes out its compressed data and empties the buffer. It then continues on to the next round of compression. > With the reservation that Tclkit needs to evolve in very robust and > compatible ways, I'd definitely be interested to eventually bring such > improvements to Tclkit - it could help solve more issue, I think. But > there's no rush (and I'm a bit tied down right now) - perhaps first > build it and use it yourself. Once you're happy with it we can > reconsider and think about the next steps? Well, I need to rebuild the Windows version of TclKit to add some Windows-specific commands (dealing with drives, free space, shortcuts, etc...) for my purposes anyway. I think when I switch to TclKit from freeWrap, I'll just use TclKit as is. It just means that people using InstallBase won't be able to add REALLY big files to their installs. 0-] I'm not sure at what size it all breaks down, but I've added 5M files using TclKit without too much trouble. It's only when I start testing on really huge files that I get lock-ups and trouble. Thanks for the help, Damon From lvirden@cas.org Fri Dec 6 05:50:21 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB6BoKx24880 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 05:50:21 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB6BpLL7028359 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 06:51:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB6BpL312566; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 06:51:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 06:51:21 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021206065121.AAB12548@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Anyone know when the Mac 68k tclkit will support itcl? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I tried last night to make use of the latest tclkit on my Mac 68k and found I was unable to bring up a wikit because it requires itcl and tclkit is not the same on all platforms - on the Mac 68k platform there at least isn't a working Itcl . Perhaps it would be best if we can't support itcl on all platforms to move it out of the Tclkit and into its own starkit? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Dec 6 08:43:11 2002 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB6EhBx01345 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 08:43:11 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18KJiH-0000iY-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 14:44:21 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021206143935.0253bc90@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 14:44:20 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <051A78F3-0211-11D7-BA68-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20021127125559.01e22308@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] tclkit menu crash on windows Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: In trying to work out why my starpack crashes, I've isolated the following simple script which crashes tclkit.exe: menu .menubar . configure -menu .menubar foreach m {one two} { menu .menubar.t$m .menubar.t$m add command -label "cmd in $m" -command "puts \{cmd $m\}" .menubar add cascade -menu .menubar.t$m -label $m } .menubar delete one # Enter the above script and then go to the menu 'two' with the mouse # and select the menu entry 'cmd in two'. tclkit crashes. I do have a workaround which can be placed in tkWinMenu.c (similar to the one already in tkMenu.c for tclkit) but I'm wondering if anyone can shed any light on this? The problem is a menu entry ends up with a ridiculous large '->index' value in the millions. Everything else about the menu entry looks quite correct, and the bug is so easily reproducible and specific for me that I don't believe it is obvious memory corruption, but a specific Tk-related bug. NB: I do *not* see this bug in Wish, only in tclkit! Vince. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Dec 6 10:06:09 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB6G69x07336 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 10:06:09 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id gB6G70E4003187 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 09:07:00 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA08272 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 09:07:19 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAP7Y; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 09:07:18 -0700 Message-ID: <3DF0CB79.C2355D59@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 09:08:25 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone know when the Mac 68k tclkit will support itcl? References: <20021206065121.AAB12548@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > I tried last night to make use of the latest tclkit on my Mac 68k and > found I was unable to bring up a wikit because it requires itcl and > tclkit is not the same on all platforms - on the Mac 68k platform > there at least isn't a working Itcl . > > Perhaps it would be best if we can't support itcl on all platforms to > move it out of the Tclkit and into its own starkit? I'm puzzled by your suggested solution. Why not get Itcl working on the Mac 68k platform so tclkit is the "same" on all platforms. Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Dec 6 10:35:55 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB6GZtx10018 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 10:35:55 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gB6GawL7003903 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 11:36:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gB6Gawo16129; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 11:36:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 11:36:58 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021206113658.AAB16018@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone know when the Mac 68k tclkit will support itcl? In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 06 Dec 2002 09:08:25 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Tom Krehbiel > I'm puzzled by your suggested solution. Why not get Itcl working on the Mac 68k platform so tclkit is the "same" on all platforms. There are at least 3 ways to move forwards here: 1. Tell Mac 68k users that their platform is no longer going to be supported, and move the binary into some sort of 'here it is without support' category. This has the least amount of effort on development resources, and has a minimal impact on most of the participatingn tcl community, and yet keeps in tune with tclkit's philosophy. Dropping support for Classic MacOS - particularly the old 68k platform - has been suggested over the years and I know I would understand (but be disappointed) if this approach were taken. 2. If someone is available, has interest, but is unable to get itcl to work, then I suppose that tclkit on this platform could be distributed in a 'crippled' mode, where starkits dependant on itcl just won't work. But that seems to run counter to the heart of tclkit, and I would think that dropping support altogether would be more along the philosophical approach. This is where things are at today, so it actualy is 3. If someone is available and has interest, and can correct the situation, that would be wonderful. This has the benefit of including a (admittedly small) group of users, at the cost of taking up time that might be spent improving or extending support on newer hardware/software. So in answer to your question - my original request was more along the lines of wondering aloud if the current problem was an accidental bug, or an intentional limitation - and if an intentional limitation, then is that a satisfactory state for Tclkit? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Dec 6 11:19:58 2002 Received: from smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB6HJwx14249 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 11:19:58 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18KMA0-0008SH-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 17:21:08 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021206171904.0254f890@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 17:21:04 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit menu crash on windows In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021206143935.0253bc90@mail.wolfbusiness.com> References: <051A78F3-0211-11D7-BA68-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20021127125559.01e22308@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Further testing on this seems to show it is due to the special compiler flags used in the Win-TclKit build for the file tkMenu.c. If I make all files use /02 (optimize by speed) and remove all other optimization flags (including the /Ob2 inlining flag), then this bug goes away. I assume it is therefore a compiler bug. JCW: Why does the MSVC++ project contain a special setting just for the file tkMenu.c? (Or did I somehow set that myself, accidentally)... cheers, Vince. At 02:44 PM 12/6/2002 +0000, Vince Darley wrote: >In trying to work out why my starpack crashes, I've isolated the following >simple script which crashes tclkit.exe: > >menu .menubar >. configure -menu .menubar >foreach m {one two} { > menu .menubar.t$m > .menubar.t$m add command -label "cmd in $m" -command "puts \{cmd $m\}" > .menubar add cascade -menu .menubar.t$m -label $m >} > >.menubar delete one > ># Enter the above script and then go to the menu 'two' with the mouse ># and select the menu entry 'cmd in two'. tclkit crashes. > >I do have a workaround which can be placed in tkWinMenu.c (similar to the >one already in tkMenu.c for tclkit) but I'm wondering if anyone can shed >any light on this? > >The problem is a menu entry ends up with a ridiculous large '->index' >value in the millions. Everything else about the menu entry looks quite >correct, and the bug is so easily reproducible and specific for me that I >don't believe it is obvious memory corruption, but a specific Tk-related bug. > >NB: I do *not* see this bug in Wish, only in tclkit! > >Vince. > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Sat Dec 7 01:40:02 2002 Received: from frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.20.107]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB77e1x18099; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 01:40:01 -0600 Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id gB77evEp013393; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:40:58 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:40:57 +1100 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das.jpg Subject: Re: [Starkit] Anyone know when the Mac 68k tclkit will support itcl? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: starkit@equi4.com, Jean-Claude Wippler , Jim Ingham To: "Larry W. Virden" From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <20021206113658.AAB16018@cas.org> Message-Id: <390216DE-09B7-11D7-94F6-003065E46D0C@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, On Saturday, December 7, 2002, at 03:36 AM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > 3. If someone is available and has interest, and can correct the > situation, > that would be wonderful. I really am neither available nor do I have huge interest, but itcl for classic MacOS (both ppc & 68k) is near the top of my todo list (I have been promising it to JC for weeks) but I have been swamped lately and have not gotten around to it; sorry, RSN... as far as dropping support for MacOS Classic for tcl/tk overall, I have been planning to propose exactly that to the TCT as soon as 8.5 branches off, IMHO the maintainer effort going forward is just not worth it anymore given the tiny&shrinking userbase, it'd be better to concentrate on Mac OS X, where a lot of work remains. (Of course, if there are maintainers who would like to take over the mac classic work, I'd be happy with that too) Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now to something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Mon Dec 9 07:57:33 2002 Received: from rildoimml02.riley.army.mil (rildoimml02.riley.army.mil [144.246.27.62]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB9DvVx13607 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 07:57:32 -0600 Received: by rildoimml02.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 07:59:49 -0600 Message-ID: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D070A@rildoimml05> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 07:57:24 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Starkit corruption? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all. I'm having a problem writing to a StarKit. I'm using Tclkit 8.4.1 and I have an app that I want to store some information inside the StarKit. My code seems to work the first time, but the next time I run the app I get an error "package require app-***" can't be loaded or something like that. I'm creating the StarKit as writeable. Here's my code, Am I just not doing something right? set ttplib ttplib.sdx mk4vfs::mount $ttplib $ttplib cd $ttplib file delete -force license.dat set fid [open license.dat w+] puts $fid "set kit(key) $lic(key)" puts $fid "set kit(dir) $lic(dir)" puts $fid "set kit(vers) $lic(vers)" puts $fid "set kit(limit) $lic(limit)" flush $fid close $fid cd .. mk4vfs::umount $ttplib From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 9 08:20:38 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB9EKbx15313 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 08:20:37 -0600 Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 15:21:50 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit corruption? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D070A@rildoimml05> Message-Id: <8EC3DBF2-0B81-11D7-BA90-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > My code seems to work the first time, but the next time I run the app > I get > an error "package require app-***" can't be loaded or something like > that. > I'm creating the StarKit as writeable. [...] > mk4vfs::mount $ttplib $ttplib Please use "vfs::mk4::Mount $ttplib $ttplib". [...] > mk4vfs::umount $ttplib Please use "vfs::unmount $ttplib". I doubt that this explains or solves your problem, but "ya nev'r no" ... I can't see anything wrong with, not can I reproduce it on Linux. Do you get garbage when you unpack the starkit in a new dir? Hm... could you add "fconfigure $fid -translation lf" after the open? I wonder... -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Dec 9 08:26:36 2002 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB9EQax15762 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 08:26:36 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id PAA04091 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 15:27:49 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA03690 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 15:27:44 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3DF4A85F.300A10D3@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 15:27:44 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit corruption? References: <8EC3DBF2-0B81-11D7-BA90-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > > > My code seems to work the first time, but the next time I run the app > > I get > > an error "package require app-***" can't be loaded or something like > > that. > > I'm creating the StarKit as writeable. > [...] > > mk4vfs::mount $ttplib $ttplib > > Please use "vfs::mk4::Mount $ttplib $ttplib". > > [...] > > mk4vfs::umount $ttplib > > Please use "vfs::unmount $ttplib". > > I doubt that this explains or solves your problem, but "ya nev'r no" ... > > I can't see anything wrong with, not can I reproduce it on Linux. > Do you get garbage when you unpack the starkit in a new dir? > > Hm... could you add "fconfigure $fid -translation lf" after the open? > I wonder... > Could this have the same cause as my complaints about Wikit on a Windows NT machine? Mike, are you storing the application on an NFS disk? In my case it turned out that there was a very unfortunate interference between Windows NT running the Wikit and the file server storing the data file. When I moved the data file to a local disk, the problem was gone! Regards, Arjen From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Mon Dec 9 13:08:29 2002 Received: from rildoimml02.riley.army.mil (rildoimml02.riley.army.mil [144.246.27.62]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB9J8Sx12424 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 13:08:28 -0600 Received: by rildoimml02.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 13:10:46 -0600 Message-ID: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0710@rildoimml05> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 13:08:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Starkit Corruption: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >Please use "vfs::mk4::Mount $ttplib $ttplib". >Please use "vfs::unmount $ttplib". Somewhere I had an example that used "mk4vfs", is "vfs" better to use for any significant reason? Is mk4vfs obsolete? Am I using it wrong, the documentation wasn't a lot of help? I also thought the command response on "mk4vfs::umount" was wrong but since I started using a variable it works better. I think mk4vfs::mount parameters were "local mkfile args" and umount are "local" which actually didn't work for me. When I changed them to variables it worked out better, but then again I just mount it with the same name as the starkit, and that alleviated some confusion. >Could this have the same cause as my complaints about Wikit on a Windows >NT >machine? >Mike, >are you storing the application on an NFS disk? In my case it turned out >that there was a very unfortunate interference between Windows NT >running >the Wikit and the file server storing the data file. When I moved the >data file to a local disk, the problem was gone! >Regards, >Arjen Actually I was using it on Windows 98 just stored on a local disk. And then I brought it to work and had the same problem on Win2k. I put a couple of 5 second delays (after 5000) in because I wasn't sure if it was having a problem with the autocommit in a Starkit. That has helped a little. Jean-Claude I didn't unwrap it back to disk, I just look at it with Kviewer and the dir:name field gets all kinds of weird numbers in there and it changes. Sometimes its numbers, sometimes it looks fine just won't open when I use the source command the second time. From jgodfrey@optinest.com Mon Dec 9 16:03:27 2002 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB9M3Qx04924 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:03:27 -0600 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id gB9M2Ww00309 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:02:35 -0600 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:08:48 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <002601c29bf4$0b9f25e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Subject: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I never saw a response to the following message regarding using images in a Wikit. Maybe I missed it, but I thought I'd try again... Jeff -----Original Message----- From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Jeff Godfrey Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 6:20 PM To: Tom Krehbiel; starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system OK, I'm on my way. I've even played with some images, and had *mostly* good luck. There seems to be a problem with referencing the same image multiple times on the same page. All images end up stacked up at the location of the first reference. Is this a known issue, or am I doing something wrong? Thanks, Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 9 16:59:07 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB9Mx6x11539 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:59:06 -0600 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 00:00:19 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > There seems to be a problem with referencing the same image multiple > times on the same page. All images end up stacked up at the location > of the > first reference. Is this a known issue, or am I doing something wrong? Looks like a bug... I've added a note at http://www.equi4.com/wikit Hm, I assume that's to do things like re-use bullets and such on a page? Must admit that I never thought of this case. I'll look into it. -jcw From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Mon Dec 9 18:41:11 2002 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBA0fBx21199 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 18:41:11 -0600 Received: (qmail 10711 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 00:42:25 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-19.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.19) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 00:42:25 -0000 Message-ID: <003001c29fe4$e01493c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 18:41:21 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Re: Wikit style help system Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 5:00 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system > Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > > There seems to be a problem with referencing the same image multiple > > times on the same page. All images end up stacked up at the location > > of the > > first reference. Is this a known issue, or am I doing something wrong? > > Looks like a bug... I've added a note at http://www.equi4.com/wikit > > Hm, I assume that's to do things like re-use bullets and such on a > page? Must admit that I never thought of this case. I'll look into it. Actually, when I ran into it, I was just playing. I was trying to place multiple images on the same page, but only had a single image handy so I tried to use it more than once... But, the reason *I* would use it for real is just what you mentioned - bullets, dividers, and other page-type elements... Jeff From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Wed Dec 11 13:06:57 2002 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBBJ6vG06342 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:06:57 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1 [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gBBJ84OV027300 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:08:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gBBJ7wFx024005 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:07:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:07:49 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:09:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi - First, thanks for a great tool! I was having a problem with running a starpack on solaris 8 that is required to process command line arguments. The program in question requires Tk and would die in a rather nasty way if command line options were passed in with out a preceding "--". Something like this would not work: # myprogram -option1 value -option2 value2 couldn't load library "/homes/bschofie/develop/arinfo/arinfo/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory ... But worked just fine when ran like this: # myprogram -- -option1 value -option2 value2 Since requiring my users to use a "--" every time they wanted to specify an option was unacceptable, I began looking through the mailing list archives and saw other people were having the same problem, but I failed to find a suitable solution. Well, here is my solution that may help some people: I added a simple check and modified the argv variable in main.tcl. The following is my main.tcl file: if {[lindex $argv 0] != "--"} { set argv [concat "--" $argv] } package require starkit starkit::startup package require app-myprogram In the primary program script (lib/app-myprogram/myprogram.tcl) the "package require Tk" is happily placed on the second line. It seems that during the loading of Tk the command line arguments are parsed for the standard wish arguments such as -display, -geometry, and so on, but loading fails because it doesn't understand my application specific arguments, dies and a nasty "couldn't load .... " message is displayed. By adding a "--" it allows the command line arguments to pass through Tk and on to my application. However, by adding the "--", it disables the use of the standard wish arguments. For my application, this fine. To get around this, one could replace my simple "set argv [concat "--" $argv]" line with a smart parser that grouped the wish arguments together, then stuck a "--" between those arguments and the application specific arguments. Upon further thought, if an application supported both a console mode and a graphical mode where the "package require Tk" would be called optionally, say after some command line parsing, one would most likey need to modify the argv variable just prior to loading Tk. Any way hope this helps someone else, and thanks again for the hard work. -- Bryan From andreask@ActiveState.com Wed Dec 11 13:15:09 2002 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBBJF8G07280 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:15:08 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBBJGBKs028477 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:16:11 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBBJGBp04900 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:16:11 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:16:12 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) > Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 11:09 AM > To: 'starkit@equi4.com' > Subject: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments > Upon further thought, if an application supported both a console > mode and a graphical mode where the "package require Tk" would be > called optionally, say after some command line > parsing, one would most likey need to modify the argv variable > just prior to loading Tk. This is exactly what tclapp in TDK-NR [x] is doing. Save the command line, clear command line, load Tk, restore command line from saved data, proceed as usual. ~~~ [x] Tcl Dev Kit Next Release, tclapp is the successor to prowrap. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 11 13:45:08 2002 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBBJj8G10423 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:45:08 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id gBBJkFo7027659 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:46:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id gBBJkFp21834; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:46:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:46:15 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20021211144615.AAB21796@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:09:28 -0500 To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" : I added a simple check and modified the argv variable in main.tcl. The following is my main.tcl file: : if {[lindex $argv 0] != "--"} { : set argv [concat "--" $argv] : } : package require starkit : starkit::startup : package require app-myprogram So after you do this, one can still provide, on the command line, the flags that are required to go to Tk - things like the -display , etc.? Or do you also have to add special code to ensure that those options get passed onto Tk? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Fri Dec 13 15:40:36 2002 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDLeZG15501 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:40:35 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net [3.159.236.68]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gBDLfjrG027492 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:41:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gBDLfd0P007134 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:41:40 -0500 (EST) Received: by cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:41:29 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:43:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" > : I added a simple check and modified the argv variable in main.tcl. The following is my main.tcl file: > : if {[lindex $argv 0] != "--"} { > : set argv [concat "--" $argv] > : } > : package require starkit > : starkit::startup > : package require app-myprogram > So after you do this, one can still provide, on the command line, the > flags that are required to go to Tk - things like the -display , etc.? > Or do you also have to add special code to ensure that those options > get passed onto Tk? > -- > Larry W. Virden The quick answer in no arguments get passed to Tk. By stuffing the "--" at the front of the argv list, I essentially sort circuit all options to TK and cause all options to go directly to my application command line argument parser. Andreas' solution of clearing the argv variable and restoring later is equally effective and perhaps conceptually clearer. His solution, like mine prohibits standard Tk arguments. Here is a more robust and generic solution that allows both tk options and application options to peacefully co-exist and works very nicely when placed generically in main.tcl before the application package is loaded: --- # # parse the command line arguments, splitting them into known # tk options and application options. All tk options require an # additional parameter, which can be found right after the option # switch. (e.g. -display crescent:0.0 -geometry +0+0) # set tkOptions [list] set appOptions [list] for {set i 0} {$i < [llength $argv]} { incr i } { set opt [lindex $argv $i] switch -- $opt { -colormap { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -display { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -geometry { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -name { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -sync { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -visual { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -use { incr i ; lappend tkOptions $opt [lindex $argv $i] } -- { # Get the remainder of the command line arguments from # just passed the "--" to the end. They will all be application # options incr i set appOptions [concat $appOptions [lrange $argv $i end]] } default { lappend appOptions $opt } } } # # Combine the tk options and the application options and stick a "--" # between, then update argc to reflect the appropriate number of arguments # set argv [concat $tkOptions "--" $appOptions] set argc [llength $argv] --- One could replace the individual tk arguments with a clever regexp and set the switch statement to -regexp. Something like this should work (though I didn't test it): {^-(colormap|display|geometry|name|sync|visual|use)$} Depending on your situation, you may not need any of the tk commands prior to parsing your own application arguments. In which case, I'd recommend moving the argument parsing to your primary application script. Once you've built a list of tk options, like above, and parsed your specific options, you could do a little argv trickery, much like Andreas does. --- set saveArgv $argv set argv $tkOptions set argc [llength $argv] package require Tk 8.4 set argv $saveArgv set argc [llength $argv] unset saveArgv --- For my specific case, I actually use Tk's "option" command capabilities prior to parsing arguments. I store application defaults in an option file and "option readfile" just prior to command line parsing. Hope that's helpful. - Bryan From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Dec 13 16:34:04 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDMY4G17834; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:34:04 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gBDMZLPQ011024; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:35:21 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA24778; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:35:21 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAV8W; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:35:20 -0700 Message-ID: <3DFA60F4.55D6DBE2@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:36:36 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit References: <434C80D6-07B3-11D7-B5AF-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] History Page? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, I am using an imbedded wikit to document my application. I just tried to create a page titled 'History' and found the it already existed and had a message that read "This page is a place holder - do not change for now...". I really need to have a page titled 'History' so my question is, what will happen if I edit the 'History' page? Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Dec 13 17:04:10 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDN49G19295 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:04:09 -0600 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 00:02:34 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] History Page? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3DFA60F4.55D6DBE2@motorola.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I am using an imbedded wikit to document my application. I just tried > to create a page titled 'History' and found the it already > existed and had a message that read "This page is a place holder - do > not change for now...". I really need to have a page titled > 'History' so my question is, what will happen if I edit the 'History' > page? Whoops - yes, this may cause trouble later on. Pages 0..9 have a special status (some unused but reserved). Better not start using them as normal ones. My suggestion would be to make the following change to your wikit.tkd datafile, and then open again and you will be able to create a normal page titled "History": package require Mk4tcl mk::file open db wikit.tkd mk::set db.pages!3 name 3 mk::view size db.refs 0 mk::file close db Put the above in a separate script and run it once while wikit is not active. The "view size" command is there to reset all cross-references, so things will be re-built on next open. That first open make take a few seconds. Untested code, but I think it should work. After this, page 3 is called "3". -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Dec 13 17:07:39 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDN7cG19490 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:07:38 -0600 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 00:08:54 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) wrote: [...] > Hope that's helpful. Very - I'm not ignoring this. Am shuffling stuff between machines, so I can't act on this rigth now. Within a few days, I will - sorry for the delay. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Dec 13 17:39:59 2002 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDNdxG21023; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:39:59 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id gBDNemY2018251; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:40:48 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA19194; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:36:28 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAWA4; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:40:30 -0700 Message-ID: <3DFA703A.56B60907@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:41:46 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] History Page? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, Is there a list of the reserved pages and their titles. It would be helpful to me in avoiding similar problems in the future. Thanks, Tom K. > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > I am using an imbedded wikit to document my application. I just tried > > to create a page titled 'History' and found the it already > > existed and had a message that read "This page is a place holder - do > > not change for now...". I really need to have a page titled > > 'History' so my question is, what will happen if I edit the 'History' > > page? > > Whoops - yes, this may cause trouble later on. Pages 0..9 have a > special status (some unused but reserved). Better not start using them > as normal ones. > > My suggestion would be to make the following change to your wikit.tkd > datafile, and then open again and you will be able to create a normal > page titled "History": > > package require Mk4tcl > mk::file open db wikit.tkd > mk::set db.pages!3 name 3 > mk::view size db.refs 0 > mk::file close db > > Put the above in a separate script and run it once while wikit is not > active. > > The "view size" command is there to reset all cross-references, so > things will be re-built on next open. That first open make take a few > seconds. > > Untested code, but I think it should work. After this, page 3 is > called "3". > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From jcw@equi4.com Fri Dec 13 17:47:08 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDNl7G21396; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:47:07 -0600 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 00:48:24 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] History Page? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: starkit To: Tom Krehbiel From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3DFA703A.56B60907@motorola.com> Message-Id: <5E2C0C2C-0EF5-11D7-AD14-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > Is there a list of the reserved pages and their titles. It would be > helpful to me in avoiding similar problems in the future. Bzzzt... mk::file open db wikit.tkd -readonly foreach x {0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9} { puts "$x - [mk::get db.pages!$x name] } -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Sat Dec 14 05:53:11 2002 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBEBrBG13636 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 05:53:11 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB72C87.ipt.aol.com [172.183.44.135]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AOB38586 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 14 Dec 2002 11:54:10 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214114601.01f29118@mail.onetel.net.uk> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 11:53:21 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Can anyone clarify what this API actually does: vfs::mk4::Mount .... ?-readonly? ?-nocommit? As far as I can tell, the default 'mode' of a mk4vfs is "rw", and giving the '-readonly' flag sets that to "ro", and giving '-nocommit' sets that to "nc". So these three are somehow mutually exclusive options. What does a 'commit' do? Write changes to disk? To the mk4 database in memory? I don't see where the actual state of a starkit comes into this (i.e. whether you gave 'sdx' the '-writable' flag or not). And, as I remarked earlier, starpacks are treated no differently to anything else. I need to add/extend/change something in mk4vfs.tcl so that I can specify a filesystem is actually "read-only" in the traditional sense of the word. I can certainly see how to do that in the vfs-layer, but what I really don't see is how such a concept should interact with these modes of "rw" "ro" "nc". (Would anyone have a problem if I changed those modes to something more human-readable?) thanks for any help, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Sat Dec 14 06:23:07 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBECN6G14186 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 06:23:06 -0600 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 13:24:23 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214114601.01f29118@mail.onetel.net.uk> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > Can anyone clarify what this API actually does: > > vfs::mk4::Mount .... ?-readonly? ?-nocommit? MK can be opened r/o or r/w. When opened r/w, it will default to saving all changes on close (in Mk4tcl). The "-nocommit" flag turns off this behavior so a close will automatically commit changes Commit is db-speak for writing to disk. It's an atomic operation - either all changes are applied, or none. In MK's VFS layer, commits are scheduled every 5s once a change has been made. The "-nocommit" flag is used to prevent commits from being done if nothing was changed - so what happens in the current code, is that if the datafile is opened r/w, then mk4vfs will only start a 5s periodic commit upon a first change (a file open in r/w mode is enough, IIRC). This logic implies that if a datafile is opened r/w, but no change ever made to it, then no commit takes places, not even on close. > As far as I can tell, the default 'mode' of a mk4vfs is "rw", and > giving the '-readonly' flag sets that to "ro", and giving '-nocommit' > sets that to "nc". So these three are somehow mutually exclusive > options. And to complicate matters: sdx now wraps starkits to open in r/o mode by default. This is determined by the header at the beginning of a starkit file. > What does a 'commit' do? Write changes to disk? To the mk4 database > in memory? To disk. VFS actions write to memory. > I don't see where the actual state of a starkit comes into this (i.e. > whether you gave 'sdx' the '-writable' flag or not). And, as I > remarked earlier, starpacks are treated no differently to anything > else. The "-writeable" flag affects the header of starkits. Keep in mind that starkits are Tcl scripts with a big binary blob at the end. They re-open themselves through the MK/Mk4tcl/mk4vfs layers when executed. That's where the decision is made how. > I need to add/extend/change something in mk4vfs.tcl so that I can > specify a filesystem is actually "read-only" in the traditional sense > of the word. I can certainly see how to do that in the vfs-layer, but > what I really don't see is how such a concept should interact with > these modes of "rw" "ro" "nc". (Would anyone have a problem if I > changed those modes to something more human-readable?) I think rw/ro/nc are private to mk4vfs.tcl, you can change them as needed. All they do is affect the logic of open modes and the commit + 5s timer logic. There is one more thing which I mentioned briefly before. It looks like one can close and re-open a MK datafile underneath the VFS layer - i.e. *while* it is mounted. That opens the path to making starkits re-open themselves for changes. This would be quite useful, because of locking issues. Right now, wikit.kit is a tarkit which uses wikit.tkd as separate (non-VFS) MK datafile for storage. The starkit is opened r/o, wikit.tkd of course r/w (in the general case). Wikit goes through some hoops to create/manage a "wikit.lock" file to properly serialize access when called from multiple places or as CGI. Right now, there is no robust way for starkits to use locking, because the point where lock contention needs to be solved is before opening the starkit, not afterwards. So apps running as starkit cannot get the logic right to be modifiable with proper multi-user locking. Which was one reason why I turned sdx's default to wrap starkits as r/o. With close + lock + reopen-r/w logic added, starkits could solve this. One could launch a starkit in r/o mode, safely, and then if the starkit decides it needs to modify itself (self-updating, or saving config settings, for example), it could - while running - do the close/lock/reopen thing. While running and mounted as VFS. Just mentioning this to point to something which is likely to be extended one day. Not soon, it'll probably be done after some more commit-extend/commit-aside logic has been implemented in the MK core (ignore this comment, it's not relevant for now). -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Sat Dec 14 07:51:10 2002 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBEDpAG15616 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 07:51:10 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB648FE.ipt.aol.com [172.182.72.254]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AOB44613 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 14 Dec 2002 13:52:42 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214135040.01f36a60@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 13:52:22 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214114601.01f29118@mail.onetel.net.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 01:24 PM 12/14/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >MK can be opened r/o or r/w. When opened r/w, it will default to saving >all changes on close (in Mk4tcl). The "-nocommit" flag turns off this >behavior so a close will automatically commit changes Can you just clarify this one? "rw" ... default to saving all changes on close "-nocommit" turns this off so a close will automatically commit changes They sound the same to me... cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Sat Dec 14 07:58:52 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBEDwqG15767 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 07:58:52 -0600 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 15:00:09 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214135040.01f36a60@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <5B3ABE42-0F6C-11D7-A3C7-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > At 01:24 PM 12/14/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >> MK can be opened r/o or r/w. When opened r/w, it will default to >> saving all changes on close (in Mk4tcl). The "-nocommit" flag turns >> off this behavior so a close will automatically commit changes > > Can you just clarify this one? > > "rw" ... default to saving all changes on close > "-nocommit" turns this off so a close will automatically commit changes Will *not* commit changes. Mk4vfs must do so with an explicit commit call. -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Sat Dec 14 10:15:23 2002 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBEGFNG20873 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 10:15:23 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB5250A.ipt.aol.com [172.181.37.10]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id ANQ26557 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 14 Dec 2002 16:13:59 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214161247.01f4fd08@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 16:16:00 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable In-Reply-To: <5B3ABE42-0F6C-11D7-A3C7-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214135040.01f36a60@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 03:00 PM 12/14/2002 +0100, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: "rw" ... default to saving all changes on close >>"-nocommit" turns this off so a close will automatically commit changes > >Will *not* commit changes. Mk4vfs must do so with an explicit commit call. Thanks for all the help --- still one more clarification! Looking at the code now, it appears as if any 'write' operation (close/delete/mkdir, etc) results in a call to 'setupCommits {db}' which appears then to have the effect of setting up periodic commits unless the db is in 'ro' mode. So, this would seem to convert 'nc' into 'rw' on the fly, and makes me wonder whether there is actually any difference between the two settings at all? cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Sat Dec 14 10:28:54 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBEGSrG21917; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 10:28:54 -0600 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:30:12 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starpack/kit writable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v548) Cc: Starkit list To: Vince Darley From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021214161247.01f4fd08@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <516036D0-0F81-11D7-8779-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.548) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > Looking at the code now, it appears as if any 'write' operation > (close/delete/mkdir, etc) results in a call to 'setupCommits {db}' > which appears then to have the effect of setting up periodic commits > unless the db is in 'ro' mode. So, this would seem to convert 'nc' > into 'rw' on the fly, and makes me wonder whether there is actually > any difference between the two settings at all? There is. The "nc" mode never does a commit if nothing is ever written. It should not matter, but for now it makes a difference (touching datafile mod dates, but I think also some other subtleties). Not sure whether a forced exit would differ - probably not, if VFS goes through all the normal unmount steps on exit. Ctrl/C-aborts are a different issue of course, but fine - in that case the last completed commit will go into effect on next open. I agree that rw and nc should ultimately become one and the same. Now that nc is the default for "sdx -writeable" (used to be rw), I think rw is becoming less important. It's all a bit messy (and the MK C++ core makes it messier still - there "nc" is the default open mode and "rw" is accomplished by doing a "AutoCommit()" call...). -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Dec 17 12:01:36 2002 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBHI1aG26169; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:01:36 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id gBHI2tPQ020384; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:02:55 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA11669; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:02:55 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAXL4; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:02:54 -0700 Message-ID: <3DFF671F.95348381@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:04:15 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit References: <434C80D6-07B3-11D7-B5AF-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Wikit database maintenance questions Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, I'm using a stand-alone wikit (.tkd) for my applications user guide. I am now at a point where I need to do some cleanup on the .tkd file. I would like to write scripts to do the cleanup but I don't know enough about both how a wikit works and the mktcl interface to safely right the scripts. The two things I would like to do are: 1) Create a page reference listing. What I would like to see is a list where each enter is a page id followed by the page id of all pages that reference the initial page id. 2) Delete unused pages from the .tkd file. I think I can figure out how to do this but I'm not sure what the consequences will be. If a remove a page is removed will the pages be reordered and will this cause all the page references to be broken? Thanks for your help. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Dec 17 12:12:44 2002 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBHICiG27057 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:12:44 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id gBHIE4q5029369 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:14:04 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA27378 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:14:03 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCAXMG; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:14:03 -0700 Message-ID: <3DFF69BC.A10F459@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:15:24 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit References: <434C80D6-07B3-11D7-B5AF-00050251EF2F@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Wikit page id search trick. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I just notice something very useful when working with wikit. If you would like to view a particular page id, you can enter the page id surrounded by angle brackets (e.g. '[45]'). The search engine will report something like: Searched for "45" (in page titles): * No matches found But the "45" will be a link so you can just click on it to go to the page with an id of 45. Tom K. From damon@your.unreality.com Tue Dec 17 12:57:22 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBHIvMG30520 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:57:22 -0600 Received: (qmail 63145 invoked by uid 300); 17 Dec 2002 18:58:27 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 18:58:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:58:27 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Starkits and fcopy Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Are there any known issues with using fcopy to copy a file out of a starpack? I haven't had a chance to truly debug yet, but using TclKit with InstallBase, my Starpack crashes, without fail, after unpacking two files. If I run the unpack binary, it will unpack two files and then crash with "child process exited abnormally." Everytime. If I run it again, I get two files further (it skips files previously installed). And after two files, crash. Like I said, I haven't truly debugged this to find out where it's happening. I was just wondering if anyone has seen anything like this or knows about a known issue I'm unaware of. Thanks, Damon From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Fri Dec 20 09:10:23 2002 Received: from dewey.iland.net (dewey.iland.net [205.242.230.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBKFAMQ04934 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:10:23 -0600 Received: (qmail 5185 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 15:11:41 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-65.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.65) by dewey.iland.net with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 15:11:41 -0000 Message-ID: <008301c2a839$49135080$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:05:24 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Sourcing a starkit - help! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction, because I am becoming thoroughly confused... I spent a good part of yesterday rearranging code and directory structures to try to find a clean (and parallel) development and test environment for my application, which will ultimately be packaged as several starpacks and a starkit library. When I went to bed last night, I'm sure (?) everything was working as I wanted, but this morning I seem to have a (minor) problem. Oh yeah, I'm running under Win98 and using the latest tcl and tclkit releases... Basically, I'm trying to source a starkit (containing library procedures) from within some of my tcl code - that is eventually packaged as a starpack. Here's what works: - The final starpack and starkit sitting next to each other work correctly - good - The development code (unpacked) is able to successfully source the starkit library when using the tclkit interpreter - good Here's what's broken: - The development code (unpacked) is *not* able to source the starkit library when using the standard wish interpreter - bad I get the following error during the source operation (hand-typed, so I hope it's accurate): Fatal error couldn't read file "F:/tcl_dev/agent_manager/library.kit/main.tcl": No error while executing "source F:/tcl_dev/agent_manager/library.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" What's with the "No error" description? In either case (tclkit and wish), I am just executing the standard "main.tcl" file that will eventually become part of the starpack. I *do* have the starkit package available for the package require command... Now, I'm guessing that the standard wish interpreter doesn't know enough about the vfs system to properly source the starkit because I haven't loaded something? Again, I'm really quite sure that I had all this working last night (unless someone convinces me that I couldn't have...), but I'm not sure what I've done to break it. It's not a huge stumbling block, because I can test in my development environment by running it against tclkit and all is OK - I just want to be able to run against both tclkit and wish. Any suggestions are appreciated... Thanks, Jeff From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Fri Dec 20 09:47:45 2002 Received: from ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net [216.34.191.35]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBKFliQ07243 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:47:44 -0600 Received: from int-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-3 [3.159.232.67]) by ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gBKFn0c9007266 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:49:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id gBKFmsFN021698 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:48:55 -0500 (EST) Received: by cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:48:42 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:50:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] nested starkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is it possible to have nested starkits? I am trouble getting the follow setup to work: myapp.vfs\ | |-- main.tcl |-- lib\ | |-- app-myapp\ | | | | | |-- myapp.tcl | | |-- pkgIndex.tcl | | | |-- kits\ | | | | | |-- kit1.kit | | |-- kit2.kit | | |-- pkgIndex.tcl Everything works fine if I run main.tcl explicitly with tclkit as follows: # tclkit myapp.vfs/main.tcl But if I make myapp.kit as follows: # sdx wrap myapp.kit and run: # ./myapp.kit I get a very large and nasty error that indicates: file open failed while executing "mk::file open mk4vfs2 /homes/schofield/tmp/myapp.kit/lib/kits/kit1.kit -readonly" .... I even tried coping my nested kits out to a real file and sourcing them, but I get the same error. Is this just a limitation of a starkit? Do nested kits just not work? Thanks - Bryan Schofield From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 23 13:23:19 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBNJNIQ12126 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:23:18 -0600 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:24:41 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit menu crash on windows Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021206143935.0253bc90@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <2F71D678-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > In trying to work out why my starpack crashes, I've isolated the > following simple script which crashes tclkit.exe: > > menu .menubar > . configure -menu .menubar > foreach m {one two} { > menu .menubar.t$m > .menubar.t$m add command -label "cmd in $m" -command "puts \{cmd > $m\}" > .menubar add cascade -menu .menubar.t$m -label $m > } > > .menubar delete one > > # Enter the above script and then go to the menu 'two' with the mouse > # and select the menu entry 'cmd in two'. tclkit crashes. [...] > I do *not* see this bug in Wish, only in tclkit! This is just on Windows, right? -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 23 13:23:22 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBNJNLQ12134 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:23:21 -0600 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:24:44 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit menu crash on windows Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021206171904.0254f890@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <313A92A3-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > Further testing on this seems to show it is due to the special > compiler flags used in the Win-TclKit build for the file tkMenu.c. If > I make all files use /02 (optimize by speed) and remove all other > optimization flags (including the /Ob2 inlining flag), then this bug > goes away. I assume it is therefore a compiler bug. > > JCW: Why does the MSVC++ project contain a special setting just for > the file tkMenu.c? (Or did I somehow set that myself, > > accidentally)... Eh, I think I set those different on your recommendations... If you can pinpoint the spot where things go bad, I could insert compiler pragma's for it instead - it would be easier to maintain than this (which, frankly, I had forgotten all about). -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 23 13:23:25 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBNJNOQ12140 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:23:24 -0600 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:24:48 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit Corruption: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43564D0710@rildoimml05> Message-Id: <334E04E2-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > Somewhere I had an example that used "mk4vfs", is "vfs" better to use > for > any significant reason? Is mk4vfs obsolete? Am I using it wrong, the > documentation wasn't a lot of help? I also thought the command > response on > "mk4vfs::umount" was wrong but since I started using a variable it > works > better. I think mk4vfs::mount parameters were "local mkfile args" and > umount > are "local" which actually didn't work for me. When I changed them to > variables it worked out better, but then again I just mount it with > the same > name as the starkit, and that alleviated some confusion. There have been mixup's in this logic in the past. Right now, my suggestion is to stay away from doing any direct mk4vfs calls. Instead use: vfs::mk4::Mount ?-ro etc? Trick to help remember the order: just like the unix "mount" command. The above is the beast because it also registers the file system and makes vfs awar of how to unmount things. So to unmount, do: vfs::unmount You can find from by asking vfs: This returns all registered mountpoints: puts [vfs::filesystem info] This returns info about one registered mountpoint: puts "info = [vfs::filesystem info ]" The returned info is the command VFS uses for all requests, in the case of a MK datafile mounted through mk4vfs: info = ::vfs::mk4::handler The dbname in turn is listed in the pairwise list returned from Mk4tcl: puts "dbs = [mk::file open]" So in principle you can figure out db names, datafile names, and mountpoints from each other. > Actually I was using it on Windows 98 just stored on a local disk. And > then > I brought it to work and had the same problem on Win2k. I put a couple > of 5 > second delays (after 5000) in because I wasn't sure if it was having a > problem with the autocommit in a Starkit. That has helped a little. > Jean-Claude I didn't unwrap it back to disk, I just look at it with > Kviewer > and the dir:name field gets all kinds of weird numbers in there and it > changes. Sometimes its numbers, sometimes it looks fine just won't > open when > I use the source command the second time. If kviewer produces garbage, then the datafile is currupt :( Due to MK's column-wise data layout, corruption often looks very weird, and messes up everything at the same time (one or more columns, anyway). -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 23 13:23:30 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBNJNTQ12145 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:23:29 -0600 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:24:52 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit style help system Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <35E522B6-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > I never saw a response to the following message regarding using images > in a > Wikit. Maybe I missed it, but I thought I'd try again... I made a note of it. It may sound absurd, but after all these years I think I am actually on the road to getting organized :) > OK, I'm on my way. I've even played with some images, and had > *mostly* good > luck. There seems to be a problem with referencing the same image > multiple > times on the same page. All images end up stacked up at the location > of the > first reference. Is this a known issue, or am I doing something wrong? Sounds like a bug - I never thought of this case, nor did I ever test it. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 23 13:23:32 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBNJNVQ12151 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:23:32 -0600 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:24:55 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Pesky -- in command line arguments Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <377E9866-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) wrote: > I was having a problem with running a starpack on solaris 8 that is > required to process command line arguments. The program in question > requires Tk and would die in a rather nasty > way if command line options were passed in with out a preceding "--". > > Something like this would not work: > > # myprogram -option1 value -option2 value2 > couldn't load library > "/homes/bschofie/develop/arinfo/arinfo/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such > file or directory > ... > > But worked just fine when ran like this: > # myprogram -- -option1 value -option2 value2 > > Since requiring my users to use a "--" every time they wanted to > specify an option was unacceptable, I began looking through the > mailing list archives and saw other people were > having the same problem, but I failed to find a suitable solution. I've made changes, but I think they were after the Nov 2002 build. The current code does things somewhhat better, but it still needs a core patch (to get rid of Tcl/Tk grabbing "-file") and it still is a major hack (because Tclkit tries to ride on as much std code as it can, and that means it gets control too late as a starpack to really get everything right). These issues are being discussed and looked at, I'm not exactly sure where we stand today. > Well, here is my solution that may help some people: [...] Thanks very much. Somewhat related, let me mention that I've improved the handling of "package require Tk", which on Unix always gave some obscure and confusing remark. Try using Tk when there is do DISPLAY variable in the env, for example. The latest changes in CVS alters tk/pkgIndex.tcl to work better, and fail in the proper way: $ unset DISPLAY $ tclkit % package require Tk couldn't load library "/home/jcw/bin/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory % ^D $ ./tclkit % package require Tk no display name and no $DISPLAY environment variable % This will be in the next round of Tclkit releases. With a bit of luck, the situation with "--" and special options should also be fully resolved by then. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 23 13:29:23 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBNJTMQ12779 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:29:22 -0600 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:30:45 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit Corruption: - typo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <334E04E2-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: <08669B90-16AD-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > The above is the beast because [...] Not sure what I ate but that should have been "best", not "beast"... :) -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Dec 24 06:32:23 2002 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBOCWNQ10396 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 06:32:23 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18QoFo-0000NY-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 12:33:48 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20021224123107.01e3c400@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 12:33:44 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <313A92A3-16AC-11D7-B98F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20021206171904.0254f890@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] tclkit and ftp, urltype etc vfs... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I notice that the standard tclkit seems only to come with a limited set of vfs implementations (no ftp, urltype, etc). What is the recommended way of adding these in? I assume they should really go inside tclkit/lib/vfs/..., but that stuff comes from 'runtime-tk.bin' and I don't know if I can mess with that. (This is on Windows) cheers, Vince. From damon@your.unreality.com Tue Dec 24 16:56:20 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBOMuJQ18351 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 16:56:20 -0600 Received: (qmail 50135 invoked by uid 300); 24 Dec 2002 22:57:39 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 22:57:39 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 16:57:39 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Loading shared libraries Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Question, Does TclKit have a command to override the loading of libraries so as to facilitate loading stored shared libraries? I can just write and rename the load command to check for the library, but I didn't know if TclKit might already attempt this. Thanks, Damon From jcw@equi4.com Tue Dec 24 17:05:47 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBON5kQ18484 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 17:05:46 -0600 Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 00:07:11 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Loading shared libraries Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6EC4FBF4-1794-11D7-8896-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > Does TclKit have a command to override the loading of libraries so > as to facilitate loading stored shared libraries? I can just write and > rename the load command to check for the library, but I didn't know if > TclKit might already attempt this. Not sure what you are asking here... can Tclkit load shared libs stored in a starkit or starpack? Yes - that's done by the VFS core in Tcl in fact: for all but the native filesystem, VFS will copy the shared lib to a (native) temp file and load it from there. On Unix, the cleanup happens at the end of loading. On Windows, a DLL which is in use cannot be deleted, so Tclkit will delete it when exiting (I'm not sure how robust this currently is - there might be ways to improve on it by registering the deletion with Win32...). Or were you asking something else? -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Tue Dec 24 17:22:03 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBONM3Q18628 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 17:22:03 -0600 Received: (qmail 50586 invoked by uid 300); 24 Dec 2002 23:23:24 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 23:23:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 17:23:24 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Loading shared libraries In-Reply-To: <6EC4FBF4-1794-11D7-8896-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Not sure what you are asking here... can Tclkit load shared libs stored > in a starkit or starpack? > > Yes - that's done by the VFS core in Tcl in fact: for all but the > native filesystem, VFS will copy the shared lib to a (native) temp file > and load it from there. On Unix, the cleanup happens at the end of > loading. On Windows, a DLL which is in use cannot be deleted, so > Tclkit will delete it when exiting (I'm not sure how robust this > currently is - there might be ways to improve on it by registering the > deletion with Win32...). > > Or were you asking something else? Nope. That's exactly what I was asking. 0-] Thanks. Damon From jahbini@lava.net Wed Dec 25 13:00:41 2002 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{MvxCVtog/NkR5/5MvdhBvHv4+G4DSC/f}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBPJ0eQ29539 for ; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 13:00:41 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com[64.65.110.34]) (1159 bytes) by malasada.lava.net; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 09:02:05 -1000 (HST) via sendmail [esmtp] id for Message-ID: <3E0A00AA.75560DF1@lava.net> Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 09:02:02 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.8-26mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] looking for example of self modifying kit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: My clumsy attempt to create a new file within a scripted document (postcard.kit) seems all wrong, in that it did not work. My application "postcard.kit" needs to get some configuration info from the sysadmin and save it inside itself for later runs by the actual user. I tried to open a file within 'postcard.kit' and write to it and close it. This happens with no error. On subsequent runs, the file can't be found, though. When I use SDX to unwrap the kit, the new file is nowhere to be found. Is there some other metakit command needed to actually update postcard.kit? Any example would be appreciated. Jim Hinds From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 25 15:44:41 2002 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBPLieQ30871 for ; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 15:44:40 -0600 Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 22:46:07 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] looking for example of self modifying kit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E0A00AA.75560DF1@lava.net> Message-Id: <460A2DB5-1852-11D7-8896-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jim Hinds wrote: > When I use SDX to unwrap the kit, the new file is nowhere to be found. > Is there some other metakit command needed to actually update > postcard.kit? The most likely explanation is that you created your starkit in SDX without the "-writable" flag. The default for SDX is now to create read-only starkits. The confusing part is that file writes continue to succeed (they remain in memory), but the changes are never committed to file. This is a deliberate design choice, but it can also be quite confusing... -jcw From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Dec 25 17:33:56 2002 Received: from lewey.iland.net (lewey.iland.net [205.242.230.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBPNXtQ32051 for ; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 17:33:56 -0600 Received: (qmail 16405 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 23:35:23 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-200.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.200) by lewey.iland.net with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 23:35:23 -0000 Message-ID: <002d01c2ac6d$29e3c180$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 17:27:10 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Subject: [Starkit] Repost - Sourcing a Starkit - help! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I don't think I've seen a response on this one (from 5 days ago), so I thought I'd try again... Thanks, Jeff ================ Hi All, I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction, because I am becoming thoroughly confused... I spent a good part of yesterday rearranging code and directory structures to try to find a clean (and parallel) development and test environment for my application, which will ultimately be packaged as several starpacks and a starkit library. When I went to bed last night, I'm sure (?) everything was working as I wanted, but this morning I seem to have a (minor) problem. Oh yeah, I'm running under Win98 and using the latest tcl and tclkit releases... Basically, I'm trying to source a starkit (containing library procedures) from within some of my tcl code - that is eventually packaged as a starpack. Here's what works: - The final starpack and starkit sitting next to each other work correctly - good - The development code (unpacked) is able to successfully source the starkit library when using the tclkit interpreter - good Here's what's broken: - The development code (unpacked) is *not* able to source the starkit library when using the standard wish interpreter - bad I get the following error during the source operation (hand-typed, so I hope it's accurate): Fatal error couldn't read file "F:/tcl_dev/agent_manager/library.kit/main.tcl": No error while executing "source F:/tcl_dev/agent_manager/library.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" What's with the "No error" description? In either case (tclkit and wish), I am just executing the standard "main.tcl" file that will eventually become part of the starpack. I *do* have the starkit package available for the package require command... Now, I'm guessing that the standard wish interpreter doesn't know enough about the vfs system to properly source the starkit because I haven't loaded something? Again, I'm really quite sure that I had all this working last night (unless someone convinces me that I couldn't have...), but I'm not sure what I've done to break it. It's not a huge stumbling block, because I can test in my development environment by running it against tclkit and all is OK - I just want to be able to run against both tclkit and wish. Any suggestions are appreciated... Thanks, Jeff From mel@redolive.com Thu Dec 26 16:10:46 2002 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBQMAil18615 for ; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 16:10:45 -0600 Received: (qmail 32765 invoked by uid 511); 26 Dec 2002 23:11:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO redolive2o00) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 23:11:02 -0000 Message-ID: <000d01c2ad2c$73227700$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 17:16:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2AD02.8A2DEA80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Web application Starpack Question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2AD02.8A2DEA80 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000A_01C2AD02.8A2DEA80" ------=_NextPart_001_000A_01C2AD02.8A2DEA80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i am trying to create a complete asp (web) application. A self contained = startpack which includes a httpd server and several dynamic pages. THE PROBLEM ! httpd referes to files internally once the ROOT directory is set. i also = use cgi.tcl so a command like "put [img /images/junk.gif]" is internally accessed = as: /ROOT/icons/junk.gif is there a solution to this problem? i do not wat to ship all my code = exposed + tons of directories and html pages! many thanks, Mel -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - =20 =20 P.O.Box 6210 New York,NY 10150=20 Email: Mel@RedOlive.com=20 URL: http://www.RedOlive.com=20 Phone: (646) 303-1234 Mobile=20 (877) 882-0266 Office=20 =20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - =20 ------=_NextPart_001_000A_01C2AD02.8A2DEA80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i am trying to create a complete asp = (web)=20 application. A self contained startpack which includes a httpd server = and=20 several dynamic pages.
 
THE PROBLEM !
httpd referes to files internally once = the ROOT=20 directory is set. i also use cgi.tcl
 
so a command like "put [img = /images/junk.gif]" is=20 internally accessed as:
/ROOT/icons/junk.gif
 
is there a solution to this problem? i = do not wat=20 to ship all my code exposed + tons of directories and html = pages!
 
many thanks,
Mel

P.O.Box=20 6210
New York,NY 10150
<= /TR>
Email: Mel@RedOlive.com
URL: http://www.RedOlive.com
Phone: (646) 303-1234 Mobile
(877) 882-0266 = Office
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If I use Netscape, a popup is displayed to save to a file. Is there a way to do the same thing under IE 6.0. Kind Regards Jeff Smith __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From damon@your.unreality.com Fri Dec 27 21:32:07 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBS3W7l24813 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 21:32:07 -0600 Received: (qmail 30706 invoked by uid 300); 28 Dec 2002 03:33:19 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 03:33:19 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 21:33:19 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20021227003748.98129.qmail@web14604.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Crash on exit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I don't think is actually a TclKit problem, but I was hoping someone here could help me. I have a .dll that is actually packed within the TclKit binary that I'm loading into TclKit on Windows. Everytime I exit, the application crashes. If I run TclKit without ever loading this library, everything works fine and the exit goes smoothly. It's only when loading a library does the exit fail with a Windows GPF. Could is have something to do with Windows loading the library from the VFS? I know it's offloaded into a temporary directory before loading, but I just don't know what's doing it. The library is faily simply. Any help is appreciated. Thanks, Damon From damon@your.unreality.com Sun Dec 29 11:24:45 2002 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBTHOil00746 for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 11:24:45 -0600 Received: (qmail 68333 invoked by uid 300); 29 Dec 2002 17:25:57 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 17:25:57 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 11:25:57 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] MetaKit data Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is there any easy way to find out the point in a Starkit where a file's data starts? Like at what byte the "contents" are located. I know I can just retrive the contents through mk::get, but I need to know where in the data those contents lie. Thanks for any help, Damon From adrian_wallaschek@be.ibm.com Mon Jan 6 05:27:42 2003 Received: from d06lmsgate-6.uk.ibm.com (d06lmsgate-6.uk.ibm.com [194.196.100.252]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h06BROc17423 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 05:27:42 -0600 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate-6.uk.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id LAA18340 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 11:27:16 GMT Received: from d16ml005.be.ibm.com (d16ml005.be.ibm.com [9.36.73.42]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.3/NCO/VER6.4) with ESMTP id h06BSglq112384 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 11:28:43 GMT To: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.7 March 21, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Adrian Wallaschek" Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 13:37:45 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D16ML005/16/M/IBM(Release 5.0.9a |January 7, 2002) at 06/01/2003 12:28:42 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi there, if anybody is interested, here is the list of changes required to build a TCLkit for AIX using IBM's compiler instead of GNU. (Still the GNU compiler might be not acceptable for some professional projects e.g. in an banking IT environment, etc. - yes I know they are stupid, but they decide ... ;-) ). After downloading the tar files and copying the genkit script, first untar the files and have a look at the tcl source-tree. In src/tk/generic/tkMenu.c please change line 1198 (or around there). It contains a C++ comment lead-in (double-slash) while the compiler is a little bit nercous on this, better change to /* ... */ or just delete the line that is commented out. This is due to the fact that the tk/configure chooses its compiler after its own taste and doesn't follow the configuration in genkit. Regrettably the double-slash is used in a lot of C source of the kit so we need to specify the compiler in the genkit to swallow this. Change the genkit in the beginning of the file, where the configurations for the compiler are in a switch statement: switch $tcl_platform(os) { AIX { array set Z {tclsuff "-Wl,-bshared -lcrypt" tksuff -lIM} array set X {gcc "xlC -qcpluscmt" g++ "xlC" -static ""} } ........ This keeps the array set Z as it was before and changes the compiler to use "xlC" which is the C++ compiler. As even the C++ compiler in Visual Age for C/C++ checks wether its input file is a C source and then limits to C syntax we need to explicitely enable // comments with "-qcpluscmt". From here on follow the usual paths. Btw. I was a little bit sad that there is not howto or even README telling a little bit about the design of tclkits, like where the VFS is mounted, how to understand the boot.tcl etc. two or three pages about this would help avoid quite some research. Anyway it is brilliant. The tclkit will help to jump over a lot of administrative fences using TCL in a rather conservative project ("No we won't install the interpreter on our productive environment because it would be a development platform in the production system possibly compromising security, bla di bla ...", now they won't object: its a closed application and the interpreter is not reusable for anything else anymore!). Well done! Regards, Adrian Wallaschek "Just when you think, life can't possible get worse, it suddenly does!" The Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy - Douglas Adams From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 6 06:28:09 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h06CS8c19502 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 06:28:08 -0600 Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 13:29:45 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <89F98FD7-2172-11D7-9A0A-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] shared library copying and cleanup Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Howdy & happy 2003... VFS currently uses the following logic to load shared libraries: * determine temp dir * copy shared lib to it, using some temp name * load the copy On Unix, VFS then unlinks right away. On Windows (and HP-UX?) this is not possible, so the file is scheduled for cleanup on exit (which may fail when killed/aborted). This differs from Tclkit 8.2, which concocted a name using an MD5 signature derived from the full path to the shared lib inside VFS (IIRC), and then left that file lying around. This introduced a cache mechanism, avoiding copy/uncompress for all subsequent runs, and kept all uses separate, at the cost of more storage and a temp area which may grow over time. Both have advantages, but both of them also have disadvantages. If the requirement is to never leave anything behind on the disk, then even the current one is not able to guarantee that on Windows. It'd be nice to improve on this a bit - some thoughts: * we could introduce an adjustable shared lib policy (configurable temp dir, and clean up vs. leave as cache) * or more rigidly define where things get unloaded, then add some logic to try and clean up more on startup * another option is to simply document the behavior fully, and leave it to each developer to adjust/extend as needed Given that load-to-mem is likely to be some time off (there are new developments which indicate that more people are trying to solve this - e.g. UPX cvs), I think the basic Unix approach is probably as far as we can go for now - it copies, loads, and cleans up in quick succession, so it's least likely to leave droppings behind. As for caching, I suspect that this will become more and more important as smaller and more numerous shared libs get used. Which is a likely trend IMO, with Critcl and with kitten-like "extension packs" becoming more common. Anyone care to comment and help make good choices here? -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jan 6 09:46:22 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h06FkLc29176; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 09:46:21 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h06FluB6021274; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 08:47:56 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA09767; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 08:47:55 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCBZWV; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 08:47:54 -0700 Message-ID: <3E19A52A.EE433FCA@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 08:47:54 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] shared library copying and cleanup References: <89F98FD7-2172-11D7-9A0A-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, [snip] > It'd be nice to improve on this a bit - some thoughts: > * we could introduce an adjustable shared lib policy > (configurable temp dir, and clean up vs. leave as cache) > * or more rigidly define where things get unloaded, then > add some logic to try and clean up more on startup A refinement of this idea would be to implement a rigid policy but include a clean up command in tclkit and let the developer decide if a pre-clean is required. This approach would also allow a developer to run tclkit interactively and force a clean up during development. > * another option is to simply document the behavior fully, > and leave it to each developer to adjust/extend as needed [snip] From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Mon Jan 6 22:26:44 2003 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h074Qhc09615 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 22:26:43 -0600 Received: (qmail 20306 invoked by uid 8); 7 Jan 2003 04:28:18 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "DigitalSmarties.com") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpd6ZfaLt; Mon, 06 Jan 2003 23:28:16 EST Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 12:28:13 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Adrian Wallaschek" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6F84CB15-21F8-11D7-8437-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Adrian, > if anybody is interested, here is the list of changes required to > build a > TCLkit for AIX using IBM's compiler instead of GNU. Thanks for posting this info. I did the original AIX port using GNU gcc. It would be (mildly) interesting to know if the AIX compiler produces significantly better code. Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Tue Jan 7 02:39:58 2003 Received: from digital-smarties.com (IDENT:qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h078dvc16587 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 02:39:57 -0600 Received: (qmail 20622 invoked by uid 8); 7 Jan 2003 08:41:32 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (192.168.1.3, claiming to be "DigitalSmarties.com") by gateway.digital-smarties.com with SMTP id smtpdGjjHPV; Tue, 07 Jan 2003 03:41:23 EST Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 16:41:17 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] shared library copying and cleanup Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Steve Landers To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <89F98FD7-2172-11D7-9A0A-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Monday, January 6, 2003, at 08:29 PM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > VFS currently uses the following logic to load shared libraries: > * determine temp dir > * copy shared lib to it, using some temp name > * load the copy > On Unix, VFS then unlinks right away. On Windows (and HP-UX?) this is > not possible, so the file is scheduled for cleanup on exit (which may > fail when killed/aborted). I can confirm that on HP-UX you can't delete a shared library that is "busy" (i.e. loaded). Unfortunately, the temporary file isn't cleaned up on exit - so copies of any HP-UX shared libraries within a Starkit accumulate in /var/tmp easy time the Starkit is run (look for /var/tmp/tcl*). Not good :-( It may be possible to force the deletion on HP-UX (but I doubt it), or it may be possible to schedule the deletion similar to how it is done on Windows. For now I'll probably modify my application to clean out any files of the form /var/tmp/tcl* owned by the current user ... this way at least /var/tmp won't fill up. Not ideal, but ... -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jan 7 08:47:01 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h07El1c01608 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 08:47:01 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h07Emb8t002249 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 07:48:37 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id HAA07867 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 07:48:08 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id V7XCB5VR; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 07:48:36 -0700 Message-ID: <3E1AE8C4.D54481F3@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 07:48:36 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Landers CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] shared library copying and cleanup References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, > I can confirm that on HP-UX you can't delete a shared library that is > "busy" (i.e. loaded). Unfortunately, the temporary file isn't cleaned > up on exit - so copies of any HP-UX shared libraries within a Starkit > accumulate in /var/tmp easy time the Starkit is run (look for > /var/tmp/tcl*). I also ran into the deletion problem on HP-UX but I thought the files were being scheduled for clean up. I see now that that aren't. They definitely should be scheduled for clean up on exit (if that is possible). -tjk From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Jan 7 09:09:46 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h07F9kc03348 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 09:09:46 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id QAA15378 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 16:11:21 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA14833 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 16:11:14 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E1AEE12.7B5FAC27@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 16:11:14 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Making installation executables Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I used the receipe on starpacks to create a simple installation executable: it required some care with paths and all, and under Windows (95,NT,..) and MacOS it should probably register the application in accord with the platform's conventions, but all the code it took was: set installdir [file dirname [info script]] set appdir [file join $installdir ".." ".." "application"] foreach file [glob [file join $appdir *]] { file copy $file . } The directory structure: ./install.vfs lib/ application/ main.tcl As the first command returns the path .../lib/app-install, you need to go up two levels and I wanted to avoid an extra directory level. If you copy the executable into the directory that should contain it all and then run it, the program gets neatly installed. -- Just for your information Regards, Arjen From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jan 7 09:59:51 2003 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h07Fxpc07206 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 09:59:51 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (cgey2.capgemini.se [193.234.247.51]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AOR89389 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 7 Jan 2003 16:00:16 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030107155608.024ffec0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 15:59:12 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] shared library copying and cleanup In-Reply-To: <3E1AE8C4.D54481F3@motorola.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The problem is probably here, in tclIOUtil.c (line 2614...) /* * Try to delete the file immediately -- this is * possible in some OSes, and avoids any worries * about leaving the copy laying around on exit. */ if (Tcl_FSDeleteFile(copyToPtr) == TCL_OK) { Tcl_DecrRefCount(copyToPtr); (*handlePtr) = NULL; (*unloadProcPtr) = NULL; return TCL_OK; } This is the code that tries to delete the file, and if successful, doesn't schedule the file for deletion at exit. You will need to debug whether Tcl_FSDeleteFile(copyToPtr) is returning TCL_OK or not, and if it isn't (which it should not), why 'FSUnloadTempFile' is either not being called or isn't managing to delete the temporary file. cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 8 09:04:32 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h08F4Wc30221 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 09:04:32 -0600 Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 16:06:08 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian Wallaschek wrote: > if anybody is interested, here is the list of changes required to > build a > TCLkit for AIX using IBM's compiler instead of GNU. Very - thx. > In src/tk/generic/tkMenu.c please change line 1198 (or around there). Done (this is a patch by me, only meaningful on Windows, btw). Will be in CVS later today. > Regrettably the double-slash is used in a lot of C source of the kit > so we > need to specify the compiler in the genkit to swallow this. Can you please help me find those? All I found were three lines at the top of src/rechan.c in the tclkit sources. Are any more left? > Btw. I was a little bit sad that there is not howto or even README > telling > a little bit about the design of tclkits, like where the VFS is > mounted, > how to understand the boot.tcl etc. two or three pages about this would > help avoid quite some research. Your diplomatic skills are appreciated :) All I can say is: things have changed. No one cared about anything for a long time, so it was essentially me using it (and knowing the details which others now miss), and many things developed by Matt Newman and me over time. I agree that it needs a lot more info. I've tried to write down things several times, but for a long time all I was capable of was hand-waving and writing madman-like tales of how wonderful everything could be and why everyone should adopt it. Maybe I could do a better job by now, but I'm not sure when I'll be able to get to it (as usual, the future is calling...). Now that tclkits and starkits have become, eh, let's say "acceptable", there is a clear need to document the state of things as they are today (quite fixed by now), and to introduce the decisions made. Such as the convention of mounting x on itself with VFS, turning a file into a directory. And pitfalls, like no longer having access to the underlying file (I hope to resolve this, also the ability to remount a r/o file as a r/w one). The fact that running in unwrapped mode makes things appear in blah.vfs/... while running wrapped up makes this blah.kit/..., and more. How to use SDX with a hack when all you have is tclkit.exe, and no tclkitsh.exe - there is so much. I anyone wishes to take the lead in this, please let me know. The starkit pages are a protected wiki, I'm willing to give access on an individual basis to extend things and have them immediately show up under the www.equi4.com/starkit area. > Anyway it is brilliant. The tclkit will help to jump over a lot of > administrative fences using TCL in a rather conservative project [...] > Well done! Thanks - may it work well for you too! And let's give credit where credit is due: by now, the whole concept owes a *lot* to numerous people, all on this mailing list. Let's enjoy the ride, folks, also in 2003 ... IMO it's only just beginning! :) -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jan 8 09:43:11 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h08FhAc01117 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 09:43:11 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h08FidQr024342 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:44:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h08FieD16220; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:44:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:44:40 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030108104440.AAB16085@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 In-Reply-To: of Wed, 8 Jan 2003 16:06:08 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Regrettably the double-slash is used in a lot of C source of the kit > > so we > > need to specify the compiler in the genkit to swallow this. > > Can you please help me find those? All I found were three lines at the > top of src/rechan.c in the tclkit sources. Are any more left? When I grep through the entire tclkit tree, I find very few places where // is used as a comment, outside of the C++ code in metakit. In ./src/tk/generic/tkMenu.c ,there appears to be at line 1198, a // comment. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From adrian_wallaschek@be.ibm.com Wed Jan 8 10:32:26 2003 Received: from d06lmsgate-6.uk.ibm.com (d06lmsgate-6.uk.ibm.com [194.196.100.252]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h08GWPc05601 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:32:25 -0600 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate-6.uk.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id QAA10772 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 16:32:27 GMT Received: from d16ml005.be.ibm.com (d16ml005.be.ibm.com [9.36.73.42]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.3/NCO/VER6.4) with ESMTP id h08GXsX9134496 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 16:33:55 GMT Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.7 March 21, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Adrian Wallaschek" Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 18:35:00 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D16ML005/16/M/IBM(Release 5.0.9a |January 7, 2002) at 08/01/2003 17:33:54 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok, after now a few people found what I over estimated, here my apology, it is really only a few places, but those few occurrences of // did the mess as good as many more ;-). Maybe in my grep I had accidently the kit directory with its C++ as well in. Anyway the settings I supplied will make the xlC ignore the // comments like gcc does, but for the products not using this compiler setting, like the one line patch in tk (tkMenu.c:1198 already noticed and solved), this option won't work. A question remains: why does genkit not transfer e.g. the compiler settings into the configure calls of the other elements. If you configure globally a C/C++ compiler why alloing sub-components to chose their own. I am currently working on the genkit script (reformatting to a optically more beatiful level at least in my eyes, just a mater of personal taste). I am adding XoTCL (my personal favorite) and some other small elements and I try to amend little details. The genkit script is a really nice basis to work on, I prefered this to weaving shared-objects into the VFS because this would create more work when porting. Ideal target is to have the genkit script as versatile that any somehow TEA compliant interesting extension is already listed and can be configured into the build with either just a switch or a few lines of config. The script is almost there, just not enough extensions as so far it is only in what was needed for the authors use. I am just experimenting, nothing might come out but so far it looks good. Regards, Adrian Wallaschek "Just when you think, life can't possible get worse, it suddenly does!" The Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy - Douglas Adams "Larry W. Virden" To: Starkit list Sent by: cc: starkit-admin@equ Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 i4.com 08.01.03 16:44 > > Regrettably the double-slash is used in a lot of C source of the kit > > so we > > need to specify the compiler in the genkit to swallow this. > > Can you please help me find those? All I found were three lines at the > top of src/rechan.c in the tclkit sources. Are any more left? When I grep through the entire tclkit tree, I find very few places where // is used as a comment, outside of the C++ code in metakit. In ./src/tk/generic/tkMenu.c ,there appears to be at line 1198, a // comment. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Wed Jan 8 10:51:17 2003 Received: from mailout08.sul.t-online.com (mailout08.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h08GpGc07250 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:51:16 -0600 Received: from fwd02.sul.t-online.de by mailout08.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18WJRi-0002DN-0D; Wed, 08 Jan 2003 17:52:50 +0100 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[217.82.106.241]) by fmrl02.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18WJRa-0kwxjUC; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 17:52:42 +0100 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4FF57BEF; Thu, 8 Mar 2001 21:48:32 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3E1C594B.9030806@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 18:00:59 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian Wallaschek wrote: >I am currently working on the genkit script (reformatting to a optically >more beatiful level at least in my eyes, just a mater of personal taste). I >am adding XoTCL (my personal favorite) and some other small elements and I >try to amend little details. The genkit script is a really nice basis to >work on, I prefered this to weaving shared-objects into the VFS because >this would create more work when porting. > Basically your right, but if I understand the tclkit philosophy right this isn't the way things should be. Tclkit as basic, static and trusted set of extensions and the tcl core, the vfs for anything extra. I really would like XoTcl in too perhaps alongside IncrTcl, but because i do not want to loose the benefits of prebuilt tclkits I'm more in favor of building a XoTcl starkit. >Ideal target is to have the genkit script as versatile that any somehow TEA >compliant interesting extension is already listed and can be configured >into the build with either just a switch or a few lines of config. The >script is almost there, just not enough extensions as so far it is only in >what was needed for the authors use. > I think it would be even better to have a script that moved and built any somehow TEA(2) compliant extension into a starkit. Kitten is nice, but a nice "install to starkit" skript for extensions would be very nice indeed. Question to jcw and others out there: Could some target like this be added to the not yet officially released TEA2 standard, an "install to starkit" target for make? Michael Schlenker > > From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jan 8 11:19:44 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h08HJic09504 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 11:19:44 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h08HLDQr027554 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 12:21:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h08HLEk17476; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 12:21:14 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 12:21:14 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030108122114.AAB17421@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 08 Jan 2003 18:00:59 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Michael Schlenker > Could some target like > this be added to the not yet officially released TEA2 standard, an > "install to starkit" target for make? 1. What goes into the TEA 2 sample extension is a factor of the maintainer of that code - currently that's the Tcl maintainers (and in particular I believe J Hobbs). 2. If all the pieces needed to build a starkit came in the Tcl core distribution, or at least were commonly available, and if the steps for building a starkit are automatable, then it should be able to be put into a makefile. 3. What would _you_ consider the set of steps a Makefile should take if someone did a "make starkit"? Does this outline cover the basic needs? a. Ensure that the extension has been built. b. Create a starkit directory structure. c. Copy the appropriate files into the appropriate directories d. Generate the appropriate start up script. e. Invoke sdx.kit with appropriate arguments. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Wed Jan 8 12:05:20 2003 Received: from mailout01.sul.t-online.com (mailout01.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.80]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h08I5Kc13015 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 12:05:20 -0600 Received: from fwd03.sul.t-online.de by mailout01.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18WKbM-0004Fh-00; Wed, 08 Jan 2003 19:06:52 +0100 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[217.82.106.241]) by fmrl03.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18WKb4-0B1KXAC; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 19:06:34 +0100 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38D8E7BEF; Thu, 8 Mar 2001 23:02:26 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3E1C6A9F.3030300@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 19:14:55 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build extension in starkit from TEA2 makefile? References: <20030108122114.AAB17421@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >From: Michael Schlenker > > >>Could some target like >>this be added to the not yet officially released TEA2 standard, an >>"install to starkit" target for make? >> >> > >1. What goes into the TEA 2 sample extension is a factor of the maintainer >of that code - currently that's the Tcl maintainers (and in particular >I believe J Hobbs). > Thats true, but i do not think he would reject a working patch to TEA2 that added a "make starkit" target to the TEA build system. (not that i have this patch or time to write it at the moment, but it surely could be done). >2. If all the pieces needed to build a starkit came in the Tcl core >distribution, or at least were commonly available, and if the steps for >building a starkit are automatable, then it should be able to be put into >a makefile. > >3. What would _you_ consider the set of steps a Makefile should take if >someone did a "make starkit"? Does this outline cover the basic needs? > >a. Ensure that the extension has been built. > >b. Create a starkit directory structure. > Or use an existing one (starkit or non-wrapped vfs dir) and only add the extension built. >c. Copy the appropriate files into the appropriate directories > > This gets complex, at least unless TIP 55 or some other convention is adopted for platform specific files. If that is done "appropriate directories" becomes a usefull term. >d. Generate the appropriate start up script. > A convention how these look and are installed would have to be done first. >e. Invoke sdx.kit with appropriate arguments. > Basically yes. I thought of an invocation like: make install-in-starkit --starkit-location=/home/mic/mystarkit.kit --sdx-location=/usr/local/bin/sdx.kit or make starkit --starkit-location=/home/foo/bar.kit --sdx-location=/usr/local/bin/sdx.kit The rational behind this idea is simple: a) Kitten is nice, but gets larger and larger and isn't available for all platforms, if one only wants a single extension in a starkit he needs the starkit built from scratch. It's not hard, but it's non trivial. b) Using a (probably small) addition to the build system for building starkits could solve some simple problems: - the build system can provide a helper script to create and install to platform specific subdirs in the starkit - the build system could probably provide the dependency information for the shared libs created - the build system can prodive a helper script to create working pkgIndex.tcl files using the platform specific subdirs - the extension starkit can be built for more platforms automatically (all that are or get supported by TEA2) c) It raises the visibility of starkits as a deployment option Michael Schlenker From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Sun Jan 12 18:42:25 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0D0g6c15911 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:42:25 -0600 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h0D0hc12042146 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:43:38 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:43:38 -0600 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: starkit@equi4.com User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) Organization: The University of Chicago Library X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] tclkit can't load binary extensions under FreeBSD? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I've recently discovered tclkit and the starkit concept and have designed my latest application as a starkit; it's all amazing and has made a tremendous difference in my work. My thanks to JCW and everybody else who's put all this together. Having said that, you can probably guess that I have a problem! :-) While the ease with which starkits can be built for other platforms is an advantage for me, my primary platform at work is FreeBSD. My problem is that it seems that tclkit can't load binary extensions under FreeBSD. I'm using the latest pre-built FreeBSD tclkit from . Here are a few random extensions that don't load: $ tclkit % set auto_path [concat /usr/local.43/lib $auto_path] /usr/local.43/lib /usr/app/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 /usr/app/bin/tclkit/lib % info patch 8.4.1 % package require Cost couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/cost2.2/libcost2.2.so": Service unavailable % package require dictionary couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/dictionary1.0/dictionary.so": Service unavailable % package require rbtree couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/rbtree1.1/rbtree.so": Service unavailable % package require tcLex couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/tcLex1.2/tcLex.so.1.2": Service unavailable % package require TclCurl couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/tclcurl0.90/../libtclcurl090.so.1": Service unavailable % package require sqlite couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/tclsqlite0/sqlite.so": Service unavailable But they all load just fine under tclsh on the same machine: $ tclsh8.4 % set auto_path [concat /usr/local.43/lib $auto_path] /usr/local.43/lib /usr/local/lib/tcl8.4 /usr/local/lib /usr/local/lib/tcllib1.2 % info patch 8.4a4 % package require Cost 2.2 % package require dictionary 1.0 % package require rbtree 1.1 % package require tcLex 1.2 % package require TclCurl 0.9 % package require sqlite 2.0 If tclkit needs more work under FreeBSD to enable it to load binary extensions, I would be happy to volunteer to attempt it. But as I don't know much about binary extensions (here's a hint: I hear people on this list mentioning "stubs" and I have no idea what that means) or building tclkit, I thought I'd ask about this first in case it's either a trivial oversight in the FreeBSD build, or in case there's some major technical problem that I ought to know about in advance (I hope not -- seems like if the standard FreeBSD tclsh can do it, tclkit ought to be able to as well) --- or in case I'm doing something very dumb that should be obvious from the above! Thanks for any help, tips or hints! -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ The University of Chicago Library Digital Library Development Center From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 13 06:02:45 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0DC2ic05224 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 06:02:44 -0600 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 13:04:24 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit can't load binary extensions under FreeBSD? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <2863855C-26EF-11D7-821E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > problem is that it seems that tclkit can't load binary extensions > under FreeBSD. I'm using the latest pre-built FreeBSD tclkit from > . > > Here are a few random extensions that don't load: > > $ tclkit > % set auto_path [concat /usr/local.43/lib $auto_path] > /usr/local.43/lib /usr/app/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 > /usr/app/bin/tclkit/lib > % info patch > 8.4.1 > % package require Cost > couldn't load file "/usr/local.43/lib/cost2.2/libcost2.2.so": > Service unavailable [...] Yes, I've seen this too - a few people have said the same in private email before. I don't know what the problem is. For some reason shared library linkage is not working as expected on FreeBSD. it may have to do with the fact that Tclkit is statically linked to something it should not. If anyone has access to a FreeBSD box and can dive in: genkit probably needs to be changed to do shared linking i.s.o. static (it's all at the top of the script). I'll see what I can do, there's a FreeBSD setup on SourceForge. The way things are now, starkits cannot use shared libs with tclkit on FreeBSD :( -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 13 10:33:57 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0DGXuc24465 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 10:33:57 -0600 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 17:35:36 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit on AIX with Visual Age C/C++ 5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <0B3AAAD6-2715-11D7-810F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian Wallaschek wrote: > if anybody is interested, here is the list of changes required to > build a > TCLkit for AIX using IBM's compiler instead of GNU. [...] > In src/tk/generic/tkMenu.c please change line 1198 (or around there). > It > contains a C++ comment lead-in (double-slash) while Done. > Change the genkit in the beginning of the file, where the > configurations > for the compiler are in a switch statement: > > switch $tcl_platform(os) { > AIX { array set Z {tclsuff "-Wl,-bshared -lcrypt" tksuff > -lIM} > array set X {gcc "xlC -qcpluscmt" g++ "xlC" -static > ""} } > ........ This is a good option, but it would not work for those who have gcc (evidently). There's an undocumented "feature" of genkit, that you can set up a file called "genkit.local" and it'll pick up changes from it afetr all definitions are done, but before starting to do actual work (see the "source" cmd near the end). My suggestion would be to put the above in there, in your case: switch $tcl_platform(os) { AIX { array set Z {tclsuff "-Wl,-bshared -lcrypt" tksuff -lIM} array set X {gcc "xlC -qcpluscmt" g++ "xlC" -static ""} } } Not tested, but this should have the same effect - without altering genkit. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jan 13 16:09:10 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0DM99c24791; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 16:09:09 -0600 Received: from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h0DMBGT6004032; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 15:11:16 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA09579; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 15:10:49 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWCRGT; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 15:10:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3E233962.DEE8B423@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 15:10:42 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Wikit Bug Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There appears to be a bug/problem in the Wikit code. The following page source: The '''Open''' dialog is found on the ['''File''' menu]. produces a wikit page that looks like this The Open dialog is found on the gFile menu. where 'Open' is bold and 'File' is bold. This is not an urgent problem for me. Regards, Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 13 16:14:40 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0DMEec25334 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 16:14:40 -0600 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 23:16:20 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E233962.DEE8B423@motorola.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Re: Wikit Bug Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > There appears to be a bug/problem in the Wikit code. > > The following page source: > > The '''Open''' dialog is found on the ['''File''' menu]. > > produces a wikit page that looks like this > > The Open dialog is found on the gFile menu. > > where 'Open' is bold and 'File' is bold. Answer: markup (bold/italic) is not allowed inside page references and URLs. The bug is that Wikit should more gracefully deal with incorrect input (and it should be more rigidly defined/documented). -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 15 16:21:46 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0FMLjc12367; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:21:46 -0600 Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 23:23:27 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Damon Courtney From: Jean-Claude Wippler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] zlib Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon, all, I've extended tclkit's zlib code to decompress on the fly. This should mean that opening large files in VFS no longer block for a long period of time, and that there is no longer a need to hold a complete copy of the expanded file in memory, as the currend tclkit does. If you're interested in this, please try the new builds (Win32 and Linux) in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ and let me know how things go. This has been *very* "lightly tested", I just made sure it runs a few basic things. It's all transparent - a new mk4vfs::zstreamed flag enables the new logic and is set by default in these latest tclkit builds. There is one drawback to all this: seeking back in a compressed file means VFS needs to rewind and decompress/skip data from the start. This is unavoidable. If that is a problem, then you can set mk4vfs::zstreamed to zero, from which point tclkit reverts to its old memchan-style buffering approach (it's a global setting). The changes are in mk4vfs.tcl (minor) and in vfslib.tcl (a new vfs::zstream command, based on rechan). The C code in tclkit's zlib.c was extended with two commands (sdecompress and sinflate), which create a temp command object to maintain state for decompression while it is in progress. Multiple files can be open and decompressing on-the-fly at the same time. All changes are now in CVS. If there is sufficient feedback, I'll try to get this into the upcoming release round for Tclkit. Details about performance / memory-use effects are also most welcome, since no supporting empirical evidence has been collected so far :) -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jan 15 16:50:35 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0FMoYc14755; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:50:34 -0600 Received: from pobox4.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h0FMqGlG024613; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:52:17 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox4.mot.com (MOT-pobox4 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA05921; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:52:16 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWCS6A; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:52:16 -0700 Message-ID: <3E25E61F.90F416BD@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:52:15 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problems adding help to starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am adding a help wiki to my application and have run into some problem (bugs?). 1) The Formating Rules state that a line that beginning with white space is not wrapped. Actually lines that start with white space DO wrap. This problem doesn't occur on a Tcl'ers Wiki page viewed with a browser. 2) The Formating Rules state that a line that beginning with white space will not have an "reference generating". Actually an http reference will be converted to a reference even in a string preceded by a white space. This appears to be consistent with the Formating Rules on the Tcl'ers Wiki however the font used for the reference is a proportional font while the rest of the string is a fix font thus causing a problem with text alignment. 3) The Formating Rules illustrate a first and second numbered bullet that are actually numbered 5 and 6. This problem exists because the bullet number isn't being reset. This problem doesn't occur on a Tcl'ers Wiki page viewed with a browser. Tom Krehbiel From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 15 17:28:04 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0FNS3c17812; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 17:28:03 -0600 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:29:44 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems adding help to starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Tom Krehbiel From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <3E25E61F.90F416BD@motorola.com> Message-Id: <3A58F3D0-28E1-11D7-A26F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I am adding a help wiki to my application and have run into some > problem (bugs?). Cool, you're exercising the local mode a bit more - good. Let's make it better. > 1) The Formating Rules state that a line that beginning with white > space is not wrapped. Actually lines that start with white space > DO wrap. This problem doesn't occur on a Tcl'ers Wiki page viewed with > a browser. Ouch. Is it possible to turn off line wrap in a Tk widget on a per-line basis? > 2) The Formating Rules state that a line that beginning with white > space will not have an "reference generating". Actually an http > reference will be converted to a reference even in a string preceded > by a white space. This appears to be consistent with the > Formating Rules on the Tcl'ers Wiki however the font used for the > reference is a proportional font while the rest of the string is a > fix font thus causing a problem with text alignment. Yes, the more accurate rule is that no transformations are made which change the appearance, so that copy and paste of verbatim text in plain text mode does not cause surprises. So highlighting URLs is ok (and convenient, though only in HTML until Tk gets browsing capabilities), but dropping "''" to turn things into italic mode is not. Yes, this is a bug - there need to be two styles for urls. Or we could just drop the highlighting, since it's not doing anything anyway. > 3) The Formating Rules illustrate a first and second numbered bullet > that are actually numbered 5 and 6. This problem exists because > the bullet number isn't being reset. This problem doesn't occur on a > Tcl'ers Wiki page viewed with a browser. Good catch. Need to add logic to the Tk renderer to reset more often. I've made a note of all this, thx. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jan 15 17:56:25 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0FNuPc20145; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 17:56:25 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h0FNwZEQ001191; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:58:35 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA26988; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:58:07 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWCS8B; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:58:07 -0700 Message-ID: <3E25F58E.BD717257@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:58:06 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problems adding help to starkit References: <3A58F3D0-28E1-11D7-A26F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > > 1) The Formating Rules state that a line that beginning with white > > space is not wrapped. Actually lines that start with white space > > DO wrap. This problem doesn't occur on a Tcl'ers Wiki page viewed with > > a browser. > > Ouch. Is it possible to turn off line wrap in a Tk widget on a > per-line basis? I think we're in luck. I just looked at the man page for the text widget and appears there is a '-wrap mode' option to the tag command that can be used to override the widgets '-wrap' option in the tag range. Tom K. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Jan 16 04:22:45 2003 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0GAMjc25534 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 04:22:45 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (cgey1.capgemini.se [193.234.247.50]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AOZ25934 (AUTH vincedarley); Thu, 16 Jan 2003 10:25:25 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030116102123.01efe058@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 10:24:07 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] zlib In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This looks v. useful indeed -- I had wondered what those long waits were that I was seeing. One optimisation might be either to provide a new fconfigure option (-streamed, for example), or to automatically switch from streaming to non-streaming on the fly when the first backwards 'seek' is performed. p.s. I've added the new 'tarvfs' to the tclvfs project at sourceforge. cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jan 16 04:31:22 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0GAVLc26088; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 04:31:21 -0600 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:33:02 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] zlib Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Vince Darley From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030116102123.01efe058@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince, Could you run a quick check that the latest Win32 builds work? I'm getting reports from Damon Courtney that they don't even launch (2k+XP), but on my NT4 setup it works just fine. Just a download and launch, and if you have time, a trial run with alphatk perhaps :) > p.s. I've added the new 'tarvfs' to the tclvfs project at sourceforge. Ah, cool. That plus on-the-fly zlib decompression might allow us to go through tarfiles reasonably efficiently. The decompression code is not tied to mk4vfs, the call is: set zfd [vfs::ztream decompress $ifd filesize] The expanded filesize is needed for now, e.g. for relative-to-end-seeking. I haven't yet placed it in the tclvfs project, wanted to first make sure things work as expected. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jan 16 04:32:55 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0GAWsc26201; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 04:32:54 -0600 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:34:35 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] zlib - whoops Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Vince Darley , Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1B753FD0-293E-11D7-A26F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Vince, > > Could you run a quick check that the latest Win32 builds work? [...] That was intended as private email - sorry :) -jcw From tom.wilkason@cox.net Thu Jan 16 21:33:13 2003 Received: from lakemtao04.cox.net (lakemtao04.cox.net [68.1.17.241]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0H3XDc16526 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:33:13 -0600 Received: from bertha ([68.99.175.107]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with SMTP id <20030117033453.BQMA22825.lakemtao04.cox.net@bertha> for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:34:53 -0500 Message-ID: <005401c2bdd9$83a189f0$647ba8c0@bertha> From: "Tom Wilkason" To: Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:35:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Subject: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am trying to find a consistent way I can determine the true local folder name of where I started up my starkit or starpack (i.e. the folder one which they reside). The usual suspects don't seem to work: [info script] -> gives the vfs script name argv0 -> gives the name of the kit or the main.tcl file within the starpack [pwd] -> this works as long as the working directory is the same as the kit/pack I am trying to overload the load command to look for loadable libraries within the same folder before trying to load them from the vfs. I have a case where I would prefer NOT to wrap them, but keep them separate. I would like however to store them in the same directory as the kit/pack bypassing any pkgIndex.tcl declrations. Also, is there an easy, consistent, cross-platform way to tell if you are running in a kit vs running in a pack? Thanks, Tom Wilkason From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Jan 16 21:37:07 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0H3b7c16784 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:37:07 -0600 Received: (qmail 74498 invoked by uid 300); 17 Jan 2003 03:38:51 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 03:38:51 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:38:50 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Tom Wilkason cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder In-Reply-To: <005401c2bdd9$83a189f0$647ba8c0@bertha> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I am trying to find a consistent way I can determine the true local folder > name of where I started up my starkit or starpack (i.e. the folder one which > they reside). The usual suspects don't seem to work: > > [info script] -> gives the vfs script name > argv0 -> gives the name of the kit or the main.tcl file within the starpack > [pwd] -> this works as long as the working directory is the same as the > kit/pack file dirname [info nameofexecutable] ? > Also, is there an easy, consistent, cross-platform way to tell if you are > running in a kit vs running in a pack? I don't think so, but I think it's a good idea. 0-] Anyone on the TclKit team add this to their TO DO list? Damon From tom.wilkason@cox.net Thu Jan 16 21:43:26 2003 Received: from lakemtao02.cox.net (lakemtao02.cox.net [68.1.17.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0H3hQc17127 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:43:26 -0600 Received: from bertha ([68.99.175.107]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with SMTP id <20030117034503.SONP6744.lakemtao02.cox.net@bertha>; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:45:03 -0500 Message-ID: <005b01c2bdda$f0d13d80$647ba8c0@bertha> From: "Tom Wilkason" To: "Damon Courtney" Cc: References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:45:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Damon Courtney" To: "Tom Wilkason" Cc: Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 10:38 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder > > I am trying to find a consistent way I can determine the true local folder > > name of where I started up my starkit or starpack (i.e. the folder one which > > they reside). The usual suspects don't seem to work: > > > > [info script] -> gives the vfs script name > > argv0 -> gives the name of the kit or the main.tcl file within the starpack > > [pwd] -> this works as long as the working directory is the same as the > > kit/pack > > file dirname [info nameofexecutable] ? Works for packs, but for kits it returns the tclkit location, not the kit itself. Again, if I could tell what I was running from I could figure it out using a mixture of the above commands. Tom Wilkason From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 17 06:42:35 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HCgYc14015 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 06:42:34 -0600 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 13:44:17 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <005b01c2bdda$f0d13d80$647ba8c0@bertha> Message-Id: <647E36A2-2A19-11D7-A26F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Wilkason wrote: > I am trying to find a consistent way I can determine the true local folder > name of where I started up my starkit or starpack (i.e. the folder one which > they reside). The usual suspects don't seem to work: > > [info script] -> gives the vfs script name > argv0 -> gives the name of the kit or the main.tcl file within the starpack > [pwd] -> this works as long as the working directory is the same as the > kit/pack Try $starkit::topdir - it is set by starkit::startup. These two lines should always be the first two in main.tcl: package require starkit if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return Usually, main.tcl contains just one more line after that: package require app-myapp (replace "myapp" by whatever your app is called) That way, you can run things 4 ways: 1. unwrapped: tclkit myapp.vfs/main.tcl 2. starkit: tclkit myapp.kit 3. starpack: myapp 4. sourced: source myapp.vfs/main.tcl 5. plugin: no, not yet, but who knows - one day? The string returned by startup is one of the above, and indicates to the main.tcl script how it was launched. The check and return on "sourced" is a convenience, it prevents main.tcl from actually starting anything up. The effect is that the starkit's lib/ directory will have been added to the path, so all packages are available to the context where "source" was called. This auto_path change is part of the logic in starkit::startup. The other thing startup does, is to set starkit::topdir to the directory where main.tcl resides, which I think is what you were looking for. To be complete, I have to mention that there's a "gotcha" in the current logic. If one starkit sources another, say a collection of packages such as kitten, then starkit::topdir will end up being set as pointing to kitten. That's usually not what you want, so you have to save topdir in your scripts before sourcing other starkits: set mytopdir $starkit::topdir source somepath/kitten.kit Oh, and starkit defines a "lassign" command. It's unfortunate that it has to be in this package, but I kept missing it and adding it to just about every script. This way it is available in all starkits, regardless of the mode they are used in. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jan 17 08:38:55 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HEctc20418; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 08:38:55 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h0HEedFP018240; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 07:40:39 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id HAA13397; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 07:40:38 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWCT94; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 07:40:38 -0700 Message-ID: <3E2815E5.DA315C83@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 07:40:37 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder References: <647E36A2-2A19-11D7-A26F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, > Oh, and starkit defines a "lassign" command. It's unfortunate that it > has to be in this package, but I kept missing it and adding it to just > about every script. This way it is available in all starkits, > regardless of the mode they are used in. Yiks! % tclkit % info commands l* list lrange lsearch lappend llength linsert lreplace librarypath lset load lindex lsort % lassign wrong # args: should be "lassign l args" % info commands l* list lassign lrange lsearch lappend llength linsert lreplace librarypath lset load lindex lsort % lassign {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} name uid gid longName % puts $dave can't read "dave": no such variable It looks to me like lassign still needs some work or it isn't the same command that is discribed in TclX where lassign {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} name uid gid longName Assigns name to ``dave'', uid to ``100'', gid to ``200'', and longName to ``Dave Foo''. Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 17 08:46:02 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HEk1c20968 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 08:46:01 -0600 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 15:47:43 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E2815E5.DA315C83@motorola.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > % tclkit [...] > % lassign {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} name uid gid longName > % puts $dave > can't read "dave": no such variable % puts $name dave % > It looks to me like lassign still needs some work or it isn't the same > command that is discribed in TclX where > > lassign {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} name uid gid longName > Assigns name to ``dave'', uid to ``100'', gid to ``200'', and longName > to ``Dave Foo''. ??? What use is such a command? The point of lassign is that you can take a list of data and split it out into variables. The variable names are known, it's the data which tend to come in as a list (e.g. "args"), no? It avoids the (not-very-intuitive, IMO) foreach trick: foreach {name uid gid longName} {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} break -jcw From adrian_wallaschek@be.ibm.com Fri Jan 17 10:13:05 2003 Received: from d06lmsgate-5.uk.ibm.com (d06lmsgate-5.uk.ibm.com [195.212.29.5]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HGD4c28091 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 10:13:04 -0600 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate-5.uk.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id QAA44828 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 16:13:08 GMT Received: from d16ml005.be.ibm.com (d16ml005.be.ibm.com [9.36.73.42]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.3/NCO/VER6.4) with ESMTP id h0HGEgUH098060 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 16:14:42 GMT To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.7 March 21, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Adrian Wallaschek" Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:07:22 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D16ML005/16/M/IBM(Release 5.0.9a |January 7, 2002) at 17/01/2003 17:14:42 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Tk pkgIndex too ignorant. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi there, just hunted a ghost for a day: Assume to have a tclkit, unset the variable DISPLAY, run it and do a "package require Tk". From here on the box cheats you: it tells you that it couldn't load the libtk8.4.so!!! Well we didn't intend to did we? We had linked the tk8.4.a statically into our tclkit so where is it? The guru (not me) would immediately try: load "" Tk which will tell about the missing display variable. So why not the first time? pkgIndex.tcl in the vfs:lib/tk8.4 There it first tries to load the static version of a package. If this load (which implies its initialization) failes, it assumes that there is no static version and tries on with a dynamic loadable. May I humble propose to patch this pkgIndex.tcl manually or just replace it with some that tries the static load (load "" Tk) and nothing else, so in case there is an error, the correct error is displayed? Me idiot was looking a full day at my compiler options trying to find out why it "didn't link the tk statically" ... buuhuuuu! 8-((( I recompiled about 30-40 times and got ... nothing, why? there was no problem! I feel stupid now! ;-) Have your fun! Regards, Adrian Wallaschek "Just when you think, life can't possible get worse, it suddenly does!" The Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy - Douglas Adams From dgporter@erols.com Fri Jan 17 10:38:28 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HGcSc30535 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 10:38:28 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVbcXndy1leJLg2N09otbbXD7sSquA69Mw2ozoT/SaDFd96qzJC+LR2cCtCv/wN2SQE= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18ZZXP-0000NW-00; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:40:11 -0500 Message-ID: <3E2831E6.609@erols.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:40:06 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adrian Wallaschek CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tk pkgIndex too ignorant. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian Wallaschek wrote: > So why not the first time? pkgIndex.tcl in the vfs:lib/tk8.4 > > There it first tries to load the static version of a package. > > If this load (which implies its initialization) failes, it assumes that > there is no static version and tries on with a dynamic loadable. This whole thing is a bug. As I understand it, the tclkit executable includes a static copy of the Tk package. Given that, tclkit initialization should directly call the appropriate [package ifneeded] to register the right way to [package require] the Tk it contains. There should not even be any pkgIndex.tcl file for Tk. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jan 17 10:42:39 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HGgcc30951; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 10:42:38 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h0HGiLC8027963; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 09:44:22 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA01624; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 09:44:21 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWC4FK; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 09:44:20 -0700 Message-ID: <3E2832E4.157603AC@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 09:44:20 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Finding true startup folder References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, Oops, I haven't used the lassign command in a long time and I thought the assignment order was from right to left. My expectation was that "set name to dave" would be name=dave while assign name to dave would be dave=name. Sorry for the confusion. Tom K. > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > % tclkit > [...] > > % lassign {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} name uid gid longName > > % puts $dave > > can't read "dave": no such variable > > % puts $name > dave > % > > > It looks to me like lassign still needs some work or it isn't the same > > command that is discribed in TclX where > > > > lassign {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} name uid gid longName > > Assigns name to ``dave'', uid to ``100'', gid to ``200'', and longName > > to ``Dave Foo''. > > ??? > > What use is such a command? The point of lassign is that you can take > a list of data and split it out into variables. The variable names are > known, it's the data which tend to come in as a list (e.g. "args"), no? > > It avoids the (not-very-intuitive, IMO) foreach trick: > foreach {name uid gid longName} {dave 100 200 {Dave Foo}} break > > -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 17 10:45:18 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HGjHc31266 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 10:45:18 -0600 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:47:00 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tk pkgIndex too ignorant. Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <4C4B3C5C-2A3B-11D7-A09E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian Wallaschek wrote: > Hi there, just hunted a ghost for a day: > > Assume to have a tclkit, unset the variable DISPLAY, run it and do a > "package require Tk". > > From here on the box cheats you: it tells you that it couldn't load the > libtk8.4.so!!! This has been fixed in the CVS version, see: http://www.equi4.com/metakit/viewcvs.cgi/tclkit/kit-unix.vfs/lib/ tk8.4/pkgIndex.tcl?rev=1.3&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup > I feel stupid now! ;-) Have your fun! I'm sorry for that. I do recall having mentioned this on the list, but it may well have been hidden inside some other reply. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 17 10:50:45 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HGoic31913 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 10:50:44 -0600 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:52:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tk pkgIndex too ignorant. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E2831E6.609@erols.com> Message-Id: <0ECC9724-2A3C-11D7-A09E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Donald G Porter wrote: > This whole thing is a bug. It is, see last msg. > As I understand it, the tclkit executable includes a static copy of > the Tk package. Given that, tclkit initialization should directly > call the appropriate [package ifneeded] to register the right way to > [package require] the Tk it contains. There should not even be any > pkgIndex.tcl file for Tk. There are several modes of operation. There are tclkit(sh) builds without Tk, tclkit builds with, and there are cases where Tk is in the VFS loaded as extension, because static linkage is not possible (Solaris), or not wanted (FreeBSD, in the next tclkit release). The change I've checked in will load static if it sees that static is in the "info loaded" list, and load dynamic otherwise. It solves Adrian's case, because failure to load Tk will be clearly identified. Either no DISPLAY, or not present anywhere. -jcw From dgporter@erols.com Fri Jan 17 11:22:51 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HHMpc02381; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:22:51 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVb1/R0JwDuEHNbC8zt2h8Zssh+Zh7u813Lo3MAWKBF56h9ScsFlBRUxCk68RiwhC7M= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18ZaEN-00011v-00; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 12:24:35 -0500 Message-ID: <3E283C52.5090603@erols.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 12:24:34 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tk pkgIndex too ignorant. References: <0ECC9724-2A3C-11D7-A09E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > There are several modes of operation. There are tclkit(sh) builds > without Tk, tclkit builds with, and there are cases where Tk is in the > VFS loaded as extension, because static linkage is not possible > (Solaris), or not wanted (FreeBSD, in the next tclkit release). OK, so then there should be a pkgIndex.tcl file for Tk in the VFS, if there is also a libTk.so in the VFS. I stand corrected on that point. My point is that you can cover all your modes of operation, and have less chance of similar errors, if you take a more systematic approach instead of making ad hoc changes. The [package ifneeded] registration of the availability of a package for loading should be done near where the success of that [load]ing is provided for. If you place a libTk.so file in your VFS, then it is available for loading via [load libTk.so Tk], and you should have a pkgIndex.tcl file also in your VFS to register that fact. OTOH, if you have a static copy of Tk in your executable, and your executable calls Tcl_StaticPackage() for it, then it is available for loading via [load {} Tk], and you should call [package ifneeded] right then to register that fact. Following this approach, you end up using exactly the pkgIndex.tcl file for Tk that comes with Tk -- no TclKit specific mods. What tclkit has now is an attempt to register the availability of both kinds of [load]ing in a single place, which is not well-modularized, and as a result requires probing gymnastics ([info loaded] ...). -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 17 11:43:56 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0HHhtc04145 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:43:55 -0600 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:45:36 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tk pkgIndex too ignorant. Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <3E283C52.5090603@erols.com> Message-Id: <7C56F786-2A43-11D7-A09E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h0HHhtc04145 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Donald G Porter wrote: > The [package ifneeded] registration of the availability of a package > for loading should be done near where the success of that [load]ing > is provided for. Ok. > If you place a libTk.so file in your VFS, then it is available for > loading via [load libTk.so Tk], and you should have a pkgIndex.tcl > file also in your VFS to register that fact. Ok. > OTOH, if you have a static copy of Tk in your executable, and your > executable calls Tcl_StaticPackage() for it, then it is available > for loading via [load {} Tk], and you should call [package ifneeded] > right then to register that fact. This is tricky - "right then" is in the C code, while the package ifneeded is Tcl code. I could insert an "eval", but it sounds like a hack. Or can I - what if Tk gets registered with a NULL interp pointer (or is that silly for Tk, I'm not too clear on single-interp vs. NULL-pointer interp static package defs). > Following this approach, you end up using exactly the pkgIndex.tcl > file for Tk that comes with Tk -- no TclKit specific mods. I agree that this would be nice. But it's hard. There's a bunch of tcl scripts which always end up being in a dir, hence in VFS. There's a shared lib with different suffixes which can be in there too, or not - if loaded statically. So I'm being forced to treat the collection of tcl scripts differently (since the pkgIndex.tcl file is one of them, sometimes), depending on how I build. This really is hard. The way tclkit gets built, is that I have a VFS file which works for all platforms (a starkit like "runtime" collection). I then go to each of the platforms, build the compiled code, and bring all of this like a pack rat back to a single machine. Then, there's a script which takes the prefix (compiled tclkit), slaps on the runtime VFS via "cat", and violá - a ready-to-distribute tclkit. The logic for compilation is nicely reduced to just that, while the architecture independent work takes place in a place far away, my office... For dyn-loaded tk's, which are a fly in the ointment, I open up the VFS runtime, copy tk.so/sl/dll in, and close it. I now agree that this can be the spot where pkgIndex.tcl gets added as well. But it leaves me with the case where Tk is in the static code. Which depends on the platform. I guess I could do the same here: mount the VFS, copy just a static-load pkgIndex.tcl in there, and close it up again. It's still not what you suggest: putting the package ifneeded in the C code. > What tclkit has now is an attempt to register the availability of both > kinds of [load]ing in a single place, which is not well-modularized, > and as a result requires probing gymnastics ([info loaded] ...). Yep, but let's add a bit of pragmatism here: the gymnastics are trivial. > -- > | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division > | > | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory > | > | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST > | > |______________________________________________________________________ > | > > > ################################################################# > ################################################################# > ################################################################# > ##### > ##### > ##### > ################################################################# > ################################################################# > ################################################################# You sig sure is a long one! -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jan 18 10:31:39 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0IGVcc07813 for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 10:31:39 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0IGXFj5011682 for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 11:33:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0IGXFS29502; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 11:33:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 11:33:15 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030118113315.AAB29490@cas.org> To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] Note to people attempting to build Tclkit on Solaris Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Note that g++ , at least on Solaris, has a rather nasty situation that builders of Tclkit need to remember. I'm told by our inhouse g++ maintainer that the development community for g++ expect the user of g++ to set an environment flag specifying the -R flag - g++ by default builds executables that cannot find the g++ specific libraries such as libstdc++ . This is really nasty with tclkit, since the errors encountered are cryptic and in fact are not even reported to the user until late in the process, when this isn't set up properly. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Jan 20 08:17:08 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0KEH7c25668 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 08:17:07 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0KEIkj5028950 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:18:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0KEIjs01096; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:18:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:18:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030120091845.AAB1078@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Kitten strange behavior Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I just tried to run kitten.kit -u and got the following strange response: $ kitten.kit -u Search Did the server side support for kitten updating itself change? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 20 11:44:22 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0KHiLc11201; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 11:44:21 -0600 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:46:05 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Metakit mailing list From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <0C87F0D7-2C9F-11D7-B0FE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Q: Basic questions about huge databases. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re discussion on limits and sizes... (crossposted to starkit mailing list). I just did a few tests (from tcl), using hashing on a fast Linux box. Wanted to follow up because I think I gave the impression that millions of rows is a lot... Well, I don't want to get into actual timings, given that it all depends on everything from etching process used to the phase of the moon anyway, but here's some info which may be of use. - databases of several hundreds Mb's can work really well - same for "millions of rows", it's no longer such a big deal - add many thousands of rows per second even from a scripting interface - as of MK 2.3/2.4, there are persistent hash indexes, and they really have O(1) performance (10's/100's of thousands of accesses per second) There continue to be effects which can surprise you, because column-wise data is something radically, totally, fundamentally different, but you have to keep in mind that these "surprises" can go both ways... At the C/C++ and Python and Tcl level, be prepared to see performance levels which seem unreal. There will be an order of magnitude difference between a hand-coded C/C++ in-memory hash table and the one MK offers persistently, but that should be about it. I've been seeing hash access rates of 25K searches/sec, using a new experimental Tcl wrapper (which appears to slow it down 4-fold, so there's a lot of leeway for optimization). I've never taken the time to compare this with other DB's (again: etching and moon phases), but it seems to me that MK packs a lot of oomph. Please feel free to follow up with teal-life stories and experiences of your own. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jan 20 14:45:17 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0KKjHc26687; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:45:17 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h0KKl3Wq012620; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:47:03 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA06466; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:47:02 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWCVNH; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:46:16 -0700 Message-ID: <3E2C6018.42604A7E@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:46:16 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list References: <647E36A2-2A19-11D7-A26F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problem/Bug with Wikit in stand-alone mode Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There is a problem with the handling of the button on reference pages (when using wikit in stand-alone mode). My expectation is that when you click on a page title and get a reference page then the button should return you to the page you were just viewing. This isn't the case. When your are viewing a reference page the back button actually returns you to the "Back" page for the page your were viewing. This behavior is different than what would occur if the wiki were displayed through a browser. A worst case example of this bug is a Home Page that is referenced from some other page in the wiki. If this occurs then if you view the Home Page's reference page immediately after starting wikit you will find that all the button (except Help) are disabled which means you have to follow a link. Tom K. From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Jan 21 01:22:21 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0L7MKc06347 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 01:22:20 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA01235 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:24:07 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA00816; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:23:53 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E2CF589.2F66C780@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:23:53 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Q: Basic questions about huge databases. References: <0C87F0D7-2C9F-11D7-B0FE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Re discussion on limits and sizes... (crossposted to starkit mailing > list). > > I've never taken the time to compare this with other DB's (again: > etching and moon phases), but it seems to me that MK packs a lot of > oomph. One of the reasons I am very much interested in MK is that it uses columns and rows as if you were working with C/Fortran arrays, rather than unordered sets of data records - this makes storing a timeseries almost trivial (try doing that in a classical relational DB, you end up using an extra column for the index of the data in the timeseries or using BLOBs). Another reason is that it comes as a neatly packaged executable and that the databases themselves are mere files. Very transportable. > > Please feel free to follow up with teal-life stories and experiences of > your own. > I did at: Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Tue Jan 21 14:27:31 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0LKRUc16294 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 14:27:30 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0LKT9j5015003 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:29:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0LKT9T18806; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:29:09 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 15:29:09 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030121152909.AAB18797@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Forwarded: Using tclkit for cgi Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The following message appeared on the tclhttpd mailing list. If someone here has the Tclkit solution, perhaps you could either email the poster, post to the mailing list, or at the very least, drop a note back here to this list and I will try to contact the principals involved. Forwarded mail follows: Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 13:39:09 +0200 >From: Nicolas Boretos To: tclhttpd-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Tclhttpd-users] Using tclkit for cgi Hi all, I have been successfully using tclhttpd with tclkit for years for templating (.tml pages). I have now a need to use cgi for a project and trying to get tcl cgi scripts running under tclhttpd. I need to use tclkit as the hosting company does not have tcl installed, but allows me to use my own interpreter, tclkit, on RH linux. My problem; I am trying to get basic cgi scripts working (hello.cgi, env.cgi) from the tclhttpd distro running, but to call tclkit instead of tclsh.Simply replacing the call from tclsh to tclkit, produces errors. Trying a little wrapper for my scripts ###wrapper.tcl #!/bin/sh exec /usr/local/bin/tclkit /home/tclhttpd3.4.2/htdocs/cgi-bin/env.tcl ###env.tcl puts "Content-Type: text/html" puts "" puts "The environment" puts "

The environment

" puts foreach name [lsort [array names env]] { puts "" } puts
$name$env($name)
exit 0 the error Tcl-Webserver/3.4.2 September 3, 2002 Tcl version 8.4.1.1 Webmaster: webmaster@nicolas.maich.gr can't use empty string as operand of "+" while executing "expr {$counter(total) + $delta}" (procedure "counter::count" line 3) invoked from within "counter::count $what $delta" (procedure "Count" line 5) invoked from within "Count errors" (procedure "Httpd_Error" line 11) invoked from within "Httpd_Error $sock 400 $fd" (procedure "CgiSpawn" line 21) invoked from within "CgiSpawn $sock $path" (procedure "CgiHandle" line 4) invoked from within "CgiHandle /cgi-bin/hello_wrap.cgi {} /root/tclhttpd3.4.2/bin/../htdocs/cgi-bin/hello_wrap.cgi sock12" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval $cmd [list $sock]" (procedure "Url_Handle" line 5) invoked from within "Url_Handle [list CgiHandle $url $extra $path] $sock" (procedure "Cgi_Domain" line 46) invoked from within "Cgi_Domain /cgi-bin /root/tclhttpd3.4.2/bin/../htdocs/cgi-bin sock12 /hello_wrap.cgi" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval $Url(command,$prefix) [list $sock $suffix]" I'll start looking into the counter package, but any help would be appreciated. regards, nicolas boretos -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jan 21 14:45:14 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0LKjDc18648 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 14:45:14 -0600 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 21:46:59 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Forwarded: Using tclkit for cgi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030121152909.AAB18797@cas.org> Message-Id: <7CBD96C9-2D81-11D7-9731-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > The following message appeared on the tclhttpd mailing list. Thanks for forwarding it. This was resolved in private email as being caused by file modes. -jcw From mel@redolive.com Wed Jan 22 12:09:35 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0MI9Yc23307 for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2003 12:09:34 -0600 Received: (qmail 7774 invoked by uid 511); 22 Jan 2003 19:09:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 19:09:43 -0000 Message-ID: <00c501c2c242$684975b0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 13:16:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00C2_01C2C218.7F5DE9E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] kit for my entire web site, but how ??? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00C2_01C2C218.7F5DE9E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i am trying to create a complete website kit for my customer. i am using cgi.tcl "Don's package" and a couple of packages that i have = written myself. how can i make apache server to look inside my package for cgi files = etc. ? it seems that apache looks for centain directories for Root, Bin, Icons = etc. many thatks, and as usual a simple example would go an extra mile ! Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_00C2_01C2C218.7F5DE9E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i am trying to create a complete = website kit for my=20 customer.
i am using cgi.tcl "Don's package" and = a couple of=20 packages that i have written myself.
 
how can i make apache server to look = inside my=20 package for cgi files etc. ?
it seems that apache looks for centain = directories=20 for Root, Bin, Icons etc.
 
many thatks, and as usual a simple = example would go=20 an extra mile !
 
Yours, Mel
------=_NextPart_000_00C2_01C2C218.7F5DE9E0-- From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Wed Jan 22 12:16:27 2003 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0MIGRc23852 for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2003 12:16:27 -0600 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id SAA06190; Wed, 22 Jan 2003 18:18:11 GMT From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200301221818.SAA06190@sole.prd.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Starkit] kit for my entire web site, but how ??? To: mel@redolive.com (Mel) Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 18:18:10 +0000 (GMT/BST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <00c501c2c242$684975b0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> from "Mel" at Jan 22, 3 01:16:39 pm Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > i am trying to create a complete website kit for my customer. > i am using cgi.tcl "Don's package" and a couple of packages that i have = > written myself. > > how can i make apache server to look inside my package for cgi files = > etc. ? > it seems that apache looks for centain directories for Root, Bin, Icons = > etc. > > many thatks, and as usual a simple example would go an extra mile ! > > Yours, Mel Consider using tclhttpd as your server: it's possible to put tclkit plus tclhttpd as a starkit, plus a surprising amount of content on a single floppy. I run two open-access websites this way, www.careerdemon.com and www.prd.co.uk, and though neither of them has a lot of content they do some quite clever tcl-based things and are very simple to manage. -- Steve Blinkhorn From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 22 12:33:22 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0MIXMc25185 for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2003 12:33:22 -0600 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 19:35:09 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] kit for my entire web site, but how ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200301221818.SAA06190@sole.prd.co.uk> Message-Id: <3C15E2CC-2E38-11D7-9731-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Blinkhorn wrote: [Mel] >> i am trying to create a complete website kit for my customer. >> i am using cgi.tcl "Don's package" and a couple of packages that i >> have = >> written myself. >> >> how can i make apache server to look inside my package for cgi files = >> etc. ? >> it seems that apache looks for centain directories for Root, Bin, >> Icons = >> etc. >> >> many thatks, and as usual a simple example would go an extra mile ! >> >> Yours, Mel > > Consider using tclhttpd as your server: it's possible to put tclkit > plus tclhttpd as a starkit, plus a surprising amount of content on a > single floppy. I run two open-access websites this way, > www.careerdemon.com and www.prd.co.uk, and though neither of them has > a lot of content they do some quite clever tcl-based things and are > very simple to manage. If that is not an option as is, you could have a look at a page with tips on how to use Apache to pass requests through to tclhttpd, as described by Mark Roseman's excellent info page about this approach: http://www.courseforum.com/howto_proxy.html -jcw From nicolasb@maich.gr Thu Jan 23 01:26:41 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0N7Qec31659 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 01:26:40 -0600 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Thu Jan 23 10:00:36 2003 +0200 Message-ID: <3E2F9AD0.9010600@maich.gr> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:33:36 +0200 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Blinkhorn CC: Mel , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] kit for my entire web site, but how ??? References: <200301221818.SAA06190@sole.prd.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Blinkhorn wrote: >>i am trying to create a complete website kit for my customer. >>i am using cgi.tcl "Don's package" and a couple of packages that i have = >>written myself. >> >>how can i make apache server to look inside my package for cgi files = >>etc. ? >>it seems that apache looks for centain directories for Root, Bin, Icons = >>etc. >> >>many thatks, and as usual a simple example would go an extra mile ! >> >>Yours, Mel > > > > Consider using tclhttpd as your server: it's possible to put tclkit > plus tclhttpd as a starkit, plus a surprising amount of content on a > single floppy. I run two open-access websites this way, > www.careerdemon.com and www.prd.co.uk, and though neither of them has > a lot of content they do some quite clever tcl-based things and are > very simple to manage. > I strongly second that;-) regards, nicolas boretos From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jan 23 05:03:39 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NB3cc11196 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 05:03:38 -0600 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:05:25 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] itcl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, Tclkit has included Incrtcl as statically-linked extension for quite some time, as you probably know. A few times there have been questions about why itcl, or why not also itk. I've defended the current setup by saying that being able to rely on itcl always being present means that (in the tclkit context) one could count on having an OO system within reach on all platforms. I would like to revoke that decision and drop itcl from the tclkit build. - itcl is one OO extension, I'm not sure it is *the* OO extension everyone uses - itcl is in, itk is not (less essential, also not available on MacOS X with Aqua) - in fact not even itcl is in MacOS classic right now - there are pure-Tcl OO alternatives (albeit slower), even itcl has an alternative (Matt Newman's Tcl++, see http://www.sensus.org/tcl/) But perhaps the most important reasons are that itcl is not needed by tclkit itself (and is the only extension in there that does not have to be), and that now that we have starpacks and an emerging set of conventions for multi-platform starkits the deployment of itcl for multi-platform scenario's has become so much simpler. As someone pointed out to me recently: *if* itcl is a candidate for removal, then let's get it over with and reduce the pain before even more widespread use of tclkit makes it harder still. Having said that, I don't want to make such a drastic change without consulting people on this list. Also, I would like to offer a good way out if you have already based your work on itcl, so here's the proposal: - drop itcl from the tclkit static builds on all platforms - adjust genkit, so it *continues* to build itcl as shared lib - built both binaries for all platforms in the next release round - create a starkit with all itcl binaries This last starkit will contain all platform-specific shared libraries, as well as the incrtcl runtime scripts. This can then be used in a number of ways: - deploy alongside your apps and source it to make itcl available again - you could unwrap it and throw out the platforms you don't want - unwrap and copy the package/binaries into your own starkits In the case of starpack, you can copy the appropriate files and wrap them along with the rest, to end up with an application which again runs out of the box. The only difference is that itcl will be loaded dynamically (and hence uses a temp copy to work from). Lastly, as people have been discovering more and more it seems, you can of course take everything and build your own variant of tclkit with itcl back in as static library. It's all open source, so there really are no new limitations at all. I'm aware of the fact that this marks a full reversal of my own position. I'm not doing this lightly, but feel nevertheless that a little pain and some regrets now are better than carrying on as is. I have to admit that I do not use itcl myself. I'm getting very good mileage out of pure-tcl solutions, and tend to stay away from OO-ness at lower levels. But that's evidently a personal choice and preference. I'm sure itcl can work great for others... this is not about removing that option, only a way to tone down in what tclkit carries around as default. If you think there are important drawbacks or problems with this change, or that I'm overlooking something important, please let me know! -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 23 05:13:33 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NBDXc11845 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 05:13:33 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0NBFCj5025627 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 06:15:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0NBFBE20757; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 06:15:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 06:15:11 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030123061511.AAB20735@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl In-Reply-To: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:05:25 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Given that the TCT has voted to make itcl part of the Tcl source code distribution, and that, in my opinion, it is only a matter of time until itcl is in the source distribution, at that point will itcl show back up in tclkit, or will tclkit no longer reflect the Tcl distribution functionality? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Thu Jan 23 08:25:00 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net [216.34.191.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NEP0c24732 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 08:25:00 -0600 Received: from int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-2 [3.159.232.66]) by ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h0NEQd4o022736 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:26:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h0NEQXrS000138 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:26:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:23:19 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] itcl Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:23:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I think the "Why IncrTcl" paragraph of Steve Lander's "Beyond TclKit" paper in section 5 provides a very valid reason to leave IncrTcl in and is provided below: Having read this, one might legitimately ask "why IncrTcl and why not one of the other object oriented extensions?" . The first part is easy enough to answer - an object oriented extension can make Tcl code much simpler and more maintainable. This is particularly true of event driven GUI code, where it avoids the need to carry around a lot of context, or pollution of the global namespace. Any object oriented extension for Tcl would have done but IncrTcl is well established, relatively stable and adds only around 50Kb to the size of TclKit. The entire document can be found here: http://www.digital-smarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf -- Personally, I use Tclkit to create completely self contained fairly large applications that are deployed on many independant machines. Having IncrTcl automatically available to me is a major convience. Yes, I could build IncrTcl for each machine and include in every Starpack I deploy or deploy an IncrTcl library on every machine and load it in every application, but those are extra steps that create hassle. One of Tclkits greatest points is convience, I think removing IncrTcl dimenishes its value. Furthermore, those not using IncrTcl that really, really want to save the ~50k could build themselves a custom IncrTcl-free Tclkit. That's my 2 cents. -- Bryan Schofield -----Original Message----- From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 6:05 AM To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] itcl Hello, Tclkit has included Incrtcl as statically-linked extension for quite some time, as you probably know. A few times there have been questions about why itcl, or why not also itk. I've defended the current setup by saying that being able to rely on itcl always being present means that (in the tclkit context) one could count on having an OO system within reach on all platforms. I would like to revoke that decision and drop itcl from the tclkit build. - itcl is one OO extension, I'm not sure it is *the* OO extension everyone uses - itcl is in, itk is not (less essential, also not available on MacOS X with Aqua) - in fact not even itcl is in MacOS classic right now - there are pure-Tcl OO alternatives (albeit slower), even itcl has an alternative (Matt Newman's Tcl++, see http://www.sensus.org/tcl/) But perhaps the most important reasons are that itcl is not needed by tclkit itself (and is the only extension in there that does not have to be), and that now that we have starpacks and an emerging set of conventions for multi-platform starkits the deployment of itcl for multi-platform scenario's has become so much simpler. As someone pointed out to me recently: *if* itcl is a candidate for removal, then let's get it over with and reduce the pain before even more widespread use of tclkit makes it harder still. Having said that, I don't want to make such a drastic change without consulting people on this list. Also, I would like to offer a good way out if you have already based your work on itcl, so here's the proposal: - drop itcl from the tclkit static builds on all platforms - adjust genkit, so it *continues* to build itcl as shared lib - built both binaries for all platforms in the next release round - create a starkit with all itcl binaries This last starkit will contain all platform-specific shared libraries, as well as the incrtcl runtime scripts. This can then be used in a number of ways: - deploy alongside your apps and source it to make itcl available again - you could unwrap it and throw out the platforms you don't want - unwrap and copy the package/binaries into your own starkits In the case of starpack, you can copy the appropriate files and wrap them along with the rest, to end up with an application which again runs out of the box. The only difference is that itcl will be loaded dynamically (and hence uses a temp copy to work from). Lastly, as people have been discovering more and more it seems, you can of course take everything and build your own variant of tclkit with itcl back in as static library. It's all open source, so there really are no new limitations at all. I'm aware of the fact that this marks a full reversal of my own position. I'm not doing this lightly, but feel nevertheless that a little pain and some regrets now are better than carrying on as is. I have to admit that I do not use itcl myself. I'm getting very good mileage out of pure-tcl solutions, and tend to stay away from OO-ness at lower levels. But that's evidently a personal choice and preference. I'm sure itcl can work great for others... this is not about removing that option, only a way to tone down in what tclkit carries around as default. If you think there are important drawbacks or problems with this change, or that I'm overlooking something important, please let me know! -jcw _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From dgporter@erols.com Thu Jan 23 08:36:38 2003 Received: from smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.61]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NEabc25538 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 08:36:37 -0600 Received: from 66-44-8-182.s2214.apx1.lnh.md.dialup.rcn.com ([66.44.8.182] helo=there) by smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net with smtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18biUr-0005ds-00; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:38:26 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Don Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com To: "Larry W. Virden" , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:31:05 -0500 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] References: <20030123061511.AAB20735@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20030123061511.AAB20735@cas.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 23 January 2003 06:15, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Given that the TCT has voted to make itcl part of the Tcl source code > distribution, and that, in my opinion, it is only a matter of time > until itcl is in the source distribution, at that point will itcl > show back up in tclkit, or will tclkit no longer reflect the Tcl > distribution functionality? Keep in mind, Larry, that TIP 50 is about bundling the itcl package with Tcl, not about merging the sources. Does the current tclkit automatically include the tcltest package? I doubt it. Even though tcltest is bundled with Tcl. By the same reasoning, there no reason a tclkit would have to include the itcl package, even if it comes bundled with Tcl. I'm a fan of modularity, so taking out unnecessary components is something I tend to like, but I don't think I have enough tclkit/Starkit experience to cast a meaningful "vote" on the subject. -- | Don Porter dgporter@erols.com | | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" | | -- Adam West as BATMAN | |______________________________________________________________________| From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 23 09:24:39 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NFOdc29376 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:24:39 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0NFQJj5014275 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 10:26:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0NFQJW24177; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 10:26:19 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 10:26:19 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030123102619.AAB24072@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl In-Reply-To: of Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:31:05 -0500 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: tcltest not in tclkit Tcltest is not something that the average developer worries about or tries to use. On the other hand, it doesn't appear that tclkit includes all the development pieces of the current tcl distribution, so I guess it is a moot point anyways. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Thu Jan 23 11:29:44 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NHThc07017 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:29:43 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h0NHVUYH026380 (8.12.5/2.00); Thu, 23 Jan 2003 18:31:30 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E304500.4050404@hccnet.nl> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:39:44 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" CC: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) wrote: > I think the "Why IncrTcl" paragraph of Steve Lander's "Beyond TclKit" paper in section 5 provides a very valid reason to leave IncrTcl in and is provided below: > > Having read this, one might legitimately ask "why IncrTcl and why not one of the other object oriented extensions?" Choosing between OO-extensions is not the same as deciding whether or not to include an OO-extension. I fail to see how Steve Lander's remark relates to the latter problem. > ... > Personally, I use Tclkit to create completely self contained fairly large applications that are deployed on many independant machines. Having IncrTcl automatically available to me > is a major convience. Yes, I could build IncrTcl for each machine and include in every Starpack I deploy or deploy an IncrTcl library on every machine and load it in every > application, but those are extra steps that create hassle. One of Tclkits greatest points is convience, I think removing IncrTcl dimenishes its value. > ... Whatever great the pain in this case, or in all cases where iTcl is being used, the arguments appear to be circumstantial. Furthermore, those that do want iTcl could use themselves one of the accomodations suggested by Jean-Claude. Erik Leunissen ============== From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Thu Jan 23 11:32:14 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NHWDc07251 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:32:14 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id h0NHY1YH027010 (8.12.5/2.00); Thu, 23 Jan 2003 18:34:02 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E304597.40902@hccnet.nl> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:42:15 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl References: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm downright in favor of leaving iTcl out. There is enough reason in: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: "... itcl is not needed by tclkit itself. ...". People who need iTcl can use the accomodations proposed by Jean-Claude. MHO, Erik Leunissen ============== From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Thu Jan 23 11:40:54 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net [216.34.191.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NHesc07846 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:40:54 -0600 Received: from int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-2 [3.159.232.66]) by ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h0NHgW4o000679 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:42:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h0NHgQmD021325 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:42:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:39:12 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] itcl Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:39:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: One last thought ... If it is decided that IncrTcl is to be removed from Tclkit, is possible to that an IncrTcl capable distribution be made available? Since genkit can produce a Tclkit and a Tclkitsh, is it unreasonable for it to be able to produce a ITclkit and ITclkitsh as well? Where ITclkit and ITclkitsh are the equivalent of the current, statically linked tclkit(sh). - Bryan From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Thu Jan 23 11:41:33 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NHfWc07926 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:41:32 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id h0NHhKYH029051 (8.12.5/2.00); Thu, 23 Jan 2003 18:43:20 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E3047C6.3020808@hccnet.nl> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:51:34 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl References: <20030123061511.AAB20735@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Don Porter wrote: > > I'm a fan of modularity, so taking out unnecessary components is > something I tend to like, but I don't think I have enough > tclkit/Starkit experience to cast a meaningful "vote" on the subject. > The modularity argument is a good one. Do we need more reason? I think you may be at the right distance from experienced starkit-users to provide in a natural way the argument that cuts ice. Erik Leunissen ============== From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 23 11:42:38 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NHgcc08021 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:42:38 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0NHiJYc014424 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:44:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0NHiIY26672; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:44:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:44:18 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030123124418.AAB26639@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl In-Reply-To: of Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:31:05 -0500 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Don Porter > Does the current tclkit automatically include the tcltest package? $ cat tst.kit #! tclkit catch {package require ""} puts [package names] $ tclkit tst.kit http pwb rechan zipvfs tcltest opt mk4vfs vfslib msgcat scripdoc zlib starkit Tcl Itcl Mk4tcl vfs Tk So yes, it looks like tclkit does come with tcltest. Does tclkit on Windows come with the dde package? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From dgporter@erols.com Thu Jan 23 12:13:30 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NIDUc10764 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:13:30 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVap1g/z42AzIi1OQpSVwtvHZ34dBAr6gR/YFIAlr6RHtkSPtxt4MqARcUqXnRn5Oyk= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18blsk-0005jg-00; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 13:15:18 -0500 Message-ID: <3E303131.3090609@erols.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 13:15:13 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl References: <20030123124418.AAB26639@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>Does the current tclkit automatically include the tcltest package? > So yes, it looks like tclkit does come with tcltest. All I can say is I'm surprised. Looks like there's an opportunity to purge more unnecessary stuff from the core tclkit build then. (I can't imagine that tclkit actually depends on tcltest?!) -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Jan 23 12:20:08 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NIK8c11408 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:20:08 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0NILgg4002639; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 10:21:42 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0NILg708328; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 10:21:42 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: , "Larry W. Virden" Cc: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] itcl Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 10:21:42 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <3E303131.3090609@erols.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Donald G Porter > Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 10:15 AM > To: Larry W. Virden > Cc: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl > > > > >>Does the current tclkit automatically include the tcltest package? > > > So yes, it looks like tclkit does come with tcltest. > > All I can say is I'm surprised. Looks like there's an opportunity to > purge more unnecessary stuff from the core tclkit build then. > > (I can't imagine that tclkit actually depends on tcltest?!) no. The list of packages looks like as if all packages found tcl8.4/library (http, tcltest,msgcat) are also in the tclkit. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jan 23 14:13:30 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NKDUc21584 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 14:13:30 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0NKFDg4013402 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:15:13 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0NKFD725028 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:15:13 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] itcl Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:15:10 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JCW wrote: > But perhaps the most important reasons are that itcl is not needed by > tclkit itself (and is the only extension in there that does not have to I think I started this argument in part by mentioning that we didn't plan to include it in the base kits that we ship with the Tcl Dev Kit. In point of fact, 2.5 beta 1 does ship with itcl in the base kits, but that was because it was easier to leave it in the build system. We do still plan to remove it for 2.5 final. The primary reason for this is that base kits in the TDK are just that - base kits. There aren't meant to be used by themselves, they are meant to provide the base for users building their own apps. If a user requires itcl, then they would include it in the list of TclApp packages to provide (this is all easy point and click). The separation of packages, especially binary ones, is really valuable in its flexibility. That said, TDK base kits are not tclkits. DGP wrote: > Does the current tclkit automatically include the tcltest package? Yes it does, because that is part of the tcl core, which tclkit requires. LV wrote: > at that point will itcl show back up > in tclkit, or will tclkit no longer reflect the Tcl distribution > functionality? The letter of TIP 50 provided that itcl would be a package one always received when you downloaded the "Tcl sources". It's not clear, but the spirit of TIP 50 may not require that it actually be part of the build. I look at TIP 50 more of a start along the lines of having the "Tcl source base" be more BI-like. I can imagine Thread being the next in line for inclusion. > Lastly, as people have been discovering more and more it seems, you can > of course take everything and build your own variant of tclkit with > itcl back in as static library. It's all open source, so there really > are no new limitations at all. I would at least leave this option someone in the build system. Perhaps even in such a way that --with-module=itcl is all that is needed, so other such modules could be added over time to make it easier for those building their own specialized base kits. Jeff From tom.wilkason@cox.net Thu Jan 23 19:22:02 2003 Received: from lakemtao02.cox.net (lakemtao02.cox.net [68.1.17.243]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0O1M1c18252 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 19:22:02 -0600 Received: from bertha ([68.99.175.107]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with SMTP id <20030124012343.UHWD6744.lakemtao02.cox.net@bertha> for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:23:43 -0500 Message-ID: <001001c2c347$640f64e0$657ba8c0@bertha> From: "Tom Wilkason" To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:24:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2C31D.7B1F6C40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2C31D.7B1F6C40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable As a long-time Itcl user and a new convert to StarKits, I would much = prefer to see Itcl stay with, rather than be bundled or built = separately. Itcl isn't the only OO framework around, but it appears to = be, by far, the most commonly used (I boldly say this with no statistics = to back me up :>).. I believe its inclusion promotes better software = design. Offering a number of different OO frameworks, IMHO, will just = confuse new converts to Tcl/Tk OO. Moreover, Its overhead is quite low = and doesn't preclude other OO frameworks. That being said, adding back Itcl as a Starkit wouldn't cause much grief = to me, so long as there were starkits for the various platforms = available. However, I do believe it is a step backwards in the greater = scheme. My two-cents, Tom Wilkason ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2C31D.7B1F6C40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
As a long-time Itcl user and a new convert to = StarKits, I=20 would much prefer to see Itcl stay with, rather than be bundled or built = separately. Itcl isn't the only OO framework around, but it appears to = be, by=20 far, the most commonly used (I boldly say this with no statistics to = back me up=20 :>).. I believe its inclusion promotes better software design. = Offering a=20 number of different OO frameworks, IMHO, will just confuse new converts = to=20 Tcl/Tk OO. Moreover, Its overhead is quite low and doesn't preclude = other OO=20 frameworks.
 
That being said, adding back Itcl as a Starkit = wouldn't cause=20 much grief to me, so long as there were starkits for the various = platforms=20 available. However, I do believe it is a step backwards in the greater=20 scheme.
 
My two-cents,
Tom Wilkason
------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2C31D.7B1F6C40-- From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Thu Jan 23 23:01:53 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0O51rc31151; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 23:01:53 -0600 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h0O53e12058165; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 23:03:40 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 23:03:40 -0600 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl In-Reply-To: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) Organization: The University of Chicago Library X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: JCW> I would like to revoke that decision and drop itcl from the tclkit JCW> build. Since my primary platform is freebsd, I would be unable to use itcl if it weren't built into tclkit (due to the current inability of the freebsd build of tclkit to load binary extensions). I do use itcl in my starkits. But assuming that we eventually solve this freebsd problem, I would have no objection to itcl's removal if it makes tclkit maintenance easier or more rational. -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! Song of the Moment: Gaskrankinstation (Headless Chickens) From mel@redolive.com Fri Jan 24 10:25:21 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0OGPKc11603 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 10:25:21 -0600 Received: (qmail 13455 invoked by uid 511); 24 Jan 2003 17:25:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 17:25:28 -0000 Message-ID: <002c01c2c3c6$31c30300$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:32:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0029_01C2C39C.48BF3440" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] watered down version of tclhttpd ? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C2C39C.48BF3440 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i have invested a lot in cgi.tcl from Don Libe's and can not go back. = there are tons of web sites that depend on them ! i started using TclHttpd the past 2 days with lots of success. however, = i am not using any special features of tclhttpd like templating etc. QUESTION: is there a watered down version of tclhttpd with no bells & = whisles, just to get me by with my cgi.tcl out there? i use JavaScript = and TclPlugin also i am also packing my sites using Starkit. Many thanks in advance, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C2C39C.48BF3440 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i have invested a lot in cgi.tcl from = Don Libe's=20 and can not go back. there are tons of web sites that depend on them=20 !
 
i started using TclHttpd the past 2 = days with lots=20 of success. however, i am not using any special features of tclhttpd = like=20 templating etc.
 
QUESTION: is there a watered down = version of=20 tclhttpd with no bells & whisles, just to get me by with my cgi.tcl = out=20 there? i use JavaScript and TclPlugin also
 
i am also packing my sites using=20 Starkit.
 
Many thanks in advance,
Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C2C39C.48BF3440-- From mel@redolive.com Fri Jan 24 10:28:10 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0OGSAc12031 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 10:28:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 13465 invoked by uid 511); 24 Jan 2003 17:28:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 17:28:18 -0000 Message-ID: <003f01c2c3c6$97302150$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:35:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2C39C.AE53FED0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] creating executable of my starkit... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2C39C.AE53FED0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i use tclkitsh "wrap xxx.vfs" and i get 2 files on windows: xxx & xxx.bat PROBLEM: when i use these 2 files, i get the error: "Bad Command", if i = also include tclkitsh to these 2 files, i have no problems! QUESTION: how can i create a single executable file for my target = windows OS? Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2C39C.AE53FED0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i use tclkitsh "wrap xxx.vfs" and i get = 2 files on=20 windows:
xxx & xxx.bat
 
PROBLEM: when i use these 2 files, i = get the error:=20 "Bad Command", if i also include tclkitsh to these 2 files, i have no=20 problems!
 
QUESTION: how can i create a single = executable file=20 for my target windows OS?
 
Yours,
Mel
------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2C39C.AE53FED0-- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 24 10:37:13 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0OGbCc13035 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 10:37:13 -0600 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 17:39:00 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] creating executable of my starkit... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <003f01c2c3c6$97302150$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Message-Id: <5701CDFE-2FBA-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h0OGbCc13035 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > i use tclkitsh "wrap xxx.vfs" and i get 2 files on windows: I assume that's "tclkitsh sdx wrap xxx.vfs". > xxx & xxx.bat >   > PROBLEM: when i use these 2 files, i get the error: "Bad Command", if > i also include tclkitsh to these 2 files, i have no problems! >   > QUESTION: how can i create a single executable file for my target > windows OS? Have a look at the wrap options: tclkitsh sdx help wrap The one you need is "-interp", try this: tclkitsh sdx wrap xxx.vfs -interp tclkit Explanation: sdx wraps into a starkit which uses the same runtime as the one sdx was called with, tclkitsh in this case. The above switches it to tclkit. -jcw From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Fri Jan 24 12:33:35 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0OIXZc23607; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:33:35 -0600 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h0OIZK12030675; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:35:21 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:35:20 -0600 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: steve@digital-smarties.com Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl In-Reply-To: <1043392732.3e30e8dcab7f0@gw.digitalsmarties.com> References: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <1043392732.3e30e8dcab7f0@gw.digitalsmarties.com> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "steve" == steve writes: steve> Leaving aside the question of whether itcl should be removed from Tclkit for a steve> moment, I would assume the freebsd loading issue will be addressed before it steve> happens. steve> I've now got the FreeBSD 5.0 disks and I hope to be looking at the problem steve> before the next round of Tclkit builds. That's great! I appreciate it. /k -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! Song of the Moment: Gaskrankinstation (Headless Chickens) From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 24 12:38:46 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0OIcjc24060 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:38:45 -0600 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 19:40:31 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <51025180-2FCB-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: >>>>>> "steve" == steve writes: > > steve> [...] I would assume the freebsd loading issue will be > addressed before it > steve> happens. > > steve> I've now got the FreeBSD 5.0 disks and I hope to be looking at > the problem > steve> before the next round of Tclkit builds. > > That's great! I appreciate it. The problem is caused by the static build of tclkit, causing it to be unable to dynload anything else for some reason. So this is definitely solvable... -jcw From mel@redolive.com Fri Jan 24 21:49:22 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0P3nMc27889 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 21:49:22 -0600 Received: (qmail 15049 invoked by uid 511); 25 Jan 2003 04:49:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 04:49:29 -0000 Message-ID: <001801c2c425$c04533f0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 22:56:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C2C3FB.D745D200" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] newbeeeeeeeeeeee Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C2C3FB.D745D200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i place a bunch of my packages in tclhttpd.vfs/lib directory, but my = package require does not seem to work !!! i checked the content of my pkgIndex with other packages there and the = ones i copied from tcllib and i can not for the life of me see any = difference. my packages are pretty standard cgi1.8 (Don Lib's) and a few = more packages.=20 should i let Starkit know about them somewhere ? or should i not place = them in xxx.vfs/lib directory? many thanks, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C2C3FB.D745D200 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i place a bunch of my packages in = tclhttpd.vfs/lib=20 directory, but my package require does not seem to work !!!
i checked the content of my pkgIndex = with other=20 packages there and the ones i copied from tcllib and i can not for the = life of=20 me see any difference. my packages are pretty standard cgi1.8 (Don = Lib's) and a=20 few more packages.
 
should i let Starkit know about them = somewhere ? or=20 should i not place them in xxx.vfs/lib directory?
 
many thanks,
Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C2C3FB.D745D200-- From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 25 06:36:54 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PCarc08210 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 06:36:54 -0600 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:38:44 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] newbeeeeeeeeeeee Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <001801c2c425$c04533f0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h0PCarc08210 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > i place a bunch of my packages in tclhttpd.vfs/lib directory, but my > package require does not seem to work !!! > i checked the content of my pkgIndex with other packages there and the > ones i copied from tcllib and i can not for the life of me see any > difference. my packages are pretty standard cgi1.8 (Don Lib's) and a > few more packages. >   > should i let Starkit know about them somewhere ? or should i not place > them in xxx.vfs/lib directory? Look at man pages for the $auto_path setting. Perhaps something like: lappend auto_path [file normalize tclhttpd.vfs/lib] -jcw From rohan@rohanpall.com Sat Jan 25 09:05:36 2003 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (postfix@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PF5ac13274 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 09:05:36 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1953A8FE8B for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 07:07:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from 24.114.111.163 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 10:07:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2948.24.114.111.163.1043507246.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 10:07:26 -0500 (EST) From: "Rohan Pall" To: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] a solid foundation Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have been planning on releasing my software 'mindweb' as a .kit file only. I am making a website for it. I want to make money by selling it. I also have ideas for other softwares. My payware is being based on tclkit. It will be able to run on multiple platforms by using tclkit as a base. It currently contains no binary extensions. Itcl might be removed from starkits. I am now reconsidering how stable a foundation tclkit might be. Ro From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sat Jan 25 10:59:24 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PGxOc15118 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 10:59:24 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP for id h0PH1CYH022642 (8.12.5/2.00); Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:01:13 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E32E0E9.9000600@hccnet.nl> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 20:09:29 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: L.S. When creating an image (from a .png file) using tkImg, tclkit crashes. Please note that I do not know whether this is specific to using the png image file format or tkImg (using any image file format that it supports) in combination with tclkit. The same sequence of commands does its job nicely when using a regular wish or tclsh instead of tclkit. Can this be behaviour be reproduced? If so, is there any idea how to prevent/circumvent this? Greetings, Erik Leunissen ============== Reproducible script + machine particulars ========================================= > tclkit % parray tcl_platform tcl_platform(byteOrder) = littleEndian tcl_platform(machine) = i686 tcl_platform(os) = Linux tcl_platform(osVersion) = 2.4.10-4GB tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = erik tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 % set tcl_patchLevel 8.4.1 % lappend auto_path /usr/local/lib /usr/local/lib % package require Img 1.2.4 % image create photo test -file some.png -- crash occurs here -- From jahbini@lava.net Sat Jan 25 11:54:15 2003 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{Wlu6p8wynuKVhkV+tIPLwqQjMRGid6Nn}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PHsEc15923 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 11:54:15 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com [64.65.110.34]) by malasada.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98A4017A04A for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 07:56:02 -1000 (HST) Message-ID: <3E32CFB2.7BDA20F1@lava.net> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 07:56:02 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.18-6mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl References: <9344381E-2EC2-11D7-B5D6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There is a critical mass of folks (like myself) that do use itcl with tclkit. Moving itcl out of the core simply shifts the development and maintenece burdon from the few core developers to the many tclkit users. I'd like to think I'm as competent to support this shift in the firmament as JCW, but that's just my hubris speaking. Most likely I'd have major pains implementing the guidelines that have been suggested. Of course, the core developers would have more questions in this forum each time one of us finds a new creative way to screw up the build of itcl. My feeling is that moving itcl out of tclkit will make harder work for everyone and more of it too. (Shoes for industry?!?) Jim Hinds keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: > > JCW> I would like to revoke that decision and drop itcl from the tclkit > JCW> build. > > Since my primary platform is freebsd, I would be unable to use itcl if > it weren't built into tclkit (due to the current inability of the > freebsd build of tclkit to load binary extensions). I do use itcl in > my starkits. But assuming that we eventually solve this freebsd > problem, I would have no objection to itcl's removal if it makes > tclkit maintenance easier or more rational. > > -- > Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! > http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ > Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! > Song of the Moment: Gaskrankinstation (Headless Chickens) > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From matt@sensus.org Sat Jan 25 15:17:18 2003 Received: from ficus.frogspace.net ([64.6.237.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PLHIc19662 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:17:18 -0600 Received: from ool-435070ee.dyn.optonline.net ([67.80.112.238] helo=sensus.org) by ficus.frogspace.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #5) id 18cXhd-0005xH-00; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:19:02 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:21:31 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Jim Hinds From: Matt Newman In-Reply-To: <3E32CFB2.7BDA20F1@lava.net> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am entering late and missed most of the thread, but this is a somewhat tried argument that has been doing the rounds in various flavors for approx. 8 years. [incr Tcl] is not the best thing since sliced bread... we all know that, but.... It is *very* widely used, especially in highly mission critical deployments, and its continued absence from standard Tcl distributions has IMNSHO hurt Tcl greatly. Until such time as a far superior *and* widely used alternative becomes established why don't we just quite the debate and include it. It is easy to compile, since it does not have any system dependencies, save Tcl, and if the default makefiles that come with it are unpalatable then lets just rewrite them. I know that Jeff Hobbs has been rather "cool" on [incr Tcl], but his reasons are personal, and not technical, even if he does not realize that yet. Matt On Saturday, January 25, 2003, at 12:56 PM, Jim Hinds wrote: > There is a critical mass of folks (like myself) that do use itcl with > tclkit. > Moving itcl out of the core simply shifts the development and > maintenece burdon > from the few core developers to the many tclkit users. > > I'd like to think I'm as competent to support this shift in the > firmament as JCW, > but that's just my hubris speaking. Most likely I'd have major pains > implementing the guidelines that have been suggested. Of course, the > core > developers would have more questions in this forum each time one of us > finds a > new creative way to screw up the build of itcl. > > My feeling is that moving itcl out of tclkit will make harder work for > everyone > and more of it too. (Shoes for industry?!?) > > Jim Hinds > > keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > >>>>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: >> >> JCW> I would like to revoke that decision and drop itcl from the >> tclkit >> JCW> build. >> >> Since my primary platform is freebsd, I would be unable to use itcl if >> it weren't built into tclkit (due to the current inability of the >> freebsd build of tclkit to load binary extensions). I do use itcl in >> my starkits. But assuming that we eventually solve this freebsd >> problem, I would have no objection to itcl's removal if it makes >> tclkit maintenance easier or more rational. >> >> -- >> Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, >> Tarantula Town! >> http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ >> Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! >> Song of the Moment: Gaskrankinstation (Headless Chickens) >> _______________________________________________ >> starkit mailing list >> starkit@equi4.com >> http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Jan 25 15:51:09 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PLp8c20467 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:51:08 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0PLqrwq005185; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:52:53 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0PMqjB16622; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:52:45 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Matt Newman" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] itcl Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:52:48 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I know that Jeff Hobbs has been rather "cool" on [incr Tcl], but his > reasons are personal, and not technical, even if he does not realize > that yet. That's a rather backwards jab Matt. For all that you think I am "cool" on [incr Tcl], I have ensured that it is included in whatever ActiveState has done with Tcl. If you look back you'll see that I also maintained public patches so I could use itcl at various time's in its past. That said, it is correct that I do not rely on it anymore. For my purposes the pure OO Tcl variants have sufficed (don't need speed). It's also true that JohnO's resistance towards it rubbed off on me a bit while I worked for him. The less-than-tactful support by some of [incr Tcl]'s proponents (hint hint) have also not helped it over time. > It is *very* widely used, especially in highly mission critical > deployments, and its continued absence from standard Tcl distributions > has IMNSHO hurt Tcl greatly. While some will agree, there are those that have argued itcl's prominence as Tcl's OO also hurt Tcl greatly. I don't buy that, otherwise I would not include [incr Tcl] in our stuff, but there are 2 sides to each coin. Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Jan 25 16:15:38 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PMFbc21112 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:15:37 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0PMHMwq007244; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:17:22 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0PNHEB18693; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:17:14 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Erik Leunissen" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:17:19 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <3E32E0E9.9000600@hccnet.nl> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > When creating an image (from a .png file) using tkImg, tclkit crashes. > > Please note that I do not know whether this is specific to using the png > image file format or tkImg (using any image file format that it > supports) in combination with tclkit. > > tclkit > % lappend auto_path /usr/local/lib > /usr/local/lib > % package require Img > 1.2.4 > % image create photo test -file some.png I was able to run the entire Img demo (with various formats embedded as base64 in the demo file) without error: % lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 6 > ./base-tk-linux-ix86 % lappend auto_path /usr/local/TDK25/lib /usr/local/TDK25/bin/base-tk-linux-ix86/lib/tcl8.4 /usr/local/TDK25/bin/base-tk-linux-ix86/lib /usr/local/TDK25/lib % source ../demos/Img/demo.tcl % exit lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 7 > Note that it may be related to the -file part, which I don't use, but I suspect that you Img 1.2.4 isn't compatible with Tk 8.4. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sat Jan 25 16:54:15 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PMsEc22050 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:54:14 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h0PMtrYH020639 (8.12.5/2.00); Sat, 25 Jan 2003 23:55:53 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:04:09 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: > ... > I was able to run the entire Img demo (with various formats embedded > as base64 in the demo file) without error: > > % lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 6 > ./base-tk-linux-ix86 > % lappend auto_path /usr/local/TDK25/lib > /usr/local/TDK25/bin/base-tk-linux-ix86/lib/tcl8.4 > /usr/local/TDK25/bin/base-tk-linux-ix86/lib /usr/local/TDK25/lib > % source ../demos/Img/demo.tcl > % exit > lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 7 > > > Note that it may be related to the -file part, which I don't use, but > I suspect that you Img 1.2.4 isn't compatible with Tk 8.4. > Then how come that the Img demo runs without errors if I source it from a *regular wish* ? The problem (segmentation fault) occurs when I source demo.tcl into *tclkit* (having the characteristics that I provided in my previous post). Do we by any chance use a different version of tclkit? Mine is tclkit8.4.1-38 (date 5-11-2002). Erik Leunissen ============== From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Jan 25 16:58:55 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PMwsc22179 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:58:55 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0PN0dwq010673; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:00:39 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0Q00WB21778; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:00:32 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Erik Leunissen" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:00:37 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > I was able to run the entire Img demo (with various formats embedded > > as base64 in the demo file) without error: > > > > % lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 6 > ./base-tk-linux-ix86 ... > Then how come that the Img demo runs without errors if I source it from > a *regular wish* ? That would indicate that the Img you have works just fine - assuming that "regular wish" is a regular 8.4 wish. > The problem (segmentation fault) occurs when I source demo.tcl into > *tclkit* (having the characteristics that I provided in my previous post). > > Do we by any chance use a different version of tclkit? Mine is > tclkit8.4.1-38 (date 5-11-2002). The command line above isn't too descriptive, but it is the base kit provided in the Tcl Dev Kit 2.5 beta, compiled this month. You're tclkit is quite old, so you might try a newer version. Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Jan 25 17:01:36 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PN1ac22289 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:01:36 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0PN3Lwq011054 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:03:21 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0Q03EB22179 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:03:14 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:03:18 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Do we by any chance use a different version of tclkit? Mine is > > tclkit8.4.1-38 (date 5-11-2002). > > The command line above isn't too descriptive, but it is the base kit > provided in the Tcl Dev Kit 2.5 beta, compiled this month. You're > tclkit is quite old, so you might try a newer version. Er .. then again, perhaps that is Nov 5, not May 11 as I first guessed. In any case, also note that I am using Img 1.3 in my test which worked, not 1.2.4. Also note that the core has changed in a few key bugs even in the last 2 months. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 25 17:04:33 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PN4Xc22375 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:04:33 -0600 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:06:21 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> Message-Id: <9E68C16E-30B9-11D7-8921-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Erik Leunissen wrote: [...] > Do we by any chance use a different version of tclkit? Mine is > tclkit8.4.1-38 (date 5-11-2002). The way to check versions of tclkit is: puts $vfs::tclkit_version The "official" November release in pub/tk/ should print "200211.001". Hard to tell what the problem is in this case, btw. You could try the builds in pub/tk/newer/ which are the latest (work-in-progress), just to compare with. -jcw From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sat Jan 25 17:24:47 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PNOkc22824 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:24:46 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h0PNQWYH024160 (8.12.5/2.00); Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:26:32 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E333B38.7070300@hccnet.nl> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:34:48 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: > >>Then how come that the Img demo runs without errors if I source it from >>a *regular wish* ? >> > > That would indicate that the Img you have works just fine - assuming > that "regular wish" is a regular 8.4 wish. > This is the case (8.4.1). > > The command line above isn't too descriptive, but it is the base kit > provided in the Tcl Dev Kit 2.5 beta, compiled this month. You're > tclkit is quite old, so you might try a newer version. > I just downloaded the single only newer version that I could find, being http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/linux-i686.gz I'm baffled: the segfault occurs with this release also. It just doesn't make sense to me that this can happen while everything goes fine with the regular wish. Erik Leunissen ============== > . > > From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sat Jan 25 17:29:39 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PNTcc22959 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:29:38 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h0PNVOYH024730 (8.12.5/2.00); Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:31:24 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E333C5D.7000703@hccnet.nl> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:39:41 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: >> > > Er .. then again, perhaps that is Nov 5, not May 11 as I first guessed. > In any case, also note that I am using Img 1.3 in my test which worked, > not 1.2.4. Aha! I hope this is the reason. Tomorrow I will try Img1.3 Thanks, Erik Leunissen ============== Also note that the core has changed in a few key bugs even > in the last 2 months. > > Jeff > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > . > > From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sat Jan 25 18:09:31 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0Q09Vc23826 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:09:31 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h0Q0BGYH028178 (8.12.5/2.00); Sun, 26 Jan 2003 01:11:17 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E3345B5.5080707@hccnet.nl> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:19:33 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: > > Er .. then again, perhaps that is Nov 5, not May 11 as I first guessed. > In any case, also note that I am using Img 1.3 in my test which worked, > not 1.2.4. Also note that the core has changed in a few key bugs even > in the last 2 months. > Case resolved ! Conclusion of this (nightly) exercise: - wish8.4.1 runs with Img1.2.4 and probably Img1.3 - tclkit 200211.001 ( Nov 5 ;-) ), which is also based on Tk8.4.1, does run with Img1.3 but not with Img1.2.4 (segfault) I am contented with getting tkImg on its feet in combination with tclkit. However, I still do not understand why tclkit is not happy with Img1.2.4 but that won't keep me from a good night's sleep. Erik Leunissen ============== From akupries@shaw.ca Sat Jan 25 19:32:03 2003 Received: from pd5mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0Q1W3c25514 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 19:32:03 -0600 Received: from pd6mr2so.prod.shaw.ca (pd6mr2so-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.217]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H9A0033XSCH0I@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:33:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml5so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml5so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.149]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H9A00IKNSCHQX@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:33:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from bluepeak (h24-76-111-211.vc.shawcable.net [24.76.111.211]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0H9A00BH9SCGDS@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:33:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18cbWr-0000G6-00; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:24:09 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:24:09 -0800 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes In-reply-to: Message from Erik Leunissen "of Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:04:09 +0100." <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> To: Erik Leunissen Cc: Jeff Hobbs , starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jeff Hobbs wrote: > > > ... > > I was able to run the entire Img demo (with various formats embedded > > as base64 in the demo file) without error: > > > > % lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 6 > ./base-tk-linux-ix86 > > % lappend auto_path /usr/local/TDK25/lib > > /usr/local/TDK25/bin/base-tk-linux-ix86/lib/tcl8.4 > > /usr/local/TDK25/bin/base-tk-linux-ix86/lib /usr/local/TDK25/lib > > % source ../demos/Img/demo.tcl > > % exit > > lorax [/usr/local/TDK25/bin] 7 > > > > > Note that it may be related to the -file part, which I don't use, but > > I suspect that you Img 1.2.4 isn't compatible with Tk 8.4. > > Before you all get to far off track, Erik please try the Img __1.3__ we have in the CVS. It was refactored and got stub support and should work much cleanlier. I remember that JC and SteveL did some tests with it after I was through with it. 1.2.4 and 8.4 are not a good mix. -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From matt@sensus.org Sat Jan 25 21:45:32 2003 Received: from ficus.frogspace.net ([64.6.237.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0Q3jWc28470 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:45:32 -0600 Received: from ool-435070ee.dyn.optonline.net ([67.80.112.238] helo=sensus.org) by ficus.frogspace.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #5) id 18cdlA-0005B3-00; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 19:47:05 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:49:38 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Matt Newman , "Starkit list" To: "Jeff Hobbs" From: Matt Newman In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <31737758-30E1-11D7-9ACE-000393D6059C@sensus.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Saturday, January 25, 2003, at 04:52 PM, Jeff Hobbs wrote: >> I know that Jeff Hobbs has been rather "cool" on [incr Tcl], but his >> reasons are personal, and not technical, even if he does not realize >> that yet. > > That's a rather backwards jab Matt. For all that you think I am "cool" > on [incr Tcl], I have ensured that it is included in whatever > ActiveState > has done with Tcl. If you look back you'll see that I also maintained > public patches so I could use itcl at various time's in its past. You are right, that was a comment best written, pondered, then deleted as "old stuff". Sorry. >> It is *very* widely used, especially in highly mission critical >> deployments, and its continued absence from standard Tcl distributions >> has IMNSHO hurt Tcl greatly. > > While some will agree, there are those that have argued itcl's > prominence > as Tcl's OO also hurt Tcl greatly. I don't buy that, otherwise I would > not include [incr Tcl] in our stuff, but there are 2 sides to each > coin. > Noted - but surely we need to find that elusive third side? I think I will go bury my head in shame for another 3 years... and re-emerge when I have cleansed myself :-( Till then, Matt From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jan 25 23:54:28 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0Q5sRc31315 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 23:54:28 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0Q5uAYc010856 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:56:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0Q5uAE05897; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:56:10 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:56:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030126005610.AAB5873@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl In-Reply-To: <31737758-30E1-11D7-9ACE-000393D6059C@sensus.org> of Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:49:38 -0500 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Matt Newman > I think I will go bury my head in shame for another 3 years... and > re-emerge when I have cleansed myself :-( Please don't, Matt. I think that the _first_ part of your msg, at least, was important - people currently _using_ tclkit with the itcl portion. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sun Jan 26 03:14:15 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0Q9EEc03910 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:14:14 -0600 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h0Q9G3YH020244 (8.12.5/2.00); Sun, 26 Jan 2003 10:16:03 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E33C565.1010104@hccnet.nl> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 12:24:21 +0100 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Kupries CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes References: <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas Kupries wrote: > > Before you all get to far off track, Erik please try the Img __1.3__ > we have in the CVS. It was refactored and got stub support and should > work much cleanlier. I remember that JC and SteveL did some tests with > it after I was through with it. 1.2.4 and 8.4 are not a good mix. > Thanks Andreas, This confirms my experiences. In the meantime, I've got tclkit to work with Img1.3 (i.e. tkImg1.3rc which I downloaded from SourceForge). Another matter: I'd like to report a minor issue with the build sequence of tkImg1.3rc: When building Img1.3 in a standard way, without setting any options like -prefix=: ./configure make make install I end up finding the binaries in /usr/lib/Img1.3 instead of /usr/local/lib/Img1.3. A checked that the Makefile that was generated has an entry: prefix = /usr Therefore, I think something somewhere is wrong with the default -prefix or -install-prefix. Greetings, Erik Leunissen ============== From akupries@shaw.ca Sun Jan 26 04:47:07 2003 Received: from pd4mo2so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0QAl7c13827 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 04:47:07 -0600 Received: from pd2mr4so.prod.shaw.ca (pd2mr4so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.107]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H9B0080NI1LZX@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:48:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml7so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml7so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.151]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H9B00FPFI1LC1@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:48:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from bluepeak (h24-76-111-211.vc.shawcable.net [24.76.111.211]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0H9B00CIGI1KVE@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:48:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18ck7w-0004kO-00; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:35:00 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:35:00 -0800 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - tkImg combination crashes In-reply-to: Message from Erik Leunissen "of Sun, 26 Jan 2003 12:24:21 +0100." <3E33C565.1010104@hccnet.nl> To: Erik Leunissen Cc: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <3E333409.6010508@hccnet.nl> <3E33C565.1010104@hccnet.nl> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Andreas Kupries wrote: > > > > > Before you all get to far off track, Erik please try the Img __1.3__ > > we have in the CVS. It was refactored and got stub support and should > > work much cleanlier. I remember that JC and SteveL did some tests with > > it after I was through with it. 1.2.4 and 8.4 are not a good mix. > > > > > > Another matter: > I'd like to report a minor issue with the build sequence of tkImg1.3rc: > > When building Img1.3 in a standard way, without setting any options like > -prefix=: > ./configure > make > make install > > I end up finding the binaries in /usr/lib/Img1.3 instead of > /usr/local/lib/Img1.3. > > A checked that the Makefile that was generated has an entry: > prefix = /usr > > Therefore, I think something somewhere is wrong with the default -prefix > or -install-prefix. This is a known bug (see SF bug database for tkImg) I have a fix for, although not yet committed. I am currently waiting for a confirmation that the fix is working for the person which reported the problem. ... Maybe I commit tomorrow ... ooops, today, even without the confirmation. -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jcw@equi4.com Sun Jan 26 08:07:20 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0QE7Jc19034 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 08:07:19 -0600 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 15:09:09 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] what is in tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Please let me apologize for starting what I knew might be a contentious issue w.r.t. incrtcl. The discussion was a very valuable one, at least for me. With all respect, I think everyone is missing the essence of my proposal. There would have been no need to build itcl, even if it were no longer statically linked, since I was in fact proposing to supply all builds for all platforms as starkit. But it is clear that people rely on itcl. More than I had expected, in fact. And that tclkit gets used as is, no rebuilds, no re-packaging, no other binary extensions - again, more than expected. So a change to itcl could indeed introduce practical obstacles and affect the way it is used. For the sake of minimalism, I had hoped to make itcl as much a package as any other, which anyone could pick or leave out at will. The reason to bring this up now, was out of a sense of urgency - either itcl changes status now, or it will have to stay in for good. Well, for good it is. The cost is several dozen Kb of code/scripts. There's a new page on the web now, describing what is in tclkit: http://www.equi4.com/260 To put it all in perspective - the latest tclkit still runs scripted documents created years ago, and converts the previous format of Metakit datafiles on the fly if needed. Which goes to show that I'm not changing things at random for the heck of it, nor playing the (planned or unplanned) obsolescence game! Ok, to summarize: I revoke my proposal to change the status of itcl. Again with sincere apologies for having caused all this confusion in the first place. Incrtcl is, always has been, and always will be present in the standard tclkit release. Phew! -jcw From rohan@rohanpall.com Sun Jan 26 09:55:51 2003 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (postfix@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0QFtpc21314 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 09:55:51 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B0BEC8FE8D for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 07:57:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from 24.114.111.163 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 10:57:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2210.24.114.111.163.1043596662.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 10:57:42 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] what is in tclkit From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler said: > To put it all in perspective - the latest tclkit still runs scripted > documents created years ago, and converts the previous format of > Metakit datafiles on the fly if needed. Which goes to show that I'm > not changing things at random for the heck of it, nor playing the > (planned or unplanned) obsolescence game! Tclkit is a joy to use. These are the words that I was hoping for. Ro From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Mon Jan 27 07:07:21 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net [216.34.191.35]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0RD7Lc03037 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 07:07:21 -0600 Received: from int-ch1gw-4.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-4 [3.159.232.68]) by ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h0RD8SlZ024160 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:09:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from pri01dirnage.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-4.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h0RD8PCg010469 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:08:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by pri01dirnage.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:05:57 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] what is in tclkit Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:05:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I second that! Thanks JCW and the rest of the Tclkit maintainers! - Bryan -----Original Message----- From: Rohan Pall [mailto:rohan@rohanpall.com] Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2003 10:58 AM To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] what is in tclkit Jean-Claude Wippler said: > To put it all in perspective - the latest tclkit still runs scripted > documents created years ago, and converts the previous format of > Metakit datafiles on the fly if needed. Which goes to show that I'm > not changing things at random for the heck of it, nor playing the > (planned or unplanned) obsolescence game! Tclkit is a joy to use. These are the words that I was hoping for. Ro _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From mel@redolive.com Mon Jan 27 17:25:59 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0RNPwc21825 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 17:25:59 -0600 Received: (qmail 31840 invoked by uid 511); 28 Jan 2003 00:26:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 00:26:05 -0000 Message-ID: <008901c2c65c$79844e40$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:33:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0086_01C2C632.908F9AB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Successful BLT Starkit ? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0086_01C2C632.908F9AB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable has anyone successfuly created aStarkit using BLT ? may i hava sample please? Thanks,Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0086_01C2C632.908F9AB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
has anyone successfuly created aStarkit = using BLT=20 ?
may i hava sample please?
 
Thanks,Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0086_01C2C632.908F9AB0-- From mel@redolive.com Mon Jan 27 21:05:41 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0S35ec01962 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:05:41 -0600 Received: (qmail 32337 invoked by uid 511); 28 Jan 2003 04:05:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 04:05:47 -0000 Message-ID: <00da01c2c67b$2b877590$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 22:13:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00D7_01C2C651.429BE9C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] tcldemo, straight from the source !!! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00D7_01C2C651.429BE9C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I downloaded tcldemo from Equi4 site. it runs fine i did a "sdx unwrap tcldemo.kit" and i sure enough got tcldemo.vfs i did a "sdx wrap tcldemo -runtime tclkit" and i got 2 files: = tcldemo.bat and tcldemo (OK) when i run it i get the error message: "can not find tcldemo/bwdemo.tcl" and when i do "sdx wrap tcldemo.exe -runtime tclkit", i get "program too = big to fit in memory" !!!! what am i doing wrong? can someone tell me how to create a "single = executable" from my Starkit ! and also, can someone tell me how tcldemo.kit was built ( i mean the = command line!) Mooocho thanks for the greatest work YET! Mel ------=_NextPart_000_00D7_01C2C651.429BE9C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I downloaded tcldemo from Equi4 site. = it runs=20 fine
 
i did a "sdx unwrap tcldemo.kit" and i = sure enough=20 got tcldemo.vfs
 
i did a "sdx wrap tcldemo -runtime = tclkit" and i=20 got 2 files: tcldemo.bat and tcldemo (OK)
 
when i run it i get the error message: = "can not=20 find tcldemo/bwdemo.tcl"
 
and when i do "sdx wrap tcldemo.exe = -runtime=20 tclkit", i get "program too big to fit in memory" !!!!
 
what am i doing wrong? can someone tell = me how to=20 create a "single executable" from my Starkit !
 
and also, can someone tell me how = tcldemo.kit was=20 built ( i mean the command line!)
 
Mooocho thanks for the greatest work=20 YET!
 
Mel
------=_NextPart_000_00D7_01C2C651.429BE9C0-- From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Mon Jan 27 21:31:17 2003 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0S3VHc03185 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:31:17 -0600 Received: (qmail 32313 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 03:32:57 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-221.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.221) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 03:32:57 -0000 Message-ID: <005d01c2c67d$e88d9640$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <00da01c2c67b$2b877590$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tcldemo, straight from the source !!! Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:32:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 1/24/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mel" > To: > Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 9:13 PM > Subject: [Starkit] tcldemo, straight from the source !!! > > I downloaded tcldemo from Equi4 site. it runs fine > > i did a "sdx unwrap tcldemo.kit" and i sure enough got tcldemo.vfs > > i did a "sdx wrap tcldemo -runtime tclkit" and i got 2 files: tcldemo.bat and tcldemo (OK) > > when i run it i get the error message: "can not find tcldemo/bwdemo.tcl" First, if you are trying to create a *starkit* (not a starpack), you do not need to specify the -runtime argument. So, the following should successfully rewrap tcldemo.kit: sdx wrap tcldemo.kit > and when i do "sdx wrap tcldemo.exe -runtime tclkit", i get "program too big to fit in memory" !!!! > > what am i doing wrong? can someone tell me how to create a "single executable" from my Starkit ! Your command line looks basically correct for the creation of a starpack, but..... you must make a *copy* of the tclkit.exe file to use with the "-runtime" argument. Because the sdx command is already "using" the main tclkit.exe file, it cannot be added to the starpack (because it is in use). Therefore, just copy the tclkit.exe to say, tclkit_copy.exe. Then, use the following to create the starpack: sdx wrap tcldemo.exe -runtime tclkit_copy.exe If you don't already have a copy, Steve Landers has produced a *wonderful* paper entitled "Beyond TclKit - Starkits, Starpacks, and other *stuff", that does a great job of explaining all this stuff. You can get a copy from: http://digitalsmarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf Hope that helps... Jeff From lvirden@cas.org Tue Jan 28 04:54:22 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0SAsMc26576 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 04:54:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0SAu6Yc019577 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:56:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0SAu6820175; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:56:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:56:06 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030128055606.AAB20143@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Successful BLT Starkit ? In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:33:19 -0500 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: creating a starkit with BLT How would you go about creating a starkit with BLT? I have not done that, but I guess the first step would be to see if anyone has taken the time to create a Stubs version of the latest BLT. Then build that and make use of it. Another alternative might be to make a 'bltkit' - a customized tclkit with blt statically linked into it. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From rohan@rohanpall.com Tue Jan 28 09:52:08 2003 Received: from pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (postfix@pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0SFq8c16911 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 09:52:08 -0600 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pochacco.ex.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B26258FFDF for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 07:54:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from 24.114.111.163 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 10:54:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1144.24.114.111.163.1043769240.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 10:54:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Successful BLT Starkit ? From: "Rohan Pall" To: In-Reply-To: <20030128055606.AAB20143@cas.org> References: Your message of Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:33:19 -0500 <20030128055606.AAB20143@cas.org> User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden said: > Re: creating a starkit with BLT > > How would you go about creating a starkit with BLT? I have not done > that, but I guess the first step would be to see if anyone has taken the > time to create a Stubs version of the latest BLT. Then build that and > make use of it. The sweeter way. > Another alternative might be to make a 'bltkit' - a customized tclkit > with blt statically linked into it. This is a pointer to a post by Wojciech Kocjan where he says: > http://www.zoro2.org/_chwilowe/bltkitty.exe > It includes BLT, Itcl+Itk 3.3, Iwidgets 4 and is compiled with threads. > The only bad side is the ugly icon and that I'm not sure if it's the > latest mk with threads enabled correctly. But - just don't use thread::* > commands and it should work as expected. See the post with message ID in google groups for more details. Oh yeah, you can always change the icon if you don't like it. I have not used bltkitty but it looks like the link works. Rohan From wojciech@kocjan.org Tue Jan 28 16:09:37 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0SM9Zc18739 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:09:36 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18ddwR-0006kh-00 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:10:51 +0100 Message-ID: <3E36FF96.5050108@kocjan.org> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:09:26 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Successful BLT Starkit ? References: Your message of Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:33:19 -0500 <20030128055606.AAB20143@cas.org> <1144.24.114.111.163.1043769240.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> In-Reply-To: <1144.24.114.111.163.1043769240.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan Pall wrote: >>How would you go about creating a starkit with BLT? I have not done >>that, but I guess the first step would be to see if anyone has taken the >>time to create a Stubs version of the latest BLT. Then build that and >>make use of it. > The sweeter way. Yeah. This is a big PITA with BLT :( >>Another alternative might be to make a 'bltkit' - a customized tclkit >>with blt statically linked into it. > This is a pointer to a post by Wojciech Kocjan where he says: >>http://www.zoro2.org/_chwilowe/bltkitty.exe http://www.zoro2.org/bikit.exe (batteries included tclkit :) The old one also works, but has problems with some resources... (so you WILL have problems with radiobuttons/checkbuttons). It does NOT include threads (had some problems with some extensions :), but includes Itcl+Itk 3.3 and BLT. >>It includes BLT, Itcl+Itk 3.3, Iwidgets 4 and is compiled with threads. >>The only bad side is the ugly icon and that I'm not sure if it's the >>latest mk with threads enabled correctly. But - just don't use thread::* >>commands and it should work as expected. > See the post with message ID in google groups > for more details. Cool, now I'm famous ;-) -- WK (written at Stardate 57076.8) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 29 06:09:06 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TC94c16682 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 06:09:05 -0600 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 13:38:13 +0200 Resent-Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 13:10:56 +0100 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-4--1036936082 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: "Semion Parancher" To: Resent-To: Starkit list Resent-Message-Id: <6A2276F56A95224AA5AE83FD3DDF3585EA8A91@exrad2.ad.rad.co.il> Resent-From: Jean-Claude Wippler Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Starpacks with .dll Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Apple-Mail-4--1036936082 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed (Forwarded to list -jcw) Hi All ! Is=A0it possible to create stand alone starpack (.exe) that includes = .dll=20 files for Windows platform=A0? I wrote few Tcl packages by Tcl/Tk and LabWindowsCVI (c,c++), and these=20= packages usually consist of=A0 .tcl and .dll files. Many applications were created based on these packages, and working=20 under Windows 98. I distribute these applications=A0to other PCs that don't have Tcl/Tkby=20= Wise InstallBuilder. I build Application directory with subdirectories as bin,lib of Tcl=20 which are needed for=A0=A0PCs without Tcl/Tk in order to run the Tcl=20 applications. All of the procedure I=A0described above works fine, but now I wont to=20= distribute my applications as stand alone run time file (.exe). And I want to use the Starpacks. I prepared one starpack but it doesn't work, and I received the next=20 error message : " 5233couldn't load library I/O error while load=20 c:/Myapp.exe/lib/Mylib/my.dll". =A0Further more,=A0I tried to work with your tcl84dok.kit that include=20= tkhtml.dll.=A0which Idownloaded=A0from your site, and prepared = tcl84dok.exe=20 starpack by using=A0the "sdx tcl84dok.exe -runtime tclkit.exe" command. When I run tcl84dok.exe I get the next error message: " 8083couldn't load library I/O error while load=20 c:/tcl84dok.exe/lib/arch/Windows/tkhtml0.0/tkhtml.dll". When=A0using the=A0"tclkit.exe tcl84dok.kit" command all work fine. Please advise. =A0 Regard's Parancher Semion Automatic Test Equipment Development Dep. RAD Data Communications Ltd. Phone: +972-3-6455145 Fax : +972-3-6488785 Email:=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0=A0 semion_p@rad.co.il Web Site:=A0=A0 www.rad.com =A0 =A0 -jcw= --Apple-Mail-4--1036936082 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=ISO-8859-1 Arial(Forwarded to list -jcw) Hi All ! ArialIs=A0it possible to create stand alone starpack (.exe) that includes .dll files for Windows platform=A0? ArialI wrote few Tcl packages by Tcl/Tk and LabWindowsCVI (c,c++), and these packages usually consist of=A0 .tcl and .dll files. ArialMany applications were created based on these packages, and working under Windows = 98. ArialI distribute these applications=A0to other PCs that don't have Tcl/Tkby Wise = InstallBuilder. ArialI build Application directory with subdirectories as bin,lib of Tcl which are needed for=A0=A0PCs without Tcl/Tk in order to run the Tcl = applications. ArialAll of the procedure I=A0described above works fine, but now I wont to distribute my applications as stand alone run time file (.exe). ArialAnd I want to use the Starpacks. ArialI prepared one starpack but it doesn't work, and I received the next error message = : Arial" 5233couldn't load library I/O error while load = c:/Myapp.exe/lib/Mylib/my.dll". Arial=A0Further more,=A0I tried to work with your tcl84dok.kit that include tkhtml.dll.=A0which Idownloaded=A0from your site, and prepared tcl84dok.exe starpack by using=A0the "sdx tcl84dok.exe -runtime tclkit.exe" = command. ArialWhen I run tcl84dok.exe I get the next error message: Arial" 8083couldn't load library I/O error while load = c:/tcl84dok.exe/lib/arch/Windows/tkhtml0.0/FFFF,0000,0000tkhtml.dll". ArialWhen=A0using the=A0"tclkit.exe tcl84dok.kit" command all work fine. ArialPlease = advise. =A0 ArialRegard's Parancher Semion Automatic Test Equipment Development Dep. RAD Data Communications Ltd. Phone: +972-3-6455145 Fax : +972-3-6488785 Email:=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0=A0 1999,1999,FFFFsemion_p@rad.co.il ArialWeb Site:=A0=A0 = 1999,1999,FFFFwww.rad.com =A0 =A0 -jcw= --Apple-Mail-4--1036936082-- From mel@redolive.com Wed Jan 29 15:15:26 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0TLFPc06679 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:15:25 -0600 Received: (qmail 5841 invoked by uid 511); 29 Jan 2003 22:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 22:15:31 -0000 Message-ID: <002501c2c7dc$94b493b0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:22:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2C7B2.AB7B3600" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Starkit & Mac OS9 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2C7B2.AB7B3600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i am not a Mac user, but... i have a project that must run on Mac OS9 ! would Starkit work on that platform ? I also use tclvfs package extensively. is there a vfs package for Mac = OS? many thanks Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2C7B2.AB7B3600 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i am not a Mac user, = but...
i have a project that must run on Mac = OS9=20 !
would Starkit work on that platform = ?
I also use tclvfs package extensively. = is there a=20 vfs package for Mac OS?
 
many thanks
Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2C7B2.AB7B3600-- From mel@redolive.com Wed Jan 29 15:47:20 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0TLlJc09598 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:47:19 -0600 Received: (qmail 5934 invoked by uid 511); 29 Jan 2003 22:47:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOlive2000) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 22:47:26 -0000 Message-ID: <003901c2c7e1$0a28f2e0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> From: "Mel" To: Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:54:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0036_01C2C7B7.213F14C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Link vs Copy Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C2C7B7.213F14C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i have tons of projects that i want to port to Starkit. Starkit makes it = nice and managable :-) HOWEVER; i have things under the control of cvs. i use BWidgets extensively, but = i have 20 or more copies of it in my various xxx.vfs directories = (unmanagable) and can not put all copies in my cvs (since they are the = same) is there a way in my xxx.vfs/lib directory to refer to say = "c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/BWidget1.5", rather than a physical copying of = the entire content ? and god forbid if i have to move to BWidget1.??? = version ! vow 20 times recursive copy, test etc. i can kinda live with this, but had to ask !!!! thanks Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C2C7B7.213F14C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i have tons of projects that i want to = port to=20 Starkit. Starkit makes it nice and managable :-)
 
HOWEVER;
i have things under the control of cvs. = i use=20 BWidgets extensively, but i have 20 or more copies of it in my various = xxx.vfs=20 directories (unmanagable) and can not put all copies in my cvs (since = they are=20 the same)
is there a way in my xxx.vfs/lib = directory to refer=20 to say "c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/BWidget1.5", rather than a physical = copying of=20 the entire content ? and god forbid if i have to move to BWidget1.??? = version !=20 vow 20 times recursive copy, test etc.
 
i can kinda live with this, but had to = ask=20 !!!!
 
thanks
Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C2C7B7.213F14C0-- From Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jan 29 16:01:24 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TM1Oc10851 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:01:24 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h0TM3H2I025470 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:03:17 -0700 (MST) Received: [from il02exb02.corp.mot.com (il02exb02.corp.mot.com [10.0.100.67]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA03533 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:03:17 -0700 (MST)] Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:03:17 -0700 (MST) From: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Message-Id: <200301292203.PAA03533@pobox.mot.com> Received: by il02exb02.corp.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:03:17 -0600 Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.7.187]) by IL02EXF01.DS.mot.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:03:04 -0600 To: Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0 Sender: rna020 Message-ID: <3E384F96.1C0CFA48@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:03:02 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mel CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Link vs Copy References: <003901c2c7e1$0a28f2e0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Jan 2003 22:03:04.0399 (UTC) FILETIME=[32863DF0:01C2C7E2] Mel, > i have tons of projects that i want to port to Starkit. Starkit makes it nice and managable :-) > > HOWEVER; > i have things under the control of cvs. i use BWidgets extensively, but i have 20 or more copies of it in my various xxx.vfs > directories (unmanagable) and can not put all copies in my cvs (since they are the same) > is there a way in my xxx.vfs/lib directory to refer to say "c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/BWidget1.5", rather than a physical copying of > the entire content ? and god forbid if i have to move to BWidget1.??? version ! vow 20 times recursive copy, test etc. > > i can kinda live with this, but had to ask !!!! If you're on unix than just us links to the bwidget stuff. I use cvs with Makefile scripts that link stuff in at build time. It works great. Tom K. From dgporter@erols.com Wed Jan 29 16:05:44 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TM5ic11263 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:05:44 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVZ3rJxPKG7ioFonCkKkwRVMkrZFyuhD4RzkjgzEfu7Y/B9hRCkDJogZJnN2eALdEt4= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18e0Mq-0007Um-00; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:07:36 -0500 Message-ID: <3E3850A3.3040100@erols.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:07:31 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mel CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Link vs Copy References: <003901c2c7e1$0a28f2e0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > i have things under the control of cvs. i use BWidgets extensively, but > i have 20 or more copies of it in my various xxx.vfs directories > (unmanagable) and can not put all copies in my cvs (since they are the same) Why in the world would you import multiple copies of the same thing into a CVS repository. This is what CVS modules are for. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From morgangoeller@cox.net Wed Jan 29 16:06:56 2003 Received: from localhost (pix-fw.wan.aol.com [152.163.190.1]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TM6uc11390 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:06:56 -0600 Received: from [10.4.24.165] ([10.4.24.165]) by localhost (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id h0TM8ctY000500 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:08:39 -0700 (MST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.0.2006 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:08:36 -0700 From: Morgan Goeller To: Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, This is my first post, so please forgive my ignorance in advance. I love the concept of the starkit, and I think it is truly a revolutionary step in the acceptance of TCL applications. I do a lot of database development and would like to simplify the deployment of my applications. To do this, I would need db connectivity, something that would probably be useful for other developers. I would propose to make a starkit that includes: 1. nstcl (a somewhat standard interface for database connectivity) 2. TCL Packages for database drivers (SybTCL, OraTCL, mysqlTCL, odbcTCL). 3. Binaries for popular platforms (windows, linux, mac os x). I don't see this as a terribly difficult task, except for dealing with multiple binaries for the same package. For example, if I compiled SybTCL for Windows I would have a .DLL, for Mac OS X a .dylib, for linux a .so. How does starkit handle the presence of different shared libraries? Should the packages handle this on the fly? Would it be better to do this as a starkit for each platform? Thanks, Morgan Goeller From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 29 16:29:23 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TMTNc13526 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:29:23 -0600 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 23:31:15 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit & Mac OS9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <002501c2c7dc$94b493b0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Message-Id: <609B6793-33D9-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > i am not a Mac user, but... > i have a project that must run on Mac OS9 ! > would Starkit work on that platform ? > I also use tclvfs package extensively. is there a vfs package for Mac > OS? http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tclkit-macos-ppc.bin.gz (Desktop) 1 % info patchlevel 8.4.0 (Desktop) 2 % parray tcl_platform tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = ppc tcl_platform(os) = MacOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 9.2 tcl_platform(platform) = macintosh tcl_platform(user) = Jean-Claude Wippler tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 (Desktop) 3 % package require vfs 1.0 (Desktop) 4 % package names http pwb rechan zipvfs tcltest opt mk4vfs vfslib msgcat scripdoc zlib starkit Tcl Itcl Mk4tcl vfs Tk (Desktop) 5 % info nameofexe SilverJay:Users:jcw:Desktop:tclkit-mac-ppc (Desktop) 6 % Making things double-clickable is somewhat more involved, but "source myapp.kit" should work. No support for shared libs in VFS (but you load external ones). -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 29 16:33:17 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TMXHc13917 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:33:17 -0600 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 23:35:08 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Link vs Copy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <003901c2c7e1$0a28f2e0$a6c809c0@evgl.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > is there a way in my xxx.vfs/lib directory to refer to say > "c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/BWidget1.5", rather than a physical copying > of the entire content ? and god forbid if i have to move to > BWidget1.??? version ! vow 20 times recursive copy, test etc. Unix symlinks (I use them underneath Win32 on a Samba server). Or put all your common stuff in a separate starkit and source it (put in lib/, create main.tcl, yada, yada...). Don't go too fancy on all this - we are likely to see more options evolve as package distribution and update management starts to show on the radar screen. -jcw From Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jan 29 16:39:06 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TMd6c14518 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:39:06 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h0TMfX30014700 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:41:33 -0700 (MST) Received: [from il02exb02.corp.mot.com (il02exb02.corp.mot.com [10.0.100.67]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA18665 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:40:59 -0700 (MST)] Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:40:59 -0700 (MST) From: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Message-Id: <200301292240.PAA18665@pobox.mot.com> Received: by il02exb02.corp.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:40:09 -0600 Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.7.187]) by IL02EXF01.DS.mot.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:40:02 -0600 To: Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0 Sender: rna020 Message-ID: <3E385842.D0EB84AC@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:40:02 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Morgan Goeller CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Jan 2003 22:40:03.0061 (UTC) FILETIME=[5CF33250:01C2C7E7] Morgan, > I love the concept of the starkit, and I think it is truly a revolutionary > step in the acceptance of TCL applications. I do a lot of database > development and would like to simplify the deployment of my applications. > To do this, I would need db connectivity, something that would probably be > useful for other developers. > > I would propose to make a starkit that includes: > > 1. nstcl (a somewhat standard interface for database connectivity) > 2. TCL Packages for database drivers (SybTCL, OraTCL, mysqlTCL, odbcTCL). > 3. Binaries for popular platforms (windows, linux, mac os x). > > I don't see this as a terribly difficult task, except for dealing with > multiple binaries for the same package. For example, if I compiled SybTCL > for Windows I would have a .DLL, for Mac OS X a .dylib, for linux a .so. > How does starkit handle the presence of different shared libraries? Should > the packages handle this on the fly? Would it be better to do this as a > starkit for each platform? I'm using starkits that work with MySQL. Currently they interact through a terminal but I would like to do my transaction through the API. I've looked at several interfaces an the one I like (so far) is the mysqltcl (ttp://www.xdobry.de/mysqltcl/) interface. If you get a starkit build that runs on Solaris, HP-UX, and Windows I would be interested. Tom K. From damon@your.unreality.com Wed Jan 29 16:47:05 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0TMl5c15335 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:47:05 -0600 Received: (qmail 40005 invoked by uid 300); 29 Jan 2003 22:48:58 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 22:48:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:48:58 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Re: tbcload (fwd) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Forwarding this to the list for discussion... > > Have you ever though of including tbcload in TclKit as a good means > obfuscating code? I don't really need it, but I know a lot of people > > have said they want a way to distribute their .kit's in a way that > > protects their source. With tbcload being open-source and relatively > > easy to compile, you could add it as a standard module to TclKit and > > make it really able to load anything Tcl. > Absolutely! Mark Roseman proposed that a while back and is using it. > > We concluded that tbcload is best included with the starkit, because > formats change - and that way the code that decodes is next to the > encoded data. Also, this makes it easier to create custom variations > (people tend to ask for this to be safe if ever someone posts a generic > "cracker" for tbc-coded files). > > AFAIK, TclDevKit 2.5 (not in beta, it can deliver starkits) has that > logic included. > > Anyway, good thinking - and definitely a very good match for starkits > for those who need this. > > -jcw So, then, are we talking about making tbcload a Starkit? Can we get one for every platform? I'm not using it myself (I rarely obfuscate code), I'm just wondering if it would be easily available on all platforms supported by TclKit? D PS: While I've got you here, what's the next release schedule looking like? InstallBase is looking really strong using TclKit. 0-] From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 29 16:48:16 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TMmGc15462 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:48:16 -0600 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 23:50:07 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <03AB94CB-33DC-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Morgan Goeller wrote: > This is my first post Welcome! > I would propose to make a starkit that includes: > > 1. nstcl (a somewhat standard interface for database connectivity) > 2. TCL Packages for database drivers (SybTCL, OraTCL, mysqlTCL, > odbcTCL). > 3. Binaries for popular platforms (windows, linux, mac os x). Sounds great. I think someone also wrapped SQLite, it might be a nice addition to your mix. And if you want to share: there's the Starkit Distribution Archive, at http://mini.net/sdarchive/ to hold either a link or a copy to such a starkit. > I don't see this as a terribly difficult task, except for dealing with > multiple binaries for the same package. For example, if I compiled > SybTCL > for Windows I would have a .DLL, for Mac OS X a .dylib, for linux a > .so. > How does starkit handle the presence of different shared libraries? > Should > the packages handle this on the fly? Would it be better to do this as a > starkit for each platform? Good point. This is something that needs to be addressed real soon IMO - a convention for naming, for loading the appropriate shared library, and for either falling back to Tcl or reporting an error if the loading failed. For now, I just hack things in an ad-hoc manner. You may want to do the same, while exploring what works best. But I hope we do implement some logic soon... Hm, it *would* be nice to have something in the upcoming tclkit 8.4.2 release (forget "end Jan", I'm now aiming for "first half of Feb"). -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Wed Jan 29 16:53:17 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0TMrHc15975 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:53:17 -0600 Received: (qmail 40124 invoked by uid 300); 29 Jan 2003 22:55:09 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 22:55:09 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:55:09 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit In-Reply-To: <03AB94CB-33DC-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Hm, it *would* be nice to have something in the upcoming tclkit 8.4.2 > release (forget "end Jan", I'm now aiming for "first half of Feb"). Well, that answers my last question. 0-] I guess I'll just keep testing and churning on the newer/ binaries. 0-] Thanks, Damon From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Wed Jan 29 17:00:26 2003 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0TN0Qc16670 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:00:26 -0600 Received: (qmail 13701 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 23:02:06 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-30.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.30) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 23:02:06 -0000 Message-ID: <020101c2c7ea$64e1f5c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:01:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 1/28/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Morgan Goeller" To: Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 4:08 PM Subject: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit > Hello, > > This is my first post, so please forgive my ignorance in advance. > > > I love the concept of the starkit, and I think it is truly a revolutionary > step in the acceptance of TCL applications. I do a lot of database > development and would like to simplify the deployment of my applications. > To do this, I would need db connectivity, something that would probably be > useful for other developers. > > I would propose to make a starkit that includes: > > 1. nstcl (a somewhat standard interface for database connectivity) > 2. TCL Packages for database drivers (SybTCL, OraTCL, mysqlTCL, odbcTCL). > 3. Binaries for popular platforms (windows, linux, mac os x). > > I don't see this as a terribly difficult task, except for dealing with > multiple binaries for the same package. Hi Morgan, Steve Landers paper (Beyond TclKit - Starkits, Starpacks, and other *stuff) discusses (and has suggested solutions for) this exact topic in section 4.4 "Multi-platform binary extensions". If you don't yet have the paper, it can be d/l'd here: http://digitalsmarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf Jeff From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Wed Jan 29 17:51:34 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0TNpXc21442 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:51:33 -0600 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h0TNrQ12065890 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:53:27 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:53:26 -0600 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <03AB94CB-33DC-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <03AB94CB-33DC-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi! I have a big production application that I wrote as a starkit, running under FreeBSD. It's got some speed problems, so I want to profile it. I thought I'd use the profile stuff in TclX and do my profiling under Linux. I'm using the TclX package from kitten. But I can't get it to load. $ tclkit-linux-x86 % info pa 8.4.1 % source /data/src/kitten.kit % package require Tclx Can't find a usable tclx.tcl in the following directories: /data/src/tclkit-linux-x86/lib/tclx8.4 /data/lib/tclx8.4 /lib/tclx8.4 /data/library /library /tclx8.4.0/library /tclx8.4.0/library This probably means that tclx wasn't installed properly. % glob -d /data/src/tclkit-linux-x86/lib/tclx8.4 tclx.tcl /data/src/tclkit-linux-x86/lib/tclx8.4/tclx.tcl As you can see from the glob, it's there, and I actually I got it to properly load once, by fooling around with auto_path or tcl_library or tcl_libPath, but I have been unable to replicate it! Actually I copied the tclx8.4 directory from kitten.vfs/lib into my vfs/lib and wrapped my app, but I can't get that to work either. Does anybody know how to get Tclx to load in this situation? Thanks! /k -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Song of the Moment: Blimps Go 90 (Guided by Voices) From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Jan 29 18:19:22 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0U0JLc23680 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:19:21 -0600 Received: (qmail 2607 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 00:21:11 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 30 Jan 2003 00:21:11 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:21:11 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: tbcload (fwd) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Damon Courtney From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, January 30, 2003, at 06:48 AM, Damon Courtney wrote: > So, then, are we talking about making tbcload a Starkit? Can we > get > one for every platform? I'm not using it myself (I rarely obfuscate > code), > I'm just wondering if it would be easily available on all platforms > supported by TclKit? This is an excellent idea. I single "library" Starkit that contains as many tbcload binaries as we can collect for various platforms. Starkit developers can just extract the ones they need. I'd be happy to collate if others want to mail me the tbcload shared libs. Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From michael@cleverly.com Wed Jan 29 19:15:05 2003 Received: from mgr4.xmission.com (mail@mgr4.xmission.com [198.60.22.204]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0U1F5c27881 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 19:15:05 -0600 Received: from [198.60.22.200] (helo=mail.xmission.com) by mgr4.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 18e3K2-0007vA-04 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:16:54 -0700 Received: from [166.70.107.99] (helo=gibraltar.deseretbook.net) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 18e3K2-0002l5-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:16:54 -0700 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:16:35 -0700 (MST) From: "Michael A. Cleverly" To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit In-Reply-To: <03AB94CB-33DC-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wed, 29 Jan 2003, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > I would propose to make a starkit that includes: > > > > 1. nstcl (a somewhat standard interface for database connectivity) > > 2. TCL Packages for database drivers (SybTCL, OraTCL, mysqlTCL, > > odbcTCL). > > 3. Binaries for popular platforms (windows, linux, mac os x). > > Sounds great. I think someone also wrapped SQLite, it might be a nice > addition to your mix. SQLite does have Tcl bindings: http://www.sqlite.org/tclsqlite.html Michael From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Wed Jan 29 21:30:28 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (root@vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0U3URc04206 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 21:30:27 -0600 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (root@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0U3WHk24803 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:32:17 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.0.0.44) with SMTP id M2003013014321515054 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:32:15 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0U3WFA24798 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:32:15 +1100 (EST) From: Steve Cassidy To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 30 Jan 2003 14:31:45 +1100 Message-Id: <1043897506.3389.1497.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Starkit] Starkits and CANTCL Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I was working on CANTCL the other night and got to the point where I could download and install a package from a cantcl server into a running tcl installation. I had some observations to share here: - When I run the installer via tclkit it will put the new package into the tclkit vfs (it looks for a writeable directory on auto_path), if this was done from a starkit it would provide a neat way of adding packages to starkits. All of the support code is already in tclkit so it would be relatively easy to build a 'vanilla' starkit which could download any packages you want and install them into itself. - The package format described in TIP55 is almost but not quite adhered to by the default layout of starkits. This is what the TIP says: packagename$version + DESCRIPTION.txt -- Metadata, description of the package + doc/ -- documentation + examples/ -- example scripts and applications + $architecture/ -- shared library directories + pkgIndex.tcl -- package index file (optional) where $architecture is a platform specific directory like Linux-x86/ or Windows/ containing libraries. Tcl code is put into the special architecture dir. tcl/. Missing from current starkits is the DESCRIPTION.txt metadata file which is terribly useful since it describes inter-package dependancies as well as names and descriptions. - currently I'm using zip files for packages but there's nothing saying that they can't be starkits. Downloading and installing a starkit would be just as easy and the sdarchive offers a good reasource. If starkits had DESCRIPTION.txt and conformed to the above structure this would be quite easy to do. Alternatively, CANTCL could do the converse and deliver packages in starkit or zip file format. My progress on this is v. slow since I have too many other things to do but I welcome any and all input and collaboration on making this stuff a reality. Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From SEMION_P@rad.co.il Thu Jan 30 00:54:57 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0U6stc14074 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 00:54:56 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h0U6uRUP024643 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:56:27 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h0U6uRq3024640 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:56:27 +0200 (IST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C2C82C.07E5B9E6" Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:51:35 +0200 Message-ID: <6A2276F56A95224AA5AE83FD3DDF3585EA8A92@exrad2.ad.rad.co.il> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Starpacks with (.dll) files for Windows Thread-Index: AcLILJwOvi99JzQgEde9lgCQJ3e/MQ== From: "Semion Parancher" To: Subject: [Starkit] Starpacks with (.dll) files for Windows Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C2C82C.07E5B9E6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1255" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All ! Is it possible to create stand alone starpack (.exe) that includes .dll = files for Windows platform ? I wrote few Tcl packages by Tcl/Tk and LabWindowsCVI (c,c++), and these = packages usually consist of .tcl and .dll files. Many applications were created based on these packages, and working = under Windows 98. I distribute these applications to other PCs that don't have Tcl/Tk by = Wise InstallBuilder. I build Application directory with subdirectories as bin,lib of Tcl = which are needed for PCs without Tcl/Tk in order to run the Tcl = applications. All of the procedure I described above works fine, but now I wont to = distribute my applications as stand alone run time file (.exe).=20 And I want to use the Starpacks. I prepared one starpack but it doesn't work, and I received the next = error message : " 5233couldn't load library I/O error while load = c:/Myapp.exe/lib/Mylib/my.dll". Further more, I tried to work with your tcl84dok.kit that include = tkhtml.dll. which I downloaded from your site, and prepared tcl84dok.exe = starpack by using the "sdx tcl84dok.exe -runtime tclkit.exe" command. When I run tcl84dok.exe I get the next error message:=20 " 8083couldn't load library I/O error while load = c:/tcl84dok.exe/lib/arch/Windows/tkhtml0.0/tkhtml.dll". When using the "tclkit.exe tcl84dok.kit" command all work fine. Please advise. Regard's=20 Parancher Semion Automatic Test Equipment Development Dep. RAD Data Communications Ltd. Phone: +972-3-6455145 Fax : +972-3-6488785 Email: semion_p @rad.co.il Web Site: www.rad.com =20 =20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C2C82C.07E5B9E6 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1255" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi All = !
Is it possible=20 to create stand alone starpack (.exe) that includes .dll files for = Windows=20 platform ?
I = wrote few Tcl=20 packages by Tcl/Tk and LabWindowsCVI (c,c++), and these packages usually = consist=20 of  .tcl and .dll files.
Many = applications=20 were created based on these packages, and working under Windows = 98.
I = distribute these=20 applications to other PCs that don't have Tcl/Tk by Wise=20 InstallBuilder.
I = build Application=20 directory with subdirectories as bin,lib of Tcl which are needed=20 for  PCs without Tcl/Tk in order to run the Tcl=20 applications.
All of = the procedure=20 I described above works fine, but now I wont to distribute my = applications as stand=20 alone run time file (.exe).
And I = want to use=20 the Starpacks.
I = prepared one=20 starpack but it doesn't work, and I received the next error message=20 :
" = 5233couldn't load=20 library I/O error while load = c:/Myapp.exe/lib/Mylib/my.dll".
 Further=20 more, I tried to work with your tcl84dok.kit that include=20 tkhtml.dll. which I downloaded from your site, and prepared = tcl84dok.exe starpack by using the "sdx tcl84dok.exe -runtime = tclkit.exe"=20 command.
When I = run=20 tcl84dok.exe I get the next error message:
" = 8083couldn't load=20 library I/O error while load=20 c:/tcl84dok.exe/lib/arch/Windows/tkhtml0.0/tkhtml.dll".
When using=20 the "tclkit.exe tcl84dok.kit" command all work = fine.
Please = advise.
 Regard's =

Parancher Semion
Automatic Test Equipment Development = Dep.
RAD=20 Data Communications Ltd.
Phone: +972-3-6455145
Fax :=20 +972-3-6488785
Email:         semion_p@rad.co.il
Web Site:   = www.rad.com

 

 
------_=_NextPart_001_01C2C82C.07E5B9E6-- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 30 04:54:52 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UAsqc03045 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 04:54:52 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0UAubYc026331 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:56:38 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0UAudY07782; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:56:39 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:56:39 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030130055639.AAB7748@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Link vs Copy In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:54:46 -0500 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Mel" > i use BWidgets extensively, but > i have 20 or more copies of it in my various xxx.vfs directories > is there a way in my xxx.vfs/lib directory to refer to say > "c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/BWidget1.5", rather than a physical copying of = > the entire content ? Mel, you need to read up on mountable starkits! That way, you put Bwidget into its own starkit, then mount it. Jean-Claude, do we have a specific page for creating toolset starkits (ala kitten?) that describes anything special that should/could be done along these lines? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 30 04:57:04 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UAv3c03269 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 04:57:04 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0UAwnYc026542 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:58:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0UAwoX07797; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:58:50 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:58:50 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030130055850.AAB7786@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:08:36 -0700 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Morgan Goeller > I would propose to make a starkit that includes: > 2. TCL Packages for database drivers (SybTCL, OraTCL, mysqlTCL, odbcTCL). > 3. Binaries for popular platforms (windows, linux, mac os x). > I don't see this as a terribly difficult task, except for dealing with > multiple binaries for the same package. Actually, read Steve Lander's starkit paper which discusses this. A warning though - make certain that the database vendor license for their code permits the kind of distribution you plan (personal, site, customer, public, whatever). -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 30 04:59:18 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UAxIc03497 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 04:59:18 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0UB12Yc027554 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 06:01:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0UB14U07896; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 06:01:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 06:01:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030130060104.AAB7811@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] DB-Centric Starkit In-Reply-To: <03AB94CB-33DC-11D7-B981-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Wed, 29 Jan 2003 23:50:07 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Good point. This is something that needs to be addressed real soon IMO > - a convention for naming, for loading the appropriate shared library, > and for either falling back to Tcl or reporting an error if the loading > failed. I seem to recall that the Cantcl proposal and TIP, as well as Steve Lander's paper, had some proposals for binary layout - making use of $tcl_platform to generate platform directories. As long as a package was only going to contain one release of libraries (for instance, not trying to release something with Oracle 7, 8 and 9...) the proposals seemed to work. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jan 30 05:01:55 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UB1tc03790 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:01:55 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0UB3eYc028029 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 06:03:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0UB3fq07928; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 06:03:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 06:03:41 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030130060341.AAB7906@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:53:26 -0600 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu > Hi! I have a big production application that I wrote as a starkit, > running under FreeBSD. It's got some speed problems, so I want to > profile it. Is it the application that has speed problems, or the application under starkit? In other words, if you do sdx.kit unwrap yourapp.kit and then run the code inside the yourapp.vfs directory, do you still see problems? Can you profile _that_ code any easier? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Jan 30 05:06:43 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0UB6fc04260 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:06:42 -0600 Received: (qmail 4080 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 11:08:33 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 30 Jan 2003 11:08:33 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 19:08:32 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Link vs Copy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <20030130055639.AAB7748@cas.org> Message-Id: <2B20501A-3443-11D7-8597-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Mel, you need to read up on mountable starkits! That way, you put > Bwidget into its own starkit, then mount it. Or just source it > Jean-Claude, do we have a specific page for creating toolset starkits > (ala kitten?) that describes anything special that should/could be done > along these lines? See my Starkit paper from the conference - http://digitalsmarties.com/Tcl2002/tclkit.pdf Cheers Steve From Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Jan 30 09:02:26 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UF2Pc27001 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:02:25 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h0UF4J2I019435 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:04:19 -0700 (MST) Received: [from il02exb02.corp.mot.com (il02exb02.corp.mot.com [10.0.100.67]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA05664 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:03:17 -0700 (MST)] Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:03:17 -0700 (MST) From: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Message-Id: <200301301503.IAA05664@pobox3.mot.com> Received: by il02exb02.corp.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:04:18 -0600 Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.7.187]) by IL02EXF01.DS.mot.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:03:51 -0600 To: Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0 Sender: rna020 Message-ID: <3E393ED6.833857BD@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:03:50 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Cassidy CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkits and CANTCL References: <1043897506.3389.1497.camel@climie> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2003 15:03:51.0722 (UTC) FILETIME=[CCC610A0:01C2C870] Steve, > I was working on CANTCL the other night and got to the point where > I could download and install a package from a cantcl server into > a running tcl installation. I had some observations to share here: > > - When I run the installer via tclkit it will put the new package into > the tclkit vfs (it looks for a writeable directory on auto_path), if > this was done from a starkit it would provide a neat way of adding > packages to starkits. All of the support code is already in tclkit so it > would be relatively easy to build a 'vanilla' starkit which could > download any packages you want and install them into itself. > > - The package format described in TIP55 is almost but not quite adhered > to by the default layout of starkits. This is what the TIP says: > > packagename$version > + DESCRIPTION.txt -- Metadata, description of the package > + doc/ -- documentation > + examples/ -- example scripts and applications > + $architecture/ -- shared library directories > + pkgIndex.tcl -- package index file (optional) > > where $architecture is a platform specific directory like Linux-x86/ or I think you should use the values found in the tcl_platform array to set the architecture value. See example below: % tclkit % parray tcl_platform tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = 9000/785 tcl_platform(os) = HP-UX tcl_platform(osVersion) = B.11.00 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = rna020 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 > Windows/ containing libraries. Tcl code is put into the special > architecture dir. tcl/. > > Missing from current starkits is the DESCRIPTION.txt metadata file which > is terribly useful since it describes inter-package dependancies as well > as names and descriptions. > > - currently I'm using zip files for packages but there's nothing > saying that they can't be starkits. Downloading and installing a > starkit would be just as easy and the sdarchive offers a good reasource. > If starkits had DESCRIPTION.txt and conformed to the above structure > this would be quite easy to do. Alternatively, CANTCL could do the > converse and deliver packages in starkit or zip file format. > > My progress on this is v. slow since I have too many other things to do > but I welcome any and all input and collaboration on making this stuff a > reality. From Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Jan 30 10:21:36 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UGLZc02074 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:21:36 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h0UGNSS1015998 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:23:29 -0700 (MST) Received: [from il02exb02.corp.mot.com (il02exb02.corp.mot.com [10.0.100.67]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA00775 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:22:26 -0700 (MST)] Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:22:26 -0700 (MST) From: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Message-Id: <200301301622.JAA00775@pobox3.mot.com> Received: by il02exb02.corp.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:23:28 -0600 Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.7.187]) by IL02EXF01.DS.mot.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:23:23 -0600 To: Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0 Sender: rna020 Message-ID: <3E39517B.BE9B897A@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:23:23 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Test Message (delete me) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2003 16:23:23.0834 (UTC) FILETIME=[E92C91A0:01C2C87B] Delete this test message. My my browser or mail system haven't been including a subject line with my email. This is a test to see if the problem is fixed. Sorry about the inconvenience. -- Tom Krehbiel From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Thu Jan 30 15:34:34 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0ULYWc32212 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 15:34:34 -0600 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h0ULaL12065189; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 15:36:21 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 15:36:21 -0600 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? In-Reply-To: <20030130060341.AAB7906@cas.org> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "LV" == Larry W Virden writes: >> Hi! I have a big production application that I wrote as a starkit, >> running under FreeBSD. It's got some speed problems, so I want to >> profile it. LV> Is it the application that has speed problems, or the application under LV> starkit? Oh I'm pretty sure it's my application code. *Possibly* it might be metakit, which I am using heavily in the suspect code, but I think it's me. LV> In other words, if you do LV> sdx.kit unwrap yourapp.kit LV> and then run the code inside the yourapp.vfs directory, do you still see LV> problems? Can you profile _that_ code any easier? I can't because I only know how to run my unwrapped code with tclkit -- I can't run my code under tclx or tclsh with tclx loaded because then several internal packages -- starkit, Mk4tcl, etc -- aren't available. I tried unwrapping tclkit itself but I couldn't figure out exactly what to extract -- or where to extract it to -- to get tclsh to work. But I can't run my unwrapped app with tclkit either because the FreeBSD version can't load binary extensions (I hope I don't sound like I'm harping on this...). I was trying to do my profiling that way with tclkit on a handy Linux box, and that's where I encountered my problem loading Tclx. /k -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Song of the Moment: Buzzards and Dreadful Crows (Guided by Voices) From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Thu Jan 30 17:18:37 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (root@vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UNIac08493 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:18:36 -0600 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (root@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0UNKRk20134 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:20:27 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.0.0.44) with SMTP id M2003013110202426914 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:20:24 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0UNKNA20118; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:20:23 +1100 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) From: Steve Cassidy To: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <200301301503.IAA05664@pobox3.mot.com> References: <200301301503.IAA05664@pobox3.mot.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 31 Jan 2003 10:19:51 +1100 Message-Id: <1043968792.7956.2736.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I think you should use the values found in the tcl_platform > array to set the architecture value. See example below: > There are two issues here, one is a standard set of names to call platform specific directories, the other is where to look when you're trying to find the right version of a library for your platform. There's some code in tclkit which looks in a standard set of places based on tcl_platform: # Extend auto_path with a set of directories, if they exist. # # The following paths may be added (but in the opposite order): # $base/lib # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(machine) # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(platform) # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os) # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os)/$tcl_platform(osVersion) # # The last two entries are actually expanded even further, splitting # $tcl_platform(os) on spaces and $tcl_platform(osVersion) on ".". # # So on NT, "Windows" and "Windows/NT" would also be considered, and on # Linux 2.2.14, all of the following: Linux/2, Linux/2/2, Linux/2/2/14 # # Only paths for which the dir exist are added (once) to auto_path. (found in scripdoc.tcl inside tclkit) These look like as good a set of names as any to work with -- package authors could choose the most general location that defines the platform their code works with (eg. Windows, Linux, HP-UX) although I'd drop the 'arch' subdirectory. When it comes to loading appropriate packages (while constructing pkgIndex.tcl) then the pkg_mkIndex mechanism means that you should look anywhere that might work -- my approach is to look for any files ending in [info sharedlibextension], pkg_mkIndex then tries to load them and should find the package in the one for that platform. Does anyone know of a case where attempting to load an innapropriate library would cause a fatal crash? I can see that this strategy won't work for fine differences between platforms (eg. Linux/2/2 vs Linux/2/4) and in those cases authors would have to provide their own hand crafted pkgIndex.tcl files I think (although some cases could be automated). Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 31 04:36:14 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VAaEc26601 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 04:36:14 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0VAc1Yc010400 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:38:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0VAc1I14259; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:38:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:38:01 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030131053801.AAB14213@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <1043968792.7956.2736.camel@climie> of 31 Jan 2003 10:19:51 +1100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Steve Cassidy > There's some code in tclkit which looks in a standard set > of places based on tcl_platform: > > # Extend auto_path with a set of directories, if they exist. > # > # The following paths may be added (but in the opposite order): > # $base/lib I hope no one puts _binary_ code at this level though > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(machine) > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(platform) > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os) > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os)/$tcl_platform(osVersion) > # > # The last two entries are actually expanded even further, splitting > # $tcl_platform(os) on spaces and $tcl_platform(osVersion) on ".". > # Only paths for which the dir exist are added (once) to auto_path. You know, no discovery _really_ needs to be done here. sdx.kit _could_ automatically create, in the startup script, the auto_path value. Discovery and interpretation of pkgIndex.tcl is one of the slower steps. Perhaps we could 'pre-compile' the info - either general, or even better, a proc that at run time sets the machine specific values without having to munge through all the directories to find it. You know - do the work one time, at compile time. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jan 31 08:30:17 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VEUHc13243 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:30:17 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h0VEWBP1014456 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 07:32:11 -0700 (MST) Received: [from il02exb02.corp.mot.com (il02exb02.corp.mot.com [10.0.100.67]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id HAA14343 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 07:32:11 -0700 (MST)] Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 07:32:11 -0700 (MST) From: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Message-Id: <200301311432.HAA14343@mothost.mot.com> Received: by il02exb02.corp.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:32:11 -0600 Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.7.187]) by IL02EXF01.DS.mot.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:32:04 -0600 To: Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0 Sender: rna020 Message-ID: <3E3A88E2.D770A243@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 07:32:02 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) References: <20030131053801.AAB14213@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Jan 2003 14:32:04.0543 (UTC) FILETIME=[866B64F0:01C2C935] Larry, > You know, no discovery _really_ needs to be done here. sdx.kit _could_ > automatically create, in the startup script, the auto_path value. Discovery > and interpretation of pkgIndex.tcl is one of the slower steps. Perhaps we > could 'pre-compile' the info - either general, or even better, a proc > that at run time sets the machine specific values without having to munge > through all the directories to find it. You know - do the work one time, > at compile time. I think this is a good idea. When sdx wraps a starkit it should include auto_path discovery code for the platform. And when sdx wraps a starpack it should include an appropreate platform value on the autopath. Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 31 09:13:23 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VFDMc16446 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:13:22 -0600 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 16:15:15 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1043968792.7956.2736.camel@climie> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] package collections Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: > There are two issues here, one is a standard set of names > to call platform specific directories, the other is where > to look when you're trying to find the right version of > a library for your platform. > > There's some code in tclkit which looks in a standard set > of places based on tcl_platform: > > # Extend auto_path with a set of directories, if they exist. > # > # The following paths may be added (but in the opposite order): > # $base/lib > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(machine) > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(platform) > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os) > # $base/lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os)/$tcl_platform(osVersion) > # > # The last two entries are actually expanded even further, splitting > # $tcl_platform(os) on spaces and $tcl_platform(osVersion) on ".". > # > # So on NT, "Windows" and "Windows/NT" would also be considered, and on > # Linux 2.2.14, all of the following: Linux/2, Linux/2/2, Linux/2/2/14 > # > # Only paths for which the dir exist are added (once) to auto_path. > > (found in scripdoc.tcl inside tclkit) Note that "package scripdoc" has been superceded by "package starkit". It is part of tclkit to maintain backward compatibility. I'm no longer that keen on it, for reasons to be described below. Let's try to find a higher vantage point. I would like to re-focus this by taking more aspects into consideration. Some people on this list may have opposing views on all this - so let's try to stay out of choices based on what exists, or what could exist, for the time being. We're moving towards a world with lots of packages, platforms, repositories, and target audiences. That's a lot of dimensions: - package names / authors / maintainers - versions - content: code, docs, demos, test suites, examples, datafiles, patches - platform specific files (compiled code) - inter-dependencies Everyone expects and wants something different from the above mix, and I no doubt left out other important aspects. Looking at this from a geostationary orbit (as I said: a different perspective), I see collections of files, and we all want to throw files in (new and revised), and pull specific subsets out, based on selections in one or more of the above dimensions. When it comes to repositories, I'd like to point out that we're not necessarily talking about a single one. There may be different sets, different packaging models, but also local intranet mirrors (or partial mirrors), and proprietary repositories. For example, I wouldn't mind dedicating a section of a local disk or a server as repository, and having all apps share it during development. At the other end of the scale, one could say that each app is a repository. In the end, it's about collections: what do you need to bring together to deliver an application? What is going to be considered infrastructure, and what is going to be treated as part of the application? Are there other deliverables - say in the case of application suites? How does one do "proxy apps", which get code at runtime from a server (and perhaps cache it)? For which aspects is it desirable to work with copies, and for which not? This is of course also what tclkit and starkits are all about. One problem IMO, is that we're all trying to shoehorn the "file soup" into a hierarchical tree. Which simply isn't a good fit: one dir per package-revision, say. Ok, inside one dir per platform? Ok, where do I put docs? Where do I put test suites? What about platform specific tests? Yes, there are answers. After all, we've come this far, so there must be. But it still gets messy. Suppose I'm evaluating things, and just want to see docs and examples. For a range of packages. Oh, and only those which work at least on a specified mix of platforms. If the basic model of all this is a hierarchy (dirs, xml, whatever), then IMO it's just going to be a messy traversal to come up with an answer for such a request. Let alone compare collections, or merge them. Maybe we can do better. Maybe we can treat this all as being about package collections, with people and apps needing subsets of various kinds. And conclude that naming conventions and package structure are secondary. This may not seem like much, but it might help with the discussion of how to do all this. For example, I really don't care whether a Win32 shared lib for jpeg support is placed at: tkimg-1.0/Windows/tcljpeg.dll or: 1.0/Release/From/activestate.com/Windows/tkimg/dlls/tcljpeg or: myjpeg.dll I don't even care whether all of the above are mixed up, or changed later on (other than that it might turn into a maintenance nightmare). What I do care about is usage scenario's, i.e. being able to do "package require blah 1.7283a12" and knowing what needs to be in place to make it work (during development as well as in deployed state). And understanding how updates can be managed and traced back through all this. What also will become important, is the search and historical archivation facilities of a repository, but that's really not new: every library must solve this, across all domains - not just Tcl or software. With "library" used in a very loose sense (from web sites to a single starkit). But again: it really doesn't matter how the library works, it could be a bunch of monkeys on bicycles for all I care - provided they work accurately and fast enough :) Anyway - this was a long-winded way of saying that there is no point in discussing design choices, when we haven't even charted all the dimensions involved... -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 31 09:27:46 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VFRjc17633 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:27:45 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0VFTWYc016481 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:29:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0VFTWV19514; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:29:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:29:32 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030131102932.AAB19502@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] tclkit help sought Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Platform SPARC Solaris 2.6, gcc 2.95.3 I downloaded the tar files, etc. from the tclkit source tars area. I ran the genkit A, genkit B tcl, genkit B, and cat'ed together the pieces. I set the permission mode. Now, I see this: $ ./tclkit application-specific initialization failed: couldn't read file "/vol/tclsrcsol/tcl84/tclkit/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4/init.tcl": Error 0 % The tar files, runtime, etc. were all downloaded today. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 31 09:34:31 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VFYVc18206 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:34:31 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0VFaHYc019192 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:36:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0VFaI019631; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:36:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:36:18 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030131103618.AAB19586@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] package collections In-Reply-To: of Fri, 31 Jan 2003 16:15:15 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Anyway - this was a long-winded way of saying that there is no point in > discussing design choices, when we haven't even charted all the > dimensions involved... What - requirements first? Heresy ... that's the way of logic, reason, order, ... Where's the fun in that ? Seriously, I agree with you - let's figure out more specifically what needs to be done. How does one generate requirements from some many diverse, possibly conflicting, needs? Do we need some sort of agreed upon common goal? Or do we just start writing down what we 'want'? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 31 09:43:16 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VFhFc19042 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:43:15 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0VFj2Yc021853 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:45:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0VFj2v19869; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:45:02 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:45:02 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030131104502.AAB19841@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] question about vfs.tar.gz in the tclkit build Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone looked at the current state of tclvfs and seen if it is ready to be used in the tclkit? I know there's been a lot of changes. And it appears to me there is a bug in the current CVS Makefile (a wrong directory is used during the libraries step). I just wasn't certain whether the vfs.tar.gz had had bug fixes put into it that might not be in tclvfs.sf.net's cvs. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@sr-tech.com Fri Jan 31 10:18:21 2003 Received: from server.sr-tech.com (h-69-3-36-98.NYCMNY83.covad.net [69.3.36.98]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VGIKc22628 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:18:20 -0600 Received: from secure.sr-tech.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server.sr-tech.com (8.12.1/SR-Technology) with ESMTP id h0VGIAps010228 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:18:10 -0500 From: "Steve Redler IV" To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] package collections Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:18:10 -0500 Message-Id: <20030131161810.M16395@sr-tech.com> X-Mailer: Open WebMail 1.81 20021212 X-OriginatingIP: 67.85.214.7 (steve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Due to the varied usage of starkits, their applications and their platforms, I would suggest to make a grid of sorts, whereby we can compare the many properties and how they relate to other properties. Start with a simple set of tables that can briefly define the attributes for these properties. For example, I deal with cross platform GUI apps, embedded server apps on Linux, and productivity apps on an Linux iPaq. Cross plat App Embeded App iPaq App compiled code avoid it ok ok documentation ok not needed ok proxy-app ok no network maybe minimal size got gigs ok ok kitchen sink ok possibly waste of space use starpaks ok possibly too big After all the "dimensions are charted" everone will have a better understanding of the requirements of the packaging system. Best Regards, -- Steve Redler IV, SCSE, SR Technology SR Tech Secure Webmail From Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jan 31 10:20:50 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VGKoc22912; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:20:50 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h0VGNJSD001436; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:23:19 -0700 (MST) Received: [from il02exb02.corp.mot.com (il02exb02.corp.mot.com [10.0.100.67]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA12156; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:22:43 -0700 (MST)] Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:22:43 -0700 (MST) From: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Message-Id: <200301311622.JAA12156@mothost.mot.com> Received: by il02exb02.corp.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:00:14 -0600 Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.7.187]) by IL02EXF01.DS.mot.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:00:12 -0600 To: To: Subject: [Starkit] (no subject) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0 Sender: rna020 Message-ID: <3E3A9D8B.7AEBC345@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:00:11 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] package collections References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Jan 2003 16:00:12.0642 (UTC) FILETIME=[D65F4420:01C2C941] Jean-Claude, My ideal solution (as viewed from 23K miles) is that vfs should be extended with functionality similar to CVS and ClearCase tagging. With this functionality, a starkit could be mounted with a platform and version specified and the vfs system would then provide an appropriate view of starkit contents. Tom K. PS. Sorry for the subject line problem. I have submitted a trouble ticket to the IS group. Hopefully it won't take years to resolve. [..snip..] > Note that "package scripdoc" has been superceded by "package starkit". > It is part of tclkit to maintain backward compatibility. I'm no longer > that keen on it, for reasons to be described below. > > Let's try to find a higher vantage point. I would like to re-focus > this by taking more aspects into consideration. Some people on this > list may have opposing views on all this - so let's try to stay out of > choices based on what exists, or what could exist, for the time being. > > We're moving towards a world with lots of packages, platforms, > repositories, and target audiences. That's a lot of dimensions: > - package names / authors / maintainers > - versions > - content: code, docs, demos, test suites, examples, datafiles, > patches > - platform specific files (compiled code) > - inter-dependencies > > Everyone expects and wants something different from the above mix, and > I no doubt left out other important aspects. > > Looking at this from a geostationary orbit (as I said: a different > perspective), I see collections of files, and we all want to throw > files in (new and revised), and pull specific subsets out, based on > selections in one or more of the above dimensions. > > When it comes to repositories, I'd like to point out that we're not > necessarily talking about a single one. There may be different sets, > different packaging models, but also local intranet mirrors (or partial > mirrors), and proprietary repositories. For example, I wouldn't mind > dedicating a section of a local disk or a server as repository, and > having all apps share it during development. At the other end of the > scale, one could say that each app is a repository. > > In the end, it's about collections: what do you need to bring together > to deliver an application? What is going to be considered > infrastructure, and what is going to be treated as part of the > application? Are there other deliverables - say in the case of > application suites? How does one do "proxy apps", which get code at > runtime from a server (and perhaps cache it)? For which aspects is it > desirable to work with copies, and for which not? This is of course > also what tclkit and starkits are all about. > > One problem IMO, is that we're all trying to shoehorn the "file soup" > into a hierarchical tree. Which simply isn't a good fit: one dir per > package-revision, say. Ok, inside one dir per platform? Ok, where do > I put docs? Where do I put test suites? What about platform specific > tests? > > Yes, there are answers. After all, we've come this far, so there must > be. > > But it still gets messy. Suppose I'm evaluating things, and just want > to see docs and examples. For a range of packages. Oh, and only those > which work at least on a specified mix of platforms. If the basic > model of all this is a hierarchy (dirs, xml, whatever), then IMO it's > just going to be a messy traversal to come up with an answer for such a > request. Let alone compare collections, or merge them. > > Maybe we can do better. Maybe we can treat this all as being about > package collections, with people and apps needing subsets of various > kinds. And conclude that naming conventions and package structure are > secondary. This may not seem like much, but it might help with the > discussion of how to do all this. For example, I really don't care > whether a Win32 shared lib for jpeg support is placed at: > tkimg-1.0/Windows/tcljpeg.dll > or: > 1.0/Release/From/activestate.com/Windows/tkimg/dlls/tcljpeg > or: > myjpeg.dll > > I don't even care whether all of the above are mixed up, or changed > later on (other than that it might turn into a maintenance nightmare). > > What I do care about is usage scenario's, i.e. being able to do > "package require blah 1.7283a12" and knowing what needs to be in place > to make it work (during development as well as in deployed state). And > understanding how updates can be managed and traced back through all > this. > > What also will become important, is the search and historical > archivation facilities of a repository, but that's really not new: > every library must solve this, across all domains - not just Tcl or > software. With "library" used in a very loose sense (from web sites to > a single starkit). But again: it really doesn't matter how the library > works, it could be a bunch of monkeys on bicycles for all I care - > provided they work accurately and fast enough :) > > Anyway - this was a long-winded way of saying that there is no point in > discussing design choices, when we haven't even charted all the > dimensions involved... From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jan 31 11:27:52 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VHRqc29551 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:27:52 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h0VHULSD018299 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:30:21 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA24731 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:28:42 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWC8HH; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:29:00 -0700 Message-ID: <3E3AB255.F5BD9F43@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:28:53 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Test Message (delete) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Delete this test message. I'm trying a different email proxy to see if it fixes my email header problem on mail to the outside. -- Tom Krehbiel From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Jan 31 11:38:50 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VHcoc30595 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:38:50 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0VHeUwq002907; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:40:31 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0VHeUB19016; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:40:30 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Larry W. Virden" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] question about vfs.tar.gz in the tclkit build Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:40:25 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <20030131104502.AAB19841@cas.org> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Has anyone looked at the current state of tclvfs and seen if it > is ready to be used in the tclkit? I know there's been a lot of > changes. And it appears to me there is a bug in the current CVS > Makefile (a wrong directory is used during the libraries step). This question confuses me ... tclvfs is already used in tclkit. I don't know what Makefile bug you are referring to, but I did make some changes and it works as expected for me. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 31 11:52:47 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VHqlc31888 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:52:47 -0600 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 18:54:39 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] question about vfs.tar.gz in the tclkit build Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1177A612-3545-11D7-9618-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: >> Has anyone looked at the current state of tclvfs and seen if it >> is ready to be used in the tclkit? I know there's been a lot of >> changes. And it appears to me there is a bug in the current CVS >> Makefile (a wrong directory is used during the libraries step). > > This question confuses me ... tclvfs is already used in tclkit. Tclkit VFS differs in two ways: - not all drivers from TclVFS are included (only Metakit and ZIP) - I work from a copy, stored in TclKit CVS, for things such as vfslib.tcl, mk4vfs.tcl, and a fer others That last one is a trade-off. At times, it helps me isolate things, and times it means tclkit can try out a few new things, and at times tclkit lags behind. I'm almost ready to merge a new feature back into TclVFS: on-the-fly zlib decompression (the current mk4vfs in tclkit uses an in-mem uncompressed copy of what is on file, using memchan/rechan). The change is backward compatible, and only activated in newer tclkit builds, which include an improved version of the zlib extension. It introduces a new "vfs::zstream" channel (r/o for now). Once that is done, things will be brought 100% in sync again. > I don't know what Makefile bug you are referring to, but I did > make some changes and it works as expected for me. Me neither. TclVFS's makefile is not used by genkit, just "vfs.c". -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Jan 31 11:55:55 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VHtsc32175 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:55:55 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0VHvhwq004720; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:57:43 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0VHvhB21957; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:57:43 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:57:42 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > profiling under Linux. I'm using the TclX package from kitten. ... > As you can see from the glob, it's there, and I actually I got it to > properly load once, by fooling around with auto_path or tcl_library or > tcl_libPath, but I have been unable to replicate it! > > Actually I copied the tclx8.4 directory from kitten.vfs/lib into my > vfs/lib and wrapped my app, but I can't get that to work either. > > Does anybody know how to get Tclx to load in this situation? Odd ... I have not been able to reproduce this using the Tcl Dev Kit, which has a similar setup. Adding Tclx leads to a successfule package require of it. Perhaps the TclX kitten package needs updating? Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 31 12:16:58 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VIGvc01738 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 12:16:57 -0600 Received: from srv23s4d.cas.org (srv23s4d [134.243.50.242]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0VIIiYc021857 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 13:18:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by srv23s4d.cas.org (8.8.8+Sun/m4_8.8.8/CAS_CLIENT-1.16) id NAA08170; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 13:18:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 13:18:46 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030131131846.AAB8156@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:53:26 -0600 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From the downloaded solaris starkit: $ tclkit % info pa 8.4.1 % source /ldatae/bin/kitten.kit % package require Tclx 153762couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tclWIa4kR": ld.so.1: tclkit: fatal: /var/tmp/tclWIa4kR: wrong ELF data format: ELFDATA2LSB % -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Jan 31 12:22:47 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VIMlc02322 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 12:22:47 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0VIOSwq007266; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:24:28 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0VIORB26971; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:24:27 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:24:22 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <20030131131846.AAB8156@cas.org> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > >From the downloaded solaris starkit: > > $ tclkit > % info pa > 8.4.1 > % source /ldatae/bin/kitten.kit > % package require Tclx > 153762couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tclWIa4kR": ld.so.1: tclkit: > fatal: /var/tmp/tclWIa4kR: wrong ELF data format: ELFDATA2LSB This looks like you grabbed the wrong kit architecture for TclX. Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Jan 31 12:25:28 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VIPSc02578 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 12:25:28 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h0VIR7wq007435; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:27:07 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h0VIR1B27352; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:27:07 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Semion Parancher" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starpacks with (.dll) files for Windows Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:26:56 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1255" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <6A2276F56A95224AA5AE83FD3DDF3585EA8A92@exrad2.ad.rad.co.il> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If you would like to use starkits but want something a little easier to use, try Tcl Dev Kit which turns the whole operation into a few clicks of a GUI. v2.5 now in beta is starkit-based: http://www.ActiveState.com/TclDevKit/beta Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions -----Original Message----- From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Semion Parancher ... Is it possible to create stand alone starpack (.exe) that includes .dll files for Windows platform ? ... And I want to use the Starpacks. I prepared one starpack but it doesn't work, and I received the next error message ... From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 31 12:27:56 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VIRtc02860 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 12:27:55 -0600 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:29:48 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: >> Actually I copied the tclx8.4 directory from kitten.vfs/lib into my >> vfs/lib and wrapped my app, but I can't get that to work either. >> >> Does anybody know how to get Tclx to load in this situation? > > Odd ... I have not been able to reproduce this using the Tcl Dev Kit, > which has a similar setup. Adding Tclx leads to a successfule package > require of it. Perhaps the TclX kitten package needs updating? Probably. I see the same problem here. It's not the shared lib that fails to load, but tclx failing to find its init files, which appears to be hard-wired: % package require Tclx Can't find a usable tclx.tcl in the following directories: /home/jcw/bin/tclkit/lib/tclx8.4 /home/jcw/lib/tclx8.4 /home/lib/tclx8.4 /home/jcw/library /home/library /home/tclx8.4.0/library /tclx8.4.0/library Workaround is perhaps to set an env or global var? I can easily adjust kitten when told what to fix and how. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 31 12:29:14 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VITDc02993; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 12:29:13 -0600 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:31:05 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <20030131131846.AAB8156@cas.org> Message-Id: <288BC0EE-354A-11D7-9618-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > From the downloaded solaris starkit: > > $ tclkit > % info pa > 8.4.1 > % source /ldatae/bin/kitten.kit > % package require Tclx > 153762couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tclWIa4kR": ld.so.1: tclkit: fatal: > /var/tmp/tclWIa4kR: wrong ELF data format: ELFDATA2LSB > % Unrelated. There is no tclx solaris build in kitten. There is also no naming convention yet, remember? So it tries to load the .so it finds, which is for Linux. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 31 12:48:58 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0VImwc04865 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 12:48:58 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h0VIojYc001686 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 13:50:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h0VIoj023550; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 13:50:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 13:50:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030131135045.AAB23151@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclX in a Starkit? In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:24:22 -0800 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Jeff Hobbs" > > % package require Tclx > > 153762couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tclWIa4kR": ld.so.1: tclkit: > > fatal: /var/tmp/tclWIa4kR: wrong ELF data format: ELFDATA2LSB > > This looks like you grabbed the wrong kit architecture for TclX. Alas, this is not in my control - as I showed, I just start a standard tclkit , source in the kitten.kit from the web site today, and do the package require. Must be a bug in kitten.kit . -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From damon@your.unreality.com Fri Jan 31 22:21:59 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h114Lxc10464 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 22:21:59 -0600 Received: (qmail 90169 invoked by uid 300); 1 Feb 2003 04:23:54 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 04:23:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 22:23:54 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Unbundling a Starpack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Would stripping the TclKit header from a Starpack produce a Starkit? D From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 1 10:28:03 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h11GS2c00807 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 10:28:02 -0600 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 17:29:57 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Unbundling a Starpack Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <66EA66E6-3602-11D7-B91E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > Would stripping the TclKit header from a Starpack produce a > Starkit? Yes and no - see http://www.equi4.com/191 All of the Tcl/Tk runtime files are also in the VFS part, so you will need to remove those. After such pruning, you will end up with the database part of a starkit. Add the header prefix and yes, that's it :) -jcw From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Sun Feb 2 17:25:28 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (root@vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h12NPRc21541 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 17:25:28 -0600 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (root@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h12NRKk14184 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:27:20 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.0.0.44) with SMTP id M2003020310271908856 for ; Mon, 03 Feb 2003 10:27:19 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h12NRIA14180; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:27:19 +1100 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] (no subject) From: Steve Cassidy To: Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <200301311432.HAA14343@mothost.mot.com> References: <200301311432.HAA14343@mothost.mot.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 03 Feb 2003 10:26:37 +1100 Message-Id: <1044228398.18152.4.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sat, 2003-02-01 at 01:32, Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com wrote: > > You know, no discovery _really_ needs to be done here. sdx.kit _could_ > > automatically create, in the startup script, the auto_path value. Discovery > > and interpretation of pkgIndex.tcl is one of the slower steps. Perhaps we > > could 'pre-compile' the info - either general, or even better, a proc > > that at run time sets the machine specific values without having to munge > > through all the directories to find it. You know - do the work one time, > > at compile time. > > I think this is a good idea. When sdx wraps a starkit it should include auto_path > discovery code for the platform. And when sdx wraps a starpack it > should include an appropreate platform value on the autopath. None of this is needed and discovery only needs to happen once -- on installation of the package. pkg_mkIndex is told to go look for package components, it does so and writes pkgIndex.tcl and then whenever the package is needed the right things get loaded. I believe this works most of the time, for thoese cases where it doesn't, a hand coded pkgIndex.tcl can be supplied until such time as we can see a generalisation and code it up (eg. in a fixed pkg_mkIndex). This works for starkits and regular tcl packages too. Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From andreask@ActiveState.com Mon Feb 3 12:45:31 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h13IjUc19597 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 12:45:31 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h13IlIwq016443 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:47:18 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h13IlIB12484 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:47:18 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] (no subject) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:47:18 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <1044228398.18152.4.camel@climie> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > On Sat, 2003-02-01 at 01:32, Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com wrote: > > > > You know, no discovery _really_ needs to be done here. > sdx.kit _could_ > > > automatically create, in the startup script, the auto_path > value. Discovery > > > and interpretation of pkgIndex.tcl is one of the slower > steps. Perhaps we > > > could 'pre-compile' the info - either general, or even better, a proc > > > that at run time sets the machine specific values without > having to munge > > > through all the directories to find it. You know - do the > work one time, > > > at compile time. > > > > I think this is a good idea. When sdx wraps a starkit it should > include auto_path > > discovery code for the platform. And when sdx wraps a starpack it > > should include an appropreate platform value on the autopath. I am not sure that auto_path discovery for binary packages is needed at all. One, install all packages in one directory, for example 'lib', instead of using a complicated directory in a package. Second, if there are more than one binary version of a package X in a starkit differentiate them via X-arch1 X-arch2, etc. The names archN can be freely chosen. Three, check in the pkgIndex.tcl files of these packages for the necessary conditions. I.e. the pkgIndex.tcl file for an i*86 binary will not register the package if tcl_platform indicates that the platform is sparc. Now only the binary packages for a specific platform are actually registered when tcl goes looking for packages, the packages not matching the platform are simply not known anymore. This is essentially the same mechanism used by a number of packages in tcllib which need a specific version of the core to run, applied to architecture dependencies. If the core is not, for example 8.2 or higher they simply don't register, and become unknown. Regarding item one above, this is optional. If the general code looking for package indices is extended to automatically look in all subdrectories it is no problem to store the different architectures for a binary package X into lib/X/arch1 lib/X/arch2 ... -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jgodfrey@optinest.com Mon Feb 3 14:45:19 2003 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h13KjJc29431 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:45:19 -0600 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id h13KkHb04509 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:46:21 -0600 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:50:43 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Subject: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I am (for the first time) trying to use tclkit on a non-Window system (specifically HPUX). So, I dl'd "tclkit-hpux-9000.gz" from equi4.com. Following the instructions, here's (the important parts of) my session: hpserv 34: mv tclkit-hpux-9000.gz tclkit.gz hpserv 36: gzip -d tclkit.gz hpserv 38: chmod 777 tclkit hpserv 39: ./tclkit /usr/lib/dld.sl: Can't open shared library: /usr/lib/libc.2 /usr/lib/dld.sl: No such file or directory IOT trap (core dumped) Having very little experience with Unix build environments (or *any* build environment, for that matter), I'm stumped. I assume that tclkit needs to be built differently, so this stuff is static instead of shared? Any help appreciated. Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA Phone: 816.836.2000 Fax : 816.836.8589 Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Mon Feb 3 18:12:29 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h140CSc13347 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:12:28 -0600 Received: (qmail 6971 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 00:14:23 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2003 00:14:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 08:14:23 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: "Starkit mailing list" To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <9CE3B292-37D5-11D7-80D8-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote ... > (for the first time) trying to use tclkit on a non-Window system > (specifically HPUX). So, I dl'd "tclkit-hpux-9000.gz" from equi4.com. > Following the instructions, here's (the important parts of) my session: > > hpserv 34: mv tclkit-hpux-9000.gz tclkit.gz > hpserv 36: gzip -d tclkit.gz > hpserv 38: chmod 777 tclkit > hpserv 39: ./tclkit > /usr/lib/dld.sl: Can't open shared library: /usr/lib/libc.2 > /usr/lib/dld.sl: No such file or directory > IOT trap (core dumped) > > Having very little experience with Unix build environments (or *any* > build > environment, for that matter), I'm stumped. I assume that tclkit > needs to > be built differently, so this stuff is static instead of shared? Except that it isn't possible (or, rather, I couldn't find a way to do it). HP-UX isn't my favourite OS ... to put it mildly. I did the Tclkit port because one of my customers needed it for a product. Anyway, the first thing to establish is whether you've got a PA-RISC machine and HP-UX 11. FWIW, there are (at least) a few people who are using the HP-UX tclkit successfully, so it may be something on the particular machine. Do "uname -a" - you should see something like HP-UX xxxxxx B.11.00 U 9000/800 20053xxxxxx unlimited-user license The key thing is to make sure you are running HP-UX 11.0 on a PA-RISC machine - either PA-RISC 1.1 or 2 ... the binary is built to be compatible with both. One thing that does make me suspicious is the message about /usr/lib/libc.2 not being available - are there any versions of libc in /usr/lib? Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Mon Feb 3 18:46:52 2003 Received: from dewey.iland.net (dewey.iland.net [205.242.230.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h140kqc15981 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:46:52 -0600 Received: (qmail 17963 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 00:48:37 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-203-7.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.203.7) by dewey.iland.net with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 00:48:37 -0000 Message-ID: <005e01c2cbe7$0c8c4b40$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <9CE3B292-37D5-11D7-80D8-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:47:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 1/31/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, See my comments below ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Landers" To: "Jeff Godfrey" Cc: "Starkit mailing list" Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 6:14 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? > Jeff Godfrey wrote ... > > > environment, for that matter), I'm stumped. I assume that tclkit > > needs to > > be built differently, so this stuff is static instead of shared? > > Except that it isn't possible (or, rather, I couldn't find a way to do > it). > > HP-UX isn't my favourite OS ... to put it mildly. I did the Tclkit port > because one of my customers needed it for a product. > > Anyway, the first thing to establish is whether you've got a PA-RISC > machine and HP-UX 11. > > FWIW, there are (at least) a few people who are using the HP-UX tclkit > successfully, so it may be something on the particular machine. > > Do "uname -a" - you should see something like > HP-UX xxxxxx B.11.00 U 9000/800 20053xxxxxx unlimited-user license hpserv 29: uname -a HP-UX hpserv B.10.20 A 9000/851 2003026773 two-user license Hmmm... Seems it is running 10.2, not 11. > The key thing is to make sure you are running HP-UX 11.0 on a PA-RISC > machine - either PA-RISC 1.1 or 2 ... the binary is built to be > compatible with both. > > One thing that does make me suspicious is the message about > /usr/lib/libc.2 not being available - are there any versions of libc in > /usr/lib? hpserv 30: ls -l /usr/lib/libc.* -r-xr-xr-x 1 bin bin 1863680 Nov 10 1999 /usr/lib/libc.1* -r--r--r-- 1 bin bin 2456532 Nov 10 1999 /usr/lib/libc.a lrwxrwxrwx 1 root sys 15 Jul 8 2002 /usr/lib/libc.sl@ -> /usr/lib/libc.1 Does this shed light on anything? Thanks for any input. Jeff From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Mon Feb 3 19:00:20 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1410Jc16997 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 19:00:19 -0600 Received: (qmail 7069 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 01:02:15 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2003 01:02:15 -0000 Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 09:02:15 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <005e01c2cbe7$0c8c4b40$0101a8c0@quantex> Message-Id: <4CC1AA8B-37DC-11D7-80D8-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, On Tuesday, February 4, 2003, at 08:47 AM, Jeff Godfrey wrote: > hpserv 29: uname -a > HP-UX hpserv B.10.20 A 9000/851 2003026773 two-user license > > Hmmm... Seems it is running 10.2, not 11. Yep - that'll do it :-( I don't have access to a 10.2 box, so you'll need to build Tclkit on HP-UX 10.2 ... assuming you have the compilers available. It's worth doing, but not as easier as other platforms. I can help/talk you through it. Alternatively, there may be someone else on the list with a 10.2 box who'd be willing to give it a try? Let me know Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Mon Feb 3 22:29:28 2003 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h144TSc29101 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 22:29:28 -0600 Received: (qmail 4118 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 04:31:27 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-50.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.50) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 04:31:27 -0000 Message-ID: <000501c2cc06$2e59c3a0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <4CC1AA8B-37DC-11D7-80D8-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 22:30:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 1/31/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Landers" To: "Jeff Godfrey" Cc: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 7:02 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? > Jeff, > > On Tuesday, February 4, 2003, at 08:47 AM, Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > > hpserv 29: uname -a > > HP-UX hpserv B.10.20 A 9000/851 2003026773 two-user license > > > > Hmmm... Seems it is running 10.2, not 11. > > Yep - that'll do it :-( > > I don't have access to a 10.2 box, so you'll need to build Tclkit on > HP-UX 10.2 ... assuming you have the compilers available. > > It's worth doing, but not as easier as other platforms. I can help/talk > you through it. > > Alternatively, there may be someone else on the list with a 10.2 box > who'd be willing to give it a try? Steve, I do have access to the necessary build tools. Although I'm quite rusty at this, it's not *completely* foreign to me.. so I'm game if you don't mind giving me a push in the right direction. Thanks, Jeff From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Tue Feb 4 00:20:07 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h146K5c02815 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 00:20:06 -0600 Received: (qmail 7751 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 06:22:01 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2003 06:22:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 14:21:57 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit-hpux-9000 shared libraries? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <000501c2cc06$2e59c3a0$0101a8c0@quantex> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, > I do have access to the necessary build tools. Although I'm quite > rusty at > this, it's not *completely* foreign to me.. so I'm game if you don't > mind > giving me a push in the right direction The best starting point is http://www.equi4.com/218 - this describes the Tclkit build process and, in particular, "genkit" - the script that tries to do most of the work for you. Also, look in http://www.equi4.com/222 for platform specific issues. I suggest we take this off list now and report back once we have success :-) Cheers Steve From jahbini@lava.net Tue Feb 4 23:27:03 2003 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{T37ZNRgL+DNtCvf4hu37dEKc/hPKV6HE}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h155R2c05899 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 23:27:03 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com [64.65.110.34]) by malasada.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75EAE17A00F for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 19:28:58 -1000 (HST) Message-ID: <3E40A11A.7A514FF6@lava.net> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 19:28:58 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.18-6mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpacks with (.dll) files for Windows References: <6A2276F56A95224AA5AE83FD3DDF3585EA8A92@exrad2.ad.rad.co.il> Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I had this DLL problem with imglib which wants access to a windows jpeg dll.  Tclkit knew all about copying imglib out to a temp directory, but imglib (even stub enabled) just used a vanilla Windos OS call to load its helper library.

The solution was pretty simple: just prior to issuing the tcl LOAD of the imglib, put a statement to FILE COPY the needed DLL into the windows C:\windows\temp directory, CD into that directory.  The tcl LOAD worked.

The code I used:
 

 proc catch_and_load { lib } {
                set f [file join $::bindir $lib ]
                set d [file join $::tempdir $lib ]
                file copy -force $f $d
                if { [ catch { load $d } result ] } {
                show_error "failed dll load of $f result = $result"
                } else {
                #newLine "\nOK dll tempdir load of $f result = $result"
                }
        }

set fdest [ file join $::tempdir jpeg62.dll ]
if { [file exists $fdest ] } {
          if [ catch { file delete  $fdest } errms ] {
#Windows won't let us delete this DLL if it is in use.  We don't want to start the app twice.
                  show_error "Another copy of application may be active, please manually stop all, then delete $fdest, and re-start"
                  }
          }

file copy [ file join $::bindir jpeg62.dll ] $fdest
 

set ::bindir [file join $::starkit::topdir bin]
set tempdir [file join "c:/" windows temp]
cd $tempdir
catch_and_load img13.dll
 

Y'r Ob'd't S'v't

Jim Hinds
 

Semion Parancher wrote:

 Hi All !Is it possible to create stand alone starpack (.exe) that includes .dll files for Windows platform ?I wrote few Tcl packages by Tcl/Tk and LabWindowsCVI (c,c++), and these packages usually consist of  .tcl and .dll files.Many applications were created based on these packages, and working under Windows 98.I distribute these applications to other PCs that don't have Tcl/Tk by Wise InstallBuilder.I build Application directory with subdirectories as bin,lib of Tcl which are needed for  PCs without Tcl/Tk in order to run the Tcl applications.All of the procedure I described above works fine, but now I wont to distribute my applications as stand alone run time file (.exe). And I want to use the Starpacks.I prepared one starpack but it doesn't work, and I received the next error message :" 5233couldn't load library I/O error while load c:/Myapp.exe/lib/Mylib/my.dll". Further more, I tried to work with your tcl84dok.kit that include tkhtml.dll. which I downloaded from your site, and prepared tcl84dok.exe starpack by using the "sdx tcl84dok.exe -runtime tclkit.exe" command.When I run tcl84dok.exe I get the next error message: " 8083couldn't load library I/O error while load c:/tcl84dok.exe/lib/arch/Windows/tkhtml0.0/tkhtml.dll".When using the "tclkit.exe tcl84dok.kit" command all work fine.Please advise. Regard's
Parancher Semion

Automatic Test Equipment Development Dep.
RAD Data Communications Ltd.
Phone: +972-3-6455145
Fax : +972-3-6488785
Email:         semion_p@rad.co.il
Web Site:   www.rad.com
 
   
From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Thu Feb 6 07:32:57 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [216.35.73.165]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16DWuc10088 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:32:57 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net [3.159.236.68]) by ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h16DYnZu010985 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:34:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h16DYhNu003327 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:34:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by cin01ssbhmailge.gemail.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id <1DD3ZX0M>; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:31:25 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:31:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I came across this oddity the other day and was wondering if anyone else has experienced it. It seems that Tk will not load in Tclkit if argv contains "-help" or a substring of "-help", ie. "-h", "-he", or "-hel". The following is an example that shows the problem using tclkit interactively, although I found the problem developing a starkit. What to do about this? # tclkit % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version 200211.001 % set argv -help -help % set argc [llength $argv] 1 % package require Tk couldn't load library "/homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory % set argv -helpx -helpx % package require Tk 8.4 - Bryan From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 6 07:47:17 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16DlGc11205 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:47:16 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 14:49:13 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) wrote: > I came across this oddity the other day and was wondering if anyone > else has experienced it. It seems that Tk will not load in Tclkit if > argv contains "-help" or a substring of > "-help", ie. "-h", "-he", or "-hel". The following is an example that > shows the problem using tclkit interactively, although I found the > problem developing a starkit. What to do > about this? > > # tclkit > % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version > 200211.001 > % set argv -help > -help > % set argc [llength $argv] > 1 > % package require Tk > couldn't load library > "/homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or > directory > % set argv -helpx > -helpx > % package require Tk > 8.4 Yes, you're caught by a couple of "unfortunates": Here's using the very latest build of tclkit from pub/tk/newer/ - which no longer messes up error messages from Tk: % set argv -help -help % set argc [llength $argv] 1 % package require Tk Command-specific options: -colormap: Colormap for main window -display: Display to use -geometry: Initial geometry for window -name: Name to use for application -sync: Use synchronous mode for display server -visual: Visual for main window -use: Id of window in which to embed application --: Pass all remaining arguments through to script % So at least that will explain what is really going on underneath. What you've hit is Tk behavior: Tk scans and "eats" some args when launched. IMO this is a design mistake (in the context of starting up tclsh and launching Tk as a package) - but we're stuck with it, at least for the time being. Workaround is to insert a "--" arg to prevent Tk from picking up things: % set argv "-- -help" -- -help % set argc 2 2 % package require Tk 8.4 % There's more nastiness of a similar nature ("-file" arg in starpacks), which required a minor patch to the Tk code base - this is the last remaining issue standing between Tclkit and using a 100% standard Tcl/Tk distribution. -jcw From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Thu Feb 6 08:44:48 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net [216.34.191.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16Eimc15758 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:44:48 -0600 Received: from int-ch1gw-4.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-4 [3.159.232.68]) by ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h16Ekck6014778 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:46:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from pri01dirnage.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-4.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h16EkV2i007028 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:46:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by pri01dirnage.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id <1D6MB2AJ>; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:43:49 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:43:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have been using the "--" trick, in fact my standard main.tcl has a logic to preprocess argv before it ever reaches my app-xxx scripts. It sorts the Tk and application options and stuffs a "--" between them. What struck me odd about this is that "-help" (and substrings of it) seemed to trigger bad behavior where other arguments did not. I think that "-help" is actually an unreported option of Tk (wish) that simply dumps help info to the screen and exits. If anyone is interested in my main.tcl lemme know and I will post it. #tclkit % set argv -cheese -cheese % package require Tk 8.4 #tclkit % set argv -h -h % package require Tk couldn't load library "/homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory % -----Original Message----- From: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 8:32 AM To: 'starkit@equi4.com' Subject: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity I came across this oddity the other day and was wondering if anyone else has experienced it. It seems that Tk will not load in Tclkit if argv contains "-help" or a substring of "-help", ie. "-h", "-he", or "-hel". The following is an example that shows the problem using tclkit interactively, although I found the problem developing a starkit. What to do about this? # tclkit % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version 200211.001 % set argv -help -help % set argc [llength $argv] 1 % package require Tk couldn't load library "/homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory % set argv -helpx -helpx % package require Tk 8.4 - Bryan _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Feb 6 08:45:41 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16Ejec15859 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:45:40 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id PAA09746 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 15:47:39 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA09212 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 15:47:29 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E427581.CDEFBE90@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 15:47:29 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > What you've hit is Tk behavior: Tk scans and "eats" some args when > launched. IMO this is a design mistake (in the context of starting up > tclsh and launching Tk as a package) - but we're stuck with it, at > least for the time being. > This is rather standard behaviour for X/Xt programs: they pick out the interesting bits and pieces at start-up (XAppInitialise() or something) and leave the rest to the application itself. Regards, Arjen From dgporter@erols.com Thu Feb 6 08:52:28 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16EqRc16398 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:52:27 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVb8eMXEghW2ywd3ZleVwyquYl78jvZ5+PTyt8P/slWo5DesbEuGIW7wcReRtsE0fXg= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18gnQ2-0006IF-00; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:54:26 -0500 Message-ID: <3E42771E.2080501@erols.com> Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:54:22 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Arjen Markus CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity References: <3E427581.CDEFBE90@wldelft.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: >>What you've hit is Tk behavior: Tk scans and "eats" some args when >>launched. IMO this is a design mistake (in the context of starting up >>tclsh and launching Tk as a package) - but we're stuck with it, at >>least for the time being. Arjen Markus wrote: > This is rather standard behaviour for X/Xt programs: ...for programs, yes. So, I agree that it is correct behavior for the wish program to do this. However, as JCW correctly notes, the Tk package should not be doing this. This is all an historical legacy from the days when the only way to get Tk was by running a special program, like wish. There are a handful of similar issues in Tk, and I expect in time the migration to a well-behaved package will be completed. Bug reports and Feature Requests should help speed things. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| From mjacobson@northropgrumman.com Thu Feb 6 09:21:16 2003 Received: from xcgmd811.northgrum.com (xcgmd811.northgrum.com [155.104.240.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16FLFc18804 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:21:15 -0600 Received: by xcgmd811.northgrum.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) id ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:27:47 -0800 Message-ID: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1FA7@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> From: "Jacobson, Michael P." To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:15:40 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] Problem with Lastest TclKit and BWidget Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Windows using the TclKit (upx and non upxed version) dated 2-4-03 I get the following error whenever BWidget is loaded with a "package require". error seeking to end of file "C:/StarDom.kit/lib/bwidget1.4.1/lang/en.rc":bad file number while executing "option read [file join $::BWIDGET::LIBRARY "lang" "en.rc"]" ... This kit application works fine on the 11-04-02 release of TclKit. Michael Jacobson Senior Software Engineer, APG-68 Northrop Grumman ESSS From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 6 09:33:30 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16FXTc19834; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:33:29 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 16:35:27 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with Lastest TclKit and BWidget Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" To: "Jacobson, Michael P." From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE1FA7@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> Message-Id: <9DBEC512-39E8-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Michael P. wrote: > On Windows using the TclKit (upx and non upxed version) dated 2-4-03 I > get > the following error whenever BWidget is loaded with a "package > require". > > error seeking to end of file > "C:/StarDom.kit/lib/bwidget1.4.1/lang/en.rc":bad file number while > executing > "option read [file join $::BWIDGET::LIBRARY "lang" "en.rc"]" > ... > > This kit application works fine on the 11-04-02 release of TclKit. Thanks for reporting this. It's interesting that you're hitting the same file as one I had a few days ago. That may be a valuable hint. Yes, there is some problem with the new zlib on-the-fly decompress code in the latest experimental builds of tclkit. There is a workaround: set mk4vfs::zstreamed 0 Do that anywhere before package require BWidget, and things will resort to the original code. I'm working on this. It's good to see others banging on the latest builds! -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 6 09:34:42 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16FYgc19954 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:34:42 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h16FaXEu004612 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:36:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h16FaXH02363; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:36:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:36:33 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030206103633.AAB2324@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] wikit under cgi question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am trying to get a wikit running under apache on redhat. I wrote my cgi script to cd into the wikit directory (which has 777 permissions), then starts tclkit wikit.kit wikit.tkd . I get the "My Wiki" first page. However, when I click on the Help link, I get a URL of http://my_url/cgi-bin/3 and the error: Object not found! The requested URL was not found on this server. If you entered the URL manually please check your spelling and try again. If you think this is a server error, please contact the webmaster Error 404 my_url Thu 06 Feb 2003 10:35:17 AM EST Apache/2.0.40 (Red Hat Linux) Is there something else I am missing here? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 6 10:16:29 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16GGSc23824 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:16:29 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h16GIMwq008781 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:18:22 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn7.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.237]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h16GIMB31550 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:18:22 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:18:36 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <3E42771E.2080501@erols.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > >>What you've hit is Tk behavior: Tk scans and "eats" some args when > >>launched. IMO this is a design mistake (in the context of starting up > >>tclsh and launching Tk as a package) - but we're stuck with it, at > >>least for the time being. > > Arjen Markus wrote: > > This is rather standard behaviour for X/Xt programs: > > ...for programs, yes. So, I agree that it is correct behavior for > the wish program to do this. > > However, as JCW correctly notes, the Tk package should not be doing > this. > > This is all an historical legacy from the days when the only way to get > Tk was by running a special program, like wish. I have already noted in the bug report that I oppose this change, and it just struck me why this can't be changed anytime in the near future. The consumption of argv by Tk is key at startup for some things because it's the only way that some initial args get to the main window that will be created. The plugin *requires* this behavior to operate - it's the only way to pass args to Tk at load time. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Feb 6 10:34:23 2003 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16GYNc25606 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:34:23 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18gp0f-0002oG-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 16:36:21 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206163449.01df0e80@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 16:36:20 +0000 To: "Starkit list" From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity In-Reply-To: References: <3E42771E.2080501@erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 08:18 AM 2/6/2003 -0800, Jeffrey Hobbs wrote: >I have already noted in the bug report that I oppose this change, >and it just struck me why this can't be changed anytime in the near >future. The consumption of argv by Tk is key at startup for some >things because it's the only way that some initial args get to the >main window that will be created. The plugin *requires* this >behavior to operate - it's the only way to pass args to Tk at load >time. But that is, surely, because the plugin is pretending to be "Wish" and not just "Tk"? Or what args in particular is it that need to reach the main window? Vince. From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 6 10:39:47 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16Gdjc26139 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:39:45 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h16Gfdwq011097; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:41:39 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn7.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.237]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h16GfcB02557; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:41:38 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Vince Darley" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:41:53 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206163449.01df0e80@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > >future. The consumption of argv by Tk is key at startup for some > >things because it's the only way that some initial args get to the > >main window that will be created. The plugin *requires* this > >behavior to operate - it's the only way to pass args to Tk at load > But that is, surely, because the plugin is pretending to be "Wish" and not > just "Tk"? Or what args in particular is it that need to reach the main > window? Well ... that's an interesting first question. Is the plugin Tk or Wish? I would say "Tk". It's not the wish plugin, it's the Tcl/Tk plugin. In any case, what happens is that (in the in-process case), the main interpreter creates a safe slave, and sets the -use value for the '.' window to know what internal window of the browser to use. I've also made demos on clt that indicate how a pure Tcl server could control launch multiple Tk sessions anyway with slave interps using the -display arg set in argv. Jeff From dgporter@erols.com Thu Feb 6 10:51:57 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16Gpuc27405 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:51:56 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVY/fXAqVg9Z8wyUwsTxTWf1zjNTMiyis5EUlhXVph0h3kV46l1UYuAnauEltVOvtwg= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18gpHf-0007KC-00; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 11:53:55 -0500 Message-ID: <3E429323.6030202@erols.com> Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 11:53:55 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jeff@hobbs.org CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeffrey Hobbs wrote: > I have already noted in the bug report that I oppose this change, > and it just struck me why this can't be changed anytime in the near > future. The consumption of argv by Tk is key at startup for some > things because it's the only way that some initial args get to the > main window that will be created. Uh, yes. Automatic creation of the main window "." is another in that handful of things that wish ought to do, but Tk should not. No auto-creation of "." means no necessary dependence on an X server or equivalent means we can finally use Tk's [image] command on a headless server. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Thu Feb 6 10:51:48 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16Gpmc27384 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:51:48 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1 [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h16GrdOi006655; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:53:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h16GrXWF017302; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:53:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16GrWr05207; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:53:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.9.3+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id LAA06640; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:53:32 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200302061653.LAA06640@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: jeff@hobbs.org cc: "Vince Darley" , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Jeffrey Hobbs" of "Thu, 06 Feb 2003 08:41:53 PST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 11:53:32 -0500 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: jeffh@activestate.com said: > In any case, what happens is that (in the in-process case), the main > interpreter creates a safe slave, and sets the -use value for the '.' > window to know what internal window of the browser to use. > I've also made demos on clt that indicate how a pure Tcl server could > control launch multiple Tk sessions anyway with slave interps using > the -display arg set in argv. Hmm, I wonder. Couldn't [package require Tk] look in a different variable, perhaps ::tk::argv, that's initialized from ::argv by Wish initialization? That would solve the problem of having Tk hijack some other app's args. What am I missing? -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Feb 6 10:59:14 2003 Received: from smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16GxEc28145 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:59:14 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18gpOi-000FH8-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 17:01:12 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206165818.01dbcbc0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 17:01:09 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity In-Reply-To: <3E429323.6030202@erols.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 11:53 AM 2/6/2003 -0500, Donald G Porter wrote: >Uh, yes. Automatic creation of the main window "." is another in that >handful of things that wish ought to do, but Tk should not. > >No auto-creation of "." means no necessary dependence on an X server or >equivalent means we can finally use Tk's [image] command on a headless >server. Yes, exactly! I couldn't agree more. Vince. From dgporter@erols.com Thu Feb 6 10:59:20 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16GxKc28157 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:59:20 -0600 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVavrLl4a72Q1c4UVvfZD2vqw06rn8K2rCnfeyRQ5wFPdF++Xn25kZCYFNyuB6DN2bo= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 18gpOo-0000o1-00; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 12:01:19 -0500 Message-ID: <3E4294DE.3030006@erols.com> Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 12:01:18 -0500 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dgporter@erols.com CC: jeff@hobbs.org, Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity References: <3E429323.6030202@erols.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Donald G Porter wrote: > No auto-creation of "." means no necessary dependence on an X server or > equivalent means we can finally use Tk's [image] command on a headless > server. ...and that we could [pkg_mkIndex] Tk on a headless machine as well. Ditto the indexing of any package that depends on Tk. Tk Bug 509974. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 6 11:07:42 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16H7gc29036 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:07:42 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h16H9XEu006771 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 12:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h16H9Yf04040; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 12:09:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 12:09:34 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030206120934.AAB4021@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206163449.01df0e80@mail.wolfbusiness.com> of Thu, 06 Feb 2003 16:36:20 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: Tk's need to munch on command line arguments Is Tk the only extension which needs this functionality? Or is this functionality which would be better served to generalize so that any extension could do such munching... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Feb 6 12:37:58 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16Ibwc05182; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 12:37:58 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h16Idrst016080; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:39:54 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA27293; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:39:56 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWDBB6; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:39:55 -0700 Message-ID: <3E42ABFB.6F207F0B@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 11:39:55 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jeff@hobbs.org CC: Starkit list , Jean-Claude Wippler References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] tclkit + vu problem on HPUX Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I did some testing of the stripchart extension (from the vu package) under tclkit and run into a problem on HP-UX. I just ran tclkit and typed in the test command. I ran tests on both Solaris and HP-UX and Solaris didn't seem to have a problem. The problem occurred during the package require command on HP-UX as shown below. % package require vu couldn't find procedure Vu_Init What makes this strange is that a package require using wish (from ActiveTcl) on HP-UX doesn't have this problem. Tom Krehbiel From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Thu Feb 6 17:35:35 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16NZYc08443 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:35:35 -0600 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h16NbWR20177 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:37:32 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([127.0.0.1]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.0.0.44) with SMTP id M2003020710373124975 for ; Fri, 07 Feb 2003 10:37:31 +1100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (steve@climie.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.240.224]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h16NbSk20162; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:37:28 +1100 (EST) Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit under cgi question From: Steve Cassidy To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20030206103633.AAB2324@cas.org> References: <20030206103633.AAB2324@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 Date: 07 Feb 2003 10:36:35 +1100 Message-Id: <1044574595.18152.223.camel@climie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 02:36, Larry W. Virden wrote: > I am trying to get a wikit running under apache on redhat. > > I wrote my cgi script to cd into the wikit directory (which has 777 > permissions), then starts tclkit wikit.kit wikit.tkd . > I get the "My Wiki" first page. > > However, when I click on the Help link, I get a URL of http://my_url/cgi-bin/3 You accessed your wiki without a trailing / and so the relative link it generated (eg. help) resolved to the same directory as your wiki rather than being appended to the wiki url. The answer is to access http://my_url/cgi_bin/mywiki.cgi/ -- note the trailing slash. It seems that this common problem could be fixed by checking inside the wiki by generating absolute rather than relative links. Is there a reason that this isn't possible? Steve -- Steve Cassidy........Computing, Macquarie University, Sydney, Australia ............................. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 7 05:35:23 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17BZMc32406 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 05:35:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h17BbFEu013331 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:37:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h17BbGr07204; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:37:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:37:16 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030207063715.AAB7148@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit under cgi question In-Reply-To: <1044574595.18152.223.camel@climie> of 07 Feb 2003 10:36:35 +1100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Steve Cassidy > > On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 02:36, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > I am trying to get a wikit running under apache on redhat. > > > > I wrote my cgi script to cd into the wikit directory (which has 777 > > permissions), then starts tclkit wikit.kit wikit.tkd . > > I get the "My Wiki" first page. > > > > However, when I click on the Help link, I get a URL of http://my_url/cgi-bin/3 > > You accessed your wiki without a trailing / and so the relative link > it generated (eg. help) resolved to the same > directory as your wiki rather than being appended to the wiki url. The > answer is to access http://my_url/cgi_bin/mywiki.cgi/ -- note the > trailing slash. Hmm - I thought this was going to be the solution. And in fact, it does solve the problem - sort of... However, this morning after reading the wikit page on cgi, I updated my wikit script to set the WIKIT_BASE as is recommended as an alternative - since I don't have control over whether a user includes that trailing slash or not. I end up with the problem again if I say: export WIKIT_BASE=http://myurl/~lvirden/cgi-bin/wiki/ cd /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/wikit-data/ exec /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/tclkit-linux-x86 /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/wikit-data/wikit.kit /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/wikit-data/wikit.tkd in my wikit cgi script. In fact, the problem is worse after this - because now even when I DO put the trailing slash in the browser location, the behavior is the same. So I've commented out the WIKIT_BASE setting temporarily. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 7 05:47:30 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17BlTc00841 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 05:47:29 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h17BnMEu016420 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h17BnN307408; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:49:23 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:49:23 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030207064923.AAB7308@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit under cgi question In-Reply-To: <20030207063715.AAB7148@cas.org> of Fri, 7 Feb 2003 06:37:16 -0500 (EST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've got a different question and I can't tell if this is a wikit problem or a CGI - if it is cgi, I'll go off and figure out with the site administrator how to fix it. After commenting out that BASE, I was playing with the empty wikit and noticed that there are some 'empty' links (starkit, tclkit, etc.) so I clicked on starkit to fill it in. When I pressed the save button, I see this screen: An internal error was detected in the service software. The diagnostics are being emailed to the service system administrator (nowhere@to.go). with this URL in the location field: http://www.maypark.com/~lvirden/cgi-bin/wikit/10 It appears to be from cgi.tcl Is there a WIKIT_ADMIN_EMAIL environment variable so that wikit can mail off an appropriate error? Or does wikit need to generate some kind of message into the server logs so that the administrator knows what the problem is? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 7 07:25:31 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17DPVc10033 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 07:25:31 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h17DROEu019188 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:27:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h17DRO808921; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:27:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:27:24 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030207082724.AAB8906@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I know I can hack the wikit code to set alternate fonts, font sizes, colors, window sizes, etc. But I was wondering if anyone has figured out whether you can set these types of values via X resources - and if so, what the naming will be to get through the layers to the actual application? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 7 08:38:37 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17Ecac17251 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:38:36 -0600 Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:40:35 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1E0E117F-3AAA-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: SUMMARY As Starkits and related technology (Tclkit, VFS, etc) have matured, more and more people are coming to rely on them every day. Not only has this led to better quality and fewer bugs, but many people are coming forward with ideas for new developments ... particularly in the area of repositories, distribution and deployment. Because of this, it is an opportune time to review the state of Starkits and related technology, and preview some future developments - in particular, Starchive. Starchive is the successor to SDarchive - the Starkit Developer Archive. But it will be quite different in structure. It has been described as more like a cloud of "atoms" that are combined on the fly to make a Starkit, which is then delivered to your desktop. Imagine if, when building an application, you could check the list of components/packages needed - perhaps some cross platform pure Tcl packages, compiled extensions for a few platforms, etc ... and then have a new Starkit delivered to your desktop ready to form the basis of your application. But Starchive will also know the dependencies between packages. If you enable, for example, the Wikit checkbox because you want to include a local mode wiki in your application, then Starchive will deduce that you'll also need autoscroll, cgi, gbutton as well as the wikit package, and will add those to the Starkit it delivers. You'll also want to be able to keep your Starkits up to date - Starchive makes use of a new technology called Starsync which makes that very practical. Starsync can automatically and incrementally update a Starkit if one of its components changes. So, read on and see what all this star stuff is about! - STATUS OF STARKITS - NEXT RELEASES - STARKIT VERSIONS - SDARCHIVE IS COOL - INTRODUCING STARSYNC - STARCHIVE - ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS STATUS OF STARKITS Starkits have been around for some time now, though it was only last summer that the name was made public and more final details were hammered out. Tclkit 8.4 of Sep 2002 supports them, but the best release is now Tclkit 8.4.1 of Nov 2002. As of Oct 2002, ActiveTcl 8.4.1.0 also has all the components needed to run starkits (TclVFS, Metakit, etc). There are over two dozen platform builds of Tclkit. On Macintosh, starkits are more or less supported for both Classic (OS 7.5.5..9.2.2, PPC and 68K), and for the current Mach/BSD based OS X (both an X11 version and a first Aqua release of Tk). The "best" URLs for the latest information on these items are: http://www.equi4.com/starkit http://www.equi4.com/tclkit http://tcl.activestate.com/ Note that www.equi4.com is now based on wikit, so you can do searches, eg: http://www.equi4.com/star http://www.equi4.com/cgi* Lastly, I'd like to mention that there is now a bug tracking system on the Equi4 Software website. Long overdue, but... better late than never: http://www.equi4.com/bugs NEXT RELEASES Tclkit is being readied for a new 8.4.2 release as soon as Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 is out, which is later this month, if all goes well. The main changes planned are: * new on-the-fly decompression of files in VFS (less mem use) * change incrtcl from static-linked to shared lib (keep inside Tclkit) * ability to build threaded versions * support for customizable icon on Windows * bug fixes, including some platform-specific ones This is not an exhaustive list, just what came to mind right now. Most changes are finishing touches, really. Tclkit is maturing now. The baseline of Tclkit has been better defined , this should make it clear what part of Tclkit can be used safely without risking future incompatibilities. Nobody is perfect, but at least it documents the goals. Tclkit 8.4.1 is going to remain the baseline for future releases, i.e. the intention is to keep starkits maximally compatible with "8.4.1 and later". The reason to pick 8.4.1 is that it is stable, and that it is available for such a large range of platforms. STARKIT VERSIONS Starkits are a packaging technology, i.e. a "hull", not contents. This implies that often starkits do not automatically have an obvious version number to identify different updates of the same package, as "kitten.kit" shows. Version numbers are a mixed blessing. For some reason, the second a number is issued, some last tweak is needed, invalidating the number. With collections of Tcl packages, the version identifier tends to be artificial (example: is the version number of Tcllib truly an accurate "tag" for each copy out there?). This has led to much confusion in the past. But there is now a solution: $ sdx version kitten.kit sdx.kit sdx.kit critcl.vfs 2003/01/21-00:48:23 12392-12689 kitten.kit 2003/02/07-13:00:53 38108-24587 sdx.kit 2003/01/29-21:03:36 18239-31656 critcl.vfs $ This new module in SDX returns two identifying codes: 1. the GMT timestamp of the newest file found 2. a CRC-32 "version ID" based on all names, sizes, dates The first value reported indicates how recent files inside a starkit are. These can be compared to determine which of two starkits is the newest one. Note that this utility can also be used with unwrapped dir/file trees. The version ID will differ for each modified version of a starkit. There is a minute probability of a "collision", but "kitten,12392-12689" really does identify a very specific collection of file versions for all practical purposes. Version IDs are not ordered. The modification date of a starkit itself is not used, nor is its size (for reasons which should become clear below). A tclkit is a starkit, hence it also has a version ID. IDs do not include the header, i.e. version IDs of different tclkit builds will be the same if only the compiled code differs: $ sdx version tclkit-{freebsd,linux}-x86 vfs-200211.001-tk.bin 2002/11/04-17:01:28 62229-29400 tclkit-freebsd-x86 2002/11/04-17:01:28 62229-29400 tclkit-linux-x86 2002/11/04-17:01:28 62229-29400 vfs-200211.001-tk.bin $ From now on, all starkit and tclkit releases on www.equi4.com will be tracked by these version IDs and latest modification dates. The latest SDX can be downloaded from either of these URLs: http://mini.net/sdarchive/sdx.kit http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/sdx.kit SDARCHIVE IS COOL The collection of starkits maintained by Steve Landers on mini.net has been growing steadily over the past months, 88 starkits and starpacks on last count. A simple submit form was added not so long ago, for anyone to submit a starkit, either by value (a copy) or by reference (an URL). The relevant urls are: http://mini.net/sdarchive/ http://mini.net/sdarchive/submit.cgi The sdarchive index page is currently being reworked to provide some more information. The changes will make it easier to see what is new, how small starkits are, and perhaps most importantly - the new page will include new version IDs mentioned above. INTRODUCING STARSYNC But even with version IDs, sdarchive stops short of the much further reaching potential of starkits: over-the-net incremental updates. There is another new module in SDX, which lets you inspect, obtain, and update starkits from sdarchive: * let's examine the "Fractal" Tk demo by Keith Vetter: $ sdx update -n fractal.kit FRACTAL: looking up on http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... 3 differences: 69 main.tcl 35188 lib/app-fractal/fractal.tcl 76 lib/app-fractal/pkgIndex.tcl $ * ok, looks ok, let's get that starkit: $ sdx update fractal.kit FRACTAL: fetching from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... File created. $ * subsequent updates would be done the same way: $ sdx update fractal.kit FRACTAL: updating from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... No change. $ The implementation of this all, server and client, takes advantage of several aspects of the Metakit database: * changes are transacted, aborted updates can always be resumed * simple and efficient client-side implementation and protocol * on-the-fly restructuring to make a table-of-contents * only changed files are fetched, in zlib-compressed form * server also stores starkits, no packing/unpacking whatsoever The new "Starsync" server implementation is a simple CGI script (all of the server logic is also in SDX, though it has not yet been exposed for used from the command line). All client-server interactions are stateless and use a normal HTTP "POST" request, with a very compact Metakit-based "table of contents" exchange (typically less than 0.1% of the starkit size). The new "sdx update" mechanism supports using other servers ("-from" option), i.e. synchronization is not limited to sdarchive. More info on this is being worked out right now, to make it simple to set up more starsync servers (mirrors, proprietary repositories, personal collections, etc). This will - of course - be deployed as a starkit. Everything is open source, all details of code and data are public. For now, "sdx update" is intended as a "public preview" which hopefully will make it much simpler to take advantage of what is in sdarchive today. It lacks goodies such as a progress indicator, but it is fully operational. Starsync is a new development - it is currently being refined for use in a commercial product, and is sponsored by Unified Technologies Corporation. I am *extremely* grateful for UTCorp's permission to spin off the general purpose technology behind Starsync, and to make it available to others as Open Source Software. This is a perfect example of how open source and proprietary commercial development can benefit from each other IMO. STARCHIVE As Steve Jobs would probably say: we have not one, not *two*, but THREE revolutions in store for you :) Version IDs and efficient synchronization are nothing but a prelude to what really triggered this post: a conceptual model for the flow and maintenance of software. Software collections, archives, repositories... whatever. Starchive is a concept, supported by some simple tools to make it a reality. Some of these tools exist now, others are starting to take shape. And although a lot of what I'm describing is driven by technology, and starkits in particular, this is not intended as Yet Another Plan To Create An Archive Of Everything. For the sake of brevity, and because not everyone here is interested in plans, ideas, and can-be's, the story about Starchives has been placed on the web, at: http://www.equi4.com/starchive Starchives are about flow. Pulling collections. Anything. Not just Tcl. ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS Most, if not all, ideas presented above came about through numerous discussions, emails, and chats between Steve Landers and me. What started for us as a name and a few sketches on a whiteboard in Houten, February 2002, is now starting to materialize. Mark Roseman helped refine some of the (many) loose ends. Not that I have any clue of what this *really* leads to, btw :) -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Feb 7 09:25:38 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17FPcc22210 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 09:25:38 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h17FSFJ4024393 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:28:15 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA19807 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:27:37 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWDBWD; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 08:27:36 -0700 Message-ID: <3E43D068.A93A1D57@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 08:27:36 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look References: <20030207082724.AAB8906@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, Interesting question. I've been spending a lot of time working on the wikit code and have sent JCW several patches related to the Tk gui. I have consolidated the color stuff into one location but didn't mess with the fonts or window size (all thought I did consider it). If I recall correctly the options command works with the X resource system so it shouldn't be to hard to expose this stuff to the outside world. If you have some example code it would be useful. I'm also working on a major revision (i.e. total rewrite) of the wikitool to make it more useful when working with stand alone wikit's. Tom Krehbiel > I know I can hack the wikit code to set alternate fonts, font sizes, colors, > window sizes, etc. > > But I was wondering if anyone has figured out whether you can > set these types of values via X resources - and if so, what the naming > will be to get through the layers to the actual application? From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 7 10:06:32 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17G6Wc25689 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:06:32 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h17G8PEu008045 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:08:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h17G8PG12087; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:08:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:08:25 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030207110825.AAB12032@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 07 Feb 2003 08:27:36 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Tom Krehbiel > I'm also working on a major revision I've been taking a look at the wikit code this morning. I want to add a new environment variable WIKIT_ADMIN_EMAIL which gets passed to the cgi routine that expects a login id of an admin to whom error reports are to be sent. I don't have any code yet for exposing the internal fonts, etc. to the options database. I have to learn more before I do that. Another question, perhaps you can answer. Where does the default wikit.tkd contents originate? There's some things that those default pages should have - for instance, I'd like to see the Help page just be help for _using_ the wikit, and there be a seperate page for building applications with the wikit. I'd hack on the pages to do the work - I just am uncertain where to hack. Also, there appears to be some pages missing - at least one for starkit and one for tclkit . -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 7 10:19:22 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17GJMc26872 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:19:22 -0600 Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:21:21 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030207110825.AAB12032@cas.org> Message-Id: <31D20C5A-3AB8-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: <...cool tweaks...> > Another question, perhaps you can answer. Where does the default > wikit.tkd > contents originate? There's a blank copy inside vfs that gets copied out, see: wikit.vfs/lib/app-wikit/start.tcl The blank copy is created from the help document, but only special pages 0..9 are copied, so that anyone can start with a real empty wiki: wikit.vfs/doc/wikidoc.tkd Another way to customize, is simply to create a small wiki just as you'd like to see it as starting point, and list that on the web somewhere? Or even inside wikit as alternative, but in that case I hope we can come up with a clear logic as to what goes in, and for what purpose... -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Feb 7 10:51:01 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17Gp1c29493; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:51:01 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h17Gr10J019462; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 09:53:01 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA03959; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 09:53:01 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWDB6V; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 09:53:00 -0700 Message-ID: <3E43E46C.95177483@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 09:53:00 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com, Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look References: <20030207110825.AAB12032@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > I've been taking a look at the wikit code this morning. I want to add > a new environment variable WIKIT_ADMIN_EMAIL which gets passed to the > cgi routine that expects a login id of an admin to whom error reports > are to be sent. > > I don't have any code yet for exposing the internal fonts, etc. to > the options database. I have to learn more before I do that. If you can wait a couple of weeks (I'm going on a business trip) I'll do the coding and send it JCW along with a bug fix I already have for JCW. My request was just for best practice example of how to connect tcl internal setting to X window setting. I personally hate the X window setting stuff so I never bother. Normally it just leads to confusion for the end user. However, being able to control the setting when wikit is imbeded would be useful. > Another question, perhaps you can answer. Where does the default wikit.tkd > contents originate? There's some things that those default pages should Wikit is a starkit so the default wikit is found in the doc directory as wikidoc.tkd. If you want to update the documentation then make a copy of that file, update it and sent it to JCW for his review. Any page (including the reserved pages i.e. 0-10) can be accessed using their page number. Just entering the the page number surrounded by square brackets into the search field. The best way to create a new wikit is just to start hacking the home page to be what ever you would like then add or modify the existing pages. Adding pictures is more of a problem and stripping a .tkd of unused pages is currently not possible (which is why I'm upgrading wikitool). > have - for instance, I'd like to see the Help page just be help for _using_ > the wikit, and there be a seperate page for building applications with the > wikit. I'd hack on the pages to do the work - I just am uncertain where > to hack. Also, there appears to be some pages missing - at least one for > starkit and one for tclkit . Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 7 10:55:52 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17Gtpc29878 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:55:51 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h17GviEu028167 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:57:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h17Gvik13025; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:57:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:57:44 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030207115744.AAB13001@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 07 Feb 2003 09:53:00 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Tom Krehbiel >If you want to update the documentation then make a copy of that file, > update it and sent it to JCW for his review. Will do. > Any page (including the > reserved pages i.e. 0-10) can be accessed using their page number. Just > entering the the page number surrounded by square brackets into the > search field. I can't seem to get this to work. > The best way to create a new wikit is just to start hacking > the home page to be what ever you would like then add or modify the > existing pages. Are there things that others on this list would like to see improved with regards to the default wikit.tkd ? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 7 11:05:39 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17H5dc30738 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:05:39 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h17H7WEu001713 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 12:07:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h17H7Wv13507; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 12:07:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 12:07:32 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030207120732.AAB13496@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look In-Reply-To: <31D20C5A-3AB8-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:21:21 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > There's a blank copy inside vfs that gets copied out, see: > wikit.vfs/lib/app-wikit/start.tcl > The blank copy is created from the help document, but only special > pages 0..9 are copied, so that anyone can start with a real empty wiki: > wikit.vfs/doc/wikidoc.tkd Ah - that explains the empty pages I am seeing. There are two or three references on the Help page to pages elsewhere in wikidoc.tkd, but those pages don't get copied. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Feb 7 11:35:38 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h17HZcc00677 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:35:38 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h17Hbc0J001660 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:37:38 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exm25.corp.mot.com (az33exm25.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.157]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA16883 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:37:38 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exm25.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2656.59) id CYQWDB8H; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:37:37 -0700 Message-ID: <3E43EEE0.F8CBA798@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 10:37:36 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look References: <20030207115744.AAB13001@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > > Any page (including the > > reserved pages i.e. 0-10) can be accessed using their page number. Just > > entering the the page number surrounded by square brackets into the > > search field. > > I can't seem to get this to work. Here is a listing of what is in the wikidoc.tkd database. C ID Date/Time F B I U Who Title - --- ------------------- -- -- -- -- ----- ------------------------------ . 0 2002/05/24 18:13:40 2 0 0 0 local My Wiki . 1 2002/05/28 18:32:25 0 0 0 1 local Wikit . 2 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 0 Search . 3 2002/07/07 17:45:51 10 0 0 1 local Help . 4 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 0 Recent Changes . 5 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 0 History . 6 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 5 Formatting Rules . 7 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 0 7 . 8 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 0 8 . 9 2002/05/23 20:29:21 0 0 0 3 Web Settings . 10 2002/07/07 17:38:24 1 0 0 1 local Starkit . 11 2002/07/07 17:44:52 1 0 0 0 local Adding Help to Starkits . 12 2002/07/07 17:39:22 1 0 0 2 local TclKit E 13 . 0 0 0 0 help E 14 . 0 0 0 0 Info . 15 2002/05/25 02:48:14 0 0 0 1 local Incr Tcl Suppose you want to look at page 9 (Web Settings). You could just enter "Web Settings" into the search field and the follow the link but if you don't know the name of a page then your out of luck. If you don't know the name of a page but want to look at it then you can do the following. How to look at page number 9. 1) startup wikit % wikit wikidoc.tkd 2) in the Search: field enter '[9]' 3) You will get a message that looks like this: > Searched for "9" (in page titles): > > * No matches found > > Tip: append an asterisk to search the page contents as well as titles. but notice the '9' is an active link so click on it to go to page 9. Tom K. From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Fri Feb 7 11:55:10 2003 Received: from dewey.iland.net (dewey.iland.net [205.242.230.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h17HtAc02070 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:55:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 25370 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 17:57:02 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-236.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.236) by dewey.iland.net with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 17:57:02 -0000 Message-ID: <014301c2ced2$36cdb4a0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <20030207110825.AAB12032@cas.org> <3E43E46C.95177483@motorola.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:55:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 2/7/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Krehbiel" To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: ; "Jean-Claude Wippler" Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: tips on altering local wikit look > ... and stripping a .tkd of unused pages is currently not possible (which is why I'm upgrading wikitool). This will be a *very* welcomed change IMHO.... Jeff From btheado@columbus.rr.com Fri Feb 7 21:32:53 2003 Received: from ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h183Wrc08195 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 21:32:53 -0600 Received: from desktop123456 (dhcp065-024-132-156.columbus.rr.com [65.24.132.156]) by ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h183YqLg029460 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 22:34:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <004f01c2cf23$0ad680b0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Reply-To: "Brian Theado" From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: <1E0E117F-3AAA-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 22:34:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Jean-Claude Wippler" wrote: [lots of exciting stuff about starchives] > * let's examine the "Fractal" Tk demo by Keith Vetter: > $ sdx update -n fractal.kit [more stuff snipped] When I try this I get an error about an invalid command "::vfs::mk4::_umount". Any ideas? Here are the details: C:\starchive>tclkitsh sdx.kit version sdx.kit 2003/02/07-13:00:53 38108-24587 sdx.kit C:\starchive>tclkitsh sdx.kit version tclkitsh.exe 2003/02/07-18:04:09 53939-51197 tclkitsh.exe C:\starchive>tclkitsh sdx.kit update -n fractal.kit FRACTAL: looking up on http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... invalid command name "::vfs::mk4::_umount" while executing "::vfs::mk4::_umount db2 C:/starchive/" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel \#0 $_unmountCmd($norm) [list $norm]" (procedure "vfs::unmount" line 4) invoked from within "vfs::unmount " (procedure "starsync::summary" line 18) invoked from within "starsync::summary $catalog" invoked from within "set listing [starsync::summary $catalog]" (file "C:/starchive/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/update.tcl" line 46) invoked from within "source [file join $b $a.tcl] " (file "C:/starchive/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" line 31) invoked from within "source C:/starchive/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require app-sdx " (file "sdx.kit/main.tcl" line 3) invoked from within "source sdx.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" C:\starchive>dir Volume in drive C is DISK1_VOL1 Volume Serial Number is 8E8F-2C09 Directory of C:\starchive 02/07/2003 10:17 PM . 02/07/2003 10:17 PM .. 02/07/2003 09:24 PM 89,531 sdx.kit 02/07/2003 09:36 PM 460,277 tclkitsh.exe 2 File(s) 549,808 bytes 2 Dir(s) 19,369,197,568 bytes free From btheado@columbus.rr.com Fri Feb 7 22:04:53 2003 Received: from ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1844rc09569 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 22:04:53 -0600 Received: from desktop123456 (dhcp065-024-132-156.columbus.rr.com [65.24.132.156]) by ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1846rLg016850 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 23:06:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <005901c2cf27$83c67210$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Reply-To: "Brian Theado" From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 23:06:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] sdx help not working correctly Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When I type tclkitsh sdx.kit help, I expect all the subcommands to be listed, but I only see the wrap command listed. If I execute tclkitsh and manually mount sdx.kit, the glob command seems to return the file names with their first characters all missing. I think this is contributing to the help problem as help uses glob to get a list of commands. Any idea on what the problem is? Details: C:\starchive>tclkitsh % package require mk4vfs 1.8 % mk4vfs::mount sdx sdx.kit mk4vfs1 % cd sdx % glob * hangeLog oc ib ain.tcl % cd lib/app-sdx % glob * ddtoc.tcl rc16.tcl val.tcl etch.tcl tpd.tcl elp.tcl ttpd.tcl ttpdist.tcl s.tcl s k.tcl d5sum.tcl kinfo.tcl kshow.tcl kgIndex.tcl wrap.tcl atarx.tcl execd.tcl dx. tcl ync.tcl gz2kit.tcl reetime.tcl nwrap.tcl pdate.tcl ersion.tcl rap.tcl % exit C:\starchive>tclkitsh sdx.kit version sdx.kit 2003/02/07-13:00:53 38108-24587 sdx.kit C:\starchive>tclkitsh sdx.kit version tclkitsh.exe 2003/02/07-18:04:09 53939-51197 tclkitsh.exe Brian Theado From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 8 05:37:25 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h18BbOc21810 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 05:37:25 -0600 Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 12:39:25 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <004f01c2cf23$0ad680b0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > "Jean-Claude Wippler" wrote: > [lots of exciting stuff about starchives] >> * let's examine the "Fractal" Tk demo by Keith Vetter: >> $ sdx update -n fractal.kit > [more stuff snipped] > > When I try this I get an error about an invalid command > "::vfs::mk4::_umount". Any ideas? Yup - stupid typo. Fixed in sdx, that call never existed. > C:\starchive>tclkitsh sdx.kit version tclkitsh.exe > 2003/02/07-18:04:09 53939-51197 tclkitsh.exe Yup, that's the latest in pub/tk/newer/ - wonderful. Thanks for letting me know. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 8 05:58:00 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h18Bw0c22278 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 05:58:00 -0600 Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 13:00:00 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx help not working correctly Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <005901c2cf27$83c67210$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > When I type tclkitsh sdx.kit help, I expect all the subcommands to be > listed, but I only see the wrap command listed. Hm... because there's a cmd called "qwrap". Looks like the very latest tclkit build in /pub/tk/newer has trouble. Let me add that this is a more experimental build than usual, as I applied Vince Darley's early-and-untested VFS speedup patches to help him optimize things. It looks like on win32, the "\" is eating up the next character. For now I suggest falling back to an older tclkit(sh). I'll have a new build shortly, give me a day or so. Thanks (again!) for catching this one. It never surfaced during my linux trials. -jcw From btheado@columbus.rr.com Sat Feb 8 06:22:22 2003 Received: from ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h18CMMc22903 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 06:22:22 -0600 Received: from desktop123456 (dhcp065-024-132-156.columbus.rr.com [65.24.132.156]) by ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h18COM8F015620 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 07:24:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000c01c2cf6d$02d87400$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Reply-To: "Brian Theado" From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 07:24:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Fixed sdx works but only with newer tclkitsh Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The typo fix got me past the invalid command error, but using "2002/11/04-09:24:29 15160-15552 tclkitsh.exe" from pub/tk I get an error about the wrong number of args being passed to ::mk4vfs::_umount. If I use the tclkitsh.exe from pub/tk/newer, then the sdx update command works fine. Here's the full error I got: C:\starchive>c:\bin\tclkitsh c:\bin\sdx.kit update -n fractal.kit FRACTAL: looking up on http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... wrong # args: should be "::mk4vfs::_umount db" while executing "::mk4vfs::_umount db2 C:/starchive/" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel \#0 $_unmountCmd($norm) [list $norm]" (procedure "vfs::unmount" line 4) invoked from within "vfs::unmount " (procedure "starsync::summary" line 18) invoked from within "starsync::summary $catalog" invoked from within "set listing [starsync::summary $catalog]" (file "C:/bin/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/update.tcl" line 46) invoked from within "source [file join $b $a.tcl] " (file "C:/bin/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" line 31) invoked from within "source C:/bin/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require app-sdx " (file "c:/bin/sdx.kit/main.tcl" line 3) invoked from within "source c:/bin/sdx.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" Thanks, Brian From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 8 06:29:09 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h18CT8c23080 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 06:29:08 -0600 Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 13:31:09 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Fixed sdx works but only with newer tclkitsh Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000c01c2cf6d$02d87400$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: <3373E7AA-3B61-11D7-97D7-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > The typo fix got me past the invalid command error, but using > "2002/11/04-09:24:29 15160-15552 tclkitsh.exe" from pub/tk I get an > error > about the wrong number of args being passed to ::mk4vfs::_umount. If > I use > the tclkitsh.exe from pub/tk/newer, then the sdx update command works > fine. Drat. Too many things changing at once - another dumb bug, mount/unmount code has changed a bit to try and simplify things a bit. Please get sdx again, I should have brought it back in line with the rest before. Your patience will be rewarded... eventually! -jcw From btheado@columbus.rr.com Sat Feb 8 06:42:06 2003 Received: from ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h18Cg6c23421 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 06:42:06 -0600 Received: from desktop123456 (dhcp065-024-132-156.columbus.rr.com [65.24.132.156]) by ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h18Ci68F020970 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 07:44:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001201c2cf6f$c4da5e40$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Reply-To: "Brian Theado" From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: <3373E7AA-3B61-11D7-97D7-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Fixed sdx works but only with newer tclkitsh Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 07:44:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It works great now, thanks. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Starkit list" Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 7:31 AM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Fixed sdx works but only with newer tclkitsh > Brian Theado wrote: > > > The typo fix got me past the invalid command error, but using > > "2002/11/04-09:24:29 15160-15552 tclkitsh.exe" from pub/tk I get an > > error > > about the wrong number of args being passed to ::mk4vfs::_umount. If > > I use > > the tclkitsh.exe from pub/tk/newer, then the sdx update command works > > fine. > > Drat. Too many things changing at once - another dumb bug, > mount/unmount code has changed a bit to try and simplify things a bit. > > Please get sdx again, I should have brought it back in line with the > rest before. > > Your patience will be rewarded... eventually! > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Feb 8 23:48:55 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h195msc22240 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 23:48:54 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h195ogwq012227; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:50:42 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h195ogB30819; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:50:42 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Kevin Kenny" Cc: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:50:40 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <200302061653.LAA06640@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > In any case, what happens is that (in the in-process case), the main > > interpreter creates a safe slave, and sets the -use value for the '.' > > window to know what internal window of the browser to use. > > > I've also made demos on clt that indicate how a pure Tcl server could > > control launch multiple Tk sessions anyway with slave interps using > > the -display arg set in argv. > Couldn't [package require Tk] look in a different variable, perhaps > ::tk::argv, that's initialized from ::argv by Wish initialization? That > would solve the problem of having Tk hijack some other app's args. > What am I missing? This is the same code path that wish uses for consuming args at startup, so you do have to watch any changes. For 9.0, this is certainly something that could be looked into, but I think you may change something somebody relies on otherwise (or rather, you still would with 9, but that's a major version change). Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Feb 8 23:50:27 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h195oRc22303 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 23:50:27 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h195qMwq012334 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:52:23 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h195qMB31056 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:52:22 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Weird [package require Tk] Oddity Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:52:20 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <3E429323.6030202@erols.com> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Jeffrey Hobbs wrote: > > I have already noted in the bug report that I oppose this change, > > and it just struck me why this can't be changed anytime in the near > > future. The consumption of argv by Tk is key at startup for some > > things because it's the only way that some initial args get to the > > main window that will be created. > > Uh, yes. Automatic creation of the main window "." is another in that > handful of things that wish ought to do, but Tk should not. > > No auto-creation of "." means no necessary dependence on an X server or > equivalent means we can finally use Tk's [image] command on a headless > server. So you are saying that the completely valid script: package require Tk pack [entry .e] will have to change for those that want to use tclsh and the dynamic loading of Tk? I'm not buying it. I'm not sure that I would want that even for Tk 9. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Sun Feb 9 15:12:28 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h19LCRc20288 for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 15:12:27 -0600 Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 22:14:29 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <79EFA994-3C73-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] some new documentation Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There is now some more documentation about the newer aspects of starkits and their use ("better late than never"?). FYI, all this documentation is listed on the main page: http://www.equi4.com/starkit "Anatomy of a starkit" contains several graphics to explain things: http://www.equi4.com/191 "How to set up starkits as CGI" tries to help with making CGI work: http://www.equi4.com/259 "Placing packages in a starkit" describes why and how kitten works: http://www.equi4.com/266 "Version ID" describes the algorithm used in the sdx "version" command: http://www.equi4.com/265 "Starsync" describes sdx "update" and how to set up a CGI server: http://www.equi4.com/264 And last but not least, a page describing a brand-new feature of sdx "wrap", which makes it possible to customize the icons of a Win32 starpack (executable): http://www.equi4.com/267 Please let me know if there are inaccuracies or omissions. -jcw From colin@chinix.com Mon Feb 10 02:18:55 2003 Received: from sharedtech.dyndns.org (postfix@CPE-144-136-124-37.nsw.bigpond.net.au [144.136.124.37]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1A8Isc12048 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 02:18:54 -0600 Received: from there (colin.sharedtech.dyndns.org [192.168.1.1]) by sharedtech.dyndns.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7E5D375E60 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:20:55 +1100 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Colin McCormack Reply-To: colin@chinix.com Organization: Chinix To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:14:39 +1100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030210082055.7E5D375E60@sharedtech.dyndns.org> Subject: [Starkit] Suggestion Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I've noticed that an error in main.tcl will lead to a misleading error. It would be clearer if the error was propagated more directly, as below. Colin --- proc tk_messageBox {args} { global errorInfo puts stderr "$errorInfo - $args" } if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -nocommit } err]} { global errorInfo set e "$err - $errorInfo - This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" error $e } From engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at Mon Feb 10 02:35:00 2003 Received: from ws01is01.highway.telekom.at (WS01IS01.highway.telekom.at [195.3.96.67]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1A8Yxc12932 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 02:35:00 -0600 Received: from b52.b.ssg.co.at (L0441P15.dipool.highway.telekom.at [62.46.119.15]) by ws01is01.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA33446 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:24:57 +0100 From: engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at Received: by b52.b.ssg.co.at (Sendmail (8.8.8) RTSX11/3, from userid 510) id E59AED990; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:28:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by b52.b.ssg.co.at (Sendmail (8.8.8) RTSX11/3) with ESMTP id DB429D21 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:28:05 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:28:05 +0100 (CET) X-X-Sender: bert@b52.b.ssg.co.at To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] kitten error XLowerWindow Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: this main.tcl: package require starkit package require Tk starkit::startup source [file join [file dirname $starkit::topdir] kitten.kit] package require Tix source [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib mtest.tcl] produces: 284745couldn't load file "/tmp/tclS5PIPm": /tmp/tclS5PIPm: undefined symbol: XLowerWindow while executing "load /home/bert/comp/tcl-starkits/kitten.kit/lib/tix8.2/Linux/libtix8.2.so Tix" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require Tix" (file "mtest.vfs/main.tcl" line 9) kitten and tclkit from lastweek. any hints -- BINGO: Einpflegen --- Engelbert Gruber -------+ SSG Fintl,Gruber,Lassnig / A6410 Telfs Untermarkt 9 / Tel. ++43-5262-64727 ----+ From engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at Mon Feb 10 02:35:00 2003 Received: from ws01is01.highway.telekom.at (WS01IS01.highway.telekom.at [195.3.96.67]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1A8Yxc12933 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 02:35:00 -0600 Received: from b52.b.ssg.co.at (L0441P15.dipool.highway.telekom.at [62.46.119.15]) by ws01is01.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA42428 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:24:57 +0100 From: engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at Received: by b52.b.ssg.co.at (Sendmail (8.8.8) RTSX11/3, from userid 510) id CC1BBD994; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:31:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by b52.b.ssg.co.at (Sendmail (8.8.8) RTSX11/3) with ESMTP id C3393C64 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:31:35 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:31:35 +0100 (CET) X-X-Sender: bert@b52.b.ssg.co.at To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <1E0E117F-3AAA-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: References: <1E0E117F-3AAA-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] starkit::topdir changed by kitten Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: i have a link to kitten.kit from my apps directory. now file dirname $starkit::topdir returns the apps directory before sourcing kitten and kittens directory afterwards. is this intentional ? -- BINGO: definitive merger agreement --- Engelbert Gruber -------+ SSG Fintl,Gruber,Lassnig / A6410 Telfs Untermarkt 9 / Tel. ++43-5262-64727 ----+ From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 10 03:43:26 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1A9hPc18443 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 03:43:25 -0600 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 10:45:28 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit::topdir changed by kitten Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <62DF992A-3CDC-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at wrote: > i have a link to kitten.kit from my apps directory. > now file dirname $starkit::topdir returns the apps directory > before sourcing kitten and kittens directory afterwards. > > is this intentional ? It's an unfortunate side-effect of "source" with starkits. I've been doing things like the following to get around it: set oldtop $starkit::topdir source ... set starkit::topdir $oldtop or: set apptopdir $starkit::topdir source ... But thinking about it a bit more, it seems that once topdir is set, the starkit package should perhaps better not change it anymore... Would it be an idea to change the behavior of "package starkit"? Package starkit is now at version 1.0, such a change would mean that (only) *newer* 1.1 versions would show this behavior. I.e. all tclkits built from now on. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 10 04:03:19 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1AA3Ic20908 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 04:03:18 -0600 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 11:05:21 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Suggestion Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030210082055.7E5D375E60@sharedtech.dyndns.org> Message-Id: <2A50A7C8-3CDF-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Colin McCormack wrote: > I've noticed that an error in main.tcl will lead to a misleading error. > It would be clearer if the error was propagated more directly, as > below. > > Colin > --- > proc tk_messageBox {args} { > global errorInfo > puts stderr "$errorInfo - $args" > } > if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -nocommit } > err]} { > global errorInfo > set e "$err - $errorInfo - This requires a new TclKit release, see > http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" > error $e > } You're referring to the catch-all error reporting code in the starkit header. Yes, the "requires a newer version of tclkit" error is at times highly confusing (and misleading). This comes from the time when starkits where still called scripted documents and their internal design was being changed from a 1st-generation MK database with special structure, to a 2nd generation one with the then-new VFS code. There were quite a few starkits then which could not be made to work with the new code. The current starkits are 3rd-generation. That's by now no longer an issue. There may be a few 1st-gen files left (Tcl 8.0.x), but it's surely extremely uncommon by now. The 2nd-gen "scripted documents" (Tcl 8.2.x) continue to work with todays tclkits, AFAIK. I wonder whether it is by now perhaps better to simply replace starkit headers by something like: package require starkit starkit::header mk4 -nocommit IOW, no special error capture at all? Note that there is a trick to generate starkits with custom headers: The default header is: #!/bin/sh # \ exec tclkit "$0" ${1+"$@"} if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -readonly }]} { set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" error $e } ^Z (The ^Z is a CTRL/Z, it is essential to have one at the end of the script) If you want to use a nonstandard one, create a file with it, make sure the ^Z is in there, and use the "-runtime" option of sdx wrap to insert it at the front of the starkit in place of the default one. If you come up with a header which works well, I'll be happy to test on a few platforms and adopt it for the next release of sdx. We should try to keep the default header under 256 bytes. It must work with and without GUI. The code you have above might be a bit too brutal, since it replaces tk_messageBox (Tk is already loaded on startup, at least for win32 and macos). -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 10 04:39:09 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1AAd8c25186 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 04:39:08 -0600 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 11:41:11 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] kitten error XLowerWindow Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <2B7C5C6F-3CE4-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: engelbert.gruber@ssg.co.at wrote: [kitten] > package require Tix > source [file join [file dirname [info script]] lib mtest.tcl] > > produces: > 284745couldn't load file "/tmp/tclS5PIPm": /tmp/tclS5PIPm: undefined > symbol: > XLowerWindow > while executing > "load > /home/bert/comp/tcl-starkits/kitten.kit/lib/tix8.2/Linux/libtix8.2.so > Tix" [...] Two problems were found: - tix was not linked with -L/usr/X11R6/lib -lX11 - the TIX_LIBRARY environment variable was not set I've re-linked and re-wrapped. Both problems should be fixed in the latest kitten: 2003/02/10-10:33:48 67149-18796 The -lX11 issue is an important one for tclkit: since it links statically with X11, GUI extensions will need to be adjusted to take care of X11 themselves (this is preferable in any case, for platforms which support no back-linking). -jcw From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Mon Feb 10 05:13:35 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1ABDXc29378 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 05:13:33 -0600 Received: (qmail 31759 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 11:15:32 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 10 Feb 2003 11:15:32 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:15:31 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Suggestion Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <2A50A7C8-3CDF-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Monday, February 10, 2003, at 06:05 PM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > I wonder whether it is by now perhaps better to simply replace starkit > headers by something like: > package require starkit > starkit::header mk4 -nocommit > IOW, no special error capture at all? Yes. As you noted one can easily add a capture if it is required (e.g. for a particular package) Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Mon Feb 10 05:17:43 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1ABHec29902 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 05:17:42 -0600 Received: (qmail 31793 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 11:19:40 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 10 Feb 2003 11:19:40 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:19:38 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit::topdir changed by kitten Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <62DF992A-3CDC-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: <8AD82426-3CE9-11D7-94EB-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Monday, February 10, 2003, at 05:45 PM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > But thinking about it a bit more, it seems that once topdir is set, > the starkit package should perhaps better not change it anymore... I'd vote for that ... it fits nicely with the Tcl approach of "do what surprises the least" Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From damon@your.unreality.com Mon Feb 10 18:10:22 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1B0AMc17137 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:10:22 -0600 Received: (qmail 9996 invoked by uid 300); 11 Feb 2003 00:12:24 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 00:12:24 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:12:24 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 In-Reply-To: <1E0E117F-3AAA-11D7-8730-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > * support for customizable icon on Windows I've actually found that you can speed up this icon conversion quite a bit if you do this: foreach {k v} [decICO $icon1] { if {![info exists new($k)]} { continue } if {[string length $new($k)] != [string length $v]} { continue } lappend map $v $new($k) } set out [string map $map $exe] Instead of the [string first] / [binary scan] method. Since we're basically just doing string replacing, this makes the code really simple and inreases speed significantly. From '1965270 microseconds per iteration' to '1144039 microseconds per iteration' on average, roughly. Damon From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 10 18:56:21 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1B0uLc21174 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:56:21 -0600 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 01:58:22 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: >> * support for customizable icon on Windows > > I've actually found that you can speed up this icon conversion > quite > a bit if you do this: > > foreach {k v} [decICO $icon1] { > if {![info exists new($k)]} { continue } > if {[string length $new($k)] != [string length $v]} { continue } > lappend map $v $new($k) > } > set out [string map $map $exe] Yup, that would speed up. But unfortunately, it has a side-effect, in that all instances are replaced, not just the first. This means that since you have a tclkit with a resource icon inside the executable, *and* the "tclkit.ico" file in VFS, both will be changed. This means it makes no sense anymore to store "custom.ico" as well. I'm considering changing "sdx wrap". Instead of a file "custom.ico", you would now name that replacement icon file "tclkit.ico". Avoids a redundant copy, and makes things more logical. The big drawback of "string map" remains though: it indiscriminately replaces each occurrence (what if the icon is also stored in VFS for other uses?). Note that a 2s -> 1s speedup, as you report, is not such a big deal - this is only done once, during packaging. As Vince pointed out to me, there are other replacements which would be nice to change as well: i.e. the Win32 'name', 'description', and 'version' resources in the exe. Hm... that's slightly trickier, since some of these are variable size. What I *could* do is make sure the resource strings are relatively long and "sufficiently unique". That way, a similar search-and-replace (or string map) could be used to adjust those as well. Extra data at the end will probably be ignored (if not, it could be space-padded). -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Mon Feb 10 19:06:14 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1B16Ec22000 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:06:14 -0600 Received: (qmail 10803 invoked by uid 300); 11 Feb 2003 01:08:17 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 01:08:17 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:08:17 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Yup, that would speed up. > > But unfortunately, it has a side-effect, in that all instances are > replaced, not just the first. Well, shut my mouth. I hadn't thought of that. 0-] Well, it's prolly ok for what I'm doing. I would rather have the speed-up. > I'm considering changing "sdx wrap". Instead of a file "custom.ico", > you would now name that replacement icon file "tclkit.ico". Avoids a > redundant copy, and makes things more logical. The big drawback of > "string map" remains though: it indiscriminately replaces each > occurrence (what if the icon is also stored in VFS for other uses?). > Note that a 2s -> 1s speedup, as you report, is not such a big deal - > this is only done once, during packaging. All things being equal, I don't think you really need more than one .ico. I think replacing tclkit.ico would do just fine. I wrote my routine to look for custom.ico and fallback to tclkit.ico if it didn't find custom, but one icon would be just as easy. > As Vince pointed out to me, there are other replacements which would be > nice to change as well: i.e. the Win32 'name', 'description', and > 'version' resources in the exe. Hm... that's slightly trickier, since > some of these are variable size. > > What I *could* do is make sure the resource strings are relatively long > and "sufficiently unique". That way, a similar search-and-replace (or > string map) could be used to adjust those as well. Extra data at the > end will probably be ignored (if not, it could be space-padded). That might be really cool. I hadn't really given any thought to those variables. Damon From akupries@shaw.ca Mon Feb 10 19:34:19 2003 Received: from pd3mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1B1YJc23821 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:34:19 -0600 Received: from pd2mr3so.prod.shaw.ca (pd2mr3so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.108]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HA400AD5F4LOV@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:36:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml3so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml3so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.147]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HA400K92F4LL3@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:36:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from bluepeak (h24-76-111-211.vc.shawcable.net [24.76.111.211]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.6 (built Apr 26 2002)) with SMTP id <0HA4008EGF4KLQ@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:36:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18iPDI-0000E2-00; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 17:27:56 -0800 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 17:27:56 -0800 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starnews Feb 2003 In-reply-to: Message from Jean-Claude Wippler "of Tue, 11 Feb 2003 01:58:22 +0100." To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Damon Courtney wrote: > > >> * support for customizable icon on Windows > > > > I've actually found that you can speed up this icon conversion > > quite > > a bit if you do this: > > > > foreach {k v} [decICO $icon1] { > > if {![info exists new($k)]} { continue } > > if {[string length $new($k)] != [string length $v]} { continue } > > lappend map $v $new($k) > > } > > set out [string map $map $exe] > > Yup, that would speed up. > > But unfortunately, it has a side-effect, in that all instances are > replaced, not just the first. True > This means that since you have a tclkit with a resource icon inside the > executable, *and* the "tclkit.ico" file in VFS, both will be changed. No. Or rather, if and only if the tclkit.ico in VFS is _not_ compressed. As compresseed is the default it should be different at the binary level and thus stay unchanged. > This means it makes no sense anymore to store "custom.ico" as well. > I'm considering changing "sdx wrap". Instead of a file "custom.ico", > you would now name that replacement icon file "tclkit.ico". Avoids a > redundant copy, and makes things more logical. The big drawback of > "string map" remains though: it indiscriminately replaces each > occurrence (what if the icon is also stored in VFS for other uses?). > Note that a 2s -> 1s speedup, as you report, is not such a big deal - > this is only done once, during packaging. -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Feb 11 13:24:16 2003 Received: from smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1BJOFc16317 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 13:24:16 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18ig2r-00084Y-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:26:17 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030211192538.01f079f8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:26:17 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] some new documentation In-Reply-To: <79EFA994-3C73-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > >What I *could* do is make sure the resource strings are relatively long >and "sufficiently unique". That way, a similar search-and-replace (or >string map) could be used to adjust those as well. Extra data at the >end will probably be ignored (if not, it could be space-padded). This sounds like a good solution... (I'm just testing out the new .ico support).... Vince. From Bryan.Schofield@gehh.ge.com Tue Feb 11 17:50:48 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1BNomc09378 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:50:48 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [3.159.236.67]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h1BNqjBc013159 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:52:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from pri01dirnage.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h1BNqd8C023292 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:52:39 -0500 (EST) Received: by pri01dirnage.ge.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id <1YHBXGS5>; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:49:46 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] some new documentation Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:49:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > >What I *could* do is make sure the resource strings are relatively long >and "sufficiently unique". Would something like a md5 hash of a resource string make it relatively long and "sufficiently unique" enough? But I am not familiar with the code that uses these strings. Just thought I'd mention hashing because I have found it useful in the past to generate unique "simple" strings from complex data. For instance, generating an object name from a file name. - Bryan From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Feb 13 00:43:00 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1D6gxc14999 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:42:59 -0600 Received: (qmail 7033 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 06:45:00 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 13 Feb 2003 06:45:00 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:44:58 +0800 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=Apple-Mail-20-239505213 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: mkg@partek.com To: Starkit list From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Apple-Mail-20-239505213 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Hello Starcritters :-) Mark Greene (mkg on the Tclers Chat) has flagged a performance issue that is worth mentioning. Running the attached script on the latest released Linux tclkit (http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tclkit-linux-x86.gz) gives the following performance: genkeys 50 50000: 770899 microseconds per iteration load hash: 44840137 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 1311874900 microseconds per iteration Running it with last Tclkit pre-release build (http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/linux-i686.gz) gives genkeys 50 50000: 754719 microseconds per iteration load hash: 46344509 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 4891820 microseconds per iteration Not sure why, but the "array unset" is an order of magnitude faster. I'm sure there's a good explanation ... Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com --Apple-Mail-20-239505213 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=tst.tcl Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: application/octet-stream; x-unix-mode=0755; name="tst.tcl" proc genKeyLst {N {prefix ""}} { set lst {} for {set i 0} {$i < $N} {incr i} { lappend lst $prefix[format "%06d" $i] } return $lst } proc timeHashNewDel {M N} { set et [time { set Mlst [genKeyLst $N]; set Nlst [genKeyLst $M] }] puts "genkeys $M $N: $et" set et [time { foreach m $Mlst { foreach n $Nlst { set aHash($m,$n) [expr {rand()}] } } }] puts "load hash: $et" set et [time { array unset aHash }] puts "unset hash: $et" return 1 } time {timeHashNewDel 50 50000} --Apple-Mail-20-239505213-- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 13 04:54:58 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DAsvc32440; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 04:54:57 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:57:03 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: mkg@partek.com To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Landers wrote: > Mark Greene (mkg on the Tclers Chat) has flagged a performance issue > that is worth mentioning. [...] > Not sure why, but the "array unset" is an order of magnitude faster. That's with 2,500,000 elements - has anyone done this test with tclsh? This effect is no doubt attributable to changes in Tcl, latest tclkit currently track the CVS head very very closely. I can't think of anything in tclkit which could even affect this (it better not!). -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Feb 13 05:52:40 2003 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DBqec04737 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 05:52:40 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18jHwx-000Mhf-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:54:44 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030213115042.0204eb48@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:54:42 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <79EFA994-3C73-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Does anyone have any plans/suggestions for how to check and/or set whether a starkit/starpack is: (i) read-only ('open foo w' fails with an error) (ii) translucent ('open foo w' works, but 'foo' will disappear on exit unless specific action is taken to store the information on exit) (iii) read-write ('open foo w' works and 'foo' will be stored permanently in the kit) Currently starpacks and "read-only" starkits are always translucent, and writable starkits and truly read-write. I would like to expose control over this to the Tcl level in a robust way, which would also be useful for other vfs filesystems. Any ideas? Vince. From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 13 05:59:15 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DBxFc05273 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 05:59:15 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1DC1Cno017054 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 07:01:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1DC1C319274; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 07:01:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 07:01:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030213070112.AAB19152@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030213115042.0204eb48@mail.wolfbusiness.com> of Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:54:42 +0000 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I wonder if there needs to be something like an info or file type command that one can apply to a path to provide introspective information about the filesystem. Some of the information that seems like it might be useful would be: o is this a virtual file system? o is this read or writable (or transient) o what is the vfs scheme for the filesystem represented Are there other pieces of info that might be useful to know about a filesystem? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Feb 13 06:37:49 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunrise.wldelft.nl [145.9.131.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DCbnc08216 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:37:49 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id NAA07835 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:39:53 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (sunray [145.9.132.100]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA05507; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:39:29 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E4B9201.FD602160@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:39:29 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list , mkg@partek.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Steve Landers wrote: > > > Mark Greene (mkg on the Tclers Chat) has flagged a performance issue > > that is worth mentioning. > [...] > > Not sure why, but the "array unset" is an order of magnitude faster. > > That's with 2,500,000 elements - has anyone done this test with tclsh? > > This effect is no doubt attributable to changes in Tcl, latest tclkit > currently track the CVS head very very closely. I can't think of > anything in tclkit which could even affect this (it better not!). > > -jcw > I have run the test with Tcl 8.4.1 (ActiveTcl, Windows NT): genkeys 50 50000: 918761 microseconds per iteration load hash: 277857946 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 1671459156 microseconds per iteration As I do not have Tcl 8.4.2, I have no way to compare it though. Regards, Arjen From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Feb 13 09:00:21 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DF0Kc20362 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 09:00:20 -0600 Received: from pe172.katowice.cvx.ppp.tpnet.pl ([213.76.12.172] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18jKsQ-0001wd-00 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 16:02:16 +0100 Message-ID: <3E4BB331.5070700@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 16:01:05 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Debugging tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello. I've built a tclkit with --enable-symbols and CC="gcc -g" so that I could debug it (I also use some of my code so I want to find all the SEGVs). It is Win32 with mingw+cygwin. I can debug tclkit until I append a .kit at the end of the executable file - then gdb prints an error and just stops. For now I've added an #ifdef to the 'mk::open exe' line to open [info nameofexe].kit, but this stops me from debugging a starpack. Any ideas on how to debug a tclkit? -- WK (written at Stardate 57120.6) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 13 10:37:29 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DGbSc29486; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 10:37:28 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:39:35 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: mkg@partek.com To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Steve Landers wrote: > >> Mark Greene (mkg on the Tclers Chat) has flagged a performance issue >> that is worth mentioning. > [...] >> Not sure why, but the "array unset" is an order of magnitude faster. > > That's with 2,500,000 elements - has anyone done this test with tclsh? > > This effect is no doubt attributable to changes in Tcl, latest tclkit > currently track the CVS head very very closely. I can't think of > anything in tclkit which could even affect this (it better not!). Confirmed on Linux. Latest CVS is order of magnitude faster in array unset of this large array. Both tclkit and tclsh - it's not tclkit specific. All I can think of is that older Tcl's convert each float stored as value to a string, and then delete that. That's tons of string allocs and deletes, while the latest code just releases the Tcl_Obj's (with a float value in them). No idea *why*, but it would explain this dramatic difference. Conclusion - move to latest Tcl/Tk :) -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 10:48:13 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DGmCc30545; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 10:48:13 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DGoCiU016494; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 08:50:12 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn10.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.240]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DGoBB20118; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 08:50:11 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit list" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 08:50:43 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-reply-to: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Confirmed on Linux. Latest CVS is order of magnitude faster in array > unset of this large array. Both tclkit and tclsh - it's not tclkit > specific. ... > Conclusion - move to latest Tcl/Tk :) Well, we always strive for that to be the conclusion. :) I'll do a full tclbench run with 8.4.1 vs HEAD today to see what else we might find. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ From mkg@partek.com Thu Feb 13 11:31:11 2003 Received: from banyan.partek.com (banyan.partek.com [209.61.158.96]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DHVAc02115; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:31:11 -0600 Received: from there (adsl-66-137-199-217.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.137.199.217]) by banyan.partek.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DHXFx05519; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:33:15 -0600 Message-Id: <200302131733.h1DHXFx05519@banyan.partek.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Mark K. Greene" Organization: Partek Incorporated To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:33:10 -0600 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:39 am, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Steve Landers wrote: > >> Mark Greene (mkg on the Tclers Chat) has flagged a performance issue > >> that is worth mentioning. > > > > [...] > > > >> Not sure why, but the "array unset" is an order of magnitude faster. > > > > That's with 2,500,000 elements - has anyone done this test with tclsh? > > > > This effect is no doubt attributable to changes in Tcl, latest tclkit > > currently track the CVS head very very closely. I can't think of > > anything in tclkit which could even affect this (it better not!). > > Confirmed on Linux. Latest CVS is order of magnitude faster in array > unset of this large array. Both tclkit and tclsh - it's not tclkit > specific. > > All I can think of is that older Tcl's convert each float stored as > value to a string, and then delete that. That's tons of string allocs > and deletes, while the latest code just releases the Tcl_Obj's (with a > float value in them). > > No idea *why*, but it would explain this dramatic difference. > > Conclusion - move to latest Tcl/Tk :) > > -jcw If the alloc/free of strings vs. floats is the problem then wouldn't I be able to use [format "%12.10f" [expr {rand()}]] in the "load hash" loop to force the fast version to go slow? Weird. In trying this in the tclsh 8.4.1 i built in-house (RH 7.2), i found that there is no slowdown at all, with or without the "[format ..." change. I guess this further supports "move to latest Tcl/Tk" but it's odd that my in-house (but otherwise unmodified) 8.4.1 doesn't show this behavior. At least I won't have to wait for 8.4.2 ;) Mark From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 12:23:36 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DINZc06843 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:23:36 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DILWiU025987; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 10:21:32 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DILWB02622; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 10:21:32 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 10:21:32 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <20030213070112.AAB19152@cas.org> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > o is this a virtual file system? > o is this read or writable (or transient) > o what is the vfs scheme for the filesystem represented I *think* these exist now in commands that Vince added with VFS. The 'file system' command should answer 1 and 3. The second should be handled by 'file writable', *if* the VFS is implemented right. Jeff From GargashS@Otologics.com Thu Feb 13 12:42:33 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DIgXc08702 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:42:33 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: tclkit tracking tcl (was RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:44:37 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Thread-Index: AcLTTxJX2rqWye1FTOySvXhifc0tlgAOLjIQ From: "Scott Gargash" To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1DIgXc08702 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > > This effect is no doubt attributable to changes in Tcl, latest tclkit > currently track the CVS head very very closely. This brings up a question I've had. How closely does tclkit track tcl, and is there a mechanism to know when the tclkit version of tcl has changed, along with what changed in it? Is there a tclkit CVS tree somewhere? I ran into an issue where I had grabbed a version of tcl from the tclkit repository. This version had a bug when closing the vfs. I tracked the bug to generic/tclIOUtil.c, but I could not find my version of that file anywhere. The header comment said it was v1.65, but it was different than v1.65 in the Tcl CVS repository, and the tclkit archive no longer had the version I grabbed. It turns out that Vince Darley had checked in a fix for the bug I had found into theTcl CVS tree 22 minutes prior to me finding it. So I grabbed the tcl sources out of the CVS tree in order to work around the bug. But now I am working off of the main CVS branch and not the Tclkit version. Since I have an existence proof that the tclkit version is (potentially) a branch of the main CVS tree and not just a copy, I'm unsure of which branch I should be using, and how do I know when something has been updated and it's worth grabbing? And how can I track the history of the tclkit version when the only thing visible is the latest version. This last point is not an entirely academic issue. We're using tclkit in medical software, and it's important to know what and why changes have been made to the codebase. Scott From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 13:11:46 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DJBjc11515 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:11:45 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DJDiiU031345; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:13:44 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DJDiB12160; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:13:44 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Scott Gargash" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: tclkit tracking tcl (was RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:13:43 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ... > This last point is not an entirely academic issue. We're using > tclkit in medical software, and it's important to know what and > why changes have been made to the codebase. Don't think I'm trying to troll here, but there comes a point when one has to ask if the product/project is so important, shouldn't they be thinking about real support? While the desire to know what base a tclkit is is fine, if you have critical components built on it, it is thus critical to know the reliability of the software. Grabbing from the repository is always a crapshoot. Paying someone like JCW to make sure you can rely on what is in his repository and that you can rely on someone to go to in case trouble arises is a Good Thing(tm). That of course depends on what JCW's own desire of how he wishes to offer support, but there is always some support alternative. You are making a decent request, and I know that you managed to find the solution yourself, but what happens when the next "critical bug" hits you? I mention this because I do get sensitive around user expectations on free software (where paid support is available for commercial users). I have actually had people who had the audacity to say, "X is broken, you *have* to fix it because I need it for my commercial product Y". ActiveState of course has commercial customers that do make such requests - then it is completely reasonable because we charge them for their ability to tell us to jump. I realize that is not what you have asked, but support should always be considered for those with strong commercial reliance. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 13 13:20:52 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DJKpc12279 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:20:51 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1DJMmmA003082 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:22:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1DJMmB28646; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:22:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:22:48 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030213142248.AAB28614@cas.org> Subject: Re: tclkit tracking tcl (was RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance) In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:13:43 -0800 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Amen! Any time I hear a business ask questions about support for ANY kind of software, I get nervous. Support contacts are available - businesses should not hesitate to take advantage of them. Don't create mission critical products based on any product - free or commercial - without a contract in hand that allows you some degree of escalation of problem resolution. Otherwise, you will find yourself relying on software and needing changes either without expertise in-house to change it yourself, or dependant on closed source or even on large corporations whose priorities in fixing software is less focused than you need. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From GargashS@Otologics.com Thu Feb 13 13:44:57 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DJivc14366 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:44:57 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: tclkit tracking tcl (was RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:47:01 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: tclkit tracking tcl (was RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance) Thread-Index: AcLTlZBev6NTFrPTRCaXHnN3qZgzbgAAB3iw From: "Scott Gargash" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1DJivc14366 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: Larry W. Virden [mailto:lvirden@cas.org] > Amen! > > Any time I hear a business ask questions about support for > ANY kind of software, > I get nervous. Support contacts are available - businesses should not > hesitate to take advantage of them. Don't create mission critical > products based on any product - free or commercial - without > a contract > in hand that allows you some degree of escalation of problem > resolution. > Otherwise, you will find yourself relying on software and > needing changes > either without expertise in-house to change it yourself, or > dependant on > closed source or even on large corporations whose priorities > in fixing > software is less focused than you need. Except this is orthogonal to the question I asked. I was asking about configuration and release management, not bug resolution or product support. My concern is that it's not clear how to track what code went into a given release of a tclkit. The issue of paying someone to be available to make a code change upon request doesn't really enter into it. Not that I'm opposed to contracting for support assuming that the current experiments justify using tclkit. Availability of support was a requirement from the start. Although, I am unsure if it would involve getting support for tcl, tclkit or both, and if they would be supported individually or separately. Scott From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 13:57:33 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DJvXc15399 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:57:33 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DJxSiU003440; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:59:29 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DJxSB20845; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:59:28 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Scott Gargash" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: tclkit tracking tcl (was RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:59:27 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Except this is orthogonal to the question I asked. I was asking > about configuration and release management, not bug resolution or > product support. My concern is that it's not clear how to track > what code went into a given release of a tclkit. The issue of > paying someone to be available to make a code change upon request > doesn't really enter into it. I disagree that on that point though. You were asking to be made aware of specific details relating to configuration and release management, as well as "to know what and why changes have been made". This is something that ActiveState provides to commercial support customers (among other bennies). Part of support is us proactively stating the what and why of things, when people should move versions, and when they shouldn't. It really is a different level of effort involved. Release engineering is not trivial, as I'm sure you know being one that delivers your own product. When we cut a patchlevel of Tcl, we do make the full Release Notes for everyone, but that is not something kept up to date on a weekly basis. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Thu Feb 13 11:43:01 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DHh0c03188; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:43:01 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1 [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.9.1/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h1DHivMk010415; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:44:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h1DHipcE006209; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:44:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DHioJ12841; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:44:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.9.3+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id MAA18096; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:44:50 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200302131744.MAA18096@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: "Mark K. Greene" cc: Starkit list , Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Mark K. Greene" of "Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:33:10 CST." <200302131733.h1DHXFx05519@banyan.partek.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:44:50 -0500 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hmm, were all builds the same state of --enable-threads? Could the differences be accounted for by the change in memory allocation in threaded builds? -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From mkg@partek.com Thu Feb 13 12:27:08 2003 Received: from banyan.partek.com (banyan.partek.com [209.61.158.96]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DIR8c07224; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:27:08 -0600 Received: from there (adsl-66-137-199-217.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.137.199.217]) by banyan.partek.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DIRCx05692; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:27:12 -0600 Message-Id: <200302131827.h1DIRCx05692@banyan.partek.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Mark K. Greene" Organization: Partek Incorporated To: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:27:06 -0600 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] Cc: Starkit list , Jean-Claude Wippler References: <200302131744.MAA18096@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> In-Reply-To: <200302131744.MAA18096@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: My in-house build does have threads enabled: mkg@maple pts/4 0% .../mkg > tclsh8.4 % set tcl_patchLevel 8.4.1 % array names tcl_platform osVersion byteOrder threaded machine platform os user wordSize And excerpting from tclConfig.sh: ... # -D flags for use with the C compiler. TCL_DEFS=' -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_LIMITS_H=1 -DTCL_THREADS=1 -DUSE_THREAD_ALLOC=1 -D_REENTRANT=1 -D_THREAD_SAFE=1 -DHAVE_READDIR_R=1 -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE=1 -DTCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE=long\ long -DHAVE_STRUCT_STAT64=1 -DHAVE_TYPE_OFF64_T=1 ... Looks like that could be the difference. the tclkit exe that's slower doesn't have threads enabled. On Thursday 13 February 2003 11:44 am, Kevin Kenny wrote: > Hmm, were all builds the same state of --enable-threads? > Could the differences be accounted for by the change in memory > allocation in threaded builds? Mark From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 14:47:14 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DKlDc19764 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:47:13 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DKn7iU008309; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:49:07 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DKn6B28776; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:49:06 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Steve Landers" , "Starkit list" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:49:04 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Mark Greene (mkg on the Tclers Chat) has flagged a performance issue > that is worth mentioning. I can't confirm the "order of magnitude" difference, but I do see a repeatable diff: > tclsh8.4.1 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl genkeys 50 50000: 705734 microseconds per iteration load hash: 39462227 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 398117582 microseconds per iteration > tclsh8.4.2 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl genkeys 50 50000: 805744 microseconds per iteration load hash: 43064195 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 298894670 microseconds per iteration I just see that Mark confirmed he wasn't using the same type of build. Always rule #1 in comparing performance. ;) Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 14:58:27 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DKwRc20803 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:58:27 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DL0RiU009376; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:00:27 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DL0OB30430; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:00:24 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:00:20 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > tclsh8.4.1 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl > genkeys 50 50000: 705734 microseconds per iteration > load hash: 39462227 microseconds per iteration > unset hash: 398117582 microseconds per iteration > > > tclsh8.4.2 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl > genkeys 50 50000: 805744 microseconds per iteration > load hash: 43064195 microseconds per iteration > unset hash: 298894670 microseconds per iteration > > I just see that Mark confirmed he wasn't using the same type of > build. Always rule #1 in comparing performance. ;) And for kicks, tclsh8.4.2-threaded gives: > ./tclsh ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl genkeys 50 50000: 819531 microseconds per iteration load hash: 40453372 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 4976925 microseconds per iteration Er ... um, yes, that is repeatable. The threaded version is a ton faster. Wow, you say ... threads are cool! Well, actually what you are seeing here is the effect of the special threaded-obj allocator in 8.4. It is a high-water-mark allocator that doesn't return anything but large obj allocations to the system. This is of course much faster and works for some apps, but not all. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 13 15:19:57 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DLJvc22723 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:19:57 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 22:22:04 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <32DA10DE-3F99-11D7-8BA1-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Re: tclkit tracking tcl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Scott Gargash wrote: > concern is that it's not clear how to track what code went into a > given release of a tclkit. The issue of paying someone to be > available to make a code change upon request doesn't really enter into > it. Tclkit gets built in two different tracks: - the "official" releases in pub/tk/ - newer releases in pub/tk/newer/ For "official" releases, all sources are frozen and made available as tar/gz files from pub/tk/tars/ - the last release cycle was November 2002. For newer releases, the cycle is less formal, but nevertheless traceable (more or less, ahem). I track CVS of Tcl, Tk, Incrtcl, TclVFS, Metakit, and I check in all changes to the Tclkit sources (this is a very small set of files by now). I made one big mistake about two weeks ago, of replacing pub/tk/tars/ with new sources, breaking the rule of having Nov 2002 tclkits sit next to the sources used for them. My apologies for that. This basic structure is likely to remain as is: one low-frequency but widely ported major release, with frozen source code, and a bursty "newer" area. Currently, I'm tracking the head of CVS almost daily, to have a good handle on what is about to become 8.4.2. Expect a major announcement about the whole issue of tclkit releases and support around the same time that 8.4.2 gets released. There is quite a bit cooking on that side. All I'll say for now is that tclkit is being used more and more in production projects, and it definitely deserves a matching level of care and support by now. Stay tuned! -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 13 15:22:56 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DLMtc23021 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:22:55 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 22:25:02 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <9D13652C-3F99-11D7-8BA1-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Hobbs wrote: >>> tclsh8.4.1 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl [...] >> unset hash: 398117582 microseconds per iteration >> >>> tclsh8.4.2 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl [...] >> unset hash: 298894670 microseconds per iteration [...] And for kicks, tclsh8.4.2-threaded gives: >> ./tclsh ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl [...] > unset hash: 4976925 microseconds per iteration > > Er ... um, yes, that is repeatable. The threaded version is a ton > faster. Wow, you say ... threads are cool! Well, actually what you > are seeing here is the effect of the special threaded-obj allocator > in 8.4. It is a high-water-mark allocator that doesn't return > anything but large obj allocations to the system. This is of course > much faster and works for some apps, but not all. Hm. In my case, no threaded builds are used at all. Yet I see that massive difference in tclkit Nov 2002 vs today's latest: $ tclkit % set vfs::tclkit_version 200211.001 % info patchlevel 8.4.1 [...] genkeys 50 50000: 122723 microseconds per iteration load hash: 10293534 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 234635120 microseconds per iteration $ $ ./tclkit % set vfs::tclkit_version 200211.185 % info patchlevel 8.4.1.1 [...] genkeys 50 50000: 106174 microseconds per iteration load hash: 8246830 microseconds per iteration unset hash: 769494 microseconds per iteration $ Those last figures also came out of latest tclsh (static build). We may be seeing changes in the C runtime. The latest was built with gcc 3.2.1 - maybe it too has been improving the default -lc allocator? Another point is that the slow case was eating up over 250 Mb of RAM (the fast case went by too quickly for me to check). Draw your own conclusions please - because I won't... -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Feb 13 15:46:59 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DLkxc25179 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:46:59 -0600 Received: (qmail 77272 invoked by uid 300); 13 Feb 2003 21:49:04 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 21:49:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:49:04 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: tclkit tracking tcl In-Reply-To: <32DA10DE-3F99-11D7-8BA1-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Expect a major announcement about the whole issue of tclkit releases > and support around the same time that 8.4.2 gets released. There is > quite a bit cooking on that side. All I'll say for now is that tclkit > is being used more and more in production projects, and it definitely > deserves a matching level of care and support by now. Stay tuned! I'm not using it in "production" code yet, but I hope to be soon! 0-] I hate being the only developer of a project. I have too hard a time limiting myself in my releases. *sigh* Damon From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 13 16:06:55 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DM6tc26856 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 16:06:55 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 23:09:02 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] mailing list admin Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Folks, I have two requests of an administrative nature: Primo: Please do not include my email address when posting to this mailing list. They just end up generating near-duplicates in my mailbox. I've been getting too many of these lately :( Secundo: The mailing list rejects posts from non-members. Which is super cool, because this keeps quite a few spam messages off the list. But it seems that more and more legitimate posts are being made by non-members, or by people from an alternate email address. Unfortunately, Mailman then reminds me *daily* of each pending request/rejection. Sooo... - If you're getting a rejection message, please subscribe and resubmit (and then unsubscribe, if you prefer the silence). I see the post get through, and can delete the pending msg. - If you have multiple email accounts, consider signing up with each of them. Each subscription can be set to not receive posts directly - yet it will still let you post replies. -jcw From mkg@partek.com Thu Feb 13 17:23:27 2003 Received: from banyan.partek.com (banyan.partek.com [209.61.158.96]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DNNRc00948 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:23:27 -0600 Received: from there (adsl-66-137-199-217.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.137.199.217]) by banyan.partek.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DNPVx06828; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:25:31 -0600 Message-Id: <200302132325.h1DNPVx06828@banyan.partek.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Mark K. Greene" Organization: Partek Incorporated To: "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:25:26 -0600 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] Cc: "Jeff Hobbs" References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 13 February 2003 03:00 pm, Jeff Hobbs wrote: > > > tclsh8.4.1 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl > > > > genkeys 50 50000: 705734 microseconds per iteration > > load hash: 39462227 microseconds per iteration > > unset hash: 398117582 microseconds per iteration > > > > > tclsh8.4.2 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl > > > > genkeys 50 50000: 805744 microseconds per iteration > > load hash: 43064195 microseconds per iteration > > unset hash: 298894670 microseconds per iteration > > > > I just see that Mark confirmed he wasn't using the same type of > > build. Always rule #1 in comparing performance. ;) > > And for kicks, tclsh8.4.2-threaded gives: > > ./tclsh ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl > > genkeys 50 50000: 819531 microseconds per iteration > load hash: 40453372 microseconds per iteration > unset hash: 4976925 microseconds per iteration > > Er ... um, yes, that is repeatable. The threaded version is a ton > faster. Wow, you say ... threads are cool! Well, actually what you > are seeing here is the effect of the special threaded-obj allocator > in 8.4. It is a high-water-mark allocator that doesn't return > anything but large obj allocations to the system. This is of course > much faster and works for some apps, but not all. > > Jeff Hmmm... The evidence so far leads me to tentatively conclude that non-threaded builds of *any* Tcl release cannot use big arrays (>1M key-value pairs) without taking a huge performance hit when the array is unset. If anyone comes up with evidence or special cases to the contrary please let me know. I can work around this by either using a threaded build, *not* unsetting the array (say by doing this in a temporary process that just exits), or modifying our algorithms to use smaller arrays. -- Mark From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Feb 13 17:27:48 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DNRmc01384 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:27:48 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1DNTliU024113 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:29:47 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1DNTgB21044 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:29:42 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:29:43 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <200302132325.h1DNPVx06828@banyan.partek.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Hmmm... The evidence so far leads me to tentatively conclude that > non-threaded builds of *any* Tcl release cannot use big arrays > (>1M key-value > pairs) without taking a huge performance hit when the array is unset. If > anyone comes up with evidence or special cases to the contrary > please let me > know. > > I can work around this by either using a threaded build, *not* > unsetting the > array (say by doing this in a temporary process that just exits), or > modifying our algorithms to use smaller arrays. Whatb is stored in the arrays to make them this big ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Feb 14 01:22:11 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunrise.wldelft.nl [145.9.131.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1E7MBc30644 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 01:22:11 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA23023 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 08:24:16 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (sunray [145.9.132.100]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA22790 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 08:24:10 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E4C999A.872A6E2@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 08:24:10 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] mailing list admin References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Folks, I have two requests of an administrative nature: > > Primo: Please do not include my email address when posting to this > mailing list. They just end up generating near-duplicates in my > mailbox. I've been getting too many of these lately :( > Can you arrange for this to happen automatically (by overriding the reply-to field - that at least is what I understand to be the automatic solution)? If not, I will take special care anyway that my mails are sent to a single address only (unless of course a cc is required, etc. etc. :) Regards, Arjen From brian.theado@wcom.com Fri Feb 14 09:03:55 2003 Received: from dgesmtp01.wcom.com (dgesmtp01.wcom.com [199.249.16.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1EF3tc26567 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 09:03:55 -0600 Received: from pmismtp03.wcomnet.com ([166.38.62.38]) by firewall.wcom.com (Iplanet MTA) with ESMTP id <0HAB002A90F9SJ@firewall.wcom.com> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:01:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from pmismtp03.wcomnet.com by pmismtp03.wcomnet.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.7 (built May 7 2002)) with SMTP id <0HAB00G010B70A@pmismtp03.wcomnet.com> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:01:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from dgexch50.wcomnet.com ([166.38.58.238]) by pmismtp03.wcomnet.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.7 (built May 7 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HAB00G400DE1L@pmismtp03.wcomnet.com> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:00:51 +0000 (GMT) Received: by DGEXCH50.wcomnet.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1Y7BXCHX>; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:01:32 +0000 Content-return: allowed Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 14:57:37 +0000 From: "Theado, Brian P." To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Mr7VLOPBXi8IbsBdQzkO1Q)" Subject: [Starkit] "sdx version" inconsistency Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --Boundary_(ID_Mr7VLOPBXi8IbsBdQzkO1Q) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I just noticed that when I wrapped up a starkit and executed "sdx version" on both the directory and on the resulting starkit, I got different results. The reason for the difference is because I have a CVS subdirectory that is newer than the newest source file (because my last CVS checkin came later than the source modification). The wrap command is smart enough to ignore the CVS directories. Should sdx version exclude the same files from its check that sdx wrap does? Brian Theado --Boundary_(ID_Mr7VLOPBXi8IbsBdQzkO1Q) Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable "sdx version" inconsistency

I just noticed that when I wrapped up = a starkit and executed "sdx version" on both the directory = and on the resulting starkit, I got different results.  The reason = for the difference is because I have a CVS subdirectory that is newer = than the newest source file (because my last CVS checkin came later = than the source modification).  The wrap command is smart enough = to ignore the CVS directories.  Should sdx version exclude the = same files from its check that sdx wrap does?

Brian Theado

= --Boundary_(ID_Mr7VLOPBXi8IbsBdQzkO1Q)-- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 14 09:22:33 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1EFMWc27885; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 09:22:32 -0600 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:24:37 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] "sdx version" inconsistency Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" To: "Theado, Brian P." From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6E070EA8-4030-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1EFMWc27885 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian P. wrote: > I just noticed that when I wrapped up a starkit and executed "sdx > version" on both the directory and on the resulting starkit, I got > different results.  The reason for the difference is because I have a > CVS subdirectory that is newer than the newest source file (because my > last CVS checkin came later than the source modification).  The wrap > command is smart enough to ignore the CVS directories.  Should sdx > version exclude the same files from its check that sdx wrap does? Hm, yes - it should. I've adjusted version so it skips the same files as wrap: CVS RCS core a.out (These defaults are built into sync.tcl, which does all wrap/unwrap copying - it's all a bit ad-hoc and currently not configurable in wrap/qwrap from the command line.) Good catch. Fixed in sdx 2003/02/14 15:21:57 16962-18346. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 14 12:20:52 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1EIKpc09723 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:20:51 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1EIMmjV013314 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:22:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1EIMnH02018; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:22:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:22:49 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030214132249.AAB2015@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] sdx help question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When I type "sdx help" the output ends with the statement: For more information, type: help help ?command? Should that be "sdx help ?command?" or should it be "sdx help help ?command?" ? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 14 12:25:01 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1EIP1c10129 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:25:01 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1EIQwjV014467 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:26:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1EIQxa02711; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:26:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:26:59 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030214132659.AAB2706@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] sdx update error report Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have a version of wikit.kit named "wikit-kit". I get this error when I type $ sdx update wikit-kit WIKIT-KIT: updating from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... load error while executing "mk::file load $db $fd" (procedure "memvfs" line 11) invoked from within "memvfs $data" (procedure "applydiffs" line 2) invoked from within "applydiffs $data $path" (procedure "starsync::request" line 19) invoked from within "starsync::request $server $path $fake" invoked from within "set catalog [starsync::request $server $path $fake]" (file "/volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/update.tcl" line 45) invoked from within "source [file join $b $a.tcl] " (file "/volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" line 31) invoked from within "source /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require app-sdx " (file "/volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx/main.tcl" line 3) invoked from within "source /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" WIKIT: updating from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... 4 changes applied. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mkg@partek.com Fri Feb 14 12:38:55 2003 Received: from banyan.partek.com (banyan.partek.com [209.61.158.96]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1EIctc11342 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:38:55 -0600 Received: from there (adsl-66-137-199-217.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.137.199.217]) by banyan.partek.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1EIf1x09985; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:41:01 -0600 Message-Id: <200302141841.h1EIf1x09985@banyan.partek.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Mark K. Greene" Organization: Partek Incorporated To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:40:56 -0600 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] References: <200302141801.h1EI1Ec08204@trixie.triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <200302141801.h1EI1Ec08204@trixie.triqs.com> Cc: andreask@ActiveState.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: starkit digest, Vol 1 #165 - 4 msgs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 14 February 2003 12:01 pm, you wrote: > > Message: 1 > From: "Andreas Kupries" > To: "Starkit list" > Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit performance > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:29:43 -0800 > > > Hmmm... The evidence so far leads me to tentatively conclude that > > non-threaded builds of *any* Tcl release cannot use big arrays > > (>1M key-value > > pairs) without taking a huge performance hit when the array is unset. If > > anyone comes up with evidence or special cases to the contrary > > please let me > > know. > > > > I can work around this by either using a threaded build, *not* > > unsetting the > > array (say by doing this in a temporary process that just exits), or > > modifying our algorithms to use smaller arrays. > > Whatb is stored in the arrays to make them this big ? The arrays basically store an MxN array of floating point values of gene expression data, where MxN can be 0.5 million to 4 million entries. The hash keys are strings, about 12-20 bytes total. The solution is "upgrade to 8.4.2" as Jean-Claude Wippler has pointed out, as the latest version of tclkit, built non-threaded against the near-8.4.2 version of Tcl, does not exhibit the slow performance. I'm not sure why Jeff Hobbs tclsh8.4.2 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl build showed only marginal improvement, but since at least someone has found that 8.4.2 non-threaded builds are OK, I'm ready to just "upgrade to 8.4.2" and forget about it for now. Mark From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Feb 14 16:58:15 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1EMwFc31326 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:58:15 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1EN0FiU018619; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:00:15 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1EN0FB07442; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:00:15 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Mark K. Greene" , Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 15:00:14 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <200302141841.h1EIf1x09985@banyan.partek.com> Importance: Normal Subject: [Starkit] Benchmarking (WAS: tclkit performance) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > The solution is "upgrade to 8.4.2" as Jean-Claude Wippler has pointed out, as > the latest version of tclkit, built non-threaded against the near-8.4.2 > version of Tcl, does not exhibit the slow performance. > I'm not sure why Jeff Hobbs tclsh8.4.2 ~/lorax/scratch/tst.tcl build showed > only marginal improvement, but since at least someone has found that 8.4.2 > non-threaded builds are OK, I'm ready to just "upgrade to 8.4.2" and forget > about it for now. There is only one answer to that ... only my numbers are correct. :) What you glossed over is not that I only saw a marginal improvement, but rather that I never saw the enormous slowdown that was originally reported. Don't go thinking that I discount reports of irregularities in core performance or other areas. I take them very seriously. However, I have had enough experience dealing with these to know that people are not aware of issues that may not be core-related or even make simple mistakes (most common is differing build types) and thus get varying results that really should not be compared. I wrote the tclbench benchmark suite to level the playing field, and I have a system that is extremely well controlled (a critical component). I welcome any additions people want to make to it - it's the one system that I have the most trust in to compare, analyze, and hunt down performance issues. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 15 04:02:25 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FA2Oc21474 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 04:02:24 -0600 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:04:29 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: A problem was recently reported on c.l.tcl with Tclkit on Linux, which I think means big trouble for the way tclkit is built, see http://groups.google.com/ groups?group=comp.lang.tcl&selm=411a7241.0302141826.2e1289c1%40posting.g oogle.com This problem can be trivially reproduced with Critcl: $ cat pw.tcl source critcl.kit package require critcl critcl::ccode { #include } critcl::cproc pwname {int uid} vstring { return getpwuid(uid)->pw_name; } puts [pwname 500] $ tclkit pw.tcl Segmentation fault $ dyntclkit pw.tcl jcw $ The run at the end was done with a tclkit build which omits "-static" from the link step. The issue seems to be the static linkage of libstdc.a, which pulls in things from that library to resolve all undefined symbols. In the above, it looks like the extension is pulling in getpwuid from a different copy, as shared lib. And that for *some* reason, this causes a crash. IOW, linking statically causes extensions to resolve other symbols than those present in tclkit from a second *shared* copy of the runtime. Two runtime copies now proves to be trouble - I had hoped it would not be an issue :( This was probably a disaster waiting to happen. Now it has. The reason this is trouble, is that Tclkit without -static has a number of shared library dependencies: $ ldd tclkit libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x40023000) libz.so.1 => /usr/lib/libz.so.1 (0x40026000) libstdc++.so.5 => /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/libstdc++.so.5 (0x40034000) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x40100000) libgcc_s.so.1 => /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/libgcc_s.so.1 (0x40122000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x4012b000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000) Most of the above are fine, this approach has evolved over many years, and many OS versions get it right nowadays in terms of forward compatibility. Except C++ ... I am worried that such a build will not run on all variants of Linux which exists out there. Even if resolved, there can be gcc 3.x vs 2.x issues. In the worst case, this means there may have to be builds for different distro's. AAARRRGGGHHH... Note that for many of the other platforms, genkit already builds tclkit without "-static" (because it failed), so the problem is mostly one of Linux, in terms of impact. Unfortunately, in terms of variety, Linux is a nightmare. Which means its a gcc context. I'm wondering if there is a way to force -lstdc++ to be resolved statically and leave the rest dynamic? The reasoning being that very few extensions rely on C++, and even then they will probably work just fine. It's pulled into the core because of Metakit (darn, how I regret still not having a C version of MK by now). I understand that one may be able to force a load by pointing to the .a file explicitly, and will try that. But if someone else on this list also wants to have a go at this, it would be a really big help. Or just give me some hints on what to do. I remember having tried things in the past, and being surprised how the gcc linker continued to load the shared lib - short of unpacking all of liblstdc++.a and giving all .o's to the linker (!). If nothing else, I'll just have to take a dual approach with Linux: provide a static link as it is today, making it clear that some extensions may run into trouble, and provide a more or less dynlinked one, which may not run everywhere. FYI, there's a dynlinked version of tclkit for Linux in pub/tk/newer/. It's considerably smaller than the current release build of Tclkit for Linux (2.5 vs 3 Mb uncompressed). YUCK. -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Sat Feb 15 05:12:02 2003 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FBC2c23015 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 05:12:02 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB3B88D.ipt.aol.com [172.179.184.141]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id APO41961 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:14:05 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030215111049.020a0de8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:14:02 +0000 To: "Starkit list" From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write In-Reply-To: References: <20030213070112.AAB19152@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 10:21 AM 2/13/2003 -0800, Jeff Hobbs wrote: > > o is this a virtual file system? > > o is this read or writable (or transient) > > o what is the vfs scheme for the filesystem represented > >I *think* these exist now in commands that Vince added with VFS. >The 'file system' command should answer 1 and 3. The second should >be handled by 'file writable', *if* the VFS is implemented right. Jeff's right ('file system' handles 1,3), *except* that: (i) 'file writable' won't differentiate between translucent and true read-write filesystems (ii) we also want to be able to control this from Tcl (so, e.g., we need to be able to do 'file writable mykit.kit translucent' or whatever). And, I think Jeff's also right in that 'file writable' may not be implemented correctly by many of the vfs implementations in tcl. I think for the moment, the best thing to do is add something to tclvfs to handle this stuff, and then in the future have some TIP to move the functionality into Tcl's core when it's all worked out. cheers, Vince. From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Sat Feb 15 05:18:50 2003 Received: from web13310.mail.yahoo.com (web13310.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.222]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1FBIoc23183 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 05:18:50 -0600 Message-ID: <20030215112056.46384.qmail@web13310.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.235] by web13310.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 03:20:56 PST Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 03:20:56 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Segfault Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (I originally submitted the question to c.l.t, but just discovered this forum which is more appropriate. I also want to mention I compiled with stubs) I am using Red Hat 8.0, the following example segfaults the interpreter when trying to load test.so from tclkit. Same code works fine with regular wish Any ideas on what may be causing it, how to avoid or troubleshoot it? (it also happens with other psw related functions, such as setpwent,etc.) #include "tcl.h" #include int Test_Init( Tcl_Interp *interp ) { int error; struct passwd *pwd; pwd = getpwuid(500); return TCL_OK; } The last few lines of an strace: brk(0x8312000) = 0x8312000 brk(0) = 0x8312000 socket(PF_UNIX, SOCK_STREAM, 0) = 4 connect(4, {sin_family=AF_UNIX, path="/var/run/.nscd_socket"}, 110) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory) close(4) = 0 open("/etc/nsswitch.conf", O_RDONLY) = 4 fstat64(4, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644, st_size=1750, ...}) = 0 mmap2(NULL, 4096, PROT_READ|PROT_WRITE, MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_ANONYMOUS, -1, 0) = 0x405d0000 read(4, "#\n# /etc/nsswitch.conf\n#\n# An ex"..., 4096) = 1750 read(4, "", 4096) = 0 close(4) = 0 munmap(0x405d0000, 4096) = 0 --- SIGSEGV (Segmentation fault) --- +++ killed by SIGSEGV +++ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 15 06:52:51 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FCqoc25471 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 06:52:50 -0600 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:54:54 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: [following up on my own post] Here's an example of the issues that this has to deal with. Using a tip gleaned from: http://groups.google.com/ groups?selm=sxpwgweyw9.fsf%40marvin.first.gmd.de&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain First, I used "g++ -### -o kit *.o $L $X -ldl -lieee -lm -lz" to find out what gcc/g++ produces as linker command. Output: "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/collect2" "--eh-frame-hdr" "-m" "elf_i386" "-dynamic-linker" "/lib/ld-linux.so.2" "-o" "kit" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../crt1.o" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../crti.o" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/crtbegin.o" "-L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1" "-L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../../i686-pc-linux- gnu/lib" "-L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../.." "kitInit.o" "pwb.o" "rechan.o" "tclAppInit.o" "vfs.o" "zlib.o" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Tcl/unix/libtcl8.4.a" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Tk/unix/libtk8.4.a" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Itcl/itcl/libitcl3.3.a" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Mk4tcl/builds/.libs/libmk4tcl.a" "-L/usr/X11R6/lib" "-lX11" "-ldl" "-lieee" "-lz" "-lstdc++" "-lm" "-lgcc_s" "-lgcc" "-lc" "-lgcc_s" "-lgcc" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/crtend.o" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../crtn.o" Then, I manually bracket the -lz -lstdc++ calls to statically link them: "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/collect2" "--eh-frame-hdr" "-m" "elf_i386" "-dynamic-linker" "/lib/ld-linux.so.2" "-o" "kit" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../crt1.o" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../crti.o" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/crtbegin.o" "-L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1" "-L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../../i686-pc-linux- gnu/lib" "-L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../.." "kitInit.o" "pwb.o" "rechan.o" "tclAppInit.o" "vfs.o" "zlib.o" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Tcl/unix/libtcl8.4.a" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Tk/unix/libtk8.4.a" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Itcl/itcl/libitcl3.3.a" "/home/shared/basekit/tclkit/../Dists/Mk4tcl/builds/.libs/libmk4tcl.a" "-L/usr/X11R6/lib" "-lX11" "-ldl" "-lieee" -Bstatic "-lz" "-lstdc++" -Bdynamic "-lm" "-lgcc_s" "-lgcc" "-lc" "-lgcc_s" "-lgcc" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/crtend.o" "/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/../../../crtn.o" Result succeeds: -rwxr-xr-x 1 jcw users 2016129 Feb 15 13:31 tclkit This binary works. It solves input of special non-ascii7 chars as well, because I switched to a dynlinked X11 along the way, dropping another 500 Kb off the result - this will be tweaked further later on, by making Tk a dynloaded extension. That way the startup dependency on X11 will be avoided, making at least the Tcl side of Tclkit work on a non-X11 setup (e.g. a server). But the requirements to run this binary are now: $ ldd tclkit libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x40023000) libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x400ff000) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x40102000) libgcc_s.so.1 => /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.2.1/libgcc_s.so.1 (0x40123000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x4012c000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000) As far as I can tell, "libgcc_s.so.1" means BIG trouble. It's not on an older RH 7.1 setup, for example. This binary has become distro-specific :( Leaving out libgcc_s generates tons of unresolveds, apparently related to C++ exception handling - which (ironically) Metakit does *not* use at all. Is there any intelligent way out of this? Please help. -jcw PS. One pragmatic solution would be to add a call to getpwuid inside Tclkit, causing the related code to be present, and extensions to work ok through back-linking. Time wasted on this is perhaps better spent on recoding Metakit to Tcl/C? Don't laugh... C++ is a dead-end, as has been proven again :( From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 15 10:53:00 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FGqxc31115; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:52:59 -0600 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 17:55:05 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Guaca Mole , David Zolli To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <3B7B4954-4106-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > [following up on my own post] [again...] > Leaving out libgcc_s generates tons of unresolveds, apparently related > to C++ exception handling - which (ironically) Metakit does *not* use > at all. Resolved by linking to -lgcc_eh. Ok, latest linux builds in pub/tk/newer/ have following requirements: $ ldd tclkit libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x40023000) libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x400ff000) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x40102000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x40123000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000) All of these should work with most Linux distributions (I hope!). The ugly details of how this was done can be found in the latest file "M.sh" revision in the Tclkit CVS repository. This fixes getpwuid etc, as well as ability to type accented chars in X11. Please give it a try! -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Feb 15 12:46:31 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FIkUc02569 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:46:30 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1FImUiU009882 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:48:31 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.233]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1FImUB06838 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:48:30 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:49:07 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > ok through back-linking. Time wasted on this is perhaps better spent > on recoding Metakit to Tcl/C? Don't laugh... C++ is a dead-end, as has > been proven again :( This is an interesting question, since I know that we've discussed it off-list a few times. I haven't looked at the metakit source base, but I have converted several C++ extensions to C in my time (and I never regretted it). Do you have any estimate of what this would entail? Special C++ features you rely on? The C++ metakit stuff really does generate the most build troubles across platforms (insight into part of reason why C++ went out of fashion ??). Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sat Feb 15 12:52:49 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FIqnc02808 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:52:49 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1FIpviU010235; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:51:57 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.233]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1FIppB07223; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:51:57 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Vince Darley" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:52:28 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030215111049.020a0de8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > > o is this a virtual file system? > > > o is this read or writable (or transient) > > > o what is the vfs scheme for the filesystem represented > > > >I *think* these exist now in commands that Vince added with VFS. > >The 'file system' command should answer 1 and 3. The second should > >be handled by 'file writable', *if* the VFS is implemented right. > > Jeff's right ('file system' handles 1,3), *except* that: > > (i) 'file writable' won't differentiate between translucent and true > read-write filesystems > (ii) we also want to be able to control this from Tcl (so, e.g., > we need to be able to do 'file writable mykit.kit translucent' or > whatever). Vince, can you elaborate on what differentiation you are making between "translucent" and "true" read-write filesystems? I can infer something, but I know I'm just guessing. Take for example an mk vs. ftp vs. http tclvfs. Thanks, Jeff From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Sat Feb 15 13:35:39 2003 Received: from web13305.mail.yahoo.com (web13305.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.175.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1FJZdc04318 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:35:39 -0600 Message-ID: <20030215193745.85326.qmail@web13305.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.235] by web13305.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:37:45 PST Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:37:45 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list In-Reply-To: <3B7B4954-4106-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Yes! It works! Wow, talk about great suppport! :) But it has now a dependency on libX11? I am new to Tclkits, but shouldnt that only happen if I do a package require Tk and load Tk from the VFS? Many production environments dont have X installed --- Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > [following up on my own post] > > [again...] > > > Leaving out libgcc_s generates tons of > unresolveds, apparently related > > to C++ exception handling - which (ironically) > Metakit does *not* use > > at all. > > Resolved by linking to -lgcc_eh. > > Ok, latest linux builds in pub/tk/newer/ have > following requirements: > > $ ldd tclkit > libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 > (0x40023000) > libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x400ff000) > libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x40102000) > libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x40123000) > /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 > (0x40000000) > > All of these should work with most Linux > distributions (I hope!). > > The ugly details of how this was done can be found > in the latest file > "M.sh" revision in the Tclkit CVS repository. > > This fixes getpwuid etc, as well as ability to type > accented chars in > X11. > > Please give it a try! > > -jcw > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 15 13:36:35 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FJaYc04380 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:36:35 -0600 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 20:38:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <15B560CC-411D-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeffrey Hobbs wrote: >> ok through back-linking. Time wasted on this is perhaps better spent >> on recoding Metakit to Tcl/C? Don't laugh... C++ is a dead-end, as >> has >> been proven again :( > > This is an interesting question, since I know that we've discussed > it off-list a few times. I haven't looked at the metakit source > base, but I have converted several C++ extensions to C in my time > (and I never regretted it). Do you have any estimate of what this > would entail? Special C++ features you rely on? The C++ metakit > stuff really does generate the most build troubles across platforms Tell me about it :( - and for 3 language contexts: C++, Tcl, Python. The MK core is 16 KLOC, add 4.5 for Mk4tcl, and 4 for Mk4py. There's a *lot* of MK that is not really exposed to Tcl at all (relational view operators). That upper level represents about 4 KLOC (I have a trimmed core, which would still do enough for VFS). Read-only access is much much simpler, a pure-Tcl MK file reader has be written in well 1 KLOC (albeit pretty dense code). Unfortunately, I expect a 1-1 translation of C++ -> C to take more code than MK currently has. MK has been a pretty long evolution path, with half a *dozen* rewrites of core parts. The C++ core is a pretty lean and mean machine by now. The C++ code does not use exceptions, templates, or RTTI - all of this to keep portability optimal (very close to the guidelines which Netscape/Mozilla sticks to). Correction: Mk4py does use expections, but things could be recoded without. Virtual member calls are very tightly tuned, and limited but crucial. Constructors and destructors play an absolutely essential role, which means that in C it'll be a lot more explicit code. Especially for MK's internal ref-counting. > (insight into part of reason why C++ went out of fashion ??). Actually, I still really really like this subset of C++. It's what has allowed me to write code which is robust, and which *stays* robust as changes are made and new features added. But the portability makes the whole point moot. C++ is a portability nightmare - partly because imperfect implementations keep pulling stuff in which I do not need at all. If C++ were efficient *and* small - it'd rock. Given three wishes, I'd love to see the following happen: 1. a solid MK reader in Tcl, sufficient to drive VFS r/o 2. a new vector-oriented core, with a few C primitives 3. the rest fully scripted, with C only for bottlenecks (Item #1 is just about there, btw, in the form of the "readkit" Tcl script.) Say... you don't happen to have a genie stashed away somewhere, perhaps? -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 15 13:50:33 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FJoWc04845 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:50:32 -0600 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 20:52:37 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030215193745.85326.qmail@web13305.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <087ECE11-411F-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Guaca Mole wrote: (I can't help but think that it's not your real name...) > Yes! It works! Wow, talk about great suppport! :) > But it has now a dependency on libX11? I am new to > Tclkits, but shouldnt that only happen if I do a > package require Tk and load Tk from the VFS? Many > production environments dont have X installed Correct. The impossible: today - miracles take a bit longer :) I think that the conclusion of this experiment has to be that for Linux, we're going to have to maintain two builds: - similar to this latest one, but with Tk and X11 shared (and as you say: such that X11 is not needed for Tcl use) - the original build: everything static, i.e. a build which should continue to work just about anywhere The first has a few dependencies, but is small and is probably the best one to work with, normally. The second is how the Nov 2002 release works. It will fail on nss-related code such as getpwuid, and with accented-char input in Tk. OTOH, it'll be able to run Tk even on a server with no X11 whatsoever installed (with DISPLAY pointing to another machine, evidently). Can anyone else on this list confirm that tclkit in pub/tk/newer/ works on more Linux distro's than just RH 8.0? Just launching it should be enough of a test, if you see a prompt, it's ok. -jcw Mission Impossible 5oftware Team From akupries@shaw.ca Sat Feb 15 14:05:08 2003 Received: from pd4mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FK58c05400 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 14:05:08 -0600 Received: from pd6mr3so.prod.shaw.ca (pd6mr3so-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.218]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HAD00IR5982Z4@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:07:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml10so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml10so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.80]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HAD00BHA982VT@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:07:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from bluepeak (h24-76-111-211.vc.shawcable.net [24.76.111.211]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with SMTP id <0HAD00CRO981ZC@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:07:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18k8N4-0007F6-00 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:53:10 -0800 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:53:04 -0800 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! In-reply-to: Message from Jean-Claude Wippler "of Sat, 15 Feb 2003 20:38:40 +0100." <15B560CC-411D-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> To: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <15B560CC-411D-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > (insight into part of reason why C++ went out of fashion ??). > > Actually, I still really really like this subset of C++. It's what has > allowed me to write code which is robust, and which *stays* robust as > changes are made and new features added. But the portability makes the > whole point moot. C++ is a portability nightmare - partly because > imperfect implementations keep pulling stuff in which I do not need at > all. If C++ were efficient *and* small - it'd rock. > > Given three wishes, I'd love to see the following happen: > 1. a solid MK reader in Tcl, sufficient to drive VFS r/o > 2. a new vector-oriented core, with a few C primitives > 3. the rest fully scripted, with C only for bottlenecks > > (Item #1 is just about there, btw, in the form of the "readkit" Tcl > script.) > > Say... you don't happen to have a genie stashed away somewhere, perhaps? Anyone who has the time and will to write MK implementation in C or Tcl (or an overburdened student^W^Wgenie available) should also know that a specification of the Metakit file format can be had from me or JC, as additional documentation beyond the C++ code itself. -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Sat Feb 15 14:12:50 2003 Received: from mailout10.sul.t-online.com (mailout10.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FKCoc05720 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 14:12:50 -0600 Received: from fwd03.sul.t-online.de by mailout10.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18k8i7-00037p-06; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:14:55 +0100 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[217.82.111.165]) by fmrl03.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18k8i6-1LNfSSC; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:14:54 +0100 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C8157BEF; Wed, 21 Mar 2001 02:11:36 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3E4EA03A.9040209@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:16:58 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! References: <087ECE11-411F-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > The first has a few dependencies, but is small and is probably the > best one to work with, normally. > > The second is how the Nov 2002 release works. It will fail on > nss-related code such as getpwuid, and with accented-char input in > Tk. OTOH, it'll be able to run Tk even on a server with no X11 > whatsoever installed (with DISPLAY pointing to another machine, > evidently). > > Can anyone else on this list confirm that tclkit in pub/tk/newer/ > works on more Linux distro's than just RH 8.0? Just launching it > should be enough of a test, if you see a prompt, it's ok. Tried on SuSE Linux 8.x: (not sure if 8.0/8.1) /pub/tk/newer/linux-i686.gz Startup failed with error message: linux-i686: /lib/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.3' not found (required by linux-i686) My info executing libc.so.6: /lib/libc.so.6: GNU C Library stable release version 2.2.5, by Roland McGrath et al. Copyright (C) 1992-2001, 2002 Free Software Foundation, Inc. This is free software; see the source for copying conditions. There is NO warranty; not even for MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. Compiled by GNU CC version 3.2. Compiled on a Linux 2.4.19 system on 2002-10-24. Available extensions: GNU libio by Per Bothner crypt add-on version 2.1 by Michael Glad and others Berkeley DB glibc 2.1 compat library by Thorsten Kukuk linuxthreads-0.9 by Xavier Leroy NoVersion patch for broken glibc 2.0 binaries BIND-8.2.3-T5B libthread_db work sponsored by Alpha Processor Inc NIS(YP)/NIS+ NSS modules 0.19 by Thorsten Kukuk Report bugs using the `glibcbug' script to . Michael Schlenker From michael@cleverly.com Sat Feb 15 14:45:24 2003 Received: from mgr2.xmission.com (mgr2.xmission.com [198.60.22.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FKjOc07411 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 14:45:24 -0600 Received: from [198.60.22.200] (helo=mail.xmission.com) by mgr2.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 18k9CV-0008Hc-02 for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:46:19 -0700 Received: from [166.70.107.99] (helo=gibraltar.deseretbook.net) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 18k9CV-0001Oe-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:46:19 -0700 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:45:55 -0700 (MST) From: "Michael A. Cleverly" To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! In-Reply-To: <087ECE11-411F-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Sat, 15 Feb 2003, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Can anyone else on this list confirm that tclkit in pub/tk/newer/ works > on more Linux distro's than just RH 8.0? Just launching it should be > enough of a test, if you see a prompt, it's ok. On RH 7.3 and a Debian (stable?) box I have access to I get: ./linux-i686: /lib/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.3' not found (required by ./linux-i686) On an aging RH 6.2 box I get the above plus several other errors. Michael From daniel@rawbyte.com Sat Feb 15 15:03:05 2003 Received: from enroque.rawbyte.com (adsl-63-192-218-231.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.218.231]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FL34c08274 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 15:03:04 -0600 Received: by enroque.rawbyte.com (Postfix, from userid 501) id E2FBA3512E; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:08:03 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:08:03 -0800 From: Daniel Lopez To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <20030215210803.GA8936@rawbyte.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Subject: [Starkit] Latest tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Maybe the trick is to compile it in an old glibc2 system hoping it will be forward-compatible? [daniel@enroque tmp]$ ./linux-i686 ./linux-i686: /lib/libc.so.6: version GLIBC_2.3' not found (required by ./linux-i686) [daniel@enroque tmp]$ cat /etc/redhat-release Mandrake Linux release 8.2 (Bluebird) for i586 [daniel@enroque tmp]$ cat /etc/mandrake-release Mandrake Linux release 8.2 (Bluebird) for i586 [daniel@enroque tmp]$ ldd linux-i686 ./linux-i686: /lib/libc.so.6: version GLIBC_2.3' not found (required by ./linux-i686) libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x40022000) libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x400e9000) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x400ec000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x4010f000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000) From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 15 16:40:57 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1FMeuc12712 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 16:40:56 -0600 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 23:43:02 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok, here's the summary so far... (thx for quick help, MS + MC). Last build was useless (glibc-2.3.1 dependency). Rebuilt with gcc 3.2 and glibc-2.2.5, it looks like things work on: Debian stable Gentoo 1.4rc2 RH 7.1 and 7.3 (but not 6.2) SuSE 8.0 That looks promising enough to keep going. The dependencies are: $ ldd tclkit libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x40023000) libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x400ff000) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x40102000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x40123000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000) (that X11 dependency in there is on its way out, no worries) -jcw From daniel@rawbyte.com Sat Feb 15 20:20:48 2003 Received: from enroque.rawbyte.com (adsl-63-192-218-231.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.218.231]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1G2Klc17987 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 20:20:47 -0600 Received: by enroque.rawbyte.com (Postfix, from userid 501) id B5B4D3516E; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 18:25:47 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 18:25:47 -0800 From: Daniel Lopez To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <20030216022547.GA9480@rawbyte.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Subject: [Starkit] Latest build Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I can confirm it works on Mandrake 8.2 and RedHat 8.0 Cheers Daniel From vince.darley@eurobios.com Mon Feb 17 02:15:39 2003 Received: from rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (rly-ip03.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.7]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1H8Fdc06496 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 02:15:39 -0600 Received: from logs-mtc-th.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-th.proxy.aol.com [64.12.102.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN3-0217031641; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 03:16:41 1900 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACA4A8B6.ipt.aol.com [172.164.168.182]) by logs-mtc-th.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1GDWusR338899 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 08:32:57 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030216132050.021b9e88@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:32:47 +0000 To: "Starkit list" From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030215111049.020a0de8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Apparently-From: Vincedarley@aol.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 10:52 AM 2/15/2003 -0800, Jeffrey Hobbs wrote: >Vince, can you elaborate on what differentiation you are making >between "translucent" and "true" read-write filesystems? I can >infer something, but I know I'm just guessing. Take for example >an mk vs. ftp vs. http tclvfs. Sure! Any starpack is by default "translucent". You can happily open, write, delete, mkdir *inside* the starpack without any problems at all. (e.g. Alphatk.exe can edit itself while running). BUT, when you exit, all your changes are lost. Nothing actually changed on disk at all, and, in fact, nothing can change on disk without a complex exit process which doesn't yet exist (not in tclvfs anyway). So the read-write nature of the starpack was entirely an illusion created by what someone on the Wiki called a "translucent" filesystem. The same kind of thing can potentially make a CD-ROM appear read-write too, if desired. Of course, one could create a mechanism to store each session's changes as a 'delta' to the read-only original, and hence make this illusion more permanent. One could even re-write the starpack on exit to make the illusion almost perfect. Some filesystems are true read-write (ftp, or a starkit created with '-writable'), some are read-only (zip, tar at present), and some are translucent (starpack, starkit without '-writable'). I would like to provide a consistent interface by which the application developer can control this (when it is possible, of course) from Tcl. Perhaps: vfs::filesystem configure $mount -state state Where 'state' is (readonly|readwrite|translucent), and if it is 'translucent' there's a way to hook into the unmount/close process to store the 'delta', and if its readwrite, there's a way to, perhaps, adjust the commit frequency, etc. Perhaps each filesystem (or filesystem-mount pair) can specify some attributes? One could even imagine the ability in Tcl to adjust the state of the native filesystem with some hypothetical "filesystem / configure -state readonly"? cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 17 06:24:19 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1HCOIc17856 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 06:24:18 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:26:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030216132050.021b9e88@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: <08C9A583-4273-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1HCOIc17856 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince, > Sure! Any starpack is by default "translucent". You can happily > open, write, delete, mkdir *inside* the starpack without any problems > at all. (e.g. Alphatk.exe can edit itself while running). BUT, when > you exit, all your changes are lost. Nothing actually changed on disk > at all, and, in fact, nothing can change on disk without a complex > exit process which doesn't yet exist (not in tclvfs anyway). Accurate. Note that "mk::file save" can write current state to another file. > I would like to provide a consistent interface by which the > application developer can control this (when it is possible, of > course) from Tcl. This would indeed be nice. I'm not sure far you can/should go with this w.r.t. Metakit. MK *is* a quirky beast, it may never fit in fully. Let me describe a few things it does for me: As you mention, one can "write" translucently to CD-ROM. This has actually an important use in more general MK databases: it lets you restructure and convert a database on open, when a new version of the code needs to open an older version of the database. MK uses this trick to open pre 2.01 DB's, but apps also use it if they changed the database layout (a few more fields, for example). The rest of the app then proceeds with a single consistent model, without having written anything. Second, there really are several uses for restructuring a MK-based VFS datafile on the fly, at times. The VFS format is: dirs[name:S,parent:I,files[name:S,size:I,date:I,contents:B] In Starsync, I restructure this with one "mk::view layout" command to: dirs[name:S,parent:I,files[name:S,size:I,date:I] Then I serialize it to a memchan and read it back. Voilá, a catalog, as a small string. This transformation is instant. Similar tricks can be used to define an extra MD5 field, put the message digest, and drop the files again - a MD5 table of contents. Third, and this is an under-utilized (and unfinished) feature of the MK core: there are two special ways to open a MK datafile: commit-extend and commit-aside. Commit extend writes at the end only. That means multiple readers can be supported in some models (the file may grow quickly, and needs cleanup phases - this is how Apple's AddressBook uses it, btw). Commit aside opens a second file and saves differential changes there. Open normally and you get the original, open with the aside file and you see a modified state. It stacks. It means you can take a CD-ROM, make "changes", ship the changes file to someone else with the CD, and they can see the modified state as well. Including restructures, anything. Think of updates, also of VFS change sets. This is not limited to VFS, it works with any MK datafile. There's a lot of untapped potential in all this. I just wanted to describe it a bit more, so you can put the MK side of VFS in perspective. I haven't figured out how to expose any of this through VFS, not to what extent one should. These tricks for now, require getting at the MK database handle underneath the mk4vfs driver, and doing direct MK calls. -jcw From morgangoeller@cox.net Mon Feb 17 11:59:45 2003 Received: from morgan-goellers-computer.local (pix-fw.wan.aol.com [152.163.190.1]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1HHxjc03711 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 11:59:45 -0600 Received: from [10.4.25.245] ([10.4.25.245]) by morgan-goellers-computer.local (8.12.6/8.12.2) with ESMTP id h1HI1hZP000979 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 11:01:44 -0700 (MST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.0.2006 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 11:01:40 -0700 From: Morgan Goeller To: Untitled 2 Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Issue with the Mac OS X version of TCLKit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Folks, I just tried to download the Mac OS versions of TCLKit binaries and they seem to be "Classic" applications, which is a change from a few weeks ago. This is occuring with the files: tclkit-macos-fat.bin.gz 11/05 11:19 1764314b 19a6b531bc47e4c9 tclkit-macos-ppc.bin.gz 11/05 11:19 1040982b d8d9684c9c004d52 I have checked this on two separate computers, both running OS X. I have recently wiped my box and no longer have the previous version. If possible, could we have the OS X version back, or at least have both binaries available? Thanks, Morgan From jeffh@ActiveState.com Mon Feb 17 12:49:42 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1HIngc07011; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:49:42 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1HIpiiU006046; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:51:44 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1HIphB08666; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:51:44 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit - big linking dilemma! Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:51:40 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <15B560CC-411D-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > The MK core is 16 KLOC, add 4.5 for Mk4tcl, and 4 for Mk4py. There's a > *lot* of MK that is not really exposed to Tcl at all (relational view > operators). That upper level represents about 4 KLOC (I have a trimmed > core, which would still do enough for VFS). Hmmm, I know I'm going to be obnoxious here, but that really doesn't sound like much. The Tcl plugin is over 14K, which I just rewrote in large part functionally, in addition to removing all (completely useless) C++ code. > Read-only access is much much simpler, a pure-Tcl MK file reader has be > written in well 1 KLOC (albeit pretty dense code). All things worth looking forward to. > Unfortunately, I expect a 1-1 translation of C++ -> C to take more code > than MK currently has. MK has been a pretty long evolution path, with ... > The C++ code does not use exceptions, templates, or RTTI - all of this > to keep portability optimal (very close to the guidelines which Which should also keep translation to a minimum pain level. Aren't I just the devil ... > Say... you don't happen to have a genie stashed away somewhere, perhaps? Darn, I knew we should have kept that old wish icon around. ;) Jeff From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Feb 18 10:49:41 2003 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1IGnec19281 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 10:49:41 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB488B8.ipt.aol.com [172.180.136.184]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id AQC23762 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 18 Feb 2003 16:49:03 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030218164807.0223d040@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 16:49:08 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] read-only/translucent/read-write In-Reply-To: <08C9A583-4273-11D7-BF61-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030216132050.021b9e88@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FWIW, I've submitted a first cut at this read-only/translucent/read-write control to the tclvfs project on sourceforge. See the changelog for further info. Vince. From vthomas@toadmail.com Tue Feb 18 12:59:31 2003 Received: from fajita.toad.net (fajita.toad.net [162.33.144.56]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1IIxUc31061 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 12:59:30 -0600 Received: (from apache@localhost) by fajita.toad.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h1IJ1dA02148 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:01:39 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: fajita.toad.net: apache set sender to vthomas@toadmail.com using -f To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <1045594899.3e52831327117@webmail.toad.net> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:01:39 -0500 (EST) From: vthomas@toadmail.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: IMP/PHP IMAP webmail program 2.2.6 X-WebMail-Originator: ToadNet, Inc. X-Originating-IP: 162.33.141.122 Subject: [Starkit] tk_getOpenFile - is this a limitation of Starkit or my understanding? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I wanted to distribute an application that reads xml files along with the files of interest. The scripted document was the obvious paradigm. However it seems that I can't use the system dialogs such as tk_getOpenFile. Here is a test case, if I qwrap the following lines, package require Tk set types {{"Tcl files" {*.tcl} } {"All Files" {*.*} } } tk_getOpenFile -filetypes $types -initialdir [file join $starkit::topdir lib] -title "Load tcl file" and try it on Linux it works but on Windows '98 and 2000 the initialdir is ignored, and then there is no way to get into the vfs, yes? To some extent I would be amazed if it did work since you have handed off to the system and it knows nothing about the vfs. However, I don't see this anywhere as a caveat and it works on Linux. Doing cd [file join $starkit::topdir lib] before it doesn't help either. _________________________________________________________________________ This mail sent via toadmail.com, web e-mail @ ToadNet - want to go fast? http://www.toadmail.com From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Tue Feb 18 13:14:47 2003 Received: from mailout09.sul.t-online.com (mailout09.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.84]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1IJEkc32447 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 13:14:46 -0600 Received: from fwd07.sul.t-online.de by mailout09.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18lDEb-0002Au-04; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 20:16:53 +0100 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[80.130.23.179]) by fmrl07.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18lDEI-1UBVXUC; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 20:16:34 +0100 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0F9C7BEF; Wed, 21 Mar 2001 23:49:35 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3E52870F.6030708@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 20:18:39 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] tk_getOpenFile - is this a limitation of Starkit or my understanding? References: <1045594899.3e52831327117@webmail.toad.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: vthomas@toadmail.com wrote: >I wanted to distribute an application that reads xml files along with the files >of interest. The scripted document was the obvious paradigm. However it seems >that I can't use the system dialogs such as tk_getOpenFile. > >Here is a test case, if I qwrap the following lines, > >package require Tk >set types {{"Tcl files" {*.tcl} } {"All Files" {*.*} } } >tk_getOpenFile -filetypes $types -initialdir [file join $starkit::topdir lib] >-title "Load tcl file" > >and try it on Linux it works but on Windows '98 and 2000 the initialdir is >ignored, and then there is no way to get into the vfs, yes? To some extent I >would be amazed if it did work since you have handed off to the system and it >knows nothing about the vfs. However, I don't see this anywhere as a caveat and >it works on Linux. >Doing > cd [file join $starkit::topdir lib] >before it doesn't help either. > Your right, that you cannot access the native dialog, if you want to access files in the vfs. Windows doesn't know about the tcl Vfs, so there is nothing that could be done. It works on Linux because there is no native dialog there. The Linux version uses the tk dialog provided by the tk library. (tk8.x / tkfbox.tcl tk.tcl xmfbox.tcl) You could delete the native widget command under windows and always use the unix one, or try and mix it. rename tk_getOpenFile winTk_getOpenFile than source tkfbox.tcl and copy the code from tk.tcl that selects the dialog for your platform. Michael Schlenker From jeffh@ActiveState.com Tue Feb 18 13:20:51 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1IJKpc00540 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 13:20:51 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1IJMsiU012109; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:22:54 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1IJMsB09013; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:22:54 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: , Subject: RE: [Starkit] tk_getOpenFile - is this a limitation of Starkit or my understanding? Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:22:53 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <1045594899.3e52831327117@webmail.toad.net> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I wanted to distribute an application that reads xml files along with the files > of interest. The scripted document was the obvious paradigm. However it seems > that I can't use the system dialogs such as tk_getOpenFile. http://groups.google.ca/groups?selm=Xns930479C6B7E75jeffh.activestate%4064.1 87.24.4 Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Tue Feb 18 14:02:34 2003 Received: from rildoimml01.riley.army.mil (rildoimml01.riley.army.mil [144.246.27.61]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1IK2Xc04583 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:02:34 -0600 Received: by rildoimml01.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <17VV2RC0>; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:00:52 -0600 Message-ID: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E07C@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:02:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > * support for customizable icon on Windows I'd love to play around with this. Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file with? From damon@your.unreality.com Tue Feb 18 14:06:54 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1IK6sc04977 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:06:54 -0600 Received: (qmail 87626 invoked by uid 300); 18 Feb 2003 20:09:00 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 20:09:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:09:00 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" cc: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON In-Reply-To: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E07C@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > * support for customizable icon on Windows > I'd love to play around with this. > Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file > with? Though Icon Studio is a very nice free tool, it doesn't really have the ability to stretch or shrink icons into new sizes. I found IconCool Editor pretty good at that. There are many others. Those are just the ones I found that worked pretty well. D From wojciech@kocjan.org Tue Feb 18 14:09:58 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1IK9jc05230 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:09:47 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18lE5D-00046Q-00 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 21:11:15 +0100 Message-ID: <3E52931C.7010803@kocjan.org> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 21:10:04 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E07C@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> In-Reply-To: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E07C@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: > >> * support for customizable icon on Windows > > I'd love to play around with this. > Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file > with? I use gimp+png2ico :) Never tried the results on a 16-color display though :) -- WK (written at Stardate 57134.8) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From ilya_g@rad.com Wed Feb 19 02:47:36 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1J8lYc20398 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 02:47:35 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1J8nDUP024982 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:49:13 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1J8nDq3024979 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:49:13 +0200 (IST) Received: from ilyag ([192.115.243.37]) by exrad2.ad.rad.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:44:09 +0200 Message-ID: <000b01c2d7f3$a51c1120$25f373c0@rad.co.il> From: "Ilya Ginzburg" To: References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:48:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2003 08:44:09.0726 (UTC) FILETIME=[11E859E0:01C2D7F3] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > > * support for customizable icon on Windows > > I'd love to play around with this. > > Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file > > with? > > Though Icon Studio is a very nice free tool, it doesn't really have > the ability to stretch or shrink icons into new sizes. I found IconCool > Editor pretty good at that. There are many others. Those are just the > ones I found that worked pretty well. > > D > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Hi! I am trying to change the icon of my app.exe file. I created simple icon file and named it tclkit.ico and put it in app.vfs directory. Now I wrap the exe by - I see (by quantity of files) , that the file included in the exe file. But the icon of app.exe still remain icon of TclTk and not my. Why doesn't work? From ilya_g@rad.com Wed Feb 19 02:49:32 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1J8nVc20533 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 02:49:31 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1J8pBUP025192 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:51:11 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1J8pBq3025189 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:51:11 +0200 (IST) Received: from ilyag ([192.115.243.37]) by exrad2.ad.rad.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:46:07 +0200 Message-ID: <002101c2d7f3$eb346720$25f373c0@rad.co.il> From: "Ilya Ginzburg" To: "Starkit list" Subject: Fw: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:50:14 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2003 08:46:07.0289 (UTC) FILETIME=[57FB0A90:01C2D7F3] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > > > > > * support for customizable icon on Windows > > > I'd love to play around with this. > > > Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file > > > with? > > > > Though Icon Studio is a very nice free tool, it doesn't really have > > the ability to stretch or shrink icons into new sizes. I found IconCool > > Editor pretty good at that. There are many others. Those are just the > > ones I found that worked pretty well. > > > > D > > > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > Hi! I am trying to change the icon of my app.exe file. I created simple icon file and named it tclkit.ico and put it in app.vfs directory. Now I wrap the exe by - I see (by quantity of files) , that the file included in the exe file. But the icon of app.exe still remain icon of TclTk and not my. Why doesn't work? From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 19 02:59:52 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1J8xpc21210 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 02:59:52 -0600 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 10:02:00 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000b01c2d7f3$a51c1120$25f373c0@rad.co.il> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ilya Ginzburg wrote: > I am trying to change the icon of my app.exe file. [...] > Why doesn't work? You need the latest versions of sdx and latest version ov tclkit.exe Specifically, tclkit.exe must be from the pub/tk/newer/ directory. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 19 05:13:33 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1JBDXc29089 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 05:13:33 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1JBFX7V007520 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 06:15:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1JBFZi11862; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 06:15:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 06:15:35 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030219061535.AAB11098@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] wikit with .htaccess - is there anything else special that I need to know? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've got my personal wikit set up with a public read only link and a private .htaccess link. Unfortunately, while the wikit is showing me the first page, it won't show me any other page of the wikit. Here's my read/writable wikit cgi script: #! /bin/ksh cd /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/wikit-data/ exec /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/tclkit-linux-x86 /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/wikit-data/wikit.kit /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/wikit-data/wikit.tkd In the server log, I am getting this error: [Wed Feb 19 06:01:46 2003] [error] [client 134.243.40.138] script not found or unable to stat: /home/lvirden/public_html/cgi-bin/20 when I try to go to the page. Can anyone see anything specific that I need additionally to set up? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 19 08:31:31 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1JEVVc12131 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 08:31:31 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1JEXW7V010767 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 09:33:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1JEXXT16219; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 09:33:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 09:33:33 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030219093333.AAB16209@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit with .htaccess - is there anything else special that I need to know? In-Reply-To: <20030219061535.AAB11098@cas.org> of Wed, 19 Feb 2003 06:15:35 -0500 (EST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: problems accessing pages Never mind - this is bug #11 . I was mis-remembering where the trailing slash went -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 10:12:50 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KGCoc14032 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 10:12:50 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 17:14:59 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: While getting ready for the upcoming tclkit 8.4.2 release, I'm trying to make it still easier for people to build tclkit. The main reason being that I hope to share the "fun" of building things with you, while automating it all as much as possible - we could have a "tclkit build fest" and end up with a truly huge number of platforms! Everything is documented at http://www.equi4.com/268 - please let me know if there are typo's, errors, or omissions in any of this. Accuracy matters a lot here... If you want to try this out - I've updated http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ with what is probably the last pre-release candidate for tclkit. Please consider this a "dry run" only. The code produced at this stage should *not* be considered the real thing. Apart from Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 not being released yet, there are several more details te be worked out in tclkit linking. Some changes to tclvfs and/or runtime files are also still likely. The final tclkit 8.4.2 release is expected within a week. -jcw PS. Here's the output from my local Linux box: $ mkdir a $ cd a $ wget -q http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit $ tclsh genkit A Fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz Fetching tars/tk.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz Fetching tars/itcl.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/itcl.tar.gz Fetching tars/mk.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/mk.tar.gz Fetching tars/vfs.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/vfs.tar.gz Fetching tars/kit.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/kit.tar.gz Fetching tars/zlib.tar.gz ... OK unpacking tars/zlib.tar.gz $ tclsh genkit B tcl tcl: sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok make binaries libraries ... ok make install-binaries install-... ok echo parray tcl_platform | /ho... ok Done. $ sh ../genkit B zlib: sh /home/shared/basekit/tclkit... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok kitsh: gcc -c -I. -I/home/shared/base... ok g++ -o kitsh tclAppInit.o pwb.... ok strip kitsh ... ok ls -l /home/shared/basekit/tcl... ok itcldyn: sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok make binaries ... ok make install-binaries ... ok tkdyn: sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok make binaries ... ok make install-binaries ... ok Done. $ sh genkit C $ ls -s result-teevie.equi4.local.tar.gz 1480 result-teevie.equi4.local.tar.gz $ sh genkit D Fetching tars/runtime-tk.kit ... OK info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.224 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = littleEndian tcl_platform(machine) = i686 tcl_platform(os) = Linux tcl_platform(osVersion) = 2.4.20 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = jcw tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-teevie.equi4.local $ sh genkit E tclkit-teevie.equi4.local: 1122905 -> 1657237 $ ./tclkit-teevie.equi4.local % info patchlevel 8.4.2 % ^D $ From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 20 11:20:25 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KHKOc19723 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:20:24 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1KHMR7V017795 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:22:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1KHMQJ05813; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:22:26 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:22:26 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030220122225.AAB5798@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit In-Reply-To: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 20 Feb 2003 17:14:59 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: One question about the new steps. After I complete the entire process, I have this: build/ dummy-lwv26awu* genkit* install/ noarch/ out/ result-lwv26awu.tar.gz src/ tars/ tclkit-lwv26awu* Should there have been a tclkitsh as well? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Thu Feb 20 11:29:32 2003 Received: from lewey.iland.net (lewey.iland.net [205.242.230.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1KHTWc20512 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:29:32 -0600 Received: (qmail 2877 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 17:31:45 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-73.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.73) by lewey.iland.net with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 17:31:45 -0000 Message-ID: <00ac01c2d905$782eebc0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit list" References: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:28:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 2/19/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Starkit list" Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:14 AM Subject: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit > tkdyn: > sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok > make binaries ... ok > make install-binaries ... ok FWIW, I tried this out this morning under Linux Mandrake 8.2. I get as far as the "make install-binaries" step of "tkdyn" and get some type of "Abnormal Exit" message (sorry, don't have it in front of me).... Looks like I'm on my own at this point.... ;^) Jeff From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Feb 20 11:34:42 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KHYac21002 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:34:39 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18luca-0006am-00 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:36:32 +0100 Message-ID: <3E5511B3.3030001@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:34:43 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit References: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > While getting ready for the upcoming tclkit 8.4.2 release, I'm trying to > make it still easier for people to build tclkit. The main reason being > that I hope to share the "fun" of building things with you, while > automating it all as much as possible - we could have a "tclkit build > fest" and end up with a truly huge number of platforms! I kind of hoped on seeing my updates to genkit (at least windows+mingw support). Perhaps, if you're considering doing a leaner and meaner genkit, this would be good time to work on Windows platform? :) WK (written at Stardate 57139.7) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Feb 20 11:44:34 2003 Received: from smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KHiYc21875 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:44:34 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18lumE-0009iv-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 17:46:30 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030220174539.02345b88@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 17:46:28 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit In-Reply-To: <3E5511B3.3030001@kocjan.org> References: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 06:34 PM 2/20/2003 +0100, you wrote: >I kind of hoped on seeing my updates to genkit (at least windows+mingw >support). I'd be interested in seeing those too... Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 11:51:42 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KHpfc22541; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:51:41 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:53:50 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: "Starkit list" To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <00ac01c2d905$782eebc0$0101a8c0@quantex> Message-Id: <44B7B321-44FC-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > FWIW, I tried this out this morning under Linux Mandrake 8.2. I get > as far > as the "make install-binaries" step of "tkdyn" and get some type of > "Abnormal Exit" message (sorry, don't have it in front of me).... > > Looks like I'm on my own at this point.... ;^) You are... unless you share the output of cat build/`hostname`/tkdyn with us (Mandrake 8.1 worked for me) -jcw From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Feb 20 11:56:50 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KHuYc23049 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 11:56:46 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18luxS-0006wS-00; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:58:06 +0100 Message-ID: <3E5516E6.20302@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:56:54 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Vince Darley CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit References: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030220174539.02345b88@mail.wolfbusiness.com> In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030220174539.02345b88@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > At 06:34 PM 2/20/2003 +0100, you wrote: > >I kind of hoped on seeing my updates to genkit (at least windows+mingw > >support). > > I'd be interested in seeing those too... My older version is here: http://www.zoro2.org/tclkit-batteries-included.tar.gz I fixed a bug here or there, but in general, it allows building tclkit with mingw... If JCW wants to, I could patch up the current genkit so that it works on both linux and windows, and so that it allows building itcl+itk static/dynamic, whatever the user declares via $env(BC*) :) -- WK (written at Stardate 57139.7) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Thu Feb 20 12:24:12 2003 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1KIOBc25628 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:24:11 -0600 Received: (qmail 32501 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:26:23 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-73.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.73) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:26:23 -0000 Message-ID: <00e001c2d90d$1a078d60$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit list" References: <44B7B321-44FC-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:22:54 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 2/19/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Jeff Godfrey" Cc: "Starkit list" Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit > Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > > FWIW, I tried this out this morning under Linux Mandrake 8.2. I get > > as far > > as the "make install-binaries" step of "tkdyn" and get some type of > > "Abnormal Exit" message (sorry, don't have it in front of me).... > > > > Looks like I'm on my own at this point.... ;^) > > You are... unless you share the output of > cat build/`hostname`/tkdyn > with us Thanks for the tip JC, I didn't even know *where* to look for the problem. - build/`hostname`/tkdyn/config.log looks like a good place to look for problems, so opening it reveals... [... snip ...] configure:4303:27: X11/Intrinsic.h: No such file or directory configure: failed program was: #line 4302 "configure" #include "confdefs.h" #include [... snip ...] - A find on the system doesn't come up with "Intrinsic.h" - A quick google session informs me that it should be in --> /usr/X11R6/include/X11/Intrinsic.h but it's not - Another google search says that it should be part of the Xfree86-devel rpm - I guess it hasn't been installed on this box... - As I am not the admin of this system, I'll have to check with my SysAdmin... If any of the above tells someone that I (who am fairly clueless about this stuff) am off on a completely unrelated tangent, please speak up... ;^) Thanks, Jeff From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 20 12:38:59 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KIcxc27007 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:38:59 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1KIf17V020423 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:41:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1KIf0i07740; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:41:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:41:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030220134100.AAB7724@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:22:54 -0600 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Perhaps genkit should go ahead and build the non-Tk version if the X11 headers or libraries are not found? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 12:48:35 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KImYc27904 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:48:34 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 19:50:44 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <00e001c2d90d$1a078d60$0101a8c0@quantex> Message-Id: <37C6788C-4504-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: >> You are... unless you share the output of >> cat build/`hostname`/tkdyn >> with us > > Thanks for the tip JC, I didn't even know *where* to look for the > problem. And it would have been even better if I had said: cat out/`hostname`/tkdyn ... :) > configure:4303:27: X11/Intrinsic.h: No such file or directory Your system does not have the necessary X11 headers/libs, I suspect. -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Thu Feb 20 12:53:18 2003 Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KIrIc28356 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:53:18 -0600 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0HAM00E01F85UL@houston.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:55:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0HAM00D6HF7Z58@houston.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:55:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id h1KItBb02750 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:55:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:55:11 -0500 (EST) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I decided to follow the steps from 1.1, even though I have various tcl stuff already on my machine, a Sun ultra 5 running solaris (SunOS 5.9). I succeeded in building it all, but you might note on step 1.4 this problem and its solution: jhz[argon.jhuapl.edu:(/local/argon/build)]112: ./tclsh genkit A application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in the following directories: {} /usr/local/lib/tcl8.4 /local/argon/lib/tcl8.4 /local/lib/tcl8.4 /local/argon/library /local/library /local/tcl8.4.2/library /tcl8.4.2/library /usr/local/lib/tcl8.4 Of course I needed to set my environment to find the new libraries: export TCL_LIBRARY=./tcl/library and then './tclsh genkit A' ran OK. Oh, if you already have tclsh installed and it finds that one when you run 'tclsh', it might not work, so always run './tclsh' I know this is trivial stuff, but you maybe want to mention these for newcomers... ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 12:54:14 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KIsEc28457 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:54:14 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 19:56:24 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030220134100.AAB7724@cas.org> Message-Id: <021BDA2B-4505-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Perhaps genkit should go ahead and build the non-Tk version if > the X11 headers or libraries are not found? In fact, it will. Jeff Godfrey's error does not prevent him from completing steps C and D. He won't be able to do E, which integrates incrtcl and tk shared libs. But I'm not too keen on this anymore. Tclkit represents a certain fixed amount of functionality. Tclkitsh was a sidestep to accommodate the Windows command line. The way tclkit is built now, Tk is dynamically loaded. That means the latest builds will work without X, simply by never doing "package require Tk". (Almost: as I said, some link tweaks needed still) In the case of Jeff G's Mandrake 8.2: it's not suited for building Tclkit as it stands now, i.e. it needs X11 headers & libs. But he will be just fine with other Linux builds. -jcw From crcha@wanadoo.be Thu Feb 20 12:26:31 2003 Received: from ev6.be.wanadoo.com (ev6.be.wanadoo.com [195.74.212.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KIQUc25876 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:26:31 -0600 Received: from wanadoo.be (adsl-147-250.wanadoo.be [213.177.147.250]) by ev6.be.wanadoo.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h1KISdq29913 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 19:28:39 +0100 Message-ID: <3E552D27.4020301@wanadoo.be> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 19:31:51 +0000 From: Cristian Chaparro User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit References: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-wanadoo-be-Metrics: ev6 1016; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, Mandrake 9.0 with ActiveTcl installed worked for me also, except for some minor differences... Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > $ mkdir a > $ cd a > $ wget -q http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit > $ tclsh genkit A Got this: error reading package index file /usr/local/ActiveTcl/lib/vfs1.0/pkgIndex.tcl: can't read "tcl_platform(platform)": no such variable downloading and untaring continued Ok... > > $ sh ../genkit B The ../ shouldn't be there as I'm still in .../a/ ... typo probably? > > $ sh genkit C > $ ls -s result-teevie.equi4.local.tar.gz > 1480 result-teevie.equi4.local.tar.gz 1474973 Feb 20 19:02 result-crcha.myhome.tar.gz > > $ sh genkit E > tclkit-teevie.equi4.local: 1122905 -> 1657237 tclkit-crcha.myhome: 1077589 -> 1601747 I like it when things work as promised! Thanks! Cristian. From bryan@bitmover.com Thu Feb 20 13:00:32 2003 Received: from pimout3-ext.prodigy.net (pimout3-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJ0Wc29108; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:00:32 -0600 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-66-139-39-161.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.139.39.161]) by pimout3-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.3 da nor stuldap/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1KJ2f0X041204; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:02:42 -0500 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:02:13 -0600 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Bryan Oakley In-Reply-To: <7546BED0-44EE-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, February 20, 2003, at 10:14 AM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > PS. Here's the output from my local Linux box: > [snip] > $ tclsh genkit B tcl > tcl: > sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok > make binaries libraries ... ok > make install-binaries install-... ok > echo parray tcl_platform | /ho... ok > Done. > $ sh ../genkit B Is that right? After I do the "genkit B tcl" step I'm in the directory that contains genkit. I had to do "sh genkit B" It seems like it would be a simple thing to write a makefile and/or a tcl and/or wish script that does all these steps, so one could simply do "make tclkit" or whatever, and sit back and watch the magic. That could even eliminate the need to use "wget" (which my machine doesn't have, FWIW) by using the tcl http package. BTW: with the one minor change mentioned above, this worked great on my MacOSX 10.2.3 system. Kudos. --bryan From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 13:17:53 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJHqc30693 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:17:52 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:20:01 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <4F152B5E-4508-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan Oakley wrote: >> $ tclsh genkit B tcl [...] >> $ sh ../genkit B > > Is that right? After I do the "genkit B tcl" step I'm in the directory > that contains genkit. I had to do "sh genkit B" Whoops. I goofed - I was using ../genkit everywhere and forgot to edit this *one* case out . > It seems like it would be a simple thing to write a makefile and/or a > tcl and/or wish script that does all these steps, so one could simply > do "make tclkit" or whatever, and sit back and watch the magic. That > could even eliminate the need to use "wget" (which my machine doesn't > have, FWIW) by using the tcl http package. Hm, yes - I had initially hoped to make genkit do everything, but that idea broke down because it's a Tcl script. There may not be a tclsh to start with... Yes, a makefile might be a good idea. Perhaps with rules such as: genkit: wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit || \ echo "please donwload a copy of 'genkit' - cannot proceed." Hm, more work... > BTW: with the one minor change mentioned above, this worked great on > my MacOSX 10.2.3 system. Kudos. 10.2.3, eh? That's old stuff... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 13:26:03 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJQ3c31458 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:26:03 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:28:12 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E5516E6.20302@kocjan.org> Message-Id: <73C286AC-4509-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > Vince Darley wrote: >> At 06:34 PM 2/20/2003 +0100, you wrote: >> >I kind of hoped on seeing my updates to genkit (at least >> windows+mingw >support). >> I'd be interested in seeing those too... > > My older version is here: > http://www.zoro2.org/tclkit-batteries-included.tar.gz > > I fixed a bug here or there, but in general, it allows building tclkit > with mingw... Thanks for reminding me, and sorry for letting this slip. Note that incrtcl is no longer statically linked, so it can be dropped or moved by those who insist. I am ok with that, but will not spend much of my time on this myself. I'm trying *hard* to limit my focus, not spread it even thinner... As for mingw - yes, good idea. Looking now! -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 20 13:33:59 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJXxc32239 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:33:59 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1KJa17V017990 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:36:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1KJa0H13975; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:36:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:36:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030220143600.AAB13690@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] some new documentation In-Reply-To: <79EFA994-3C73-11D7-BCB4-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Sun, 9 Feb 2003 22:14:29 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: sdx update capability When I run sdx update tkdiff.kit and sdx reports 1 changes applied. then should I be surprised when I do this? $ ls -l /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 63160 Aug 7 2002 /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit seeing as today isn't Aug 7, 2002 on my machine? That is to say, after sdx update file.kit should file.kit be updated? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 13:42:14 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJgDc00600 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:42:13 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:44:22 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] some new documentation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030220143600.AAB13690@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > When I run > > sdx update tkdiff.kit > > and sdx reports > 1 changes applied. > > then should I be surprised when I do this? Very. > $ ls -l /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit > -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 63160 Aug 7 2002 > /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit > > seeing as today isn't Aug 7, 2002 on my machine? That is to say, after > sdx update file.kit > > should file.kit be updated? Yes. Please unwrap, fetch tkdiff over the web, unwrap separately and diff them... Also, if you have the old tkdiff.kit still - can you do: sdx update -n tkdiff.kit to see what file it reports as changed? (I don't remember changing anything...) You may have hit a bug - I hope you can narrow this down. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 20 13:51:47 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJplc01525 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:47 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1KJro7V024397 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:53:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1KJrn114573; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:53:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:53:49 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030220145349.AAB14356@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] some new documentation In-Reply-To: of Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:44:22 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Please unwrap, fetch tkdiff over the web, unwrap separately and diff > them... > > Also, if you have the old tkdiff.kit still - can you do: > sdx update -n tkdiff.kit > to see what file it reports as changed? > > (I don't remember changing anything...) > > You may have hit a bug - I hope you can narrow this down. $ wget http://mini.net/sdarchive/tkdiff.kit $ ls -l tkdiff.kit /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 63160 Aug 7 2002 /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit -rw-r--r-- 1 lwv26 dept26 63166 Feb 20 14:48 tkdiff.kit $ mkdir prev curr $ mv tkdiff.kit curr $ cp /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit prev $ cd prev $ sdx unwrap tkdiff.kit $ cd ../curr $ sdx unwrap tkdiff.kit $ cd .. $ dircmp prev/tkdiff.vfs current/tkdiff.vfs /ldatae/WWW/Starkit/prev/tkdiff.vfs /ldatae/WWW/Starkit/current/tkdiff.vfs /ldatae/WWW/Starkit/prev/tkdiff.vfs Feb 20 14:51 2003 Comparison of prev/tkdiff.vfs current/tkdiff.vfs Page 1 directory . directory ./bin same ./bin/main.tcl $ sdx update -n /ldatae/bin/tkdiff.kit TKDIFF: comparing with http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... 1 differences: - -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Feb 20 13:54:58 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJsuc01861 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:54:57 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18lwoO-0008Pn-00 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:56:52 +0100 Message-ID: <3E5532BC.8060901@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:55:40 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit References: <73C286AC-4509-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <73C286AC-4509-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > Thanks for reminding me, and sorry for letting this slip. Ok. My latest version of genkit is here: http://www.zoro2.org/bi-genkit > Note that incrtcl is no longer statically linked, so it can be dropped > or moved by those who insist. I am ok with that, but will not spend > much of my time on this myself. I'm trying *hard* to limit my focus, > not spread it even thinner... Hmmm. Actually I'm considering on moving to dynamic itcl+itk myself. Just never had the time to work on this. I'll probably have to work on building stubs-enabled blt as well, then I could move from static tclkit to a dynamic one. The only problem is that a lot of TCL*.TMP remains on windows after some time :( Any chance that genkit would help in building itkdyn as well? (as an option of course - I'd rather not compile it for every single platform I'll run my kits on :) > As for mingw - yes, good idea. Looking now! :) -- WK (written at Stardate 57139.8) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 13:57:38 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KJvbc02133 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:57:37 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:59:47 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E552D27.4020301@wanadoo.be> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Cristian Chaparro wrote: > Mandrake 9.0 with ActiveTcl installed worked for me also, except for > some minor differences... Thanks for doing the test. >> $ tclsh genkit A > > Got this: > error reading package index file > /usr/local/ActiveTcl/lib/vfs1.0/pkgIndex.tcl: can't read > "tcl_platform(platform)": no such variable That seems to be a leftover from a "global tcl_platform" that was changed a while ago - I suspect it's all solved in newer ActiveTcl builds. >> $ sh ../genkit B > > The ../ shouldn't be there as I'm still in .../a/ ... typo probably? Yes, "sh genkit B" is ok. >> $ sh genkit E >> tclkit-teevie.equi4.local: 1122905 -> 1657237 > > tclkit-crcha.myhome: 1077589 -> 1601747 > > I like it when things work as promised! And I like it if things (sometimes) work as intended :) Thanks. -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Feb 20 14:16:29 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1KKGTc03694 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:16:29 -0600 Received: (qmail 36315 invoked by uid 300); 20 Feb 2003 20:18:39 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 20:18:39 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:18:39 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit In-Reply-To: <021BDA2B-4505-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > In fact, it will. Jeff Godfrey's error does not prevent him from > completing steps C and D. He won't be able to do E, which integrates > incrtcl and tk shared libs. > > But I'm not too keen on this anymore. Tclkit represents a certain > fixed amount of functionality. Tclkitsh was a sidestep to accommodate > the Windows command line. You will continue to put out tclkitsh for Windows though, right? 0-] Damon From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 14:21:11 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KKLAc04063 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:21:11 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 21:23:20 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <2769B4AA-4511-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > You will continue to put out tclkitsh for Windows though, right? > 0-] Yup! -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 14:32:34 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KKWXc05019 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:32:33 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 21:34:43 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E5532BC.8060901@kocjan.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > I'll probably have to work on building stubs-enabled blt as well, then > I > could move from static tclkit to a dynamic one. The only problem is > that > a lot of TCL*.TMP remains on windows after some time :( The dll cleanup has been improved recently, there was a bug in the Nov 2002 builds, IIRC. Another valuable change, which could be done at the script level - is to go back to caching dll's. I.e. copy them to a fixed spot, and re-use if present. This used to be the way older tclkits worked. > Any chance that genkit would help in building itkdyn as well? (as an > option of course - I'd rather not compile it for every single platform > I'll run my kits on :) Yes... it should be feasible to add this. Note that genkit can still build itcl statically. It's just that "itcl" is no longer a default build target, but "itcldyn" is. You could add other build targets, if you like. -jcw From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Thu Feb 20 15:24:11 2003 Received: from lewey.iland.net (lewey.iland.net [205.242.230.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1KLOAc09412 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 15:24:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 12120 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 21:26:23 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-196.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.196) by lewey.iland.net with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 21:26:23 -0000 Message-ID: <003e01c2d926$82b3c7c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit list" References: <37C6788C-4504-11D7-A9C3-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 15:24:48 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 2/19/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Claude Wippler" To: "Starkit list" Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit > Jeff Godfrey wrote: > > >> You are... unless you share the output of > >> cat build/`hostname`/tkdyn > >> with us > > > > Thanks for the tip JC, I didn't even know *where* to look for the > > problem. > > Your system does not have the necessary X11 headers/libs, I suspect. Got my SysAdmin to install the missing X11 stuff, and *everything* worked like a champ! Great work! Jeff From mike.collins@riley.army.mil Thu Feb 20 16:16:03 2003 Received: from rildoimml01.riley.army.mil (rildoimml01.riley.army.mil [144.246.27.61]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KMG3c13834 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:16:03 -0600 Received: by rildoimml01.riley.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <17VV27CM>; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:14:39 -0600 Message-ID: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E0A0@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> From: "Collins, Mike DAC DOIM" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:16:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks Damon. My compliments JCW I created all the icons in the ICO file and wrapped them up, worked first time. Excellent, will make for a much more professional looking application. On a side note, is the latest TCLKIT "\pub\newer" complete and released? I noticed that when I rewrapped my application with these newest SDX.kit and TCLKIT.EXE I was getting a commit failure that I never had with the current Tclkit.exe. -----Original Message----- From: Damon Courtney [mailto:damon@your.unreality.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 2:09 PM To: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM Cc: 'starkit@equi4.com' Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON > > * support for customizable icon on Windows > I'd love to play around with this. > Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file > with? Though Icon Studio is a very nice free tool, it doesn't really have the ability to stretch or shrink icons into new sizes. I found IconCool Editor pretty good at that. There are many others. Those are just the ones I found that worked pretty well. D From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 20 16:41:49 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1KMfnc15879 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:41:49 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:43:58 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E0A0@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM wrote: (Great to hear icons are working for you - I wonder why not for Ilya Ginzburg) > On a side note, is the latest TCLKIT "\pub\newer" complete and > released? I > noticed that when I rewrapped my application with these newest SDX.kit > and > TCLKIT.EXE I was getting a commit failure that I never had with the > current > Tclkit.exe. No, the "pub/newer/" builds are always risky - just as CVS head is not always the best state of the source code for projects... Fetch again, please. This case was a change in tclvfs's new r/o vs. r/w vs. translucent mode handling. There will be more tweaks for another few days, I expect. -jcw From joachim.zaers@web.de Fri Feb 21 03:19:28 2003 Received: from ikendi.com (ikendi.com [213.198.61.169]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1L9JRc29833 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 03:19:27 -0600 Received: from tokio (pD902CF57.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.207.87]) by ikendi.com (8.12.6) id h1L9LaAX054165 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 02:21:36 -0700 (MST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Joachim Zaers Reply-To: joachim.zaers@web.de Organization: JoSoft Consulting To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:21:16 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <200302201801.h1KI1Dc23590@trixie.triqs.com> In-Reply-To: <200302201801.h1KI1Dc23590@trixie.triqs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200302211021.16292.joachim.zaers@web.de> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1L9JRc29833 Subject: [Starkit] Re: preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I also like to vote for - blt static lib support (bltkitsh and bltkit) no big deal and I'm tried of including the support everytime I update genkit - mingw windows support For people with real low bandwidth you might want to consider even setting up an additional rsync server for downloading/updating the packages. But I really like the ability to bootstrap via the web. -- Joachim Zaers Email : joachim.zaers@web.de From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Fri Feb 21 03:37:43 2003 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1L9bhc31080 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 03:37:43 -0600 Received: (from steve@localhost) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA02518 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:39:01 GMT From: Steve Blinkhorn Message-Id: <200302210939.JAA02518@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:38:46 +0000 (GMT/BST) Company: Psychometric Research & Development Ltd Address: Brewmaster House, The Maltings, St Albans AL1 3HT, UK Phone: +44 1727 841455 Fax: +44 1727 847846 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Icons Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I use IconForge for creating and resizing Windows icons. Slightly awkward to use until you get the hang of it, but it cheerfully resizes. -- Steve Blinkhorn From usus@aladyn.de Fri Feb 21 03:41:32 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1L9fVc31349 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 03:41:32 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 7A5912EF74; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:43:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id A123017140 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:43:30 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:43:30 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030221094330.A123017140@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.9 required=5.0 tests=UPPERCASE_25_50 version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: * Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Jean-Claude, I just tested your new genkit on Linux - works great. Then I tried to do the same on a Sun Solaris 5.8 box and I encounter the same problems as before. I append the output of the kitsh build from the stage "sh genkit B", maybe you are able to see what's going wrong. Everything except kitsh compiles fine. Best regards Ulrich --------------------------- RUN: gcc -c -I. -I/usr/local/src/tclkit3/src/tcl/generic -I/usr/local/src/tclkit3/src/mk/include -I/usr/local/src/tclkit3/src/zlib -DNDEBUG -DTCL_LOCAL_APPINIT=TclKit_AppInit -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_LIMITS_H=1 {-DTCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE=long long} -DHAVE_STRUCT_DIRENT64=1 -DHAVE_STRUCT_STAT64=1 -DHAVE_TYPE_OFF64_T=1 -DWORDS_BIGENDIAN=1 -DHAVE_GETCWD=1 -DHAVE_OPENDIR=1 -DHAVE_STRSTR=1 -DHAVE_STRTOL=1 -DHAVE_STRTOLL=1 -DHAVE_STRTOULL=1 -DHAVE_TMPNAM=1 -DHAVE_WAITPID=1 -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_SYS_PARAM_H=1 -DUSE_TERMIOS=1 -DHAVE_SYS_TIME_H=1 -DTIME_WITH_SYS_TIME=1 -DHAVE_TZNAME=1 -DHAVE_GMTIME_R=1 -DHAVE_LOCALTIME_R=1 -DHAVE_TIMEZONE_VAR=1 -DHAVE_ST_BLKSIZE=1 -Dstrtod=fixstrtod -DSTDC_HEADERS=1 -DNO_UNION_WAIT=1 -DHAVE_SIGNED_CHAR=1 -DHAVE_LANGINFO=1 -DSTATIC_BUILD=1 -D_REENTRANT=1 -D_POSIX_PTHREAD_SEMANTICS=1 -DHAVE_SYS_IOCTL_H=1 -DHAVE_SYS_FILIO_H=1 -O src/pwb.c src/kitInit.c src/zlib.c src/rechan.c /usr/local/src/tclkit3/src/tcl/unix/tclAppInit.c RUN: gcc -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/usr/local/src/tclkit3/install/sigoslab160/lib -ltcl8.4 -ldl -lsocket -lnsl -lm Undefined first referenced symbol in file __cxa_pure_virtual ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o) vtable for __cxxabiv1::__si_class_type_info../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o) operator new[](unsigned) ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(store.o) vtable for __cxxabiv1::__class_type_info../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o) operator delete(void*) ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o) operator new(unsigned) ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o) __gxx_personality_v0 ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o) operator delete[](void*) ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o) ld: fatal: Symbol referencing errors. No output written to kitsh collect2: ld returned 1 exit status ERROR: child process exited abnormally while executing "run gcc -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/usr/loca..." ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval run $X(g++) -o $target [glob *.o] $L" ("kitsh" arm line 28) invoked from within "switch $target { tcl { config tcl/$X(unix) --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries libraries file mkdir ..." From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 21 04:01:28 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LA1Rc32713 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 04:01:27 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:03:37 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030221094330.A123017140@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > I just tested your new genkit on Linux - works great. > Then I tried to do the same on a Sun Solaris 5.8 box and I > encounter the same problems as before. I append the output > of the kitsh build from the stage "sh genkit B", maybe you are > able to see what's going wrong. Everything except kitsh > compiles fine. [...] > RUN: gcc -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o > ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a > ../zlib/libz.a > -L/usr/local/src/tclkit3/install/sigoslab160/lib -ltcl8.4 -ldl > -lsocket -lnsl > -lm > > Undefined first referenced > symbol in file > __cxa_pure_virtual ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o) [...] It's failing to find the -lstdc++ library, I suspect. Try adding this to your env: LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/local/lib -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Fri Feb 21 04:39:04 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LAd3c02813 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 04:39:04 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 4E1F32F16C; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:41:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 80E8D2AFA2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:41:13 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:41:13 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030221104113.80E8D2AFA2@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.4 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 21 February 2003 11:03, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I just tested your new genkit on Linux - works great. > > Then I tried to do the same on a Sun Solaris 5.8 box and I > > encounter the same problems as before. I append the output > > of the kitsh build from the stage "sh genkit B", maybe you are > > able to see what's going wrong. Everything except kitsh > > compiles fine. > > [...] > > > RUN: gcc -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o > > ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a > > ../zlib/libz.a > > -L/usr/local/src/tclkit3/install/sigoslab160/lib -ltcl8.4 -ldl > > -lsocket -lnsl > > -lm > > > > Undefined first referenced > > symbol in file > > __cxa_pure_virtual ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o) > > [...] > > It's failing to find the -lstdc++ library, I suspect. > > Try adding this to your env: > LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/local/lib > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit /usr/local/lib is already part of my LD_LIBRARY_PATH, and libstdc++ is there, as .so and .a. Hey, wait. I got it! Line 40 of genkit maps g++ to gcc. This is wrong! Using g++ instead of gcc solves every problem. The resulting tclkit appears to pass all my test until now. Thanks Ulrich From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 05:16:11 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LBGAc04884 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 05:16:10 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LBIEXH017461 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:18:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LBIEu12982; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:18:14 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:18:14 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221061814.AAB12947@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] preview - a leaner and meaner genkit In-Reply-To: <20030221094330.A123017140@sigosmail.sigos.de> of Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:43:30 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Note that I have built the test suite against Solaris 8. I use the following ksh script to do so: export CC=gcc export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/projects/gnu/sparc-sun-solaris8/lib:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH cp tars/genkit . chmod u+x genkit tclsh ./genkit A tclsh ./genkit B tcl sh ./genkit B sh ./genkit C sh ./genkit D DISPLAY=:0 sh ./genkit D sh ./genkit E -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Feb 21 05:35:34 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LBZXc06039 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 05:35:33 -0600 Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([217.96.105.122] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18mBUs-0000Gw-00 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:37:42 +0100 Message-ID: <3E560F3C.4010905@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:36:28 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: preview - a leaner and meaner genkit References: <200302201801.h1KI1Dc23590@trixie.triqs.com> <200302211021.16292.joachim.zaers@web.de> In-Reply-To: <200302211021.16292.joachim.zaers@web.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Joachim Zaers wrote: > I also like to vote for > - blt static lib support (bltkitsh and bltkit) > no big deal and I'm tried of including the support > everytime I update genkit Ok. I've done that (right now I'm working on something better - stubs enabled blt compile, at least on Windows) > - mingw windows support This will be done, I hope. ps. I vote for threaded/unthreaded. Anyone else has anything to say about (custom) threaded builds? - except them *not* being called tclkit :) -- WK (written at Stardate 57142.5) "Data typing is an illusion. Everything is a sequence of bytes." -Todd Coram From usus@aladyn.de Fri Feb 21 06:01:48 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LC1mc07845 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:01:48 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 72E3E3B79C; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:03:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id AC24C2D4C2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:03:57 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:03:57 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030221120357.AC24C2D4C2@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] size difference Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: My SunOs tclkit is 1838456 bytes long. Now I do the following: sdx unwrap tclkit mv tclkit.vfs z.vfs sdx wrap z cat kitsh z >ztcl The new ztcl is 1725252 bytes long and appears to behave exactly as my original tclkit. What am I missing? Ulrich From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 06:08:21 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LC8Lc08383 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:08:21 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LCAPXH002582 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:10:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LCAPN13825; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:10:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:10:25 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221071025.AAB13801@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] size difference In-Reply-To: <20030221120357.AC24C2D4C2@sigosmail.sigos.de> of Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:03:57 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: tclkit steps What is it you are trying to accomplish? Why are you prepending kitsh ? I'm confused. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From usus@aladyn.de Fri Feb 21 06:20:25 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCKPc09176 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:20:25 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 9F9F3328DA; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:22:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id DD7002B28A for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:22:34 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] size difference Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:22:34 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <20030221071025.AAB13801@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20030221071025.AAB13801@cas.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030221122234.DD7002B28A@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.4 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 21 February 2003 13:10, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Re: tclkit steps > > What is it you are trying to accomplish? Why are you prepending kitsh ? > I'm confused. At first it was just curiousity to see what's inside a tclkit from a vfs point of view. Then I wondered wether I could integrate an extension, say mysqltcl, into the tclkit itself (not the starkit with my app). I prepend kitsh, because "z" is just a starkit, not an executable, not a runtime for other starkits. I think, runtime-tk.kit is equivalent, except for tk and itcl, isn't it? Ulrich From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 21 06:28:58 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCSwc09689 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:28:58 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:31:08 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] size difference Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030221120357.AC24C2D4C2@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-Id: <5A35B4E8-4598-11D7-9A4F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > My SunOs tclkit is 1838456 bytes long. > Now I do the following: > sdx unwrap tclkit > mv tclkit.vfs z.vfs > sdx wrap z > cat kitsh z >ztcl Ah, I see you've figured out the exe logic :) > The new ztcl is 1725252 bytes long and appears to behave > exactly as my original tclkit. What am I missing? Some free space in VFS, as tk and incrtcl extensions were added and comitted. This opt was not yet in genkit - now it is... (only genkit E changed) I've also changed the solaris build to use g++. If that fails for you, Larry, please try "export CXX=gcc", but if it works it might be that the LD_LIBRARY_PATH setting can then be dropped. Furthermore, runtime-{sh,tk}.kit will be dropped. I'm switching to "runtime.kit", which has everything needed, other than libtk8.4.so and libitcl3.3.so ... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 21 06:32:28 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCWRc09904 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:32:27 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:34:38 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] size difference Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030221122234.DD7002B28A@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: (See other email too) > At first it was just curiousity to see what's inside a tclkit from a > vfs > point of view. Then I wondered wether I could integrate an extension, > say > mysqltcl, into the tclkit itself (not the starkit with my app). Yes, you should be able to do this. Another way is to set up a dir area: z.vfs/lib/somepkg/somefiles Then use "sdx wrap z -runtime tclkit-solaris". It does the same, essentially. If yo do not add a z.vfs/main.tcl file, then the result is essentially an extendeded tclkit, and not a true starpack. This is the suggested way to add things. Genkit does not use this simpyl to avoid a dependency on sdx, but it does the same - and now it does compaction as well. -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Fri Feb 21 06:34:55 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCYtc10072 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:34:55 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id B3C0B3B966; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:37:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id F29003B7D3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:37:04 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] size difference Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:37:04 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <5A35B4E8-4598-11D7-9A4F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <5A35B4E8-4598-11D7-9A4F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030221123704.F29003B7D3@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.4 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 21 February 2003 13:31, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > My SunOs tclkit is 1838456 bytes long. > > Now I do the following: > > sdx unwrap tclkit > > mv tclkit.vfs z.vfs > > sdx wrap z > > cat kitsh z >ztcl > > Ah, I see you've figured out the exe logic :) > > > The new ztcl is 1725252 bytes long and appears to behave > > exactly as my original tclkit. What am I missing? > > Some free space in VFS, as tk and incrtcl extensions were added and > comitted. > So it's safe to assume that tclkit and "ztcl" are functionally identical? Ulrich From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 06:35:28 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCZSc10128 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:35:28 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LCbXXH014600 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:37:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LCbWK14165; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:37:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:37:32 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221073732.AAB14160@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] suggested improvement to http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/README Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Add the URL to http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/README so that when someone downloads it as a part of a mirror, the README has info about the master URL for the tar files, etc. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 06:40:06 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCe6c10418 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:40:06 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LCgAXH015822 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:42:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LCgAP16601; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:42:10 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:42:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221074210.AAB16581@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Re: genkit changes Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I picked up the genkit from today and tried it without the LD_LIBRARY_PATH - I still get an error about the libstdc++ missing. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 06:44:21 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCiLc10667 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:44:21 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LCkPXH016999 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:46:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LCkPo20136; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:46:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:46:25 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221074625.AAB20130@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] new error in latest genkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: After downloading the newest genkit and running it, I am seeing the following: info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu couldn't open "tars/runtime.kit/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so": read-only file syste merror copying "install/lwv26awu/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so" to "tars/runtime.kit /lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so": read-only file system couldn't open "tars/runtime.kit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": read-only file systemerr or copying "install/lwv26awu/lib/libtk8.4.so" to "tars/runtime.kit/lib/tk8.4/lib tk8.4.so": read-only file system can't read "v::timer(mk4vfs1)": no such variable -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 21 06:53:26 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LCrQc11408 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:53:26 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:55:36 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] new error in latest genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030221074625.AAB20130@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > After downloading the newest genkit and running it, I am seeing > the following: [...] > can't read "v::timer(mk4vfs1)": no such variable Known (recent) issue. Tclvfs details are in flux. Has all been resolved, you're hitting details due to version changes and stale copies on the web. Please do a full re-fetch and build next Monday. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 21 11:19:50 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LHJnc00524 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:19:50 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:21:59 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] new error in latest genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030221074625.AAB20130@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > couldn't open "tars/runtime.kit/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so": read-only > file syste > merror copying "install/lwv26awu/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so" to > "tars/runtime.kit > /lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so": read-only file system > couldn't open "tars/runtime.kit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": read-only file > systemerr > or copying "install/lwv26awu/lib/libtk8.4.so" to > "tars/runtime.kit/lib/tk8.4/lib > tk8.4.so": read-only file system > can't read "v::timer(mk4vfs1)": no such variable Ok, this should now be fixed: two different errors - get a new copy of genkit and delete tars/runtime*, then run genkit D & E again. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 21 11:33:09 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LHX8c01621 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:33:08 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:35:19 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] tclkit linux Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (Sorry for the recent email flood - winding down now) Just uploaded a brand new tclkit Linux build over here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/linux-i686.gz This should be very close to the way the "real" binary will end up. It's a *lot* smaller, now that -lc and -lX11 are dynamically linked. It has -lstdc++ and -lz statically linked. That means it should run on a very wide range of Linux distributions, yet support Tk when X11 is installed, and Tk input methods, as well as loading any other extension dynamically. This was built on Mandrake 8.1 - using gcc 2.95.6 - to stay with lower-version library dependencies. I can switch to something else if we hit any snags. The final tclkit 8.4.2 release round will include this setup as well as the previous fully-static builds. Between the two of those, just about all Linux distro's ought to be covered, even very old ones. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 11:41:20 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LHfJc02277 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:41:19 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LHhNXH004354 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:43:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LHhM600838; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:43:22 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:43:22 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221124322.AAB29840@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] new error in latest genkit In-Reply-To: of Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:21:59 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well, here's what happened. I downloaded the new genkit. I removed the tars/runtime* files. I tried to do the genkit D like you suggested. That failed due to the dummy-lwv26awu not being able to find the libstdc++ . So I ran genkit from A-E. This 'worked' - that is to say, no errors were encountered. Alas, the resulting tclkit executable also has the problem with libstdc++ . Something has changed for the worse because yesterday things built fine. I suspect it is the change from gcc to g++ in genkit. Somehow I have to pass an additional flag to the genkit build process so that when creating a.out or shared libraries, it appends a -R flag to resolve this issue. Or is there perhaps a need for me to somehow 'rebuild from scratch' because something's being left around in a cache file somewhere? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 12:05:28 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LI5Sc04331 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:05:28 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LI7WXH013862 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:07:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LI7Ve08448; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:07:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:07:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221130731.AAB8200@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Okay, just for kicks, I deleted everything but the tars and genkit and began again. I also used a different version of gcc, hoping that it might do better with regards to the stupid libstdc++ . The version I am using in this test is from Sun itself - the most common case you are likely to find with SPARC Solaris 8. After the unpacking, tcl, zlib, and vfs appear to build okay. Then I see this: mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... FAILED: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- sh ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/noarch --exec-prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu --with-tcl=/ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic --disable-shared -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- ERROR: child process exited abnormally kitsh: gcc -c -I. -I/ldatae/tclkit/sr... ok g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... FAILED: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib -ltcl8.4 -ldl -lsocket -lnsl -lm -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- ERROR: child process exited abnormally Now, in /ldatae/tclkit/out/lwv26awu/mk I see: RUN: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/noarch --exec-prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu --with-tcl=/ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic --disable-shared checking for Python configuration... not enabled checking for Tcl headers... found /ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic/tcl.h checking for Tcl package installation location... /ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic/../lib checking for building with threads... no (default) checking for g++... g++ checking for C++ compiler default output... a.out checking whether the C++ compiler works... configure: error: cannot run C++ compiled programs. If you meant to cross compile, use `--host'. ERROR: child process exited abnormally while executing "run sh ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/noarch --exec-prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu --with-tcl=/ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/g..." ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list run sh [file join ../../../src $dir configure] --prefix=$::P/noarch --exec-prefix=$::P/install/$::H] $args" (procedure "config" line 2) invoked from within "config mk/unix --with-tcl=$P/src/tcl/generic --disable-shared" ("mk" arm line 2) invoked from within "switch $target { tcl { config tcl/$X(unix) --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries libraries file mkdir ..." In /ldatae/tclkit/build/lwv26awu/mk/config.log I see: This file contains any messages produced by compilers while running configure, to aid debugging if configure makes a mistake. It was created by configure, which was generated by GNU Autoconf 2.54. Invocation command line was $ ../../../src/mk/unix/configure --prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/noarch --exec-prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu --with-tcl=/ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic --disable-shared ## --------- ## ## Platform. ## ## --------- ## hostname = lwv26awu uname -m = sun4u uname -r = 5.8 uname -s = SunOS uname -v = Generic_108528-16 /usr/bin/uname -p = sparc /bin/uname -X = System = SunOS Node = lwv26awu Release = 5.8 KernelID = Generic_108528-16 Machine = sun4u BusType = Serial = Users = OEM# = 0 Origin# = 1 NumCPU = 1 /bin/arch = sun4 /usr/bin/arch -k = sun4u /usr/convex/getsysinfo = unknown hostinfo = unknown /bin/machine = unknown /usr/bin/oslevel = unknown /bin/universe = unknown PATH: /opt/sfw/bin PATH: /usr/tcl8/bin PATH: /opt/SUNWspro/bin PATH: /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin PATH: /projects/sprs_lwv/sol26/bin PATH: /projects/sprs_lwv/sol26/bin/mime PATH: /projects/sprs_lwv/sol2/bin PATH: /projects/sprs_lwv/bin PATH: /projects/sprs_lwv/bin/mime PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.news PATH: /usr/perl5/bin PATH: /projects/gnu/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/bin PATH: /usr/tcl84/bin PATH: /usr/tcl83/bin PATH: /vol/tclsrcsol/TclDevKit/bin PATH: /projects/xopsrc/sun4/bin PATH: /projects/xopsrc/bin PATH: /usr/atria/bin PATH: /projects/intranet/bin PATH: /projects/clearcase/bin PATH: /vol/adobe/Acroread5.06/bin PATH: /vol/adobe/Acrobat4.05/bin PATH: /usr/perl5/lib/site_perl/5.005/sun4-solaris/auto/Image/Magick/bin PATH: /usr/openwin/demo PATH: /opt/sfw/bin PATH: /ldata/bin PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.aws PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/sol2 PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.frontend PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.ksh PATH: /cas/test/bin/sun4 PATH: /projects/sprs_lwv/bin/sol2 PATH: /usr/j2se/bin PATH: /usr/java/bin PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/sun4 PATH: /usr/local/bin PATH: /usr/dt/bin PATH: /usr/openwin/bin PATH: /bin PATH: /opt/SUNWsmtv/bin PATH: /cas/bin/sun4 PATH: /cas/abin/sun4 PATH: /cas/X11/sun4/bin PATH: /usr/ccs/bin PATH: /lprod/bin PATH: /usr/sbin PATH: /usr/ucb PATH: /cas/tools/bin/sun4 PATH: /cas/X11/sun4/tools/bin PATH: /vol/staroffice6.0/program PATH: /home/lwv26/bin PATH: /cas/tools/pdbin/sun4 PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.mistypes PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.toys PATH: /home/lwv26/bin/D.tools PATH: /projects/npd/npdweb/bin-sol2 ## ----------- ## ## Core tests. ## ## ----------- ## configure:1467: checking for Python configuration configure:1488: result: not enabled configure:1513: checking for Tcl headers configure:1540: result: found /ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic/tcl.h configure:1544: checking for Tcl package installation location configure:1546: result: /ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic/../lib configure:1563: checking for building with threads configure:1571: result: no (default) configure:1628: checking for g++ configure:1644: found /opt/sfw/bin/g++ configure:1654: result: g++ configure:1670: checking for C++ compiler version configure:1673: g++ --version &5 2.95.3 configure:1676: $? = 0 configure:1678: g++ -v &5 Reading specs from /opt/sfw/lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/2.95.3/specs gcc version 2.95.3 20010315 (release) configure:1681: $? = 0 configure:1683: g++ -V &5 g++: argument to `-V' missing configure:1686: $? = 1 configure:1706: checking for C++ compiler default output configure:1709: g++ conftest.cc >&5 configure:1712: $? = 0 configure:1746: result: a.out configure:1751: checking whether the C++ compiler works configure:1757: ./a.out ld.so.1: ./a.out: fatal: libstdc++.so.2.10.0: open failed: No such file or directory ../../../src/mk/unix/configure: line 1: 6698 Killed ./$ac_file configure:1760: $? = 137 configure:1768: error: cannot run C++ compiled programs. If you meant to cross compile, use `--host'. ## ---------------- ## ## Cache variables. ## ## ---------------- ## ac_cv_env_CC_set=set ac_cv_env_CC_value=gcc ac_cv_env_CFLAGS_set= ac_cv_env_CFLAGS_value= ac_cv_env_CPPFLAGS_set= ac_cv_env_CPPFLAGS_value= ac_cv_env_CXXCPP_set= ac_cv_env_CXXCPP_value= ac_cv_env_CXXFLAGS_set= ac_cv_env_CXXFLAGS_value= ac_cv_env_CXX_set= ac_cv_env_CXX_value= ac_cv_env_LDFLAGS_set= ac_cv_env_LDFLAGS_value= ac_cv_env_build_alias_set= ac_cv_env_build_alias_value= ac_cv_env_host_alias_set= ac_cv_env_host_alias_value= ac_cv_env_target_alias_set= ac_cv_env_target_alias_value= ac_cv_exeext= ac_cv_prog_ac_ct_CXX=g++ ## ----------------- ## ## Output variables. ## ## ----------------- ## CC='gcc' CFLAGS='' CPPFLAGS='' CXX='g++' CXXCPP='' CXXFLAGS='' DEFS='' ECHO='echo' ECHO_C='' ECHO_N='-n' ECHO_T='' EGREP='' EXEEXT='' INSTALL_DATA='' INSTALL_PROGRAM='' INSTALL_SCRIPT='' LDFLAGS='' LIBOBJS='' LIBS='' LIBTOOL='' LIBTOOL_MODULE_FLAGS='' LIBTOOL_SHLIB_FLAGS='' LINK_SPECIAL_FILES='' LINK_SPECIAL_FLAGS='' LN_S='' LTLIBOBJS='' MK_INSTALL='install-mk install-tcl install-tcl' MK_TARGETS='core tcl tcl' MK_THREADS='' MODULE_SUFFIX='' OBJEXT='' PACKAGE_BUGREPORT='' PACKAGE_NAME='' PACKAGE_STRING='' PACKAGE_TARNAME='' PACKAGE_VERSION='' PATH_SEPARATOR=':' PY_INCLUDE_DIR='# no Python headers' PY_LIB_DIR='' RANLIB='' SHELL='/bin/bash' SHLIB_SUFFIX='' STRIP='' STRIP_FLAGS='' TCL_INCLUDE_DIR='/ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic' TCL_LIB_DIR='/ldatae/tclkit/src/tcl/generic/../lib' ac_ct_CC='' ac_ct_CXX='g++' ac_ct_RANLIB='' ac_ct_STRIP='' bindir='${exec_prefix}/bin' build='' build_alias='' build_cpu='' build_os='' build_vendor='' datadir='${prefix}/share' exec_prefix='/ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu' host='' host_alias='' host_cpu='' host_os='' host_vendor='' includedir='${prefix}/include' infodir='${prefix}/info' libdir='${exec_prefix}/lib' libexecdir='${exec_prefix}/libexec' localstatedir='${prefix}/var' mandir='${prefix}/man' oldincludedir='/usr/include' prefix='/ldatae/tclkit/noarch' program_transform_name='s,x,x,' sbindir='${exec_prefix}/sbin' sharedstatedir='${prefix}/com' sysconfdir='${prefix}/etc' target_alias='' ## ----------- ## ## confdefs.h. ## ## ----------- ## #define PACKAGE_BUGREPORT "" #define PACKAGE_NAME "" #define PACKAGE_STRING "" #define PACKAGE_TARNAME "" #define PACKAGE_VERSION "" configure: exit 1 ---- Notice that even the version of g++ from Sun has the libstdc++ problem. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 12:18:34 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LIIXc05409 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:18:33 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LIKbXH018357 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:20:38 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LIKbC13039; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:20:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:20:37 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221132037.AAB13000@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem In-Reply-To: <20030221130731.AAB8200@cas.org> of Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:07:31 -0500 (EST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When I drop back and add the LD_LIBRARY_PATH back in, I then get this: tcl: sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok make binaries libraries ... ok make install-binaries install-... ok echo parray tcl_platform | /ld... ok Done. zlib: sh /ldatae/tclkit/build/lwv26a... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok kitsh: gcc -c -I. -I/ldatae/tclkit/sr... ok g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... ok strip kitsh ... ok ls -l /ldatae/tclkit/install/l... ok itcldyn: sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok make binaries ... ok make install-binaries ... ok tkdyn: sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok make binaries ... ok make install-binaries ... ok Done. dummy-lwv26awu: Cannot find ELF child killed: kill signal dummy-lwv26awu: Cannot find ELF child killed: kill signal dummy-lwv26awu: Cannot find ELF child killed: kill signal The dummy-lwv26awu is built, but doesn't work! Now I am REALLY perplexed. Perhaps this 'as is' compiler shipped by Sun doesn't work... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Feb 21 12:25:06 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LIP5c05959 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:25:05 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1LIRAXH020362 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:27:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1LIR9H13189; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:27:09 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:27:09 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030221132709.AAB13155@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem In-Reply-To: <20030221132037.AAB13000@cas.org> of Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:20:37 -0500 (EST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well, after more experimentation, I find that the tclsh8.4 that is built here works fine. The wish sort of works - it starts up, but tells me it cannot find a tk.tcl file - having never tried starting this binary before, I'm uncertain whether this is common or not. When I get to the kitsh, I start getting the ELF not found. The error appears to be in the runtime code that starts the executable - which says that something there failed. The configure for mk worked - which says that g++ seems to have worked. So something between building mk and the creation of kitsh is no longer working. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From crcha@wanadoo.be Fri Feb 21 13:18:06 2003 Received: from ev6.be.wanadoo.com (ev6.be.wanadoo.com [195.74.212.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1LJI6c10315 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:18:06 -0600 Received: from wanadoo.be (adsl-147-254.wanadoo.be [213.177.147.254]) by ev6.be.wanadoo.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h1LJKEq16854 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 20:20:15 +0100 Message-ID: <3E568AC1.8070601@wanadoo.be> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 20:23:29 +0000 From: Cristian Chaparro User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem References: <20030221132037.AAB13000@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-wanadoo-be-Metrics: ev6 1023; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Larry, I just ssh'ed to my solaris 2.8 in the lab and everything run as it should... that is, except for dummy that didn't work because I still can not master the tunneling issue... So here is what I got: .... everything ok ... /home/crcha/a> sh ./genkit D fetching tars/runtime.kit ... ok info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = crcha tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 XIO: fatal IO error 131 (Connection reset by peer) on X server "oberon:17.0" after 0 requests (0 known processed) with 0 events remaining. child process exited abnormally /home/crcha/a> sh ./genkit E tclkit-oberon: 1277205 -> 1747978 /home/crcha/a> ./tclkit-oberon % info patchlevel 8.4.2 % exit I don't think the sysadmin did anything special to install the os, so _I think_ it must be solaris as offered by sun. And I have ActiveTcl installed... I don't know in which way this could help... but I hope it does :-) Cristian. Larry W. Virden wrote: >When I drop back and add the LD_LIBRARY_PATH back in, I then get this: > >tcl: > sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok > make binaries libraries ... ok > make install-binaries install-... ok > echo parray tcl_platform | /ld... ok > Done. > zlib: > sh /ldatae/tclkit/build/lwv26a... ok > make libz.a ... ok > vfs: > sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok > make binaries ... ok > mk: > sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok > make libmk4tcl.la ... ok > kitsh: > gcc -c -I. -I/ldatae/tclkit/sr... ok > g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... ok > strip kitsh ... ok > ls -l /ldatae/tclkit/install/l... ok > itcldyn: > sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok > make binaries ... ok > make install-binaries ... ok > tkdyn: > sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok > make binaries ... ok > make install-binaries ... ok > Done. >dummy-lwv26awu: Cannot find ?ELF >child killed: kill signal >dummy-lwv26awu: Cannot find ?ELF >child killed: kill signal >dummy-lwv26awu: Cannot find ?ELF >child killed: kill signal > >The dummy-lwv26awu is built, but doesn't work! Now I am REALLY perplexed. >Perhaps this 'as is' compiler shipped by Sun doesn't work... > > From usus@aladyn.de Fri Feb 21 18:32:54 2003 Received: from p10074274.pureserver.de (accademia-del-caffe.com [217.160.78.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1M0Wrc06727 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:32:53 -0600 Received: from hoppel (du-012-235.access.de.clara.net [212.82.253.235]) by p10074274.pureserver.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with SMTP id h1M0YwC27672; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 01:34:58 +0100 Message-ID: <012d01c2da0a$322e04c0$6400a8c0@usus.priv> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ulrich_Sch=F6bel?= To: "Larry W. Virden" , References: <20030221132037.AAB13000@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 01:24:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry W. Virden" To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 7:20 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem ... [debugging stuff] ... > > The dummy-lwv26awu is built, but doesn't work! Now I am REALLY perplexed. > Perhaps this 'as is' compiler shipped by Sun doesn't work... The first tip I received on my first exposure to a Sun: Don't use the Sun compiler! Never ever! Install gcc before you do anything else! I believe this has saved me from a lot of unpleasant work. Ulrich > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > -><- > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From lvirden@cas.org Sat Feb 22 03:37:57 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1M9bvc29370 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 03:37:57 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1M9e0XH005776 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 04:40:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1M9e1912081; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 04:40:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 04:40:01 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030222044001.AAB12061@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on latest genkit problem In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 22 Feb 2003 01:24:54 +0100 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: 1. The compiler to which I was referring is a version of gcc distributed as a part of a cd of open software that sun provides. 2. someone locally build the same version of gcc - and it acts in much the same fashion - with most of the same problems. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From will@wjduquette.com Sat Feb 22 14:40:48 2003 Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1MKemc27283 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 14:40:48 -0600 Received: from pool0142.cvx12-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.226.142] helo=notebook.wjduquette.com) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18mgU7-0001pV-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 12:43:00 -0800 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20030222124143.00a9cd20@pop.earthlink.net> X-Sender: wduquet1@pop.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 12:45:16 -0800 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Will Duquette Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] It Just Works Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Howdy! Every day I look at the traffic on this list, and marvel at all of the problems people are having. That's what the list is for, of course, but it sure makes it look like using Starkits is difficult. On the contrary. Today I finally managed to scrape together some time to work on my Notebook app; and after updating it to use Snit 0.8 I downloaded the latest stable tclkit, tclkitsh, and sdx and rebuilt a stand-alone Windows starpack. I had no trouble whatsoever, at any time in the process; the executable runs just fine. I grant you, I'm not doing anything fancy--but then, at the moment I don't need anything fancy. And for me, it just works. Way cool. Will ----------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | It's amazing what you can do http://www.wjduquette.com | with the right tools. From ilya_g@rad.com Sun Feb 23 03:02:59 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1N92vc24419 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 03:02:58 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1N94bSa002460 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 11:04:37 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1N94b4s002457 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 11:04:37 +0200 (IST) Received: from ilyag ([192.115.243.37]) by exrad2.ad.rad.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sun, 23 Feb 2003 10:59:30 +0200 Message-ID: <001d01c2db1a$73184c00$25f373c0@rad.co.il> From: "Ilya Ginzburg" To: References: <464A43842A2EF54F9183D07E0DEC43560102E0A0@rildoimml05.riley.army.mil> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 11:03:36 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 08:59:31.0000 (UTC) FILETIME=[E0AE9B80:01C2DB19] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Please help! The tclkit.ico file doesn't change the icon of the application! the sdx downloaded from http://www.equi4.com/206 the tclkit downloaded now from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/ The ico file placed at d:\tclkit\hello.vfs After performing in console of tclkitsh %sdx wrap hello.exe -runtime win32.upx.exe the file hello.exe has icon of Tk. Your suggestions? ----- Original Message ----- From: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 12:16 AM Subject: RE: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON > Thanks Damon. > > My compliments JCW I created all the icons in the ICO file and wrapped them > up, worked first time. Excellent, will make for a much more professional > looking application. > > On a side note, is the latest TCLKIT "\pub\newer" complete and released? I > noticed that when I rewrapped my application with these newest SDX.kit and > TCLKIT.EXE I was getting a commit failure that I never had with the current > Tclkit.exe. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Damon Courtney [mailto:damon@your.unreality.com] > Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 2:09 PM > To: Collins, Mike DAC DOIM > Cc: 'starkit@equi4.com' > Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON > > > > * support for customizable icon on Windows > > I'd love to play around with this. > > Anybody got a good pointer to an editor that we can create the ICO file > > with? > > Though Icon Studio is a very nice free tool, it doesn't really have > the ability to stretch or shrink icons into new sizes. I found IconCool > Editor pretty good at that. There are many others. Those are just the > ones I found that worked pretty well. > > D > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From ilya_g@rad.com Sun Feb 23 05:08:43 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1NB8fc02522 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 05:08:42 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1NBANSa012389 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:10:23 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1NBAM4s012386 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:10:22 +0200 (IST) Received: from ilyag ([192.115.243.37]) by exrad2.ad.rad.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:05:16 +0200 Message-ID: <001201c2db2c$04225cc0$25f373c0@rad.co.il> From: "Ilya Ginzburg" To: References: <28669510-471C-11D7-804A-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:09:21 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2DB3C.C778D220" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 11:05:16.0117 (UTC) FILETIME=[71EC1850:01C2DB2B] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2DB3C.C778D220 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The output of sdx is: customizing tclkit.ico in executable icon 48x48/256 replaced 7 updates applied Ilya > Ilya, >=20 > > The tclkit.ico file doesn't change the icon of the application! >=20 > I've added an extra message so sdx reports when it sees tclkit.ico in=20 > both the win32.upx.exe and in hello.vfs/tclkit.ico - please update = your=20 > sdx.kit copy. >=20 > > After performing in console of tclkitsh %sdx wrap hello.exe -runtime > > win32.upx.exe the file hello.exe has icon of Tk. >=20 > Can you send me the output of sdx? >=20 > The logic in sdx is now: >=20 > [...] > vfs::mk4::Mount $filename hdr -readonly > # we only look for an icon if the runtime is called *.exe (!) > if {[string tolower [file extension $filename]] =3D=3D ".exe"} { > catch { set ::origicon [readfile hdr/tclkit.ico] } > } > [...] > if {[info exists origicon] && > [file exists [file join $idir tclkit.ico]]} { > puts " customizing tclkit.ico in executable" > [...] >=20 > If you don't get that message, please send me a listing of hello.vfs. >=20 > I can try things later today to see if there is a bug when run on=20 > windows. >=20 > -jcw >=20 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2DB3C.C778D220 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The output of sdx is:
customizing tclkit.ico in=20 executable
icon 48x48/256  = replaced
7 updates applied
 
Ilya
 
> Ilya,
>
> = > The=20 tclkit.ico file doesn't change the icon of the application!
> =
>=20 I've added an extra message so sdx reports when it sees tclkit.ico in =
>=20 both the win32.upx.exe and in hello.vfs/tclkit.ico - please update your =
>=20 sdx.kit copy.
>
> > After performing in console of = tclkitsh %sdx=20 wrap hello.exe -runtime
> > win32.upx.exe the file hello.exe = has icon=20 of Tk.
>
> Can you send me the output of sdx?
> =
> The=20 logic in sdx is now:
>
> [...]
> =     =20 vfs::mk4::Mount $filename hdr -readonly
>      = # we=20 only look for an icon if the runtime is called *.exe (!)
>=20      if {[string tolower [file extension $filename]] = =3D=3D=20 ".exe"} {
>        catch { set = ::origicon=20 [readfile hdr/tclkit.ico] }
>      }
>=20 [...]
>      if {[info exists origicon]=20 &&
>          = [file exists=20 [file join $idir tclkit.ico]]} {
> =       =20 puts " customizing tclkit.ico in executable"
> [...]
> =
> If=20 you don't get that message, please send me a listing of = hello.vfs.
>=20
> I can try things later today to see if there is a bug when run = on=20
> windows.
>
> -jcw
> ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2DB3C.C778D220-- From ilya_g@rad.com Sun Feb 23 05:47:17 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1NBlGc03995 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 05:47:16 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1NBmvSa015271 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:48:57 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1NBmu4s015268 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:48:56 +0200 (IST) Received: from ilyag ([192.115.243.37]) by exrad2.ad.rad.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:43:50 +0200 Message-ID: <001c01c2db31$67550220$25f373c0@rad.co.il> From: "Ilya Ginzburg" To: References: <26CC412B-4721-11D7-804A-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:47:54 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2DB42.2A9AAEA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 11:43:50.0164 (UTC) FILETIME=[D533A540:01C2DB30] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2DB42.2A9AAEA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I don't understand something. The following snipped from http://www.equi4.com/267 : ... you need a Windows "ICO" file with the following resolution icons in it: 16x16, 4-bit (16-color) 16x16, 8-bit (256-color) 32x32, 4-bit (16-color) 32x32, 8-bit (256-color) 48x48, 4-bit (16-color) 48x48, 8-bit (256-color) put that icon in the file myapp.vfs/tclkit.ico=20 ... and my file (created by Microangelo 5.5) has parameters 48x48/256. What is not according to requires?=20 Regards, =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Ilya Ginzburg Automatic Test Equipment Development Dep. RAD Data Communications Ltd. Har Ha-Chozvim 'B' Jerusalem Israel index: 91450 p.o.b.: 45081 Phone: +972-2-5889215 Fax : +972-2-5829936 Email: ilya_g@rad.com Web : http://www.rad.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Ilya Ginzburg Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 1:22 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Ilya, > The output of sdx is: > customizing tclkit.ico in executable > icon 48x48/256 replaced > 7 updates applied Well, that explains everything. SDX is replacing only the 48x48/256=20 bitmap. Read http://www.equi4.com/267 ... add more resolutions to your ico file! -jcw ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2DB42.2A9AAEA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
...
you need a Windows "ICO" file with = the=20 following resolution icons in = it:
       =20 16x16, 4-bit (16-color)
        = 16x16,=20 8-bit (256-color)
        32x32, = 4-bit=20 (16-color)
        32x32, 8-bit=20 (256-color)
        48x48, 4-bit=20 (16-color)
        48x48, 8-bit=20 (256-color)
put that icon in the file myapp.vfs/tclkit.ico =
...
and my file (created by Microangelo = 5.5) has=20 parameters 48x48/256. What
is not according to = requires? 

Regards,
 
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D
Ilya=20 Ginzburg
Automatic Test Equipment Development Dep.
RAD Data = Communications=20 Ltd.
Har Ha-Chozvim 'B' Jerusalem Israel
index: = 91450   =20 p.o.b.: 45081
Phone: +972-2-5889215
Fax  : = +972-2-5829936
Email:=20 ilya_g@rad.com
Web  :=20 http://www.rad.com
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
----- Original Message -----
From: Jean-Claude Wippler <jcw@equi4.com>
To: Ilya Ginzburg <ilya_g@rad.co.il>
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 1:22=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit=20 ICON

Ilya,

> The output of sdx is:
> customizing = tclkit.ico in=20 executable
> icon 48x48/256 replaced
> 7 updates=20 applied

Well, that explains everything.  SDX is replacing = only the=20 48x48/256
bitmap.

Read http://www.equi4.com/267 = ... add more=20 resolutions to your ico file!

-jcw
 ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2DB42.2A9AAEA0-- From ilya_g@rad.com Sun Feb 23 07:33:36 2003 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (radmail1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1NDXZc08136 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 07:33:35 -0600 Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1NDZESa023439 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:35:14 +0200 (IST) Received: from exrad2.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.112]) by antivir1.rad.co.il (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id h1NDZE4s023436 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:35:14 +0200 (IST) Received: from ilyag ([192.115.243.37]) by exrad2.ad.rad.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:30:09 +0200 Message-ID: <003901c2db40$41926be0$25f373c0@rad.co.il> From: "Ilya Ginzburg" To: References: <08AF9621-472B-11D7-804A-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:34:14 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 13:30:09.0632 (UTC) FILETIME=[AFA93600:01C2DB3F] Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Jean. Probably the source of my problem is MicroAngelo. I download IconStudio and SDX WORK now!!! Thank you very much!! Regards. Ilya . ----- Original Message ----- From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Ilya Ginzburg Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 2:33 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: starkit ICON Ilya Ginzburg wrote: > I don't understand something. > The following snipped from http://www.equi4.com/267 : > ... > you need a Windows "ICO" file with the following resolution icons in > it: > 16x16, 4-bit (16-color) > 16x16, 8-bit (256-color) > 32x32, 4-bit (16-color) > 32x32, 8-bit (256-color) > 48x48, 4-bit (16-color) > 48x48, 8-bit (256-color) > put that icon in the file myapp.vfs/tclkit.ico > ... > and my file (created by Microangelo 5.5) has parameters 48x48/256. What > is not according to requires? Further down: you need *all* of the above 6 resolutions/depths of your icon, if you want to be certain that your icon gets shown instead of the original Tk one, regardless of windows version, screen settings, and resolution (if nothing else you can take another one and stretch/shrink it, for example with MSVC6) -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Feb 24 01:27:41 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1O7Rec16943 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 01:27:40 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA03229 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:29:53 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA03027 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:29:45 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E59C9E9.EBF4394C@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:29:45 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] It Just Works References: <5.1.1.6.0.20030222124143.00a9cd20@pop.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Will Duquette wrote: > > Howdy! > > Every day I look at the traffic on this list, and marvel at all of the > problems people are having. That's what the list is for, of course, > but it sure makes it look like using Starkits is difficult. On the > contrary. > > Today I finally managed to scrape together some time to work on my > Notebook app; and after updating it to use Snit 0.8 I downloaded the > latest stable tclkit, tclkitsh, and sdx and rebuilt a stand-alone > Windows starpack. > > I had no trouble whatsoever, at any time in the process; the executable > runs just fine. > > I grant you, I'm not doing anything fancy--but then, at the moment > I don't need anything fancy. And for me, it just works. > > Way cool. > > Will > Let me join in with this thread: I do not do much fancy stuff either and after a first few hours of setting up my first serious application using Tclkit, everything has worked splendidly. The problems that people encounter seem to fall into two categories: - Using extensions that somehow interfer with the standard set-up (BLT, threads, ...) - Using the latest beta releases Of course: I profit mightily from their efforts to get it to work on so many platforms with so many wonderful stuff inside and outside -- I almost feel ashamed not joining in more actively. But then I try to compsensate in other areas. So, to all those people working so hard to solve these sometimes interesting, sometimes bizarre problems: I am very, very grateful! Regards, Arjen From usus@aladyn.de Mon Feb 24 03:43:20 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1O9hKc24758; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 03:43:20 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 6076F3BC53; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 10:45:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 9FE663BA44; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 10:45:31 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] size difference Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 10:45:31 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <3BD53C32-459D-11D7-9A4F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <3BD53C32-459D-11D7-9A4F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030224094531.9FE663BA44@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.4 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 21 February 2003 14:06, you wrote: > Ulrich, > > > So it's safe to assume that tclkit and "ztcl" are functionally > > identical? > > Only if you promise to get the last genkit and try "sh genkit E" to > compare sizes > > -jcw Hi Jean-Claude, tried it: It's even better! Only 1674531 bytes! And works great! Thanks Ulrich From headsup_popup@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 05:13:24 2003 Received: from web14607.mail.yahoo.com (web14607.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.224.87]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1OBDOc31473 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 05:13:24 -0600 Message-ID: <20030224111537.27496.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [203.32.142.5] by web14607.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 03:15:37 PST Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 03:15:37 -0800 (PST) From: HeadsUp Support Subject: Re: [Starkit] It Just Works To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <3E59C9E9.EBF4394C@wldelft.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, As a novice to both Tcl and Starkits (in fact programming on a computer), I would also like to comment that Starkits have enabled me to fulfill a dream of developing a cross-platform application. This was achieved without even knowing what compiling is (and I am still not sure and I don't really care!). Keep up the good work. For some of us your turning dreams into reality! All the best. Jeff Smith --- Arjen Markus wrote: > Will Duquette wrote: > > > > Howdy! > > > > Every day I look at the traffic on this list, and > marvel at all of the > > problems people are having. That's what the list > is for, of course, > > but it sure makes it look like using Starkits is > difficult. On the > > contrary. > > > > Today I finally managed to scrape together some > time to work on my > > Notebook app; and after updating it to use Snit > 0.8 I downloaded the > > latest stable tclkit, tclkitsh, and sdx and > rebuilt a stand-alone > > Windows starpack. > > > > I had no trouble whatsoever, at any time in the > process; the executable > > runs just fine. > > > > I grant you, I'm not doing anything fancy--but > then, at the moment > > I don't need anything fancy. And for me, it just > works. > > > > Way cool. > > > > Will > > > > Let me join in with this thread: I do not do much > fancy stuff either > and after a first few hours of setting up my first > serious application > using Tclkit, everything has worked splendidly. > > The problems that people encounter seem to fall into > two categories: > - Using extensions that somehow interfer with the > standard set-up > (BLT, threads, ...) > - Using the latest beta releases > > Of course: I profit mightily from their efforts to > get it to work > on so many platforms with so many wonderful stuff > inside and outside > -- I almost feel ashamed not joining in more > actively. But then > I try to compsensate in other areas. > > So, to all those people working so hard to solve > these sometimes > interesting, sometimes bizarre problems: I am very, > very grateful! > > Regards, > > Arjen > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From lvirden@cas.org Mon Feb 24 07:33:11 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1ODXAc09799 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 07:33:11 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1ODZGXH014679 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:35:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1ODZGP27167; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:35:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:35:16 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030224083516.AAB27131@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] feb 23 genkit needs ability to pass in flags Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: For genkit to properly generate working tclkit's in my environment, I have to pass into the build process a -R flag. However, reading through the genkit source, I don't see a way to pass in the appropriate flag. It looks like genkit reads in flags generated via the build process - however, the current build process (for g++) doesn't determine the right flags for my environment. Has anyone an idea of a way to get what I want, short of hand modifying genkit? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 24 07:54:47 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1ODskc11688; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 07:54:46 -0600 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 14:56:57 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] feb 23 genkit needs ability to pass in flags Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <20030224083516.AAB27131@cas.org> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > For genkit to properly generate working tclkit's in my environment, > I have to pass into the build process a -R flag. However, reading > through > the genkit source, I don't see a way to pass in the appropriate flag. > It looks like genkit reads in flags generated via the build process - > however, the current build process (for g++) doesn't determine the > right > flags for my environment. > > Has anyone an idea of a way to get what I want, short of hand modifying > genkit? There is a yet-to-be-documented new feature in genkit, in which you can override anything you like - the file "genkit.local" gets sourced after everything has been defined and setup, but before actual actions take place. Maybe the following "genkit.local" will work for you: switch $tcl_platform(os) { SunOS { array set X {g++ gcc} } I'm trying to keep the "g++" default, because it works properly on at least one other setup. Maybe the above is enough to get you back on track as well? -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Feb 24 08:30:44 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1OEUhc14842 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 08:30:44 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1OEWnXH007576 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 09:32:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1OEWnD27865; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 09:32:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 09:32:49 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030224093248.AAB27813@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] feb 23 genkit needs ability to pass in flags In-Reply-To: of Mon, 24 Feb 2003 14:56:38 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: genkit.local That file seems like it has some potential. I just have to figure out the parts of genkit that build using g++ so that I can figure out how to override the configure step of any g++ related steps to include the link time flag I need - I think I will see if I can say something like switch $tcl_platform(os) { SunOS { array set X {g++ "g++ -R/projects/gnu/sparc-sun-solaris8/lib"} } That may be what I need. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Feb 25 06:05:34 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1PC5Xc11335 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 06:05:33 -0600 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Feb 25 14:41:23 2003 +0200 Message-ID: <3E5B5DFE.70202@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 14:13:50 +0200 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com References: <20030224111537.27496.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] vfs mounting Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I wonder if someone may shed some light on vfs mounting, so here goes. Using the headsup startkit as a starting point, I am trying to run cgi scripts under the tcl server, but am getting stuck. This is on Windows, but I have seen the same on Linux and Solaris, so I dont think its an OS (tclkit.8.4.2) 1 % vfs::filesystem info C:/tclkit.8.4.2/headsup C:/tclkit.8.4.2/win32.upx.exe (tclkit.8.4.2) 2 % vfs::mk4::Mount headsup headsup mk4vfs2 (tclkit.8.4.2) 3 % glob * headsup headsup.vfs test.html win32.upx.exe (tclkit.8.4.2) 4 % cd headsup (headsup) 5 % file copy ../test.html ./htdocs/test.html 8411 ###copies OK ##The new page shows fine in a browser (headsup) 6 % pwd C:/tclkit.8.4.2/headsup (headsup) 7 % cd htdocs (htdocs) 8 % glob * .tml cgi-bin empty.html error.html headsup.html headsup.pac headsupdir hup images index.tml libtml mydata.tml notfound.html proxy.pac redirect register.tml sample.tml test.html (htdocs) 9 % cd cgi-bin (cgi-bin) 10 % glob * env env.cgi env.cgi.bak env.tcl (cgi-bin) 11 % set fd [open env.cgi r] rechan256 (cgi-bin) 12 % puts [read $fd] #!/bin/sh # \ exec tclsh8.3 "$0" ${1+"$@"} #close [open /tmp/iwashere w] puts "Content-Type: text/html" puts "" puts "The environment" puts "

The environment

" puts foreach name [lsort [array names env]] { puts "" } puts
$name$env($name)
exit 0 ###File reads OK Pointing a browser to http://localhost:8015:/cgi-bin/env.cgi returns this error couldn't read file "c:/tclkit8.4.2/headsup/bin/../htdocs/cgi-bin/env.cgi" : no such file or directory Mounting the starkit under c:/tclkit.8.4.2 returns the same error vfs::mk4::Mount headsup c:/tclkit/headsup Anyway, a pointer in the right direction would be appreciated... regards, nicolas boretos From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Feb 25 06:31:02 2003 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1PCV1c13256 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 06:31:01 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (cgey2.capgemini.se [193.234.247.51]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id APX38550 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 25 Feb 2003 12:33:07 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030225122617.01e6a6f0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 12:33:06 +0000 To: Nicolas Boretos , starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs mounting In-Reply-To: <3E5B5DFE.70202@maich.gr> References: <20030224111537.27496.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 02:13 PM 2/25/2003 +0200, Nicolas Boretos wrote: >Pointing a browser to http://localhost:8015:/cgi-bin/env.cgi returns this >error > >couldn't read file "c:/tclkit8.4.2/headsup/bin/../htdocs/cgi-bin/env.cgi" >: no such file or directory The file only exists according to Tcl. Your operating system (and all other applications) don't know about it, and can't know about it.(*) Vince. (*) well, perhaps in some distant future someone could provide reverse-vfs hooks so that the OS asks Tcl about the given file. I know this is in principle possible on Win, Mac and Unix, but I don't have any plans in that direction. From nicolasb@maich.gr Tue Feb 25 06:58:19 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1PCwIc15456 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 06:58:19 -0600 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Tue Feb 25 15:34:08 2003 +0200 Message-ID: <3E5B6A5C.3060108@maich.gr> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 15:06:36 +0200 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Vince Darley CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs mounting References: <20030224111537.27496.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030225122617.01e6a6f0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > At 02:13 PM 2/25/2003 +0200, Nicolas Boretos wrote: > >> Pointing a browser to http://localhost:8015:/cgi-bin/env.cgi returns >> this error >> >> couldn't read file >> "c:/tclkit8.4.2/headsup/bin/../htdocs/cgi-bin/env.cgi" : no such file >> or directory > > > The file only exists according to Tcl. Your operating system (and all > other applications) don't know about it, and can't know about it.(*) > > Vince. > Hi, Thanx for your quick reply. I believe that in tclhttpd, most of the calls are from within the tcl interpreter that launched the tclhttpd, as the file open test showed above. Or I am missing something.... regards, nicolas From jcw@equi4.com Tue Feb 25 09:21:26 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1PFLQc27540 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 09:21:26 -0600 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 16:23:38 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs mounting Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E5B5DFE.70202@maich.gr> Message-Id: <1D67F462-48D5-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Nicolas Boretos wrote: > Using the headsup startkit as a starting point, I am trying to run cgi > scripts under the tcl server, but am getting stuck. This is on > Windows, but I have seen the same on Linux and Solaris, so I dont > think its an OS > > (tclkit.8.4.2) 1 % vfs::filesystem info > C:/tclkit.8.4.2/headsup C:/tclkit.8.4.2/win32.upx.exe > (tclkit.8.4.2) 2 % vfs::mk4::Mount headsup headsup > mk4vfs2 > (tclkit.8.4.2) 3 % glob * > headsup headsup.vfs test.html win32.upx.exe > (tclkit.8.4.2) 4 % cd headsup > (headsup) 5 % file copy ../test.html ./htdocs/test.html > 8411 > ###copies OK > ##The new page shows fine in a browser > (headsup) 6 % pwd > C:/tclkit.8.4.2/headsup > (headsup) 7 % cd htdocs > (htdocs) 8 % glob * > .tml cgi-bin empty.html error.html headsup.html headsup.pac headsupdir > hup images index.tml libtml mydata.tml notfound.html proxy.pac > redirect register.tml sample.tml test.html > (htdocs) 9 % cd cgi-bin > (cgi-bin) 10 % glob * > env env.cgi env.cgi.bak env.tcl > (cgi-bin) 11 % set fd [open env.cgi r] > rechan256 > (cgi-bin) 12 % puts [read $fd] > #!/bin/sh I know nothing about tclhttpd but is this script really being run in-process? If not, then Vince's comment applies. If tclhttpd sees the file, and then does an exec on it - that will fail because exec is an os command, which has no way to access that file. > # \ > exec tclsh8.3 "$0" ${1+"$@"} And this just happens later. SO it never gets here, But even it you get back to a second tcl executable, you'll need to remount headsup again. Note that to even attempt this, you will have to mount it readonly in *both* cases. > #close [open /tmp/iwashere w] > > puts "Content-Type: text/html" > puts "" > puts "The environment" > puts "

The environment

" > puts > foreach name [lsort [array names env]] { > puts "" > } > puts
$name$env($name)
> exit 0 > > ###File reads OK > > Pointing a browser to http://localhost:8015:/cgi-bin/env.cgi returns > this error > > couldn't read file > "c:/tclkit8.4.2/headsup/bin/../htdocs/cgi-bin/env.cgi" : no such file > or directory Can you get a stack trace for the error logs or from tclhttpd? My hunch is that this is from an "exec" in Tcl, which won;t work with files in VFS. But why all this trouble - can you not use .tml and direct urls to avoid triggering the cgi cycle? Then everything is in process. Even multiple interpreters and threading is supported if you open the Metakit VFS starkit in "-shared" mode. -jcw From scfiead@hotmail.com Tue Feb 25 13:38:28 2003 Received: from hotmail.com (bay2-dav22.bay2.hotmail.com [65.54.246.79]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1PJcSc16754 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:38:28 -0600 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:40:33 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [24.137.9.31] From: "Ryan Casey" To: References: <200302231801.h1NI19c19083@trixie.triqs.com> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 14:40:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2003 19:40:33.0023 (UTC) FILETIME=[C2A910F0:01C2DD05] Subject: [Starkit] Re: starkit digest, Vol 1 #176 - 5 msgs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Subject: [Starkit] It Just Works > > Howdy! > > Every day I look at the traffic on this list, and marvel at all of the > problems people are having. That's what the list is for, of course, > but it sure makes it look like using Starkits is difficult. On the > contrary. > I have been lurking some time on this list, and I have been playing with TclKit here and there. Today I decided to give the icon thing a go. Genereated an icon, put it in it's place, wrapped, and there it was. This is the one thing that always annoyed me about FreeWrap. I always built a custom FreeWrap version to include my icon. Well, the vestiges are gone. StarKit/Packs are my future. FreeWrap served me well, but can no longer compare. Ryan *Hmmm, now if only I could get myself a Mac to build on.* From damon@your.unreality.com Tue Feb 25 13:55:10 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1PJtAc18188 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:55:10 -0600 Received: (qmail 52515 invoked by uid 300); 25 Feb 2003 19:57:24 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 19:57:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:57:24 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Ryan Casey cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: starkit digest, Vol 1 #176 - 5 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I have been lurking some time on this list, and I have been playing with > TclKit here and there. Today I decided to give the icon thing a go. > Genereated an icon, put it in it's place, wrapped, and there it was. This > is the one thing that always annoyed me about FreeWrap. I always built a > custom FreeWrap version to include my icon. Well, the vestiges are gone. > StarKit/Packs are my future. FreeWrap served me well, but can no longer > compare. Ironically, the icon changing stuff is all Tcl code and could easily be included in freewrap as well. Not that I'm advocating it, mind you. 0-] I just spent quite a bit of effort converting InstallBase from freewrap to TclKit, and I don't foresee me going back. 0-] Damon From jcw@equi4.com Tue Feb 25 18:18:44 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1Q0Ihc11673; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 18:18:43 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 01:20:55 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <2BE0B7B2-4920-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] OOMK 0.1 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (This is one of those posts which fits into neither mailing list) For adventurous Tcl coders: OOMK is a new pure-Tcl wrapper around Mk4tcl, which brings the OO model which C++ and Python have so long enjoyed to Tcl. Sometimes code shows it all more easily - a complete example: package require oomk mkstorage db db define v1 {s1 s2} {11 aa 22 bb 33 cc} db define v2 {s1 s3} {11 eleven 22 twenty-two 44 forty-four 22 hi!} [$v1 join $v2 s1] as v3 $v3 dump \t Output: s1 s3 s2 -- -- ---------- 11 aa eleven 22 bb hi! 22 bb twenty-two -- -- ---------- This is release 0.1 (IOW, it's experimental). I will help fix things where possible, but am not committing to this as being *the* future API for MK + Tcl. The OO model is based on Will Duquette's neat "Snit" package (version 0.8). It requires the very latest release of Metakit (version 2.4.9). More details can be found here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/oomk.kit/lib/app-oomk/oomk.txt The actual code itself is in a single script: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/oomk.kit/lib/oomk/oomk.tcl Or download it all as a Starkit (it'll be added to sdarchive): http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/oomk.kit -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Tue Feb 25 19:57:24 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1Q1vOc22361 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 19:57:24 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1Q1xXiU016245; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:59:33 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1Q1xWB23691; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:59:32 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Will Duquette" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] It Just Works Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:59:30 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20030222124143.00a9cd20@pop.earthlink.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Every day I look at the traffic on this list, and marvel at all of the > problems people are having. That's what the list is for, of course, > but it sure makes it look like using Starkits is difficult. On the > contrary. ... > I grant you, I'm not doing anything fancy--but then, at the moment > I don't need anything fancy. And for me, it just works. I don't want to rain on a nice parade, as starkits are easy to use. However, there is a significant cliff (as can be expected) when moving from pure Tcl apps to apps with binary code. Things like dependent libraries really throw a wrench into the problem. Even the core is tricked on this one with the dependence on tclpip84.dll for Win9x when you need to exec something (shooty damned OS ). Jeff From rohan@rohanpall.com Tue Feb 25 20:11:19 2003 Received: from jareth.dreamhost.com (postfix@jareth.dreamhost.com [66.33.198.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1Q2BJc23270 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 20:11:19 -0600 Received: from ABSORB (unknown [24.114.111.163]) by jareth.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 631836B5F6 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 18:13:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 21:32:43 -0500 From: Rohan Pall X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.53d) Reply-To: Rohan Pall X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <83295393984.20030225213243@rohanpall.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re[2]: [Starkit] It Just Works In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JH> I don't want to rain on a nice parade, as starkits are easy to JH> use. However, there is a significant cliff (as can be expected) JH> when moving from pure Tcl apps to apps with binary code. Things JH> like dependent libraries really throw a wrench into the problem. JH> Even the core is tricked on this one with the dependence on JH> tclpip84.dll for Win9x when you need to exec something (shooty JH> damned OS ). I'm still using freewrap 4.4 for my latest commercial app because of a dependence on blt (no stubs), and because freewrap 4.4 starts up faster than tclkit. There is also the overwhelming fact that I am comfortable with 8.3.2, it is stable as a rock and I need to get this program out yesterday. Tclkit is great for pure tcltk apps though. Starkits are the future, guaranteed. A few kinks to be worked out, thats all ;) -- Best regards, Rohan mailto:rohan@rohanpall.com From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 26 04:28:29 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QASSc25080 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 04:28:28 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:30:42 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <5B77ED44-4975-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 sources have been tagged for release (read: bang on it with all your might, because anything that slips through now will haunt us all for a long long time!). I've updated the all the files in pub/tk/tars/ - and have placed new builds in pub/tk/newer/. The builds are: linux-x86.* preferred binaries for Linux linux-x86static.* fallback fully static (like Nov 2002 builds) win32* Windows builds The genkit build script has been tweaked further based on all recent feedback. The starting point for "Seven steps to get a Tclkit on YOUR Unix system" is: http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit FYI, the Tclkit build process has been formalized a bit, and will use a three-tier approach. There is a draft of the plans at http://www.equi4.com/271 to outline what I hope will help everyone understand the status and variety of all builds. The following people have signed up to take care of what will become the first "level 1" builds of Tclkit 8.4.2: Steve Landers - Solaris Bryan Oakley - Macintosh OS X (X11) Mark Roseman - FreeBSD Jean-Claude Wippler - Linux and Windows Once the "official" Tcl/Tk release is out, which I expect by next week, I will start organizing a "Tclkit build fest", in an attempt to drive as many builds on as many platforms as we can muster. This will be announced on comp.lang.tcl and coordinated on the wiki. Goal #1: match the November 2002 build list at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/builds.html Goal #2: beat the list of all builds ever tried, see http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/status.html Goal #3: total platform domination! :) I'll look at Mac Aqua and Mac Classic builds once the dust settles a bit. If you have an interest in building Tclkit for a specific platform and would like to help with building a solid executable, please give the genkit script a try and let me know. The more names we can list to kickstart, the more it can tempt others to join and create other binaries. But before then, let's try to really flesh out the details, so that builds can become as painless as possible when the festivities begin. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 26 04:41:04 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QAf3c25932 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 04:41:04 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1QAhAXH020231 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 05:43:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1QAhBp25121; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 05:43:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 05:43:11 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030226054310.AAB25110@cas.org> Subject: Re: Re[2]: [Starkit] It Just Works In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 25 Feb 2003 21:32:43 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Rohan Pall > I'm still using freewrap 4.4 for my latest commercial app because of a > dependence on blt (no stubs), and because freewrap 4.4 starts up > faster than tclkit. I don't see easy solutions for the "no stubs" right now. However, is there anything that can be done about startup time? Has anyone profiled the startup time? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 26 05:15:30 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QBFTc28785 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 05:15:29 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 12:17:43 +0100 Subject: Re: Re[2]: [Starkit] It Just Works Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030226054310.AAB25110@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I don't see easy solutions for the "no stubs" right now. The solution is: George Howlett. > However, is there anything that can be done about startup time? Has > anyone profiled the startup time? On a fast (2.4 GHz) Linux box: $ time ./tclkit a && wc a"). Launching default tclkit and doing a package require Tk took 2372. Launching tclsh 8.3.4 took 104 system calls. Launching wish 8.3.4 took 737. The Nov 2002 tclkit does 233 calls. With a Tk launch it is 1444. Hm, weird, no idea why latest tclkit is doing so many more "access" and "lstat64" calls than the November 2002 build - needs investigation. Launching of a deeply nested dir is slower (VFS stats each dir in turn). Windows will be slower. Startup off a file server will be slower. For comparison: Python 2.2.2 took 533, Perl 5.8.0 took 94. Not sure I'm comparing apples with apples, though - I'm sure these can be explained in tons of ways. -jcw From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Wed Feb 26 05:31:53 2003 Received: from frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.20.107]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QBVqc30109; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 05:31:52 -0600 Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1QBY5Jd012780; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 22:34:05 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 22:34:04 +1100 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das.jpg Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <5B77ED44-4975-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: <35BAA966-497E-11D7-8992-003065E46D0C@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, On Wednesday, Feb 26, 2003, at 21:30 Australia/Sydney, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > I'll look at Mac Aqua and Mac Classic builds once the dust settles a > bit. for 8.4.2, I've re-architected the TkAqua standalone build to be much easier and more robust (no relinking necessary anymore), so we should be able to base a tkAqua tclkit lookalike on that as before. you could even copy my embeddding scripts for use in e.g. genkit to build an embedded tkaqua tclkit from an installed TclTk (no sources necessary...) I've also verified that 8.4.2 standard unix tcl and tk/X11 build fine on macosx, so the osx/X11 starkit should be a no brainer. tcltk Mac Classic 8.4.2 builds fine as well, so only the issue of the missing itcl port remains there; I should regain access to my OS9 mac after the weekend, I'll try to find some time to have a look at this. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Feb 26 05:56:22 2003 Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QBuLc32140 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 05:56:21 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (cgey2.capgemini.se [193.234.247.51]) by msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with ESMTP id APY28360 (AUTH vincedarley); Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:58:34 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030226115234.01e33df8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:58:33 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: startup time...Re: Re[2]: [Starkit] It Just Works In-Reply-To: References: <20030226054310.AAB25110@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >Launching of a deeply nested dir is slower (VFS stats each dir in turn). This is true --- but, someone enterprising could do some work on tcl/unix/tclUnixFCmd.c:TclpObjNormalizePath(...) to improve this. For example, if that file path length is greater than a certain number of chars, a binary search would probably be a much more efficient way of normalizing. i.e. speculatively search for a '/' approximately half-way along the path, and try calling 'realpath' on it. If it succeeds, you don't need to check all the directories up to that point, etc. The code already has an optimisation for ordinary Tcl/Tk to check the entire path first, but of course for a starkit/pack, this will generally fail, and the one-by-one code path will be used. Also, depending on the relative speeds of 'access()' vs 'realpath()' the existing code may not be doing the right trade-off either. cheers, Vince. From usus@aladyn.de Wed Feb 26 08:02:45 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QE2hc11111 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:02:44 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id C2B2436620; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:04:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id E592C1978F for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:04:56 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:04:56 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <5B77ED44-4975-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <5B77ED44-4975-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030226140456.E592C1978F@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,PLING version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday 26 February 2003 11:30, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > The Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 sources have been tagged for release (read: bang on it > with all your might, because anything that slips through now will haunt > us all for a long long time!). > > I've updated the all the files in pub/tk/tars/ - and have placed new > builds in pub/tk/newer/. > I've extended genkit a bit in Phase E so that it includes all packages that I've put into an 'addons' directory beneath 'tars'. This is to make it easier to build a custom tclkit. Ulrich *** genkit.org Wed Feb 26 12:23:27 2003 --- genkit Wed Feb 26 13:27:32 2003 *************** *** 545,550 **** --- 545,551 ---- set I install/$H set E [info sharedlibext] set R tars/runtime.kit + set A addons if {![file exists $R]} { origfetch $R } *************** *** 559,569 **** exec strip $I/lib/libtk8$X(.)4$E$Z(vso) # the following approach makes sure the result is optimally packed ! set script [string map [list @H $H @I $I @E $E @R $R @. $X(.) @v $Z(vso)] { set db [vfs::mk4::Mount @R @R -readonly] vfs::attributes @R -state translucent file copy @I/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3@.3@E@v @R/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3@E file copy @I/lib/libtk8@.4@E@v @R/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4@E set fd [open tclkit-@H a] mk::file save $db $fd close $fd --- 560,575 ---- exec strip $I/lib/libtk8$X(.)4$E$Z(vso) # the following approach makes sure the result is optimally packed ! set script [string map [list @A $A @H $H @I $I @E $E @R $R @. $X(.) @v $Z(vso)] { set db [vfs::mk4::Mount @R @R -readonly] vfs::attributes @R -state translucent file copy @I/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3@.3@E@v @R/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3@E file copy @I/lib/libtk8@.4@E@v @R/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4@E + if {[file isdirectory @A]} { + foreach f [glob -nocomplain @A/*] { + file copy $f @R/lib + } + } set fd [open tclkit-@H a] mk::file save $db $fd close $fd From nicolasb@maich.gr Wed Feb 26 08:07:14 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1QE7Dc11520 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:07:13 -0600 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Wed Feb 26 16:42:56 2003 +0200 Message-ID: <3E5CCBF8.2020401@maich.gr> Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 16:15:20 +0200 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs mounting References: <1D67F462-48D5-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Nicolas Boretos wrote: > > I know nothing about tclhttpd but is this script really being run > in-process? If not, then Vince's comment applies. > > If tclhttpd sees the file, and then does an exec on it - that will fail > because exec is an os command, which has no way to access that file. Thanx all for the responses, I think that is what the cgi mechanism does; fork a process to run the script, not in-process... alas the current issue... > But why all this trouble - can you not use .tml and direct urls to avoid > triggering the cgi cycle? Then everything is in process. Even multiple > interpreters and threading is supported if you open the Metakit VFS > starkit in "-shared" mode. Whenever we can, this is exactly what we do. There are cases though where we must run an external program via cgi... Attached is a script that copies out the "kitted?" cgi-bin directory to $env(TMP) and takes over from there...I think i's kinda kludgey, but.... proc cgikit::map_cgi {cgi_tmp_dir wrapped_dir} { #wrapped_dir is what is the cgi directory actually is # check to see if running as a starkit if {[info exists starkit::topdir]} { if {[info procs ::Httpd_Server] ne ""} { set cgi_source [file join $::Config(docRoot) $wrapped_dir] set cgi_dest [file join $::env(TMP) $cgi_tmp_dir] file copy $cgi_source $cgi_dest Cgi_Directory /$cgi_tmp_dir $cgi_dest set ::Httpd(starkit_cgi_dir) $cgi_dest #register callback on exit Httpd_RegisterShutdown cgikit::cgi_cleanup return "$wrapped_dir directory remapped to /$cgi_tmp_dir" } } } proc cgikit::cgi_cleanup {} { ###exiting tclhttpd via the SrvUI calls this proc ###What to do if exiting from shell, or Control-C??? if {[info exists starkit::topdir]} { if {[info procs ::Httpd_Server] ne ""} { eval file delete -force $::Httpd(starkit_cgi_dir) } } } So on startup of tclhttpd, we call map_cgi, and things seem to work.. In my tclkit, I added this to the starkit namespace, and it seems to work OK. A couple of questions/caveats If tclhttpd is not exited via the Tk interface, the files dont get cleaned up. Is there a place somewhere in tclkit that the cleanup can be called, sould some simply "Control-C" the server? Any other possibilities to explore...? anyway, thanx for responses and sharing your great work, regards, nicolas From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 26 08:10:22 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QEAMc11819 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:10:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1QECSXH017332 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:12:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1QECTj01920; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:12:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:12:29 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030226091229.AAB28901@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! In-Reply-To: <5B77ED44-4975-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:30:42 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > The genkit build script has been tweaked further based on all recent > feedback. The starting point for "Seven steps to get a Tclkit on YOUR > Unix system" is: > http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit Question - would it be useful to add to this url the note that after getting the latest genkit, it ensures a) that it has the latest tar files and b) that anything previously done on the machine in the current directory will not interfer with the current run? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 26 08:20:05 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QEK5c12717 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:20:05 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1QEMCXH020081 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:22:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1QEMCg06342; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:22:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:22:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030226092212.AAB6323@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Questions about the latest genkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I had a couple of weird things occur with the latest genkit. However, when I reran it, they don't show up. So I'm puzzled about the implications. At the end of run 1, I got: info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu tclkit-lwv26awu: 1163917 -> 1572137 tar: D: Cannot stat: No such file or directory tar: Error exit delayed from previous errors Compression: 98.39% Coding with btoa Packing kit 1... File Name Archive # Description ---------------------------------------------------------- zag.ba.aa 1 Stamping kit 1... tclkit-lwv26awu: 1163917 -> 1572137 ---- Notice the tar error? Also notice the btoa call? I have a new file, called Kit01, in the current directory. At the end of run two, I see: info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu tclkit-lwv26awu: 1163917 -> 1572137 Nothing from the tar command , but also nothing about that Kit01 file either. Are these artifacts about which I need not worry? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 26 08:28:50 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QESnc13494; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:28:50 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:31:03 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Questions about the latest genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <20030226092212.AAB6323@cas.org> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > tar: D: Cannot stat: No such file or directory > tar: Error exit delayed from previous errors > Compression: 98.39% > Coding with btoa > Packing kit 1... > File Name Archive # Description > ---------------------------------------------------------- > zag.ba.aa 1 > Stamping kit 1... > tclkit-lwv26awu: 1163917 -> 1572137 Never seen this before. > running dummy-lwv26awu > tclkit-lwv26awu: 1163917 -> 1572137 Normal result. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 26 08:28:54 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QESrc13501 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:28:53 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:31:07 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030226140456.E592C1978F@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > I've extended genkit a bit in Phase E so that it includes all packages > that I've put into an 'addons' directory beneath 'tars'. Which is exactly what I want to avoid. Modifications to tclkit should not be called tclkit - please. I have no means to enforce this. All I can do is beg and plea that this decision is respected as much as possible. The difference is sanity. Tclkit represents a fixed set of functionality. It evolves in ways which does its very best to maintain compatibility. This is an important issue to deal with the brittleness that comes with splitting apps in a runtime and a starkit. Take the starkit, get a "suitable" runtime, put them together and bingo: satisfaction, happiness, applause. If you want to build a parallel universe with a modified tclkit, I'm all for it (seriously). What you need to do is give it a name (say "mykit"), and generate your starkits with "sdx wrap ... -interp mykit". Modify sdx if you like, so it does that by default. Put in your own icon, and the illusion is pretty complete. > This is to make it easier to build a custom tclkit. This on the other hand is fine with me - not that it matters :) But instead of altering genkit, why not simply use sdx wrap? - create a dir mykit.vfs/... with all packages you want to add - copy tclkit to tclkit.temp - run sdx: sdx wrap mykit -runtime tclkit.temp Same result... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 26 08:34:45 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QEYjc14032 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:34:45 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:36:58 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] vfs mounting Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E5CCBF8.2020401@maich.gr> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Nicolas Boretos wrote: > Attached is a script that copies out the "kitted?" cgi-bin directory > to $env(TMP) and takes over from there...I think i's kinda kludgey, > but.... It's a way out. The "load" command is essentially oing the same. > If tclhttpd is not exited via the Tk interface, the files dont get > cleaned up. Is there a place somewhere in tclkit that the cleanup can > be called, sould some simply "Control-C" the server? There's not much you can do against ^C. Tclx has system hooks AFAIK. A shell script which launches the server and cleans up when it exits? -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 26 09:21:14 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QFLEc18326 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:21:14 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1QFNLXH014925 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:23:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1QFNLd07694; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:23:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:23:21 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030226102321.AAB7446@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] solaris 2.6 and solaris 8 success with latest genkit build Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Status of genkit on Solaris. On Solaris 8, after monkeying around with some environment variables and genkit.local, I am able to create a tclkit which does not require a user to set values into their LD_LIBRARY_PATH in order to use it. However, even after making the same changes for Solaris 2.6, I'm still unsucessful at building a similar tclkit with the current genkit . I continue my struggles... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 26 09:25:53 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QFPqc18782 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:25:52 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1QFRxXH017282 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1QFS0r07792; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030226102759.AAB7773@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] solaris 2.6 and solaris 8 success with latest genkit build In-Reply-To: <20030226102321.AAB7446@cas.org> of Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:23:21 -0500 (EST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: Solaris 2.6 woes Okay - it was my fault. In one of my changes for Solaris 2.6, I mistyped a directory name. g++ didn't complain that the directory didn't exist - just didn't find anything useful there. Repairing that fixed things for me. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From usus@aladyn.de Wed Feb 26 09:41:55 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QFftc20342 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:41:55 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 0F3D33BFD3; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 16:44:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 4B9C23BF4C for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 16:44:08 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 16:44:08 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030226154408.4B9C23BF4C@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,PLING version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday 26 February 2003 15:31, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I've extended genkit a bit in Phase E so that it includes all packages > > that I've put into an 'addons' directory beneath 'tars'. ... > Modifications to tclkit should not be called tclkit - please. Seconded. It was not my intention to call it 'tclkit'. ... > If you want to build a parallel universe with a modified tclkit, I'm > all for it (seriously). What you need to do is give it a name (say > "mykit"), and generate your starkits with "sdx wrap ... -interp mykit". ... > > But instead of altering genkit, why not simply use sdx wrap? > > - create a dir mykit.vfs/... with all packages you want to add > - copy tclkit to tclkit.temp > - run sdx: > sdx wrap mykit -runtime tclkit.temp > I wasn't aware of those two options to sdx. They serve my needs perfectly. Ulrich From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 26 09:52:22 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QFqMc21313 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:52:22 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 16:54:34 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] solaris 2.6 and solaris 8 success with latest genkit build Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030226102321.AAB7446@cas.org> Message-Id: <9A0F8E08-49A2-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Status of genkit on Solaris. > > On Solaris 8, after monkeying around with some environment variables > and > genkit.local, I am able to create a tclkit which does not require a > user > to set values into their LD_LIBRARY_PATH in order to use it. > > However, even after making the same changes for Solaris 2.6, I'm still > unsucessful at building a similar tclkit with the current genkit . > I continue my struggles... Thanks for persevering. I wonder how all this variability comes about - here's SourceForge: usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1 jcw $ sh genkit D info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200211.244 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = jcw tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1 usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1 jcw $ sh genkit E tclkit-usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1: 1277017 -> 1684856 usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1 jcw $ gcc -v Reading specs from /opt/sfw/lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/2.95.3/specs gcc version 2.95.3 20010315 (release) usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1 jcw $ g++ -v Reading specs from /opt/sfw/lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/2.95.3/specs gcc version 2.95.3 20010315 (release) usf-cf-sparc-solaris-1 jcw $ No tweaks whatsoever, a home run: 7 steps. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 26 10:10:29 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QGATc23050 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:10:29 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h1QGCZXH013178 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:12:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h1QGCZ108641; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:12:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:12:35 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030226111235.AAB8596@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] solaris 2.6 and solaris 8 success with latest genkit build In-Reply-To: <9A0F8E08-49A2-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Wed, 26 Feb 2003 16:54:34 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > No tweaks whatsoever, a home run: 7 steps. My problem arises in that g++ on my machine is not installed in one of the system's default load library locations. Thus, attempts to run g++ binary applications are unable to locate libstdc++ and refuse to run. My tweaks are intended to let genkit find the libraries it needs when building metakit (problem 1) and then to insert the library directory into the tclkit (problem 2) so that the users on my system don't have to add directories to their LD_LIBRARY_PATH before attempting to use a tclkit/starkit based application. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Wed Feb 26 10:27:05 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1QGR5c24871 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:27:05 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1QGTEiU030664 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:29:14 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn8.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.238]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1QGTDB27405 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:29:14 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 tagged for release - just a few more days! Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:30:17 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Modifications to tclkit should > not be called tclkit - please. I have no means to enforce this. All I > can do is beg and plea that this decision is respected as much as > possible. Which is a valid request. ActiveState simply calls them "base kits" in the Tcl Dev Kit, where "starkits" is the more generic term. > The difference is sanity. Tclkit represents a fixed set of > functionality. It evolves in ways which does its very best to maintain > compatibility. Of course, squatting on tclkit may not have been the best when it isn't just 'tcl' inside. ;) Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ From mel@redolive.com Thu Feb 27 11:03:36 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1RH3Zc22368 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:03:36 -0600 Received: (qmail 27672 invoked by uid 511); 27 Feb 2003 18:03:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 18:03:30 -0000 Message-ID: <003f01c2de82$7814d0a0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:05:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2DE58.8F265EA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] help rebuilding tclhttpd... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2DE58.8F265EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i got tclhttpd.kit. i ran "sdx unwrap tclhttpd.kit" on my WInDoze Xp and = ended up with tclhttpd.vfs directory i deleted a bunch of files and dirs that are irrelevant for my = application. QUESTION: i need to rebuild it now and have no clue, since i can not = find main.tcl in tclhttpd.vfs file for testing can someone please tell me: 1) how to test my new package 2) how to build a single tclhttpd.exe file many thanks, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2DE58.8F265EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i got tclhttpd.kit. i ran "sdx unwrap = tclhttpd.kit"=20 on my WInDoze Xp and ended up with tclhttpd.vfs directory
 
i deleted a bunch of files and dirs = that are=20 irrelevant for my application.
 
QUESTION: i need to rebuild it now and = have no=20 clue, since i can not find main.tcl in tclhttpd.vfs file for=20 testing
 
can someone please tell = me:
1) how to test my new = package
2) how to build a single tclhttpd.exe=20 file
 
many thanks, = Mel
------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2DE58.8F265EA0-- From mel@redolive.com Thu Feb 27 11:45:41 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1RHjfc26363 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:45:41 -0600 Received: (qmail 27764 invoked by uid 511); 27 Feb 2003 18:45:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 18:45:36 -0000 Message-ID: <004a01c2de88$59c49850$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:47:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0047_01C2DE5E.70E875D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Help with tclhttpd please.... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01C2DE5E.70E875D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable can someone explain how to get rid of these warnings and errors:=20 -where do i get package limit from -where should i place my .htaccess file i am on WINDOZE XP&^%$#@*() Don't do "package require tcllib", ask for individual modules. auto_path: C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/tcl8.4 c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/tcllib1.3/calendar c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/tcllib1.3/control c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/tcllib1.3/math C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom can't find package limit Running with default file descriptor limit No .htaccess support: can't find package crypt Loading code from C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom httpd started on port 8015 ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01C2DE5E.70E875D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
can someone explain how to get rid of = these=20 warnings and errors:
-where do i get package limit = from
-where should i place my .htaccess file = i am on=20 WINDOZE XP&^%$#@*()
 
Don't do "package require tcllib", ask = for=20 individual=20 modules.
auto_path:
C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib
c:/c= ygwin/usr/local/lib/tcl8.4
c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib
c:/cygwin/usr/lo= cal/lib/tcllib1.3/calendar
c:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/tcllib1.3/controlc:/cygwin/usr/local/lib/tcllib1.3/math
C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/= bin/../custom
can't=20 find package limit
Running with default file descriptor limit
No = .htaccess=20 support: can't find package crypt
Loading code from=20 C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom
httpd started on port=20 8015
------=_NextPart_000_0047_01C2DE5E.70E875D0-- From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Thu Feb 27 12:20:20 2003 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1RIKJc29578 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:20:19 -0600 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id SAA24269; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 18:22:32 GMT Message-Id: <200302271822.SAA24269@sole.prd.co.uk> To: "Mel" cc: "Starkit" , steve@sole.prd.co.uk Subject: Re: [Starkit] help rebuilding tclhttpd... In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:05:45 EST." <003f01c2de82$7814d0a0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 18:22:32 +0000 From: Steve Blinkhorn Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>"Mel" said: > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C2DE58.8F265EA0 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > i got tclhttpd.kit. i ran "sdx unwrap tclhttpd.kit" on my WInDoze Xp and = > ended up with tclhttpd.vfs directory > > i deleted a bunch of files and dirs that are irrelevant for my = > application. > > QUESTION: i need to rebuild it now and have no clue, since i can not = > find main.tcl in tclhttpd.vfs file for testing > Whoa! if it's the packaged-up tclhttpd starkit that jcw adapted slightly from my version, you don't want to delete *anything* from it if you want it to work. I already stripped out everything needless, and added just one thing (ezsmtp) for convenience. It *may* work as a starpack - I haven't tried - but first of all it's much easier to get it going as a starkit in the form in which you originally got it. You've probably deleted main.tcl by accident. In only slightly different form, that particular starkit has been running live servers for over two years, so my guess is you should slow down and find your way around. Get a clean copy and start afresh building your document tree and the .rc file, run it as a starkit till it's doing what you want, and then work out if it's a candidate for single-file executable starpack form. If you're planning on anything being written into the file, the starpack approach won't work anyway. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 27 12:43:26 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1RIhQc31765 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:43:26 -0600 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:45:41 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] help rebuilding tclhttpd... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200302271822.SAA24269@sole.prd.co.uk> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Blinkhorn wrote: >>>> "Mel" said: >> i got tclhttpd.kit. i ran "sdx unwrap tclhttpd.kit" on my WInDoze Xp >> and = >> ended up with tclhttpd.vfs directory [...] > Whoa! if it's the packaged-up tclhttpd starkit that jcw adapted > slightly from my version, you don't want to delete *anything* from it > if you want it to work. I already stripped out everything needless, > and added just one thing (ezsmtp) for convenience. [...] There's two starkits: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/tclhttpd.kit http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/tclhttpdmin.kit The latter is your reduced version, Steve. Both are browseable on the web, just start from this URL: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/ > -where should i place my .htaccess file i am on WINDOZE XP&^%$#@*() [...] > No .htaccess support: can't find package crypt Sure, you can curse all you like in front of 100+ readers, without reading what you're posting. But it wouldn't hurt to look around and read a bit, Mel. Tclhttpd is plain and simple Tcl, you know. Search through docs, dirs, and files and all the issues you raise should become clear. Besides - these issues are tclhttpd-specific, not starkit. -jcw From GargashS@Otologics.com Thu Feb 27 17:06:55 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1RN6tc24143 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 17:06:55 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:09:10 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: using non-tcl files from a vfs Thread-Index: AcLetTvntgol/+YgTVKsFubA/mRIOQ== From: "Scott Gargash" To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1RN6tc24143 Subject: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Problem: We have a SWIG-generated wrapper DLL for an externally supplied tcl-unaware capability DLL. We'd like to package the whole thing in a starkit. The problem is that the SWIG wrapper DLL is implicitly linked against the capability DLL, but the runtime loader (obviously) can't locate and load the capability DLL from the VFS. And since the capability DLL is tcl-unaware, it can't even be explicitly loaded via tcl load since it doesn't have a package_Init function. The current workaround is to extract the capability DLL from the VFS into the temp directory and add the temp directory to the library search path before trying to load the wrapper DLL. This works, with one caveat. The VFS layer knows to cleanup extracted files that it has extracted, but it doesn't know about files that the user has extracted. This caveat shows up in other cases as well. We have another use where the starkit execs an utility that is packaged in the starkit. Since you can't exec from a VFS, the executable needs to be extracted from it. The same cleanup issue exists here. Have others run into these sorts of issues, and if so, how are you solving them? A couple of thoughts on improvements. Suggestion 1: Modify the Tcl load command such that when the empty string is passed as the package name, the library is not considered as a Tcl package with a package_Init function. In this case, the load command should just load the shared library, but not try to lookup any symbols or call any functions from the library. This is more of a Tcl than a starkit suggestion, but starkits make it more visible since implicit linking can't be used. Suggestion 2: Add a VFS extract {vfsFile {destFile {}} command that copies a file out of the VFS to the destFile if specified, or the temp directory if destFile is not specified, and adds the extracted file to the list of files to be cleaned up when the interpreter exits. Would these mods be useful to others? -------------------------------------------- Scott Gargash Software Engineer Otologics, LLC 303.996.8238 From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Feb 28 05:41:08 2003 Received: from smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.12]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SBf7c11326 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 05:41:07 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18oivC-000FyC-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 11:43:22 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030228112727.01d7d778@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 11:43:21 +0000 To: From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 04:09 PM 2/27/2003 -0700, Scott Gargash wrote: >Have others run into these sorts of issues, and if so, how are you solving >them? Tk also has the issue with Windows cursors. I plan to submit a TIP in the next six months which adds a new API to Tcl through which vfs files can be robustly extracted to temp and cleaned up (either immediately or at exit, as appropriate). This can then be exposed through tclvfs to any starkit. In the mean-time, one approach is to ensure such temporary files match a specific pattern, and each time your code starts up it deletes all temporary files which match that pattern (or tries to). That way you'll have at most one set of temporary files lying around. Vince. From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Feb 28 10:40:39 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SGecc03571 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:40:39 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1SGgniU006809 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 08:42:49 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1SGgnB08962 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 08:42:49 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 08:42:49 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030228112727.01d7d778@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > In the mean-time, one approach is to ensure such temporary files match a > specific pattern, and each time your code starts up it deletes all > temporary files which match that pattern (or tries to). That way you'll > have at most one set of temporary files lying around. This can of course be a bad thing if more than one instance of the application is running, deleting the files they need from each other. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Fri Feb 28 10:47:00 2003 Received: from lewey.iland.net (lewey.iland.net [205.242.230.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1SGl0c04174 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:47:00 -0600 Received: (qmail 23355 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 16:49:19 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-144.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.144) by lewey.iland.net with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 16:49:19 -0000 Message-ID: <010201c2df49$0fbc4ac0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:47:14 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 2/26/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 10:42 AM Subject: RE: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs > > In the mean-time, one approach is to ensure such temporary files match a > > specific pattern, and each time your code starts up it deletes all > > temporary files which match that pattern (or tries to). That way you'll > > have at most one set of temporary files lying around. > > This can of course be a bad thing if more than one instance of the > application is running, deleting the files they need from each other. Instance specific temporary filenames? Yuk... From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Feb 28 10:55:37 2003 Received: from smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SGtac05030 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:55:36 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18onpX-000GDC-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 16:57:51 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030228165452.01eaf960@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 16:57:50 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs In-Reply-To: <010201c2df49$0fbc4ac0$0101a8c0@quantex> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 10:47 AM 2/28/2003 -0600, you wrote: > > This can of course be a bad thing if more than one instance of the > > application is running, deleting the files they need from each other. >Instance specific temporary filenames? Yuk... This is only really a problem if you have copies of your app firing up at random times. If your app really needs the temporary file, it will be 'in use' in the OS and therefore not be deleted. If your app has finished using the file, it's fine if it is deleted. The only problem is if it is deleted in the small time between it being created and being used, unless you really need persistent temporary files of some kind (which are a security risk anyway). cheers, Vince. From GargashS@Otologics.com Fri Feb 28 10:58:11 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SGwBc05274 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:58:11 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:00:27 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Thread-Index: AcLfSV8zCjC2HJ8kT0a3L+Zq2hAbjAAADajA From: "Scott Gargash" To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1SGwBc05274 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeff Godfrey [mailto:jeff_godfrey@pobox.com] > Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 9:47 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andreas Kupries" > To: > Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 10:42 AM > Subject: RE: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs > > > > In the mean-time, one approach is to ensure such > temporary files match a > > > specific pattern, and each time your code starts up it deletes all > > > temporary files which match that pattern (or tries to). > That way you'll > > > have at most one set of temporary files lying around. > > > > This can of course be a bad thing if more than one instance of the > > application is running, deleting the files they need from > each other. > > > Instance specific temporary filenames? Yuk... And if you want the runtime library loader to find a library, the filename can't be changed from what you linked against. Although it would be nice to have a language supported mechanism to generate a unique per instance filename for temp files. Something like $$ in perl. Scott From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Feb 28 11:03:11 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SH3Ac05822 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 11:03:10 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1SH5LiU009022 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:05:21 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h1SH5LB12667 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:05:21 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:05:21 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > > > In the mean-time, one approach is to ensure such > > temporary files match a > > > > specific pattern, and each time your code starts up it deletes all > > > > temporary files which match that pattern (or tries to). > > That way you'll > > > > have at most one set of temporary files lying around. > > > > > > This can of course be a bad thing if more than one instance of the > > > application is running, deleting the files they need from > > each other. > > > > > > Instance specific temporary filenames? Yuk... > > And if you want the runtime library loader to find a library, the > filename can't be changed from what you linked against. > > Although it would be nice to have a language supported mechanism > to generate a unique per instance filename for temp files. > Something like $$ in perl. Hm. [pid] ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 28 11:17:16 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SHHFc07318 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 11:17:15 -0600 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 18:19:24 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030228165452.01eaf960@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > This is only really a problem if you have copies of your app firing up > at random times. If your app really needs the temporary file, it will > be 'in use' in the OS and therefore not be deleted. If your app has > finished using the file, it's fine if it is deleted. The only problem > is if it is deleted in the small time between it being created and > being used, unless you really need persistent temporary files of some > kind (which are a security risk anyway). What this discussion tells me, is that across platforms and usage scenario's, there's a lot of ways to do things, and more than enough rope to hang oneself. It might be worthwhile to extract the logic of temp files into a separate package, and (please!) make it scripted, so one can see what it does and take over in exceptional cases. And example is the current load-via-temp copy, which had to be tweaked when we found out that HP-UX needs a certain mode. I'm not sure, but it may be that one day we'll hit a case where the copy needs a certain suffix as well. All of this is currently sealed in the core and, eh, "somewhat frozen" (short of overriding it with Tcl). It sounds to me like Scott Gargash's opening comments could lead to a solution which also caters for "foreign shared libs" and their cleanup. The original tclkit 8.2 code used a caching mechanism, by Matt Newman, with tweaks by Steve Landers to insert a "uid" into the path and solve security issues. The caching logic got lost (everything is a trade-off) in the current codebase, so again this points to the need to make load-via-temp more flexible. Some people want certain cleanup, others want maximal cache use. And as has been pointed out, it's not just for shared libs, on Win32 the use of cursors also needs a temp copy. Having it work for exec and pipe-open will be useful, as Nicolas Boretos recently illustrated with tclhttpd. With a mindset of writing *all* policy code in Tcl, one could take this even further and create a "primitive load" for doing the system calls, and a Tcl wrapper to subsume what today's "load" does. But that's food for thought for 8.5 or 9.0, not the 8.4.x codebase, hence a long time off. Interesting... how we're gradually turning away from the disk as central FS and VFS being a Tcl-specific trick, to seeing everything from Tcl and VFS, and having to "fix" the limitations of the outside world :) -jcw From GargashS@Otologics.com Fri Feb 28 11:52:07 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SHq7c10731 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 11:52:07 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:54:23 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Thread-Index: AcLfS7+wRuH/wPoWTrSeM6oNLUqN1AABlsrA From: "Scott Gargash" To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1SHq7c10731 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Although it would be nice to have a language supported mechanism > > to generate a unique per instance filename for temp files. > > Something like $$ in perl. > > Hm. [pid] ? Yup, that would do it. I don't know how I've never noticed that command before. From cferril@mchsi.com Fri Feb 28 15:46:14 2003 Received: from sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (sccmmhc01.mchsi.com [204.127.203.183]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1SLkEc31204 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 15:46:14 -0600 Received: from wcferril ([12.218.3.140]) by sccmmhc01.mchsi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20030228214825.LHLR2338.sccmmhc01.mchsi.com@wcferril> for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 21:48:25 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Chuck Ferril To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] using non-tcl files from a vfs Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 15:49:03 -0600 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200302281549.03206.cferril@mchsi.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h1SLkEc31204 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Yes. And your code illustrates it nicely (please *do* consider posting > this to the starkit mailing list...). Ok...here it is: proc starkit::extdir { {base {}} } { if { $base == {} } { set base [file join "$::starkit::topdir" ..] } while { ![info exist ::starkit::extdirPath] } { set ::starkit::extdirPath \ [file normalize \ [file join "$base" \ "tmp_[clock seconds]_[expr int(rand() * 1000)]"] \ ] if { [file exists "$::starkit::extdirPath"] } { unset ::starkit::extdirPath } else { file mkdir "$::starkit::extdirPath" } } return "$::starkit::extdirPath" } proc starkit::extdirCopy { vfsname } { set result [file join [starkit::extdir] [file tail "$vfsname"]] catch {file copy -force "$vfsname" "$result"} return $result } proc starkit::extdirCleanup {} { if { [info exist ::starkit::extdirPath] } { catch {file delete -force "$::starkit::extdirPath"} unset ::starkit::extdirPath } } The namespace and procedure names used were based on my original example idea to jcw; anyone feel free to suggest something better, or even rewrite it :-) Obviously, if this isn't part of the starkit namespace...it needs to be changed. > I'm all for this sort of approach. I'd urge you to bring it forward > and try to make this a simple and widely usable extension. The cleanup > on exit may need some more work, I'm not sure what hooks Tcl offers > these days. I see this a fundamental, not as an extension. I'm sure it needs work (at least more than the few minutes it took to write), there may be issues I'm unaware of on platforms other than Linux and Windows. > Last comment: keep in mind that this is not about a single temp > strategy. IMO, we're going to need a few good options, a way to pick > them, and a stable API so people really get used to it. I hope this is useful to someone; I know it has been vital to everything I have done using starkits, and I think something that performs this function truly belongs in the starkit somewhere. That doesn't mean that it couldn't be ignored and done another way, but it at least provides *a* way to do it. ...FWIW... Chuck From jcw@equi4.com Sat Mar 1 09:15:49 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h21FFmc23730 for ; Sat, 1 Mar 2003 09:15:49 -0600 Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2003 16:18:04 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] starchive preview Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If you're interested in the concept of starchive, as mentioned recently on this list, you may want to have a look at a first implementation. See http://www.equi4.com/StarchiveImplementation It turns out that creating the associative file store was too trivial to let this linger any further. And though there is not yet an interface to retrieve complete starkits from starchive, I'll use this mechanism from now on when making changes to starkits such as sdx, kitten, and wikit. This means that as of today, all versions of these starkits will be kept. Please don't expect anything substantial from this preview - it's just to show how simple it can be to maintain an arbitrary collection of starkits and all their versions. The whole concept hinges on some essential properties of starkits and of Metakit, but the actual contents can be absolutely anything. As a matter of fact, I threw in a starkit called "sources" which contains the complete collection of source code needed to build Tcl from scratch, just to see some statistics of this approach: - 229 dirs with 2808 files - unpacked on disk (blocking makes it look a bit high): 48 Mb - sources.kit is 10.3 Mb (roughly same as sum of distro tars) - the starkit map for sources.kit is 95 Kb The entire starchive currently has 134 starkits, 8913 files, and require 55 Mb space for the data and 870 Kb for the starkit maps. Oh, it's basically what is currently in the Starkit Distribution Archive collection at http://mini.net/sdarchive/ - plus a few others. The way I see it, this can easily scale to tens of thousands of starkits (and versions) and millions of files. Just some figures to keep y'all thinking... :) -jcw From mel@redolive.com Mon Mar 3 05:49:06 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h23Bn5c18455 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 05:49:06 -0600 Received: (qmail 10478 invoked by uid 511); 3 Mar 2003 12:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 12:48:59 -0000 Message-ID: <018701c2e17b$33d3a2d0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 06:51:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0184_01C2E151.4AF906F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] NEED A STRAIGHT ANSWER !!!! Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0184_01C2E151.4AF906F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i need to know the command line that builds tclhttpd. is this so hard to = answer ? 1) i downloaded tclhttpd.kit 2) unwrapped it using: "sdx unwrap tclkttpd" and got tclhttpd.vfs 3) wrapped it using: "sdx wrap tclhttpd" and got: "tclhttpd" file and = not "tclhttpd.kit" !!!! 4) run it using "tclkit tclhttpd" and get the error "could'nt read file = tclhttpd/main.tcl"=20 how on earth was this package built? in the first place pleeeeeez help yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0184_01C2E151.4AF906F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i need to know the command line that = builds=20 tclhttpd. is this so hard to answer ?
 
1) i downloaded = tclhttpd.kit
2) unwrapped it using: "sdx unwrap = tclkttpd" and=20 got tclhttpd.vfs
3) wrapped it using: "sdx wrap = tclhttpd" and got:=20 "tclhttpd" file and not "tclhttpd.kit" !!!!
4) run it using "tclkit tclhttpd" and = get the error=20 "could'nt read file tclhttpd/main.tcl"
 
how on earth was this package built? in = the first=20 place
 
pleeeeeez help
 
yours, Mel
 
------=_NextPart_000_0184_01C2E151.4AF906F0-- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Mar 3 05:54:28 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h23BsSc18839 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 05:54:28 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h23BudXH026815 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 06:56:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h23Budv04172; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 06:56:39 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 06:56:39 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030303065639.AAB4083@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] NEED A STRAIGHT ANSWER !!!! In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 3 Mar 2003 06:51:18 -0500 To: "Starkit" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: sdx unwrap file.kit sdx wrap file.kit -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mel@redolive.com Mon Mar 3 06:12:05 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h23CC5c20122 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 06:12:05 -0600 Received: (qmail 10538 invoked by uid 511); 3 Mar 2003 13:11:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 13:11:58 -0000 Message-ID: <01a701c2e17e$6a1ab7e0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 07:14:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01A4_01C2E154.813B8820" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] tclhttpd.kit question... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01A4_01C2E154.813B8820 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i have my cgi files (bunch of tcl files) inside my tclvfs and want to = use them from inside my starkit. how can i tell tclhttpd to look inside = itself for htdocs (files)? yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_01A4_01C2E154.813B8820 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i have my cgi files (bunch of tcl = files) inside my=20 tclvfs and want to use them from inside my starkit. how can i tell = tclhttpd to=20 look inside itself for htdocs (files)?
 
yours, Mel
------=_NextPart_000_01A4_01C2E154.813B8820-- From mel@redolive.com Mon Mar 3 13:57:08 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h23Jv7c27556 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 13:57:07 -0600 Received: (qmail 11640 invoked by uid 511); 3 Mar 2003 20:57:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 20:57:00 -0000 Message-ID: <015401c2e1bf$613ff5e0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:59:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E195.76562910" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] starkit + sqlite anyone Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E195.76562910 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i tried desparately to build a starkit with sqlite, but failed on load = package. (TEA issue? maybe) i was wondering if anyone has done this and can help me out here.... Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E195.76562910 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i tried desparately to build a starkit with sqlite, but failed on = load=20 package. (TEA issue? maybe)
 
i was wondering if anyone has done this and can help me out = here....
 
Yours, Mel
 
------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E195.76562910-- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 3 14:10:39 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h23KAcc29114 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:10:39 -0600 Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 21:12:55 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit + sqlite anyone Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <015401c2e1bf$613ff5e0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: <8524E104-4DB4-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > i tried desparately to build a starkit with sqlite, but failed on load > package. (TEA issue? maybe) What platform? What happens - what errors? How does this differ from any other extension? There's no magic involved, but without information it all becomes a bit silly. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Mar 3 14:11:12 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h23KBCc29206 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:11:12 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h23KELT9004296 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 13:14:21 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA16230 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 13:13:30 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (8.11.6/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h23KDSJ28586 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:13:29 -0600 Message-ID: <3E63B767.F7806BF0@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 13:13:27 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] starchive preview References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, Does this mean the existing http://mini.net/sdarchive/ site will no longer have the latest versions of starkits such as sdx, kitten, and wikit? Tom K. > > If you're interested in the concept of starchive, as mentioned recently > on this list, you may want to have a look at a first implementation. > See > http://www.equi4.com/StarchiveImplementation > > It turns out that creating the associative file store was too trivial > to let this linger any further. And though there is not yet an > interface to retrieve complete starkits from starchive, I'll use this > mechanism from now on when making changes to starkits such as sdx, > kitten, and wikit. This means that as of today, all versions of these > starkits will be kept. > > Please don't expect anything substantial from this preview - it's just > to show how simple it can be to maintain an arbitrary collection of > starkits and all their versions. The whole concept hinges on some > essential properties of starkits and of Metakit, but the actual > contents can be absolutely anything. > > As a matter of fact, I threw in a starkit called "sources" which > contains the complete collection of source code needed to build Tcl > from scratch, just to see some statistics of this approach: > - 229 dirs with 2808 files > - unpacked on disk (blocking makes it look a bit high): 48 Mb > - sources.kit is 10.3 Mb (roughly same as sum of distro tars) > - the starkit map for sources.kit is 95 Kb > > The entire starchive currently has 134 starkits, 8913 files, and > require 55 Mb space for the data and 870 Kb for the starkit maps. Oh, > it's basically what is currently in the Starkit Distribution Archive > collection at http://mini.net/sdarchive/ - plus a few others. The way > I see it, this can easily scale to tens of thousands of starkits (and > versions) and millions of files. > > Just some figures to keep y'all thinking... :) > > -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 3 14:22:29 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h23KMSc30477 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:22:28 -0600 Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 21:24:45 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] starchive preview Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E63B767.F7806BF0@motorola.com> Message-Id: <2C2E34DD-4DB6-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > Does this mean the existing http://mini.net/sdarchive/ site will no > longer have the latest versions of starkits such as sdx, kitten, and > wikit? Oh, no - sdarchive remains *the* source of starkits, as far as I'm concerned. All mini.net/starch/ does is that I can now start tracking all history (sort of like mini.net/tclhist/ collecting the history of the Tclers' Wiki, i.e. mini.net/tcl/, as a completely independent subsystem). When I update something in say "sdx", it ends up in 4 places now: 1. in CVS 2. as starkit in pub/sk/ which is mirrored to mini.net/sdarchive/ 3. as updated notes on the www.equi4.com/sdx page 4. and now also: added to this initial starchive prototype At some point in the future, I'll add the logic to browse and download all starkit versions stored in mini.net/starch/ - and *then* one could start thinking about reworking sdarchive to also use this collection. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 3 18:25:41 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h240Pec21872; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 18:25:40 -0600 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 01:27:58 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: announce@equi4.com, Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <2694A91A-4DD8-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Metakit 2.4.9.1 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Only two weeks after the 2.4.9 release: here is a new update. The changes are minor, most changes affect only Mk4tcl or Mk4py. The reason to release again so soon was not because of some serious bug, but to synchronize the Metakit source code and version number with a new release of Tclkit (8.4.2). 2003-03-03 ############################################ MK 2.4.9.1 2003-03-02 Fixes to Mk4py (gmcm) 2003-03-01 Revert changes in Mk4py/scxx, avoid Mk4tcl warning 2003-02-28 Fixed relaxed layout in Mk4tcl, several Mk4py fixes 2003-02-27 Added support for HPUX aCC "long long" 2003-02-26 Added 64-bit int support to Mk4tcl, fix mingw 2003-02-24 Break was missing in switch Mk4py 2003-02-20 Remove a stray include, remove CR's 2003-02-18 ############################################## MK 2.4.9 As of now, a new 4-level version number is used, to indicate that only bug fixes and no feature changes whatsoever are planned for this code base henceforth. http://www.equi4.com/metakit -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Mar 4 01:29:37 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h247Tbc21180 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 01:29:37 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA11484 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 08:31:55 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA11196 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 08:31:47 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E645663.9DED74DB@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 08:31:47 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] starchive preview References: <2C2E34DD-4DB6-11D7-8423-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > Does this mean the existing http://mini.net/sdarchive/ site will no > > longer have the latest versions of starkits such as sdx, kitten, and > > wikit? > > Oh, no - sdarchive remains *the* source of starkits, as far as I'm > concerned. > I have been wondering about the new versioning method. As it is no longer linear, is the creation date used to check that the starkit to be run is too new to be run with the Tclkit that was started? In other words: how does Tclkit decide that it can not handle the starkit? Just wondering :) Regards, Arjen From mel@redolive.com Tue Mar 4 08:58:05 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h24Ew4c24756 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 08:58:05 -0600 Received: (qmail 13983 invoked by uid 511); 4 Mar 2003 15:57:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 15:57:57 -0000 Message-ID: <004401c2e25e$c4e37780$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 10:00:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0041_01C2E234.DC0A6240" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] how do i load a starkit dll? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01C2E234.DC0A6240 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i have included a dll file in my starkit and need to load it. how do i reference it ? i tried [file join $starkit::topdir lib xxx.dll] = and it fails to load Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01C2E234.DC0A6240 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i have included a dll file in my = starkit and need=20 to load it.
how do i reference it ? i tried [file = join=20 $starkit::topdir lib xxx.dll] and it fails to load
 
Yours, Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0041_01C2E234.DC0A6240-- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Mar 4 09:05:40 2003 Received: from smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net (smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net [212.135.6.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24F5ec25538 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 09:05:40 -0600 Received: from [212.134.222.3] (helo=trapper.eurobios.com) by smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18qE1N-0008LC-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 04 Mar 2003 15:07:57 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030304150626.01f64aa8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 15:07:57 +0000 To: "Starkit" From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] how do i load a starkit dll? In-Reply-To: <004401c2e25e$c4e37780$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 10:00 AM 3/4/2003 -0500, Mel wrote: >i have included a dll file in my starkit and need to load it. >how do i reference it ? i tried [file join $starkit::topdir lib xxx.dll] >and it fails to load Mel, I really think you need to provide more information with all these reports of yours. Clearly, all of this stuff *works* for pretty much everyone else. So, when you say "it fails to load", you need to tell us what happens *EXACTLY* (including errors messages), or all we can say is "it works for us". Vince. From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Mar 4 09:06:50 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24F6nc25682 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 09:06:49 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id QAA24115 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 16:09:08 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA23427 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 16:08:52 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E64C184.93424393@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 16:08:52 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] how do i load a starkit dll? References: <004401c2e25e$c4e37780$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Mel wrote: > > i have included a dll file in my starkit and need to load it. > how do i reference it ? i tried [file join $starkit::topdir lib > xxx.dll] and it fails to load > > Yours, Mel I use the following to load tktable: - Store the DLL file in app-mykit - Adapt the pcgIndex.tcl file to include: package ifneeded Tktable 2.7 "package require Tk 8.2; [list load [file join $dir Tktable.dll] Tktable]" Then do "package require Tktable" in the code Hope this helps. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 4 12:33:50 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24IXnC14538 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 12:33:49 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h24Ia2XH025769 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 13:36:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h24Ia1322108; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 13:36:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 13:36:01 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030304133601.AAB22080@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If I have a directory where I've been building Tclkits to date, and I want to build the very latest version, what should I delete before I begin? Should I delete everything and start with a fresh genkit? Will genkit get the latest tar files, if necessary, and begin from there? Just curious about what to recommend to someone the _second_ time through the effort. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 4 12:50:09 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24Io8C16087 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 12:50:08 -0600 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 19:52:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030304133601.AAB22080@cas.org> Message-Id: <716332E4-4E72-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > If I have a directory where I've been building Tclkits to date, > and I want to build the very latest version, what should I delete > before I begin? Should I delete everything and start with a fresh > genkit? Will genkit get the latest tar files, if necessary, and > begin from there? > > Just curious about what to recommend to someone the _second_ time > through the effort. Good point - thanks for bringing it up. No - genkit does not refresh - if the src/tcl dir exists, it uses that. If not, and tars/tcl.tar.gz exists, it unpacks it. The very best way to start is from scratch, especially while the last tweaks for 8.4.2 are being applied, also to genkit itself. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 4 14:41:25 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24KfPC28551 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 14:41:25 -0600 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 21:43:44 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.2 builds Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok, this is it - the Tcl/Tk sources have been tagged as 8.4.2 and source tars are now available from http://tcl.sf.net - congrats and hats off to Jeff Hobbs, ActiveState's Tcl ambassador and release manager "par excellence"! All files in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ have been updated with final sources for Tclkit 8.4.2. One (minor) patch to Tk distinguishes these sources from the official distribution (see all.diffs), all other packages are straight CVS head snapshots. A freshly-brewed Metakit 2.4.9.1 minor release is also included. The VFS runtime has been updated, $vfs::tclkit_version is 200303. Note: minor documentation tweaks to kit.tar.gz files are still planned, as well as any changes that need to be made to make the "genkit" script work yet more widely. This will not affect the generated code. Apart from this, everything is FINAL! <... pause added for maximum impact ...> On Thursday, a "Tclkit Build Fest" will be announced on comp.lang.tcl and the wiki, running from March 6 through 15, during which I will do my best to help anyone who wants to build a tclkit binary from scratch using the "genkit" script. As described on the http://www.equi4.com/TclkitReleasePolicy page, there are now three levels of Tclkit builds: - level 3: community driven, provided as is - level 2: associated with a maintainer, verified to work - level 1: fully supported, core releases Build levels can be changed, when someone steps forward (or drops out). The following builds are available right now: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.2/ Level 2: FreeBSD (x86) - Mark Roseman Mac OS X (ppc) - Bryan Oakley Solaris (x86) - Steve Landers Level 1: Linux (x86) - Jean-Claude Wippler Solaris (sparc) - Steve Landers Windows (x86) - Jean-Claude Wippler The better we succeed in creating a broad collection of equivalent tclkit ports, the more tempting it will be for people to start building apps and utilities on top. Keep in mind that this set is not just some portable scripting language - it's a phenomenal amount of ready-to-use infrastructure, all of it as compatible and cross-platform as it gets. There have been several comments about this approach in other scripting languages communities. Stubs, VFS, GUI, connectivity, storage: Tcl/Tk, and with it Tclkit, has it all - in a very compact package, with a deployment model based on "instant-on" software, i.e. Starkits. It doesn't get any simpler. Others can only watch and play catch-up. The final chapter in this story depends on our ability to produce the binary runtimes that make it complete. The better we kickstart this, from the Starkit mailing list, the more it will entice others to join in and add yet more builds, when the Tclkit Build Fest is announced. Let me re-iterate once again how you can help make a difference: - follow the seven steps outlined on this page: http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit - send me your "result-*.tar.gz" (from "sh genkit C", step 5) (all the essential binaries and build logs are in there) - I'll list your build, with proper credits of course, at: http://www.equi4.com/275 or http://www.equi4.com/276 - final binaries end up in the tclkit download repository: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.2/ Sooo... please crank up your compilers! -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Tue Mar 4 14:57:24 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24KvOC30455 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 14:57:24 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h24KxciU032673 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 12:59:38 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h24KxcB00533 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 12:59:38 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.2 builds Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 12:59:36 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Ok, this is it - the Tcl/Tk sources have been tagged as 8.4.2 and > source tars are now available from http://tcl.sf.net - congrats and > hats off to Jeff Hobbs, ActiveState's Tcl ambassador and release > manager "par excellence"! Thanks for the kind words, although it is quite a cadre of people that make these releases ever better. One item of some interest to the starkit list, aside from the Tcl Dev Kit 2.5 using starkit technology for the deployment tool, is that ActiveTcl and the Tcl Dev Kit are now distributed on Windows as self-installing starkits. We used to use WinZipSE, but starkits are faster and "better" (doesn't require unzipping everything to a temp dir before running). We'll probably do more with that in the future, but this was a pleasant improvement for us. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From mel@redolive.com Tue Mar 4 15:00:46 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h24L0jC30886 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 15:00:45 -0600 Received: (qmail 14793 invoked by uid 511); 4 Mar 2003 22:00:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.12) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 22:00:38 -0000 Message-ID: <002e01c2e291$6f5238f0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 16:02:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002B_01C2E267.866092A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] httpd starkit question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002B_01C2E267.866092A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i would like to wrap all my custom codes inside the starkit tclhttpd.kit = as a single executable. tclhttpd references htdocs and custom = directories outside of the kit. how can i tell tclhttpd to look inside = the kit for all the files and folders htdocs and custom ? stand alone iget: ----------------------------------- auto_path: C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib c:/mel/bin/tclkitsh.exe/lib/tcl8.4 c:/mel/bin/tclkitsh.exe/lib C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib/tcllib1.3/calendar C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib/tcllib1.3/control C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib/tcllib1.3/math C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom can't find package limit Running with default file descriptor limit No .htaccess support: can't find package crypt Loading code from C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom Loaded AutoResizeImg.tcl:=20 Loaded Button.tcl:=20 Loaded cgi.tcl:=20 Loaded Desktop.tcl:=20 Loaded Dialog.tcl:=20 Loaded du.tcl:=20 Loaded Error.tcl:=20 Loaded find.tcl:=20 Loaded Home.tcl:=20 Loaded ImgSize.tcl:=20 Loaded Javascripts.tcl:=20 Loaded Login.tcl:=20 Loaded Menus.tcl:=20 Loaded Notebook.tcl:=20 Loaded Question.tcl:=20 Loaded Run.tcl:=20 Loaded sql.tcl:=20 Loaded Table.tcl:=20 Loaded TitledFrame.tcl:=20 Loaded Trace.tcl:=20 Loaded Util.tcl:=20 Loaded Warning.tcl:=20 httpd started on port 8015 wrapped version i get: ------------------------------------------------------- ./tclhttpd.exe=20 can't find package limit Running with default file descriptor limit No .htaccess support: can't find package crypt httpd started on port 8015 AS YOU NOTICE; it does not load my custom files=20 thanks for your help ------=_NextPart_000_002B_01C2E267.866092A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i would like to wrap all my custom = codes inside the=20 starkit tclhttpd.kit as a single executable. tclhttpd references htdocs = and=20 custom directories outside of the kit. how can i tell tclhttpd to look = inside=20 the kit for all the files and folders htdocs and custom ?
 
stand alone iget:
-----------------------------------
auto_path:
C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib
c:/mel/= bin/tclkitsh.exe/lib/tcl8.4
c:/mel/bin/tclkitsh.exe/lib
C:/Mel/tclh= ttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../lib/tcllib1.3/calendar
C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhtt= pd.vfs/bin/../lib/tcllib1.3/control
C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/.= ./lib/tcllib1.3/math
C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom
can= 't=20 find package limit
Running with default file descriptor limit
No = .htaccess=20 support: can't find package crypt
Loading code from=20 C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom
Loaded AutoResizeImg.tcl:=20
Loaded Button.tcl:
Loaded cgi.tcl:
Loaded Desktop.tcl: =
Loaded=20 Dialog.tcl:
Loaded du.tcl:
Loaded Error.tcl:
Loaded = find.tcl:=20
Loaded Home.tcl:
Loaded ImgSize.tcl:
Loaded Javascripts.tcl: =
Loaded Login.tcl:
Loaded Menus.tcl:
Loaded Notebook.tcl: =
Loaded=20 Question.tcl:
Loaded Run.tcl:
Loaded sql.tcl:
Loaded = Table.tcl:=20
Loaded TitledFrame.tcl:
Loaded Trace.tcl:
Loaded Util.tcl:=20
Loaded Warning.tcl:
httpd started on port 8015
 
wrapped version i get:
-------------------------------------------------------
./tclhttpd.exe
can't find package=20 limit
Running with default file descriptor limit
No .htaccess = support:=20 can't find package crypt
httpd started on port 8015
AS YOU NOTICE; it does not load my = custom files=20
 
thanks for your = help
------=_NextPart_000_002B_01C2E267.866092A0-- From damon@your.unreality.com Tue Mar 4 15:04:02 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h24L42C31293 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 15:04:02 -0600 Received: (qmail 13904 invoked by uid 300); 4 Mar 2003 21:06:22 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 21:06:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 15:06:22 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.2 builds In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > One item of some interest to the starkit list, aside from the Tcl Dev > Kit 2.5 using starkit technology for the deployment tool, is that > ActiveTcl and the Tcl Dev Kit are now distributed on Windows as > self-installing starkits. We used to use WinZipSE, but starkits are > faster and "better" (doesn't require unzipping everything to a temp > dir before running). We'll probably do more with that in the future, > but this was a pleasant improvement for us. Absolutely. I find now that I've moved InstallBase from freeWrap to TclKit that I can take advantage of a lot of great features in TclKit to make my installs even better. Most commercial installers I've tested (and I've tested most all of them), particularly the Java-based multi-platform installers, all unpack massive amounts of data into temporary directories for installation. I'm proud to say that InstallBase's temporary install size is about the size of one TclKit. 0-] And it's smokingly fast in start-up compared to an installer that has to unpack megs of stuff before it can even go. To sum up, "TclKit... sweeet..." D From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 4 16:04:17 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h24M4HC05750 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 16:04:17 -0600 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 23:06:36 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] httpd starkit question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <002e01c2e291$6f5238f0$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: <91113860-4E8D-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > i would like to wrap all my custom codes inside the starkit > tclhttpd.kit as a single executable. tclhttpd references htdocs and > custom directories outside of the kit. how can i tell tclhttpd to look > inside the kit for all the files and folders htdocs and custom ? > stand alone iget: [...] > No .htaccess support: can't find package crypt > Loading code from C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/bin/../custom > Loaded AutoResizeImg.tcl: [...] > wrapped version i get: [...] No .htaccess support: can't find package crypt > httpd started on port 8015 > AS YOU NOTICE; it does not load my custom files When running unwrapped, files are in: C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs/... When running wrapped, from say tclhttpd.kit, files are in: C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.kit/... Make sure to call starkit::startup in your main.tcl file, as is the convention for starkit nowadays. When you do, you will have a variable $starkit::topdir, set to either C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.vfs or C:/Mel/tclhttpd/tclhttpd.kit Use that to set up the custom file path. -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Wed Mar 5 03:29:37 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h259TaC30746; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 03:29:36 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 7FE2E4D28D; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:31:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 2D7E53B812; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:31:55 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:31:54 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <716332E4-4E72-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <716332E4-4E72-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030305093155.2D7E53B812@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.3 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,DOUBLE_CAPSWORD version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, first of all: Many thanks to all the people who brought us Tcl/Tk8.4.2 and tclkit. The appended small Makefile does (at least for me on Linux and Sun) everything to build a tclkit from nothing (except this Makefile, of course). Maybe (hopefully) it helps to spread the use of tclkit. Best regards Ulrich -------- snip -------- ################################################################ # # # This makefile generates a standard tclkit executable on # # your unix machine. # # # # Just put it into an empty directory and type 'make'. # # It then retrieves everything it needs from the internet # # in the most stable version available. # # # ################################################################ # Set TCLSH to the name of your tclsh (Any 8.x tclsh should do). TCLSH = tclsh8.3 # Set GET to the name of a prog that is able to retrieve # a single file from the internet. GET = wget -q # This is the 'mother of the universe'. SOURCE = http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit tclkit: genkit $(TCLSH) genkit A $(TCLSH) genkit B tcl sh genkit B sh genkit C sh genkit D sh genkit E genkit: $(GET) $(SOURCE) clean: rm -rf build dummy-$(HOSTNAME) install noarch out \ result-$(HOSTNAME).tar.gz src tclkit-$(HOSTNAME) fresh: clean rm -rf tars genkit -------- snip -------- On Tuesday 04 March 2003 19:52, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Larry W. Virden wrote: > > If I have a directory where I've been building Tclkits to date, > > and I want to build the very latest version, what should I delete > > before I begin? Should I delete everything and start with a fresh > > genkit? Will genkit get the latest tar files, if necessary, and > > begin from there? > > > > Just curious about what to recommend to someone the _second_ time > > through the effort. > > Good point - thanks for bringing it up. > > No - genkit does not refresh - if the src/tcl dir exists, it uses that. > If not, and tars/tcl.tar.gz exists, it unpacks it. > > The very best way to start is from scratch, especially while the last > tweaks for 8.4.2 are being applied, also to genkit itself. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Wed Mar 5 09:55:33 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25FtWC03094 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 09:55:32 -0600 Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 16:57:52 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030305093155.2D7E53B812@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-Id: <38A31262-4F23-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > The appended small Makefile does (at least for me on Linux and Sun) > everything to build a tclkit from nothing (except this Makefile, of > course). > > Maybe (hopefully) it helps to spread the use of tclkit. Thanks! I've added it to the pub/tk/tars/ area, and have updated the "Building Tclkit" web page. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 5 10:17:19 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25GHIC05192 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:17:19 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h25GJcCd018157 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 09:19:38 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA00005 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 09:17:47 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h25GJaT07755 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:19:36 -0600 Message-ID: <3E662396.DD83557F@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 09:19:34 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit References: <716332E4-4E72-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <20030305093155.2D7E53B812@sigosmail.sigos.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich, The Makefile file only works if wget exists and since it is apparently 3rd party code there needs to be information on what to do if it isn't install. I also have a Sun and it is not available on my Sun. This problem should be addressed in the http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit documentation which also assume the existence of wget. I also believe that even if I had a copy of wget I could not use it as described in http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit or the Makefile code below, because I would need to pass in a proxy, userid and password in order to establish an http connection for the download. If wget supports this feature it should be included in the description, if not it should be documented as a limitation. Tom K. > Hi all, > > first of all: Many thanks to all the people who brought us Tcl/Tk8.4.2 > and tclkit. > > The appended small Makefile does (at least for me on Linux and Sun) > everything to build a tclkit from nothing (except this Makefile, of course). > > Maybe (hopefully) it helps to spread the use of tclkit. > > Best regards > > Ulrich > > -------- snip -------- > > ################################################################ > # # > # This makefile generates a standard tclkit executable on # > # your unix machine. # > # # > # Just put it into an empty directory and type 'make'. # > # It then retrieves everything it needs from the internet # > # in the most stable version available. # > # # > ################################################################ > > # Set TCLSH to the name of your tclsh (Any 8.x tclsh should do). > TCLSH = tclsh8.3 > > # Set GET to the name of a prog that is able to retrieve > # a single file from the internet. > GET = wget -q > > # This is the 'mother of the universe'. > SOURCE = http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit > > tclkit: genkit > $(TCLSH) genkit A > $(TCLSH) genkit B tcl > sh genkit B > sh genkit C > sh genkit D > sh genkit E > > genkit: > $(GET) $(SOURCE) > > clean: > rm -rf build dummy-$(HOSTNAME) install noarch out \ > result-$(HOSTNAME).tar.gz src tclkit-$(HOSTNAME) > > fresh: clean > rm -rf tars genkit > > -------- snip -------- > > On Tuesday 04 March 2003 19:52, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Larry W. Virden wrote: > > > If I have a directory where I've been building Tclkits to date, > > > and I want to build the very latest version, what should I delete > > > before I begin? Should I delete everything and start with a fresh > > > genkit? Will genkit get the latest tar files, if necessary, and > > > begin from there? > > > > > > Just curious about what to recommend to someone the _second_ time > > > through the effort. > > > > Good point - thanks for bringing it up. > > > > No - genkit does not refresh - if the src/tcl dir exists, it uses that. > > If not, and tars/tcl.tar.gz exists, it unpacks it. > > > > The very best way to start is from scratch, especially while the last > > tweaks for 8.4.2 are being applied, also to genkit itself. > > > > -jcw > > > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From jcw@equi4.com Wed Mar 5 10:28:45 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25GSiC06419 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:28:44 -0600 Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 17:31:04 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E662396.DD83557F@motorola.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > The Makefile file only works if wget exists and since it is apparently > 3rd party code there needs to be information on what to do if it isn't > install. I also have a Sun and it is not available on my Sun. This > problem should be addressed in the http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit > documentation which also assume the existence of wget. I also believe > that even if I had a copy of wget I could not use it as described in > http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit or the Makefile code below, > because I would need to pass in a proxy, userid and password in order > to establish an http connection for the download. If wget supports > this feature it should be included in the description, if not it > should be documented as a limitation. Hm, yes. But by now I would expect "wget" to be as widely known as "gzip"? And there's always google... the first links takes you to its home page. Anyway, if you have tclkit and sdx, then you can have a basic alternative: sdx fetch http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit No proxy support - oh wait, let me fix that (adding Pat Thouyt's "autoproxy" now). Ok, done. Fetch, eh... wait a second, there's a recursion here. Oh well: if you get the latest sdx, you'll have "sdx fetch" and "sdx update" work with proxies, i.e. "http_proxy=server:port sdx fetch ...". Note that genkit does not *need* to do automated fetching. If you get all files from pub/tk/tars/ and put them in a local tars/ directory, genkit will work - as it did before. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 5 10:30:19 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25GUIC06630 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:30:18 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h25GWVXH007604 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 11:32:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h25GWVC07021; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 11:32:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 11:32:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030305113231.AAB7002@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 05 Mar 2003 09:19:34 -0700 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: wget I wonder - since all we are using of wget is a simple binary file retrieval, should we instead use a tcl script (since tclsh is needed by genkit anyways?) -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Wed Mar 5 10:45:05 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25Gj5C08084 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:45:05 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h25GlJ8M011050 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 08:47:19 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn6.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.236]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h25GlJB22279 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 08:47:19 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 08:48:39 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Hm, yes. But by now I would expect "wget" to be as widely known as > "gzip"? And there's always google... the first links takes you to its > home page. wget is far and away not as widely known as gzip. Besides, this is just a Tcl script of the form: package require http set url "http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit" set file [file tail $url] set fid [open $file w] set tok [http::get_url $url -binary 1 -channel $fid] http::wait $tok close $fid > No proxy support - oh wait, let me fix that (adding Pat Thouyt's And of course you can config with http::config for a proxy port. Jeff From bryan@bitmover.com Wed Mar 5 10:45:14 2003 Received: from pimout2-ext.prodigy.net (pimout2-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25GjDC08105 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:45:13 -0600 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-66-137-59-59.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.137.59.59]) by pimout2-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.3 da nor stuldap/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h25GlX2l234834 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 11:47:33 -0500 Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:47:00 -0600 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Bryan Oakley To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <15E4CA2A-4F2A-11D7-B56A-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday, March 5, 2003, at 10:31 AM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Hm, yes. But by now I would expect "wget" to be as widely known as > "gzip"? And there's always google... the first links takes you to its > home page. Just to chime in... until I tried to build tclkit I only barely knew of wget. I knew it existed but I never had a need for it and it wasn't installed on my MacOS box. In my case, though, a simple "fink install wget" solved the problem nicely. So I'll add a datapoint to the argument that wget isn't yet nearly as ubiquitous as gzip. --bryan From jcw@equi4.com Wed Mar 5 10:54:21 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25GsKC09022 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 10:54:20 -0600 Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 17:56:39 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6F40F608-4F2B-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeffrey Hobbs wrote: > wget is far and away not as widely known as gzip. Oh, ok. I've been too much exposed to Linux, apparently. > Besides, this is just a Tcl script of the form: > > package require http > set url "http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit" > set file [file tail $url] > set fid [open $file w] > set tok [http::get_url $url -binary 1 -channel $fid] > http::wait $tok > close $fid > >> No proxy support - oh wait, let me fix that (adding Pat Thouyt's > > And of course you can config with http::config for a proxy port. Ok, placed on the web ("wikified" is the word, but this one is private). Thx! -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 5 16:40:16 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25MeGC11210 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 16:40:16 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h25MgWEH014604 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 15:42:32 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA07012 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 15:42:35 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h25MgXT17703 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 16:42:33 -0600 Message-ID: <3E667D57.6989F110@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 15:42:31 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Did you mean to use http::geturl? I get the following: % package require http 2.4.2 % http::get_url invalid command name "http::get_url" % http::geturl wrong # args: should be "http::geturl url args" % Tom K. > > Hm, yes. But by now I would expect "wget" to be as widely known as > > "gzip"? And there's always google... the first links takes you to its > > home page. > > wget is far and away not as widely known as gzip. Besides, this > is just a Tcl script of the form: > > package require http > set url "http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit" > set file [file tail $url] > set fid [open $file w] > set tok [http::get_url $url -binary 1 -channel $fid] > http::wait $tok > close $fid > > > No proxy support - oh wait, let me fix that (adding Pat Thouyt's > > And of course you can config with http::config for a proxy port. > > Jeff Did you mean to use http::geturl? I get the following: % package require http 2.4.2 % http::get_url invalid command name "http::get_url" % http::geturl wrong # args: should be "http::geturl url args" % Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 5 17:11:41 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25NBfC14488 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 17:11:41 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h25NE162014502 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 16:14:01 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA10703 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 16:14:01 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h25NDxT05600 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 17:13:59 -0600 Message-ID: <3E6684B5.2DF77791@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 16:13:57 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit References: <3E667D57.6989F110@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Here is a script that deals with proxy login. Tom K. -------------------- package require http package require base64 set ProxyHost "my.proxyhost.com" set ProxyPort "1080" set ProxyUsername "userid" set ProxyPassword "password" # this proc was taken from tkchat proc buildProxyHeaders {} { global ProxyUsername ProxyPassword set auth {} set auth [list "Proxy-Authorization" [concat "Basic" [base64::encode ${ProxyUsername}:${ProxyPassword}]]] return $auth } http::config -proxyhost ${ProxyHost} -proxyport ${ProxyPort} set url "http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit" set file [file tail $url] set fid [open $file w] set tok [http::geturl $url -headers [buildProxyHeaders] -binary 1 -channel $fid -timeout 30000] http::wait $tok close $fid From jcw@equi4.com Wed Mar 5 17:26:13 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h25NQDC15933 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 17:26:13 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 00:28:33 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E6684B5.2DF77791@motorola.com> Message-Id: <2E29A7EB-4F62-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > Here is a script that deals with proxy login. > Tom K. > -------------------- > > package require http > package require base64 [...] While the logic looks ok, I fear that we're now risking of introducing more dependencies than we bargained for... now we need the "base64" package! :( Note that tclkit still builds on a system with no installed "tclsh". It's just a bit more work (get tcl, build, etc). The above, while definitely useful for some, will simply shift the problem from fetching files to one of fetching the base64 library, which is inside tcllib, which has an installation, ... arrrgggh! How did we (as a profession) end up making everything so totally inter-dependent? Every time a problem "A" comes up, it needs a solution to "B" first, which uses "C"... etc. Well, let's hope Tclkit will one day get us all out of this madness :) (Not saying this to downplay the validity of the above code, which *is* a solution for some) -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Mar 6 05:59:36 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26BxZC31926 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 05:59:35 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h26C1mXH012878 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 07:01:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h26C1nD12823; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 07:01:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 07:01:49 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030306070149.AAB12697@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit In-Reply-To: <2E29A7EB-4F62-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 6 Mar 2003 00:28:33 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > While the logic looks ok, I fear that we're now risking of introducing > more dependencies than we bargained for... now we need the "base64" > package! :( The proxy password apparently needs to be base64 encoded. Three choices are: o expand the code in the utility to reinvent base64 o expect that the tclsh that is being used has access to base64, o not support that proxy feature. I suspect the proxy stuff was added because of the request here of some way for someone behind a proxy to fetch the code. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 06:21:39 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26CLdC01073 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 06:21:39 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 13:23:59 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030306070149.AAB12697@cas.org> Message-Id: <81E75DB4-4FCE-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > From: Jean-Claude Wippler >> While the logic looks ok, I fear that we're now risking of introducing >> more dependencies than we bargained for... now we need the "base64" >> package! :( > > The proxy password apparently needs to be base64 encoded. Three > choices > are: [...] No, at the end of that path lies madness. The problem was one of obtaining a few files - the solution can not be one of getting yet *more* stuff first! The conclusion: stop trying to push a square peg into a round hole. 1. use available tools to fetch what is needed, i.e. use: browser, wget, curl, sdx, diskettes, CD's, your stepmother, whatever 2. follow the steps described on the web 3. and the end of this process, a tclkit binary comes out (pinch me, please - I can't believe I have to spell all this out... :) -jcw From bryan@bitmover.com Thu Mar 6 07:21:11 2003 Received: from pimout3-ext.prodigy.net (pimout3-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26DLBC05506; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 07:21:11 -0600 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-65-69-121-232.dsl.kscymo.swbell.net [65.69.121.232]) by pimout3-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.3 da nor stuldap/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h26DNV4W583174; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 08:23:31 -0500 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 07:23:00 -0600 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler From: Bryan Oakley In-Reply-To: <81E75DB4-4FCE-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, March 6, 2003, at 06:23 AM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Larry W. Virden wrote: > >> From: Jean-Claude Wippler >>> While the logic looks ok, I fear that we're now risking of >>> introducing >>> more dependencies than we bargained for... now we need the "base64" >>> package! :( >> >> The proxy password apparently needs to be base64 encoded. Three >> choices >> are: > [...] > > No, at the end of that path lies madness. The problem was one of > obtaining a few files - the solution can not be one of getting yet > *more* stuff first! > > The conclusion: stop trying to push a square peg into a round hole. > > 1. use available tools to fetch what is needed, i.e. use: > browser, wget, curl, sdx, diskettes, CD's, your stepmother, whatever > 2. follow the steps described on the web > 3. and the end of this process, a tclkit binary comes out > > (pinch me, please - I can't believe I have to spell all this out... :) Part of this came about as soon as someone made a Makefile with "wget" in it. Perhaps we need to modify the makefile to start at the step after the wget. So the instructions are: "fetch the files from , then run "make". Better yet, perhaps the makefile could have targets for wget, tclhttp, ftp, etc. So one could fetch the Makefile and do "make wget tclkit". If no one else wants to, I'd be willing to work on this. --bryan From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Mar 6 09:13:40 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26FDdC15363 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 09:13:39 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h26FG062026905 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 08:16:00 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA07162 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 08:16:00 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h26FFwT09744 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 09:15:58 -0600 Message-ID: <3E67662C.BDB89AF3@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 08:15:56 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit References: <81E75DB4-4FCE-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, My intention in posting the proxy stuff was not to get it included on the web page, but to inform those who were interested. However, my original point seems to have gotten lost. The http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit site doesn't contain enough information about how to perform a build for someone behind a firewall. If a browser is used to down load the genkit, from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit and the command $ tclsh genkit A is then perform, all you get is an error. fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... couldn't open socket: host is unreachable AT this point the reader is stuck with no where to go for help. What I was hoping for was an explanation of where to go to download the rest of the tar files (not a proxy interface). Hope this helps, Tom K. > Larry W. Virden wrote: > > > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > >> While the logic looks ok, I fear that we're now risking of introducing > >> more dependencies than we bargained for... now we need the "base64" > >> package! :( > > > > The proxy password apparently needs to be base64 encoded. Three > > choices > > are: > [...] > > No, at the end of that path lies madness. The problem was one of > obtaining a few files - the solution can not be one of getting yet > *more* stuff first! > > The conclusion: stop trying to push a square peg into a round hole. > > 1. use available tools to fetch what is needed, i.e. use: > browser, wget, curl, sdx, diskettes, CD's, your stepmother, whatever > 2. follow the steps described on the web > 3. and the end of this process, a tclkit binary comes out > > (pinch me, please - I can't believe I have to spell all this out... :) > > -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 10:23:21 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26GNKC21862 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 10:23:20 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 17:25:39 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E67662C.BDB89AF3@motorola.com> Message-Id: <44F304EE-4FF0-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > If a browser is used to down load the genkit, from > > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit > > and the command > > $ tclsh genkit A > > is then perform, all you get is an error. > > fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... couldn't open socket: host is > unreachable > > AT this point the reader is stuck with no where to go for help. What I > was hoping for was an explanation of where to go to download the rest > of the tar files (not a proxy interface). You're right. I will make changes to the page to clarify this point, thanks. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 10:29:40 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26GTdC22467 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 10:29:39 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 17:31:59 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Preparing to build a tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <270EEAA2-4FF1-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan Oakley wrote: > Part of this came about as soon as someone made a Makefile with "wget" > in it. Which in turn was caused by me using wget in all my examples. > Perhaps we need to modify the makefile to start at the step after the > wget. So the instructions are: "fetch the files from , then run > "make". > > Better yet, perhaps the makefile could have targets for wget, tclhttp, > ftp, etc. So one could fetch the Makefile and do "make wget tclkit". > > If no one else wants to, I'd be willing to work on this. Thanks - but I think I would rather go back to basics. Maybe the issue stops being one if wget is removed as example, and I just write "get file X from http://Y" ? I'm sure people know how to get one or more files from the web? There are a few pitfalls, such as binary mode / CRLF's, but that too is common knowledge? (Given a choice, any choice, I always pick "simplicity" :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 13:01:06 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26J15C02718; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 13:01:05 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 20:03:25 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: announce@equi4.com, Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <4EFB0CA6-5006-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] ANNOUNCE: Tclkit 8.4.2 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: First off, a big hurray to Jeff Hobbs, ActiveState, and all other people involved in making the new Tcl/Tk 8.4.2 release a reality. There's a time for blood, sweat, and tears, and there's a time to stand up... and accept a big round of well-deserved applause! My congratulations and a very sincere Thank You. With that out of the way, I'm hereby proud to announce the release of Tclkit 8.4.2, the standalone runtime which stands on the shoulders of the Tcl/Tk open source giant. Tclkit 8.4.2 is a milestone release. It concludes the work started by Matt Newman and Vince Darley, who introduced and implemented VFS, the Virtual File System which makes application deployment as "Starkits" possible (formerly called "scripted documents"). Unlike many projects, Tclkit 8.4.2 has become simpler over the years. It now consists of the following standard components: - Tcl 8.4.2 (using a subset of available encodings) - Tk 8.4.2 (one optional patch for "-file" arg handling) - Incrtcl 3.3 (from CVS) - TclVFS 1.2 (not all drivers, just mk4vfs and zipvfs) - Metakit 2.4.9.1 (recent minor release, replaces 2.4.9) - Zlib 1.1.4 (the de-facto compression standard) All of the above are "wide open source", using liberal BSD/MIT'ish licenses. In addition, a few small source files and scripts are needed to make it all work together. These are available in the "tclkit" source distribution, which I am hereby placing in the public domain. Main URLs on the web: http://www.equi4.com/tclkit = Tclkit homepage http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ = Tclkit download area http://www.equi4.com/starkit = Starkit homepage But what *is* Tclkit? Ah, thank you for asking... - Tclkit is a tclsh: launch and you get a prompt - Tclkit is a wish: just do "package require Tk" - Tclkit is self-contained: a one-file executable - Tclkit runs scripts passed to it on the command line - Tclkit runs Starkits, i.e. wrapped/compressed applications - Tclkit can be the runtime in single-file Starpacks - Tclkit loads shared extensions via the stub mechanism - Tclkit runs procomp's bytecoded files, through tbcload - Tclkit includes the Incrtl Object Oriented extension - Tclkit includes the Metakit embedded vector-based database - Tclkit is available for two dozen platforms (more below) The essence of Tclkit as a runtime, is that it packs a huge amount of generic functionality into a trivial-to-use executable. To quote Steve Landers: "install == cp" (or copy) and "remove == rm" (or del) The same applies to Starkits. This approach lets you create "instant-on" applications which can be shipped as single file and They Just Work (TM). Tclkit is much more than just another binary build of Tcl, Tk, etc. It is being used in a growing range of commercial projects as hassle-free application infra-structure and runtime foundation. The fact that it combines a fixed set of mature technologies in a self-contained package, means you can at last focus on content and design of your application, and consider all deployment issues solved. New high-profile "rollouts" based on Tclkits and Starkits are taking place right now. Tclkit is no toy. It has run for 18 months on end, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, in a commercial multi-platform client-server project. It has been driving the server and client side of applications which have been downloaded by thousands of non-computer people. It has been deployed to thousands of workstations in a large corporate setting. The Tclers' Wiki has been running for years, using Tclkit. The www.equi4.com website is also wikit-based, and it too runs on Tclkit. In short - Tclkit goes that last mile and gets the job done. Tclkit and Starkits are mature now - not perfect. Rough edges still exist, these are being taken care of as much as possible (through collaboration on the Starkit mailing list). But make no mistake - they deliver and have been tremendous fun for quite some time now, for developers and end-users alike. There is no magic involved in all this. These 1..2 Mb executable Tclkit runtimes are simply taking the promise of scripting and making it a very practical reality. Tcl and Tk: with all of the gains and none of the pains. GUIs, networking, storage - it's all there, and everything that isn't can be added to it. Tclkit is not a new tool. In fact, it's still 100% Tcl and Tk. You can develop as you did before if you like, and then use Tclkit for deployment. One very exciting development is that ActiveTcl 8.2.4 and TclDevKit 2.5 have fully adopted the technology of Tclkit and Starkits. You can now build applications with TclDevKit and at the end of the process click a few buttons to "wrap" everything up using the very same technology. At the other end of the scale, you can choose to use Tclkit as your development environment (don't forget to check out xotclide!), place your sources in a standard structure, debug in unpacked mode, then wrap it up and ship without a tclsh or wish in sight. The convenience of cross-platform wrapping now extends to both developers *and* end users. All options are open, all choices remain yours. Phew. So much for the Tclkit and Starkit story. Thanks for reading this far. May Tcl/Tk and Tclkit serve you well! :) -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Mar 6 14:30:43 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h26KUgC09962 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 14:30:42 -0600 Received: (qmail 57215 invoked by uid 300); 6 Mar 2003 20:33:04 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 20:33:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 14:33:04 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <4EFB0CA6-5006-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] TclKit 8.4.2 question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, Out of curiosity (since it doesn't say anywhere), what is "statically" linked in tclkit-linux-x86static*? For that matter, what is statically linked in each TclKit versus dynamically? 0-] Thanks, Damon From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 15:03:00 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26L2xC13621 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 15:02:59 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 22:05:19 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKit 8.4.2 question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <5663302A-5017-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > Out of curiosity (since it doesn't say anywhere), what is > "statically" > linked in tclkit-linux-x86static*? > > For that matter, what is statically linked in each TclKit versus > dynamically? 0-] Cheeky answer: a mess, you don't want to know ;) Longer answer... It's the way the code is linked against the runtime libraries (-lc, -lX11, etc). With fully static linkage, tclkit does not rely on *any* shared libraries. It's big, it only seems to be feasible on Linux, it has somw flaws, but it convenient because the same binary runs just about anywhere, With default linkage, -lc etc are linked dynamically. This means tclkit depends on the proper /lib/libc.so files etc. being present. Dynamic linkage is perfect, in theory. In practice, it's a minefield. The Tclkit 8.4.2 Linux binary uses tricks to link -lstdc++ statically, but -lc dynamically. I had to try about a dozen different Linux distro's before one came up which seems to generate dependencies that are resolvable on all common other systems. Which is why it's Mandrake 7.2 (not something newer). It's also how I learned to love VMware - which allows me to keep multiple distro's without losing my sanity... so far :) Actually, with pure C things are reasonably under control nowadays. It's the C++ stuff which messes it up. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 15:22:18 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h26LMHC15850 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 15:22:17 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 22:24:37 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <08AD1888-501A-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] ANNOUNCE: Tclkit Build Fest Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (As announced on comp.lang.tcl) There is *ONE* unfinished chapter left in the Tclkit/Starkit story. Tclkit is fully open source, and has also always been available as ready to use binaries for many platforms. With the generous help of several contributors, the Nov 2002 release was built for some 25 platforms, i.e. Windows, several Macintosh variants, and *many* Unix systems. That build set remains in place, at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.1/ For reference, the Sep 2002 conference build is also kept online, at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.0/ Now that the 8.4.2 release is out, I would like to try to end up with a truly monumental set of consistent binaries, over as many platforms as we can muster. The reason is that with Starkits, running pure-Tcl applications becomes trivial - for any platform for which there exists a Tclkit binary, that is. Such a binary collection will not suit everyone's need, but it's there for those who want it. * more tclkits == more widespread tcl/tk apps * more tcl/tk apps == more potential developers +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ | | | Official Tclkit Build Fest announcement - March 6 through 15, 2003 | | ================================================================== | | | | I, jcw, hereby offer to help you with all issues related to getting| | a Tclkit built for your platform. Yes YOU, dear reader - this is a| | plea (ploy!) to get you involved and help a Wheely Good Cause (TM).| | | | FWIW, this offer is valid starting today and ends March 15, 2003. | | Act now! While supplies last! You won't regret it! :) | | | +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ The process to build a Tclkit from scratch is very simple by now, and is based on a "genkit" script which wrapps all the autoconf and make calls needed to construct and integrate the different packages. On most platforms, when it's not full moon, that is. On those platforms where genkit still fails, feedback to help improve that Tcl script would be highly appreciated. The Tclkit 8.4.2 collection has been split into three categories: level 3 - community supplied, "as is" binaries level 2 - maintained/verified builds level 1 - currently Windows, Linux, and Solaris Everything is described at http://www.equi4.com/TclkitReleasePolicy - I will adjust and update these pages and lists, so everyone can track what is happening, and which builds are planned, in progress, and completed, respectively. The actual build is described at http://www.equi4.com/BuildingTclkit - the whole process takes 7 steps, there is a Makefile to reduce that to just 2: get the makefile and run it. If things don't work, i.e. if you're behind a proxy or firewall, or don't have a tclsh to kick-start things: this too is documented. In the past 2 days, *ten* 8.4.2 builds have been contributed: * BSD/OS 4.1 - by Steve Blinkhorn * FreeBSD 4.5 - by Mark Roseman * HP-UX 11 - by Tom Krehbiel * IRIX 6.5 (32 and 64 bit) - by Donal Fellows * Linux - by Jean-Claude Wippler * Macintosh OS X 10.2.3 - by Bryan Oakley * Solaris Sparc - by Steve Landers * Solaris x86 7 - by Steve Landers * Windows - by Jean-Claude Wippler FYI, a pre-final release of tclkit 8.4.2 has compiled "out of the box" with genkit on over 20 systems, which should give you some confidence that the build process is already quite mature. And of course, once you *have* a tclkit binary, it'll be there for a long time to build on and with... so this effort is really well spent. All 8.4.2 builds sent to me (preferably as the tar/gz file from "genkit C") will be added to the Tclkit binary download collection (except duplicates): http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.2/ All contributions will be acknowledged on the level 1/2/3 pages - if you have an interest in keeping builds up to date and veryifying that they really work as promised, then please consider "maintaining" them as level 2 builds. I would like to thank all contributors of past and present builds, as well as participants on the Starkit mailing list for helping bring Tclkit to what it is today. Allow me also to end with an especially big Thank You to Steve Landers and to Steve Blinkhorn, who both shared the drive and motivation and who were actually willing to travel - from AU (!) and UK - to meet up and help shape the future of what we believe to be just the beginning of a story which is still unfolding: scripting as the basis for lots and lots of software development. You can now add a big fat checkmark next to the term "deployment" :) Let the festivities begin! -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Mar 6 15:29:46 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h26LTkC16778 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 15:29:46 -0600 Received: (qmail 58635 invoked by uid 300); 6 Mar 2003 21:32:08 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 21:32:08 -0000 Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 15:32:08 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANNOUNCE: Tclkit Build Fest In-Reply-To: <08AD1888-501A-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ > | | > | Official Tclkit Build Fest announcement - March 6 through 15, 2003 | > | ================================================================== | > | | > | I, jcw, hereby offer to help you with all issues related to getting| > | a Tclkit built for your platform. Yes YOU, dear reader - this is a| > | plea (ploy!) to get you involved and help a Wheely Good Cause (TM).| > | | > | FWIW, this offer is valid starting today and ends March 15, 2003. | > | Act now! While supplies last! You won't regret it! :) | > | | > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ You are such a cheeseball. 0-] I mean that in the kindest way. 0-] D From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 6 18:36:59 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h270awC01960 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 18:36:59 -0600 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 01:39:19 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <3B77E75A-5035-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] bug in self-modifying starkit open mode Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well... nothing like a "final" release to bring out the bugs! The short story: if you have been deploying self-modifying starkits, read on. If not, ignore this email - your starkits and tclkits are not affected. Ok, here goes... (thx Philip Moore for reporting/investigating this) The bad news: starkits created with "sdx ... -writable" work with 8.4.1, but don't save changes in 8.4.2 :( The good news: it is a bug in the mk4vfs.tcl runtime, i.e. in VFS and can/will be fixed for all tclkit releases ASAP. No C recompiles are needed. The good news: to fix this, you can add the following line in the startup of a starkit, before writing and things will be ok for both 8.4.1 and 8.4.2: catch { vfs::attributes $starkit::topdir -state readwrite } The bad news: this needs a change in your starkits, it won't make existing self-writing starkits work when people switch from 8.4.1 to 8.4.2 :( The good news: there is a temporary workaround build of SDX which can be used to unwrap and re-wrap (-writable) again, which avoids the problem, it's at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/sdx-workaround.kit The good news: I will fix all Tclkit 8.4.2 builds and update them in the download area, i.e. pub/tk/8.4.2/. This will be ready tomorrow, I expect. The unfortunate consequence of all this - is that even with the three tclkits, i.e. 8.4.1, 8.4.2 (current: 200303), and 8.4.2 (imminent: 200303.001), there will be copies of "8.4.2 200303" out there which break existing self-modifying starkits. You may want to add a check of the form "$vfs::tclkit_version > 200303". The good news is that the number of such starkits is probably still very limited. There is no problem mounting a starkit read/write and making changes. There is *only* a problem with starkits created with "sdx ... -writable" which mount themselves, i.e. which are run or passed as main script to a tclkit. The technical reason for this is that SDX sets those starkits up to open in "-nocommit" mode, which was broken by recent (readonly/translucent/readwrite) changes in TclVFS and the mk4vfs handler. It should not have slipped through, but it did. My apologies. -jcw From headsup_popup@yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 20:42:10 2003 Received: from web14612.mail.yahoo.com (web14612.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.219]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h272gAC12443 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 20:42:10 -0600 Message-ID: <20030307024431.8368.qmail@web14612.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [203.32.142.5] by web14612.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 06 Mar 2003 18:44:31 PST Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 18:44:31 -0800 (PST) From: HeadsUp Support Subject: Re: [Starkit] bug in self-modifying starkit open mode To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <3B77E75A-5035-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: My "HeadsUp" Starkit on the sdarchive is a self-modifying starkit. I blame myself for this bug getting through as I didn't check it with the newer tclkit8.4.2 builds therefore I am sure the problem could have been detected earlier. Sorry I let the team down :-( Regards Jeff Smith --- Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Well... nothing like a "final" release to bring out > the bugs! > > The short story: if you have been deploying > self-modifying starkits, > read on. If not, ignore this email - your starkits > and tclkits are not > affected. > > Ok, here goes... (thx Philip Moore for > reporting/investigating this) > > The bad news: starkits created with "sdx ... > -writable" work with > 8.4.1, but don't save changes in 8.4.2 :( > > The good news: it is a bug in the mk4vfs.tcl > runtime, i.e. in VFS and > can/will be fixed for all tclkit releases ASAP. No > C recompiles are > needed. > > The good news: to fix this, you can add the > following line in the > startup of a starkit, before writing and things will > be ok for both > 8.4.1 and 8.4.2: > > catch { vfs::attributes $starkit::topdir -state > readwrite } > > The bad news: this needs a change in your starkits, > it won't make > existing self-writing starkits work when people > switch from 8.4.1 to > 8.4.2 :( > > The good news: there is a temporary workaround build > of SDX which can > be used to unwrap and re-wrap (-writable) again, > which avoids the > problem, it's at: > http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/sdx-workaround.kit > > The good news: I will fix all Tclkit 8.4.2 builds > and update them in > the download area, i.e. pub/tk/8.4.2/. This will be > ready tomorrow, I > expect. > > The unfortunate consequence of all this - is that > even with the three > tclkits, i.e. 8.4.1, 8.4.2 (current: 200303), and > 8.4.2 (imminent: > 200303.001), there will be copies of "8.4.2 200303" > out there which > break existing self-modifying starkits. You may > want to add a check of > the form "$vfs::tclkit_version > 200303". > > The good news is that the number of such starkits is > probably still > very limited. There is no problem mounting a > starkit read/write and > making changes. There is *only* a problem with > starkits created with > "sdx ... -writable" which mount themselves, i.e. > which are run or > passed as main script to a tclkit. The technical > reason for this is > that SDX sets those starkits up to open in > "-nocommit" mode, which was > broken by recent (readonly/translucent/readwrite) > changes in TclVFS and > the mk4vfs handler. > > It should not have slipped through, but it did. My > apologies. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Mar 7 02:25:51 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h278PoC10356 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 02:25:50 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id JAA10291 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:28:11 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA09886 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:28:04 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E685814.F7833EF4@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 09:28:04 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] C++ question References: <5663302A-5017-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > > With default linkage, -lc etc are linked dynamically. This means > tclkit depends on the proper /lib/libc.so files etc. being present. > > Dynamic linkage is perfect, in theory. In practice, it's a minefield. > The Tclkit 8.4.2 Linux binary uses tricks to link -lstdc++ statically, > but -lc dynamically. I had to try about a dozen different Linux > distro's before one came up which seems to generate dependencies that > are resolvable on all common other systems. Which is why it's Mandrake > 7.2 (not something newer). It's also how I learned to love VMware - > which allows me to keep multiple distro's without losing my sanity... > so far :) > > Actually, with pure C things are reasonably under control nowadays. > It's the C++ stuff which messes it up. > I have seen this type of statement a lot lately (mostly or exclusively in the context of Tcl :) as I am not in contact with the C++ community). What are the issues in general with respect to the deployment of C++ programs? The reason I ask is that my company is very seriously considering the use of the Qt library for redesigning the user-interfaces in one of our products (mind you: this is beyond my control or influence). Deployment right now, using C/Fortran libraries that linked statically if at all possible, has been simple enough (though with its own troubles). I would hate to see the relative simplicity go down the drain because of the use of C++ Regards, Arjen From mel@redolive.com Fri Mar 7 02:45:05 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h278j4C11889 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 02:45:04 -0600 Received: (qmail 22179 invoked by uid 511); 7 Mar 2003 09:44:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.9) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 09:44:55 -0000 Message-ID: <005c01c2e486$28ec2370$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 03:47:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0059_01C2E45C.3FFF3810" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Starkit question... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0059_01C2E45C.3FFF3810 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i am running on windows XP and have a starkit that includes an = executable and dependent libraries within it. what i like to do is after wrapping, = i like to run this executable from inside my wrapped application. the = QUESTION is how to access it ? i do something like: ->set pid [exec $starkit::topdir/lib/apple.exe] and it works fine when i run it unwrapped. once i wrap it and run it i = get the complaint that: ->couldn't execute "C:\Mel\apache\my.exe\lib\apple.exe": = no such file or directory while executing... can anyone help ? thanks ------=_NextPart_000_0059_01C2E45C.3FFF3810 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i am running on windows XP and have a starkit that includes an=20 executable
and dependent libraries within it. what i like to do is = after=20 wrapping, i
like to run this executable from inside my wrapped = application.=20 the QUESTION
is how to access it ?

i do something=20 like:
          &nbs= p;    =20 ->set pid [exec $starkit::topdir/lib/apple.exe]
and it works fine = when i=20 run it unwrapped. once i wrap it and run it i get
the complaint=20 that:

          =      =20 ->couldn't execute "C:\Mel\apache\my.exe\lib\apple.exe": no
such = file or=20 directory  while executing...

can anyone help=20 ?
thanks

------=_NextPart_000_0059_01C2E45C.3FFF3810-- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Fri Mar 7 02:58:47 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h278wkC12980 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 02:58:46 -0600 Received: (qmail 6429 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 09:01:06 -0000 Received: from ozzie.digital-smarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.3) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 07 Mar 2003 09:01:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 17:01:05 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit question... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: "Starkit" To: "Mel" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <005c01c2e486$28ec2370$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: <5469AFB2-507B-11D7-A23C-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h278wkC12980 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel, I think you've already been told this, but since it was 3:47am when you asked I figure you need a break ;-) > i do something like: >                 ->set pid [exec $starkit::topdir/lib/apple.exe] > and it works fine when i run it unwrapped. once i wrap it and run it i > get > the complaint that: > >                 ->couldn't execute > "C:\Mel\apache\my.exe\lib\apple.exe": no > such file or directory  while executing... That's because the operating system cannot see inside the Starkit's VFS, and the "exec" command asks the OS to load the exe. The solution is for you to explicitly copy the exe to the windows temp directory and exec it there. Steve -- Steve Landers Scripting Design Studio Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From jcw@equi4.com Fri Mar 7 03:03:00 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2792xC13446 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 03:02:59 -0600 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:05:19 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit question... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <005c01c2e486$28ec2370$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > can anyone help ? To quote Jeff Hobbs, "GTFG": http://www.google.com/search?q=exec+inside+starkit&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Mar 7 04:22:16 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27AMFC19378 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:22:15 -0600 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:24:36 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] C++ question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E685814.F7833EF4@wldelft.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen Markus wrote: >> Actually, with pure C things are reasonably under control nowadays. >> It's the C++ stuff which messes it up. >> > > I have seen this type of statement a lot lately (mostly or exclusively > in the context of Tcl :) as I am not in contact with the C++ > community). > > What are the issues in general with respect to the deployment of C++ > programs? > > The reason I ask is that my company is very seriously considering the > use of the Qt library for redesigning the user-interfaces in one of > our products (mind you: this is beyond my control or influence). > Deployment right now, using C/Fortran libraries that linked statically > if at all possible, has been simple enough (though with its own > troubles). I would hate to see the relative simplicity go down the > drain because of the use of C++ Well - if it's beyond your control, then that's basically it... Anyway, I'll bite - and reply with some personal opinions (plenty of those around here). Warning: it will get a bit long and pedantic... unfortunately. My apologies for hijacking the starkit mailing list for this topic. I spent 10 years with C, then another 10 with C++ (starting with "cfront": yes, I am *that* old...). Saw exceptions come, and templates, and RTTI, and STL. Wrote quite a bit with MFC, the Win32 GUI of back then. C++ is brilliant. Constructors/destructors (combined with exceptions, a tough technical challenge) are astonishingly effective at simplifying things and making code robust. Refcounting can be made automatic with smart pointers, and so can thread-locking. All the "forgot to decref/unlock" issues vanish. I jumped onto C++ the moment it came out, because it had such a great effect on quality. Especially over longer periods of time, when you come back and change something without having to worry about nasty side-effects (OO plays a part in that). STL is brilliant. A way to write generic algorithms, which through templates generalize themselves at compile time to produce efficient code. It requires some real good programmers to create such a core, but the results are impressive. Unfortunately, C++ is also horrible. People can create monstrosities (class forests?), and immensely bloated code in no time. Performance is truly awful if you don't know what you're doing. Maintainability of the code is a nightmare if things just get layered and layered and layered. I have been called in to retool (salvage, actually) large C++ projects several times, and always bring scissors and an axe with me. Think 50..80% *deleted*. Performance jumps up, modularity comes back, extensibility is an option again. C++ in the wrong hands is dramatically worse than C, I assure you. I was still learning how to do better after 10 years of intense C++ coding. The language is relatively easy on the surface, but using it right is another story. Metakit was coded in C++ and the core rewritten from scratch *several* times (I'm not making this up). It's not perfect, but it's small and efficient. It is extremely careful about using virtual members (they are fundamental, but only in a few spots), and I dropped exceptions, templates, and RTTI. Everything was re-coded, with less overhead. The killer is deployment. C++ has evolved for so long - if not the language, i.e. templates, RTTI, exception handling, then the runtime and STL. Oh btw, STL is mostly source - templates cannot be compiled very far before use. Adopt it and watch your build performance go down the drain big time. And stay out of syntax errors, please - debugging an error message from STL (what a concept!) is a nightmare. And when it works: debugging unexpected low performance from some STL is equally challenging. But as I said, the killer is deployment. The runtimes are big and evolving. Try creating a binary (a feat in itself across >3 compilers), and then run it on another machine. The one surprising exception is Windows - MSVC has been C *and* C++ from the start, and the runtime has matured quickly. It helps that Win32 has 90% of the market, and that MFC made C++ a common choice - so problems *had* to be solved early on. Right now, most problems of building Tclkit, which links Metakit statically, come from the C++ side. Some are my fault - I made some awkward compromises (64-bit machines and long-long's). But the real decisive factor for me is that C++ has it fundamentally backwards. Once you "get" the scripting perspective that is. Which is that there are large "business-logic" and "glue" sections representing the bulk of any app, and small but critical (heh!) parts which require top performance. The 80/20 rule, etc. I dare say it out loud here - people without scripting language experience have no clue. They don't see that one needs different levels of expressiveness for different parts of an application. Things like automatic refcounting and exceptions are so totally natural in scripting, we don't even think about allocating, or resizing, or cleaning up string buffers. Templates make no sense when data and/or variables are dynamically typed, and when string-like macro expansion does at least as much. All of C++ is redundant, when using a scripting language. RTTI? Hah! What about performance? Ah yes, that again. Performance lives in 10% of the code. So should we extend our C, eh C++, language so it scales to the other 90%? Bzzzzt. Don't be silly. We pick the language that makes *us* most productive for 90%. And we pick another language that makes the computer most efficient in where *it* spends 90%. With a little of bit of thought, we end up with a two-level extension, plug-in, runtime-linkage, call-it-whatever-you-like approach. Better still, that separation can be refined and adjusted along the way - as insight is gained. When scripting is an option, C++ makes no sense. With all due respect, the QT, KDE, gstreamer, Mozilla, any-big-C++-centric-project developers haven't evolved far enough yet. You can replace "C++" by "Java" in the above. It has the same focus of taking a low-level language to all corners of application development and solves nothing over C++, not even portability. It just adds the need to install/update/maintain a CDROM full of software. OO-ness is not the same as high-level. Not even close. Ok, I'll stop - I've no doubt painted myself into a corner by now. But I can assure you - it's one of the prettiest corners you can imagine. -jcw PS. A critique of C++ with a completely different (non-scripting) perspective, dated 1996, can be found at http://www.elj.com/cppcv3/ From jahbini@lava.net Fri Mar 7 04:30:55 2003 Received: from malasada.lava.net (IDENT:{uqbFu4jAARG1Hx+PAAzIQproDDW8DQ74}@malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27AUsC20044 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:30:54 -0600 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com [64.65.110.34]) by malasada.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2213B17A017 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 00:33:13 -1000 (HST) Message-ID: <3E687568.50AC70F9@lava.net> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 00:33:13 -1000 From: Jim Hinds X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.18-6mdk i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] genkit script mod for creating Itk and Iwidgets in a tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: not as painful to work into the latest genkit as I had feared. Works for Linux. Put the Iwidgets directory just below the src directory. There is no tar source (that I know of). I got the latest iwidgets from http://incrtcl.sourceforge.net/iwidgets/distribution.html I've been using Iwidgets in a tclkit that I home brewed about 6 months ago. I have to rebuild since there seems to be a bug in the Itcl name scoping mechanism when tracing a (non-existant) variable, so I need a debug version. This time the creation of the new tclkit was much smoother: the genkit logic has much improved: much thanks, Jean-Claude. Jim Hinds ========================================================================================== #!/bin/sh # # Generate TclKit - run "tclsh genkit", or see info at end of this script. # # Written by Jean-Claude Wippler, as part of Tclkit. # March 2003 - placed in the public domain by the author. # # For latest version of this tool see # $Id: genkit,v 1.50 2003/03/06 23:30:41 wcvs Exp $ # \ exec "install/`hostname`/bin/tclsh8.4" "$0" ${1+"$@"} # This code is dual-mode, it can be run as tcl or as sh script, which # is need to bootstrap this stuff. Make sure Tcl is not too old, though. package require Tcl 8.1 # This is the base url to fetch source tars from if not already present: set origurl http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk # All platform differences are collected below for easy reference. # # The idea is quite straightforward: # - the X array is set up so "$X(anything)" defaults to "anything" # - the Z array is set up so "$X(anything)" defaults to "" # - i.e. "$X(foo)" defaults to "foo" and "$Z(foo)" defaults to "" # - then for each platform, we can add overrides to alter defaults # # NOTE that if the file "genkit.local" exists, it will be sourced before # actual processing begins - this allows adding more elaborate tweaks. array set X {} array set Z {} switch -glob $tcl_platform(os) { AIX { array set Z {tclsuff "-Wl,-bshared -lcrypt" tksuff -lIM} array set X {gcc xlC g++ xlC} } BSD/OS { array set X {make gmake} } HP-UX { array set X {gcc cc g++ aCC} } NetBSD { array set X {. ""} } OpenBSD { array set Z {vso .1.0} array set X {. ""} } OSF1 { array set X {gcc cc g++ cxx} } #SunOS { array set X {g++ gcc}; set env(CC) gcc } SunOS { array set X {}; set env(CC) gcc } Windows* { array set Z {s s .exe .exe} array set X {. "" unix win tclsh8.4 tclsh84s.exe} } default { array set X {} } } # make $X(anything) default to the value "anything" proc xdefval {a e op} { if {![info exists ::X($e)]} { set ::X($e) $e } } trace var X r xdefval # make $Z(anything) default to the empty string proc zdefval {a e op} { if {![info exists ::Z($e)]} { set ::Z($e) "" } } trace var Z r zdefval # recursive directory listing, a bit like "ls -lR" proc listall {dirs} { while {[llength $dirs] > 0} { set dir [lindex $dirs 0] set dirs [lrange $dirs 1 end] puts "\n$dir:" set entries [glob -nocomplain [file join $dir *]] #if {[llength $entries] > 0} { puts "" } foreach path [lsort $entries] { if {[file isdir $path]} { set len " " set tim " dir" set suf "/" lappend dirs $path } else { set len [format %9d [file size $path]] set tim [clock format [file mtime $path] -format {%y/%m/%d %H:%M}] set suf "" } puts " $len $tim [file tail $path]$suf" } } puts "" } # copy one file and adjust modification to same as original proc dupfile {from to} { set mod [file mtime $from] if {![file exists $to] || $mod != [file mtime $to]} { puts "file copy -force $from $to" file copy -force $from $to file mtime $to $mod } } # recursively copy subdirs and files, if modification times differ proc sync {from to} { foreach path [glob -nocomplain [file join $from *]] { set tail [file tail $path] set dest [file join $to $tail] if {[file isdir $path]} { file mkdir $dest sync $path $dest } else { dupfile $path $dest } } } # return file contents as a string proc readfile {name {binary 0}} { set fd [open $name] if {$binary} { fconfigure $fd -translation binary -encoding binary } set contents [read $fd] close $fd return $contents } # calculate a simple 4-digit sum of a string proc simplesum {str} { set s 0 foreach x [split $str ""] { binary scan $x c v set s [expr {7*$s+$v}] } return [format %04d [expr {abs($s) % 9000 + 1000}]] } # calculate an md5 checksum for a file proc md5sum {name} { return [lindex [exec md5sum -b $name] 0] } # create a tag for a file and delete it proc tagfile {name} { if {[catch { md5sum $name } tag]} { set tag "" } else { lappend tag [file size $name] [file mtime $name] } file delete name return [linsert $tag 0 $name] } # compare tag, if same then restore its modification time proc untagfile {tag} { foreach {nm md sz mtime} $tag break if {[file exists $nm] && [file size $nm] == $sz && [md5sum $nm] == $md} { file mtime $nm $mtime } } # convert seconds to readable date/time format proc timestamp {{now ""} {sep -}} { if {$now == ""} { set now [clock seconds] } return [clock format $now -format "%Y/%m/%d$sep%H:%M:%S"] } # convert possibly globbed path specifier to real name, if unique proc unglob {path} { set f [glob -nocomplain $path] if {[llength $f] == 1} { set path [lindex $f 0] } return $path } # execute external command proc run {args} { puts -nonewline [format { %-30.30s... } $args] flush stdout puts $::F "\nRUN: $args\n" flush $::F set err [catch { eval exec $args >>& $::P/out/$::H/$::target } msg] seek $::F 0 end if {$err == 0} { puts "ok" } else { puts "FAILED:" puts "-[string repeat {=-} 39]\n$args\n-[string repeat {#-} 39]" return -code error $msg } } # run a configure script proc config {dir args} { eval [list run sh [file join ../../../src $dir configure] \ --prefix=$::P/noarch --exec-prefix=$::I] $args } # parse and load tcl/tk config files into global vars proc loadconf {name} { set vars {} foreach x {AR DBGX LDFLAGS LIBS LIB_RUNTIME_DIR NODOT_VERSION VERSION} { global $x set $x "" } set fd [open $name] while {[gets $fd line] >= 0} { if {[regexp {^(\w+)=$} $line - name]} { set value "" } elseif {![regexp {^(\w+)='(.*)'$} $line - name value]} { continue } global $name set $name [subst $value] lappend vars $name } close $fd return $vars } # summarize all available results proc summarize {aref {modules {kitsh itcldyn tkdyn kit builds}}} { upvar $aref summary array set targets {} array set platforms {} foreach file [glob -nocomplain out/*/*] { set platform [lindex [file split $file] 1] set platforms($platform) 1 set target [lindex [file split $file] 2] set targets($target) 1 set log [readfile $file] switch -regexp $log { "\nERROR:" { set status ERR } "\nEND\." { set status (+) } default { set status BAD } } set ${target}($platform) $status array set info:$platform {} if {$target == "tcl"} { foreach line [split $log \n] { if {[regexp {^tcl_platform\((\w+)\)\s+= (.*)} $line - key value]} { set info:${platform}($key) $value } } } } array set files {} foreach {target mask} { kit kit{,.exe} kitsh kitsh{,.exe} mkcpp lib/libmk4.{so,sl,dylib,dll} mktcl lib/libmk4tcl.{so,sl,dylib,dll} itcldyn lib/tcl3.3/libitcl3{,.}3.{so,so.1.0,sl,dylib,dll} itkdyn lib/itk3.3/libitk3{,.}3.{so,so.1.0,sl,dylib,dll} tkdyn lib/libtk8{,.}4.{so,so.1.0,sl,dylib,dll} tcl bin/tclsh8{,.}4{,s.exe} } { array set $target {} foreach file [glob -nocomplain install/*/$mask] { set platform [lindex [file split $file] 1] set mtime [timestamp [file mtime $file]] lappend ${target}($platform) $mtime [file size $file]b lappend files($platform) $target } } foreach target [lsort [array names targets]] { foreach {k v} [array get $target] { set info:${k}($target) $v } } set platlist {} array set summary {} foreach platform [lsort [array names platforms]] { if {[info exists info:${platform}(machine)] > 0} { lappend platlist $platform set summary($platform,id) [simplesum $platform] foreach k "machine os osVersion wordSize byteOrder $modules" { set x {} if {[info exists info:${platform}($k)]} { set x [set info:${platform}($k)] switch $k { byteOrder { regsub {Endian} $x {} x } } regsub {^\(\+\)} $x {OK} x regsub {^OK } $x {} x if {$k != "builds"} { set x [lindex $x 0] } if {[regsub {^200\d/(\d\d/\d\d)-.*$} $x {\1} x]} { switch $k kitsh - itcldyn - itkdyn - tkdyn - kit { set v [string map \ {kitsh sh tkdyn tdyn itcldyn itkdyn idyn kit full} $k] lappend info:${platform}(builds) $v } } } set summary($platform,$k) $x } } } return $platlist } # Copy a URL to a file and print meta-data # (this sample code was adapted from the Tcl manual page) proc origfetch {file} { package require http puts -nonewline " fetching $file ... " flush stdout set fd [open $file w] set t [http::geturl $::origurl/$file -channel $fd -blocksize 4096] close $fd scan [http::code $t] {HTTP/%f %d} ver ncode puts [http::status $t] http::cleanup $t if {$ncode != 200 || [file size $file] == 0} { file delete $file } } namespace eval commands { # Step 1: acquire and unpack all the necessary sources # The goal is to end up with a src/ dir and tcl/tk/etc dirs in it proc A {args} { global origurl file mkdir src set packages $args if {[llength $packages] == 0} { set packages {tcl tk itcl mk vfs kit zlib} } foreach pkg $packages { if {[file exists src/$pkg]} { continue } set cvs "cvs/$pkg" if {[file isdir $cvs]} { puts " symlinking to $cvs" cd src exec ln -s ../$cvs $pkg cd .. continue } set tar "tars/$pkg.tar.gz" if {![file isfile $tar]} { file mkdir tars origfetch $tar } if {[file isfile $tar]} { puts " unpacking $tar" cd src exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf - cd .. continue } puts stderr "$pkg: not found" } } # Step 2: build all the components of TclKit proc B {args} { global target F H P B I S X Z if {[llength $args] == 0} { set args {zlib vfs mk kitsh itcldyn itkdyn iwidgets tkdyn} } set H [exec hostname] set P [pwd] set B $P/build/$H set I $P/install/$H set S $P/src foreach target $args { puts " $target:" file mkdir out/$H set F [open $P/out/$H/$target w] fconfigure $F -buffering line if {[catch { file mkdir $B/$target cd $B/$target switch $target { tcl { config tcl/$X(unix) --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries libraries file mkdir $I run $X(make) install-binaries install-libraries # results have been installed so tclsh can be used run $I/bin/$X(tclsh8.4) << "parray tcl_platform" } tk { config tk/$X(unix) --with-tcl=$B/tcl --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries } tkdyn { config tk/unix --with-tcl=$B/tcl #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries file mkdir $I run $X(make) install-binaries # don't keep the installed wish, just the shared lib file delete $I/bin/wish8.4 # results have been installed so shared lib can be packaged later } itcl { config itcl/itcl --with-tcl=$B/tcl --disable-shared run $X(make) binaries } itcldyn { config itcl/itcl --with-tcl=$B/tcl run $X(make) binaries file mkdir $I run $X(make) install-binaries } itkdyn { sync $S/itcl/itcl/generic $B/itcldyn/generic config itcl/itk --with-tcl=$B/tcl --with-itcl=$B/itcldyn run $X(make) binaries libraries file mkdir $I run $X(make) install-binaries install-libraries } iwidgets { #the iwidgets config won't run without this dummy file # run touch $S/itcl/config/mkinstalldirs config iwidgets --with-tcl=$B/tcl --with-tk=$B/tk --with-itcl=$S/itcl file mkdir $I/lib/iwidgets/scripts sync $S/iwidgets/generic $I/lib/iwidgets/scripts file copy -force $B/iwidgets/iwidgets.tcl $B/iwidgets/pkgIndex.tcl $I/lib/iwidgets } mk { config mk/unix --with-tcl=$S/tcl/generic --disable-shared run $X(make) libmk4tcl.la } vfs { config vfs --with-tcl=$B/tcl --disable-shared run $X(make) binaries } zlib { # copy all files to build area, it doesn't build in another spot sync $S/zlib . config [pwd] run $X(make) libz.a } kitsh - kit { # copy all files to build area, it doesn't build in another spot sync $S/kit . eval global [loadconf $B/tcl/tclConfig.sh] # work around a quoting bug when 64-bit ints are supported regsub {long long} $TCL_DEFS {long\ long} TCL_DEFS set D [list -DNDEBUG -DTCL_LOCAL_APPINIT=TclKit_AppInit] set O [list -I. -I$S/tcl/generic -I$S/mk/include -I$S/zlib] set L [list ../tcl/libtcl8$X(.)4$Z(s).a ../vfs/libvfs1$X(.)2.a \ ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a] switch $target { kitsh { eval lappend L $TCL_LIB_SPEC $TCL_LIBS $Z(tclsuff) } kit { eval global [loadconf $B/tk/tkConfig.sh] lappend D -DKIT_INCLUDES_TK eval lappend O -I$S/tk/generic $TK_XINCLUDES eval lappend L $TK_BUILD_LIB_SPEC $TK_LIBS $Z(tksuff) } } append target $Z(.exe) eval run $X(gcc) -c $O $D $TCL_DEFS $TCL_CFLAGS_OPTIMIZE \ [glob src/*.c] [list $S/tcl/unix/tclAppInit.c] eval run $X(g++) -o $target [glob *.o] $L run strip $target file mkdir $I file delete $I/$target file copy $target $I run ls -l $I } } puts $F "\nEND." } err]} { puts " ERROR: $err" puts $F "\nERROR: $::errorInfo" } close $F cd $P } puts " Done." } # Step 3: collect results proc C {} { set H [exec hostname] exec tar cf - install/$H out/$H | gzip >result-$H.tar.gz } # Step 4: create a dummy tclkit and try it proc D {} { global X Z set H [exec hostname] set I install/$H set E [info sharedlibext] set R tars/runtime.kit if {![file exists $R]} { origfetch $R } exec cat $I/kitsh $R >dummy-$H file attributes dummy-$H -permissions +x set script [string map [list @H $H @I $I @E $E$Z(vso) @. $X(.)] { puts " info loaded = [info loaded]" puts " tclkit_version = $vfs::tclkit_version" parray tcl_platform load @I/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3@.3@E puts " package Itcl = [package require Itcl]" if {[info exists env(DISPLAY)] && $env(DISPLAY) ne ""} { load @I/lib/libtk8@.4@E puts " package Tk = [package require Tk]" pack [label .l -text " @H says HELLO! "] -padx 50 -pady 50 } else { puts " *** DISPLAY has not been defined, skipping Tk test ***" } after 3000 destroy . puts " running [file tail [info nameofexe]]" }] exec ./dummy-$H <<$script >@stdout 2>@stderr } # Step 5: extended version includes incrtcl and tk proc E {} { global X Z set H [exec hostname] set I install/$H set E [info sharedlibext] set R tars/runtime.kit if {![file exists $R]} { origfetch $R } file copy -force $I/kitsh tclkit-$H file attributes tclkit-$H -permissions +x # needed for OpenBSD, which leaves them as 0555 file attributes $I/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3$X(.)3$E$Z(vso) -permissions +w file attributes $I/lib/itk3.3/libitk3$X(.)3$E$Z(vso) -permissions +w file attributes $I/lib/libtk8$X(.)4$E$Z(vso) -permissions +w # MacOS X will barf when trying to strip shared libs catch { exec strip $I/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3$X(.)3$E$Z(vso) } catch { exec strip $I/lib/itk3.3/libitk3$X(.)3$E$Z(vso) } catch { exec strip $I/lib/libtk8$X(.)4$E$Z(vso) } # the following approach makes sure the result is optimally packed set script [string map [list @H $H @I $I @E $E @R $R @. $X(.) @v $Z(vso)] { set db [vfs::mk4::Mount @R @R -readonly] vfs::attributes @R -state translucent file copy @I/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3@.3@E@v @R/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3@E file mkdir @R/lib/itk3.3 file mkdir @R/lib/iwidgets/scripts file copy @I/lib/itk3.3/libitk3@.3@E@v @R/lib/itk3.3/libitk3.3@E file copy @I/lib/itk3.3/pkgIndex.tcl @R/lib/itk3.3/pkgIndex.tcl file copy @I/lib/itk3.3/itk.tcl @R/lib/itk3.3/itk.tcl file copy @I/lib/libtk8@.4@E@v @R/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4@E eval file copy [glob @I/lib/iwidgets/*.*] @R/lib/iwidgets eval file copy [glob @I/lib/iwidgets/scripts/*] @R/lib/iwidgets/scripts set fd [open tclkit-@H a] mk::file save $db $fd close $fd vfs::unmount @R }] # need to run from dummy, because VFS needs Mk4tcl exec ./dummy-$H <<$script puts " tclkit-$H: [file size dummy-$H] -> [file size tclkit-$H]" } # Private use: freeze build results for packaging proc F {} { file mkdir parts foreach pf [summarize ia] { if {$ia($pf,builds) == ""} continue set info(seq) [simplesum $pf] set info(name) [string tolower $ia($pf,os)-$ia($pf,machine)] regsub -all {[^a-z0-9-]} $info(name) {} info(name) set iprefix install/$pf set oprefix parts/$info(name).$info(seq) set lib $iprefix/lib set sfx ".{so,so.1.0,sl,dylib,dll}" set tag [tagfile $oprefix,in] foreach build $ia($pf,builds) { switch $build { sh { dupfile $iprefix/kitsh $oprefix,sh } idyn { dupfile [unglob $lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3{,.}3$sfx] $oprefix,it } tdyn { dupfile [unglob $lib/libtk8{,.}4$sfx] $oprefix,tk } full { dupfile $iprefix/kit $oprefix,ui } } } foreach x [glob -nocomplain $oprefix,*] { regsub {.*,} $x {} k if {$k != "in"} { set info($k) [list [file mtime $x] [md5sum $x] [file size $x]] file attributes $x -permissions 0755 } } foreach x [array names ia $pf,*] { set k [lindex [split $x ,] 1] switch $k kit - kitsh - idyn - tdyn continue set info($k) $ia($x) } foreach x {tcl tk} { if {[file exists $iprefix/lib/${x}Config.sh]} { foreach y [loadconf $iprefix/lib/${x}Config.sh] { set info($y) [string trim [set ::$y]] } } } set fd [open $oprefix,in w] foreach x [lsort [array names info]] { puts $fd [list $x $info($x)] } close $fd untagfile $tag unset info } } # Private use: generate all builds proc G {} { file mkdir head foreach x [glob -nocomplain parts/*,in] { regexp {.*/(.*-.*)\.(\d+),in} $x - pf seq regsub {,in} $x {} prefix array set info [readfile $x] set mtime [file mtime $x] if {[info exist info(sh)]} { if {[info exist info(tk)]} { set f head/$pf.$seq-dyn.bin set g tk exec cat $prefix,sh dist/newer/runtime-$g.kit > $f vfs::mk4::Mount $f kit -nocommit dupfile $prefix,tk kit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so vfs::unmount kit } else { set f head/$pf.$seq-sh.bin set g sh exec cat $prefix,sh dist/newer/runtime-$g.kit > $f } if {$mtime < [file mtime dist/newer/runtime-$g.kit]} { set mtime [file mtime dist/newer/runtime-$g.kit] } file mtime $f $mtime file attributes $f -permissions 0755 } if {[info exist info(ui)]} { set f head/$pf.$seq.bin exec cat $prefix,ui dist/newer/runtime.kit > $f file attributes $f -permissions 0755 if {$mtime < [file mtime dist/newer/runtime.kit]} { set mtime [file mtime dist/newer/runtime.kit] } file mtime $f $mtime } unset info } } # List the contents of a starkit proc L {doc} { set tail [file tail $doc] # no changes requested, just list full contents vfs::mk4::Mount $doc $tail -readonly listall $tail vfs::unmount $tail } # Merge parts with runtime VFS proc M {path {ext so}} { regexp {^parts/(.*)\.(\d\d\d\d),in$} $path - name id file copy -force parts/$name.$id,sh head/$name.$id set script [string map [list @N $name @I $id @E $ext] { set db [vfs::mk4::Mount runtime.kit runtime -readonly] catch { vfs::attributes runtime -state translucent } file copy parts/@N.@I,it runtime/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.@E file copy parts/@N.@I,tk runtime/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.@E set fd [open head/@N.@I a] mk::file save $db $fd close $fd vfs::unmount runtime puts "Output in: head/@N.@I" }] exec tclkit <<$script >@stdout 2>@stderr } # Packager, merges one or more files/dirs into a starkit proc P {exe args} { set tail [file tail $exe] if {[llength $args] < 1} { puts "usage: $::argv0 P exefile dir ?...?" exit 1 } vfs::mk4::Mount $exe $exe -nocommit foreach addin $args { if {[file isdir $addin]} { sync $addin $exe } else { vfs::mk4::Mount $addin $addin -readonly sync $addin $exe vfs::unmount $addin } } vfs::unmount $exe } # Produce a build status summary as a concise HTML table proc S {{outfile status.html}} { set modules {tcl mk vfs kitsh itcldyn tkdyn kit builds} set fd [open $outfile w] puts $fd "TclKit Build Status" puts $fd "

TclKit build status as of [timestamp]

" puts $fd "" set tags "os machine version word endian $modules id host" puts $fd "" foreach pf [summarize info $modules] { set all($info($pf,os),$info($pf,machine),$info($pf,osVersion),$pf) $pf } foreach x [lsort -dictionary [array names all]] { set pf $all($x) set data {} foreach k "os machine osVersion wordSize byteOrder $modules id" { set x $info($pf,$k) set x [string range $x 0 19] regsub -all { } $x {\ } x regsub {^ERR} $x {ERR} x lappend data $x } lappend data [lindex [split $pf .] 0] puts $fd "" } puts $fd "
[join $tags {}]
[join $data {}]
" close $fd } # Copy the VFS tail (i.e. all MK data) to a separate file # The result is like perfect snow... freshly packed :) proc T {infile outfile} { mk::file open db $infile -readonly set fd [open $outfile w] mk::file save db $fd close $fd mk::file close db puts [exec ls -lG $outfile] } } set cmd [lindex $argv 0] set argv [lrange $argv 1 end] switch -- $cmd G - L - P { # these use VFS, make sure it's available set v [package require mk4vfs] # fix bug in two mk4vfs revs (needed when "mkfile" and "local" differ) switch $v 1.0 - 1.1 { proc vfs::mk4::Mount {mkfile local args} { set db [eval [list ::mk4vfs::_mount $local $mkfile] $args] ::vfs::filesystem mount $local [list ::vfs::mk4::handler $db] ::vfs::RegisterMount $local [list ::vfs::mk4::Unmount $db] return $db } proc mk4vfs::mount {local mkfile args} { uplevel [list ::vfs::mk4::Mount $mkfile $local] $args } } } if {[file exists genkit.local]} { source genkit.local } if {[namespace eval commands [list info procs $cmd]] == ""} { puts "Generate TclKit - by Jean-Claude Wippler (a tool to help build TclKit runtime releases) Usage: $::argv0 cmd ?args...? Cmd: A = Step 1: acquire source packages B = Step 2: build binaries C = Step 3: collect results D = Step 4: create a dummy tclkit and try it E = Step 5: extended version includes incrtcl and tk A few more commands, not for general use: F = Freeze build results for packaging G = Generate tclkit* executables L = List contents of a VFS file M = Merge parts with runtime VFS P = Merge files and dirs into one package S = Generate an HTML build summary T = Extract the VFS tail to a separate file " exit } if {[catch { namespace eval commands [concat $cmd $argv] } msg]} { puts stderr $msg exit 1 } # vim: ft=tcl From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Mar 7 04:31:05 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27AV4C20064 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:31:04 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id LAA05913 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:33:26 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA05032 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:33:12 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E687568.BB9E15CB@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 11:33:12 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] C++ question References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Anyway, I'll bite - and reply with some personal opinions (plenty of > those around here). Warning: it will get a bit long and pedantic... > unfortunately. My apologies for hijacking the starkit mailing list for > this topic. > Well, I was first - so, I should apologize :) Now, I am going to print your lengthy reply and read it with due attention. Regards, Arjen From mel@redolive.com Fri Mar 7 04:53:16 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27ArFC21715 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:53:15 -0600 Received: (qmail 22539 invoked by uid 511); 7 Mar 2003 11:53:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.9) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 11:53:07 -0000 Message-ID: <00b201c2e498$11a40900$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 05:55:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C2E46E.28B71DA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] library load problems... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C2E46E.28B71DA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable running unwarapped version works fine for me. but once i copy the dll = from my inside starkit pack to tmp i end up with the following errors on = WInDoze XP and the latest tclkit my tcl code: ------------------------------------------------- file copy -force [file join $starkit::topdir lib optcl optcl.dll] = $::env(TEMP) load [file join $::env(TEMP) optcl.dll] error code ------------------------------------------------- couldn't load library "c:/tmp/optcl.dll": invalid argument while executing "load [file join $::env(TEMP) optcl.dll]" (file "my.kit/main.tcl" line 22) invoked from within "source my.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" PS:- does tcl "file copy" command have other attrubutes for copying = binaries etc ? Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C2E46E.28B71DA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
running unwarapped version works fine = for me. but=20 once i copy the dll from my inside starkit pack to tmp i end up with the = following errors on WInDoze XP and the latest tclkit
 
my tcl code:
-------------------------------------------------
file copy -force [file join = $starkit::topdir lib=20 optcl optcl.dll] $::env(TEMP)
load [file join $::env(TEMP)=20 optcl.dll]
 
error code
-------------------------------------------------
couldn't load library = "c:/tmp/optcl.dll": invalid=20 argument
    while executing
"load [file join = $::env(TEMP)=20 optcl.dll]"
    (file "my.kit/main.tcl" line=20 22)
    invoked from within
"source=20 my.kit/main.tcl"
    ("uplevel" body line=20 1)
    invoked from within
"uplevel [list source = [file join=20 $self main.tcl]]"
 
 
PS:- does tcl "file copy" = command have other=20 attrubutes for copying binaries etc ?
 
Yours, Mel
------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C2E46E.28B71DA0-- From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Fri Mar 7 07:42:46 2003 Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27DgjC00686 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:42:45 -0600 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0HBD00401SUYO7@houston.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:44:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0HBD00MHRSUSMB@houston.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 07 Mar 2003 08:44:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id h27Diqr07238 for ; Fri, 07 Mar 2003 08:44:52 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 08:44:52 -0500 (EST) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Subject: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I downloaded tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz to my: SunOS argon.jhuapl.edu 5.9 Generic_112233-01 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-5_10 machine. I gunzipped it and got 'tclkit-solaris-sparc'. I renamed it 'tclkit' and did a 'chmod 755 tclkit'. I ran ./tclkit and came up with the tclkit '%' prompt and was running tclsh. But could not load Tk: % package require Tk couldn't load library "/home/u8/jhz/downloads/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory % Any ideas? I did some tclkit stuff months ago, and this worked, I think, so maybe I'm rusty... ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From lvirden@cas.org Fri Mar 7 08:23:27 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27ENQC04883 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:23:26 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h27EPeXH016293 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:25:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h27EPff25615; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:25:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:25:41 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030307092541.AAB25587@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] TclKit 8.4.2 question In-Reply-To: <5663302A-5017-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 6 Mar 2003 22:05:19 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > The Tclkit 8.4.2 Linux binary uses tricks to link -lstdc++ statically, > but -lc dynamically. If anyone works out the tricks to use with g++ on SPARC Solaris for libstdc++, I'd love to learn them. That library is the one pain I have in building tclkits. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From nicolasb@maich.gr Fri Mar 7 08:34:56 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27EYtC06160 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:34:55 -0600 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Fri Mar 07 17:10:49 2003 +0200 Message-ID: <3E68B01D.8040601@maich.gr> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 16:43:41 +0200 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] C++ question References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: ----Snip---- > to the other 90%? Bzzzzt. Don't be silly. We pick the language that > makes *us* most productive for 90%. And we pick another language that > makes the computer most efficient in where *it* spends 90%. With a > little of bit of thought, we end up with a two-level extension, plug-in, > runtime-linkage, call-it-whatever-you-like approach. Better still, that > separation can be refined and adjusted along the way - as insight is > gained. Hi, I was a fortunate one, when JC drove this insight home 'bout ~4-5 years ago, when I commented to him that I should be learning a "real" language instaed of this "piddley" little tcl/tk language that I was using. Through his sage words, I've since then been able to keep 3 programmers employed full time through competetive grants, yielding timely and effective project deliverables with the above 90/10 rule and approach. I express my gratitude to JC, AS and the Tcl/Tk community for all of their help, products and support through the years. I surf in your wake... sincerely, nicolas boretos From matt@sensus.org Fri Mar 7 08:35:09 2003 Received: from ficus.frogspace.net ([64.6.237.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27EZ9C06207 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:35:09 -0600 Received: from ool-435070ee.dyn.optonline.net ([67.80.112.238] helo=sensus.org) by ficus.frogspace.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #5) id 18rIyW-0000HH-00; Fri, 07 Mar 2003 06:37:28 -0800 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:37:52 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] library load problems... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Matt Newman , "Starkit" To: "Mel" From: Matt Newman In-Reply-To: <00b201c2e498$11a40900$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: <605928C2-50AA-11D7-AE33-000393D6059C@sensus.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h27EZ9C06207 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The "invalid arg" is almost certainly a missing dependent library. You would get this if you did not compile with tclstub*.lib (& -DUSE_TCL_STUBS) Or if you have specified any other non-standard libraries in the compile/link phase of optcl.dll Placing these in the same directory as the optcl.dll should address this issue on windows. Matt Newman On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 05:55 AM, Mel wrote: > running unwarapped version works fine for me. but once i copy the dll > from my inside starkit pack to tmp i end up with the following errors > on WInDoze XP and the latest tclkit >   > my tcl code: > ------------------------------------------------- > file copy -force [file join $starkit::topdir lib optcl optcl.dll] > $::env(TEMP) > load [file join $::env(TEMP) optcl.dll] >   > error code > ------------------------------------------------- > couldn't load library "c:/tmp/optcl.dll": invalid argument >     while executing > "load [file join $::env(TEMP) optcl.dll]" >     (file "my.kit/main.tcl" line 22) >     invoked from within > "source my.kit/main.tcl" >     ("uplevel" body line 1) >     invoked from within > "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" >   >   > PS:- does tcl "file copy" command have other attrubutes for copying > binaries etc ? >   > Yours, Mel From lvirden@cas.org Fri Mar 7 08:46:01 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27Ek1C07215 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:46:01 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h27EmFXH024957 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:48:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h27EmG226081; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:48:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:48:16 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030307094816.AAB26074@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Re: tclkit-solaris-sparc Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When I download the 8.4.2 binary for tclkit-solaris-sparc, gunzip it, set permissions to 755 and execute it, I get: ld.so.1: /ldatae/WWW/tclkit-solaris-sparc: fatal: libstdc++.so.2.10.0: open failed: No such file or directory Killed (P.S. This is the problem I've been fighting the past months...) -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From btheado@pop-server.columbus.rr.com Fri Mar 7 09:28:29 2003 Received: from relay2.softcomca.com (relay2.softcomca.com [168.144.1.68]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27FSTC10872 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:28:29 -0600 Received: from M2W088.mail2web.com ([168.144.251.200]) by relay2.softcomca.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5576); Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:30:45 -0500 Message-ID: <174210-22003357153045514@M2W088.mail2web.com> X-Priority: 3 Reply-To: btheado@columbus.rr.com X-Originating-IP: 209.154.226.142 X-URL: http://mail2web.com/ From: "btheado@pop-server.columbus.rr.com" To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:30:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Mar 2003 15:30:45.0987 (UTC) FILETIME=[85D25B30:01C2E4BE] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h27FSTC10872 Subject: [Starkit] Starkit sourcing, vfs idea: set operations Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: For my tkoutline application I have my own code stored in CVS and I also have external libraries. In the past I have just placed a copy of the external libraries in my CVS workarea. Then when I distribute a starkit I just wrap from the CVS workarea. Works great, but when I have development directories on multiple machines and I make a changes to the external libraries, I have to make the same changes in all my development directories. I realized I should probably keep my external libraries as a starkit and just use the "source library.kit" trick. To execute the application during development, run the following wrapper file: source library.kit source mycvsdir/main.tcl To create the starkit for deployment: copy library.kit application.kit sdx sync mycvsdir application.kit I think I would have started using this approach earlier (I've seen jcw mention sourcing starkits a few times), but the starkit creation step wasn't immediately obvious to me. Thinking through the "source library.kit" trick, somehow sparked an idea of a "union vfs" that could serve the same purpose in a more general way. The union vfs would take a list of file paths and a mount point as input. The mounted directory would then contain all the files from all the paths. To execute the application during development, run the following wrapper file: package require vfs::setops::union vfs::setops::union::Mount mycvsdir library.kit uniondir package require starkit source uniondir/main.tcl For deployment package require vfs::setops::union vfs::setops::union::Mount mycvsdir library.kit myapp.vfs # Sdx doesn't currenly support calling its subcommands from Tcl, # but this is probably easy to add source sdx.kit; wrap myapp.kit The "union vfs" does have one advantage over the "source library.kit" method--the library.kit won't need to have its own main.tcl file. I may take a stab at implementing this union vfs. If a union vfs has some utility, then why not other set operations like *identity*. I envision the identity vfs handlers would make calls right back to standard Tcl file functions in order to derive the information they need to return. Now that I think about it, I guess this would have to be implemented more like a mirror vfs or symlink vfs (i.e. the mount point couldn't be the same as the actual directory, otherwise the calls to the standard Tcl file functions in the vfs handlers would result in an infinite loop). The identity vfs would be useful for documenting how to create a vfs. The tclvfs package already has testvfs.tcl for this purpose, but the identity vfs has two advantages. First, it can actually be executed (both success and failure cases) for all file operations. Second, the mappings between the vfs operations and actual Tcl commands would be clear just be reading the identity vfs source code. Other set operations such as intersect, minus may be useful as vfs's, but I haven't given them much thought. Any thoughts? Brian Theado -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From btheado@pop-server.columbus.rr.com Fri Mar 7 09:32:46 2003 Received: from relay2.softcomca.com (relay2.softcomca.com [168.144.1.68]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27FWkC11282 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:32:46 -0600 Received: from M2W071.mail2web.com ([168.144.251.180]) by relay2.softcomca.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5576); Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:35:03 -0500 Message-ID: <2920-2200335715353475@M2W071.mail2web.com> X-Priority: 3 Reply-To: btheado@columbus.rr.com X-Originating-IP: 209.154.226.142 X-URL: http://mail2web.com/ From: "btheado@pop-server.columbus.rr.com" To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:35:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Mar 2003 15:35:03.0524 (UTC) FILETIME=[1F536240:01C2E4BF] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h27FWkC11282 Subject: [Starkit] More vfs ideas: filter, starsync, starchive Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Here are some more vfs ideas I had: Filter vfs: When mounting, either an exclude or include glob pattern can be specified. For exclude, only files not matching the glob pattern will be visible; for include only files matching the pattern would be visible. One example of where I thought this could be used is with sdx sync and sdx version where certain files are ignored (CVS, a.out, etc.). It may be overkill for this example, but there are probably other uses. Starsync vfs: Replace sdx update functionality with "mount http://some.server/some.kit" followed by "sdx sync remote.kit local.kit" Starchive vfs: The internal starchive format (http://www.equi4.com/273) could be exposed as a vfs. To the user of the starchive filesystem it appears that each starkit is a directory each starkit version appears as a file in that directory with a name matching its version id. This would allow both the starchive server and a local starchive copy to access the internal starchive format with simple file commands. Brian Theado -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 7 09:40:06 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27Fe6C12064 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:40:06 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h27FgD8M017733; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:42:13 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn8.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.238]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27FgDB12755; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:42:13 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: "Larry W. Virden" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: tclkit-solaris-sparc Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:42:56 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <20030307094816.AAB26074@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > When I download the 8.4.2 binary for tclkit-solaris-sparc, gunzip it, > set permissions to 755 and execute it, I get: > > ld.so.1: /ldatae/WWW/tclkit-solaris-sparc: fatal: > libstdc++.so.2.10.0: open failed: No such file or directory > Killed DEATH TO C++! This is my new rallying cry. This means that the libstdc++ library was not compiled in statically, and unfortunately this library isn't a standard component on many boxes. It may be in /usr/local/lib, which you will need to add to LD_LIBRARY_PATH. If so, then the tclkit should be recompiled to use -R/usr/local/lib. To be honest, metakit's C++ is the single hardest component to deal with in ActiveTcl. For the amount of time that we have spent dealing with boxes to make sure C++ is around and configured correctly, we could likely have reimplemented metakit in C. I'm 100% sure this is the case if you include time that others have had to deal with this as well. I'm serious JC ... Jeff From lvirden@cas.org Fri Mar 7 09:47:23 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27FlMC12780 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:47:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h27FnaXH020026 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:49:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h27FnbO28145; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:49:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:49:37 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030307104937.AAB28134@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: tclkit-solaris-sparc In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:42:56 -0800 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" > This means that the libstdc++ > library was not compiled in statically, and unfortunately this > library isn't a standard component on many boxes. It may be > in /usr/local/lib, which you will need to add to LD_LIBRARY_PATH. > If so, then the tclkit should be recompiled to use > -R/usr/local/lib. In my case, the library is not in /usr/local/lib. This is the reason I've been creating genkit.local stuff - to handle this problem. For instance, Sun Solaris 8 or newer probably have this library somewhere in /opt/sfw/ . -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 7 09:52:13 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27FqDC13326 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:52:13 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h27FsT8M018940 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:54:30 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn8.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.238]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27FsTB15058 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:54:29 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: tclkit-solaris-sparc Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:55:12 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > To be honest, metakit's C++ is the single hardest component to > deal with in ActiveTcl. For the amount of time that we have > spent dealing with boxes to make sure C++ is around and > configured correctly, we could likely have reimplemented metakit > in C. I'm 100% sure this is the case if you include time that > others have had to deal with this as well. I'm serious JC ... The above sounded a little harsh, so I'll further clarify. I think metakit is invaluable as a component, which is why I would really consider investing the time to reimplement, rather than just drop (which I have considered for other troublesome bits). There is nothing wrong with the code, it is more a case in point of what JC said earlier about deployment issues with C++ -- platform vendors may have finally gotten to a point where you can expect a certain modicum of C++ support across platforms, but you certainly cannot expect it to be there by default. :( Windows and Linux may represent a large chunk of the user pie, and they have the C++ bits (although some may be rotted on older Linux machines, and note that gcc-3 broke ABI compat with older C++ binaries so you have to recompile everything, which wasn't true with pure C ...), but the enterprise (for which I obviously have a focus) have big iron, but we want the Tcl solution to be just as easy and effective for them. All in all, metakit is still in my sights for a rewrite ... Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 7 10:05:44 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27G5iC14646 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:05:44 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h27G0l8M019474; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:00:47 -0800 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn8.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.238]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27G0kB16105; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:00:46 -0800 Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey Hobbs" To: , Subject: RE: [Starkit] More vfs ideas: filter, starsync, starchive Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:01:29 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <2920-2200335715353475@M2W071.mail2web.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Filter vfs: > > When mounting, either an exclude or include glob pattern can be specified. > For exclude, only files not matching the glob pattern will be visible; for > include only files matching the pattern would be visible. You might find the Tcl Dev Kit tool useful in this respect: http://www.activestate.com/Tcl It provides a nice UI that allows you to specify things with patterns or recurse whole directories, etc. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ From mel@redolive.com Fri Mar 7 11:15:33 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27HFXC21460 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:15:33 -0600 Received: (qmail 23169 invoked by uid 511); 7 Mar 2003 18:15:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.9) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 18:15:25 -0000 Message-ID: <012601c2e4cd$79346260$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:17:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0123_01C2E4A3.902D8660" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] sorry, but had to ask this again Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0123_01C2E4A3.902D8660 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i have a package "optcl" which includes a dll file. would "package = require optcl" suffice ? or do i have to copy the dll file to tmp and = load it manulally ? if package require is enough then, i get an error on WinDoze XP as = follows: couldn't load library c:\tmp\TCLBC0.tmp": invalid argument.... i must add the it works fine when i run "tclkit main.tcl" directly from = inside my vfs directory, with my main something like package require starkit starkit::startup package require optcl sorry for this repeatative question ------=_NextPart_000_0123_01C2E4A3.902D8660 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i have a package "optcl" which includes = a dll file.=20 would "package require optcl" suffice ? or do i have to copy the = dll file=20 to tmp and load it manulally ?
 
if package require is enough then, i = get an error=20 on WinDoze XP as follows:
 
couldn't load library = c:\tmp\TCLBC0.tmp": invalid=20 argument....
 
i must add the it works fine when i run = "tclkit=20 main.tcl" directly from inside my vfs directory, with my main something=20 like
 
package require=20 starkit
starkit::startup
 
package require optcl
 
sorry for this repeatative = question
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0123_01C2E4A3.902D8660-- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Mar 7 11:31:20 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27HVKC23083 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:31:20 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h27HXYXH010984 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:33:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h27HXZR01115; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:33:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:33:35 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030307123334.AAB1101@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] sorry, but had to ask this again In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:17:46 -0500 To: "Starkit" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Mel" > sorry for this repeatative question Are you saying that you were unable to locate the previous times this question has been asked and answered? Or that the answers do not work for you? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mel@redolive.com Fri Mar 7 11:47:55 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27HlsC24752 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:47:54 -0600 Received: (qmail 23256 invoked by uid 511); 7 Mar 2003 18:47:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.9) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 18:47:46 -0000 Message-ID: <015401c2e4d1$fe61df40$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:50:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] you are dealing with a very confused guy... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable as you see i am very DESPARATE to get my app up and running while = everyone is screeming at mui !!! my main program goes like this: ----------------------------------------------------- package require starkit starkit::startup file mkdir $::env(TMP)/conf file copy -force [file join $starkit::topdir lib conf httpd.conf] = $::env(TMP)/conf foreach i {roHttpd.exe libapr.dll libaprutil.dll libhttpd.dll kill.exe = optcl/optcl.dll} { file copy -force [file join $starkit::topdir lib $i] $::env(TMP) } running my main.tcl with tclkit.exe directly on WinDoze XP resusts in copying files (PLEASE NOTE FILE SIZE DIFFERENCES) -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- c:/tmp: total 761 free 9355260 drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:18 . drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Dec 31 1969 .. drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:18 conf -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 21468 Mar 7 05:06 kill.exe -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 122880 Mar 7 02:54 libapr.dll -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 155648 Mar 7 02:54 libaprutil.dll -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 237568 Mar 7 02:54 libhttpd.dll -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 212992 Mar 7 05:26 optcl.dll -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 20480 Mar 7 02:54 roHttpd.exe runnig my wrapped application and doing "file copy" to tmp would result: -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- c:/tmp: total 31 free 9356064 drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:21 . drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Dec 31 1969 .. drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:21 conf -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 4135 Mar 7 05:06 kill.exe -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 570 Mar 7 02:54 libapr.dll -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 4447 Mar 7 02:54 libaprutil.dll -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 130 Mar 7 02:54 libhttpd.dll -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 5677 Mar 7 05:26 optcl.dll -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 8247 Mar 7 02:54 roHttpd.exe WHY are my files SMALLER in a wrapped application (are they zipped = somehow ?) thanks. as you see i am Desparate to get this application going, but i = am not getting very far Yours, Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
as you see i am very DESPARATE to get = my app up and=20 running while everyone is screeming at mui !!!
 
my main program goes like = this:
-----------------------------------------------------
package require=20 starkit
starkit::startup
 
file mkdir $::env(TMP)/conf
file = copy -force=20 [file join $starkit::topdir lib conf httpd.conf] = $::env(TMP)/conf
 
foreach i {roHttpd.exe libapr.dll = libaprutil.dll=20 libhttpd.dll kill.exe optcl/optcl.dll} {
    file copy = -force=20 [file join $starkit::topdir lib $i] $::env(TMP)
}
running my=20 main.tcl with tclkit.exe directly on WinDoze XP resusts in
copying = files=20 (PLEASE NOTE FILE SIZE=20 DIFFERENCES)
---------------------------------------------------------= -------------------
 c:/tmp:
 =20 total 761  free 9355260
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 Mel      = root       =20 0 Mar  7 12:18 .
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 Mel      = root       =20 0 Dec 31  1969 ..
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 Mel      = root       =20 0 Mar  7 12:18 conf
  -rwxrwxrwx   1=20 Mel      root    21468 Mar  = 7 05:06=20 kill.exe
  -rw-rw-rw-   1 = Mel     =20 root   122880 Mar  7 02:54 libapr.dll
 =20 -rw-rw-rw-   1 Mel      = root  =20 155648 Mar  7 02:54 libaprutil.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   = 1=20 Mel      root   237568 Mar  7 = 02:54=20 libhttpd.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 Mel      root   212992 Mar  7 = 05:26=20 optcl.dll
  -rwxrwxrwx   1 = Mel     =20 root    20480 Mar  7 02:54 roHttpd.exe

runnig = my=20 wrapped application and doing "file copy" to tmp would=20 result:
--------------------------------------------------------------= --------------
 c:/tmp:
 =20 total 31  free 9356064
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 Mel      = root       =20 0 Mar  7 12:21 .
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 Mel      = root       =20 0 Dec 31  1969 ..
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 Mel      = root       =20 0 Mar  7 12:21 conf
  -rwxrwxrwx   1=20 Mel      root     4135 = Mar  7=20 05:06 kill.exe
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 Mel      root      570 = Mar  7 02:54 libapr.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 Mel      root     4447 = Mar  7=20 02:54 libaprutil.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 Mel      root      130 = Mar  7 02:54 libhttpd.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 Mel      root     5677 = Mar  7=20 05:26 optcl.dll
  -rwxrwxrwx   1=20 Mel      root     8247 = Mar  7=20 02:54 roHttpd.exe



WHY are my files SMALLER in a wrapped=20 application (are they zipped somehow
?)

thanks. as you see i = am=20 Desparate to get this application going, but i am
not getting very=20 far
Yours, Mel
------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0-- From damon@your.unreality.com Fri Mar 7 11:59:45 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27HxjC25899 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:59:45 -0600 Received: (qmail 75765 invoked by uid 300); 7 Mar 2003 18:02:07 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 18:02:07 -0000 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:02:07 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Latest TclKit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I thought it was legal to attempt to delete a file from a read-only Starkit, as it would just delete it from memory. My code used to work in this respect, and it doesn't now. Was this behavior changed? Do I need to do something special to make it work? I'm trying to delete a file from a read-only Starkit and then call mk::file save to write out the data. Keep in mind that I don't use sdx to build my Starkits. They are built by another piece of code. So, if there's some flag I need to "turn on," I need to know how to really tell TclKit to do it. 0-] Thanks, Damon From mel@redolive.com Fri Mar 7 12:06:14 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h27I6DC26517 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:06:13 -0600 Received: (qmail 23313 invoked by uid 511); 7 Mar 2003 19:06:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.9) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 19:06:05 -0000 Message-ID: <016201c2e4d4$8d7f6010$a7c809c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: References: <200303071801.h27I11C26074@trixie.triqs.com> Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 13:08:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Re: starkit digest, Vol 1 #192 - 3 msgs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: it maybe me, but i posted a number of messages, which were never replied to, so i do not know where to find the answers to my questions. second, i used to get an email myselef as far as my question was concerned. I no longer recieve such message and i only get a digest. as you see i am not sure, if my question was answerd to or not. i only rely on the digest to find my answers thanks for your help Mel ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 1:01 PM Subject: starkit digest, Vol 1 #192 - 3 msgs > Send starkit mailing list submissions to > starkit@equi4.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > starkit-request@equi4.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > starkit-admin@equi4.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of starkit digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: sorry, but had to ask this again (Larry W. Virden) > 2. you are dealing with a very confused guy... (Mel) > 3. Latest TclKit (Damon Courtney) > > --__--__-- > > Message: 1 > Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:33:35 -0500 (EST) > From: "Larry W. Virden" > Subject: Re: [Starkit] sorry, but had to ask this again > To: "Starkit" > > From: "Mel" > > > sorry for this repeatative question > > Are you saying that you were unable to locate the previous times this > question has been asked and answered? Or that the answers do not work > for you? > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > -><- > > --__--__-- > > Message: 2 > From: "Mel" > To: "Starkit" > Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:50:08 -0500 > Subject: [Starkit] you are dealing with a very confused guy... > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > as you see i am very DESPARATE to get my app up and running while = > everyone is screeming at mui !!! > > my main program goes like this: > ----------------------------------------------------- > package require starkit > starkit::startup > > file mkdir $::env(TMP)/conf > file copy -force [file join $starkit::topdir lib conf httpd.conf] = > $::env(TMP)/conf > > foreach i {roHttpd.exe libapr.dll libaprutil.dll libhttpd.dll kill.exe = > optcl/optcl.dll} { > file copy -force [file join $starkit::topdir lib $i] $::env(TMP) > } > > running my main.tcl with tclkit.exe directly on WinDoze XP resusts in > copying files (PLEASE NOTE FILE SIZE DIFFERENCES) > -------------------------------------------------------------------------= > --- > c:/tmp: > total 761 free 9355260 > drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:18 . > drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Dec 31 1969 .. > drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:18 conf > -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 21468 Mar 7 05:06 kill.exe > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 122880 Mar 7 02:54 libapr.dll > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 155648 Mar 7 02:54 libaprutil.dll > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 237568 Mar 7 02:54 libhttpd.dll > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 212992 Mar 7 05:26 optcl.dll > -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 20480 Mar 7 02:54 roHttpd.exe > > runnig my wrapped application and doing "file copy" to tmp would result: > -------------------------------------------------------------------------= > --- > c:/tmp: > total 31 free 9356064 > drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:21 . > drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Dec 31 1969 .. > drwxrwxrwx 2 Mel root 0 Mar 7 12:21 conf > -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 4135 Mar 7 05:06 kill.exe > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 570 Mar 7 02:54 libapr.dll > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 4447 Mar 7 02:54 libaprutil.dll > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 130 Mar 7 02:54 libhttpd.dll > -rw-rw-rw- 1 Mel root 5677 Mar 7 05:26 optcl.dll > -rwxrwxrwx 1 Mel root 8247 Mar 7 02:54 roHttpd.exe > > > > WHY are my files SMALLER in a wrapped application (are they zipped = > somehow > ?) > > thanks. as you see i am Desparate to get this application going, but i = > am > not getting very far > Yours, Mel > > ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0 > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > charset=3Diso-8859-1"> > > > > >
as you see i am very DESPARATE to get = > my app up and=20 > running while everyone is screeming at mui !!!
>
 
>
my main program goes like = > this:
>
size=3D2>----------------------------------------------------- V> >
package require=20 > starkit
starkit::startup
>
 
>
file mkdir $::env(TMP)/conf
file = > copy -force=20 > [file join $starkit::topdir lib conf httpd.conf] = > $::env(TMP)/conf
>
 
>
foreach i {roHttpd.exe libapr.dll = > libaprutil.dll=20 > libhttpd.dll kill.exe optcl/optcl.dll} {
    file copy = > -force=20 > [file join $starkit::topdir lib $i] $::env(TMP)
}
>
size=3D3>running my=20 > main.tcl with tclkit.exe directly on WinDoze XP resusts in
copying = > files=20 > (PLEASE NOTE FILE SIZE=20 > DIFFERENCES)
---------------------------------------------------------= > -------------------
 c:/tmp:
 =20 > total 761  free 9355260
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 > Mel      = > root       =20 > 0 Mar  7 12:18 .
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 > Mel      = > root       =20 > 0 Dec 31  1969 ..
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 > Mel      = > root       =20 > 0 Mar  7 12:18 conf
  -rwxrwxrwx   1=20 > Mel      root    21468 Mar  = > 7 05:06=20 > kill.exe
  -rw-rw-rw-   1 = > Mel     =20 > root   122880 Mar  7 02:54 libapr.dll
 =20 > -rw-rw-rw-   1 Mel      = > root  =20 > 155648 Mar  7 02:54 libaprutil.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   = > 1=20 > Mel      root   237568 Mar  7 = > 02:54=20 > libhttpd.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 > Mel      root   212992 Mar  7 = > 05:26=20 > optcl.dll
  -rwxrwxrwx   1 = > Mel     =20 > root    20480 Mar  7 02:54 roHttpd.exe

runnig = > my=20 > wrapped application and doing "file copy" to tmp would=20 > result:
--------------------------------------------------------------= > --------------
 c:/tmp:
 =20 > total 31  free 9356064
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 > Mel      = > root       =20 > 0 Mar  7 12:21 .
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 > Mel      = > root       =20 > 0 Dec 31  1969 ..
  drwxrwxrwx   2=20 > Mel      = > root       =20 > 0 Mar  7 12:21 conf
  -rwxrwxrwx   1=20 > Mel      root     4135 = > Mar  7=20 > 05:06 kill.exe
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 > Mel      root      570 = > > Mar  7 02:54 libapr.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 > Mel      root     4447 = > Mar  7=20 > 02:54 libaprutil.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 > Mel      root      130 = > > Mar  7 02:54 libhttpd.dll
  -rw-rw-rw-   1=20 > Mel      root     5677 = > Mar  7=20 > 05:26 optcl.dll
  -rwxrwxrwx   1=20 > Mel      root     8247 = > Mar  7=20 > 02:54 roHttpd.exe



WHY are my files SMALLER in a wrapped=20 > application (are they zipped somehow
?)

thanks. as you see i = > am=20 > Desparate to get this application going, but i am
not getting very=20 > far
Yours, Mel
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0151_01C2E4A8.1585BCC0-- > > > --__--__-- > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:02:07 -0600 (CST) > From: Damon Courtney > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] Latest TclKit > > I thought it was legal to attempt to delete a file from a read-only > Starkit, as it would just delete it from memory. My code used to work > in this respect, and it doesn't now. Was this behavior changed? Do I > need to do something special to make it work? I'm trying to delete a file > from a read-only Starkit and then call mk::file save to write out the data. > > Keep in mind that I don't use sdx to build my Starkits. They are built > by another piece of code. So, if there's some flag I need to "turn on," I > need to know how to really tell TclKit to do it. 0-] > > Thanks, > > Damon > > > > --__--__-- > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > End of starkit Digest > From frank@canyon-medical.com Fri Mar 7 15:10:27 2003 Received: from mail3.centurytel.net (mail3.centurytel.net [209.142.136.99]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27LAQC10146 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 15:10:26 -0600 Received: from aSqueakSystem (pppoe0159.sm.centurytel.net [64.91.3.162]) by mail3.centurytel.net (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h27LCkml021620 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 15:12:46 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <200303072112.h27LCkml021620@mail3.centurytel.net> X-Mailer: Celeste 2.0.4956 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 15:13:42 -0600 Subject: Re: [Starkit] library load problems... To: "Starkit" From: Frank Sergeant Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel, It appears you are using Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 as your email client and that you do not have it configured quite right. All your postings on the starkit list are sent with HTML markup when it is better if they are sent as plain text. Could you check your email settings and turn off the HTML? Thank you. -- Frank From jcw@equi4.com Fri Mar 7 17:46:56 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h27NktC23796 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 17:46:55 -0600 Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 00:49:16 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] bug in self-modifying starkit open mode Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3B77E75A-5035-11D7-A01D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: <682A4E58-50F7-11D7-83E1-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: To follow up... > The good news: I will fix all Tclkit 8.4.2 builds and update them in > the download area, i.e. pub/tk/8.4.2/. This will be ready tomorrow, I > expect. I lied. I'm going to leave things as is for now. It needs to be fixed, but not hurried. There are two workarounds to deal with it. -jcw From john@totten.com Fri Mar 7 22:08:03 2003 Received: from c000.snv.cp.net (h008.c000.snv.cp.net [209.228.32.72]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h28483C08967 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 22:08:03 -0600 Received: (cpmta 19422 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 20:10:24 -0800 Received: from 24.237.189.247 (HELO totten.com) by smtp.totten.com (209.228.32.72) with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 20:10:24 -0800 X-Sent: 8 Mar 2003 04:10:24 GMT Message-ID: <3E696CB0.6030809@totten.com> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 19:08:16 -0900 From: John Totten User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.9) Gecko/20020401 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Can I protect my Code/Data ? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am new to the list so apologies if this issue has been addressed. Seems anyone can download sdx and have your code and data for free. How can I lock them out? From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 7 22:18:51 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h284IoC09607 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 22:18:51 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h284L78M021868; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 20:21:07 -0800 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h284L7B32666; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 20:21:07 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "John Totten" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Can I protect my Code/Data ? Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 20:21:03 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <3E696CB0.6030809@totten.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I am new to the list so apologies if this issue has been addressed. > Seems anyone can download sdx and have your code and data for free. How > can I lock them out? That is the purpose of procomp in the Tcl Dev Kit: http://www.activestate.com/Tcl The latest Tcl Dev Kit wrapper tool is starkit based, and there is simply an extra checkbox "Compile Tcl Files" that will precompile (obfuscate in a way that end users can't introspect it) your code. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From lvirden@cas.org Sat Mar 8 05:08:22 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h28B8MC29426 for ; Sat, 8 Mar 2003 05:08:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.5/m8.12.5/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h28BAbXH017257 for ; Sat, 8 Mar 2003 06:10:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h28BAbf09594; Sat, 8 Mar 2003 06:10:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 06:10:37 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030308061037.AAB9575@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] question on adding help to scripted doc Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: In looking at 's page on adding help to scripted documents, I found it a bit out of date. I was able to update the sdx command information to reflect the current syntax. However, one of the pieces of info I was uncertain about was how to add the wikit scripts to an application to get the wikit help. Do I add the wikit.kit file, or do I unwrap the kit and add the .vfs directory? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Mar 10 05:43:44 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2ABhiC29841 for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 05:43:44 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2ABk0sL025531 for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 06:46:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2ABk1x05514; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 06:46:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 06:46:01 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030310064600.AAB5485@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] sdx update peculiarity Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: steve landers announced this morning updating sdarchive with a new version of tkchat.kit . So I decided to use sdx update to get the new version. lwv26awu (30886) $ ls -l /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tkchat.kit -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 89142 Feb 3 09:28 /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tkchat.kit lwv26awu (30887) $ sdx update /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tkchat.kit TKCHAT: updating from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... 1 changes applied. lwv26awu (30888) $ ls -l /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tkchat.kit -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 89142 Feb 3 09:28 /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tkchat.kit It doesn't look like the update worked. $ sdx update -n /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tkchat.kit TKCHAT: comparing with http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... 1 differences: 126079 lib/app-tkchat/tkchat.tcl -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jgodfrey@optinest.com Mon Mar 10 11:28:55 2003 Received: from linux2.optinest.com (node-20.65.210.128.in-addr.arpa [65.210.128.20] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2AHStC28735 for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 11:28:55 -0600 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [65.210.128.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id h2AHRjZ25438 for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 11:28:14 -0600 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 11:31:57 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [Starkit] Starpack resource string modifications? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, On 11/4/02, Will Duquette started a short-lived discussion about the possibility of modifying the resource strings that appear inside a starpack (at least under Windows). The latest tclkit/sdx creates a starpack with the following resource strings: Company Name: Equi4 Software Language: English (United States) Original Filename: tclkit.exe Product Name: Tclkit 8.4 for Windows Product Version: 8.4.2 I know that we now have the ability to change the program icon (which is great, thanks!), but I don't see any mention of modifying any of the above info. Is this available (and I missed it), still being considered, or likely not to happen at all? IIRC, the above strings are *much* cleaner than some previous builds, but it would be nice to (be able to) modify them to suit particular needs... Just curious... Thanks, Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA Phone: 816.836.2000 Fax : 816.836.8589 Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com From andreask@ActiveState.com Tue Mar 11 10:35:36 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2BGZaC13469 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 10:35:36 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h2BGbt8M002004 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 08:37:55 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2BGbtB06761 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 08:37:55 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Starkit_Devel" Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 08:37:55 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E7A9.82FA3480" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Subject: [Starkit] FW: [comp.lang.tcl] change icon in starpack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E7A9.82FA3480 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit FYI. Maybe someone here can answer the question ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join the community at the 10th Tcl conference http://wiki.tcl.tk/6274 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E7A9.82FA3480 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment From: "Maritn Fickert" To: Path: bluepeak.shaw.ca!news1.calgary.shaw.ca!pd2nf2so.cg.shawcable.net!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!sea-feed.news.verio.net!quark.scn.rain.com!chilly.oregonvos.net!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!postnews1.google.com!not-for-mail Subject: change icon in starpack Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 02:07:50 -0800 Lines: 11 Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Message-ID: <45043475.0303110207.6c7543b8@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 X-Trace: posting.google.com 1047377270 19740 127.0.0.1 (11 Mar 2003 10:07:50 GMT) X-Complaints-to: groups-abuse@google.com X-Received-Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 03:07:51 MST (news1.calgary.shaw.ca) I created a starpack, and it works great. Thank you for that tool. But my problem is to change the icon on windows. I read the webpage carefully, downloaded the latest versions of sdx, tclkitsh and tclkit. I created an tclkit.ico file with the six different icons inside. I copied the tclkit.ico file into the root of my vfs. I wraped it as usual (sdx wrap myapp.exe -runtime tclkit.exe)... The binary works, but the icon remains "TK"..... Thank you Martin ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E7A9.82FA3480-- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Tue Mar 11 12:38:33 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2BIcWC27484 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 12:38:32 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2BIeoXZ019044 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 13:40:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvw03.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2BIeiSA025274 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 13:40:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.27 by cinmlvw03.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 11 Mar 2003 13:40:42 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Tue, 11 Mar 2003 13:40:42 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 13:40:42 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253CE@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Thread-Index: AcLkr946h7lrS9TOQi+PWA646+bT9wDTYECA From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Mar 2003 18:40:42.0391 (UTC) FILETIME=[B8429A70:01C2E7FD] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2BIcWC27484 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Oddly enough I get the same problem with the 8.4.2 solaris-sparc version that is available for download at www.equi4.com/tk/8.4.2 Anyone else having problems with this build? The 8.4.1 release works great for me. -----Original Message----- From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu [mailto:john_zouck@jhuapl.edu] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 8:45 AM To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem I downloaded tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz to my: SunOS argon.jhuapl.edu 5.9 Generic_112233-01 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-5_10 machine. I gunzipped it and got 'tclkit-solaris-sparc'. I renamed it 'tclkit' and did a 'chmod 755 tclkit'. I ran ./tclkit and came up with the tclkit '%' prompt and was running tclsh. But could not load Tk: % package require Tk couldn't load library "/home/u8/jhz/downloads/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or directory % Any ideas? I did some tclkit stuff months ago, and this worked, I think, so maybe I'm rusty... ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 12 07:04:23 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2CD4MC12326 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 07:04:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2CD5u3x022030 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:06:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2CCvmK23888; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 07:57:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 07:57:48 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030312075748.AAB23848@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 11 Mar 2003 13:40:42 -0500 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Could you type the following command? $ sdx version tclkit-solaris-sparc 2003/03/11 12:08:39 48747-56108 /ldatae/bin/tclkit-solaris-sparc From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" > Oddly enough I get the same problem with the 8.4.2 solaris-sparc version > that is available for download at www.equi4.com/tk/8.4.2 Anyone else > having problems with this build? The 8.4.1 release works great for me. -----Original Message----- From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu [mailto:john_zouck@jhuapl.edu] > I ran ./tclkit and came up with the tclkit '%' prompt and was running > tclsh. > > But could not load Tk: > > % package require Tk > couldn't load library > "/home/u8/jhz/downloads/tclkit/lib/tk8.4/libtk8.4.so": no such file or > directory > % -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Mar 12 07:40:19 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2CDeJC14762 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 07:40:19 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1 [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2CDgbOM017104 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:42:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvw03.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2CDgVwF023044 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:42:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.27 by cinmlvw03.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:42:31 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:42:30 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:42:30 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E259EE@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Thread-Index: AcLomHrZd0FwbaQ5QDSzWib3TXNw7wABKYXw From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Mar 2003 13:42:30.0896 (UTC) FILETIME=[3A82DF00:01C2E89D] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2CDeJC14762 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: -----Original Message----- From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf Could you type the following command? $ sdx version tclkit-solaris-sparc 2003/03/11 12:08:39 48747-56108 /ldatae/bin/tclkit-solaris-sparc > sdx version tclkit-solaris-sparc 2003/03/03 21:45:14 49354-73706 tclkit-solaris-sparc From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 12 07:45:01 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2CDj0C15119 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 07:45:00 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2CDlI3t016181 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:47:19 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2CDlI724818; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:47:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:47:18 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030312084718.AAB24809@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:42:30 -0500 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Try picking up the latest tclkit-solaris-sparc and see if the problem has been resolved. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Mar 12 08:31:05 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2CEV5C18953 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 08:31:05 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1 [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2CEXMOM015452 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:33:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2CEXGTg026262 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:33:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.26 by CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:33:16 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:33:04 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:33:02 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E259EF@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Thread-Index: AcLoni4hz/rRA8cYRQmixDA/ol+73wABgvKw From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Mar 2003 14:33:04.0936 (UTC) FILETIME=[4AF0A280:01C2E8A4] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2CEV5C18953 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well, the latest tclkit-solaris-sparc appears to be an empty file.. -rw------- 1 bschofie cad 0 Mar 12 09:30 tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz Sometimes it's hard to win :-P -----Original Message----- From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Larry W. Virden Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:47 AM To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Solaris tclkit-solaris-sparc Tk problem Try picking up the latest tclkit-solaris-sparc and see if the problem has been resolved. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From dgroth@gmx.de Thu Mar 13 03:34:27 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.net [213.165.65.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2D9YQC11211 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 03:34:26 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 03:34:26 -0600 Message-Id: <200303130934.h2D9YQC11211@trixie.triqs.com> Received: (qmail 17378 invoked by uid 0); 13 Mar 2003 09:36:47 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (HELO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp005-rz3) with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 09:36:47 -0000 From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Dec-Alpha OSF4 build failed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I use tclkit on windows with much success and it would be great to use it also on our dec-alpha servers. But as other previously I run into some troubles. dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src> uname -a OSF1 homer.molgen.mpg.de V4.0 878 alpha using the 8.4.0 build: dgroth@harry:/project/amphioxus/src> tclkit-tru64-alpha 9514:/project/amphioxus/bin/tclkit-tru64-alpha: /sbin/loader: Error: Unresolved symbol in /project/amphioxus/bin/tclkit-tru64-alpha: _F64_stat 9514:/project/amphioxus/bin/tclkit-tru64-alpha: /sbin/loader: Error: Unresolved symbol in /project/amphioxus/bin/tclkit-tru64-alpha: _F64_lstat 9514:/project/amphioxus/bin/tclkit-tru64-alpha: /sbin/loader: Fatal Error: this executable has unresolvable symbols using the static-build with included X of 8.4.1 for osf5.1 stops with a core dump as described previously: http://trixie.triqs.com/pipermail/starkit/2002-November/000401.html I first tried to build tclkit using the standard procedure but I don't have cxx, so this build failed. dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src> sh genkit B zlib: sh /amd/schnuppi/3/project/amp... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok kitsh: cc -c -I. -I/amd/schnuppi/3/pr... ok cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... FAILED: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/homer.molgen.mpg.de/lib -ltcl8.4 -lm -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- ERROR: couldn't execute "cxx": no such file or directory Because my machine has the gnu-compilers installed I repeated the build with gcc following this commands suceeding now even until reaching `sh genkit D': $ wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit $ # set the compiler to the gnu ones $ perl -i.bak -ne 'if (/OSF/) { print " OSF1 { array set X {gcc gcc g++ g++} }\n"} else { print }' genkit $ tclsh genkit A $ tclsh genkit B tcl $ sh genkit B $ sh genkit C $ sh genkit D @homer:/project/amphioxus/src> sh genkit D info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200303 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = littleEndian tcl_platform(machine) = alpha tcl_platform(os) = OSF1 tcl_platform(osVersion) = V4.0 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = dgroth tcl_platform(wordSize) = 8 package Itcl = 3.3 couldn't load file "install/homer.molgen.mpg.de/lib/libtk8.4.so": Unresolved symbol in install/homer.molgen.mpg.de/lib/libtk8.4.so: XFlush running dummy-homer.molgen.mpg.de $sh genkit E runs without problems but of course the runtime can't load tk because of the missing XFlush. any suggestions against for the build ? Thank you very much. regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235 Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Thu Mar 13 05:47:59 2003 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2DBlwC20784 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 05:47:58 -0600 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA11349 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 11:50:23 GMT Message-Id: <200303131150.LAA11349@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 11:50:23 +0000 From: Steve Blinkhorn Subject: [Starkit] file delete -force Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "file delete -force mydir" when the file concerned is a non-empty directory inside a starkit causes an error that results in tclkit hanging on BSD/OS but not on Windows. The same code runs trouble-free outside a starkit. Does this relate to a known problem? From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Thu Mar 13 08:14:08 2003 Received: from dewey.iland.net (dewey.iland.net [205.242.230.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2DEE7C32726 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 08:14:07 -0600 Received: (qmail 11871 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 14:16:32 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-91.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.91) by dewey.iland.net with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 14:16:32 -0000 Message-ID: <007401c2e96b$05a3f980$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 08:15:11 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 3/7/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Subject: [Starkit] Odd starpack / focus / console problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, Using (what I believe to be) the latest tclkit/sdx tools, I am seeing some very strange focus behavior of a TK application under various flavors of Windows. Here's what I see: - Take any simple Tk application, like --> pack [button .b1 -text "Exit" -command exit] - Make a starpack out of it. - Run the starpack - When the application starts up, it does not have the system focus. Before manually focusing the app (with a mouse click), if I press Alt-Tab (Windows task switcher), I see 2 "Tk" tasks. One is my application, the other is labeled "Console". But I never asked for a console in my app. Also, there is no visible console window on the screen, nor is there a console on my task bar or in the Windows "Close Program" dialog. - If I either Alt-Tab my way to the app (which focuses it), or if I mouse click on the app to focus it, the "Console" task goes away and the application reacts normally. Basically, once the app *is* focused once, all is normal. It just doesn't receive focus by default for some reason and has this weird "Console" task hanging around until it is focused. I have temporarily fixed the problem by placing a "focus -force ." in my application code, which does seem to work. I have verified this behavior on both Windows 98 and Windows NT 4.0. I don't remember ever seeing this with previous version of tclkit/sdx, but I don't have any of those versions installed to try. Has anyone else seen this? Thanks, Jeff From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Thu Mar 13 12:22:52 2003 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2DIMqC22752 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 12:22:52 -0600 Received: (qmail 14390 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 18:25:18 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-91.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.91) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 18:25:18 -0000 Message-ID: <011401c2e98d$c63c5b20$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <007401c2e96b$05a3f980$0101a8c0@quantex> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Odd starpack / focus / console problem Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 12:24:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 3/7/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 8:15 AM Subject: [Starkit] Odd starpack / focus / console problem > Hi All, > > Using (what I believe to be) the latest tclkit/sdx tools, I am seeing some > very strange focus behavior of a TK application under various flavors of > Windows. Here's what I see: > > - Take any simple Tk application, like --> pack [button .b1 -text > "Exit" -command exit] > - Make a starpack out of it. > - Run the starpack > - When the application starts up, it does not have the system focus. Before > manually focusing the app (with a mouse click), if I press Alt-Tab (Windows > task switcher), I see 2 "Tk" tasks. One is my application, the other is > labeled "Console". But I never asked for a console in my app. Also, there > is no visible console window on the screen, nor is there a console on my > task bar or in the Windows "Close Program" dialog. > - If I either Alt-Tab my way to the app (which focuses it), or if I mouse > click on the app to focus it, the "Console" task goes away and the > application reacts normally. Basically, once the app *is* focused once, all > is normal. It just doesn't receive focus by default for some reason and has > this weird "Console" task hanging around until it is focused. > > I have temporarily fixed the problem by placing a "focus -force ." in my > application code, which does seem to work. > > I have verified this behavior on both Windows 98 and Windows NT 4.0. I > don't remember ever seeing this with previous version of tclkit/sdx, but I > don't have any of those versions installed to try. > > Has anyone else seen this? > > Thanks, > > > Jeff Sorry to reply to my own post, but, upon further investigation, this appears to be unrelated to tclkit/sdx/starkits/starpacks. The above simple application reacts as described when run against the wish application provide with ActiveTcl 8.4.1 and 8.4.2. I don't currently have earlier versions to test against. Can anyone else verify this behavior? I'll probably post to c.l.t also... Thanks, Jeff From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Mar 13 21:07:09 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2E379C23911 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 21:07:09 -0600 Received: (qmail 3897 invoked by uid 300); 14 Mar 2003 03:09:37 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 03:09:37 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 21:09:37 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Unmounting a mk4 vfs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Out of curiosity, which is the MOST appropriate way to unmount a mk4 vfs? We have: mk4vfs::unmount mk4vfs::_unmount vfs::mk4::Unmount vfs::filesystem unmount I have seen all used and was just curious which one I should bet on most likely being there in future releases. 0-] I'm having trouble with vfs::filesystem unmount with regards to a file in a symlink'd directory. It doesn't seem to actually unmount the file. D From damon@your.unreality.com Fri Mar 14 01:29:45 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2E7TjC02342 for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 01:29:45 -0600 Received: (qmail 6518 invoked by uid 300); 14 Mar 2003 07:32:14 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 07:32:14 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 01:32:14 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] The running executable Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Beyond initial startup, does TclKit need the executing file mounted? By that I mean, can I unmount the running TclKit and not worry about it needing to access files within the VFS later? Or, does TclKit do stuff with the system beyond initial startup? Thanks, Damon From vince.darley@eurobios.com Sat Mar 15 05:10:09 2003 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2FBA8C04544 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 05:10:08 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com (ACB5B1AF.ipt.aol.com [172.181.177.175]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id AAP75122 (AUTH vincedarley); Sat, 15 Mar 2003 11:12:31 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030314195626.01f81e18@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 19:58:03 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Unmounting a mk4 vfs In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: You're best of using vfs::unmount (which works for all filesystems) or vfs::mk4::Unmount (mk4 only). The others are either unsupported (mk4vfs::*) or operate at a lower level than you should really be using (vfs::filesystem unmount). We're obviously interested in any problems you're having with symlinks.... cheers, Vince. At 09:09 PM 3/13/2003 -0600, Damon Courtney wrote: > Out of curiosity, which is the MOST appropriate way to unmount a >mk4 vfs? We have: > > mk4vfs::unmount > mk4vfs::_unmount > vfs::mk4::Unmount > vfs::filesystem unmount > > I have seen all used and was just curious which one I should bet on >most likely being there in future releases. 0-] I'm having trouble with >vfs::filesystem unmount with regards to a file in a symlink'd directory. >It doesn't seem to actually unmount the file. > >D > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit Vince Darley CEO, Eurobios UK Ltd Tel: +44 (0)207 420 4319 Mobile: +44 (0) 794 154 8527 www.eurobios.com & www.biosgroup.com From john@totten.com Mon Mar 17 02:11:01 2003 Received: from c000.snv.cp.net (h002.c000.snv.cp.net [209.228.32.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2H8B1C16515 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 02:11:01 -0600 Received: (cpmta 26659 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 00:13:29 -0800 Received: from 24.237.189.247 (HELO localhost.localdomain) by smtp.totten.com (209.228.32.66) with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 00:13:29 -0800 X-Sent: 17 Mar 2003 08:13:29 GMT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: John Totten Reply-To: john@totten.com To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 23:10:54 -0900 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.4] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200303162310.54772.john@totten.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2H8B1C16515 Subject: [Starkit] VFS and Wikit Searches Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Two questions:- Does Wikit Searching (in local mode) work with the vfs::zip driver or are searching and zipping mutually exclusive? Can a Starkit contain more than one Wikit and still maintain different cache/hash for each Wikit ? This would be equivalent to two unique help systems From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 17 05:58:19 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HBwIC29243 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 05:58:19 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:00:43 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <14828E50-5870-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: First of all, sorry for dropping off the net most of last week - hardware and network troubles kept me busy with all sorts of nonsense :( The tclkit build fest has brought out a number of issues in tclkit. Here's the bad news first: the issues are severe enough to ask y'all to rebuild tclkit 8.4.2 once more. Please re-fetch the tars. I have updated Metakit to release 2.4.9.2 and the VFS runtime (mk4vfs.tcl in runtime.kit, to be precise). The genkit script has also been adjusted. There are three ways in which you can detect this very latest change: - Tclkit's VFS runtime: $vfs::tclkit_version is now 200303.001 - package Mk4tcl: release is now 2.4.9.2 (was 2.4.9.1) - package mk4vfs: release is now 1.9 (was 1.8) Issues addressed in these final 8.4.2 release files: 1) An important change is in mk4vfs, where the "translucent/readwrite" mode has been reset to match previous tclkit usage. Writable starkits should work as is again, with the standard sdx -writable mechanism. The bump to a new Metakit release is not related, I just thought I'd get some valuable bug fixes in while I could. 2) A serious security issue was found and resolved by Reinhard Max: the search path for locating Tk, which is now loaded dynamically by default, used to include a reference to the original build path. This opens a security hole if someone puts nasty stuff in that location. His changes to genkit clears path settings so these do not get compiled into the binaries. 3) There is some trouble with X11 loading on some platforms. It turns out that "-L/use/X11R6/lib -lX11" is not in the Tk build files. The tclkit main program (i.e. kitsh) is *not* linked to X11 - allowing it to work properly as tclsh when launched on a machine where X11 is not installed. This is important, but it means that Tk must now find X11 on its own, and cannot rely on the main app already having loaded X11 libraries. This breaks at least OpenBSD and Alpha/OSF, from what i can tell from reports so far. The solution is to force Tk to include X11 - if you know how to do that, please let me know so I can adjust genkit. 4) On my build setup, I recently upgraded to XFree86 4.3.0 - and found out that the static library now has a reference to code in the -lpthread library. O joy - now I have to link that in as well. That "little" change makes tclkit-linux-x86static about 200 Kb larger. Yuck. Sort of proves that the world we have created is completely crazy. Oh well, the static-linked one is a fallback build anyway. Sooooo... how to end this and declare victory? Well, ahem... I'm going to urge everyone who has submitted a build to redo this once more, if it's not too much to ask. The current builds can be salvaged more or less by just fixing up the VFS at the end, but I would rather only do this as last resort. Such fixed-up releases would fix the mk4vfs/translucent issues, but not the secure rpaths (nor include Mk4tcl 2.4.9.2, but that is not a critical change). The pivot date is today: all tclkit builds created on or after March 17, 2003 will be considered "truly final". -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Mar 17 06:26:31 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HCQVC31062 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 06:26:31 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2HCSqKV024848 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 07:28:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2HCSrA28347; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 07:28:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 07:28:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030317072853.AAB28332@cas.org> Subject: Problems building latest tclkit [Was: Re: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 In-Reply-To: <14828E50-5870-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:00:43 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well, after reading your note this morning, I removed the source directories and tar files in my tclkit build directory, fetched the latest genkit, and begin building on my Sunblad 100, with gcc/g++ version 2.95.3 . Here's what I saw: fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz fetching tars/tk.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz fetching tars/itcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/itcl.tar.gz fetching tars/mk.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/mk.tar.gz fetching tars/vfs.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/vfs.tar.gz fetching tars/kit.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/kit.tar.gz fetching tars/zlib.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/zlib.tar.gz tcl: sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok make install-binaries install-... ok /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26aw... ok Done. application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. zlib: sh /ldatae/tclkit/build/lwv26a... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok kitsh: gcc -c -I. -I/ldatae/tclkit/sr... ok g++ -R/projects/gnu/sparc-sun-... ok strip kitsh ... ok ls -l /ldatae/tclkit/install/l... ok itcldyn: sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok make binaries ITCL_LIBRARY= ... ok make install-binaries ... ok tkdyn: sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok make install-binaries ... ok Done. application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200303 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200303 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 package Tk = 8.4 running dummy-lwv26awu application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. tclkit-lwv26awu: 1588893 -> 1997246 -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 17 07:30:20 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HDUJC02394 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 07:30:19 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 14:32:43 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] VFS and Wikit Searches Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200303162310.54772.john@totten.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: John Totten wrote: > Does Wikit Searching (in local mode) work with the vfs::zip driver or > are > searching and zipping mutually exclusive? Wikit datafiles use Metakit, but these are *not* VFS files. You cannot mount wikit.tkd - wikit uses raw MK calls to store and search pages, for performance reasons. > Can a Starkit contain more than one Wikit and still maintain different > cache/hash for each Wikit ? This would be equivalent to two unique help > systems Yes, though perhaps not simultaneously without tweaks. Not sure what you mean by cache/hash, though. From the help page in wikit's own online help: if {[llength $argv] == 0} { if {[catch {package require Wikit}]} { # ... output console mode help } else { Wikit::init $path_to_wiki_datafile } } -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 17 07:35:27 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HDZQC02851 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 07:35:26 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 14:37:49 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] The running executable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > Beyond initial startup, does TclKit need the executing file > mounted? > By that I mean, can I unmount the running TclKit and not worry about it > needing to access files within the VFS later? Or, does TclKit do stuff > with the system beyond initial startup? I can not repeat this enough - tclkit is simply tcl. The only difference is that it carries its runtime on its back, and has startup tricks to VFS mount that. If you unmount [info nameofexe], you are essentially taking away all runtime scripts. May work, depends on what you're doing, obviously. Ah, wait... I think I know what you're up to - yes, to make a copy of tclkit as file you should be able to unmount, copy, and remount with no ill effects. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 17 09:33:43 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HFXgC10043 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:33:42 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:36:06 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <14828E50-5870-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: <2B271213-588E-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Whoops - I forgot to describe how to rebuild a second time. The safest is: rm -rf build sh genkit B tcl sh genkit B sh genkit C [etc] But if you want to minimize build steps, all that changed this time around as far as compilation goes is Metakit, hence the following will do: rm -rf build/`hostname`/mk sh genkit B sh genkit C [etc] The output of step C is a tar file, called "result-*.tar.gz". That's the one to send over (thanks Mark R, Bryan O, and Bob T for rebuilding right away!). Larry, I don't know what the problem is you're seeing - are you using the latest genkit? -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Mar 17 09:54:44 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HFshC11446 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:54:44 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2HFv5KV010769 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:57:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2HFv5t10616; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:57:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:57:05 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030317105705.AAB3275@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 In-Reply-To: <2B271213-588E-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:36:06 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: am I using a new genkit yes - I fetched it this morning. This is SPARC Solaris 8 on a SunBlade 100 using gcc 2.95.3 . However, for the build attempt this morning, I didn't delete the build directory - just the src and tars contents. I'm rerunning now with the build gone as well. That doesn't help - I continue to see the error previously reported. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Mar 17 09:59:47 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HFxlC11920 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:59:47 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h2HG1cxm021662 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:01:38 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id JAA11123 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:02:15 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2HG2DT26142 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:02:13 -0600 Message-ID: <3E75F184.2D344DF7@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:02:12 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] VFS and Wikit Searches References: <200303162310.54772.john@totten.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: John, > Does Wikit Searching (in local mode) work with the vfs::zip driver or are > searching and zipping mutually exclusive? Don't know. > Can a Starkit contain more than one Wikit and still maintain different > cache/hash for each Wikit ? This would be equivalent to two unique help > systems I think this would be a problem because the current Wikit implementation doesn't use a variable for the wikit database handle. Tom K. From damon@your.unreality.com Mon Mar 17 10:07:11 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2HG7BC12491 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:07:11 -0600 Received: (qmail 53102 invoked by uid 300); 17 Mar 2003 16:09:42 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 16:09:42 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:09:42 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] The running executable In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I can not repeat this enough - tclkit is simply tcl. The only > difference is that it carries its runtime on its back, and has startup > tricks to VFS mount that. > > If you unmount [info nameofexe], you are essentially taking away all > runtime scripts. May work, depends on what you're doing, obviously. > > Ah, wait... I think I know what you're up to - yes, to make a > copy of tclkit as file you should be able to unmount, copy, and remount > with no ill effects. On the ball as always. 0-] That's what I'm doing. I've already got it figured out. I just had some trouble across platforms. I've got it worked out now, I think. Just had to do some fiddling to make it all work. D From vince.darley@eurobios.com Mon Mar 17 10:18:48 2003 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HGImC13435 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:18:48 -0600 Received: from trapper.eurobios.com ([212.134.222.3]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id AAR37769 (AUTH vincedarley); Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:21:15 GMT Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030317162005.020d9c70@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:21:20 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] The running executable In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Ah, wait... I think I know what you're up to - yes, to make a > > copy of tclkit as file you should be able to unmount, copy, and remount > > with no ill effects. > > On the ball as always. 0-] That's what I'm doing. I've already got >it figured out. I just had some trouble across platforms. I've got it >worked out now, I think. Just had to do some fiddling to make it all >work. It might be nice to add a "standard" procedure to tclvfs's 'vfsUtils.tcl' to do this. cheers, Vince. From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 17 10:26:34 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HGQYC14156 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:26:34 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:28:58 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030317105705.AAB3275@cas.org> Message-Id: <8DAD917A-5895-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Re: am I using a new genkit > > yes - I fetched it this morning. That's a borad term - nanosecond accuracy, please ;) > This is SPARC Solaris 8 on a SunBlade 100 using gcc 2.95.3 . > > However, for the build attempt this morning, I didn't delete the build > directory - just the src and tars contents. > > I'm rerunning now with the build gone as well. > > That doesn't help - I continue to see the error previously reported. Does adding the following env var help? TCL_LIBRARY=`pwd`/noarch/lib/tcl8.4 -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Mon Mar 17 10:30:09 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HGU9C14496 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:30:09 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2HGWUKV023814 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:32:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2HGWUB17016; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:32:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:32:30 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030317113230.AAB16924@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] peculiar tclkit / kitten.kit / code problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I was looking at the report on comp.lang.tcl about a problem using activetcl 8.4.2.0 on windows with the wiki page http://mini.net/tcl/3150 code. So I saved the code off into a file, and ran it first with wish 8.4.2 . That worked fine. Next, I tried it with the march 17, 2003 Tclkit on windows. I quickly was reminded (via error) that tcllib was not in tclkit. So I take the latest kitten.kit, do a source kitten.kit within the tclkit, and then source in the above code. That's when I get this error: % source tabdisp.tk couldn't load library "C:\TEMP\c3\TCL4.tmp": invalid argument I thought that was a peculiar error, so I decided to try it with the 2003/03/11 12:08:39 48747-56108 /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit version of tclkit. I get this error with it: couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tcl8Fa4_G": ld.so.1: tclkit: fatal: /var/tmp/tcl8Fa4_G: wrong ELF data format: ELFDATA2LSB I don't know if this indicates that the current kitten.kit is broken, that tclkit is broken, or that the code on the above page won't work with tclkit... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From usus@aladyn.de Mon Mar 17 10:34:05 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HGY4C14860 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:34:04 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id B4E734DE50; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:36:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 60BF92EF19; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:36:32 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: "Larry W. Virden" , Starkit list Subject: Re: Problems building latest tclkit [Was: Re: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:36:32 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <20030317072853.AAB28332@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20030317072853.AAB28332@cas.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030317163632.60BF92EF19@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Same with me. I downloaded genkit and tars this afternoon. uname -a: SunOS sigoslab160 5.8 Generic_108528-18 sun4u sparc SUNW,Sun-Blade-100 Best regards Ulrich On Monday 17 March 2003 13:28, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Well, after reading your note this morning, I removed the source > directories and tar files in my tclkit build directory, fetched the latest > genkit, and begin building on my Sunblad 100, with gcc/g++ version 2.95.3 . > > Here's what I saw: > fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz > fetching tars/tk.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz > fetching tars/itcl.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/itcl.tar.gz > fetching tars/mk.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/mk.tar.gz > fetching tars/vfs.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/vfs.tar.gz > fetching tars/kit.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/kit.tar.gz > fetching tars/zlib.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/zlib.tar.gz > tcl: > sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok > make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok > make install-binaries install-... ok > /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26aw... ok > Done. > application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in > the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 > /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library > /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library > /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library > > > > This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. > > zlib: > sh /ldatae/tclkit/build/lwv26a... ok > make libz.a ... ok > vfs: > sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok > make binaries ... ok > mk: > sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok > make libmk4tcl.la ... ok > kitsh: > gcc -c -I. -I/ldatae/tclkit/sr... ok > g++ -R/projects/gnu/sparc-sun-... ok > strip kitsh ... ok > ls -l /ldatae/tclkit/install/l... ok > itcldyn: > sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok > make binaries ITCL_LIBRARY= ... ok > make install-binaries ... ok > tkdyn: > sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok > make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok > make install-binaries ... ok > Done. > application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in > the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 > /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library > /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library > /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library > > > > This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. > > application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in > the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 > /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library > /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library > /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library > > > > This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. > > info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} > tclkit_version = 200303 > tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian > tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u > tcl_platform(os) = SunOS > tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 > tcl_platform(platform) = unix > tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 > tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 > package Itcl = 3.3 > package Tk = 8.4 > running dummy-lwv26awu > application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in > the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 > /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library > /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library > /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library > > > > This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. > > info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} > tclkit_version = 200303 > tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian > tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u > tcl_platform(os) = SunOS > tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 > tcl_platform(platform) = unix > tcl_platform(user) = lwv26 > tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 > package Itcl = 3.3 > package Tk = 8.4 > running dummy-lwv26awu > application-specific initialization failed: Can't find a usable init.tcl in > the following directories: {} /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/lib/tcl8.4 > /ldatae/tclkit/install/lib/tcl8.4 /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu/library > /ldatae/tclkit/install/library /ldatae/tclkit/install/tcl8.4.2/library > /ldatae/tclkit/tcl8.4.2/library > > > > This probably means that Tcl wasn't installed properly. > > tclkit-lwv26awu: 1588893 -> 1997246 From lvirden@cas.org Mon Mar 17 10:57:05 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2HGv4C16827 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:57:04 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2HGxQKV002895 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:59:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2HGxQT02705; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:59:26 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:59:26 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030317115926.AAB17118@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit 200303.001 In-Reply-To: <8DAD917A-5895-11D7-868F-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:28:58 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > Larry W. Virden wrote: > > > Re: am I using a new genkit > > > > yes - I fetched it this morning. > > That's a borad term - nanosecond accuracy, please ;) Each time I start to build a tclkit I fetch a fresh genkit to ensure I have the latest changes. The latest fetch of http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit was this morning at 11:35 AM EST HOWEVER, the genkit has a date of March 13, at 12:05 on it (wget keeps the date of the remote file). The CVS info on this genkit is: # $Id: genkit,v 1.52 2003/03/13 17:05:03 wcvs Exp $ Is there a different place we should be getting genkit? > Does adding the following env var help? > > TCL_LIBRARY=`pwd`/noarch/lib/tcl8.4 yes, it does. The warnings go away at that point. One note of interest: the warning messages I was getting came from the genkit processing; it _appeared_ to me that the tclkit that was generated found the init.tcl appropriately. It was only during the steps of building the tclkit that I saw the errors. Now I see no errors. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Mar 17 18:42:58 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2I0gvC19319 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 18:42:57 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 01:45:21 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] small tweak to genkit needed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Last buglet spasms... The genkit script failed on some platforms, because of the new tighter loading seacurity. You may not even have noticed it, because this is a failure in the last step of "genkit B tcl", which is not truly a problem for tclkit itself. But it is for me - because of the failure, my scripts do no have the information needed to deal with result-*.tar.gz files. I can only humbly beg for your continued help to get this right... - first off, please check the status page on the web: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/status.html - if the build you sent is not listed with date 3/17, then please follow the following steps - else all is ok for you - fetch http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit again - the file has a CVS header which says: $Id: genkit,v 1.56 2003/03/18 00:30:12 wcvs Exp $ - run at least the following commands (of the 7 std steps): tclsh genkit B tcl sh genkit C - check the output of "cat out/`hostname`/tcl" - the end of that file should contain a parray dump of tcl_platform Then, please email the result-*.tar.gz file once more. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 18 08:13:48 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IEDlC26909 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:13:47 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2IEG9KV023161 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:16:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2IEG9h18618; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:16:09 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:16:09 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030318091609.AAB13934@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] if you encounter problems with dynamic libstdc++ resolution Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks to Steve Landers and a long series of tests, I have found a new way to resolve things so that genkit builds without apparent error. Before invoking genkit, do the following: CXXFLAGS="-Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++" export CXXFLAGS and mk's configure will complete successfully. I don't know if there is a better way to tell genkit to do this. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 18 08:41:05 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IEf4C29238 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:41:04 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2IEhRKV003381 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:43:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2IEhRH19385; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:43:27 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:43:27 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030318094327.AAB19336@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit to see if it is working? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tcl and many of its extensions come with test suites that allow someone to get some feeling as to whether things are pieced together properly. Has anyone considered a starkit which might exercise a tclkit to see if the various extensions, etc. are working? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From max@suse.de Tue Mar 18 08:51:43 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IEpgC30316 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:51:43 -0600 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6D3A14653; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:54:12 +0100 (MET) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:54:11 +0100 (CET) From: Reinhard Max To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit to see if it is working? In-Reply-To: <20030318094327.AAB19336@cas.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, On Tue, 18 Mar 2003 at 09:43, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Tcl and many of its extensions come with test suites that allow > someone to get some feeling as to whether things are pieced together > properly. > > Has anyone considered a starkit which might exercise a tclkit to see > if the various extensions, etc. are working? I emailed jcw half an hour ago, that I might start writing a simple test suite for tclkits. I didn't think of packaging it as a starkit, but now that you mention it, it feels just natural. I think such a testsuite would only have to ensure, that all packages are there, and can be loaded and used, because the packages themselves have already been tested with their own test suite while building tclkit. cu Reinhard From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 18 09:07:32 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IF7WC31749 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:07:32 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2IF9tKV012672 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:09:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2IF9tu19859; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:09:55 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:09:55 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030318100955.AAB19850@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit to In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:54:11 +0100 (CET) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Funny how those things work out. So genkit does run all the test suites? That's good. What else might 'go wrong' from the point of view of code within a tclkit as opposed to testing the code outside the tclkit? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Tue Mar 18 09:22:06 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IFM6C00403 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:22:06 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:23:23 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:23:23 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit tosee if it is working? Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:23:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I think such a testsuite would only have to ensure, that all > packages are there, and can be loaded and used, because the > packages themselves have already been tested with their own > test suite while building tclkit. I don't think that genkit runs any test suites. There is a line which runs a simple "hello world" wish test. After running genkit, I stepped into the tcl src directory and ran the Tcl test suite, like this: cd src/tcl/tests ../../../tclkit- all.tcl But I got lots of errors. A few of them were HP-UX specific problems with the file system. Lots of errors were because of encodings which tclkit does not include. Many tests skipped because tclkit wasn't compiled with "tcltest", "testobj", or other test related options. I also tried running tests for itcl, mk, and vfs with similar results. I think it would be helpful to have a test suite just for the tclkit, which would properly ignore the tests tclkit cannot complete. Then a simple diff between tclkit and vanilla tcl/tk/itcl/etc test suites would highlight any problems that the tclkit might have. I don't know if the best way to test would be to add code to genkit or have a separate starkit or an extra test script in the genkit directory. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 18 09:35:24 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IFZOC01506 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:35:24 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2IFbkKV024055 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:37:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2IFbkw20646; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:37:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:37:46 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030318103746.AAB20592@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit tosee if it is working? In-Reply-To: of Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:23:16 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hmm - this is weird. I just cd'd into my tclkit/build/`hostname`/tcl directory and typed make test. The tests all succeeded. I'm wondering whether Tcl's test suite setup is perhaps not stand alone enough - if perhaps it is picking up information from the tcl that I have installed elsewhere. I mean, even the encoding test, etc. passed. I would be really happy about the test results - if I didn't have a fear that I can no longer trust "make test" ... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From max@suse.de Tue Mar 18 09:39:35 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IFdYC01863 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:39:34 -0600 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C7F414729; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:42:04 +0100 (MET) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:41:58 +0100 (CET) From: Reinhard Max To: "Techentin, Robert W." Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit tosee if it is working? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tue, 18 Mar 2003 at 09:23, Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > I don't think that genkit runs any test suites. > > There is a line which runs a simple "hello world" wish test. Oops, you are right. Don't know how I got the impression the Tcl testsuite would be executed durin build. cu Reinhard From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Mar 18 09:42:49 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IFgnC02132 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:42:49 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h2IFjJK6010866 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:45:19 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA12638 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:43:09 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2IFjHT15333 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:45:17 -0600 Message-ID: <3E773F0B.10852AC6@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:45:15 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit tosee if it is working? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Reinhard, > > Tcl and many of its extensions come with test suites that allow > > someone to get some feeling as to whether things are pieced together > > properly. > > > > Has anyone considered a starkit which might exercise a tclkit to see > > if the various extensions, etc. are working? > > I emailed jcw half an hour ago, that I might start writing a simple > test suite for tclkits. I didn't think of packaging it as a starkit, > but now that you mention it, it feels just natural. > > I think such a testsuite would only have to ensure, that all packages > are there, and can be loaded and used, because the packages themselves > have already been tested with their own test suite while building > tclkit. I suggested added testing to the genkit after the previous round of build, and Bob Techentin responded with the following: --- I ran the tcl test suite from within the source directory. cd src/tcl/tests ../../../tclkit- all.tcl >& test.log I didn't make any effort to run any other test suite. --- So I added these rules to my make file test-tcl: cd src/tcl/tests ; \ ../../../tclkit-$(HOSTNAME) all.tcl 2>&1 | tee test.log test-tk: cd src/tk/tests ; \ ../../../tclkit-$(HOSTNAME) all.tcl 2>&1 | tee test.log and ran the tests. The test run but a large number of errors were generated (which isn't very helpful). There appears to be two primary causes of the problems. The first is an apparent lack of font encodings required by the tests (see example). ---- Result was: unknown encoding "jis0208" ---- Result should have been (exact matching): The second appears to be related to the tree structure for the build (see example) ---- Result was: couldn't open "/home/xxxxx/UNPACK/Tcl_Tk/BuildTclKit/src/tk/tests/../../../tclkit-arbok/lib/tk8.4/images/pwrdLogo150.gif": no such file or directory ---- Result should have been (exact matching): My conclusion is that running the standard test suit will not be possible with out some major changes to the way tclkit is built (which is unfortunate). Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 18 09:52:57 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IFqvC02996 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:52:57 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2IFtJKV029444 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:55:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2IFtJG20876; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:55:19 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:55:19 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030318105519.AAB20833@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone thought about a way to test a tclkit tosee if In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:45:15 -0700 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I just attempted to run the tests of each of the packages. I cd'd into the build directory for each piece of tclkit and typed "make test". I did NOT attempt to run the tests using tclkit. Tcl and zlib tests were completely successful. The Tk test had the same 4 errors I always see. The vfs test failed in the same manner it always fails for me. The itcldyn failed with 2 errors, which I have sent to itcl mailing list for comment. The mk test program would not even build... I get the error: $ make test /bin/sh ./libtool --mode=link g++ -static -o regress regress.o tbasic1.o tbasic2.o tcusto1.o tcusto2.o tdiffer.o textend.o tformat.o tlimits.o tmapped.o tnotify.o tresize.o tstore1.o tstore2.o tstore3.o tstore4.o tstore5.o libmk4.la g++ -o regress regress.o tbasic1.o tbasic2.o tcusto1.o tcusto2.o tdiffer.o textend.o tformat.o tlimits.o tmapped.o tnotify.o tresize.o tstore1.o tstore2.o tstore3.o tstore4.o tstore5.o ./.libs/libmk4.a -lstdc++ test -d tests || mkdir tests test -d ../tests/ok/CVS && (test -d tests/CVS || mkdir tests/CVS) make: [test] Error 1 (ignored) test -f reversed || cp ../../../src/mk/unix/reversed . ./regress ld.so.1: ./regress: fatal: libstdc++.so.2.10.0: open failed: No such file or directory make: *** [test] Killed I have yet to figure out how to get libtool to cooperate in creating regress with libstdc++ linked statically. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Tue Mar 18 12:11:54 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IIBrC16272 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 12:11:54 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 12:14:18 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 12:14:17 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 12:14:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Subject: [Starkit] Unresolved symbol in dyntk (Xbell) on OSF1 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: We just happen to have a DEC Alpha running OSF1 v4.0, and I wanted to try building tclkit there, too. It is an older box running legacy applications. We don't have a license to the 'cxx' compiler any more, so I built gcc/g++, wget, and tcl/tk 8.4.2 to give me enough tools to run the genkit process. The build looked successful (no errors during compile and link), but when it tries to run the simple wish test, it fails with couldn't load file "install/tie/lib/libtk8.4.so": Unresolved symbol in install/tie/lib/libtk8.4.so: XBell Sure enough, I can't 'package require Tk' for this tclkit. Has anybody seen this sort of problem before? Do I need to add an explicit X11 link? Or is it likely that something has just corroded on this machine's configuration? Thanks, Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 18 12:32:59 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IIWwC18570 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 12:32:58 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2IIZLKV024073 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 13:35:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2IIZLQ23785; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 13:35:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 13:35:21 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030318133521.AAB23744@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Unresolved symbol in dyntk (Xbell) on OSF1 In-Reply-To: of Tue, 18 Mar 2003 12:14:12 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: XBell unresolved On your system, do you have a man page for XBell ? Maybe your system doesn't have that function - though it seems unlikely. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 18 13:42:46 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IJgjC25222 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 13:42:45 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 20:45:10 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Unresolved symbol in dyntk (Xbell) on OSF1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <21209317-597A-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > We just happen to have a DEC Alpha running OSF1 v4.0, and I wanted to > try > building tclkit there, too. It is an older box running legacy > applications. [...] > The build looked successful (no errors during compile and link), but > when it > tries to run the simple wish test, it fails with > > couldn't load file "install/tie/lib/libtk8.4.so": Unresolved > symbol in install/tie/lib/libtk8.4.so: XBell > > Sure enough, I can't 'package require Tk' for this tclkit. Has > anybody seen > this sort of problem before? Do I need to add an explicit X11 link? > Or is > it likely that something has just corroded on this machine's > configuration? This looks very much like the same problem reported for a few other platforms recently. The issue is that "kitsh", the main app, is not linked against -lX11, so it can run as tclsh equivalent on machines withou X11 installed. Then the Tk extension gets loaded in an environment which has lot yet loaded X11 libs. And fails... Conclusion - Tk needs to have these options added to the link: -L/use/X11R6/lib -lX11 If anyone knows exactly what magic incantations to add to genkit, I'll do it right away. Probably something like LDFLAGS= - but I'm not too much an expert in all this autoconf stuff (I just fudge my way around, like most mortals on this planet :) Note that this issue is kind of new for Tcl/Tk, which used to build either as tclsh main (which needs no X) or as wish (which links to X in the main, not the shared lib, on some platforms). Linux seems to get the link right - for some reason... -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 18 14:25:12 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IKPBC29782 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 14:25:11 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 21:27:37 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Message-Id: <0F41E44C-5980-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2IKPBC29782 Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit build progress Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It appears that tclkit builds are back on track, more or less. If we can settle the X11 linking issue, I am confident the rest will be minimal tweaking, at most. Check this out, folks: 20 platform builds ready to go, at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.2/ (a few more binaries, to cover for win32 and linux-x86 variations) Thanks to the efforts of... drum roll please! :) Steve Blinkhorn Donal Fellows Tom Krehbiel Steve Landers Reinhard Max Bryan Oakley Mark Roseman Ulrich Schöbel Pat Thoyts With a extra round of applause please for Reinhard Max, who fired up the SuSE build colossus to deliver 9 (nine!) Linux builds, including some neat 64-bit ones! There will be more as time progresses, I'm sure, but already this turns Tcl/Tk into an infrastructure which should hugely widen the reach of existing and yet-to-be invented scripted applications. Add to that the Starkit packaging system, which works across the board as well as on all ActiveTcl distributions, and I think it is safe to conclude that we now have a unique open source system in place for software development *and* deployment. Never before has the setting for Tcl/Tk-based software been so fertile. Just add your killer app scripts! :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 18 16:08:48 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IM8lC08871 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:08:48 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 23:11:11 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <86C5EBD9-598E-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: A few people have recently commented on wikit font sizes in local mode (this is also an issue when used as embedded help system, which is why I'm posting this on this more general starkit mailing list). Right now, local mode use is hardwired into wikit. From gui.tcl: # accomodate platform differences - on some Unices the helvetica font # appears smaller for a given point size. set family helvetica set title 16 set default 9 set thin 4 set buttonsize 9 switch $tcl_platform(os) { Darwin { set default 11 ; set buttonsize 10} Linux { set default 10 } Windows* { set family arial } } catch { font create wikit_default -family $family -size $default font create wikit_underline -family $family -size $default \ -underline true font create wikit_button -family $family -size $buttonsize font create wikit_title -family $family -size $title -weight bold font create wikit_edit -family courier -size $default -weight normal font create wikit_fixed -family courier -size $default -weight bold font create wikit_thin -family courier -size $thin font create wikit_bold -family $family -size $default -weight bold font create wikit_italic -family $family -size $default -slant italic font create wikit_bolditalic -family $family -size $default \ -weight bold -slant italic gButton::init -bg $Color::wikiBg -font wikit_button -disabledfill $Color::btnDisable } It seems to me that we can now do better than that, give the X options database and the fact that wikit will run on more and more platforms as tclkits spread themselves further and further. Is there a Tk font guru in the room who would like to review and improve on this logic? My first reaction was to carry out a proposal to make local-mode wikit source a ~/.wikitrc file so things become configurable, but until the above is streamlined it looks like this would make no difference. To summarize: the context in which configuration appears to be important, is when running wikit in local mode (this is where ~/.wikitrc would come in), but perhaps even more importantly is the case of running wikit as embedded help system. How does one make such a help system play nice with a huge variety of usage scenario's? -jcw From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Tue Mar 18 16:55:23 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IMtMC12995 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:55:23 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:57:52 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:57:52 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:57:50 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I haven't done extensive testing myself, but the suggestions on the "Practical Guide to Choosing Fonts" page at http://mini.net/tcl/451 seem to indicate that a combination of font family and size is appropriate for each platform. Kevin Kenny also posted code for using [tk scaling] properly. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Mar 18 17:07:05 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2IN75C13963 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:07:05 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h2IN9Z5Y018609 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:09:35 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA10979 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:07:24 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2IN9XT16208 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:09:33 -0600 Message-ID: <3E77A72B.93284FC0@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:09:31 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <86C5EBD9-598E-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, If we do fonts we should also do colors. I'm no expert but will make the changes to the code if we can agree on how to implement the configuration control. Using .wikitrc files seems reasonable. I would normally use the following hierarchy for setting options: 1) defaults (Level 20 Options) 2) ~/.wikitrc (Level 40 Options) 3) ./.wikitrc (Level 60 Options) Does this seem reasonable? It ignores the possibility of having site level (i.e. network wide) default setting. Tom K. > > A few people have recently commented on wikit font sizes in local mode > (this is also an issue when used as embedded help system, which is why > I'm posting this on this more general starkit mailing list). > > Right now, local mode use is hardwired into wikit. From gui.tcl: > > # accomodate platform differences - on some Unices the helvetica > font > # appears smaller for a given point size. > set family helvetica > set title 16 > set default 9 > set thin 4 > set buttonsize 9 > switch $tcl_platform(os) { > Darwin { set default 11 ; set buttonsize 10} > Linux { set default 10 } > Windows* { set family arial } > } > catch { > font create wikit_default -family $family -size $default > font create wikit_underline -family $family -size $default \ > -underline true > font create wikit_button -family $family -size $buttonsize > font create wikit_title -family $family -size $title -weight > bold > font create wikit_edit -family courier -size $default -weight > normal > font create wikit_fixed -family courier -size $default -weight > bold > font create wikit_thin -family courier -size $thin > font create wikit_bold -family $family -size $default -weight > bold > font create wikit_italic -family $family -size $default -slant > italic > font create wikit_bolditalic -family $family -size $default \ > -weight bold -slant italic > > gButton::init -bg $Color::wikiBg -font wikit_button > -disabledfill $Color::btnDisable > } > > It seems to me that we can now do better than that, give the X options > database and the fact that wikit will run on more and more platforms as > tclkits spread themselves further and further. Is there a Tk font guru > in the room who would like to review and improve on this logic? > > My first reaction was to carry out a proposal to make local-mode wikit > source a ~/.wikitrc file so things become configurable, but until the > above is streamlined it looks like this would make no difference. > > To summarize: the context in which configuration appears to be > important, is when running wikit in local mode (this is where > ~/.wikitrc would come in), but perhaps even more importantly is the > case of running wikit as embedded help system. How does one make such > a help system play nice with a huge variety of usage scenario's? > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Mar 18 17:11:18 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2INBIC14365 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:11:18 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h2INDoHB000079 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:13:50 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA13624 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:13:48 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2INDkT18891 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:13:46 -0600 Message-ID: <3E77A829.54F71580@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:13:45 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rob, > I haven't done extensive testing myself, but the suggestions on the > "Practical Guide to Choosing Fonts" page at http://mini.net/tcl/451 seem to > indicate that a combination of font family and size is appropriate for each > platform. Kevin Kenny also posted code for using [tk scaling] properly. If the defaults can be overridden by a user, it seems to me that having perfect default settings is less of an issue. Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 18 17:16:51 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2INGpC14837 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:16:51 -0600 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 00:19:14 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E77A72B.93284FC0@motorola.com> Message-Id: <08C8659C-5998-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > If we do fonts we should also do colors. I'm no expert but will make > the changes to the code if we can agree on how to implement the > configuration control. Using .wikitrc files seems reasonable. Yes, .wikitrc seems ok for local mode wikit use, but I'm not sure about embedded help. If that gets into a product, people probably won't want it to just source things. My suggestions match yours, with as extra that help systems don't source, but expect sensible defaults to work, or ro have been adjusted before use. Having fonts with wikit* names is probable enough. No site level settings please. It just creates clashes over time. And state which gets forgotten about. If you want to manage the changes for this - that would be great! -jcw From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Tue Mar 18 17:17:55 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2INHtC14944 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:17:55 -0600 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h2INKPpD051590; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:20:25 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:20:25 -0600 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Tom Krehbiel Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: <3E77A72B.93284FC0@motorola.com> References: <86C5EBD9-598E-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <3E77A72B.93284FC0@motorola.com> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "TK" == Tom Krehbiel writes: TK> If we do fonts we should also do colors. I'm no expert but will TK> make the changes [...] Thanks! On my machine, the local wikit fonts are so tiny I can't read them. TK> [...] to the code if we can agree on how to implement TK> the configuration control. Using .wikitrc files seems TK> reasonable. I would normally use the following hierarchy for TK> setting options: TK> 1) defaults (Level 20 Options) TK> 2) ~/.wikitrc (Level 40 Options) TK> 3) ./.wikitrc (Level 60 Options) I would avoid using a ./.wikitrc due to the security problems you get with config files in the current directory. That is, assuming that these rc files would contain tcl code that would be eval'ed, as opposed to some other format that would merely be parsed. Or maybe I'm missing something -- I've never used the Tk option stuff. /k -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Song of the Moment: Edison's Memos (Robert Pollard and his Soft Rock Renegades) From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Mar 18 17:28:18 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2INSIC15806 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:28:18 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h2INUmXX016017 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:30:48 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id QAA00183 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:30:48 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2INUjT29576 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:30:46 -0600 Message-ID: <3E77AC24.D6DFA432@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:30:44 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <08C8659C-5998-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, I'm not proposing that the code "source" a file. I'm proposing the use of the tk "option" command which has "option readfile fileName ?priority?". I don't know the details of this command but I would assume that it is safe to use (i.e. prevents interpretation of code in the file). I'm I missing some in my approach? Tom K. > > If we do fonts we should also do colors. I'm no expert but will make > > the changes to the code if we can agree on how to implement the > > configuration control. Using .wikitrc files seems reasonable. > > Yes, .wikitrc seems ok for local mode wikit use, but I'm not sure about > embedded help. If that gets into a product, people probably won't want > it to just source things. > > My suggestions match yours, with as extra that help systems don't > source, but expect sensible defaults to work, or ro have been adjusted > before use. Having fonts with wikit* names is probable enough. > > No site level settings please. It just creates clashes over time. And > state which gets forgotten about. > > If you want to manage the changes for this - that would be great! From jcw@equi4.com Tue Mar 18 17:45:26 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2INjPC17314 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:45:26 -0600 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 00:47:49 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E77AC24.D6DFA432@motorola.com> Message-Id: <06C5499E-599C-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > I'm not proposing that the code "source" a file. I'm proposing the use > of the tk "option" command which has "option readfile fileName > ?priority?". I don't know the details of this command but I would > assume that it is safe to use [...] Ah, ok. Not sure - depends on whether you would want to allow any other configurability than "just" X options at some point in time. I was assuming "option add ..." commands in ~/.wikitrc, but I'll stop poking my nose into things I really don't know enough about. -jcw From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Tue Mar 18 19:55:01 2003 Received: from hewey.iland.net (qmailr@hewey.iland.net [205.242.230.200]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2J1t0C27776 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:55:01 -0600 Received: (qmail 22841 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 01:57:16 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-19.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.19) by hewey.iland.net with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 01:57:16 -0000 Message-ID: <017b01c2edba$b6b4d700$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack resource string modifications? Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:55:43 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 3/18/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Seeing no response in 8 days, I thought I'd cast this one out again... Thanks for any input. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 11:31 AM Subject: [Starkit] Starpack resource string modifications? > Hi All, > > On 11/4/02, Will Duquette started a short-lived discussion about the > possibility of modifying the resource strings that appear inside a starpack > (at least under Windows). The latest tclkit/sdx creates a starpack with the > following resource strings: > > Company Name: Equi4 Software > Language: English (United States) > Original Filename: tclkit.exe > Product Name: Tclkit 8.4 for Windows > Product Version: 8.4.2 > > I know that we now have the ability to change the program icon (which is > great, thanks!), but I don't see any mention of modifying any of the above > info. Is this available (and I missed it), still being considered, or > likely not to happen at all? > > IIRC, the above strings are *much* cleaner than some previous builds, but it > would be nice to (be able to) modify them to suit particular needs... > > Just curious... > > Thanks, > > > > Jeff Godfrey > Optimation USA > Phone: 816.836.2000 > Fax : 816.836.8589 > Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Mar 19 01:19:04 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2J7J3C09750 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 01:19:03 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA16459 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:21:33 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA16294 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:21:25 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E781A75.D8379AC9@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:21:25 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <86C5EBD9-598E-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > A few people have recently commented on wikit font sizes in local mode > (this is also an issue when used as embedded help system, which is why > I'm posting this on this more general starkit mailing list). > > > It seems to me that we can now do better than that, give the X options > database and the fact that wikit will run on more and more platforms as > tclkits spread themselves further and further. Is there a Tk font guru > in the room who would like to review and improve on this logic? > > My first reaction was to carry out a proposal to make local-mode wikit > source a ~/.wikitrc file so things become configurable, but until the > above is streamlined it looks like this would make no difference. > > To summarize: the context in which configuration appears to be > important, is when running wikit in local mode (this is where > ~/.wikitrc would come in), but perhaps even more importantly is the > case of running wikit as embedded help system. How does one make such > a help system play nice with a huge variety of usage scenario's? > I want to chime in with Tom Krehbiel: on my UNIX system I get white text on a white background, which as you all can imagine is not very readable. (Of course, me being the local UNIX guru, I can solve this by an incantation involving "echo", "xrdb" and file name manipulation, but it remains a nuisance). My preferences would be: black text on white background (both need to be set explicitly!) and have the user select other colours via the usual mechanisms. Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Mar 19 01:21:13 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2J7LDC09897 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 01:21:13 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA18425 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:23:43 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA18270 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:23:36 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E781AF8.7A8253EF@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:23:36 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <86C5EBD9-598E-11D7-90D9-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <3E77A72B.93284FC0@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > > >>>>> "TK" == Tom Krehbiel writes: > > TK> If we do fonts we should also do colors. I'm no expert but will > TK> make the changes [...] > > Thanks! On my machine, the local wikit fonts are so tiny I can't read > them. > > TK> [...] to the code if we can agree on how to implement > TK> the configuration control. Using .wikitrc files seems > TK> reasonable. I would normally use the following hierarchy for > TK> setting options: > > TK> 1) defaults (Level 20 Options) > TK> 2) ~/.wikitrc (Level 40 Options) > TK> 3) ./.wikitrc (Level 60 Options) > > I would avoid using a ./.wikitrc due to the security problems you get > with config files in the current directory. That is, assuming that > these rc files would contain tcl code that would be eval'ed, as > opposed to some other format that would merely be parsed. > > Or maybe I'm missing something -- I've never used the Tk option stuff. > YOu can do a safe sourcing of a .wikitrc file - I will publish a solution on the Wiki today! Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Wed Mar 19 02:39:33 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2J8dWC13977; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 02:39:32 -0600 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:41:56 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Metakit performance datapoint Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: With the caveat that benchmarks can be made to prove anything, and that I will mention only what suits me best, here's a pointer to some recent benchmarks in which Metakit was included: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/ forum.php?thread_id=1811280&forum_id=1100 (the sqlite timings are hard to put in perspective: different machine) I'll just add one comment, about the fact that one MK timing appears to have O(N^2) performance: this has been coded without blocked or hashed views. Thanks to Gordon for pointing these timings out. Make sure you get the orders of magnitude right when interpreting these numbers :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Mar 19 03:10:06 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2J9A5C15901; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 03:10:05 -0600 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 10:12:30 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Starkit list To: Metakit mailing list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] Free-riding on open source software Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is an issue which I want to bring up *before* it becomes a serious problem. As you know, Metakit is open source software. It has evolved and grown as an independent product over a period of 7 years now, the second half of which in open source form, using the liberal X11/MIT open source license. As you may or may not know, my company also offers a commercial "Metakit Enterprise License" for those who require a more formal level of support (one year at a time) and for those who wish to support me and my work on Metakit to make it a sustainable activity. See http://www.equi4.com/metakit/license.html I am pleased to report that the number of Enterprise License customers is increasing, with a few particularly loyal customers renewing the license on a yearly basis. But at the same time, I see an alarming trend. There are *several* major companies by now, which have based some of their commercial offerings heavily on Metakit, yet who have not - for quite some time in some cases - taken the step to purchase an Enterprise License. I am willing to assume that this is because I do not tend to make a fuss about that side of things - the option may not even be known to some. The "Prisoner's Dilemma" insight, which comes from game theory, illustrates how it is very logical for parties to leave cost issues up to others, i.e. "if others pay, why stick my neck out?", and "if they are not paying, why should I?". Unfortunately, in the case of MK, theory and practice need to be in sync. Like most mortals on this planet, "food on the table" as well as "financial reward" are very real concepts to me. I have chosen the path of making Metakit open source, and sharing inordinate amounts of my time with others, on the basis that commercial projects are what will keep me going, while MK (and the derived Tclkit project) are "spin-offs". And they are, and it works (yes, trust me, it does!). Equi4 Software has allowed me to be independent for almost 14 years by now, and I see no reason why that could not last. As I have said a few times in the past, independence is more than not having a boss: it also is a crucial foundation for thinking outside the box. But there is an inequality which worries me. Some highly commercial companies, for which the cost of a Metakit Enterprise License is almost too low to take seriously, are relying on Metakit, its data structures, and most importantly: the data of their customers. They make their business model work using open source, yet do not "give back" or "do the right thing". The reason this concerns me is not what you probably think. I'm not talking about my bottom line, or having a hard time making a living (though I've seen better years, yes). The problem is the future of my work. I am currently working on a number of new implementation ideas, which take some of the lessons and experiences learned from Metakit *way* further. That means I'm contemplating moving away more from paid contract work, and focusing almost exclusively on design, architecture, and algorithms. Having a more independent level of funding would free me more to work on such things. And share them, as I *very* much would like to. But to do so, I urge those of you who have incorporated Metakit into your commercial products, or plan to do so, to broaden your perspective and think ahead just a bit further. Without a certain level of financial support, I will be forced to reconsider the proprietary option. I'm not saying this lightly. FWIW, I strongly believe in the strength of open source software - and the quality benefits it brings to everyone involved. For something as fundamental as long-lived data storage, it's more than a nice ideology - it's crucial IMO. It's hard for me as techie to refrain from talking about the ideas themselves here, I can assure you. All I'll say for now is: you ain't seen nothin' yet, the data concepts which lie underneath Metakit are in their infancy. I'm talking orders of magnitude in both performance and scalability, and with today's CPU architectures the trade-offs are in fact getting more and more in favor of MK's approach. With your help, we can sit on the same side of the table and have a shared interest. Please don't force me to work in secrecy. -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Mar 19 03:21:35 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2J9LYC17072 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 03:21:34 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id KAA19425 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 10:24:05 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA18871 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 10:23:52 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E783728.B7EF7B@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 10:23:52 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] Configuration data References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, as I promised, I have put my little experiment with a safe way of adding configuration data on the Wiki: I also have some experience with the option database in Tk (and the one found in X11 directly :). So, if I can contribute to the wikit issue, please let me know. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 19 05:41:18 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JBfHC25957 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 05:41:17 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2JBheGd020533 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 06:43:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2JBhfJ27413; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 06:43:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 06:43:41 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030319064340.AAB27395@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Configuration data In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 19 Mar 2003 10:23:52 +0100 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Arjen Markus > I also have some experience with the option database in Tk (and the > one found in X11 directly :). So, if I can contribute to the wikit > issue, please let me know. The more we use option setting similar to, or perhaps leveraging off of, the user's environment, the more accepted Tk applications will become. If we can set things up for users to provide xrdb style options in a manner in which other X/Windows/MacOS applications use, and make use of things like style and theme manager X/Windows/MacOS resources, the better users will like the applications. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 19 07:48:20 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JDmKC02484 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 07:48:20 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2JDocGd005968 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:50:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2JDoce29574; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:50:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:50:38 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030319085038.AAB29558@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] starkit/metakit question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Within a starkit, I am seeing a case where the script is attempting to open a metakit file and the open fails with the obscure message: file open failed Is there someway to determine _why_ the file open fails? Perhaps this is some limitation within the starkit structure. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Mar 19 08:03:14 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JE3EC03616 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:03:14 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [3.159.236.67]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2JE5eXZ019995 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:05:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvw03.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2JE5XIU027738 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:05:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.27 by cinmlvw03.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:05:09 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:05:09 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:05:08 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D2@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Thread-Index: AcLt6KtaoZfo4X79So+pKgmHUQLWnwANo2ng From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2003 14:05:09.0236 (UTC) FILETIME=[8D095B40:01C2EE20] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2JE3EC03616 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Not sure I understand all this talk about "sourcing" config data when the tk option data base is perfectly suited for this task. Sample Wikit Option File: *Wikit.defaultFontSize: 12 *Wikit.defaultFontFamily: helvetica *Wikit.defaultFontColor: black *Wikit.defaultFieldBg: white ... then in the code somewhere, something like this: # read default options option readfile $defaultWikitOption ; # some file in the wikit.kit # override defaults with any users or application wikit options if {[file exists $userWikitOptions]} { option readfile $userWikitOptions ; # some other file } # create the fonts font create wikit_default \ -family [option get . Wikit.defaultFontFamily *] \ -size [option get . Wikit.defaultFontSize *] ... # also wanna set the text bg/fg colors, but user could have specified "cheese" for a color if {[catch { $text configure \ -bg [option get . Wikit.defaultFieldBg *] \ -fg [option get . Wikit.defaultFontColor *] } err]} { # log the err and use hard coded defaults $text configure -bg white -fg black } -- Bryan -----Original Message----- From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Arjen Markus Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 2:24 AM To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > > >>>>> "TK" == Tom Krehbiel writes: > > TK> If we do fonts we should also do colors. I'm no expert but will > TK> make the changes [...] > > Thanks! On my machine, the local wikit fonts are so tiny I can't read > them. > > TK> [...] to the code if we can agree on how to implement > TK> the configuration control. Using .wikitrc files seems > TK> reasonable. I would normally use the following hierarchy for > TK> setting options: > > TK> 1) defaults (Level 20 Options) > TK> 2) ~/.wikitrc (Level 40 Options) > TK> 3) ./.wikitrc (Level 60 Options) > > I would avoid using a ./.wikitrc due to the security problems you get > with config files in the current directory. That is, assuming that > these rc files would contain tcl code that would be eval'ed, as > opposed to some other format that would merely be parsed. > > Or maybe I'm missing something -- I've never used the Tk option stuff. > YOu can do a safe sourcing of a .wikitrc file - I will publish a solution on the Wiki today! Regards, Arjen _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Mar 19 08:16:57 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JEGuC04633 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:16:56 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id PAA09855 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:19:27 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA09340 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:19:20 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E787C67.1BCEEC3A@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:19:20 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D2@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" wrote: > > Not sure I understand all this talk about "sourcing" config data when the tk option data base is perfectly suited for this task. > > Sample Wikit Option File: > *Wikit.defaultFontSize: 12 > *Wikit.defaultFontFamily: helvetica > *Wikit.defaultFontColor: black > *Wikit.defaultFieldBg: white > ... > It would apply if you want to make the default system-dependent: if { $tcl_platform(os) == "..." } { set fontsize 12 } etc. Or if there are other data that need to be configurable, such as a title or a client's name etc. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 19 08:25:37 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JEPbC05318 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:25:37 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2JERxGd022303 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:28:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2JES0c00094; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:28:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:28:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030319092759.AAB51@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:19:20 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Arjen Markus > > "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" wrote: > > > > Not sure I understand all this talk about "sourcing" config data when the tk option data base is perfectly suited for this task. Using .rc files, or option database format files, introduces yet another file for deployment. Seems like the wikit should, at the very least, allow the option of storing the configuration information in the wikit.tkd or the wikit.kit file, to keep deployment issues simpler. Perhaps the data should be stored with some sort of tie to the user's name, so that more than one user can manage their own configuration? > It would apply if you want to make the default system-dependent: > > if { $tcl_platform(os) == "..." } { > set fontsize 12 > } Platform dependent attributes seem like a good thing to consider. > Or if there are other data that need to be configurable, such as > a title or a client's name etc. These however can be managed with the Tk options. What _can't_ be done is to use this approach in starkits which cannot depend on Tk being available (such as a cgi accessible wikit) . -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 19 09:45:08 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JFj8C12746 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:45:08 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h2JFld5Y023519 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:47:39 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA28311 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:47:38 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2JFlaT14135 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:47:36 -0600 Message-ID: <3E789116.688D70D0@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:47:34 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030319092759.AAB51@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: All, To clearify several points. 1) I intend to use the tk options database to control both color and font settings in a wikit. 2) A set of reasonable default settings will be included with the wikit code, but they will not be customized based on the platform. 3) The tk option system reads resource defininitions from ~/.Xdefaults at start up on unix systems, so no new resource file will be supported on unix. Is this acceptable? 4) On windows the code will will read resoures using the following code. option readfile [file join $env(HOME) .Xdefaults] Does this seem reasonable to those familiar with windows? Regards, Tom Krehbiel From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 19 09:51:13 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JFpDC13356 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:51:13 -0600 Received: from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h2JFri5Y026198 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:53:44 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id IAA05800 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:53:44 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2JFrfT18628 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 09:53:42 -0600 Message-ID: <3E789285.129E8AF3@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:53:41 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's (more) References: <20030319092759.AAB51@cas.org> <3E789116.688D70D0@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: All, Forgot to mention. 6) The format for resource definitions is the same format used for X resources. Tom K. From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Mar 19 11:49:06 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JHn5C25778 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:49:05 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [3.159.236.67]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2JHpTXZ004655 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:51:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2JHpN4j024311 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:51:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.26 by CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:50:33 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:50:33 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:50:32 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D3@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Thread-Index: AcLuJAJl6/BuP6/FQqCkxJXN7gETewAFvpJA From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2003 17:50:33.0016 (UTC) FILETIME=[09D66B80:01C2EE40] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2JHn5C25778 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: LWW> Using .rc files, or option database format files, introduces yet another LWW> file for deployment. In general for any tk application, a default option file can be included in the kit. Which is, yes, another file, but it is internal to the kit and it *separates* configuration options from the actual software. Furthermore, then it is easy (via vfs) to copy the default file to some user config file that he or she could change to suit their preferences. LWW> Seems like the wikit should, at the very least, allow the option of LWW> storing the configuration information in the wikit.tkd or the wikit.kit LWW> file, to keep deployment issues simpler. This is exactly what I meant with the default option file. LWW> Perhaps the data should be stored with some sort of tie to the user's name, so LWW> that more than one user can manage their own configuration? Then by creating a user specific copy of the option file, to say ~/.some-app-rc, the user can make modification that would be good for *future* version of the application. Storing user specific options inside the kit introduces several problems: 1) What about the next version. The user needs to reset their preferences. 2) In a multiuser environment, the kit now stores everyones preference? What happens if I use the app once, then leave? How would the kit know to remove my now uneeded prefs. 3) What if the kit is installed, by say root on unix, now it has to have write permisions to everyone that intends to use it. Defeating the whole security mechanism. Additionaly, one clever developer could generate a generic option file editor that could be used my any application. Perhaps emedding special comments in the option file would clue the editor in on the proper UI control. Perhaps something like this where type indicates the type of control, this case a font selector: ! option ! name: default group: font desc: The default font used for text ! default: helvetica type: fontname *Wikit.defaultFont AM> It would apply if you want to make the default system-dependent: AM> AM> if { $tcl_platform(os) == "..." } { AM> set fontsize 12 AM> } LWW> Platform dependent attributes seem like a good thing to consider. switch $tcl_platform(os) { unix { set defaultOptFile options.unix } windows { set defaultOptFile options.win } macos { set defaultOptFile options.win } default { set defaultOptFile options.generic } } option readfile $defaultOptFile ... Now we don't have lots of "if" or "switch" statements all over or big blocks of code for each platform to configure things font size. We do however have 3 or more default option files to maintain, but it is much less painful to modify a simple option file than to hunt down and modify a big block of code. Plus if you still want to copy the default option file out to the be user option file, you can now install platform specific user option file with ease and we've managed to keep configuration details *separate* from software. AM> Or if there are other data that need to be configurable, such as AM> a title or a client's name etc. *Wikit.title: some app title *Wikit.clientName: Mr. Pickles *Wikit.favoriteFruit: apple option data base can store non-tk related data LWW> These however can be managed with the Tk options. What _can't_ be done LWW> is to use this approach in starkits which cannot depend on Tk being LWW> available (such as a cgi accessible wikit) . Now we've found a potential problem.... one could at the expense of loading tk in memory: package require Tk wm withdraw . Or spend a few minutes writing a option file parser and non-tk "option" command that could be used for any application in the event Tk is not available. package require tcloptions -- tcloptions.tcl package provide tcloptions 1.0 if {[package versions Tk] == ""} { # no tk present namespace eval ::tcloptions { } proc ::option {subcommand args} { #call ::tcloptions command ... } proc ::tcloptions::readfile {file {priority ""} } { ... } proc ::tcloptions::get { window name class } { ... } proc ::tcloptions::add { pattern value {priority ""}} { ... } proc ::tcloptions::clear {} { ... } } - Anyway these are just my opinions on creating user customizable software. ok, that's my rant :-P bryan From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 19 12:07:11 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JI7BC28140 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:07:11 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h2JI9hEY019214 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:09:44 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA21609 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:09:41 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2JI9dT31238 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:09:40 -0600 Message-ID: <3E78B263.726C4469@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:09:39 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D3@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan, There is already an 'option' command (it is part of the tk distribution). Check the tk doc's for more info. Tom K. > > LWW> Using .rc files, or option database format files, introduces yet another > LWW> file for deployment. > > In general for any tk application, a default option file can be included in the kit. Which is, yes, another file, but it is internal to the kit and it *separates* configuration options from the actual software. Furthermore, then it is easy (via vfs) to copy the default file to some user config file that he or she could change to suit their preferences. > > LWW> Seems like the wikit should, at the very least, allow the option of > LWW> storing the configuration information in the wikit.tkd or the wikit.kit > LWW> file, to keep deployment issues simpler. > > This is exactly what I meant with the default option file. > > LWW> Perhaps the data should be stored with some sort of tie to the user's name, so > LWW> that more than one user can manage their own configuration? > > Then by creating a user specific copy of the option file, to say ~/.some-app-rc, the user can make modification that would be good for *future* version of the application. Storing user specific options inside the kit introduces several problems: > 1) What about the next version. The user needs to reset their preferences. > 2) In a multiuser environment, the kit now stores everyones preference? What happens if I use the app once, then leave? How would the kit know to remove my now uneeded prefs. > 3) What if the kit is installed, by say root on unix, now it has to have write permisions to everyone that intends to use it. Defeating the whole security mechanism. > > Additionaly, one clever developer could generate a generic option file editor that could be used my any application. Perhaps emedding special comments in the option file would clue the editor in on the proper UI control. > Perhaps something like this where type indicates the type of control, this case a font selector: > ! option > ! name: default group: font desc: The default font used for text > ! default: helvetica type: fontname > *Wikit.defaultFont > > AM> It would apply if you want to make the default system-dependent: > AM> > AM> if { $tcl_platform(os) == "..." } { > AM> set fontsize 12 > AM> } > > LWW> Platform dependent attributes seem like a good thing to consider. > > switch $tcl_platform(os) { > unix { set defaultOptFile options.unix } > windows { set defaultOptFile options.win } > macos { set defaultOptFile options.win } > default { set defaultOptFile options.generic } > } > option readfile $defaultOptFile > ... > > Now we don't have lots of "if" or "switch" statements all over or big blocks of code for each platform to configure things font size. We do however have 3 or more default option files to maintain, but it is much less painful to modify a simple option file than to hunt down and modify a big block of code. Plus if you still want to copy the default option file out to the be user option file, you can now install platform specific user option file with ease and we've managed to keep configuration details *separate* from software. > > AM> Or if there are other data that need to be configurable, such as > AM> a title or a client's name etc. > > *Wikit.title: some app title > *Wikit.clientName: Mr. Pickles > *Wikit.favoriteFruit: apple > option data base can store non-tk related data > > LWW> These however can be managed with the Tk options. What _can't_ be done > LWW> is to use this approach in starkits which cannot depend on Tk being > LWW> available (such as a cgi accessible wikit) . > > Now we've found a potential problem.... one could at the expense of loading > tk in memory: > package require Tk > wm withdraw . > > Or spend a few minutes writing a option file parser and non-tk "option" command that could be used for any application in the event Tk is not available. > package require tcloptions > > -- tcloptions.tcl > package provide tcloptions 1.0 > if {[package versions Tk] == ""} { > # no tk present > namespace eval ::tcloptions { > } > proc ::option {subcommand args} { > #call ::tcloptions command > ... > } > proc ::tcloptions::readfile {file {priority ""} } { ... } > proc ::tcloptions::get { window name class } { ... } > proc ::tcloptions::add { pattern value {priority ""}} { ... } > proc ::tcloptions::clear {} { ... } > } > > - > Anyway these are just my opinions on creating user customizable software. > > ok, that's my rant :-P > bryan > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 19 12:12:55 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JICsC28869 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:12:54 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2JIFHGd023579 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:15:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2JIFHH05020; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:15:17 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:15:17 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030319131517.AAB4986@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:09:39 -0700 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, what Bryan was addressing was my comment that there are times when the Tk option command is not available or not usable. For example, one of the tclkit builds that are created is for Windows, without Tk. With respect to wikit, wikit local mode uses Tk - wikit CGI mode does not. It would be preferable for changes to Wikit's to be done carefully so as not to pollute the cgi mode with Tk dependant commands. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 19 12:46:21 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JIkLC32620 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:46:21 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h2JImq3x022845 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:48:52 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id LAA07344 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:46:40 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2JImoT25737 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 12:48:50 -0600 Message-ID: <3E78BB90.4A4FB63C@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:48:48 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030319131517.AAB4986@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, I'm not sure I understand the concern. Setting local mode options only has meaning when a Tk gui is being used. All the code related to the Tk gui is contained in a single file (which is the one I'm modifying). The gui code is only loaded if a tk interface is requested so the option handling code I'm adding will only be used if Tk is available. Does this answer your concern or am I still missing something? Tom K. > Tom, what Bryan was addressing was my comment that there are times when > the Tk option command is not available or not usable. For example, one > of the tclkit builds that are created is for Windows, without Tk. With > respect to wikit, wikit local mode uses Tk - wikit CGI mode does not. > It would be preferable for changes to Wikit's to be done carefully so as > not to pollute the cgi mode with Tk dependant commands. From lvirden@cas.org Wed Mar 19 13:34:58 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JJYvC05041 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:34:58 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2JJbKGd022914 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 14:37:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2JJbK606484; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 14:37:20 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 14:37:20 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030319143720.AAB6450@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:48:48 -0700 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, The code for local fonts and colors handled by options is just fine. Arjen mentioned the idea of handling other attributes - like application titles, etc. - resources that conceivably wikit might share between its cgi and local tk desktop code. In the cases of shared attributes, the tk option commands would not be a good fit. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 19 14:13:25 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JKDPC08901 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 14:13:25 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h2JKFtIx020498 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:15:56 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id NAA28798 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:13:44 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2JKFrT21452 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 14:15:54 -0600 Message-ID: <3E78CFF9.5164E23@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:15:53 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030319143720.AAB6450@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, Ahh, yes. I'm only dealing with fonts and colors. I just checked the code on HP and my win2000 and it seems to work ok. I added some info to the help doc also. On windows I look for a file at $env(HOME)/Xdefault.txt for options settings. This was a trade-off since windows doesn't like $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. The resource entries look like this: ! Wikit Color definitions *wiki.fg: #000000 *wiki.bg: #ffffff *wiki.btndisable: #404040 *wiki.linkfg: #0000ff *wiki.linkactive: #ff0000 *wiki.fixedfg: #8b0000 *wiki.fixedbg: #e0e0e0 *wiki.copybg: #fafad2 ! Wikit Font definitions *wiki.defaultfont: -family helvetica -size 10 *wiki.underlinefont: -family helvetica -size 10 -underline true *wiki.buttonfont: -family helvetica -size 9 *wiki.titlefont: -family helvetica -size 16 -weight bold *wiki.editfont: -family courier -size 10 -weight normal *wiki.fixedfont: -family courier -size 10 -weight bold *wiki.thinfont: -family courier -size 4 *wiki.boldfont: -family helvetica -size 10 -weight bold *wiki.italicfont: -family helvetica -size 10 -slant italic *wiki.bolditalicfont: -family helvetica -size 10 -weight bold -slant italic Tom K. > The code for local fonts and colors handled by options is just fine. > > Arjen mentioned the idea of handling other attributes - like application > titles, etc. - resources that conceivably wikit might share between its > cgi and local tk desktop code. > > In the cases of shared attributes, the tk option commands would not be > a good fit. From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Mar 19 15:32:25 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [216.35.73.165]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JLWOC16251 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:32:25 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net [3.159.236.68]) by ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2JLYm4M025761 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:34:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2JLYgwm027740 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:34:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.26 by CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:33:39 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:33:38 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:33:38 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D4@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Thread-Index: AcLuVJ8hpwYnBsNZSCeWE33aLV5xswAB/16g From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2003 21:33:38.0961 (UTC) FILETIME=[347B8810:01C2EE5F] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2JLWOC16251 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: TK> Ahh, yes. I'm only dealing with fonts and colors. I just checked the code on HP and my TK> win2000 and it seems to work ok. I added some info to the help doc also. On windows I TK> look for a file at $env(HOME)/Xdefault.txt for options settings. This was a trade-off TK> since windows doesn't like $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. Does it also look for $env(HOME)/.Xdefault on unix/mac systems? HOME env variable is not guaranteed to exist or be set correctly on unix... In fact, there is no guarantee that it is sure to exist or be set correct on any platform: someone may do "array unset env" for some bizarre reason. Would [file join ~ .Xdefault] be a better choice since the ~ expansion will be handled naturally by tcl? Also I strongly discourage the use of ".Xdefault" for wiki options for the following reasons: 1) on unix/linux the file "~/.Xdefaults" is of significant meaning and contains options for multiple X applications. ~/.Xdefault is too close in name and will probably lead to some confused users. 2) Xdefault has no real meaning on non-X systems. 3) Xdefault has no real meaning in the context of wikit. Wouldn't wikit.options or wikit-opts.txt or .wikitrc or wiki-something be more appropriate for wikit options? Isolate wikit's options in their own file as to not corrupt or be corrupted by something else and you could write a configuration gui that reads/writes you wikit's options file with out having to deal with some other applications options. Again, just my opinion. - Bryan From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 19 16:34:56 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2JMYtC22034 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:34:55 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h2JMbQIx002405 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:37:26 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id PAA13657 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:35:15 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2JMbOT24049 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:37:24 -0600 Message-ID: <3E78F124.464807FE@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:37:24 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D4@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan, > Does it also look for $env(HOME)/.Xdefault on unix/mac systems? Any thing in tcl_platform(os) that doesn't glob match Windows* uses $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. This may be a problem on a mac but I don't have access to a mac so can't determine what works. If the file doesn't exist then the code continues, you just can't change the colors and fonts so your no worse off then you are now. > HOME env variable is not guaranteed to exist or be set correctly > on unix... In > fact, there is no guarantee that it is sure to > exist or be set correct on any platform: someone may do "array > unset env" for some bizarre reason. Would [file join ~ > .Xdefault] be a better choice since the ~ expansion will be > handled naturally by tcl? I agree that HOME is unreliable to some degree, but I don't see anything in the 'file' man page that makes me feel any better about ~. If you have some special knowledge concerning ~ in the file join command please let me know. > Also I strongly discourage the use of ".Xdefault" for wiki > options for the following reasons: > > 1) on unix/linux the file "~/.Xdefaults" is of significant > meaning and contains options for multiple X applications. > ~/.Xdefault is too close in name and will probably lead to some > confused users. > > 2) Xdefault has no real meaning on non-X systems. > > 3) Xdefault has no real meaning in the context of wikit. > Wouldn't wikit.options or wikit-opts.txt or .wikitrc or > wiki-something be more appropriate for wikit options? > > Isolate wikit's options in their own file as to not corrupt or > be corrupted by something else and you could write a > configuration gui that reads/writes you wikit's options file > with out having to deal with some other applications options. Actually the X applications default file is named ".Xdefaults". The use of this file was intentional and is explained by a reading of the tk 'option' command. Tk is X based and the Tk option system loads resource string from the ~/.Xdefaults file under X windows (even if you don't use the option command). On none X windows system the Tk internals still use the same options database but it isn't loaded from an external file because there isn't any standard. I choose to perform a load from $env(HOME)/Xdefaults.txt on non-X system (i.e. Windows) so a user can adjust the option settings. I would have used $env(HOME)/.Xdefaults but that causes a problem with windows. Tom K. From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Wed Mar 19 23:49:59 2003 Received: from frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.20.107]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2K5nwC18530 for ; Wed, 19 Mar 2003 23:49:58 -0600 Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by frostbite.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.7/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h2K5qML1026138; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 16:52:22 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 16:52:21 +1100 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das.jpg Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: To: Tom Krehbiel From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <3E78F124.464807FE@motorola.com> Message-Id: <1DE29231-5A98-11D7-90EB-003065E46D0C@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, On Thursday, Mar 20, 2003, at 09:37 Australia/Sydney, Tom Krehbiel wrote: >> Does it also look for $env(HOME)/.Xdefault on unix/mac systems? > > Any thing in tcl_platform(os) that doesn't glob match Windows* > uses $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. This may be a problem on a mac but I > don't have access to a mac so can't determine what works. If the > file doesn't exist then the code continues, you just can't change > the colors and fonts so your no worse off then you are now. it should be no problem on MacOSX to use $env(HOME)/.Xdefault , however you should consider that on OSX you can run both the X11 version of tclkit, where $env(HOME)/.Xdefault is a good fit; as well as an Aqua version of tclkit, where $env(HOME)/.Xdefault may not be what you want, because the X11 and Aqua versions of Tk don't have access to the same fonts, use different widget metrics etc... and you may not want to share the settings. I'd suggest distinguish these using [tk windowingsystem] and using the platform standard $env(HOME)/Library/Preferences/.Xdefault for [tk windowingsystem] == "aqua" on Mac OS 9, $env(HOME)/.Xdefault may not be a good choice, you should probably use $env(PREF_FOLDER) instead, c.f. tclvars manpage. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Mar 20 01:21:56 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2K7LuC23744 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 01:21:56 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA17120 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:24:27 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA16985 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:24:20 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E796CA4.E8F8D60E@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:24:20 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030319092759.AAB51@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: With regards to setting resources under Windows: - Many Windows users are familiar with INI-files, a rather undisciplined file format. - My guess is that providing an INI-file instead of a file .Xdefaults (in the unixy format) will help win these users for our case. Mind you, I am not at all happy with these files, but that is the common factor amongst Windows applications (the registry is certainly _not_ a recommendable way to go - as many are awed by it and others are explicitly excluded from touching the thing) Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Mar 20 01:36:14 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2K7aDC24944 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 01:36:13 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA04929 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:38:45 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA04634 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:38:37 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E796FFD.4D880A98@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:38:37 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030319143720.AAB6450@cas.org> <3E78CFF9.5164E23@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > Larry, > > Ahh, yes. I'm only dealing with fonts and colors. I just checked the code on HP and my win2000 and it seems to work ok. I added some info to the help doc also. On windows I look for a file at $env(HOME)/Xdefault.txt for options settings. This was a trade-off since windows doesn't like $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. > Bryan does raise a valid point: - The option database is useable for other things than merely Tk widget options - The option command could be isolated (at least as far as handling the database files is concerned) from Tk. (I think the main reason for the option command to be part of Tk is the interaction with the X resources manager, but for "local" options that ought not to be an issue). Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Mar 20 01:42:50 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2K7gnC25390 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 01:42:49 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA16068 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:45:20 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA15765 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:45:13 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E797189.D64B1C66@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:45:13 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D4@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> <3E78F124.464807FE@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > Bryan, > > > Does it also look for $env(HOME)/.Xdefault on unix/mac systems? > > Any thing in tcl_platform(os) that doesn't glob match Windows* > uses $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. This may be a problem on a mac but I > don't have access to a mac so can't determine what works. If the > file doesn't exist then the code continues, you just can't change > the colors and fonts so your no worse off then you are now. > Opening a file with the name ".Xdefault" is no problem, env(HOME) must be the culprit. What about: - env(HOME) if it exists - the directory where the application lives if that is a writable one (not specific for a particular user of course) - C:/ in case the former is not true Regards, Arjen From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Mar 20 08:30:06 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2KEU6C26792 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:30:06 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:32:13 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:32:13 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:32:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > 1) on unix/linux the file "~/.Xdefaults" is of significant > meaning and contains options for multiple X applications. > ~/.Xdefault is too close in name and will probably lead to > some confused users. Oh, I had forgotten about that. I seem to remember that Xt style guidelines, suggest putting an application's default resource file in /usr/lib/X11/app-defaults, named something like the application name. This resource file could then also appear as a dot-file in the user's home directory. There are even environment variables to point to these different files. See http://www.faqs.org/faqs/Xt-FAQ/section-21.html or google's cache for that page. If you drop resource definitions into ~/.Xdefaults, they automagically get read when Tk starts. I would think it would be pretty confusing to have a wikit-specific application resource file named ~/.Xdefault. Wouldn't $env(HOME)/.wikit be more appropriate? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Thu Mar 20 08:37:48 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2KEbmC27458 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:37:48 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2KEeCGd023070 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:40:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2KEeC510898; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:40:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:40:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030320094012.AAB10851@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: of Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:32:12 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I myself would prefer to see the code use, on X based systems, the standard directories that other X applications use rather than putting data out in other places. Most X applications expect to use $XUSERFILESEARCHPATH, and look for a file named something like Wikit . For unix users, this path generally looks in various places such as $HOME/app-defaults/ . -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Thu Mar 20 08:50:52 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net [216.34.191.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2KEoqC28630 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:50:52 -0600 Received: from int-ch1gw-5.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-5 [3.159.232.69]) by ext-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/030701) with ESMTP id h2KErCTo004584 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:53:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-5.online-age.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with SMTP id h2KEr65E026012 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:53:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from 3.159.213.26 by CINMLVW02.e2k.ad.ge.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:44:24 -0500 Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:44:22 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6410.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:44:22 -0500 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253D5@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's Thread-Index: AcLuaFYeqXR5i7kDRDC19ICtrVkVWwAew2zg From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Mar 2003 14:44:22.0951 (UTC) FILETIME=[325F8370:01C2EEEF] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2KEoqC28630 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: TK> Any thing in tcl_platform(os) that doesn't glob match Windows* TK> uses $env(HOME)/.Xdefault. So if run wikit, I will have ~/.Xdefault (for wikit) and ~/.Xdefaults for all my standard X apps? That doesn't seem right... TK> I agree that HOME is unreliable to some degree, but I don't see TK> anything in the 'file' man page that makes me feel any better TK> about ~. If you have some special knowledge concerning ~ in the TK> file join command please let me know. On unix [file normalize ~] is the user's home directory On win9X [file normalize ~] is C:/ On NT [file normalize ~] seems to be the users home directory, can someone else verify this? I don't have Win2K or XP machine to test on and my NT access is through Citrix Metaframe client, where the ~ expansion correctly becomes my NT home directory. I assume it works the same on standard NT installs. TK> Actually the X applications default file is named ".Xdefaults". Yes exactly, which is why I made the following comments: BS> 1) on unix/linux the file "~/.Xdefaults" is of significant BS> meaning and contains options for multiple X applications. BS> ~/.Xdefault is too close in name and will probably lead to some BS> confused users. BS> BS> 2) Xdefault has no real meaning on non-X systems. BS> BS> 3) Xdefault has no real meaning in the context of wikit. BS> Wouldn't wikit.options or wikit-opts.txt or .wikitrc or BS> wiki-something be more appropriate for wikit options? If your intent is to put wikit options with all the other X application options then so be it and use [file join ~ .Xdefaults]. I just personally think is not that great of an idea. How do plan to get the options in ~/.Xdefaults? Wikit will insert them, or does the user have to hand edit it? And if the user has some options specified, then decides they no longer want wikit, they have surgically remove lines from ~/.Xdefaults instead of a simple rm ~/.wikitrc. TK> The use of this file was intentional and is explained by a TK> reading of the tk 'option' command. Tk is X based and the Tk option TK> system loads resource string from the ~/.Xdefaults file under X TK> windows (even if you don't use the option command). On none X TK> windows system the Tk internals still use the same options TK> database but it isn't loaded from an external file because there TK> isn't any standard. I choose to perform a load from TK> $env(HOME)/Xdefaults.txt on non-X system (i.e. Windows) so a user TK> can adjust the option settings. I would have used $env(HOME)/.Xdefaults TK> but that causes a problem with windows. So the program will automatically and magically load options on X and explicitly load an option file on windows? So the program acts different on different platforms? Isn't it desirable to make the app do the same thing on different platforms and get it's configuration details from the same place? I must be really missing something, seem like this would be the most simple and straight forward solution: if {[file exists [file join ~ .wikitrc]} { option readfile [file join ~ .wikitrc] } LWV> Most X applications expect to use $XUSERFILESEARCHPATH, and look for a LWV> file named something like Wikit . For unix users, this path generally LWV> looks in various places such as $HOME/app-defaults/ . But what about non X systems? - Bryan From lvirden@cas.org Thu Mar 20 09:14:47 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2KFEkC30806 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:14:46 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2KFHAGd006436 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 10:17:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2KFHAL11899; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 10:17:10 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 10:17:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030320101710.AAB11863@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:44:22 -0500 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" > LWV> Most X applications expect to use $XUSERFILESEARCHPATH, and look for a > LWV> file named something like Wikit . For unix users, this path generally > LWV> looks in various places such as $HOME/app-defaults/ . > > But what about non X systems? Then wikit should behave there in the manner that users of those systems expect. Note that on Windows, that should probably mean using a .ini file rather than registry - unless there is a way to guarantee that the user has registry update privleges. One of the biggest griefs we have here is that many applications in XP for instance expect the sole user of a desktop to run in power user for their application. At _our_ site - a business - no users run in power user mode (admins come and log in temporarily to perform power user operations, then log back off). Some applications mentioned above for instance install themselves so that only a power user can excute them! Or they allow you to install for joe/jane doe user, but said user must be operating as a power user for the application to save its defaults, etc. These are nasty behaviors... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From kennykb@hippolyta.crd.ge.com Thu Mar 20 10:45:54 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2KGjsC06315 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 10:45:54 -0600 Received: from int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [3.159.236.65]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2KGm5XZ025015; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 11:48:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from crdns.crd.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.8/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h2KGlwsu007342; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 11:47:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta.crd.ge.com (hippolyta.crd.ge.com [3.1.7.7]) by crdns.crd.ge.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2KGlvM21240; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 11:47:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hippolyta by hippolyta.crd.ge.com (8.11.6+Sun/GE-CRD Standard Sendmail Version S1.5) id h2KGlup00635; Thu, 20 Mar 2003 11:47:56 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200303201647.h2KGlup00635@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.2 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 From: kennykb@crd.ge.com (Kevin Kenny) Organization: Advanced Computing Technologies, GE Global Research Center To: "Larry W. Virden" cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's X-Face: 5*Bwl\0iY*1'W~D~c2foEA#,\H[\j3:fTgL0QDgl'0/_fV8X|GO>!b`fdiNc{Ioj6u7a{qq 1h+JHjg)m(|axb2m&0{I9cl5lQ9OeK\vdx=Ca]v9No,e'd~rIQ'ei,%J!^+@w|2/fLdXMKEOIh85kr plx|`3lxhu#KWB;}OjDeAg^ X-URI: http://ce-toolkit.crd.ge.com/people/kennykb.html X-Image-URL: http://192.35.44.8/people/kennykb.gif X-No-Matter-Where-You-Go: There you are. In-Reply-To: Message from "Larry W. Virden" of "Thu, 20 Mar 2003 10:17:10 EST." <20030320101710.AAB11863@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 11:47:56 -0500 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: lvirden@cas.org said: > Note that on Windows, that should probably mean using a .ini file > rather than registry - unless there is a way to guarantee that the > user has registry update privleges. [...] > Some applications mentioned above for instance install themselves so > that only a power user can excute them! Or they allow you to install > for joe/jane doe user, but said user must be operating as a power user > for the application to save its defaults, etc. Is it really true that your site's access controls block ALL registry updates? Per-user settings should be in HKEY_CURRENT_USER, which should be open to everyone. I agree that requiring access to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE is rude. Larry, can you try a quick test for us on one of your local machines? Run the following script, and tell me if it works when the machine is "locked down." package require registry registry set HKEY_CURRENT_USER\\Software\\Tcltest\\foo bar grill sz puts [registry get HKEY_CURRENT_USER\\Software\\Tcltest\\foo bar] registry delete HKEY_CURRENT_USER\\Software\\Tcltest If it works, then we've no problem with your supposed "registry update privileges." If it fails, then your sysadmins suffer from a worse case of cranio-anal impaction than I thought possible. -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin KENNY GE Corporate Research & Development kennykb@crd.ge.com P. O. Box 8, Bldg. K-1, Rm. 5B36A Schenectady, New York 12301-0008 USA From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Mar 21 01:46:32 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2L7kWC11096 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 01:46:32 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA21737 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 08:49:04 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA21544 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 08:48:56 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E7AC3E8.1BD2D301@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 08:48:56 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030320101710.AAB11863@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > > Some applications mentioned above for instance install themselves so that > only a power user can excute them! Or they allow you to install for joe/jane > doe user, but said user must be operating as a power user for the application > to save its defaults, etc. > > These are nasty behaviors... We are still trying to analyse the problem - and as it has not been seen a second time, it is rather difficult and annoying - but "access denied" messages can occur under unsuspected circumstances with XP (and possibly with NT as well). I was bitten in the following way: - I installed a package of our own on a test PC with a "fresh" installation of XP (it was the final test before delivery to the customer) - During the installation a working directory is created (in this case: on the C-drive) - All went well, the machine was rebooted (not quite necessary in my view, but anyway) - I tried - as the same user, who was part of the administrator group - to run the program. I got error messages: "access is denied" on subdirectories of this working directory. I could however ignore them - all went well. I decided to see if this was due to the C-disk. Indeed: I changed the working directory to one on the D-disk, no problem. Then I removed the working directory on the C-disk, re-created it manually, and eh presto, the problem was gone! This was all using the same user-ID. A colleague and I tried to find out about the actual rights of the user and how to deal with them for new users, but this proved to be really bothersome - you enter a user-interface that has a very cuddly/cottony feeling to it but it does not help you achieve anything :( Sofar my worst experience with XP up to now. I have had reports from customers that under NT similar things can happen. Just had to get it off my chest. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Fri Mar 21 05:09:51 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2LB9pC26375 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 05:09:51 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2LBCHGd023253 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 06:12:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2LBCGI14169; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 06:12:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 06:12:16 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030321061216.AAB14149@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's In-Reply-To: <200303201647.h2KGlup00635@hippolyta.crd.ge.com> of Thu, 20 Mar 2003 11:47:56 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Kevin, your package registry sample code worked fine for me on my NT system. I will try it on XP as soon as I can and let you know what is going on there. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Michael_Scharf@gmx.de Sun Mar 23 08:58:51 2003 Received: from mailout03.sul.t-online.com (mailout03.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.81]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2NEwoC01679; Sun, 23 Mar 2003 08:58:51 -0600 Received: from fwd02.sul.t-online.de by mailout03.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 18x6yQ-0006F0-08; Sun, 23 Mar 2003 16:01:22 +0100 Received: from gmx.de (320007127165-0001@[80.132.63.87]) by fmrl02.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 18x6yG-03SU9AC; Sun, 23 Mar 2003 16:01:12 +0100 Message-ID: <3E7DCC5A.2030104@gmx.de> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 16:01:46 +0100 From: Michael Scharf User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 320007127165-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Free-riding on open source software Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Jean-Claude, your posting made me think. I am trying at the moment (besides my normal job) to create my own independent business. At the moment I make no money at all with my idea. I'm still in the development phase. Because I don't want to have to high initial investment costs (besides my time), I try to choose open source libraries as basis of my work. There are 3 things I like about it: - initially no investment (in money) - though in case of metakit the lack of extensive documentation yields quite some time investment. - source is available (it helped me to overcome the documentation deficiencies. I could also report bugs with fixes...) - there are support groups (also helpful) Once my company makes money, I have absolutely no problem to pay for the open source libraries (if the price is reasonable). A negative example for me is For BSD-DB 4.x: SleepyCat wants between $25,000 and $300,000 plus $5,000-$60,000 annual maintenance. Which is simply outside any realistic considerations for a product that will cost $20 per license. I would have to sell 15,000 copies just to pay for the SleepyCat license... I told them that's far too expensive for me and the sales representative answered: "...we could talk about financing a buyout for you, where you paid the cost over a year or two, which would alleviate the up-front large-payment problem." Actually, they even want me to pay if I make my product freeware but not open source... Interestingly, bsddb is free for open source products and it therefore is widely distributed and used. It's also free when used on a single host (like a web server). What I want to say is that I think the concept "free for open source and some payment for commercial products" is OK, unless the payment is reasonable. I think if you "force" commercial users to pay the reasonably low fee and keep the product open source, the number of registered users could increase. As you pointed out, for some of the companies the annual fee is just "nothing". I think, they would not want to risk to get a legal problem and would pay. Unless you increase the price drastically, I think even one-person shareware programmers could afford a license. So, my suggestion is: keep it open source, but "force" commercial user to pay a "little" fee.... Michael From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Mar 24 11:29:47 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2OHTlC14043 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 11:29:47 -0600 Received: from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h2OHVvnp010305 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 10:31:57 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA17085 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 10:30:03 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2OHWJT25142 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 11:32:20 -0600 Message-ID: <3E7F4122.4F329560@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 10:32:18 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] wikit font size Q's References: <20030321061216.AAB14149@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I was on vacation Thursday and Friday so this is a response to several postings. There seems to be a miss understanding about how to use the .Xdefaults file. The .Xdefaults file can be use to define resources for ALL your applications. There is no need to have a file for each application. There are several ways to define applications specific entries in the .Xdefaults file. The method I used was to include wikit in the value name. It is also possible to prefix your entries with the name of the executable. Because much of the interface is created dynamically the entries read from the resource database are not directly associated with an option associated with a tk widget. Since I don't have access to Mac hardware/os's I need someone to provide me with the response produced by tcl command and to do testing of any changes. Daniel Steffen made some good suggestions (wink,wink). It was mentioned that X windows resource loading can occur from at least 4 different "standard" locations. I'm aware of this, however in my experience this only leads to confusion by both the end user and other parties that are trying to keep the end user happy. I preference is to give the end user control of the look and feel. But to address the need for a globally install set of preferences I propose adding a resource that is a path to global resource file. Please give me feed back on this proposal. Tom K. From eric.melbardis@netkitsolutions.com Mon Mar 24 19:20:32 2003 Received: from postoffice.netkitsolutions.com ([64.171.203.131]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2P1KWC08418 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 19:20:32 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.5762.3 Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 17:23:13 -0800 Message-ID: <4405D76EF1E9D4119B2700A0CC754C7C2A2D62@postoffice.netkitsolutions.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: win32 build problems Thread-Index: AcLybRQbWP2pqpSfQheh363+M55ANw== From: "Eric P. Melbardis" To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h2P1KWC08418 Subject: [Starkit] win32 build problems Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: hi, 1) i downloaded the latest versions of all required packages 2) accessed cvs to get latest code fot tclkit 3) under msvc6 there were no makefiles i found them under the cvs attic (were these accidently deleted) or is there a better version comming??? still issing some stuff, such as config.tcl - i will try to extract for your distribution tclkit i am not sure what procedure was used to go from kitsh.exe to tclkitsh.exe but am working on it. regards, eric From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Tue Mar 25 13:20:55 2003 Received: from chewey.iland.net (chewey.iland.net [205.242.230.203]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2PJKsC26045 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:20:55 -0600 Received: (qmail 17150 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2003 19:23:28 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-27.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.27) by chewey.iland.net with SMTP; 25 Mar 2003 19:23:28 -0000 Message-ID: <017101c2f304$002f16e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:23:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 3/21/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Subject: [Starkit] Starpack - "file open failed" error over network Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I am getting some strange results while trying to run a starpack over a network under Windows (both NT and 98). Here's the scenario: - SYSTEM#1 has a valid, functional starpack on it's local hard drive. - SYSTEM#2 has network access to SYSTEM#1. - If I map a network drive from SYSTEM#2 to SYSTEM#1 and access the starpack (through Windows Explorer) via the drive mapping, all works as expected. - If instead, I access the starpack through the Network Neighborhood (instead of Windows Explorer), I get an error dialog entitled "Error in TclKit" with the message "file open failed". Does anyone know what is causing this or have a hint at where I should start looking? I think Larry Virden reported a similar problem to this list on March 19. His end result was the same as above, although the situation leading to the result may have been entirely different. I could find no response to his initial question. Thanks for any input. Jeff From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 25 13:38:24 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2PJcOC27385 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:38:24 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h2PJepGd029738; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:40:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h2PJep300981; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:40:51 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:40:51 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030325144051.AAB548@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack - "file open failed" error over network In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:23:15 -0600 To: "Jeff Godfrey" Cc: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, I got no response to my problem at all. My problem's background is quite different. In my case, a starkit is set up to invoke a help wikit if no arguments are provided. While on the author's system it works just fine, on my machine the starkit fails with the file open error. I'm using the very latest tclkit. The author wasn't. One weird thing is that in my case, if I unwrap the starkit and then do a tclkit main.tcl I get the behavior we want. But if I run the same app from within the starkit, I don't get the wikit. The code in question is, in essense: set msg "" if {[catch {mk::file open wdb $name -nocommit $flags} msg] \ && [file $tst $name]} { # do some stuff } and we never get into doing some stuff - instead, msg has as its contents: file open failed name has a value, though flags has no value. tst is set to writable. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Tue Mar 25 13:46:22 2003 Received: from dewey.iland.net (dewey.iland.net [205.242.230.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2PJkMC27955 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:46:22 -0600 Received: (qmail 11238 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2003 19:48:50 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-27.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.27) by dewey.iland.net with SMTP; 25 Mar 2003 19:48:50 -0000 Message-ID: <019b01c2f307$8bbf83e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: References: <017101c2f304$002f16e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack - "file open failed" error over network Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:48:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 3/21/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Godfrey" > I am getting some strange results while trying to run a starpack over a > network under Windows (both NT and 98). Here's the scenario: > > - SYSTEM#1 has a valid, functional starpack on it's local hard drive. > - SYSTEM#2 has network access to SYSTEM#1. > - If I map a network drive from SYSTEM#2 to SYSTEM#1 and access the starpack > (through Windows Explorer) via the drive mapping, all works as expected. > - If instead, I access the starpack through the Network Neighborhood > (instead of Windows Explorer), I get an error dialog entitled "Error in > TclKit" with the message "file open failed". Ooops. Sorry. Minor correction. The last point should have read "...through Network Neighborhood (***instead of the mapped drive***), I get ..." From andreask@ActiveState.com Tue Mar 25 14:15:47 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2PKFkC30003 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:15:47 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h2PKIG8M022080 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 12:18:17 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2PKIGB03264 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2003 12:18:16 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starpack - "file open failed" error over network Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 12:18:16 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <019b01c2f307$8bbf83e0$0101a8c0@quantex> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jeff Godfrey" > > I am getting some strange results while trying to run a starpack over a > > network under Windows (both NT and 98). Here's the scenario: > > > > - SYSTEM#1 has a valid, functional starpack on it's local hard drive. > > - SYSTEM#2 has network access to SYSTEM#1. > > - If I map a network drive from SYSTEM#2 to SYSTEM#1 and access the > starpack > > (through Windows Explorer) via the drive mapping, all works as expected. > > - If instead, I access the starpack through the Network Neighborhood > > (instead of Windows Explorer), I get an error dialog entitled "Error in > > TclKit" with the message "file open failed". > > Ooops. Sorry. Minor correction. The last point should have read > "...through Network Neighborhood (***instead of the mapped > drive***), I get > ..." We at ActiveState have a similar bug in our bugzilla database. Executing of the Starpack installer on a Win 9x system via mapped drive is ok, but via UNC path (\\hostname\path) we get 'file open failed'. We haven't tried to isolate the cause yet. I suspect something in the windows-specific part of the VFS implementation in the core which dislikes UNC paths when on Win9x. Maybe doesn't recognize somewhere and because of that the path is given to the native filesystem instead of the mounted metakit filesystwem of the starpack itself. Note that on an NT class system usage of UNC path to start the starpack is ok, even if the path is on a remote computer. Only Win9x seems to suffer. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join the community at the 10th Tcl conference http://wiki.tcl.tk/6274 From damon@your.unreality.com Wed Mar 26 00:14:15 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2Q6EFC23908 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 00:14:15 -0600 Received: (qmail 74618 invoked by uid 300); 26 Mar 2003 06:16:53 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 26 Mar 2003 06:16:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 00:16:53 -0600 (CST) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Error messages Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is there any way we can get better error messages from Metakit? Specifically, when opening a file, all we get is "file open failed." There has to be some other information we can get. It failed because the file is already being accessed, or it failed because something weird happened. I got a report from someone using InstallBase who sent me the error message that Metakit couldn't open a file, but I have no idea why. It seems to work on my system. What are the conditions under which mk::file open can fail? Thanks for the help, Damon From usus@aladyn.de Wed Mar 26 11:01:34 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2QH1XC29915 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:01:33 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id ED7BE349EC; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 18:04:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 9F68134528 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 18:04:08 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 18:04:08 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030326170408.9F68134528@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] load doesn't work Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Here's a very simple extension in file mycmd.c: #include int mycmd(ClientData clientData, Tcl_Interp *interp, int objc, Tcl_Obj *CONST objv[]) { Tcl_Obj *out; out = Tcl_NewStringObj("Hello, here I am.",-1); Tcl_SetObjResult(interp,out); return TCL_OK; } int Mycmd_Init(Tcl_Interp *Interp) { if (Tcl_InitStubs(Interp, "8.1", 0) == NULL) return TCL_ERROR; Tcl_CreateObjCommand(Interp, "mycmd", mycmd, 0, NULL); return Tcl_PkgProvide(Interp,"Mycmd","1.0"); } I compile this little extension with gcc -c mycmd.c gcc -shared -o mycmd.so mycmd.o on a linux box. Then I try: $ tclsh8.4 % load ./mycmd.so % mycmd Hello, here I am. % exit $ Everything's alright. But: $ tclkit % load ./mycmd.so couldn't load file "./mycmd.so": ./mycmd.so: undefined symbol: Tcl_NewStringObj % Why can't tclkit load such a simple shared library, but tclsh (even a static build) can? The tclsh8.4 in .../install/hostname/bin built during the genkit process is able to load it, but kitsh in .../install/hostname isn't. What going wrong? Please help. Best regards Ulrich From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Mar 26 11:16:55 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2QHGsC31080 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:16:54 -0600 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h2QHJVZ0021817 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 10:19:31 -0700 (MST) Received: [from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by pobox.mot.com (MOT-pobox 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA15377 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 10:19:30 -0700 (MST)] Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h2QHJST29281 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:19:29 -0600 Message-ID: <3E81E11F.3BEEDE24@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 10:19:27 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work References: <20030326170408.9F68134528@sigosmail.sigos.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich, Take a look at critcl. http://www.equi4.com/critlib/critcl.README http://www.equi4.com/critlib/ http://mini.net/tcl/2516.html Tom K. > > Here's a very simple extension in file mycmd.c: > > #include > > int mycmd(ClientData clientData, Tcl_Interp *interp, int objc, Tcl_Obj *CONST > objv[]) > { > Tcl_Obj *out; > out = Tcl_NewStringObj("Hello, here I am.",-1); > Tcl_SetObjResult(interp,out); > return TCL_OK; > } > > int Mycmd_Init(Tcl_Interp *Interp) > { > if (Tcl_InitStubs(Interp, "8.1", 0) == NULL) return TCL_ERROR; > Tcl_CreateObjCommand(Interp, "mycmd", mycmd, 0, NULL); > return Tcl_PkgProvide(Interp,"Mycmd","1.0"); > } > > I compile this little extension with > > gcc -c mycmd.c > gcc -shared -o mycmd.so mycmd.o > > on a linux box. > Then I try: > $ tclsh8.4 > % load ./mycmd.so > % mycmd > Hello, here I am. > % exit > $ > > Everything's alright. But: > > $ tclkit > % load ./mycmd.so > couldn't load file "./mycmd.so": ./mycmd.so: undefined symbol: > Tcl_NewStringObj > % > > Why can't tclkit load such a simple shared library, but tclsh (even a static > build) can? > > The tclsh8.4 in .../install/hostname/bin built during the genkit process is > able to load it, but kitsh in .../install/hostname isn't. What going wrong? > > Please help. > > Best regards > > Ulrich Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From max@suse.de Wed Mar 26 11:16:56 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2QHGuC31084 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:16:56 -0600 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5364E14AE8; Wed, 26 Mar 2003 18:19:32 +0100 (MET) Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 18:19:26 +0100 (CET) From: Reinhard Max To: Ulrich Schoebel Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work In-Reply-To: <20030326170408.9F68134528@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 at 18:04, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > if (Tcl_InitStubs(Interp, "8.1", 0) == NULL) return TCL_ERROR; This is not enough for stubs support, you also have to take care about stubs at compile and link time: > gcc -c mycmd.c > gcc -shared -o mycmd.so mycmd.o gcc -c mycmd.c -DUSE_TCL_STUBS gcc -shared -o mycmd.so mycmd.o -ltclstub8.4 cu Reinhard From usus@aladyn.de Thu Mar 27 03:10:08 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2R9A7C09684 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 03:10:08 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 4A2C24E428; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:12:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 08E944E398; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:12:43 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Reinhard Max Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:12:42 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] Cc: starkit@equi4.com References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030327091243.08E944E398@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I know that it's not enough for stubs support, but that is not my intention. Leave the "Tcl_InitStubs" line out, it's not important for me. The point is, that I have a shared library which I want to load into my tcl interpreter and that's also used by other, non-tcl, programs. I explicitly don't want stubs support in this case. The question is: What's wrong with tclkit, as it is _not_ compatible with a vanilla tclsh with regard to loading of shared libraries. Nevertheless, thanks for your reply. Also thanks to Tom Krehbiel, but critcl is not what I need here. Best regards Ulrich On Wednesday 26 March 2003 18:19, Reinhard Max wrote: > On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 at 18:04, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > if (Tcl_InitStubs(Interp, "8.1", 0) == NULL) return TCL_ERROR; > > This is not enough for stubs support, you also have to take care about > > stubs at compile and link time: > > gcc -c mycmd.c > > gcc -shared -o mycmd.so mycmd.o > > gcc -c mycmd.c -DUSE_TCL_STUBS > gcc -shared -o mycmd.so mycmd.o -ltclstub8.4 > > cu > Reinhard From max@suse.de Thu Mar 27 03:14:20 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2R9EKC10112 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 03:14:20 -0600 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C401B144F9; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:16:56 +0100 (MET) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:16:56 +0100 (CET) From: Reinhard Max To: Ulrich Schoebel Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work In-Reply-To: <20030327091243.08E944E398@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thu, 27 Mar 2003 at 10:12, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > I know that it's not enough for stubs support, but that is not my > intention. Leave the "Tcl_InitStubs" line out, it's not important > for me. It might not be important for you, but it is important for tclkit. ;) An extension has to be stubs enabled to be loadable by tclkit, AFAIK. cu Reinhard From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Mar 27 03:25:52 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2R9PqC10661 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 03:25:52 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id KAA23752 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:28:28 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA23343 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:28:20 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E82C434.D8865E0F@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:28:20 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work References: <20030327091243.08E944E398@sigosmail.sigos.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I know that it's not enough for stubs support, but that is not my intention. > Leave the "Tcl_InitStubs" line out, it's not important for me. > The point is, that I have a shared library which I want to load into > my tcl interpreter and that's also used by other, non-tcl, programs. > I explicitly don't want stubs support in this case. > > The question is: What's wrong with tclkit, as it is _not_ compatible with > a vanilla tclsh with regard to loading of shared libraries. > > Nevertheless, thanks for your reply. Also thanks to Tom Krehbiel, but > critcl is not what I need here. > The problem is that you did not specify the required shared library in the link command. I am not sure why you did not get warnings about unresolved externals. Regards, Arjen From usus@aladyn.de Thu Mar 27 03:34:35 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2R9YYC11083 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 03:34:35 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 8B1CF4E459; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:37:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 5CED74E41C; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:37:11 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Reinhard Max Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:37:11 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] Cc: starkit@equi4.com References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030327093711.5CED74E41C@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 27 March 2003 10:16, Reinhard Max wrote: > On Thu, 27 Mar 2003 at 10:12, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I know that it's not enough for stubs support, but that is not my > > intention. Leave the "Tcl_InitStubs" line out, it's not important > > for me. > > It might not be important for you, but it is important for tclkit. ;) > An extension has to be stubs enabled to be loadable by tclkit, AFAIK. > The claim is: Invoke a tclkit with no args and it will behave just like a tclsh. That's not the case, obviously. Ulrich From usus@aladyn.de Thu Mar 27 03:43:30 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2R9hTC11489 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 03:43:29 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 5EE404E456; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:46:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 315BD4E433; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:46:06 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Arjen Markus Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:46:06 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] Cc: starkit@equi4.com References: <20030327091243.08E944E398@sigosmail.sigos.de> <3E82C434.D8865E0F@wldelft.nl> In-Reply-To: <3E82C434.D8865E0F@wldelft.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030327094606.315BD4E433@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 27 March 2003 10:28, Arjen Markus wrote: > > The problem is that you did not specify the required shared library in > the > link command. I am not sure why you did not get warnings about > unresolved > externals. > > Regards, > > Arjen > Hi Arjen, did you try to compile it? Even a -Wall doesn't issue any warnings. The symbols are resolved at load time by the link loader, I think. Ulrich From max@suse.de Thu Mar 27 03:55:19 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2R9tIC12045 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 03:55:19 -0600 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BE9314608; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:57:55 +0100 (MET) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 10:57:55 +0100 (CET) From: Reinhard Max To: Ulrich Schoebel Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work In-Reply-To: <20030327093711.5CED74E41C@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thu, 27 Mar 2003 at 10:37, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > On Thursday 27 March 2003 10:16, Reinhard Max wrote: > > On Thu, 27 Mar 2003 at 10:12, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > > I know that it's not enough for stubs support, but that is not my > > > intention. Leave the "Tcl_InitStubs" line out, it's not important > > > for me. > > > > It might not be important for you, but it is important for tclkit. ;) > > An extension has to be stubs enabled to be loadable by tclkit, AFAIK. > > > The claim is: Invoke a tclkit with no args and it will behave just > like a tclsh. That's not the case, obviously. Try it with a statically linked tclsh and it will also not work. What you are trying to do is a cheat, that only works with a dynamically linked tclsh, and only on systems that support backlinking. If you do it the official way and use stubs, it will work everywhere. cu Reinhard From usus@aladyn.de Thu Mar 27 04:13:10 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2RADAC13231 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 04:13:10 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id A74CB4E478; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 11:15:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 6C12139B10; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 11:15:46 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Reinhard Max Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 11:15:46 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] Cc: starkit@equi4.com References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030327101546.6C12139B10@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 27 March 2003 10:57, Reinhard Max wrote: > On Thu, 27 Mar 2003 at 10:37, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > On Thursday 27 March 2003 10:16, Reinhard Max wrote: > > > On Thu, 27 Mar 2003 at 10:12, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > > > I know that it's not enough for stubs support, but that is not my > > > > intention. Leave the "Tcl_InitStubs" line out, it's not important > > > > for me. > > > > > > It might not be important for you, but it is important for tclkit. ;) > > > An extension has to be stubs enabled to be loadable by tclkit, AFAIK. > > > > The claim is: Invoke a tclkit with no args and it will behave just > > like a tclsh. That's not the case, obviously. > > Try it with a statically linked tclsh and it will also not work. What Tried it, works. > you are trying to do is a cheat, that only works with a dynamically ^^^^^ agreed > linked tclsh, and only on systems that support backlinking. If you do ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This seems to be the real reason for my confusion. Tried it on a Sun and it didn't work. > it the official way and use stubs, it will work everywhere. > > cu > Reinhard As I told Arjen already, I'll try to convince our "non-Tclers" to use the stubs library, too. But, just for my curiousity, what the hell is the difference between tclkit and tclsh in this regard? Thanks for your efforts Ulrich From jcw@equi4.com Thu Mar 27 05:47:51 2003 Received: from equi4.com (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2RBloC18223 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 05:47:50 -0600 Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 12:50:25 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030327101546.6C12139B10@sigosmail.sigos.de> Message-Id: <4C71216C-604A-11D7-B52B-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: [rmax] >>>> It might not be important for you, but it is important for tclkit. >>>> ;) >>>> An extension has to be stubs enabled to be loadable by tclkit, >>>> AFAIK. >>> >>> The claim is: Invoke a tclkit with no args and it will behave just >>> like a tclsh. That's not the case, obviously. >> >> Try it with a statically linked tclsh and it will also not work. What > Tried it, works. >> you are trying to do is a cheat, that only works with a dynamically > ^^^^^ agreed >> linked tclsh, and only on systems that support backlinking. If you do > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > This seems > to be the real reason for my confusion. Tried it on a Sun and it > didn't work. >> it the official way and use stubs, it will work everywhere. >> >> cu >> Reinhard > > As I told Arjen already, I'll try to convince our "non-Tclers" to use > the > stubs library, too. > > But, just for my curiousity, what the hell is the difference between > tclkit > and tclsh in this regard? The difference is the startup logic (mounting VFS so files get found inside). Tclkit is built in the same way as a statically-linked tclsh. Ah, wait, I found it - tclsh is linked with "-rdynamic", tclkit isn't. That means tclsh makes its symbols available to shared libs through "back-linking". You can google for "-rdynamic" (with quotes) for more info, for example: http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin/2001-03/msg01895.html I am a bit hesitant to add this to the genkit build as default... it's essentially the "TCL_LD_FLAGS" setting in tclConfig.sh, which means adding the following line in the "kitsh" branch of The Big Build Switch (TM) in genkit: eval lappend L $TCL_LD_FLAGS But you have a point - if tclsh does it, so should tclkit, if possible. Please try the latest Linux build (tclkit-linux-x86.*), which has been re-linked with this change (genkit has also been adjusted). If it solves everything and introduces no new problems, I'll leave this change in. (I still think stubs are the way to go...) -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Thu Mar 27 06:52:54 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2RCqsC21330; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 06:52:54 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id BB5BA3C737; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 13:55:30 +0100 (CET) Received: from there (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with SMTP id 7E5843BBDD; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 13:55:30 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] load doesn't work Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 13:55:30 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.1] References: <4C71216C-604A-11D7-B52B-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <4C71216C-604A-11D7-B52B-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20030327125530.7E5843BBDD@sigosmail.sigos.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,AWL version=2.31 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 27 March 2003 12:50, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > > > But, just for my curiousity, what the hell is the difference between > > tclkit > > and tclsh in this regard? > > The difference is the startup logic (mounting VFS so files get found > inside). Tclkit is built in the same way as a statically-linked tclsh. > > Ah, wait, I found it - tclsh is linked with "-rdynamic", tclkit isn't. > That means tclsh makes its symbols available to shared libs through > "back-linking". You can google for "-rdynamic" (with quotes) for more > info, for example: > http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin/2001-03/msg01895.html > > I am a bit hesitant to add this to the genkit build as default... it's > essentially the "TCL_LD_FLAGS" setting in tclConfig.sh, which means > adding the following line in the "kitsh" branch of The Big Build Switch > (TM) in genkit: > eval lappend L $TCL_LD_FLAGS Yes, that's it. I rebuilt our custom kit using the new genkit. Now it works as expected. > > But you have a point - if tclsh does it, so should tclkit, if possible. > Please try the latest Linux build (tclkit-linux-x86.*), which has been > re-linked with this change (genkit has also been adjusted). If it > solves everything and introduces no new problems, I'll leave this > change in. > > (I still think stubs are the way to go...) Yes, strongly seconded. But the above solution saves me from some headache this weekend. I'm convinced, we'll stubify all our libs in the long run, it just requires some missionary efforts from my side (The Sun is my friend). Thanks for the enlightenment and for the help Ulrich From jcw@equi4.com Sat Mar 29 04:59:16 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2TAxFN28019 for ; Sat, 29 Mar 2003 04:59:15 -0600 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0533883BA1 for ; Sat, 29 Mar 2003 05:59:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 11:59:17 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <7C4BA2D1-61D5-11D7-BC3C-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Subject: [Starkit] threaded tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FYI, Zoran Vasiljevic reported a nasty issue with threading in the VFS core on c.l.t http://groups.google.com/ groups?selm=4247cd6d.0303270157.18bef7d3%40posting.google.com Just so you know that while threaded builds are starting to become viable, it's still early days. -jcw From andreask@ActiveState.com Mon Mar 31 15:01:40 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2VL1dN14114 for ; Mon, 31 Mar 2003 15:01:40 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h2VL1bvg012641 for ; Mon, 31 Mar 2003 13:01:37 -0800 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h2VL1aB28958 for ; Mon, 31 Mar 2003 13:01:37 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] if you encounter problems with dynamic libstdc++ resolution Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 13:01:37 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <20030318091609.AAB13934@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Larry W. Virden > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 6:16 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] if you encounter problems with dynamic libstdc++ > resolution > > > Thanks to Steve Landers and a long series of tests, I have found a new > way to resolve things so that genkit builds without apparent error. > > Before invoking genkit, do the following: > CXXFLAGS="-Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++" > export CXXFLAGS > > and mk's configure will complete successfully. > > I don't know if there is a better way to tell genkit to do this. While this is certainly on the right track things can be a bit hairier. Create a shared metakit library, we want libstdc++ statically linked, our linker is gcc. Now it is necessary to edit the LDFLAGS variable in the generated Makefile. Instead of LDFLAGS = -lstdc++ use LDFLAGS = -Wl,"-Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++" -Wl,"-Wl,-Bdynamic -lc" Explanation: When 'libtool', our beloved [*] compiler abstraction tool which is much to intelligent for its own good, and not smart enough to avoid all the pitfalls, encounters a -Wl,... option and is in link-mode it strips the -Wl part by itself, under the assumption that it is directly calling the linker application. In the case of linker == gcc this is not the case, and gcc barfs (warnings only) when it sees the lone -Bstatic handed to it by libtool. So an additional level of -Wl quoting is required to get the option not only through libtool, but gcc also to the linker. Usage of -lstdc++ in the above quoting is necessary, because libtool also places all -Wl,...-generated options at the end of the link line. So if I had used -Wl,"-Wl,-Bstatic" -lstdc++ the -Bstatic would ultimatively wind up _after_ -lstdc++. That does not help us at all. The -Bdynamic -lc is something which we seem to be able to leave out without adverse effects. I left it in just to be sure. Maybe a future version of -lstdc++ will require -l functions. [*] Yes, this is sarcasm. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join the community at the 10th Tcl conference http://wiki.tcl.tk/6274 From lvirden@cas.org Tue Apr 1 11:30:53 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h31HUrN21492 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 11:30:53 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h31HUoj3020323 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:30:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h31HUoH09047; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:30:50 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:30:50 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030401123050.AAB9038@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Forwarded: : Starkit archive on book.s CD-ROM Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >From: welch@acm.org (Brent Welch) Newsgroups: comp.lang.tcl Subject: Starkit archive on book's CD-ROM Date: 1 Apr 2003 09:06:42 -0800 Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Lines: 11 Message-ID: <1f3b9004.0304010906.40ac845c@posting.google.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.166.227.95 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 1049216802 27369 127.0.0.1 (1 Apr 2003 17:06:42 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 1 Apr 2003 17:06:42 GMT Xref: news.cas.org comp.lang.tcl:210772 I'm assembling the CD-ROM for the 4th edition of Practical Programming in Tcl and Tk. I'm planning on including a copy of the Starkit archive (http://mini.net/sdarchive) This is a general head's up, call for updates, call for objections, etc. By the way, if you haven't played with Starkits yet, they are really, really nice. The book will have a chapter on Starkits, and that chapter will likely be up on my website at http://www.beedub.com/book. A big thank you to Jean-Claude Wippler for creating Tclkit and Steve Landers for maintaining the Starkit archive. Brent Welch welch@acm.org -------- -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Apr 1 16:32:10 2003 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h31MW9N12885 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 16:32:09 -0600 Received: (qmail 19226 invoked by uid 0); 1 Apr 2003 22:34:27 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 22:34:27 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.11.6/8.8.7) with ESMTP id h31MWAL28083 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 17:32:10 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h31MWAp22378 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 17:32:10 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200304012232.h31MWAp22378@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 17:32:10 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "Larry W. Virden" at Apr 01, 2003 12:30:50 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Failures with Starkit 8.4.2 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, At the final minutes before deadline, I'm having problems with some 8.4.2 tclkits. tclkit-solaris-sparc Trying to run this on an ultrasparc 5, SunOS 5.5.1 I get a Bad System Call error, and the task exits. tclkit-win32.exe tclkit-win32.upx.exe I downloaded the latest sdx (today), and build the application on a Linux (RH 7.3, x86) with this script: ..................................................................... rm -rf scrollHtml.vfs scrollHtml.kit scrollHtml sdx qwrap scrollHtml.tcl sdx unwrap scrollHtml.kit mkdir scrollHtml.vfs/lib/imgs cp *.gif scrollHtml.vfs/lib/imgs mkdir scrollHtml.vfs/lib/htmlparse cp /usr/local/ActiveTcl/lib/tcllib1.2/htmlparse/* scrollHtml.vfs/lib/htmlparse mkdir scrollHtml.vfs/lib/struct cp /usr/local/ActiveTcl/lib/tcllib1.2/struct/* scrollHtml.vfs/lib/struct mkdir scrollHtml.vfs/lib/cmdline cp /usr/local/ActiveTcl/lib/tcllib1.2/cmdline/* scrollHtml.vfs/lib/cmdline sdx wrap scrollHtml.kit sdx wrap scrollHtml -runtime tclkit-linux-x86 sdx wrap scrollHtml.exe -runtime tclkit-win32.upx.exe ..................................................................... The wrapped linux version works fine under Linux, but the scrollHtml.exe throws this error: Tclkit-win32 has caused an error in TCLKIT-WIN32.UPX.EXE tclkit-win32 will now close This also occurs when running with tclkit-win32.exe. Invoking the application as tclkits\tclkit-win32.upx.exe scrollHtml.kit from a DOS window has the same failure Starting the application by double clicking tclkit-win32.upx.exe, and then sourcing scrollHtml.kit from the command window works. The application passes procheck. The test platform is Windows ME on a laptop. Any Suggestions? Clif -- .... Clif Flynt ... http://www.cflynt.com ... clif@cflynt.com ... ..Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide (2'nd edition) - Morgan Kauffman .. ..... 10'th Annual Tcl/Tk Conference, July 29, Ann Arbor MI ..... ............. http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2003/ ............ From jcw@equi4.com Tue Apr 1 16:51:49 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h31MpmN14466 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 16:51:48 -0600 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF84A83B9F for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 17:51:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 00:51:46 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Failures with Starkit 8.4.2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200304012232.h31MWAp22378@clif.cflynt.com> Message-Id: <83FC5EED-6494-11D7-A473-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Clif Flynt wrote: > tclkit-solaris-sparc > Trying to run this on an ultrasparc 5, SunOS 5.5.1 > I get a > Bad System Call > error, and the task exits. Built on 5.7 AFAIK, so no running properly on 5.5 is probably caused by incompatibilities. If you have to run on 5.5, and assuming 5.5 will run on all newer OS'es, your best bet would be to build tclkit on 5.5 ... Steve Landers (who is away this week) and/or Larry Virden may be able to help further. > tclkit-win32.exe > tclkit-win32.upx.exe [...] > The wrapped linux version works fine under Linux, but the > scrollHtml.exe > throws this error: > > Tclkit-win32 has caused an error in > TCLKIT-WIN32.UPX.EXE > tclkit-win32 will now close [...] > Starting the application by double clicking tclkit-win32.upx.exe, and > then > sourcing scrollHtml.kit from the command window works. How about running scrollHtml in unpacked state, i.e. typing: tclkit-win32.upx.exe scrollHtml.vfs/main.tcl Could there be a pathname issue? Try running with tclkit and the starkit in c:\. > The test platform is Windows ME on a laptop. I know of no issues which could explain this. If you like, I can give it a try here with 98 or NT4, just to compare. -jcw From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Apr 1 22:12:02 2003 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h324C2N32572 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 22:12:02 -0600 Received: (qmail 8839 invoked by uid 0); 2 Apr 2003 04:14:19 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 04:14:19 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.11.6/8.8.7) with ESMTP id h324C3L29271; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 23:12:03 -0500 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h324C4x24282; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 23:12:04 -0500 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200304020412.h324C4x24282@clif.cflynt.com> To: jcw@equi4.com (Jean-Claude Wippler) Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 23:12:04 -0500 (EST) Cc: starkit@equi4.com (Starkit list) In-Reply-To: from "Jean-Claude Wippler" at Apr 02, 2003 12:51:46 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Failures with Starkit 8.4.2/Windows solved. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, > > tclkit-solaris-sparc > > Trying to run this on an ultrasparc 5, SunOS 5.5.1 > > I get a > > Bad System Call > > error, and the task exits. > > Built on 5.7 AFAIK, so no running properly on 5.5 is probably caused by > incompatibilities. If you have to run on 5.5, and assuming 5.5 will > run on all newer OS'es, your best bet would be to build tclkit on 5.5 Thanks. I'll ignore this problem, and assume that anyone who expects to run the application will be someone keeping up on Solaris releases. I'd never expect forward compatibility in an OS. Particularly with the proof that backward compatibility doesn't exist. > > Windows problem ellided The problem appears to be this set of code: ............... bind .c { update idle; set html(height) [winfo height .] set html(width) [winfo width .] eval destroy [winfo children .] DrawScreen displayFile $html(currentFile) 0 } ............... When it's hit, it throws the error. The trick turned out to be that X only throws a configure event when you resize, etc, while Windows seems to throw that event when the application is initialized. My logic drew the main screen, including bindings, then loaded the first file, which set "html(currentFile)" to an initial value. On Windows, the event is being generated before html(currentFile) is set. When run in the Tcl interpreter, this throws an "undefined variable" error, when run as a wrapped TclKit, it throws a Windows error. This code works: ............... bind .c { if {[info exists html(currentFile)]} { update idle; set html(height) [winfo height .] set html(width) [winfo width .] eval destroy [winfo children .] DrawScreen displayFile $html(currentFile) 0 } } ............... Just setting html(currentFile) before invoking this code did not work. I suspect that there is other setup being done (or not done) before this gets invoked on Windows boxes. Part of the problem is probably that the "bind" command is done inside "DrawScreen", and (to find some initial sizes), there are a couple of "update idle" calls inside the DrawScreen procedure. Why it the code works OK in pure wish, or if sourced into a TclKit, but not when wrapped or run from a "tclkit application" type command line is a question for folks more intimate with these internals than I. Clif From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Apr 2 00:23:34 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h326NXN06195 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 00:23:33 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id HAA27717 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 07:23:38 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA27360 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 07:23:30 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3E8A81E2.D6B54D0@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2003 08:23:30 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Question about error handling in Metakit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I ran into a small problem the other day when using the Metakit package in Tclkit. I tried to select records in a table using the select command, but I used the wrong field name (stat instead of station, stat was not a valid field in the table/view in question). The select command did not complain, but instead it gave an empty list of records. I would have expected an error message. Is this a feature or an omission? Or am I mistaken? Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Wed Apr 2 05:46:17 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h32BkHN22883 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 05:46:17 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h32BkEj3012328 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 06:46:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h32BkF110968; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 06:46:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 06:46:15 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030402064614.AAB10953@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] anyone _want_ to test a solaris 2.6 version of tclkit? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have built a solaris 2.6 version of the latest tclkit. However, until someone tests it, I won't know if it has anything weird in it or not. If you have a need to test such a thing, let me know. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From glennw_yh@yahoo.com Wed Apr 2 06:15:48 2003 Received: from web40205.mail.yahoo.com (web40205.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h32CFmN24927 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 06:15:48 -0600 Message-ID: <20030402121543.59952.qmail@web40205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.47.226.99] by web40205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 04:15:43 PST Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 04:15:43 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Wesley To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] tclkit for Solaris with BLT Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone succesfully built a tclkit that has BLT statically linked in on Solaris? I have been hacking on it for a while now without success. Any advice, no matter how obvious it may seem, is appreciated. I did see that wojciech@kocjan.org created one for the PC. Glenn Wesley glennw_yh@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more http://tax.yahoo.com From lvirden@cas.org Wed Apr 2 09:42:00 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h32Fg0N04808 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 09:42:00 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h32Ffvj3011753 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:41:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h32Ffvu20384; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:41:57 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:41:57 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030402104157.AAB20375@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] anyone _want_ to test a solaris 2.6 version of tclkit? In-Reply-To: <20030402064614.AAB10953@cas.org> of Wed, 2 Apr 2003 06:46:15 -0500 (EST) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks to the various volunteers. Someone stepped up, tested it, and things are working without platform specificities. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From pieper@xenia.media.mit.edu Sat Apr 5 09:52:16 2003 Received: from clifford.bwh.harvard.edu (clifford.bwh.harvard.edu [134.174.9.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h35FqGN24329 for ; Sat, 5 Apr 2003 09:52:16 -0600 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clifford.bwh.harvard.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h35FqMI01523 for ; Sat, 5 Apr 2003 10:52:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3E8EFBAC.7040209@xenia.media.mit.edu> Date: Sat, 05 Apr 2003 10:52:12 -0500 From: Steve Pieper User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3b) Gecko/20030210 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] kit.dsw file or mingw? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I can't find the kit.dsw microsoft developer studio project file that's used in M.bat to build a windows tclkit. Is it supposed to be in the distribution or on equi4.com somewhere? Alternatively, has anyone built all of tclkit with mingw? Thanks, Steve From btheado@columbus.rr.com Sun Apr 6 16:58:20 2003 Received: from ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h36LwJN30011 for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2003 16:58:20 -0500 Received: from desktop123456 (dhcp065-024-132-156.columbus.rr.com [65.24.132.156]) by ohsmtp03.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h36LwQPu007325 for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2003 17:58:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000d01c2fc87$a6a1eed0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Reply-To: "Brian Theado" From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 17:58:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] oomk: problems with select method Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The select examples from the oomk documentation don't seem to work for me. I start with the initial setup: source oomk.kit package require oomk mkstorage db mydata.mk db layout persons {name age:I shoesize:F} [db view persons] as pv $pv append name me age 99 shoesize 6.5 $pv append name you age 21 shoesize 7 $pv append name someone age 39 shoesize 8 Now when I execute any of the example select commands, I get an error. Here's one, for example: [$pv select age -max 65] as v bad option "as": must be close, delete, exists, find, get, properties, insert, open, search, select, set, size, loop, view, or info Fingerprints: 2003/03/30 17:53:59 48725-42990 oomk.kit 2003/03/17 10:05:22 32124-73847 c:/bin/tclkit.exe Brian Theado From btheado@columbus.rr.com Mon Apr 7 21:33:49 2003 Received: from ohsmtp02.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp02.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.37]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h382XnN07071 for ; Mon, 7 Apr 2003 21:33:49 -0500 Received: from desktop123456 (dhcp065-024-132-156.columbus.rr.com [65.24.132.156]) by ohsmtp02.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h382XvJD018702 for ; Mon, 7 Apr 2003 22:33:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000401c2fd77$4e71eda0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Reply-To: "Brian Theado" From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: <000d01c2fc87$a6a1eed0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Subject: Re: [Starkit] oomk: problems with select method Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2003 22:33:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I find that if I add a wrapper select method to the mkview class and I adjust for a documention error, then I can get the select to work. Here's the missing select method I wrote: method select args { if {[llength $args] == 1} {set args [lindex $args 0]} set tmpView [_mksnit [eval [linsert $args 0 $self.mk select]]] set view [$self map $tmpView] $tmpView destroy return $view } Documentation error: All of the example queries are documented like $pv select age -max 65 but they should be $pv select -max age 65 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2003 5:58 PM Subject: [Starkit] oomk: problems with select method > The select examples from the oomk documentation don't seem to work for me. > I start with the initial setup: > > source oomk.kit > package require oomk > mkstorage db mydata.mk > db layout persons {name age:I shoesize:F} > [db view persons] as pv > $pv append name me age 99 shoesize 6.5 > $pv append name you age 21 shoesize 7 > $pv append name someone age 39 shoesize 8 > > Now when I execute any of the example select commands, I get an error. > Here's one, for example: > > [$pv select age -max 65] as v > bad option "as": must be close, delete, exists, find, get, properties, > insert, open, search, select, set, size, loop, view, or info > > Fingerprints: > 2003/03/30 17:53:59 48725-42990 oomk.kit > 2003/03/17 10:05:22 32124-73847 c:/bin/tclkit.exe > > > Brian Theado > > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Tue Apr 8 02:35:06 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h387Z6N19018 for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 02:35:06 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3FB383BBF for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 03:35:08 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 09:35:09 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] oomk: problems with select method Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000401c2fd77$4e71eda0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > I find that if I add a wrapper select method to the mkview class and I > adjust for a documention error, then I can get the select to work. Thanks! Ouch. There's a glaring bug in the select of the OO interface of Mk4tcl 2.4.9.2, which requires your workaround *unless* the result is sorted (has -sort or -rsort params). I think that the following tweak solves it: > Here's the missing select method I wrote: > method select args { > if {[llength $args] == 1} {set args [lindex $args 0]} > set tmpView [_mksnit [eval [linsert $args 0 $self.mk select]]] if {[lsearch -exact $args -sort] >= 0 || [lsearch -exact $args -rsort] >= 0} { return $tmpView } > set view [$self map $tmpView] > $tmpView destroy > return $view > } Yikes, this is going to be messy - if I solve it in >2.4.9.2, the above method will need to become conditional: if {[package require Mk4tcl] eq "2.4.9.2"} { method select args { ... } } And worse still: "$v select ..." in the Mk4tcl OO interface should really have been called "$v view select ...", since this command now returns a view. So much for a quick change, without thinking it through or testing it properly :( The proper fix will be to support both "$v select ..." (which returns a Tcl list of ints) *and* "$v view select ..." (which returns a view and fixes the 2.4.9.2 bug). I've made changes to oomk so it works, and in anticipation of such a change in a future Mk4tcl revision. New version ID: 2003/04/08 07:31:53 62403-34156 oomk.kit > Documentation error: > All of the example queries are documented like > $pv select age -max 65 > but they should be > $pv select -max age 65 Whoops, double . Thanks, I've adjusted the docs. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Apr 9 14:57:54 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h39JvrN24970 for ; Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:57:54 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2378838E6 for ; Wed, 9 Apr 2003 15:57:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 21:57:58 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] kit.dsw file or mingw? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E8EFBAC.7040209@xenia.media.mit.edu> Message-Id: <8FB7A61D-6AC5-11D7-8384-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Pieper wrote: > I can't find the kit.dsw microsoft developer studio project file > that's used in M.bat to build a windows tclkit. Is it supposed to be > in the distribution or on equi4.com somewhere? (My apologies for taking so long to respond, I recently changed things a bit for MSVC, and had to clean up to make this releasable) I've uploaded a tar with the required files: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/msvc6.tar.gz > Alternatively, has anyone built all of tclkit with mingw? I started to make adjustments to genkit so it would work with mingw, but it has not been completed. It's based on Wojciech Kocjan's genkit changes, while attempting to reduce the number of changes needed to bring mingw into the fold. If anyone tries this and can let me know what remains to be done (and how), I'll be happy to finish the job. For me, the priority of this is down, since I use MSVC6. Note that M.bat and other build remnants in the kit.tar.gz file (and CVS) are now obsolete. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Apr 11 06:59:08 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3BBx7N02812 for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 06:59:08 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h3BBxB0a019444 for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 07:59:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h3BBxBX26239; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 07:59:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 07:59:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030411075911.AAB23354@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] sdx update question - does this report when new tclkit pieces are available? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is sdx update smart enough to recognize when new runtime pieces or tar files are available and can be built? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Apr 11 17:22:10 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3BMM9N17128 for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 17:22:09 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BA1C83BDF for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:22:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 00:22:15 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] kit.dsw file or mingw? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E960A0D.1090002@alum.mit.edu> Message-Id: <0CAB91B0-6C6C-11D7-B07E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Pieper wrote: > The msvc6 project worked like a champ, thanks! > > I went a ways down the mingw route, but I wasn't having great luck > (which prompted me to ask for the dsw file). I think it could be done > but I hadn't used mingw until this experiment and it wasn't clear to > me how to handle the windows-specific portions when the build > environment looks and smells like unix...but, I'd like to unify my > build process across my various platforms so I may try again with > genkit and mingw. > > Are the changes you made for mingw included in the current genkit? Yes - as far as I got, anyway. Run genkit from cygwin, with gcc in the path. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Apr 15 09:04:09 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3FE48N16416 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:04:09 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h3FE4NNb004516 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 07:04:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3FE4LOq005519 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:04:21 -0500 Message-ID: <3E9C1165.B42B23D0@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 07:04:21 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list References: <02d301c30344$4d902e60$242cfc3e@imsgsx6tvznbng> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Use of Select Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ian, From the tcl bindings man page EXAMPLES Select a range of entries: foreach i [mk::select db.phonebook -min date 19980101 -max date 19980131] { puts "Dated Jan 1998: [mk::get db.phonebook!$i name]" } Search for a unique match ('-count 2' speeds up selection when many entries match): set v [mk::select db.phonebook -count 2 -glob name "John*"] switch [llength $v] { 0 {puts "not found"} 1 {puts "found: [mk::get db.phonebook![lindex $v 0] name]"} 2 {puts "there is more than one entry matching 'John*'"} } Sort by descending date and by ascending name: foreach i [mk::select db.phonebook -rsort date -sort name] { puts "Change log: [mk::get db.phonebook!$i date name]" } Tom K. > Hi, > > Forgive me if I appear dumb ! > > I am struggling to ascertain how I can implement some more complex select statements to obtain a sub-set of rows from a view. > > For example, I would like to : > > select where "name 1" NOT EQUAL "value 1" > select where "name 1" EQUAL "value 1" AND "name 2" EQUAL "value 2" AND "name 3" NOT EQUAL "value 3" > select where "name 1" EQUAL "value 1" OR "name 2" EQUAL "value 2" > select where ("name 1" EQUAL "value 1" AND "name 2" EQUAL "value 2") OR "name 3" EQUAL "value3" > > etc etc. > > Is it easy to implement these kinds of select statements using metakit ? If so, can you point me at some code examples (or give me a clue what the code should look like). > > Thanks very much in advance for any information you can provide. > > Best regards, > Ian Fairclough. From mel@redolive.com Tue Apr 15 15:29:07 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3FKT6N13911 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 15:29:07 -0500 Received: (qmail 19433 invoked by uid 511); 15 Apr 2003 21:26:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 21:26:05 -0000 Message-ID: <00a601c3038d$b0ebeeb0$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 16:29:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C3036C.29BA1C80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] itcl_info NO MORE... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C3036C.29BA1C80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable tclkit.exe (the latest) does not have command itcl_info any more !!! i am on windows2000 thanks for your help ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C3036C.29BA1C80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
tclkit.exe (the latest) does not have = command=20 itcl_info any more !!!
i am on windows2000
 
thanks for your = help
------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C3036C.29BA1C80-- From brett_schwarz@yahoo.com Tue Apr 15 15:35:49 2003 Received: from r2d2.centurytel.net (r2d2.centurytel.net [209.142.136.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3FKZmN14564 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 15:35:49 -0500 Received: from [192.168.123.166] ([64.91.109.123]) by r2d2.centurytel.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h3FKa2c4029501 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 15:36:03 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [Starkit] itcl_info NO MORE... From: Brett Schwarz To: Starkit In-Reply-To: <00a601c3038d$b0ebeeb0$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> References: <00a601c3038d$b0ebeeb0$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1050423406.6626.125.camel@thor.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.1.2 (Preview Release) Date: 15 Apr 2003 09:16:46 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: itcl_info is very old. Pre 3.X days. It was kept in there for backwards compatibility. However, I think Itcl 3.3 removed all of the old commands. See here: http://incrtcl.sourceforge.net/itcl/itcl3-port.html --brett On Tue, 2003-04-15 at 13:29, Mel wrote: > tclkit.exe (the latest) does not have command itcl_info any more !!! > i am on windows2000 > > thanks for your help From phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com Thu Apr 17 10:31:06 2003 Received: from slb-smtpout-01.boeing.com (slb-smtpout-01.boeing.com [130.76.64.48]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3HFV6N18344 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:31:06 -0500 Received: from slb-av-02.boeing.com ([129.172.13.7]) by slb-smtpout-01.boeing.com (8.9.2/8.8.5-M2) with ESMTP id IAA06613 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 08:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from blv-hub-01.boeing.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slb-av-02.boeing.com (8.9.3p2/8.9.2/MBS-AV-02) with ESMTP id IAA21625 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 08:31:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com (xch-mwbh-10.mw.nos.boeing.com [130.38.253.37]) by blv-hub-01.boeing.com (8.11.3/8.11.3/MBS-LDAP-01) with ESMTP id h3HFVKf14978 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 08:31:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com ([130.38.253.26]) by XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.2966); Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:30:53 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6334.0 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:30:52 -0500 Message-ID: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A5F@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Thread-Topic: Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools thread-index: AcME9lQJfe9/4ow5QZCK+Ylol8aHjA== From: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Apr 2003 15:30:53.0899 (UTC) FILETIME=[557961B0:01C304F6] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3HFV6N18344 Subject: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am very impressed with the potential of wikit. However, there are some things that I am having difficulty with: * Once I add pages to the Wiki, I don't know how to (leter) get rid of them. Once they are no longer referenced, I think I should be able to use the wikitool to find and then remove old pages. * When I try to run various commands under wikitools (like "... pages report", I do not get any output. I can generate an index, but reports and most other commands seem to produce no output (to files or screen). * It could be nice to add the ability to underline words that are _marked like this_ * Whenever I try to indent a line (with white space or tabs) I get a highlighted line, with different font and fg/bg colors. Perhaps it would be nice to be able to have a block indent capability * I have tried to add images to a wikit by following some of the on-line documentation, but I do not get an in-line image. I may not be doing something right, so I would like to write to the maintainer of wikit and wikitools. Thank you, Phillip St. John From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Thu Apr 17 12:01:41 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net [216.34.191.35]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3HH1fN24029 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 12:01:41 -0500 Received: from int-ch1gw-5.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-5 [3.159.232.69]) by ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.9/030701) with ESMTP id h3HH1oeC023815 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 13:01:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-5.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h3HH1hAe010251 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 13:01:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Thu, 17 Apr 2003 13:01:43 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 13:01:43 -0400 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F1@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools Thread-Index: AcME9lQJfe9/4ow5QZCK+Ylol8aHjAABiCaw From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Apr 2003 17:01:43.0650 (UTC) FILETIME=[05C76420:01C30503] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3HH1fN24029 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: EXT-St. John, Phillip E [mailto:phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 11:31 AM > * I have tried to add images to a wikit by following some > of the on-line documentation, but I do not get an in-line image. I use wikit as cgi and the following works for me: My inline image [http://my.domain.com/some/image.gif] The image needs to be fully qualified or it does not work. If we're making requests for enhancements to Wikit, I have a few too... * I'd love to see "Delete " right next the "Edit ". Where "Delete" would show a list of pages that reference the current page and have a "confirm deletion" button. As far as the other pages are concerned, they'd behaive just like they already do if a page does no exist. * I'd also like to see more inline formating options: Bold: ***bold this text*** I think if bold could also be identified as "***", it would simply sentences that have bold and italics. Consider the following: If I want a sentence in italics and 1 bold word, then this must be done: ''this is italic '''''bold '''''italic again'' Where this is much easier: ''this is italic ***bold*** italic again'' For complex sentences, the use of ' becomes obsurd and very easy to mis-count or misplace. Underline: ___underline this text___ Block Indent: | this text is indented, and the format is consistent with bullets, and numbered lists. Tables: +--------------+----------+------------+ |- cell 1 -|- cell 2 -|- cell 3 -| +--------------+----------+------------+ | cell 4 | cell 5 | cell 6 | +--------------+----------+------------+ | cell 7 | cell 8 | cell 9 | +--------------+----------+------------+ | one big cell | cell 11 | +--------------+----------+------------+ This structure relies on the first "+--+---+--+" line to indicate a table and the number of columns in it. The character positions of the +'s can be used in subsequent rows to determine the column span of a cell, by comparing the position of cell "|" character. Finally, the "|- -|" construct could indicate that this cell is special or a header, and gets a different back ground color or font. I realize that these things deviate from the original wiki concept, but I hate to think that something as cool as wikit is stagnant in it's capability. - Bryan From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Apr 17 13:21:28 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3HILSN29747 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 13:21:28 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h3HILiav022765 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 11:21:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3HILeOq028208 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 13:21:41 -0500 Message-ID: <3E9EF0AE.65FC1593@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 11:21:34 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A5F@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: John, Are you using wikitool on a windows machine? > I am very impressed with the potential of wikit. However, there are some things that I am having difficulty with: > > * Once I add pages to the Wiki, I don't know how to (leter) get rid of them. Once they are no longer referenced, I think I should be able to use the wikitool to find and then remove old pages. Yes, you should. > * When I try to run various commands under wikitools (like "... pages report", I do not get any output. I can generate an index, but reports and most other commands seem to produce no output (to files or screen). You should see something on stdout (it isn't sent to a file). > * Whenever I try to indent a line (with white space or tabs) I get a highlighted line, with different font and fg/bg colors. Perhaps it would be nice to be able to have a block indent capability Indent level support isn't currently implemented although there is some code to support indent levels in the formating code. I'm currently trying to figure out what it means (I didn't write it). > * I have tried to add images to a wikit by following some of the on-line documentation, but I do not get an in-line image. There may be some confusion here (if your talking about adding the image to the database). Some of the on line documentation discusses an older version of wikitool. The wikitool help documentation should explain how to add a gif image to your database. > I may not be doing something right, so I would like to write to the maintainer of wikit and wikitools. I'm sort of a "maintainers" for the wikitool. I rewrote the original wikitool to include more functionality and I am familiar with some of the wikit code. I think JCW is the maintainer on the wikit code but I know others have contributed. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Apr 17 16:10:56 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3HLAuN12032 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:10:56 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h3HLBCav010335 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:11:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3HLBAOq020731 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:11:11 -0500 Message-ID: <3E9F186D.B03377BC@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:11:09 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A60@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Phillip, > Yes, I am using a windows machine, and I am not receiving anything on stdout. > If I run wikitool on UNIX, I get the expected output. Perhaps this is a bug. I guess I need to do some testing on windows to figure out what the problem is. I don't normally work on windows so it may take some time. > During my presentation, I also mentioned that Motorola was one of the > companies using Tcl to create solutions (source: The Developer Xchange). > Is Tcl, in fact, widely used at Motorola? I read that it was used for > automated hardware testing and to coordinate different pieces of test > equipment. That information is old. I think the group that was doing the automated testing was shut down and moved over sea's. The group was in a different state and I'm not sure what happened. I'm only aware of a small number of tcl uses in Motorola at this time. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Apr 17 16:36:03 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3HLa3N13487 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:36:03 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h3HLaKJa004638 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:36:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3HLaIOq000854 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:36:18 -0500 Message-ID: <3E9F1E51.7BC7A03E@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:36:17 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F1@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I use wikit as cgi and the following works for me: > > My inline image [http://my.domain.com/some/image.gif] > > The image needs to be fully qualified or it does not work. Images can also be stored in the wiki database if you have access to it. > If we're making requests for enhancements to Wikit, I have a few too... I'm not a wikit guru or maintainer, but will comment a little from my current knowledge of wikit. > * I'd love to see "Delete " right next the "Edit ". > Where "Delete" would show a list of pages that reference the current page and > have a "confirm deletion" button. As far as the other pages are concerned, > they'd behaive just like they already do if a page does no exist. Deletion should be done by a maintenance tool not from the interface. There are a lot of issues associated with deleting pages not the least of which is how to deal with multiple uses accessing the page that is being deleted. The wikitool code provides ways to systematically clean up wiki database. > * I'd also like to see more inline formating options: > > Bold: ***bold this text*** I think if bold could also be identified as "***", > it would simply sentences that have bold and italics. Consider the following: > If I want a sentence in italics and 1 bold word, then this must be done: > ''this is italic '''''bold '''''italic again'' > Where this is much easier: > ''this is italic ***bold*** italic again'' > For complex sentences, the use of ' becomes obsurd and very easy to mis-count > or misplace. Simplicity was a large part of the design. The above proposal would break the parser because it requires a context to be maintained. Your above example could also be written ''this is italic'' '''bold''' ''italic again'' Which seems fairly clear to me and shouldn't result in mis-count. > Underline: ___underline this text___ This might be possible. > Block Indent: | this text is indented, and the format is consistent with > bullets, and numbered lists. The stream format used internally supports indent level. I'm looking into what it would take to get it working. > Tables: > +--------------+----------+------------+ > |- cell 1 -|- cell 2 -|- cell 3 -| > +--------------+----------+------------+ > | cell 4 | cell 5 | cell 6 | > +--------------+----------+------------+ > | cell 7 | cell 8 | cell 9 | > +--------------+----------+------------+ > | one big cell | cell 11 | > +--------------+----------+------------+ > > This structure relies on the first "+--+---+--+" line to indicate a table and > the number of columns in it. The character positions of the +'s can be used in > subsequent rows to determine the column span of a cell, by comparing the > position of cell "|" character. Finally, the "|- -|" construct could indicate > that this cell is special or a header, and gets a different back ground color > or font. Adding table support would be a lot of work. Remember that changes and new features need to work for both cgi served wiki's and imbedded wiki's and should be backward compatible. I'm surprised that you don't want font size and color control. I would place this request ahead of a request for table support. Regards, Tom K. From phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com Thu Apr 17 18:02:50 2003 Received: from slb-smtpout-01.boeing.com (slb-smtpout-01.boeing.com [130.76.64.48]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3HN2oN18445 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:02:50 -0500 Received: from slb-av-02.boeing.com ([129.172.13.7]) by slb-smtpout-01.boeing.com (8.9.2/8.8.5-M2) with ESMTP id QAA25905 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:02:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from blv-hub-01.boeing.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slb-av-02.boeing.com (8.9.3p2/8.9.2/MBS-AV-02) with ESMTP id QAA09088 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:03:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com (xch-mwbh-10.mw.nos.boeing.com [130.38.253.37]) by blv-hub-01.boeing.com (8.11.3/8.11.3/MBS-LDAP-01) with ESMTP id h3HN33f21215 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:03:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com ([130.38.253.26]) by XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.2966); Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:01:26 -0500 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:01:26 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6334.0 Message-ID: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A63@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Thread-Topic: File locking issue with multiple users Thread-Index: AcMFNUX/S/QEogxFRneABHXb24R0vA== From: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Apr 2003 23:01:26.0446 (UTC) FILETIME=[4620B4E0:01C30535] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3HN2oN18445 Subject: [Starkit] File locking issue with multiple users Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: All: I am developing a tool that will be used simultaneously by multiple users on a UNIX platform. I would like to implement the Help documentation as a read-only wikit, but whenever the it is opened, the wikit locking mechanism seems to prevent others from accessing the wikit. My first thought was that if the wikit is read-only for everyone, then perhaps there doesn't need to be a locking mechanism. However, my next thought was, what if users were accessing the wikit, and a developer wanted (for some reason) to modify something. Would modifications be inhibited until all read-only users exited? This would NOT be an issue in our environment, where there is good separation between development and release environments, but I suppose it could affect some folks. Any thoughts? Phillip St. John Launch Systems Boeing From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Fri Apr 18 02:25:13 2003 Received: from sputnik (c20003.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au [210.49.97.80]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3I7PCN08172 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 02:25:12 -0500 Received: from sputnik ([127.0.0.1] helo=mq.edu.au ident=steve) by sputnik with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 196IsW-00023i-00; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 09:33:16 +1000 Message-ID: <3E9F39B2.7070103@mq.edu.au> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 09:33:06 +1000 From: Steve Cassidy User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020623 Debian/1.0.0-0.woody.1 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tom Krehbiel CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F1@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> <3E9F1E51.7BC7A03E@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >Block Indent: | this text is indented, and the format is consistent with >bullets, and numbered lists. > > >>Tables: >>+--------------+----------+------------+ >>... >> >> >Adding table support would be a lot of work. > >Remember that changes and new features need to work for both cgi served wiki's and imbedded wiki's and should be backward compatible. > >I'm surprised that you don't want font size and color control. I would place this request ahead of a request for table support. > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin mechanism to add new formatting capabilities. I recall this has been mentioned before. Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in some way? Such a structure might enable new features to be added more easily. My personal wish would be for section headers, ~~Title has been suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet these days. Steve From jcw@equi4.com Fri Apr 18 04:26:55 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3I9QsN16102 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 04:26:55 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E26183BB5 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 05:27:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 11:27:08 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] File locking issue with multiple users Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A63@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: EXT-St. John, Phillip E wrote: > I am developing a tool that will be used simultaneously by multiple > users on a UNIX platform. I would like to implement the Help > documentation as a read-only wikit, but whenever the it is opened, the > wikit locking mechanism seems to prevent others from accessing the > wikit. > > My first thought was that if the wikit is read-only for everyone, then > perhaps there doesn't need to be a locking mechanism. However, my > next thought was, what if users were accessing the wikit, and a > developer wanted (for some reason) to modify something. Would > modifications be inhibited until all read-only users exited? This > would NOT be an issue in our environment, where there is good > separation between development and release environments, but I suppose > it could affect some folks. These are exactly the issues. You're right in that opening wikit with -readonly allows multiple simultaneous reads. The trouble is writing - if one access is writable, all other readers must be locked out. The restriction is not quite that stringent (a single commit won't actually affect current readers, but every further commit would). One usage scenario is local-mode Tk editing, with simultanous CGI read-only access. It's a convenient way to maintain notes which others can read. I've just added a "-nolock" flag to wikit. Get latest rev and use "wikit -readonly -nolock". -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Apr 18 05:05:47 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3IA5kN18217 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 05:05:46 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDDAD83BB5 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 06:05:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 12:06:00 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3E9F39B2.7070103@mq.edu.au> Message-Id: <5B3F6A02-7185-11D7-8907-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Cassidy wrote: [a range of feature requests] > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin mechanism to add new > formatting capabilities. I recall this has been mentioned before. > Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in some way? > Such a structure might enable new features to be added more easily. > > My personal wish would be for section headers, ~~Title has been > suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. Yup, I'd like that too (I've also seen "== ... ==" as alternative syntax). Titles can be made to stand out clearly (and cleanly) now that we have style sheets. It's interesting to note that at the last Tcl conference in Vancouver, when I asked whether we should redo wikit or add all sorts of features for the Tclers' Wiki, the reaction was essentially "nah, it works". Which I interpreted as "let's focus on content, not gimmicks". > Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet these days. Wikit was one of the first Tcl apps I coded, years ago. It has come a long way since then (this was way before starkits/scripted-docs). It's one of those apps that spreads by itself, keeps on getting tweaked in neat ways - but let's face it, this thing really needs to be either recoded from scratch or refactored / modularized so individual pieces can be improved further. There's the meaner-and-leaner Kiwi rendering engine (for html only, so far). There's the TIP rendering code. And things like Will Duquette's Notebook. There is the ProjectForum/CourseForum product to look at for inspiration. And there are of course about one million other wiki's, ranging from trivial to over-the-top. My design goals then still basically stand: - single file app and single-file storage - html CGI mode *and* local mode Tk - fast local mode searching Two new modes were added later: - embedded help, and running as http server IMO the most distinguishing feature of wikit is its local-mode capability (and it being in Tcl). Note however, that nothing prevents anyone from creating a "wikit_html" with all the Tk stuff ripped out and tons of rendering extensions added in. If done with the same storage design, one could still use the local mode through the current wikit. It might be a good way to experiment with new features, some of which we could then later try to fold into the original wikit codebase? A plugin mechanism would be nice too. Eh... Snit objects, anyone? -jcw From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Fri Apr 18 16:35:06 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net [216.34.191.37]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3ILZ6N28353 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 16:35:06 -0500 Received: from int-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-1 [3.159.232.65]) by ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.9/030701) with ESMTP id h3ILZGnG022767 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:35:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h3ILZAqG004681 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:35:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:35:09 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:35:10 -0400 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F3@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools Thread-Index: AcMFklF+BlpgI5WiRuWGSdqa1zMYOgAXtB3g From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "Starkit list" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Apr 2003 21:35:09.0744 (UTC) FILETIME=[62FC6B00:01C305F2] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3ILZ6N28353 Subject: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok .. so here's a new prototype parser that is a bit more modular and has more functionality. I didn't get to table support, but maybe I can monday. Also, I appologize for the lack of comments, I had *very* little time to do this, plus it's just a prototype. Below is code for 1 wp.tcl file (the parser) and 1 sample input file. The sample input file is default formatting help that come with wikit plus a few more things. For now just save the contests to wp.tcl in wp.in (or something simular) Then run: # tclkit wp.tcl wp.in > test.html - enjoy and let me know what you think. bryan --------- PARSER wp.tcl -------- namespace eval wp { variable lineModifiers [list] variable charSubstitutions array set charSubstitutions {} variable fontModifiers array set fontModifiers {} } namespace eval wp::linemod {} proc wp::registerLineModifier {procname} { puts stderr "registering line modifier: $procname" lappend wp::lineModifiers $procname } proc wp::registerCharacterSubstituion {char substitution} { puts stderr "registering character substitution: $char --> $substitution" set wp::charSubstitutions($char) $substitution } proc wp::registerFontModifier {key htmlTag} { puts stderr "registering font modifier: $key --> $htmlTag" set wp::fontModifiers($key) $htmlTag } proc wp::parse { data } { set html "\n" append html [wp::createHeader] append html "\n" # append the page title append html "

Page Title

" # assume that formating does not span lines. set contentsHtml "

Contents

    " set ref 1 set bodyHtml "" foreach line [split $data \n] { if {[regexp {^[A-Z 0-9]+$} [string trim $line]]} { # this is a section header set line [string trim $line] append contentsHtml "
  • $line
    • " append bodyHtml "

    $line

    " incr ref continue } set line [wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions $line] set line [wp::makeFontModifications $line] set line [wp::makeLineModifications $line] append bodyHtml "$line\n" } append html "$contentsHtml

$bodyHtml\n\n" puts $html } proc wp::makeLineModifications {line} { foreach {modProc} $wp::lineModifiers { if {[catch { eval $modProc \$line } result]} { puts stderr \ "error running line modifier \"$modProc\" on \"$line\" : $result" puts stderr $::errorInfo } else { set line $result } } return $line } proc wp::makeFontModifications {line} { foreach key [array names wp::fontModifiers] { # the keys must be presented in pairs, or no substitution should be made set length [string length $key] set modLength [string length $wp::fontModifiers($key)] set start [string first $key $line] while {$start != -1} { set end [string first $key $line [expr {$start + $length}]] if {$end == -1} { break } # replace the end of the match first, so the substitution does not # move our end match set line [string replace $line $end [expr {$end + $length -1}]\ ""] set line [string replace $line $start [expr {$start + $length - 1}] \ "<$wp::fontModifiers($key)>"] set start [string first $key $line [expr {$end + $length -1}]] } } return $line } proc wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions {line} { foreach char [array names wp::charSubstitutions] { regsub -all -- "\[$char\]" $line "\\$wp::charSubstitutions($char)" line } return $line } ## # create the head portion of the html output ## proc wp::createHeader {} { append html "\n" append html " Sample Page\n" # add the meta data, base, css stuff too append html "\n" return $html } proc wp::linemod::horizontalRule {line} { if {[regexp {^(<.*>|\s)*----+\s*$} $line]} { regsub -- {----+} $line "

" line } return $line } proc wp::linemod::lineBreaks { line } { if {[string trim $line] == ""} { return "
" } return $line } proc wp::linemod::links { line } { variable link if {![info exists link]} { set link(count) 1 set link(escapedBracket) {(\]\])|(\[\[)} set link(siteAbbrevRegexp) \ {\[((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+\]($)?} set link(siteRegexp) \ {((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+($)?} set link(imageRegexp) \ {\[.+\.(jpg|png|gif)\]} set link(localRegexp) {\[.+\]} } # there could be multiple links on a line array set hrefs {} set hcount 0 set looking 1 while {$looking} { incr hcount if {[regexp $link(escapedBracket) $line match]} { # [[ or ]] not a link! if {$match == "\[\["} { set hrefs($hcount) "\[" } else { set hrefs($hcount) "\]" } regsub -- $link(escapedBracket) $line " __HREF$hcount " line } elseif {[regexp $link(imageRegexp) $line match]} { # inline image set hrefs($hcount) \ "" regsub -- $link(imageRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line } elseif {[regexp $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line match]} { # abbreviated or tiny remote site link set hrefs($hcount) \ "\[$link(count)\]" incr link(count) regsub -- $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line } elseif {[regexp $link(siteRegexp) $line match]} { # remote site link set hrefs($hcount) "[string trim $match]" regsub -- $link(siteRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line } elseif {[regexp $link(localRegexp) $line match]} { # wikit local page set match [string trim $match \[\]] set hrefs($hcount) \ "$match" regsub -- $link(localRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line } else { set looking 0 } } foreach name [array names hrefs] { regsub -- " __HREF$name " $line "$hrefs($name)" line } return $line } proc wp::linemod::lists {line} { variable list if {![info exists list]} { set list none } switch -regexp -- $line { { [0-9]+\. .*} { # part of ordered list regsub -- { [0-9]+\.} $line "

  • " line switch -- $list { "none" { set line "
      $line" } "unordered" { set line "
        $line" } "ordered" { set line "$line" } "definition" { set line "
          $line" } } set list "ordered" } { [\*] .*} { # part of unordered list regsub -- { [\*]} $line "
        1. " line switch -- $list { "none" { set line "
            $line" } "unordered" { set line "$line" } "ordered" { set line "
          $line" } "definition" { set line "
            $line" } } set list "unordered" } { .+: .*} { # part of a definition list set i [string first ":" $line] set term [string trim [string range $line 0 [expr {$i - 1}]]] set def [string trim [string range $line [expr {$i + 1}] end]] set line "
            $term
            $def
            " switch -- $list { "none" { set line "
            $line" } "unordered" { set line "
          $line" } "ordered" { set line "
      $line" } } set list "definition" } default { # not part of a list switch -- $list { "unordered" { set line "\n$line" } "ordered" { set line "
    \n$line" } "definition" { set line "\n$line" } } set list "none" } } return $line } #====================================================================== set infile [lindex $argv 0] if {![file exists $infile]} { puts "File does not exist: $infile" puts "Usage: [info script] input_file_name" exit } if {[catch { set chan [open $infile] set data [read $chan] close $chan } err]} { puts "Error reading $infile: $err" exit } ## # Register characters that we need to substitute, so browsers won't spaz ## foreach {char subst} { "<" "<" ">" ">" "\"" """ } { wp::registerCharacterSubstituion $char $subst } ## # Now allow for some handy font modification ## foreach {key htmlTag} { ''' b '' i ___ u === h3 } { wp::registerFontModifier $key $htmlTag } ## # Now allow line modifications ## foreach {modProc} { wp::linemod::lineBreaks wp::linemod::lists wp::linemod::links wp::linemod::horizontalRule } { wp::registerLineModifier $modProc } wp::parse $data ---------------------- END OF PARSER FILE --------------------- -------------------- SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- TEST CHARS < > " TEST FONT FORMATS * '''bold''' * ''italic'' * ___underline___ * ===Heading=== * '''A complex ''line ___is ''' easy___ to'' do LINKS * http://www.equi4.com/ or [http://www.equi4.com/] * https://www.google.com * ftp://ftp.cool.com/file.ext * http://www.google.com/images/logo.gif * [http://www.equi4.com/images/e4s.gif] * [local page] STANDARD FORMAT HELP FROM WIKIT '''References:''' 1. You can refer to another page by putting its name in square brackets like this: [[PAGE]] 1. URLs will automatically be recognized and underlined: http://your.site/contents.html 1. If you put URLs in square brackets, they'll be shown as a tiny reference [http://your.site/contents.html] instead. ''In this situation'', the system assumes that any url ending in '''.jpg''', '''.png''', or '''.gif''' is an image and displays it inline. 1. URL methods recognized are: * http://www.w3.org/ * ftp://ftp.x.org/ * mailto:user@somehost.com * news:comp.lang.tcl '''Adding highlights:''' * Surround text by pairs of single quotes to make it ''display in italic'' * Surround text by triples of single quotes to make it '''display in bold''' '''Adding structure to your text:''' * Lines of text are normally joined, with empty lines used to delineate paragraphs * Lines starting with three spaces, a "*", and another space are shown as bulleted items. The entire item must be entered as one line (possibly wrapping). * Lines starting with three spaces, a "1.", and another space are shown as a numbered list. Each numbered item must be entered as one logical line. 1. first numbered bullet 1. second numbered bullet * Lines starting with three spaces, item tag name, ":", three spaces, and then the item tag body (entered as 1 logical line) are shown as taggest lists. tag: text tag: text2 All other lines beginning with white space are shown as is - no highlighting, reference generating, or even text wrapping occur. * Put four or more dashes on a line to get a horizontal separator, like the "----" below: ---- ''Using brackets in your text'' can be done by doubling them, so '''[[[[''' shows as '''[['''. -------------------- END OF SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > -----Original Message----- > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:06 AM > To: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and > wikitools > > > Steve Cassidy wrote: > > [a range of feature requests] > > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin mechanism to add new > > formatting capabilities. I recall this has been mentioned before. > > Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in > some way? > > Such a structure might enable new features to be added more easily. > > > > My personal wish would be for section headers, ~~Title has been > > suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. > > Yup, I'd like that too (I've also seen "== ... ==" as alternative > syntax). Titles can be made to stand out clearly (and cleanly) now > that we have style sheets. > > It's interesting to note that at the last Tcl conference in > Vancouver, > when I asked whether we should redo wikit or add all sorts of > features > for the Tclers' Wiki, the reaction was essentially "nah, it works". > Which I interpreted as "let's focus on content, not gimmicks". > > > Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet > these days. > > Wikit was one of the first Tcl apps I coded, years ago. It > has come a > long way since then (this was way before > starkits/scripted-docs). It's > one of those apps that spreads by itself, keeps on getting tweaked in > neat ways - but let's face it, this thing really needs to be either > recoded from scratch or refactored / modularized so individual pieces > can be improved further. > > There's the meaner-and-leaner Kiwi rendering engine (for html > only, so > far). There's the TIP rendering code. And things like Will > Duquette's > Notebook. There is the ProjectForum/CourseForum product to > look at for > inspiration. And there are of course about one million other wiki's, > ranging from trivial to over-the-top. > > My design goals then still basically stand: > - single file app and single-file storage > - html CGI mode *and* local mode Tk > - fast local mode searching > Two new modes were added later: > - embedded help, and running as http server > > IMO the most distinguishing feature of wikit is its local-mode > capability (and it being in Tcl). > > Note however, that nothing prevents anyone from creating a > "wikit_html" > with all the Tk stuff ripped out and tons of rendering > extensions added > in. If done with the same storage design, one could still use the > local mode through the current wikit. It might be a good way to > experiment with new features, some of which we could then > later try to > fold into the original wikit codebase? > > A plugin mechanism would be nice too. Eh... Snit objects, anyone? > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Fri Apr 18 16:44:08 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3ILi8N28982 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 16:44:08 -0500 Received: from int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-3 [3.159.236.67]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h3ILiIYP026048 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:44:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h3ILiCeO000407 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:44:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:44:11 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:44:11 -0400 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F4@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools Thread-Index: AcMFklF+BlpgI5WiRuWGSdqa1zMYOgAXtB3gAACCcRA= From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "Starkit list" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Apr 2003 21:44:11.0339 (UTC) FILETIME=[A5CD41B0:01C305F3] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3ILi8N28982 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Oh... I guess I should I say that *everything* the parser does with exception to the automatic table of contents is optional. That is to say, that everything else is plugged in via the registerLineModifier, registerCharacterSubstituion, and registerFontModifier procedures. That goes for links, lists, font formating, horizontal rules, and so on. -- bryan > -----Original Message----- > From: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 5:35 PM > To: Starkit list > Subject: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) > > > Ok .. so here's a new prototype parser that is a bit more > modular and has more functionality. I didn't get to table > support, but maybe I can monday. Also, I appologize for the > lack of comments, I had *very* little time to do this, plus > it's just a prototype. > > Below is code for 1 wp.tcl file (the parser) and 1 sample > input file. The sample input file is default formatting help > that come with wikit plus a few more things. For now just > save the contests to wp.tcl in wp.in (or something simular) > > Then run: > # tclkit wp.tcl wp.in > test.html > > > - enjoy and let me know what you think. > bryan > > --------- PARSER wp.tcl -------- > > namespace eval wp { > variable lineModifiers [list] > variable charSubstitutions > array set charSubstitutions {} > variable fontModifiers > array set fontModifiers {} > } > namespace eval wp::linemod {} > > > > > proc wp::registerLineModifier {procname} { > puts stderr "registering line modifier: $procname" > lappend wp::lineModifiers $procname > } > proc wp::registerCharacterSubstituion {char substitution} { > puts stderr "registering character substitution: $char --> > $substitution" > set wp::charSubstitutions($char) $substitution > } > proc wp::registerFontModifier {key htmlTag} { > puts stderr "registering font modifier: $key --> $htmlTag" > set wp::fontModifiers($key) $htmlTag > } > > proc wp::parse { data } { > set html "\n" > append html [wp::createHeader] > append html "\n" > # append the page title > append html "

    Page Title

    " > > # assume that formating does not span lines. > > set contentsHtml "

    Contents

      " > set ref 1 > set bodyHtml "" > foreach line [split $data \n] { > if {[regexp {^[A-Z 0-9]+$} [string trim $line]]} { > # this is a section header > set line [string trim $line] > append contentsHtml "
    • $line
      • " > append bodyHtml "

      $line

      " > incr ref > continue > } > set line [wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions $line] > set line [wp::makeFontModifications $line] > set line [wp::makeLineModifications $line] > append bodyHtml "$line\n" > } > > > append html "$contentsHtml

    size=0>

    $bodyHtml\n\n" > puts $html > } > > > > proc wp::makeLineModifications {line} { > foreach {modProc} $wp::lineModifiers { > if {[catch { > eval $modProc \$line > } result]} { > puts stderr \ > "error running line modifier \"$modProc\" on > \"$line\" : $result" > puts stderr $::errorInfo > } else { > set line $result > } > } > return $line > } > > proc wp::makeFontModifications {line} { > foreach key [array names wp::fontModifiers] { > # the keys must be presented in pairs, or no > substitution should be made > set length [string length $key] > set modLength [string length $wp::fontModifiers($key)] > set start [string first $key $line] > while {$start != -1} { > set end [string first $key $line [expr {$start + $length}]] > if {$end == -1} { break } > # replace the end of the match first, so the > substitution does not > # move our end match > set line [string replace $line $end [expr {$end + $length -1}]\ > ""] > set line [string replace $line $start [expr {$start + > $length - 1}] \ > "<$wp::fontModifiers($key)>"] > set start [string first $key $line [expr {$end + $length -1}]] > } > } > return $line > } > > > proc wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions {line} { > foreach char [array names wp::charSubstitutions] { > regsub -all -- "\[$char\]" $line > "\\$wp::charSubstitutions($char)" line > } > return $line > } > > ## > # create the head portion of the html output > ## > proc wp::createHeader {} { > append html "\n" > append html " Sample Page\n" > # add the meta data, base, css stuff too > append html "\n" > return $html > } > > > proc wp::linemod::horizontalRule {line} { > if {[regexp {^(<.*>|\s)*----+\s*$} $line]} { > regsub -- {----+} $line "

    " line > } > return $line > } > > proc wp::linemod::lineBreaks { line } { > if {[string trim $line] == ""} { return "
    " } > return $line > } > > proc wp::linemod::links { line } { > variable link > if {![info exists link]} { > set link(count) 1 > set link(escapedBracket) {(\]\])|(\[\[)} > set link(siteAbbrevRegexp) \ > {\[((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+\]($)?} > set link(siteRegexp) \ > {((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+($)?} > set link(imageRegexp) \ > {\[.+\.(jpg|png|gif)\]} > set link(localRegexp) {\[.+\]} > > } > # there could be multiple links on a line > array set hrefs {} > set hcount 0 > set looking 1 > while {$looking} { > incr hcount > if {[regexp $link(escapedBracket) $line match]} { > # [[ or ]] not a link! > if {$match == "\[\["} { > set hrefs($hcount) "\[" > } else { > set hrefs($hcount) "\]" > } > regsub -- $link(escapedBracket) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > } elseif {[regexp $link(imageRegexp) $line match]} { > # inline image > set hrefs($hcount) \ > "" > regsub -- $link(imageRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line match]} { > # abbreviated or tiny remote site link > set hrefs($hcount) \ > "\[$link(count)\]" > incr link(count) > regsub -- $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteRegexp) $line match]} { > # remote site link > set hrefs($hcount) "[string trim $match]" > regsub -- $link(siteRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > } elseif {[regexp $link(localRegexp) $line match]} { > # wikit local page > set match [string trim $match \[\]] > set hrefs($hcount) \ > "$match" > regsub -- $link(localRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > } else { > set looking 0 > } > } > foreach name [array names hrefs] { > regsub -- " __HREF$name " $line "$hrefs($name)" line > } > return $line > } > > proc wp::linemod::lists {line} { > variable list > if {![info exists list]} { > set list none > } > switch -regexp -- $line { > { [0-9]+\. .*} { > # part of ordered list > regsub -- { [0-9]+\.} $line "

  • " line > switch -- $list { > "none" { set line "
      $line" } > "unordered" { set line "
        $line" } > "ordered" { set line "$line" } > "definition" { set line "
          $line" } > } > set list "ordered" > } > { [\*] .*} { > # part of unordered list > regsub -- { [\*]} $line "
        1. " line > switch -- $list { > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > "unordered" { set line "$line" } > "ordered" { set line "
          $line" } > "definition" { set line "
            $line" } > } > set list "unordered" > } > { .+: .*} { > # part of a definition list > set i [string first ":" $line] > set term [string trim [string range $line 0 [expr {$i - 1}]]] > set def [string trim [string range $line [expr {$i + 1}] end]] > set line "
            $term
            $def
            " > switch -- $list { > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > "unordered" { set line "
          $line" } > "ordered" { set line "
      $line" } > } > set list "definition" > } > default { > # not part of a list > switch -- $list { > "unordered" { set line "\n$line" } > "ordered" { set line "
    \n$line" } > "definition" { set line "\n$line" } > } > set list "none" > } > } > return $line > } > > > #============================================================= > ========= > set infile [lindex $argv 0] > if {![file exists $infile]} { > puts "File does not exist: $infile" > puts "Usage: [info script] input_file_name" > exit > } > > if {[catch { > set chan [open $infile] > set data [read $chan] > close $chan > } err]} { > puts "Error reading $infile: $err" > exit > } > > > ## > # Register characters that we need to substitute, so browsers > won't spaz > ## > foreach {char subst} { > "<" "<" > ">" ">" > "\"" """ > } { > wp::registerCharacterSubstituion $char $subst > } > > ## > # Now allow for some handy font modification > ## > foreach {key htmlTag} { > ''' b > '' i > ___ u > === h3 > } { > wp::registerFontModifier $key $htmlTag > } > > > ## > # Now allow line modifications > ## > foreach {modProc} { > wp::linemod::lineBreaks > wp::linemod::lists > wp::linemod::links > wp::linemod::horizontalRule > } { > wp::registerLineModifier $modProc > } > wp::parse $data > > > > > > ---------------------- END OF PARSER FILE --------------------- > > -------------------- SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > TEST CHARS > < > " > > TEST FONT FORMATS > * '''bold''' > * ''italic'' > * ___underline___ > * ===Heading=== > * '''A complex ''line ___is ''' easy___ to'' do > > LINKS > * http://www.equi4.com/ or [http://www.equi4.com/] > * https://www.google.com > * ftp://ftp.cool.com/file.ext > * http://www.google.com/images/logo.gif > * [http://www.equi4.com/images/e4s.gif] > * [local page] > > > STANDARD FORMAT HELP FROM WIKIT > > '''References:''' > 1. You can refer to another page by putting its name in > square brackets like this: [[PAGE]] > 1. URLs will automatically be recognized and underlined: > http://your.site/contents.html > 1. If you put URLs in square brackets, they'll be shown as > a tiny reference [http://your.site/contents.html] instead. > ''In this situation'', the system assumes that any url ending > in '''.jpg''', '''.png''', or '''.gif''' is an image and > displays it inline. > 1. URL methods recognized are: > * http://www.w3.org/ > * ftp://ftp.x.org/ > * mailto:user@somehost.com > * news:comp.lang.tcl > > '''Adding highlights:''' > * Surround text by pairs of single quotes to make it > ''display in italic'' > * Surround text by triples of single quotes to make it > '''display in bold''' > > '''Adding structure to your text:''' > * Lines of text are normally joined, with empty lines used > to delineate paragraphs > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "*", and another > space are shown as bulleted items. The entire item must be > entered as one line (possibly wrapping). > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "1.", and another > space are shown as a numbered list. Each numbered item must > be entered as one logical line. > 1. first numbered bullet > 1. second numbered bullet > * Lines starting with three spaces, item tag name, ":", > three spaces, and then the item tag body (entered as 1 > logical line) are shown as taggest lists. > tag: text > tag: text2 > > All other lines beginning with white space are shown as is > - no highlighting, reference generating, or even text wrapping occur. > > * Put four or more dashes on a line to get a horizontal > separator, like the "----" below: > ---- > ''Using brackets in your text'' can be done by doubling them, > so '''[[[[''' shows as > '''[['''. > > -------------------- END OF SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:06 AM > > To: Starkit list > > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for > wikit and > > wikitools > > > > > > Steve Cassidy wrote: > > > > [a range of feature requests] > > > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin mechanism to add new > > > formatting capabilities. I recall this has been mentioned before. > > > Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in > > some way? > > > Such a structure might enable new features to be added > more easily. > > > > > > My personal wish would be for section headers, ~~Title has been > > > suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. > > > > Yup, I'd like that too (I've also seen "== ... ==" as alternative > > syntax). Titles can be made to stand out clearly (and cleanly) now > > that we have style sheets. > > > > It's interesting to note that at the last Tcl conference in > > Vancouver, > > when I asked whether we should redo wikit or add all sorts of > > features > > for the Tclers' Wiki, the reaction was essentially "nah, it > works". > > Which I interpreted as "let's focus on content, not gimmicks". > > > > > Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet > > these days. > > > > Wikit was one of the first Tcl apps I coded, years ago. It > > has come a > > long way since then (this was way before > > starkits/scripted-docs). It's > > one of those apps that spreads by itself, keeps on getting > tweaked in > > neat ways - but let's face it, this thing really needs to be either > > recoded from scratch or refactored / modularized so > individual pieces > > can be improved further. > > > > There's the meaner-and-leaner Kiwi rendering engine (for html > > only, so > > far). There's the TIP rendering code. And things like Will > > Duquette's > > Notebook. There is the ProjectForum/CourseForum product to > > look at for > > inspiration. And there are of course about one million > other wiki's, > > ranging from trivial to over-the-top. > > > > My design goals then still basically stand: > > - single file app and single-file storage > > - html CGI mode *and* local mode Tk > > - fast local mode searching > > Two new modes were added later: > > - embedded help, and running as http server > > > > IMO the most distinguishing feature of wikit is its local-mode > > capability (and it being in Tcl). > > > > Note however, that nothing prevents anyone from creating a > > "wikit_html" > > with all the Tk stuff ripped out and tons of rendering > > extensions added > > in. If done with the same storage design, one could still use the > > local mode through the current wikit. It might be a good way to > > experiment with new features, some of which we could then > > later try to > > fold into the original wikit codebase? > > > > A plugin mechanism would be nice too. Eh... Snit objects, anyone? > > > > -jcw > > > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Apr 18 17:55:55 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3IMttN01299 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:55:55 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h3IMuCma014451 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 15:56:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3IMuAOq003318 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:56:10 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA08288.AAE24C9E@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 15:56:08 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F4@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan, If your developing this prototype for something related to the wikit then you need to look at the TextToStream proc in the format.tcl file (unless you want to completely rewrite the TextToStream and all the various streamToXXX rendering and utility procedures). Tom K. > > Oh... I guess I should I say that *everything* the parser does with exception to the automatic table of contents is optional. That is to say, that everything else is plugged in via the registerLineModifier, registerCharacterSubstituion, and registerFontModifier procedures. That goes for links, lists, font formating, horizontal rules, and so on. > > -- bryan > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 5:35 PM > > To: Starkit list > > Subject: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) > > > > > > Ok .. so here's a new prototype parser that is a bit more > > modular and has more functionality. I didn't get to table > > support, but maybe I can monday. Also, I appologize for the > > lack of comments, I had *very* little time to do this, plus > > it's just a prototype. > > > > Below is code for 1 wp.tcl file (the parser) and 1 sample > > input file. The sample input file is default formatting help > > that come with wikit plus a few more things. For now just > > save the contests to wp.tcl in wp.in (or something simular) > > > > Then run: > > # tclkit wp.tcl wp.in > test.html > > > > > > - enjoy and let me know what you think. > > bryan > > > > --------- PARSER wp.tcl -------- > > > > namespace eval wp { > > variable lineModifiers [list] > > variable charSubstitutions > > array set charSubstitutions {} > > variable fontModifiers > > array set fontModifiers {} > > } > > namespace eval wp::linemod {} > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::registerLineModifier {procname} { > > puts stderr "registering line modifier: $procname" > > lappend wp::lineModifiers $procname > > } > > proc wp::registerCharacterSubstituion {char substitution} { > > puts stderr "registering character substitution: $char --> > > $substitution" > > set wp::charSubstitutions($char) $substitution > > } > > proc wp::registerFontModifier {key htmlTag} { > > puts stderr "registering font modifier: $key --> $htmlTag" > > set wp::fontModifiers($key) $htmlTag > > } > > > > proc wp::parse { data } { > > set html "\n" > > append html [wp::createHeader] > > append html "\n" > > # append the page title > > append html "

    Page Title

    " > > > > # assume that formating does not span lines. > > > > set contentsHtml "

    Contents

      " > > set ref 1 > > set bodyHtml "" > > foreach line [split $data \n] { > > if {[regexp {^[A-Z 0-9]+$} [string trim $line]]} { > > # this is a section header > > set line [string trim $line] > > append contentsHtml "
    • $line
      • " > > append bodyHtml "

      $line

      " > > incr ref > > continue > > } > > set line [wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions $line] > > set line [wp::makeFontModifications $line] > > set line [wp::makeLineModifications $line] > > append bodyHtml "$line\n" > > } > > > > > > append html "$contentsHtml

    > size=0>

    $bodyHtml\n\n" > > puts $html > > } > > > > > > > > proc wp::makeLineModifications {line} { > > foreach {modProc} $wp::lineModifiers { > > if {[catch { > > eval $modProc \$line > > } result]} { > > puts stderr \ > > "error running line modifier \"$modProc\" on > > \"$line\" : $result" > > puts stderr $::errorInfo > > } else { > > set line $result > > } > > } > > return $line > > } > > > > proc wp::makeFontModifications {line} { > > foreach key [array names wp::fontModifiers] { > > # the keys must be presented in pairs, or no > > substitution should be made > > set length [string length $key] > > set modLength [string length $wp::fontModifiers($key)] > > set start [string first $key $line] > > while {$start != -1} { > > set end [string first $key $line [expr {$start + $length}]] > > if {$end == -1} { break } > > # replace the end of the match first, so the > > substitution does not > > # move our end match > > set line [string replace $line $end [expr {$end + $length -1}]\ > > ""] > > set line [string replace $line $start [expr {$start + > > $length - 1}] \ > > "<$wp::fontModifiers($key)>"] > > set start [string first $key $line [expr {$end + $length -1}]] > > } > > } > > return $line > > } > > > > > > proc wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions {line} { > > foreach char [array names wp::charSubstitutions] { > > regsub -all -- "\[$char\]" $line > > "\\$wp::charSubstitutions($char)" line > > } > > return $line > > } > > > > ## > > # create the head portion of the html output > > ## > > proc wp::createHeader {} { > > append html "\n" > > append html " Sample Page\n" > > # add the meta data, base, css stuff too > > append html "\n" > > return $html > > } > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::horizontalRule {line} { > > if {[regexp {^(<.*>|\s)*----+\s*$} $line]} { > > regsub -- {----+} $line "

    " line > > } > > return $line > > } > > > > proc wp::linemod::lineBreaks { line } { > > if {[string trim $line] == ""} { return "
    " } > > return $line > > } > > > > proc wp::linemod::links { line } { > > variable link > > if {![info exists link]} { > > set link(count) 1 > > set link(escapedBracket) {(\]\])|(\[\[)} > > set link(siteAbbrevRegexp) \ > > {\[((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+\]($)?} > > set link(siteRegexp) \ > > {((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+($)?} > > set link(imageRegexp) \ > > {\[.+\.(jpg|png|gif)\]} > > set link(localRegexp) {\[.+\]} > > > > } > > # there could be multiple links on a line > > array set hrefs {} > > set hcount 0 > > set looking 1 > > while {$looking} { > > incr hcount > > if {[regexp $link(escapedBracket) $line match]} { > > # [[ or ]] not a link! > > if {$match == "\[\["} { > > set hrefs($hcount) "\[" > > } else { > > set hrefs($hcount) "\]" > > } > > regsub -- $link(escapedBracket) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > } elseif {[regexp $link(imageRegexp) $line match]} { > > # inline image > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > "" > > regsub -- $link(imageRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line match]} { > > # abbreviated or tiny remote site link > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > "\[$link(count)\]" > > incr link(count) > > regsub -- $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteRegexp) $line match]} { > > # remote site link > > set hrefs($hcount) "[string trim $match]" > > regsub -- $link(siteRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > } elseif {[regexp $link(localRegexp) $line match]} { > > # wikit local page > > set match [string trim $match \[\]] > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > "$match" > > regsub -- $link(localRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > } else { > > set looking 0 > > } > > } > > foreach name [array names hrefs] { > > regsub -- " __HREF$name " $line "$hrefs($name)" line > > } > > return $line > > } > > > > proc wp::linemod::lists {line} { > > variable list > > if {![info exists list]} { > > set list none > > } > > switch -regexp -- $line { > > { [0-9]+\. .*} { > > # part of ordered list > > regsub -- { [0-9]+\.} $line "

  • " line > > switch -- $list { > > "none" { set line "
      $line" } > > "unordered" { set line "
        $line" } > > "ordered" { set line "$line" } > > "definition" { set line "
          $line" } > > } > > set list "ordered" > > } > > { [\*] .*} { > > # part of unordered list > > regsub -- { [\*]} $line "
        1. " line > > switch -- $list { > > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > > "unordered" { set line "$line" } > > "ordered" { set line "
          $line" } > > "definition" { set line "
            $line" } > > } > > set list "unordered" > > } > > { .+: .*} { > > # part of a definition list > > set i [string first ":" $line] > > set term [string trim [string range $line 0 [expr {$i - 1}]]] > > set def [string trim [string range $line [expr {$i + 1}] end]] > > set line "
            $term
            $def
            " > > switch -- $list { > > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > > "unordered" { set line "
          $line" } > > "ordered" { set line "
      $line" } > > } > > set list "definition" > > } > > default { > > # not part of a list > > switch -- $list { > > "unordered" { set line "\n$line" } > > "ordered" { set line "
    \n$line" } > > "definition" { set line "\n$line" } > > } > > set list "none" > > } > > } > > return $line > > } > > > > > > #============================================================= > > ========= > > set infile [lindex $argv 0] > > if {![file exists $infile]} { > > puts "File does not exist: $infile" > > puts "Usage: [info script] input_file_name" > > exit > > } > > > > if {[catch { > > set chan [open $infile] > > set data [read $chan] > > close $chan > > } err]} { > > puts "Error reading $infile: $err" > > exit > > } > > > > > > ## > > # Register characters that we need to substitute, so browsers > > won't spaz > > ## > > foreach {char subst} { > > "<" "<" > > ">" ">" > > "\"" """ > > } { > > wp::registerCharacterSubstituion $char $subst > > } > > > > ## > > # Now allow for some handy font modification > > ## > > foreach {key htmlTag} { > > ''' b > > '' i > > ___ u > > === h3 > > } { > > wp::registerFontModifier $key $htmlTag > > } > > > > > > ## > > # Now allow line modifications > > ## > > foreach {modProc} { > > wp::linemod::lineBreaks > > wp::linemod::lists > > wp::linemod::links > > wp::linemod::horizontalRule > > } { > > wp::registerLineModifier $modProc > > } > > wp::parse $data > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- END OF PARSER FILE --------------------- > > > > -------------------- SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > > TEST CHARS > > < > " > > > > TEST FONT FORMATS > > * '''bold''' > > * ''italic'' > > * ___underline___ > > * ===Heading=== > > * '''A complex ''line ___is ''' easy___ to'' do > > > > LINKS > > * http://www.equi4.com/ or [http://www.equi4.com/] > > * https://www.google.com > > * ftp://ftp.cool.com/file.ext > > * http://www.google.com/images/logo.gif > > * [http://www.equi4.com/images/e4s.gif] > > * [local page] > > > > > > STANDARD FORMAT HELP FROM WIKIT > > > > '''References:''' > > 1. You can refer to another page by putting its name in > > square brackets like this: [[PAGE]] > > 1. URLs will automatically be recognized and underlined: > > http://your.site/contents.html > > 1. If you put URLs in square brackets, they'll be shown as > > a tiny reference [http://your.site/contents.html] instead. > > ''In this situation'', the system assumes that any url ending > > in '''.jpg''', '''.png''', or '''.gif''' is an image and > > displays it inline. > > 1. URL methods recognized are: > > * http://www.w3.org/ > > * ftp://ftp.x.org/ > > * mailto:user@somehost.com > > * news:comp.lang.tcl > > > > '''Adding highlights:''' > > * Surround text by pairs of single quotes to make it > > ''display in italic'' > > * Surround text by triples of single quotes to make it > > '''display in bold''' > > > > '''Adding structure to your text:''' > > * Lines of text are normally joined, with empty lines used > > to delineate paragraphs > > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "*", and another > > space are shown as bulleted items. The entire item must be > > entered as one line (possibly wrapping). > > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "1.", and another > > space are shown as a numbered list. Each numbered item must > > be entered as one logical line. > > 1. first numbered bullet > > 1. second numbered bullet > > * Lines starting with three spaces, item tag name, ":", > > three spaces, and then the item tag body (entered as 1 > > logical line) are shown as taggest lists. > > tag: text > > tag: text2 > > > > All other lines beginning with white space are shown as is > > - no highlighting, reference generating, or even text wrapping occur. > > > > * Put four or more dashes on a line to get a horizontal > > separator, like the "----" below: > > ---- > > ''Using brackets in your text'' can be done by doubling them, > > so '''[[[[''' shows as > > '''[['''. > > > > -------------------- END OF SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:06 AM > > > To: Starkit list > > > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for > > wikit and > > > wikitools > > > > > > > > > Steve Cassidy wrote: > > > > > > [a range of feature requests] > > > > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin mechanism to add new > > > > formatting capabilities. I recall this has been mentioned before. > > > > Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in > > > some way? > > > > Such a structure might enable new features to be added > > more easily. > > > > > > > > My personal wish would be for section headers, ~~Title has been > > > > suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. > > > > > > Yup, I'd like that too (I've also seen "== ... ==" as alternative > > > syntax). Titles can be made to stand out clearly (and cleanly) now > > > that we have style sheets. > > > > > > It's interesting to note that at the last Tcl conference in > > > Vancouver, > > > when I asked whether we should redo wikit or add all sorts of > > > features > > > for the Tclers' Wiki, the reaction was essentially "nah, it > > works". > > > Which I interpreted as "let's focus on content, not gimmicks". > > > > > > > Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet > > > these days. > > > > > > Wikit was one of the first Tcl apps I coded, years ago. It > > > has come a > > > long way since then (this was way before > > > starkits/scripted-docs). It's > > > one of those apps that spreads by itself, keeps on getting > > tweaked in > > > neat ways - but let's face it, this thing really needs to be either > > > recoded from scratch or refactored / modularized so > > individual pieces > > > can be improved further. > > > > > > There's the meaner-and-leaner Kiwi rendering engine (for html > > > only, so > > > far). There's the TIP rendering code. And things like Will > > > Duquette's > > > Notebook. There is the ProjectForum/CourseForum product to > > > look at for > > > inspiration. And there are of course about one million > > other wiki's, > > > ranging from trivial to over-the-top. > > > > > > My design goals then still basically stand: > > > - single file app and single-file storage > > > - html CGI mode *and* local mode Tk > > > - fast local mode searching > > > Two new modes were added later: > > > - embedded help, and running as http server > > > > > > IMO the most distinguishing feature of wikit is its local-mode > > > capability (and it being in Tcl). > > > > > > Note however, that nothing prevents anyone from creating a > > > "wikit_html" > > > with all the Tk stuff ripped out and tons of rendering > > > extensions added > > > in. If done with the same storage design, one could still use the > > > local mode through the current wikit. It might be a good way to > > > experiment with new features, some of which we could then > > > later try to > > > fold into the original wikit codebase? > > > > > > A plugin mechanism would be nice too. Eh... Snit objects, anyone? > > > > > > -jcw > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > starkit mailing list > > > starkit@equi4.com > > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From colin@chinix.com Mon Apr 21 00:37:27 2003 Received: from sharedtech.dyndns.org (postfix@CPE-144-136-124-91.nsw.bigpond.net.au [144.136.124.91]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3L5bQN12692 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 00:37:26 -0500 Received: from kneebone.sharedtech.dyndns.org (kneebone.sharedtech.dyndns.org [192.168.2.2]) by sharedtech.dyndns.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8A6E75E67 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 15:37:41 +1000 (EST) From: Colin McCormack To: Starkit list Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1050903464.1210.12.camel@kneebone.sharedtech.dyndns.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.4 Date: 21 Apr 2003 15:37:44 +1000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Wikit - Local Settings page Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I find the default fonts and such too small (on my laptop) luckily, with a bit of trust in the code and a small hack, we can add the same sort of configurability as cgi settings page gives: diff -r wikit-cvs.vfs/lib/wikit/gui.tcl wikit-cn.vfs/lib/wikit/gui.tcl 334a335,340 > } > > # load and evaluate Local Wikit page > if {[catch {eval [mk::get wdb.pages!8 page]} result]} { > puts stderr $result > } 335a342 > catch { Note that this uses page 8, which is explicitly reserved, so to be polite we'd need to find a spare page (IANA Wikit reserver numbers? :) If you then add a page 8 with some tcl you can reconfigure on the fly (almost - you have to restart the local wiki) Here's my preferred settings for example: # change fonts - example font configure wikit_button -family lucida -size 15 font configure wikit_title -family lucida -size 24 -weight bold font configure wikit_edit -family lucida -size 18 -weight normal font configure wikit_fixed -family lucida -size 18 -weight bold font configure wikit_thin -family lucida -size 18 font configure wikit_bold -family lucida -size 18 -weight bold font configure wikit_italic -family lucida -size 18 -slant italic font configure wikit_bolditalic -family lucida -size 18 -weight bold -slant italic font configure wikit_default -family lucida -size 18 # Wikit Colors namespace eval ::Wikit::Color { set wikiFg "#000000" set wikiBg "#ffffff" set btnDisable "#404040" set linkFg blue set linkActive "#ff0000" set fixedFg "#8b0000" set fixedBg "#e0e0e0" set copyBg "#fafad2" } -- Colin McCormack From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Mon Apr 21 07:08:02 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3LC82N27277 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 07:08:02 -0500 Received: from int-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [3.159.236.66]) by ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h3LC8Fl2022837 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 08:08:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h3LC89Di012369 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 08:08:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Mon, 21 Apr 2003 08:08:09 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 08:08:09 -0400 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F5@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) Thread-Index: AcMF/gJ9/PoHOiLgRaGKBvO1+cApVwB/yqag From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "Starkit list" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Apr 2003 12:08:09.0414 (UTC) FILETIME=[AC874660:01C307FE] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3LC82N27277 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm sorry, I completely omitted my intentions... The parser I wrote is merely an example, one possible solution of many. It is my hope, that it would be useful to wikit maintainers, but it is, in fact, up to them to: a) do nothing b) implement a more feature rich and flexible parsing subsystem as a solution of their choice. I also did take a look at format.tcl and I have a few thoughts. Why not have wikit load the appropriate formatter depending on mode. When in cgi mode, wikit will never have use for TK rendering code, and yet it is loaded. Likewise, html is not needed in local mode. Would it be better to isolate the tk and cgi parsing in to two different modules? - bryan > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Krehbiel [mailto:tom.krehbiel@motorola.com] > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:56 PM > Cc: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) > > > Bryan, > > If your developing this prototype for something related to > the wikit then you need to look at the TextToStream proc in > the format.tcl file (unless you want to completely rewrite > the TextToStream and all the various streamToXXX rendering > and utility procedures). > > Tom K. > > > > > Oh... I guess I should I say that *everything* the parser > does with exception to the automatic table of contents is > optional. That is to say, that everything else is plugged in > via the registerLineModifier, registerCharacterSubstituion, > and registerFontModifier procedures. That goes for links, > lists, font formating, horizontal rules, and so on. > > > > -- bryan > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 5:35 PM > > > To: Starkit list > > > Subject: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) > > > > > > > > > Ok .. so here's a new prototype parser that is a bit more > > > modular and has more functionality. I didn't get to table > > > support, but maybe I can monday. Also, I appologize for the > > > lack of comments, I had *very* little time to do this, plus > > > it's just a prototype. > > > > > > Below is code for 1 wp.tcl file (the parser) and 1 sample > > > input file. The sample input file is default formatting help > > > that come with wikit plus a few more things. For now just > > > save the contests to wp.tcl in wp.in (or something simular) > > > > > > Then run: > > > # tclkit wp.tcl wp.in > test.html > > > > > > > > > - enjoy and let me know what you think. > > > bryan > > > > > > --------- PARSER wp.tcl -------- > > > > > > namespace eval wp { > > > variable lineModifiers [list] > > > variable charSubstitutions > > > array set charSubstitutions {} > > > variable fontModifiers > > > array set fontModifiers {} > > > } > > > namespace eval wp::linemod {} > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::registerLineModifier {procname} { > > > puts stderr "registering line modifier: $procname" > > > lappend wp::lineModifiers $procname > > > } > > > proc wp::registerCharacterSubstituion {char substitution} { > > > puts stderr "registering character substitution: $char --> > > > $substitution" > > > set wp::charSubstitutions($char) $substitution > > > } > > > proc wp::registerFontModifier {key htmlTag} { > > > puts stderr "registering font modifier: $key --> $htmlTag" > > > set wp::fontModifiers($key) $htmlTag > > > } > > > > > > proc wp::parse { data } { > > > set html "\n" > > > append html [wp::createHeader] > > > append html "\n" > > > # append the page title > > > append html "

    Page Title

    " > > > > > > # assume that formating does not span lines. > > > > > > set contentsHtml "

    Contents

      " > > > set ref 1 > > > set bodyHtml "" > > > foreach line [split $data \n] { > > > if {[regexp {^[A-Z 0-9]+$} [string trim $line]]} { > > > # this is a section header > > > set line [string trim $line] > > > append contentsHtml "
    • $line
      • " > > > append bodyHtml "

      $line

      " > > > incr ref > > > continue > > > } > > > set line [wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions $line] > > > set line [wp::makeFontModifications $line] > > > set line [wp::makeLineModifications $line] > > > append bodyHtml "$line\n" > > > } > > > > > > > > > append html "$contentsHtml

    > > size=0>

    $bodyHtml\n\n" > > > puts $html > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::makeLineModifications {line} { > > > foreach {modProc} $wp::lineModifiers { > > > if {[catch { > > > eval $modProc \$line > > > } result]} { > > > puts stderr \ > > > "error running line modifier \"$modProc\" on > > > \"$line\" : $result" > > > puts stderr $::errorInfo > > > } else { > > > set line $result > > > } > > > } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > proc wp::makeFontModifications {line} { > > > foreach key [array names wp::fontModifiers] { > > > # the keys must be presented in pairs, or no > > > substitution should be made > > > set length [string length $key] > > > set modLength [string length $wp::fontModifiers($key)] > > > set start [string first $key $line] > > > while {$start != -1} { > > > set end [string first $key $line [expr {$start + $length}]] > > > if {$end == -1} { break } > > > # replace the end of the match first, so the > > > substitution does not > > > # move our end match > > > set line [string replace $line $end [expr {$end + > $length -1}]\ > > > ""] > > > set line [string replace $line $start [expr {$start + > > > $length - 1}] \ > > > "<$wp::fontModifiers($key)>"] > > > set start [string first $key $line [expr {$end + > $length -1}]] > > > } > > > } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > > > > proc wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions {line} { > > > foreach char [array names wp::charSubstitutions] { > > > regsub -all -- "\[$char\]" $line > > > "\\$wp::charSubstitutions($char)" line > > > } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > ## > > > # create the head portion of the html output > > > ## > > > proc wp::createHeader {} { > > > append html "\n" > > > append html " Sample Page\n" > > > # add the meta data, base, css stuff too > > > append html "\n" > > > return $html > > > } > > > > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::horizontalRule {line} { > > > if {[regexp {^(<.*>|\s)*----+\s*$} $line]} { > > > regsub -- {----+} $line "

    " line > > > } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::lineBreaks { line } { > > > if {[string trim $line] == ""} { return "
    " } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::links { line } { > > > variable link > > > if {![info exists link]} { > > > set link(count) 1 > > > set link(escapedBracket) {(\]\])|(\[\[)} > > > set link(siteAbbrevRegexp) \ > > > {\[((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+\]($)?} > > > set link(siteRegexp) \ > > > {((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+($)?} > > > set link(imageRegexp) \ > > > {\[.+\.(jpg|png|gif)\]} > > > set link(localRegexp) {\[.+\]} > > > > > > } > > > # there could be multiple links on a line > > > array set hrefs {} > > > set hcount 0 > > > set looking 1 > > > while {$looking} { > > > incr hcount > > > if {[regexp $link(escapedBracket) $line match]} { > > > # [[ or ]] not a link! > > > if {$match == "\[\["} { > > > set hrefs($hcount) "\[" > > > } else { > > > set hrefs($hcount) "\]" > > > } > > > regsub -- $link(escapedBracket) $line " > __HREF$hcount " line > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(imageRegexp) $line match]} { > > > # inline image > > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > > "" > > > regsub -- $link(imageRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line match]} { > > > # abbreviated or tiny remote site link > > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > > "\[ \[\]]>$link(count)\]" > > > incr link(count) > > > regsub -- $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line " > __HREF$hcount " line > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteRegexp) $line match]} { > > > # remote site link > > > set hrefs($hcount) "[string trim > $match]" > > > regsub -- $link(siteRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(localRegexp) $line match]} { > > > # wikit local page > > > set match [string trim $match \[\]] > > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > > "$match" > > > regsub -- $link(localRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > > } else { > > > set looking 0 > > > } > > > } > > > foreach name [array names hrefs] { > > > regsub -- " __HREF$name " $line "$hrefs($name)" line > > > } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::lists {line} { > > > variable list > > > if {![info exists list]} { > > > set list none > > > } > > > switch -regexp -- $line { > > > { [0-9]+\. .*} { > > > # part of ordered list > > > regsub -- { [0-9]+\.} $line "

  • " line > > > switch -- $list { > > > "none" { set line "
      $line" } > > > "unordered" { set line "
        $line" } > > > "ordered" { set line "$line" } > > > "definition" { set line "
          $line" } > > > } > > > set list "ordered" > > > } > > > { [\*] .*} { > > > # part of unordered list > > > regsub -- { [\*]} $line "
        1. " line > > > switch -- $list { > > > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > > > "unordered" { set line "$line" } > > > "ordered" { set line "
          $line" } > > > "definition" { set line "
            $line" } > > > } > > > set list "unordered" > > > } > > > { .+: .*} { > > > # part of a definition list > > > set i [string first ":" $line] > > > set term [string trim [string range $line 0 [expr > {$i - 1}]]] > > > set def [string trim [string range $line [expr {$i > + 1}] end]] > > > set line "
            $term
            $def
            " > > > switch -- $list { > > > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > > > "unordered" { set line "
          $line" } > > > "ordered" { set line "
      $line" } > > > } > > > set list "definition" > > > } > > > default { > > > # not part of a list > > > switch -- $list { > > > "unordered" { set line "\n$line" } > > > "ordered" { set line "
    \n$line" } > > > "definition" { set line "\n$line" } > > > } > > > set list "none" > > > } > > > } > > > return $line > > > } > > > > > > > > > #============================================================= > > > ========= > > > set infile [lindex $argv 0] > > > if {![file exists $infile]} { > > > puts "File does not exist: $infile" > > > puts "Usage: [info script] input_file_name" > > > exit > > > } > > > > > > if {[catch { > > > set chan [open $infile] > > > set data [read $chan] > > > close $chan > > > } err]} { > > > puts "Error reading $infile: $err" > > > exit > > > } > > > > > > > > > ## > > > # Register characters that we need to substitute, so browsers > > > won't spaz > > > ## > > > foreach {char subst} { > > > "<" "<" > > > ">" ">" > > > "\"" """ > > > } { > > > wp::registerCharacterSubstituion $char $subst > > > } > > > > > > ## > > > # Now allow for some handy font modification > > > ## > > > foreach {key htmlTag} { > > > ''' b > > > '' i > > > ___ u > > > === h3 > > > } { > > > wp::registerFontModifier $key $htmlTag > > > } > > > > > > > > > ## > > > # Now allow line modifications > > > ## > > > foreach {modProc} { > > > wp::linemod::lineBreaks > > > wp::linemod::lists > > > wp::linemod::links > > > wp::linemod::horizontalRule > > > } { > > > wp::registerLineModifier $modProc > > > } > > > wp::parse $data > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- END OF PARSER FILE --------------------- > > > > > > -------------------- SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > > > TEST CHARS > > > < > " > > > > > > TEST FONT FORMATS > > > * '''bold''' > > > * ''italic'' > > > * ___underline___ > > > * ===Heading=== > > > * '''A complex ''line ___is ''' easy___ to'' do > > > > > > LINKS > > > * http://www.equi4.com/ or [http://www.equi4.com/] > > > * https://www.google.com > > > * ftp://ftp.cool.com/file.ext > > > * http://www.google.com/images/logo.gif > > > * [http://www.equi4.com/images/e4s.gif] > > > * [local page] > > > > > > > > > STANDARD FORMAT HELP FROM WIKIT > > > > > > '''References:''' > > > 1. You can refer to another page by putting its name in > > > square brackets like this: [[PAGE]] > > > 1. URLs will automatically be recognized and underlined: > > > http://your.site/contents.html > > > 1. If you put URLs in square brackets, they'll be shown as > > > a tiny reference [http://your.site/contents.html] instead. > > > ''In this situation'', the system assumes that any url ending > > > in '''.jpg''', '''.png''', or '''.gif''' is an image and > > > displays it inline. > > > 1. URL methods recognized are: > > > * http://www.w3.org/ > > > * ftp://ftp.x.org/ > > > * mailto:user@somehost.com > > > * news:comp.lang.tcl > > > > > > '''Adding highlights:''' > > > * Surround text by pairs of single quotes to make it > > > ''display in italic'' > > > * Surround text by triples of single quotes to make it > > > '''display in bold''' > > > > > > '''Adding structure to your text:''' > > > * Lines of text are normally joined, with empty lines used > > > to delineate paragraphs > > > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "*", and another > > > space are shown as bulleted items. The entire item must be > > > entered as one line (possibly wrapping). > > > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "1.", and another > > > space are shown as a numbered list. Each numbered item must > > > be entered as one logical line. > > > 1. first numbered bullet > > > 1. second numbered bullet > > > * Lines starting with three spaces, item tag name, ":", > > > three spaces, and then the item tag body (entered as 1 > > > logical line) are shown as taggest lists. > > > tag: text > > > tag: text2 > > > > > > All other lines beginning with white space are shown as is > > > - no highlighting, reference generating, or even text > wrapping occur. > > > > > > * Put four or more dashes on a line to get a horizontal > > > separator, like the "----" below: > > > ---- > > > ''Using brackets in your text'' can be done by doubling them, > > > so '''[[[[''' shows as > > > '''[['''. > > > > > > -------------------- END OF SAMPLE INPUT FILE > ---------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:06 AM > > > > To: Starkit list > > > > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for > > > wikit and > > > > wikitools > > > > > > > > > > > > Steve Cassidy wrote: > > > > > > > > [a range of feature requests] > > > > > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin > mechanism to add new > > > > > formatting capabilities. I recall this has been > mentioned before. > > > > > Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in > > > > some way? > > > > > Such a structure might enable new features to be added > > > more easily. > > > > > > > > > > My personal wish would be for section headers, > ~~Title has been > > > > > suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. > > > > > > > > Yup, I'd like that too (I've also seen "== ... ==" as > alternative > > > > syntax). Titles can be made to stand out clearly (and > cleanly) now > > > > that we have style sheets. > > > > > > > > It's interesting to note that at the last Tcl conference in > > > > Vancouver, > > > > when I asked whether we should redo wikit or add all sorts of > > > > features > > > > for the Tclers' Wiki, the reaction was essentially "nah, it > > > works". > > > > Which I interpreted as "let's focus on content, not gimmicks". > > > > > > > > > Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet > > > > these days. > > > > > > > > Wikit was one of the first Tcl apps I coded, years ago. It > > > > has come a > > > > long way since then (this was way before > > > > starkits/scripted-docs). It's > > > > one of those apps that spreads by itself, keeps on getting > > > tweaked in > > > > neat ways - but let's face it, this thing really needs > to be either > > > > recoded from scratch or refactored / modularized so > > > individual pieces > > > > can be improved further. > > > > > > > > There's the meaner-and-leaner Kiwi rendering engine (for html > > > > only, so > > > > far). There's the TIP rendering code. And things like Will > > > > Duquette's > > > > Notebook. There is the ProjectForum/CourseForum product to > > > > look at for > > > > inspiration. And there are of course about one million > > > other wiki's, > > > > ranging from trivial to over-the-top. > > > > > > > > My design goals then still basically stand: > > > > - single file app and single-file storage > > > > - html CGI mode *and* local mode Tk > > > > - fast local mode searching > > > > Two new modes were added later: > > > > - embedded help, and running as http server > > > > > > > > IMO the most distinguishing feature of wikit is its local-mode > > > > capability (and it being in Tcl). > > > > > > > > Note however, that nothing prevents anyone from creating a > > > > "wikit_html" > > > > with all the Tk stuff ripped out and tons of rendering > > > > extensions added > > > > in. If done with the same storage design, one could > still use the > > > > local mode through the current wikit. It might be a good way to > > > > experiment with new features, some of which we could then > > > > later try to > > > > fold into the original wikit codebase? > > > > > > > > A plugin mechanism would be nice too. Eh... Snit > objects, anyone? > > > > > > > > -jcw > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > starkit mailing list > > > > starkit@equi4.com > > > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > starkit mailing list > > > starkit@equi4.com > > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > -- > Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com > Software Developer > Design to Manufacturing Solutions > Semiconductor Products Sector > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Apr 21 11:06:53 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3LG6rN05640 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 11:06:53 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h3LG7C19016501 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:07:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3LG7AOq020384 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 11:07:10 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA4172D.34B68778@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:07:09 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) References: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E253F5@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan, There was discussion about font size here several weeks ago and I updated the wikit code to read defaults (colors & fonts) from a configuration file. I set the changes to JCW for review (if I recall correctly) but the changes haven't yet propagated to the sdarchive site. Tom K. > I'm sorry, I completely omitted my intentions... > > The parser I wrote is merely an example, one possible solution of many. It is my hope, that it would be useful to wikit maintainers, but it is, in fact, up to them to: > a) do nothing > b) implement a more feature rich and flexible parsing subsystem as a solution of their choice. > > I also did take a look at format.tcl and I have a few thoughts. Why not have wikit load the appropriate formatter depending on mode. When in cgi mode, wikit will never have use for TK rendering code, and yet it is loaded. Likewise, html is not needed in local mode. Would it be better to isolate the tk and cgi parsing in to two different modules? > > - bryan > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Tom Krehbiel [mailto:tom.krehbiel@motorola.com] > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:56 PM > > Cc: Starkit list > > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) > > > > > > Bryan, > > > > If your developing this prototype for something related to > > the wikit then you need to look at the TextToStream proc in > > the format.tcl file (unless you want to completely rewrite > > the TextToStream and all the various streamToXXX rendering > > and utility procedures). > > > > Tom K. > > > > > > > > Oh... I guess I should I say that *everything* the parser > > does with exception to the automatic table of contents is > > optional. That is to say, that everything else is plugged in > > via the registerLineModifier, registerCharacterSubstituion, > > and registerFontModifier procedures. That goes for links, > > lists, font formating, horizontal rules, and so on. > > > > > > -- bryan > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Schofield, Bryan (TRANS) > > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 5:35 PM > > > > To: Starkit list > > > > Subject: [Starkit] Wikit - And a new parser (protoype included!) > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok .. so here's a new prototype parser that is a bit more > > > > modular and has more functionality. I didn't get to table > > > > support, but maybe I can monday. Also, I appologize for the > > > > lack of comments, I had *very* little time to do this, plus > > > > it's just a prototype. > > > > > > > > Below is code for 1 wp.tcl file (the parser) and 1 sample > > > > input file. The sample input file is default formatting help > > > > that come with wikit plus a few more things. For now just > > > > save the contests to wp.tcl in wp.in (or something simular) > > > > > > > > Then run: > > > > # tclkit wp.tcl wp.in > test.html > > > > > > > > > > > > - enjoy and let me know what you think. > > > > bryan > > > > > > > > --------- PARSER wp.tcl -------- > > > > > > > > namespace eval wp { > > > > variable lineModifiers [list] > > > > variable charSubstitutions > > > > array set charSubstitutions {} > > > > variable fontModifiers > > > > array set fontModifiers {} > > > > } > > > > namespace eval wp::linemod {} > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::registerLineModifier {procname} { > > > > puts stderr "registering line modifier: $procname" > > > > lappend wp::lineModifiers $procname > > > > } > > > > proc wp::registerCharacterSubstituion {char substitution} { > > > > puts stderr "registering character substitution: $char --> > > > > $substitution" > > > > set wp::charSubstitutions($char) $substitution > > > > } > > > > proc wp::registerFontModifier {key htmlTag} { > > > > puts stderr "registering font modifier: $key --> $htmlTag" > > > > set wp::fontModifiers($key) $htmlTag > > > > } > > > > > > > > proc wp::parse { data } { > > > > set html "\n" > > > > append html [wp::createHeader] > > > > append html "\n" > > > > # append the page title > > > > append html "

    Page Title

    " > > > > > > > > # assume that formating does not span lines. > > > > > > > > set contentsHtml "

    Contents

      " > > > > set ref 1 > > > > set bodyHtml "" > > > > foreach line [split $data \n] { > > > > if {[regexp {^[A-Z 0-9]+$} [string trim $line]]} { > > > > # this is a section header > > > > set line [string trim $line] > > > > append contentsHtml "
    • $line
      • " > > > > append bodyHtml "

      $line

      " > > > > incr ref > > > > continue > > > > } > > > > set line [wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions $line] > > > > set line [wp::makeFontModifications $line] > > > > set line [wp::makeLineModifications $line] > > > > append bodyHtml "$line\n" > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > append html "$contentsHtml

    > > > size=0>

    $bodyHtml\n\n" > > > > puts $html > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::makeLineModifications {line} { > > > > foreach {modProc} $wp::lineModifiers { > > > > if {[catch { > > > > eval $modProc \$line > > > > } result]} { > > > > puts stderr \ > > > > "error running line modifier \"$modProc\" on > > > > \"$line\" : $result" > > > > puts stderr $::errorInfo > > > > } else { > > > > set line $result > > > > } > > > > } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > proc wp::makeFontModifications {line} { > > > > foreach key [array names wp::fontModifiers] { > > > > # the keys must be presented in pairs, or no > > > > substitution should be made > > > > set length [string length $key] > > > > set modLength [string length $wp::fontModifiers($key)] > > > > set start [string first $key $line] > > > > while {$start != -1} { > > > > set end [string first $key $line [expr {$start + $length}]] > > > > if {$end == -1} { break } > > > > # replace the end of the match first, so the > > > > substitution does not > > > > # move our end match > > > > set line [string replace $line $end [expr {$end + > > $length -1}]\ > > > > ""] > > > > set line [string replace $line $start [expr {$start + > > > > $length - 1}] \ > > > > "<$wp::fontModifiers($key)>"] > > > > set start [string first $key $line [expr {$end + > > $length -1}]] > > > > } > > > > } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::makeCharacterSubstitutions {line} { > > > > foreach char [array names wp::charSubstitutions] { > > > > regsub -all -- "\[$char\]" $line > > > > "\\$wp::charSubstitutions($char)" line > > > > } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > ## > > > > # create the head portion of the html output > > > > ## > > > > proc wp::createHeader {} { > > > > append html "\n" > > > > append html " Sample Page\n" > > > > # add the meta data, base, css stuff too > > > > append html "\n" > > > > return $html > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::horizontalRule {line} { > > > > if {[regexp {^(<.*>|\s)*----+\s*$} $line]} { > > > > regsub -- {----+} $line "

    " line > > > > } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::lineBreaks { line } { > > > > if {[string trim $line] == ""} { return "
    " } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::links { line } { > > > > variable link > > > > if {![info exists link]} { > > > > set link(count) 1 > > > > set link(escapedBracket) {(\]\])|(\[\[)} > > > > set link(siteAbbrevRegexp) \ > > > > {\[((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+\]($)?} > > > > set link(siteRegexp) \ > > > > {((ht|f)tp(s)?://|(mailto|news):)[^\s< ]+($)?} > > > > set link(imageRegexp) \ > > > > {\[.+\.(jpg|png|gif)\]} > > > > set link(localRegexp) {\[.+\]} > > > > > > > > } > > > > # there could be multiple links on a line > > > > array set hrefs {} > > > > set hcount 0 > > > > set looking 1 > > > > while {$looking} { > > > > incr hcount > > > > if {[regexp $link(escapedBracket) $line match]} { > > > > # [[ or ]] not a link! > > > > if {$match == "\[\["} { > > > > set hrefs($hcount) "\[" > > > > } else { > > > > set hrefs($hcount) "\]" > > > > } > > > > regsub -- $link(escapedBracket) $line " > > __HREF$hcount " line > > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(imageRegexp) $line match]} { > > > > # inline image > > > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > > > "" > > > > regsub -- $link(imageRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line match]} { > > > > # abbreviated or tiny remote site link > > > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > > > "\[ > \[\]]>$link(count)\]" > > > > incr link(count) > > > > regsub -- $link(siteAbbrevRegexp) $line " > > __HREF$hcount " line > > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(siteRegexp) $line match]} { > > > > # remote site link > > > > set hrefs($hcount) "[string trim > > $match]" > > > > regsub -- $link(siteRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > > > } elseif {[regexp $link(localRegexp) $line match]} { > > > > # wikit local page > > > > set match [string trim $match \[\]] > > > > set hrefs($hcount) \ > > > > "$match" > > > > regsub -- $link(localRegexp) $line " __HREF$hcount " line > > > > } else { > > > > set looking 0 > > > > } > > > > } > > > > foreach name [array names hrefs] { > > > > regsub -- " __HREF$name " $line "$hrefs($name)" line > > > > } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > proc wp::linemod::lists {line} { > > > > variable list > > > > if {![info exists list]} { > > > > set list none > > > > } > > > > switch -regexp -- $line { > > > > { [0-9]+\. .*} { > > > > # part of ordered list > > > > regsub -- { [0-9]+\.} $line "

  • " line > > > > switch -- $list { > > > > "none" { set line "
      $line" } > > > > "unordered" { set line "
        $line" } > > > > "ordered" { set line "$line" } > > > > "definition" { set line "
          $line" } > > > > } > > > > set list "ordered" > > > > } > > > > { [\*] .*} { > > > > # part of unordered list > > > > regsub -- { [\*]} $line "
        1. " line > > > > switch -- $list { > > > > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > > > > "unordered" { set line "$line" } > > > > "ordered" { set line "
          $line" } > > > > "definition" { set line "
            $line" } > > > > } > > > > set list "unordered" > > > > } > > > > { .+: .*} { > > > > # part of a definition list > > > > set i [string first ":" $line] > > > > set term [string trim [string range $line 0 [expr > > {$i - 1}]]] > > > > set def [string trim [string range $line [expr {$i > > + 1}] end]] > > > > set line "
            $term
            $def
            " > > > > switch -- $list { > > > > "none" { set line "
            $line" } > > > > "unordered" { set line "
          $line" } > > > > "ordered" { set line "
      $line" } > > > > } > > > > set list "definition" > > > > } > > > > default { > > > > # not part of a list > > > > switch -- $list { > > > > "unordered" { set line "\n$line" } > > > > "ordered" { set line "
    \n$line" } > > > > "definition" { set line "\n$line" } > > > > } > > > > set list "none" > > > > } > > > > } > > > > return $line > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > #============================================================= > > > > ========= > > > > set infile [lindex $argv 0] > > > > if {![file exists $infile]} { > > > > puts "File does not exist: $infile" > > > > puts "Usage: [info script] input_file_name" > > > > exit > > > > } > > > > > > > > if {[catch { > > > > set chan [open $infile] > > > > set data [read $chan] > > > > close $chan > > > > } err]} { > > > > puts "Error reading $infile: $err" > > > > exit > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > ## > > > > # Register characters that we need to substitute, so browsers > > > > won't spaz > > > > ## > > > > foreach {char subst} { > > > > "<" "<" > > > > ">" ">" > > > > "\"" """ > > > > } { > > > > wp::registerCharacterSubstituion $char $subst > > > > } > > > > > > > > ## > > > > # Now allow for some handy font modification > > > > ## > > > > foreach {key htmlTag} { > > > > ''' b > > > > '' i > > > > ___ u > > > > === h3 > > > > } { > > > > wp::registerFontModifier $key $htmlTag > > > > } > > > > > > > > > > > > ## > > > > # Now allow line modifications > > > > ## > > > > foreach {modProc} { > > > > wp::linemod::lineBreaks > > > > wp::linemod::lists > > > > wp::linemod::links > > > > wp::linemod::horizontalRule > > > > } { > > > > wp::registerLineModifier $modProc > > > > } > > > > wp::parse $data > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- END OF PARSER FILE --------------------- > > > > > > > > -------------------- SAMPLE INPUT FILE ---------------------- > > > > TEST CHARS > > > > < > " > > > > > > > > TEST FONT FORMATS > > > > * '''bold''' > > > > * ''italic'' > > > > * ___underline___ > > > > * ===Heading=== > > > > * '''A complex ''line ___is ''' easy___ to'' do > > > > > > > > LINKS > > > > * http://www.equi4.com/ or [http://www.equi4.com/] > > > > * https://www.google.com > > > > * ftp://ftp.cool.com/file.ext > > > > * http://www.google.com/images/logo.gif > > > > * [http://www.equi4.com/images/e4s.gif] > > > > * [local page] > > > > > > > > > > > > STANDARD FORMAT HELP FROM WIKIT > > > > > > > > '''References:''' > > > > 1. You can refer to another page by putting its name in > > > > square brackets like this: [[PAGE]] > > > > 1. URLs will automatically be recognized and underlined: > > > > http://your.site/contents.html > > > > 1. If you put URLs in square brackets, they'll be shown as > > > > a tiny reference [http://your.site/contents.html] instead. > > > > ''In this situation'', the system assumes that any url ending > > > > in '''.jpg''', '''.png''', or '''.gif''' is an image and > > > > displays it inline. > > > > 1. URL methods recognized are: > > > > * http://www.w3.org/ > > > > * ftp://ftp.x.org/ > > > > * mailto:user@somehost.com > > > > * news:comp.lang.tcl > > > > > > > > '''Adding highlights:''' > > > > * Surround text by pairs of single quotes to make it > > > > ''display in italic'' > > > > * Surround text by triples of single quotes to make it > > > > '''display in bold''' > > > > > > > > '''Adding structure to your text:''' > > > > * Lines of text are normally joined, with empty lines used > > > > to delineate paragraphs > > > > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "*", and another > > > > space are shown as bulleted items. The entire item must be > > > > entered as one line (possibly wrapping). > > > > * Lines starting with three spaces, a "1.", and another > > > > space are shown as a numbered list. Each numbered item must > > > > be entered as one logical line. > > > > 1. first numbered bullet > > > > 1. second numbered bullet > > > > * Lines starting with three spaces, item tag name, ":", > > > > three spaces, and then the item tag body (entered as 1 > > > > logical line) are shown as taggest lists. > > > > tag: text > > > > tag: text2 > > > > > > > > All other lines beginning with white space are shown as is > > > > - no highlighting, reference generating, or even text > > wrapping occur. > > > > > > > > * Put four or more dashes on a line to get a horizontal > > > > separator, like the "----" below: > > > > ---- > > > > ''Using brackets in your text'' can be done by doubling them, > > > > so '''[[[[''' shows as > > > > '''[['''. > > > > > > > > -------------------- END OF SAMPLE INPUT FILE > > ---------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] > > > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:06 AM > > > > > To: Starkit list > > > > > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for > > > > wikit and > > > > > wikitools > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Steve Cassidy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > [a range of feature requests] > > > > > > Perhaps what's needed is some kind of plugin > > mechanism to add new > > > > > > formatting capabilities. I recall this has been > > mentioned before. > > > > > > Could the current formatter be extended to allow plugins in > > > > > some way? > > > > > > Such a structure might enable new features to be added > > > > more easily. > > > > > > > > > > > > My personal wish would be for section headers, > > ~~Title has been > > > > > > suggested and shouldn't break anything already in place. > > > > > > > > > > Yup, I'd like that too (I've also seen "== ... ==" as > > alternative > > > > > syntax). Titles can be made to stand out clearly (and > > cleanly) now > > > > > that we have style sheets. > > > > > > > > > > It's interesting to note that at the last Tcl conference in > > > > > Vancouver, > > > > > when I asked whether we should redo wikit or add all sorts of > > > > > features > > > > > for the Tclers' Wiki, the reaction was essentially "nah, it > > > > works". > > > > > Which I interpreted as "let's focus on content, not gimmicks". > > > > > > > > > > > Remember, colours and fonts can be set with the stylesheet > > > > > these days. > > > > > > > > > > Wikit was one of the first Tcl apps I coded, years ago. It > > > > > has come a > > > > > long way since then (this was way before > > > > > starkits/scripted-docs). It's > > > > > one of those apps that spreads by itself, keeps on getting > > > > tweaked in > > > > > neat ways - but let's face it, this thing really needs > > to be either > > > > > recoded from scratch or refactored / modularized so > > > > individual pieces > > > > > can be improved further. > > > > > > > > > > There's the meaner-and-leaner Kiwi rendering engine (for html > > > > > only, so > > > > > far). There's the TIP rendering code. And things like Will > > > > > Duquette's > > > > > Notebook. There is the ProjectForum/CourseForum product to > > > > > look at for > > > > > inspiration. And there are of course about one million > > > > other wiki's, > > > > > ranging from trivial to over-the-top. > > > > > > > > > > My design goals then still basically stand: > > > > > - single file app and single-file storage > > > > > - html CGI mode *and* local mode Tk > > > > > - fast local mode searching > > > > > Two new modes were added later: > > > > > - embedded help, and running as http server > > > > > > > > > > IMO the most distinguishing feature of wikit is its local-mode > > > > > capability (and it being in Tcl). > > > > > > > > > > Note however, that nothing prevents anyone from creating a > > > > > "wikit_html" > > > > > with all the Tk stuff ripped out and tons of rendering > > > > > extensions added > > > > > in. If done with the same storage design, one could > > still use the > > > > > local mode through the current wikit. It might be a good way to > > > > > experiment with new features, some of which we could then > > > > > later try to > > > > > fold into the original wikit codebase? > > > > > > > > > > A plugin mechanism would be nice too. Eh... Snit > > objects, anyone? > > > > > > > > > > -jcw > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > starkit mailing list > > > > > starkit@equi4.com > > > > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > starkit mailing list > > > > starkit@equi4.com > > > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > starkit mailing list > > > starkit@equi4.com > > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > > -- > > Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com > > Software Developer > > Design to Manufacturing Solutions > > Semiconductor Products Sector > > _______________________________________________ > > starkit mailing list > > starkit@equi4.com > > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Apr 22 18:44:46 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3MNikN29182 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 18:44:46 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h3MNj6IL010106 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:45:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3MNj4Oq009408 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 18:45:04 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA5D3FF.B2D53637@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:45:03 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] PROBLEM with HP-UX tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The current HP-UX build (at /pub/tk/8.4.2) should probably be remove until a "safe" build is created. The current build doesn't remove files the are "loaded" to the /var/tmp directory at runtime. This eventually will result in a file system error of "no space left on device". I though this problem had been fixed but apparently not. I will start looking into the problem tomorrow. Any help with this problem would be appreciated. Tom K. From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Apr 23 01:26:12 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3N6QBN13269 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 01:26:11 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA07947 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 08:26:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA07768 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 08:26:25 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EA63211.B5821A0F@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 08:26:25 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROBLEM with HP-UX tclkit References: <3EA5D3FF.B2D53637@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > The current HP-UX build (at /pub/tk/8.4.2) should probably be remove until a "safe" build is created. The current build doesn't remove files the are "loaded" to the /var/tmp directory at runtime. This eventually will result in a file system error of "no space left on device". > > I though this problem had been fixed but apparently not. I will start looking into the problem tomorrow. Any help with this problem would be appreciated. > > Tom K. > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. Regards, Arjen From welch@panasas.com Tue Apr 22 21:31:40 2003 Received: from medlicott.panasas.com ([65.194.57.194]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3N2VeN04228 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:31:40 -0500 Received: from panasas.com (welch@localhost) by medlicott.panasas.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3N2QnE03611; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 19:26:50 -0700 Message-Id: <200304230226.h3N2QnE03611@medlicott.panasas.com> X-Authentication-Warning: medlicott.panasas.com: welch owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/02/2003 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Tom Krehbiel cc: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools In-reply-to: <3E9F186D.B03377BC@motorola.com> References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A60@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> <3E9F186D.B03377BC@motorola.com> Comments: In-reply-to Tom Krehbiel message dated "Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:11:09 -0700." From: Brent Welch X-URL: http://www.panasas.com/ X-Face: "HxE|?EnC9fVMV8f70H83&{fgLE.|FZ^$>@Q(yb#N,Eh~N]e&]=> r5~UnRml1:4EglY{9B+ :'wJq$@c_C!l8@<$t,{YUr4K,QJGHSvS~U]H`<+L*x?eGzSk>XH\W:AK\j?@?c1o List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>Tom Krehbiel said: > Phillip, > > > Yes, I am using a windows machine, and I am not receiving anything on stdo ut. > > If I run wikitool on UNIX, I get the expected output. Perhaps this is a b ug. > > I guess I need to do some testing on windows to figure out what the problem is. I don't normally work on windows so it may take some time. In my experience, if your starkit does puts to stdout, then you need to use tclkitsh on windows, in which case you'll get the output to the DOS window. I also considered adding "console show" but I haven't tried that. -- Brent Welch Software Architect, Panasas Inc Delivering the World's Most Scalable and Agile Storage Network www.panasas.com welch@panasas.com From welch@panasas.com Wed Apr 23 01:47:23 2003 Received: from medlicott.panasas.com ([65.194.57.194]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3N6lMN13972 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 01:47:22 -0500 Received: from panasas.com (welch@localhost) by medlicott.panasas.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3N6gbI04944 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 23:42:37 -0700 Message-Id: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> X-Authentication-Warning: medlicott.panasas.com: welch owned process doing -bs To: starkit@equi4.com From: Brent Welch X-URL: http://www.panasas.com/ X-Face: "HxE|?EnC9fVMV8f70H83&{fgLE.|FZ^$>@Q(yb#N,Eh~N]e&]=>r5~UnRml1:4EglY{9B+ :'wJq$@c_C!l8@<$t,{YUr4K,QJGHSvS~U]H`<+L*x?eGzSk>XH\W:AK\j?@?c1o Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 23:42:37 -0700 Subject: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've added a chapter on Starkits to "Practical Programming in Tcl and Tk". You can check it out at http://www.beedub.com/book/4th/Starkit.pdf I'd appreciate any and all comments in the next week. JCW has given it a once-over already, and I've re-wacked the sections he found, um, "unclear". This audience probably knows everything in the material already, but if there are glaring ommisions, errors, improvements, etc., please let me know. -- Brent Welch Software Architect, Panasas Inc Delivering the World's Most Scalable and Agile Storage Network www.panasas.com welch@panasas.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Apr 23 10:45:21 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NFjKN15512 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:45:20 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h3NFjf19020677 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 08:45:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3NFjROq028757 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:45:35 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA6B516.818202F2@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 08:45:26 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A60@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> <3E9F186D.B03377BC@motorola.com> <200304230226.h3N2QnE03611@medlicott.panasas.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brent, Thanks, for the input. I worked on the problem a little last week and found that the code does work correctly on window but (as has been reported) the output I send to stdout doesn't show up in the DOS window. The "console show" approach was recommended to me but tclkit opens a console by default so that didn't seem to help. I haven't downloaded tclkitsh yet to try that approach. If tclkitsh does work then I will have to decide what to do with the imbedded wikit help :-( Tom K. > > >>>Tom Krehbiel said: > > Phillip, > > > > > Yes, I am using a windows machine, and I am not receiving anything on > stdo > ut. > > > If I run wikitool on UNIX, I get the expected output. Perhaps this is > a b > ug. > > > > I guess I need to do some testing on windows to figure out what the > problem > is. I don't normally work on windows so it may take some time. > > In my experience, if your starkit does puts to stdout, then you > need to use tclkitsh on windows, in which case you'll get the > output to the DOS window. I also considered adding "console show" > but I haven't tried that. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Apr 23 12:14:53 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NHErN23352 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:14:53 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h3NHFEAM004302 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:15:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3NHFCOq015209 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:15:12 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA6CA1F.81467C85@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:15:11 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROBLEM with HP-UX tclkit References: <3EA5D3FF.B2D53637@motorola.com> <3EA63211.B5821A0F@wldelft.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > > The current HP-UX build (at /pub/tk/8.4.2) should probably be remove > > until a "safe" build is created. The current build doesn't remove files > > the are "loaded" to the /var/tmp directory at runtime. This eventually > > will result in a file system error of "no space left on device". > > > > I though this problem had been fixed but apparently not. I will start > > looking into the problem tomorrow. Any help with this problem would be > > appreciated. > > > > Tom K. > > IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment > of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that > is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. > > Regards, > > Arjen IIRC the need for placing shared object files in a tmp directory is not unique to HPUX. What is unique to HPUX is that the OS won't allow the file to be deleted while it is in use. This results in an inability to remove the shared objects when they are written to the tmp directory. My recollection is that when a shared library is to be loaded from within a starkit the following steps are taken. 1) a unique process specific file name is created (e.g. tcla3435) 2) the shared library is written to a tmp directory (e.g. /var/tmp) using the file name generated in (1) 3) the tmp file is loaded from the tmp directory 4) the tmp file is immediately deleted This solution depends on the OS to delay deletion of the pages associated with the tmp file until all page locks are released by the executing process. While the above implementation works it does have the following disadvantages. 1) No attempt is made to share libraries that are by definition sharable objects. 2) The solution depends on OS behavior that is not implemented the same on all OS's. With the above in mind I would like to suggest that a better implementation would use the following steps. 1) given a shared library file name then create a tmp file name that looks like this _ where is a hash key value based on the file size and content. 2) If a file having the name _ is found in the tmp directory then load it 2) If a file isn't found then write the shared library to the tmp directory using the file name generated in (1) and load the file The above implementation would have several advantages. 1) true sharing could occur on the shared libraries 2) loading would be faster in most cases since a file write wouldn't be necessary 3) The implementation would work on with all OS's Also, deletion of files by a sysadmin shouldn't cause problems for applications because on systems that allow deletion the blocks will still be locked and on systems that don't the file won't be deleted. The only disadvantage I see with this new implementation is a potential security hole if the shared files in the tmp directory can be replaced by a malicious user and then used by another application. Prevention of this possibility is the purpose of the hash value in the name. Calculation of the could potentially be done at wrap time and cached for use at runtime. Comments??? Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Apr 23 12:22:10 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NHMAN23937 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:22:10 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h3NHMVnH023474 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:22:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3NHMHOq019174 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:22:29 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA6CBC9.D819B@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:22:18 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A60@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> <3E9F186D.B03377BC@motorola.com> <200304230226.h3N2QnE03611@medlicott.panasas.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brent, > In my experience, if your starkit does puts to stdout, then you > need to use tclkitsh on windows, in which case you'll get the > output to the DOS window. I also considered adding "console show" > but I haven't tried that. I just realized why I didn't proceed, the download site doesn't contain any pre built tclkitsh's and I can't do builds on my windows system. Is there some place I can get a 8.4 pre built tclkitsh? Tom K. From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Wed Apr 23 12:30:19 2003 Received: from mailout07.sul.t-online.com (mailout07.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.83]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NHUIN24636 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:30:19 -0500 Received: from fwd02.sul.t-online.de by mailout07.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 198O4t-0003LE-00; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:30:39 +0200 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (520047057634-0001@[217.82.105.146]) by fmrl02.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 198O4o-2KDbJwC; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:30:34 +0200 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70D9E7BEF for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2001 22:26:26 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3EA6CE75.9040004@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:33:41 +0200 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Looking for the point of contact for wikit and wikitools References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A60@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> <3E9F186D.B03377BC@motorola.com> <200304230226.h3N2QnE03611@medlicott.panasas.com> <3EA6CBC9.D819B@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Sender: 520047057634-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: >Brent, > > > >>In my experience, if your starkit does puts to stdout, then you >>need to use tclkitsh on windows, in which case you'll get the >>output to the DOS window. I also considered adding "console show" >>but I haven't tried that. >> >> > >I just realized why I didn't proceed, the download site doesn't >contain any pre built tclkitsh's and I can't do builds on my >windows system. Is there some place I can get a 8.4 pre built >tclkitsh? > > > From the usual place: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.2/ (hint: Its not named tclkitsh, but tclkit-win32-sh.exe.gz or tclkit-win32-sh.upx.exe) Michael From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Apr 23 12:54:26 2003 Received: from motgate6.mot.com ([144.189.100.106]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NHsQN26861 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:54:26 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate6.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate6) with ESMTP id h3NHsluP026020 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:54:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3NHsjOq003850 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:54:46 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA6D364.AB21146F@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:54:44 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > > The current HP-UX build (at /pub/tk/8.4.2) should probably be remove > > until a "safe" build is created. The current build doesn't remove files > > the are "loaded" to the /var/tmp directory at runtime. This eventually > > will result in a file system error of "no space left on device". > > > > I though this problem had been fixed but apparently not. I will start > > looking into the problem tomorrow. Any help with this problem would be > > appreciated. > > > > Tom K. > > IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment > of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that > is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. > > Regards, > > Arjen IIRC the need for placing shared object files in a tmp directory is not unique to HPUX. What is unique to HPUX is that the OS won't allow the file to be deleted while it is in use. This results in an inability to remove the shared objects when they are written to the tmp directory. My recollection is that when a shared library is to be loaded from within a starkit the following steps are taken. 1) a unique process specific file name is created (e.g. tcla3435) 2) the shared library is written to a tmp directory (e.g. /var/tmp) using the file name generated in (1) 3) the tmp file is loaded from the tmp directory 4) the tmp file is immediately deleted This solution depends on the OS to delay deletion of the pages associated with the tmp file until all page locks are released by the executing process. While the above implementation works it does have the following disadvantages. 1) No attempt is made to share libraries that are by definition sharable objects. 2) The solution depends on OS behavior that is not implemented the same on all OS's. With the above in mind I would like to suggest that a better implementation would use the following steps. 1) given a shared library file name then create a tmp file name that looks like this _ where is a hash key value based on the file size and content. 2) If a file having the name _ is found in the tmp directory then go to (4) 3) If a file isn't found then write the shared library to the tmp directory using the file name generated in (1) and go to (5) 4) Generate a value for the file in the tmp directory and verify that it matchs the value for the actual shared library. 5) load the _ from the tmp directory The above implementation would have several advantages. 1) true sharing could occur for the shared libraries 2) loading might be faster in most cases since a file write wouldn't be necessary 3) The implementation would work on with all OS's Also, deletion of files by a sysadmin shouldn't cause problems for applications because on systems that allow deletion the blocks will still be locked and on systems that don't the file won't be deleted. The only disadvantage I see with this new implementation is a potential security hole if a shared file in the tmp directory is replaced by a malicious user and then used by another application. Prevention of this possibility is the purpose of the hash value in the name. Calculation of the could potentially be done at wrap time and cached for use at runtime. Comments??? Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Apr 23 12:54:40 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NHseN26880 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:54:40 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h3NHt1jx019393 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:55:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3NHsxOq003971 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 12:55:00 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA6D374.6971B3EA@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:55:00 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROBLEM with HP-UX tclkit References: <3EA5D3FF.B2D53637@motorola.com> <3EA63211.B5821A0F@wldelft.nl> <3EA6CA1F.81467C85@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > > > > > > The current HP-UX build (at /pub/tk/8.4.2) should probably be remove > > > until a "safe" build is created. The current build doesn't remove files > > > the are "loaded" to the /var/tmp directory at runtime. This eventually > > > will result in a file system error of "no space left on device". > > > > > > I though this problem had been fixed but apparently not. I will start > > > looking into the problem tomorrow. Any help with this problem would be > > > appreciated. > > > > > > Tom K. > > > > IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment > > of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that > > is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. > > > > Regards, > > > > Arjen > > IIRC the need for placing shared object files in a tmp directory > is not > unique to HPUX. What is unique to HPUX is that the OS won't allow > the file to be deleted while it is in use. This results in an > inability > to remove the shared objects when they are written to the tmp > directory. [..snip..] The reply I sent to Arjen was incomplete. Please see new posting with subject "PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading". Tom K. From max@suse.de Wed Apr 23 16:36:24 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NLaON14299 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:36:24 -0500 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4143F14BFD for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:36:45 +0200 (MEST) Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:36:36 +0200 (CEST) From: Reinhard Max To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading In-Reply-To: <3EA6D364.AB21146F@motorola.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wed, 23 Apr 2003 at 10:54, Tom Krehbiel wrote: > The only disadvantage I see with this new implementation is a > potential security hole if a shared file in the tmp directory is > replaced by a malicious user and then used by another application. I think that would be a really serious security hole. Another disadvantage would be some waste of disk space. Yes, harddisks are large and cheap these days, but I still dislike applications that leave temporary files behind when they exit. > Prevention of this possibility is the purpose of the hash > value in the name. Calculation of the could potentially be > done at wrap time and cached for use at runtime. I think the safest way would be to cache the libraries on a per user basis, but that would again give up (at least partially) the advantages of shared libs. A shared cache can only be halfways secure when the hash key gets recalculated from the temp file at load time, and tclkit refuses loading if it doesn't match. But even this would leave us with a race condition: someone could overwrite the file between checking the lib and loading it. cu Reinhard From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Apr 23 19:07:14 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3O07CN26109 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:07:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 1956 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 00:07:32 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 24 Apr 2003 00:07:32 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:07:32 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit mailing list To: Tom Krehbiel From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <3EA6D364.AB21146F@motorola.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, Tom Krehbiel wrote ... > IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment > of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that > is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. Leaving aside the question of what to do in the longer term, I've implemented a workaround for a customer of mine. It's a small script that is called at the start of their Starkits, and which cleans up old temporary files on HP-UX. The Tcl VFS code uses mkstemp to create the temporary file. As at HP-UX B.11.00 this doesn't use the TMPDIR, TMP or TEMP variables, but rather places the temporary files in /var/tmp. So I just look for files matching "/var/tmp/tcl??????" that are owned by the current user, and delete them. But you can't just remove them - some may have been created by a currently running Starkit and not yet loaded, so the cleanup script only deletes any temp files that are over 10 seconds old (note that the actual bug/limitation in HP-UX silently prevents any active shared libs from being removed - we only want to avoid the situation where we remove a temp file after it is created and before it is loaded). I know it's a hack, bug it works and it was certainly a lot easy than trying to make HP-UX behave itself like all other UNIX implementations. It's only a small script, but I've asked the customer for the OK to distribute it. Maybe we could put something like this into the starkit package (i.e. the startup code) while waiting for a more permanent solution? Cheers Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Apr 23 19:12:07 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3O0C5N26473 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:12:06 -0500 Received: (qmail 2133 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 00:12:25 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 24 Apr 2003 00:12:25 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:12:26 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Steve Landers To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6DD6CE14-75E9-11D7-B2B5-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I wrote ... > I know it's a hack, bug it works Freudian slip - but it works ;-) Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From mel@redolive.com Wed Apr 23 23:55:24 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3O4tNN09169 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:55:24 -0500 Received: (qmail 27430 invoked by uid 511); 24 Apr 2003 05:52:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 05:52:18 -0000 Message-ID: <025801c30a1d$c0925250$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "Starkit" Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 00:55:39 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0255_01C309FC.39544B20" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] tclkit & threads Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0255_01C309FC.39544B20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable is there anyway i can get to starkit::topdir from inside a thread? on = windows or use packages within a starkit? i dont seem to be able to = reference anything from inside a thread (sorry if this is elementary. i = am venturing into the unknows!) thanks,=20 Mel ------=_NextPart_000_0255_01C309FC.39544B20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    is there anyway i can get to = starkit::topdir from=20 inside a thread? on windows or use packages within a starkit? i dont = seem to be=20 able to reference anything from inside a thread (sorry if this is = elementary. i=20 am venturing into the unknows!)
     
    thanks,
    Mel
    ------=_NextPart_000_0255_01C309FC.39544B20-- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Apr 24 01:59:26 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3O6xPN16735 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 01:59:26 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA21145 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:59:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA20867 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:59:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EA78B5B.886E899E@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:59:39 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits References: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brent Welch wrote: > > I've added a chapter on Starkits to "Practical Programming in Tcl and Tk". > You can check it out at http://www.beedub.com/book/4th/Starkit.pdf > I'd appreciate any and all comments in the next week. JCW has given it > a once-over already, and I've re-wacked the sections he found, um, "unclear". > This audience probably knows everything in the material already, but if > there are glaring ommisions, errors, improvements, etc., please let me know. Just a few remarks: - I think it should be made clear that starkits may contain _binary_ extensions as well as scripts. - I plea for mentioning Wikit as a means to incorporate online help - And just a suggestion, why not include the possibility to use a starpack as a self-extracting executable and a concise installation facility. I know that with a starkit installation is not necessary (even a dirty word :) but I have applied the starkit technology in an application that contains other programs that still need the classical approach. The self-extraction part is done as follows: - The whole directory structure is a subdirectory "allfiles" of myapp.vfs - Then the following fragment takes care of getting the files in the current directory: set installdir [file dirname [info script]] set appdir [file join $installdir ".." ".." "allfiles"] foreach file [glob [file join $appdir *]] { file copy $file . } With Steve Cassidy's "progman.tcl" script I create the necessary entries in the Windows start menu, and eh presto, my installation is done. Regards, Arjen From koloska@voiceinterconnect.de Thu Apr 24 04:30:11 2003 Received: from thalita.eatserver.de (h-71.155.2.81.webtronic.de [81.2.155.71] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3O9UAN00598 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 04:30:10 -0500 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by thalita.eatserver.de (8.11.6/8.11.6/SuSE Linux 0.5) id h3O9YaK17519 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:34:36 +0200 Received: from UNKNOWN(217.85.224.42), claiming to be "titania.vic" via SMTP by thalita, id smtpds3Whsc; Thu Apr 24 09:34:30 2003 Received: from voiceinterconnect.de (oberon.vic [192.168.13.150]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by titania.vic (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27C8C455B2 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:30:23 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EA7AEAF.5030309@voiceinterconnect.de> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:30:23 +0200 From: Uwe Koloska Organization: voiceINTERconnect GmbH User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: de, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits References: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> In-Reply-To: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.73.1.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, very nice to see that you are reworking your excellent book! Negating the saying that tcl programmers are so much involved with making good applications, that they have not enough time to write books about it ;-) Just a quick note while I'm skipping about the starkit chapter: - on page 3(353) under accessing a Zip File there is an 'is' too much in the second line at the end. - page 4(354): to install sdx you have to place it into PATH on *NiX and rename it from 'sdx.kit' to 'sdx'. On windows you can put it anywhere if you have an association of "*.kit" with tclkit. MacOS X behaves like *NIX. On MacOS you have to use MPW with its shell like commandwindow or use it from the tcl console (but how??). - because sdx and tclkit are moving targets, I think it would be a good idea to include information about how to get and interpret the versioning information - page 5(355): AFAIK upx is a selfextracting program loader. It is independent from metakit, but uses the same algo for packing (zlib). - starpacks can be build on every platform for any platform. And important: the tclkit you use for running sdx must not be used as runtime (the docy says so). May I suggest to extend the chapter with critlib? Or has it its own chapter? I hope my little remarks are helpful. Keep up the good work! Uwe Koloska -- voiceINTERconnect www.voiceinterconnect.de ... smart speech applications from germany From lvirden@cas.org Thu Apr 24 05:16:57 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OAGvN05930 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 05:16:57 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h3OAHCKw019064 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 06:17:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h3OAHCq16983; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 06:17:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 06:17:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030424061711.AAB16972@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:30:23 +0200 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Uwe Koloska > - because sdx and tclkit are moving targets, I think it would be > a good idea to include information about how to get and > interpret the versioning information In particular, mentioning sdx's starsync functionality (perhaps including how to leverage it in one's own application) seems particularly relevant. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Apr 24 09:36:18 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OEaIN06053 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:36:18 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:36:35 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2NFMGHB6>; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:36:35 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: welch@panasas.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:36:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I've added a chapter on Starkits to "Practical Programming in > Tcl and Tk". You can check it out at One more thing, Brent... On your Metakit section, I think it might be helpful to include a couple of the descriptive points I've seen while reading the Wiki. Metakit IS scriptable, dynamic, efficient and easy. Metakit is not SQL and not massively scalable. I think I saw the quote that it falls very nicely into the moderate application realm between a bunch of flat files and a big fancy multithreaded SQL database. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Apr 24 10:42:25 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OFgPN12126 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:42:25 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h3OFgljx008315; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:42:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3OFgHOq002774; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:42:39 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA805D7.B8A4E226@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:42:15 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brent Welch CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits References: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brent, I'm looking foreword to buying a copy and seeing it on the shelf in book stores. As always I'm impressed by the clarity and writing style. Here are a few nit-pix's 1) page 359; Section "Metakit"; first sentence of second paragraph I would change "reference Metakit" to "reference for Metakit". 2) page 360; Section Metakit Data Model; first sentence has a trailing "-". 3) page 361; second paragraph; second line; last word on line is "row" should be "rows" 4) page 364; section Thin Clients; second sentence; I would replace "displays pretty" with "displays a pretty" 5) page 364; section Thin Clients; line 9; I think the "have" needs to be changed to "has" Regarding content I have a soft spot for imbedded Wikit help so I would like to see information on how to include Wikit help in applications and packages. I am hopeful that imbedded help for libraries will eventually remove the need for a centralized man page system for developers. I also think that a brief description of critcl, some where in your book, would be helpful since it provides a new capability that would be of interest to developers. An example of imbedded help can be found in the critcl.kit. Best Regards, Tom Krehbiel From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Apr 24 10:49:32 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OFnWN12796 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:49:32 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h3OFnsAM014685 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:49:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3OFn9Oq008076 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:49:47 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA80776.1E4426A8@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 08:49:10 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, Thanks for the help (idea). This will help me bridge the gap. Tom K. > > Hi all, > > Tom Krehbiel wrote ... > > > IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment > > of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that > > is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. > > Leaving aside the question of what to do in the longer term, I've > implemented a workaround for a customer of mine. It's a small script > that is called at the start of their Starkits, and which cleans up old > temporary files on HP-UX. > > The Tcl VFS code uses mkstemp to create the temporary file. As at HP-UX > B.11.00 this doesn't use the TMPDIR, TMP or TEMP variables, but rather > places the temporary files in /var/tmp. So I just look for files > matching "/var/tmp/tcl??????" that are owned by the current user, and > delete them. > > But you can't just remove them - some may have been created by a > currently running Starkit and not yet loaded, so the cleanup script > only deletes any temp files that are over 10 seconds old (note that the > actual bug/limitation in HP-UX silently prevents any active shared libs > from being removed - we only want to avoid the situation where we > remove a temp file after it is created and before it is loaded). > > I know it's a hack, bug it works and it was certainly a lot easy than > trying to make HP-UX behave itself like all other UNIX implementations. > It's only a small script, but I've asked the customer for the OK to > distribute it. > > Maybe we could put something like this into the starkit package (i.e. > the startup code) while waiting for a more permanent solution? > > Cheers > > Steve From reinhard@cadence.com Thu Apr 24 11:10:37 2003 Received: from mailgate.Cadence.COM (mailgate.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.1]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OGAbN14882 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:10:37 -0500 Received: from cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (cdsmunich.Cadence.COM [158.140.172.1]) by mailgate.Cadence.COM (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA19537; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:10:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cadence.com (mreinhard [158.140.172.30]) by cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (8.10.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h3OGAuD00375; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:10:56 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EA80C90.2080600@cadence.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:10:56 +0200 From: Reinhard Fobbe Reply-To: Reinhard Fobbe Organization: Cadence Design Systems GmbH User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Landers CC: Tom Krehbiel , Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Received: By mailgate.Cadence.COM as JAA19537 at Thu Apr 24 09:10:57 2003 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I used this code in my script to get rid off temp files. The idea is to start a second process that sleeps long enough until the main script is terminated: --- if {$tcl_platform(os)=="HP-UX"} { exec sh -c "sleep 1;rm -f $tmpfile & } else { file delete -force $tmpfile } exit --- It works for me, but I'm sure there a better way to do this ... Cheers, Reinhard >> IIRC, the HPUX was the only (?) system that requires special treatment >> of the shared libraries. Perhaps some cleanup code must be added that >> is called when the script exits - a rather ugly hack. > > > Leaving aside the question of what to do in the longer term, I've > implemented a workaround for a customer of mine. It's a small script > that is called at the start of their Starkits, and which cleans up old > temporary files on HP-UX. > > The Tcl VFS code uses mkstemp to create the temporary file. As at > HP-UX B.11.00 this doesn't use the TMPDIR, TMP or TEMP variables, but > rather places the temporary files in /var/tmp. So I just look for > files matching "/var/tmp/tcl??????" that are owned by the current > user, and delete them. > From lvirden@cas.org Thu Apr 24 11:40:24 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OGeNN18134 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:40:23 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h3OGeceZ004683 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:40:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h3OGec522233; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:40:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:40:38 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030424124038.AAB21955@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Help sought building a starkit using snack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello. Here's what I am trying to do. I'm trying to put together a simple little toy application for my son. The application looks like this: file.tcl images/file.gif sounds/file.wav and file.tcl uses Tk and snack . So I got file.tcl to work from a normal directory. Then I did the sdx qwrap and sdx unwrap, moved the images and sounds directory into vfs . I'm trying to figure out how to deal with snack though. Where within my file.vfs directory should the snack.kit go? I tried this: $ cat file.vfs/main.tcl package require starkit starkit::startup set dir [file dirname $starkit::topdir] set path [file join $dir file.vfs lib snack.kit] if { ! [ file exists $path]} { puts stderr "Starkit is malformed" exit 1 } source $path package require app-file $ However, when I run this, I get: couldn't read file "/tmp/danspet/danspet.vfs/lib/snack.kit/main.tcl": no such file or directory while executing "source /tmp/danspet/danspet.vfs/lib/snack.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" I think I'm getting my real and virtual file systems mixed up - can someone help me get this straightened out? Thanks! -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Apr 24 11:53:18 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OGrHN19505 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 11:53:17 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C41FF83987 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:53:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:53:34 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Help sought building a starkit using snack Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030424124038.AAB21955@cas.org> Message-Id: <49292044-7675-11D7-8179-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I'm trying to figure out how to deal with snack though. Where within > my > file.vfs directory should the snack.kit go? Although there are tricks to load a MK datafile (such as a starkit) *inside* a starkit, it's much more trouble than you'd want to get into, I expect. If snack is a nice starkit, with all packages in its "lib/" subdir, why not just merge the packages? Like so: sdx unwrap snack.kit mv snack.vfs/lib/* file.vfs/lib/ > I think I'm getting my real and virtual file systems mixed up - can > someone > help me get this straightened out? Thanks! Easiest is not to next starkits. Make it work 100% unwrapped, then wrap the whole kaboodle up. Such a KISS approach is probably also going to come in handy when starsync and starchive evolve to update individual packages. -jcw From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Apr 24 12:40:30 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OHeUN24180 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:40:30 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:39:58 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2NFMGHL5>; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:39:58 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: steve@DigitalSmarties.com, tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:39:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Leaving aside the question of what to do in the longer term, I've > implemented a workaround for a customer of mine. It's a small script > that is called at the start of their Starkits, and which cleans up > old temporary files on HP-UX. > > The Tcl VFS code uses mkstemp to create the temporary file. As at > HP-UX B.11.00 this doesn't use the TMPDIR, TMP or TEMP variables, > but rather places the temporary files in /var/tmp. So I just look > for files matching "/var/tmp/tcl??????" that are owned by the > current user, and delete them. > I've been saving up this thread for several days now. I am very much interested in problems on HP-UX, but I haven't had a chance to do anything with it until this morning. I tried searching the user support forums at hp.com, but I didn't have much luck looking for problems deleting temp files. Then I tried 'man mkstemp', and found this notice at the top of the man page: These functions (mktemp() and mkstemp()) are provided solely for backward compatibility and importability of applications, and are not recommended for new applications where portability is important. For portable applications, use tmpfile() instead (see tmpfile(3S)). Looking at the man page for tmpfile(), I see that it is both ANSI C and POSIX.1 compliant, and it automagically deletes the file on process exit, unlike mkstemp(), which leaves the file for the programmer to delete. Wouldn't a solution to this problem be to use tmpfile() instead of mkstemp()? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com Thu Apr 24 12:58:21 2003 Received: from stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com (stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com [130.76.96.56]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OHwLN26076 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:58:21 -0500 Received: from stl-av-02.boeing.com ([192.76.190.7]) by stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com (8.9.2/8.8.5-M2) with ESMTP id MAA03318 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:58:43 -0500 (CDT) Received: from slb-hub-01.boeing.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by stl-av-02.boeing.com (8.9.3p2/8.9.2/MBS-AV-02) with ESMTP id MAA20804 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:58:42 -0500 (CDT) Received: from XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com (xch-mwbh-10.mw.nos.boeing.com [130.38.253.37]) by slb-hub-01.boeing.com (8.11.3/8.11.3/MBS-LDAP-01) with ESMTP id h3OHwet05812 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:58:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com ([130.38.253.26]) by XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.2966); Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:58:05 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6334.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:58:05 -0500 Message-ID: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A68@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Thread-Topic: Needed: Tclkit for HP-UX 10.20 Thread-Index: AcMKiw4sG8RD8fxESTmOk4yk+d4IYg== From: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Apr 2003 17:58:05.0714 (UTC) FILETIME=[0E89A720:01C30A8B] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3OHwLN26076 Subject: [Starkit] Needed: Tclkit for HP-UX 10.20 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone successfully built a Tclkit for HP-UX 10.20? My initial attempt was unsuccessful. I like the way genkit attempts to make building a TclKit as straightforward as possible, but creating a TclKit for HP-UX 10.20 still seems a little tricky. I would suggest that, just as there is a growing repository of StarKits, there should also be a list of contributed TckKits for various operating systems that people can use. Best regards, Phillip St. John The Boeing Company From max@suse.de Thu Apr 24 13:09:22 2003 Received: from Cantor.suse.de (ns.suse.de [213.95.15.193]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OI9MN27231 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:09:22 -0500 Received: from Hermes.suse.de (Hermes.suse.de [213.95.15.136]) by Cantor.suse.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1872A14B90 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 20:09:44 +0200 (MEST) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 20:09:36 +0200 (CEST) From: Reinhard Max To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thu, 24 Apr 2003 at 12:39, Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > Wouldn't a solution to this problem be to use tmpfile() instead of > mkstemp()? Is there any way to get the name of the file, that tmpfile created? If not, it's not usable for this purpose, because dlopen() needs a filename. cu Reinhard From jcw@equi4.com Thu Apr 24 13:32:11 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OIWBN29544 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:32:11 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41F9A83987 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:32:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 20:32:27 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1999353F-7683-11D7-8179-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Reinhard Max wrote: > On Thu, 24 Apr 2003 at 12:39, Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > >> Wouldn't a solution to this problem be to use tmpfile() instead of >> mkstemp()? > > Is there any way to get the name of the file, that tmpfile created? > If not, it's not usable for this purpose, because dlopen() needs a > filename. That's the catch... On systems with a /proc filesystem, you can open any open file again by name by using path "/proc/[pid]/fd/$fd", but I doubt that HP-UX supports it. Might I propose to submit this issue as a bug at SF? The code which takes care of all this is in the VFS code, file generic/tclIOUtil.c: line 530 - info about the load/unload logic line 2539 - Tcl_FSLoadFile(), which does it all line 2682 - tries to delete, if it fails, delete after unload That way, those with access to systems which do not allow deletion of the file while in use can then band together and pull attention from the TCT? I suspect that the basic logic is ok, since cleanup works on Win32 (which also disallows immediate deletes)? -jcw From dgporter@erols.com Thu Apr 24 15:16:58 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OKGwN06912 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:16:58 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVbref3a0wUlJREnK04txkEio7MpTI/2QKzTFlqDA+gxVSAIY6AcgTG5Zy+Yg8FHFwE= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 198n9j-0002PC-00; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:17:19 -0400 Message-ID: <3EA84648.1000600@erols.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:17:12 -0400 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brent Welch CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits References: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> <3EA805D7.B8A4E226@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: My comments: 1) page 352; Section "Virtual File Systems"; Tcl_CreateChannel and [puts] are offered as examples of the VFS API, but both deal with channels, not filesystems. 2) page 354; It is claimed that sdx adds "package provide hello 1.0" to hello.tcl, but later in the example, it is clear that the fake package name is really app-hello. Either sdx adds "package provide app-hello 1.0" to hello.tcl, or else there's much uglier nonsense going on in the starkit internals than should be recorded in a permanent printed text. 3) page 355, "Exploring the..."; 2d line: everything in___to a package 4) page 356, Example 22-6; looks like the filename should be 22_5.tcl 5) page 357, final paragraph; it is noted that tcllib takes up a lot of space. This is more a bug in tclhttpd than the book, but that's where the real error is. tclhttpd does not use "tcllib", it uses a handful of the packages found in tcllib, and has no earthly reason for dragging the rest of it around. Indeed, since stooop was added to tcllib, tclhttpd pays a [::proc] redefinition penalty by bringing stooop, which it does not use, into the interpreter. 6) page 358, continues to talk about "...every application that needed tcllib...". You will do the world a great favor to not speak about tcllib as if it were a package. No app should depend on "tcllib"; it should depend on particular package(s) it finds in tcllib. Note that the pending tcllib 1.4 release will no longer respond to [package require tcllib], so this misconception must be corrected. 7) page 358, "Sharing a Starkit Package"; we already have too many different things we call a "package". Why not just "Sharing a Starkit" ? I did not review the Metakit section. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Apr 24 18:43:30 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3ONhSN23152 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:43:29 -0500 Received: (qmail 7154 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 23:43:48 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 24 Apr 2003 23:43:48 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:43:47 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Needed: Tclkit for HP-UX 10.20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: To: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A68@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Message-Id: <97BDC544-76AE-11D7-953C-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday, April 25, 2003, at 01:58 AM, EXT-St. John, Phillip E wrote: > Has anyone successfully built a Tclkit for HP-UX 10.20? My initial > attempt was unsuccessful. I like the way genkit attempts to make > building a TclKit as straightforward as possible, but creating a > TclKit for HP-UX 10.20 still seems a little tricky. I know that some people were looking at it (Bob Techentin or Tom Krehbiel?) but I don't know how far they got. > I would suggest that, just as there is a growing repository of > StarKits, there should also be a list of contributed TckKits for > various operating systems that people can use. See http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Apr 24 19:46:47 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3P0kkN26712 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 19:46:46 -0500 Received: (qmail 8683 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 00:47:06 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 25 Apr 2003 00:47:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:47:05 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Reinhard Max From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6FE2CDE8-76B7-11D7-953C-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday, April 25, 2003, at 02:09 AM, Reinhard Max wrote: > Is there any way to get the name of the file, that tmpfile created? > If not, it's not usable for this purpose, because dlopen() needs a > filename. tmkfile returns a stdio stream pointer (i.e. "FILE *") - I vaguely remember there being a function that returns the file associated with a stream .... it's been a while since I used stdio directly though. Steve From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Apr 25 01:29:20 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3P6TJN11518 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 01:29:19 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA22341 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:29:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA22124 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:29:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EA8D5CE.90EA57E0@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:29:34 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Reinhard Max wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Apr 2003 at 12:39, Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > > > Wouldn't a solution to this problem be to use tmpfile() instead of > > mkstemp()? > > Is there any way to get the name of the file, that tmpfile created? > If not, it's not usable for this purpose, because dlopen() needs a > filename. > > cu One could perhaps use tmpnam() in stead - that returns a name. Regards, Arjen From welch@panasas.com Thu Apr 24 22:12:22 2003 Received: from medlicott.panasas.com ([65.194.57.194]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3P3CLN01042 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 22:12:22 -0500 Received: from panasas.com (welch@localhost) by medlicott.panasas.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3P37QD17930 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 20:07:26 -0700 Message-Id: <200304250307.h3P37QD17930@medlicott.panasas.com> X-Authentication-Warning: medlicott.panasas.com: welch owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/02/2003 with nmh-1.0.4 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits In-reply-to: <3EA84648.1000600@erols.com> References: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> <3EA805D7.B8A4E226@motorola.com> <3EA84648.1000600@erols.com> Comments: In-reply-to Donald G Porter message dated "Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:17:12 -0400." From: Brent Welch X-URL: http://www.panasas.com/ X-Face: "HxE|?EnC9fVMV8f70H83&{fgLE.|FZ^$>@Q(yb#N,Eh~N]e&]=> r5~UnRml1:4EglY{9B+ :'wJq$@c_C!l8@<$t,{YUr4K,QJGHSvS~U]H`<+L*x?eGzSk>XH\W:AK\j?@?c1o List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thank you all for the great comments on the book chapter! I'll do my best to incorporate your comments, but at some point (very soon) I need to declare victory and polish up other parts of the book. Thanks again! I think Starkits are the coolest Tcl feature in many years. -- Brent Welch Software Architect, Panasas Inc Delivering the World's Most Scalable and Agile Storage Network www.panasas.com welch@panasas.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Fri Apr 25 07:18:57 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3PCIrN32619 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:18:54 -0500 Received: (qmail 26029 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 12:19:08 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 25 Apr 2003 12:19:08 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 20:19:07 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=Apple-Mail-3--48496338 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Steve Landers To: Starkit mailing list In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1CC9480C-7718-11D7-953C-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Apple-Mail-3--48496338 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Folks, I wrote .... > Leaving aside the question of what to do in the longer term, I've > implemented a workaround for a customer of mine. It's a small script > that is called at the start of their Starkits, and which cleans up old > temporary files on HP-UX. ... > I know it's a hack, bug it works and it was certainly a lot easy than > trying to make HP-UX behave itself like all other UNIX > implementations. It's only a small script, but I've asked the customer > for the OK to distribute it. And they gave the go-ahead - see attached Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com --Apple-Mail-3--48496338 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=cleanup.tcl Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: application/octet-stream; x-unix-mode=0644; name="cleanup.tcl" # # Clean up temporary files left around by the Tcl VFS when loading # shared libraries on certain platforms # # Call at the start of your Starkit if you are running on the following # platforms: # HP-UX # # Steve Landers # proc VFScleanup {} { global tcl_platform switch $tcl_platform(os) { HP-UX { # HP-UX ... what a system! Too bad Mr Packard didn't have # precedence ;-) # # Tcl uses mkstemp to create the temporary file. As at HP-UX # B.11.00 this doesn't use the TMPDIR, TMP or TEMP variables, but # rather places the temporary files in /var/tmp set dir /var/tmp set pattern "tcl??????" } Windows* { # We could implement this for Windows, since a program crash or # termination without normal exiting will leave the temporary # files. Since this is relatively uncommon it hasn't been # implemented return } default { return } } # note we silently ignore any errors catch { if {[file isdirectory $dir]} { set user $tcl_platform(user) set now [clock seconds] # Number of seconds old that a temporary file must it will be # deleted. # This is done to avoid the (extremely unlikely) race condition # wherein two Starkits run currently, and this cleanup runs between # when the Tcl VFS creates the temporary file and when it loads it set age 10 cd $dir foreach file [glob $pattern] { # only those files owned by the current user if {[file attributes $file -owner] eq $user} { if {[expr {$now - [file mtime $file]}] > $age} { file delete $file } } } } } msg # puts stderr "msg = $msg" ;# uncomment to debug } --Apple-Mail-3--48496338-- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Apr 25 09:55:04 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3PEt4N08001 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 09:55:04 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h3PEtQc4020857 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:55:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3PEtMNc009180 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 09:55:22 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA94C55.98D1DB9C@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:55:17 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits References: <200304230642.h3N6gbI04944@medlicott.panasas.com> <3EA805D7.B8A4E226@motorola.com> <3EA84648.1000600@erols.com> <200304250307.h3P37QD17930@medlicott.panasas.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brent, > I think Starkits are the coolest Tcl feature in many years. I couldn't agree more. I'm hoping the book will mention them in the intro and other locations to first time readers and those who have fallen way will realize tcl is continuing to evolve in some really cool directions. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Apr 25 10:31:51 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3PFVpN10988 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:31:51 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h3PFWDjH007373 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:32:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3PFVnNc030880 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:32:11 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA954E4.3616450C@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:31:48 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading References: <1999353F-7683-11D7-8179-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, [..snip..] > Might I propose to submit this issue as a bug at SF? The code which > takes care of all this is in the VFS code, file generic/tclIOUtil.c: The code appears to be part of the TCL code not the VFS code. tcl/generic/tclIOUtil.c Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Apr 25 12:58:46 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3PHwjN23347 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:58:46 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h3PHx8md025492 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:59:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h3PHwvNc017300 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:59:00 -0500 Message-ID: <3EA97761.B961963B@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:58:57 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading References: <1CC9480C-7718-11D7-953C-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, The cleanup.tcl code does a cd to /var/tmp and doesn't restore the current working directory. This should probably be changed if the routine is the first thing called in that application. Tom K. > Folks, > > I wrote .... > > > Leaving aside the question of what to do in the longer term, I've > > implemented a workaround for a customer of mine. It's a small script > > that is called at the start of their Starkits, and which cleans up old > > temporary files on HP-UX. > ... > > I know it's a hack, bug it works and it was certainly a lot easy than > > trying to make HP-UX behave itself like all other UNIX > > implementations. It's only a small script, but I've asked the customer > > for the OK to distribute it. > > And they gave the go-ahead - see attached > > Steve From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri Apr 25 16:47:55 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3PLltN10524 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:47:55 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:47:47 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2NFMG206>; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:47:47 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:47:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've spent the day trying to track down the specifics of why HP-UX leaves temporary files laying about after extracting and loading libraries. After instrumenting the code "a lot", I've determined that on HP-UX, you just can't delete a shared library that is in use. The unlink() function returns the error code [ETXTBSY], which translates to "Text file busy". Unlink() should remove the directory entry for an open file, but leave the data intact until the last user is done with it. But in HP-UX's case, it just fails when trying to delete executing code. I've meddled quite a bit with Tcl_FSLoadFile() in tclIOUtil.c. If the initial load (dlopen) on the library fails, heroic code copies the shared library into a native file system temp file. It then tries to load the library again, and, if successful, deletes the temporary file. If deleting the temporary file fails, much more code goes to great lengths to set up all kinds of cleanup procs for unloading the library. Unfortunately, I can't prove that the unloading procs are ever called. I've tested my logging code on both HP-UX and Linux (Red Hat 7.1), and I get all sorts of messages about temp files and calls to dlopen() or shl_open(), but the unloading proc never seems to get called. Can anybody else confirm this? Is the VFS unload proc really the right place to delete a file, if it hasn't been deleted before? Or should we write a special cleanup procedure for atexit()? Thanks for your input, Bob P.S. Its always refreshing to struggle with debugging C code once in a while. It really puts Tcl programming in perspective... -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Fri Apr 25 18:51:55 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3PNpsN20413 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 18:51:54 -0500 Received: (qmail 11191 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 23:52:13 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 25 Apr 2003 23:52:13 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 07:52:12 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROPOSAL for Shared Library Loading Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit mailing list To: Tom Krehbiel From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <3EA97761.B961963B@motorola.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, > The cleanup.tcl code does a cd to /var/tmp and doesn't restore > the current working directory. This should probably be changed if > the routine is the first thing called in that application. Ah - good catch :-) When I extracted it from my customer's application I inadvertently left it out. I'll add a page to the wiki once I've patched it. Steve From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Sat Apr 26 05:04:52 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3QA4oN14173 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 05:04:50 -0500 Received: (qmail 26276 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 10:05:11 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 26 Apr 2003 10:05:10 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:05:10 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Book chapter on Starkits Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Brent Welch , starkit@equi4.com To: dgporter@erols.com From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <3EA84648.1000600@erols.com> Message-Id: <90BA66C7-77CE-11D7-953C-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday, April 25, 2003, at 04:17 AM, Donald G Porter wrote: > 2) page 354; It is claimed that sdx adds "package provide hello 1.0" > to hello.tcl, but later in the example, it is clear that the > fake package name is really app-hello. Either sdx adds > "package provide app-hello 1.0" to hello.tcl, or else there's > much uglier nonsense going on in the starkit internals than should > be recorded in a permanent printed text. "sdx qwrap" will add "package provide app-hello 1.0" to the wrapped script if it doesn't already contain it. Steve From lvirden@cas.org Tue Apr 29 06:10:08 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3TBA7N01970 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 06:10:07 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h3TBAPgM012109 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:10:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h3TBAQj15229; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:10:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:10:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030429071026.AAB14398@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] ISO: ideas for learning what's new on sdarchive? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: SD Archive provides a web archive for starkits. sdx's StarSync implementation gives us the ability to update starkits when they change. Right now, the SD Archive is small enough that all one has to do is read through the 100 or so entries to see what is new. however, if the archive grows, the page may become too large to stay a single page, and it becomes a bit tougher to determine what is new on the page. I know that CPAN has this feature I used to use a lot which reports to you any module you don't have installed on your system, with a one line description of what the missing item does. I wonder whether some sort of functionality of this type would be useful for the web page. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Tue Apr 29 06:26:40 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3TBQbN03214 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 06:26:38 -0500 Received: (qmail 5930 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 11:27:00 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 29 Apr 2003 11:27:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:26:58 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: ideas for learning what's new on sdarchive? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <20030429071026.AAB14398@cas.org> Message-Id: <7D528906-7A35-11D7-8395-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > I know that CPAN has this feature I used to use a lot which reports to > you > any module you don't have installed on your system, with a one line > description of what the missing item does. > > I wonder whether some sort of functionality of this type would be > useful > for the web page. It's a good idea, but perhaps not for SDarchive. You've no doubt seen JCW's discussion paper re Starchive - this will (potentially) be a better place to enable such features. Sdarchive won't evolve much further - I've got a few things that I am struggling to find time to finish (sorted by time last changed, perhaps an RSS feed). But realistically, Starchive (and other repositories layered on it, like Cantcl) is the way of the future. Cheers Steve From lvirden@cas.org Tue Apr 29 06:36:01 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3TBa1N03976 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 06:36:01 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h3TBaJgM019038 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:36:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h3TBaKB15722; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:36:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:36:20 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030429073620.AAB15669@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: ideas for learning what's new on sdarchive? In-Reply-To: <7D528906-7A35-11D7-8395-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> of Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:26:58 +0800 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Steve Landers > You've no doubt seen > JCW's discussion paper re Starchive - this will (potentially) be a > better place to enable such features. I've read the Starchive ( http://www.equi4.com/261 ) and Starchive Implementation ( http://www.equi4.com/273 ) pages at mini.net . I went to the work-in-progress URL ( http://mini.net/starch/ ) - but I've not quite figured out yet what steps to take with it. It kind of looks like the data and lib directories appear twice here - so I have more reading to do of the 2 tcl scripts and the listk.kit ... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Apr 29 07:46:59 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3TCkxN09669 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 07:46:59 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B860183952 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 08:47:18 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 14:47:19 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: ideas for learning what's new on sdarchive? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <7D528906-7A35-11D7-8395-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3TCkxN09669 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Landers wrote: > Larry, > [browsing repositories...] >> I wonder whether some sort of functionality of this type would be >> useful >> for the web page. > > It's a good idea, but perhaps not for SDarchive. You've no doubt seen > JCW's discussion paper re Starchive - this will (potentially) be a > better place to enable such features. I'll be presenting a Starchive paper in Nürnberg, end of May. I think I've also heard Steve Landers mumble Michigan and Starchive in one sentence :) The current mini.net/starch/ area is a raw view of the underlying data (it's still evolving, but the essence is there, i.e. associative memory). My aim is to come up with a conceptual design and a basic implementation, but keep in mind that starchive will deal with remote as well as local repositories, and that the interfaces to it will not be limited to a single one (web, Tk, API, etc). So please don't draw too many conclusions just yet. I'm trying to scratch my own itches while keeping this as generic as possible. There will be very few restrictions imposed on *what* is stored. To name a few contexts: CPAN-like, RPM-like, gentoo/portage-like, CANTCL... I don't want to close off any avenues. The emphasis will be on starkits, but zips and other forms of exchange should be doable (both submission and extraction). It will work on/from any platform for which there is a Tclkit or an ActiveTcl distribution. In a nutshell: I see Starchive as a a location-independent, versioned, scalable "collection of file collections". -jcw From clif@clif.cflynt.com Tue Apr 29 12:00:14 2003 Received: from ic.net (relay084.ic.net [152.160.8.94]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3TH0EN00326 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:00:14 -0500 Received: (qmail 97724 invoked by uid 0); 29 Apr 2003 17:04:11 -0000 Received: from noucorp.com.12.160.152.in-addr.arpa (HELO bastion.noucorp.com) (152.160.12.213) by dialin.netrek.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:04:11 -0000 Received: from clif.cflynt.com (clif.cflynt.com [192.168.9.2]) by bastion.noucorp.com (8.11.6/8.8.7) with ESMTP id h3TGxqL27212 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:59:52 -0400 Received: (from clif@localhost) by clif.cflynt.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h3TGxsw04709 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:59:54 -0400 From: Clif Flynt Message-Id: <200304291659.h3TGxsw04709@clif.cflynt.com> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:59:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL6] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Embedded Interp & Starkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've been putting together some papers/tutorials on embedding Tcl interps in other applications, rather than extending the Tcl interpreter with other libraries. An embedded interp needs to call Tcl_Init to load the init.tcl file. This seems like a great application for a starpack: To wrap an embedded application and the associated scripts. I'm not sure just how one would go about it. Would you need to build a custom TclKit from source, using the embedded application as the tclsh, (which might not ever have a Tcl prompt), or is there another way, or can this just not be done with current technology? I'm certain it can be done with the VFS, just not sure how one would construct the executable file. Thanks, Clif -- .... Clif Flynt ... http://www.cflynt.com ... clif@cflynt.com ... ..Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide (2'nd edition) - Morgan Kauffman .. ..... 10'th Annual Tcl/Tk Conference, July 29, Ann Arbor MI ..... ............. http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2003/ ............ From GargashS@Otologics.com Tue Apr 29 14:24:22 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3TJOMN17038 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 14:24:22 -0500 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: [Starkit] Embedded Interp & Starkits MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 13:24:48 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Embedded Interp & Starkits Thread-Index: AcMOcT3vkTkDo9Z/QgSDLoK87VtZmQACF8JA From: "Scott Gargash" To: "Clif Flynt" , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h3TJOMN17038 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: We've done (almost) exactly this here. We have a tclkitsh.dll which is essentally tcl84.dll with a VFS. This library can then be linked into your application like tcl84.dll, and you can invoke the tcl interpreter and any contained code in the VFS (init.tcl, etc). One caveat, for reasons unknown rewrapping the library to extend the VFS doesn't work. If you want to add to the VFS, you need to rebuild the library. It would be nice to be able to release the library as a binary, and rewrap the binary with SDX to include whatever user extensions are desired without needing the library sources, a la starpacks. We intend to get submit the mods back that were needed to build tclkitsh as a shared library. Sometime soon... Scott > -----Original Message----- > From: Clif Flynt [mailto:clif@cflynt.com] > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:00 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] Embedded Interp & Starkits > > > I've been putting together some papers/tutorials on embedding Tcl > interps in other applications, rather than extending the Tcl > interpreter > with other libraries. > > An embedded interp needs to call Tcl_Init to load the init.tcl file. > > This seems like a great application for a starpack: To wrap > an embedded > application and the associated scripts. I'm not sure just > how one would > go about it. > > Would you need to build a custom TclKit from source, using > the embedded > application as the tclsh, (which might not ever have a Tcl > prompt), or is > there another way, or can this just not be done with current > technology? > > I'm certain it can be done with the VFS, just not sure how one would > construct the executable file. > > Thanks, > > Clif > -- > .... Clif Flynt ... http://www.cflynt.com ... clif@cflynt.com ... > ..Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide (2'nd edition) - Morgan Kauffman .. > ..... 10'th Annual Tcl/Tk Conference, July 29, Ann Arbor MI ..... > ............. http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2003/ ............ > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From lista@nakawe.se Sun May 4 15:12:06 2003 Received: from smtp.telenordia.se (franklin.telenor.se [213.150.135.136]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h44KC5N13879 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:12:06 -0500 Received: from nakawe-huvud (h120n1c1o1018.bredband.skanova.com [217.208.212.120]) by franklin.telenor.se (BMR ErlangTM/OTP 3.1) with ESMTP id 660556.79154.1052.1s928361franklin for ; Sun, 04 May 2003 22:12:34 +0200 Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 22:15:32 +0200 (W. Europe Daylight Time) From: Veronica Loell Reply-To: To: Message-ID: X-Warning: UNAuthenticated Sender MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] tcldot and sqliteTcl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Theese two packages would add _a lot_ of power to Tclkit. Tcl-dot's digraph rendering and a powerful SQL92 compliant database server. I am planning to use Tclkit to write a generic interface to TclTk, and I will use for both of them. sqliteTcl for the processing and Tcldot for widget-creation. Both of them run on my platform (windows) but I think they would be worthy components of kitten. I could of course write an interface to be used with any SQL-server but it sort of defeats the purpose of Starkits. As far as TclDot goes, it can be compiled on *my platform* under cygwin basically from the box, so, it is not crucial to have it ported. I would not mind lending a hand trying to port it to compile natively on win32 (with mingw). ---- As far as choosing packages to include, I would suggest something like this: widgets - utilities utilities makes sense to have in one package widgets on the other hand is a much choosier business, I thinkt that keeping each package in separate starkits may be a good idea, that way people can pick and choose their favourites. ---- I am no porter of software, but I think that considering its small footprint sqliteTcl would have a given place in Tclkit. If it is portable enough that is. Just consider giving someone a copy of Tclkit and saying, btw, there is ftp, email, webserver _and a powerful sql-server included in this package... - A note against including sqliteTcl is that it does not support concurrent writes to a table, but that could be easily fixed by just adding a writeserver to it. ------ Veronica Loell From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Sun May 4 19:21:46 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h450LjN24773 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:21:45 -0500 Received: (qmail 5897 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 00:22:11 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 05 May 2003 00:22:11 -0000 Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 08:22:12 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tcldot and sqliteTcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: To: From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <9DD28722-7E8F-11D7-B941-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Veronica, > Theese two packages would add _a lot_ of power to Tclkit. > > Tcl-dot's digraph rendering and a powerful SQL92 compliant database > server. You can already use Tcldot within Starkits - have a look at the "doted" starkit on the Starkit archive - http://mini.net/sdarchive - it contains a compiled tcldot extension for AIX, HP-UX, Linux, Tru64 and Solaris. > As far as TclDot goes, it can be compiled on *my platform* under cygwin > basically from the box, so, it is not crucial to have it ported. I > would > not mind lending a hand trying to port it to compile natively on win32 > (with mingw). As you have no doubt seen, the graphviz (and hence tcldot) build system is very *nix centric, so a mingw approach might indeed be the best approach. I'll be very interested to hear if you make progress. > As far as choosing packages to include, I would suggest something like > this: ... > I am no porter of software, but I think that considering its small > footprint sqliteTcl would have a given place in Tclkit. If it is > portable > enough that is. > Just consider giving someone a copy of Tclkit and saying, > btw, there is ftp, email, webserver _and a powerful sql-server > included in > this package... It is very unlikely that any more functionality will be added to Tclkit itself. In fact, for the last year we have been agonising over whether [incr Tcl] should be retained Tclkit. I've argued in its favour, because it is general purpose, small (~40k) and can lead to better programming style. If something like Snit had of been available at the time the decision was made I might have argued otherwise. But the key point is this - Tclkit is a minimal set of generally applicable tools. Metakit was included because it enables Starkits to be transaction safe, not because it was the "preferred" database. Any other functionality should go into the application Starkit. I realise that this is sometimes less than ideal when using compiled extensions - but the alternative of bloating Tclkit is worse. BTW, this is one reason why I prefer to use Tcl-only extensions whenever feasable (e.g. BWidgets rather than Iwidgets). It is also the reason why [incr Tcl] is in Tclkit but [incr Tk] and [incr Widgets] are not. But when I do need compiled extensions I don't make a custom Tclkit - I put them in a Starkit and dynamically load the version for the currently running platform. And, of course, if I do want to deploy as a single file application I create a platform-specific Starpack. I don't know if sqlLite is stubs enabled, but if it is then it should work in a Starkit. If so, feel free to send me the binaries and I'll add it to the Starkit Archive so that others can benefit. Regards Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From jcw@equi4.com Mon May 5 05:41:19 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h45AfIN23776 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 05:41:18 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD7B383953 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:41:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 12:41:44 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tcldot and sqliteTcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <9DD28722-7E8F-11D7-B941-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Message-Id: <29F539EA-7EE6-11D7-BFF5-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve Landers wrote: > I don't know if sqlLite is stubs enabled, but if it is then it should > work in a Starkit. If so, feel free to send me the binaries and I'll > add it to the Starkit Archive so that others can benefit. Agree - adding one or more builds of Sqlite to http://mini.net/sdarchive/ would be a great way to help more people use it, I expect. There is no need to merge things into Kitten right now - there are new ideas w.r.t. Starchive (to be presented at EuroTcl end of this month) which should make it much easier to mix and merge packages across starkits, so just having it in the current sdarchive is just as practical as in Kitten. -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Mon May 5 10:34:43 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h45FYgN14170 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:34:42 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 7FA2A4D42A; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:35:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C1D12D474 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:35:12 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Starkit list Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:32:41 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200305051732.41723.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-21.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_10,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [Starkit] file attributes Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: For a file "my_file" inside a Starkit the command file attributes my_file -permissions returns an empty string. I then tried file attributes my_file which returns "-group {} -owner {} -permissions {} -vfs 1". Does this mean that vfs cannot determine the permissions of a file inside a Starkit? Best regards Ulrich From jcw@equi4.com Mon May 5 15:08:36 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h45K8aN06794 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:08:36 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C1D883953 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 16:09:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 22:09:01 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] file attributes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200305051732.41723.usus@aladyn.de> Message-Id: <69EECF5C-7F35-11D7-BFF5-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > For a file "my_file" inside a Starkit the command > file attributes my_file -permissions > returns an empty string. I then tried > file attributes my_file > which returns "-group {} -owner {} -permissions {} -vfs 1". > Does this mean that vfs cannot determine the permissions of > a file inside a Starkit? There is no portable way to do this - starkits do not track file modes, owners, groups, links. Just names, dates, and sizes... If you need to maintain this info, you could consider adding say a "MANIFEST" file (or "descript.ion" ) with the extra details. One per dir, or one at the top level of the starkit, it really depends on your needs. You could in fact extend the MK datafile views to store this information, but it may be more trouble than it's worth, given that neither the current VFS nor the current SDX implementations support it (and probably just drop it again). -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 08:12:53 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48DCrN12682 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:12:53 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48DDHsC007007 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:13:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48DDHu08026; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:13:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:13:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508091317.AAB8023@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] bwdemo.kit problems Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: $ sdx update /ldatae/bin/bwdemo.kit BWDEMO: updating from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... No change. $ tclkit /ldatae/bin/bwdemo.kit don't know how to run bwdemo for /ldatae/bin/bwdemo.kit while executing "error "don't know how to run $root for $self"" Anyone know what is wrong with bwdemo.kit ? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 08:16:45 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48DGiN13050 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:16:44 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48DHAsC008933 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:17:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48DHAe08103; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:17:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:17:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508091710.AAB8098@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If one was to choose starkit as the file format for distribution, what infrastructure would a developer need to use the extension without extraction, if they were writing a non-starkit application. That is to say, if they were writing a Tcl program using tclsh from the Tcl core, and not tclkit or a starkit package for their application? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 8 08:20:16 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48DKGN13414 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:20:16 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 984A383953 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:20:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 15:20:42 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] bwdemo.kit problems Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030508091317.AAB8023@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > $ sdx update /ldatae/bin/bwdemo.kit > BWDEMO: updating from http://mini.net/sync.cgi ... > No change. > $ tclkit /ldatae/bin/bwdemo.kit > don't know how to run bwdemo for /ldatae/bin/bwdemo.kit > while executing > "error "don't know how to run $root for $self"" I cannot reproduce this on my Linux box with tclkit 8.4.2. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 8 08:28:01 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48DS0N14148 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:28:01 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6672283953 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:28:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 15:28:26 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030508091710.AAB8098@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > If one was to choose starkit as the file format for distribution, what > infrastructure would a developer need to use the extension without > extraction, if they were writing a non-starkit application. That is to > say, if they were writing a Tcl program using tclsh from the Tcl > core, and not tclkit or a starkit package for their application? They will probably need the following packages installed: starkit tclvfs Mk4tcl As well as memchan/trf, or rechan/zlib from critlib. I think that's about it. ActiveTcl, as you know, is a non-tclkit build with the packages included to work with starkits. With some hacking, I suspect that Mk4tcl can be replaced by the pure-Tcl readkit for such read-only uses of starkits. That can be use on platforms where Mk4tcl (which is C++) has not been ported to, though you'll still need the tclvfs/rechan/zlib C-based extensions. Which is *exactly* why I've been in favor of putting these in the core: tclvfs - I suspect it'll go in one day rechan - something like this is in the test suite, i.e. nearly there zlib - yes, yes, yes, let decompression be always available To drive that last point home: to me, zlib is as much a standard system component as say regex, or sockets. Well, it should be... -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 08:32:51 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48DWoN14634 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:32:50 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48DXGsC015317 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:33:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48DXGn08622; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:33:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:33:16 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508093316.AAB8577@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] bwdemo.kit problems In-Reply-To: of Thu, 8 May 2003 15:20:42 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Okay, here's an update. I downloaded bwdemo.kit some time ago. I only try it out occasionally. However, I regularly run an sdx update against it, to ensure I'm keeping it up to date. Today I was trying it out due to one of my other projects and I got the error I reported here . When jcw reported he didn't get the same error, I downloaded the newest sparc tclkit I could find, and still got the same error. So I downloaded bwdemo.kit from sdarchive and tried it. That one works. So, I was puzzled, and I decided to compare the two. $ ls -l previous/bwdemo.kit current/bwdemo.kit -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 126424 May 8 09:25 current/bwdemo.kit -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 252913 May 8 09:28 previous/bwdemo.kit Wow - look at the difference. Something obviously weird between these two starkits. So, next I sdx unwrap the two starkits. Then I type: $ dircmp -s previous current and I get: /ldatae/WWW/Starkit/Bwdemo/previous /ldatae/WWW/Starkit/Bwdemo/current /ldatae/WWW/Starkit/Bwdemo/previous May 8 09:28 2003 Comparison of previous current Page 1 different ./bwdemo.kit $ Okay, now I am freaking out. There is no apparent difference in the code within the two starkits. Yet one is much bigger than the other, and the larger one does not run. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 8 08:52:45 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48DqiN16726 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:52:45 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E8E683953 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:53:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 15:53:11 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] bwdemo.kit problems Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030508093316.AAB8577@cas.org> Message-Id: <67F19F4E-815C-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > However, I regularly run an sdx update against it, to ensure I'm > keeping > it up to date. The starsync/update system is not quite perfect, I suspect that we're hitting a bug in it... > So I downloaded bwdemo.kit from sdarchive and tried it. That one > works. Good. Solved. > $ ls -l previous/bwdemo.kit current/bwdemo.kit > -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 126424 May 8 09:25 > current/bwdemo.kit > -rwxr-xr-x 1 lwv26 dept26 252913 May 8 09:28 > previous/bwdemo.kit > > Wow - look at the difference. Something obviously weird between these > two starkits. That's a, eh, feature... Starkit updates are Metakit datafile commits. MK datafiles grow to roughly twice their optimal size, due to the commit/rollback logic. Might seem like a lot, but once you see how other DB's do, it's actually quite good. The easy way to compact is sdx unwrap + wrap, btw. [...] > Okay, now I am freaking out. There is no apparent difference in the > code within the two starkits. Yet one is much bigger than the other, > and the larger one does not run. Aha, a clear case of bigger *not* being better! ;) Nah, the size is accounted for. And I now have a hunch what the problem could be. Could you do one more test and verify that the rewrapped previous works? What I suspect may be the problem here, is the header. Please try something like the following to compare just the leading 256-byte headers (which is text): dd if=previous/bwdemo.kit of=p bs=256 count=1 dd if=current/bwdemo.kit of=c bs=256 count=1 diff p c -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 09:08:15 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48E8FN18643 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:08:15 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48E8esC004267 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:08:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48E8fe09073; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:08:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 10:08:41 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508100841.AAB9050@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] bwdemo.kit problems In-Reply-To: <67F19F4E-815C-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 8 May 2003 15:53:11 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > The starsync/update system is not quite perfect, I suspect that we're > hitting a bug in it... > > So I downloaded bwdemo.kit from sdarchive and tried it. That one > > works. > > Good. Solved. Solved - yes. Explained so that the underlying problem is understood and resolved - not yet. > Starkit updates are Metakit datafile commits. MK datafiles grow to > roughly twice their optimal size, due to the commit/rollback logic. > Might seem like a lot, but once you see how other DB's do, it's > actually quite good. The size wasn't mattering to me as much as the difference in size but yet the dircmp showing no differences. > Nah, the size is accounted for. And I now have a hunch what the > problem could be. Could you do one more test and verify that the > rewrapped previous works? > > What I suspect may be the problem here, is the header. Please try > something like the following to compare just the leading 256-byte > headers (which is text): > dd if=previous/bwdemo.kit of=p bs=256 count=1 > dd if=current/bwdemo.kit of=c bs=256 count=1 > diff p c After doing the dd's, here's the diff: $ diff p c 4,8c4,6 < if [catch {package require scripdoc}] { < set e "This requires a new TclKit release, e.g. http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" < error $e < } else { < scripdoc::init 1.0 mk4 --- > if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -readonly }]} { > set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" > error $e 10,11c8 < return < ########################################### \ No newline at end of file --- > ################################################ \ No newline at end of file Again - the immediate problem for this one starkit is solved. The ultimate problem - starkits becoming corrupted during refresh - remains to be resolved. Is this something that sdx update needs to watch for and then, rather than downloading updated parts, just replace the entire package? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 8 09:30:25 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48EUON20915 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:30:25 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65D6D83953 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:30:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 16:30:50 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] bwdemo.kit problems Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030508100841.AAB9050@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: >> Good. Solved. > > Solved - yes. Explained so that the underlying problem is understood > and resolved - not yet. Read on. It's fully explained now. > The size wasn't mattering to me as much as the difference in size but > yet the dircmp showing no differences. Free space inside the MK datafile. > After doing the dd's, here's the diff: > > $ diff p c > 4,8c4,6 > < if [catch {package require scripdoc}] { > < set e "This requires a new TclKit release, e.g. > http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" > < error $e > < } else { > < scripdoc::init 1.0 mk4 > --- >> if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -readonly >> }]} { >> set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see >> http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/" >> error $e > 10,11c8 > < return > < ########################################### > \ No newline at end of file > --- >> ################################################ > \ No newline at end of file Cool, that explains it all: starsync (sdx update) does not update starkit headers. It cannot easily in fact, since this is the small part that is *not* part of Metakit. > The ultimate problem - starkits becoming corrupted during refresh - Bzzzzt, wrong conclusion. What happens is that starkit headers and starkit contents can go out of sync with "sdx update". I'll need to look into the best way to deal with this. You had an old starkit. At some point the sdarchive one was replaced with one that uses a different header and the new blah.kit/main.tcl style (Steve and I are still going through them to clean up old scripted-document leftovers). You then used "sdx update" to update the scripts, but the header remains. In this case, as you can see, the header launches the scripdoc package, which is still present but deprecated. Old headers expect old starkit layouts (blah.kit/bin/main.tcl, etc). I suspect that some detail in the scripdoc package has not followed the new starkit approach. Ah, yes, of course: root and base vars are no longer used, it's all $starkit::topdir now. Ok, I'll need to look into this. For now, my advice is to do: grep -l scripdoc * on all your starkits. Delete those that get listed and re-fetch. FYI, there are still a few old headers on sdarchive: efftcl.kit expand.kit kitview.kit rmt.kit sdx.prev.kit slidem.kit sockspy.kit tcldemo.kit tclhttpd.kit tinyba.kit tinyjots.kit tinytask.kit tinyticker.kit tkcon.kit tkregexp.kit weather.kit We'll get to those, at some point, I'm sure. Note that these *do* work, it's just that the mix of old header and adjusted starkit contents is currently broken. Thanks for reporting this. -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu May 8 10:02:27 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48F2QN23842 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:02:26 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F2sHt009848 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:02:54 -0700 Received: from win2ksrvr (vpn2.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.232]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48F2rXj031480 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:02:54 -0700 Reply-To: From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:04:55 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Which is *exactly* why I've been in favor of putting these in the core: > tclvfs - I suspect it'll go in one day > rechan - something like this is in the test suite, i.e. nearly there > zlib - yes, yes, yes, let decompression be always available > To drive that last point home: to me, zlib is as much a standard system > component as say regex, or sockets. Well, it should be... Hmmm, funny thing you name two of the larger components that some people ask whether they should be seperated from the core (as components). That's not necessarily against what you want, but it means "in the core" is something that may change architecturally in the future. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 8 10:18:49 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48FInN25442 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:18:49 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C7F683953 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:19:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 17:19:16 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <6E884026-8168-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff, [regex, sockets] > Hmmm, funny thing you name two of the larger components that some > people ask whether they should be seperated from the core (as > components). That's not necessarily against what you want, but > it means "in the core" is something that may change architecturally > in the future. Agree 100%, "in the core" != "built-in". You know how big a fan of modularity I am. Maybe something similar to Python's structure would work: a lot of the functionality is coded as independent extension, with a file specifying whether to build linked in, as dynamic extension, or nor at all. Taken to extremes, and with VFS to help us, the future core of Tcl could be as minimal as a stub vector, a bootstrap VFS reader, and a module manager. Well, that's just a wild thought. The nice part, and the reason why a comment like this has a place on this mailing this IMO, is that starkits can help *reduce* as well as grow the system. All we'd be doing is really to vary what combinations of pieces are given to the linker, and when. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 10:19:47 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48FJlN25578 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:19:47 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48FKAsC017650 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:20:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48FKA011071; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:20:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 11:20:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508112009.AAB11049@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 8 May 2003 08:04:55 -0700 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: When I hear "add tclvfs (zlib,...) to core", I presume the speaker, at least in this case, means distribute the extension in the tcl tarball/zip file, rather than "write the functionality into the core into the same modules as everything else. Do I misunderstand? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 10:23:22 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48FNMN26008 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:23:22 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48FNlsC018888 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:23:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48FNlr11177; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:23:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 11:23:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508112347.AAB11158@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution In-Reply-To: <6E884026-8168-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 8 May 2003 17:19:16 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Jean-Claude Wippler > is that starkits can help *reduce* as well as grow the system. That was sort of what I had in mind with this thread. I'd like to see what was necessary to deploy extensions as starkits which then might 'trivially' be used as is. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 11:52:57 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48GqvN03134 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:52:57 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48GrNsC000486 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:53:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48GrNG12334; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:53:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 12:53:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508125323.AAB12298@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] ISO: solutions to a starkit *dok problem Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: During my adventures today, I found that the *dok.kit files were not working for me on SPARC Solaris. Talking with dgp and others on the tcler's wiki chat, the problem was that tclkit was not descending the depths of the *dok's lib directory structure to find the SPARC's .so file. So, I made a one line change to bw13dok's main.tcl file, extending auto_path to include lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os), renamed lib/arch/SunOS-sparc to lib/arch/SunOS , and rewrapped the code. The bw13dok then started up. I tested a bit, then mailed off the fixed starkits to steve landers. Alas - now for the problem. Turns out that extending the auto_path like the above isn't going to work for Windows platforms. This is because there are several tcl_platform(os) values for Windows. Which wouldn't be a problem, but I don't know on which of the various Windows os values the dll in the bw13dok starkit works. So, the problem is two part - on what platforms does this Windows dll work, and do we really have to have multiple Windows subdirectories or should we plan on a hack that just uses "Windows" for any of the Windows platforms on which the Tkhtml.so works? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 8 12:20:31 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48HKUN05726 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:20:30 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F60483953 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 13:20:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 19:20:56 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: solutions to a starkit *dok problem Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030508125323.AAB12298@cas.org> Message-Id: <6DBF0C36-8179-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > So, I made a one line change to bw13dok's main.tcl file, extending > auto_path to include lib/arch/$tcl_platform(os), > renamed lib/arch/SunOS-sparc to lib/arch/SunOS , and rewrapped the > code. > > The bw13dok then started up. [...] > So, the problem is two part [...] Very simple solution: append both the extended and the original path (in that order) IOW, don't remove the original code, just insert the arch/$tcl_platform(os) value before it. The original code works for Windows, no need to change that. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 8 12:54:28 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48HsSN08623 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:54:28 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h48HsrsC023402 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 13:54:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h48Hsr313448; Thu, 8 May 2003 13:54:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 13:54:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030508135453.AAB13439@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ISO: solutions to a starkit *dok problem In-Reply-To: <6DBF0C36-8179-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 8 May 2003 19:20:56 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JC, I didn't change the original code. I added a line, based on the comment by Don Porter that Tcl won't search that low in the directory for pkgIndex.tcl files... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu May 8 14:01:49 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48J1mN15149 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 14:01:49 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48J2HHt029067 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:02:17 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48J2GXj003457 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:02:16 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 12:02:12 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <20030508112009.AAB11049@cas.org> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > When I hear "add tclvfs (zlib,...) to core", I presume the speaker, > at least in this case, means distribute the extension in the tcl tarball/zip > file, rather than "write the functionality into the core into the same > modules as everything else. I would assume the same as well, along the lines of TIP #50, with the added caveat that they would be compiled by default with the core as well. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu May 8 14:09:09 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48J98N15968 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 14:09:08 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48J9aHt029790 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:09:37 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48J9aXj004656 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:09:36 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 12:09:30 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <6E884026-8168-11D7-BD77-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Hmmm, funny thing you name two of the larger components that some > > people ask whether they should be seperated from the core (as > > components). That's not necessarily against what you want, but > > it means "in the core" is something that may change architecturally > > in the future. > > Agree 100%, "in the core" != "built-in". > > You know how big a fan of modularity I am. Maybe something similar to > Python's structure would work: a lot of the functionality is coded as > independent extension, with a file specifying whether to build linked > in, as dynamic extension, or nor at all. Of course, note that the lack of good integration of the RE stuff has been noted as a negative aspect of Python. > Taken to extremes, and with VFS to help us, the future core of Tcl > could be as minimal as a stub vector, a bootstrap VFS reader, and a > module manager. Well, that's just a wild thought. The nice part, and And while this is interesting from a research perspective, I think the idea practically stinks. Look at trends ... aside from embedded environments (which is another discussion), kernels are growing in size, not shrinking. They do this to improve the integration of components. That doesn't mean I don't think Tcl could improve the modularity of existing core pieces, but that we should all think practically about what such a design would look like. Jeff From GargashS@Otologics.com Thu May 8 15:13:15 2003 Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h48KDEN22517 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 15:13:14 -0500 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:13:45 -0600 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Use of starkit for extension disiribution Thread-Index: AcMVlZlOmS7skqbnTMqX5Evr4XPzawAAJjEw From: "Scott Gargash" To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h48KDEN22517 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeff Hobbs [mailto:jeffh@activestate.com] > > > Taken to extremes, and with VFS to help us, the future core of Tcl > > could be as minimal as a stub vector, a bootstrap VFS reader, and a > > module manager. Well, that's just a wild thought. The > nice part, and > > And while this is interesting from a research perspective, I think the > idea practically stinks. Look at trends ... aside from embedded > environments (which is another discussion), kernels are growing in > size, not shrinking. They do this to improve the integration of > components. That doesn't mean I don't think Tcl could improve the > modularity of existing core pieces, but that we should all think > practically about what such a design would look like. I have been thnking about this recently, and I think it can be done moderately cleanly. (This is mostly thoughts that have been mulling around in my head for the last week or so, after reading the wiki page on tail calls. It's still very much a concept in progress). Define a module to be 1) the name of a namespace and 2) the name of a major command that tail-call dispatches the minor command into the namespace. As an example: module eval string { proc length {string} {...} #... } When this code is executed, the module eval acts just like namespace eval, except is also creates a new command something like the following pseudo-code: proc string {minorCmd args} { # TODO: check for minorCmd validity, generate error message if not # dispatch to the subcommand through a tail call (make this level of # stack disappear from the stack trace) return -tail [eval string::$mingorCmd $args] } Now, string functionality can all be moved out of the core and into a package as long as the string package has the string command registered so that auto_load can find it. So you wouldn't need to start with the string functionality loaded, but if you invoke the string command the module is automagically loaded for you. And with the tail call, the module-ness disappears from the programmer. It seems like it would work well for any functionality that fits the major command/minor command tcl idiom. That's not all of tcl, but it is a lot. Good features: * It's largely end-user invisible. * It primarily lives on existing functionality (package and the unknown/auto_load mechanism), and a well known tcl idiom. * Since namespaces aren't closed a programmer can extend the set of operations in a module by adding new commands into the namespace. * There's a natural migration path for code to move from being a 3rd party utility to "core" functionality without changing client code. It's just a matter of moving the package into the standard distribution. * Unifying namespaces and commands seems like a pretty natural leadin to any of a number of tcl object systems. Like I said, this is still in the mulling around stage. I haven't had an opportunity to look at what implementing tail calls entails, and I haven't thought about versioning issues, along with probably a hundred other issues. But it's been sitting in my head for a few days now and it's been resonating. Even if the core doesn't want to be modularized this way, I think it would be useful for non-core extensions. From jgodfrey@optinest.com Fri May 9 16:23:49 2003 Received: from linux2.optinest.com ([208.188.206.240]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h49LNdN08395 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:23:49 -0500 Received: from nt40ld (nt4-0ld [208.188.206.93]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id h49LNjQ00570 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:23:45 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 16:24:10 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [Starkit] AIX 4.3.3 Tclkit binary? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Does anyone have such a beast? If so, can I get my hands on it? Me and code that requires compilation just don't seem to get along well anymore... I guess I'm just too used to the simplicity offered by tcl/tk... I've attempted to build it using the instructions at http://www.equi4.com/218, but I've run into numerous road blocks. If I need to build it myself, I'm happy to try again, but I may need some guidance... Thanks, Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA Phone: 816.836.2000 Fax : 816.836.8589 Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com From jcw@equi4.com Sat May 10 09:39:59 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4AEdxN25563 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:39:59 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DAE783953 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 10:40:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 16:40:27 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] AIX 4.3.3 Tclkit binary? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <5780FA8E-82F5-11D7-84F6-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > Does anyone have such a beast? If so, can I get my hands on it? > > Me and code that requires compilation just don't seem to get along well > anymore... I guess I'm just too used to the simplicity offered by > tcl/tk... > > I've attempted to build it using the instructions at > http://www.equi4.com/218, but I've run into numerous road blocks. That's unfortunate. I've only once had to do a MK release on AIX, all I remember is that it wasn't easy. > If I need to build it myself, I'm happy to try again, but I may need > some > guidance... I hope some people on this list will jump in with advice, but perhaps the best way forward is simply do the genkit shuffle and report concisely where things go wrong. Over the course of a copule of days, it could just lead to success... (and it would document the issues, also most valuable). One thing which AFAIK matters in all this is what compiler(s) you're using. It's not necessarily so much an issue of bugs, as one of picking the combo to get C and C++ code built just right. -jcw From mocallins@yahoo.com Sat May 10 11:19:37 2003 Received: from web21310.mail.yahoo.com (web21310.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.211]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4AGJbN30943 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 11:19:37 -0500 Message-ID: <20030510162011.55733.qmail@web21310.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.102.216.26] by web21310.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:20:11 PDT Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:20:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Collins To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Tequila Server question / enhancement Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is there any mechanism to see which clients are currently accessing a Tequila Server and or possibly which variables they might be using? via the tequila remote commands? __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Mon May 12 17:34:25 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4CMYBN04448 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:34:25 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h4CMYaK8073716 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:34:38 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 17:34:36 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: starkit@equi4.com User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] slight hack to genkit for NetBSD Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: genkit has problems untarring tar files on my NetBSD systems: tclsh8.3 genkit A fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz child killed: write on pipe with no readers The line of code in question is: exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf - The strange thing is, the tar archive is unpacked perfectly, so if you just run "genkit A" again, it will get tk.tar.gz and then blow up with the same error. If you keep running "genkit A" until all seven tar files are unpacked, you can continue on and get a mostly-functional NetBSD tclkit (see my next email re "mostly"... :-). If you manually run [exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf -] in tclsh, the same error occurs, so it's not genkit's fault. General testing with [exec date | cat] and the like doesn't produce the error. And I get no error at all if I run gzip -d ... | tar xf - in the shell. The tclsh I have for bootstrapping on this machine is 8.3.4, but I get the same error if I then rebuild tclkit from scratch using using the 8.4.2 tclkit I just built. Anyway, I thought I'd report the problem, strange as it is. Here's a hack to genkit that "sidesteps" the problem: change the: exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf - line to this: if [catch {exec tar xzf ../$tar}] { exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf - } This works for me and should do the untarring without an external gzip on any system with a tar that supports the z option (which should include any system where tar is GNU tar -- NetBSD, FreeBSD, most if not all Linuxes). It should fall back to the original code if tar doesn't support z -- works for me on SunOS-5.7, for example. If anybody has any insight (or guesses) into this "child killed: write on pipe with no readers" error I'd be interested to hear it, but it's not preventing my tclkit build at this point. /k From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Mon May 12 17:47:29 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4CMlJN05627 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:47:29 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h4CMljK8074881 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:47:45 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 17:47:45 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: starkit@equi4.com User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Multipart_Mon_May_12_17:47:45_2003-1" Subject: [Starkit] Can't build a fully working tclkit for NetBSD Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Multipart_Mon_May_12_17:47:45_2003-1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII I'm trying to build tclkit for NetBSD (1.6). Everything seems to work fine except I can't get Tk to work; the Tk test fails with: couldn't load file "install/nirvana/lib/libtk84.so": install/nirvana/lib/libtk84.so: Undefined PLT symbol "XOpenDisplay" (reloc type = 7, symnum = 893) and I get the same error if I say: package require Tk I've tried pointing at /usr/X11R6/lib with -rpath and -rpath-link but neither worked. Other builtin packages seem okay: % package require Mk4tcl 2.4.9.2 % package require vfs 1.2 I'd really like to get a fully-functional tclkit for this platform but I'm not sure where to go from here. Does anybody have any suggestions of things for me to try? /k --Multipart_Mon_May_12_17:47:45_2003-1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII $ make GET=ftp tclsh8.3 genkit A fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz fetching tars/tk.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz fetching tars/itcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/itcl.tar.gz fetching tars/mk.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/mk.tar.gz fetching tars/vfs.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/vfs.tar.gz fetching tars/kit.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/kit.tar.gz fetching tars/zlib.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/zlib.tar.gz tclsh8.3 genkit B tcl tcl: sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok make install-binaries install-... ok /usr/tmp/tclkit/install/nirvan... ok Done. sh genkit B zlib: sh /usr/tmp/tclkit/build/nirva... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok kitsh: gcc -c -I. -I/usr/tmp/tclkit/s... ok g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... ok strip kitsh ... ok ls -l /usr/tmp/tclkit/install/... ok itcldyn: sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok make binaries ITCL_LIBRARY= ... ok make install-binaries ... ok tkdyn: sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok make install-binaries ... ok Done. sh genkit C sh genkit D fetching tars/runtime.kit ... ok info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200303.001 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = littleEndian tcl_platform(machine) = i386 tcl_platform(os) = NetBSD tcl_platform(osVersion) = 1.6 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = keith tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 couldn't load file "install/nirvana/lib/libtk84.so": install/nirvana/lib/libtk84.so: Undefined PLT symbol "XOpenDisplay" (reloc type = 7, symnum = 893) running dummy-nirvana sh genkit E tclkit-nirvana: 1110972 -> 1494403 --Multipart_Mon_May_12_17:47:45_2003-1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII --Multipart_Mon_May_12_17:47:45_2003-1-- From jcw@equi4.com Mon May 12 17:52:51 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4CMqoN06136 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:52:50 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id D277E8395B for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:53:19 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 00:53:21 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] slight hack to genkit for NetBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <87BC372C-84CC-11D7-B921-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > genkit has problems untarring tar files on my NetBSD systems: > > tclsh8.3 genkit A > fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz > child killed: write on pipe with no readers > > The line of code in question is: > > exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf - > > The strange thing is, the tar archive is unpacked perfectly, [...] > If you manually run [exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xf -] in tclsh, the > same error occurs, so it's not genkit's fault. [...] I wonder whether the following modified line would work: exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xfb - 6 This brings back old memories. It's tar's blocking factor. Apparently, that tar does not fill its read buffer when the pipe splits up long requests (4 Kb, probably). So the above trick reduces the blocking to 3 Kb... -jcw From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Mon May 12 17:59:36 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4CMxQN06767; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:59:36 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h4CMxqK8075279; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:59:52 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 17:59:52 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] slight hack to genkit for NetBSD In-Reply-To: <87BC372C-84CC-11D7-B921-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <87BC372C-84CC-11D7-B921-000A957664F8@equi4.com> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: >> tclsh8.3 genkit A >> fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok >> unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz >> child killed: write on pipe with no readers JCW> I wonder whether the following modified line would work: JCW> exec gzip -d < ../$tar | tar xfb - 6 JCW> This brings back old memories. It's tar's blocking factor. That sounded good, but no dice: yields the same error message. /k From jcw@equi4.com Mon May 12 18:02:18 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4CN2HN07014 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:02:17 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AEF28395B for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 19:02:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 01:02:48 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Can't build a fully working tclkit for NetBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > I'm trying to build tclkit for NetBSD (1.6). Everything seems to work > fine except I can't get Tk to work; the Tk test fails with: > > couldn't load file "install/nirvana/lib/libtk84.so": > install/nirvana/lib/libtk84.so: Undefined PLT symbol "XOpenDisplay" > (reloc type = 7, symnum = 893) First of all, could you do a test with the previous revision? It's at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.1/tclkit-netbsd-x86.gz It looks like the Tk shared lib was linked without X11 linkage. In the normal genkit case, Tk gets loaded as shared lib. The main app is not linked against X11, so that it runs on servers without X for example. As a result, tclkit is somewhat more sensitive to having Tk linked "properly". You'll need to look at the linker output in "out/nirvana/tkdyn" to find out what the build did. Maybe all it needs is a "configure --with-x" or some such? > I'd really like to get a fully-functional tclkit for this platform but > I'm not sure where to go from here. Does anybody have any suggestions > of things for me to try? You shouldn't be too far from reaching nirvana . If nothing else, you could email me the result of "genkit C", which is a big file called result-nirvana.tar.gz containing build logs and binaries (as far as it managed to get built). I can have a look. Oh, and once you do get it all going - sending me *that* "genkit C" result would be very much appreciated - I can then add it to the build set and put your name next to the level 3 build for NetBSD x86. -jcw From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Mon May 12 18:16:44 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4CNGXN08196 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:16:44 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h4CNGxK8076158 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:16:59 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 18:16:59 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Can't build a fully working tclkit for NetBSD In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: JCW> First of all, could you do a test with the previous revision? It's at: JCW> http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.1/tclkit-netbsd-x86.gz [package require Tk] works with this one! JCW> It looks like the Tk shared lib was linked without X11 linkage. In the JCW> normal genkit case, Tk gets loaded as shared lib. The main app is not JCW> linked against X11, so that it runs on servers without X for example. JCW> As a result, tclkit is somewhat more sensitive to having Tk linked JCW> "properly". JCW> You'll need to look at the linker output in "out/nirvana/tkdyn" to find JCW> out what the build did. Maybe all it needs is a "configure --with-x" JCW> or some such? I'll try this next -- hadn't noticed the logs... /k From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Tue May 13 22:18:49 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4E3InN10806 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 22:18:49 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Tue, 13 May 2003 22:19:11 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2NFMHJD9>; Tue, 13 May 2003 22:19:10 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: keith@lib.uchicago.edu, starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] slight hack to genkit for NetBSD Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 22:19:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > genkit has problems untarring tar files on my NetBSD systems: > > tclsh8.3 genkit A > fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok > unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz > child killed: write on pipe with no readers I had the same problem on HP-UX, where gzip|tar would return an error code. I modified genkit to catch the exec. Works fine. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From jcw@equi4.com Wed May 14 15:42:05 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4EKg4N11605 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 15:42:05 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C028F8396D for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 16:42:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 22:42:38 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <998CC394-864C-11D7-9E32-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] Fwd: Mk4tcl - corrupted database over network - WinNT Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (Forwarded from Metakit mailing list - in case it's a Tcl "thing") See discussion thread, for context: http://www.equi4.com/pipermail/metakit/2003-May/001130.html Begin forwarded message: From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Wed May 14, 2003 22:32:25 Europe/Amsterdam To: Metakit mailing list Subject: Re: [Metakit] Mk4tcl - corrupted database over network - WinNT Jeff, > No, the file is *very* small as far as DB's go. Currently it contains > 13 > separate views. Some of them have only (and will never have more > than) just > a few records. The largest view will have maybe 30-60 records with > about 5 > properties.... > > Right now, I'd be more than willing to trade speed for reliability. > What > are you thinking? Several options. One is to save differently, to a new file and then replace the datafile with the changed one. That would keep memory mapping on, but would never change the file on the server - other than replacing it completely (better make sure it's well tested, or you might risk losing the datafile completely). The logic is to open with -readonly, and then to save: set fd [open s:/path/on/server/outfile w] mk::file save db $fd close $fd file rename -force s:/path/on/server/outfile s:/path/on/server/datafile The above means you're only reading and doing full saves, so you have to get rid of commit calls. The other, even more drastic, measure is to also load the database entirely via a read, and then use it as in-mem DB. That approach means again you cannot commit. To open in this manner: mk::view open db ;# note: no filename given set fd [open s:/path/on/server/datafile] mk::file load db $fd close $fd At this point, you have an in-memory datafile. To be honest, I'd be hesitant to do either one. Running away from the problem is not going to solve it - but it's your call, and maybe you have no choice. A script that triggers the problem could help a lot. Make it commit more than once, make it save substantial amounts of data, close and reopen occasionally. Let it run overnight, whatever... Another way to try nailing this down, is to create a trace of all MK requests (even in code shipped to your customer, if need be), which when things go wrong can be inspected and even replayed and pruned until the trouble is localized in a specific sequence of requests. See the "mktrace.tcl" script, which is old but should still work - or can as least give you some thoughts on how to go about that: http://www.equi4.com/pub/etc/mktrace.tcl Note that this logs *all* MK calls, so if you're using starkits, you might want to add logic to filter out some of the calls. -jcw PS. I'll re-send this email to the starkit mailing list, in case you want to discuss Tcl-specific aspects of all this. Though if it's a case of MK damaging files, then this is indeed the right mailing list for such issues. _______________________________________________ metakit mailing list - metakit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/metakit -jcw From david@larochelle-innovation.com Thu May 15 02:24:56 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4F7OtN32044 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:24:55 -0500 Received: from david.nerim.net (unknown [177.2.177.1]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC1764800D for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:25:32 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:25:14 +0200 From: David Zolli To: Starkit list Message-Id: <20030515092514.00000e20.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.11claws (GTK+ 1.3.0; Win32) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp\e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit builtin packages Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I'm new to this list so forgive me if this question have already been asked a lot of time : Why all these packages are already included in a 'standard' (win32) tclkit? http pwb rechan zipvfs tcltest opt mk4vfs vfs::zip vfslib scripdoc msgcat zlib registry starkit Tcl Itcl dde Mk4tcl vfs vfs::mk4 Tk I understand well the required status of vfs, Tcl, Tk, msgcat, etc.. but why Itcl, or tcltest? Wouldn't it be better to include them if needed? Regards, -- David Zolli From nicolasb@maich.gr Thu May 15 02:38:16 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4F7cFN01218 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:38:15 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Thu May 15 11:15:25 2003 +0300 Message-ID: <3EC345DD.6020804@maich.gr> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:46:37 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Integrating Application data into Starkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, Pondering if there's correct/standard or more elegant approach to integrating data into a starkit? Currently doing this... ###Check for wrapped or not if [info exists starkit::topdir] { set mydb mk4vfs1 } else {set mydb [mk::file open mydb path to data.mk]} ###Define structure mk::view layout $mydb.view1 etc.... A couple of sore spots I saw in general was... 1. Unwrapping and re-wrapping the starkit results in the data views being lost. 2. How to run wrapped or unwrapped while maintaing data that might have accumulated in tha data views? I guess I could write out the starkit , then re-define the structure omitting the dirs view? Storing this file in the vfs directory would facilitate things but result in bigger starkit.... Anyway, would appreciate some feedback... regards, nicolas boretos From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 15 05:48:26 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FAmPN23008 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 05:48:25 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h4FAmu70016388 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:48:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h4FAmuR07079; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:48:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 06:48:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030515064856.AAB7055@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit builtin packages In-Reply-To: <20030515092514.00000e20.david@larochelle-innovation.com> of Thu, 15 May 2003 09:25:14 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I believe that itcl is present because many users of starkits want included in starkit an object oriented extension. Since itcl is slated to be distributed with tcl in the future, it was felt this was a great way for people to have it available. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From david@larochelle-innovation.com Thu May 15 09:29:55 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FETtN15581 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:29:55 -0500 Received: from david.larochelle-innovation.com (unknown [177.2.177.1]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B437F4800D for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:30:32 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 16:30:30 +0200 From: David Zolli To: Starkit list Message-Id: <20030515163030.33c64af5.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i686-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp \e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h4FETtN15581 Subject: [Starkit] Compose keys under linux Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've just try tclkit 842 under linux. Compose keys works well in console mode (ie when I launch tclkit from a xterm) but it doesn't into my Tk app (iso8859-1 encoding - french keyboard). It's only for compose keys char : I got ^e instead of ê atc.. Accentuated chars like é or à works well. Anybody can confirm (or not) that bug? -- David Zolli From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 15 09:40:39 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FEecN16789 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:40:38 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h4FEf870015652 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h4FEf9w13281; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030515104109.AAB13226@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Compose keys under linux In-Reply-To: <20030515163030.33c64af5.david@larochelle-innovation.com> of Thu, 15 May 2003 16:30:30 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I don't have linux - I have sparc solaris. Here's what I did: $ tclkit % I type e' and see an acute e appear at the %. I then type: % package require Tk 8.4 % entry .e .e % pack .e % and then I click to focus on the entry box and type the same 3 keys. In the entry box I also see the acute e. So it _seems_ to work fine on this platform. Do you have a specific small coherent example which is not working? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From david@larochelle-innovation.com Thu May 15 10:06:35 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FF6YN19680 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:06:34 -0500 Received: from david.nerim.net (unknown [177.2.177.1]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68E884800D for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:07:12 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 17:06:54 +0200 From: David Zolli To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Compose keys under linux Message-Id: <20030515170654.00006fda.david@larochelle-innovation.com> In-Reply-To: <20030515104109.AAB13226@cas.org> References: <20030515163030.33c64af5.david@larochelle-innovation.com> <20030515104109.AAB13226@cas.org> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.11claws (GTK+ 1.3.0; Win32) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp\e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h4FF6YN19680 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Le 15/05/03 10:41:09 "Larry W. Virden" a dit : I've done exactly the same test : $ tclkit I type ^ then e and see ê appear at the %. Then type: % package require Tk 8.4 % entry .e .e % pack .e and then I click to focus on the entry box and type ^ and e and I see : ^e (it would have been ê). As I don't know if your system is able to display it, the char expected is \xEA in iso8859-1 (or iso8859-15) encoding. -- David Zolli From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 15 10:14:55 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FFEtN20779 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:14:55 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18FE78396D for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:15:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 17:15:27 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Compose keys under linux Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <20030515170654.00006fda.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Message-Id: <0F051E75-86E8-11D7-9E32-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h4FFEtN20779 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: David Zolli wrote: > Le 15/05/03 10:41:09 > "Larry W. Virden" a dit : > > I've done exactly the same test : > > $ tclkit > > I type ^ then e and see ê appear at the %. > > Then type: > % package require Tk > 8.4 > % entry .e > .e > % pack .e > > and then I click to focus on the entry box and type ^ and e and I see : > ^e (it would have been ê). > > As I don't know if your system is able to display it, the char expected > is \xEA in iso8859-1 (or iso8859-15) encoding. You need a dynamically linked executable, i.e. not the tclkit-linux-x86static* builds. AFAIK, this has to do with X11 loading a locale-specific shared lib. I think it's all about what X11 calls "input methods". (the iso8859-1 encoding is in standard tclkit, but iso8859-15 isn't) -jcw From david@larochelle-innovation.com Thu May 15 10:45:34 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FFjYN24573 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:45:34 -0500 Received: from david.nerim.net (unknown [177.2.177.1]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE83E4800D for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:46:11 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 17:45:54 +0200 From: David Zolli To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Compose keys under linux Message-Id: <20030515174554.00007202.david@larochelle-innovation.com> In-Reply-To: <0F051E75-86E8-11D7-9E32-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <20030515170654.00006fda.david@larochelle-innovation.com> <0F051E75-86E8-11D7-9E32-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.11claws (GTK+ 1.3.0; Win32) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp\e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Le 15/05/03 17:15:27 Jean-Claude Wippler wrote : > .../... > You need a dynamically linked executable, i.e. not the > tclkit-linux-x86static* builds. AFAIK, this has to do with X11 > loading a locale-specific shared lib. I think it's all about what X11 > calls "input methods". Ok, I try with gz and upx non-static tclkits : both works very well. :-) > (the iso8859-1 encoding is in standard tclkit, but iso8859-15 isn't) Yes, I nocited that. Could be a problem for europeans... -- David Zolli From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu May 15 12:02:09 2003 Received: from motgate6.mot.com (motgate6.mot.com [144.189.100.106]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4FH28N00835 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:02:08 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate6.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate6) with ESMTP id h4FH2lRM013009 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:02:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h4FH2Vir005094 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:02:32 -0500 Message-ID: <3EC3C826.34C6EACE@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:02:30 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit builtin packages References: <20030515092514.00000e20.david@larochelle-innovation.com> <3EC3AE57.51CE84BD@motorola.com> <20030515171639.00006b3b.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: David, > I understand. So the right question would have been : why Itcl and not > Itk then? I think the answer to this is that at the time the decision was made, good pure tcl/tk widget sets were available but there wasn't a good pure tcl object system. Tom K. From mel@redolive.com Sat May 17 08:50:58 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4HDovN08229 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:50:58 -0500 Received: (qmail 26885 invoked by uid 511); 17 May 2003 14:47:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 17 May 2003 14:47:42 -0000 Message-ID: <00dd01c31c7b$6fa56010$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 09:51:37 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] Latin char problem with tclkit... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: i have a file c:/tmp/z with content: ------------------------------------------------------- Nettogewinne in Höhe von rund 500 Millionen Euro aus der Veräußerung von Geschäftsfeldern kompensiert. Diese stammen überwiegend aus dem Verkauf des Wertpapierverwahr and a tcl file (t): ---------------------------------------------------------- set f [open c:/tmp/z r] #fconfigure $f -encoding utf-8 while {[gets $f line] >= 0} { puts "$line" } THE PROBLEM ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - i got the latest tclkitsh.exe (8.4.2) from download site and saved it to c:/tmp when i run "tclkitsh.exe t" i get the following lines: Nettogewinne in Höhe von rund 500 Millionen Euro aus der VeräuÃYerung von Geschäftsfeldern kompensiert. Diese stammen überwiegend aus dem Verkauf des Wertpapierverwahr HOWEVER: if i run my tclsh on the file i see the correct answer. any help is appreciated ***A WEIRED PROBLEM. i have a tclkitsh.exe in my /usr/local/bin directory. if i run it from its location like "/usr/local/bin/tclkitsh.exe c:/tmp/t" it works fine, but if i copy tclkitsh.exe to my c:/tmp directory and run it i get garbage From mel@redolive.com Sat May 17 09:17:07 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4HEH7N09170 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 09:17:07 -0500 Received: (qmail 26945 invoked by uid 511); 17 May 2003 15:13:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 17 May 2003 15:13:51 -0000 Message-ID: <00e801c31c7f$171d5b10$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 10:17:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] encoding problem... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: i figured out that when i place my tclkitsh.exe in /usr/local/bin it uses the encoding from /usr/local/lib/tcl8.4/encoding directory. (FINE) where should i place the encoding directory in my starkit package ? is starkit "HARD CODED" to look in "../lib/tcl8.4/encoding" directory ? i think IT IS ! i did the following test. created c:/tmp/lib/tcl8.4/encoding and copied all files from /usr/local/lib/tcl8.4/encoding there created c:/tmp/bin/ directory and copied tclkitsh.exe there when i run c:/tmp/tclkitsh.exe, it uses encoding from "../lib/tcl8.4/encoding" directory. this proves hard coded encoding in starkit package. my question remains: where should i place the encoding directory in my starkit package to understand say "Latin" characters ? Yours, Mel From david@larochelle-innovation.com Mon May 19 07:44:29 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4JCiSN20908 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:44:28 -0500 Received: from david.nerim.net (unknown [177.2.177.1]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA3EB4800D for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:45:04 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 14:44:49 +0200 From: David Zolli To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] encoding problem... Message-Id: <20030519144449.00002223.david@larochelle-innovation.com> In-Reply-To: <00e801c31c7f$171d5b10$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> References: <00e801c31c7f$171d5b10$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.11claws (GTK+ 1.3.0; Win32) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp\e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Le 17/05/03 10:17:47 "Mel" a dit : > where should i place the encoding directory in my starkit package ? I've tried and tested this, and it's works : 1) Unpack your starkit if is not already done. 2) Create this directory : .../appname.vfs/lib/tcl8.4/encoding 3) Copy the needed encoding(s) .enc file(s) in this directory (from an existing tcl installation or from tcl CVS repository here : http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/tcl/tcl/library/encoding/ if you using the last tclkit). 4) re-wrap your starkit with these new files. Then, these encoding are avalaible in you starkit/starpack and your starkit can be launched with a 'standard' tclkit. -- David Zolli From mel@redolive.com Mon May 19 19:58:49 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4K0wnN07710 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:58:49 -0500 Received: (qmail 8412 invoked by uid 511); 20 May 2003 01:55:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 20 May 2003 01:55:31 -0000 Message-ID: <00cb01c31e6b$11269120$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: References: <200305191701.h4JH1EN08355@trixie.triqs.com> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 20:59:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] Re: starkit digest, Vol 1 #246 - 1 msg Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: if i do "sdx.bat wrap tclkit.exe -runtime runtime.exe would it not use runtime.exe for wrapping ? if it does, would it not overwrite what's in my package? thanks for your help Mel ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:01 PM Subject: starkit digest, Vol 1 #246 - 1 msg > Send starkit mailing list submissions to > starkit@equi4.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > starkit-request@equi4.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > starkit-admin@equi4.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of starkit digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: encoding problem... (David Zolli) > > --__--__-- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 14:44:49 +0200 > From: David Zolli > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] encoding problem... > Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com > Organization: La Rochelle Innovation > > Le 17/05/03 10:17:47 > "Mel" a dit : > > > where should i place the encoding directory in my starkit package ? > > I've tried and tested this, and it's works : > > 1) Unpack your starkit if is not already done. > 2) Create this directory : .../appname.vfs/lib/tcl8.4/encoding > 3) Copy the needed encoding(s) .enc file(s) in this directory (from an > existing tcl installation or from tcl CVS repository here : > http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/tcl/tcl/library/encoding/ > if you using the last tclkit). > 4) re-wrap your starkit with these new files. > > Then, these encoding are avalaible in you starkit/starpack and your > starkit can be launched with a 'standard' tclkit. > > -- > David Zolli > > > --__--__-- > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > End of starkit Digest > > From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Thu May 22 12:59:13 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4MHwwN29460 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:59:12 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h4MHxViT022089 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:59:32 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:59:31 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: starkit@equi4.com User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Multipart_Thu_May_22_12:59:31_2003-1" Subject: [Starkit] Writable Starkit in Multiuser Environment: How? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Multipart_Thu_May_22_12:59:31_2003-1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII I am just trying out writable starkits for the first time, attempting to add a new feature to a rather large existing program which is implemented as an ordinary read-only starkit. Basically, I want any user with write permission on the starkit to be able to invoke it in such a way that it modifies itself, but I want any user *without* write permission to still be able to run the application without any errors, as long as they don't try to use the "self-modifying" option. The problem is, if my writable starkit is invoked by a user without write permission, it blows up before my code is even executed. Here is version info: $ uname -a FreeBSD jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu 4.6.2-RELEASE-p12 FreeBSD 4.6.2-RELEASE-p12 #0: Mon Mar 24 18:52:12 CST 2003 root@jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/JFCL i386 $ sdx version /usr/app/bin/sdx 2003/03/06 11:59:36 56635-48537 /usr/app/bin/sdx $ sdx version /usr/app/bin/tclkit 2003/03/17 21:42:18 20590-19938 /usr/app/bin/tclkit $ tclkit % info pa 8.4.2 I've written a tiny program called "fixate" to illustrate what I'm trying to do. It implements fixate-able parameters as files in the VFS, specifically any file in the directory $starkit::topdir/fixate. Usage is: * List names of all fixated parameters: fixate * Dump value of a given fixated parameter foo: fixate foo * Set the value of fixated parameter foo to bar: fixate foo bar Here is fixate.vfs/lib/app-fixate/fixate.tcl: proc main {} { lassign $::argv file value if {$value eq ""} { if {$file eq ""} { # dump all fixated parameters foreach file [glob -dir [file join $starkit::topdir fixate] *] { puts [file tail $file] } } else { # dump fixated parameter set fp [open [file join $starkit::topdir fixate $file]] puts [read $fp] close $fp } } else { # fixate a parameter set fp [open [file join $starkit::topdir fixate $file] w] puts -nonewline $fp $value close $fp } } main package provide app-fixate 1.0 As wrapped, the starkit contains one fixated parameter, foo: $ ls -l fixate.vfs/fixate total 1 -rw-rw-r-- 1 keith keith 3 May 22 12:18 foo which has the value "bar". If I wrap this starkit read-only, it works as expected; of course, any new value given for a parameter is simply lost when the program terminates: $ sdx wrap fixate 8 updates applied $ ./fixate foo $ ./fixate foo bar $ ./fixate foo zap $ ./fixate foo bar If I wrap it with the -writable option, it works perfectly, fixating parameters right and left, since I own the starkit and have write permission on it: $ sdx wrap fixate -writable 8 updates applied $ ls -l fixate -rwxrwxr-x 1 keith keith 1105 May 22 12:46 fixate $ ./fixate foo $ ./fixate foo bar $ ./fixate foo zap $ ./fixate foo zap But when I take away my write permission (simulating a user other than myself, the fixate "admin"), it blows up: $ chmod a-w fixate $ ls -l fixate -r-xr-xr-x 1 keith keith 1648 May 22 12:50 fixate $ ./fixate file open failed while executing "mk::file open mk4vfs1 /disk/home/keith/tmp/fixate/fixate -nocommit" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list mk::file open $db $file] $args" (procedure "::mk4vfs::_mount" line 9) invoked from within "::mk4vfs::_mount /disk/home/keith/tmp/fixate/fixate -nocommit" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list ::mk4vfs::_mount $mkfile] $args" (procedure "::vfs::mk4::Mount" line 9) invoked from within "::vfs::mk4::Mount ./fixate ./fixate -nocommit" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list ::vfs::${driver}::Mount $self $self] $args" What I want is for it to work in every case except that of the user trying to actually fixate a new value -- if it blows up there, I'm perfectly happy, though of course I'd prefer to be able to catch the error and generate a nicer error message. So, is it possible to do what I want? Am I missing something obvious? Also, would anything change if I wrapped a starpack as opposed to a starkit? The writable starkit is attached. Thanks! /k -- Keith Waclena --Multipart_Thu_May_22_12:59:31_2003-1 Content-Type: application/octet-stream Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="fixate" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 IyEvYmluL3NoCiMgXApleGVjIHRjbGtpdCAiJDAiICR7MSsiJEAifQpwYWNrYWdlIHJlcXVp cmUgc3RhcmtpdApzdGFya2l0OjpoZWFkZXIgbWs0IC1ub2NvbW1pdAoaIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMj IyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMj IyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMj IyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjIyMjI0pMGgAAAAVw/wABAHic K0hMzk5MT1UoSi0szSxKVSguSSzKzizhgtJWViBGSWkBVwGawsSCAt20zIrEklQuAIPHGas3 AgFKACAAAxoNzT56YXADAAAAAICEnfyCAZmAhIi+Bf//AAEANwIBSgAgAAPNDc0+emFwAwAA AAA8cm9vdD4AbGliAGFwcC1maXhhdGUAZml4YXRlAEd7/wABAG1haW4udGNsAAkAAAAAAEQi BM0+eJwrSEzOTkxPVShKLSzNLEpVKC5JLMrOLOGC0lZWIEZJaQFXAZrCxIIC3bTMisSSVC4A g8cZqzdmaXhhdGUudGNsAHBrZ0luZGV4LnRjbABmaXhhdGUudGNsfgDbDCICSgAgAMYKzT4i BM0+IgTNPnicnZHNboUgEIXX8hSTe101sWm3vopxMZXR0oswBfQ2Mb57+bGxaTdN2XHmcM4H sLMDzKgMbDtsAuLS6L2aDNRti25aYVSaYEW9UB6rEbY6b4He4XJJx6osZuOpJfMV5DIzoNYx 5gMDSWB0OFMg54tltI5weC013aTtCzRSOeiy8GYjWu0DupsKbRssp1nJ6uGhT0UVL8Ef/oBK QybpS/wuqh1Ie/qB9AunTD0FGBk6y2T+gHBUHV2FI15HRp0PcdDWJx9HkPyAJ871KwW/Y/wP Ae6xLwM0xhq6a2VyK5S/EtXJUZ5lFyL9uxCMww0nAnZ2VTLCMDdH9PPjk/gE5husInBhY2th Z2UgaWZuZWVkZWQgYXBwLWZpeGF0ZSAxLjAgW2xpc3Qgc291cmNlIFtmaWxlIGpvaW4gJGRp ciBmaXhhdGUudGNsXV0KcGFja2FnZSBwcm92aWRlIGFwcC1maXhhdGUgMS4wCgoCAUoAIABm b28ABAAAAAAAgIGJAZ+GAaiAgQGuhAGvtwGzgeiAgICAg6QB64ICj4CGApGMApcC7AKjhumA gIGEBZWGBZmAge+E8IP0hfeAgISd/IIBmYCE5L8FnwWkhQWngICEnfyCAZmAhAGbxQWsgIGJ AZ+GAaiAgQGuhAGvt4yBw4CAgICDpAHrggKPgIYCkYwClwLsBtmGxICAgYQFlYYFmYCByoTL g8+F0oCBjgXxgAAAAAAAA0GAAABCAAAC/0pMCgAAAAHFeJydkc1uhSAQhdfyFJN7XTWxabe+ inExldHSizAF9DYxvnv5sbFpN03ZceZwzgewswPMqAxsO2wC4tLovZoM1G2LblphVJpgRb1Q HqsRtjpvgd7hcknHqixm46kl8xXkMjOg1jHmAwNJYHQ4UyDni2W0jnB4LTXdpO0LNFI56LLw ZiNa7QO6mwptGyynWcnq4aFPRRUvwR/+gEpDJulL/C6qHUh7+oH0C6dMPQUYGTrLZP6AcFQd XYUjXkdGnQ9x0NYnH0eQ/IAnzvUrBb9j/A8B7rEvAzTGGrprZXIrlL8S1clRnmUXIv27EIzD DScCdnZVMsIwN0f08+OT+ATmG6wicGFja2FnZSBpZm5lZWRlZCBhcHAtZml4YXRlIDEuMCBb bGlzdCBzb3VyY2UgW2ZpbGUgam9pbiAkZGlyIGZpeGF0ZS50Y2xdXQpwYWNrYWdlIHByb3Zp ZGUgYXBwLWZpeGF0ZSAxLjAKCoC8ZGlyc1tuYW1lOlMscGFyZW50OkksZmlsZXNbbmFtZTpT LHNpemU6SSxkYXRlOkksY29udGVudHM6Ql1dgY3XgAAAAAAABQaAAABBAAAExUpMCgAAAABa gLxkaXJzW25hbWU6UyxwYXJlbnQ6SSxmaWxlc1tuYW1lOlMsc2l6ZTpJLGRhdGU6SSxjb250 ZW50czpCXV2BjQXegAAAAAAABWCAAABCAAAFHg== --Multipart_Thu_May_22_12:59:31_2003-1-- From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 22 15:40:52 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4MKepN14499 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:40:51 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9543083AEA for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:41:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:41:30 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Writable Starkit in Multiuser Environment: How? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > I am just trying out writable starkits [...] > I've written a tiny program called "fixate" [...] > If I wrap this starkit read-only, it works as expected [...] > If I wrap it with the -writable option, it works perfectly, [...] > But when I take away my write permission (simulating a user other than > myself, the fixate "admin"), it blows up: > > $ chmod a-w fixate > $ ls -l fixate > -r-xr-xr-x 1 keith keith 1648 May 22 12:50 fixate > $ ./fixate > file open failed > while executing > "mk::file open mk4vfs1 /disk/home/keith/tmp/fixate/fixate > -nocommit" > ("eval" body line 1) > invoked from within > "eval [list mk::file open $db $file] $args" [...] First of all many thanks for a very clear explanation and demo. Yes, this is one of the rough edges. The point is that Mk4tcl refuses to open a datafile r/o if r/w requested (just like fopen). The trouble with that is that the Tcl exception gets thrown before the scripts inside the starkit get control. Sort of a chicken-and-edd thing. > What I want is for it to work in every case except that of the user > trying to actually fixate a new value -- if it blows up there, I'm > perfectly happy, though of course I'd prefer to be able to catch the > error and generate a nicer error message. I was at first alarmed by you use of the term "blows up", since it's a Tcl error. Except that it happens before you get control :) > So, is it possible to do what I want? Am I missing something obvious? > Also, would anything change if I wrapped a starpack as opposed to a > starkit? First off: starpacks are read-only, always. That's an OS restriction: you can't modify a file which is being executed. So so, starpacks would be going down the wrong path. There *is* a way to do this, but it's a hack. Open as read-only, so things always get to the point of running your scripts. Then, close the datafile and re-open it r/w underneath yourself. That's not as crazy at it may sound, though I suspect that there are still unexplored aspects in this approach: - a starkit is always launched using MK db name "mk4vfs1" - you can see this with "puts [mk::file open]" - so what you can do is: mk::file close mk4vfs1 mk::file open mk4vfs1 -nocommit $filename - the trick is to get at the filename, but that's part of the output of "mk::file open", so it's all introspectable and doable I've always meant to make this the default behavior, albeit perhaps with an explicit call in the mk4vfs handler. That way, starkits can *always* run, but when they need to modify themselves they can try to do so in a controlled way. But not before all issues have been fully ironed out... There's some danger in all this, as the locking discussions on the Metakit mailing lists show. You have to be 100% certain that no other process has the file open, or file curruption is possible. Playing these tricks on a file server is, eh... tricky. If you want to guard against corruption, you'll need to use a locking mechanism (lockfiles, a socket, mother-in-law, whatever) - which is where things get really tricky. Because launching the starkit by itself is already going to open the file r/o. The chance of problems with r/o concurrent use is small but non-zero. It will only be an issue when a process opens a datafile, and at least *two* commits have been made (not necessarily same process). After that, the reader will see data on file which is inconsistent with what it may have buffered in its own memory. All due to the stable storage algorithm used in MK - long story... In the end, after several decades of DB coding, I can only conclude that file systems make lousy concurrency blockers, regardless of all nifty locking schemes offered. The only serious way is at the application level, i.e. a client/server structure. Which is why I tend to favor a central server with tons of caching in a local *copy* if needed. > The writable starkit is attached. Much appreciated. I was able to reproduce effortlessly on MacOSX. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 22 15:57:35 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4MKvZN16135 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:57:35 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9736F83AEA for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:58:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:58:13 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Writable Starkit in Multiuser Environment: How? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1A6BD09A-8C98-11D7-8877-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: keith@lib.uchicago.edu wrote: > I am just trying out writable starkits [...] Here's a different line of thought: launch the starkit through a separate Tcl script, or even a specially created starpack version of tclkit. You could even create that startup facility when the starkit is launched without it for the first time and inform people that tsk, tsk, tsk, they did bad and should use the other launch approach from now on. It may not win a prize in the single-file deployment olympics, but it may be a solution for every scenario you need to deal with. Having starpacks set up a *few* things on first launch is something which may be of use in other situations too btw. I just wanted to mention this because it seems people are often focused on an installer as first stage which gets jettisoned after use. It's quite feasible to set up nice shortcuts and even "brand" things as a customization service, without adopting the "installer mindset" ... -jcw From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Thu May 22 16:43:37 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4MLhaN20205; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:43:36 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h4MLiLiT035539; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:44:21 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:44:21 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Writable Starkit in Multiuser Environment: How? In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: JCW> I was at first alarmed by you use of the term "blows up", since it's a JCW> Tcl error. Except that it happens before you get control :) Tcl stack traces tend to elicit the term "blows up" from my users. :-) JCW> First off: starpacks are read-only, always. That's an OS restriction: JCW> you can't modify a file which is being executed. So so, starpacks JCW> would be going down the wrong path. I can live with that. JCW> There *is* a way to do this, but it's a hack. [...] JCW> There's some danger in all this, as the locking discussions on the JCW> Metakit mailing lists show. You have to be 100% certain that no other JCW> process has the file open, or file curruption is possible. Playing JCW> these tricks on a file server is, eh... tricky. I'll give this a try! I'm not too worried about the locking issues, as my intention is for this feature to be used by the admin *very* occasionally, to configure a few global parameters; I expect this would typically be just after acquiring and right before installing my application. I'm happy to just put a big warning in the docs. Thanks! -- Keith Waclena From nicolasb@maich.gr Fri May 23 07:40:42 2003 Received: from mail-server ([193.218.36.74]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4NCeeN13618 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:40:41 -0500 Received: FROM maich.gr BY mail-server ; Fri May 23 16:18:28 2003 +0300 Message-ID: <3ECE1903.7090704@maich.gr> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 15:50:11 +0300 From: Nicolas Boretos User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020510 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Writable Starkit crash on exit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, Have created a "writable" starkit that works as it should, both running either "sourced" or as a starkit. The problem I am seeing, is that while the I am able to write to the starkit, it crashes when exiting the application. Re-launching it it comes up ok, the data all seems to be there, it works, but again crashes on exit. This is on WinXP and 2000, with the official 17/03/2003 build of Tclkit.... It does not crash on OSX? I am calling "commit" after defining the structure in the db, and after writing data? Is there anything else I should(not) be doing? JC, I can send you the error report if it'll help.... insight would be appreciated, regards, nicolas boretos ####Starup logic#### if {![info exists starkit::topdir]} { ###Running sourced ###check to see if data file exists if {[file exists [file join $::env(RUBIA_LIBRARY) rubia.mk]]} { set rubia [mk::file open rubia [file join $::env(RUBIA_LIBRARY) rubia.mk]] puts "Opened Rubia using [file join $::env(RUBIA_LIBRARY) rubia.mk]" } else { #Open new datafile and define schema set rubia [mk::file open rubia [file join $::env(RUBIA_LIBRARY) rubia.mk]] puts "Opened new Rubia Datafile" rubia::define_schema puts "Rubia Shema Created" } } if {[info exists starkit::topdir]} { #We are running as a starkit set rubia mk4vfs1 if {[llength [mk::file views mk4vfs1]] == "1"} { ####Rubia structure is not yet defined (running first time), define it rubia::define_schema } } From phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com Fri May 23 12:51:27 2003 Received: from stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com (stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com [130.76.96.56]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NHpQN11223 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:51:26 -0500 Received: from stl-av-02.boeing.com ([192.76.190.7]) by stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com (8.9.2/8.8.5-M2) with ESMTP id MAA08538 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:52:12 -0500 (CDT) Received: from blv-hub-01.boeing.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by stl-av-02.boeing.com (8.9.3p2/8.9.2/MBS-AV-02) with ESMTP id MAA23994 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:52:11 -0500 (CDT) Received: from XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com (xch-mwbh-10.mw.nos.boeing.com [130.38.253.37]) by blv-hub-01.boeing.com (8.11.3/8.11.3/MBS-LDAP-01) with ESMTP id h4NHq9H16771 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:52:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com ([130.38.253.26]) by XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.2966); Fri, 23 May 2003 12:52:08 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6334.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:52:08 -0500 Message-ID: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A81@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Thread-Topic: RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack Thread-Index: AcMhVAeONxg13tfJSOmeuR1oAriqOQ== From: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 May 2003 17:52:08.0778 (UTC) FILETIME=[07C44AA0:01C32154] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h4NHpQN11223 Subject: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Request for Comment: I have been using StarPacks for deployment of in-house tools, but I am preparing a Tcl application for distribution to a group of external customers. I do not want to distribute the source code, so I am considering releasing the application as a StarPack. I understand that source files released as StarPacks (and Starkits for that matter) are stored in a database and have a couple of different levels of compression, but does this adequately protect the code from reverse engineering? I know that .kit files can be unwrapped, but what about StarPacks? From what I have read on the subject, any software protection scheme can be cracked, so the challenge is simply to make the effort prohibitavely difficult (for all but the most determined cracker.) Do StarPacks offer any code protection, and if so, then what additional steps might be worth taking to discourage reverse engineering through some of Tcl's introspection commands? Phillip St. John The Boeing Company From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri May 23 12:57:00 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NHv0N11821 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:57:00 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHvTTx009385; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:57:29 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NHvTab024311; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:57:29 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:57:29 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A81@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Consider using procomp and tbcload from Tcl Dev Kit to protect your binaries. That is a combination Mark roseman has reported good sucess with. Starkit/pack alone just compress the stored files, but do not obfuscate them in any way. Mount a starpack as directory, read the files, see the code. procomp prevents not the mounting and reading, but you won't see the code. http://www.activestate.com/Tcl_Dev_Kit -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join the community at the 10th Tcl conference http://wiki.tcl.tk/6274 > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of EXT-St. John, Phillip E > Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:52 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a > StarPack > > > Request for Comment: > > I have been using StarPacks for deployment of in-house tools, but > I am preparing a Tcl application for distribution to a group of > external customers. I do not want to distribute the source code, > so I am considering releasing the application as a StarPack. I > understand that source files released as StarPacks (and Starkits > for that matter) are stored in a database and have a couple of > different levels of compression, but does this adequately protect > the code from reverse engineering? I know that .kit files can be > unwrapped, but what about StarPacks? > > >From what I have read on the subject, any software protection > scheme can be cracked, so the challenge is simply to make the > effort prohibitavely difficult (for all but the most determined > cracker.) Do StarPacks offer any code protection, and if so, > then what additional steps might be worth taking to discourage > reverse engineering through some of Tcl's introspection commands? > > > Phillip St. John > > The Boeing Company > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com Fri May 23 12:58:05 2003 Received: from stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com (stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com [130.76.96.56]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NHw5N11948 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:58:05 -0500 Received: from stl-av-01.boeing.com ([192.76.190.6]) by stl-smtpout-01.boeing.com (8.9.2/8.8.5-M2) with ESMTP id MAA13920 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:58:50 -0500 (CDT) Received: from blv-hub-01.boeing.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by stl-av-01.boeing.com (8.9.3p2/8.9.2/MBS-AV-02) with ESMTP id MAA08072 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:58:49 -0500 (CDT) Received: from XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com (xch-mwbh-10.mw.nos.boeing.com [130.38.253.37]) by blv-hub-01.boeing.com (8.11.3/8.11.3/MBS-LDAP-01) with ESMTP id h4NHwmH25580 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:58:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com ([130.38.253.26]) by XCH-MWBH-10.mw.nos.boeing.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.2966); Fri, 23 May 2003 12:58:34 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6334.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:58:34 -0500 Message-ID: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12077061@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Thread-Topic: RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? Thread-Index: AcMhVO2T8Jw51JIIRCCy02ps4PRIOQ== From: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 May 2003 17:58:34.0542 (UTC) FILETIME=[EDB334E0:01C32154] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h4NHw5N11948 Subject: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The format of original posting appears to be corrupted, so let's try it again... Request for Comment: I have been using StarPacks for deployment of in-house tools, but I am preparing a Tcl application for distribution to a group of external customers. I do not want to distribute the source code, so I am considering releasing the application as a StarPack. I understand that source files released as StarPacks (and Starkits for that matter) are stored in a database and have a couple of different levels of compression, but does this adequately protect the code from reverse engineering? I know that .kit files can be unwrapped, but what about StarPacks? From what I have read on the subject, any software protection scheme can be cracked, so the challenge is simply to make the effort prohibitively difficult (for all but the most determined cracker.) Do StarPacks offer any code protection, and if so, then what additional steps might be worth taking to discourage reverse engineering through some of Tcl's introspection commands? Phillip St. John The Boeing Company From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Fri May 23 13:28:25 2003 Received: from hewey.iland.net (lewey.iland.net [205.242.230.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4NISPN14956 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:28:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 32426 invoked from network); 23 May 2003 18:29:09 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-201-124.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.201.124) by lewey.iland.net with SMTP; 23 May 2003 18:29:09 -0000 Message-ID: <011101c32158$fb48d980$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" , References: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12077061@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:27:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/22/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: ----- Original Message ----- From: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" To: Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 12:58 PM Subject: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? > Do StarPacks offer any code protection [?] > > Phillip St. John No more protection than is offered by a StarKit. They can *both* be unwrapped using the standard sdx tools. Both are definitely better than nothing, but they are not (intended to be) secure.... Jeff From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Fri May 23 13:32:10 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-5.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-5.online-age.net [64.14.56.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NIWAN15365 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:32:10 -0500 Received: from int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-3 [3.159.236.67]) by ext-nj2gw-5.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h4NIWVi5022107 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:32:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h4NIWhvP002009 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:32:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4905); Fri, 23 May 2003 14:30:40 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:30:41 -0400 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E2540A@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? Thread-Index: AcMhVO2T8Jw51JIIRCCy02ps4PRIOQAAeb+w From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 May 2003 18:30:40.0959 (UTC) FILETIME=[69EF1CF0:01C32159] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h4NIWAN15365 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: -----Original Message----- From: EXT-St. John, Phillip E [mailto:phillip.e.stjohn@boeing.com] uest for Comment: >Do StarPacks offer any code protection, and if so, then what >additional steps might be worth taking to discourage >reverse engineering through some of Tcl's introspection >commands? Since tcl scripts reside *in* the kit/pack, one could byte compile .tcl files and include the byte compiled version in you distributed app. As a bonus, it would also save executition time required to compile on the fly.. though the time saved would probably negligable. http://dev.scriptics.com/software/tclpro/ As a further step, you could run you tcl scripts through an obfuscator before byte compiling. A quick google search lead me to Frink as a TCL obfuscator. I've never used it, but maybe Frink is something worth investigating. http://catless.ncl.ac.uk/Programs/Frink/ - Bryan From lvirden@cas.org Fri May 23 13:56:51 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NIuoN17522 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:56:50 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h4NIvSVr010467 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:57:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h4NIvSV07940; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:57:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:57:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030523145728.AAB7929@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 23 May 2003 14:30:41 -0400 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" > Since tcl scripts reside *in* the kit/pack, one could > byte compile .tcl files and include the byte compiled version in you distributed app. As a bonus, it would also save executition time required to compile on the fly.. though the time saved would probably negligable. Really? It was my understanding that going through this, if anything, made the application a bit slower, as there was now overhead to undo the things that was done to the code . > As a further step, you could run you tcl scripts through an obfuscator before byte compiling. A quick google search lead me to Frink as a TCL obfuscator. I've never used it, but maybe Frink is something worth investigating. I'm uncertain how this would help - the byte code compilation should be identical, unless frink actually substitutes new tcl proc invocations for the previous ones. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri May 23 14:11:01 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NJB0N18541 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:11:00 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NJBeTx015344 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:11:40 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NJBeab002093 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:11:40 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] RFC: How much code protection is offered by a StarPack? Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:11:36 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <20030523145728.AAB7929@cas.org> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry Virdern wrote: > From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" > > > Since tcl scripts reside *in* the kit/pack, one could > > byte compile .tcl files and include the byte compiled version > > in you distributed app. As a bonus, it would also save > > executition time required to compile on the fly.. though the time > Really? It was my understanding that going through this, if anything, made > the application a bit slower, as there was now overhead to undo the things > that was done to the code . Larry is correct in this respect. The TclPro/Tcl Dev Kit Compiler will actually result in code that is slightly slower to load because there is two levels of obfuscation that actually take place. It does precompile the code, but in order for that code to be safely placed in a text file, it must be rendered into ascii-7. That causes the reading of it to be slightly slower. > > As a further step, you could run you tcl scripts through an > > obfuscator before byte compiling. A quick google search lead me > > to Frink as a TCL obfuscator. I've never used it, but maybe Frink > > is something worth investigating. > > I'm uncertain how this would help - the byte code compilation should be > identical, unless frink actually substitutes new tcl proc invocations for > the previous ones. Yes, frink will make the code harder to read, but not actually make it un-introspectable in any way (whereas the Compiler does make procs un-instrospectable). Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri May 23 14:40:06 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NJe5N20602 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:40:05 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h4NJeoAU028849 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:40:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h4NJemir029211 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:40:48 -0500 Message-ID: <3ECE793E.7725415@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:40:46 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] tclkit bug and RFC on suggested fix Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Well, I've decide revisit the HP-UX shared object load problem (bug) one more time. To refresh everyone's memory, the HP-UX os won't allow a file that has been loaded at run time to be deleted until the process has exited. This prevents a tclkit application from cleaning up shared object that are written out from the internal vfs to /var/tmp so that can be loaded. Steve Landers kindly provided a clean up procedure (see enclosed file) that remove files from the /var/tmp directory which were left behind by other processes or previous invocations. This work-a-round is an ugly patch on an other wise beautiful system and I initially didn't mind it to much since most since my customers were on Solaris systems. Over time my attitude has changed (after hanging my system several times) and I now think the problem should be considered a tclkit bug that needs to fixed. To justify the above statement, do the following on an HP-UX system. % tclkit % package require Tk 8.4 % exit % This is certainly a reasonable thing to do, but currently there is no hope that the file placed in the /var/tmp directory will ever be cleaned up and at some point a resource limit will be exceeded and the system will hang. Also, this problem isn't just confined to HP-UX systems because as Steve notes, "a program crash or termination without normal exiting will leave the temporary files." on a Windows system. Event if this problem is rare it is still a bug and I suspect there are conditions and situations on all platforms where the scheduled clean up doesn't occur. So how can the bug be fixed? A simple fix would be to add Steve Landers' clean up script to tclkit and execute it once at start up. This approach could be limited to HP-UX (to avoid unknown interactions) or could be extended to include other platforms such as Windows. The decision about whether to do a clean on a platform could either be handled in the script itself (e.g. Steve's script) or at tclkit compile time for the platform. If a robust clean up script can be developed then it might be possible to use a pre-clean strategy for shared objects on all platforms and eliminate the current post-clean strategy (which isn't robust). Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Fri May 23 15:00:23 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NK0MN22114 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:00:22 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E0A483AEA for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:01:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 22:01:00 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit bug and RFC on suggested fix Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3ECE793E.7725415@motorola.com> Message-Id: <466329F2-8D59-11D7-8877-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom Krehbiel wrote: [...] > the problem should be considered a tclkit bug that needs to > fixed. > > To justify the above statement, do the following on an HP-UX > system. > > % tclkit > % package require Tk > 8.4 > % exit > % > > This is certainly a reasonable thing to do, but currently there > is no hope that the file placed in the /var/tmp directory will > ever be cleaned up and at some point a resource limit will be > exceeded and the system will hang. [...] > So how can the bug be fixed? > > A simple fix would be to add Steve Landers' clean up script to [...] Another option is to revert to what tclkit did in its initial 8.2 days, pre VFS-in-the-core: come up with a unique path, and put dll's there. This is what Matt Newman originally implemented. It does leave files around, but at most one copy of each. In fact, it has a valuable property that the unpacked files act as cache, avoiding the unpack step next time around. One way to generate the unique path is as the md5 sum of the full path to the dll (i.e. inside the mounted starkit, all the way into VFS). As long as starkits don't move, this generates a unique md5. And loads from two different starkits will not clash. Note that md5 is not part of tclkit itself anymore, though crc32 is (in zlib). There's the pure-Tcl md5 if needed. It needs some care to prevent malicious hijacking, which can be solved by including the effective [uid] in the path, and sealing that dir off for others (more refined: giving it the same permissions as the dir where the starkit lives from which a DLL is being copied). Such code is no doubt best written in Tcl, and IMO should become part of tclkit (though one could easily test with an override of the load command in the starkit/starpack itself). It then becomes a policy choice as to whether that caching style is used. Another policy, would be Steve's. Yet another could try to hook exit, and do things. None of this will be 100%, but then again that's pretty hard when the app is not allowed to delete a shared lib while in use. Win32 plays tricks with batch files, and one can play self-relaunch games, or start a watchdog which periodically tries to clean up, but it may all be more trouble than it's worth. I guess it all depends. -jcw From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri May 23 15:05:41 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NK5eN22533 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:05:40 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:06:21 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2NFMHSNB>; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:06:21 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] tclkit bug and RFC on suggested fix Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 15:06:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > To refresh everyone's memory, the HP-UX os won't allow a file > that has been loaded at run time to be deleted until the > process has exited. This prevents a tclkit application from > cleaning up shared object that are written out from the > internal vfs to /var/tmp so that can be loaded. > > Steve Landers kindly provided a clean up procedure (see enclosed > file) that remove files from the /var/tmp directory which > were left behind by other processes or previous invocations. > This work-a-round is an ugly patch on an other wise beautiful > system ... I think this is a problem with the VFS, and not with Tclkit per-se. I was trying to debug this on one of our HP systems about a month ago. I was able to stumble through Tcl_FSLoadFile() in tclIOUtil.c, which I think is part of Tcl VFS that moved into the core. This routine appears to set up exit handlers which should be able to unload and delete the shared library, but I didn't have time to track everything down. It looked to me as if the cleanup handlers were never called - which would be a VFS bug. Has anybody on this list worked closely with the VFS code? Am I interpreting its behavior correctly? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri May 23 16:40:50 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NLeoN30977 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:40:50 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h4NLfRBb002313; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:41:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h4NLfPir013999; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:41:25 -0500 Message-ID: <3ECE9585.654A3A3F@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:41:25 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com, Jeff Hobbs Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit bug and RFC on suggested fix References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rob, > > To refresh everyone's memory, the HP-UX os won't allow a file > > that has been loaded at run time to be deleted until the > > process has exited. This prevents a tclkit application from > > cleaning up shared object that are written out from the > > internal vfs to /var/tmp so that can be loaded. > > > > Steve Landers kindly provided a clean up procedure (see enclosed > > file) that remove files from the /var/tmp directory which > > were left behind by other processes or previous invocations. > > This work-a-round is an ugly patch on an other wise beautiful > > system ... > > I think this is a problem with the VFS, and not with Tclkit per-se. I think your right, I forgot the vfs stuff had been move to the tcl core. This problem needs to be addressed by the tcl core team. > I was trying to debug this on one of our HP systems about a month ago. I > was able to stumble through Tcl_FSLoadFile() in tclIOUtil.c, which I think > is part of Tcl VFS that moved into the core. This routine appears to set up > exit handlers which should be able to unload and delete the shared library, > but I didn't have time to track everything down. It looked to me as if the > cleanup handlers were never called - which would be a VFS bug. My understanding is that on HP-UX (and I think Windows) the cleanup handler isn't called because the os wouldn't allow the file to be deleted and therefore would produce an error. Tom Krehbiel From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri May 23 16:47:09 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NLl9N31510 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:47:09 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:47:47 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2NFMHSR3>; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:47:46 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com, JeffH@ActiveState.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] tclkit bug and RFC on suggested fix Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 16:47:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > My understanding is that on HP-UX (and I think Windows) the > cleanup handler isn't called because the os wouldn't allow > the file to be deleted and therefore would produce an error. Not exactly. Deleting the file (by calling unlink()) returns a non-success status and sets ERRNO, but it doesn't halt the program. It might be an HP-UX specific thing that the cleanup proc is never called. I didn't get that deep in to it. I could just tell that my "printf" in the cleanup proc never got called. I also haven't had a chance to try loading the library, then unloading and unlinking, just to see if it is possible for HP-UX to unload and delete a temp file. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From bryan@bitmover.com Sat May 24 18:45:35 2003 Received: from pimout1-ext.prodigy.net (pimout1-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.77]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4ONjYN04163 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 18:45:35 -0500 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-66-141-207-105.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.141.207.105]) by pimout1-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h4ONkIPg049222; Sat, 24 May 2003 19:46:18 -0400 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 18:46:17 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Andrew Chang To: Starkit From: Bryan Oakley Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] problems building tclkit on netbsd Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: We're trying to build tclkit on netbsd and are getting the following error during "genkit D" step. Anyone know what the cause of this error message might be? I'm not at all familiar with netbsd or the nuts and bolts of the build process. ============= /bin/sh genkit D info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} tclkit_version = 200303.001 tcl_platform(byteOrder) = littleEndian tcl_platform(machine) = i386 tcl_platform(os) = NetBSD tcl_platform(osVersion) = 1.5 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 package Itcl = 3.3 couldn't load file "install/netbsd.bitmover.com/lib/libtk84.so": install/netbsd.bitmover.com/lib/libtk84.so: Undefined PLT symbol "XOpenDisplay" (reloc type = 7, symnum = 532) running dummy-netbsd.bitmover.com -- Bryan Oakley bryan at bitmover dot com From jcw@equi4.com Mon May 26 17:02:44 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4QM2iN24848 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:02:44 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5219F83AEA for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:03:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 00:03:22 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] problems building tclkit on netbsd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan Oakley wrote: > We're trying to build tclkit on netbsd and are getting the following > error during "genkit D" step. Anyone know what the cause of this error > message might be? I'm not at all familiar with netbsd or the nuts and > bolts of the build process. > > > ============= > /bin/sh genkit D > info loaded = {{} zlib} {{} vfs} {{} rechan} {{} pwb} {{} Mk4tcl} > tclkit_version = 200303.001 > tcl_platform(byteOrder) = littleEndian > tcl_platform(machine) = i386 > tcl_platform(os) = NetBSD > tcl_platform(osVersion) = 1.5 > tcl_platform(platform) = unix > tcl_platform(user) = > tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 > package Itcl = 3.3 > couldn't load file "install/netbsd.bitmover.com/lib/libtk84.so": > install/netbsd.bitmover.com/lib/libtk84.so: > Undefined PLT symbol "XOpenDisplay" (reloc type = 7, symnum = 532) > running dummy-netbsd.bitmover.com Dunno - has been reported before. Also, google gives: http://mail-index.netbsd.org/netbsd-help/2000/09/24/0003.html My hunch is that on NetBSD another X11 -l option needs to be added. Tclkit 8.4.1 build at the time seems to have built properly. Newer C? Newer X? -jcw From david@larochelle-innovation.com Wed May 28 02:30:54 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4S7UqN10126 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 02:30:53 -0500 Received: from david.nerim.net (unknown [177.2.177.1]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 434744800D for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 09:31:35 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 09:31:34 +0200 From: David Zolli To: Starkit list Message-Id: <20030528093134.00000470.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.11claws (GTK+ 1.3.0; Win32) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp\e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Custom tclkit.ico Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Under win98 SE I tried to change starpack icon. Each time I got this message: customizing tclkit.ico in executable icon 32x32/16: replaced icon 16x16/16: replaced icon 32x32/256: NOT FOUND icon 48x48/256: NOT FOUND icon 48x48/16: NOT FOUND icon 16x16/256: NOT FOUND updates applied I tried with a lot of icon files, downloaded or done by myself. All have the six required resolutions in it. An idea? -- David Zolli From bryan@bitmover.com Wed May 28 14:32:15 2003 Received: from pimout3-ext.prodigy.net (pimout3-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4SJWEN19168 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:32:15 -0500 Received: from bitmover.com (adsl-66-141-207-105.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.141.207.105]) by pimout3-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h4SJX3J9055600 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:33:04 -0400 Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 14:33:03 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Bryan Oakley To: Starkit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <32E82058-9143-11D7-BE76-000393A78FA0@bitmover.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] aix tclkit core dump on exit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anybody seen the problem where a tclkit core dumps on exit? I've got a problem like that, but not exactly like that :-) I'm building a custom tclkit with a few missing pieces (no itcl, itcldyn or tkdyn) so it's not quite a real tclkit (*). I finally got it to build on AIX and it seems to run fine. When it exists, however, I always get "Illegal instruction (core dumped)". Has anyone seen this before on any other platform? (*) Why? Because a stock tclkit won't compile on all our platforms and this pared down version seems to do a little better in that regard. I'm just in the investigatory stage of trying to figure out if we can use tclkits but some platforms are giving me fits. --bryan From jcw@equi4.com Thu May 29 16:34:28 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4TLYRN28671 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 16:34:28 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B49FB83AEA; Thu, 29 May 2003 17:35:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 23:35:10 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit list To: "EXT-St. John, Phillip E" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: <455F11A22AE1004CA28BE0B7BA686B12081A87@XCH-MW-13.mw.nos.boeing.com> Message-Id: <6C7213DE-921D-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] Re: Problems building a StarKit on Solaris 5.6 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: EXT-St. John, Phillip E wrote: (forwarded to mailing list) > I am running with an old version of Solaris, and I wonder if anyone > has bothered to create a TclKit for version 5.6? The Solaris kit that > is offered in the archive does NOT work with this early version. > However, it seems to work fine with 5.8 (and beyond perhaps). > >> uname -a > SunOS cmsu3 5.6 Generic_105181-20 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-5_10 > > When I download and try to generate the kit myself, everything goes > smooth until I get to "sh genkit B". Then I get output like: > > 133 /home/m411120/temp/genkit > sh genkit B vfs > vfs: > sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok > make binaries ... FAILED: > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > =-=-=-=-=- > make binaries > -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- > #-#-#-#-#- > ERROR: child process exited abnormally > Done. > > > When I look in the output directory, I get something like this at the > end of the vfs file: > > (...) > checking for tclsh... (cached) > /home/m411120/temp/genkit/build/cmsu3/tcl/tclsh > creating ./config.status > creating Makefile > > RUN: make binaries > > make: Fatal error: Don't know how to make target `vfs.o' > > ERROR: child process exited abnormally > while executing > "run $X(make) binaries" > ("vfs" arm line 3) > invoked from within > "switch $target { > > tcl { > config tcl/$X(unix) --disable-shared > #run $X(make) genstubs > run $X(make) binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS= CC_SEARC..." > > Note that vfs is not the only part that I have trouble with. I'm > getting similar output for kitsh and itcldyn. I would appreciate any > suggestions you might have on this matter. I think this is a matter of using gmake instead of make. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu May 29 17:49:58 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4TMnvN02751 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 17:49:57 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-2.00) with ESMTP id h4TMoeVr013947 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:50:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h4TMoeX20637; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:50:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 18:50:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030529185040.AAB20624@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: Problems building a StarKit on Solaris 5.6 In-Reply-To: <6C7213DE-921D-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> of Thu, 29 May 2003 23:35:10 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Note that at least two people on the list build for Solaris 5.6 (because I am one of them) and I think that ActiveState builds there too. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From dgroth@gmx.de Mon Jun 2 05:58:54 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h52AwrN12944 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 05:58:54 -0500 Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 05:58:54 -0500 Message-Id: <200306021058.h52AwrN12944@trixie.triqs.com> Received: (qmail 20202 invoked by uid 65534); 2 Jun 2003 10:59:41 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp022) with SMTP; 02 Jun 2003 12:59:41 +0200 From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello! Finally I found a cxx compiler on a machine in our network. So I tried to build tclkit with cxx instead of my former approach using gcc and failing at X11 linking. everything went well until: dgroth@marvin:/project/amphioxus/src> tclsh8.4 genkit B zlib: sh /amd/schnuppi/3/project/amp... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok kitsh: cc -c -I. -I/amd/schnuppi/3/pr... ok cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... FAILED: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/lib -ltcl8.4 -lm -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- ERROR: child process exited abnormally itcldyn: sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok make binaries ITCL_LIBRARY= ... ok make install-binaries ... ok tkdyn: sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok make install-binaries ... ok Done. If I jump into: build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/kitsh and execute: dgroth@marvin:/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/kitsh> cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/lib -ltcl8.4 -lm ld (prelink): ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTI11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZNK11c4_Strategy7IsValidEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTI9c4_Stream: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTS11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTS9c4_Stream: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(store.o): _ZTI11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(store.o): _ZTI11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(store.o): _ZTS11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(store.o): _ZTS11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(fileio.o): _ZTI11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(fileio.o): _ZTI9c4_Stream: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(fileio.o): _ZTS11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(fileio.o): _ZTS9c4_Stream: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(handler.o): _ZTI11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(handler.o): _ZTS11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZN10c4_Handler6DefineEiPPKh: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZN10c4_Handler9FlipBytesEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZN10c4_Handler13GetNthMemoColEib: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZNK10c4_Handler12IsPersistentEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZN10c4_Handler8UnmappedEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZN10c4_Handler10HasSubviewEi: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZNK13c4_HandlerSeq11NumHandlersEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZNK13c4_HandlerSeq10NthHandlerEi: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZNK13c4_HandlerSeq14HandlerContextEi: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTI10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTI13c4_HandlerSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTS13c4_HandlerSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTI11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTS10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTS11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTI13c4_DerivedSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTS13c4_DerivedSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTI11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTS11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(remap.o): _ZTI15c4_CustomViewer: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZNK13c4_HandlerSeq10NthHandlerEi: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZNK13c4_HandlerSeq14HandlerContextEi: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTI10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTI13c4_HandlerSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTS13c4_HandlerSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTI11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTS10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(custom.o): _ZTS11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTI13c4_DerivedSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTS13c4_DerivedSeq: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTI11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(derived.o): _ZTS11c4_Sequence: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(remap.o): _ZTI15c4_CustomViewer: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(remap.o): _ZTS15c4_CustomViewer: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZN10c4_Handler13GetNthMemoColEib: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZN10c4_Handler9FlipBytesEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZN10c4_Handler10HasSubviewEi: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZN10c4_Handler6DefineEiPPKh: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZN10c4_Handler8UnmappedEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZTI10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZTS10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined Unresolved: _Unwind_Resume _ZdaPv _ZdlPv _Znwm _ZTVN10__cxxabiv120__si_class_type_infoE _ZTVN10__cxxabiv117__class_type_infoE __gxx_personality_v0 _Znam __cxa_pure_virtual does not lead to a result: reading http://www.equi4.com/233 - Tclkit Tru64 notes I tried: dgroth@marvin:/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/kitsh> cxx -v -non_shared -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/lib -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/tkdyn -ltcl8.4 -lm -ltk8.4 -lX11 -ldnet_stub /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/ld -cxxsyms -o kitsh -non_shared -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/lib -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/tkdyn -g0 -O1 -L/usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/ /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/crt0.o /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/_main.o pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a -ltcl8.4 -lm -ltk8.4 -lX11 -ldnet_stub /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/libcxxstd.a /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/libcxx.a -lexc -lc /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/ld: 0.01u 0.04s 0:00 45% 0+42k 1+4io 0pf+0w 42stk+6120mem ld (prelink): ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTI11c4_Strategy: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZNK11c4_Strategy7IsValidEv: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTI9c4_Stream: weak symbol multiply defined ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(format.o): _ZTS10c4_Handler: weak symbol multiply defined Can't locate file for: -ltk8.4 /usr/lib/cmplrs/cxx/V6.3-008/ld: 0.02u 0.04s 0:00 66% 0+54k 0+0io 0pf+0w 54stk+8720mem does also not help. I think I need a libtk8.4.a but how to create one ? It would be really great to have tclkit also on the DEC-Alphas. regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235 Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Mon Jun 2 09:52:20 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h52EqJN01061 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 09:52:20 -0500 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9022075.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.32.117]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr11) with ESMTP id h52ErAKT018940 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:53:11 +0200 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id 73DB928A4F; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:44:51 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id 6943E30327 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:44:51 +0200 (MEST) Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:44:51 +0200 (MEST) From: Harald Oehlmann X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Starpack error: view index is out of range Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dear list, sdx.kit: 2003-03-14 tclkit-win32.upx.exe: 8.4.2.1 2003-01-17 tclkitsh-win32.upx.exe: 2003-01-17 after packing a starpack with: tclkitsh sdx.kit elmiport.exe -runtime tclkit.exe I get the startup error in a tk_messagebox: Title: Error in TclKit Message: view index is out of range . This happens already in the initialisation of the starpack and is independent on the main.tcl file (anyway only the starpack initialisation runs). It looks like this depends on the packed data (around 400kb). Could anybody me guide to a reason for this? Harald From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jun 2 15:30:00 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h52KTxN30146 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 15:29:59 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85ED383AEA for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:30:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 22:30:46 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200306021058.h52AwrN12944@trixie.triqs.com> Message-Id: <17047C1A-9539-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > Finally I found a cxx compiler on a machine in our network. So I tried > to build tclkit with cxx instead of my former approach using gcc and > failing at X11 linking. [...] > kitsh: > cc -c -I. -I/amd/schnuppi/3/pr... ok > cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... FAILED: > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > =-=-=-= > cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o > ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a > ../zlib/libz.a > -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/ > lib -ltcl8.4 -lm > -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- > #-#-#-# [...] > ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTI11c4_Strategy: weak symbol > multiply defined I'm assuming these are not show stoppers... > Unresolved: > _Unwind_Resume > _ZdaPv > _ZdlPv > _Znwm > _ZTVN10__cxxabiv120__si_class_type_infoE > _ZTVN10__cxxabiv117__class_type_infoE > __gxx_personality_v0 > _Znam > __cxa_pure_virtual But these are :( > does not lead to a result: > reading http://www.equi4.com/233 - Tclkit Tru64 notes I tried: > > dgroth@marvin:/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/kitsh> > cxx -v -non_shared -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o > tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a > ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a > -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/ > lib > -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/ > tkdyn -ltcl8.4 -lm -ltk8.4 -lX11 -ldnet_stub Omit -ltk8.4 - reason: kitsh is a tclsh equivalent. Tk is stored as shared library in VFS. That extension has already been built (genkit B tkdyn). > does also not help. I think I need a libtk8.4.a but how to create one ? If you really want Tk linked in statically, which may get you past the X11 linkage issues, then you should try: genkit B tk kit Let me explain: "genkit B" is shorthand for "genkit B zlib vfs mk kitsh itcldyn tkdyn". Each build a subsystem, in that order, "genkit B kitsh" builds a tclsh-equivalent, i.e. *with* Tcl but *without* Tk. You can still build a static "kit", which is a tclsh-with-tk. In both cases, Tk is treated as any other extension. IOW, whether you launch tclkitsh or tclkit makes no difference: it will start up as tclsh, *not* wish. In kitsh, "package require Tk" will look for a shared extension, i.e. "tkdyn" called Tk (which may or may not be present), whereas in kit, Tk is statically linked in, so the package require will always be resolved without loading anything extra. > It would be really great to have tclkit also on the DEC-Alphas. Well, first of all: are there builds of tclkit older than 8.4.2 which fit your needs? I definitely remember building tclkit for Tru64 several times in the past. If not, delete the build/ directory and type: genkit B zlib vfs mk itcl tk kit If that completes, you can create a working tclkit by replacing genkit steps D end E with: cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.kit >mytclkit chmod +x mytclkit -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jun 2 15:41:03 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h52Kf2N30724 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 15:41:02 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E318C83AEA for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 16:41:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 22:41:49 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack error: view index is out of range Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Harald Oehlmann wrote: > sdx.kit: 2003-03-14 The SDX version ID can be extracted with "tclkitsh sdx.kit version". I get: 2003/03/06 11:59:36 56635-48537 > tclkit-win32.upx.exe: 8.4.2.1 2003-01-17 > tclkitsh-win32.upx.exe: 2003-01-17 > > after packing a starpack with: > tclkitsh sdx.kit elmiport.exe -runtime tclkit.exe > I get the startup error in a tk_messagebox: > Title: Error in TclKit > Message: view index is out of range > . > > This happens already in the initialisation of the starpack and is > independent on the main.tcl file (anyway only the starpack > initialisation > runs). It looks like this depends on the packed data (around 400kb). > > Could anybody me guide to a reason for this? It's a failure message which in past was an indication of a mixup between versions of tclkit and sdx, but I don't see how this can be the case here. It was hard to track down back then, because the error happens before the starkit scripts have control. You're going to have to drill down to solve this, I'm afraid: - does tclkit start ok by itself? - try wrapping a mini main.tcl with just a "puts hello" or some such You say that it depends on the pack data. It may be that there is a conflict of what is in your starkit input dir and what Tclkit itself uses. Try unpacking tclkit: copy tclkit.exe kcopy.exe sdx unwrap kcopy.exe Then compare the files in kcopy.vfs/ and elmiport.vfs/ and see if anything conflicts which might prevent the result from starting up properly. Or maybe it's something unexpected happening too early on in processing. Add puts calls to see how far startup actually succeeds (you'll have to tweak this since puts gets lost with tclkit on win32: i.e. puts to file, or use GUI calls). -jcw From dgroth@gmx.de Tue Jun 3 02:59:05 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h537x4N00465 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 02:59:04 -0500 Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 02:59:04 -0500 Message-Id: <200306030759.h537x4N00465@trixie.triqs.com> Received: (qmail 2009 invoked by uid 65534); 3 Jun 2003 07:59:51 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp007) with SMTP; 03 Jun 2003 09:59:51 +0200 From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: jcw@equi4.com CC: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <17047C1A-9539-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> (message from Jean-Claude Wippler on Mon, 2 Jun 2003 22:30:46 +0200) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed References: <17047C1A-9539-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Indeed the following procedure succeeds almost: mkdir tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2 cd tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2 wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit # using gcc instead of cxx because cxx tclkit gives after the same procedure # a core dump. gcc is 3.0.4 perl -i.bak -ne 'if (/OSF/) { print " OSF1 { array set X {gcc gcc g++ g++} }\n"} else { print }' genkit tclsh8.4 genkit A tclsh8.4 genkit B tcl tclsh8.4 genkit B zlib vfs mk itcl tk kit cd tars/ wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit cd .. cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.kit > mytclkit chmod 755 mytclkit ./mytclkit it runs, no missing X if package require Tk!!!! I could even run a large Kit with BWidget1.6.0, ctext, iniparse inbuild! The resulting executable is surprisingly small 2.5 MB. I thougth X was statically linked. However still one problem resits: It is not possible to load Itcl: % package require Itcl couldn't load library "/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2/mytclkit/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so": no such file or directory So I can't use Wikit! I think we are almost done ... please help! regards, Detlef >Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > >> Finally I found a cxx compiler on a machine in our network. So I tried >> to build tclkit with cxx instead of my former approach using gcc and >> failing at X11 linking. >[...] >> kitsh: >> cc -c -I. -I/amd/schnuppi/3/pr... ok >> cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o z... FAILED: >> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- >> =-=-=-= >> cxx -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o >> ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a >> ../zlib/libz.a >> -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/ >> lib -ltcl8.4 -lm >> -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- >> #-#-#-# >[...] >> ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(viewx.o): _ZTI11c4_Strategy: weak symbol >> multiply defined > >I'm assuming these are not show stoppers... > >> Unresolved: >> _Unwind_Resume >> _ZdaPv >> _ZdlPv >> _Znwm >> _ZTVN10__cxxabiv120__si_class_type_infoE >> _ZTVN10__cxxabiv117__class_type_infoE >> __gxx_personality_v0 >> _Znam >> __cxa_pure_virtual > >But these are :( > >> does not lead to a result: >> reading http://www.equi4.com/233 - Tclkit Tru64 notes I tried: >> >> dgroth@marvin:/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/kitsh> >> cxx -v -non_shared -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o >> tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4.a ../vfs/libvfs1.2.a >> ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a >> -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/install/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/ >> lib >> -L/amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphioxus/src/build/marvin.molgen.mpg.de/ >> tkdyn -ltcl8.4 -lm -ltk8.4 -lX11 -ldnet_stub > >Omit -ltk8.4 - reason: kitsh is a tclsh equivalent. Tk is stored as >shared library in VFS. That extension has already been built (genkit B >tkdyn). > >> does also not help. I think I need a libtk8.4.a but how to create one ? > >If you really want Tk linked in statically, which may get you past the >X11 linkage issues, then you should try: > genkit B tk kit > >Let me explain: "genkit B" is shorthand for "genkit B zlib vfs mk kitsh >itcldyn tkdyn". Each build a subsystem, in that order, "genkit B >kitsh" builds a tclsh-equivalent, i.e. *with* Tcl but *without* Tk. >You can still build a static "kit", which is a tclsh-with-tk. > >In both cases, Tk is treated as any other extension. IOW, whether you >launch tclkitsh or tclkit makes no difference: it will start up as >tclsh, *not* wish. > >In kitsh, "package require Tk" will look for a shared extension, i.e. >"tkdyn" called Tk (which may or may not be present), whereas in kit, Tk >is statically linked in, so the package require will always be resolved >without loading anything extra. > >> It would be really great to have tclkit also on the DEC-Alphas. > >Well, first of all: are there builds of tclkit older than 8.4.2 which >fit your needs? I definitely remember building tclkit for Tru64 >several times in the past. > >If not, delete the build/ directory and type: > genkit B zlib vfs mk itcl tk kit > >If that completes, you can create a working tclkit by replacing genkit >steps D end E with: > cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.kit >mytclkit > chmod +x mytclkit > >-jcw > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235 Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jun 3 04:23:27 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h539NRN08540 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 04:23:27 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BB7683B12 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 05:24:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:24:15 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200306030759.h537x4N00465@trixie.triqs.com> Message-Id: <24E25AE6-95A5-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > Indeed the following procedure succeeds almost: > mkdir tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2 > cd tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2 > wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit > # using gcc instead of cxx because cxx tclkit gives after the same > procedure > # a core dump. gcc is 3.0.4 > perl -i.bak -ne 'if (/OSF/) { print " OSF1 { array set X {gcc gcc > g++ g++} }\n"} else { print }' genkit > tclsh8.4 genkit A > tclsh8.4 genkit B tcl > tclsh8.4 genkit B zlib vfs mk itcl tk kit > cd tars/ > wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit > cd .. > cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.kit > mytclkit > chmod 755 mytclkit > > ./mytclkit > > it runs, no missing X if package require Tk!!!! > I could even run a large Kit with BWidget1.6.0, ctext, iniparse > inbuild! > The resulting executable is surprisingly small 2.5 MB. I thougth X was > statically linked. > > However still one problem resits: It is not possible to load Itcl: Ah, oops. I see that genkit no longer works properly for static builds. Please fetch a new copy from the website (pub/tk/tars/ dir), it should be fixed now. I am not sure how static your link is - you could see whether X11 is indeed linked in statically with "ldd". Note that there is some disadvantages to static-linked Tk w/ X11: such a binary will not startup on systems which have no X11 installed, and in some cases X11 will not properly support locale's and input methods. These were the reasons to abandon this approach for general builds, but apart from that it should work just fine... Once things build and work properly, could you do a "genkit C" and send me the result-*.tar.gz file? It has all the build logs and the intermediate build binaries from which I can generate a tclkit myself for adding to the collection. -jcw From dgroth@gmx.de Tue Jun 3 05:28:03 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h53AS2N14233 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 05:28:02 -0500 Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 05:28:02 -0500 Message-Id: <200306031028.h53AS2N14233@trixie.triqs.com> Received: (qmail 30005 invoked by uid 65534); 3 Jun 2003 10:28:50 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp008) with SMTP; 03 Jun 2003 12:28:50 +0200 From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: jcw@equi4.com CC: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <24E25AE6-95A5-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> (message from Jean-Claude Wippler on Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:24:15 +0200) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed References: <24E25AE6-95A5-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Now it works: the whoole procedure becuase it might work also on other platforms like netbsd!! dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src> mkdir tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3 dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src> cd tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3 dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit --11:36:35-- http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit => `genkit' Connecting to www.equi4.com:80... connected! HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK Length: 23,287 [text/plain] 0K -> .......... .......... .. [100%] 11:36:36 (37.04 KB/s) - `genkit' saved [23287/23287] dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> perl -i.bak -ne 'if (/OSF/) { print " OSF1 { array set X {gcc gcc g++ g++} }\n"} else { print }' genkit dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> ls genkit genkit.bak dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> tclsh8.4 genkit A fetching tars/tcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz fetching tars/tk.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz fetching tars/itcl.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/itcl.tar.gz fetching tars/mk.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/mk.tar.gz fetching tars/vfs.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/vfs.tar.gz fetching tars/kit.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/kit.tar.gz fetching tars/zlib.tar.gz ... ok unpacking tars/zlib.tar.gz dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> tclsh8.4 genkit B tcl tcl: sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok make install-binaries install-... ok /amd/schnuppi/3/project/amphio... ok Done. dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> tclsh8.4 genkit B zlib vfs mk itcl tk kit zlib: sh /amd/schnuppi/3/project/amp... ok make libz.a ... ok vfs: sh ../../../src/vfs/configure ... ok make binaries ... ok mk: sh ../../../src/mk/unix/config... ok make libmk4tcl.la ... ok itcl: sh ../../../src/itcl/itcl/conf... ok make binaries ITCL_LIBRARY= ... ok tk: sh ../../../src/tk/unix/config... ok make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS=... ok kit: gcc -c -I. -I/amd/schnuppi/3/p... ok g++ -o kit pwb.o kitInit.o zli... ok strip kit ... ok ls -l /amd/schnuppi/3/project/... ok Done. dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> cd tars dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3/tars> wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit --12:07:25-- http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit => `runtime.kit' Connecting to www.equi4.com:80... connected! HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK Length: 245,528 [application/octet-stream] 0K -> .......... .......... .......... .......... .......... [ 20%] 50K -> .......... .......... .......... .......... .......... [ 41%] 100K -> .......... .......... .......... .......... .......... [ 62%] 150K -> .......... .......... .......... .......... .......... [ 83%] 200K -> .......... .......... .......... ......... [100%] 12:07:28 (136.39 KB/s) - `runtime.kit' saved [245528/245528] dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3/tars> cd .. dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.kit > mytclkit dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> chmod 755 mytclkit dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> ./mytclkit % package require Itcl 3.3 % package require Tk 8.4 % exit dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> ldd mytclkit libX11.so () => /usr/shlib/libX11.so libstdc++.so (3.0) => /usr/local/lib/libstdc++.so libm.so (osf.1) => /usr/shlib/libm.so libgcc_s.so.1 (gcc.1) => /usr/local/lib/libgcc_s.so.1 libc.so (osf.1) => /usr/shlib/libc.so Seems that X11 is dynamic. I don't understand why if tkdyn is used dynamic x is missing and if static tk is used dynamic X is there ? My test application, a kit which depends on and includes BWidget, ctext, iniparse, itcl, Wikit, gbutton runs smoothly!! The resultfile is at: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/result-homer.molgen.mpg.de.tar.gz The executable is at: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/tclkit-dec-alphastatic.gz build system was: Digital UNIX V4.0D compiler: gcc 3.0.4 The older true64 builds on 5.1 gave me always a core dump like my own one build with cxx. tclkit is great and it was really the cause why I use tcl since some months (beside perl) continously. regards and thanks a lot. Detlef > chmod 755 mytclkit >X-Flags: 1001 >From: Jean-Claude Wippler >Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com >Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:24:15 +0200 >X-GMX-Antivirus: -2 (not scanned, virus scanner disabled) >X-GMX-Antispam: 0 (Mail was not recognized as spam) > >Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > >> Indeed the following procedure succeeds almost: >> mkdir tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2 >> cd tclkit-8.4.2-gcc2 >> wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/genkit >> # using gcc instead of cxx because cxx tclkit gives after the same >> procedure >> # a core dump. gcc is 3.0.4 >> perl -i.bak -ne 'if (/OSF/) { print " OSF1 { array set X {gcc gcc >> g++ g++} }\n"} else { print }' genkit >> tclsh8.4 genkit A >> tclsh8.4 genkit B tcl >> tclsh8.4 genkit B zlib vfs mk itcl tk kit >> cd tars/ >> wget http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit >> cd .. >> cat install/`hostname`/kit tars/runtime.kit > mytclkit >> chmod 755 mytclkit >> >> ./mytclkit >> >> it runs, no missing X if package require Tk!!!! >> I could even run a large Kit with BWidget1.6.0, ctext, iniparse >> inbuild! >> The resulting executable is surprisingly small 2.5 MB. I thougth X was >> statically linked. >> >> However still one problem resits: It is not possible to load Itcl: > >Ah, oops. I see that genkit no longer works properly for static >builds. Please fetch a new copy from the website (pub/tk/tars/ dir), >it should be fixed now. > >I am not sure how static your link is - you could see whether X11 is >indeed linked in statically with "ldd". Note that there is some >disadvantages to static-linked Tk w/ X11: such a binary will not >startup on systems which have no X11 installed, and in some cases X11 >will not properly support locale's and input methods. These were the >reasons to abandon this approach for general builds, but apart from >that it should work just fine... > >Once things build and work properly, could you do a "genkit C" and send >me the result-*.tar.gz file? It has all the build logs and the >intermediate build binaries from which I can generate a tclkit myself >for adding to the collection. > >-jcw > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235 Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jun 3 06:32:32 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h53BWWN19344 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 06:32:32 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0B5283B12 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 07:33:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 13:33:19 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200306031028.h53AS2N14233@trixie.triqs.com> Message-Id: <2CDED957-95B7-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > Now it works: > the whoole procedure becuase it might work also on other platforms like > netbsd!! [...] > dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> perl -i.bak > -ne 'if (/OSF/) { print " OSF1 { array set X {gcc gcc g++ g++} > }\n"} else { print }' genkit The above is no longer needed, genkit has been adjusted. [...] > dgroth@homer:/project/amphioxus/src/tclkit-8.4.2-gcc3> ldd mytclkit > libX11.so () => /usr/shlib/libX11.so > libstdc++.so (3.0) => /usr/local/lib/libstdc++.so > libm.so (osf.1) => /usr/shlib/libm.so > libgcc_s.so.1 (gcc.1) => /usr/local/lib/libgcc_s.so.1 > libc.so (osf.1) => /usr/shlib/libc.so > > Seems that X11 is dynamic. I don't understand why if tkdyn is used > dynamic x > is missing and if static tk is used dynamic X is there ? Me neither. The wonders of technology and the amazing success of the human race to make thing complex all the time... > My test application, a kit which depends on and includes BWidget, > ctext, iniparse, itcl, Wikit, gbutton runs smoothly!! Great. Thanks for persevering and for sharing the results. > The older true64 builds on 5.1 gave me always a core dump like my own > one build with cxx. I expect (hope!) that this is because 5.1 binaries may not be 100% compatible with 4.0 ... I've added your binary to the build collection, and have added a new page on www.equi4.com to describe the whole process since, as you say, it may indeed be of use to others who run into build/linkage trouble. Static builds turn out to be a useful fallback option. See http://www.equi4.com/admin/edit.cgi/284 -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jun 3 07:10:47 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h53CAiN22852 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 07:10:44 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BE0A83B12 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 08:11:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:11:31 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Build Alpha-Dec OSF1.0 4.0F with cxx failed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <2CDED957-95B7-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Message-Id: <82B874B2-95BC-11D7-8B73-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Whoops... > I've added your binary to the build collection, and have added a new > page on www.equi4.com to describe the whole process since, as you say, > it may indeed be of use to others who run into build/linkage trouble. > Static builds turn out to be a useful fallback option. > > See http://www.equi4.com/admin/edit.cgi/284 That one won't work for public use. This is the one I meant: http://www.equi4.com/284 -jcw From Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk Wed Jun 4 08:59:16 2003 Received: from newpost.lewisham.gov.uk (newpost.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.199.153]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h54DxFN07327 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 08:59:16 -0500 Received: from lmx.lewisham.gov.uk (lmx.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.207.18]) by newpost.lewisham.gov.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA64074 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 14:48:54 +0100 Received: by lmx.lewisham.gov.uk(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.7 (934.1 12-30-1999)) id 80256D3B.004C5967 ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 14:53:47 +0100 X-Lotus-FromDomain: LEWISHAM From: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <80256D3B.004C53F4.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2003 14:53:41 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Starkit] Is it possible to "join" views? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is it possible (or planned) to join views in a "select"? Regards, =Adrian= From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jun 4 12:50:04 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h54Ho4N27136 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 12:50:04 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h54HowiU007728; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 10:50:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h54HoBqc022547; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 12:50:53 -0500 Message-ID: <3EDE3153.516031E7@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Jun 2003 10:50:11 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is it possible to "join" views? References: <80256D3B.004C53F4.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian, > Is it possible (or planned) to join views in a "select"? I believe the answer is yes for tcl code, but I haven't had time to try it out. The problem is documentation, I've looked at the C code and found the commands but I haven't found much in the way of documentation. Take a look at the following http://mini.net/tcl/8866 I think Python may also exposes this functionality. Tom K. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jun 4 12:55:31 2003 Received: from motgate6.mot.com ([144.189.100.106]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h54HtVN27707 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 12:55:31 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate6.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate6) with ESMTP id h54HuPj5012691; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 10:56:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h54HtZqc026905; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 12:56:25 -0500 Message-ID: <3EDE3296.C72687DC@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Jun 2003 10:55:34 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Is it possible to "join" views? References: <80256D3B.004C53F4.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian, > Is it possible (or planned) to join views in a "select"? Oops, egg on my face. Apparently there is now oomk which has good documentation. Home page: http://www.equi4.com/oomk Documentation: http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/oomk.kit/lib/app-oomk/oomk.txt Tom K. From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Jun 4 15:28:40 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net [216.34.191.35]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h54KSeN07980 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 15:28:40 -0500 Received: from int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-2 [3.159.232.66]) by ext-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.9/030701) with ESMTP id h54KTRlL000817 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 16:29:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef03.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h54KTLxe024169 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 2003 16:29:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlvem02.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.52]) by cinmlef03.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6673); Wed, 4 Jun 2003 16:29:20 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2003 16:29:20 -0400 Message-ID: <1641ACF0F83E85439EEA3278A5F5482A10E25412@CINMLVEM02.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Is it possible to "join" views? Thread-Index: AcMqwtMkBBGuobMATIWHg4snYGtjHwAD+QDg From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jun 2003 20:29:20.0744 (UTC) FILETIME=[FA9D1680:01C32AD7] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h54KSeN07980 Subject: [Starkit] Core Dump On Exit With Mounted Zip Archive Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I think I might have found a bug concerning tclkit and mounted, embedded zip archives. I have kit that has imbedded zip archives, simular to following directory structure: myapp.vfs |--main.tcl |--lib |--app-myapp | |--myapp.tcl |--archive.zip In myapp.tcl, the zip archive is mounted as follows: set HOME $::starkit::topdir ; # application home directory set LIB [file join $HOME lib] ; # application lib directory ... vfs::zip::Mount [file join $LIB archive.zip] When wrap unwraped, I experience no problem. # tclkit myapp.vfs/main.tcl myapp done However, when I wrap myapp as a kit or pack I experience a problem when the kit exits. # tclkit sdx wrap myapp.vfs 123 updates applied # tclkit sdx wrap myapp.vfs -runtime tclkit-solaris 122 updates applied # sdx version sdx 2003/03/06 11:59:36 56635-48537 sdx # sdx version tclkit 2003/04/10 03:47:58 44230-54047 tclkit # sdx version tclkit-solaris 2003/04/10 03:47:58 44230-54047 tclkit-solaris # tclkit myapp.kit myapp done called Tcl_Close on channel with refCount > 0 Abort (core dumped) # file core core: ELF 32-bit MSB core file SPARC Version 1, from 'tclkit' # myapp myapp done called Tcl_Close on channel with refCount > 0 Abort (core dumped) # file core core: ELF 32-bit MSB core file SPARC Version 1, from 'myapp' If I move the zip archive out of kit and mount them as follows, then I experience no problems. vfs::zip::Mount /path/to/archive.zip The program runs normally with the embedded zip archive, it just core dumps on exit. This problem does not exists in the previous version of tclkit I was using. The program exits normally in both kit and pack forms where the older version of tclkit is used for the runtime prefix. # sdx version tclkit-841 2002/11/04 17:01:28 62229-29400 tclkit-841 # tclkit-841 myapp.kit myapp done I'm afraid this is all the debugging on core I can offer: (gdb) where #0 0x137204 in _libc_kill () #1 0x131e04 in abort () #2 0x944f8 in Tcl_PanicVA () #3 0x94524 in Tcl_Panic () #4 0x7f284 in Tcl_Close () #5 0x7dbbc in TclFinalizeIOSubsystem () #6 0x6c8c0 in Tcl_FinalizeThread () #7 0x6c74c in Tcl_Finalize () #8 0x6c498 in Tcl_Exit () #9 0x4edec in Tcl_ExitObjCmd () #10 0x49384 in TclEvalObjvInternal () #11 0x49c00 in Tcl_EvalEx () #12 0x49f48 in Tcl_Eval () #13 0x8e29c in Tcl_Main () #14 0x46fb0 in main () Has anyone else encountered this? -- bryan From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jun 5 08:16:46 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h55DGgN20483 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 08:16:44 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19NucR-0008B4-00 for ; Thu, 05 Jun 2003 15:17:27 +0200 Message-ID: <3EDF42BB.30201@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 05 Jun 2003 15:16:43 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1; MultiZilla v1.4.0.3J) Gecko/20030425 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit References: <2ehDa.462$Lw1.84372@news.uswest.net> <415cbd25.0306040540.72e9f325@posting.google.com> In-Reply-To: <415cbd25.0306040540.72e9f325@posting.google.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: Threaded Tclkit question ? (Fw) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: JCW asked me to copy it to the list, so here goes: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Having said that, I suspect that some tclkit initialization logic may > be incorrect for slave interpreters in a threaded build (maybe even in > any build). The logic for this is in the "boot.tcl" script, which is > run on startup. Actually, I'm running threaded tclkit and run threaded starpacks. There are some points worth remembering (maybe they should get wiki'fied? :). First of all there are many problems with threaded tclkit+starpacks, threaded Tcl is not as mature as should be yet, I guess someone from the Tcl core will agree with that. These were mostly tested on windows, but seem to be right on linux as well (no idea about other OSses): 1/ child threads and slave interpreters have access to all mk4 vfs archives - even when a thread/slave is created before the vfs is mounted (though it seems a bit strange to me) % vfs::mk4::Mount C:/bin/kit.exe C:/bin/kit.exe mk4vfs1 % glob C:/bin/kit.exe/* C:/bin/kit.exe/bin C:/bin/kit.exe/boot.tcl C:/bin/kit.exe/config.tcl C:/bin/kit.exe/lib % x eval {glob C:/bin/kit.exe/*} C:/bin/kit.exe/bin C:/bin/kit.exe/boot.tcl C:/bin/kit.exe/config.tcl C:/bin/kit.exe/lib % thread::send 1428 {glob C:/bin/kit.exe/*} C:/bin/kit.exe/bin C:/bin/kit.exe/boot.tcl C:/bin/kit.exe/config.tcl C:/bin/kit.exe/lib 2/ do *not* use source in child threads with vfs based files on Windows. there is a bug, which will show up sooner or later, and it will crash your app in initialization. instead, write your own source. rename source realsource proc ::source {f} { if {[catch {set fh [open $f r]; set b [read $fh]; close $fh} rc]} { return -code error -errorinfo $rc -errorcode $::errorCode $rc } set s [info script] info script $file if {[catch {uplevel 1 $b} rc]==1} { info script $s # the line below dumps errors in wish console catch {thread::send -async $mainthread [list puts $::errorInfo]} return -code error -errorinfo $rc -errorcode $::errorCode $rc } info script $s return $rc } 3/ thread 2.4 has a bug (Zoran already has that fixed in 2.5 AFAIR), which comes up in windows+wish, when you do thread::send -async, and it throws an error - no NULL theck on "stderr" handle. 4/ write a separate script that will initialize your child threads, then do (after replacing the source proc): thread::send $thread [list source [file join \ [file dirname [info script]] threadinit.tcl]] And then, instead of $starkit::topdir, use [info script]+file dirname to guess your current directory 5/ If you use package mechanism, send auto_path to child threads thread::send $thread [list set ::auto_path $::auto_path] I really suggest using package mechanism, since in larger projects, my starkits/starpacks come out of several directories, and then adding a bit more info in auto_path helps me work in such structures (they only "come together" into one lib/ directory in the starpacks). 6/ remember about a nasty bug in windows' socket handling in case you'd like to thread::transfer sockets. There's no real solution to that, yet, I work around this by using a small dll I wrote. Another option is to do close [socket -server {} 0] during child threads initialization. This is said to help, but I remember it not helping me with a lot of [fileevent] based sockets. I guess there's much more to consider... Anyway, my advice is that you try and keep away from threads. I only used those in two projects, and I already converted one of them to non-threaded. The other one is a communication server, which is designed to handle several hundred connections at once, so I decided to split the connections to threads (though there is a master thread that handles all the decisions :). -- WK From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Thu Jun 5 09:52:20 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h55EqJN27283 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 09:52:20 -0500 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD902202B.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.32.43]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr11) with ESMTP id h55ErC3V007439 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 16:53:13 +0200 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id CB85128A50; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 16:50:52 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id C0C5730B39 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 16:50:52 +0200 (MEST) Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2003 16:50:52 +0200 (MEST) From: harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack error: view index is out of range In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am back after some testing (thanks, jcw). The result is as follows (why ?): Platform: Windows XP Home, sdx.kit 2003-03-14, tclkit 8.4.2.1 2003-01-17 When I wrap the file: -main.tcl- console show puts "Hello" package require starkit set folder(StarMode) [starkit::startup] puts "Hello2" -EOF- I only get the output "Hello" If I modify the file as: -main.tcl- console show puts "Hello" package require starkit starkit::startup puts "Hello2" -EOF- I get Hello and Hello2 on the console. Similar with a big application. If I put away the brackets around the "starkit::startup" to catch the result, I get away the starkit initialisation error: View index is out of the range I have no idea why this happens but anyway, now it works. Thanks to any help. - Harald From larry@wildopensource.com Thu Jun 5 14:08:05 2003 Received: from smith-house.org (dsl.smith-house.MV.COM [207.22.21.36]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h55J85N18444 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 14:08:05 -0500 Received: from wildopensource.com (scraps.smith-house.org [207.22.48.150]) by smith-house.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h55IvCx00407 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 14:57:12 -0400 Message-ID: <3EDF9632.50400@wildopensource.com> Date: Thu, 05 Jun 2003 15:12:50 -0400 From: Larry Smith Organization: Wild Open Source, Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20021003 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Latest kitten.kit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've just downloaded the latest starkit/starpack software from equi4.com. I need the tls package, but sourcing kitten and then "package require tls" crashes with a "head not ELF format" error. It looks like it might be trying to load a .dll, even though my system is linux. Is this a known problem? Is there a workaround? regards, -- .-. .-. .---. .---. .-..-. | Wild Open Source Inc. | |__ / | \| |-< | |-< > / | "Making the bazaar just a `----'`-^-'`-'`-'`-'`-' `-' | little more commonplace." home: www.smith-house.org | work: www.wildopensource.com From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jun 5 19:06:42 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5606fN11045 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 19:06:42 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 750D583B12; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 20:07:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 02:07:30 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: david@larochelle-innovation.com To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] tclkit icon Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: David, all, I've just found out that tclkit 8.4.2 was not build with the right icon file (the exe does not have all the necessary resolutions, therefore they cannot be replaced by sdx when creating a starpack). I got confused by another build I did for a customer. I'll solve this by either fixing the current one, or when building a next release of tclkit.exe, but I just wanted to let you know that the problems you were seeing were caused by me... Sorry for not having caught this sooner. -jcw From steve@sole.prd.co.uk Wed Jun 11 05:34:28 2003 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (0@sole.prd.co.uk [193.117.57.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5BAYRN19884 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 05:34:27 -0500 Received: from sole.prd.co.uk (99@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sole.prd.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.0) with ESMTP id LAA04422 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 11:35:26 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200306111035.LAA04422@sole.prd.co.uk> To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 11:35:26 +0100 From: Steve Blinkhorn Subject: [Starkit] tclkit does not die gracefully on error Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: We have reports of a particular problem with a starkit-delivered application which we have so far been unable to replicate, but which we have talked users through remotely by phone so that they could recover. When some fatal error occurs (and otherwise there is nothing to link the cases that have been reported), the application crashes, but the tclkit process keeps running. Any attempt to restart the application from its shortcut on the desktop generates an error message reporting that main.tcl cannot be found. We imagine this really means that the other instance of tclkit has locked all or part of the starkit, so that it is inaccessible. To get the user going again it is necessary to kill the process from the task manager. All of this on Win32 anything from 95 to XP (and the users typically don't know which - they're salesmen). Has anyone had a comparable experience? Is this tclkit or starkit or Tcl/Tk in general? From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jun 11 17:34:35 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5BMYYN21883 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:34:34 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C42783B12 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 18:35:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:35:29 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <0155D4A0-9C5D-11D7-8345-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] oomk tweaks Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Thanks to comments by Steve Landers, I've been able to tidy up some loose ends in oomk, the Snit-based-OO-wrapper-around-MK. - access to subviews via the cursor should now work, i.e.: $foo loop c { $c(subview) as bar $bar loop d { ... } } - groupby was hitting a bug (needs ":V") in mk4too, oomk works around it - looping actually does something with break/continue/return now, and it no longer eats up errors but re-throws them outside the loop (whoops!) Latest kit at http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/ -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Thu Jun 12 10:40:56 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5CFerN04777 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 10:40:56 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 1716D52EA8; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 17:41:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C08B952D5E for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 17:41:53 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Starkit list Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 17:38:46 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200306121738.46435.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-19.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, today I tried to compile a tclkit on a skiffcluster (strong arm) and, although it took quite a while, it compiled without errors. Then I copied the tclkit to an ipaq with familiar linux (2.4.19) and it failed to run with: error while loading shared libraries: libstdc++-libc6.1-2.so.3: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory What can I do to get a working tclkit? I already downloaded a 8.4.1-tclkit and it works fine, but due to a bug in 8.4.1 I need 8.4.2. Apart from that I prefer tclkits built by myself. Any hints? Thank you all Ulrich From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jun 12 13:04:09 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5CI49N18215 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 13:04:09 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5CI52VD029164; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 11:05:02 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5CI52D2024975; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 11:05:02 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Ulrich Schoebel" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 11:04:58 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200306121738.46435.usus@aladyn.de> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > today I tried to compile a tclkit on a skiffcluster (strong arm) > and, although it took quite a while, it compiled without errors. > Then I copied the tclkit to an ipaq with familiar linux (2.4.19) > and it failed to run with: > error while loading shared libraries: libstdc++-libc6.1-2.so.3: > cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Ah, the evil C++ dependencies strike again! You basically need to make sure that libstdc++ is either statically linked into your executable (preferred if you plan to share it), or get the libstdc++ libraries for your Linux/ipaq machine. These are not part of a standard distro (much less an ipaq distro I imagine). Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Jun 12 13:22:09 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@your.unreality.com [65.119.55.185]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h5CIM9N20042 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 13:22:09 -0500 Received: (qmail 40640 invoked by uid 300); 12 Jun 2003 18:23:18 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Jun 2003 18:23:18 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 13:23:18 -0500 (CDT) From: Damon Courtney To: Jeff Hobbs cc: Ulrich Schoebel , Starkit list Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: How did I know Jeff would pipe in with a C++ comment? 0-] D > Ah, the evil C++ dependencies strike again! You basically need > to make sure that libstdc++ is either statically linked into your > executable (preferred if you plan to share it), or get the > libstdc++ libraries for your Linux/ipaq machine. These are not > part of a standard distro (much less an ipaq distro I imagine). > > Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy > Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ > Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Thu Jun 12 16:23:38 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5CLNcN05059; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 16:23:38 -0500 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h5CLOdiT093487; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 16:24:39 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 16:24:39 -0500 Message-ID: From: keith@lib.uchicago.edu To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] oomk tweaks In-Reply-To: <0155D4A0-9C5D-11D7-8345-000A957664F8@equi4.com> References: <0155D4A0-9C5D-11D7-8345-000A957664F8@equi4.com> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.4 (Hosorogi) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 MULE XEmacs/21.1 (patch 14) (Cuyahoga Valley) (i386--freebsd) X-Face: )C,7auub1,qHwu.Spk;Y6'8pld<:g8_\/=Zo/=E3y5*[m?C;;5Wc'B9=V+I:v 7>8Y=yx{[yy0$Zu@q+d&+$`jV{"Gk"Q0A#d]btd#$qjAR),qXF+GuE#?9Q4_xai{V&". MJluE"^Oj41R'ypsHcp2_`6kxl;T7?5eW57j#Muert'z`Y Y03pPAp3uY@x9DhN?yWwH.!jV? MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.4 - "Hosorogi") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: JCW> Thanks to comments by Steve Landers, I've been able to tidy up some JCW> loose ends in oomk, the Snit-based-OO-wrapper-around-MK. [...] Naive questions: * How many ways (packages) are there for doing Metakit in Tcl? I just use Mk4tcl. I occasionally (like, now) hear tantalizing mentions of other possibilities... mk4too? oomk? More? (I don't see anything but Mk4tcl mentioned at .) * Am I missing any fundamental Metakit capabilities by using Mk4tcl? I don't mean, O-O vs not O-O, but fundamental primitive operations that are maybe not exposed in Mk4tcl -- like the mythical (?) join, perhaps? What could these other approaches do for me? * Do these questions simply mean that I should also subscribe to the Metakit list? /k -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! Song of the Moment: Say Hello to the Angels (Interpol) From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Jun 12 18:27:20 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h5CNRIN14441 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 18:27:18 -0500 Received: (qmail 20802 invoked from network); 12 Jun 2003 23:28:15 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 12 Jun 2003 23:28:15 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 07:28:16 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] oomk tweaks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit list To: keith@lib.uchicago.edu From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <8B055F6A-9D2D-11D7-8A15-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Keith, > Naive questions: > > * How many ways (packages) are there for doing Metakit in Tcl? I just > use Mk4tcl. I occasionally (like, now) hear tantalizing mentions of > other possibilities... mk4too? oomk? More? (I don't see anything > but Mk4tcl mentioned at .) There are three, but only two recommended Mk4tcl - the original binding. It hides a lot of the Metakit functionality mk4too - an experimental binding by Matt Newman - it exposes more of the Metakit features but was undocumented and never an "official" interface oomk - a more advanced binding developed by Jean-Claude Wippler earlier this year. It is layered on mk4too and so exposes more of Metakit features (see below). > * Am I missing any fundamental Metakit capabilities by using Mk4tcl? > I don't mean, O-O vs not O-O, but fundamental primitive operations > that are maybe not exposed in Mk4tcl -- like the mythical (?) join, > perhaps? What could these other approaches do for me? Yes - oomk (and mk4too) provide features like join, hash, blocked views, projection, groupby, etc. I've used all three, but I'm now trying to stick with oomk because 1) I think it will ultimately be the preferred interface and 2) it has more "features" and 3) I like it ;-) > * Do these questions simply mean that I should also subscribe to the > Metakit list? It would hurt (it's a low volume list). HTH Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk Fri Jun 13 04:54:46 2003 Received: from newpost.lewisham.gov.uk (newpost.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.199.153]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5D9sjN13559 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 04:54:46 -0500 Received: from lmx.lewisham.gov.uk (lmx.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.207.18]) by newpost.lewisham.gov.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA30796 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 10:44:15 +0100 Received: by lmx.lewisham.gov.uk(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.7 (934.1 12-30-1999)) id 80256D44.0035F0F8 ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 10:49:10 +0100 X-Lotus-FromDomain: LEWISHAM From: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <80256D44.0035EE60.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 10:49:04 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Starkit] MetaKit: Record locking? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Are there any supported/recommended methods to manage record locking using (TCL) MetaKit? Many Thanks, =Adrian= From usus@aladyn.de Fri Jun 13 07:05:11 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5DC5AN22086 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 07:05:11 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 3EB725368D; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:06:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDF2F35A8B; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:06:10 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: "Jeff Hobbs" , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:02:54 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200306131402.54705.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-31.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_10,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 12 June 2003 20:04, Jeff Hobbs wrote: > > today I tried to compile a tclkit on a skiffcluster (strong arm) > > and, although it took quite a while, it compiled without errors. > > Then I copied the tclkit to an ipaq with familiar linux (2.4.19) > > and it failed to run with: > > error while loading shared libraries: libstdc++-libc6.1-2.so.3: > > cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory > > Ah, the evil C++ dependencies strike again! You name it! > You basically need > to make sure that libstdc++ is either statically linked into your That's what I want to do, but I'm not sure how. I set up a file genkit.local with array set Z {tclsuff "-Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++" tksuff "-Wl,-Bstatic -lstdc++"} in it, but then the generated tclkit dumps core. Looking for clues Ulrich > executable (preferred if you plan to share it), or get the > libstdc++ libraries for your Linux/ipaq machine. These are not > part of a standard distro (much less an ipaq distro I imagine). > > Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy > Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ > Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Fri Jun 13 13:24:27 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-5.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-5.online-age.net [64.14.56.41]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5DIORN15614 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 13:24:27 -0500 Received: from int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-3 [3.159.236.67]) by ext-nj2gw-5.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h5DIOrwj025465 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:24:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef03.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h5DIPFrl027788 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:25:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from CINMLVEM06 ([3.159.213.76]) by cinmlef03.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6673); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:25:15 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:25:15 -0400 Message-ID: <6D2B56E0F16C21439123B86E945199CD42A9BE@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Oh Man, where are my pages? Thread-Index: AcMx2QigYeYGsg8ISvith2HTJoSplA== From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jun 2003 18:25:15.0537 (UTC) FILETIME=[22A46810:01C331D9] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h5DIORN15614 Subject: [Starkit] Oh Man, where are my pages? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Since I'm so very pleased with tclkit it has become *the* TCL distribution installed on my machines. Life is simple, life is good. However, sometimes I want to refer to the documentation to double check api and I find myself having to do one of two things: 1) Refer to my 8.2 man pages that are installed. 2) Go to web to view up to date information. I prefer to just use man since it's so much faster and I can do it from my chosen work environment, emacs, with ease. Having grown tired of looking things up on the web or possible out of date material, I downloaded the 8.4 source code and installed just the documentation. Which got me thinking (dangerous) and I said to myself, "Self, how many other people use tclkit exclusively and have the same lack of tcl man pages?" So I was thinking, that in the great tclkit fashion, I could whip up a starkit that would install only the tcl/tk man pages if other people found it beneficial. Does anyone think this is a worth while effort? -- bryan From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Jun 13 13:30:22 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5DIUMN15942 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 13:30:22 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5DIVIVD010175 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 11:31:19 -0700 Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5DIVID2006261 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 11:31:18 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Oh Man, where are my pages? Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 11:31:18 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <6D2B56E0F16C21439123B86E945199CD42A9BE@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > So I was thinking, that in the great tclkit fashion, I could whip > up a starkit that would install only the tcl/tk man pages if > other people found it beneficial. Does anyone think this is a > worth while effort? Similar to http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/tcl84dok.kit ? Reachable through http://mini.net/sdarchive/ (Section 'Documentation'). -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com Join the community at the 10th Tcl conference http://wiki.tcl.tk/6274 From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Mon Jun 16 11:17:26 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5GGHPN02079 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2003 11:17:25 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h5GGIT7M005378 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2003 09:18:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h5GGICZK031951 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2003 11:18:28 -0500 Message-ID: <3EEDEDC3.35655343@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2003 09:18:11 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DDL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] oomk tweaks References: <8B055F6A-9D2D-11D7-8A15-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, > Hi Keith, > > > Naive questions: [..snip..] > > * Do these questions simply mean that I should also subscribe to the > > Metakit list? > > It would hurt (it's a low volume list). I think Steve ment "wouldn't" :-) > HTH > > Steve From headsup_popup@yahoo.com Tue Jun 17 00:07:28 2003 Received: from web14601.mail.yahoo.com (web14601.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.224.79]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h5H57SN19444 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2003 00:07:28 -0500 Message-ID: <20030617050832.95327.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [129.78.64.5] by web14601.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 16 Jun 2003 22:08:31 PDT Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2003 22:08:31 -0700 (PDT) From: HeadsUp Support To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] How to R/W to Metakit datafiles inside a "-writable" Starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I am trying to read/write to a Metakit datafile inside a tclhttpd "-writable" starkit. I use the following command to open the Metakit datafile mk::file open people [file join $starkit::topdir htdocs people.dat] This works fine when launched unwrapped but when wrapped I get an error "file open failed" when tclhttpd starts up. I moved this command to main.tcl (I am not sure if this is right) package require starkit starkit::startup package provide tcllib 1.3 ;# fake, because not all pkgs are included set env(TCL_HTTPD_LIBRARY) [file join $starkit::topdir lib] mk::file open people [file join $starkit::topdir htdocs people.dat] source [file join $starkit::topdir bin httpd.tcl] and when I launch the wrapped starkit I get the same "file open failed" message file open failed while executing "mk::file open people [file join $starkit::topdir htdocs people.dat]" (file "formkit.kit/main.tcl" line 5) invoked from within "source formkit.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" I have checked that my starkit is indeed "writable" by using a script which allows me to upload files to tclhttpd. The starkit size grows and when I unwrap it the uploaded files are there. Is the way you open and close Metakit datafiles inside a starkit different from outside. If so can someone give an example or point me to the right documentation? Kind Regards Jeff Smith __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Tue Jun 17 07:02:15 2003 Received: from mailout11.sul.t-online.com (mailout11.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.85]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5HC2EN11306 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2003 07:02:14 -0500 Received: from fwd11.aul.t-online.de by mailout11.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 19SFBG-00050O-04; Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:03:18 +0200 Received: from pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (SrL+woZ6oetNSV+0rPBMLGF0m1UKQ9LLgDiT3ZkO3qvDkcua9nSkUi@[80.130.27.244]) by fmrl11.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 19SFBA-24FwIq0; Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:03:12 +0200 Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (unknown [192.168.2.2]) by pD9526E6A.dip.t-dialin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6051C7BEF; Mon, 7 May 2001 10:42:08 +0000 (/etc/localtime) Message-ID: <3EEF046A.6090609@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:07:06 +0200 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2a) Gecko/20020910 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: HeadsUp Support Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to R/W to Metakit datafiles inside a "-writable" Starkit References: <20030617050832.95327.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Seen: false X-ID: SrL+woZ6oetNSV+0rPBMLGF0m1UKQ9LLgDiT3ZkO3qvDkcua9nSkUi@t-dialin.net Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: HeadsUp Support wrote: >Hi all, > >I am trying to read/write to a Metakit datafile inside >a tclhttpd "-writable" starkit. I use the following >command to open the Metakit datafile > >mk::file open people [file join $starkit::topdir >htdocs people.dat] > >This works fine when launched unwrapped but when >wrapped I get an error "file open failed" when >tclhttpd starts up. > >I moved this command to main.tcl (I am not sure if >this is right) > >package require starkit >starkit::startup >package provide tcllib 1.3 ;# fake, because not all >pkgs are included >set env(TCL_HTTPD_LIBRARY) [file join $starkit::topdir >lib] >mk::file open people [file join $starkit::topdir >htdocs people.dat] >source [file join $starkit::topdir bin httpd.tcl] > >and when I launch the wrapped starkit I get the same >"file open failed" message > >file open failed > while executing >"mk::file open people [file join $starkit::topdir >htdocs people.dat]" > (file "formkit.kit/main.tcl" line 5) > invoked from within >"source formkit.kit/main.tcl" > ("uplevel" body line 1) > invoked from within >"uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" > >I have checked that my starkit is indeed "writable" >by using a script which allows me to upload files to >tclhttpd. The starkit size grows and when I unwrap it >the uploaded files are there. > >Is the way you open and close Metakit datafiles inside >a starkit different from outside. If so can someone >give an example or point me to the right >documentation? > You have hit a limitation of Metakit, metakit cannot (AFAIK) open a metakit database from within a (metakit)-VFS, directly. One way to get going is to use the channel interface to Metakit and (mk::file save, mk::file load), another one is to add your data directly to the metakit database containing the starkit. A third way is to copy the database out to a temporary directory, as it is done for shared libraries. Search the mailing list archive for an example (it appeared some weeks ago, either on Metakit or Starkit list...) Michael From gclts-starkit@gmane.org Thu Jun 19 07:40:09 2003 Received: from main.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.224.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JCe8N32186 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 07:40:09 -0500 Received: from root by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19SyiU-0008Am-00 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:40:38 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from news by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19SycD-0007hy-00 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:34:09 +0200 From: "Ryan Casey" Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 08:34:13 -0400 Lines: 15 Message-ID: X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] Free Newsgroup for StarKit Mailing List Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: If you would prefer to read this in a newsreader format instead of in individual emails or digests, there is a new group at: news.gmane.org called gmane.comp.lang.tcl.starkit This is a free news server that translates hundreds of lists between newsreader and email list format. The group contains the archives of the Starkit mailing list back to it's inception (I think) in 7/2002 Ryan P. Casey From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jun 19 13:27:52 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JIRnN24669 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:27:52 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19T49O-00009H-00 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:28:46 +0200 Message-ID: <3EF200E0.2040205@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:28:48 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello. The OS is either Windows 2000 or Windows XP Pro with mingw. For a long time I've been encountering a problem with tclkit based on tclvfs+tcl 8.4.2 - it seems that [file stat] and [file size] does not show correct sizes for VFS files. I always get a file size of 4430332983890392160. I downloaded tars from equi4.com last week to check if new versions resolve this problem, and it seems that it still exists. I've tried tcl 8.4.2 and 8.4.3. Also, I even tried to change src/vfs/generic/vfs.c to always set st_size to 0 - it still is the same. -- WK From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jun 19 13:42:15 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JIgEN25663 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:42:14 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19T4NT-0000Ml-00 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:43:19 +0200 Message-ID: <3EF20449.4030402@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:43:21 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs References: <3EF200E0.2040205@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: <3EF200E0.2040205@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Uz.ytkownik Wojciech Kocjan napisa?: > For a long time I've been encountering a problem with tclkit based on > tclvfs+tcl 8.4.2 - it seems that [file stat] and [file size] does not > show correct sizes for VFS files. I always get a file size of > 4430332983890392160. What is interesting/annoying, it seems that Tcl uses 8 bytes for storing file size (and other WideInt related stuff), while vfs claims sizeof(bufPtr->st_size) to be 4. Any ideas why? -- WK From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jun 19 13:50:31 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JIoUN26238 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:50:30 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD60A83B12 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:51:31 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:51:30 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EF20449.4030402@kocjan.org> Message-Id: <0A0973EC-A287-11D7-889D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Wojciech Kocjan wrote: >> For a long time I've been encountering a problem with tclkit based on >> tclvfs+tcl 8.4.2 - it seems that [file stat] and [file size] does not >> show correct sizes for VFS files. I always get a file size of >> 4430332983890392160. > > What is interesting/annoying, it seems that Tcl uses 8 bytes for > storing file size (and other WideInt related stuff), while vfs claims > sizeof(bufPtr->st_size) to be 4. Ah - that might explain it all. Maybe the TclVFS extension is being compiled with an incompatible set of configuration settings? If TclVFS's notion of stat buffers does not match Tcl's and the OS's, then bad things can/will happen... I once had such a case crashing a while back. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jun 19 13:51:04 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JIp4N26294 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:51:04 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5JIq3dm009335 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:52:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5JIq3616898; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:52:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:52:03 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030619145203.AAB16818@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:43:21 +0200 To: starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I know that, from previous discussions here, in the wiki chatroom, and comp.lang.tcl , that the tcl vfs driver writer decides how much of the underlying file system to expose. And I know that the driver for disk file systems does not bring all the underlying file system attributes through to vfs. I seem to recall people reporting that file permission modes don't carry through as sometimes expected. I wonder whether file sizes do , at least for the systems on which you have tried. From what I can tell, on SPARC Solaris, the file sizes seem to work as I would expect, both from a virtual file system and a real disk file. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jun 19 13:55:13 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JItDN26581 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:55:13 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5JIuEj0016731 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 11:56:14 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5JIuDD2003689 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 11:56:13 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 11:56:12 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <0A0973EC-A287-11D7-889D-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > What is interesting/annoying, it seems that Tcl uses 8 bytes for > > storing file size (and other WideInt related stuff), while vfs claims > > sizeof(bufPtr->st_size) to be 4. > > Ah - that might explain it all. Maybe the TclVFS extension is being > compiled with an incompatible set of configuration settings? > > If TclVFS's notion of stat buffers does not match Tcl's and the OS's, > then bad things can/will happen... I once had such a case crashing a > while back. If that version of TclVFS wasn't using the latest TEA2 setup, then it might be missing the 64-bit file systems check. The tclvfs in CVS certainly does have this correct though. Jeff From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jun 19 14:03:30 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JJ3SN27141 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:03:29 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19T4i2-0000gS-00 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 21:04:34 +0200 Message-ID: <3EF20944.5090201@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 21:04:36 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Uz.ytkownik Jeff Hobbs napisa?: >>If TclVFS's notion of stat buffers does not match Tcl's and the OS's, >>then bad things can/will happen... I once had such a case crashing a >>while back. > If that version of TclVFS wasn't using the latest TEA2 setup, then it > might be missing the 64-bit file systems check. The tclvfs in CVS > certainly does have this correct though. Somehow, DEFS definition in Makefile had this in it: '-DTCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE=long\ long'. After removing it, everything seems to work fine for now. The version I got is from equi4.com/pub/tk/tars or something. This is from the .tar.gz: -rw-r--r-- jcw/users 56781 2003-02-22 01:25:22 vfs/generic/vfs.c -- WK From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jun 19 14:45:28 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JJjRN29746 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:45:28 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5JJkSj0020475; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 12:46:28 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5JJkSD2010500; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 12:46:28 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Wojciech Kocjan" , "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 12:46:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3EF20944.5090201@kocjan.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > >>If TclVFS's notion of stat buffers does not match Tcl's and the OS's, > >>then bad things can/will happen... I once had such a case crashing a > >>while back. > > If that version of TclVFS wasn't using the latest TEA2 setup, then it > > might be missing the 64-bit file systems check. The tclvfs in CVS > > certainly does have this correct though. > > Somehow, DEFS definition in Makefile had this in it: > '-DTCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE=long\ long'. After removing it, everything seems to > work fine for now. > > The version I got is from equi4.com/pub/tk/tars or something. This is > from the .tar.gz: > > -rw-r--r-- jcw/users 56781 2003-02-22 01:25:22 vfs/generic/vfs.c It's the tcl.m4, which configure inherits, that matters. In any case, it just seems *wrong* to remove the TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE definition from the makefile for tclvfs. That may cause other issues about conflicting core and extension wide int definitions. There is something that should be added to the DEFS, not removed. Here is my TCL_DEFS line in my tclvfs build on one of my linux machines: TCL_DEFS = -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_LIMITS_H=1 -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE=1 -DTCL_WIDE_IN T_TYPE=long\ long -DHAVE_STRUCT_STAT64=1 -DHAVE_TYPE_OFF64_T=1 -DHAVE_GETCWD=1 -DHAVE_OPE NDIR=1 -DHAVE_STRSTR=1 -DHAVE_STRTOL=1 -DHAVE_STRTOLL=1 -DHAVE_STRTOULL=1 -D HAVE_TMPNAM=1 -DHAVE_WAITPID=1 -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_SYS_PARAM_H=1 -DUSE_ TERMIOS=1 -DHAVE_SYS_TIME_H=1 -DTIME_WITH_SYS_TIME=1 -DHAVE_TM_ZONE=1 -DHAVE _GMTIME_R=1 -DHAVE_LOCALTIME_R=1 -DHAVE_TM_GMTOFF=1 -DHAVE_TIMEZONE_VAR=1 -D HAVE_ST_BLKSIZE=1 -DSTDC_HEADERS=1 -DHAVE_SIGNED_CHAR=1 -DSTATIC_BUILD=1 -DP EEK_XCLOSEIM=1 -DHAVE_SYS_IOCTL_H=1 I think you are missing the HAVE_STRUCT_STAT64 HAVE_TYPE_OFF64_T. Jeff From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jun 19 15:31:56 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JKVtN00433 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:31:56 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19T65Q-0001sv-00; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 22:32:48 +0200 Message-ID: <3EF21DF2.3060302@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 22:32:50 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: You wrote: >>>>If TclVFS's notion of stat buffers does not match Tcl's and the OS's, >>>>then bad things can/will happen... I once had such a case crashing a >>>>while back. >>>If that version of TclVFS wasn't using the latest TEA2 setup, then it >>>might be missing the 64-bit file systems check. The tclvfs in CVS >>>certainly does have this correct though. >>Somehow, DEFS definition in Makefile had this in it: >>'-DTCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE=long\ long'. After removing it, everything seems to >>work fine for now. > It's the tcl.m4, which configure inherits, that matters. In any case, > it just seems *wrong* to remove the TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE definition from > the makefile for tclvfs. That may cause other issues about conflicting > core and extension wide int definitions. There is something that > should be added to the DEFS, not removed. Well, I simply looked for -D in tcl's Makefile. It does not define TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE, so tclvfs shouldn't either. According to tcl.h, it selects what to use for Tcl_StatBuf according to, among many, TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE macro. So my guess is that it should be defined the same as when compiling Tcl. Actually, I'm a bit confused, since I got used that Tcl tries to be as version-independant as possible. Wouldn't it be better to create some functions to store parts of the stat - when building against stubs it would call the functions, and simply access elements of the structure otherwise. -- WK From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jun 19 15:40:13 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JKeDN01019 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:40:13 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5JKfDj0024588; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:41:13 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5JKfDD2018360; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:41:13 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Wojciech Kocjan" Cc: "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:41:10 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3EF21DF2.3060302@kocjan.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Well, I simply looked for -D in tcl's Makefile. It does not define > TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE, so tclvfs shouldn't either. According to tcl.h, it > selects what to use for Tcl_StatBuf according to, among many, > TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE macro. So my guess is that it should be defined the > same as when compiling Tcl. You are correct. The issue seems to be that it's getting confused because of the mingw environment about what DEF should be used. On Windows, it should be int64, not long long. > Actually, I'm a bit confused, since I got used that Tcl tries to be as > version-independant as possible. Wouldn't it be better to create some > functions to store parts of the stat - when building against stubs it > would call the functions, and simply access elements of the structure > otherwise. Possibly. The whole 64-bit FS configuration still requires some refinement. This is being discussed now on tcl-core. Jeff From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jun 19 15:49:29 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5JKnTN01751 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:49:29 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5JKoTj0025311 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:50:29 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5JKoTD2019497 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:50:29 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Strange problems with tcl 8.4.2+mingw+tclvfs Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:50:24 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Well, I simply looked for -D in tcl's Makefile. It does not define > > TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE, so tclvfs shouldn't either. According to tcl.h, it > > selects what to use for Tcl_StatBuf according to, among many, > > TCL_WIDE_INT_TYPE macro. So my guess is that it should be defined the > > same as when compiling Tcl. > > You are correct. The issue seems to be that it's getting confused > because of the mingw environment about what DEF should be used. > On Windows, it should be int64, not long long. Err ... icky. This actually gets messy, but you can see the magic in tcl/generic/tcl.h, ~line 360. This mixes wide int and 64-bit FS stuff together, in a way that possibly isn't 100% correct across all configurations. Jeff From usus@aladyn.de Mon Jun 23 04:16:14 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5N9GDN31850 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 04:16:13 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 53AB13CAAB; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 11:17:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05D883CA6B for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 11:17:21 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: "Starkit list" Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 11:12:22 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200306231112.22082.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-19.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_10,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I still didn't make it, so I have to ask again: I need a 8.4.2 tclkit for an ipaq and I am unable to compile it so that libstdc++ will be linked in statically. There's a 8.4.1 tclkit at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ so it must be possible to compile a tclkit for an ipaq. Which tricks/options/patches are necessary to compile? Thx for your advice Ulrich From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Jun 23 08:50:16 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5NDoFN17065 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 08:50:15 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id PAA06254 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:51:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA05269 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:51:09 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EF705CD.C8D7A67E@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:51:09 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I have encountered several strange problems when running certain programs from within a starpack on Windows XP (other Windows varieties not checked): - I start the programs via [exec] - One program waits for one or several newlines before it continues (or at least that is how I could solve the halting problem - excusez le pun) If I start it from a DOS box manually, no such thing happens - it will simply start. The solution was easy enough and the program uses a graphical library that might be responsible for this, but still. - One program, actually one of those ghastly setup programs that register DLLs, OCXs and what not, halts on the updating of a (system) font, MS Symbols. This is a very nasty one: it does not do that all the time, it is fairly consistent in this behaviour on laptops of the brand Toshiba (which are notorious among some of my colleagues for this and other types of problems). But the consequence is that you need to reboot the computer and run the setup program manually. (I will spare you the details). Note that when run from a DOS box or Windows Explorer or some such program, it works correctly. My guess is that somehow some of the font files or other resources are locked. Can anyone shed any light on this behaviour? Note: I have not had a chance to see whether any other Tcl shell/environment causes the same problems. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Mon Jun 23 09:00:03 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5NE03N17812 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 09:00:03 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5NE15dm020081 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:01:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5NE15317476; Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:01:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:01:05 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030623100105.AAB17445@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 23 Jun 2003 15:51:09 +0200 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It would be interesting to try to write a small Tcl program, using tclsh, that did an exec of the same programs with the same arguments, to see if the problem is isolated to starkits, or if it is a problem of the programs being written expecting to be double clicked from the window manager... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Jun 24 01:48:33 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5O6mWN26416 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2003 01:48:32 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA18151 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 24 Jun 2003 08:49:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA17742 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2003 08:49:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EF7F47E.8546DF8@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 08:49:34 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack References: <20030623100105.AAB17445@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > It would be interesting to try to write a small Tcl program, using tclsh, > that did an exec of the same programs with the same arguments, to see > if the problem is isolated to starkits, or if it is a problem of the > programs being written expecting to be double clicked from the window > manager... Well, the first problem has gone away: the computational program is behaving exactly the same way under all Tcl environments as in the DOS box. It was probably the wrong solution to some problem that I could not properly detect. The second problem is much nastier and requires more preparation. I will keep you informed. Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Jun 24 03:58:32 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5O8wWN04301 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2003 03:58:32 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id KAA09270 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:59:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA08503 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:59:29 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EF812F1.52D740F1@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:59:29 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack References: <20030623100105.AAB17445@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > It would be interesting to try to write a small Tcl program, using tclsh, > that did an exec of the same programs with the same arguments, to see > if the problem is isolated to starkits, or if it is a problem of the > programs being written expecting to be double clicked from the window > manager... The problem for the setup executable (created with the WISE installation package) is very real: I created a small script and turned that into a starkit: exec setup.exe That hangs. When I run this command from tclsh, there is no problem. When I run this script from wish: the setup also hangs. The only indications of the cause that I have: - The last message is "Skipping fences.ttf" - The next step is to update "MT Symbol.ttf" - As the fonts should never be replaced if the files exist, this is probably not the place where things go awry ... - Statements after the font stuff in combination with the error message that comes up when I kill the bugger, indicate that there may be a problem with the 16-bits subsystem (two files belonging to Visual Basic version 3.0) Testing with: exec setup.exe & results in a successful installation. (Due to a particularly bizarre^H^H^H^H^H the need to patch the installation, I did not want to put the setup process in the background) Regards, Arjen Can anyone shed more light? From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jun 25 05:18:52 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PAIqN28691 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 05:18:52 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5PAJudm013354 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:19:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5PAJuE02451; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:19:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:19:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030625061956.AAB2432@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've a co-worker who is wanting to create an application that needs a scrolling frame like Tix has. However, while Tix is dynamically loadable, I don't see stubs anywhere in the version I build. That means we are going to have to mess around with linking it into the tclkit, doesn't it? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Wed Jun 25 06:03:37 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PB3bN01496 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:03:37 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:04:45 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:04:44 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 06:04:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I've a co-worker who is wanting to create an application that > needs a scrolling frame like Tix has. > > However, while Tix is dynamically loadable, I don't see stubs > anywhere in the version I build. > > That means we are going to have to mess around with linking > it into the tclkit, doesn't it? I don't suppose either the Iwidgets ScrolledFrame or the Bwidget ScrolledWindow would suffice? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From btheado@rrohio.com Wed Jun 25 07:11:17 2003 Received: from outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (outbound-relay.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PCBHN09199 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 07:11:17 -0500 Received: from fep02.biz.rr.com (fep02.biz.rr.com [24.30.199.8]) by outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5PCCRIe021496 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 08:12:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([24.92.142.47]) by fep02.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030625121227.JRKW25701.fep02.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 08:12:27 -0400 Message-ID: <000c01c33b13$0b469ba0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: References: <20030625061956.AAB2432@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 08:12:27 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > However, while Tix is dynamically loadable, I don't see stubs > anywhere in the version I build. > I don't have any experience with Tix, but I just downloaded the source from http://tix.sourceforge.net and saw this in tixInit.c, which suggests all it would take is to compile with -DUSE_TCL_STUBS: #ifdef USE_TCL_STUBS if(Tcl_InitStubs(interp, TCL_VERSION, 0) == NULL) return TCL_ERROR; if(Tk_InitStubs(interp, TCL_VERSION, 0) == NULL) return TCL_ERROR; #endif Brian Theado From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jun 25 09:53:39 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PErcN22697 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:53:39 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id h5PEsnP1018691 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 07:54:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h5PEslZK030368 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:54:47 -0500 Message-ID: <3EF9B7B7.3090708@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 07:54:47 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>I've a co-worker who is wanting to create an application that >>needs a scrolling frame like Tix has. >> >>However, while Tix is dynamically loadable, I don't see stubs >>anywhere in the version I build. >> >>That means we are going to have to mess around with linking >>it into the tclkit, doesn't it? > > I don't suppose either the Iwidgets ScrolledFrame or the Bwidget > ScrolledWindow would suffice? > > Bob I believe you are correct, to load dynamically the package needs to be stub enabled. I have used both the Bwidget and Iwidget set and find they work well. You might also look at using Snit (an a pure tcl extention) and the native tk widgets. Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jun 25 10:07:19 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PF7JN23798 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 10:07:19 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5PF8Mdm006685 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:08:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5PF8N607899; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:08:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:08:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030625110823.AAB7890@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 25 Jun 2003 07:54:47 -0700 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Turns out that at least one of the of Tix distributions has stubs support - it just is turned off by default (!) Thanks all! -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From reinhard@cadence.com Wed Jun 25 10:30:11 2003 Received: from mailgate.Cadence.COM (mailgate.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.1]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PFUAN25572 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 10:30:11 -0500 Received: from cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (cdsmunich.Cadence.COM [158.140.172.1]) by mailgate.Cadence.COM (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA06813; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 08:31:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cadence.com (mreinhard [158.140.172.30]) by cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (8.10.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h5PFVJ821942; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 17:31:19 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EF9C047.3000008@cadence.com> Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 17:31:19 +0200 From: Reinhard Fobbe Reply-To: Reinhard Fobbe Organization: Cadence Design Systems GmbH User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.2b) Gecko/20021016 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tom Krehbiel CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? References: <3EF9B7B7.3090708@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Received: By mailgate.Cadence.COM as IAA06813 at Wed Jun 25 08:31:20 2003 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Tom, the BWidget package is also a pure Tcl/Tk package; there's no need for stub-enab. there. Reinhard Tom Krehbiel wrote: >>> I've a co-worker who is wanting to create an application that needs >>> a scrolling frame like Tix has. >>> >>> However, while Tix is dynamically loadable, I don't see stubs >>> anywhere in the version I build. >>> >>> That means we are going to have to mess around with linking it into >>> the tclkit, doesn't it? >> >> >> I don't suppose either the Iwidgets ScrolledFrame or the Bwidget >> ScrolledWindow would suffice? >> >> Bob > > > I believe you are correct, to load dynamically the package needs > to be stub enabled. I have used both the Bwidget and Iwidget set > and find they work well. You might also look at using Snit (an > a pure tcl extention) and the native tk widgets. > > Tom K. > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > -- Mit freundlichen Gruessen, Reinhard Fobbe Technical Leader SP&R Cadence Design Systems GmbH Mozartstrasse 2 D-85622 Feldkirchen, Germany Tel: +49 (0)89 4563-1880 Fax: +49 (0)89 4563-1800 From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jun 25 10:42:30 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PFgUN26510 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 10:42:30 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5PFhYdm015770 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:43:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5PFhYs08613; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:43:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:43:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030625114334.AAB8590@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 25 Jun 2003 17:31:19 +0200 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The problem is that he was unable to get BWidgets scrolled frame to act the same way that Tix's scrolled frame widget did. I didn't understand the entire explanation - it had to do with created a top level window that acted as a form, which contained a couple of text areas and some buttons. On large screens, the widget worked fine, but on Windows, with lesser resolution, the buttons and text areas were off the screen. He wasn't able to get BWidget's scrolled frame to resize in a way that would allow the text areas to resize along with the resizing window. Sorry I am so vague - he is much more into the gui design than I. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jun 25 11:24:55 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PGOsN29576 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:24:54 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h5PGQ1Yb026297; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:26:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h5PGPvZK025142; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:25:58 -0500 Message-ID: <3EF9CD14.7000102@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:25:56 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? References: <20030625114334.AAB8590@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20030625114334.AAB8590@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, I've observered similar problems with BWidgets on all platforms related to resize objects in the toplevel frame. For some reason the frame returned by the toplevel doesn't seem to resize properly when the window is resized. What seems to work best for me is to always pack another frame in the toplevel frame and then use grid calls to configure the sub-frames. You will also find resizing problems with paned windows. The resizing problems with paned windows are not related to BWidgets its a tk problem. I've had a bug report in for sometime now on the paned window resizing problem. Tom K. > The problem is that he was unable to get BWidgets scrolled frame to act > the same way that Tix's scrolled frame widget did. > > I didn't understand the entire explanation - it had to do with created > a top level window that acted as a form, which contained a couple of > text areas and some buttons. On large screens, the widget worked fine, > but on Windows, with lesser resolution, the buttons and text areas > were off the screen. He wasn't able to get BWidget's scrolled frame > to resize in a way that would allow the text areas to resize along > with the resizing window. > > Sorry I am so vague - he is much more into the gui design than I. From jeffh@ActiveState.com Wed Jun 25 11:51:01 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PGp0N31385 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:51:00 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5PGq6vX004588 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:52:06 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5PGq5D2026268 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:52:05 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:52:05 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3EF9CD14.7000102@motorola.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I've observered similar problems with BWidgets on all platforms > related to resize objects in the toplevel frame. For some reason > the frame returned by the toplevel doesn't seem to resize > properly when the window is resized. If there are BWidgets resize issues with widgets, then these should be carefully made into snippet bug reports and reported. Since I started using BWidgets, I have corrected numerous bugs, rewritten whole widgets (like ScrolledWindow) and added features. All the incremental work that people put in are what makes it all worth using. > You will also find resizing problems with paned windows. The This is already corrected in 8.5 by DKF. Someone should remind him to backport it to 8.4. I hope it also corrects the last-pane resize issue as well ... I hate that one. > > The problem is that he was unable to get BWidgets scrolled frame to act > > the same way that Tix's scrolled frame widget did. Again, the BWidgets ScrolledFrame will be much easier to use over time, so perhaps a few minutes correcting BWidgets is better spent than the time to manhandle building and maintaining Tix. Jeff From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Jun 25 12:25:38 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5PHPbN01496 for ; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 12:25:38 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h5PHQhYl010700; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 10:26:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h5PHQeZK011597; Wed, 25 Jun 2003 12:26:41 -0500 Message-ID: <3EF9DB51.8070600@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 10:26:41 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Has anyone created a starkit/starpack that uses Tix? References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>I've observered similar problems with BWidgets on all platforms >>related to resize objects in the toplevel frame. For some reason >>the frame returned by the toplevel doesn't seem to resize >>properly when the window is resized. > > > If there are BWidgets resize issues with widgets, then these should > be carefully made into snippet bug reports and reported. Since I > started using BWidgets, I have corrected numerous bugs, rewritten > whole widgets (like ScrolledWindow) and added features. All the > incremental work that people put in are what makes it all worth > using. [..snip..] Just in case anyone miss interperated my previous emails, the BWidget set is my primary tool for GUI development and I would recommend it to anyone. I didn't mean to sound like I was complaining. Development pressures usually cause me to send time looking for work-a-rounds instead of tracking down problem, reducing them to test cases and submitting bug reports. If I recall correctly the issue resizing problems I have seen appear to be a Dialog (i.e. toplevel) problem, not a problem with the widget that is placed in the Dialog frame. Next time I see the problem I will document it. Tom K. From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jun 26 04:43:06 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5Q9h5N03503 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 04:43:05 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03FC583B12 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 05:44:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2003 11:44:11 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EF812F1.52D740F1@wldelft.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen, > The problem for the setup executable (created with the WISE > installation > package) is very real: > > I created a small script and turned that into a starkit: > > exec setup.exe > > That hangs. > > When I run this command from tclsh, there is no problem. When I > run this script from wish: the setup also hangs. > > The only indications of the cause that I have: > - The last message is "Skipping fences.ttf" > - The next step is to update "MT Symbol.ttf" > - As the fonts should never be replaced if the files exist, > this is probably not the place where things go awry ... > - Statements after the font stuff in combination with the error > message that comes up when I kill the bugger, indicate that there may > be a problem with the 16-bits subsystem (two files belonging to > Visual > Basic version 3.0) > > Testing with: > > exec setup.exe & > > results in a successful installation. Weird. Note that tclkit does not come with the tclpip or something program, which as I understand is needed to run pipes (hence also the exec cmd inside Tcl?) when the launched programs are old 16-bit apps. If you can somehow trim the problem down to something I can reproduce, then I'll definitely will attempt to fix it. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jun 26 04:48:42 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5Q9mgN03872 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 04:48:42 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1CF683B12 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 05:49:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2003 11:49:47 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200306231112.22082.usus@aladyn.de> Message-Id: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > I need a 8.4.2 tclkit for an ipaq and I am unable to compile it so that > libstdc++ will be linked in statically. There's a 8.4.1 tclkit at > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ so it must be possible to compile a tclkit > for an ipaq. Which tricks/options/patches are necessary to compile? Tclkit 8.4.1 used to be built fully static on most platforms, i.e. with the "-static" flag during linking. Tclkit 8.4.2 no longer does so, but getting the C++ libs linked static while keeping C dynamic takes some voodoo and proper moon phases. Your best bet is probably to create a "genkit.local" file with something like the following in it: set X(g++) {g++ -static} This creates a fully static app, with all libs linked statically. When building the kit target ("./genkit B kit"), check out the logs to see that the -static flag was indeed passed in, i.e. "less out/`hostname`/kit". -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Jun 26 05:57:46 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5QAvjN07558 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 05:57:45 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id MAA26858 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 12:58:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA26336 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 12:58:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EFAD1E5.72496350@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2003 12:58:45 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Arjen, > > > Weird. > > Note that tclkit does not come with the tclpip or something program, > which as I understand is needed to run pipes (hence also the exec cmd > inside Tcl?) when the launched programs are old 16-bit apps. > > If you can somehow trim the problem down to something I can reproduce, > then I'll definitely will attempt to fix it. > > -jcw > Yes, well, as the problem also occurred under plain wish.exe and it is in fact solved by running the setup.exe in the background, my immediate problem is solved for the moment (the patch turned out not to be necessary after all). I think it should serve as a warning for others: [exec]ing an arbitrary program can cause strange problems under Windows. As I am not at all familiar with setup/installation programs that do all kinds of arcane things with registering OCXs and stuff - and I definitely want to keep it that way! - I have little else to go on than what I have described. Regards, Arjen From usus@aladyn.de Thu Jun 26 06:32:37 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5QBWaN09744 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 06:32:36 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 4162054310; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 13:33:47 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id E44F95430C; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 13:33:46 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Arjen Markus , Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem with running certain programs from within a starpack Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2003 13:28:15 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <3EFAD1E5.72496350@wldelft.nl> In-Reply-To: <3EFAD1E5.72496350@wldelft.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200306261328.15945.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-30.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 26 June 2003 12:58, Arjen Markus wrote: OT, this is good for a QOTW: [exec]ing an arbitrary program can cause strange problems under Windows. Ulrich From jcw@equi4.com Thu Jun 26 08:39:57 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5QDdvN18246 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 08:39:57 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E13A83B12 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 09:41:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2003 15:41:02 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] win32 starpack icons Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FYI, I've updated the tclkit 8.4.2 builds for Windows so the icon replacement in "sdx wrap" works again. It was a manual patch to replace the icon resource inside the exe, no changes to code. Previous binaries in prevwin/ dir. -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Thu Jun 26 09:42:04 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5QEg4N22128 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 09:42:04 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id CB824543B5; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 16:43:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BD3153F17 for ; Thu, 26 Jun 2003 16:43:14 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2003 16:37:42 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200306261637.42121.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday 26 June 2003 11:49, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I need a 8.4.2 tclkit for an ipaq and I am unable to compile it so that > > libstdc++ will be linked in statically. There's a 8.4.1 tclkit at > > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ so it must be possible to compile a tclkit > > for an ipaq. Which tricks/options/patches are necessary to compile? > > Tclkit 8.4.1 used to be built fully static on most platforms, i.e. with > the "-static" flag during linking. > > Tclkit 8.4.2 no longer does so, but getting the C++ libs linked static > while keeping C dynamic takes some voodoo and proper moon phases. We haven't reached new moon yet, thus the generated tclkit gets a SEGV. Until then I try fiddling around in Makefile.in of mk and a few other tricks. I'll keep you informed of success or EOP (End Of Patience). > > Your best bet is probably to create a "genkit.local" file with > something like the following in it: > set X(g++) {g++ -static} > This creates a fully static app, with all libs linked statically. > > When building the kit target ("./genkit B kit"), check out the logs to > see that the -static flag was indeed passed in, i.e. "less > out/`hostname`/kit". Yes, it was. It seems there's another trick necessary when generating libmk4tcl.a. Thanks for your help Ulrich > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk Fri Jun 27 06:12:57 2003 Received: from pixfirewall (newpost.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.199.153]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5RBCuN15798 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 06:12:57 -0500 Received: from lmx.lewisham.gov.uk (lmx.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.207.18]) by pixfirewall (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA20362 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 12:02:18 +0100 Received: by lmx.lewisham.gov.uk(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.7 (934.1 12-30-1999)) id 80256D52.003D10AB ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 12:06:59 +0100 X-Lotus-FromDomain: LEWISHAM From: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <80256D52.003D0EA5.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2003 12:06:53 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Starkit] Creating a Starpack containing packages Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Can anybody help me. I'm new to Starkits and am trying to "starpack" an application which is implemented as a set of packages. Assume I have a script "myapp.tcl" which requires packages "mypackage 1.0" and "somepackage 1.0" and I also want both of the packages to be contained within the starkit. How do I do this? I've tried several directory layouts, none of which work. I've had a look at the Wikis and the "Tcl and Starkits" chapter from "Practical Programming in Tcl and Tk" and can't find an example just like this. Many Thanks, =Adrian= From usus@aladyn.de Fri Jun 27 06:22:26 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5RBMQN16382 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 06:22:26 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id B89A65445B; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 13:23:37 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6917054443 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 13:23:37 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Creating a Starpack containing packages Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2003 13:17:56 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <80256D52.003D0EA5.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> In-Reply-To: <80256D52.003D0EA5.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200306271317.56143.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Adrian, this is easy. Put all your packages into the my_app.vfs/lib directory. auto_path will include this directory, so "package require mypackage 1.0" will work. Best regards Ulrich On Friday 27 June 2003 13:06, Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk wrote: > Can anybody help me. I'm new to Starkits and am trying to "starpack" an > application which is > implemented as a set of packages. > > Assume I have a script "myapp.tcl" which requires packages "mypackage 1.0" > and "somepackage > 1.0" and I also want both of the packages to be contained within the > starkit. > > How do I do this? I've tried several directory layouts, none of which work. > I've had a look > at the Wikis and the "Tcl and Starkits" chapter from "Practical Programming > in Tcl and Tk" > and can't find an example just like this. > > Many Thanks, > =Adrian= > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jun 28 03:42:20 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5S8gKN28982 for ; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 03:42:20 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5S8hQdm020924 for ; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 04:43:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5S8hQL29890; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 04:43:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2003 04:43:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030628044326.AAB29871@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: What would people think of this - when tclkit starts, it looks at the name by which it is started. If the name is "wish", the tcl command package require Tk is executed. That would allow people to install a tclkit , link it to wish (or rename it, etc.) and run scripts written to run with #! wish type startups without change. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jahbini@lava.net Sat Jun 28 04:32:04 2003 Received: from aiea.romantictrances.com (rrcs-west-66-91-154-154.biz.rr.com [66.91.154.154]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5S9W4N30601 for ; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 04:32:04 -0500 Received: from lava.net (aiea.romantictrances.com [66.91.154.154]) by aiea.romantictrances.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0673F6A; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 23:40:39 -1000 (HST) Message-ID: <3EFD6297.3070600@lava.net> Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2003 23:40:39 -1000 From: Jim Hinds User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en; Stable) Gecko/20020826 Beonex/0.8.1-stable X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change References: <20030628044326.AAB29871@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: How about make it a glob for *wish*. That way it could be 'wishkit' or 'mywishkit' and still turn on the Tk stuff. Jim Hinds Larry W. Virden wrote: >What would people think of this - when tclkit starts, it looks at the name >by which it is started. If the name is "wish", the tcl command > >package require Tk > >is executed. > >That would allow people to install a tclkit , link it to wish (or rename >it, etc.) and run scripts written to run with #! wish type startups >without change. > > From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jun 28 04:54:08 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5S9s8N31195 for ; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 04:54:08 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5S9tEdm021490 for ; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 05:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5S9tER01455; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 05:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2003 05:55:14 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030628055514.AAB1433@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 27 Jun 2003 23:40:39 -1000 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: That would be fine too, if it is what users want. Yes, I know I have the source and I can hack this in. I'm just wondering if others think it might be a useful hack to include. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From e.leunissen@hccnet.nl Sat Jun 28 11:19:52 2003 Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl (smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5SGJpN09860 for ; Sat, 28 Jun 2003 11:19:52 -0500 Received: from hccnet.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia62-29.dsl.hccnet.nl [62.251.29.62] with ESMTP id h5SGKwT9009486 (8.12.9/2.03); Sat, 28 Jun 2003 18:20:58 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EFDC11C.8060504@hccnet.nl> Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2003 18:23:56 +0200 From: Erik Leunissen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-us, de, nl, fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change References: <20030628055514.AAB1433@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > That would be fine too, if it is what users want. > > Yes, I know I have the source and I can hack this in. I'm just wondering > if others think it might be a useful hack to include. > Seems to me like a good idea. Erik Leunissen ============== From jeffh@ActiveState.com Sun Jun 29 15:13:51 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5TKDpN04632 for ; Sun, 29 Jun 2003 15:13:51 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5TKEor9007980; Sun, 29 Jun 2003 13:14:50 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5TKEnD2012222; Sun, 29 Jun 2003 13:14:50 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Larry W. Virden" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 13:14:48 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20030628044326.AAB29871@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > What would people think of this - when tclkit starts, it looks at the name > by which it is started. If the name is "wish", the tcl command > > package require Tk > > is executed. > > That would allow people to install a tclkit , link it to wish (or rename > it, etc.) and run scripts written to run with #! wish type startups > without change. I for one dislike this idea at first glance, although I could possibly warm up to it. I've been working to get people to use package require Tk in their scripts whether they start them from 'wish' or not, just as a matter of good style. After all, it isn't wish, and has other dissimilarities aside from not auto-loading Tk. Jeff From reinhard@cadence.com Mon Jun 30 02:08:48 2003 Received: from mailgate.Cadence.COM (mailgate.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.1]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5U78mN30926 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 02:08:48 -0500 Received: from cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (cdsmunich.Cadence.COM [158.140.172.1]) by mailgate.Cadence.COM (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA26876; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 00:09:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cadence.com (mreinhard [158.140.172.30]) by cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (8.10.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h5U79u806004; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 09:09:56 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3EFFE244.5050309@cadence.com> Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 09:09:56 +0200 From: Reinhard Fobbe Reply-To: Reinhard Fobbe Organization: Cadence Design Systems GmbH User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.2b) Gecko/20021016 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change References: <20030628044326.AAB29871@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Received: By mailgate.Cadence.COM as AAA26876 at Mon Jun 30 00:09:58 2003 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Larry, I would not use wish or tclsh here - these names were already used by older Tcl distributions and their use may generate confusion. If a script uses "package require Tk" then it should run in the same way in tclsh and tclkit. Reinhard Larry W. Virden wrote: >What would people think of this - when tclkit starts, it looks at the name >by which it is started. If the name is "wish", the tcl command > >package require Tk > >is executed. > >That would allow people to install a tclkit , link it to wish (or rename >it, etc.) and run scripts written to run with #! wish type startups >without change. > > From lvirden@cas.org Mon Jun 30 05:53:33 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5UArXN12500 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 05:53:33 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5UAsetx012917 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:54:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5UAsff04571; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:54:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:54:41 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030630065441.AAB4525@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 30 Jun 2003 09:09:56 +0200 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I would not use wish or tclsh here - these names were already used by > older Tcl distributions and their use may generate confusion. > > If a script uses "package require Tk" then it should run in the same > way in tclsh and tclkit. Reinhard I agree - someone comfortable coding can code just that and things will work fine. I started thinking of this in response to a posting on comp.lang.tcl, where someone who sounded like a non-programmer who was trying to get an application to run but was getting the error that there was no wish. Trying to take someone who is trying to use applications, and teach them how to compile and install code, is a daunting task. And it seemed to me that tclkit would be a great benefit to people in that situation - if they could just download tclkit as 'wish', and have it work, then there would be no need for anything else to be installed. No worries about them accidentally deleting files that wish requires to run, etc. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Jun 30 05:56:29 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5UAuTN12689 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 05:56:29 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h5UAvatx014439 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:57:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h5UAvbv04609; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:57:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:57:37 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030630065737.AAB4575@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change In-Reply-To: Your message of Sun, 29 Jun 2003 13:14:48 -0700 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Jeff Hobbs" > I've been working to get people to use package require > Tk in their scripts whether they start them from 'wish' or not, just as > a matter of good style. Doing a package require Tk won't do any good if there is no 'wish' command installed on the system and the application does an 'exec wish'. Asking a programmer to edit one or more applications is one thing. Asking a non technical user to edit one or more applications safely is something else quite different. > After all, it isn't wish, and has other > dissimilarities aside from not auto-loading Tk. Interesting - I had not known there were other dissimilarities. What other wish features does tclkit / package require Tk miss? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jun 30 06:16:43 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5UBGhN14098 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:16:43 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B084683B12 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 07:17:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 13:17:51 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030630065441.AAB4525@cas.org> Message-Id: <7CF9761C-AAEC-11D7-BF7E-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: [wish] > I started thinking of this in response to a posting on comp.lang.tcl, > where > someone who sounded like a non-programmer who was trying to get an > application to run but was getting the error that there was no wish. > > Trying to take someone who is trying to use applications, and teach > them > how to compile and install code, is a daunting task. And it seemed to > me > that tclkit would be a great benefit to people in that situation - if > they > could just download tclkit as 'wish', and have it work, then there > would be > no need for anything else to be installed. No worries about them > accidentally deleting files that wish requires to run, etc. I don't get it. "I need to go from A to B. I've been all over town, trying to find a red whatchamacallit but all I could find are green whatchamacallits - now I'm having a hard time looking for for a shop which sells me red paint for them." Eh... what about the fact that green whatchamacallits get you from A to B just as well? Quicker in fact, because green whatchamacallits come pre-assembled, whereas the red ones need to be readied for use? (Translation: put "#!/usr/bin/env tclkit" and "package require Tk" at the top, and everything works everywhere, period, end of story.) -jcw PS. If you don't like that solution because it "limits" you to tclkit, then change that first line to "#!/usr/bin/env mytcl" and add a symlink to your preferred distro-du-jour. From koloska@voiceinterconnect.de Mon Jun 30 06:21:29 2003 Received: from thalita.eatserver.de (h-71.155.2.81.webtronic.de [81.2.155.71] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5UBLSN14445 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 06:21:29 -0500 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by thalita.eatserver.de (8.11.6/8.11.6/SuSE Linux 0.5) id h5UBMpm19198 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 13:22:51 +0200 Received: from UNKNOWN(217.225.249.253), claiming to be "titania.vic" via SMTP by thalita, id smtpdnLCxly; Mon Jun 30 11:22:45 2003 Received: from voiceinterconnect.de (oberon.vic [192.168.13.150]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by titania.vic (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AD2B455B2 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 13:22:16 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3F001D67.1070004@voiceinterconnect.de> Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 13:22:15 +0200 From: Uwe Koloska Organization: voiceINTERconnect GmbH User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: de, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Creating a Starpack containing packages References: <80256D52.003D0EA5.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> <200306271317.56143.usus@aladyn.de> In-Reply-To: <200306271317.56143.usus@aladyn.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.73.1.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello Adrian, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > Hi Adrian, > > this is easy. Put all your packages into the my_app.vfs/lib directory. > auto_path will include this directory, so "package require mypackage 1.0" > will work. It's as easy as Ulrich told you! But if you are new to starkits a more detailed explanation may be of thelp to you: - first create a standard starkit with your application: sdx qwrap myapp.tcl this will create a myapp.kit - unpack the newly created startkit sdx unwrap myapp.kit this will create a dir myapp.vfs - copy/move your librarys to the library dir of myapp myapp.vfs/lib - rewrap the whole thing sdx wrap myapp.kit and voila: your starkit inludes your app and all needed libraries. if you really want to create a starpack (as your subject suggested) you have to decide for which platform you want to build it. The make an executable out of your myapp.vfs by adding "-runtime" to sdx. For example if you are developing on linux (a good choice and have to build a starpack for windows, just copy a reasonable tclkit.exe to the path where your myapp.vfs lives and enter sdx wrap myapp.exe -runtime tclkit.exe Hope this helps Uwe -- voiceINTERconnect www.voiceinterconnect.de ... smart speech applications from germany From david@larochelle-innovation.com Mon Jun 30 10:41:25 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5UFfMN31475 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 10:41:22 -0500 Received: from david.larochelle-innovation.com (david [10.177.0.2]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F3BF4800D for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 17:42:36 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 17:42:30 +0200 From: David Zolli To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] win32 starpack icons Message-Id: <20030630174230.4ebe8ed4.david@larochelle-innovation.com> In-Reply-To: References: Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i686-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp \e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg="pgp-sha1"; boundary="=.LXSNMhz7E3.Zr." Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=.LXSNMhz7E3.Zr. Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Multipart_Mon__30_Jun_2003_17:42:30_+0200_084877d8" --Multipart_Mon__30_Jun_2003_17:42:30_+0200_084877d8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Le jeu 26 jun 2003 15:41:02 CEST Jean-Claude Wippler a =E9crit : > FYI, I've updated the tclkit 8.4.2 builds for Windows so the icon=20 > replacement in "sdx wrap" works again. It was a manual patch to=20 > replace the icon resource inside the exe, no changes to code. Previous=20 > binaries in prevwin/ dir. I tried this new version and I got this message: customizing tclkit.ico in executable icon 32x32/16: replaced icon 16x16/16: replaced icon 32x32/256: NOT SAME SIZE icon 48x48/256: NOT SAME SIZE icon 48x48/16: replaced icon 16x16/256: NOT SAME SIZE and created executable use tclkit.ico, not mine. With old tclkit, using the same icon it returns: customizing tclkit.ico in executable icon 32x32/16: replaced icon 16x16/16: replaced icon 32x32/256: NOT FOUND icon 48x48/256: NOT FOUND icon 48x48/16: NOT FOUND icon 16x16/256: NOT FOUND and created executable uses my 16 colors icon view. What's going wrong ? 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Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE/AFpr+PlsgBoYl0ARAkAyAJ9gxDLEinEHCzyCSvxzH1VltknI1QCg2lZ4 qcvtpQ773UdAsW0kXmUWvNM= =AFHU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=.LXSNMhz7E3.Zr.-- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Mon Jun 30 13:04:03 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h5UI43N08453 for ; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 13:04:03 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5UI53r9000901; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 11:05:03 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h5UI53D2012917; Mon, 30 Jun 2003 11:05:03 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Larry W. Virden" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Proposed tclkit change Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2003 11:05:01 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20030630065737.AAB4575@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > I've been working to get people to use package require > > Tk in their scripts whether they start them from 'wish' or not, just as > > a matter of good style. > > Doing a package require Tk won't do any good if there is no 'wish' command > installed on the system and the application does an 'exec wish'. Asking OK, in this case I would say the same as I have for the 'expect' binary - create a wrapper Tcl script that recreates the correct behavior. > > After all, it isn't wish, and has other > > dissimilarities aside from not auto-loading Tk. > > Interesting - I had not known there were other dissimilarities. > > What other wish features does tclkit / package require Tk miss? We will ignore Windows, but the attached console thing is a major difference there. Aside from that, tclkits have different default behavior for handling of auto_path. Also, would that work if you passed things like -display anothermachine:0.0 on the command line? Jeff From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 1 12:31:14 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h61HVDa08456 for ; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 12:31:13 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h61HWTj1023398 for ; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 10:32:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h61HWQC3010530 for ; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 12:32:27 -0500 Message-ID: <3F01C5AA.9090300@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 01 Jul 2003 10:32:26 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] How do I determine if my code is wrapped? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is there a starkit variable that can be checked (at runtime) to determine if the code that is executing is wrapped (i.e. starkit or starpack) or not? Tom K. From jeffh@ActiveState.com Tue Jul 1 15:22:12 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h61KMBa23616 for ; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 15:22:12 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h61KNMjb024886; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 13:23:22 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h61KNMD2008941; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 13:23:22 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Tom Krehbiel" , "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] How do I determine if my code is wrapped? Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2003 13:23:20 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3F01C5AA.9090300@motorola.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Is there a starkit variable that can be checked (at runtime) to > determine if the code that is executing is wrapped (i.e. starkit > or starpack) or not? I believe you want the info at http://www.equi4.com/191 Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 1 15:29:58 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h61KTwa24445 for ; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 15:29:58 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h61KVANg028681; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 13:31:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h61KV9C3026189; Tue, 1 Jul 2003 15:31:10 -0500 Message-ID: <3F01EF8D.8060608@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 01 Jul 2003 13:31:09 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Hobbs CC: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] How do I determine if my code is wrapped? References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I just found the answer to my question. It is in Chapter 22 of the latest version of "Practial Programing in Tcl and Tk". the starkit::startup procedure returns one of the following. starpack starkit unwrapped tclhttpd plugin service source Tom K. From usus@aladyn.de Wed Jul 2 10:51:58 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h62Fpvv19290; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 10:51:58 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 9022A54234; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 17:51:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32E4B540DC; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 17:51:55 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Jean-Claude Wippler , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 17:45:20 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200307021745.20233.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Jean-Claude, I tried your advice, 'set X(g++) {g++ -static}', and followed the recipe on http://www.equi4.com/284. This gave me a fully static tclkit. It works and doesn't need libstdc++, _*BUT*_ it's impossible to load extension libraries. This is also the case with the precompiled tclkit8.4.1. How can I link the tclkit with a static libstdc++, but keep the ability to load shared libraries? Ulrich On Thursday 26 June 2003 11:49, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I need a 8.4.2 tclkit for an ipaq and I am unable to compile it so that > > libstdc++ will be linked in statically. There's a 8.4.1 tclkit at > > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ so it must be possible to compile a tclkit > > for an ipaq. Which tricks/options/patches are necessary to compile? > > Tclkit 8.4.1 used to be built fully static on most platforms, i.e. with > the "-static" flag during linking. > > Tclkit 8.4.2 no longer does so, but getting the C++ libs linked static > while keeping C dynamic takes some voodoo and proper moon phases. > > Your best bet is probably to create a "genkit.local" file with > something like the following in it: > set X(g++) {g++ -static} > This creates a fully static app, with all libs linked statically. > > When building the kit target ("./genkit B kit"), check out the logs to > see that the -static flag was indeed passed in, i.e. "less > out/`hostname`/kit". > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 2 11:56:32 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h62GuVv25490 for ; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 11:56:31 -0500 Received: from srv40s4u.cas.org (srv40s4u [134.243.40.43]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h62GuMO5010404 for ; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 12:56:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by srv40s4u.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h62GuNV24946; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 12:56:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 12:56:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030702125623.AAB24799@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've a simple demo application I am trying to wrap. $ cat ~/tixdemo.tcl #! /usr/tcl84/bin/tclsh package require Tk package require Tix button .b -text "Hello, world" -command { exit } pack .b I have the following in tixdemo.tcl: $ ls -RC /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs: lib main.tcl /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib: Tix8.2.0 application libtix8.2g.so /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/Tix8.2.0: Balloon.tcl EFileBox.tcl LabFrame.tcl SText.tcl VStack.tcl BtnBox.tcl EFileDlg.tcl LabWidg.tcl SWidget.tcl VTree.tcl CObjView.tcl Event.tcl ListNBk.tcl SWindow.tcl Variable.tcl ChkList.tcl FileBox.tcl Meter.tcl Select.tcl Verify.tcl ComboBox.tcl FileCbx.tcl MultView.tcl Shell.tcl Version.tcl Compat.tcl FileCmpt.tcl NoteBook.tcl SimpDlg.tcl WInfo.tcl Console.tcl FileDlg.tcl OldUtil.tcl StackWin.tcl WinFile.tcl Control.tcl FileEnt.tcl OptMenu.tcl StatBar.tcl bitmaps DefSchm.tcl FileUtil.tcl PanedWin.tcl StdBBox.tcl fs.tcl DialogS.tcl FloatEnt.tcl PopMenu.tcl StdShell.tcl pkgIndex.tcl DirBox.tcl Grid.tcl Primitiv.tcl TList.tcl pref DirDlg.tcl HList.tcl ResizeH.tcl Tix.tcl tclIndex DirList.tcl HListDD.tcl SGrid.tcl Tree.tcl DirTree.tcl IconView.tcl SHList.tcl UnixFile.tcl DragDrop.tcl Init.tcl SListBox.tcl Utils.tcl DtlList.tcl LabEntry.tcl STList.tcl VResize.tcl /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/Tix8.2.0/bitmaps: act_fold.gif file.xbm minimize.xbm openfold.gif srcfile.gif act_fold.xbm file.xpm minus.gif openfold.xbm srcfile.xbm act_fold.xpm folder.gif minus.xbm openfold.xpm srcfile.xpm balarrow.xbm folder.xbm minus.xpm plus.gif system.xbm cbxarrow.xbm folder.xpm minusarm.gif plus.xbm textfile.gif ck_def.xbm harddisk.xbm minusarm.xbm plus.xpm textfile.xbm ck_off.xbm hourglas.mask minusarm.xpm plusarm.gif textfile.xpm ck_on.xbm hourglas.xbm mktransgif.tcl plusarm.xbm tick.xbm cross.xbm incr.xbm network.xbm plusarm.xpm warning.gif decr.xbm info.gif no_entry.gif resize1.xbm warning.xpm drop.xbm info.xpm no_entry.xpm resize2.xbm file.gif maximize.xbm openfile.xbm restore.xbm /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/Tix8.2.0/pref: 10Point.fs Bisque.cs Makefile TK.csc TkWin.csc WmDefault.fsc 10Point.fsc Bisque.csc Old12Pt.fs TK.fs TkWin.fs WmDefault.py 12Point.fs Blue.cs Old14Pt.fs TK.fsc TkWin.fsc WmDefault.tcl 12Point.fsc Blue.csc SGIGray.cs TixGray.cs WmDefault.cs WmDefault.txt 14Point.fs Gray.cs SGIGray.csc TixGray.csc WmDefault.csc pkgIndex.tcl 14Point.fsc Gray.csc TK.cs TkWin.cs WmDefault.fs tixmkpref /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/application: tixdemo.tcl $ cat /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/Tix8.2.0/pkgIndex.tcl # Tcl package index file, version 1.0 package ifneeded Tix 8.2 \ [list load [file join [file dirname $dir] libtix8.2g.so] Tix] $ cat /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/main.tcl package require starkit starkit::startup set startup [file join $starkit::topdir lib/application/tixdemo.tcl] set ::argv0 $startup source $startup $ Now, when I try to run the main.tcl, I get this error: $ tclkit tixdemo.vfs/main.tcl Can't find a usable Init.tcl in the following directories: /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit/lib/tix8.2 /volws/lwv26/ldatae/lib/tix8.2 /volws/lwv26/lib/tix8.2 /volws/lwv26/ldatae/library /volws/lwv26/library /volws/lwv26/tix8.2.0/library /volws/tix8.2.0/library This probably means that tix wasn't installed properly. while executing "error $msg" (procedure "tcl_findLibrary" line 76) invoked from within "tcl_findLibrary tix $tix_version $tix_patchLevel Init.tcl TIX_LIBRARY tix_library" (procedure "tixInit" line 4) invoked from within "tixInit" invoked from within "load /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/libtix8.2g.so Tix" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require Tix" (file "/home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/application/tixdemo.tcl" line 4) invoked from within "source $startup" (file "tixdemo.vfs/main.tcl" line 18) I'm missing something simple - but I'm uncertain what. Has anyone an idea what might be going wrong? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Jul 2 18:22:06 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h62NM4v00550 for ; Wed, 2 Jul 2003 18:22:04 -0500 Received: (qmail 24305 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2003 23:22:01 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 02 Jul 2003 23:22:01 -0000 Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 07:21:59 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <20030702125623.AAB24799@cas.org> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, > "tcl_findLibrary tix $tix_version $tix_patchLevel Init.tcl TIX_LIBRARY > tix_library" ... > I'm missing something simple - but I'm uncertain what. Has anyone an > idea > what might be going wrong? You might need to set env(TIX_LIBRARY) to point to the directory in the VFS where the Tix Init.tcl script lives. Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jul 3 06:30:49 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63BUnv09409 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 06:30:49 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h63BUgO5020428 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 07:30:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h63BUgZ29160; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 07:30:42 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 07:30:42 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030703073042.AAB28853@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-Reply-To: of Thu, 3 Jul 2003 07:21:59 +0800 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: setting TIX_LIBRARY I just wish I understood _why_ this was necessary. It isn't necessary with the copy of the code installed on my real disk. Thanks for the idea though. Apparently there's something different about the way Tclkit loads extensions from within a starkit and the way that Tcl loads them. I wish I understood the difference better - right now, this difference prevents me from using starkits as well as helping my developers use them. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From usus@aladyn.de Thu Jul 3 10:57:31 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63FvUv30168; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 10:57:30 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id B34C151B0C; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 17:57:28 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D91E2DD54; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 17:57:28 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Jean-Claude Wippler , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 17:50:43 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200307031750.43164.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Phew! I finally got it! The trick is to set X(g++) gcc and then following the instructions to build a static tclkit. Then you get a statically linked tclkit _with_ the ability to load shared libs. I extended the Makefile to include the target "tclkit-static". Best regards Ulrich On Thursday 26 June 2003 11:49, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I need a 8.4.2 tclkit for an ipaq and I am unable to compile it so that > > libstdc++ will be linked in statically. There's a 8.4.1 tclkit at > > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ so it must be possible to compile a tclkit > > for an ipaq. Which tricks/options/patches are necessary to compile? > > Tclkit 8.4.1 used to be built fully static on most platforms, i.e. with > the "-static" flag during linking. > > Tclkit 8.4.2 no longer does so, but getting the C++ libs linked static > while keeping C dynamic takes some voodoo and proper moon phases. > > Your best bet is probably to create a "genkit.local" file with > something like the following in it: > set X(g++) {g++ -static} > This creates a fully static app, with all libs linked statically. > > When building the kit target ("./genkit B kit"), check out the logs to > see that the -static flag was indeed passed in, i.e. "less > out/`hostname`/kit". > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From vince.darley@eurobios.com Thu Jul 3 11:08:25 2003 Received: from out.exponential-e.net (out.exponential-e.net [62.244.177.197]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63G8Ov31127; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 11:08:24 -0500 Received: from rough.eurobios.com (62-244-188-66.cust.exponential-e.net [62.244.188.66]) by out.exponential-e.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63G89129259; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 17:08:09 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030703170644.025e4e60@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2003 17:08:08 +0100 To: Ulrich Schoebel , Jean-Claude Wippler , "Starkit list" From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <200307031750.43164.usus@aladyn.de> References: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [Starkit] Starpack (Win) without the "Tclkit, ..." message? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Has anyone worked out how to replace the "Tclkit, a standalone runtime for Tcl/Tk" message and associated version number information embedded in a Windows starpack with something else? (The stuff that shows up in Windows properties dialogs, amongst other places) cheers, Vince. From rohan@rohanpall.com Thu Jul 3 11:28:12 2003 Received: from chococat.sd.dreamhost.com (chococat.sd.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63GSCv00388 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 11:28:12 -0500 Received: from rohanpall.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chococat.sd.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C4778FA72 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 09:28:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 24.114.111.163 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rohan@rohanpall.com) by webmail.rohanpall.com with HTTP; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 12:28:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <44008.24.114.111.163.1057249697.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 12:28:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rohan Pall" To: User-Agent: DreamHost Webmail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [Starkit] bandwidth Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I realize that I download the binaries a lot, and from many servers accross the world which I adminster / am a member of. I can't afford an industrial license, but I firmly believe a man must pay for another man's work. Is there a payment option? Rohan From btheado@rrohio.com Thu Jul 3 15:02:42 2003 Received: from email-out-01.biz.rr.com (email-out-01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63K2gv21108 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 15:02:42 -0500 Received: from fep03.biz.rr.com (fep03.biz.rr.com [24.30.201.200]) by email-out-01.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h63K2fDh003249 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 16:02:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([24.92.142.47]) by fep03.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030703200241.RSY14106.fep03.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 16:02:41 -0400 Message-ID: <002201c3419e$0f347480$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: References: <20030703073042.AAB28853@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 16:02:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > Re: setting TIX_LIBRARY > > I just wish I understood _why_ this was necessary. It isn't necessary > with the copy of the code installed on my real disk. > From your previous post, the error comes from tcl_findLibrary. From http://www.tcl.tk/man/tcl8.4/TclCmd/library.htm#M12: "Otherwise the search looks in these directories: the directory named by the environment variable enVarName; relative to the Tcl library directory; relative to the executable file in the standard installation bin or bin/arch directory; relative to the executable file in the current build tree; relative to the executable file in a parallel build tree." With tclkit, the Tcl library directory is within tclkit, so unless you build Tix into tclkit, it won't find the init.tcl file that way. One idea is to set env(TIX_LIBRARY) within Tix's pkgIndex.tcl file to be $starkit::topdir/lib/. Brian Theado From dgporter@erols.com Thu Jul 3 15:42:43 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63Kghv25116 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 15:42:43 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYcARCXpE5hWO6ppM6CL8V3kbSQF6GmW9lFKWf7L4ewlEDdqY3c+Io2eeOQVEwnhQ0= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19YAuf-0002n5-00; Thu, 03 Jul 2003 16:42:41 -0400 Message-ID: <3F049540.2070905@erols.com> Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2003 16:42:40 -0400 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030521 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Theado CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work References: <20030703073042.AAB28853@cas.org> <002201c3419e$0f347480$6401a8c0@desktop123456> In-Reply-To: <002201c3419e$0f347480$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > One idea is to set env(TIX_LIBRARY) within Tix's pkgIndex.tcl file to be > $starkit::topdir/lib/. That sounds like a bad idea for several reasons. The most important one is that it negates the purpose of using the environment variable in the first place. That purpose is to provide the end user with a tool for forcing the search path to meet their needs. This is in place to give end-users the power to do last resort workarounds of buggy installations. Packagers shouldn't be taking this tool away from end users. The problem appears to be a bug in Tix. Tix apparently insists on being installed in a particular place realtive to [info library], and is broken if it is installed in other directories on the auto_path. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From dgporter@erols.com Thu Jul 3 16:08:53 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63L8rv27626 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 16:08:53 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVZIFAp6D8JOwPt/FDcVIHH2N3i8dDqMoJt6I+N8LBT2WtJ7bhhAHsX/aLUSCmGJUbo= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19YBK0-00014B-00; Thu, 03 Jul 2003 17:08:52 -0400 Message-ID: <3F049B64.2040802@erols.com> Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2003 17:08:52 -0400 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030521 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work References: <20030702125623.AAB24799@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20030702125623.AAB24799@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > I've a simple demo application I am trying to wrap. > $ cat ~/tixdemo.tcl > /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/Tix8.2.0: ... > DialogS.tcl FloatEnt.tcl PopMenu.tcl StdShell.tcl pkgIndex.tcl ... > DragDrop.tcl Init.tcl SListBox.tcl Utils.tcl > $ cat /home/lwv26/tixdemo.vfs/lib/Tix8.2.0/pkgIndex.tcl > > # Tcl package index file, version 1.0 > > package ifneeded Tix 8.2 \ > [list load [file join [file dirname $dir] libtix8.2g.so] Tix] > It appears that the fix for this Tix bug is to add the command set ::tix_library $dir to Tix's load script, so the above should be: if {![package vsatisfies [package provide Tcl] 8]} {return} package ifneeded Tix 8.2 " [list load [file join [file dirname $dir] libtix8.2.g.so] Tix] [list set ::tix_library $dir]" Does some Tix user want to contribute that to the Tix maintainers? -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From dgporter@erols.com Thu Jul 3 16:16:44 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63LGiv28460 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 16:16:44 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYsIVk5PHrqiLW20oSb+WC1sy0bxMppAKN4N3Y9HJ6JQUJL5jKdn0Wt5zOl0jg0K0k= Received: from hamming.cam.nist.gov ([129.6.88.137] helo=erols.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19YBRb-0002c6-00; Thu, 03 Jul 2003 17:16:43 -0400 Message-ID: <3F049D3A.1080206@erols.com> Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2003 17:16:42 -0400 From: Donald G Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030521 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dgporter@erols.com CC: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work References: <20030702125623.AAB24799@cas.org> <3F049B64.2040802@erols.com> In-Reply-To: <3F049B64.2040802@erols.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Donald G Porter wrote: > if {![package vsatisfies [package provide Tcl] 8]} {return} > package ifneeded Tix 8.2 " > [list load [file join [file dirname $dir] libtix8.2.g.so] Tix] > [list set ::tix_library $dir]" > > Does some Tix user want to contribute that to the Tix maintainers? On second thought, that change is not quite "generally correct" enough to go back into Tix, but it will take care of your specific problem of making (single architecture) Tix in a Starkit work. -- | Don Porter Mathematical and Computational Sciences Division | | donald.porter@nist.gov Information Technology Laboratory | | http://math.nist.gov/~DPorter/ NIST | |______________________________________________________________________| ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# From lvirden@cas.org Thu Jul 3 23:33:47 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h644Xlv25114 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 23:33:47 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h644XeO5021789 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 00:33:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h644Xdx28100; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 00:33:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 00:33:39 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030704003339.AAB28058@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 03 Jul 2003 16:42:40 -0400 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Donald G Porter > The problem appears to be a bug in Tix. Tix apparently insists on > being installed in a particular place realtive to [info library], and > is broken if it is installed in other directories on the auto_path. Looking at Tix initialization code, it appears to call tcl_findLibrary, which is documented as the means to find one's code. However, the algorithm tcl_findLibrary describes doesn't really work with tclkit/starkit - I think that tcl_findLibrary is going to need a bit of enhancement to work with tclkit/starkit . In fact, I am confused as how things are working now. Do most extensions set a global variable like tclxml_library or whatever to point inside the starkit? Otherwise, I would have thought tcl_findLibrary should be failing for any case where someone copies an extension from its installation directory into a starkit. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From usus@aladyn.de Fri Jul 4 04:00:43 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6490gv09950; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 04:00:42 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id C418E54B6E; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 11:00:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EA9C2C877; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 11:00:41 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Jean-Claude Wippler , "Starkit list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq (retry) Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 10:53:49 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <8603FC40-A7BB-11D7-9EAE-000A957664F8@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200307031750.43164.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-33.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Phew! I finally got it! The trick is to set X(g++) gcc and then following the instructions to build a static tclkit. Then you get a statically linked tclkit _with_ the ability to load shared libs. I extended the Makefile to include the target "tclkit-static". Best regards Ulrich On Thursday 26 June 2003 11:49, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > > I need a 8.4.2 tclkit for an ipaq and I am unable to compile it so that > > libstdc++ will be linked in statically. There's a 8.4.1 tclkit at > > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ so it must be possible to compile a tclkit > > for an ipaq. Which tricks/options/patches are necessary to compile? > > Tclkit 8.4.1 used to be built fully static on most platforms, i.e. with > the "-static" flag during linking. > > Tclkit 8.4.2 no longer does so, but getting the C++ libs linked static > while keeping C dynamic takes some voodoo and proper moon phases. > > Your best bet is probably to create a "genkit.local" file with > something like the following in it: > set X(g++) {g++ -static} > This creates a fully static app, with all libs linked statically. > > When building the kit target ("./genkit B kit"), check out the logs to > see that the -static flag was indeed passed in, i.e. "less > out/`hostname`/kit". > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From dgporter@erols.com Fri Jul 4 10:53:09 2003 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h64Fr8v02799 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 10:53:08 -0500 Received: from 66-44-6-44.s1568.apx1.lnh.md.dialup.rcn.com ([66.44.6.44] helo=there) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with smtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19YSrz-0005ae-00; Fri, 04 Jul 2003 11:53:08 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Don Porter Reply-To: dgporter@erols.com To: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 11:43:37 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] References: <20030704003339.AAB28058@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20030704003339.AAB28058@cas.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 04 July 2003 00:33, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Looking at Tix initialization code, it appears to call > tcl_findLibrary, which is documented as the means to find one's code. > However, the algorithm tcl_findLibrary describes doesn't really work > with tclkit/starkit - I think that tcl_findLibrary is going to need > a bit of enhancement to work with tclkit/starkit . Larry, thanks for reporting this problem with packages that use [tcl_findLibrary]. They do fail in a starkit, as you discovered, but the bug is in fact deeper than that. These packages rely on being installed in the "conventional" location (under TCL_EXEC_PREFIX and TCL_PREFIX) in order to work properly. Starkits are only one way to escape from that convention. Prompted by your report, I examined Tk and discovered it suffers from the same defect. See Tk Bug 765642 for full dissection and ideas about how to use new TIP 59 features to solve the problem. In fact, I am > confused as how things are working now. Do most extensions set a > global variable like tclxml_library or whatever to point inside the > starkit? Otherwise, I would have thought tcl_findLibrary should be > failing for any case where someone copies an extension from its > installation directory into a starkit. What other packages do you know of that make use of [tcl_findLibrary] ? Has there been an attempt to put any of them in a starkit? -- | Don Porter dgporter@erols.com | | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" | | -- Adam West as BATMAN | |______________________________________________________________________| From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Jul 4 11:29:45 2003 Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h64GTTv05399 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 11:29:44 -0500 Received: from rough.eurobios.com (ACBDFA75.ipt.aol.com [172.189.250.117]) by msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id AFD10300 (AUTH vincedarley); Fri, 4 Jul 2003 17:29:21 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030704172732.02580fb8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 17:29:10 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-Reply-To: References: <20030704003339.AAB28058@cas.org> <20030704003339.AAB28058@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: At 11:43 04/07/2003 -0400, Don Porter wrote: >What other packages do you know of that make use of >[tcl_findLibrary] ? Has there been an attempt to put any of >them in a starkit? The 'Plplotter' package uses tcl_findLibrary (at least I'm pretty sure it does), and that works inside a starkit... (it's on the starkit archive) Vince. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jul 4 16:37:05 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h64Lb5v26807 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 16:37:05 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h64LavO5017882 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 17:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h64LavP11462; Fri, 4 Jul 2003 17:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 17:36:57 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030704173657.AAB11155@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-Reply-To: of Fri, 4 Jul 2003 11:43:37 -0400 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Don Porter > What other packages do you know of that make use of > [tcl_findLibrary] ? Has there been an attempt to put any of > them in a starkit? I don't know how many more there are - some of the ones are: tclreadline tclx tix tk tkhtml vu vuwidgets -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Sat Jul 5 19:35:52 2003 Received: from web41901.mail.yahoo.com (web41901.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.152]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h660Zpv00591 for ; Sat, 5 Jul 2003 19:35:52 -0500 Message-ID: <20030706003546.87828.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41901.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 05 Jul 2003 17:35:46 PDT Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2003 17:35:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] core when wrapping Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, For reasons outside my control, I have to wrap a directory tree that contains a directory named core/ The sdx tool ignores several files, such as a.out, CVS and, here is my problem, core, as seen in line 241 of sdx.vfs/lib/app-sdx/sync.tcl Unfortunately, there is no way of 'unignoring' this with the wrap command. You have the option of doing -ignore with the sync command, though that will add to the list of names to ignore, not remove It should be easy to fix and make it configurable for the wrap command which names to ignore or 'unignore' Can you fix it? Alternatively, I can give it a try and submit a patch if you let me know which command line option name to use (--unignore ?) Thanks! PS: As a workaround I unwrapped sdx and removed core reference __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com From michael.jacobson@ngc.com Thu Jul 3 12:56:48 2003 Received: from xcgmd810.northgrum.com (xcgmd810.northgrum.com [155.104.240.104]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h63Humv08628 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 12:56:48 -0500 Received: by xcgmd810.northgrum.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 3 Jul 2003 10:57:54 -0700 Message-ID: <939BE12B0744D211BD5A00A0C9DA3D8708CE215C@xcgmd009.md.essd.northgrum.com> From: "Jacobson, Michael P." To: "'Vince Darley'" , Starkit list Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starpack (Win) without the "Tclkit, ..." message? Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 10:56:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince, > Has anyone worked out how to replace the "Tclkit, a standalone runtime for > Tcl/Tk" message and associated version number information embedded in a > Windows starpack with something else? I have used Resource Hacker @ http://www.users.on.net/johnson/resourcehacker/ to edit this and replace icons. Note that you can only do this with the non-upxed version of tclkit but then you can just upx it yourself. Michael Jacobson From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jul 8 08:36:33 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68DaWd16779 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 08:36:33 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDA1683B16 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 09:36:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 15:36:22 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <29EF725A-B149-11D7-ACCC-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] List should be back up Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a test. If you get this message, then it means that the mailing list is back up after a total server rebuild. The archives should be back as well, I don't think any messages or new posts were lost. Please don't reply to this message, I can track it on the server to see whether things are ok. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 8 09:10:16 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68EAFd19538 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 09:10:15 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h67L8XKf025714 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2003 14:08:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h67L8VYA003533 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2003 16:08:31 -0500 Message-ID: <3F09E14E.3070206@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2003 14:08:30 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] FYI: bug in starkit::startup procedure Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have run into bug in the starkit::startup procedure. This procedure should always return a key word that indicates the type of object that is being started (e.g. unwrapped, starkit, starpack, ...etc.). The bug occurs when a starpack is run on a solaris system but not on hpux systems. I don't have have information on other platforms. Here is what I have found. 1) create a test file that contains the following ----- file start ----- #!/bin/sh # the next line restarts this file using a tcl shell \ exec tclkit "$0" -- ${1+"$@"} package require starkit puts "##([starkit::startup])" ----- file end ----- 2) convert test file to starpack named "test" 3) create the following directory /disks/proj1 (which may require root access) 4) put the starpack (test) in the /disks/proj1 directory 3) create a soft link (/proj1) that points to the /disks/proj1 directory (this may alos require root access) /proj1 -> /disks/proj1 6) now execute the starpack using /disks/proj1/test and you will get ##(starpack) 5) but when you execute the starpack using /proj1/test and you will get ##(unwrapped) which is a bug. Regards, Tom Krehbiel P.S. I don't have control of the way systems are configured where my code is installed so don't blame me for the link. This bug was reported by a user who doesn't have root access. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 8 09:10:43 2003 Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68EAgd19575; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 09:10:42 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id h67GGUlj009873; Mon, 7 Jul 2003 09:16:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h67GGMYA025328; Mon, 7 Jul 2003 11:16:25 -0500 Message-ID: <3F099CD6.6040700@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2003 09:16:22 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rohan Pall CC: starkit@equi4.com, Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] bandwidth References: <44008.24.114.111.163.1057249697.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> In-Reply-To: <44008.24.114.111.163.1057249697.squirrel@webmail.rohanpall.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Rohan > I realize that I download the binaries a lot, and from many servers > accross the world which I adminster / am a member of. > > I can't afford an industrial license, but I firmly believe a man must pay > for another man's work. > > Is there a payment option? Contact Jean-Claude Wippler . It is my understanding that his company (Equi4) is largely responsible for the starkit technology. Tom K. From lvirden@cas.org Tue Jul 8 09:57:24 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68EvNd23904 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 09:57:23 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h68EvG1P028683 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 10:57:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h68EvGP20890; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 10:57:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 10:57:16 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030708105715.AAB20677@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] FYI: bug in starkit::startup procedure In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 07 Jul 2003 14:08:30 -0700 To: Starkit mailing list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am running Sparc solaris 8. Here's what I just did. 1. copied the script from your message into /tmp/tst.tcl 2. executed the script and got: ##(unwrapped) 3. ran sdx.kit qwrap /tmp/tst.tcl 4. ran the tst.kit and got: ##(sourced) 5. ran sdx.kit unwrap /tmp/tst.kit 6. ran sdx.kit wrap tst -runtime /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit 7. ran the resulting starpack /tmp/tst: ##(sourced) The tclkit in question is: $ sdx.kit version /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit 2003/04/02 11:45:13 37473-20079 /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit and sdx.kit is: $ sdx.kit version /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx.kit 2003/06/19 13:15:20 23418-11722 /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/sdx.kit $ uname -a SunOS lwv26awu 5.8 Generic_108528-16 sun4u sparc SUNW,Sun-Blade-100 -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 8 10:13:23 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68FDNd25415 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 10:13:23 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h68FDMKf027837 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 08:13:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h68FDKR2026357 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 10:13:20 -0500 Message-ID: <3F0ADF8E.9000307@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2003 08:13:18 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] FYI - library loading trick for starkit's Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This trick my be of interest if you need to use a package that contains hard links. I needed to use the Tkhtml package but found that it is hard linked to the zlib library which ment it couldn't be used except in the special case where the zlib library had been installed on the host system in the right location using the correct name for the library. This of course ment that Tkhtml can't be wrapped into a starkit. To over come this problem I did the following. ----- start of file ----- #!/bin/sh # the next line restarts this file using a tcl shell \ exec tclkit "$0" ${1+"$@"} package require starkit starkit::startup # The following is a nasty work-a-round that will allow the Tkhtml # module to be wrapped in a starkit. The Tkhtml module was linked # against the zlib library so we need to do a preload on the zlib # library so the functions calls will be resolved when Tkhtml is # loaded. The zlib.so file is deleted (below) after it has been # used by the Tkhtml module. This solution is only good for Solaris # and Linux. It will not work on HP-UX. if { ![info exists env(LD_PRELOAD)] } { # export the library to /var/tmp file copy -force [file join $::starkit::topdir lib libzlibtcl1.0.so] /var/tmp/libz.so # set permissions so other processes won't have problems file attributes /var/tmp/libz.so -permissions ugo+rwx # set the LD_PRELOAD environment variable to point to the library set env(LD_PRELOAD) /var/tmp/libz.so # the following lines restart the application a second time switch -exact [starkit::startup] { starpack { eval exec $::starkit::topdir $argv } starkit { eval exec [info nameofexecutable] $::starkit::topdir $argv } unwrapped { eval exec "$::starkit::topdir/[info script]" $argv } default { # bail-out } } # Done with the recursive call exit } package require Tk package require Tkhtml # remove the exported library file file delete /var/tmp/libz.so [...snip...] ----- end of file ----- Tom K. From wliao@generationec.com Tue Jul 8 12:52:23 2003 Received: from mail2.intermedia.net (mail2.intermedia.net [206.40.48.152]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68HqNd10682 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 12:52:23 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (unverified [192.94.73.2]) by mail2.intermedia.net (Rockliffe SMTPRA 4.5.6) with ESMTP id for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 10:51:41 -0700 Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 12:48:50 -0500 From: WL X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.62r) Personal Reply-To: starkit@equi4.com X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1316938638.20030708124850@generationec.com> To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] details on license for wikit.kit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hey, all. Silly me: I posted this to clt originally, then I remembered I can go straight to the horse's mouth, as it were.... Anyways, I'm trying to find some details about the license for wikit.kit. I'd like to incorporate format.tcl (Wikit::Format::*) into a project I'm working on. wikit.kit itself doesn't seem to have anything about it. Thanks a bunch. WL From jcw@equi4.com Tue Jul 8 12:58:37 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h68Hwad11429 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 12:58:37 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDC0283B16 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2003 13:58:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 19:58:27 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] details on license for wikit.kit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1316938638.20030708124850@generationec.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: WL wrote: > Anyways, I'm trying to find some details about the license for > wikit.kit. I'd like to incorporate format.tcl (Wikit::Format::*) > into a project I'm working on. > > wikit.kit itself doesn't seem to have anything about it. I've added a note to http://www.equi4.com/wikit : "Wikit is open source, any lawful use is permitted, an acknowledgement would be appreciated" -jcw From mel@redolive.com Wed Jul 9 02:04:24 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h6974Nd13927 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 02:04:23 -0500 Received: (qmail 32632 invoked by uid 511); 9 Jul 2003 07:59:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 9 Jul 2003 07:59:21 -0000 Message-ID: <000d01c345e8$5139d660$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 03:04:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] Starkit & my exeutable "iconbitmap" ??? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: i am creating executables on WinDoze2000 using tclkit and wish to set the "Executable's" iconbitmap to something other that TK(logo). is there a command to do this ? thanks From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Jul 9 02:11:11 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h697BBd14418 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 02:11:11 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id JAA16556 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 09:11:10 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA16129 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 09:10:58 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F0BC002.7202F214@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2003 09:10:58 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list References: <29EF725A-B149-11D7-ACCC-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] A useful utility? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, in two of the starkits that I have created, I use the console window as the medium to type in commands. To help the user understand what he/she can do, I have written a small set of commands that allow the user to get on-line help or to invoke a demo: % help Type "help command" for help on a command Type "help overview" for a list of commands Type "help general" for more information on this application For demos: "help demo" provides information % help demo Run a specific demo: demo name You can use the "which-demos" command to get an overview of the demos. The "extract-demos" command copies the source files to the current directory. % help display Create the canvas and show the grid and axis lines etc. Would it be a good idea to collect utilities such as this one (another tool could consist of procs to save and restore configuration files of the .xxxrc/INI style) into a generally available set of tools? Regards, Arjen From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Jul 9 02:14:56 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h697Esd14715 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 02:14:54 -0500 Received: (qmail 28606 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2003 07:14:50 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 09 Jul 2003 07:14:50 -0000 Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 15:14:47 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit & my exeutable "iconbitmap" ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: "STARKIT" To: "Mel" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <000d01c345e8$5139d660$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: <06095189-B1DD-11D7-A4B6-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 03:04 PM, Mel wrote: > i am creating executables on WinDoze2000 using tclkit and wish to set > the > "Executable's" > iconbitmap to something other that TK(logo). > > is there a command to do this ? Go to http://www.equi4.com/starkit and look for "Custom icons for Win32 starpacks" Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 9 04:59:39 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h699xdd27696 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 04:59:39 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h699xU1P026522 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 05:59:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h699xUi27847; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 05:59:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 05:59:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030709055930.AAB27826@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] A useful utility? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 09 Jul 2003 09:10:58 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I think making general tools like this available is a wonderful idea. As far as the help goes - it doesn't seem like it would be starkit specific, would it? It could become a general Tcllib library. In fact, I always wished I had time to split Tclx's help facility (and help files) out of that extension and then propose it be added to Tcl itself. As for saving and restoring config files - have you taken a look at the new tcllib ini file routines to see if you have functionality that could be added to it? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Jul 9 05:25:59 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69APwd29645 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 05:25:58 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id MAA06789 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 12:25:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA06635 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 12:25:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F0BEDAE.E07B6201@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2003 12:25:50 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] A useful utility? References: <20030709055930.AAB27826@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > I think making general tools like this available is a wonderful idea. > > As far as the help goes - it doesn't seem like it would be starkit specific, > would it? It could become a general Tcllib library. In fact, I always > wished I had time to split Tclx's help facility (and help files) out of that > extension and then propose it be added to Tcl itself. Yes, putting it in Tcllib is a nice alternative. > > As for saving and restoring config files - have you taken a look at the new > tcllib ini file routines to see if you have functionality that could > be added to it? I have looked at these routines. I do not like INI files as such - too little structure (and in my company they are sometimes used for - yuck - procedural tasks - why can they not listen and use Tcl instead?) I have not written any actual procs that could team up with the INI-procs, but I have been thinking about it. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 9 05:39:34 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69AdXd30747 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 05:39:34 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h69AdO1P009590 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:39:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h69AdOp28682; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:39:24 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:39:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030709063924.AAB28656@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] A useful utility? In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 09 Jul 2003 12:25:50 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Arjen Markus > > As for saving and restoring config files - have you taken a look at the new > > tcllib ini file routines to see if you have functionality that could > > be added to it? > > I have looked at these routines. I do not like INI files as such I obviously misunderstood your original question then. I apologize. My idea for most code is: If it seems of use to more than a small group of people, is tcl scriptable, and its license and contents are legal and 'safe' to add to Tcllib, I like to encourage people to talk to the tcllib maintainers and developers mailing list concerning the possibility of adding the code to the library. During that discussion, it is my hope that some consideration will be given to where the final distribution point should be - tcllib, tcl itself, or some separate package. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Jul 9 06:09:02 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69B91d00642 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:09:02 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id NAA09650 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 13:09:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA09366 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 13:08:51 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F0BF7C3.E6779BD0@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2003 13:08:51 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] A useful utility? References: <20030709063924.AAB28656@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > From: Arjen Markus > > > > As for saving and restoring config files - have you taken a look at the new > > > tcllib ini file routines to see if you have functionality that could > > > be added to it? > > > > I have looked at these routines. I do not like INI files as such > > I obviously misunderstood your original question then. I apologize. > My idea for most code is: > > If it seems of use to more than a small group of people, is tcl scriptable, > and its license and contents are legal and 'safe' to add to Tcllib, I like > to encourage people to talk to the tcllib maintainers and developers mailing > list concerning the possibility of adding the code to the library. > > During that discussion, it is my hope that some consideration will be > given to where the final distribution point should be - tcllib, tcl itself, > or some separate package. I quite agree with your point of view. As I was thinking of _starkits_ at the time, using config files to save state, user preferences and the like, I mentioned this in the same message. Yes, it would of course be potentially useful for a broader audience. Regards, Arjen From jgodfrey@optinest.com Wed Jul 9 10:42:20 2003 Received: from linux2.optinest.com ([208.188.206.250]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69FgJd26240 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 10:42:19 -0500 Received: from nt40ld ([208.188.206.132]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id h69FfFb14570 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 10:41:15 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 10:48:21 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit for AIX 4.3.3 and HPUX 10.2 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, I am in need of a tclkit binary for both IBM AIX 4.3.3 and HPUX 10.2. I have attempted to build both using genkit and the instructions posted on the equi4 website, but so far, haven't had much luck. I know that neither OS is exactly current, which when coupled with my *very* rusty (at best) Unix build skills are causing me more problems than I know how to deal with. I have had marginally better luck under AIX (Genkit step 2.1 completes, but most of step 2.2 fails for one reason or another (zlib and itcldyn complete OK)). I can't even get step 2.1 to complete on the HP system. Before I spend a lot of time slugging through pages of error messages that, for the most part, I don't understand... does anyone have tclkit binaries for either of these systems? I have asked for these in the past, but by the lack of response I assume they haven't existed... Short of that, is anyone familiar enough with either of these environments to provide me with some guidance? I can at least follow instructions and collect information well... ;^) Also, currently I only have access to the "vendor provided" compilers on both systems. I do not have any GNU compilers - although I could maybe go that route if necessary. Thanks for any binaries, assistance, or advice you can provide... Jeff Godfrey Optimation USA Phone: 816.836.2000 Fax : 816.836.8589 Email: mailto:jgodfrey@optinest.com From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jul 9 10:59:21 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69FxLd28220 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 10:59:21 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B104783BB4 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 11:59:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:59:15 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for AIX 4.3.3 and HPUX 10.2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit mailing list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <4A737FA2-B226-11D7-ACCC-000A957664F8@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > I am in need of a tclkit binary for both IBM AIX 4.3.3 and HPUX 10.2. > I > have attempted to build both using genkit and the instructions posted > on the > equi4 website, but so far, haven't had much luck. As someone who shall remain nameless, and who contributes to this mailing list will probably be quick to point out (), the trouble generally comes from the C++ requirements of Metakit ;) The key issue seems to be to first of all figure out what mix of compilers to use - please check the equi4 website for some (minimal) info about previous build experiences, i.e. http://www.equi4.com/admin/edit.cgi/223 http://www.equi4.com/admin/edit.cgi/228 I have access to neither platform (which probably also explains why things are not in better shape by now), and I'm a few days from going off on vacation so I won't be able to help you right now. Things which would really be helpful, and perhaps others can fill in those gaps, is to understand what platform versions there are on both AIX and HP-UX, and to what extent things are portable between them. Note that you can manually investigate problems component by component. Just go to build/`hostname`// and try to adjust makefiles, tupe "make", etc. FWIW, I am quite *eager* to resolve such issues, now that we've come so far. Evidently most new ports are likely to be the tough cases :( - But it will have to wait as far as my participation is concerned. Good luck with the ports. -jcw From usus@aladyn.de Wed Jul 9 10:59:24 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69FxNd28224 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 10:59:23 -0500 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 1BF5C54C74; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:59:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC206547F4 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:59:21 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: Starkit list Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:51:35 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200307091751.35030.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-20.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_01,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, a tclkit for the Compaq iPAQ under the 'familiar' Linux distribution and gpe (contains an X server) is now available at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/tclkit-linux-arm.gz I tested it with several game starkits, snack (cool.tcl) and mysqltcl. Everything works fine. Best regards Ulrich From jgodfrey@optinest.com Wed Jul 9 11:17:01 2003 Received: from linux2.optinest.com ([208.188.206.250]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h69GH1d30355 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 11:17:01 -0500 Received: from nt40ld ([208.188.206.132]) by linux2.optinest.com (8.11.6/8.11.3) with SMTP id h69GFub15018 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2003 11:15:56 -0500 From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: "Starkit mailing list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit for AIX 4.3.3 and HPUX 10.2 Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 11:23:03 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <4A737FA2-B226-11D7-ACCC-000A957664F8@equi4.com> Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2003 10:59 AM > To: Starkit mailing list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for AIX 4.3.3 and HPUX 10.2 > The key issue seems to be to first of all figure out what mix of > compilers to use - please check the equi4 website for some (minimal) > info about previous build experiences, i.e. > http://www.equi4.com/admin/edit.cgi/223 > http://www.equi4.com/admin/edit.cgi/228 Hmmm.. I think those links should be: http://www.equi4.com/223 http://www.equi4.com/228 Unfortunately, I have read both of those already. The notes on the AIX page did allow me to get a bit further in the process, but still no luck... > and I'm a few days from going off on vacation so I won't be able to help you right now. Well, as long as it was planned *before* my post.... ;^) > FWIW, I am quite *eager* to resolve such issues, now that we've come so > far. Evidently most new ports are likely to be the tough cases :( - > But it will have to wait as far as my participation is concerned. I am also *eager* to resolve these issues. I have been working on a rather large tcl based project for a while now. I have attempted these builds at various points in the project's history but have always failed... at which point I pushed them to the back burner in hopes that things would become easier as time marched on. I am now nearing the point where they can no longer be ignored... Anyway, thanks for the response and the info. I'll keep playing... Jeff From welch@panasas.com Sat Jul 12 00:35:02 2003 Received: from medlicott.panasas.com ([63.80.58.202]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6C5Z2m19341 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 00:35:02 -0500 Received: from panasas.com (welch@localhost) by medlicott.panasas.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6C5VlP03623; Fri, 11 Jul 2003 22:31:48 -0700 Message-Id: <200307120531.h6C5VlP03623@medlicott.panasas.com> X-Authentication-Warning: medlicott.panasas.com: welch owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/02/2003 with nmh-1.0.4 To: "Brian Theado" cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-reply-to: <002201c3419e$0f347480$6401a8c0@desktop123456> References: <20030703073042.AAB28853@cas.org> <002201c3419e$0f347480$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Comments: In-reply-to "Brian Theado" message dated "Thu, 03 Jul 2003 16:02:40 -0400." From: Brent Welch X-URL: http://www.panasas.com/ X-Face: "HxE|?EnC9fVMV8f70H83&{fgLE.|FZ^$>@Q(yb#N,Eh~N]e&]=> r5~UnRml1:4EglY{9B+ :'wJq$@c_C!l8@<$t,{YUr4K,QJGHSvS~U]H`<+L*x?eGzSk>XH\W:AK\j?@?c1o List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Does it make sense to override tcl_findLibrary so "it just works" within a starkit ? >>>"Brian Theado" said: > "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > Re: setting TIX_LIBRARY > > > > I just wish I understood _why_ this was necessary. It isn't necessary > > with the copy of the code installed on my real disk. > > > > From your previous post, the error comes from tcl_findLibrary. From > http://www.tcl.tk/man/tcl8.4/TclCmd/library.htm#M12: > > "Otherwise the search looks in these directories: the directory named by the > environment variable enVarName; relative to the Tcl library directory; > relative to the executable file in the standard installation bin or bin/arch > directory; relative to the executable file in the current build tree; > relative to the executable file in a parallel build tree." > > With tclkit, the Tcl library directory is within tclkit, so unless you build > Tix into tclkit, it won't find the init.tcl file that way. > > One idea is to set env(TIX_LIBRARY) within Tix's pkgIndex.tcl file to be > $starkit::topdir/lib/. > > Brian Theado > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Brent Welch Software Architect, Panasas Inc Delivering the World's Most Scalable and Agile Storage Network www.panasas.com welch@panasas.com From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jul 12 06:32:20 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6CBWKm30260 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 06:32:20 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h6CBWARS012522; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 07:32:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h6CBWB521372; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 07:32:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 07:32:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030712073211.AAB21353@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-Reply-To: <200307120531.h6C5VlP03623@medlicott.panasas.com> of Fri, 11 Jul 2003 22:31:47 -0700 To: Brent Welch Cc: "Brian Theado" , starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: An overall solution to the problem really is needed - we've seen two or three non-starkit related reports of this problem in the past month on comp.lang.tcl - people who want or need to install an extension somewhere other than $prefix . For instance, a user who has no admin privleges installing the extension in their own directory. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jul 12 07:03:09 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6CC39m31166 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 07:03:09 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A87883D3E for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:03:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 14:03:02 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030712073211.AAB21353@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > An overall solution to the problem really is needed - we've seen two or > three non-starkit related reports of this problem in the past month > on comp.lang.tcl - people who want or need to install an extension > somewhere > other than $prefix . For instance, a user who has no admin > privleges installing the extension in their own directory. I always just do "lapped auto_path /path/to/some/dir/with/extensions" at the start of my app/script - though for anything related to deployment, it's really simply postponing the issue, since that won't work on other machines. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Sat Jul 12 07:20:03 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6CCK2m31676 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 07:20:02 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h6CCJsRS017226 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:19:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h6CCJtk22203; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:19:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:19:55 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030712081955.AAB22194@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem getting starkit app to work In-Reply-To: of Sat, 12 Jul 2003 14:03:02 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I believe that Don, Andreas, Jeff, etc. discovered that auto_path doesn't help with tcl findlibrary though - it doesn't look there... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jul 12 11:42:43 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6CGggm07151 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 11:42:42 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id D644683D3E for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 12:42:36 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 18:42:35 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <65160.209.233.24.218.1058024178.squirrel@mod3.net> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Problem building Metakit 2.4.9.2 on Solaris 2.8 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jacob Levy wrote: > ld: fatal: library -lstdc++: not found Perhaps this previous post helps find a solution: http://trixie.triqs.com/pipermail/metakit/2003-July/001238.html -jcw From wojciech@kocjan.org Sat Jul 12 12:22:02 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (mail@bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6CHM1m08673 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 12:22:01 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19bO4N-0001HA-00 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 19:21:59 +0200 Message-ID: <3F1043BE.1050805@kocjan.org> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 19:22:06 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1; MultiZilla v1.4.0.3J) Gecko/20030425 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Does anyone find this useful? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello. I'm writing a software that will be based on modular construction. That is, most classes/functions are provided as modules (vfs::mk4 based or directory - the second one is mostly for testing). Anyway, the thing that's most interesting is that 'package require' works. This means that I can have 'modules/tcllib.kit', (with tcllib.kit/base64/base64.tcl) then do 'modules::init ./modules' and 'package require base64' will work. It is based on globbing tcllib.kit/*/pkgIndex.tcl and reading those (and then wrapping the package ifneeded in mount+unmount). Is anyone interested in this module? -- WK From btheado@rrohio.com Sat Jul 12 20:21:38 2003 Received: from email-out-01.biz.rr.com (email-out-01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6D1Lcm27443 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 20:21:38 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by email-out-01.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h6D1LcDh025074 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 21:21:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hplaptop ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030713012137.IYFT12576.fep01.biz.rr.com@hplaptop> for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 21:21:37 -0400 Message-ID: <000701c348dd$1bfdb550$b54ffea9@hplaptop> From: "Brian Theado" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Does anyone find this useful? Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 21:21:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Wojciech Kocjan wojciech@kocjan.org wrote:>Anyway, the thing that's most interesting is that 'package require' >works. This means that I can have 'modules/tcllib.kit', (with >tcllib.kit/base64/base64.tcl) then do 'modules::init ./modules' and >'package require base64' will work.I was disappointed when I downloaded tcllib.kit from sourceforge and found the starkit was simply a wrapper for the install script.I was hoping it would be setup using the convention of other librarystarkits like kitten.kit and http://mini.net/sdarchive/tcllib.kit where a simple 'source tcllib.kit' and then 'package require base64'would just work. I guess I should post this complaint to the tclliblist as it may be easy to fix (i.e. only run the installer if thestarkit is run standalone as opposed to sourced).>It is based on globbing tcllib.kit/*/pkgIndex.tcl and reading those (and >then wrapping the package ifneeded in mount+unmount).>Is anyone interested in this module?If all starkits followed the convention that 'source star.kit' worked,then I would prefer using that. Unless what you've done is somethingdifferent from what I understand?Brian Theado From btheado@rrohio.com Sat Jul 12 20:32:50 2003 Received: from email-out-01.biz.rr.com (email-out-01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6D1Wom27822 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 20:32:50 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by email-out-01.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h6D1WoDh026269 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 21:32:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hplaptop ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030713013249.IYGJ12576.fep01.biz.rr.com@hplaptop> for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2003 21:32:49 -0400 Message-ID: <000e01c348de$ac9dace0$b54ffea9@hplaptop> From: "Brian Theado" To: References: <000701c348dd$1bfdb550$b54ffea9@hplaptop> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Does anyone find this useful? Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 21:32:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: [Reposted with fixed formatting] Wojciech Kocjan wojciech@kocjan.org wrote: >Anyway, the thing that's most interesting is that 'package require' >works. This means that I can have 'modules/tcllib.kit', (with >tcllib.kit/base64/base64.tcl) then do 'modules::init ./modules' and >'package require base64' will work. I was disappointed when I downloaded tcllib.kit from sourceforge and found the starkit was simply a wrapper for the install script.I was hoping it would be setup using the convention of other librarystarkits like kitten.kit and http://mini.net/sdarchive/tcllib.kit where a simple 'source tcllib.kit' and then 'package require base64'would just work. I guess I should post this complaint to the tclliblist as it may be easy to fix (i.e. only run the installer if thestarkit is run standalone as opposed to sourced). >It is based on globbing tcllib.kit/*/pkgIndex.tcl and reading those (and >then wrapping the package ifneeded in mount+unmount). >Is anyone interested in this module? If all starkits followed the convention that 'source star.kit' worked,then I would prefer using that. Unless what you've done is somethingdifferent from what I understand? Brian Theado From wojciech@kocjan.org Sun Jul 13 05:10:16 2003 Received: from bart.nowiny.net (bart.nowiny.net [213.25.140.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6DAA4m19861 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 05:10:08 -0500 Received: from zoro2.nowiny.net ([213.25.140.6] helo=kocjan.org) by bart.nowiny.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19bdnP-0005hc-00 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 12:09:31 +0200 Message-ID: <3F112FE2.4020700@kocjan.org> Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 12:09:38 +0200 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030425 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Does anyone find this useful? References: <000701c348dd$1bfdb550$b54ffea9@hplaptop> <000e01c348de$ac9dace0$b54ffea9@hplaptop> In-Reply-To: <000e01c348de$ac9dace0$b54ffea9@hplaptop> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > I was disappointed when I downloaded tcllib.kit from sourceforge and found > the starkit was simply a wrapper for the install script. The tcllib was just an example :-) >>It is based on globbing tcllib.kit/*/pkgIndex.tcl and reading those (and >>then wrapping the package ifneeded in mount+unmount). >>Is anyone interested in this module? > If all starkits followed the convention that 'source star.kit' > worked,then I would prefer using that. Right. > Unless what you've done is > somethingdifferent from what I understand? Just out of curiosity - source tcllib.kit/kitten.kit reads all the package ifneeded and leaves the kit mounted? If so, then the first difference is that I do "mount-on-demand", so that the kit can be overwritten (mostly Windows issue) at any time. Another difference is that I split a module in two parts: 1/ packages - available through 'package require' - for loading procs, classes and other general use code 2/ init.tcl/fini.tcl - this is done upon loading/unloading a module - for example when the module is loaded, it creates a toplevel with some functions; when it is unloaded, it destroys the toplevel. There is also code to read some msgcat-enabled meta information - for example module's shortname, fullname, version and so on. But those are optional and used mostly for modulelist window, which allows loading/unloading a module. -- WK From btheado@rrohio.com Sun Jul 13 14:41:19 2003 Received: from email-out-01.biz.rr.com (email-out-01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6DJfIX07527 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 14:41:18 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by email-out-01.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h6DJfIDh022246 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 15:41:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hplaptop ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030713194117.JASO12576.fep01.biz.rr.com@hplaptop> for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 15:41:17 -0400 Message-ID: <002301c34976$bba88d20$b54ffea9@hplaptop> From: "Brian Theado" To: "starkit" References: <000701c348dd$1bfdb550$b54ffea9@hplaptop> <000e01c348de$ac9dace0$b54ffea9@hplaptop> <3F112FE2.4020700@kocjan.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Does anyone find this useful? Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 15:41:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > Just out of curiosity - source tcllib.kit/kitten.kit reads all the > package ifneeded and leaves the kit mounted? If so, then the first > difference is that I do "mount-on-demand", so that the kit can be > overwritten (mostly Windows issue) at any time. Essentially yes. In particular, "source tcllib.kit" mounts the starkit and extends the auto_path to include the lib subdirectory in the kit. The package ifneeded will be read upon the invocation of package require. The starkit remains mounted. Brian Theado From btheado@rrohio.com Sun Jul 13 18:36:30 2003 Received: from outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (outbound-relay.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6DNaUX16767 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 18:36:30 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h6DNaUIe017945 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 19:36:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hplaptop ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030713233629.JCNA12576.fep01.biz.rr.com@hplaptop> for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2003 19:36:29 -0400 Message-ID: <002b01c34997$97014cc0$b54ffea9@hplaptop> From: "Brian Theado" To: "starkit" Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 19:36:31 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [Starkit] runkit script with kitpath functionality Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Here is a script that allows a Tcl script to be executed using the libraries contained within a separate starkit. The following example executes a script foo.tcl which contains a package require tdom: tclkit runkit.tcl -kitpath tdom.kit foo.tcl I use this when developing an application that is checked out from CVS. The checked out CVS directory doesn't have any of the dependent third party libraries. I have these libraries wrapped in a separate starkit. I then use runkit along with this library starkit to run my unit tests and to run the entire application (main.tcl) during development. Then creating a deployable application starkit is a simple matter of copy libs.kit app.kit sdx sync appcvsdir app.kit Here is runkit.tcl: if {[lindex $argv 0] == "-kitpath"} { foreach path [lindex $argv 1] { source $path } set argv [lrange $argv 2 end] } set script [lindex $argv 0] # starkit::topdir from the first sourced starkit sticks, but the script # being run needs it to be relative to itself set starkit::topdir [file normalize [file dirname $script]] # Fool starkit::startup into thinking this script is not being sourced set argv0 $script source $script If anyone else finds this useful, then maybe it is a good fit for sdx? Brian Theado From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Jul 15 11:08:29 2003 Received: from motgate6.mot.com (motgate6.mot.com [144.189.100.106]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6FG8SX11101; Tue, 15 Jul 2003 11:08:29 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate6.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate6) with ESMTP id h6FG8SIP001093; Tue, 15 Jul 2003 09:08:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h6FG8R4e014778; Tue, 15 Jul 2003 11:08:28 -0500 Message-ID: <3F1426F9.2020800@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2003 09:08:25 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list CC: metakit@equi4.com References: <80256D64.00540FF6.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> In-Reply-To: <80256D64.00540FF6.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Deleting rows in multi-user environment. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Adrian, > I am developing a multi-user application using TCL/metakit. The users > access/update the database through a "server" process. > When a user deletes a row using the row-ID the row-IDs of subsequent rows > change. Therefore row-ID references that other users have become invalid. > > Is there a "metakit" method to identify a row so that when a row is deleted by > one user, other users references are still valid? Since your using Tcl, you should use tclkit as the executable (which has metakit included). See http://www.equi4.com/ for infor on Tclkit and Starkit info. Also at this sight is Tequila which is the solution to your problem. It provides an elegent shared global array throuth a server which can be tied to the metakit database. Tom K. From guenther.fischer@hrz.tu-chemnitz.de Wed Jul 16 04:58:11 2003 Received: from tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de [134.109.132.38]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6G9wAX21779 for ; Wed, 16 Jul 2003 04:58:10 -0500 Received: from hedwig.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.173] helo=mailbox.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de) by tom.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19cj33-0001ra-00; Wed, 16 Jul 2003 11:58:09 +0200 Received: from bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de ([134.109.132.46]) by mailbox.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 19cj32-0007MS-Ne; Wed, 16 Jul 2003 11:58:08 +0200 Received: from localhost (fischer@localhost) by bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6G9w8E07866; Wed, 16 Jul 2003 11:58:08 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: bruford.hrz.tu-chemnitz.de: fischer owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2003 11:58:08 +0200 (MEST) From: Guenther Fischer To: Ulrich Schoebel cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for ipaq In-Reply-To: <200307091751.35030.usus@aladyn.de> Message-ID: References: <200307091751.35030.usus@aladyn.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *19cj33-0001ra-00*Qeyjv4qrWew* Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I've tried your tclkit-linux-arm.gz on an IPAQ with opie and qpe. I call the tclkit-linux-arm I can do tcl commands like package require Tk ... If I try my Starpack wkv build with sdx wrap wkv -runtime tclkit-linux-arm I get an error: Couldn't load file /tmp/tcl0GwAri ... in order to package require Tkhtml ... it is part of my wkv.vfs/lib/tkhtml0.0/... Any idea? On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > Hi all, > > a tclkit for the Compaq iPAQ under the 'familiar' Linux distribution > and gpe (contains an X server) is now available at > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/tclkit-linux-arm.gz > > I tested it with several game starkits, snack (cool.tcl) and mysqltcl. > Everything works fine. > > Best regards > > Ulrich > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- ~Guenther Fischer From mel@redolive.com Tue Jul 22 19:04:48 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h6N04lL08155 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:04:47 -0500 Received: (qmail 26023 invoked by uid 511); 23 Jul 2003 00:59:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 23 Jul 2003 00:59:27 -0000 Message-ID: <01d401c350ae$063da260$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:04:45 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] Question... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: can i update a file within my kit with the one on a hard drive ? if so, how ? thanks, Mel From yeksoon@neuSteps.com Tue Jul 22 23:11:40 2003 Received: from neusteps.com ([202.172.231.133]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6N4BdL22853 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 23:11:39 -0500 Received: from zeus.neuSteps.com (cm81.omega78.maxonline.com.sg [218.186.78.81]) (authenticated) by neusteps.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6N4Ba630075 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 12:11:37 +0800 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20030723120039.028c3018@pop3.myrealbox.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 12:04:05 +0800 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Lok Yek Soon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-3C0B5293; boundary="=======19C8D5E=======" Subject: [Starkit] How to run tclhttpd as service? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=======19C8D5E======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-3C0B5293; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi, How can I run a "tclhttpd.kit" as an NT service? I am using tclhttpd3.4.2 and Tclkit 8.4.2. Thanks YekSoon --=======19C8D5E======= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-avg=cert; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-3C0B5293 Content-Disposition: inline --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.500 / Virus Database: 298 - Release Date: 10-Jul-03 --=======19C8D5E=======-- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Jul 23 06:00:10 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6NB09L27251 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 06:00:10 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h6NAxwZc019206 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 07:00:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h6NAxwJ24104; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 06:59:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 06:59:58 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030723065958.AAB24085@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Question... In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:04:45 -0400 To: "STARKIT" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: There are different ways to update a file in your starkit: * unwrap the starkit, copy the new file into the .vfs directory created, and then wrap the starkit again * create the starkit writable, and then add code in your application to update files -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mark@markroseman.com Wed Jul 23 07:18:26 2003 Received: from fep3.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6NCIPL01094 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 07:18:26 -0500 Received: from markroseman.com (d141-166-106.home.cgocable.net [24.141.166.106]) by fep3.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05E5BE37 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 08:18:24 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 08:21:18 -0400 Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to run tclhttpd as service? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Mark Roseman To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.2.20030723120039.028c3018@pop3.myrealbox.com> Message-Id: <29C296BD-BD08-11D7-AF0C-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > How can I run a "tclhttpd.kit" as an NT service? I am using > tclhttpd3.4.2 and Tclkit 8.4.2. > The latest TclDevKit from ActiveState has some facilities for running Tcl applications as an NT service. You might also want to look at http://www.firedaemon.com/ which allows you to install most any application as a service. Haven't tried it specifically with TclHttpd, but we use it with CourseForum/ProjectForum all the time. Mark From jeffh@ActiveState.com Wed Jul 23 19:25:26 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6O0PQL09451 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 19:25:26 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h6O0PGjb014330 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:25:16 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h6O0PGD2023045 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:25:16 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] How to run tclhttpd as service? Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:25:15 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <29C296BD-BD08-11D7-AF0C-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > How can I run a "tclhttpd.kit" as an NT service? I am using > > tclhttpd3.4.2 and Tclkit 8.4.2. > The latest TclDevKit from ActiveState has some facilities for running > Tcl applications as an NT service. The current Tcl Dev Kit does not create kits itself when you make a service, though it can (just not through the UI). An upcoming version of Tcl Dev Kit will have this functionality. > You might also want to look at http://www.firedaemon.com/ which allows > you to install most any application as a service. Haven't tried it > specifically > with TclHttpd, but we use it with CourseForum/ProjectForum all the time. I looked at that when building the TclSvc stuff. What TDK has is almost the same thing, except targetted towards Tcl script users. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From yeksoon@neuSteps.com Thu Jul 24 01:18:34 2003 Received: from neusteps.com ([202.172.231.133]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6O6IVL00847 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 01:18:32 -0500 Received: from zeus.neuSteps.com (cm81.omega78.maxonline.com.sg [218.186.78.81]) (authenticated) by neusteps.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6O6IM609613; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 14:18:22 +0800 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20030724140751.02792320@neusteps.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 14:10:00 +0800 To: Mark Roseman , starkit@equi4.com From: Lok Yek Soon Subject: Re: [Starkit] How to run tclhttpd as service? In-Reply-To: <29C296BD-BD08-11D7-AF0C-0003939931E6@markroseman.com> References: <5.2.0.9.2.20030723120039.028c3018@pop3.myrealbox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-586A561; boundary="=======5F115BF6=======" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=======5F115BF6======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-586A561; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit At 08:21 AM 23-07-03 -0400, Mark Roseman wrote: >>How can I run a "tclhttpd.kit" as an NT service? I am using tclhttpd3.4.2 >>and Tclkit 8.4.2. > > >The latest TclDevKit from ActiveState has some facilities for running >Tcl applications as an NT service. > >You might also want to look at http://www.firedaemon.com/ which allows >you to install most any application as a service. Haven't tried it >specifically >with TclHttpd, but we use it with CourseForum/ProjectForum all the time. > >Mark > I tried out Firedaemon Lite and have "tclhttpd.kit" running as a service in less than a minute. Thanks for the suggestion. YekSoon --=======5F115BF6======= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-avg=cert; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-586A561 Content-Disposition: inline --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.500 / Virus Database: 298 - Release Date: 10-Jul-03 --=======5F115BF6=======-- From Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk Thu Jul 24 03:25:21 2003 Received: from pixfirewall (newpost.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.199.153]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6O8PKL11069 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 03:25:21 -0500 Received: from lmx.lewisham.gov.uk (lmx.lewisham.gov.uk [193.195.207.18]) by pixfirewall (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA23414 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 09:12:51 +0100 Received: by lmx.lewisham.gov.uk(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.7 (934.1 12-30-1999)) id 80256D6D.002E58D8 ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 09:26:14 +0100 X-Lotus-FromDomain: LEWISHAM From: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <80256D6D.002E5871.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 09:26:12 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit for AIX? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Is there a Tclkit 8.4.2 executable available for AIX 4.3? Many Thanks, =Adrian= Information in this message is confidential and may also be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender, and then please delete the message from your system immediately. From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Jul 24 04:20:18 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h6O9KHL15466 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 04:20:17 -0500 Received: (qmail 31050 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2003 09:20:13 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 24 Jul 2003 09:20:13 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 17:20:11 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit for AIX? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <80256D6D.002E5871.00@lmx.lewisham.gov.uk> Message-Id: <06E55754-BDB8-11D7-B38F-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, July 24, 2003, at 04:26 PM, Adrian.Davis@lewisham.gov.uk wrote: > Is there a Tclkit 8.4.2 executable available for AIX 4.3? I did the port of 8.4.1 which reportedly works on 4.3. Others have discussed building 8.4.2 but I'm not aware of anyone actually having done it. I've taken the approach that I won't be doing another build for AIX until there is a major release of Tcl (i.e. 8.5) or if a paying customer requests it. It really was a pain to get the right combination of C/C++ compilers and linkers :-( I'll be surprised if the 8.4.1 version doesn't meet your needs - see http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.1/tclkit-aix-ppc.gz. Cheers Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From rjackson@nmcourts.com Thu Jul 24 11:20:27 2003 Received: from jidmail.nmcourts.com ([198.59.128.143]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6OGKRL18347 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 11:20:27 -0500 Received: from nmcourts.com ([198.59.128.94]) by jidmail.nmcourts.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.4 release 224 ID# 0-59782U3000L300S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 10:20:21 -0600 Message-ID: <3F200783.2010306@nmcourts.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 10:21:23 -0600 From: rjackson@nmcourts.com (Robert E. Jackson) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] tclkit vs isql.dll Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On a WinNT box using ActiveState tcl*, my isql.dll (Informix) works like a champ. However when using isql.dll with tclkit, I can run a few queries, and then I get an exception. Would building tclkit using mingw32(msys) and then recreating the isql.dll solve this problem? If so, then how can I build tclkit using mingw32(msys)? Bob Jackson From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Jul 24 12:18:38 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6OHIcL23724 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 12:18:38 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h6OHIWkA027423; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 10:18:32 -0700 Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h6OHIVD2030558; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 10:18:31 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Robert E. Jackson" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] tclkit vs isql.dll Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 10:18:28 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3F200783.2010306@nmcourts.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > On a WinNT box using ActiveState tcl*, my isql.dll (Informix) works > like a champ. > > However when using isql.dll with tclkit, I can run a few queries, > and then I get an exception. This looks like an extension that is not stubs-enabled, which is necessary for tclkit extensions. You will need to fix the extension. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From rjackson@nmcourts.com Thu Jul 24 13:13:27 2003 Received: from jidmail.nmcourts.com ([198.59.128.143]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h6OIDRL28798 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 13:13:27 -0500 Received: from nmcourts.com ([198.59.128.94]) by jidmail.nmcourts.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.4 release 224 ID# 0-59782U3000L300S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2003 12:13:20 -0600 Message-ID: <3F2021FE.1040703@nmcourts.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 12:14:22 -0600 From: rjackson@nmcourts.com (Robert E. Jackson) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Problem solved Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: That was it. To quote Elvis: Thank You Very Much. Bob Jeff Hobbs wrote: >> On a WinNT box using ActiveState tcl*, my isql.dll (Informix) works >> like a champ. >> >> However when using isql.dll with tclkit, I can run a few queries, >> and then I get an exception. > > > > This looks like an extension that is not stubs-enabled, which is > necessary for tclkit extensions. You will need to fix the extension. > > Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy > Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ > Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions > From jeff_godfrey@pobox.com Tue Aug 19 14:00:53 2003 Received: from dewey.iland.net (dewey.iland.net [205.242.230.201]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h7JJ0rD02180 for ; Tue, 19 Aug 2003 14:00:53 -0500 Received: (qmail 18748 invoked from network); 19 Aug 2003 19:00:50 -0000 Received: from wbrg-dialup-216-74-200-213.iland.net (HELO quantex) (216.74.200.213) by dewey.iland.net with SMTP; 19 Aug 2003 19:00:50 -0000 Message-ID: <004601c36684$2e3446c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Reply-To: "Jeff Godfrey" From: "Jeff Godfrey" To: Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2003 14:00:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 8/12/03), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Subject: [Starkit] 8.4.4 builds of tclkit? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi All, This list seems a bit slow lately... Anyway, I'm curious what the upgrade policy is for the tclkit's maintained on the equi4 site? The latest builds there seem to be based on tcl 8.4.2 and were released in March-03. At what point will those builds be upgraded to 8.4.4? Truth-be-told, I'm asking for purely selfish reasons, as 8.4.4 has a bug-fix that I would really like to have in tclkit form, but I don't have the necessary tools (or skills?) to build it myself. Ultimately, I am looking for 8.4.4 on multiple platforms, but the PC is the hot one right now. If the builds on the equi4 site are not scheduled for an upgrade any time soon, does anyone have a PC version of an 8.4.4 tclkit they'd be willing to give to me? Thanks for any input. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Tue Aug 19 16:30:39 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7JLUcD17339 for ; Tue, 19 Aug 2003 16:30:38 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (10.0.1.117 [10.0.1.117]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81D8A83CC9 for ; Tue, 19 Aug 2003 23:30:32 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2003 23:30:31 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] 8.4.4 builds of tclkit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <004601c36684$2e3446c0$0101a8c0@quantex> Message-Id: <5C52E228-D28C-11D7-BD33-000A95A26344@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jeff Godfrey wrote: > This list seems a bit slow lately... Summer (on the Northern hemisphere), no doubt. > Anyway, I'm curious what the upgrade policy is for the tclkit's > maintained > on the equi4 site? The latest builds there seem to be based on tcl > 8.4.2 > and were released in March-03. At what point will those builds be > upgraded > to 8.4.4? Truth-be-told, I'm asking for purely selfish reasons, as > 8.4.4 > has a bug-fix that I would really like to have in tclkit form, but I > don't > have the necessary tools (or skills?) to build it myself. > > Ultimately, I am looking for 8.4.4 on multiple platforms, but the PC > is the > hot one right now. If the builds on the equi4 site are not scheduled > for an > upgrade any time soon, does anyone have a PC version of an 8.4.4 tclkit > they'd be willing to give to me? I've just built and uploaded new http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/win32* files. Please give them a whirl. If they make sense, I'll create an 8.4.4 area to collect new builds in. Only changes in this build as far as I can tell: - tcl/tk 8.4.4 - everything else: latest CVS sources - cleaner 48x48 icon (thx Aaron ) -jcw From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Wed Aug 20 05:48:45 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7KAmhD07054; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 05:48:44 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h7KAmgS27337; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:48:42 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.0.0.44) with SMTP id M2003082020484117788 ; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:48:41 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h7KAmeh27329; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:48:40 +1000 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7KAmeMj005775; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:48:40 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:48:38 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] 8.4.4 builds of tclkit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit list To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Steve Landers From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <5C52E228-D28C-11D7-BD33-000A95A26344@equi4.com> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday, Aug 20, 2003, at 07:30 Australia/Sydney, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > I've just built and uploaded new > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/win32* files. Please give them a > whirl. If they make sense, I'll create an 8.4.4 area to collect new > builds in. FWIW, I've built tclkit 8.4.4 for Mac OS X with no trouble, it's included it with my latest TclTkAqua BI. I've just updated & rebuilt to make sure I had the latest sources (nothing was new since the BI release), the relevant files are here http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/tclkit/ i.e. final binary, result of 'genkit C' and runtime.kit used (updated with 8.4.4 lib files). this is built on 10.2 but runs on 10.1 as well thanks to a somewhat hackish tcl make override I've made in genkit, c.f http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/HEAD/patches/tclkit.diff (this change was made since the BI release, i.e. the tclkit in the BI doesn't run on 10.1...) The other change in that patch is to ensure that metakit is compiled with g++ 3.1 even when g++ 3.3 is installed (metakit currently crashes hard when built with g++3.3 on OSX). JC, also note http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/HEAD/patches/sdx.diff http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/HEAD/patches/wikit.diff http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/HEAD/patches/critcl.diff http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/HEAD/patches/critlib.diff sdx.diff has the changes between the latest sdx.kit and the sdx CVS, looks like the latest revision didn't get checked in... wikit.diff adds a named footer to allow for separate styling. c.f. e.g. what I do on http://alphatcl.sourceforge.net/ (note that the CSS on wiki.tcl.tk already has a style rule for the footer but current wikit doesn't add the necessary tag) the critcl changes allow critcl to run unwrapped from tclsh, as well as to compile packages that are named identically to already loaded packages, e.g. building the zlib in critlib from critcl.kit (i.e. via tclkit which already has a different zlib loaded...) the only bit of general interest in crilib.diff is the change to scratch.tcl at the end, building scratch fails w/o this. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From steffen@ics.mq.edu.au Wed Aug 20 07:31:10 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7KCV9D14849 for ; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 07:31:09 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h7KCV7S05202 for ; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 22:31:07 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.0.0.44) with SMTP id M2003082022310629895 for ; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 22:31:06 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h7KCV5h05189; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 22:31:06 +1000 (EST) Received: from ics.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7KCV5Mj005866; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 22:31:05 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 22:30:53 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] 8.4.4 builds of tclkit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit list , tcl-mac@lists.sourceforge.net To: Uwe Koloska From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <3F43563A.8030600@voiceinterconnect.de> Message-Id: <241BBF64-D30A-11D7-A1D1-000A958518E8@ics.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday, Aug 20, 2003, at 21:06 Australia/Sydney, Uwe Koloska wrote: > what about an aqua build of tclkit? a single file tclkit like on other platforms is currently difficult to do on Aqua due to several technical issues (can't load TkAqua dynamically, no static library build of TkAqua, single file executables don't connect properly to CoreServices without hackery or wrapping in app package). However, all the extensions needed to run/source starkits are part of the TclTkAqua BI. You can thus produce a fake Aqua version of tclkit via a standalone Wish.app containing these extensions (by placing them in Wish.app/Contents/lib as detailed in the TkAqua README) IIRC you'll need Mk4tcl, vfs, and rechan & zlib (both part of critlib) HTH Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From mel@redolive.com Wed Aug 20 14:58:48 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h7KJwlD19790 for ; Wed, 20 Aug 2003 14:58:47 -0500 Received: (qmail 26926 invoked by uid 511); 20 Aug 2003 20:52:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 20 Aug 2003 20:52:54 -0000 Message-ID: <006901c36755$737626f0$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 15:58:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] accessing images from outside of a starkit... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: is it possible to reference images from outside of a starkit ? i have a web-starkit using apache with a setting like: alias /images/ c:/MyWeb/images i do however wish to wrap all images if at all possible into my starkit, but dont know if i can reference it in apache as noted above. i could write all images out to a temp file, but... for every click of a user its too much i know that this is done somehow in tclhttpd, but i am not using that for other reasons. any help is highly appreciated. From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Thu Aug 21 06:53:21 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7LBrKD21723 for ; Thu, 21 Aug 2003 06:53:21 -0500 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9020FEC.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.15.236]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr12) with ESMTP id h7LBrHat002810 for ; Thu, 21 Aug 2003 13:53:18 +0200 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id EEFE528A48; Thu, 21 Aug 2003 13:51:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id D927130C0B for ; Thu, 21 Aug 2003 13:51:26 +0200 (MEST) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 13:51:26 +0200 (MEST) From: harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] 48x48icons do not update Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello List, with the 8.4.4 build of tclkit-win32.upx.exe, the two icons with the 48x48 resolution do not update any more. On the sdx-execution it gives an "Icon not found" message. This problem works using the June 8.4.2 intermediate build of tclkit. Thank you in advance, Harald From jcw@equi4.com Thu Aug 21 08:02:33 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7LD2XD26093 for ; Thu, 21 Aug 2003 08:02:33 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (10.0.1.117 [10.0.1.117]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FD3183CC9 for ; Thu, 21 Aug 2003 15:02:27 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 15:02:25 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] 48x48icons do not update Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de wrote: > with the 8.4.4 build of tclkit-win32.upx.exe, the two icons with the > 48x48 > resolution do not update any more. On the sdx-execution it gives an > "Icon > not found" message. > This problem works using the June 8.4.2 intermediate build of tclkit. Ah, good catch - should be fixed now (silly oversight in the VFS runtime). There is now a http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.4/ area with the latest builds for Windows, Linux, MacOS X (thank you Daniel Steffen), and Solaris (thank you Steve Landers). Personally, I wouldn't really rush to update unless there is a solid reason. The 8.4.2/ has more builds and they are ok. Still, 8.4.4 is there for those who want it. Btw, if you've obtained 8.4.4 before this announcement, please re-fetch to get the last version. -jcw From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Fri Aug 22 05:03:35 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7MA3XD15168 for ; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 05:03:34 -0500 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9020F8E.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.15.142]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr12) with ESMTP id h7MA3U4I004288 for ; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:03:31 +0200 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id E7AF928A47; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:01:45 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id 52DAE30D28 for ; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:01:45 +0200 (MEST) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:01:44 +0200 (MEST) From: harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Win XP - SP 8.4.4 - wm iconbitmap -default do not work with wrapped icon Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello List, another report with Version 8.4.4. I should take JC's warning more serious to stay with SP 8.4.2 but someone must make tests... Windows XP Home, Starpack 8.4.4: tclkit-win32.upx.exe - based: The command: wm iconbitmap . -default do not have any consequences (e.g. the program icon is not updated), if the iconfile is in the archive. If it is a file on the hard-disk it works. This worked with SP8.4.2... Harald From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Aug 22 13:58:41 2003 Received: from smtp5.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7MIweD18195 for ; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 13:58:41 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp5.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7MIwMc2012391; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 11:58:22 -0700 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h7MIw9dw011973; Fri, 22 Aug 2003 11:58:22 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Win XP - SP 8.4.4 - wm iconbitmap -default do not work with wrapped icon Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 11:58:05 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > another report with Version 8.4.4. I should take JC's warning more serious > to stay with SP 8.4.2 but someone must make tests... > > Windows XP Home, Starpack 8.4.4: tclkit-win32.upx.exe - based: > > The command: > wm iconbitmap . -default > do not have any consequences (e.g. the program icon is not updated), if > the iconfile is in the archive. If it is a file on the hard-disk it works. > This worked with SP8.4.2... What is the exact line that you are using? Using the 8.4.4 base kit from Tcl Dev Kit, I have no problem getting the default iconbitmap to show, which is an ico file inside the starkit. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Mon Aug 25 01:29:35 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7P6TYD18338 for ; Mon, 25 Aug 2003 01:29:35 -0500 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9020F67.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.15.103]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr12) with ESMTP id h7P6TVje005267 for ; Mon, 25 Aug 2003 08:29:32 +0200 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id 053AE28A49; Mon, 25 Aug 2003 08:29:02 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id EB5B930C0F for ; Mon, 25 Aug 2003 08:29:02 +0200 (MEST) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 08:29:02 +0200 (MEST) From: Harald Oehlmann X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Win XP - SP 8.4.4 - wm iconbitmap -default do not work with wrapped icon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello Jeff, thank you for the reply. I have retried it today and now it works. I am not aware having changed something in my code - strange. Monday is a good day. Anyway my line is: wm iconbitmap . -default [file join $::folder(Lib) .. tclkit.ico] while $::folder(Lib) contains: c:/projekte/el1001/elmilog.exe/ilib so there is the quirk with the two ".." in the path. Thanks again, Harald On Fri, 22 Aug 2003, Jeff Hobbs wrote: > > Windows XP Home, Starpack 8.4.4: tclkit-win32.upx.exe - based: > > The command: > > wm iconbitmap . -default > > do not have any consequences (e.g. the program icon is not updated), if > > the iconfile is in the archive. If it is a file on the hard-disk it works. > > This worked with SP8.4.2... > What is the exact line that you are using? Using the 8.4.4 base kit > from Tcl Dev Kit, I have no problem getting the default iconbitmap to > show, which is an ico file inside the starkit. From jcw@equi4.com Mon Aug 25 13:26:58 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7PIQwD27296; Mon, 25 Aug 2003 13:26:58 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8771483CC9; Mon, 25 Aug 2003 20:26:52 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 20:26:52 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [Starkit] paypal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, In response to occasional requests I get from people who wish to make a donation to support my OSS work (metakit, tclkit, starkits, catfish), I have added a button tied to the PayPal money transfer system, see: http://www.equi4.com/metakit/license.html Please don't jump to conclusions. This is not an initiative motivated by desperation, but simply me being tired of having to jump through hoops when people and companies get in touch and sincerely want to support my work without being able to afford the commercial Metakit Enterprise License. -jcw From btheado@rrohio.com Wed Aug 27 20:14:48 2003 Received: from outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (outbound-relay.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7S1EmD04181 for ; Wed, 27 Aug 2003 20:14:48 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7S1Eksj007519 for ; Wed, 27 Aug 2003 21:14:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20030828011446.LLCQ8891.fep01.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Wed, 27 Aug 2003 21:14:46 -0400 Message-ID: <000501c36d01$c5183a00$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 21:14:45 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Calling glob using a nonexistent file inside a mounted starkit seems to return the filename instead of returning an error that the file wasn't found. .\tclkit.exe % cd ./tclkit.exe (tclkit.exe) 2 % glob * boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico (tclkit.exe) 3 % glob foo foo (tclkit.exe) 4 % Intead of returning 'foo', I expected an error like 'no files matched glob pattern "foo"' sdx version ./tclkit.exe 2003/03/17 10:05:22 32124-73847 ./tclkit.exe Brian Theado From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Aug 28 10:50:36 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SFoaD19767 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 10:50:36 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id h7SFoZfs013883; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 08:50:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h7SFoKY8004268; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 10:50:21 -0500 Message-ID: <3F4E24C8.2020809@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 08:50:32 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Theado CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit References: <000501c36d01$c5183a00$6401a8c0@desktop123456> In-Reply-To: <000501c36d01$c5183a00$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I think the vfs behavior is to look in the local file system if it can't find the file in the starkit, so if the file 'foo' exists in the local directory glob will return 'foo'. Tom K. Brian Theado wrote: > Calling glob using a nonexistent file inside a mounted starkit seems to > return the filename instead of returning an error that the file wasn't > found. > > .\tclkit.exe > % cd ./tclkit.exe > (tclkit.exe) 2 % glob * > boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico > (tclkit.exe) 3 % glob foo > foo > (tclkit.exe) 4 % > > Intead of returning 'foo', I expected an error like 'no files matched glob > pattern "foo"' > > sdx version ./tclkit.exe > 2003/03/17 10:05:22 32124-73847 ./tclkit.exe > > > Brian Theado > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From lvirden@cas.org Thu Aug 28 10:56:59 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SFuwD20280 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 10:56:58 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h7SFuokQ000344 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:56:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h7SFuo302569; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:56:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:56:50 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030828115650.AAB2548@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 28 Aug 2003 08:50:32 -0700 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Tom Krehbiel > I think the vfs behavior is to look in the local file system > if it can't find the file in the starkit, so if the file 'foo' > exists in the local directory glob will return 'foo'. That may be - but I verified that trying to glob on any non-metacharacter string within tclkit AFTER CD'ING into the running executable gives a different result than using plain tcl. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Aug 28 11:09:05 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SG94D21266 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:09:04 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7SG2xtg015679; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:02:59 -0700 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h7SG2w0X012630; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:02:58 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Brian Theado" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:02:58 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <000501c36d01$c5183a00$6401a8c0@desktop123456> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian, what was your current working directory at the time you executed the glob command ? Did this directory contain a file named 'foo' ? You used a relative path, at that means the [pwd] is important. And the [pwd] can refer to a directory outside of the starkit. you are maybe confusing this behaviour with the old 'prowrap' in Scriptics TclPro. This wrapper used a very limited VFS which also had the peculiar behavior of looking into the wrapped application first if a relative path was used and then in the native filesystem at pwd if no file was found in the archive. Starkits/packs are different here. A relative path is handled as usual, and the current [pwd] determines if you are inside or outside of the virtual file tree. A pwd which has $starkit::topdir as its prefix is inside, everything is in the native filesystem. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Brian Theado > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 6:15 PM > To: Starkit list > Subject: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit > > > Calling glob using a nonexistent file inside a mounted starkit seems to > return the filename instead of returning an error that the file wasn't > found. > > .\tclkit.exe > % cd ./tclkit.exe > (tclkit.exe) 2 % glob * > boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico > (tclkit.exe) 3 % glob foo > foo > (tclkit.exe) 4 % > > Intead of returning 'foo', I expected an error like 'no files matched glob > pattern "foo"' > > sdx version ./tclkit.exe > 2003/03/17 10:05:22 32124-73847 ./tclkit.exe > > > Brian Theado > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From lvirden@cas.org Thu Aug 28 11:13:31 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SGDVD21616 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:13:31 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h7SGDMkQ015946 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:13:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h7SGDNW03049; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:13:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:13:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030828121322.AAB3039@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:02:58 -0700 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Okay friends, here's an example of what Brian was seeing: $ /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit % cd /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit % glob * boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico % glob andreas andreas % ^D $ ls AdobeFnt.lst big.out old.asm BLT.demo bin pfs CC.recipes bldfaqhtml private_html CDE casrun.out public_html D.archive castest_html pubsrc D.fonts dead.article rjeout D.icons dead.letter sam.lb D.info dead.letters scj.log D.misc ffjuser40ce scjpref.ini D.source fmfilesvisited spirited_english.txt Incoming i srv40.files.txt Mail index4intranet syslist.err Misc l032 temp News ldatae tst.oratcl PDASync letter.dead tst2 SCM lib tstarc.gz SoftwareDownloads linux.notes.txt txt3 WWW linux2.4 wb.txt app-defaults muse.tree.txt windows ased.cfg nsmail xyz lwv26awu (2274) $ See - no file called andreas within the VFS or outside the VFS. Yet glob says it is there. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Thu Aug 28 11:24:40 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-5.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-5.online-age.net [64.37.194.13]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SGOeD22478 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:24:40 -0500 Received: from int-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-1 [3.159.232.65]) by ext-ch1gw-5.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.9/030701) with ESMTP id h7SGOQwI017293 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:24:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef03.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-1.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.3/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h7SGOOgu001123 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:24:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from CINMLVEM06 ([3.159.213.76]) by cinmlef03.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6673); Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:24:23 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:24:23 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Thread-Index: AcNtfvXoSGDFD2HVQ+WZGm4zbbDHMAAAPeKQ From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: "Starkit list" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Aug 2003 16:24:23.0965 (UTC) FILETIME=[D7C354D0:01C36D80] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h7SGOeD22478 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I too experience glob issues. ~/bin> sdx version ./tclkit 2003/04/10 03:47:58 44230-54047 ./tclkit ~/bin> pwd /homes/bschofie/bin ~/bin> tclkit % pwd /homes/bschofie/bin % glob xxx no files matched glob pattern "xxx" % puts $argv0 tclkit % cd ./tclkit % pwd /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit % glob xxx xxx % glob * boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico % glob xxx* no files matched glob pattern "xxx*" % parray tcl_platform tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = bschofie tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 > -----Original Message----- > From: Andreas Kupries [mailto:andreask@activestate.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 12:03 PM > To: Brian Theado; Starkit list > Subject: RE: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in > mounted starkit > > > > Brian, what was your current working directory at the time > you executed the > glob command ? Did this directory contain a file named 'foo' ? > > You used a relative path, at that means the [pwd] is > important. And the > [pwd] can refer to a directory outside of the starkit. > > you are maybe confusing this behaviour with the old 'prowrap' > in Scriptics > TclPro. This wrapper used a very limited VFS which also had > the peculiar > behavior of looking into the > wrapped application first if a relative path was used and > then in the native > filesystem at pwd if no file was found in the archive. > > Starkits/packs are different here. A relative path is handled > as usual, and > the current [pwd] determines if you are inside or outside of > the virtual > file tree. A pwd which has $starkit::topdir as its prefix is inside, > everything is in the native filesystem. > > -- > Andreas Kupries > Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Brian Theado > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 6:15 PM > To: Starkit list > Subject: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit > > > Calling glob using a nonexistent file inside a mounted starkit seems to > return the filename instead of returning an error that the file wasn't > found. > > .\tclkit.exe > % cd ./tclkit.exe > (tclkit.exe) 2 % glob * > boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico > (tclkit.exe) 3 % glob foo > foo > (tclkit.exe) 4 % > > Intead of returning 'foo', I expected an error like 'no files matched glob > pattern "foo"' > > sdx version ./tclkit.exe > 2003/03/17 10:05:22 32124-73847 ./tclkit.exe > > > Brian Theado > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Aug 28 11:30:53 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SGUrD23003 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:30:53 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7SGOntg017631; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:24:49 -0700 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h7SGOm0X016312; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:24:48 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:24:48 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20030828121322.AAB3039@cas.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Larry W. Virden > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 9:13 AM > To: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit > > > Okay friends, here's an example of what Brian was seeing: > > $ /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit > % cd /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit > % glob * > boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico > % glob andreas > andreas > % ^D > $ ls > AdobeFnt.lst big.out old.asm > > > See - no file called andreas within the VFS or outside the VFS. Yet > glob says it is there. Larry, thanks for the correction. ... This sounds to me like a bug in the implementation o 'glob' for the metakit FS. This should be reported on SourceForge, at the 'tclvfs' project. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com From lvirden@cas.org Thu Aug 28 11:39:42 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SGdgD23703 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:39:42 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h7SGdWkQ011066 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:39:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h7SGdXA03701; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:39:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:39:33 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030828123933.AAB3692@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:24:48 -0700 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas - do you suppose this might be related to bug 647976 http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=647976&group_id=32692&atid=406308 which you submitted last year? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Aug 28 11:43:32 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SGhWD24031 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:43:32 -0500 Received: from equi4.com (bookie.equi4.local [10.0.1.2]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37EB283CC9 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 18:43:26 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 18:43:25 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030828121322.AAB3039@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (resent to list) Larry W. Virden wrote: > Okay friends, here's an example of what Brian was seeing: > > $ /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit > % cd /volws/lwv26/ldatae/bin/tclkit > % glob * > boot.tcl config.tcl lib tclkit.ico > % glob andreas > andreas > % ^D > $ ls [...] > See - no file called andreas within the VFS or outside the VFS. Yet > glob says it is there. Yep, good catch - it's a bug. I'm not sure where exactly, nor where to fix it - maybe in matchindirectory (defined in tclvfs, mk4vfs.tcl)? The error is thrown at a higher level upon return, if no values are returned (Tcl_GlobOjbCmd, in tclFilename.c). So the issue is to find out where "foo" slips through - maybe it's treated specially since there are no wildcard chars in it? The general logic seems to be glob -> TclGlob -> TclDoGlob -> Tcl_FSMatchInDirectory -> tclvfs matchindirectory -> mk4vfs matchindirectory. I suggest reporting it as a bug on SF, in the tclvfs project... -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Thu Aug 28 11:53:26 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SGrQD24847 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:53:26 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h7SGrGkQ023600 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:53:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h7SGrHE04028; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:53:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:53:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030828125317.AAB4009@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit In-Reply-To: of Thu, 28 Aug 2003 18:43:25 +0200 To: "Starkit list" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have filed a bug report on this -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From andreask@ActiveState.com Thu Aug 28 12:13:45 2003 Received: from smtp5.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h7SHDiD26500 for ; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:13:44 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp5.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h7SGsveP007773; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:54:57 -0700 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h7SGsv0X022016; Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:54:57 -0700 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Larry W. Virden" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:54:57 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20030828123933.AAB3692@cas.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: No, I do not believe so. The 'glob' code has no need for the inode information. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Larry W. Virden > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 9:40 AM > To: Starkit list > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Bug globbing nonexistent file in mounted starkit > > > Andreas - do you suppose this might be related to bug 647976 > http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=647976&gr > oup_id=32692&atid=406308 > which you submitted last year? > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden http://www.purl.org/NET/lvirden/> > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > -><- > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Sep 1 08:48:25 2003 Received: from web41905.mail.yahoo.com (web41905.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.156]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h81DmPD18512 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 2003 08:48:25 -0500 Message-ID: <20030901134819.72266.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41905.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 01 Sep 2003 06:48:19 PDT Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2003 06:48:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Starkits, Tk 8.5, antialiased fonts Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I am interested in using tclkit with Tcl/Tk 8.5, mainly because of the support for antialiased fonts. Is there a way of compiling antialiased font support as a shared extension that can be loaded at runtime?The idea is to enable it in platforms with xft installed and default to regular rendering in platforms which do not support it. Thanks! Daniel __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com From jeffh@ActiveState.com Mon Sep 8 21:13:01 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h892D1D17070 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 2003 21:13:01 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8926VBV012262; Mon, 8 Sep 2003 19:06:32 -0700 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h8926V0X029246; Mon, 8 Sep 2003 19:06:31 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Guaca Mole" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starkits, Tk 8.5, antialiased fonts Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 19:06:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <20030901134819.72266.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I am interested in using tclkit with Tcl/Tk 8.5, > mainly because of the support for antialiased fonts. > Is there a way of compiling antialiased font support > as a shared extension that can be loaded at > runtime?The idea is to enable it in platforms with xft > installed and default to regular rendering in > platforms which do not support it. I think this should be possible, and I mentioned it to Joe. It may even be runtime soft-switchable with more work. However, someone has to put that work into it. Volunteers? Otherwise, just build on a machine that has the right libs and assume those libs will be available for now - you are after all running an alpha version. Jeff From david@larochelle-innovation.com Tue Sep 9 03:55:52 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h898tqD17174 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 03:55:52 -0500 Received: from david.larochelle-innovation.com (david [10.177.0.2]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C8124800E for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 10:55:50 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 10:55:47 +0200 From: David Zolli To: Message-Id: <20030909105547.4940ea8d.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i686-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp \e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] "NOT SAME SIZE" when customizing tclkit.ico Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I download the last tclkit (8.4.4) and when I tried to wrap a starpack with a customized icon I got this output : customizing tclkit.ico in executable icon 32x32/16: replaced icon 16x16/16: replaced icon 32x32/256: NOT SAME SIZE icon 48x48/256: NOT SAME SIZE icon 48x48/16: replaced icon 16x16/256: NOT SAME SIZE I tried several icons made with VC6 or others icon editor but it changes nothing. Anybody knows what going wrong? -- David Zolli From david@larochelle-innovation.com Tue Sep 9 04:56:04 2003 Received: from mx.ozolli.org (arcetiq.net1.nerim.net [62.212.96.121]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h899u4D23794 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 04:56:04 -0500 Received: from david.larochelle-innovation.com (david [10.177.0.2]) by mx.ozolli.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE1614800E for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 11:56:02 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 11:55:58 +0200 From: David Zolli To: Subject: Re: [Starkit] "NOT SAME SIZE" when customizing tclkit.ico Message-Id: <20030909115558.0a1e4824.david@larochelle-innovation.com> In-Reply-To: <20030909105547.4940ea8d.david@larochelle-innovation.com> References: <20030909105547.4940ea8d.david@larochelle-innovation.com> Reply-To: david@larochelle-innovation.com Organization: La Rochelle Innovation X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.8.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i686-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: c$PrcU0KN.|0sft/Ng1*LEd2}}UfL28CT}Xj;n|?7r*}VXJC)J7d$BO#'+pd/#=EE09+c#RA'7VC5{\\pM&dHcz2PAnPp \e?oRC6wAv4w-+~7qt_hHL.(bggP2#Hg X-Operating-System: TcLinux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok, I download that : http://www.fearme.com/misc/programs.cgi?type=tcltk&file=icons And I use it to rewrite a brand new icofile. I get views from my original icofile with [getIconImage] and add it to the new one with [writeIcon] : writeIcon myicon.ico ICO 0 4 image1 (16x16x4) writeIcon myicon.ico ICO 1 4 image2 (32x32x4) writeIcon myicon.ico ICO 2 4 image3 (48x48x4) writeIcon myicon.ico ICO 3 8 image4 (16x16x8) writeIcon myicon.ico ICO 4 8 image5 (32x32x8) writeIcon myicon.ico ICO 5 8 image6 (48x48x8) Then, if I use this icon I get: customizing tclkit.ico in executable icon 32x32/16: replaced icon 16x16/16: replaced icon 32x32/256: replaced icon 48x48/256: replaced icon 48x48/16: replaced icon 16x16/256: replaced I guess it doesn't work before because my old icofile also has true colors views. -- David Zolli From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Tue Sep 9 16:55:18 2003 Received: from web41901.mail.yahoo.com (web41901.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.152]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h89LtHD06118 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 16:55:17 -0500 Message-ID: <20030909214715.86956.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41901.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 09 Sep 2003 14:47:15 PDT Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 14:47:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Guaca Mole Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starkits, Tk 8.5, antialiased fonts To: Jeff Hobbs , starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I think this should be possible, and I mentioned it > to Joe. > It may even be runtime soft-switchable with more > work. > However, someone has to put that work into it. > Volunteers? I am going to give it a try. My first thought is to turn tkUnixRFont into a shared library and try to load it during Tk initialization. Do you have suggestions on how to implement it? For example, is there a part of Tcl or Tk that enables/disables a feature in a similar way that I can use as a reference? > Otherwise, just build on a machine that has the > right libs > and assume those libs will be available for now - > you are > after all running an alpha version. I have control over the environment the tclkit will be built but not where it will be deployed. I could build two Tk libraries and bundle them inside the starkit and load the appropriate one, but I am space constrained. I have found the alpha quite stable for me so far, another option would be to back port it to 8.4 Thanks! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From jeffh@ActiveState.com Mon Sep 15 15:04:05 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8FK44D12535 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 2003 15:04:05 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8FJsHBV008486; Mon, 15 Sep 2003 12:54:18 -0700 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h8FJsH0X019116; Mon, 15 Sep 2003 12:54:17 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "Guaca Mole" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Starkits, Tk 8.5, antialiased fonts Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 12:54:17 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20030909214715.86956.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I am going to give it a try. My first thought is to > turn tkUnixRFont into a shared library and try to load > it during Tk initialization. You would have to make hooks out of the font drawing stuff. I might recommend trying to do this all in the private domain of Tk (not as a real extension). This would likely be the way it ends up (as a true core piece), so why do to the effort of making it fully independent? > For example, is there a part of Tcl or Tk that > enables/disables a feature in a similar way that I can > use as a reference? Well, you can see the tkUnixRFont just replaces tkUnixFont at compile time, so you just have to look at making that possible at runtime (tkUnixRFont requires more libraries - so these deps must be *soft*). Jeff From mel@redolive.com Mon Sep 15 19:29:02 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8G0T1D03492 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 2003 19:29:01 -0500 Received: (qmail 23228 invoked by uid 511); 16 Sep 2003 01:22:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO RedOliveXP) (67.40.211.13) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 16 Sep 2003 01:22:34 -0000 Message-ID: <00a001c37be9$85503b10$0dd32843@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 20:28:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] threaded VFS question... Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: this may be asked before, but.... is it possible to have a threaded application with one VFS in starkits, if so are there any examples on how to achieve this. i need to have 2/3 threads that use parts of the same VFS tree. thanks From damon@your.unreality.com Wed Sep 17 10:56:45 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@69-7-173-21.cyrusone.com [69.7.173.21] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8HFujD15155 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:56:45 -0500 Received: (qmail 15756 invoked by uid 300); 17 Sep 2003 15:56:48 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Sep 2003 15:56:48 -0000 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:56:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Damon Courtney To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: While trying to run an InstallBase install on Solaris 8, this was the error the user got. Looks familiar. Anyway we can get static builds of all the known TclKits? Can we make a static copy part of the standard build so that each build produces like: tclkit and tclkit.static? Thanks, Damon Error: [wonka 8] Solaris-8-sparc-Install ld.so.1: Solaris-8-sparc-Install: fatal: libstdc++.so.2.10.0: open failed: No such file or directory Killed From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 17 11:19:12 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HGJBD18075 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 11:19:11 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8HGJ20W013149 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:19:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8HGJ3600312; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:19:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:19:03 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030917121903.AAB270@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:56:48 -0500 (CDT) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sigh I don't know which makes me more upset - seeing this stupid error, or arguing with developers that it is fixable (not you, Damon). The standard fix (adding a -R flag at executable creation time) won't help in the case of tclkit; in this case, Damon's solution of static linking, if available, is about the only option that can solve the problem. A similar problem that is sometimes encountered is that of incompatible versioning. Sometimes one of these dynamic libraries undergo a dramatic change ; when that happens, it means grief for everyone during the transition. Sometimes, I really hate dynamic libraries. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 17 11:30:48 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HGUmD19452 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 11:30:48 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8HGUe0W015757 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:30:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8HGUeB00548; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:30:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:30:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030917123040.AAB515@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] interesting question on the wiki Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On the http://wiki.tcl.tk/starkit page , Dossy (of AOLServer community) asks about the availability of a starkit package, so that one could code: #! /usr/bin/tclsh package require Starkit source [file join path to tcllib.kit] for instance and have tcllib available in one's tclsh. What would need to be inside such a "Starkit" package? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 17 11:53:52 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HGrqD21873 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 11:53:52 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 65F4183C02; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:53:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 912BA83C00 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:53:43 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:54:09 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <8EC5A957-E92F-11D7-BDF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > While trying to run an InstallBase install on Solaris 8, this was > the error the user got. Looks familiar. Anyway we can get static > builds > of all the known TclKits? Can we make a static copy part of the > standard > build so that each build produces like: tclkit and tclkit.static? Fully static was not possible last time I looked: Solaris does not have a static linkable version of -lX11. For anyone who wants to dig deeper: Tclkit Solaris notes are at http://www.equi4.com/234 - and the page for AIX may contain some ideas about how to build with -lstdc++ frozen as static and the rest dynamic, see http://www.equi4.com/223 (or http://www.equi4.com/222 for all pages). To summarize, in the case of Solaris, I think what needs to be done is to figure out how to accomplish something like: gcc -shared -o kit .... -static -lstdc++ -shared ... So that the linker gets just that single library frozen and linked in right away. Note that genkit sources a "genkit.local" file if it sees one, so that's an easy way to adjust genkit's behavior. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 17 12:03:33 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HH3WD23213 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:03:33 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8HH3O0W024862 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:03:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8HH3P601566; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:03:25 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:03:25 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030917130325.AAB1022@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: <8EC5A957-E92F-11D7-BDF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> of Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:54:09 +0200 To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Here's what I do: export CC=/projects/gnu/$OS/gcc export CCC=/projects/gnu/$OS/bin/g++ export CXXFLAGS="-Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstdc++" and then I run genkit. I don't seem to have the dependency in the tclkits I generate these days with these settings. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 17 12:11:48 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HHBlD24276 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:11:48 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8HHBd0W027545 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:11:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8HHBes04580; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:11:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:11:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030917131140.AAB4341@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] strange error in building tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am seeing the following when genkit goes through the Tcl configure step: creating tclConfig.sh RUN: make binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS= CC_SEARCH_FLAGS= TCL_LIBRARY= TCL_PACKAGE_PA TH= make: Fatal error in reader: Makefile, line 1339: Macro assignment on dependency line ERROR: child process exited abnormally while executing "run $X(make) binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS= CC_SEARCH_FLAGS= TCL_LIBRARY= TCL_PACKA GE_PATH=" ("tcl" arm line 4) invoked from within "switch $target { tcl { config tcl/$X(unix) --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS= CC_SEARC..." Anyone have any ideas ? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From damon@your.unreality.com Wed Sep 17 12:32:16 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@69-7-173-21.cyrusone.com [69.7.173.21] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8HHWGD26656 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:32:16 -0500 Received: (qmail 16620 invoked by uid 300); 17 Sep 2003 17:32:19 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Sep 2003 17:32:19 -0000 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:32:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Damon Courtney To: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: <8EC5A957-E92F-11D7-BDF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Fully static was not possible last time I looked: Solaris does not have > a static linkable version of -lX11. For anyone who wants to dig > deeper: Tclkit Solaris notes are at http://www.equi4.com/234 - and the > page for AIX may contain some ideas about how to build with -lstdc++ > frozen as static and the rest dynamic, see http://www.equi4.com/223 (or > http://www.equi4.com/222 for all pages). > > To summarize, in the case of Solaris, I think what needs to be done is > to figure out how to accomplish something like: > gcc -shared -o kit .... -static -lstdc++ -shared ... > So that the linker gets just that single library frozen and linked in > right away. Note that genkit sources a "genkit.local" file if it sees > one, so that's an easy way to adjust genkit's behavior. Can someone with a Solaris box try this? I don't have access to one, and I fear that I'm probably not good enough to make it happen anyway. Anyone? I don't wanna' go back to freewrap! *sniff* Damon From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 17 12:39:57 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HHdvD27403 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:39:57 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8HHdm0W006393 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:39:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8HHdmi12438; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:39:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:39:48 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030917133948.AAB12357@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] more on the tcl error Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It appears that the error I am seeing is that Sun's make command (the only one in my path) doesn't like this line: html-tk: EXTRA_HTML_ARGS=--tk and the other one in the makefile - but gnu's make file uses them just fine. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 17 13:12:24 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HICND30709 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:12:24 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8HICF0W017209 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:12:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8HICGc20735; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:12:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:12:16 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030917141215.AAB20721@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] tclvfs update Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Just a note - the current vfs.tar.gz file was made before the Sep 1 change that Vince made fixing bugs in the mk4vfs (as well as the zipvfs and tarvfs). It might be worthwhile to update the online tar src directory, even if the binaries are not regenerated right away. His note says: $ diff vfs/ChangeLog /vol/tclsrcsol/tcl84/tclvfs/ChangeLog 0a1,6 > 2003-09-01 Vince Darley > > * library/mk4vfs.tcl: fix to Bug #796782. > * library/zipvfs.tcl: > * library/tarvfs.tcl: fix to similar bug in these filesystems. > -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 17 13:29:13 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8HITDD32275 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:29:13 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id DBBF883C02; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:29:04 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49F8083C00 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:29:04 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:29:31 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclvfs update Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030917141215.AAB20721@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Just a note - the current vfs.tar.gz file was made before the Sep 1 > change that Vince made fixing bugs in the mk4vfs (as well as the zipvfs > and tarvfs). > > It might be worthwhile to update the online tar src directory, even > if the binaries are not regenerated right away. > > His note says: > > $ diff vfs/ChangeLog /vol/tclsrcsol/tcl84/tclvfs/ChangeLog > 0a1,6 >> 2003-09-01 Vince Darley >> >> * library/mk4vfs.tcl: fix to Bug #796782. >> * library/zipvfs.tcl: >> * library/tarvfs.tcl: fix to similar bug in these filesystems. Done. New tar in www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ - thanks :) -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Sep 18 01:18:13 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8I6ICD26950 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 01:18:12 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA17144 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:18:11 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA16351 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:18:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F694E18.B5EAAFCA@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:18:00 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine References: <8EC5A957-E92F-11D7-BDF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Damon Courtney wrote: > > > While trying to run an InstallBase install on Solaris 8, this was > > the error the user got. Looks familiar. Anyway we can get static > > builds > > of all the known TclKits? Can we make a static copy part of the > > standard > > build so that each build produces like: tclkit and tclkit.static? > > Fully static was not possible last time I looked: Solaris does not have > a static linkable version of -lX11. For anyone who wants to dig > deeper: Tclkit Solaris notes are at http://www.equi4.com/234 - and the > page for AIX may contain some ideas about how to build with -lstdc++ > frozen as static and the rest dynamic, see http://www.equi4.com/223 (or > http://www.equi4.com/222 for all pages). > W.r.t. libX11 and the like: we ran into this a couple of years ago. This happens to be very deliberate: by offering shared libraries only for these system facilities Solaris tries to keep the executables independent of the OS version. (That is why you see bizarre references like /usr/platform/SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise/lib/libc_psr.so.1 when asking for the shared libraries via ldd. Regards, Arjen From damon@your.unreality.com Thu Sep 18 10:51:28 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@69-7-173-21.cyrusone.com [69.7.173.21] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8IFpSD10069 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 10:51:28 -0500 Received: (qmail 28091 invoked by uid 300); 18 Sep 2003 15:51:32 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 18 Sep 2003 15:51:32 -0000 Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 10:51:31 -0500 (CDT) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: <3F694E18.B5EAAFCA@wldelft.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > W.r.t. libX11 and the like: we ran into this a couple of years ago. > This happens to be very deliberate: by offering shared libraries only > for these system facilities Solaris tries to keep the executables > independent of the OS version. (That is why you see bizarre references > like /usr/platform/SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise/lib/libc_psr.so.1 when asking > for the shared libraries via ldd. And why does libstdc++ not show up as a dependency when running ldd on the binary? Thanks, Damon From wg@magro-soft.com Thu Sep 18 16:58:14 2003 Received: from magro-soft.com (ip18429.hera.net [213.244.184.29] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8ILwDD14756 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 16:58:13 -0500 Received: from magro-soft.com (MAGRO1.sbg [212.41.236.140]) by magro-soft.com (8.8.8) id XAA25584; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:58:14 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3F6A2A71.5060102@magro-soft.com> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:58:09 +0200 From: Wolfgang Grossbauer User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030808 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] starkit & mingw Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, is there a way to build tclkit on a win2000 using mingw? Or some other envoronment *except* MSVC6? All my builds fail at building kitsh. After fumbling in genkit (tar statement), all other modules build ok. I need a patched tk Version of tclkit-win32.upx.exe. I had *no* problems at all compiling on Linux... Wolf -- Wolfgang Grossbauer ................... Tel: +43 662 856669 11 MAGRO Software Engineering & Design ... Mob: +43 676 780 1405 Holunderstr. 481 ...................... Mail: wg@magro-soft.com A-5071 Wals / Salzburg ................ http://www.magro-soft.com From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Fri Sep 19 00:05:07 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8J556518032 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 00:05:06 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h8J554V12423 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:04 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2003091915050328427 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:03 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h8J552v12378; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:02 +1000 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8J5518m009422; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:01 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:00 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on the tcl error Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: "Larry W. Virden" From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <20030917133948.AAB12357@cas.org> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry, On Thursday, Sep 18, 2003, at 03:39 Australia/Sydney, Larry W. Virden wrote: > It appears that the error I am seeing is that Sun's make command (the > only > one in my path) doesn't like this line: > > html-tk: EXTRA_HTML_ARGS=--tk > > and the other one in the makefile - but gnu's make file uses them just > fine. this is a bug (gmake specific syntax) that I introduced and that went unnoticed into 8.4.4, it was fixed on core-8-4-branch and HEAD on 23/7, the patch is below. JC, maybe this could go into the source tarball for tclkit? Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** ------------ Index: Makefile.in =================================================================== RCS file: /cvsroot/tcl/tcl/unix/Makefile.in,v diff -u -r1.121.2.3 -r1.121.2.4 --- Makefile.in 23 Jul 2003 05:53:58 -0000 1.121.2.3 +++ Makefile.in 23 Jul 2003 15:40:39 -0000 1.121.2.4 @@ -1344,12 +1344,16 @@ # TOOL_DIR. # -html-tcl: EXTRA_HTML_ARGS=--tcl -html-tk: EXTRA_HTML_ARGS=--tk +html: + $(BUILD_HTML) +html-tcl: + $(BUILD_HTML) --tcl +html-tk: + $(BUILD_HTML) --tk -html html-tcl html-tk: +BUILD_HTML = \ $(TCL_EXE) $(TOOL_DIR)/tcltk-man2html.tcl --htmldir=$(DISTDIR)/html \ - --srcdir=$(TOP_DIR)/.. $(EXTRA_HTML_ARGS) + --srcdir=$(TOP_DIR)/.. # # Target to create a Macintosh version of the distribution. This will From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Sep 19 01:30:57 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8J6Uu525547 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 01:30:56 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA05631 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 08:30:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA05458 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 08:30:48 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F6AA298.75F4F44F@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 08:30:48 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Damon Courtney wrote: > > > W.r.t. libX11 and the like: we ran into this a couple of years ago. > > This happens to be very deliberate: by offering shared libraries only > > for these system facilities Solaris tries to keep the executables > > independent of the OS version. (That is why you see bizarre references > > like /usr/platform/SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise/lib/libc_psr.so.1 when asking > > for the shared libraries via ldd. > > And why does libstdc++ not show up as a dependency when running ldd > on the binary? > Sorry, can't help you there: so far I have not used C++ on Solaris to any extent where this might have become a problem. Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Fri Sep 19 05:29:14 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8JATD513627 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 05:29:13 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 240FA83C03; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 12:29:04 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C008383C01 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 12:29:03 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 12:29:37 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] more on the tcl error Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <2B42E9EA-EA8C-11D7-BDF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Daniel A. Steffen wrote: >> html-tk: EXTRA_HTML_ARGS=--tk >> >> and the other one in the makefile - but gnu's make file uses them just >> fine. > > this is a bug (gmake specific syntax) that I introduced and that went > unnoticed into 8.4.4, it was fixed on core-8-4-branch and HEAD on > 23/7, the patch is below. > JC, maybe this could go into the source tarball for tclkit? I've just updated the tcl and tk tars to use the core-8-4-branch cvs HEAD, i.e. 8.4.4 plus latest changes in that branch. Thx. -jcw From damon@your.unreality.com Fri Sep 19 14:07:46 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@69-7-173-21.cyrusone.com [69.7.173.21] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8JJ7k521783 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:07:46 -0500 Received: (qmail 43502 invoked by uid 300); 19 Sep 2003 19:07:50 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 19 Sep 2003 19:07:50 -0000 Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:07:50 -0500 (CDT) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: <3F6AA298.75F4F44F@wldelft.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Sorry, can't help you there: so far I have not used C++ on Solaris to > any extent where this might have become a problem. Can anyone on this list with access to a Solaris box get a version of TclKit compiled with c++ statically linked? Who does the standard version on Solaris for releases? I've tried, but I just don't know enough about linking to make it fly. *sigh* Damon From lvirden@cas.org Fri Sep 19 14:25:35 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8JJPY523436 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:25:35 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8JJPP0W021577 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:25:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8JJPQj08782; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:25:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:25:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030919152526.AAB8756@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:07:50 -0500 (CDT) To: Starkit list Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The info I sent to this list earlier in the week results in a tclkit with the library statically linked. Set this flag before invoking the build application. export CXXFLAGS="-Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstdc++" -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From damon@your.unreality.com Fri Sep 19 14:28:41 2003 Received: from your.unreality.com (IDENT:qmailr@69-7-173-21.cyrusone.com [69.7.173.21] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8JJSf523778 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:28:41 -0500 Received: (qmail 43737 invoked by uid 300); 19 Sep 2003 19:28:44 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 19 Sep 2003 19:28:44 -0000 Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 14:28:44 -0500 (CDT) From: Damon Courtney To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine In-Reply-To: <20030919152526.AAB8756@cas.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > The info I sent to this list earlier in the week results in a tclkit with > the library statically linked. > > Set this flag before invoking the build application. > > export CXXFLAGS="-Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstdc++" Could we maybe get an additional option to genkit that would handle this sort of thing? IE: sh genkit S Would produce hostname-tclkit-static Or something like that? Just curious. I appreciate the help. 0-] Thanks, Damon From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Fri Sep 19 17:46:10 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8JMk8514083 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 17:46:09 -0500 Received: (qmail 29931 invoked from network); 19 Sep 2003 22:46:06 -0000 Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 19 Sep 2003 22:46:06 -0000 Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 06:46:05 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Your favorite error and mine Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Steve Landers To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <0D66D875-EAF3-11D7-A0D8-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Saturday, September 20, 2003, at 03:07 AM, Damon Courtney wrote: > Can anyone on this list with access to a Solaris box get a version > of TclKit compiled with c++ statically linked? I can - next week though (I'm on vacation this week). > Who does the standard version on Solaris for releases? Me > I've tried, but I just don't know enough about linking to make it fly. > *sigh* Patience, glasshopper :-) Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From claird@lairds.com Sat Sep 20 08:58:53 2003 Received: from ns.purdue.org (ns.purdue.org [206.230.5.18]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8KDwqM03544 for ; Sat, 20 Sep 2003 08:58:52 -0500 Received: from claird by ns.purdue.org with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1A0iGC-0001rp-00 for ; Sat, 20 Sep 2003 08:58:52 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com Reply-To: claird@phaseit.net Message-Id: From: Cameron Laird Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 08:58:52 -0500 Subject: [Starkit] MacOS X tclkit mystery Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am doing something very, very wrong, but haven't yet seen what it is. I construct hello.tcl with contents package require starkit starkit::startup puts $starkit::topdir I build hello.kit and invoke "tclkit hello.kit". Under Unixes, I see .../hello.kit/lib/app-hello Under MacOS X, I see .../hello.kit I'm working with 8.4.4 under MacOS, 8.4* under other Unixes. I generate hello.kit by sdx qrwap hello.tcl OR by copying from one hello.kit to another OR ... "sdx lsk hello.kit" is invariant across platforms: hello.kit: dir lib/ 67 2003/09/20 08:44:22 main.tcl hello.kit/lib: dir app-hello/ hello.kit/lib/app-hello: 204 2003/09/20 08:44:22 hello.tcl 72 2003/09/20 08:44:22 pkgIndex.tcl I emphasize: I can copy hello.kit from one platform to another (and back), and the result changes for MacOS. This is not about generation of hello.kit, it appears, but tclkit's evaluation. What's going on? From jcw@equi4.com Sat Sep 20 12:25:17 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8KHPGM14001 for ; Sat, 20 Sep 2003 12:25:16 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 233EA83C04; Sat, 20 Sep 2003 19:25:03 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22FFC83C00 for ; Sat, 20 Sep 2003 19:25:01 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 19:25:37 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] MacOS X tclkit mystery Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <72E6B121-EB8F-11D7-B749-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_02_03,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Cameron Laird wrote: (Thanks for a clear-cut example) $ cat >hello.tcl package require starkit starkit::startup puts $starkit::topdir $ sdx qwrap hello.tcl 5 updates applied $ tclkit hello.kit /Users/jcw/hello.kit $ uname -a Darwin biggie.equi4.local 6.6 Darwin Kernel Version 6.6: Thu May 1 21:48:54 PDT 2003; root:xnu/xnu-344.34.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power Macintosh powerpc $ tclkit % info patch 8.4.2 % > I build hello.kit and invoke "tclkit hello.kit". Under Unixes, I see > .../hello.kit/lib/app-hello > Under MacOS X, I see > .../hello.kit I can confirm the latter. I cannot match your results on Linux: $ tclkit hello.kit /home/jcw/hello.kit $ uname -a Linux teevie.equi4.local 2.4.20-gentoo-r7 #1 SMP Mon Sep 15 11:21:42 CEST 2003 i686 Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.40GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux teevie jcw $ tclkit % info patch 8.4.4 % And just to match up (I don't have 8.4.4 on osx within as easy reach): $ tclkit842 hello.kit /home/jcw/hello.kit $ I know one trouble spot: symbolic links - but I can't see how that affects this. > I emphasize: I can copy hello.kit from one platform to another (and > back), > and the result changes for MacOS. This is not about generation of > hello.kit, > it appears, but tclkit's evaluation. What's going on? I don't like the Unix results you see. How does the following look at your end: $ sdx unwrap hello.kit 5 updates applied $ tclkit hello.vfs/main.tcl /home/jcw/hello.vfs $ If that still is wrong, consider extracting starkit.tcl from tclkit, adding a few puts'es in the startup logic, and running it interactively: tclkit source starkit.tcl source hello.vfs/main.tcl If it's *still* wrong, at least you now have immediate access to the scripts. -jcw PS. FYI, this email was pending in the Mailman queue, perhaps it was not sent from same address as your subscription? You can subscribe more than once, and disable sending to all but one to solve this. From lvirden@cas.org Mon Sep 22 06:50:29 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8MBoTM22411 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 06:50:29 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8MBoM0W020509 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:50:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8MBoLC12894; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:50:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:50:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030922075021.AAB12828@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] some kind of problem in genkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Okay, things have changed in genkit that I've not quite figured out. Here's what is going on. I decided to make a clean build of tclkit. So I deleted all the directories under the tclkit/build, tclkit/install, tclkit/out, tclkit/src, and tclkit/noarch directories. I ran genkit. Here's what I see: unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz unpacking tars/itcl.tar.gz unpacking tars/mk.tar.gz unpacking tars/vfs.tar.gz unpacking tars/kit.tar.gz unpacking tars/zlib.tar.gz tcl: sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/confi... FAILED: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- sh ../../../src/tcl/unix/configure --prefix=/ldatae/tclkit/noarch --exec-prefix= /ldatae/tclkit/install/lwv26awu --disable-shared -#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#- ERROR: child process exited abnormally Done. ./genkit[13]: install/lwv26awu/bin/tclsh8.4: not found ./genkit[13]: install/lwv26awu/bin/tclsh8.4: not found ./genkit[13]: install/lwv26awu/bin/tclsh8.4: not found ./genkit[13]: install/lwv26awu/bin/tclsh8.4: not found ./genkit[13]: install/lwv26awu/bin/tclsh8.4: not found After this set of failures, I see this directory structure: tclkit/ build/lwv26awu install noarch out/lwv26awu src/cvs/tcl src/cvs/tk src/itcl src/kit src/mk src/vfs src/zlib For some reason, the tcl and tk directories are no longer appearing under the src directory, and genkit has problems locating them. I don't know what the intent was for the cvs directory stuff - any ideas? Even when I attempt to move tcl and tk directories, genkit just puts them back there. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Mon Sep 22 07:18:05 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8MCI5M24792 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:18:05 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8MCHv0W027340 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 08:17:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8MCHu521095; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 08:17:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 08:17:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030922081756.AAB21079@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] some kind of problem in genkit In-Reply-To: <20030922075021.AAB12828@cas.org> of Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:50:21 -0400 (EDT) To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: After making this change, and moving the src/cvs/tcl and src/cvs/tk directories into src , genkit builds successfully: $ gdiff -U1 genkit.prev genkit --- genkit.prev 2003-08-26 07:30:17.000000000 -0400 +++ genkit 2003-09-22 07:50:57.600001000 -0400 @@ -356,10 +356,10 @@ } - set cvs "cvs/$pkg" - if {[file isdir $cvs]} { - puts " symlinking to $cvs" - cd src - exec ln -s ../$cvs $pkg - cd .. - continue - } + # set cvs "cvs/$pkg" + # if {[file isdir $cvs]} { + # puts " symlinking to $cvs" + # cd src + # exec ln -s ../$cvs $pkg + # cd .. + # continue + # } set tar "tars/$pkg.tar.gz" -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From mel@redolive.com Mon Sep 22 09:29:36 2003 Received: from ns.igoods.com ([67.40.211.11]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8METJM04895 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 09:29:36 -0500 Received: (qmail 22540 invoked by uid 511); 22 Sep 2003 15:22:45 -0000 Received: from h-68-167-117-157.nycmny83.covad.net (HELO RedOliveXP) (68.167.117.157) by 67.40.211.11 with SMTP; 22 Sep 2003 15:22:45 -0000 Message-ID: <014101c38115$e7bf0de0$0300a8c0@RedOliveXP> From: "Mel" To: "STARKIT" Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 10:29:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] PROBLEM with TCLFTP package Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: the following code run from wish works like a charm with tclftp package FTP::Open localhost Al Mac FTP::Get C:/a.doc C:/tmp/A.doc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------- tried the same with tclkit.exe and the ftp gets into a no return wait ::FTP::StateHandler{sock1688} DisplayMsg{{-> rc="226" -> state="get_close"}} -> rc="226" -> state="get_close" } WaitComplete{1} ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- can someone please try the same and see if i am doing anyting wrong ? thanks a lot for any help From jcw@equi4.com Mon Sep 22 12:44:51 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8MHioM23316 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 12:44:50 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id F20E183EEB; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 19:44:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27A0483B2B for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 19:44:14 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 19:44:14 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] PROBLEM with TCLFTP package Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <014101c38115$e7bf0de0$0300a8c0@RedOliveXP> Message-Id: <61919DBA-ED24-11D7-9BAE-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,SPAM_PHRASE_01_02, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mel wrote: > the following code run from wish works like a charm with tclftp package > > FTP::Open localhost Al Mac > FTP::Get C:/a.doc C:/tmp/A.doc > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- > --------- > tried the same with tclkit.exe and the ftp gets into a no return wait > > ::FTP::StateHandler{sock1688} > DisplayMsg{{-> rc="226" > -> state="get_close"}} > -> rc="226" > -> state="get_close" > } > WaitComplete{1} > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- > ---- > can someone please try the same and see if i am doing anyting wrong ? > thanks a lot for any help Seem like this hits tcl bug# 719790. I've not been able to track this down and resolve, despite several attempts. The problem causes a background fcopy (fcopy ... -command ...) to hang, just before it should finish. There is a workaround, if you know the amount of data to copy, use: fcopy $infd ... -size [file size infile] That's all I can offer as solution, right now. -jcw From Bryan.Schofield@Trans.ge.com Tue Sep 23 18:54:19 2003 Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8NNsJM15218 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 18:54:19 -0500 Received: from int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-4 [3.159.236.68]) by ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h8NNgudu018995 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 19:54:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h8NGf4vo008436 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:41:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from CINMLVEM06 ([3.159.213.76]) by cinmlef01.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6673); Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:41:04 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:41:03 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Incr tcl missing from solaris tclkit 8.4.4? Thread-Index: AcOB8XoyO4R4fVQkTxeeqOVgtBOXSA== From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Sep 2003 16:41:04.0222 (UTC) FILETIME=[7AB3EFE0:01C381F1] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h8NNsJM15218 Subject: [Starkit] Incr tcl missing from solaris tclkit 8.4.4? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Seems [Incr Tcl] is missing from the solaris 8.4.4 tclkit. Anyone else seeing this problem? > /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit % parray tcl_platform tcl_platform(byteOrder) = bigEndian tcl_platform(machine) = sun4u tcl_platform(os) = SunOS tcl_platform(osVersion) = 5.8 tcl_platform(platform) = unix tcl_platform(user) = bschofie tcl_platform(wordSize) = 4 % puts $tcl_patchLevel 8.4.4 % package require Itcl couldn't load library "/homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/itcl3.3/libitcl3.3.so": no such file or directory % cd /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/itcl3.3/ % pwd /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit/lib/itcl3.3 % glob * itcl.tcl pkgIndex.tcl % exit > sdx version /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit 2003/08/21 00:40:38 54297-19759 /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 23 20:13:34 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8O1DXM21448 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 20:13:33 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 9B7DF83EEA; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 03:13:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2881083EE7 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 03:13:27 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 03:13:26 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] some kind of problem in genkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030922075021.AAB12828@cas.org> Message-Id: <4CE08E3D-EE2C-11D7-9181-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Okay, things have changed in genkit that I've not quite figured out. > > Here's what is going on. > > I decided to make a clean build of tclkit. So I deleted all the > directories > under the tclkit/build, tclkit/install, tclkit/out, tclkit/src, and > tclkit/noarch directories. > > I ran genkit. Here's what I see: > > > unpacking tars/tcl.tar.gz > unpacking tars/tk.tar.gz I recently *manually* updated these to 8.4.4 - that was very stupid: unlike the scripts I normally use for this, I created tars with cvs/ in the path names. Unpacking them puts them in the wrong spot. I have updated all tars in http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/ to latest CVS revisions (note that tcl/tk are checked out on the core-8-4-branch, not the 8.5 etc developments). > I don't know what the intent was for the cvs directory stuff - any > ideas? None. But I'll take all the blame for wasting your time. My apologies. -jcw PS. More apologies coming later... as I fix up a mess I seem to have made of Steve Landers' Solaris builds (i.e. itcl missing). From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 23 21:08:39 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8O28VM24286 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 21:08:35 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 93D9F83EEA; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 04:08:18 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EC7E83EE7 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 04:07:58 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 04:07:54 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Incr tcl missing from solaris tclkit 8.4.4? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bryan (TRANS) wrote: > Seems [Incr Tcl] is missing from the solaris 8.4.4 tclkit. Anyone else > seeing this problem? Whoopsie daisy. My local regenerate scripts were not correctly adjusted for the latest change of having itcl as dynamic library in VFS by default, instead of being a static link inside tclkit itself. In some builds, I just took what people sent me, but in this case I had regenerated the tclkit builds, which means slapping on updated VFS runtime's at the end. This "post link" step is done for all builds I have on my machine, i.e. that's what the result-*.tar.gz files are used for, and why I prefer those submissions to just final tclkit build results. >> sdx version /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit > 2003/08/21 00:40:38 54297-19759 /homes/bschofie/bin/tclkit Thanks for reporting this. I've uploaded solaris builds which should be regenerated properly now (from the same original builds by Steve Landers). When you re-fetch, be sure to clear caches, proxies, etc - and get the changed version: 2003/08/21 00:40:38 29229-31337 tclkit-solaris-sparc 2003/08/20 09:43:28 50401-64828 tclkit-solaris-x86 (careful: the version id's file dates have not changed) -jcw PS. Thanks Steve, for helping out on short notice. From lvirden@cas.org Wed Sep 24 06:50:20 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8OBoKM27479 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 06:50:20 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h8OBoC0W020105 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 07:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.6+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h8OBoCI13329; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 07:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 07:50:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20030924075012.AAB13311@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] genkit question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Can anyone confirm that this message, and the other messages I have been sending for the past week or two, have been getting to the list. I have some doubts. For instance, the default genkit changed yesterday relating to the itcl .so file, but it left the CVS directory code in that I reported was causing a problem a day or two ago. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Sep 24 07:03:48 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8OC3mM28443 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 07:03:48 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id OAA12730 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 14:03:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA12425 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 14:03:40 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F71881C.BC503F27@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 14:03:40 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] genkit question References: <20030924075012.AAB13311@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > Can anyone confirm that this message, and the other messages I have been > sending for the past week or two, have been getting to the list. > I have some doubts. > > For instance, the default genkit changed yesterday relating to > the itcl .so file, but it left the CVS directory code in that I reported > was causing a problem a day or two ago. Larry, I can confirm that at least some of your messages about genkit come through. I can not say much about the one you mention in particular, as I ordinarily merely use tclkit and not build it (so I focus my attention mostly on other messages :). Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Wed Sep 24 09:31:05 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8OEV5M11140 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 09:31:05 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id C60A183EEA; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 16:30:57 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A33A83EE7 for ; Wed, 24 Sep 2003 16:30:57 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 16:30:59 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] genkit question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030924075012.AAB13311@cas.org> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_01_02,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Can anyone confirm that this message, and the other messages I have > been > sending for the past week or two, have been getting to the list. > I have some doubts. I've seen all your messages. Well, those that came in, that is ;) > For instance, the default genkit changed yesterday relating to > the itcl .so file, but it left the CVS directory code in that I > reported > was causing a problem a day or two ago. The CVS code was a problem in the tcl.tar.gz and tk.tar.gz files, they have been replaced on www.equi4.com - please refetch (and make sure you don't get a cached copy). -jcw From claird@lairds.com Sat Sep 27 08:49:15 2003 Received: from ns.purdue.org (ns.purdue.org [206.230.5.18]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8RDn9M03578; Sat, 27 Sep 2003 08:49:15 -0500 Received: from claird by ns.purdue.org with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1A3FRa-0000Ci-00; Sat, 27 Sep 2003 08:49:06 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com Cc: jcw@equi4.com Reply-To: claird@phaseit.net Message-Id: From: Cameron Laird Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2003 08:49:06 -0500 Subject: [Starkit] Ongoing topdir mystery Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > [Starkit] MacOS X tclkit mystery > > Jean-Claude Wippler jcw@equi4.com > Sat, 20 Sep 2003 19:25:37 +0200 > . > . > . > (Thanks for a clear-cut example) > > $ cat >hello.tcl > package require starkit > starkit::startup > puts $starkit::topdir > . > . > . > > I build hello.kit and invoke "tclkit hello.kit". Under Unixes, I see > > .../hello.kit/lib/app-hello > > Under MacOS X, I see > > .../hello.kit > > I can confirm the latter. I cannot match your results on Linux: > > $ tclkit hello.kit > /home/jcw/hello.kit > . > . > . > I don't like the Unix results you see. How does the following look at > your end: > > $ sdx unwrap hello.kit > 5 updates applied > $ tclkit hello.vfs/main.tcl > /home/jcw/hello.vfs > $ > > If that still is wrong, consider extracting starkit.tcl from tclkit, > adding a few puts'es in the startup logic, and running it interactively: > tclkit > source starkit.tcl > source hello.vfs/main.tcl > If it's *still* wrong, at least you now have immediate access to the > scripts. > > -jcw > > PS. FYI, this email was pending in the Mailman queue, perhaps it was > not sent from same address as your subscription? You can subscribe > more than once, and disable sending to all but one to solve this. > . > . > . My thanks for the reply. In my as all-too-often-overloaded condition, I ask your indulgence on resubscribing. My plan: solve the hello.kit problem first, then, later, turn attention to e-mail (and related) reconfigurations. No reply expected on this matter. I've run lots of experiments. They're making no sense to me. I include a fraction of the transcripts below. I suspect we'll be best off if I start with something very simple, though: I create and launch #!/bin/sh WORKING=/tmp/tmp rm -rf $WORKING mkdir $WORKING cd $WORKING cat > hello.tcl << DONE package require starkit starkit::startup puts \$starkit::topdir DONE sdx qwrap hello.tcl tclkit hello.kit Under Linux, I see 5 updates applied /tmp/tmp/hello.kit/lib/app-hello Under MacOS X, I see 5 updates applied /tmp/tmp/hello.kit Let me be quite clear: you are telling me that the MacOS X /tmp/tmp/hello.kit is EXPECTED, and the Debian result /tmp/tmp/hello.kit/lib/app-hello is WRONG? I want to be sure I understand the goal before I go any farther. On to substantive matters: I transcribe: WORKING$ uname -a Linux MYHOST 2.4.21-pre6 #2 SMP Mon Mar 31 16:49:30 EST 2003 i686 GNU/Linux WORKING$ mkdir tmp WORKING$ cd tmp WORKING/tmp$ cat > hello.tcl package require starkit starkit::startup puts $starkit::topdir WORKING/tmp$ sdx qwrap hello.kit 5 updates applied WORKING/tmp$ sdx unwrap hello.kit 5 updates applied WORKING/tmp$ tclkit hello.kit WORKING/tmp/hello.kit/lib/app-hello WORKING/tmp$ tclkit % source SPECIAL/starkit.tcl % source hello.vfs/main.tcl script and topdir are 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/main.tcl' and 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs'. script and topdir are 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/lib/app-hello/hello.tcl' and 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/lib/app-hello'. WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/lib/app-hello 1.0 % exit WORKING/tmp$ diff SPECIAL/starkit.tcl ORIGINAL 52d51 < puts "script and topdir are '$script' and '$topdir'." From jcw@equi4.com Sat Sep 27 09:09:45 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8RE9iM04561 for ; Sat, 27 Sep 2003 09:09:44 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 7E19583EEA; Sat, 27 Sep 2003 16:09:36 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFE7C83EE7; Sat, 27 Sep 2003 16:09:35 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2003 16:09:35 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: starkit@equi4.com To: claird@phaseit.net From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <391C7D18-F0F4-11D7-8DEE-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] Re: Ongoing topdir mystery Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Cameron, > I've run lots of experiments. They're making no sense to > me. I include a fraction of the transcripts below. I > suspect we'll be best off if I start with something very > simple, though: I create and launch > #!/bin/sh > WORKING=/tmp/tmp > rm -rf $WORKING > mkdir $WORKING > cd $WORKING > cat > hello.tcl << DONE > package require starkit > starkit::startup > puts \$starkit::topdir > DONE > sdx qwrap hello.tcl > tclkit hello.kit > Under Linux, I see > 5 updates applied > /tmp/tmp/hello.kit/lib/app-hello On Gentoo Linux, I see: /tmp/tmp/hello.kit > Let me be quite clear: you are telling me that the MacOS X > /tmp/tmp/hello.kit > is EXPECTED, and the Debian result > /tmp/tmp/hello.kit/lib/app-hello > is WRONG? I want to be sure I understand the goal before I go > any farther. Yes. > On to substantive matters: I transcribe: > WORKING$ uname -a > Linux MYHOST 2.4.21-pre6 #2 SMP Mon Mar 31 16:49:30 EST 2003 i686 > GNU/Linux > WORKING$ mkdir tmp > WORKING$ cd tmp > WORKING/tmp$ cat > hello.tcl > package require starkit > starkit::startup > puts $starkit::topdir > WORKING/tmp$ sdx qwrap hello.kit > 5 updates applied > WORKING/tmp$ sdx unwrap hello.kit > 5 updates applied > WORKING/tmp$ tclkit hello.kit > WORKING/tmp/hello.kit/lib/app-hello > WORKING/tmp$ tclkit > % source SPECIAL/starkit.tcl > % source hello.vfs/main.tcl > script and topdir are 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/main.tcl' and > 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs'. > script and topdir are > 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/lib/app-hello/hello.tcl' and > 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/lib/app-hello'. > WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/lib/app-hello > 1.0 > % exit > WORKING/tmp$ diff SPECIAL/starkit.tcl ORIGINAL > 52d51 > < puts "script and topdir are '$script' and '$topdir'." Very fishy. First of all, the lines in my copy of starkit.tcl would have to be at line 56, not 52... please compare your file with the latest copy (it's in the tclvfs SF project). Onwards. I see in starkit.tcl: namespace eval starkit { proc startup {} { global argv0 # 2003/02/11: new behavior, if starkit::topdir exists, don't disturb it if {![info exists starkit::topdir]} { variable topdir ;# the root directory (while the starkit is mounted) } set script [file normalize [info script]] set topdir [file dirname $script] The logic is that [info script] is called while main.tcl is being executed, so it should return 'WORKING/tmp/hello.vfs/main.tcl' or 'WORKING/tmp/hello.kit/main.tcl'. But note the "info exists" just preceding it. Could it be that something is setting up the $starkit::topdir variable before startup gets called? Hm... also, why are there *two* results in your "source hello.vfs/main.tcl" call? The first one seems right, and then something happens to mess it up? There is more going on here. Can you force an exception on the second call to see how it is reached? -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sat Sep 27 17:44:18 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8RMiIM29246 for ; Sat, 27 Sep 2003 17:44:18 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 2583C83EEA; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 00:44:09 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (10.0.1.252 [10.0.1.252]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99EA783EE7 for ; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 00:44:07 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2003 00:44:08 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030927223142.GB26028@uiuc.edu> Message-Id: <1AFAA109-F13C-11D7-859C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] Mk4py changes Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Nicholas, > seems to be > broken, I think it's getting caught in a RedirectMatch perhaps. Good catch. Indeed it was (recent site changes). Fixed, thx. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sun Sep 28 06:07:37 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8SB7aM09593 for ; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 06:07:37 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 76C6B8399B; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 13:07:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E2C283999 for ; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 13:07:28 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2003 13:07:30 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] package starkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: To make it easier to use starkits (including sdx, so you can wrap/unwrap) on vanilla installations of Tcl, I've set up a traditional Tcl package with all the necessary pieces. A first cut at this can be downloaded from http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/starkit.tar.gz From the README: > This package lets you use Starkits with "vanilla" installations of Tcl. > > It needs Tcl 8.4 or newer because it uses VFS, Tcl's Virtual File > System. > > This release works in Mac OS X and Linux (no other binaries are > included). > More platform support will be added over time, it's a matter of adding > more binary builds of TclVFS, Metakit, rechan, and zlib in the right > dirs. > > This distribution is a standard Tcl package. To use it, put this > entire > starkit directory in a spot where tclsh looks for packages. Then you > can > launch starkits using "tclsh myapp.kit" or "wish myapp.kit". It'd be nice to add more platforms into this single tar file, so we can cover cases where neither a full Tclkit nor a full installation of ActiveTcl is available. To do that requires building TclVFS, Metakit, rechan, and zlib. And tclsh/wish itself, of course. Both rechan and zlib are available as part of critcl, but that leads to a chicken-and-egg problem (critcl is normally used as starkit), the other way is to use the rechan.c and zlib.c files, which are self-contained and present in the tclkit distribution itself. Both rechan and zlib are optional, actually. They are not needed if both Memchan and Trf are present. My plan for the future is to also incorporate "readkit.tcl" into this package, which offers a slow and limited emulation of Metakit in pure Tcl. This would at least offer read-only use of starkits on platforms where C++ is not available or not good enough to build MK on. One use for this could be for WinCE (PocketPC) PDA's, where Tcl/Tk is still in flux, so this could be used while the development on tclsh and wish progresses. I've got a build for MK, so the hard work is done, all that remains is getting tclvfs, rechan, and zlib into the mix. If you have an interest / need for this, let me know - so we can work out the details. -jcw From dgroth@gmx.de Mon Sep 29 07:40:22 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8TCeLM01295 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 07:40:21 -0500 Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 07:40:21 -0500 Message-Id: <200309291240.h8TCeLM01295@trixie.triqs.com> Received: (qmail 31066 invoked by uid 65534); 29 Sep 2003 12:40:15 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp010) with SMTP; 29 Sep 2003 14:40:15 +0200 X-Authenticated: #220704 From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] ANN: dgMKViewer V0.3 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, because I missed it, I programmed recently a tcl based kitViewer and kitEditor with the following features: From the help. ''Features:'' * tree structure representation of database * export views as csv or tabulated files * import of tabulated or comma or space spearated files (see [Import]) * view tables alias views and simple subviews * search views by specific keywords and modi * deleting, renaming views * updating view data directly in the gui * restricting user input by [mk_column_values] table * opening several views in parallel in different notebook-tabs * simple browsing of starkit-files * if entry is filename showing file inside the application via mouse-rightclick dgMKViewer lives at: http://www.dgroth.de/tcltk_dgmkviewer.html Please be aware that this is a work in progress and should be used with care .... I would greatly appreciate, suggestions and improvements. What's next: * more oomk operations (joins, unions, intersections ...) * simple sql-layer on top of oomk Change log since the last (semi-public) 0.2-release: '' views '' * New Views can be added and modified * Existing views can be deleted or renamed * Several views or selections can be openened in parallel into different notebook-tabs (try right click on the notebook) * Sorting Views via viewname or columnnames * Browsing of starkit files * Editing subviews * Special table `mk_column_values´ for restricting editing of values '' rows '' * A row in the view is now editable via doubleclick adapted from Jeff Godfrey's mk_manager see: http://mini.net/tcl/8811 * Record editing is type specific (thx to the wcb-package Csaba Nemethy http://home.t-online.de/home/csaba.nemethi/) * New rows can inserted, appended or deleted * If cell contains filename of existing file mouse-right-click tries to view this file inside the application '' import / export '' * Improved table import with suppport for various file formats (tab,comma, semikolon delimited) * Possibility to ommit importing some columns during import * Improved export with different formats ''other'' * Minor bugfixes and improvements Have fun, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 30 06:38:13 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8UBcDM06207 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 06:38:13 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 234278399B; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:38:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B027F83999 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:38:05 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:38:11 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <92269D1C-F33A-11D7-859C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I have a question about slave interpreters. Actually, it's a long-standing bug and I'm trying to understand this: $ cd metakit/tcl/test $ tclkit all.tcl Processing 9 scripts... mk1basic mk2chan mk3struct mk4commit mk5object mk6fixed FAILED: mk6fixed.4 - slave cleanup mk7limit mk8fail mk9crash Failed 1 of 33 tests: *** mk6fixed.4 - slave cleanup *** couldn't read file "/home/jcw/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4/init.tcl": no such file or directory while executing "source /home/jcw/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4/init.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel #0 [list source [file join $tcl_library init.tcl]]" (procedure "tclInit" line 63) invoked from within "tclInit" invoked from within "interp create sub" ("uplevel" body line 2) invoked from within "uplevel $body" $ tclsh all.tcl Processing 9 scripts... mk1basic mk2chan mk3struct mk4commit mk5object mk6fixed mk7limit mk8fail mk9crash Passed 33 tests $ The code causing this is a simple "interp create sub" in metakit/tcl/test/mk6fixed.tcl, it's on the web at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/mk/metakit-2.4.9.2.kit/tcl/test/mk6fixed.test The difference is that tclkit has Mk4tcl as a static package ("load {} Mk4tcl"), while in the second case it's a normal shared library. Tclkit and tclsh are both 8.4.4. The line I have in Tclkit's app init is: Tcl_StaticPackage(NULL, "Mk4tcl", Mk4tcl_Init, NULL); How do I make tclkit behave the same as tclsh for slaves? -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Sep 30 10:13:04 2003 Received: from out.exponential-e.net (out.exponential-e.net [62.244.177.197]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8UFD3M19448 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 10:13:03 -0500 Received: from Turing.eurobios.com (62-244-188-66.cust.exponential-e.net [62.244.188.66]) by out.exponential-e.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8UFD1G03566 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 15:13:01 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20030930161126.01f2a680@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 16:13:00 +0100 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps In-Reply-To: <92269D1C-F33A-11D7-859C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> References: <92269D1C-F33A-11D7-859C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-5FC15F73; boundary="=======53773857=======" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=======53773857======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-5FC15F73; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I don't know about slave interps, but I found that loading mk4tcl twice into the same interpreter, once from static and once from a shared library led to errors like those you cited (this double load could happen, somehow, to Alphatk-starpack when mk4tcl was also available in the Tcl hierarchy) Vince. --=======53773857=======-- From eduardo@bfi.com.cu Tue Sep 30 11:45:13 2003 Received: from asl.bfi.cu ([200.55.140.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h8UGj8M26587 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 11:45:09 -0500 Received: from [10.1.0.5] (helo=mail.bfi.com.cu) by asl.bfi.cu with smtp (Exim 4.20) id 1A4NcO-0001X9-EB for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 12:44:56 -0400 Received: (qmail 2144 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2003 16:44:56 -0000 Received: from segbfi.bfi.com.cu (HELO bfi.com.cu) (10.1.0.4) by mail.bfi.com.cu with SMTP; 30 Sep 2003 16:44:56 -0000 Received: from SEGBFI/SpoolDir by bfi.com.cu (Mercury 1.47); 30 Sep 03 12:44:57 -0500 Received: from SpoolDir by SEGBFI (Mercury 1.47); 30 Sep 03 12:44:52 -0500 Received: from desarrollo (10.1.0.141) by bfi.com.cu (Mercury 1.47) with ESMTP; 30 Sep 03 12:44:52 -0500 From: eduardo@bfi.com.cu To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 12:44:51 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <3F797AC3.5165.108D70D@localhost> Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-description: Mail message body X-Scan-Signature: 80797a128bb60f70c64489f8dad33abe Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from Quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h8UGj8M26587 Subject: [Starkit] Core Dump on Exit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi , I built an StartPack on Win2k some time ago and every was ok, but now when I rebuild it and execute it he take me an error on exit like this : called Tcl_Close on channel with refCount > 0 Abort (core dumped) StartPack´s update is very simple, It´s just change 2 constants in a program with the same StartPack´s hierarchy and packages. I remembered something like that in statkit mail list and I find a mail digest dated 5 Jun 2003 from Bryan Schofield with same problem at exit time, I read an Wojciech Kocjan advices but I´m not using threads and as the mather of fact I don´t know what´s the problem. Is there something that I should read to work around this ? Thanks in advanced Eduardo. From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Tue Sep 30 12:06:04 2003 Received: from ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net [216.34.191.37]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8UH64M29090 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 12:06:04 -0500 Received: from int-ch1gw-6.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-6 [3.159.232.70]) by ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.9/030701) with ESMTP id h8UH5tqD017038 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:05:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by int-ch1gw-6.online-age.net (8.12.9/8.12.8/990426-RLH) with ESMTP id h8UH5sfx021461 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 12:05:55 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CINMLVEM06 ([3.159.213.76]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6673); Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:05:53 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Core Dump on Exit Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:04:54 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Core Dump on Exit Thread-Index: AcOHcoJqXFndtGK/TYGDzTwm25fMDQAALdFg From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Sep 2003 17:05:53.0872 (UTC) FILETIME=[1B7EBD00:01C38775] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h8UH64M29090 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The problem I was having was related to mounting a zip archive that was included in a starpack. On exit, if the zip was not unmounted, it would core. Wojciech's post was not in response to my problem. I got around by making sure I unmounted the zip archive before just prior to exit, and later abandoned the idea of embedded zips (I just wanted to see if could be done :-). I *think*, though I can't actually remember for sure, it was traced down to a bug in the vfs, which I *think* was fixed in a later build. If you haven't already, I'd update the tclkit runtime you are using to build your starpack. Just curious, have you been able to trace down what exactly is causing the core and does the core happen when the application is ran "unwrapped"? -- bryan > -----Original Message----- > From: eduardo@bfi.com.cu [mailto:eduardo@bfi.com.cu] > Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 12:45 PM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] Core Dump on Exit > > > Hi , I built an StartPack on Win2k some time ago and every was ok, > but now when I rebuild it and execute it he take me an error > on exit like > this : > > called Tcl_Close on channel with refCount > 0 > Abort (core dumped) > > StartPack´s update is very simple, It´s just change 2 > constants in a > program with the same StartPack´s hierarchy and packages. > > I remembered something like that in statkit mail list and I > find a mail > digest dated 5 Jun 2003 from Bryan Schofield with same problem at > exit time, I read an Wojciech Kocjan advices but I´m not > using threads > and as the mather of fact I don´t know what´s the problem. > > Is there something that I should read to work around this ? > > Thanks in advanced > Eduardo. > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From Gerald.Lester@showmaster.com Tue Sep 30 17:28:48 2003 Received: from pshowmaster.com (ns.showmaster.com [209.177.207.66]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8UMSmM29674 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:28:48 -0500 Received: from [172.16.0.100] (proxy.showmaster.com [209.177.207.71]) by pshowmaster.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id h8UMetG94982 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:40:55 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps From: "Gerald W. Lester" To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20030930170002.28342.39809.Mailman@trixie.triqs.com> References: <20030930170002.28342.39809.Mailman@trixie.triqs.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.8 (1.0.8-10) Date: 30 Sep 2003 17:28:58 -0500 Message-Id: <1064960939.1361.18.camel@tiger-shark> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sounds like Mk4tcl_init initializes some global C variables and the second load is walking on the first. Mind you I have not looked at the C code, just debugging from the symptoms. Does Mk4tcl use any global C variables, or is all its C data in a per-interp client-data block? > Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:38:11 +0200 > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > To: Starkit list > Subject: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps > > Hi, I have a question about slave interpreters. Actually, it's a > long-standing bug and I'm trying to understand this: > > $ cd metakit/tcl/test > $ tclkit all.tcl > Processing 9 scripts... > mk1basic > mk2chan > mk3struct > mk4commit > mk5object > mk6fixed > FAILED: mk6fixed.4 - slave cleanup > mk7limit > mk8fail > mk9crash > > Failed 1 of 33 tests: > > *** mk6fixed.4 - slave cleanup *** > couldn't read file "/home/jcw/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4/init.tcl": no > such file or directory > while executing > "source /home/jcw/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4/init.tcl" > ("uplevel" body line 1) > invoked from within > "uplevel #0 [list source [file join $tcl_library init.tcl]]" > (procedure "tclInit" line 63) > invoked from within > "tclInit" > invoked from within > "interp create sub" > ("uplevel" body line 2) > invoked from within > "uplevel $body" > $ tclsh all.tcl > Processing 9 scripts... > mk1basic > mk2chan > mk3struct > mk4commit > mk5object > mk6fixed > mk7limit > mk8fail > mk9crash > Passed 33 tests > $ > > The code causing this is a simple "interp create sub" in > metakit/tcl/test/mk6fixed.tcl, it's on the web at: > http://www.equi4.com/pub/mk/metakit-2.4.9.2.kit/tcl/test/mk6fixed.test > > The difference is that tclkit has Mk4tcl as a static package ("load {} > Mk4tcl"), while in the second case it's a normal shared library. > Tclkit and tclsh are both 8.4.4. The line I have in Tclkit's app init > is: > Tcl_StaticPackage(NULL, "Mk4tcl", Mk4tcl_Init, NULL); > > How do I make tclkit behave the same as tclsh for slaves? -- ************************************************************************ * Gerald W. Lester | Voice: +1-504-366-7469 * * Director of Information Technology | Fax: +1-504-368-7258 * * ShowMaster!(tm) Systems | WWW: www.ShowMaster.com * * 1301 Freidrichs St. | * * Gretna, LA 70053 | * * E-mail: Gerald.Lester@ShowMaster.com | * ************************************************************************ From jcw@equi4.com Tue Sep 30 18:19:18 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8UNJHM03953 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:19:17 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 063738399B; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 01:19:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 643CB83999 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 01:19:08 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 01:19:15 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <1064960939.1361.18.camel@tiger-shark> Message-Id: <8248BD7C-F39C-11D7-A2DC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Gerald W. Lester wrote: > Sounds like Mk4tcl_init initializes some global C variables and the > second load is walking on the first. > > Mind you I have not looked at the C code, just debugging from the > symptoms. Does Mk4tcl use any global C variables, or is all its C data > in a per-interp client-data block? Metakit itself has one global symbol table, mutex-protected when threaded, that's all. Mk4tcl wraps that and adds two sequence numbers which are static (generation and mkChanSeq), which are just incremented to generate unique numbers. If that fails, I don't think it'd bring down the system. All of this is C++, which does a lot more behind the scenes on startup and shutdown (constructing/destructing static objects), but I'm quite careful to stay out of all that. MK is also used in embedded systems, i.e. not Win32 or Unix, and all of this magic init stuff tends to break in such places. The main data structure (a "MkWorkspace" object, which tracks all open datafiles), is tracked in interp-local ways, using Tcl_GetAssocData/Tcl_SetAssocData. It should be ok, given that Mk4tcl.so works fine with tclsh, with multiple slave interps. >> $ tclsh all.tcl >> Processing 9 scripts... >> mk1basic >> mk2chan >> mk3struct >> mk4commit >> mk5object >> mk6fixed >> mk7limit >> mk8fail >> mk9crash >> Passed 33 tests >> $ If I trace the load calls, I get: $ tclsh all.tcl Processing 9 scripts... mk1basic load: {../../builds/Mk4tcl.so Mk4tcl} mk2chan mk3struct mk4commit mk5object mk6fixed load: {../../builds/Mk4tcl.so Mk4tcl sub} mk7limit mk8fail mk9crash Passed 33 tests $ As expected: Mk4tcl gets loaded a second time into the slave, and this is working (tclsh). In tclkit, no loads happen, because the statically-bound Mk4tcl apparently is always present. Hm. Maybe there's something else going on. Vince's comment also might be a hint: > I found that loading mk4tcl twice into the same interpreter, once from > static and once from a shared library led to errors like those you > cited The error in tclkit happens at slave creation, i.e. when tclInit gets called once to set up things, and tclInit is definitely completely different in Tclkit (setting up the VFS extension, and initing the vfs* packages so mounts work). So it's probably a bug in the tclInit code used in tclkit. Which, ehm, is coming from VFS, as a file "boot.tcl", on the web at: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit/boot.tcl It's quite a complex omelette, in terms of chickens and eggs. The final uplevel is failing. I'm a bit lost now. Is the following true? - tclInit is a Tcl proc which needs in every interp on startup - tclInit normally comes from a static string inside the executable - extensions must be loaded in each interp to (re-)define commands - VFS mount points are visible across all interps (look away, Don :) - not sure how encoding fit into all this, or whether that is relevant So to have things inited properly in each interp, I need to load all extensions and packages, but I should not mount starkits a second time - if my understanding is right. I still don't understand why tclsh works, and tclkit doesn't. Is tclkit's tclInit doing too little or too much? More Thought Needed. Please keep info and suggestions coming... -jcw From MichaelL@frogware.com Wed Oct 1 16:28:43 2003 Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com ([209.167.184.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91LShM09325 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 16:28:43 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:27:57 -0400 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 05:27:57 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 05:27:57 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 05:27:57 PM, S/MIME Sign failed at 10/01/2003 05:27:57 PM: The cryptographic key was not found, Serialize by Router on Development/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 05:27:58 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 05:27:58 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Subject: [Starkit] DLL's on Windows Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I ran into an interesting problem trying to create a Starpack/Starkit for XOTcl on Windows. XOTcl is implemented as a dll (xotcl1.0.dll) and comes with various utility libraries. Most of the libraries are pure Tcl, but some--store and xml--have binaries. Those binaries actually export XOTcl classes, and thus have a dependency on xotcl1.0.dll. When Starpacks load a dll that's embeded within the kit, they copy the dll's out to the temp directory and give them temporary names. This causes a problem which, I believe, can be fixed (sort of)--but first let me describe the problem. Load XOTcl using "package require XOTcl." Now load one of the packages which loads a dll which depends on the xotcl dll. The second package will fail to load because it can't find the xotcl dll on the path. If the dll hadn't been renamed, Windows would have found the dll in memory and would not have gone looking for it. The fact that it *is* renamed means that Windows doesn't see that it already has what it's looking for, and the search ensues... The workaround is to force the initial load of the xotcl dll using a path and dll which is outside of the Starpack. One way to do that is to copy the dll from the Starpack to the directory that contains the Starpack. In any event, you have to make sure *that* dll gets loaded so that no renaming happens. Some other attempted fixes didn't work. For example, having the dll outside the Starpack to begin with (and not doing the redirecting on load mentioned above) caused a GPF. The reason is that in those circumstances XOTcl gets loaded twice--once via the temp renamed dll loaded from within the Starpack, and once by the other dll which finds the xotcl dll on the "path" (ie, next to the executable). This is likely an XOTcl-specific issue; my point is simply that it take s a bit of effort to figure out the right fix. (It's possible that this was actually a Windows error, since we're forcing the load of a dll twice--but I doubt it.) One possible solution would be to create a uniquely named subdir in the temp directory, and then copy dll's to that subdir without renaming. Another solution would be to optionally allow dll's to be copied to the temp dir without renaming. Note that both of these options introduce new potential problems that Starpacks/Starkits are trying to solve. Specifically, if Windows finds the dll already in memory, it won't load it; what if someone else has already loaded the dll, but it's the wrong version? This used to be a problem on Windows, but as far as I know it was fixed at some point. For example, it's possible that Windows searches for dlls independently for each app. I'm not sure... but it would be good to find out, because it would impact a real/good fix for this problem. Of course, it's possible that most people don't see this as a likely problem--a dll which is loaded from a Starpack/Starkit and which in turn is linked to by other dll's. But just in case, here's the info... From MichaelL@frogware.com Wed Oct 1 16:38:22 2003 Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com ([209.167.184.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91LcMM10298 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 16:38:22 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:37:36 -0400 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 05:37:35 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 05:37:35 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 05:37:35 PM, S/MIME Sign failed at 10/01/2003 05:37:35 PM: The cryptographic key was not found, Serialize by Router on Development/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 05:37:37 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 05:37:37 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've developed a Starpack that I'm trying out on various platforms. This particular Starpack uses tDOM. I had someone try it out on Mac OS X, and he got this error: dyld: ./JumpGen can't open library: /Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Versions/8.4/Tcl (No such file or directory, errno = 2) We were able to fix the problem by installing Tcl/Tk on his machine. Clearly, then, there's a dependency on the Tcl/Tk shared libraries. Given that my understanding is that tclkits are themselves statically linked, I presume the problem must be the tDOM library. Maybe on the Mac platform they weren't compiled with stubs enabled...? This is unfamiliar territory for me on an unfamiliar platform, so I wanted to a) find out if this theory makes sense and b) if so let people know there may be a problem with the tDOM libraries on the Mac. (I can try to recompile the libraries on a Mac and such, but given that I don't have one it's going to take a while.) From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Wed Oct 1 16:45:23 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91LjNM11117 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 16:45:23 -0500 Received: (from keith@localhost) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) id h91LjNUF090618; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 16:45:23 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) X-Authentication-Warning: jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu: keith set sender to keith@lib.uchicago.edu using -f To: MichaelL@frogware.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX From: Keith Waclena In-Reply-To: (MichaelL@frogware.com's message of "Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:37:36 -0400") X-Yow: An INK-LING? Sure -- TAKE one!! Did you BUY any COMMUNIST UNIFORMS?? References: Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 16:45:23 -0500 Message-ID: Lines: 20 User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley, berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "ML" == MichaelL writes: ML> I've developed a Starpack that I'm trying out on various platforms. This ML> particular Starpack uses tDOM. ML> I had someone try it out on Mac OS X, and he got this error: ML> dyld: ./JumpGen can't open library: ML> /Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Versions/8.4/Tcl (No such file or ML> directory, errno = 2) Just to confirm, I happened to have had exactly this same problem (tDOM under Mac OS X) just yesterday. I was using the 8.4.4 darwin tclkit and the tDOM starpack from sdarchive. -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! Song of the Moment: Happy (The Wrens) From MichaelL@frogware.com Wed Oct 1 17:01:50 2003 Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com ([209.167.184.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91M1oM13727 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:01:50 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 18:01:05 -0400 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:01:04 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:01:04 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 06:01:04 PM, S/MIME Sign failed at 10/01/2003 06:01:04 PM: The cryptographic key was not found, Serialize by Router on Development/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:01:06 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 06:01:06 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Subject: [Starkit] Cross-platform Starkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Like many other people here I've built a little system for automating Starpack/Starkit construction. Like many other people here I ran into the problem of loading platform-specific libraries. Since I wanted to do "cross-compiling" of Starpacks/Starkits, I also ran into the problem of knowing various extensions on different platforms. I borrowed and modifed some things that I saw in other kits and on the wiki. In case it's helpful I'll post here my approach. (Note that some changes are subtle. For example, I changed the "Power Macintosh" glob to Power*, because according to another page on the wiki some PowerPC platforms report as "Power PC" and those should also get switched to "ppc".) Finally: I did modify some of the stuff I saw, and someone here may spot something I did that doesn't make sense on platform X. Oh, in fact that's pretty much a given... :-) # File: PkgIndexUtil.tcl # Author: Michael Lenaghan # Copyright: Public Domain # Created: 2003/09/30 # Based on an idea from the wiki @ http://mini.net/tcl/8522 # Add this line to the top of a pkgIndex.tcl file to use this file: # # source [file join [file dirname [info script]] "pkgIndexUtil.tcl"] # # Then add [platform osmachine] and [platform oslibextension] where # required in the load statements. proc platform {args} { if {[llength $args] > 0} { switch -- [lindex $args 0] { machine { global tcl_platform switch -glob -- $tcl_platform(machine) { intel - i*86* { return x86 } Power* { return ppc } sun4* { return sparc } 9000* { return 9000 } default { return [regsub -all {[ /]} \ [string tolower $tcl_platform(machine)] "-"] } } } os { global tcl_platform switch -glob -- [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0] { Win* { return windows } Sun* { return solaris } default { return [regsub -all {[ /]} \ [string tolower $tcl_platform(os)] "-"] } } } osmachine { return "[platform os]-[platform machine]" } osbinextension { if {[llength $args] == 1} { set os [platform os] } else { set os [lindex $args 1] } switch -glob -- $os { win* { return ".exe" } default { return ".bin" } } } oslibextension { if {[llength $args] == 1} { set os [platform os] } else { set os [lindex $args 1] } switch -glob -- $os { darwin* { return ".dylib" } win* { return ".dll" } default { return ".so" } } } default { error "bad option \"[lindex $args 0]\": must be machine, os, osmachine, osbinextension, or oslibextension." } } } else { error "wrong # args: should be \"platform option ?arg arg ...?\"" } } ================================================ Here's an example of use, from the first couple of lines in my XOTcl pkgIndex.tcl file: source [file join [file dirname [info script]] "pkgIndexUtil.tcl"] package ifneeded XOTcl 1.0 [list load [file join $dir [platform osmachine] libxotcl1.0[platform oslibextension]] XOTcl] ... From jcw@equi4.com Wed Oct 1 17:09:48 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91M9lM14965 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:09:47 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 4BD348399B; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:09:39 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF24983999 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:09:38 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:09:46 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: > /Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Versions/8.4/Tcl (No such file or > directory, errno = 2) > > We were able to fix the problem by installing Tcl/Tk on his machine. To chime in with Keith, I too can reproduce this with latest tclkit and tdom from sdarchive. I also tried Daniel's 8.4.4 batteries-included package, but there's a multi-threaded fly in the ointment: $ cd /Library/Tcl/tdom0.8.0/ $ ls -la total 568 drwxr-xr-x 6 root staff 204 Aug 9 21:59 . drwxr-xr-x 55 root staff 1870 Sep 28 11:21 .. -rwxr-xr-x 1 root staff 542288 Aug 6 04:53 libtdom0.8.0.dylib -rw-r--r-- 1 root staff 3912 Aug 6 04:53 libtdomstub0.8.0.a -rw-r--r-- 1 root staff 105 Aug 6 04:53 pkgIndex.tcl -rw-r--r-- 1 root staff 27725 Aug 6 04:53 tdom.tcl $ tclkit % load ./libtdom0.8.0.dylib Tcl core wasn't compiled for multithreading. % Drat, there are just too many things that can go wrong in this house of cards... What this does indicate though, is that a correct build is possible, otherwise the above message wouldn't even appear. It "just needs another set of config settings and re-compiling everything once more" (how's that for an epitaph!). -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Oct 1 17:19:31 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91MJUM16020 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:19:30 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 8AC338399B; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:19:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1255E83999 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:19:22 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:19:30 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Cross-platform Starkits Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <53794597-F45D-11D7-A2DC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_01_02,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: > Like many other people here I've built a little system for automating > Starpack/Starkit construction. Like many other people here I ran into > the > problem of loading platform-specific libraries. Since I wanted to do > "cross-compiling" of Starpacks/Starkits, I also ran into the problem of > knowing various extensions on different platforms. > > I borrowed and modifed some things that I saw in other kits and on the > wiki. In case it's helpful I'll post here my approach. Great, thanks for doing so. Please also have a look at Critcl. It contains a "proc platform" written by Steve Landers which matches some of what you did quite closely. As a matter of fact, I recently copied that proc to the starkit package, as you can see in CVS on SF, and as it's in /pub/sk/starkit.tar.gz on the equi4 website. > # Then add [platform osmachine] and [platform oslibextension] where I also added a "starkit::pload", and use it as follows: In Mk4tcl, I use: package ifneeded Mk4tcl 2.4.9.2 "package require starkit [list starkit::pload $dir Mk4tcl Mk4tcl]" Not a pretty sight perhaps, but it works. The definition of pload is: proc starkit::pload {dir name args} { set f [file join $dir [platform] $name[info sharedlibext]] uplevel 1 [linsert $args 0 load $f] } Looks like this arg-less use of platform could be merged with what you've done. -jcw From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Wed Oct 1 17:31:52 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91MVqM17646; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:31:52 -0500 Received: (from keith@localhost) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) id h91MVmER094883; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:31:48 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) X-Authentication-Warning: jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu: keith set sender to keith@lib.uchicago.edu using -f To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX From: Keith Waclena In-Reply-To: (Jean-Claude Wippler's message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:09:46 +0200") X-Yow: Did you move a lot of KOREAN STEAK KNIVES this trip, Dingy? References: Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 17:31:48 -0500 Message-ID: Lines: 25 User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley, berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h91MVqM17646 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "JCW" == Jean-Claude Wippler writes: JCW> MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: >> /Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Versions/8.4/Tcl (No such file or >> directory, errno = 2) >> >> We were able to fix the problem by installing Tcl/Tk on his machine. JCW> To chime in with Keith, I too can reproduce this with latest tclkit JCW> and tdom from sdarchive. This isn't a big problem for me because I built a parser class that can choose amongst three different parsers (not three true general purpose parsers! I only need to extract urls from web pages...), but I am confused and curious about where the problem lies: in the darwin tdom build? In the darwin tclkit? In some Darwin libraries? /k -- Keith Waclena / keith@lib.uchicago.edu / ATKQJ / Whoop-de-doo, Tarantula Town! http://www.lib.uchicago.edu/keith/ Bring back fair use: repeal the DMCA! Song of the Moment: Nelles (Guido Möbius) From MichaelL@frogware.com Wed Oct 1 17:46:12 2003 Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com ([209.167.184.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91MkBM19250; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:46:12 -0500 In-Reply-To: <53794597-F45D-11D7-A2DC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list , starkit-admin@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Cross-platform Starkits MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 18:45:26 -0400 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:45:25 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:45:25 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 06:45:25 PM, S/MIME Sign failed at 10/01/2003 06:45:25 PM: The cryptographic key was not found, Serialize by Router on Development/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:45:27 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 06:45:27 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: starkit-admin@equi4.com wrote on 10/01/2003 06:19:30 PM: > Please also have a look at Critcl. It contains a "proc platform" > written by Steve Landers which matches some of what you did quite > closely. As a matter of fact, I recently copied that proc to the > starkit package, as you can see in CVS on SF, and as it's in > /pub/sk/starkit.tar.gz on the equi4 website. Yes. As I said, I looked at some examples in existing kits. I saw the Criticl stuff used in a few of them. Some of the changes I made in my version: * You can request "os", "machine", and "osmachine" separately. * You can request "osbinextension" and "oslibextension". * With no param, osbin and oslib return the bin/lib ext of the current platform. With an os param, they return the extension of the given os. (I'm sure that list is quite incomplete!) * I force all names to lower case to avoid possible case-sensitivity confusion. There are some other small changes in globs and such, but only a few. > I also added a "starkit::pload", and use it as follows: Ah, excellent, that's much better... Better still to have something like this in the core, but the starkit package is the next best thing. From MichaelL@frogware.com Wed Oct 1 17:50:41 2003 Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com ([209.167.184.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91MofM19719 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:50:41 -0500 In-Reply-To: <1065048699.31206.11.camel@wcferril.local> To: Chuck Ferril Cc: Keith Waclena , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 18:49:54 -0400 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:49:54 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:49:54 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 06:49:54 PM, S/MIME Sign failed at 10/01/2003 06:49:54 PM: The cryptographic key was not found, Serialize by Router on Development/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 06:49:56 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 06:49:56 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Chuck Ferril wrote on 10/01/2003 06:51:39 PM: > Try the tDOM kit from my site...I believe the one on the sdarchive is > older and has a bug in the loading of the shared objects. > I used the tdom0.7.7.kit from your site. (I know there's a 0.7.8 version but I haven't used/tested that yet on the platforms I *do* use...) > FYI: I'm looking for someone willing to build the latest OSX tDOM > binaries for me since I don't have a mac. One time or ongoing? I don't have a Mac, but I can borrow one for a test. From jcw@equi4.com Wed Oct 1 17:59:58 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91MxvM20515 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:59:57 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 42E0B8399B; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:59:49 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5AF283999 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:59:48 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:59:57 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Keith Waclena wrote: [...] > I am confused and curious about where the problem lies: in the darwin > tdom build? In the darwin tclkit? In some Darwin libraries? The tdom build. The tclkit-darwin-ppc does not use Frameworks, it's a pretty standard unix binary with Tk based on X11. Tcl/Tk Aqua does, but non-GUI extensions should work in both. There's no tracking of starkits submitted to sdarchive, so it's impossible to tell where it came from (all I can say is that submission is based on an email followup, so it must have been someone who Steve Landers or I know). This is clearly not good enough for a "real" package repository. All I can say is: stay tuned - I want to get an absolutely tight system in place, so each file in any revision of any starkit can be traced. I need it at least for all the ones I manage and make public. -jcw From cferril@mchsi.com Wed Oct 1 18:12:44 2003 Received: from sccimhc02.asp.att.net (sccimhc02.asp.att.net [63.240.76.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h91NCiM21488; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 18:12:44 -0500 Received: from 192.168.2.100 (12-218-32-245.client.mchsi.com[12.218.32.245]) by sccimhc02.asp.att.net (sccimhc02) with SMTP id <20031001231142im200mhtcpe>; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 23:11:42 +0000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX From: Chuck Ferril To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1065050290.31976.8.camel@wcferril.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.3 Date: 01 Oct 2003 18:18:11 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: jcw, > There's no tracking of starkits submitted to sdarchive, so it's > impossible to tell where it came from (all I can say is that submission > is based on an email followup, so it must have been someone who Steve > Landers or I know). I built and submitted the version on the sdarchive. I had hoped that a link could be made to my site (or at least http://tdom.org) for the download. That would have made it much easier to be updated it as needed. > This is clearly not good enough for a "real" > package repository. Agreed; but at least it's a start...I'm looking forward to the next stage of starkit management. Chuck From btheado@rrohio.com Wed Oct 1 19:13:42 2003 Received: from outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (outbound-relay.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h920DgM25949 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 19:13:42 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h920DfYK015521 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:13:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20031002001340.IYBJ8891.fep01.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:13:40 -0400 Message-ID: <005301c3887a$08a080f0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: <92269D1C-F33A-11D7-859C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:13:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Jean-Claude Wippler" wrote: > Hi, I have a question about slave interpreters. Actually, it's a > long-standing bug and I'm trying to understand this: snip > http://www.equi4.com/pub/mk/metakit-2.4.9.2.kit/tcl/test/mk6fixed.test > snip I played around with the above code and the following code from defs_mk.tcl looks suspicious to me: S { # do this before each test } { # do this after each test foreach {db path} [mk::file open] { mk::file close $db } When using tclkit [mk::file open] returns 'exe', which when closed would make the tclkit vfs unreachable, right? I started looking into this because I thought it might be the same bug as http://www.equi4.com/BTS.cgi/BTS/editbugs?bugid=42, which I ran across when trying to source a starkit into a tclkit slave interp. Brian Theado From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Oct 1 20:10:26 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h921APM32341 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:10:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 31454 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2003 01:10:20 -0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavis-ng-0.1.6.4-03dc on mail.digitalsmarties.com Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 02 Oct 2003 01:10:15 -0000 Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:10:13 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list To: Chuck Ferril From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: <1065050290.31976.8.camel@wcferril.local> Message-Id: <2CF23722-F475-11D7-B669-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Chuck, > I built and submitted the version on the sdarchive. I had hoped that a > link could be made to my site (or at least http://tdom.org) for the > download. That would have made it much easier to be updated it as > needed. Sure - we can do that easy enough. Just send me the URL and I'll add a link > > Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Oct 1 20:34:40 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@gw.digital-smarties.com [203.59.125.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h921YbM01904 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:34:39 -0500 Received: (qmail 32120 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2003 01:34:35 -0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavis-ng-0.1.6.4-03dc on mail.digitalsmarties.com Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 02 Oct 2003 01:34:30 -0000 Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:34:28 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Cross-platform Starkits Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Starkit list To: MichaelL@frogware.com From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <908362D3-F478-11D7-B669-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, October 2, 2003, at 06:45 AM, MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: > Some of the changes I made in my version: > > * You can request "os", "machine", and "osmachine" separately. > * You can request "osbinextension" and "oslibextension". > * With no param, osbin and oslib return the bin/lib ext of the > current platform. With an os param, they return the extension > of the given os. (I'm sure that list is quite incomplete!) > * I force all names to lower case to avoid possible > case-sensitivity confusion. Nice work Michael :-) One thing to be aware of - on AIX (and possibly other platforms) the value of tcl_platform(machine) includes the unique CPU serial number. Last year JCW and I discussed a separate package ("platform" perhaps) that "normalises" the platform names, extracts machine type, etc. You've gone a long way to doing this, so I'd encourage you to keep going. Cheers Steve From MichaelL@frogware.com Wed Oct 1 21:47:49 2003 Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com ([209.167.184.206]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h922lmM06235 for ; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 21:47:49 -0500 In-Reply-To: <908362D3-F478-11D7-B669-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> To: Steve Landers Cc: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Cross-platform Starkits MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 22:47:02 -0400 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 10:47:03 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 10:47:03 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 10:47:03 PM, S/MIME Sign failed at 10/01/2003 10:47:03 PM: The cryptographic key was not found, Serialize by Router on Development/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 10/01/2003 10:47:04 PM, Serialize complete at 10/01/2003 10:47:04 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: starkit-admin@equi4.com wrote on 10/01/2003 09:34:28 PM: > One thing to be aware of - on AIX (and possibly other platforms) the > value of tcl_platform(machine) includes the unique CPU serial number. > Last year JCW and I discussed a separate package ("platform" perhaps) > that "normalises" the platform names, extracts machine type, etc. > You've gone a long way to doing this, so I'd encourage you to keep > going. Ok, I see that now on the wiki at http://mini.net/tcl/1649. And I can see some other possible tweaks, like changing "armv41" to "arm". The problem is that I know next to nothing about most of those platforms. But hey, I won't let that stop me. :-) ps: On the Wiki (and under your name!) it says "AIX on PPC". How many architectures does AIX run on? Is there *anything* that would make sense for that os? From akupries@shaw.ca Thu Oct 2 00:08:06 2003 Received: from pd4mo2so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92586M12906 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:08:06 -0500 Received: from pd5mr1so.prod.shaw.ca (pd5mr1so-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.232]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HM400DKL69H8F@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 01 Oct 2003 23:08:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml3so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml3so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.147]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HM40037269HOJ@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 01 Oct 2003 23:08:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluepeak (h24-76-111-211.vc.shawcable.net [24.76.111.211]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with SMTP id <0HM40058F69GX0@l-daemon> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 01 Oct 2003 23:08:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=shaw.ca) by bluepeak with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A4vOH-00035W-00 for ; Wed, 01 Oct 2003 21:48:37 -0700 Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 21:48:35 -0700 From: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] DLL's on Windows In-reply-to: <"Message from MichaelL"@frogware.com> "of Wed, 01 Oct 2003 17:27:57 EDT." To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 (debian 2.5-1) with nmh-1.0.4+dev Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I ran into an interesting problem trying to create a > Starpack/Starkit for XOTcl on Windows. XOTcl is implemented as a dll > (xotcl1.0.dll) and comes with various utility libraries. Most of the > libraries are pure Tcl, but some--store and xml--have > binaries. Those binaries actually export XOTcl classes, and thus > have a dependency on xotcl1.0.dll. > When Starpacks load a dll that's embeded within the kit, they copy > the dll's out to the temp directory and give them temporary > names. This causes a problem which, I believe, can be fixed (sort > of)--but first let me describe the problem. > Load XOTcl using "package require XOTcl." Now load one of the > packages which loads a dll which depends on the xotcl dll. The > second package will fail to load because it can't find the xotcl dll > on the path. > If the dll hadn't been renamed, Windows would have found the dll in > memory and would not have gone looking for it. The fact that it *is* > renamed means that Windows doesn't see that it already has what it's > looking for, and the search ensues... > The workaround is to force the initial load of the xotcl dll using a > path and dll which is outside of the Starpack. One way to do that is > to copy the dll from the Starpack to the directory that contains the > Starpack. In any event, you have to make sure *that* dll gets loaded > so that no renaming happens. The true fix is for the XOTcl core library to export a stub table, and for the dependent packages to link against the then existing stub library of the xotcl core. This is like it was done for TclXML and TclXML/expat, with TclXML as the core package, and TclXML/expat the package depending on it. See tclxml.sf.net for the sources of that. Another analogy is Tcl itself, with Tk as the dependent package. When this is done the dependent packages will have no direct dependency on the xotcl core anymore (everything is satisfied by the xotcl core stub library), and the resolution of the required/used function pointers will be done by the stub system of the tcl core. -- So long, Andreas Kupries Developer @ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Thu Oct 2 00:44:49 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h925imM14812 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:44:48 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h925ikV13621 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 15:44:46 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2003100215444518379 for ; Thu, 02 Oct 2003 15:44:45 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h925ihv13607; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 15:44:43 +1000 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h925ifDY020840; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 15:44:42 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 15:44:40 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: MichaelL@frogware.com, starkit@equi4.com To: Keith Waclena , Steve Landers From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <842701C2-F49B-11D7-8EF6-000A958518E8@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, Oct 2, 2003, at 07:45 Australia/Sydney, Keith Waclena wrote: > ML> I've developed a Starpack that I'm trying out on various > platforms. This > ML> particular Starpack uses tDOM. > > ML> I had someone try it out on Mac OS X, and he got this error: > > ML> dyld: ./JumpGen can't open library: > ML> /Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Versions/8.4/Tcl (No such file > or > ML> directory, errno = 2) > > Just to confirm, I happened to have had exactly this same problem > (tDOM under Mac OS X) just yesterday. I was using the 8.4.4 darwin > tclkit and the tDOM starpack from sdarchive. the OSX version of the starpack must not be linked properly with libtclstub, this error would happen if you have linked directly with the Tcl library. the tdom included in my TclTkAqua Bistro loads fine: % otool -L /Library/Tcl/tdom0.8.0/libtdom0.8.0.dylib /Library/Tcl/tdom0.8.0/libtdom0.8.0.dylib: libtdom0.8.0.dylib (compatibility version 0.0.0, current version 0.0.0) /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib (compatibility version 1.0.0, current version 63.0.0) % tclkit % lappend auto_path /Library/Tcl /Library/Tcl/bin/tclkit/lib/tcl8.4 /Library/Tcl/bin/tclkit/lib /Library/Tcl % package require tdom Tcl core wasn't compiled for multithreading. this last error happens because tclkit wasn't compiled threaded, but tdom certainly loads up to that point, no library dependency issues. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Thu Oct 2 03:53:13 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h928rCM25885; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 03:53:12 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h928rAV01006; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:53:10 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2003100218531019728 ; Thu, 02 Oct 2003 18:53:10 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h928r9v00998; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:53:09 +1000 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h928r9DY021357; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:53:09 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:53:08 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list To: Chuck Ferril From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <1065050290.31976.8.camel@wcferril.local> Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Chuck, On Thursday, Oct 2, 2003, at 09:18 Australia/Sydney, Chuck Ferril wrote: >> There's no tracking of starkits submitted to sdarchive, so it's >> impossible to tell where it came from (all I can say is that >> submission >> is based on an email followup, so it must have been someone who Steve >> Landers or I know). > > I built and submitted the version on the sdarchive. I had hoped that a > link could be made to my site (or at least http://tdom.org) for the > download. That would have made it much easier to be updated it as > needed. how did you build tdom for Mac OS X? using a standard TEA configure/make works for me and gives a properly stub-linked tdom, this for tdom HEAD as of 2003-08-05 (last build date of TclTkAquaBI) the following patch may be relevant, but I don't really think so, it only deals with libtdomstub issues. http://tcltkaqua.sourceforge.net/8.4.4/patches/tdom.diff Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Thu Oct 2 03:54:21 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h928sKM25962 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 03:54:20 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h928sJV01104 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:54:19 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2003100218541819744 for ; Thu, 02 Oct 2003 18:54:18 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h928sIv01096; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:54:18 +1000 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h928sHDY021365; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:54:17 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:54:16 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Chuck Ferril , Keith Waclena , starkit@equi4.com To: MichaelL@frogware.com From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <00E5AD5F-F4B6-11D7-9B15-000A958518E8@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, Oct 2, 2003, at 08:49 Australia/Sydney, MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: >> FYI: I'm looking for someone willing to build the latest OSX tDOM >> binaries for me since I don't have a mac. > > One time or ongoing? I don't have a Mac, but I can borrow one for a > test. not that there is a Mac OS X 10.2 machine available on the sourceforge compilefarm that anyone can access who is a developer on a SF project. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From reinhard@cadence.com Thu Oct 2 04:25:12 2003 Received: from mailgate.Cadence.COM (mailgate.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.1]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h929PBM28379 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 04:25:12 -0500 Received: from cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (cdsmunich.Cadence.COM [158.140.172.1]) by mailgate.Cadence.COM (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA01529 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 02:25:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cadence.com ([158.140.211.93]) by cdsmunich.Cadence.COM (8.10.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h929P9808820; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:25:09 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F7BEEF2.7030400@cadence.com> Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 11:25:06 +0200 From: Reinhard Fobbe Reply-To: Reinhard Fobbe Organization: Cadence Design Systems GmbH User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.2b) Gecko/20021016 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list CC: Reinhard Fobbe References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Received: By mailgate.Cadence.COM as CAA01529 at Thu Oct 2 02:25:10 2003 Subject: [Starkit] Cross-platform Tclkits Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a follow-up on the topic "[Starkit] Cross-platform Starkits". To run starkits on different architectures we can either run the Tclkit executable with the starkit as an argument or use this approach: A Starkit starts with this header: --- #!/bin/sh # \ exec tclkit "$0" ${1+"$@"} package require starkit starkit::header mk4 -readonly --- The Tclkit executables that are distributes via http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.4/ use these names: --- 1066423b 2003-08-20 tclkit-darwin-ppc.gz 1191194b 2003-08-26 tclkit-dec-alpha.gz 1642264b 2003-09-29 tclkit-hpux-9000.gz 1056264b 2003-08-20 tclkit-linux-x86.gz 1037843b 2003-08-20 tclkit-linux-x86.upx.bin 1119623b 2003-08-30 tclkit-linux-x86_64.gz 1717647b 2003-08-20 tclkit-linux-x86static.gz 1651232b 2003-08-20 tclkit-linux-x86static.upx.bin 1007487b 2003-09-23 tclkit-netbsd-x86.gz 1379504b 2003-09-23 tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz 1327993b 2003-09-23 tclkit-solaris-x86.gz 529783b 2003-08-21 tclkit-win32-sh.exe.gz 463792b 2003-08-21 tclkit-win32-sh.upx.exe 1054503b 2003-08-21 tclkit-win32.exe.gz 941325b 2003-08-21 tclkit-win32.upx.exe --- So I ended up writing this small wrapper called "tclkit" for me own use: --- #!/bin/sh # Driver for platform-independant tclkit SYS=`uname -s` DIR=`dirname "$0"` case $SYS in SunOS) exec $DIR/bin/tclkit-solaris-sparc "$@" ;; Linux) exec $DIR/bin/tclkit-linux-x86 "$@" ;; HP-UX) exec $DIR/bin/tclkit-hpux-9000 "$@" ;; CYGWIN_NT-5.0) exec $DIR/bin/tclkit-win32.exe "$@" ;; MINGW32_NT-5.0) start $DIR/bin/tclkit-win32.exe "$@" ;; *) echo "Unknown system '$SYS'";; esac --- Now I can log into any platform and run the starkit directly; it finds the correct executable via the wrapper by itself. Is this something of general interest? Then we could extend this script and make it available for download. R. From cferril@mchsi.com Thu Oct 2 08:02:00 2003 Received: from sccmmhc02.asp.att.net (sccmmhc02.asp.att.net [204.127.203.184]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92D1xM08165; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 08:02:00 -0500 Received: from 192.168.2.100 (12-218-32-245.client.mchsi.com[12.218.32.245]) by sccmmhc02.asp.att.net (sccmmhc02) with SMTP id <20031002130153mm200io8rte>; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:01:54 +0000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX From: Chuck Ferril To: "Daniel A. Steffen" Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1065100100.15171.4.camel@wcferril.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.3 Date: 02 Oct 2003 08:08:20 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Daniel, > how did you build tdom for Mac OS X? A friend of mine built it. > using a standard TEA configure/make works for me and gives a properly > stub-linked tdom, this for tdom HEAD as of 2003-08-05 (last build date > of TclTkAquaBI) > I have no idea how he built it. Could you send me the shared objects from your build? I would really like to add OSX support back into my tDOM kit. One of these days, I may finally break down and buy a Mac so I can build it myself... Chuck From steffen@ics.mq.edu.au Thu Oct 2 09:05:49 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92E5mM11660; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:05:48 -0500 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id h92E5kV19939; Fri, 3 Oct 2003 00:05:46 +1000 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2003100300054320477 ; Fri, 03 Oct 2003 00:05:43 +1000 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id h92E5dv19927; Fri, 3 Oct 2003 00:05:39 +1000 (EST) Received: from ics.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h92E5Z2P000693; Fri, 3 Oct 2003 00:05:35 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 00:05:33 +1000 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit on MacOSX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list To: Chuck Ferril From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: <1065100100.15171.4.camel@wcferril.local> Message-Id: <7D33749C-F4E1-11D7-9E86-000A958518E8@ics.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thursday, Oct 2, 2003, at 23:08 Australia/Sydney, Chuck Ferril wrote: > I have no idea how he built it. Could you send me the shared objects > from your build? they are part of my TclTkAquaBI distribution, c.f. http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/tcltk/TclTkAqua/ but if you don't have a mac you won't be able to extract the binaries from the distribution of course... ;-( I'll send you a tarball of the tdom install off-list. > I would really like to add OSX support back into my > tDOM kit. One of these days, I may finally break down and buy a Mac so > I > can build it myself... you can always use the sourceforge compilefarm, as mentioned. Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From eduardo@bfi.com.cu Thu Oct 2 09:41:17 2003 Received: from asl.bfi.cu ([200.55.140.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h92EekM13969 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:41:13 -0500 Received: from [10.1.0.5] (helo=mail.bfi.com.cu) by asl.bfi.cu with smtp (Exim 4.20) id 1A54ct-0002uR-QP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 02 Oct 2003 10:40:19 -0400 Received: (qmail 25478 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2003 14:40:19 -0000 Received: from segbfi.bfi.com.cu (HELO bfi.com.cu) (10.1.0.4) by mail.bfi.com.cu with SMTP; 2 Oct 2003 14:40:19 -0000 Received: from SEGBFI/SpoolDir by bfi.com.cu (Mercury 1.47); 2 Oct 03 10:40:20 -0500 Received: from SpoolDir by SEGBFI (Mercury 1.47); 2 Oct 03 10:40:20 -0500 Received: from desarrollo (10.1.0.141) by bfi.com.cu (Mercury 1.47) with ESMTP; 2 Oct 03 10:40:19 -0500 From: eduardo@bfi.com.cu To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:40:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <3F7C0092.3280.A38BA9@localhost> Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Scan-Signature: fa62d7169d0e92ba249fb59f887b4852 Subject: [Starkit] RE: Core Dump on Exit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi , Bryan I'm trying to identify causing a core dump but I don't get it yet, nevertheless, during tests I find a curious efect : The original application's end is : . . . wm protocol . WM_DELETE_WINDOW { set Pexit 1 } vwait Pexit exit but I realized that when I insert a tcl's command error just before exit then original error called Tcl_Close on channel with refCount > 0 dissapear and the core dump is not taken, It's with application's end like : wm protocol . WM_DELETE_WINDOW { set Pexit 1 } vwait Pexit error "Bye" 1 exit I'm working around this , searching a causing and trying to rebuild startpack with a normal exit. Best Regard Eduardo. From btheado@rrohio.com Thu Oct 2 10:38:41 2003 Received: from outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (outbound-relay.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92FceM19554 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:38:40 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h92FcdYK010424 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:38:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([166.50.135.65]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20031002153839.JQTF8891.fep01.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:38:39 -0400 Message-ID: <008101c388fb$40513ae0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:38:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] Sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Below is code that I found I needed in order to get sourcing of a starkit to work in a slave interpreter. interp create sub # Execute the following boot.tcl snippet in the slave interpreter. Without this, package require vfs fails. sub eval { load {} pwb load {} vfs # lookup and emulate "source" of lib/vfs/{vfs*.tcl,mk4vfs.tcl} # must use raw MetaKit calls because VFS is not yet in place set d [mk::select exe.dirs parent 0 name lib] set d [mk::select exe.dirs parent $d name vfs] foreach x {vfsUtils vfslib mk4vfs} { set n [mk::select exe.dirs!$d.files name $x.tcl] set s [mk::get exe.dirs!$d.files!$n contents] catch {set s [zlib decompress $s]} uplevel #0 $s } } # Setup starkit::startup dependencies sub eval { set argv0 tclkit set argv {} set argc 0 } # Source the starkit sub eval source sdx.kit Should tclkit be providing the same environment in the slave interpreter or is it the responsibility of the person creating the interpreter? Either way, it seems like it should be easier than it is. Brian Theado From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 2 10:49:04 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92Fn3M20749 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:49:04 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 14FC48399B; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:48:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 906A883999 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:48:55 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:49:03 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Q about load and slave interps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <005301c3887a$08a080f0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > I played around with the above code and the following code from > defs_mk.tcl > looks suspicious to me: > > S { > # do this before each test > } { > # do this after each test > foreach {db path} [mk::file open] { > mk::file close $db > } > > When using tclkit [mk::file open] returns 'exe', which when closed > would > make the tclkit vfs unreachable, right? Aha! I was looking in completely the wrong direction. That was it! I've fixed it and checked in the changes needed for tcl/test/* files. Thank you! > I started looking into this because I thought it might be the same bug > as > http://www.equi4.com/BTS.cgi/BTS/editbugs?bugid=42, which I ran across > when > trying to source a starkit into a tclkit slave interp. This appears to be a different issue. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 2 10:56:27 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92FuRM21336 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:56:27 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id A47108399B; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:56:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E746B83999 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:56:18 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:56:26 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <008101c388fb$40513ae0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > Below is code that I found I needed in order to get sourcing of a > starkit to > work in a slave interpreter. > > interp create sub > # Execute the following boot.tcl snippet in the slave interpreter. > Without > this, package require vfs fails. [...] > sub eval source sdx.kit > > Should tclkit be providing the same environment in the slave > interpreter or > is it the responsibility of the person creating the interpreter? > Either > way, it seems like it should be easier than it is. I would like at least some of this to be done by tclkit. The whole trick of loading vfs from MK using raw MK calls is definitely something that I hope can be done in tclInit, i.e. the code that gets run in every interp on startup, and which tclkit gets from the boot.tcl file inside it. My impression is that slaves currently start out with just a bit too little knowledge of things. It remains tricky, given that vfs needs tcl to run the higher level drivers such as mk4vfs.tcl, yet cannot source them from a MK datafile while vfs has not been inited, and as you illustrated, the same chicken-and-egg game happens again in each slave interp. -jcw From btheado@rrohio.com Thu Oct 2 13:25:15 2003 Received: from outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (outbound-relay.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92IPEM02761 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:25:15 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by outbound-relay.biz.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h92IPDYK001082 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 14:25:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([166.50.135.65]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20031002182513.KCMB8891.fep01.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 14:25:13 -0400 Message-ID: <009001c38912$854f76e0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 14:25:12 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Jean-Claude Wippler" wrote: > > I would like at least some of this to be done by tclkit. The whole > trick of loading vfs from MK using raw MK calls is definitely something > that I hope can be done in tclInit, i.e. the code that gets run in > every interp on startup, and which tclkit gets from the boot.tcl file > inside it. Actually the raw MK calls are not necessary. I just copied the code from boot.tcl. The mounted filesystem is accessible in the slave interpreter and could be used instead. The only problem is that package require vfs fails. To illustrate: tclkitsh % interp create sub sub % sub eval glob [info nameofexecutable]/* c:/bin/tclkitsh.exe/bin c:/bin/tclkitsh.exe/boot.tcl c:/bin/tclkitsh.exe/config.tcl c:/bin/tclkitsh.exe/lib % sub eval package require vfs can't find package vfs > > My impression is that slaves currently start out with just a bit too > little knowledge of things. > > It remains tricky, given that vfs needs tcl to run the higher level > drivers such as mk4vfs.tcl, yet cannot source them from a MK datafile > while vfs has not been inited, and as you illustrated, the same > chicken-and-egg game happens again in each slave interp. > Part of the problem is the raw MK datafile parts of http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit/boot.tcl aren't being called for the slave interpreter because of the following if statement: if {[info exists tcl_rcFileName]} This condition fails in the slave interpreter and so [load {} vfs] and sourcing all the vfs commands (vfsUtils, vfslib, and mk4vfs) doesn't take place. So maybe that if statement just needs modified. Another idea that might work is to have pkgIndex.tcl files for vfs and mk4vfs that do the right thing. The initial interpreter would still use the raw MK reads, but the slave interpreter would be able to go through the mounted filesystem and use the pkgIndex.tcl files in the normal way. Brian Theado From btheado@rrohio.com Thu Oct 2 18:40:09 2003 Received: from email-out-01.biz.rr.com (email-out-01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.26]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h92Ne9M01436 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:40:09 -0500 Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) by email-out-01.biz.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h92Ne86l017663 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:40:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from desktop123456 ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20031002234005.KVAW8891.fep01.biz.rr.com@desktop123456> for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:40:05 -0400 Message-ID: <00a101c3893e$81a5cbd0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> From: "Brian Theado" To: "Starkit list" References: <009001c38912$854f76e0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:40:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Another idea that might work is to have pkgIndex.tcl files for vfs and > mk4vfs that do the right thing. The initial interpreter would still use the > raw MK reads, but the slave interpreter would be able to go through the > mounted filesystem and use the pkgIndex.tcl files in the normal way. > If I add the following code to lib/vfs/pkgIndex.tcl inside of tclkit, then package require vfs works in a slave interpreter: proc loadvfs dir { load {} vfs source [file join $dir vfsUtils.tcl] source [file join $dir vfslib.tcl] } package ifneeded vfs 1.2 [list loadvfs $dir] With such a tclkit, sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter involves only: interp create sub # Setup starkit::startup dependencies sub eval { set argv0 tclkit set argv {} set argc 0 } # Source the starkit sub eval source sdx.kit Brian Theado From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 2 19:22:09 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h930M9M03518 for ; Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:22:09 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 18D2E8399B; Fri, 3 Oct 2003 02:22:03 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87D7083999 for ; Fri, 3 Oct 2003 02:22:02 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 02:22:11 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "Starkit list" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <00a101c3893e$81a5cbd0$6401a8c0@desktop123456> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_03_05,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Brian Theado wrote: > If I add the following code to lib/vfs/pkgIndex.tcl inside of tclkit, > then > package require vfs works in a slave interpreter: > > proc loadvfs dir { > load {} vfs > source [file join $dir vfsUtils.tcl] > source [file join $dir vfslib.tcl] > } > package ifneeded vfs 1.2 [list loadvfs $dir] This is absolutely wonderful. I now understand what you meant by adding package details and still launching in the original way, i.e. through raw MK calls. > With such a tclkit, sourcing a starkit in a slave interpreter involves > only: > > interp create sub > # Setup starkit::startup dependencies > sub eval { > set argv0 tclkit > set argv {} > set argc 0 > } > # Source the starkit > sub eval source sdx.kit As it should be, IMO, since none of the above should be inited by default in slaves, nor when doing a package require of the tclvfs package. I've added your code to /pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit, so future builds will include this logic. I can't see it breaking anything currently working. The nature of this fix is such that it can in fact be run anywhere in the application, so if you need to deploy starkits which use this and can't depend on tclkit being fixed, then you can simply insert those six lines in your own application or main starkit. Note that for tclkits which do not load tk or itcl dynamically (such as on Windows), you can very easily "upgrade" to this change by *appending* the new runtime.kit to the tclkit executable. It'll waste space, but it's trivial to do. It works because executables operate "from the front", while Metakit locates its data from the back of the file. Thanks again for nailing this down! -jcw From mocallins@yahoo.com Mon Oct 6 17:53:34 2003 Received: from web21307.mail.yahoo.com (web21307.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.128.232]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h96MrYM06842 for ; Mon, 6 Oct 2003 17:53:34 -0500 Message-ID: <20031006223416.48684.qmail@web21307.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.102.194.23] by web21307.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 06 Oct 2003 15:34:16 PDT Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 15:34:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Collins To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Application startup fails, but used to work. Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I've been working on an TCLkit application here for while and i have some setup scripts to create evertyhing appropriately. and just today when I ran one of those procedure to create a starkit executable everything appeared to get created correctly. But in my application I source in a separate starkit and now its failing with: can't find package app-ttplib while executing "package require app-ttplib" (file "ttplib.lib\main.tcl" line 3) invoked from within "source ttplib.lib/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" "ttplib.lib" IS a starkit that I create in one of my setup routines that has a lot of my code in it and this is the failure I get, any ideas? __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Tue Oct 7 12:55:53 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97HtqX15546 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 12:55:52 -0500 Received: (from keith@localhost) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) id h97Htq7C008822; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 12:55:52 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) X-Authentication-Warning: jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu: keith set sender to keith@lib.uchicago.edu using -f To: starkit@equi4.com From: Keith Waclena X-Yow: Didn't KIRKEGAARD wear out his TIRES in VIENNA during a SNOWSTORM of FREUD's unpaid DENTAL BILLS? Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 12:55:52 -0500 Message-ID: Lines: 88 User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley, berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Last night I added wikit to one of my starkits for local help. I followed the instructions in wikit's internal help. To summarize: 1. I copied wikit.kit (downloaded last night from equi4[1]) into snarf.vfs/lib/ (snarf being my app) 2. I created my help text by running: wikit.kit snarf.vfs/help.tkd & and doing some editing. 3. I added this startup code to my main: package require scripdoc mk4vfs::mount wikit [file join $::starkit::topdir lib wikit.kit] -readonly scripdoc::extendPath wikit 4. Then my help menu command executes this code: method help {} { package require Wikit if {[winfo exists .help]} { # pop up the help window; in most window managers, this will work # both if the window is iconified or simply buried wm withdraw .help wm deiconify .help } else { toplevel .help Wikit::init [file join $::starkit::topdir help.tkd] 1 .help } } So, this works perfectly when I run my starkit "unwrapped" like so: tclkit snarf.vfs/main.tcl http://www/ But when I wrap it like so: sdx wrap snarf and run the wrapped starkit: ./snarf http://www/ It blows up with this error: file open failed while executing "mk::file open mk4vfs2 /disk/home/keith/src/snarf/new/snarf/lib/wikit.kit -readonly" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list mk::file open $db $file] $args" (procedure "::mk4vfs::_mount" line 9) invoked from within "::mk4vfs::_mount /disk/home/keith/src/snarf/new/snarf/lib/wikit.kit -readonly" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [list ::mk4vfs::_mount $mkfile] $args" (procedure "::vfs::mk4::Mount" line 9) invoked from within "::vfs::mk4::Mount /disk/home/keith/src/snarf/new/snarf/lib/wikit.kit wikit -readonly" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list ::vfs::mk4::Mount $mkfile $local] $args" (procedure "mk4vfs::mount" line 2) invoked from within "mk4vfs::mount wikit [file join $::starkit::topdir lib wikit.kit] -readonly" ("uplevel" body line 2) invoked from within "uplevel 1 $body" The tclkit I'm using is an 8.4.4 FreeBSD tclkit that I just built, but I get the same error with an 8.4.2 FreeBSD tclkit: $ echo 'puts [info pa]' | tclkit 8.4.4 $ sdx version /data/src/tclkit-freebsd-x86-8.4.2 2003/03/17 21:42:18 20590-19938 /data/src/tclkit-freebsd-x86-8.4.2 $ echo 'puts [info pa]' | /data/src/tclkit-freebsd-x86-8.4.2 8.4.2 Anybody got any ideas? /k Footnotes: [1] 2003/09/26 11:44:01 29077-63772 /home/keith/tclkit/wikit.kit From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 7 13:30:00 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97ITxX18069 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:29:59 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 6D1F58399B; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 20:29:51 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id D031E83999 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 20:29:50 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 20:29:52 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <3DB0F514-F8F4-11D7-A871-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Keith Waclena wrote: > 3. I added this startup code to my main: > > package require scripdoc > mk4vfs::mount wikit [file join $::starkit::topdir lib wikit.kit] > -readonly > scripdoc::extendPath wikit Eh... you can't mount a starkit *from* a starkit. It's not totally impossible, technically, but Mk4tcl 2.4.9.2 does not have the necessary code. Having said that, there's a workaround: set db [vfs::mk4::Mount "" wikit] ;# empty in-mem VFS, mount point ./wikit set fd [open [file join $::starkit::topdir lib wikit.kit]] mk::file load $db $fd close $fd (This does imply that your help wikit will be fully memory-resident) Btw, package scripdoc is deprecated, consider switching to "package starkit". There are some differences, but it'll work better for the future (new starkits do a "package require starkit" in the header, so it'll streamline things a bit as well). > file open failed > while executing > "mk::file open mk4vfs2 > /disk/home/keith/src/snarf/new/snarf/lib/wikit.kit -readonly" Yep, that's the problem: wikit.kit is not a real file. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Tue Oct 7 13:47:43 2003 Received: from srv01.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97IlgX19395 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:47:42 -0500 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by srv01.cas.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/CAS_MAIL_HUB-3.02) with ESMTP id h97IlXL0026375 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:47:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id h97IlWV00926; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:47:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:47:32 -0400 (EDT) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031007144732.AAB908@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 07 Oct 2003 12:55:52 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Keith Waclena > I > followed the instructions in wikit's internal help. > It blows up with this error: > Anybody got any ideas? Well, tangentially, perhaps as you resolve the issues, you could update the pages you used as a guideline to reflect the current state of affairs? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 7 15:32:51 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97KWoX29009 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 15:32:50 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id AA9B88399B; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 22:32:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29F0E83999 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 22:32:42 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 22:32:44 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <67BB27BC-F905-11D7-A871-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_03_05,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] how to submit tclkit builds Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Triggered by some recently submitted new builds (thx!), and now that my post-link build setup seems to be working relatively smoothly, I'd really like to make it as easy as possible for anyone to submit more builds. The 8.4.4 release is more than ever based on contributions from others, which is an excellent trend from my perspective! :) So here's a brief checklist of how to get tclkit for your platform: 1. If you find a binary at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ which works for you, you're probably going to take the easy way and just use it 2. If your platform, or one very similar to it, is listed in the build status summary, you can decide to fetch a slightly older release, and be done with it, see http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/status.html 3. If it's listed, you can rebuild with genkit in the knowledge that someone has made it work in the past, with perhaps some notes to help out on the wiki pages - start at http://www.equi4.com/222 4. If it's not listed, you'll *have* to go through a genkit build, or cajole/bribe someone else to do it - see http://www.equi4.com/271 5. If you can't get a build working, feel free to ask on this starkit mailing list, or if that leads nowhere, to email me directly Now the surprise part: do *not* send me the tclkit you've built, please. Instead, for all new builds, please send a copy of the result-*.tar.gz file created during the 7-step genkit build sequence (step C, to be exact). This tar file has all the build logs and separate binaries (kitsh, tkdyn, itcldyn) needed to assemble a complete tclkit binary in my central "kitbuild" area. The advantage of doing this, is that any change which does not require a C recompile can be made and all tclkits can then be regenerated in one sweep. That includes fixes to scripts such as starkit.tcl and mk4vfs.tcl. With separate components and all details needed to track/manage them, changes to the runtime.kit tail are possible long after the build has been made. If you are concerned about sending out a 2 Mb tar with all sorts of information, let me add that this will not be allowed to go anywhere else. The only things made public are the generated tclkit (same as when you make your own build available) and the hostname of your machine (as listed in the build status summary page) for identification purposes. If the latter is a concern, there is now even a way to build with an arbitrary hostname identifier: add "set H somename" to genkit.local, the optional config file sourced by genkit. This is also useful when your system does not have a hostname set. The catch is that you have to run the genkit script as "install/somename/bin/tclsh8.4 genkit ...", because genkit itself won't be able to figure it out. As before, submitted builds will be available at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.?.?/, with a comment on the wiki to acknowledge the contribution and to list special build requirements / differences, if any. Tclkit represents a *heck* of lot of combined and packaged infrastructure IMO, and now the process has become manageable enough to say: keep those new ports coming! :) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 7 16:07:45 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97L7iX00383 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:07:44 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id E1A5E8399B; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 23:07:35 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4849383999 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 23:07:35 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 23:07:36 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Application startup fails, but used to work. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20031006223416.48684.qmail@web21307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <471EC7CA-F90A-11D7-A871-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_02_03,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mike Collins wrote: > I've been working on an TCLkit application here for while and i have > some setup scripts to create evertyhing appropriately. > and just today when I ran one of those procedure to create a starkit > executable everything appeared to get created correctly. > But in my application I source in a separate starkit and now its > failing with: > > can't find package app-ttplib > while executing > "package require app-ttplib" > (file "ttplib.lib\main.tcl" line 3) > invoked from within > "source ttplib.lib/main.tcl" > ("uplevel" body line 1) > invoked from within > "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" > > "ttplib.lib" IS a starkit that I create in one of my setup routines > that has a lot of my code in it and this is the failure I get, any > ideas? One way to resolve this is to start from scratch. Create an empty file ttplib.tcl, and do "sdx qwrap ttplib.tcl" (or "tclkitsh sdx.kit qwrap ttplib.tcl" on Windows), then unwrap the ttplib.kit file it just created and start filling in things and adding packages. The best way to test unwrapped is with "tclkit ttplib.vfs/main.tcl ...", that will be closest in behavior to what the wrapped version does. Most problems tend to be path issues. Be sure to get to grips with $starkit::topdir and [file join [file dirname [info script]] ...]. Once the starkit is ok, you can create a starpack standalone by adding the -runtime flag to sdx wrap, if you want to end up with a single executable file. Your comments above do not make clear which you're after. If I need to add more pointers to the starkit.html home page to make it easier to get started with starkits, please me know. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Oct 7 16:41:59 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97LfwX04142 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:41:59 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h97LftfS015485; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:41:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h97LfFJ1000728; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:41:16 -0500 Message-ID: <3F83331E.9090704@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 14:41:50 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Keith Waclena CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Keith, I imbed wikit.tdk's in my apps but I imbed the wikit.kit as a wikit.vfs. It's been a while but I think I had problems trying to use it as an imbedded kit because it has other imbedded packages. My header code looks like this: vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv #!/bin/sh # the next line restarts this file using a tcl shell \ exec tclkit "$0" -- ${1+"$@"} package require starkit starkit::startup lappend auto_path [file join $::starkit::topdir app] package require Tcl package require Tk wm withdraw . package require Itcl foreach component [glob -nocomplain -join $starkit::topdir lib *.vfs] { lappend auto_path [file join $component lib] } ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ The wikit.vfs in the lib directory. Later in my code I use: From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Tue Oct 7 16:57:11 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97LvBX06052 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:57:11 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:56:19 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:55:51 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] how to submit tclkit builds Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:55:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > Triggered by some recently submitted new builds (thx!), > and now that my post-link build setup seems to be working > relatively smoothly, I'd really like to make it as easy > as possible for anyone to submit more builds. The 8.4.4 > release is more than ever based on contributions > from others, which is an excellent trend from my > perspective! :) I think all this improved build and release process is great, Jean-Claude. But I'm also a little nervous about the versioning. As I read this list, I am aware that new issues are being addressed and bugs are being fixed. I am presuming that these improvements are making it in to newer tclkit distributions, but I'm not entirely sure. > As before, submitted builds will be available at > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.?.?/, with a comment on > the wiki to acknowledge the contribution and to list > special build requirements / differences, if any. The builds in the 8.4.4 directory are, if I'm not mistaken, compiled with the latest CVS sources, so they're actually a little ahead of 8.4.4. And if I follow the instructions at http://mini.net/tcl/tclkit to get my tclkit version, I get this from my most recent download. % set tcl_patchLevel 8.4.4 % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version 200303.001 And if I unwrap the tclkit, I see files dated no later than March 2003. But Tcl 8.4.4 was released in July, and has newer files than those in the tclkit. I think I might be confused. Is there a way to associate a unique version identifier with a tclkit? Perhaps something like the starkit's 'sdx version' calculation? It would be nice to be able to identify a tclkit with either specific released versions or datestamped versions of Tcl, Tk, vfs, zlib, .... Since a Tclkit is really a collection of several packages, could we make an array, something like the ::vfs::tclkit_version, but containing verison info about all the components? Thanks, Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Tue Oct 7 16:59:46 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97LxjX06313 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:59:45 -0500 Received: (from keith@localhost) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) id h97LxjTP030753; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 16:59:45 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) X-Authentication-Warning: jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu: keith set sender to keith@lib.uchicago.edu using -f To: Tom Krehbiel Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped From: Keith Waclena In-Reply-To: <3F83331E.9090704@motorola.com> (Tom Krehbiel's message of "Tue, 07 Oct 2003 14:41:50 -0700") X-Yow: I know how to get the hostesses released! Give them their own television series! References: <3F83331E.9090704@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 16:59:45 -0500 Message-ID: Lines: 31 User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley, berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "TK" == Tom Krehbiel writes: TK> I imbed wikit.tdk's in my apps but I imbed the wikit.kit as TK> a wikit.vfs. TK> foreach component [glob -nocomplain -join $starkit::topdir lib *.vfs] { TK> lappend auto_path [file join $component lib] TK> } Ah, this solves my problem! Thanks! I wasn't wedded to mounting wikit as a starkit, I just thought it was the "right" thing to do. This works great: 1. sdx unwrap wikit in the vfs lib directory 2. add the above foreach loop at the end of the vfs main.tcl file 3. package require Wikit Hmm, presumably I could avoid even the need for the foreach by doing: cd snarf.vfs/lib sdx unwrap ~/tclkit/wikit.kit mv wikit.vfs/lib/* . rm -rf wikit.vfs This is appealing because I never fiddle with main.tcl in my starkits, but then again, using wikit.vfs would make it easier for me to upgrade wikit... Anyway, thanks! /k From keith@lib.uchicago.edu Tue Oct 7 17:01:00 2003 Received: from jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu [128.135.53.49]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97M10X06504 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 17:01:00 -0500 Received: (from keith@localhost) by jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu (8.12.3p2/8.11.3) id h97M0ulR030833; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 17:00:56 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from keith@lib.uchicago.edu) X-Authentication-Warning: jfcl.lib.uchicago.edu: keith set sender to keith@lib.uchicago.edu using -f To: "Larry W. Virden" Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped From: Keith Waclena In-Reply-To: <20031007144732.AAB908@cas.org> (Larry W. Virden's message of "Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:47:32 -0400 (EDT)") X-Yow: Just to have MORE FUN, I'll pretend I am JAMES CAGNEY and I am having a tense, UP-TIGHT EXPERIENCE!! References: <20031007144732.AAB908@cas.org> Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 17:00:56 -0500 Message-ID: Lines: 9 User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley, berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> "LV" == Larry W Virden writes: LV> Well, tangentially, perhaps as you resolve the issues, you could update LV> the pages you used as a guideline to reflect the current state of affairs? I used wikit's internal help, rather than any pages at the wiki. But I will try to add a page summarizing what I did. /k From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 7 18:19:42 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h97NJfX13982 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 18:19:41 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 4B4008399B; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 01:19:33 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59B5A83999 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 01:19:32 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 01:19:33 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] how to submit tclkit builds Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_01_02,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h97NJfX13982 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > [...] a little nervous about the versioning. As I read this list, I > am aware that new issues are being addressed and bugs are being fixed. > I am > presuming that these improvements are making it in to newer tclkit > distributions, but I'm not entirely sure. Yes. > The builds in the 8.4.4 directory are, if I'm not mistaken, compiled > with > the latest CVS sources, so they're actually a little ahead of 8.4.4. Yes. I'm not systematically tracking core-8.4-branch, but I do cvs update once in a while. > And if I follow the instructions at http://mini.net/tcl/tclkit to get > my tclkit > version, I get this from my most recent download. > > % set tcl_patchLevel > 8.4.4 > % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version > 200303.001 Ouch - I've been negligent in keeping that version number up to date. By now, I think it's basically useless. > And if I unwrap the tclkit, I see files dated no later than March > 2003. But > Tcl 8.4.4 was released in July, and has newer files than those in the > tclkit. I think I might be confused. Thank you for putting it in such a diplomatic way ;) > Is there a way to associate a unique version identifier with a tclkit? > Perhaps something like the starkit's 'sdx version' calculation? This has been my aim, but sdx version is not quite there right now. It checksums everything in the runtime, including the tk8.4.so and itcl3.3.so files we nowadays have in there, due to the switch to dynamic linking as the default. The right thing to do for tclkit, would be to checksum the header (i.e. the executable code) plus the tk/itcl shared libs if present, as one datapoint, and all the other files in the runtime tail at the end as another datapoint. I must confess that the switch to dynamic shared libs inside broke the original idea of using sdx version for tclkits as well.. So perhaps the best short term solution is to extend SDX with a little more logic so it can produce meaningful version id's (i.e. fingerprints) for the binary code and for the runtime script collection. And to start tying those to each build and each change in pub/tk/tars/. > It would be nice to be able to identify a tclkit with either specific > released versions > or datestamped versions of Tcl, Tk, vfs, zlib, .... Since a Tclkit is > really a collection of several packages, could we make an array, > something like the ::vfs::tclkit_version, but containing verison info > about all the components? You're getting to the heart of the matter, IMO. And hitting one of my pet peeves. - Tclkit is a header plus a collection of files (so is any starkit) - sdx version can uniquely "fingerprint" the collection of files - but sdx version has a blind spot so far: the header - and due to the tk/itcl dyn libs, the fingerprint is messed up You may be wondering why I'm going out of my way to *not* use version numbers (i.e. numbers of all components inside plus an overall release number). It's a long story, but I'm very strongly opposed to such a mechanism - because it does not work. Version numbers are not always maintained (even Tcl/Tk fudges with the CVS revision tag). When they are, in 27-decimal precision, they become unfit for human consumption. Package versions definitely do not get bumped at every build that makes it into the world. It's just a silly idea, and IMO does more harm than good - because you're then tempted to trust revision numbers. We're used to having this great $Id: tag in CVS sources, but they usually don't make it to binaries, which is what tclkit is, at least in a substantial part. They also point to a very fundamental flaw: ya can't put a tag inside the object you're tagging without altering the object. Tags, i.e. meta information of this kind, by its very nature have to be dealt with at a higher level than the tagged objects themselves. Say hello to Gödel :) Don't get me wrong: I'm all for simple revision numbers. Every once in a while, big changes are made to a package and that must be promoted and mentioned and recognized - what better than a revision (or a year number, as car makers and Microsoft do). That's for marketing, and I'm all for it. Here's Tcl/Tk 8.4.4 - yahoo! It's *the* version, go get it now! But what we need is a much finer grained mechanism: given a deliverable, tell me please what went into it, who is responsible, where can I find all the pieces, how can I fix things, and how do I then distinguish the new deliverable so it in turn can be traced back to me. This is what Starchive is all about. It doesn't exist (pssst: there's a lot more in place privately, it's just not ready for prime time). For a lengthy overview (rant?) see: http://www.equi4.com/261 In laboratories worldwide, there is a very strictly defined term called GLP, Good Laboratory Practice (and in manufacturing: GMP). One of the concepts there is that everything must be traceable back to its origin. If someone gets a shot of vaccine, and gets sick or worse because the vaccine is contaminated or faulty in some way, you have to be able to retrace all steps back, find out what went wrong, identify the bad ingredients, locate all affected batches, and recall them to prevent disasters. Pretty simple yet very sound logic. What I would like to see, is the same in software "manufacturing". And because I.T. is such a horrid mess, it's not just what went in there, but what tools were used, which exact "service pack", what OS, heck this can be taken to arbitrary extremes. It may sound extreme for one-man shows and small businesses - but heck, if we don't fix this at *some* point, then let's all go for a nice walk in the woods or something. Today's path is a time bomb. My point is that versions of tclkit, but also versions of the increasing number of starkits being constructed, desperately need a better way to track collections of components. And not just collections, but a huge number of revisions, however small. The moment something leaves my disk, I want to have its tag logged and (virtually speaking) a snapshot taken. So that if anything needs to be done (fixing, extending, or even just examining), I can snap back to that state and deal with it. All this does not change the fact that tclkit revisioning is currently not that much more than well-intended (and error-prone) manual tracking. Version number are of course doable (the whole world does it), but in the case of collections of this type, and with updates being important, I really want to stimulate lots and lots of incremental changes, and not hamper it or freeze it with slow-paced version numbers. Anyway. My apologies for giving such a long reply to a short comment. I hope it explains where I'm coming from, where I'm headed, and why I'm not really doing much more than group each tclkit 8.4.x revision in its own directory, knowing that small details vary between them. If it weren't such a serious issue, I'd be tempted to describe the current state as a random walk with limited fluctuations: fixes, occasional botches, more fixes, etc. In any other business domain, this would be totally unacceptable. I want to help fix it, but at the right level :) I'm probably a bit on an island with this view on things. So be it... -jcw From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Tue Oct 7 18:21:48 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@dsl-202-72-154-181.wa.westnet.com.au [202.72.154.181]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h97NLlX14192 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 18:21:47 -0500 Received: (qmail 31636 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2003 23:21:45 -0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavis-ng-0.1.6.4-03dc on mail.digitalsmarties.com Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 07 Oct 2003 23:21:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 07:21:37 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: Tom Krehbiel , starkit@equi4.com To: Keith Waclena From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Wednesday, October 8, 2003, at 05:59 AM, Keith Waclena wrote: >>>>>> "TK" == Tom Krehbiel writes: > > TK> I imbed wikit.tdk's in my apps but I imbed the wikit.kit as > TK> a wikit.vfs. > > TK> foreach component [glob -nocomplain -join $starkit::topdir lib > *.vfs] { > TK> lappend auto_path [file join $component lib] > TK> } > > Ah, this solves my problem! Thanks! I wasn't wedded to mounting > wikit as a starkit, I just thought it was the "right" thing to do. > This works great: > > 1. sdx unwrap wikit in the vfs lib directory > 2. add the above foreach loop at the end of the vfs main.tcl file > 3. package require Wikit > > Hmm, presumably I could avoid even the need for the foreach by doing: > > cd snarf.vfs/lib > sdx unwrap ~/tclkit/wikit.kit > mv wikit.vfs/lib/* . > rm -rf wikit.vfs > > This is appealing because I never fiddle with main.tcl in my starkits, > but then again, using wikit.vfs would make it easier for me to upgrade > wikit... I prefer this approach over Tom's - but there is no single "correct" way. Glad to see you've got it working now :-) Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Oct 7 19:01:53 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9801rX17414 for ; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 19:01:53 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h9801ebK020019; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 17:01:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h9800xJ1032435; Tue, 7 Oct 2003 19:01:00 -0500 Message-ID: <3F8353DE.2030305@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 17:01:34 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Landers CC: Keith Waclena , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Wikit for local help: works unwrapped but not wrapped References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Steve, > > On Wednesday, October 8, 2003, at 05:59 AM, Keith Waclena wrote: > >>>>>>> "TK" == Tom Krehbiel writes: >> >> >> TK> I imbed wikit.tdk's in my apps but I imbed the wikit.kit as >> TK> a wikit.vfs. >> >> TK> foreach component [glob -nocomplain -join $starkit::topdir lib >> *.vfs] { >> TK> lappend auto_path [file join $component lib] >> TK> } >> >> Ah, this solves my problem! Thanks! I wasn't wedded to mounting >> wikit as a starkit, I just thought it was the "right" thing to do. >> This works great: >> >> 1. sdx unwrap wikit in the vfs lib directory >> 2. add the above foreach loop at the end of the vfs main.tcl file >> 3. package require Wikit >> >> Hmm, presumably I could avoid even the need for the foreach by doing: >> >> cd snarf.vfs/lib >> sdx unwrap ~/tclkit/wikit.kit >> mv wikit.vfs/lib/* . >> rm -rf wikit.vfs >> >> This is appealing because I never fiddle with main.tcl in my starkits, >> but then again, using wikit.vfs would make it easier for me to upgrade >> wikit... > > > I prefer this approach over Tom's - but there is no single "correct" way. > > Glad to see you've got it working now :-) > > Steve My wikit.vfs is in lib. The path extention may not be necessary (but then again it might). I wrote the code a while back and cann't remember all the problems I had. The lib directory also contains other .vfs directory which may also have problems (hence the loop). Conclusion: it's safe and it will always work for .vfs dirs in lib so I don't have to modify main.tcl for any of my apps. Tom K. From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Wed Oct 8 07:36:54 2003 Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h98CarX16211 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 07:36:54 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0HMF00B01V1711@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 08:36:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0HMF007FKV11SM@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 08 Oct 2003 08:36:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id h98Cabx12686 for ; Wed, 08 Oct 2003 08:36:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2003 08:36:36 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: Re: [Starkit] how to submit tclkit builds In-reply-to: X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h98CarX16211 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, This is sort of tangential to the mail list, but I wanted to let you know I'm with you all the way on the difficulty of the problem of versioning. I've pondered how to track SW for future debugging, rebuilding, etc. each time I embark on a project, and usually come up with nothing better than 'rtag' for CVS using a unique tag and keeping track of the tag in a notebook. But as you say, to really exactly reconstruct a build all components need to be kept in the repository, including compiler, linker, library, makefile, the make program itself, the operating system of the computer where it was built, ad infinitum, maybe even the type of CPU used to run the build (endian issues?), and it's version. Seems to never end. I encourage you to find a good solution. It will benefit lots of people. My apologies for the tangent. On Wed, 8 Oct 2003, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > > > [...] a little nervous about the versioning. As I read this list, I > > am aware that new issues are being addressed and bugs are being fixed. > > I am > > presuming that these improvements are making it in to newer tclkit > > distributions, but I'm not entirely sure. > > Yes. > > > The builds in the 8.4.4 directory are, if I'm not mistaken, compiled > > with > > the latest CVS sources, so they're actually a little ahead of 8.4.4. > > Yes. I'm not systematically tracking core-8.4-branch, but I do cvs > update once in a while. > > > And if I follow the instructions at http://mini.net/tcl/tclkit to get > > my tclkit > > version, I get this from my most recent download. > > > > % set tcl_patchLevel > > 8.4.4 > > % puts $::vfs::tclkit_version > > 200303.001 > > Ouch - I've been negligent in keeping that version number up to date. > By now, I think it's basically useless. > > > And if I unwrap the tclkit, I see files dated no later than March > > 2003. But > > Tcl 8.4.4 was released in July, and has newer files than those in the > > tclkit. I think I might be confused. > > Thank you for putting it in such a diplomatic way ;) > > > Is there a way to associate a unique version identifier with a tclkit? > > Perhaps something like the starkit's 'sdx version' calculation? > > This has been my aim, but sdx version is not quite there right now. It > checksums everything in the runtime, including the tk8.4.so and > itcl3.3.so files we nowadays have in there, due to the switch to > dynamic linking as the default. > > The right thing to do for tclkit, would be to checksum the header (i.e. > the executable code) plus the tk/itcl shared libs if present, as one > datapoint, and all the other files in the runtime tail at the end as > another datapoint. > > I must confess that the switch to dynamic shared libs inside broke the > original idea of using sdx version for tclkits as well.. > > So perhaps the best short term solution is to extend SDX with a little > more logic so it can produce meaningful version id's (i.e. > fingerprints) for the binary code and for the runtime script > collection. And to start tying those to each build and each change in > pub/tk/tars/. > > > It would be nice to be able to identify a tclkit with either specific > > released versions > > or datestamped versions of Tcl, Tk, vfs, zlib, .... Since a Tclkit is > > really a collection of several packages, could we make an array, > > something like the ::vfs::tclkit_version, but containing verison info > > about all the components? > > You're getting to the heart of the matter, IMO. And hitting one of my > pet peeves. > > - Tclkit is a header plus a collection of files (so is any starkit) > - sdx version can uniquely "fingerprint" the collection of files > - but sdx version has a blind spot so far: the header > - and due to the tk/itcl dyn libs, the fingerprint is messed up > > You may be wondering why I'm going out of my way to *not* use version > numbers (i.e. numbers of all components inside plus an overall release > number). It's a long story, but I'm very strongly opposed to such a > mechanism - because it does not work. Version numbers are not always > maintained (even Tcl/Tk fudges with the CVS revision tag). When they > are, in 27-decimal precision, they become unfit for human > consumption. Package versions definitely do not get bumped at every > build that makes it into the world. It's just a silly idea, and IMO > does more harm than good - because you're then tempted to trust > revision numbers. > > We're used to having this great $Id: tag in CVS sources, but they > usually don't make it to binaries, which is what tclkit is, at least in > a substantial part. They also point to a very fundamental flaw: ya > can't put a tag inside the object you're tagging without altering the > object. Tags, i.e. meta information of this kind, by its very nature > have to be dealt with at a higher level than the tagged objects > themselves. Say hello to Gödel :) > > Don't get me wrong: I'm all for simple revision numbers. Every once in > a while, big changes are made to a package and that must be promoted > and mentioned and recognized - what better than a revision (or a year > number, as car makers and Microsoft do). That's for marketing, and I'm > all for it. Here's Tcl/Tk 8.4.4 - yahoo! It's *the* version, go get > it now! > > But what we need is a much finer grained mechanism: given a > deliverable, tell me please what went into it, who is responsible, > where can I find all the pieces, how can I fix things, and how do I > then distinguish the new deliverable so it in turn can be traced back > to me. > > This is what Starchive is all about. It doesn't exist (pssst: there's > a lot more in place privately, it's just not ready for prime time). > For a lengthy overview (rant?) see: http://www.equi4.com/261 > > In laboratories worldwide, there is a very strictly defined term called > GLP, Good Laboratory Practice (and in manufacturing: GMP). One of the > concepts there is that everything must be traceable back to its origin. > If someone gets a shot of vaccine, and gets sick or worse because the > vaccine is contaminated or faulty in some way, you have to be able to > retrace all steps back, find out what went wrong, identify the bad > ingredients, locate all affected batches, and recall them to prevent > disasters. Pretty simple yet very sound logic. > > What I would like to see, is the same in software "manufacturing". And > because I.T. is such a horrid mess, it's not just what went in there, > but what tools were used, which exact "service pack", what OS, heck > this can be taken to arbitrary extremes. It may sound extreme for > one-man shows and small businesses - but heck, if we don't fix this at > *some* point, then let's all go for a nice walk in the woods or > something. Today's path is a time bomb. > > My point is that versions of tclkit, but also versions of the > increasing number of starkits being constructed, desperately need a > better way to track collections of components. And not just > collections, but a huge number of revisions, however small. The moment > something leaves my disk, I want to have its tag logged and (virtually > speaking) a snapshot taken. So that if anything needs to be done > (fixing, extending, or even just examining), I can snap back to that > state and deal with it. > > All this does not change the fact that tclkit revisioning is currently > not that much more than well-intended (and error-prone) manual > tracking. Version number are of course doable (the whole world does > it), but in the case of collections of this type, and with updates > being important, I really want to stimulate lots and lots of > incremental changes, and not hamper it or freeze it with slow-paced > version numbers. > > Anyway. My apologies for giving such a long reply to a short comment. > I hope it explains where I'm coming from, where I'm headed, and why I'm > not really doing much more than group each tclkit 8.4.x revision in its > own directory, knowing that small details vary between them. If it > weren't such a serious issue, I'd be tempted to describe the current > state as a random walk with limited fluctuations: fixes, occasional > botches, more fixes, etc. In any other business domain, this would be > totally unacceptable. I want to help fix it, but at the right level :) > > I'm probably a bit on an island with this view on things. So be it... > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Oct 8 10:11:49 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h98FBnX02054 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 10:11:49 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h98FBlxl006691 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 08:11:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h98FB4J1006139 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 10:11:05 -0500 Message-ID: <3F84292D.6070201@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2003 08:11:42 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] how to submit tclkit builds References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From mocallins@yahoo.com Wed Oct 8 14:11:15 2003 Received: from web21303.mail.yahoo.com (web21303.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.192]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h98JBEX26025 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2003 14:11:14 -0500 Message-ID: <20031008174516.50175.qmail@web21303.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.102.194.23] by web21303.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 08 Oct 2003 10:45:16 PDT Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 10:45:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Collins Subject: Re: [Starkit] Application startup fails, but used to work. To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20031007232001.14025.9924.Mailman@trixie.triqs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Yep had tried most of those things. Application has always worked unwrapped. Something must have changed with the SDX options. My old setup script had the "-writable" flag in there and when I had done it manually, during troubleshooting, I must have forgot it one time and now it works. I'm not sure what that means but I thought i'd let you know what had finally worked. > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Application startup fails, but used to work. > From: Jean-Claude Wippler > To: Starkit list > > Mike Collins wrote: > > > I've been working on an TCLkit application here for while and i > have > > some setup scripts to create evertyhing appropriately. > > and just today when I ran one of those procedure to create a > starkit > > executable everything appeared to get created correctly. > > But in my application I source in a separate starkit and now its > > failing with: > > > > can't find package app-ttplib > > while executing > > "package require app-ttplib" > > (file "ttplib.lib\main.tcl" line 3) > > invoked from within > > "source ttplib.lib/main.tcl" > > ("uplevel" body line 1) > > invoked from within > > "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" > > > > "ttplib.lib" IS a starkit that I create in one of my setup > routines > > that has a lot of my code in it and this is the failure I get, > any > > ideas? > > One way to resolve this is to start from scratch. Create an empty > file > ttplib.tcl, and do "sdx qwrap ttplib.tcl" (or "tclkitsh sdx.kit > qwrap > ttplib.tcl" on Windows), then unwrap the ttplib.kit file it just > created and start filling in things and adding packages. > > The best way to test unwrapped is with "tclkit ttplib.vfs/main.tcl > ...", that will be closest in behavior to what the wrapped version > does. > > Most problems tend to be path issues. Be sure to get to grips with > > $starkit::topdir and [file join [file dirname [info script]] ...]. > > Once the starkit is ok, you can create a starpack standalone by > adding > the -runtime flag to sdx wrap, if you want to end up with a single > executable file. Your comments above do not make clear which > you're > after. > > If I need to add more pointers to the starkit.html home page to > make it > easier to get started with starkits, please me know. > > -jcw > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Oct 9 10:13:45 2003 Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h99FDiX02217 for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:13:45 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id h99FDfoK002030; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 08:13:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h99FCtnp024742; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:12:56 -0500 Message-ID: <3F857B20.2000505@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2003 08:13:36 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stefan.vogel@avinci.de CC: Starkit mailing list References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: wikitool Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Oct 9 10:29:12 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h99FTCX03205 for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:29:12 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id h99FT9pn012009; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 08:29:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h99FSOnp010176; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:28:25 -0500 Message-ID: <3F857EC0.2020408@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2003 08:29:04 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: stefan.vogel@avinci.de, Starkit mailing list References: <3F857B20.2000505@motorola.com> In-Reply-To: <3F857B20.2000505@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: wikitool (second try) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Stefan, I'm sorry to say that the version currently is the repository has many problems (notably it does work on window). Six months ago I did a complete rewrite to address as many of the complaints as possible but just when it was almost done I got swamped at work. I intend to eventual release the new version which hopefully addresses many of the problems. Thanks for your comments. Tom Krehbiel From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Oct 9 11:18:48 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h99GImX07689 for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 11:18:48 -0500 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 11:03:42 -0500 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 11:03:12 -0500 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 11:03:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit versions (was RE: how to submit tclkit builds) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > You may be wondering why I'm going out of my way to *not* use version > numbers (i.e. numbers of all components inside plus an > overall release > number). It's a long story, but I'm very strongly opposed to such a > mechanism - because it does not work. Version numbers are not always > maintained (even Tcl/Tk fudges with the CVS revision tag). When they > are, in 27-decimal precision, they become unfit for human > consumption. Package versions definitely do not get bumped at every > build that makes it into the world. It's just a silly idea, and IMO > does more harm than good - because you're then tempted to trust > revision numbers. Jean-Claude, Thanks for the long explanation. I appreciate all of the points you brought up. And I understand how they can be important for accurate tracking of Tclkit implementation builds. But after rereading your message a couple of times, and sleeping on it, I think I'd still like to ask for Tclkit version numbers. Yes, I know they're manual and error prone. And no, I'm not asking for 27 digits of precision. But a relatively simple version number, like ActiveState's 8.4.4.0 really does help me out. I can tell at a glance if two different workstations are running different versions of the package. In theory, I can also refer to some documentation to tell exactly what went into that specific release. (In practice, ActiveState's docs aren't always right, and that's an excellent demonstration of your concerns.) But if something works on one system with 8.4.4.0 installed, and it doesn't work on one with 8.3.4.2, I've got a good idea where to start. I don't really care too much if the BWidget or TclDOM library version numbers are exact. I just know that I can upgrade the whole package to the "latest and greatest". Same thing for Tclkits. If I've got something running on HP-UX with 8.4.4.6, and it doesn't work on a PC running Tclkit 8.4.4.1, then I've got a pretty good chance of making it work with a simple TclKit upgrade. Sure, it would be great if there was exact traceability from a Tclkit version number back to all the source code. But even if we don't keep that information exact, I can still tell the difference between different Tclkits. All we really need here is the information from your table at http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/status.html . If you think the best approach will be fingerprinting the whole distribution, then perhaps we can have separate fingerprints for the source code and binary parts of the package. It would be great to differentiate between HP-UX Tclkits built by me or Reinhard Fobbe, but it would also be great to distinguish between kits built from distinct source distributions. Thanks for your consideration, JCW. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From arijit@cisco.com Thu Oct 9 16:24:04 2003 Received: from vtg-um-e2k1.sj21ad.cisco.com (vtg-um-e2k1.cisco.com [171.70.93.55]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h99LO4X06363 for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 16:24:04 -0500 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C38EAB.7B4E3782" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 14:22:45 -0700 Message-ID: <6677B3346233B94EBB11C0609351012001839F31@vtg-um-e2k1.sj21ad.cisco.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 Thread-Index: AcOOq6bLu0O77IQoSRm7zLNuOxQ+eQ== From: "Arijit Mukherji" To: Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C38EAB.7B4E3782 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In the downloadable tclkit-win32-upx.exe (version 8.4.4) from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/, i noticed that HTTP downloads do not work. I generate a standalone executable using this file and my scripts, and when the script tries to do an HTTP download, it waits forever, (although w/ a sniffer, I can see packets incoming - lot of repeats). =20 In order to isolate the problem, I ran the same set of commands from wish.exe (activetcl 8.4.4) (works) and tclkit.exe (does NOT work) so evidently, there is something wrong with this version of tclkit.exe. =20 The problem exists in version 8.4.2 too. However, version 8.4.0 seems OK (whew). =20 My platform is Windows XP Service Pack 1 =20 Has anyone else seen this too ? What would be the way to get this resolved ? This is basic functionality built into Tcl, not in any library, so I'm wondering whether other things are broken too. =20 I appreciate all help in advance. =20 - Arijit =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20 P.S. Here is a script template to reproduce the problem. Make sure you have a file (say file.html) available on an HTTP server (say http://www.webserver.com) =20 set outputChannel [open "localFile.html" "w"] set httpToken [::http::geturl http://www.webserver.com/file.html -channel $outputChannel] upvar #0 $httpToken state set httpStatus [::http::status $httpToken] set httpNCode [::http::ncode $httpToken] set httpCode [::http::code $httpToken] close $outputChannel puts $httpStatus ::http::cleanup $httpToken =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C38EAB.7B4E3782 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
    In the = downloadable=20 tclkit-win32-upx.exe (version 8.4.4) from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/, = i noticed=20 that HTTP downloads do not work. I generate a standalone executable = using this=20 file and my scripts, and when the script tries to do an HTTP download, = it waits=20 forever, (although w/ a sniffer, I can see packets incoming - lot of=20 repeats).
     
    In = order to isolate=20 the problem, I ran the same set of commands from wish.exe = (activetcl=20 8.4.4) (works) and tclkit.exe (does NOT work) so evidently, there = is=20 something wrong with this version of tclkit.exe.
     
    The = problem exists=20 in version 8.4.2 too. However, version 8.4.0 seems OK=20 (whew).
     
    My = platform is=20 Windows XP Service Pack 1
     
    Has = anyone else seen=20 this too ? What would be the way to get this resolved ? This is = basic=20 functionality built into Tcl, not in any library, so I'm wondering = whether other=20 things are broken too.
     
    I = appreciate all=20 help in advance.
     
    -=20 Arijit
     
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
     
    P.S. = Here is a=20 script template to reproduce the problem. Make sure you have a file (say = file.html) available on an HTTP server (say http://www.webserver.com)
     
       =20 set outputChannel [open "localFile.html" "w"]
        set=20 httpToken [::http::geturl http://www.webserver.com/file= .html -channel=20 $outputChannel]
        upvar #0 $httpToken=20 state
        set httpStatus [::http::status=20 $httpToken]
        set httpNCode  [::http::ncode=20 $httpToken]
        set httpCode   [::http::code = $httpToken]
        close = $outputChannel
        puts $httpStatus
       =20 ::http::cleanup $httpToken
     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C38EAB.7B4E3782-- From julian@precisium.com.au Thu Oct 9 16:57:18 2003 Received: from precisium.com.au (smtp.junctionworld.com [203.42.97.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h99LvBX08418 for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2003 16:57:13 -0500 Received: from nstorm ([203.35.226.205]) by precisium.com.au ; Thu, 09 Oct 2003 21:57:04 -0000 Message-ID: <006001c38eb0$46c06cb0$3c6f10ac@pcm> From: To: "Arijit Mukherji" , References: <6677B3346233B94EBB11C0609351012001839F31@vtg-um-e2k1.sj21ad.cisco.com> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 21:57:04 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005D_01C38EB0.46827950" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005D_01C38EB0.46827950 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageI can't duplicate the problem here. That script and that tclkit works fine for me, either wrapped or = interactively, on NT4=20 Julian. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Arijit Mukherji=20 To: starkit@equi4.com=20 Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 9:22 PM Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 = and 8.4.4 In the downloadable tclkit-win32-upx.exe (version 8.4.4) from = http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/, i noticed that HTTP downloads do not work. = I generate a standalone executable using this file and my scripts, and = when the script tries to do an HTTP download, it waits forever, = (although w/ a sniffer, I can see packets incoming - lot of repeats). In order to isolate the problem, I ran the same set of commands from = wish.exe (activetcl 8.4.4) (works) and tclkit.exe (does NOT work) so = evidently, there is something wrong with this version of tclkit.exe. The problem exists in version 8.4.2 too. However, version 8.4.0 seems = OK (whew). My platform is Windows XP Service Pack 1 Has anyone else seen this too ? What would be the way to get this = resolved ? This is basic functionality built into Tcl, not in any = library, so I'm wondering whether other things are broken too. I appreciate all help in advance. - Arijit = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D P.S. Here is a script template to reproduce the problem. Make sure you = have a file (say file.html) available on an HTTP server (say = http://www.webserver.com) set outputChannel [open "localFile.html" "w"] set httpToken [::http::geturl http://www.webserver.com/file.html = -channel $outputChannel] upvar #0 $httpToken state set httpStatus [::http::status $httpToken] set httpNCode [::http::ncode $httpToken] set httpCode [::http::code $httpToken] close $outputChannel puts $httpStatus ::http::cleanup $httpToken ------=_NextPart_000_005D_01C38EB0.46827950 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
    I can't duplicate the problem = here.
    That script and that tclkit works fine = for=20 me, either wrapped or interactively, on NT4
     
    Julian.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From:=20 Arijit = Mukherji=20
    • Sent: Thursday, October 09, = 2003 9:22=20 PM
    Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe = on Win32 :=20 HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4

    In = the=20 downloadable tclkit-win32-upx.exe (version 8.4.4) from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/, = i=20 noticed that HTTP downloads do not work. I generate a standalone = executable=20 using this file and my scripts, and when the script tries to do an = HTTP=20 download, it waits forever, (although w/ a sniffer, I can see packets = incoming=20 - lot of repeats).
     
    In = order to=20 isolate the problem, I ran the same set of commands from wish.exe = (activetcl 8.4.4) (works) and tclkit.exe (does NOT work) so = evidently,=20 there is something wrong with this version of = tclkit.exe.
     
    The = problem exists=20 in version 8.4.2 too. However, version 8.4.0 seems OK=20 (whew).
     
    My = platform is=20 Windows XP Service Pack 1
     
    Has = anyone else=20 seen this too ? What would be the way to get this resolved ? This = is=20 basic functionality built into Tcl, not in any library, so I'm = wondering=20 whether other things are broken too.
     
    I = appreciate all=20 help in advance.
     
    -=20 Arijit
     
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
     
    P.S. = Here is a=20 script template to reproduce the problem. Make sure you have a file = (say=20 file.html) available on an HTTP server (say http://www.webserver.com)
     
       =20 set outputChannel [open "localFile.html" "w"]
        = set=20 httpToken [::http::geturl http://www.webserver.com/file= .html -channel=20 $outputChannel]
        upvar #0 $httpToken=20 state
        set httpStatus [::http::status=20 $httpToken]
        set httpNCode  [::http::ncode=20 $httpToken]
        set httpCode   = [::http::code=20 $httpToken]
        close = $outputChannel
        puts = $httpStatus
       =20 ::http::cleanup $httpToken
     
    ------=_NextPart_000_005D_01C38EB0.46827950-- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Oct 10 07:10:15 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9ACAEX16389; Fri, 10 Oct 2003 07:10:14 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 5F21D8399B; Fri, 10 Oct 2003 14:10:07 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9368883999; Fri, 10 Oct 2003 14:10:06 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 14:10:06 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] bug when sorting results of groupby in Tcl Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Just to let you know that a bug has been found in the Mk4tcl extension. The problem shows up only when all of the following conditions apply: - you are using the Mk4too or Oomk packages, not just plain Mk4tcl - you are grouping views, i.e. the groupby operator - you are applying a selection or sort to the resulting subviews - the size of the subview is exactly one row The bug, with example code and output is further described here: http://www.equi4.com/BTS.cgi/BTS/editbugs?bugid=75 There is no problem in the C++ core, nor in the Python binding. As workaround, sorting can be skipped for 1-row subviews, e.g. in Oomk: if {[$v size] == 1]} { $v as v2 } else { [$v sort ...] as v2 } For selection, again the 1-row case will need to be dealt with separately. The bug is most likely in the "select" operator of Mk4tcl, which is a relatively complex combination of Select(), Sort(), and RemapWith() in the C++ core. -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Thu Oct 16 13:30:53 2003 Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9GIUqX17052 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:30:52 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0HMV000014R8JA@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:30:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0HMV00DM14R30R@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:30:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id h9GIUdp23770 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:30:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:30:39 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Subject: [Starkit] Placing metakit database files in starkits/starpacks Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I would like to wrap a tcl/tk application with its database (readonly) into at least a starkit, maybe a starpack so I can build a single file GUI program to query the database. My query program runs fine on solaris or a pc as a starkit or starpack with an external database file, but I can't seem to reference the database file (using mk::open, etc. commands) when I wrap it in the starkit. My problem might be the path I use to the database file. I've tried many different methods... Two questions: Are metakit database files embeddable this way, or is there a VFS problem with accessing them? Is there some rule of thumb for where to place various application-specific files and how to reference them from tcl? For instance I could place a file database.mk in the same VFS directory with my application script (application.vfs/lib/app-application), and reference it using a name like: [file join [file dirname [info script]] database.mk] But the mk::open fails when I do this... Thanks in advance. ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 16 13:35:34 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9GIZXX17597 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:35:33 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 6E0AD8399B; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:35:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5476D83999 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:35:18 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:35:19 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Placing metakit database files in starkits/starpacks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <7E83776F-0007-11D8-8E4E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: > Are metakit database files embeddable this way, or is there a VFS > problem > with accessing them? There's a problem. Replace: mk::open db blah -readonly with: mk::open db set fd [open blah] mk::load db $fd close $fd Then it should work (the data becomes a memory-resident database). > Is there some rule of thumb for where to place various > application-specific files and how to reference them from tcl? You're entering uncharted territory as far as I know. It's a general question: how to structure an app. Whether in a starkit or otherwise is really a separate issue. -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Thu Oct 16 14:02:11 2003 Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9GJ2BX21455; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:02:11 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0HMV00K0167DPH@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:02:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aplexus.jhuapl.edu (aplexus.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.6]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0HMV00G5B677BJ@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:02:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id h9GJ1tb25428; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:01:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:01:55 -0400 (EDT) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: Re: [Starkit] Placing metakit database files in starkits/starpacks In-reply-to: <7E83776F-0007-11D8-8E4E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: Jean-Claude Wippler Cc: Starkit list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude, With a little editing (mk::open -> mk::file open, etc.) that works just fine! Thanks! On Thu, 16 Oct 2003, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > john_zouck@jhuapl.edu wrote: > > > Are metakit database files embeddable this way, or is there a VFS > > problem > > with accessing them? > > There's a problem. Replace: > mk::open db blah -readonly > with: > mk::open db > set fd [open blah] > mk::load db $fd > close $fd > > Then it should work (the data becomes a memory-resident database). > > > Is there some rule of thumb for where to place various > > application-specific files and how to reference them from tcl? > > You're entering uncharted territory as far as I know. It's a general > question: how to structure an app. Whether in a starkit or otherwise > is really a separate issue. > > -jcw > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 16 15:26:28 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9GKQRX32747 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:26:28 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id DE2778399B; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 22:26:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A53383999 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 22:26:19 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 22:26:21 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Placing metakit database files in starkits/starpacks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <7E83776F-0007-11D8-8E4E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Message-Id: <0129F410-0017-11D8-977A-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,IN_REP_TO,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Whoops... > There's a problem. Replace: > mk::open db blah -readonly Make that "mk::file open ...". > with: > mk::open db > set fd [open blah] > mk::load db $fd Make that "mk::file load ..." > close $fd Sorry for the confusion. I've updated http://www.equi4.com/metakit/tcl.html to include this info. (thanks for letting me know about the mixups) -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Oct 21 02:31:18 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9L7VHX01523 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 02:31:18 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id JAA12751 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 09:31:17 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA12447 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 09:31:09 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F94E0BD.A9C331B3@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 09:31:09 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: [Starkit] Slow execution when packing 200 files ... References: <017b01c2edba$b6b4d700$0101a8c0@quantex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I have just run into a problem packing a lot of files into a starkit/starpack: it seems to take a very long time, even to the point where I loose my almost infinite patience and just kill the process. I have some 200 files in some 10 directories. I can make a starkit and (as I just saw) a starpack, but it takes a very long time. Is it possible to show the progress by elaborating which files are being compressed from time to time? That would help (okay in a range 1-10 of annoying things on a computer this scores about 0.1, but still ...) Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Tue Oct 21 04:46:58 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9L9kvX10656 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 04:46:57 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 9F79683AEF; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:46:50 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1823E83AE7 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:46:49 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:46:48 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit mailing list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3F94E0BD.A9C331B3@wldelft.nl> Message-Id: <7D6A0A1A-03AB-11D8-B282-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slow execution when packing 200 files ...) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen Markus wrote: > I have just run into a problem packing a lot of files into a > starkit/starpack: > it seems to take a very long time, even to the point where I loose my > almost infinite patience and just kill the process. > > I have some 200 files in some 10 directories. I can make a starkit and > (as I just saw) a starpack, but it takes a very long time. That's not much at all, is it? Some of my starkits have 100x as many. FYI, you can create uncompressed startkits with "sdx wrap ... -nocomp". > Is it possible to show the progress by elaborating which files are > being > compressed from time to time? That would help (okay in a range 1-10 of > annoying things on a computer this scores about 0.1, but still ...) Ah, you're opening/closing files and modifying them? In that case, I suggest turning off compression for new changes: set mk4vfs::compress 0 This flag is checked at file open time my the MK vfs driver. In 8.4.2 tclkit and beyond, decompression happens while reading, and compression happens on close. Seeking backwards will reset and force decompression from the start of the file again. In older tclkits decompression happens in one step during open. To fall back to decompress-on-open behavior in newer tclkits, add: set mk4vfs::zstreamed 0 -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Oct 21 05:07:56 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9LA7tX11897 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 05:07:55 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id MAA01635 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:07:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA01275 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:07:47 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F950573.BA35F523@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:07:47 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slow execution when packing 200 files ...) References: <7D6A0A1A-03AB-11D8-B282-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Arjen Markus wrote: > > > I have just run into a problem packing a lot of files into a > > starkit/starpack: > > it seems to take a very long time, even to the point where I loose my > > almost infinite patience and just kill the process. > > > > I have some 200 files in some 10 directories. I can make a starkit and > > (as I just saw) a starpack, but it takes a very long time. > > That's not much at all, is it? Some of my starkits have 100x as many. > I think it is a lot :) (I had to edit quite a fw of them :D) > FYI, you can create uncompressed startkits with "sdx wrap ... -nocomp". > > > Is it possible to show the progress by elaborating which files are > > being > > compressed from time to time? That would help (okay in a range 1-10 of > > annoying things on a computer this scores about 0.1, but still ...) > > Ah, you're opening/closing files and modifying them? > Oh no, this is just the packing during: tclkit sdx.kit wrap myapp.exe -runtime ... > In that case, I suggest turning off compression for new changes: > set mk4vfs::compress 0 > This flag is checked at file open time my the MK vfs driver. > > In 8.4.2 tclkit and beyond, decompression happens while reading, and > compression happens on close. Seeking backwards will reset and force > decompression from the start of the file again. In older tclkits > decompression happens in one step during open. > > To fall back to decompress-on-open behavior in newer tclkits, add: > set mk4vfs::zstreamed 0 > Hm, this might be useful to know but it is not the thing I was looking for: during the packing into a starpack, the console freezes. I simply got to doubt whether the whole process was continuing or not... From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Oct 21 05:54:05 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9LAs4X14214 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 05:54:05 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id MAA15343 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:54:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA15014 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:53:57 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F951045.92C843D9@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:53:57 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slow execution when packing 200 files ...) References: <7D6A0A1A-03AB-11D8-B282-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Arjen Markus wrote: > > > I have just run into a problem packing a lot of files into a > > starkit/starpack: > > it seems to take a very long time, even to the point where I loose my > > almost infinite patience and just kill the process. > > > > I have some 200 files in some 10 directories. I can make a starkit and > > (as I just saw) a starpack, but it takes a very long time. > > That's not much at all, is it? Some of my starkits have 100x as many. > > FYI, you can create uncompressed startkits with "sdx wrap ... -nocomp". > > > Is it possible to show the progress by elaborating which files are > > being > > compressed from time to time? That would help (okay in a range 1-10 of > > annoying things on a computer this scores about 0.1, but still ...) > > Ah, you're opening/closing files and modifying them? > > In that case, I suggest turning off compression for new changes: > set mk4vfs::compress 0 > This flag is checked at file open time my the MK vfs driver. > > In 8.4.2 tclkit and beyond, decompression happens while reading, and > compression happens on close. Seeking backwards will reset and force > decompression from the start of the file again. In older tclkits > decompression happens in one step during open. > Hm, this could explain (I guess) another phenomenon that I am seeing: foreach file [glob [file join $appdir *]] { file copy -force $file $installdir } is taking a very long time to finish - I know this is the culprit, as I added a tk_messageBox statement _after_ the copy at one time. The starpack is on a network disk which, I am sure, does not help boosting performance either... Regards, Arjen From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Oct 21 06:19:58 2003 Received: from out.exponential-e.net (out.exponential-e.net [62.244.177.197]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9LBJwX15485 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 06:19:58 -0500 Received: from Turing.eurobios.com (62-244-188-66.cust.exponential-e.net [62.244.188.66]) by out.exponential-e.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9LBJpP10758 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:19:52 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20031021121740.0386cb40@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:19:51 +0100 To: Starkit mailing list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slow execution when packing 200 files ...) In-Reply-To: <3F951045.92C843D9@wldelft.nl> References: <7D6A0A1A-03AB-11D8-B282-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <3F951045.92C843D9@wldelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-61F76071; boundary="=======31659F9=======" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=======31659F9======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-61F76071; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit At 11:53 21/10/2003, Arjen Markus wrote: >Hm, this could explain (I guess) another phenomenon that I am seeing: > >foreach file [glob [file join $appdir *]] { > file copy -force $file $installdir >} Not that I can help solve the speed problem, but the above should be: foreach file [glob -dir $appdir *] { ... if you want it to work no matter what braces, brackets, etc $appdir contains. (It just so happens on Tcl 8.4.4 that this correct version should be a smidgeon faster too, but clearly 'file copy' is going to dominate your timings anyway). Vince. --=======31659F9=======-- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Tue Oct 21 11:33:32 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9LGXWX30963 for ; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:33:32 -0500 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h9LGQvhd002965; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 09:26:57 -0700 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h9LGQvr6018908; Tue, 21 Oct 2003 09:26:57 -0700 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Arjen Markus'" , "'Starkit mailing list'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slow execution when packing 200 files ...) Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 09:26:57 -0700 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <05f001c397f0$259b3620$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <3F951045.92C843D9@wldelft.nl> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > Arjen Markus wrote: > > > I have some 200 files in some 10 directories. I can make a starkit > > > and (as I just saw) a starpack, but it takes a very long time. ... > The starpack is on a network disk which, I am sure, does not > help boosting performance either... Oh, that usually bites. Try moving the starpack to a local disk and trying again. The whole network thing seems to get exacerbated with the starpack architecture. For instance, I always copy a TDK or ActiveTcl install locally before installing because it will be much faster. I've noticed the same for wrapping. FWIW, I do wrap stuff with 100+ files that only takes a few seconds (maybe as many as 10 on the larger packs), writing locally using TclApp on my P4/2.4 with standard IDE drive. Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Oct 22 01:22:12 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9M6MCX20281 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 01:22:12 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA13800 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 08:22:11 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA13559 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 08:22:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F96220C.E1F95F2A@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 08:22:04 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slowexecution when packing 200 files ...) References: <7D6A0A1A-03AB-11D8-B282-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <3F951045.92C843D9@wldelft.nl> <6.0.0.22.0.20031021121740.0386cb40@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince Darley wrote: > > At 11:53 21/10/2003, Arjen Markus wrote: > >Hm, this could explain (I guess) another phenomenon that I am seeing: > > > >foreach file [glob [file join $appdir *]] { > > file copy -force $file $installdir > >} > > Not that I can help solve the speed problem, but the above should be: > > foreach file [glob -dir $appdir *] { ... > > if you want it to work no matter what braces, brackets, etc $appdir > contains. (It just so happens on Tcl 8.4.4 that this correct version > should be a smidgeon faster too, but clearly 'file copy' is going to > dominate your timings anyway). > > Vince. I am afraid I left out one vital piece of information: Copying the files themselves does not seem slow, as I can clearly see them appear on the disk, but after that has happened, it takes several minutes (!) for the [file copy] command to return. Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Wed Oct 22 03:29:01 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9M8T1X28215 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 03:29:01 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id KAA05706 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 10:29:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA05539 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 10:28:54 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F963FC6.FBB6E239@wldelft.nl> Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 10:28:54 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Controlling Starkit compression (was: Slowexecution when packing 200 files ...) References: <7D6A0A1A-03AB-11D8-B282-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <3F951045.92C843D9@wldelft.nl> <6.0.0.22.0.20031021121740.0386cb40@mail.wolfbusiness.com> <3F96220C.E1F95F2A@wldelft.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen Markus wrote: > > Vince Darley wrote: > > > > At 11:53 21/10/2003, Arjen Markus wrote: > > >Hm, this could explain (I guess) another phenomenon that I am seeing: > > > > > >foreach file [glob [file join $appdir *]] { > > > file copy -force $file $installdir > > >} > > > > Not that I can help solve the speed problem, but the above should be: > > > > foreach file [glob -dir $appdir *] { ... > > > > if you want it to work no matter what braces, brackets, etc $appdir > > contains. (It just so happens on Tcl 8.4.4 that this correct version > > should be a smidgeon faster too, but clearly 'file copy' is going to > > dominate your timings anyway). > > > > Vince. > > I am afraid I left out one vital piece of information: > > Copying the files themselves does not seem slow, as I can clearly see > them appear on the disk, but after that has happened, it takes several > minutes (!) for the [file copy] command to return. > FWIW I tried copying the executable to a local disk instead of leaving it on the network disk and then installing (i.e. executing the program :) But this did not make much difference: it still took an unexpectedly long time .... Regards, Arjen From bartis@lucent.com Wed Oct 22 16:39:24 2003 Received: from ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (ihemail2.lucent.com [192.11.222.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9MLdOX02072 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 16:39:24 -0500 Received: from nj7460exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-17-42-36.lucent.com [135.17.42.36]) by ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h9MLdFN26909 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 16:39:16 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nj7460exch001h.ho.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 17:39:15 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" To: "'starkit'" Cc: "'mpickell@aol.com'" Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 17:39:14 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C398E4.F023FB62" Subject: [Starkit] Starkit newbe question Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C398E4.F023FB62 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi =20 I'm new to Starkits so please forgive some of my questions if they're = obvious. I have an application that uses Tktable's and am trying to = wrap it for delivery to other users. I've been using the paper by Steve = Landers "Beyond TCLKIT - Starkits, Starpacks and other *stuff as a = guide. =20 I've managed to create what appears to be a proper kit using sdx qwrap = loadmrt and when unwrapped, sdx unwrap loadmrt.kit, a proper *.vfs = directory structure. I've gone in and modified various files, ran sdx = wrap loadmrt.kit and see the expected results. I ran into problems = when I tried to include the Tktable package. =20 The first issue I ran into was when I modified the pkgIndex.tcl file = with set platform [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0]. I receive an error that = "os" is not a member of the tcl_platform array. For now I simply set = platform SunOS to get around this issue. Although I'd like to = understand this I really need to resolve the issue that follows which = is the Tktable.so file will not load. =20 When I run the command tclkit loadmrt.kit I receive the following error Fatal Error couldn't load library = /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.kit/lib/Tktable/SunOS/Tktable.so =20 If I check the directory the file is where I expect it to be. One = obvious difference is the loadmrt.vfs vs. the loadmrt.kit. Being new to = Starkits I assumed this VFS dealt with that. In any case, I'm clearly = lost at this point and would appreciate some assistance. =20 bash-2.05$ ls -l total 1342 -rwxr-xr-x 1 bartis software 162972 Oct 22 17:17 Tktable.so -rwxr-xr-x 1 bartis software 1209652 Oct 22 13:55 libtk8.3.so bash-2.05$ pwd /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.vfs/lib/Tktable/SunOS Robert M. Bartis=20 Lucent Technologies =A2=20 Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH)=20 ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH) * bartis@lucent.com=20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C398E4.F023FB62 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
    Hi
     
    I'm new to Starkits so please forgive some of my questions if they're obvious. I have an application that uses Tktable's and am trying to wrap it for delivery to other users. I've been using the paper by Steve Landers "Beyond TCLKIT - Starkits, Starpacks and other *stuff as a guide.
     
    I've managed to create what appears to be a proper kit using sdx qwrap loadmrt and when unwrapped, sdx unwrap loadmrt.kit, a proper *.vfs directory structure. I've gone in and modified various files, ran sdx wrap loadmrt.kit  and see the expected results. I ran into problems when I tried to include the Tktable package.
     
    The first issue I ran into was when I modified the pkgIndex.tcl file with set platform [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0]. I receive an error that "os" is not a member of the tcl_platform array. For now I simply set platform SunOS to get around this issue. Although I'd like to understand this I really need to resolve the issue that follows which is the Tktable.so file will not load.
     
    When I run the command tclkit loadmrt.kit I receive the following error
    Fatal Error
    couldn't load library /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.kit/lib/Tktable/SunOS/Tktable.so
     
    If I check the directory the file is where I expect it to be. One obvious difference is the loadmrt.vfs vs. the loadmrt.kit. Being new to Starkits I assumed this VFS dealt with that. In any case, I'm clearly lost at this point and would appreciate some assistance.
     
    bash-2.05$ ls -l
    total 1342
    -rwxr-xr-x    1 bartis   software   162972 Oct 22 17:17 Tktable.so
    -rwxr-xr-x    1 bartis   software  1209652 Oct 22 13:55 libtk8.3.so
    bash-2.05$ pwd
    /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.vfs/lib/Tktable/SunOS

    Robert M. Bartis
    Lucent Technologies ¢
    Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH)
    ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH)

    * bartis@lucent.com

     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C398E4.F023FB62-- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Oct 22 18:51:14 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@dsl-202-72-154-181.wa.westnet.com.au [202.72.154.181]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h9MNpDX14003 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2003 18:51:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 30495 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2003 23:51:12 -0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavis-ng-0.1.6.4-03dc on mail.digitalsmarties.com Received: from gateway.digitalsmarties.com (HELO DigitalSmarties.com) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 22 Oct 2003 23:51:07 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 07:51:02 +0800 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit newbe question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: "'starkit'" , "'mpickell@aol.com'" To: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" From: Steve Landers In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <97BD7FA2-04EA-11D8-A910-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h9MNpDX14003 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Bob, On Thursday, October 23, 2003, Bartis, Robert M (Bob) wrote: > The first issue I ran into was when I modified the pkgIndex.tcl file > with set platform [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0]. I receive an error > that "os" is not a member of the tcl_platform array. Try using $::tcl_platform(os) - tcl_platform used to be declared a global in the bowels of the package loading mechanism, but now you need to explicitly reference it in the global namespace. > Tktable.so file will not load.  > When I run the command tclkit loadmrt.kit I receive the following error > Fatal Error > couldn't load library > /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.kit/lib/Tktable/SunOS/Tktable.so > > If I check the directory the file is where I expect it to be. One > obvious difference is the loadmrt.vfs vs. the loadmrt.kit. That's OK - at runtime it is looking inside the Starkit - which is what you want. > Being new to Starkits I assumed this VFS dealt with that. In any case, > I'm clearly lost at this point and would appreciate some assistance. >   > bash-2.05$ ls -l > total 1342 > -rwxr-xr-x    1 bartis   software   162972 Oct 22 17:17 Tktable.so > -rwxr-xr-x    1 bartis   software  1209652 Oct 22 13:55 libtk8.3.so Tktable is stubs enabled, so there shouldn't be any issues with loading it into Tclkit. But I'm a little puzzled by the libtk8.3.so - Tclkit already contains Tk, so there should be no need for the tk shared library, and especially not an older version. One test you could do - run tclkit manually and try loading the Tktable shared lib $ tclkit % load /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.vfs/lib/Tktable/SunOS That should work. If not, make sure you've got the latest Tktable Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 23 03:43:18 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9N8hIX09488; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 03:43:18 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 6C5FA83AEF; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 10:43:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E938183AE7; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 10:43:10 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 10:43:11 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Metakit mailing list , Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] Metakit@Web Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FYI, I just added Stefan Vogel's new "Metakit@Web" script here: http://www.equi4.com/mklinks.html It's a new Tcl script which runs under the Tclhttpd web server to create a nice manager to list, browse, create, and edit MK datafiles. Very early, as Stefan tells me, but then that's what open source is about. It takes three files to try this out: mkweb.tcl, tclhttpd.kit, and whichever tclkit matches your platform. As this evolves, it could become a very nice way to manage MK-based data via the web, but also a simple way to try out things with MK: i.e. web forms as a better command-line... -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Oct 23 10:39:01 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9NFd1X05877 for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 10:39:01 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h9NFcxlg010440; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 08:39:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h9NFcCQe001838; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 10:38:12 -0500 Message-ID: <3F97F610.5080308@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 08:38:56 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" CC: "'starkit'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit newbe question References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bob, First, don't give up I've used Tktable in starkit/starpack's for years without any problems, so there is hope. I haven't seen the problems you mention so I don't know how usefull the following will be, but here goes. I didn't use qwrap to create my initial .vfs and the directory structure is a veriation on the recommended structure. Specifically it looks like: proj.vfs | main.tcl, lib, app where the app directory contains all project related code and the lib directory contains all code libraries (like Tktable). I do things this way so my CVS module doesn't have to store any of the code found in the library. With this in mind: 1) I always unpack any libraries I place in the lib directory. This isn't supposted to be necessary but in the early days of the starkit technology it was a more reliable approach. 2) One of the first things that happens in my main.tcl is to search the lib directory for all pkgIndex.tcl files and append the location of the pkgIndex.tcl file to the auto_path variable. 3) I use the following code to create a pkgIndex.tcl files in the app directory (which is also added to the auto_path variable). pkg_mkIndex -verbose -- . *.tcl *.itcl The -verbose switch is critical because the pkg_mkIndex command will silently create a "bad" pkgIndex.tcl file unless you include the -verbose command and read the output. Regards, Tom K. > Hi > > I'm new to Starkits so please forgive some of my questions if they're > obvious. I have an application that uses Tktable's and am trying to wrap > it for delivery to other users. I've been using the paper by Steve > Landers "Beyond TCLKIT - Starkits, Starpacks and other *stuff as a guide. > > I've managed to create what appears to be a proper kit using *sdx qwrap > loadmrt* and when unwrapped, *sdx unwrap loadmrt.kit*, a proper *.vfs > directory structure. I've gone in and modified various files, ran *sdx > wrap loadmrt.kit* and see the expected results. I ran into problems > when I tried to include the Tktable package. > > The first issue I ran into was when I modified the pkgIndex.tcl file > with *set platform [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0].* I receive an error > that "os" is not a member of the tcl_platform array. For now I simply > *set platform SunOS* to get around this issue. Although I'd like to > understand this I really need to resolve the issue that follows which is > the Tktable.so file will not load. > > When I run the command *tclkit loadmrt.kit* I receive the following error > > Fatal Error > couldn't load library > /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.kit/lib/Tktable/SunOS/Tktable.so > > > If I check the directory the file is where I expect it to be. One > obvious difference is the loadmrt.vfs vs. the loadmrt.kit. Being new to > Starkits I assumed this VFS dealt with that. In any case, I'm clearly > lost at this point and would appreciate some assistance. > > bash-2.05$ ls -l > total 1342 > -rwxr-xr-x 1 bartis software 162972 Oct 22 17:17 Tktable.so > -rwxr-xr-x 1 bartis software 1209652 Oct 22 13:55 libtk8.3.so > bash-2.05$ pwd > /home/bartis/tcl/loader/loadmrt.vfs/lib/Tktable/SunOS > > *Robert M. Bartis* > *Lucent Technologies **¢* > Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH) > ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH) > > * bartis@lucent.com > > -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From bartis@lucent.com Thu Oct 23 18:07:09 2003 Received: from ihemail1.firewall.lucent.com (ihemail1.lucent.com [192.11.222.161]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9NN79X16670 for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:07:09 -0500 Received: from nj7460exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-17-42-36.lucent.com [135.17.42.36]) by ihemail1.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h9NN6HP08681 for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:06:30 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nj7460exch001h.ho.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 19:06:16 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" To: "'starkit'" Cc: "Serrao, John G (John)" Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 19:06:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C399BA.426C33A0" Subject: [Starkit] Starpack runs OK when invoked from directory it was created, but nowhere else Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C399BA.426C33A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I created a Starkit using the command sdx qwrap loadmrt, unwrapped it using sdx unwrap loadmrt.kit and have made numerous updates using sdx wrap loadmrt.kit. the loadmrt.kit file seems to run fine under tclkit. I then created a Starpack using the following script sdx wrap loadmrt.kit cp loadmrt.kit loadmrt.ux sdx wrap loadmrt.ux -runtime /home/bartis/bin/tclkit-solaris-sparc If I run the resulting file from where I created it, it runs fine. If I take the resulting file loadmrt.ux, to another directory it is unable to find the tcl files that are sourced into my program, even though they show as being present in the Starpack. If I copy the "missing" file to the local directory it runs until it hits the next source statement and then complains about it. The exact error I receive is couldn't read file "dialog.tcl": no such file or directory while executing "source dialog.tcl" (procedure "init" line 10) invoked from within "init $argc $argv" (file "/home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt/loadmrt.tcl" line 367) invoked from within "source /home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt/loadmrt.tcl" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require app-loadmrt" (file "/home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/main.tcl" line 3) The list of source files the error is reported for is shown below in bold-red I'm running all the above on a UNIX system (SunOS hoamasbld1 5.6 Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris). Any suggestions? Bob Running the command sdx lsk loadmrt.ux yields; ========================================= loadmrt.ux: 2169 2003/02/02 20:13:17 boot.tcl 37 2003/03/17 05:05:22 config.tcl dir lib/ 69 2003/10/22 13:13:19 main.tcl 10134 2002/12/06 03:58:21 tclkit.ico loadmrt.ux/lib: dir Tktable/ dir app-loadmrt/ dir itcl3.3/ dir tcl8.4/ dir tk8.4/ dir vfs/ loadmrt.ux/lib/Tktable: dir SunOS/ 245 2003/10/22 20:52:18 pkgIndex.tcl 20817 2001/10/22 19:51:33 tkTable.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt: 3120 2003/10/22 13:17:25 dialog.tcl 13275 2003/10/23 10:01:43 loadmrt.tcl 262 2003/10/22 13:16:25 loadmrtHeader.tcl 11617 2003/10/22 13:17:44 loadmrtProcs.tcl 74 2003/10/22 13:13:19 pkgIndex.tcl 2804 2003/10/22 13:16:41 timer.tcl 4449 2003/10/22 13:17:15 tkerror.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/itcl3.3: 4922 2002/10/01 08:01:44 itcl.tcl 131032 2003/04/09 23:42:20 libitcl3.3.so 297 2003/02/19 19:27:01 pkgIndex.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4: 19529 2002/11/02 18:11:16 auto.tcl dir encoding/ 9108 2001/05/17 19:53:45 history.tcl dir http/ 22451 2003/01/10 17:38:56 init.tcl 6802 2001/10/14 04:19:01 ldAout.tcl dir msgcat/ dir opt/ 23909 2003/02/26 04:34:21 package.tcl 882 1998/09/14 14:40:03 parray.tcl 27373 2003/02/19 15:29:41 safe.tcl 6097 2002/11/02 18:11:17 tclIndex dir tcltest/ 4375 2002/11/02 18:11:17 word.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/tk8.4: 9022 2002/08/31 06:33:59 bgerror.tcl 16698 2002/09/04 08:52:23 button.tcl 8985 2002/08/20 14:39:45 choosedir.tcl 21366 2003/02/22 09:39:59 clrpick.tcl 7698 2003/02/22 09:39:59 comdlg.tcl 26942 2003/02/22 09:39:59 console.tcl 6474 2002/08/31 06:33:59 dialog.tcl 17019 2003/01/24 17:48:24 entry.tcl 5072 2001/09/06 18:34:47 focus.tcl 1148012 2003/04/09 23:47:58 libtk8.4.so 13624 2002/08/31 06:33:59 listbox.tcl 37050 2002/08/31 06:33:59 menu.tcl 27260 2002/07/19 15:26:38 mkpsenc.tcl 15931 2003/02/22 09:39:59 msgbox.tcl dir msgs/ 803 1998/09/14 14:23:24 obsolete.tcl 1659 2001/09/06 18:34:48 optMenu.tcl 8004 2001/12/06 19:13:12 palette.tcl 4974 2002/08/20 14:39:45 panedwindow.tcl 248 2002/12/03 16:52:08 pkgIndex.tcl 9569 1999/02/04 15:59:48 prolog.ps 7540 2000/10/30 20:11:51 safetk.tcl 7510 2002/02/26 17:27:38 scale.tcl 11766 2002/08/31 06:33:59 scrlbar.tcl 15154 2002/08/31 06:33:59 spinbox.tcl 22210 2002/06/26 08:42:51 tclIndex 4675 2001/09/06 18:34:49 tearoff.tcl 30884 2002/08/31 06:33:59 text.tcl 16895 2003/02/18 16:48:46 tk.tcl 48932 2003/02/22 09:39:59 tkfbox.tcl 11462 2002/07/19 15:26:38 unsupported.tcl 25258 2003/02/18 16:48:46 xmfbox.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/vfs: 16599 2003/03/17 05:03:21 mk4vfs.tcl 484 2003/03/17 05:03:44 pkgIndex.tcl 4483 2002/05/28 02:30:41 scripdoc.tcl 3130 2003/02/24 07:10:18 starkit.tcl 12851 2003/02/21 11:36:40 vfsUtils.tcl 4013 2003/02/09 11:46:20 vfslib.tcl 11932 2003/02/22 09:40:04 zipvfs.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/Tktable/SunOS: 162972 2003/10/22 17:17:42 Tktable.so 1209652 2003/10/22 13:55:40 libtk8.3.so loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/encoding: 1090 1999/04/15 20:46:57 ascii.enc 1091 2001/05/30 04:49:18 cp1252.enc 1094 1999/04/15 20:47:09 iso8859-1.enc 1094 1999/04/15 20:47:09 iso8859-2.enc 1093 2001/10/14 04:19:01 macRoman.enc loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/http: 23519 2002/10/06 15:26:27 http.tcl 726 2002/02/09 12:22:16 pkgIndex.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/msgcat: 12681 2002/08/20 14:43:49 msgcat.tcl 132 2002/06/21 19:47:33 pkgIndex.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/opt: 33016 2003/01/10 17:39:10 optparse.tcl 605 2003/03/03 15:31:04 pkgIndex.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/tcltest: 610 2003/02/19 15:30:03 pkgIndex.tcl 98098 2003/02/19 15:30:03 tcltest.tcl loadmrt.ux/lib/tk8.4/msgs: 3831 2002/06/14 04:18:56 cs.msg 3728 2002/06/14 04:18:56 de.msg 8610 2002/06/14 04:18:56 el.msg 2540 2002/06/14 04:18:56 en.msg 63 2002/06/17 13:14:25 en_gb.msg 3704 2002/06/14 04:18:56 es.msg 3662 2002/06/14 04:18:56 fr.msg 3544 2002/06/14 04:18:56 it.msg 6960 2002/06/14 04:18:56 nl.msg 7105 2002/06/09 20:15:42 ru.msg Robert M. Bartis Lucent Technologies ¢ Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH) ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH) * bartis@lucent.com ------_=_NextPart_001_01C399BA.426C33A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
    I created a Starkit using the command sdx qwrap loadmrt, unwrapped it using sdx unwrap loadmrt.kit and have made numerous updates using sdx wrap loadmrt.kit. the loadmrt.kit file seems to run fine under tclkit. I then created a Starpack using the following script
    sdx wrap loadmrt.kit
    cp loadmrt.kit loadmrt.ux
    sdx wrap loadmrt.ux -runtime /home/bartis/bin/tclkit-solaris-sparc
    If I run the resulting file from where I created it, it runs fine. If I take the resulting file loadmrt.ux, to another directory it is unable to find the tcl files that are sourced into my program, even though they show as being present in the Starpack. If I copy the "missing" file to the local directory it runs until it hits the next source statement and then complains about it. The exact error I receive is
    couldn't read file "dialog.tcl": no such file or directory
        while executing
    "source dialog.tcl"
        (procedure "init" line 10)
        invoked from within
    "init $argc $argv"
        (file "/home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt/loadmrt.tcl" line 367)
        invoked from within
    "source /home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt/loadmrt.tcl"
        ("package ifneeded" script)
        invoked from within
    "package require app-loadmrt"
        (file "/home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/main.tcl" line 3)
    The list of source files the error is reported for is shown below in bold-red
    I'm running all the above on a UNIX system (SunOS hoamasbld1 5.6 Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris).
     
    Any suggestions?
     
    Bob
     
     
    Running the command sdx lsk loadmrt.ux yields;
    =========================================

    loadmrt.ux:

    2169 2003/02/02 20:13:17 boot.tcl

    37 2003/03/17 05:05:22 config.tcl

    dir lib/

    69 2003/10/22 13:13:19 main.tcl

    10134 2002/12/06 03:58:21 tclkit.ico

    loadmrt.ux/lib:

    dir Tktable/

    dir app-loadmrt/

    dir itcl3.3/

    dir tcl8.4/

    dir tk8.4/

    dir vfs/

    loadmrt.ux/lib/Tktable:

    dir SunOS/

    245 2003/10/22 20:52:18 pkgIndex.tcl

    20817 2001/10/22 19:51:33 tkTable.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt:

    3120 2003/10/22 13:17:25 dialog.tcl

    13275 2003/10/23 10:01:43 loadmrt.tcl

    262 2003/10/22 13:16:25 loadmrtHeader.tcl

    11617 2003/10/22 13:17:44 loadmrtProcs.tcl

    74 2003/10/22 13:13:19 pkgIndex.tcl

    2804 2003/10/22 13:16:41 timer.tcl

    4449 2003/10/22 13:17:15 tkerror.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/itcl3.3:

    4922 2002/10/01 08:01:44 itcl.tcl

    131032 2003/04/09 23:42:20 libitcl3.3.so

    297 2003/02/19 19:27:01 pkgIndex.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4:

    19529 2002/11/02 18:11:16 auto.tcl

    dir encoding/

    9108 2001/05/17 19:53:45 history.tcl

    dir http/

    22451 2003/01/10 17:38:56 init.tcl

    6802 2001/10/14 04:19:01 ldAout.tcl

    dir msgcat/

    dir opt/

    23909 2003/02/26 04:34:21 package.tcl

    882 1998/09/14 14:40:03 parray.tcl

    27373 2003/02/19 15:29:41 safe.tcl

    6097 2002/11/02 18:11:17 tclIndex

    dir tcltest/

    4375 2002/11/02 18:11:17 word.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tk8.4:

    9022 2002/08/31 06:33:59 bgerror.tcl

    16698 2002/09/04 08:52:23 button.tcl

    8985 2002/08/20 14:39:45 choosedir.tcl

    21366 2003/02/22 09:39:59 clrpick.tcl

    7698 2003/02/22 09:39:59 comdlg.tcl

    26942 2003/02/22 09:39:59 console.tcl

    6474 2002/08/31 06:33:59 dialog.tcl

    17019 2003/01/24 17:48:24 entry.tcl

    5072 2001/09/06 18:34:47 focus.tcl

    1148012 2003/04/09 23:47:58 libtk8.4.so

    13624 2002/08/31 06:33:59 listbox.tcl

    37050 2002/08/31 06:33:59 menu.tcl

    27260 2002/07/19 15:26:38 mkpsenc.tcl

    15931 2003/02/22 09:39:59 msgbox.tcl

    dir msgs/

    803 1998/09/14 14:23:24 obsolete.tcl

    1659 2001/09/06 18:34:48 optMenu.tcl

    8004 2001/12/06 19:13:12 palette.tcl

    4974 2002/08/20 14:39:45 panedwindow.tcl

    248 2002/12/03 16:52:08 pkgIndex.tcl

    9569 1999/02/04 15:59:48 prolog.ps

    7540 2000/10/30 20:11:51 safetk.tcl

    7510 2002/02/26 17:27:38 scale.tcl

    11766 2002/08/31 06:33:59 scrlbar.tcl

    15154 2002/08/31 06:33:59 spinbox.tcl

    22210 2002/06/26 08:42:51 tclIndex

    4675 2001/09/06 18:34:49 tearoff.tcl

    30884 2002/08/31 06:33:59 text.tcl

    16895 2003/02/18 16:48:46 tk.tcl

    48932 2003/02/22 09:39:59 tkfbox.tcl

    11462 2002/07/19 15:26:38 unsupported.tcl

    25258 2003/02/18 16:48:46 xmfbox.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/vfs:

    16599 2003/03/17 05:03:21 mk4vfs.tcl

    484 2003/03/17 05:03:44 pkgIndex.tcl

    4483 2002/05/28 02:30:41 scripdoc.tcl

    3130 2003/02/24 07:10:18 starkit.tcl

    12851 2003/02/21 11:36:40 vfsUtils.tcl

    4013 2003/02/09 11:46:20 vfslib.tcl

    11932 2003/02/22 09:40:04 zipvfs.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/Tktable/SunOS:

    162972 2003/10/22 17:17:42 Tktable.so

    1209652 2003/10/22 13:55:40 libtk8.3.so

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/encoding:

    1090 1999/04/15 20:46:57 ascii.enc

    1091 2001/05/30 04:49:18 cp1252.enc

    1094 1999/04/15 20:47:09 iso8859-1.enc

    1094 1999/04/15 20:47:09 iso8859-2.enc

    1093 2001/10/14 04:19:01 macRoman.enc

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/http:

    23519 2002/10/06 15:26:27 http.tcl

    726 2002/02/09 12:22:16 pkgIndex.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/msgcat:

    12681 2002/08/20 14:43:49 msgcat.tcl

    132 2002/06/21 19:47:33 pkgIndex.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/opt:

    33016 2003/01/10 17:39:10 optparse.tcl

    605 2003/03/03 15:31:04 pkgIndex.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4/tcltest:

    610 2003/02/19 15:30:03 pkgIndex.tcl

    98098 2003/02/19 15:30:03 tcltest.tcl

    loadmrt.ux/lib/tk8.4/msgs:

    3831 2002/06/14 04:18:56 cs.msg

    3728 2002/06/14 04:18:56 de.msg

    8610 2002/06/14 04:18:56 el.msg

    2540 2002/06/14 04:18:56 en.msg

    63 2002/06/17 13:14:25 en_gb.msg

    3704 2002/06/14 04:18:56 es.msg

    3662 2002/06/14 04:18:56 fr.msg

    3544 2002/06/14 04:18:56 it.msg

    6960 2002/06/14 04:18:56 nl.msg

    7105 2002/06/09 20:15:42 ru.msg

    Robert M. Bartis
    Lucent Technologies ¢
    Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH)
    ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH)

    * bartis@lucent.com

     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C399BA.426C33A0-- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Oct 23 18:40:15 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9NNeEX18646 for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:40:15 -0500 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 7637483AEF; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 01:40:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6C8883AE7; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 01:40:05 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 01:40:07 +0200 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starpack runs OK when invoked from directory it was created, but nowhere else Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Cc: "Serrao, John G (John)" To: "'starkit'" From: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <3BB3F6B2-05B2-11D8-A1DF-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_01_02,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h9NNeEX18646 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Robert M (Bob) wrote: > I created a Starkit using the command sdx qwrap loadmrt, unwrapped it > using sdx unwrap loadmrt.kit and have made numerous updates using sdx > wrap loadmrt.kit. the loadmrt.kit file seems to run fine under tclkit. > I then created a Starpack using the following script > > sdx wrap loadmrt.kit ^ this copies loadmrt.vfs/ contents into a new loadmrt.kit > cp loadmrt.kit loadmrt.ux ^ this copies the starkit to loadmrt.ux, and has no effect given the following: > sdx wrap loadmrt.ux -runtime /home/bartis/bin/tclkit-solaris-sparc ^ this copies loadmrt.vfs/ contents into a new loadmrt.ux, set up to run on Solaris. IOW, your last command cancels whatever you had in mind in the 2nd. And the first command is not needed for starpacks. > If I run the resulting file from where I created it, it runs fine. If > I take the resulting file loadmrt.ux, to another directory it is > unable to find the tcl files that are sourced into my program, even > though they show as being present in the Starpack. If I copy the > "missing" file to the local directory it runs until it hits the next > source statement and then complains about it. The exact error I > receive is > > couldn't read file "dialog.tcl": no such file or directory >     while executing > "source dialog.tcl" >     (procedure "init" line 10) >     invoked from within > "init $argc $argv" >     (file "/home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt/loadmrt.tcl" line > 367) >     invoked from within > "source /home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt/loadmrt.tcl" >     ("package ifneeded" script) >     invoked from within > "package require app-loadmrt" >     (file "/home/bartis/loadmrt.ux/main.tcl" line 3) Let's analyze that a bit: - starpack starts, and requires app-loadmrt - package is found in the spot where qwrap set is up - your loadmrt.tcl script executes an "init" call - your init proc, also in loadmrt.tcl, does a "source" - that source fails Conclusion: there is no file "dialog.tcl" in the *current* directory. Forget all about starkits and starpacks for a moment: the current behavior is exactly what you should expect in any setup. Now let's look at your (somewhat hard to read) listing: [...] > loadmrt.ux: > 2169 2003/02/02 20:13:17 boot.tcl > 37 2003/03/17 05:05:22 config.tcl > dir lib/ > 69 2003/10/22 13:13:19 main.tcl > 10134 2002/12/06 03:58:21 tclkit.ico > loadmrt.ux/lib: > dir Tktable/ > dir app-loadmrt/ > dir itcl3.3/ > dir tcl8.4/ > dir tk8.4/ > dir vfs/ > loadmrt.ux/lib/Tktable: > dir SunOS/ > 245 2003/10/22 20:52:18 pkgIndex.tcl > 20817 2001/10/22 19:51:33 tkTable.tcl > loadmrt.ux/lib/app-loadmrt: > 3120 2003/10/22 13:17:25 dialog.tcl > 13275 2003/10/23 10:01:43 loadmrt.tcl > 262 2003/10/22 13:16:25 loadmrtHeader.tcl > 11617 2003/10/22 13:17:44 loadmrtProcs.tcl > 74 2003/10/22 13:13:19 pkgIndex.tcl > 2804 2003/10/22 13:16:41 timer.tcl > 4449 2003/10/22 13:17:15 tkerror.tcl > loadmrt.ux/lib/itcl3.3: > 4922 2002/10/01 08:01:44 itcl.tcl > 131032 2003/04/09 23:42:20 libitcl3.3.so > 297 2003/02/19 19:27:01 pkgIndex.tcl > loadmrt.ux/lib/tcl8.4: > 19529 2002/11/02 18:11:16 auto.tcl > dir encoding/ > 9108 2001/05/17 19:53:45 history.tcl > dir http/ > 22451 2003/01/10 17:38:56 init.tcl > 6802 2001/10/14 04:19:01 ldAout.tcl > dir msgcat/ > dir opt/ > 23909 2003/02/26 04:34:21 package.tcl > 882 1998/09/14 14:40:03 parray.tcl > 27373 2003/02/19 15:29:41 safe.tcl > 6097 2002/11/02 18:11:17 tclIndex > dir tcltest/ > 4375 2002/11/02 18:11:17 word.tcl > loadmrt.ux/lib/tk8.4: > 9022 2002/08/31 06:33:59 bgerror.tcl > 16698 2002/09/04 08:52:23 button.tcl > 8985 2002/08/20 14:39:45 choosedir.tcl > 21366 2003/02/22 09:39:59 clrpick.tcl > 7698 2003/02/22 09:39:59 comdlg.tcl > 26942 2003/02/22 09:39:59 console.tcl > 6474 2002/08/31 06:33:59 dialog.tcl [etc...] How could this possibly work? You're trying to load dialog.tcl from loadmrt.ux/lib/tk8.4 - but you'r not specifying the path to it? The "source" command works relative to the current directory, which is almost never useful when starkits/starpacks are used, since these can be launched from anywhere. Why are you doing a "source dialog.tcl" in the first place? Isn't that Tk's responsibility? I suggest doing the following: 1. take your starkit, and unwrap it in a fresh empty directory: mkdir blah cd blah sdx unwrap ../loadmrt.kit 2. launch your unwrapped code there, as follows: tclkit loadmrt.vfs/main.tcl 3. fix and edit your code until that works, i.e. *unpacked* 4. then wrap, either as starkit or as starpack 5. test on another machine, or in another dir - it should now be ok I suspect that some of the troubles have been caused by experimentation to get this going in the first place. This can happen when you wrap things up without doing things like: source [file join $starkit::topdir path to my script.tcl] The key trick to keep in mind is that "tclkit loadmrt.vfs/main.tcl" and "tclkit loadmrt.kit" are two ways to run the same application code in unwrapped and in wrapped mode, and that the differences between the two are minimal. -jcw PS. One you get it working, please tell me how to improve the docs and info you found on the www.equi4.com website, so the next person will not run into similar troubles... From vince.darley@eurobios.com Fri Oct 24 04:22:17 2003 Received: from out.exponential-e.net (out.exponential-e.net [62.244.177.197]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9O9MGX18482 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 04:22:17 -0500 Received: from Turing.eurobios.com (62-244-188-66.cust.exponential-e.net [62.244.188.66]) by out.exponential-e.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9O9M6P23522 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 09:22:06 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20031024101812.01f29c18@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 10:22:06 +0100 To: From: Vince Darley In-Reply-To: <20030326170408.9F68134528@sigosmail.sigos.de> References: <20030326170408.9F68134528@sigosmail.sigos.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-7258101B; boundary="=======5DD178A1=======" Subject: [Starkit] 8.5 tclkit? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --=======5DD178A1======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-7258101B; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Has anyone tried to build a tclkit with Tcl 8.5. I tried yesterday on Windows and after adding various #defines and new files to the msvc projects (mainly for the tclPkgConfig stuff) I got it all to build. However, when I try to run it I always get a system alert with 'unknown encoding "cp1252"' (and this happens whether I set TCL_CFGVAL_ENCODING to "cp1252" or to something else). Has anyone else tried this? Is there a new startup encoding dependency? Vince. --=======5DD178A1=======-- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Oct 24 05:04:13 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9OA4CX21015 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 05:04:13 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id MAA16301 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 12:04:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA16154 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 12:04:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3F98F915.BD1159E9@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 12:04:05 +0200 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] The never-ending story about icons, part 127 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I thought I understood how I can make a starpack/starkit use custom icons and yes the icon I want to be shown in the upper-left corner of the windows (this is on Windows XP) is indeed shown. This icon is also shown in the bar that summarizes all the existing windows at the bottom. Unless ... Unless the windows per application get summarized! Then I see the Tk logo again. Personally, I do not mind, but it seems a bit odd in commercial software Customers want conformance to Windows standards - whatever they are the coming month. Does anyone have a clue about that phenomenon? Regards, Arjen From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Oct 24 11:35:09 2003 Received: from motgate2.mot.com (motgate2.mot.com [136.182.1.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9OGZ8X10393 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 11:35:08 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate2.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate2) with ESMTP id h9OGZ6pT005213 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 09:35:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id h9OGYBQe027575 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2003 11:34:12 -0500 Message-ID: <3F9954B1.8040308@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 09:34:57 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] 8.5 tclkit? References: <20030326170408.9F68134528@sigosmail.sigos.de> <6.0.0.22.0.20031024101812.01f29c18@mail.wolfbusiness.com> In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20031024101812.01f29c18@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Vince, Haven't messed with 8.5 yet. Yesterday on tkchat it was mentioned that 8.5 is to be alpha release in November so I think it may be a little early yet to be doing test builds. Tom K. > Has anyone tried to build a tclkit with Tcl 8.5. I tried yesterday on > Windows and after adding various #defines and new files to the msvc > projects (mainly for the tclPkgConfig stuff) I got it all to build. > However, when I try to run it I always get a system alert with 'unknown > encoding "cp1252"' (and this happens whether I set TCL_CFGVAL_ENCODING > to "cp1252" or to something else). > > Has anyone else tried this? Is there a new startup encoding dependency? > > Vince. From cferril@mchsi.com Sun Oct 26 13:35:37 2003 Received: from sccimhc02.asp.att.net (sccimhc02.asp.att.net [63.240.76.164]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9QJZaX24190 for ; Sun, 26 Oct 2003 13:35:37 -0600 Received: from 192.168.2.100 (12-218-32-245.client.mchsi.com[12.218.32.245]) by sccimhc02.asp.att.net (sccimhc02) with SMTP id <20031026193530im200mfrhae>; Sun, 26 Oct 2003 19:35:30 +0000 From: Chuck Ferril To: Vince Darley Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1067197435.24322.27.camel@wcferril.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.3 Date: 26 Oct 2003 13:43:55 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: Problem reading an OpenOffice .sxw (.zip) file Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: (-- copied to the starkit mailing list for everyone as suggested --) Vince, Thanks for the suggestion of using 'vfs::filesystem internalerror' since it caused me to take the time to try to understand why it did nothing...which caused me to try to figure out what it did...which I gave up on pretty quickly...and simply went after finding my original bug. :-o BTW: I found the following worked better for debugging vfs code: set ::env(VFS_DEBUG) 99 Anyway, the point is I found a fix for my problem. I found that if a file in a zip is deflated it will not be read properly because zip::Data thinks it has a zero length. I'm not sure if this is an OpenOffice format zip problem, or simply zip files in general. My fix is to load the correct file info using zip::stat which seem to work properly. This is obviously a hack, but it should help anyone more familier with zipvfs to find and fix the problem. Here is my version of zip::Data from the file zipvfs.tcl: proc zip::Data {fd arr {varPtr ""} {verify 0}} { upvar 1 $arr sb if { $varPtr != "" } { upvar 1 $varPtr data } set buf [read $fd 30] set n [binary scan $buf A4sssssiiiss \ hdr sb(ver) sb(flags) sb(method) \ time date \ sb(crc) sb(csize) sb(size) flen elen] if { ![string equal "PK\03\04" $hdr] } { binary scan $hdr H* x error "bad header: $x" } set sb(ver) [u_short $sb(ver)] set sb(flags) [u_short $sb(flags)] set sb(method) [u_short $sb(method)] set sb(mtime) [DosTime $date $time] set sb(name) [read $fd [u_short $flen]] set sb(extra) [read $fd [u_short $elen]] if { $varPtr == "" } { seek $fd $sb(csize) current } else { #!!! Added by Chuck Ferril 10-26-03 to fix reading of OpenOffice #!!! .sxw files. Any files in the zip that had a method of 8 #!!! (deflate) failed here because size and csize were zero. #!!! I'm not sure why the above computes the size and csize #!!! wrong, but stat appears works properly. I originally #!!! checked for csize of zero, but adding this change didn't #!!! appear to break the none deflated file access and seemed #!!! more natural. zip::stat $fd $sb(name) sb #!!! End of my change set data [read $fd $sb(csize)] } if { $sb(flags) & 0x4 } { # Data Descriptor used set buf [read $fd 12] binary scan $buf iii sb(crc) sb(csize) sb(size) } if { $varPtr == "" } { return "" } if { $sb(method) != 0 } { if { [catch { set data [vfs::zip -mode decompress -nowrap 1 $data] } err] } { ::vfs::log "$sb(name): inflate error: $err" binary scan $data H* x ::vfs::log $x } } return if { $verify } { set ncrc [vfs::crc $data] if { $ncrc != $sb(crc) } { tclLog [format {%s: crc mismatch: expected 0x%x, got 0x%x} \ $sb(name) $sb(crc) $ncrc] } } } To create an OpenOffice .sxw file for testing, simple use OpenOffice to create a new document, type 'Hello World', and save it... Hope this helps! Chuck On Sun, 2003-10-26 at 06:10, Vince Darley wrote: > You'll need to tell me what error message occurs and also you should use > the 'vfs::filesystem internalerror' command to allow for better debugging. > Finally, I suggest you email this to the starkit mailing list so that all > the experts can see it: > > To: Starkit list > Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com > X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.3 > List-Help: > List-Post: > List-Subscribe: , > > List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit > > List-Unsubscribe: , > > List-Archive: > > Certainly without the files in question and instructions for how to > reproduce, I'm unlikely to be able to solve it. > > Thanks! > > -- Vince > > > > > On Sat, 25 Oct 2003, Chuck Ferril wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > I'm having problems reading the content.xml file out of an > > > > OpenOffice document file (which is a zip file). I can read other > > > > files but not content.xml, I simply get nothing as if it is zero > > > > length. > > > > > > > > I originally contacted Jeff Hobbs about this (since I'm a TDK > > > > user) and he verified it failed for him and suggested I contact > > > > you about this problem. > > > > > > > > I had tried emailing you before with a bounced result...so I'm > > > > trying again with this email address (hope you get it this time). > > > > > > > > Here is a very simple script that exhibits the problem: > > > > > > > > > package require vfs > > > > > package require vfslib > > > > > > > > > > set oofile test.sxw > > > > > > > > > > set vfs [vfs::zip::Mount $oofile $oofile] > > > > > > > > > > puts "files: [glob -nocomplain -directory $oofile -tails *]" > > > > > > > > > > set fi [open [file join $oofile content.xml] r] > > > > > puts "<<[read $fi]>>" > > > > > close $fi > > > > > > > > > > vfs::zip::Unmount $vfs $oofile > > > > > > > > > > exit > > > > > > > > I can send you the test.sxw file if you need it...otherwise any > > > > OpenOffice file will do. > > > > > > > > Thanks for any assistance, > > > > Chuck Ferril > > > From arijit@cisco.com Thu Oct 30 19:46:00 2003 Received: from vtg-um-e2k1.sj21ad.cisco.com (vtg-um-e2k1.cisco.com [171.70.93.55]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9V1k0X24966 for ; Thu, 30 Oct 2003 19:46:00 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C39F50.8C542752" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:44:39 -0800 Message-ID: <6677B3346233B94EBB11C0609351012001DAD46F@vtg-um-e2k1.sj21ad.cisco.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 Thread-Index: AcOOsDWIuFiXXz4wTxeTo2OtJOPF+AQnYUuQ From: "Arijit Mukherji" To: , Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39F50.8C542752 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_002_01C39F50.8C542752" ------_=_NextPart_002_01C39F50.8C542752 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I spent some time investigating this, and found some VERY odd behavior. =20 - First of all, I compiled the latest TclKit sources using the MS VC6 project files - Downloaded runtime.kit - ran "cat kit.exe runtime.kit > tclkit.exe" =20 The resulting tclkit.exe seemed to work, BUT If i move/copy the file to another directory, then chances are all of a sudden I'll have the problem again !!=20 =20 (I have attached the script used to test this scenario - all it does is a simple HTTP get). When it fails, the http::get gets stuck midway during the transfer and never returns.=20 =20 For e.g. when i moved the tclkit.exe from "C:\Program Files\Tcl\TclKit\msvc6" to "D:\ClearCase\JPhone_w2k05\ccm_firmware\Projects\JPhone_Win32\ErrorRepor tTool" this happened. Even moving the file to C:\ caused it to happen. However, moving it to some other directories does not cause this =20 * I thought it might be something to do with the creation folder, but that is not the case. On another machine (win2k) it fails to run even when kept in a folder with the exact same name * I thought obviously it had to do with other files in the folder when it works, but I can delete everything else, and it will still work there. Moving it 2 levels higher to C:\Program Files\Tcl will cause a failure on my machine * I tried playing around with mtime and atime of the file, but to no avail. * I tried with both compressed and non-compressed versions of kit.exe (for compression i used the upx utility). This causes the resulting tclkit.exe to work in some of the folder where the uncompressed version fails, but it also fails when kept in some other directories * At this point it seems quite random where it will work and where it will not. Furthermore, it looks like on another machine, a different set of folders will work and a different set will fail At this point I am quite confused, and I feel there is a serious issue here. I'd really like some help with this - I can help with the investigation/resolution if someone would kindly guide me where to look and how to proceed. We were planning to use tclkit in some of our products, but if this is unresolved, i cannot see how we can proceed. =20 Don't know if it matters, but here are the exact steps I used - Launched tclkit.exe by double clicking on it - opened the attached .txt file, and selected the whole text and copied it using Ctrl-C - clicked on the console window of tclkit, and pasted the whole scipt using Ctrl-V =20 when it works, the script ends, but when it fails, it gets stuck in ::http::geturl forever =20 Appreciate any help in advance - Arijit =20 _____ =20 From: julian@precisium.com.au [mailto:julian@precisium.com.au]=20 Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 2:57 PM To: Arijit Mukherji; starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 I can't duplicate the problem here. That script and that tclkit works fine for me, either wrapped or interactively, on NT4=20 =20 Julian. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Arijit Mukherji =20 To: starkit@equi4.com=20 Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 9:22 PM Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 In the downloadable tclkit-win32-upx.exe (version 8.4.4) from=20 http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/, i noticed that HTTP downloads do not work. I generate a standalone executable using this file and my scripts, and when the script tries to do an HTTP download, it waits forever, (although w/ a sniffer, I can see packets incoming - lot of repeats). =20 In order to isolate the problem, I ran the same set of commands from wish.exe (activetcl 8.4.4) (works) and tclkit.exe (does NOT work) so evidently, there is something wrong with this version of tclkit.exe. =20 The problem exists in version 8.4.2 too. However, version 8.4.0 seems OK (whew). =20 My platform is Windows XP Service Pack 1 =20 Has anyone else seen this too ? What would be the way to get this resolved ? This is basic functionality built into Tcl, not in any library, so I'm wondering whether other things are broken too. =20 I appreciate all help in advance. =20 - Arijit =20 =09 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20 P.S. Here is a script template to reproduce the problem. Make sure you have a file (say file.html) available on an HTTP server (say=20 http://www.webserver.com) =20 set outputChannel [open "localFile.html" "w"] set httpToken [::http::geturl=20 http://www.webserver.com/file.html -channel $outputChannel] upvar #0 $httpToken state set httpStatus [::http::status $httpToken] set httpNCode [::http::ncode $httpToken] set httpCode [::http::code $httpToken] close $outputChannel puts $httpStatus ::http::cleanup $httpToken =09 =20 ------_=_NextPart_002_01C39F50.8C542752 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
    I spent some time investigating this, = and found some=20 VERY odd behavior.
     
    - First of all, I compiled the latest TclKit = sources using=20 the MS VC6 project files
    - Downloaded runtime.kit
    - ran "cat kit.exe runtime.kit >=20 tclkit.exe"
     
    The resulting tclkit.exe seemed to work,=20 BUT
    If i move/copy the file to = another directory,=20 then chances are all of a sudden I'll have the problem again = !!=20
     
    (I=20 have attached the script used to test this scenario - all it does is a = simple=20 HTTP get). When it fails, the http::get gets stuck midway during the = transfer=20 and never returns.
     
    For=20 e.g. when i moved the tclkit.exe from "C:\Program = Files\Tcl\TclKit\msvc6" to=20 "D:\ClearCase\JPhone_w2k05\ccm_firmware\Projects\JPhone_Win32\ErrorReport= Tool"=20 this happened. Even moving the file to C:\ caused it to happen. However, = moving=20 it to some other directories does not cause this
     
    • I=20 thought it might be something to do with the creation folder, but that = is not=20 the case. On another machine (win2k) it fails to run even when kept in = a=20 folder with the exact same name
    • I=20 thought obviously it had to do with other files in the folder when it = works,=20 but I can delete everything else, and it will still work there. Moving = it 2=20 levels higher to C:\Program Files\Tcl will cause a failure on my=20 machine
    • I=20 tried playing around with mtime and atime of the file, but to no=20 avail.
    • I = tried with both=20 compressed and non-compressed versions of kit.exe (for compression i = used the=20 upx utility). This causes the resulting tclkit.exe to work in some of = the=20 folder where the uncompressed version fails, but it also fails when = kept in=20 some other directories
    • At = this point it=20 seems quite random where it will work and where it will not. = Furthermore, it=20 looks like on another machine, a different set of folders will work = and a=20 different set will fail
    At=20 this point I am quite confused, and I feel there is a serious issue = here. I'd=20 really like some help with this - I can help with the = investigation/resolution=20 if someone would kindly guide me where to look and how to proceed. We = were=20 planning to use tclkit in some of our products, but if this is = unresolved, i=20 cannot see how we can proceed.
     
    Don't=20 know if it matters, but here are the exact steps I = used
    -=20 Launched tclkit.exe by double clicking on it
    -=20 opened the attached .txt file, and selected the whole text and copied it = using=20 Ctrl-C
    -=20 clicked on the console window of tclkit, and pasted the whole scipt = using=20 Ctrl-V
     
    when=20 it works, the script ends, but when it fails, it gets stuck in = ::http::geturl=20 forever
     
    Appreciate any help in advance
    -=20 Arijit
     

    From: julian@precisium.com.au=20 [mailto:julian@precisium.com.au]
    Sent: Thursday, October 09, = 2003=20 2:57 PM
    To: Arijit Mukherji; = starkit@equi4.com
    Subject: Re:=20 [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and=20 8.4.4

    I can't duplicate the problem = here.
    That script and that tclkit works fine = for=20 me, either wrapped or interactively, on NT4
     
    Julian.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From:=20 Arijit = Mukherji=20
    Sent: Thursday, October 09, = 2003 9:22=20 PM
    Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe = on Win32 :=20 HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4

    In = the=20 downloadable tclkit-win32-upx.exe (version 8.4.4) from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/, = i=20 noticed that HTTP downloads do not work. I generate a standalone = executable=20 using this file and my scripts, and when the script tries to do an = HTTP=20 download, it waits forever, (although w/ a sniffer, I can see packets = incoming=20 - lot of repeats).
     
    In = order to=20 isolate the problem, I ran the same set of commands from wish.exe = (activetcl 8.4.4) (works) and tclkit.exe (does NOT work) so = evidently,=20 there is something wrong with this version of = tclkit.exe.
     
    The = problem exists=20 in version 8.4.2 too. However, version 8.4.0 seems OK=20 (whew).
     
    My = platform is=20 Windows XP Service Pack 1
     
    Has = anyone else=20 seen this too ? What would be the way to get this resolved ? This = is=20 basic functionality built into Tcl, not in any library, so I'm = wondering=20 whether other things are broken too.
     
    I = appreciate all=20 help in advance.
     
    -=20 Arijit
     
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
     
    P.S. = Here is a=20 script template to reproduce the problem. Make sure you have a file = (say=20 file.html) available on an HTTP server (say http://www.webserver.com)
     
       =20 set outputChannel [open "localFile.html" "w"]
        = set=20 httpToken [::http::geturl http://www.webserver.com/file= .html -channel=20 $outputChannel]
        upvar #0 $httpToken=20 state
        set httpStatus [::http::status=20 $httpToken]
        set httpNCode  [::http::ncode=20 $httpToken]
        set httpCode   = [::http::code=20 $httpToken]
        close = $outputChannel
        puts = $httpStatus
       =20 ::http::cleanup $httpToken
     
    ------_=_NextPart_002_01C39F50.8C542752-- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39F50.8C542752 Content-Type: text/plain; name="Test HTTP.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Description: Test HTTP.txt Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Test HTTP.txt" cGFja2FnZSByZXF1aXJlIGh0dHANCnNldCB1cmwgImh0dHA6Ly9jb21tdW5pY2F0b3ItNC9Db21t dW5pY2F0b3JMb2Fkcy9DSVBDLTEtMS0wLTM4Ni5sb2FkcyINCnNldCBsb2NhbEZpbGVOYW1lICJs b2NhbEZpbGUudHh0Ig0KY2F0Y2gge2ZpbGUgZGVsZXRlIC1mb3JjZSAkbG9jYWxGaWxlTmFtZX0N CnNldCBvdXRwdXRDaGFubmVsIFtvcGVuICRsb2NhbEZpbGVOYW1lICJ3Il0NCnNldCBodHRwVG9r ZW4gWzo6aHR0cDo6Z2V0dXJsICR1cmwgLWNoYW5uZWwgJG91dHB1dENoYW5uZWxdDQp1cHZhciAj MCAkaHR0cFRva2VuIHN0YXRlDQpzZXQgaHR0cFN0YXR1cyBbOjpodHRwOjpzdGF0dXMgJGh0dHBU b2tlbl0NCnNldCBodHRwTkNvZGUgIFs6Omh0dHA6Om5jb2RlICRodHRwVG9rZW5dDQpzZXQgaHR0 cENvZGUgICBbOjpodHRwOjpjb2RlICRodHRwVG9rZW5dDQpjbG9zZSAkb3V0cHV0Q2hhbm5lbA0K ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39F50.8C542752-- From bartis@lucent.com Thu Oct 30 22:47:47 2003 Received: from hoemail1.firewall.lucent.com (hoemail1.lucent.com [192.11.226.161]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9V4llX02311 for ; Thu, 30 Oct 2003 22:47:47 -0600 Received: from nj7460exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-17-42-36.lucent.com [135.17.42.36]) by hoemail1.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h9V4lYU27249 for ; Thu, 30 Oct 2003 22:47:35 -0600 (CST) Received: by nj7460exch001h.ho.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 30 Oct 2003 23:47:33 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" To: "'starkit'" Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 23:47:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C39F6A.18B74BA2" Subject: [Starkit] Segment fault wrapping Expect script Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39F6A.18B74BA2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have an application that depends on Expect5.32.2 that I want to wrap = into a StarPack. I'm running on a Solaris machine (SunOS hoamasbld1 5.6 = Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris) and have = copied the libexpect5.32.so from the ActiveTcl/lib/expect5.32 directory = into my releaseUpgrade.vfs directory tree under =20 = /home/bartis/tcl/releaseUpdate/releaseUpdate.vfs/lib/expect/SunOS =20 I have the associated pkgIndex.tcl file located under =20 /home/bartis/tcl/releaseUpdate/releaseUpdate.vfs/lib/expect =20 and contains the following =20 bash-2.05$ cat pkgIndex.tcl # Tcl package index file, version 1.0 # This file is sourced either when an application starts up or # by a "package unknown" script. It invokes the # "package ifneeded" command to set up package-related # information so that packages will be loaded automatically # in response to "package require" commands. When this # script is sourced, the variable $dir must contain the # full path name of this file's directory. =20 set platform [lindex $::tcl_platform(os) 0] set lib expect[info sharedlibextension] =20 package ifneeded Expect 5.32.2 \ [list load [file join $dir $platform libexpect5.32.so]] bash-2.05$=20 When I wrap the file sdx wrap releaseUpdate.kit and then try to run the = resulting releaseUpdate script I receive the following error. Any idea = on what I'm doing wrong? =20 ./run: line 2: 7917 Segmentation Fault tclkit = releaseUpdate.vfs/main.tcl =20 Robert M. Bartis=20 Lucent Technologies =A2=20 Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH)=20 ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH) * bartis@lucent.com=20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39F6A.18B74BA2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    I = have an=20 application that depends on Expect5.32.2 that I want to wrap into a=20 StarPack. I'm running on a Solaris machine (SunOS hoamasbld1 5.6=20 Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris) and have = copied the=20 libexpect5.32.so from the ActiveTcl/lib/expect5.32 directory into my=20 releaseUpgrade.vfs directory tree under
     
           &nb= sp; /home/bartis/tcl/releaseUpdate/releaseUpdate.vfs/lib/expect/Sun= OS
     
    I = have the=20 associated pkgIndex.tcl file located under
     
       =20 /home/bartis/tcl/releaseUpdate/releaseUpdate.vfs/lib/expect
     
    and = contains the=20 following
     
    bash-2.05$ cat=20 pkgIndex.tcl
    # Tcl package index file, version 1.0
    # This = file is=20 sourced either when an application starts up or
    # by a "package = unknown"=20 script.  It invokes the
    # "package ifneeded" command to set = up=20 package-related
    # information so that packages will be loaded=20 automatically
    # in response to "package require" commands.  = When=20 this
    # script is sourced, the variable $dir must contain = the
    # full=20 path name of this file's directory.
     
    set platform=20 [lindex $::tcl_platform(os) 0]
    set lib expect[info=20 sharedlibextension]
     
    package ifneeded=20 Expect 5.32.2 \
            [list = load=20 [file join $dir $platform libexpect5.32.so]]
    bash-2.05$=20
    When I wrap the file sdx wrap = releaseUpdate.kit and then=20 try to run the resulting releaseUpdate script I receive the following = error. Any=20 idea on what I'm doing wrong?
     
    ./run: line 2:  7917 = Segmentation=20 Fault      tclkit=20 releaseUpdate.vfs/main.tcl
     
    Robert=20 M. Bartis
    Lucent=20 Technologies =A2=20
    Room=20 HO = 1C-413A = (HO) / 1B-304=20 (WH)
    ( 732.949.4565=20 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH)

    * bartis@lucent.com=20

     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39F6A.18B74BA2-- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Oct 31 03:23:33 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9V9NXX22441 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 03:23:33 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 38F8283B2D; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:23:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7792F83AEF for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:23:25 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:23:25 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit.exe on Win32 : HTTP broken in version 8.4.2 and 8.4.4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: In-Reply-To: <6677B3346233B94EBB11C0609351012001DAD46F@vtg-um-e2k1.sj21ad.cisco.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h9V9NXX22441 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arijit Mukherji wrote: > I spent some time investigating this, and found some VERY odd behavior. >   > - First of all, I compiled the latest TclKit sources using the MS VC6 > project files > - Downloaded runtime.kit > - ran "cat kit.exe runtime.kit > tclkit.exe" Please make sure you tried with the Tcl sources from SourceForge CVS after Oct 23rd. There was a change which may affect this. > The resulting tclkit.exe seemed to work, BUT > If i move/copy the file to another directory, then chances are all of > a sudden I'll have the problem again !! If there is a pointer related bug, then changes in the length of file paths may change things - especially if this is in the VFS code. I'm not saying it is, just trying to find some explanation for the behavior you're seeing. > (I have attached the script used to test this scenario - all it does > is a simple HTTP get). When it fails, the http::get gets stuck midway > during the transfer and never returns. A "stuck in socket I/O" bug also seems to be the problem in bug report #719790 on SF. > • At this point it seems quite random where it will work and where it > will not. Furthermore, it looks like on another machine, a different > set of folders will work and a different set will fail The hard part in cases like these is that I'm having a very hard time understanding where the bug could be. Tclkit contains a very small amount of C code, used during startup and for implementing the "zlib" and "rechan" extensions. The remaining 99% is standard Tcl, Tk, TclVFS, Metakit, and Incrtcl - which are all quite solid and mature. If there is a problem in VFS or channels, then the bug should also be present in standard installations of tclsh and wish. > At this point I am quite confused, and I feel there is a serious issue > here. I agree that this is serious. It may need running memory-checking tools. For a first step, it might be useful to compile Tcl and all the other pieces with TCL_MEM_DEBUG enabled. > Don't know if it matters, but here are the exact steps I used > - Launched tclkit.exe by double clicking on it > - opened the attached .txt file, and selected the whole text and > copied it using Ctrl-C > - clicked on the console window of tclkit, and pasted the whole scipt > using Ctrl-V >   > when it works, the script ends, but when it fails, it gets stuck in > ::http::geturl forever Good. So this fails consistently when repeated, but the problem is dependent on file system path location? That would at least rule out timing-specific socket issues. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Fri Oct 31 03:32:00 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9V9W0X22943 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 03:32:00 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id A9CE283B2D; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:31:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A52983AEF for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:31:53 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:31:53 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Segment fault wrapping Expect script Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: "'starkit'" In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <0FEFD6C0-0B85-11D8-AB3E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h9V9W0X22943 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bartis, Robert M (Bob) wrote: > I have an application that depends on Expect5.32.2 that I want to wrap > into a StarPack. I'm running on a Solaris machine (SunOS hoamasbld1 > 5.6 Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris) and > have copied the libexpect5.32.so from the ActiveTcl/lib/expect5.32 > directory into my releaseUpgrade.vfs directory tree under [...] > When I wrap the file sdx wrap releaseUpdate.kit and then try to run > the resulting releaseUpdate script I receive the following error. Any > idea on what I'm doing wrong?  > > ./run: line 2:  7917 Segmentation Fault      tclkit > releaseUpdate.vfs/main.tcl To verify that it's not wrapping-related, and I can't repeat often enough how valuable this step is for many issues, you should run in unwrapped mode and compare the results. Instead of tclkit releaseUpdate.kit do #sdx unwrap releaseUpdate.kit <-- if needed tclkit releaseUpdate.vfs/main.tcl i.e. run the exact same code, but unwrapped. Still a crash? Then my hunch would be that Expect is either not stubs-enabled (unlikely, from the ActiveTcl distro), or that it was built on Solaris > 5.6 ... I am not even sure tclkit itself was built for 5.6, I thought 5.7 was used, as this list shows: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/status.html You may want to look for older builds of tclkit and try those, just to see if this particular problem goes away. You may have to build tclkit and expect from source. -jcw From bartis@lucent.com Fri Oct 31 09:35:36 2003 Received: from auemail2.firewall.lucent.com (auemail2.lucent.com [192.11.223.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9VFZaX12896; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 09:35:36 -0600 Received: from nj7460exch002h.wins.lucent.com (h135-17-42-35.lucent.com [135.17.42.35]) by auemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h9VFa8w07739; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 09:36:12 -0600 (CST) Received: by nj7460exch002h.ho.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:35:12 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" To: "'Jean-Claude Wippler'" , "'starkit'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Segment fault wrapping Expect script Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:35:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id h9VFZaX12896 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The script in question runs fine when invoked as a standalone application. I took this script and created a kit, then unwrapped the kit to get vi .vfs directory structure. Following this I went to the path the script was using to pick up expect and copied down the .so and .a files. I moved those files under the *.vfs directory structure and modified the local pkgIndex.tcl file to point to the .so file as was done from the source Expect directory. I then attempted to run using both the tclkit and sdx commands. Same result either way. Not sure if this matters, but the Segmentation fault is coming from line two of main.tcl which is the starkit call? Need help! Bob -----Original Message----- From: Jean-Claude Wippler [mailto:jcw@equi4.com] Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 4:32 AM To: 'starkit' Subject: Re: [Starkit] Segment fault wrapping Expect script Bartis, Robert M (Bob) wrote: > I have an application that depends on Expect5.32.2 that I want to wrap > into a StarPack. I'm running on a Solaris machine (SunOS hoamasbld1 > 5.6 Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris) and > have copied the libexpect5.32.so from the ActiveTcl/lib/expect5.32 > directory into my releaseUpgrade.vfs directory tree under [...] > When I wrap the file sdx wrap releaseUpdate.kit and then try to run > the resulting releaseUpdate script I receive the following error. Any > idea on what I'm doing wrong?  > > ./run: line 2:  7917 Segmentation Fault      tclkit > releaseUpdate.vfs/main.tcl To verify that it's not wrapping-related, and I can't repeat often enough how valuable this step is for many issues, you should run in unwrapped mode and compare the results. Instead of tclkit releaseUpdate.kit do #sdx unwrap releaseUpdate.kit <-- if needed tclkit releaseUpdate.vfs/main.tcl i.e. run the exact same code, but unwrapped. Still a crash? Then my hunch would be that Expect is either not stubs-enabled (unlikely, from the ActiveTcl distro), or that it was built on Solaris > 5.6 ... I am not even sure tclkit itself was built for 5.6, I thought 5.7 was used, as this list shows: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/newer/status.html You may want to look for older builds of tclkit and try those, just to see if this particular problem goes away. You may have to build tclkit and expect from source. -jcw _______________________________________________ starkit mailing list starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Oct 31 10:34:42 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9VGYgX16536 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:34:42 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h9VGWUrT005783 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 08:32:30 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from activestate.com (vpn16.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.246]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h9VGWOkl029327; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 08:32:25 -0800 Message-ID: <3FA28E95.3010601@activestate.com> Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 08:32:21 -0800 From: Jeff Hobbs Organization: ActiveState Corporation User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "'starkit'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Segment fault wrapping Expect script References: <0FEFD6C0-0B85-11D8-AB3E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <0FEFD6C0-0B85-11D8-AB3E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Bartis, Robert M (Bob) wrote: >> I have an application that depends on Expect5.32.2 that I want to wrap >> into a StarPack. I'm running on a Solaris machine (SunOS hoamasbld1 >> 5.6 Generic_105181-29 sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-Enterprise Solaris) and >> have copied the libexpect5.32.so from the ActiveTcl/lib/expect5.32 >> directory into my releaseUpgrade.vfs directory tree under ... > Still a crash? Then my hunch would be that Expect is either not > stubs-enabled (unlikely, from the ActiveTcl distro), or that it was > built on Solaris > 5.6 ... I am not even sure tclkit itself was built We always build the release version of ActiveTcl on Solaris 5.6. However, Expect 5.32 seems fairly old, likely before the time we used a stubs-enabled version (the current is 5.38 or 5.39). That said, I do know that the most recent Expect that we deliver with ActiveTcl/TDK can be used in a starpack, as I have done it. However, you have build the stubs-enabled Expect binaries yourself or buy the TDK to use those binaries, as noted in the license agreement. The sources are all open, but we do have to put some limitation on the use of binaries to support the Tcl group at ActiveState. That's the only way I can support the statement, "I guarantee it works for you". I hope you will find that TclApp in the TDK (which generates starkits/starpacks) is worth the price alone (along with the other 6 developer tools you get). -- Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From bartis@lucent.com Fri Oct 31 16:28:36 2003 Received: from auemail1.firewall.lucent.com (auemail1.lucent.com [192.11.223.161]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9VMSZX07703 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 16:28:35 -0600 Received: from nj7460exch002h.wins.lucent.com (h135-17-42-35.lucent.com [135.17.42.35]) by auemail1.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h9VMSRL29581 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 16:28:27 -0600 (CST) Received: by nj7460exch002h.ho.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 31 Oct 2003 17:28:26 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" To: "'starkit'" Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 17:28:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C39FFD.FE5CF2F4" Subject: [Starkit] Examples of including binaries and invoking them as background pr ocess Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39FFD.FE5CF2F4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Does anyone have a good example of how to include and invoke binaries = from with a starkit? I have two applications that I'd like to = distribute in one of two ways. One where I just delivery application A = and the other where I deliver application B, which contains and invokes = A as a background task. Robert M. Bartis=20 Lucent Technologies =A2=20 Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH)=20 ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH) * bartis@lucent.com=20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39FFD.FE5CF2F4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Does = anyone have a=20 good example of how to include and invoke binaries from with a starkit? = I have=20 two applications that I'd like to distribute in one of two ways. One = where I=20 just delivery application A and the other where I deliver application = B, which=20 contains and invokes A as a background task.

    Robert=20 M. Bartis
    Lucent=20 Technologies =A2=20
    Room=20 HO = 1C-413A = (HO) / 1B-304=20 (WH)
    ( 732.949.4565=20 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH)

    * bartis@lucent.com=20

     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C39FFD.FE5CF2F4-- From bartis@lucent.com Sat Nov 1 11:46:49 2003 Received: from auemail2.firewall.lucent.com (auemail2.lucent.com [192.11.223.163]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA1HknX17764 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 2003 11:46:49 -0600 Received: from nj7460exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-17-42-36.lucent.com [135.17.42.36]) by auemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id hA1Hlaw11352 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 2003 11:47:37 -0600 (CST) Received: by nj7460exch001h.ho.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Sat, 1 Nov 2003 12:46:40 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" To: starkit Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 12:46:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3A0A0.1A87894C" Subject: [Starkit] kitten.kit read-only error Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3A0A0.1A87894C Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I recently tried to source kitten.kit into a project and encountered a = read-only error. Looking on the WEB it appears this is a known issue = that was reported sometime ago. I couldn't find any further updates. = Has this been resolved. For now I've unwrapped the version I have and = simply copy the necessary pieces into my own application. This is = desirable in some cases, but in others it would be more effective to = pull the entire package in.=20 =20 Has the issue been resolved? If so, where should I be picking up the = most current version? Robert M. Bartis=20 Lucent Technologies =A2=20 Room HO 1C-413A (HO) / 1B-304 (WH)=20 ( 732.949.4565 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH) * bartis@lucent.com=20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3A0A0.1A87894C Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    I = recently tried to=20 source kitten.kit into a project and encountered a read-only error. = Looking on=20 the WEB it appears this is a known issue that was reported sometime = ago. I=20 couldn't find any further updates. Has this been resolved. For now I've = unwrapped the version I have and simply copy the necessary pieces into = my own=20 application. This is desirable in some cases, but in others it would be = more=20 effective to pull the entire package in.
     
    Has = the issue been=20 resolved? If so, where should I be picking up the most current=20 version?

    Robert=20 M. Bartis
    Lucent=20 Technologies =A2=20
    Room=20 HO = 1C-413A = (HO) / 1B-304=20 (WH)
    ( 732.949.4565=20 (HO) / 973.386.6739 (WH)

    * bartis@lucent.com=20

     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3A0A0.1A87894C-- From jcw@equi4.com Sat Nov 1 11:59:51 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA1HxoX18309 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 2003 11:59:50 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id C065283B2D; Sat, 1 Nov 2003 18:59:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3739E83AEF for ; Sat, 1 Nov 2003 18:59:42 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 18:59:45 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] kitten.kit read-only error Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <2D0DD996-0C95-11D8-AB3E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_02_03,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Robert M (Bob) wrote: > I recently tried to source kitten.kit into a project and encountered a > read-only error. What's the error? > Looking on the WEB it appears this is a known issue that was reported > sometime ago. What's the web page? > Has the issue been resolved? Sorry to sound cheesy - what's the issue? I haven't looked at kitten for some time (though I do use some of its packages). It would help if your email includes details of what you tried, what error you encountered, what the known issue is... then we (people on this list) can check after you and find an explanation, or fix it, or suggest workarounds. > If so, where should I be picking up the most current version? sdx update kitten.kit (Which goes to http://mini.net/sdarchive/) -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Nov 3 01:27:57 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA37RuX14009 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 2003 01:27:56 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA22213 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 3 Nov 2003 08:27:55 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA21657 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 2003 08:27:47 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3FA60373.C347D064@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 03 Nov 2003 08:27:47 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "'starkit'" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Examples of including binaries and invoking them as background process References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I do not know if this applies to the way you want to distribute your application, but I have done the following (on Windows systems): - I created an installation executable as a starpack (most of my customers expect some sort of installation procedure. - This does little more than: - Show a simple screen to select a directory to copy the application to. - Copy all files and directories out of a directory contained in the starpack to that directory - Put a few items in the Start menu - My actual application is then a starpack that invokes external programs via the exec command. I can send you the skeleton code for this (I suppose I should donate it to the Wiki too :) Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Tue Nov 4 01:58:15 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA47wEX28522 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 01:58:15 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA04968 for starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 08:58:13 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA03891; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 08:57:53 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3FA75C01.B7D06941@wldelft.nl> Date: Tue, 04 Nov 2003 08:57:53 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Bartis, Robert M (Bob)" CC: "'starkit'" , rjent@rjent.pair.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Examples of including binaries and invoking them as background process References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I have put an example of the sort of scripts I use on the Wiki: (Actually, I use the script that I have posted there as a template for all this sort of stuff. In its present form it is biased towards Windows, but the principle remains the same for any platform). Regards, Arjen From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Tue Nov 4 08:43:20 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA4EhJX23978 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 08:43:20 -0600 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9020F69.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.15.105]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr12) with ESMTP id hA4EhH9S019447 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 15:43:17 +0100 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id 5D83528A48; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 15:41:09 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id 0821C305C7 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 15:41:08 +0100 (MET) Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 15:41:08 +0100 (MET) From: Harald Oehlmann X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [Starkit] fcopy -command does not fire Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dear List, I am wrapping an old complex application on windows xp with the 8.4.4 starkits. The application contains two commands: fcopy $hs1 $hd1 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 1" fcopy $hs2 $hd2 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 2" In the wrapped version, the commands are never invoked. The Handles are open file handles which point outside of the virtual file system. I have the impression, that even one fcopy -command never fires its command. In the unwrapped version, it works o.k. with tcl8.4.4. Does anybody have any ideas ? Best regards, Harald From andreask@ActiveState.com Tue Nov 4 10:43:12 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA4GhBX02682 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:43:11 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hA4GYtsk007080; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 08:34:55 -0800 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id hA4GYkkl006080; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 08:34:55 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Harald Oehlmann" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] fcopy -command does not fire Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 08:34:46 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Could that be bug http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=10894&atid=110894&func=detail&aid=5 99468 ?, recently fixed in the CVS head and the 8.4 branch. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com, a division of Sophos Tel: +1 604 484 6491 > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Harald Oehlmann > Sent: Tuesday, November 04, 2003 6:41 AM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] fcopy -command does not fire > > > Dear List, > > I am wrapping an old complex application on windows xp with the 8.4.4 > starkits. The application contains two commands: > fcopy $hs1 $hd1 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 1" > fcopy $hs2 $hd2 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 2" > In the wrapped version, the commands are never invoked. > The Handles are open file handles which point outside of the virtual file > system. > I have the impression, that even one fcopy -command never fires its > command. > In the unwrapped version, it works o.k. with tcl8.4.4. > > Does anybody have any ideas ? > > Best regards, > Harald > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Tue Nov 4 18:48:27 2003 Received: from web41906.mail.yahoo.com (web41906.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.157]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hA50mRX07051 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 2003 18:48:27 -0600 Message-ID: <20031105004821.58151.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41906.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 04 Nov 2003 16:48:21 PST Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 16:48:21 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] Staticly compiling libstdc++ and libgcc_s, but everything else dynamic Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Some time ago, Jean-Claude released a Linux binary (8.4.2) that was dinamically linked except for libstdc++ and libgcc_s. http://trixie.triqs.com/pipermail/starkit/2003-February/000882.html How can it be done when building my own tclkit? The default build is dynamically linked everything I tried adding : -static -lstdc++ to the Z array in genkit, but no luck, that just builds everything static Any suggestions? Thanks! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree From ma7777772@hotmail.com Wed Nov 5 08:05:52 2003 Received: from hotmail.com (sea1-f31.sea1.hotmail.com [207.68.163.31]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA5E5pX23383 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 08:05:51 -0600 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 06:05:46 -0800 Received: from 47.248.0.41 by sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 05 Nov 2003 14:05:45 GMT X-Originating-IP: [47.248.0.41] X-Originating-Email: [ma7777772@hotmail.com] From: "tc ma" To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Wed, 05 Nov 2003 09:05:45 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2003 14:05:46.0194 (UTC) FILETIME=[E87CF320:01C3A3A5] Subject: [Starkit] kitten.kit core dumped Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I downloaded the latest precompiled tclkit and kitten.kit binary to my solaris 8 workstation. cars27e-60> tclkit % source kitten.kit % package require Expect Segmentation Fault (core dumped) It crash at "package require Expect". -------- Larry also had problem with kitten.kit. I post his message here: From: lvirden@yahoo.com (lvirden@yahoo.com) Subject: Re: how to use kitten.kit View this article only Newsgroups: comp.lang.tcl Date: 2003-10-29 08:13:05 PST According to TingChong : :How to use the kitten.kit starkit? :source kitten.kit :package require Expect :puts "test" :puts [package versions Expect] :spawn telnet zwdls0k1 : :# ./star.tcl :Segmentation Fault - core dumped you got farther than I did. I have the latest tclkit and kitten.kit: $ tclkit % source /ldatae/bin/kitten.kit % package require Expect couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tclojaqPx": ld.so.1: tclkit: fatal: relocation error: file /var/tmp/tclojaqPx: symbol Tcl_CommandComplete: referenced symbol not found Try starting your tclkit up interactively, type in your script, and see where it is breaking. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca From lvirden@cas.org Wed Nov 5 08:48:46 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA5EmkX26153 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 08:48:46 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hA5Emcj2014236 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:48:39 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hA5Emcm05502; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:48:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:48:38 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031105094838.AAB5407@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] kitten.kit core dumped In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 05 Nov 2003 09:05:45 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: In my case, sdx.kit reports this as the 'version' of tclkit that I am using. It is a self-built version of tclkit that otherwise appears to be working fine. 2003/09/24 11:53:34 58029-10810 /ldatae/bin/sun4/tclkit Interestingly enough, I just downloaded the tcl 8.4.4 sparc solaris binary dated Sept. 2003 on equi.net and I see: $ tclkit-solaris-sparc % source /ldatae/bin/kitten.kit % package require Expect Segmentation Fault(coredump) So my personal copy appears to be working a bit better than the official version. Also, note that the above behaviors are with a version of kitten.kit downloaded this morning from equi.net. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 5 09:11:36 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA5FBaX27712 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:11:36 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id CA4EA83AF3; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 16:11:28 +0100 (CET) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B2CF83AEF for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 16:11:28 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 16:11:27 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] kitten.kit core dumped Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20031105094838.AAB5407@cas.org> Message-Id: <53D8AA4A-0FA2-11D8-9C82-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,IN_REP_TO,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Folks, > $ tclkit-solaris-sparc > % source /ldatae/bin/kitten.kit > % package require Expect > Segmentation Fault(coredump) With several threads on c.l.t and now here, I think we've established that kitten does not have a good build of expect for Solaris in it. If people want to contribute binaries (with some info, e.g. what Solaris OS vsn), I'll be happy to fix and also extend Kitten. To spell it out: if someone sends me a good build of expect.so for Solaris 7 (or 6, since they tend to be upward compatible), I'll put it in. Then, you can do "sdx update kitten.kit" and immediately benefit from it. That goes for tons of other extensions (in there now, as well as new ones). Kitten is useful, but as I've always said, it's also experimental. The proof that it makes a decent collection is there, but the infra-structure to maintain it and treat kitten as a managed repository isn't right now. As I said, if those who want to improve it would help by giving me bits to put it, I'll gladly do so and it would probably help us all go a long way. I cannot support kitten on Solaris otherwise. -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Wed Nov 5 12:50:06 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA5Io5X10251 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 12:50:06 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hA5Iiksk019889; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 10:44:46 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hA5Iij29013091; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 10:44:45 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Tcl Core List'" , "'Starkit mailing list'" Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 10:44:45 -0800 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <006301c3a3cc$e2072200$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Subject: [Starkit] Careful handling of std channels on startup Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I wanted to impart a little knowledge to save others possible wasting a couple of days scratching their heads over special startup issues. I was working on getting a base kit for NT services to work correctly, and everything worked fine from the DOS console, but crashed when used via the service manager. Various circumstances made this all very hard to grok until I went tracing deep in the code. It turns out to be fairly basic. When started from the NT service manager, you don't get std channels (this will likely affect dealing with unix daemons as well). Tcl has the behavior to automatically inherit newly opened channels as the std channels. It was doing this to the *encodings* being opened as part of startup, in particular the iso8859-1 encoding that is preloaded and cached. What I was hitting was a panic on Tcl_Close because that encoding had been inherited as a std channel and didn't want to go away. There are more details than that for those who think they might encounter this problem, and easy ways around it when you know what to expect. I just wanted to log this for others. Jeff From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Wed Nov 5 18:36:51 2003 Received: from web41903.mail.yahoo.com (web41903.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.154]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hA60aoX12923 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 18:36:50 -0600 Message-ID: <20031106003644.64155.qmail@web41903.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41903.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 05 Nov 2003 16:36:44 PST Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 16:36:44 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [Starkit] How are released tclkit built? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have been trying to solve this for the past two days. I hope whoever does the release of Tclkit for Linux can shed some light :) When I build tclkit from source on Linux (tried Mandrake 8.1, 8.2 and Red Hat 8.0) I get the following dependencies: ldd ../build/src/tclkit-example.com libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x40022000) libstdc++-libc6.2-2.so.3 => /usr/lib/libstdc++-libc6.2-2.so.3 (0x40025000) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x40072000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x40095000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000) (in Red Hat 8.0 I also get reference to libgcc_s.so) But the released tclkit for Linux does not have any references to libstdc++, how is that done? I tried several settings (after googling quite a bit) and what seems to work is adding the following to Z array in genkit: -Wl,-static -libstdc++ -static-libgcc It has, however, weird side effects and when I try to load various extensions it coredumps (see previous mail for link). The extensions are stub enabled and load fine both on regular wish and fully dynamic tclkits. So my question is again :) What do you guys use in Linux to compile-in libstdc++ statically, such as it is done in the released tclkit? Best regards __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 5 18:47:39 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA60lcX14119 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 18:47:38 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 1A5B783AF3; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 01:47:30 +0100 (CET) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id A907C83AEF for ; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 01:47:29 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 6 Nov 2003 01:47:30 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] How are released tclkit built? Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=Apple-Mail-4--421862367 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <20031106003644.64155.qmail@web41903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --Apple-Mail-4--421862367 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Guaca Mole wrote: > I have been trying to solve this for the past two > days. I hope whoever does the release of Tclkit for > Linux can shed some light :) Whoops... sorry for letting this linger. Building mixed-static/-dynamic executables is tricky. Apart from the proper build flags for gcc, I went over half a dozen Linux distro's to find one which has a not-too-shabby gcc (2.95.3) and relies on a not-too-shabby release of glibc, so that the result would be dynamic in libc in a way which really works on a wide range of Linux distro's (on the assumption that libc is upward compatible). Ended up using Mandrake 7.2, not before and not after. Then I use a hand-crafted shell script to build it, and run the gcc link step first in verbose mode, then hand-edit the command so it does what is needed, then run it again. It seems to work out, IOW it leads to a tclkit which runs on many boxes yet is dynamic in part (glibc) and not in others (c++ and zlib). Ain't software deployment fun. Attached is the makefile that did the trick for tclkit 8.4.2 - YMMV. -jcw --Apple-Mail-4--421862367 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=M.sh Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: application/octet-stream; x-unix-mode=0755; name="M.sh" #!/bin/sh # Build TclKit on Linux, using a mix of dynamic and static -lstdc++/-lz case `hostname -s` in md72) ;; *) echo "This should only be run on Mandrake 7.2!"; exit 1;; esac P=`pwd` O=$P/../src mkdir -p build-tcl build-tk build-itcl build-mk cd $P/build-tcl ../../src/tcl/unix/configure --disable-shared make libtcl8.4.a cd $P/build-tk ../../src/tk/unix/configure --enable-shared --with-tcl=$P/build-tcl make libtk8.4.so cd $P/build-itcl ../../src/itcl/itcl/configure --enable-shared --with-tcl=$P/build-tcl make libitcl3.3.so cd $P/build-mk ../../src/mk/unix/configure --disable-shared --with-tcl=$O/tcl/generic make libmk4tcl.la cd $P pwd D="-DNDEBUG -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -DHAVE_STRUCT_STAT64=1 -DHAVE_TYPE_OFF64_T=1" A="-DTCL_LOCAL_APPINIT=TclKit_AppInit" I="-I. -I$O/tcl/generic -I$O/tk/generic -I$O/mk/include" L="build-tcl/libtcl8.4.a build-mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a" rm -f *.o gcc -c -O3 $I $D $TCL_DEFS $O/kit/src/*.c $O/vfs/generic/vfs.c gcc -c -O3 $I $D $TCL_DEFS $A $O/tcl/unix/tclAppInit.c # original linker appraoch was: # g++ -static -rdynamic -o kit *.o $L -ldl -lieee -lm -lz # cmd: # g++ -v -rdynamic -o kit *.o $L -ldl -lieee -lm -lz # output: # /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/collect2 -m elf_i386 -export-dynamic -dynamic-linker /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -o kit /usr/lib/crt1.o /usr/lib/crti.o /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/crtbegin.o -L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3 kitInit.o pwb.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o vfs.o zlib.o /home/shared/kitbuilds/alt-md72/build-tcl/libtcl8.4.a /home/shared/kitbuilds/alt-md72/build-mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a -ldl -lieee -lz -lstdc++ -lm -lgcc -lc -lgcc /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/crtend.o /usr/lib/crtn.o # manually edited (link -lz and -lstdc++ static): /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/collect2 -m elf_i386 -export-dynamic -dynamic-linker /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -o kit /usr/lib/crt1.o /usr/lib/crti.o /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/crtbegin.o -L/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3 kitInit.o pwb.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o vfs.o zlib.o /home/shared/kitbuilds/alt-md72/build-tcl/libtcl8.4.a /home/shared/kitbuilds/alt-md72/build-mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a -ldl -lieee /usr/lib/libz.a /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/libstdc++.a -lm -lgcc -lc -lgcc /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i586-mandrake-linux/2.95.3/crtend.o /usr/lib/crtn.o strip kit strip build-itcl/libitcl3.3.so strip build-tk/libtk8.4.so rm *.o cat kit ../runtime.kit >kit-temp chmod +x kit-temp ./kit-temp <<'EOF' set db [vfs::mk4::Mount ../runtime.kit runtime -readonly] vfs::attributes runtime -state translucent file copy build-itcl/libitcl3.3.so runtime/lib/itcl3.3/ file copy build-tk/libtk8.4.so runtime/lib/tk8.4/ set fd [open runtime-tk.kit w] mk::file save $db $fd close $fd vfs::unmount runtime EOF cd $P cp -a kit tclkit cat runtime-tk.kit >>tclkit ls -l tclkit --Apple-Mail-4--421862367-- From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Wed Nov 5 19:22:02 2003 Received: from web41904.mail.yahoo.com (web41904.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.155]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hA61M1X17240 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 19:22:02 -0600 Message-ID: <20031106012155.23400.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41904.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 05 Nov 2003 17:21:55 PST Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 17:21:55 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Fwd: Re: [Starkit] How are released tclkit built? To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="0-402288187-1068081715=:22459" Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: --0-402288187-1068081715=:22459 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Id: Content-Disposition: inline Note: forwarded message attached. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree --0-402288187-1068081715=:22459 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41906.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 05 Nov 2003 17:20:49 PST Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 17:20:49 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] How are released tclkit built? To: Jean-Claude Wippler In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Length: 970 Thanks Jean-Claude! This is certainly a start. I need to build on more recent distribution and a newer version of Tcl/Tk (8.5) so I guess it is going to be even more fun :-) Can you include this script with future versions of tclkit? After your mail I found another M.sh, but it seems much older. Best regards > > I have been trying to solve this for the past two > > days. I hope whoever does the release of Tclkit > for > > Linux can shed some light :) > > Whoops... sorry for letting this linger. > > Building mixed-static/-dynamic executables is > tricky. Apart from the > proper build flags for gcc, I went over half a dozen > Linux distro's to > find one which has a not-too-shabby gcc (2.95.3) and > relies on a > not-too-shabby release of glibc, so that the result > would be dynamic in > libc in a way which really works on a wide range of > Linux distro's (on > the assumption that libc is upward compatible). > > Ended up using Mandrake 7.2, not before and not > after. > > Then I use a hand-crafted shell script to build it, > and run the gcc > link step first in verbose mode, then hand-edit the > command so it does > what is needed, then run it again. > > It seems to work out, IOW it leads to a tclkit which > runs on many boxes > yet is dynamic in part (glibc) and not in others > (c++ and zlib). > > Ain't software deployment fun. > > Attached is the makefile that did the trick for > tclkit 8.4.2 - YMMV. > > -jcw > > > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream x-unix-mode=0755; name=M.sh __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree --0-402288187-1068081715=:22459-- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Nov 5 20:02:43 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA622gX20337 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 2003 20:02:43 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 18E8F83AF3; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 03:02:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from equi4.com (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95C5B83AEF for ; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 03:02:36 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 6 Nov 2003 03:02:35 +0100 Subject: Re: [Starkit] How are released tclkit built? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jean-Claude Wippler To: Starkit list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20031106012049.65346.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <4A19651E-0FFD-11D8-9C82-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Guaca Mole wrote: > to build on more recent distribution and a newer > version of Tcl/Tk (8.5) so I guess it is going to be > even more fun :-) I hope you get it going. Meanwhile, I uploaded a tweaked genkit to /pub/tk/tars/ which ought to make it possible to build 8.5 (static, or whatever genkit does by default). To be used as follows: export TCL_REV=5 tclsh genkit B tcl sh genkit B etc... Not really tested, comments/tweaks welcome. -jcw From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Nov 6 10:48:24 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA6GmOX12497 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 10:48:24 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hA6GfQsk014379; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 08:41:26 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from activestate.com (vpn17.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.247]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hA6GfP29030133; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 08:41:25 -0800 Message-ID: <3FAA78D2.2080600@activestate.com> Date: Thu, 06 Nov 2003 08:37:38 -0800 From: Jeff Hobbs Organization: ActiveState Corporation User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Donal K. Fellows" CC: "'Tcl Core List'" , "'Starkit mailing list'" References: <006301c3a3cc$e2072200$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> <3FAA1873.8090008@man.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <3FAA1873.8090008@man.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] Re: [TCLCORE] Careful handling of std channels on startup Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Donal K. Fellows wrote: > Jeff Hobbs wrote: > >> It turns out to be fairly basic. When started from the NT service >> manager, you don't get std channels (this will likely affect dealing >> with unix daemons as well). Tcl has the behavior to automatically >> inherit newly opened channels as the std channels. It was doing this >> to the *encodings* being opened as part of startup, in particular the >> iso8859-1 encoding that is preloaded and cached. What I was hitting >> was a panic on Tcl_Close because that encoding had been inherited as a >> std channel and didn't want to go away. > Is this just another variation on Tcl Bug 772288? This variation is related, but I don't think it totally solves it (although I will test that). The problem is that this just causes some initialization to occur, but the std channels can still be empty. The real issue was in the unexpected (well, it's doc'ed, but occurs with internal details where you don't expect it) inheritance of newly created channels into the std channels, with the channels being those used for loading encodings at startup. -- Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From julian@precisium.com.au Thu Nov 6 11:01:23 2003 Received: from precisium.com.au (smtp.junctionworld.com [203.42.97.10]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hA6H1GX13901 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 2003 11:01:18 -0600 Received: from nstorm ([203.35.226.205]) by precisium.com.au ; Thu, 06 Nov 2003 17:01:04 -0000 Message-ID: <00e101c3a487$90996ca0$3c6f10ac@pcm> From: To: Date: Thu, 6 Nov 2003 17:01:04 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, I've been playing around with a simple extension coded in C as a bit of an experiment with cross-platform tclkit wrapping. I chose the Tclpasswd package from: http://www.graphviz.org/pub/ more for its apparent simplicity than any particular need for this package. I built the extension on both Windows NT and FreeBSD, and it ran fine on both when unwrapped. It also ran on Windows when wrapped as a .kit, but I can't get it to run properly on FreeBSD (using tclsh) when wrapped. It turns out that the problem doesn't appear to be directly related to how I've wrapped it, because a) it works ok wrapped or unwrapped, using tclkit. b) Under tclsh, the problem occurs when wrapped, or when unwrapped whenever I attempt to use it after having 'sourced' any kit file. Here is an example to clarify: FreeBSD 5.1-RELEASE, tcl 8.4.4-1 (Threaded) installed from Ports. (kitfile unwrapped, current dir contains the .so and a .kit) 1) demonstration that loading and calling of tclpasswd.so.0.3 works correctly when no kit files are involved. >tclsh %load Tclpasswd.so.0.3 %passwd x Qhpei7GfLFyOw 2) returns incorrect result after sourcing a kit file. (seems to be any kit file, not kitten.kit in particular) >tclsh %source kitten.kit %load Tclpasswd.so.0.3 %passwd x (null) If I use tclkit (e.g latest from http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.4/) instead of tclsh, the problem also doesn't occur. I've seen it written that tclkit has to do some copying of compiled libraries out from the kitfile to a temp directory for loading, but I can't find where this is implemented..(?) Does sourcing a kitfile under tclsh replace the load command with a special tclkit version of load?.. and if so, why does this seem to stop 'normal' loading from working in this case? The tdom.so file (from Chuck Ferrils tdom kit) seems to load and run ok following a 'source something.kit' I'm wondering if it's to do with dependant libraries? I know Tclpasswd relies on libcrypt. (adding a call to 'load /usr/lib/libcrypt.so' prior to 'load Tclpasswd.so.0.3' in scenario 2 above doesn't help) Even if no-one can shed light on this particular problem - any further explanations of exactly how tclkit does it's loading of compiled libs and/or where this is implemented would be great. It suddenly occurs to me that Tclpasswd.so.0.3 might be loading ok but have that the global 'crypt' function might be conflicting with some other shared library (Trf?) ... I guess I should stop all this wild guessing for now and see if you people have any ideas ;) Cheers, Julian From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 7 08:57:55 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA7EvtX31298 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 08:57:55 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hA7EvlVg017662 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:57:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hA7EvlZ22402; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:57:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:57:47 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031107095747.AAB22394@cas.org> Subject: Re: [PMX:##] [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 6 Nov 2003 17:01:04 -0000 To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: > Here is an example to clarify: > 2) returns incorrect result after sourcing a kit file. (seems to be any kit > file, not kitten.kit in particular) > > >tclsh > %source kitten.kit > %load Tclpasswd.so.0.3 > %passwd x > (null) Is that _supposed_ to work? I wasn't aware that plain tclsh's could source kitten.kit - as far as I was aware, only tclkits support that functionality. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri Nov 7 09:04:45 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA7F4jX32148 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:04:45 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:04:19 Z Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:04:19 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [PMX:##] [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:04:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > > >tclsh > > %source kitten.kit > > %load Tclpasswd.so.0.3 > > %passwd x > > (null) > > > Is that _supposed_ to work? I wasn't aware that plain > tclsh's could source kitten.kit - as far as I was aware, only > tclkits support that functionality. ActiveTcl's got all the stuff necessary to run starkits from tclsh or wish. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 7 09:19:56 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA7FJuX01353 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:19:56 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hA7FJmVg003785 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 10:19:48 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hA7FJmK22781; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 10:19:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2003 10:19:48 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031107101948.AAB22761@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: of Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:04:17 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Re: tclsh vs ActiveTcl I forgot that ActiveTcl came with that support built it. I sure wish the Tcl source distribution came with the support there as well. Does anyone on this list know whether that will happen with Tcl 8.5 ? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Fri Nov 7 09:28:37 2003 Received: from digitalsmarties.com (qmailr@dsl-202-72-154-181.wa.westnet.com.au [202.72.154.181]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hA7FSaX02685 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:28:36 -0600 Received: (qmail 16106 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2003 15:16:14 -0000 Received: from pc-00001.digitalsmarties.com (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 07 Nov 2003 15:16:14 -0000 In-Reply-To: <20031107101948.AAB22761@cas.org> References: <20031107101948.AAB22761@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <0B713E0E-1137-11D8-B582-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: starkit@equi4.com From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2003 23:28:32 +0800 To: "Larry W. Virden" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On 07/11/2003, at 11:19 PM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Re: tclsh vs ActiveTcl > > I forgot that ActiveTcl came with that support built it. > > I sure wish the Tcl source distribution came with the support there as > well. > > Does anyone on this list know whether that will happen with Tcl 8.5 ? Now :-) Well, for common platforms and easy to add for others. See http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/starkit.tar.gz Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 7 09:35:35 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA7FZZX04033 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:35:35 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hA7FZRVg009479 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 10:35:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hA7FZQV23057; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 10:35:26 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2003 10:35:26 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031107103526.AAB23034@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <0B713E0E-1137-11D8-B582-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> of Fri, 7 Nov 2003 23:28:32 +0800 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Steve Landers > On 07/11/2003, at 11:19 PM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > > Does anyone on this list know whether that will happen with Tcl 8.5 ? > > Now :-) > > Well, for common platforms and easy to add for others. See > http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/starkit.tar.gz I was really wondering whether it was possible that the necessary pieces might make their way into the Tcl source distribution, so that anyone who gets a Tcl 8.5 has the ability to load a starkit by sourcing it. That way, efforts like CANTCL could use starkits as the format of distribution and all that would need to be done to use them is to put the starkit in an appropriate directory. With a little tweaking one might even hook things into the package infrastructure... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Nov 7 09:57:16 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA7FvGX07712 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 09:57:16 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hA7FqCsk014009; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 07:52:12 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from activestate.com ([192.168.3.253]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hA7FqB29029546; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 07:52:11 -0800 Message-ID: <3FABBEC9.8000500@activestate.com> Date: Fri, 07 Nov 2003 07:48:25 -0800 From: Jeff Hobbs Organization: ActiveState Corporation User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] tclkit interfering with library 'load' on FreeBSD? References: <20031107101948.AAB22761@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20031107101948.AAB22761@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > Re: tclsh vs ActiveTcl > > I forgot that ActiveTcl came with that support built it. > I sure wish the Tcl source distribution came with the support there as well. > Does anyone on this list know whether that will happen with Tcl 8.5 ? I would be interested in seeing "full" support for starkit's in the core, but that's unlikely before 8.5. For one, metakit is written in C++, not viable for core inclusion. However, we can get part of the way there by adding tclvfs+zipvfs. That would get us a near equivalent. Not having travelled far down that thought line, I'm not sure how far away from the current starpack capabilities we'd be off. -- Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions From jeffh@ActiveState.com Fri Nov 7 14:31:22 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hA7KVMX27896 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 14:31:22 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hA7KQEsk000878; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 12:26:14 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo ([192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hA7KQA29003329; Fri, 7 Nov 2003 12:26:14 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Donal K. Fellows'" , "'Tcl Core List'" Cc: "'Starkit mailing list'" Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2003 12:26:10 -0800 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <011501c3a56d$63ecd6b0$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-reply-to: <3FAB73B9.3070204@man.ac.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Subject: [Starkit] RE: [TCLCORE] Careful handling of std channels on startup Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > OK, it's not exactly the same thing, but it stems from the same basic > root cause - strange behaviour whenever Tcl doesn't have the full set of > standard channels when initialising itself. Perhaps a different > technique would be better, for example not doing the standard channel > magic name stuff (through some kind of internal flag) while > Tcl_FindExecutable() is running? (I suspect that has other problems > though.) I think that is the solution that should be explored eventually. Tcl should not allow internal channels being used during its own initialization to interfere with (read: be inehrited as) std channels. Jeff From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Nov 10 07:19:38 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAADJbX08563 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 07:19:38 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id OAA04674 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 14:19:36 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA03796 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 14:19:23 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3FAF905B.B9BFB4F8@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 14:19:23 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] Version strings and the "what" command References: <53D8AA4A-0FA2-11D8-9C82-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, I have a somewhat exotic question: is it possible to store a string in a starkit/starpack that is recognisable by the what command? The idea is that we can then use the what command to get an overview of the versions of all the programs we use/distribute. FYI: such strings are literal C strings that begin with "@(#)" followed by the text that you want displayed. Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Mon Nov 10 08:12:09 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAAEC8X13668 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 08:12:09 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 89A4E83AF3; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 15:12:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 139748393A for ; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 15:12:01 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <3FAF905B.B9BFB4F8@wldelft.nl> References: <53D8AA4A-0FA2-11D8-9C82-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <3FAF905B.B9BFB4F8@wldelft.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Version strings and the "what" command Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 15:11:58 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, SPAM_PHRASE_05_08,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Arjen, > is it possible to store a string in a starkit/starpack that is > recognisable by the what command? [...] > FYI: such strings are literal C strings that begin with "@(#)" followed > by the text that you want displayed. Sure. All you need to do is to make sure that this text does not end up being compressed. Either store it in a separate file which is so small that "sdx wrap" won't decide to compress it, or add the "-uncomp " flag to stop sdx from doing it for a particular file. This flag can be specified more than once - the path has to be specified relative to the VFS area, i.e. if myapp.vfs/data/blah is to remain uncompressed inside the starkit/starpack, use "-uncomp data/blah". Needs a reasonably new sdx, see its change log. -jcw From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Mon Nov 10 08:27:42 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAAERfX15221 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 08:27:41 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id PAA06750 for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 15:27:41 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA05765 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 2003 15:27:17 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3FAFA045.5DB519B2@wldelft.nl> Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 15:27:17 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Version strings and the "what" command References: <53D8AA4A-0FA2-11D8-9C82-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <3FAF905B.B9BFB4F8@wldelft.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Arjen, > > > is it possible to store a string in a starkit/starpack that is > > recognisable by the what command? > [...] > > FYI: such strings are literal C strings that begin with "@(#)" followed > > by the text that you want displayed. > > Sure. All you need to do is to make sure that this text does not end > up being compressed. > > Either store it in a separate file which is so small that "sdx wrap" > won't decide to compress it, or add the "-uncomp " flag to stop > sdx from doing it for a particular file. This flag can be specified > more than once - the path has to be specified relative to the VFS area, > i.e. if myapp.vfs/data/blah is to remain uncompressed inside the > starkit/starpack, use "-uncomp data/blah". Needs a reasonably new sdx, > see its change log. > > -jcw > So my question was not that exotic or someone has been reading minds :) Thanks! Regards, Arjen From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Tue Nov 11 05:03:22 2003 Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hABB3LX19199 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 05:03:21 -0600 Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9020FD4.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.15.212]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.g-bag.baycix.de (8.12.4/8.12.4/FF-Nr12) with ESMTP id hABB32sM032175; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 12:03:03 +0100 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id 6773E28A48; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 12:00:20 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386)) with ESMTP id 5CB6B301AD; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 12:00:20 +0100 (MET) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2003 12:00:20 +0100 (MET) From: Harald Oehlmann X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: Andreas Kupries Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] fcopy -command does not fire In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Andreas, thank you for the reply. It could. Anyway, the problem apears when wrapping the application. I will wait for tcl8.4.5 with the fixed bug and retry. Harald On Tue, 4 Nov 2003, Andreas Kupries wrote: > Could that be bug > http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=10894&atid=110894&func=detail&aid=5 > 99468 > > -----Original Message----- > > I am wrapping an old complex application on windows xp with the 8.4.4 > > starkits. The application contains two commands: > > fcopy $hs1 $hd1 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 1" > > fcopy $hs2 $hd2 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 2" > > In the wrapped version, the commands are never invoked. > > The Handles are open file handles which point outside of the virtual file > > system. > > I have the impression, that even one fcopy -command never fires its > > command. > > In the unwrapped version, it works o.k. with tcl8.4.4. From jeffh@ActiveState.com Tue Nov 11 11:33:58 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hABHXvX09296 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 11:33:58 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (smtp3.ActiveState.com [192.168.3.19]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hABHTNsk001835; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 09:29:23 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hABHTIaN014318; Tue, 11 Nov 2003 09:29:18 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Harald Oehlmann'" , "'Andreas Kupries'" Cc: Subject: RE: [Starkit] fcopy -command does not fire Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2003 09:29:18 -0800 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <029201c3a879$59131d80$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-reply-to: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by trixie.triqs.com id hABHXvX09296 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Harald, It would be helpful if you could download the Tcl Dev Kit 3.0 beta: http://www.activestate.com/Products/Tcl_Dev_Kit/beta.plex It is using a pre-release 8.4.5 core for the base kits for TclApp. This would confirm for us whether the bug was fixed in 8.4.5 (although it is so close to release now, that if the answer is "no", we can't do much about it). Thanks, Jeff Hobbs The Tcl Guy Senior Developer http://www.ActiveState.com/ Tcl Support and Productivity Solutions Harald Oehlmann wrote: > Andreas, thank you for the reply. > It could. Anyway, the problem apears when wrapping the > application. I will wait for tcl8.4.5 with the fixed bug and retry. > > Harald > > On Tue, 4 Nov 2003, Andreas Kupries wrote: > > Could that be bug > > > http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=10894&atid=110894&func=detail&aid=5 99468 > > > -----Original Message----- > > > I am wrapping an old complex application on windows xp with the > > > 8.4.4 starkits. The application contains two commands: > > > fcopy $hs1 $hd1 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 1" > > > fcopy $hs2 $hd2 -command "[namespace code SaveFCopy] 2" > > > In the wrapped version, the commands are never invoked. > > > The Handles are open file handles which point outside of the virtual > > > file system. I have the impression, that even one fcopy -command > > > never fires its command. > > > In the unwrapped version, it works o.k. with tcl8.4.4. From dentar@dentar.com Fri Nov 14 13:14:22 2003 Received: from dentar.com (dhcp065-029-221-108.cinci.rr.com [65.29.221.108]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAEJEMX13159 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2003 13:14:22 -0600 Received: from ddsl-66-161-164-36.fuse.net ([66.161.164.36] helo=dentar.com) by dentar.com with asmtp (Exim 4.10) id 1AKjOf-0007Ts-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 14 Nov 2003 14:14:21 -0500 Message-ID: <3FB52A49.9060708@dentar.com> Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 14:17:29 -0500 From: "Thomas Glascock, Dentar, Inc." User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030917 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] mingw/msys build for genkit? Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I need to build my own kit (being careful not to call it tclkit ;-) ) but genkit doesn't appear to be complete. The gentleman who configured "batteries included' sent me a buildmk, however, I am unable to even use the "load" command on resulting libraries from any of the 'compiled' packages. has anyone gotten a successful kit build out of mingw/msys? I cannot afford to shell out the bucks for a proprietary microsoft compiler that I am basically going to use once. thanks tom From lvirden@cas.org Thu Nov 20 07:10:14 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKDADX03729 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 07:10:13 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hAKDA4Vg001315 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:10:05 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hAKDA4x23076; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:10:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:10:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031120081004.AAB23049@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I keep thinking about how nice it would be to have a single DOK file containing all the docs for the latest tclkit. I might be in a position soon that I could work on a project to do this. Does anyone else think this would be useful? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Nov 20 07:29:48 2003 Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKDTmX04675 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 07:29:48 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id OAA00323 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:29:46 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA26955 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:29:04 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3FBCC1A0.5C836E0E@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:29:04 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120081004.AAB23049@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > I keep thinking about how nice it would be to have a single DOK file > containing all the docs for the latest tclkit. > > I might be in a position soon that I could work on a project to do this. > > Does anyone else think this would be useful? Well, I think it would be useful! One place to find the information, sure. Regards, Arjen From lvirden@cas.org Thu Nov 20 07:35:02 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKDZ1X05103 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 07:35:01 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hAKDYrVg007726 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:34:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hAKDYr523557; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:34:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:34:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:29:04 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: Arjen Markus > "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > > > > I keep thinking about how nice it would be to have a single DOK file > > containing all the docs for the latest tclkit. > > > > I might be in a position soon that I could work on a project to do this. > > Well, I think it would be useful! One place to find the information, > sure. the one thing that I'm uncertain about how to do is how the current DOK man to html files are generated. Is there some tool being used, or is someone doing all that conversion by hand? If by hand, then updates would be slow. If however there's a tool or toolsuite being used, then my first task would be to locate and build the same toolsuite. Then I would get the current set of docs, convert them to html, then get back to the mailing list in hopes of locating docs for any parts of tclkit currently without man pages. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Nov 20 07:51:22 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKDpLX06027 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 07:51:22 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 65DEA83EF2; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:51:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A16F83BB0 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:51:13 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> References: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:51:12 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Larry W. Virden wrote: > > From: Arjen Markus >> "Larry W. Virden" wrote: >>> >>> I keep thinking about how nice it would be to have a single DOK file >>> containing all the docs for the latest tclkit. >>> >>> I might be in a position soon that I could work on a project to do >>> this. >> >> Well, I think it would be useful! One place to find the information, >> sure. I too think it would be wonderful. IMO, dok files are trivial, quite portable, and they build on a lot of technology which has been around and in widespread use for quite some time. They don't lock anyone in: anyone can unwrap and use a web browser if preferred. (I use tcl84dok.kit all the time, the py22dok.kit one is very nice too) > the one thing that I'm uncertain about how to do is how the current DOK > man to html files are generated. Don't know, I use ready-made pages, such as tcl8.4.4-html.tar.gz at: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=10894 I just take html files and drop them all in the html/ directory, making sure there is an index.html, then sdx wrap it - no other work is involved. > Is there some tool being used, or is someone doing all that conversion > by hand? If by hand, then updates would be slow. If however there's > a tool or toolsuite being used, then my first task would be to locate > and build the same toolsuite. Then I would get the current set of > docs, convert them to html, then get back to the mailing list in hopes > of locating docs for any parts of tclkit currently without man pages. The tcl*dok.kit, and others at http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/ were all created this same way, so it simply comes down to having a good set of html files. Note that "sdx update", i.e. the Starsync logic included in SDX, will quickly update only changes once you submit such dok files to the SD archive at http://mini.net/sdarchive/ - no extra effort by anyone to pick up latest changes than to do "sdx update myneatdok.kit". -jcw From dgroth@gmx.de Thu Nov 20 09:04:59 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hAKF4wX12573 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:04:58 -0600 Received: (qmail 31923 invoked by uid 65534); 20 Nov 2003 15:04:46 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp021) with SMTP; 20 Nov 2003 16:04:46 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 20 Nov 2003 16:07:32 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <20031120081004.AAB23049@cas.org> (lvirden@cas.org) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120081004.AAB23049@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I am currently preparing such an release using the snitbrowser http://mini.net/tcl/10368 and some navigation widgets (like in a windows chm-file). Let's say one week! regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From lvirden@cas.org Thu Nov 20 09:18:16 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKFIGX13300 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:18:16 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hAKFI8Vg015624 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:18:08 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hAKFI8b25391; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:18:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:18:08 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031120101807.AAB25369@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit In-Reply-To: of 20 Nov 2003 16:07:32 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" > I am currently preparing such an release using the snitbrowser > http://mini.net/tcl/10368 and some navigation widgets (like in a > windows chm-file). > > Let's say one week! Wow - that's fantastic! Let us know if you need any help. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Nov 20 10:27:15 2003 Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKGRFX19244 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:27:15 -0600 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id hAKGQiJ3024033; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:26:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id hAKGPSF7019775; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:25:28 -0600 Message-ID: <3FBCEB3A.6000403@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:26:34 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" CC: "Larry W. Virden" , starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120081004.AAB23049@cas.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FYI, I used the tkHTML (from ActiveTcl) to create a viewer on solaris. It turned out to be a major klug because the code is hard linked to a zip library. Ofcourse the library is at a different location on our installation so the only the tkHTML does is crash unless you do a preload of the library. Bottom line, tkHTML isn't a cross platform package. Tom K. > I am currently preparing such an release using the snitbrowser > http://mini.net/tcl/10368 and some navigation widgets (like in a > windows chm-file). > > Let's say one week! > > regards, > Detlef From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Thu Nov 20 10:42:54 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKGgsX20741; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:42:54 -0600 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id hAKGgjIt023838; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:42:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id hAKGc4F7001623; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 10:38:05 -0600 Message-ID: <3FBCEE2F.5020308@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:39:11 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: FYI, I while back I talked to Andreas Kupries about ActiveState documentation methods. I believe he is using the documentation tools found in tcllib (dtformat, dtformatter,...) to generate their documentation. Tom K. > Larry W. Virden wrote: > >> >> From: Arjen Markus >> >>> "Larry W. Virden" wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> I keep thinking about how nice it would be to have a single DOK file >>>> containing all the docs for the latest tclkit. >>>> >>>> I might be in a position soon that I could work on a project to do >>>> this. >>> >>> >>> Well, I think it would be useful! One place to find the information, >>> sure. > > > I too think it would be wonderful. IMO, dok files are trivial, quite > portable, and they build on a lot of technology which has been around > and in widespread use for quite some time. They don't lock anyone in: > anyone can unwrap and use a web browser if preferred. > > (I use tcl84dok.kit all the time, the py22dok.kit one is very nice too) > >> the one thing that I'm uncertain about how to do is how the current DOK >> man to html files are generated. > > > Don't know, I use ready-made pages, such as tcl8.4.4-html.tar.gz at: > http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=10894 > > I just take html files and drop them all in the html/ directory, making > sure there is an index.html, then sdx wrap it - no other work is involved. > >> Is there some tool being used, or is someone doing all that conversion >> by hand? If by hand, then updates would be slow. If however there's >> a tool or toolsuite being used, then my first task would be to locate >> and build the same toolsuite. Then I would get the current set of >> docs, convert them to html, then get back to the mailing list in hopes >> of locating docs for any parts of tclkit currently without man pages. > > > The tcl*dok.kit, and others at http://www.equi4.com/pub/sk/ were all > created this same way, so it simply comes down to having a good set of > html files. > > Note that "sdx update", i.e. the Starsync logic included in SDX, will > quickly update only changes once you submit such dok files to the SD > archive at http://mini.net/sdarchive/ - no extra effort by anyone to > pick up latest changes than to do "sdx update myneatdok.kit". > > -jcw From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Nov 20 15:31:34 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKLVYX10648 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:31:34 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:31:32 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:31:31 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:31:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > the one thing that I'm uncertain about how to do is how the > current DOK man to html files are generated. For the purposes of the "dok" starkits, it doesn't really matter. As long as Tkhtml can digest the pages, then it should work fine. There is a 'make html' target in the Tcl Makefile which will generate HTML from the man pages. I think the TMML stuff had a man-to-tmml coverter, which could generate HTML pages for other packages like Itcl. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Nov 20 16:24:24 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKMOOX15021 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 16:24:24 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 16:24:18 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 16:24:18 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 16:24:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > I while back I talked to Andreas Kupries about ActiveState > documentation methods. I believe he is using the > documentation tools found in tcllib (dtformat, > dtformatter,...) to generate their documentation. I've just gone through the process of adding some online docs to an application, and I considered using the tcllib doc tools. But my docs are user guides and technical papers - not man pages. And the doctools stuff doesn't seem to allow images - which I needed. So I ended up using LaTeX markup and latex2html to generate the HTML files (with equations and illustrations). Not terribly thrilling, but it works well. On Windows, my application fires up the system web browser. On Unix, it tries to exec mozilla. If that fails, it tries to exec netscape. If that fails, it falls back to the "hv.tcl" viewer that is distributed with the Tkhtml widget. But hv.tcl seemed to be just demo code, and I made a few changes to make it work better. Now I see the same code in the dok starkits. Umm Checking out Tkhtml from http://www.hwaci.com/sw/tkhtml/ and I see the latest rev 1.31 2003/01/28, while the version from bw13dok.kit looks like an enhanced version of 1.25 2002/02/19. But there isn't much activity at hwaci.com in a while. Is somebody maintaining this as an application? Should I submit my changes somewhere? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Thu Nov 20 17:43:40 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKNheX21691 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 17:43:40 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hAKNhWVg014737 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:43:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hAKNhWZ03322; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:43:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:43:32 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031120184332.AAB3300@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit In-Reply-To: of Thu, 20 Nov 2003 16:24:17 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: the author of tkhtml recently volunteered to either make a cvs area for it open to the tkhtml community or allow someone to set up a sf.net project. so far, no one's stepped forward to set things up. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Nov 20 17:56:05 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAKNu5X23172 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 17:56:05 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hAKNn1Yj005354; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:49:01 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hAKNn1XK004624; Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:49:01 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Larry W. Virden'" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 15:49:01 -0800 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <000c01c3afc0$df7d5360$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <20031120184332.AAB3300@cas.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > the author of tkhtml recently volunteered to either make a > cvs area for it open to the tkhtml community or allow someone > to set up a sf.net project. so far, no one's stepped forward > to set things up. It would be trivial to drop this into the tktable SF project, like several other projects for which it has become the housing for (tile, treectrl, winico, vu). It fits the same general style as the rest as well. All we need is the cvsroot tarball. Jeff Hobbs, The Tcl Guy http://www.ActiveState.com/, a division of Sophos From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 03:26:24 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hAL9QNX17606 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 03:26:23 -0600 Received: (qmail 23722 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 09:26:17 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp013) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 10:26:17 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 10:28:10 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: Jean-Claude Wippler CC: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> (message from Jean-Claude Wippler on Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:51:12 +0100) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Ok, I did a preview of the new helpbrowser: Screenshot is at: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.gif with running instances on Linux, DEC-OSF1 and Windows the same kit, the same time, different OS's. The download is at: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit it's 2.7MB There are only tkhtml shared libs for Linux, Windows at OSF1 inside, if you live elsewhere please unwrap, add your shared lib, rewrap i.e. the common path in the 21th century. I would be happy to add your fresh shared lib for tkhtml directly to the kit for your platform please compile a fresh cvs one. The way to go is: described at: http://www.hwaci.com/sw/tkhtml/ Borrowed form drh! in short: You can now also obtain the latest tkhtml sources via anonymous CVS. To access the anonymous CVS server, first install CVS on your system. (See http://www.cyclic.com/ for additional information.) Then login as follows: cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.hwaci.com:/home/cvs/tkhtml login You will be prompted for a password. Use "anonymous". After you get logged in successfully, you can check out the source tree like this: cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.hwaci.com:/home/cvs/tkhtml checkout htmlwidget This command creates a directory named "htmlwidget" and fills it with the latest version of the sources. then create a parallel directory like build-solaris cd into it and to one: ../htmlwidget/configure make there. It should build (at least it dids for me)! I would like to add more docs, tclkit, critcl (the 2002 conference paper but in html). Where I can get this. I found only the pdf's. Suggestions for other docs that must be included (iwidgets, tktable ...) are welcome. regards, detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 04:24:08 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALAO8X22464 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 04:24:08 -0600 Received: (qmail 17691 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 10:23:59 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp022) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 11:23:59 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 11:25:52 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" CC: jcw@equi4.com, starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: (dgroth@gmx.de) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sorry a minor update already, fixing some frames, puts, image bugs! Adding some useful (?) scrolling features (Space, Shift-Space, Up, Down) again the url: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit screenshot: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.gif regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 05:58:29 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALBwSX29620 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 05:58:28 -0600 Received: (qmail 10953 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 11:58:20 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp004) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 12:58:20 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 13:00:14 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] ANN: Several cross platformkits, tktreectrl, tkhtml, sqlite, tix8.2 Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, for the platforms: OSF1, Linux and Win32 I prepared some starkits containig their shared libs: They are available at: D:\home\dgroth\mytcl\website\web-dgroth\tcltk_downloads.html but should appear at sdarchive soon ... regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 21 06:28:12 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALCSCX32091 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 06:28:12 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hALCS3Vg027249 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:28:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hALCS4c02877; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:28:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:28:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit In-Reply-To: of 21 Nov 2003 11:25:52 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: One thing about dtHelpBrowser I noticed though is that it contains doc for things that are not in tclkit - for instance, tcllib, Bwidget, Tix, tkTreeControl, tclodbc, tclsqlite, tablelist, wcb, etc. Is the goal of dgHelpBrowser to be a general reference tool for all Tcl/Tk extensions? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 21 06:29:22 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALCTMX32224 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 06:29:22 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hALCTEVg027383 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:29:15 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hALCTFT02906; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:29:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:29:15 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031121072915.AAB2881@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Several cross platformkits, tktreectrl, tkhtml, sqlite, tix8.2 In-Reply-To: of 21 Nov 2003 13:00:14 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" > OSF1, Linux and Win32 I prepared some starkits containig their shared libs: > > They are available at: > D:\home\dgroth\mytcl\website\web-dgroth\tcltk_downloads.html We are not able to access html files using only your d drive as a host name. Do you have a regular url like http://somemachine.site.country/tcltk_downloads.html -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 07:12:43 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (imap.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALDCgX02882 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:12:43 -0600 Received: (qmail 28283 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 13:12:37 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp006) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 14:12:37 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 14:14:30 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <20031121072915.AAB2881@cas.org> (lvirden@cas.org) Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: Several cross platformkits, tktreectrl, tkhtml, sqlite, tix8.2 References: <20031121072915.AAB2881@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sorry for that of course from my website: http://www.dgroth.de/tcltk_downloads.html regards, Detlef >From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" > >> OSF1, Linux and Win32 I prepared some starkits containig their shared libs: >> >> They are available at: >> D:\home\dgroth\mytcl\website\web-dgroth\tcltk_downloads.html > >We are not able to access html files using only your d drive as a host >name. Do you have a regular url like > >http://somemachine.site.country/tcltk_downloads.html >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. >Larry W. Virden >Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should >be construed as representing my employer's opinions. >-><- >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 07:20:49 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALDKmX03530 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:20:48 -0600 Received: (qmail 13057 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 13:20:42 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp027) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 14:20:42 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 14:22:36 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Larry W. Virden" CC: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> (lvirden@cas.org) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Indeed Ihave the goal to have the most important documentation that you I for programming tcl in one file. Because I hate looking around into different files. I guess it's not missing that much ?! Tell me what's missing and I will ad it. Changing the content is simple. Just unwrap the kit delete the unneccessary, add the neccessary, change the changed stuff inside the kit and edit the contents.cnt file ... rewrap! regards, Detlef > >One thing about dgHelpBrowser I noticed though is that it contains doc >for things that are not in tclkit - for instance, tcllib, Bwidget, >Tix, tkTreeControl, tclodbc, tclsqlite, tablelist, wcb, etc. > >Is the goal of dgHelpBrowser to be a general reference tool for all Tcl/Tk >extensions? >-- >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. >Larry W. Virden >Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should >be construed as representing my employer's opinions. >-><- >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From usus@aladyn.de Fri Nov 21 07:41:16 2003 Received: from sigosmail.sigos.de (sigosmail.sigos.de [62.128.16.253]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALDfFX05321 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 07:41:15 -0600 Received: by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 207F05F345; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 14:41:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from sigoslx110 (inetgate.sigos.de [62.128.16.241]) by sigosmail.sigos.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD1E936526; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 14:41:13 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Ulrich Schoebel Organization: Unix Service To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" , "Larry W. Virden" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 15:37:08 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 Cc: starkit@equi4.com References: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-11.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_20,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL autolearn=ham version=2.55 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Friday 21 November 2003 14:22, Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > Indeed Ihave the goal to have the most important documentation that you I > for programming tcl in one file. Because I hate looking around into > different files. > > I guess it's not missing that much ?! > > Tell me what's missing and I will ad it. tktable, vu ... Have a nice weekend Ulrich > > Changing the content is simple. Just unwrap the kit delete the > unneccessary, add the neccessary, change the changed stuff inside the > kit and edit the contents.cnt file ... > > rewrap! > > regards, > Detlef > > >One thing about dgHelpBrowser I noticed though is that it contains doc > >for things that are not in tclkit - for instance, tcllib, Bwidget, > >Tix, tkTreeControl, tclodbc, tclsqlite, tablelist, wcb, etc. > > > >Is the goal of dgHelpBrowser to be a general reference tool for all > > Tcl/Tk extensions? > >-- > >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > >Larry W. Virden > http://www.purl.org/NET/lvirden/> Even if explicitly stated to the > > contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing > > my employer's opinions. > >-><- > >_______________________________________________ > >starkit mailing list > >starkit@equi4.com > >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 08:02:58 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (imap.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALE2vX07589 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:02:58 -0600 Received: (qmail 1553 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 14:02:51 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp025) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 15:02:51 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 15:04:45 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: jcw@equi4.com Cc: starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: (dgroth@gmx.de) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: For comparison just as a 20 minutes wrap shot for the python23 docs: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/python23dok.kit. But be aware that the index loads slow. May need some tweaking (data awareness ...). Or/and putting the index inside a mk-db -; regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 08:50:27 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALEoQX11373 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:50:26 -0600 Received: (qmail 32536 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 14:50:20 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp002) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 15:50:20 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 15:52:14 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: Ulrich Schoebel CC: lvirden@cas.org, starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> (message from Ulrich Schoebel on Fri, 21 Nov 2003 15:37:08 +0200) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: added vu2.2, tktable and SunOS 5.6 shared lib ~ 2.9Mb! Please try it out! nice weekend, Detlef > >On Friday 21 November 2003 14:22, Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: >> Indeed Ihave the goal to have the most important documentation that you I >> for programming tcl in one file. Because I hate looking around into >> different files. >> >> I guess it's not missing that much ?! >> >> Tell me what's missing and I will ad it. >tktable, vu ... > >Have a nice weekend > >Ulrich -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 21 08:56:16 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hALEuGX12111 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:56:16 -0600 Received: (qmail 30261 invoked by uid 65534); 21 Nov 2003 14:56:09 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp003) with SMTP; 21 Nov 2003 15:56:09 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 21 Nov 2003 15:58:03 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" CC: usus@aladyn.de, lvirden@cas.org, starkit@equi4.com In-reply-to: (dgroth@gmx.de) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Sorry, the path is still: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit regards, Detlef > > >added vu2.2, tktable and SunOS 5.6 shared lib ~ 2.9Mb! Please try it out! > >nice weekend, Detlef > > > > > >On Friday 21 November 2003 14:22, Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > >> Indeed Ihave the goal to have the most important documentation that you I > >> for programming tcl in one file. Because I hate looking around into > >> different files. > >> > >> I guess it's not missing that much ?! > >> > >> Tell me what's missing and I will ad it. > >tktable, vu ... > > > >Have a nice weekend > > > >Ulrich > > > > >-- >Dr. Detlef Groth >Max-Planck-Institut >fuer Molekulare Genetik >Ihnestr. 63/73 >D-14195 Berlin >Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g >Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de >Email: dgroth@gmx.de > >_______________________________________________ >starkit mailing list >starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Nov 21 09:50:01 2003 Received: from motgate5.mot.com (motgate5.mot.com [144.189.100.105]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALFo0X18630; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:50:00 -0600 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate5.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate5) with ESMTP id hALFnrIt029384; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:49:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id hALFjKF7002381; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:45:21 -0600 Message-ID: <3FBE3353.1090709@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:46:27 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com CC: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> In-Reply-To: <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The documentation that comes with ActiveTcl is resonably complete. Way don't you just down load a copy and then move the doc sub-dir into your kit. It would save you a lot of edit time. I peronally don't see the need for having the tcl documents in a kit since it will be a pain to keep them sync'ed with my tcl intallation. I just view the ActiveTcl documentation directly using my browser. If I update my installation by downloading a new version of AtciveTcl the link in my browser will automaticlly pickup the new documenation. BTW, the help browser looks really useful, so don't take the above wrong. I am currently using Tkhtml in a help system but haven't had time to get back to it. I'm glade to see that others are also working on the idea. FYI, I have spent a lot of time working with the wikit code and it's viewer is really under powered. I have considered replacing it with Tkhtml but I had problems running it on Sun and HP. The problem was with the code but with the build. If the problems get resolved then I think we should look at upgrading the wikit code. Tom K. Ulrich Schoebel wrote: > On Friday 21 November 2003 14:22, Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > >>Indeed Ihave the goal to have the most important documentation that you I >>for programming tcl in one file. Because I hate looking around into >>different files. >> >>I guess it's not missing that much ?! >> >>Tell me what's missing and I will ad it. > > tktable, vu ... > > Have a nice weekend > > Ulrich > > >>Changing the content is simple. Just unwrap the kit delete the >>unneccessary, add the neccessary, change the changed stuff inside the >>kit and edit the contents.cnt file ... >> >>rewrap! >> >>regards, >>Detlef >> >> >One thing about dgHelpBrowser I noticed though is that it contains doc >> >for things that are not in tclkit - for instance, tcllib, Bwidget, >> >Tix, tkTreeControl, tclodbc, tclsqlite, tablelist, wcb, etc. >> > >> >Is the goal of dgHelpBrowser to be a general reference tool for all >> > Tcl/Tk extensions? >> >-- >> >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. >> >Larry W. Virden > > http://www.purl.org/NET/lvirden/> Even if explicitly stated to the >> > contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing >> > my employer's opinions. >> >-><- >> >_______________________________________________ >> >starkit mailing list >> >starkit@equi4.com >> >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > > _______________________________________________ > starkit mailing list > starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 21 10:24:51 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALGOpX21744 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:24:51 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hALGOgVg025126 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 11:24:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hALGOg706720; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 11:24:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 11:24:42 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031121112442.AAB6378@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit In-Reply-To: of 21 Nov 2003 15:58:03 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" >added vu2.2, tktable and SunOS 5.6 shared lib ~ 2.9Mb! Please try it out! One thing that I'd like to see dgHelpBrowser do is remember the fact that I want to resize the browser. Another useful thing would be the ability for me to set the font and size for display - and the help browser remember that for the next time I invoke it. Someone commented about just using the ActiveTcl help. The reason I started talking about _my_ project is that I wanted a simple starkit that could be placed in the same directory as a tclkit and downloaded at the same time, so that a person who had only tclkit on their system had some docs. If someone is savvy enough to get through the activestate web site, register, download the right install script, have enough disk space to install all of activetcl, and then figure out how to make use of it, then they won't really need the starkit that I was discussing - unless, of course, they want to provide a tclkit to someone themselves. On the other hand, Dr. Groth is working on a different project. He wants an "all in one file" technical reference tool. It seems like it will become, eventually, a superset of the ActiveTcl docs or that tcl/tk pdf that occasionally is updated and announced. I think that the dgHelpBrowser is a neat idea. And if it includes all the stuff in tclkit, then I have hopes that will provide an easy way for me to cut out the pages in which I am interested to provide a subset file to live with tclkit. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri Nov 21 10:35:08 2003 Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALGZ8X23034 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:35:08 -0600 Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:35:02 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:35:02 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: dgroth@gmx.de Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:35:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Detlef, Your help browser kit is delightful. Although I use ActiveState's docs for Tcl/Tk and extensions, I would like to use something like it with my own applications. I tried dropping in my own html help files, and it seems to work nicely. But how do you generate the contents.cnt file? Are you using MSDevStudio? Or hand-editing the various indices and tables of contents? Thanks, Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Nov 21 10:38:24 2003 Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALGcNX23631 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:38:23 -0600 Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) by smtp1.ActiveState.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hALGYRYj010022; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:34:27 -0800 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.3.151]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id hALGYRXK011591; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:34:27 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Techentin, Robert W." , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:34:27 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-admin@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-admin@equi4.com]On Behalf > Of Techentin, Robert W. > Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:24 PM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: RE: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit > > > > I while back I talked to Andreas Kupries about ActiveState > > documentation methods. I believe he is using the > > documentation tools found in tcllib (dtformat, > > dtformatter,...) to generate their documentation. > > > I've just gone through the process of adding some online docs to an > application, and I considered using the tcllib doc tools. But my docs are > user guides and technical papers - not man pages. There are feature requests at SF asking to extend/change this. > And the doctools stuff > doesn't seem to allow images Yes, this is true. I noted this limitation in the doctools paper I did for the conference in Ann Arbor. > - which I needed. > So I ended up using LaTeX > markup and latex2html to generate the HTML files (with equations and > illustrations). Not terribly thrilling, but it works well. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com, a division of Sophos Tel: +1 604 484 6491 From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Nov 21 10:53:14 2003 Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hALGrDX25979 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:53:14 -0600 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id hALGrDZx011997; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:53:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id hALGphF7018377; Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:51:44 -0600 Message-ID: <3FBE42E2.4030208@motorola.com> Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:52:50 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; HP-UX 9000/785; en-US; rv:1.2) Gecko/20021219 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" CC: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031120083453.AAB23539@cas.org> <9A43A352-1B60-11D8-AD3D-000A9588127E@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Dr. Detlef, Just took a look at your help browser on windows. It look really good. It would be nice if clicking on the index tab would load an index page (e.g. the "A" page). The actual page would have to be configureable for use in other situations. Tom K. > Ok, I did a preview of the new helpbrowser: > > Screenshot is at: > > http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.gif > > with running instances > on Linux, DEC-OSF1 and Windows the same kit, the same time, different OS's. > > The download is at: > > http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit it's 2.7MB > > There are only tkhtml shared libs for Linux, Windows at OSF1 inside, > if you live elsewhere please unwrap, add your shared lib, rewrap > i.e. the common path in the 21th century. > > I would be happy to add your fresh shared lib for tkhtml directly to > the kit for your platform please compile a fresh cvs one. > > The way to go is: > described at: > http://www.hwaci.com/sw/tkhtml/ > > Borrowed form drh! > > in short: > You can now also obtain the latest tkhtml sources via anonymous CVS. To access the anonymous CVS server, first install CVS on your system. (See http://www.cyclic.com/ for additional information.) Then login as follows: > > cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.hwaci.com:/home/cvs/tkhtml login > > You will be prompted for a password. Use "anonymous". After you get logged in successfully, you can check out the source tree like this: > > cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.hwaci.com:/home/cvs/tkhtml checkout htmlwidget > > This command creates a directory named "htmlwidget" and fills it with > the latest version of the sources. > > then create a parallel directory like build-solaris cd into it and to > one: > ../htmlwidget/configure > make > there. > It should build (at least it dids for me)! > > I would like to add more docs, tclkit, critcl (the 2002 conference paper but > in html). Where I can get this. I found only the pdf's. > > Suggestions for other docs that must be included (iwidgets, tktable > ...) are welcome. > > regards, > detlef > -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From lvirden@cas.org Sun Nov 23 01:58:18 2003 Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAN7wIX17579 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 2003 01:58:18 -0600 Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) by mailhost.cas.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/CAS_MAIL_HUB-4.1) with ESMTP id hAN7w9Vg022716 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 2003 02:58:10 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost) by lwv26awu.cas.org (8.11.7+Sun/m4_8.11.6/CAS_CLIENT-1.18) id hAN7wBx05482; Sun, 23 Nov 2003 02:58:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 02:58:11 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031123025810.AAB5469@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] sdarchive solaris doted starkit note Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Just thought I would drop a note to let people know that today i downloaded the doted_solaris.kit from the sdarchive and tried to execute it. It wasn't clear if the code was intended to be an application or a tclkit sourcable file - however attempting to execute the file failed with an error that, alas, I can't copy and paste into this email. It says couldn't load file "/var/tmp/tclWnaGOm": ld.so.1: tclkit: fatal: relocation error: file /var/tmp/tclWnaGOm: symbol Tcl_DeleteCommand: referenced symbol not found while executing "load /ldata/doted_solaris.kit/lib/tcldot/SunOS/tcldot.so Tcldot" and then the remainder of the code trace. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Sun Nov 23 22:20:20 2003 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAO4KIX30566; Sun, 23 Nov 2003 22:20:19 -0600 Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id hAO4KHM06858; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:20:17 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2003112415201702882 ; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:20:17 +1100 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id hAO4KGe06851; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:20:16 +1100 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hAO4KFeS016959; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:20:15 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:20:13 +1100 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) Cc: Jean-Claude Wippler , starkit@equi4.com To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <7FFD563E-1E35-11D8-BDED-000A958518E8@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Detlef, On Friday, Nov 21, 2003, at 20:28 Australia/Sydney, Dr. Detlef Groth wrote: > with running instances > on Linux, DEC-OSF1 and Windows the same kit, the same time, different > OS's. cool! this works nicely on Mac OS X TkAqua as well (from Wish) when my BI distro is installed... I'll provide tkhtml libraries for both Mac OS X TkX11 and TkAqua when I get a chance, but the tkhtml pkgIndex will have to be extended to deal with [tk windowingsystem], [lindex $::tcl_platform(os) 0] is not good enough to distinguish between these two... Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From dgroth@gmx.de Mon Nov 24 04:03:44 2003 Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id hAOA3gX09417 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 04:03:42 -0600 Received: (qmail 30856 invoked by uid 65534); 24 Nov 2003 10:03:35 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp027) with SMTP; 24 Nov 2003 11:03:35 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 24 Nov 2003 11:05:31 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: Tom Krehbiel CC: starkit@equi4.com, jcw@equi4.com In-reply-to: <3FBE3353.1090709@motorola.com> (message from Tom Krehbiel on Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:46:27 -0700) Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building a doc file for tclkit References: <20031121072804.AAB2871@cas.org> <200311211437.08249.usus@aladyn.de> <3FBE3353.1090709@motorola.com> Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hello, To answer all questions coming over the weekend at ones: >X-GMX-Antispam: 0 (Mail was not recognized as spam) > >The documentation that comes with ActiveTcl is resonably complete. >Way don't you just down load a copy and then move the doc sub-dir >into your kit. It would save you a lot of edit time. I peronally >don't see the need for having the tcl documents in a kit since >it will be a pain to keep them sync'ed with my tcl intallation. >I just view the ActiveTcl documentation directly using my browser. >If I update my installation by downloading a new version of AtciveTcl >the link in my browser will automaticlly pickup the new documenation. > >BTW, the help browser looks really useful, so don't take the above >wrong. I am currently using Tkhtml in a help system but haven't had >time to get back to it. I'm glade to see that others are also working >on the idea. > >FYI, I have spent a lot of time working with the wikit code and it's >viewer is really under powered. I have considered replacing it with >Tkhtml but I had problems running it on Sun and HP. The problem was >with the code but with the build. If the problems get resolved then >I think we should look at upgrading the wikit code. > >Tom K. > * I think not everyone is using ActiveTcl as a their primary tcl-development platform (especially people at this list). * I personally don't feel comfortable with the chm-file on windows for instance (no index tab, treestructure does not follows my private wishes ...) * I can't simple the take tha ActiveTcl-Docs and put them in our kit (for Licensing issues) * I think we have much more tclkit-platforms than ActiveTcl distros > One thing that I'd like to see dgHelpBrowser do is remember the fact > that I want to resize the browser. Another useful thing would be the > ability for me to set the font and size for display - and the help browser > remember that for the next time I invoke it. That's coming next some kind of session management (font, lastpage(s) etc) What do you mean with `resize the browser'. On my systems (win32, osf1, linux) I can resize the window and the panedwindow. If this is not possible on your system (I observed this phaenomene quite permanently with my java-applications) try to use the -geometry flag. > Someone commented about just using the ActiveTcl help. The reason I started > talking about _my_ project is that I wanted a simple starkit that could > be placed in the same directory as a tclkit and downloaded at the same time, > so that a person who had only tclkit on their system had some docs. > If someone is savvy enough to get through the activestate web site, > register, download the right install script, have enough disk space to > install all of activetcl, and then figure out how to make use of it, then > they won't really need the starkit that I was discussing - unless, of course, > they want to provide a tclkit to someone themselves. > > On the other hand, Dr. Groth is working on a different project. He > wants an "all in one file" technical reference tool. It seems like it will > become, eventually, a superset of the ActiveTcl docs or that tcl/tk pdf > that occasionally is updated and announced. Excactly, but the pdf's are much more difficult to generate than the kit. > > I think that the dgHelpBrowser is a neat idea. And if it includes all > the stuff in tclkit, then I have hopes that will provide an easy way for > me to cut out the pages in which I am interested to provide a subset file > to live with tclkit. Thats will be easy I think about a small starkit, which unwraps, delete, adds, updates rewraps the kit. I think this can be done quite easily (see below)! > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > > Detlef, > > Your help browser kit is delightful. Although I use ActiveState's docs for > Tcl/Tk and extensions, I would like to use something like it with my own > applications. I tried dropping in my own html help files, and it seems to > work nicely. > > But how do you generate the contents.cnt file? Are you using MSDevStudio? > Or hand-editing the various indices and tables of contents? > > Thanks, > Bob > -- > Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu > Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 > 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 > Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ The procedure is quite simple I parse the main contents.htm file via tcl, add all links there, parse all those links add all links there, write the cnt-file. But you can also hand edit the cnt file to provide your own tree, index. If you want to deliver rewrap if you want to test just start the main.tcl, that's it! >Dr. Detlef, > >Just took a look at your help browser on windows. >It look really good. It would be nice if clicking >on the index tab would load an index page (e.g. >the "A" page). The actual page would have to >be configureable for use in other situations. > >Tom K. Hmm, I dont't think so. Doing more magic then neccesary would confuse some users. And if I click on Index I will loose my actual page. In order to achive what you want I modifies the stuff. To get to your "A" you have only now only Press Alt-i to raise the index, press backspace, A and Enter. I think that's quite fast. > >cool! this works nicely on Mac OS X TkAqua as well (from Wish) when my >BI distro is installed... > >I'll provide tkhtml libraries for both Mac OS X TkX11 and TkAqua when I >get a chance, but the tkhtml pkgIndex will have to be extended to deal >with [tk windowingsystem], [lindex $::tcl_platform(os) 0] is not good >enough to distinguish between these two... > >Cheers, > >Daniel > So I think we need tcl_platform(os), tcl_platform(machine) and [tk windowingsystem] for the pkgIndex file. Anything else ? >> Indeed Ihave the goal to have the most important documentation that you I >> for programming tcl in one file. Because I hate looking around into different >> files. >> >> I guess it's not missing that much ?! >> >> Tell me what's missing and I will ad it. > >Define 'missing'. > >For instance, look at the extensions included in ActiveTcl - are there >any not yet included in your docs? Here's what I have installed >locally , and I only use a small percentage of all the tcl and tk >extensions available... > > oratcl tclvfs tktreectrl-1.0 >blt sample tclx tls >bwidget snack2.2 tclxml trf >cde0.3 sybtcl tclxslt trfcrypt2.0p3 >efftcl tDOM-0.7.7 thread units >expat tcl8.4.3 tix vu >expect tcldom tk8.4.3 vuwidgets >htmlwidget tcldompro tkdnd widget >itcl tclexpat tkhtml xercessax >iwidgets tcllib tkimg xmlgen-1.4 >mclistbox tclreadline-2.1.0 tklib >memchan tclsoap tkpiechart-6.5 >metakit tcltidy tktable >-- >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. >Larry W. Virden >Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should >be construed as representing my employer's opinions. >-><- > You have three wished free ... BTW: just today. For the future it will be easy to add, remove, update existing documentation inside the starkit (see above). I updated the program the link is again: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit (still 2.9 Mb) Whats new? Just a splash screen during startup. Keybindings Alt-c, Alt-i. What's next: * Sessions (font's, history etc) * tabbed interface for the browser (opening several pages at ones). * Online tabs for wiki, groups.google.tcl, tclkitgroup .... Anyone to implement the _FormCmd inside snitbrowser.tcl ? * data aware listbox tree widget for faster loading of large * easy update mechanism of existing kit to include new docs * wikit help Any suggestions, rejections, comments, priority settings, help, welcome! regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jcw@equi4.com Mon Nov 24 08:56:50 2003 Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id hAOEuoX23825; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 08:56:50 -0600 Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id BB88D83EF2; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:56:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63EC083BB0; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:56:42 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <69FD1D4F-1E8E-11D8-B51E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list , Metakit mailing list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 15:56:41 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] server changes Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Just a brief note to let you know that the equi4.com domain is being migrated to another server. This mailing list may act funny or even lose messages for a day or two. I'll post another message when things should be back to normal. If you can't reach me, try jcw@madder.xs4all Better still, append ".nl" to the above ;) -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Tue Nov 25 22:32:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C167DB3A86; Tue, 25 Nov 2003 22:32:01 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id F184583EF2; Tue, 25 Nov 2003 22:31:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ECD183BB0; Tue, 25 Nov 2003 22:31:58 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list , Metakit mailing list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 22:31:58 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] Re: server changes X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 21:32:02 -0000 The equi4.com domain migration to another server is done. Everything looks ok from this end. Please let me know if you see anything fishy: ping times, bad response times, website, email, mailing lists, wiki, anonymous cvs ... anything. -jcw From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Nov 26 11:20:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from digitalsmarties.com (gw.digitalsmarties.com [202.72.154.181]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id D81A6B3A86 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2003 11:20:31 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 22033 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2003 10:08:43 -0000 Received: from pc-00001.digitalsmarties.com (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (192.168.1.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (192.168.1.1) with ESMTP; 26 Nov 2003 10:08:43 -0000 In-Reply-To: <20031123025810.AAB5469@cas.org> References: <20031123025810.AAB5469@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <2A484328-1FFA-11D8-9CDE-00039305E9C6@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdarchive solaris doted starkit note Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 18:20:31 +0800 To: "Larry W. Virden" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.2 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 10:20:34 -0000 On 23/11/2003, at 3:58 PM, Larry W. Virden wrote: > Just thought I would drop a note to let people know that today i > downloaded > the doted_solaris.kit from the sdarchive and tried to execute it. > It wasn't clear if the code was intended to be an application or a > tclkit sourcable file - however attempting to execute the file > failed with an error that, alas, I can't copy and paste into this > email. > > It says > couldn't load file > "/var/tmp/tclWnaGOm": ld.so.1: > tclkit: fatal: relocation > error: file > /var/tmp/tclWnaGOm: symbol > Tcl_DeleteCommand: referenced > symbol not found > while executing > "load > /ldata/doted_solaris.kit/lib/tcldot/SunOS/tcldot.so Tcldot" > > and then the remainder of the code trace. That version of doted was something I threw together a year or two ago whilst working on another project. It was built on Solaris 2.6 and certainly did work on that platform (and 2.7) using the Tclkit release that was current at the time. Since I have neither the time nor inclination to look at it, I'll just remove it from the archive. If you build a version that works feel free to pass it on and I'll re-add it to the archive. Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From dgroth@gmx.de Thu Nov 27 11:51:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4827CB3A86 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2003 11:51:55 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 1453 invoked by uid 65534); 27 Nov 2003 10:51:54 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp012) with SMTP; 27 Nov 2003 11:51:54 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 27 Nov 2003 11:53:52 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.2 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 10:51:55 -0000 Hello, I was updating the helpbrowser New features: 27.11.2003 * added weblinks to wiki and the tclkit mailing list * fixed a history bug for links with anchors * showing more images * modified the package structure of tkhtml to plugin Mac-aqua and Mac-classic shared libs (where they are?) * added wikit helpfile * browser is now tabbed you can load more than one helppage at ones (right-click on tabs) * tab renaming for the browser tabs * sessions remembering the fonts, and loaded pages using ini file in your home * changed docs tcl8.4.4 to tcl8.4.5 * updated snit 0.9 to 0.91 * added some tclkit documentation Platforms: Linux, Win32, OSF1, SunOS Tested Platforms: Win2000, Win98, Linux, OSF1 please provide more shared libs (tkhtml) for other platforms. Alternativly I can plugin in a tcl-only htmlwidget. Any recommendations ? Available: http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit I think the next release will be more official and will go to my homepage and on the sdarchive. http://www.dgroth.de Suggestions ? regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jeffh@ActiveState.com Thu Nov 27 20:39:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38B73B3A86 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2003 20:39:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) hARJVvYj005813; Thu, 27 Nov 2003 11:31:57 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.3.173]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hARJVqsA019906; Thu, 27 Nov 2003 11:31:52 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Dr. Detlef Groth'" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.2 Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 11:31:53 -0800 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <02a301c3b51d$1f1d7890$ad03a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 19:39:10 -0000 > please provide more shared libs (tkhtml) for other > platforms. Alternativly I can plugin in a tcl-only > htmlwidget. Any recommendations ? FWIW, the htmlwidget CVS is moving over to SF in the tktable project (where a few other things live). This should speed up some development on it, including giving it a fully updated TEA build system, which should improve the ability to generate a bunch of platform libs easily. Jeff From jcw@equi4.com Fri Nov 28 00:55:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D17A3B3A86; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 00:55:09 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 26CDB83EF2; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 00:55:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD90F83BB0; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 00:55:06 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <2079D5F6-2135-11D8-B51E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list , Metakit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 00:55:06 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.44 X-Spam-Level: Subject: [Starkit] started organizing some docs X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 23:55:10 -0000 FYI, I've started organizing some docs on the equi4.com website. Most prominent addition is a web conversion of Steve Landers' paper of Tclkit and Starkits. This is a new area for on-site documentation: http://www.equi4.com/papers/ Right now it's mostly scripting/Tcl, but I hope to improve this over time. Pointers to other documentation will, as before, be added to the relevant pages which already exist. Have been sprinkling a few links here and there in the past weeks. Please let me know of any missing links as well as links not present where you'd expect them. -jcw From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 28 12:04:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B0A4B3A89 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:04:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4F397B3A88 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:04:25 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 11841 invoked by uid 65534); 28 Nov 2003 11:04:24 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp013) with SMTP; 28 Nov 2003 12:04:24 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 28 Nov 2003 12:06:23 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Dr. Detlef Groth" In-reply-to: (dgroth@gmx.de) Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.2 References: X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS snapshot-20020531 cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 11:04:31 -0000 Hello, For sure, that's the last Update for several days! I have a long weekend with my family :) added: * search function (inside a webpage, based on my famous snitfinddialog) * bookmarks panel (to keep your favourite pages, also remembered in your next session) Platforms, still only: Win32, Linux, OSF1, SunOS (Larry does it work ?) regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From lvirden@cas.org Fri Nov 28 12:56:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1F4CB3A92 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:56:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXxDwf2t for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:56:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB6A6B3A8B for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:56:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hASBtwVg007241 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 06:55:59 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hASBtwR04871; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 06:55:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 06:55:58 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031128065558.AAB4694@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.2 In-Reply-To: of 28 Nov 2003 12:06:23 +0100 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 11:56:03 -0000 I am particularly interested if anyone on SUN SPARC can confirm that things work for them. It works fine for me. Several items of note. 1. I now am getting some output to stdout that I didn't get before: actual size: 12 FontCmd: 3 actual size: 12 FontCmd: 4 bold actual size: 12 FontCmd: 3 bold actual size: 12 FontCmd: 3 fixed actual size: 12 FontCmd: 4 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 4 bold and so on and later FontCmd: 3 italic actual size: 16 FontCmd: 4 anyone interested in implementing the _FormCmd 0 form {} http://news.gmane.org/group/gmane.comp.lang.tcl.starkit/last=0/force_load=t/ get {action /group/gmane.comp.lang.tcl.starkit/last=0/force_load=t/ method get name cpage} anyone interested in implementing the _FormCmd 0 form {} http://news.gmane.org/group/gmane.comp.lang.tcl.starkit/last=0/force_load=t/ get {action /group/gmane.comp.lang.tcl.starkit/last=0/force_load=t/ method get name cpage} actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 anyone interested in implementing the _FormCmd 0 select {color #000000000000 bgcolor white font {charter 13 roman normal}} .pan.f.browser.nb.fpage1.browser.f.html.x.x1 {name page onchange cpage.submit()} {{1 0 {1 }} {0 1 {2 }} {0 2 {3 }} {0 3 {4 }} {0 4 {5 }} {0 5 {6 }} {0 6 {7 }} {0 7 {8 }} {0 8 {9 }} {0 9 {10 }} {0 10 {11 }} {0 11 {12 }} {0 12 {13 }} {0 13 {14 }} {0 14 {15 }} {0 15 {16 }} {0 16 {17 }} {0 17 {18 }} {0 18 {19 }} {0 19 {20 }} {0 20 {21 }} {0 21 {22 }} {0 22 {23 }} {0 23 {24 }} {0 24 {25 }} {0 25 {26 }} {0 26 {27 }} {0 27 {28 }} {0 28 {29 }} {0 29 {30 }} {0 30 {31 }} {0 31 {32 }} {0 32 {33 }}} anyone interested in implementing the _FormCmd 0 input {color #000000000000 bgcolor white font {charter 13 roman normal}} .pan.f.browser.nb.fpage1.browser.f.html.x.x2 {type submit value Page} actual size: 16 FontCmd: 4 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 fixed actual size: 16 FontCmd: 4 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 5 bold actual size: 16 FontCmd: 4 bold actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 bold actual size: 16 FontCmd: 3 fixed actual size: 16 FontCmd: 2 actual size: 16 FontCmd: 4 2. The new dgHelpBrowser is huge - but it appears to include a snapshot of the wiki and comp.lang.tcl! Or does it include code to dynamically access them? I can't tell. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Nov 28 13:01:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C22BBB3A92 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:01:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXN1qLhi for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:01:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF1EEB3A8B for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:01:45 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 3D25D83EF2; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:01:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6E4A83BB0 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:01:43 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <20031128065558.AAB4694@cas.org> References: <20031128065558.AAB4694@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.2 Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:01:43 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:01:47 -0000 Larry W. Virden wrote: > 2. The new dgHelpBrowser is huge - but it appears to include a > snapshot of > the wiki and comp.lang.tcl! Or does it include code to dynamically > access > them? I can't tell. Of course you can. Unpack and look :) -jcw From dgroth@gmx.de Fri Nov 28 13:46:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BA85B3A8A for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:46:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXaa7N9h for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:45:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.gmx.net (mail.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id BF4C7B3A89 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2003 13:45:59 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 3057 invoked by uid 65534); 28 Nov 2003 12:45:59 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp009) with SMTP; 28 Nov 2003 13:45:59 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 28 Nov 2003 13:47:58 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: "Larry W. Virden" In-reply-to: <20031128065558.AAB4694@cas.org> (lvirden@cas.org) Subject: Re: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.2 References: <20031128065558.AAB4694@cas.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 12:46:02 -0000 The new version (0.3 with the Bookmarks panel) should be less verbose ... The wiki and the tclkit newsgroup is not build in but fetched from the web, note the blue planet symbol it's stands for internet not local access. There are only some wiki pages included. regards, Detlef >I am particularly interested if anyone on SUN SPARC can confirm that things work for them. > >It works fine for me. Several items of note. > >1. I now am getting some output to stdout that I didn't get before: > >actual size: 12 >FontCmd: 3 >actual size: 12 >FontCmd: 4 bold >actual size: 12 >FontCmd: 3 bold >actual size: 12 > > > >2. The new dgHelpBrowser is huge - but it appears to include a snapshot of >the wiki and comp.lang.tcl! Or does it include code to dynamically access >them? I can't tell. >-- >Tcl - The glue of a new generation. >Larry W. Virden >Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should >be construed as representing my employer's opinions. >-><- >_____________________________________________ >Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com >http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235 Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 1 19:34:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B14F7B3A8A for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 19:34:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXBJyJcQ for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 19:34:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6672EB3A88 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 19:34:20 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 3B7D983EF2; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 19:34:18 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5FB383BB0 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 19:34:17 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <2079D5F6-2135-11D8-B51E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> References: <2079D5F6-2135-11D8-B51E-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Critcl (was: [Starkit] started organizing some docs) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 19:34:18 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 18:34:25 -0000 To follow up: > http://www.equi4.com/papers/ The Critcl paper has also been converted to online pages: http://www.equi4.com/papers/ctpaper1.html -jcw From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 22:06:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DF9AB3A8A for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 22:06:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXdR3SCQ for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 22:06:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41902.mail.yahoo.com (web41902.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.153]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C14ADB3A88 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 22:06:32 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20031201210631.13602.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41902.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 01 Dec 2003 13:06:31 PST Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 13:06:31 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit and latest kernels/glibc X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 21:06:37 -0000 One of my users is getting the following message when running a tclkit wrapped application on latest kernel/glibc combinations. In particular he is running latest Gentoo Linux and a custom version of Red Hat 9 and tclkit is latest x86 Linux compressed with upx Incorrectly built binary which accesses errno, h.errno or _res directly. Needs to be fixed. cannot handle file 'libc.so.6' with TLS data (and then it SEGFAULTS) Googling a bit I found http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/long_list.cgi?buglist=89286 But it seems to me Tcl handles errno correctly? Has anybody run into this? What can I do to fix this? I am going to try and reproduce it, wanted to know if anybody had run into this as well __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ From jcw@equi4.com Mon Dec 1 23:09:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB89CB3A8A for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:09:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXpveixh for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:09:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC354B3A88 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:09:40 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 5D2C483EF2; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:09:38 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id D972983BB0 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:09:37 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <20031201210631.13602.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20031201210631.13602.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <0D73208F-244B-11D8-BAF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit and latest kernels/glibc Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:09:37 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 22:09:43 -0000 Guaca Mole wrote: > One of my users is getting the following message when > running a tclkit wrapped application on latest > kernel/glibc combinations. > In particular he is running latest Gentoo Linux and a > custom version of Red Hat 9 and tclkit is latest x86 > Linux compressed with upx I don't see problems in Gentoo. Haven't tried RH9. > Incorrectly built binary which accesses errno, h.errno > or _res directly. > Needs to be fixed. > cannot handle file 'libc.so.6' with TLS data > > (and then it SEGFAULTS) > > Googling a bit I found > http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/long_list.cgi?buglist=89286 > > But it seems to me Tcl handles errno correctly? > Has anybody run into this? What can I do to fix this? > I am going to try and reproduce it, wanted to know if > anybody had run into this as well Tclkit is built in two variants for Linux: fully static and linked to shared libs. The former should not have the above problem (but it has others: inability to use input methods, i.e. special character input, in X11). The latter is built on Mandrake 7.2 ... yes 7.2: it was the only distro I could find which had dependencies that worked across a wide range of distro's (I tried just about every revision of RedHat, SuSE, and Mandrake - about a year ago). It's a bit strange to see one O/S work properly for over half a decade with the same binaries on 95% of all desktops - yet Linux just can't seem to get its compatibility right for applications distributed in compiled form. The above bugreport says "just recompile with blah", which assumes builds are done on RH9: a bit myopic if you ask me... -jcw From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 23:51:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C87E2B3A8B for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:51:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXo2Elog for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:51:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41902.mail.yahoo.com (web41902.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.153]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4D155B3A88 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 2003 23:51:34 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20031201225132.71529.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41902.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 01 Dec 2003 14:51:32 PST Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 14:51:32 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit and latest kernels/glibc To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list In-Reply-To: <0D73208F-244B-11D8-BAF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 22:51:37 -0000 > > One of my users is getting the following message > when > > running a tclkit wrapped application on latest > > kernel/glibc combinations. > > In particular he is running latest Gentoo Linux > and a > > custom version of Red Hat 9 and tclkit is latest > x86 > > Linux compressed with upx > > I don't see problems in Gentoo. Haven't tried RH9. I have tried RH9 and it works just fine. I think he has probably upgraded kernel and/or new glibc library with new threading > > Incorrectly built binary which accesses errno, > h.errno > > or _res directly. > > Needs to be fixed. > > cannot handle file 'libc.so.6' with TLS data > > > > (and then it SEGFAULTS) > > > > Googling a bit I found > > > http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/long_list.cgi?buglist=89286 > > > > But it seems to me Tcl handles errno correctly? > > Tclkit is built in two variants for Linux: fully > static and linked to > shared libs. The former should not have the above > problem (but it has > others: inability to use input methods, i.e. special > character input, > in X11). The latter is built on Mandrake 7.2 ... > yes 7.2: it was the > only distro I could find which had dependencies that > worked across a > wide range of distro's (I tried just about every > revision of RedHat, > SuSE, and Mandrake - about a year ago). Size is quite important for me, it would be great if this could be solved by recompilation (even if I have to do it in Mandrake 7.2) > It's a bit strange to see one O/S work properly for > over half a decade > with the same binaries on 95% of all desktops - yet > Linux just can't > seem to get its compatibility right for applications > distributed in > compiled form. The above bugreport says "just > recompile with blah", > which assumes builds are done on RH9: a bit myopic > if you ask me... Yes, this is going to be a big problem. I have been Googling this quite a bit and it seems the problem is going to be widespread as the new glibc are rolled out. This is a thread in Debian: http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-glibc@lists.debian.org/msg07778.html On a semi-related note, have you had a look at apbuild? If I understand correctly it allows you to build with a recent version of glibc yet solve the symbol dependency to be backward compatible http://autopackage.org/downloads.html __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ From dgroth@gmx.de Tue Dec 2 10:47:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE1C4B3A8B for ; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 10:47:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXtvCDgD for ; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 10:47:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.de [213.165.64.20]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3C169B3A88 for ; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 10:47:05 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 15311 invoked by uid 65534); 2 Dec 2003 09:47:04 -0000 Received: from mg01-44.molgen.mpg.de (EHLO MG01-44) (141.14.20.59) by mail.gmx.net (mp010) with SMTP; 02 Dec 2003 10:47:04 +0100 X-Authenticated: #220704 Date: 02 Dec 2003 10:49:07 +0100 Message-Id: From: "Dr. Detlef Groth" To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] ANN: dgHelpBrowser 0.3.2 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2003 09:47:07 -0000 What: ===== An advanced HelpViewer for tcldocumentation, with contents-tree, index-lists and bookmarks panel Where: ===== http://goblet.molgen.mpg.de/dgHelpBrowser.kit What's new: ========== 2.12.2003 Version 0.3.2 * automatic processing of the noframe area or first frame * Bugfix for can not exit if closed without bookmarks * (internal) use of snitini as a wrapper for inifile * (internal) code refactoring dgwidgets 28.11.2003 Version 0.3 * added finddialog for searching inside webpages * added Bookmarks panel to store some favourites 27.11.2003 Version 0.2 * added weblinks to wiki and the tclkit mailing list * fixed a history bug for links with anchors * modified the package structure of tkhtml to plugin Mac-aqua and Mac-classic shared libs (where they are?) * added wikit helpfile * browser is now tabbed you can load more than one helppage at ones (right-click on tabs) * tab renaming for the browser tabs * sessions remembering the fonts, and loaded pages using ini file in your home * changed docs tcl8.4.4 to tcl8.4.5 * updated snit 0.9 to 0.91 * added some tclkit documentation regards, Detlef -- Dr. Detlef Groth Max-Planck-Institut fuer Molekulare Genetik Ihnestr. 63/73 D-14195 Berlin Tel.: + 49 30 - 8413 1235g Email: dgroth@molgen.mpg.de Email: dgroth@gmx.de From jcw@equi4.com Tue Dec 2 11:34:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 400A6B3A8B; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 11:34:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXkWYvjh; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 11:34:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB13FB3A88; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 11:34:31 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 0E8D883EF2; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 11:34:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D15983BB0; Tue, 2 Dec 2003 11:34:28 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1B016071-24B3-11D8-BAF8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list , Metakit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2003 11:34:27 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Views explained X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2003 10:34:34 -0000 In an attempt to better explain how MK deals with views and subviews, and how that works in MK's column-oriented design, I've set up two pages with lots of images. Start here: http://www.equi4.com/mkdocs.html These new pages are linked to from the MK documentation page, last section. -jcw From GargashS@Otologics.com Thu Dec 11 22:56:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 414C4B3A8C for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:56:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXuiQgje for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:56:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from xchange1.otologics.com (mail.otologics.com [4.18.96.14]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50825B3A87 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:56:04 +0100 (CET) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 14:56:03 -0700 Message-ID: <8EE63C03BF666D47936E7BCC5D1A0BD7034293@xchange1.otologics.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: making a custom shell from a starpack Thread-Index: AcPAMZHoGV29ScgATAeMYfnLD3AakQ== From: "Scott Gargash" To: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] making a custom shell from a starpack X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 21:56:08 -0000 I want to build a starpack that automatically loads in some packages (by = sourcing a different tclkit) for the user and if they haven't specified = a file on the command line, it will drop them into an interactive shell. = But it seems like the only file that I can get sourced from a starpack = is the main.tcl file, and if that's sourced, the shell is no longer in = interactive mode and you can't get to a shell prompt. Essentially, I = want to add the equivalent of a .tclshrc file to the starpack. It seems like this should be straightforward, but I can't figure out how = to do it. Is this possible? Scott -------------------------------------------- Scott Gargash Software Engineer=20 Otologics, LLC 303.996.8238 From Steve.Cassidy@mq.edu.au Thu Dec 11 23:06:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFC31B3A92 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 23:06:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXH7lS52 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 23:06:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail004.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail004.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.145]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50EF5B3A87 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 23:06:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from mq.edu.au (c211-30-111-91.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au [211.30.111.91])hBBM5oq03584; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:05:51 +1100 Message-ID: <3FD81838.8000709@mq.edu.au> Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 18:09:44 +1100 From: Steve Cassidy User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Scott Gargash Subject: Re: [Starkit] making a custom shell from a starpack References: <8EE63C03BF666D47936E7BCC5D1A0BD7034293@xchange1.otologics.com> In-Reply-To: <8EE63C03BF666D47936E7BCC5D1A0BD7034293@xchange1.otologics.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:06:06 -0000 Scott Gargash wrote: >I want to build a starpack that automatically loads in some packages (by sourcing a different tclkit) for the user and if they haven't specified a file on the command line, it will drop them into an interactive shell. But it seems like the only file that I can get sourced from a starpack is the main.tcl file, and if that's sourced, the shell is no longer in interactive mode and you can't get to a shell prompt. Essentially, I want to add the equivalent of a .tclshrc file to the starpack. > >It seems like this should be straightforward, but I can't figure out how to do it. Is this possible? > > Of course it is! Here's the main.tcl I use for giggle and a few other starkits/packs that I build. I'm not sure whether my r-e-p loop is exactly the same as the tclsh one but it does the job for me. #!/bin/sh # The next line is executed by /bin/sh, but not tcl \ exec /usr/bin/tclsh $0 ${1+"$@"} ## provide a tclsh-ish main for a starpack which contains libraries proc read_eval_print {} { global errorInfo while {1} { puts -nonewline "% " flush stdout if {[gets stdin line] >= 0} { if {[catch {uplevel \#0 $line} result]} { puts $result } else { puts $result } } else { exit } } } # add the current dir to the auto_path lappend auto_path [file join $argv0 lib] if {[llength $argv] == 0} { # show a prompt if {[info commands console] != ""} { console show } else { read_eval_print } } else { set sourcefile [lindex $argv 0] set argv [lrange $argv 1 end] # source the file into this interpreter source $sourcefile } From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Dec 12 08:34:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8958BB3A9F for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:34:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXCddCGe for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:34:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3209B3A87 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:34:51 +0100 (CET) Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA18993 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:34:51 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA18609 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:34:44 +0100 (MET) Sender: Arjen.Markus@wldelft.nl Message-ID: <3FD96F94.EA057B43@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:34:44 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] making a custom shell from a starpack References: <8EE63C03BF666D47936E7BCC5D1A0BD7034293@xchange1.otologics.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:34:53 -0000 Scott Gargash wrote: > > I want to build a starpack that automatically loads in some packages (by sourcing a different tclkit) for the user and if they haven't specified a file on the command line, it will drop them into an interactive shell. But it seems like the only file that I can get sourced from a starpack is the main.tcl file, and if that's sourced, the shell is no longer in interactive mode and you can't get to a shell prompt. Essentially, I want to add the equivalent of a .tclshrc file to the starpack. > > It seems like this should be straightforward, but I can't figure out how to do it. Is this possible? > The best/most convenient way that I know of is: open a console window via: console show This works with MS Windows. You will need a separate script for UNIX/Linux, but that is available on the Wiki (somewhere). Or try my plain_geometry or tcl_math starkits. They use that same technique (see the archive). Regards, Arjen From jcw@equi4.com Fri Dec 12 16:08:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E364B3AA0 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:08:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXfoY72z for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:08:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F1C2B3A87 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:08:47 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 7E8DE83C26; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:08:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9047383914 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:08:44 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <13813EE3-2CB5-11D8-94D3-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:08:43 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.5 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 15:08:50 -0000 The Tclkit download area now includes 8.4.5 binaries of Tclkit: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.5/ So far, I've built releases for: Windows: command-line and GUI, UPX-compressed and gzipped Linux: static and dynamic links, UPX-compressed and gzipped Mac OS X: gzipped, this is an X11 build, not Aqua The build process has not changed. Latest sources are in /pub/tars/. As always, if you use another platform you are welcome to contribute builds - preferably created through the genkit build script - see http://www.equi4.com/271 for details. Contributions are added to the tclkit download area mentioned above, a long-term repository and resource for sharing tclkit binaries. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Fri Dec 12 17:49:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C27DB3AA0 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 17:49:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXNOiqna for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 17:49:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86B1EB3A87 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 17:49:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBCGn30G028623 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:49:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBCGn5j16410; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:49:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:49:05 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031212114905.AAB12816@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Help sought getting latest genkit/mk to build on sparc solaris 8 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:49:12 -0000 When I attempt to build the new tclkit to build, I am running into a new problem. To run genkit, I use: export CC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/gccc export CCC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/g++ export CFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib" export CXXFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstdc++ " tclsh ./genkit A tclsh ./genkit B tcl ksh ./genkit B ksh ./genkit C ksh ./genkit D DISPLAY=lwv26awu:0 ksh ./genkit D ksh ./genkit E Here's mk's config.log output: configure:1712: g++ -v &5 Reading specs from /vol/gnu/gcc/bin/../lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/3.3.1/sp ecs Configured with: ../gcc-3.3.1/configure --prefix=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1 --enable-sha red --enable-threads --enable-cpp --enable-languages=c++ --with-gnu-as --with-as =/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/as --with-gnu-ld --with-ld=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld --h ost=sparc-sun-solaris2.8 Thread model: posix gcc version 3.3.1 configure:1715: $? = 0 configure:1717: g++ -V &5 g++: `-V' option must have argument configure:1720: $? = 1 configure:1744: checking for C++ compiler default output configure:1747: g++ -L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstd c++ conftest.cc >&5 /vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld: cannot find -lgcc_s collect2: ld returned 1 exit status and here's what I see: lwv26awu (5453) $ ls /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s* /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so.1 Any ideas on what is going wrong here? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From STEVE.COOK@NEXTIRAONE.COM Fri Dec 12 19:08:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9451B3AA0 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 19:08:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXJtvQuc for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 19:08:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from wcsntrcsoe01.wilcom.com (wcsntrcsoe01.wilcom.com [169.206.50.124]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3B2FB3A87 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 19:07:59 +0100 (CET) Received: by wcsntrcsoe01.nextiraone.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:07:56 -0600 Message-ID: <2582DD061F06D748976E651F8B1248A1095E5A@wcghoue105.wcg.williams.com> From: "Cook, Steve" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:07:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] icon problem with tclkit-win32.upx.exe 8.4.5 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 18:08:06 -0000 I just downloaded tclkit-win32.upx.exe 8.4.5 and rebuilt one of my starpacks. The starpack uses a custom tclkit.ico file. When wrapped with tclkit 8.4.4 as the prefix the 256 color icon displays correctly. When wrapped with the tclkit 8.4.5 as the prefix the icon appears to be in 16 colors. I have tried various combinations of wrapping with tclkitsh 8.4.4 and 8.4.5 using tclkit 8.4.4 and 8.4.5 prefixes. It appears that the problem is in the tclkit 8.4.5 prefixed to the starkit. From jcw@equi4.com Fri Dec 12 21:01:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51B0FB3A8A for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXv2pgf4 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98C77B3A87 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:06 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 8CF2083C26; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A3B283914 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:03 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <13813EE3-2CB5-11D8-94D3-000A9588127E@equi4.com> References: <13813EE3-2CB5-11D8-94D3-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Tclkit 8.4.5 Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:01 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 20:01:09 -0000 > The Tclkit download area now includes 8.4.5 binaries of Tclkit: > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/8.4.5/ > > So far, I've built releases for: > Windows: command-line and GUI, UPX-compressed and gzipped > Linux: static and dynamic links, UPX-compressed and gzipped > Mac OS X: gzipped, this is an X11 build, not Aqua Nothing beats a new release for bringing out trouble spots! Small tweak to the win32 gui builds: the icon was the original one, so customizing it in sdx wrap would have only inserted 2 of the 6 icon resolutions. The Mac OS X build does not work on 10.2 (yuck, a new dependency, I built on 10.3). (Thanks Keith Waclena, for the FreeBSD 4.6.2 build for x86) -jcw From yppbf2001@yahoo.com Thu Dec 11 20:47:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C066B3A8C for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:47:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX08MfMi for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:47:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from web14919.mail.yahoo.com (web14919.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.225.224]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 432FEB3A87 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:47:11 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20031211194709.20773.qmail@web14919.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [82.48.25.203] by web14919.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:47:09 PST Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:47:09 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Young To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:16:51 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] starkit::startup always return "sourced" X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:47:13 -0000 Hi all, here is a problem related to starkit::startup Apparently, it is always returning "sourced". I can't see the mistake... ...any suggestion? Thanks, Paul #-FILE test_startup.tcl -------------------------------------------- #!/bin/sh # This line continues for Tcl, but is a single line for 'sh' \ exec tclkit "$0" ${1+"$@"} global argv0 package require starkit set mode [starkit::startup] set msg [format " Mode: $mode Executable: [info nameofexecutable] Argv0: [file normalize $argv0] Script: [file normalize [info script]] Topdir: $starkit::topdir "] if {[catch {package require Tk} ver]} { puts $msg } else { tk_messageBox -icon info -message $msg } #-Test-------------------------------------------------------------- $ ./sdx.kit qwrap test_startup.tcl $ ./test_startup.kit Mode: sourced Executable: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/tclkit Argv0: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup.kit Script: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup.kit/lib/app-test_startup/test_startup.tcl Topdir: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup.kit $ ./sdx.kit unwrap test_startup.kit $ ./sdx.kit wrap test_startup -runtime tclkit-linux-x86static.upx.bin $ ./test_startup Mode: sourced Executable: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup Argv0: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup/main.tcl Script: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup/lib/app-test_startup/test_startup.tcl Topdir: /home/bruno/prj/starkit/test_startup __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? 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Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree From rothshahar@yahoo.com Thu Dec 11 16:09:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B89E4B3A8C for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 16:09:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXZr93Ce for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 16:09:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from web40102.mail.yahoo.com (web40102.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.36]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1E913B3A87 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 16:09:34 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20031211150932.7227.qmail@web40102.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.90.236.138] by web40102.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 07:09:32 PST Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 07:09:32 -0800 (PST) From: Shahar Roth To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1418923649-1071155372=:6994" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:17:29 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Fileevent problem in starkit? X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 15:09:37 -0000 --0-1418923649-1071155372=:6994 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, I'm using starkit as a shell for running tcl scripts on Windows. Before I wrap the script I want to test it unwrapped. When I'm trying to use fileevents it seems that the fileevent handler is never invoked. It does work when I'm using Tclsh83,Wish83,Wish84 and tclkit-win32-sh.exe/tclkit-win32-sh.upx.exe but it doesn't work when I use tclkit-win32.exe/tclkit-win32.upx.exe. Did anyone saw this behaviour before? Did I do something wrong or is there a problem in Startkit? Test script: proc handleFileevent {fileHandle} { if {([gets $fileHandle line] == -1) || [eof $fileHandle] } { fileevent $fileHandle readable {} after 1000 "fileevent $fileHandle readable {handleFileevent $fileHandle}" return } puts $line } set filename "c:/inputFile" set fileHandle [open $filename r] fconfigure $fileHandle -blocking 0 -buffering line fileevent $fileHandle readable "handleFileevent $fileHandle" vwait forever Thanks, Shahar --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing --0-1418923649-1071155372=:6994 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
    Hi,
    I'm using starkit as a shell for running tcl scripts on Windows. Before I wrap the script I want to test it unwrapped.
    When I'm trying to use fileevents it seems that the fileevent handler is never invoked.
    It does work when I'm using Tclsh83,Wish83,Wish84 and tclkit-win32-sh.exe/tclkit-win32-sh.upx.exe but it doesn't work when I use tclkit-win32.exe/tclkit-win32.upx.exe.
     
    Did anyone saw this behaviour before? Did I do something wrong or is there a problem in Startkit?
     
    Test script:
     
    proc handleFileevent {fileHandle} {
        if {([gets $fileHandle line] == -1) || [eof $fileHandle] } {
     fileevent $fileHandle readable {}
     after 1000 "fileevent $fileHandle readable {handleFileevent $fileHandle}"       
     return
        }
        puts $line
    }
    set filename "c:/inputFile"
    set fileHandle [open $filename r]
    fconfigure $fileHandle -blocking 0 -buffering line
    fileevent $fileHandle readable "handleFileevent $fileHandle"
    vwait forever
     
    Thanks, Shahar

    Do you Yahoo!?
    New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing --0-1418923649-1071155372=:6994-- From jcw@equi4.com Sun Dec 14 12:21:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14BC4B3A8E for ; Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:21:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX0ECKfr for ; Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:20:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED390B3A8B for ; Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:20:57 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 9F4BB83C26; Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:20:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B36AE83914; Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:20:49 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <20031211194709.20773.qmail@web14919.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20031211194709.20773.qmail@web14919.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <94F8C6C0-2E27-11D8-94D3-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit::startup always return "sourced" Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2003 12:20:54 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Paul Young X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2003 11:21:00 -0000 Paul Young wrote: > Hi all, > here is a problem related to starkit::startup > > Apparently, it is always returning "sourced". This issue has been resolved on c.l.t, see http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF -8&threadm=3HpCb.85940%24AX1.3553130%40news1.tin.it&prev=/ groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF -8%26q%3Dcomp.lang.tcl%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 17 08:43:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36B36B3AFA for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 08:43:13 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX0D37gE for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 01:43:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 382B1B3AFC for ; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 13:30:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBGCUtch009720 for ; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 07:30:56 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBGCUtq06226; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 07:30:55 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 07:30:55 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031216073055.AAB6197@cas.org> In-Reply-To: of Fri, 12 Dec 2003 21:01:01 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 00:43:13 -0000 Has anyone managed to get the new tclkit to build on SPARC Solaris 8? I'm still stymied by the error I mentioned last week: export CC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/gccc export CCC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/g++ export CFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib" export CXXFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstdc++ " tclsh ./genkit A tclsh ./genkit B tcl ksh ./genkit B ksh ./genkit C ksh ./genkit D Here's mk's config.log output: configure:1712: g++ -v &5 Reading specs from /vol/gnu/gcc/bin/../lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/3.3.1/sp ecs Configured with: ../gcc-3.3.1/configure --prefix=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1 --enable-sha red --enable-threads --enable-cpp --enable-languages=c++ --with-gnu-as --with-as =/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/as --with-gnu-ld --with-ld=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld --h ost=sparc-sun-solaris2.8 Thread model: posix gcc version 3.3.1 configure:1715: $? = 0 configure:1717: g++ -V &5 g++: `-V' option must have argument configure:1720: $? = 1 configure:1744: checking for C++ compiler default output configure:1747: g++ -L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstd c++ conftest.cc >&5 /vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld: cannot find -lgcc_s collect2: ld returned 1 exit status and here's what I see: lwv26awu (5453) $ ls /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s* /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so.1 -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 17 09:34:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6610B3A92 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:34:26 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXB0d8xw for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 02:34:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A5D1B3A8C for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:34:24 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id DF97983C27; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 02:34:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B157083914 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 02:34:22 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: <20031216073055.AAB6197@cas.org> References: <20031216073055.AAB6197@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <228C5DC6-3031-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 02:34:19 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 01:34:27 -0000 Larry W. Virden wrote: > Has anyone managed to get the new tclkit to build on SPARC Solaris 8? > I'm still stymied by the error I mentioned last week: [...] No idea. New Solaris builds by Steve Landers (thx!) have just been uploaded. That's for Sol 7, should also work on 8. -jcw From cniemira@siege.org Wed Dec 17 08:41:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96BBFB3A92 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 08:41:25 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXluCTAg for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 01:41:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.70]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7107B3B22 for ; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 21:59:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from tetsuo.siege.org (ool-4355d231.dyn.optonline.net [67.85.210.49]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) starkit@equi4.com; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:59:56 -0500 (EST) Received: by tetsuo.siege.org (Postfix, from userid 91) id 3E86C1B676; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:56:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ny-bas00.csfb.com (ny-bas00.csfb.com [198.240.130.75]) by my.siege.org (IMP) with HTTP for ; Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:56:41 -0500 Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:56:41 -0500 From: "C. Niemira" X-Originating-IP: 198.240.130.75 To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: <1071608201.3fdf71892fe0d@my.siege.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.2 X-WebMail-Company: Siege of North, Inc. X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 02:40:06 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Custom tclkit + BLT X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 00:41:27 -0000 There was a bit of discussion in the newsgroups earlier this year (and in the past) on compiling custom tclkit's with blt to create a kind of "Batteries Included" tclkit. Hopefully I'm not opening any old wounds, but I'm looking to do that very thing now, and I've run into a bit of a snag... specifically a snag getting BLT working on Windows. While I've found a few resources that have "bikit.exe" available for download (I recognize the merits of not calling something that isn't an official tclkit by that name), I can't seem to find any details how people got it working in the first place. The Linux/Solaris builds were easy enough (BLT compiles static libraries, those are loaded in kitInit.c and linked, everyone's happy), but I'm just about tearing my hair out getting a static BLT build under Windows. If anyone could point me in the right direction, I'd be quite grateful. And I do apologize if this isn't the correct place to be poking around. Cheers, -CJN From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Dec 17 09:44:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2AACB3A92 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:44:24 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXqEVCPB for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 02:44:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from digitalsmarties.com (gw.digitalsmarties.com [202.72.154.181]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 37472B3A8C for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:44:20 +0800 (WST) Received: (qmail 5802 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2003 01:33:09 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (127.0.0.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (127.0.0.1) with ESMTP; 17 Dec 2003 01:33:09 -0000 In-Reply-To: <20031216073055.AAB6197@cas.org> References: <20031216073055.AAB6197@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <86A5CA7E-3032-11D8-A7D7-000A95C5097A@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:44:17 +0800 To: "Larry W. Virden" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 01:44:25 -0000 Larry, > Has anyone managed to get the new tclkit to build on SPARC Solaris 8? Build worked out of the box for me on Sol 7 (Sparc and x86) using gnu C 2.9something I notice you're trying to build with gcc-3.3.1and threads, my guess is that there isn't a threaded version of libgcc_s Steve > I'm still stymied by the error I mentioned last week: > > export CC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/gccc > export CCC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/g++ > export CFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib" > export CXXFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic > -Wl,-lstdc++ > " > > tclsh ./genkit A > tclsh ./genkit B tcl > ksh ./genkit B > ksh ./genkit C > ksh ./genkit D > > > Here's mk's config.log output: > > configure:1712: g++ -v &5 > Reading specs from > /vol/gnu/gcc/bin/../lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/3.3.1/sp > ecs > Configured with: ../gcc-3.3.1/configure --prefix=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1 > --enable-sha > red --enable-threads --enable-cpp --enable-languages=c++ --with-gnu-as > --with-as > =/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/as --with-gnu-ld > --with-ld=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld --h > ost=sparc-sun-solaris2.8 > Thread model: posix > gcc version 3.3.1 > configure:1715: $? = 0 > configure:1717: g++ -V &5 > g++: `-V' option must have argument > configure:1720: $? = 1 > configure:1744: checking for C++ compiler default output > configure:1747: g++ -L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic > -Wl,-lstd > c++ conftest.cc >&5 > /vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld: cannot find -lgcc_s > collect2: ld returned 1 exit status > > and here's what I see: > lwv26awu (5453) $ ls /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s* > /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so.1 From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 17 19:33:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29800B3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:33:51 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXRlwXgj for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:33:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3092B3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:33:48 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHBXich005377 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 06:33:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHBXjq11413; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 06:33:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 06:33:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217063345.AAB11405@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 In-Reply-To: <86A5CA7E-3032-11D8-A7D7-000A95C5097A@DigitalSmarties.com> of Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:44:17 +0800 To: Starkit list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:33:51 -0000 Steve - what do I need to change in this set of flags so I am not trying to use threads? From: Steve Landers > I notice you're trying to build with gcc-3.3.1and threads, my guess is > that there isn't a threaded version of libgcc_s >> export CC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/gccc >> export CCC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/g++ >> export CFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib" >> export CXXFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic >> -Wl,-lstdc++ >> " -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Wed Dec 17 19:39:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 421FBB3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:39:36 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXnouDJz for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:39:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from digitalsmarties.com (gw.digitalsmarties.com [202.72.154.181]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1C8CEB3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:39:30 +0800 (WST) Received: (qmail 8128 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2003 11:28:18 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (127.0.0.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (127.0.0.1) with ESMTP; 17 Dec 2003 11:28:18 -0000 In-Reply-To: <20031217063345.AAB11405@cas.org> References: <20031217063345.AAB11405@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:39:24 +0800 To: "Larry W. Virden" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:39:37 -0000 Hi Larry, > Steve - what do I need to change in this set of flags so I am not > trying > to use threads? No idea - I presume its a default setting for your gcc installation, or maybe it is the default for gcc 3.3.1 on Solaris 8 (I don't have Solaris 8 here) I suggest you look at the gcc man page and see if there is a flag or environment variable to disable threads and then set the appropriate environment variables before invoking genkit. BTW, does a vanilla Tcl/Tk build work? Steve > From: Steve Landers > >> I notice you're trying to build with gcc-3.3.1and threads, my guess is >> that there isn't a threaded version of libgcc_s > >>> export CC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/gccc >>> export CCC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/g++ >>> export CFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib" >>> export CXXFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic >>> -Wl,-lstdc++ >>> " > -- > Tcl - The glue of a new generation. > Larry W. Virden http://www.purl.org/NET/lvirden/> > Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting > should > be construed as representing my employer's opinions. > -><- > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 17 20:18:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC0B0B3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:18:18 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXSksUys for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:18:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13851B3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:18:15 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id A59FC83C27; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:18:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AF3583914 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:18:12 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <14E01BD2-308B-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:18:11 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:18:19 -0000 FYI, I've set up a short intro page for Tcl developers, describing the steps needed to get started with starkits and tclkit. From the comments I continue to see in various places, I get the impression that many people hearing about starkit technology for the first time do see its end effects, but think there must be a lot of magic and a huge "system" behind it all. For me, by now, wrapping as starkit has become a reflex, even for single Tcl scripts - and so has running unwrapped when debugging or extending it. The page is at: http://www.equi4.com/tkstarted.html Please feel free to comment and pass it on widely. -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 17 20:31:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 730A7B3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:31:58 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX4wXc30 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:31:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FAA9B3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:31:55 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHCVqch018111 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:31:52 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHCVqo12196; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:31:52 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:31:52 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217073152.AAB12178@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 In-Reply-To: of Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:39:24 +0800 To: Starkit list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:31:58 -0000 From: Steve Landers > > Steve - what do I need to change in this set of flags so I am not > > trying > > to use threads? > > I suggest you look at the gcc man page and see if there is a flag or > environment variable to disable threads and then set the appropriate > environment variables before invoking genkit. The man page doesn't even mention the use of threads at all... > BTW, does a vanilla Tcl/Tk build work? I don't know - I've not had a chance to download it yet this morning and try. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 17 20:35:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E75D9B3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:35:52 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXWExIqt for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:35:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7117B3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:35:50 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHCZkch019019 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:35:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHCZlT12249; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:35:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:35:47 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217073547.AAB12216@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 In-Reply-To: <86A5CA7E-3032-11D8-A7D7-000A95C5097A@DigitalSmarties.com> of Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:44:17 +0800 To: Starkit list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:35:53 -0000 Actually, I just noticed something: > I'm still stymied by the error I mentioned last week: > > export CC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/gccc > export CCC=/vol/gnu/gcc/bin/g++ > export CFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib" > export CXXFLAGS="-L/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -R/vol/gnu/gcc/lib -Wl,-Bstatic -Wl,-lstdc++" > > tclsh ./genkit A > tclsh ./genkit B tcl > ksh ./genkit B > ksh ./genkit C > ksh ./genkit D > > > Here's mk's config.log output: > > configure:1712: g++ -v &5 > Reading specs from > /vol/gnu/gcc/bin/../lib/gcc-lib/sparc-sun-solaris2.8/3.3.1/specs > Configured with: ../gcc-3.3.1/configure --prefix=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1 --enable-shared --enable-threads --enable-cpp --enable-languages=c++ --with-gnu-as --with-as=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/as --with-gnu-ld --with-ld=/vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld --host=sparc-sun-solaris2.8 > Thread model: posix Notice what genkit did with mk - it configured with --enable-threads. JCW, is that new behavior? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Wed Dec 17 20:41:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D82B1B3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:41:23 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXo5HiEl for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:41:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCEF3B3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:41:20 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 6DA0E83C27; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:41:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B29A83914; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:41:18 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <20031217073547.AAB12216@cas.org> References: <20031217073547.AAB12216@cas.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4F07D9BE-308E-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:41:17 +0100 To: "Larry W. Virden" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:41:24 -0000 Larry W. Virden wrote: > Notice what genkit did with mk - it configured with --enable-threads. > > JCW, is that new behavior? $ grep thread genkit $ -jcw From lvirden@cas.org Wed Dec 17 20:50:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9710B3A9A for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:50:17 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXsIVztf for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:50:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87291B3A89 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:50:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHCoAch021415 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:50:11 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHCoB312453; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:50:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:50:11 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217075011.AAB12439@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 In-Reply-To: <4F07D9BE-308E-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> of Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:41:17 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:50:19 -0000 okay, there's obviously something wrong on this end. Sorry to have bothered you all. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Wed Dec 17 23:55:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 206B1B3A8C; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 23:55:52 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXegADiQ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:55:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5E2FB3A89; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 23:55:45 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:55:33 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:55:33 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: jcw@equi4.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:55:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 15:55:52 -0000 > > The page is at: http://www.equi4.com/tkstarted.html > Nice page, Jean-Claude. I agree that there should be a really easy starting point for potential starkit developers. It is sooo easy. But I think you're making it too complicated. "Getting started" should be a dead-simple example. You should be telling the novice users to get a Tclkit, get sdx.kit, and qwrap "Hello, world!" Asking them to use the fractal demo makes it sound mysterious. The reader didn't make the demo, they didn't set up that mysterious vfs directory, main.tcl, or anything else. If you uwrap fractal.kit, it all looks complicated. I like the example at "How to assemble a starkit" at http://www.equi4.com/188 Add direct pointers to tclkits (including Mac OSX, Linux, and "other") and unix tclkit fixups, and you're there. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Thu Dec 18 00:03:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14706B3A8C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:03:03 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX9Sqnzj for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:03:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A86BB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:03:00 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHG2uch002170 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:02:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHG2uG20245; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:02:56 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:02:56 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217110256.AAB20215@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits In-Reply-To: of Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:55:32 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:03:03 -0000 After the dead simple example, perhaps having a second example, where someone comes along to add support for a binary extension with the binaries for linux and windows or something (to show them how the pieces best should fit together to get loading of extensions to work relatively portably) would be great as well. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Dec 18 00:16:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 839AAB3A8C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:16:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX8seVaR for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:16:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65BF1B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:16:12 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id B80D383C27; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:16:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74DBB83914 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:16:09 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:16:08 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:16:14 -0000 Robert W. wrote: > But I think you're making it too complicated. "Getting started" > should be a > dead-simple example. You should be telling the novice users to get a > Tclkit, get sdx.kit, and qwrap "Hello, world!" [...] > I like the example at "How to assemble a starkit" at > http://www.equi4.com/188 > > Add direct pointers to tclkits (including Mac OSX, Linux, and "other") > and > unix tclkit fixups, and you're there. Yes, I see your point. It now occurs to me that we may addressing two categories of people here: qwrap = I'm a Tcl/Tk programmer, just want to add Starkits to my tool kit fractal = I'm starting on Tcl/Tk, make me hit the ground running, please I guess I also want to make it clear real early on that unwrapped execution is what it's all about for development - but that unwrapped mode is nevertheless the transition phase. The key focus I want to bring in, but haven't addressed yet, is that development always happens in the context of the end result - I'm sure some people just set things up and tinker on their system until everything is right, but IMHO Tclkit is much more oriented towards "developing for an app which will run on someone else's machine". From that perspective it really makes less sense to start writing code in any other spot than inside a "foo.vfs/lib/app-bar/" directory. I'll think about it a bit more, and agree that page 188 would be good as well. SDX wwrap is indeed a nice time-saver. -jcw From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Dec 18 00:44:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C152B3A8D; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:44:43 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXdAkUek; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:44:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71D41B3A89; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:44:40 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 10:43:17 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 10:43:17 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: jcw@equi4.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 10:43:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:44:43 -0000 > It now occurs to me that we may addressing two > categories of people here: > > qwrap = I'm a Tcl/Tk programmer, just want to add > Starkits to my tool kit > fractal = I'm starting on Tcl/Tk, make me hit the > ground running, please Ahh, I see the difference. But I like the clarity and correctness of your download and wrapping instructions. I think I'll copy those into "How to assemble a starkit." > > I guess I also want to make it clear real early on that unwrapped > execution is what it's all about for development - but that > unwrapped mode is nevertheless the transition phase. The key focus > I want to bring in, but haven't addressed yet, is that development > always happens in the context of the end result Oh. Even better. (But I didn't really get that from your new page.) But I'd start with the simple qwrap example. Then uwrap "Hello", look over the contents, modify it, wrap it, and release it. This is a good time to emphasize that development works on the unwrapped version, but it all works the same as the wrapped, released, version. Then unwrap a little more complicated application. More than the fractal demo. It should have several source files, a pure-tcl extension, and maybe some data files, like icons or something. Then the developer can see how all these pieces fit. And this would be a great time to reiterate that development on the unwrapped code behaves exactly as the wrapped, released application. You don't depend on external files or resources that might or might not be on your end users' machine. Then unwrap an application with binary bits. Show how the starkit can contain a shared library for many different platforms. Once again, brag about how this works great, and you don't go to dll hell. I think there's a progression from the very simple to the complex and tremendously useful. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Thu Dec 18 00:44:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BC4AB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:44:59 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXuRQfsf for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:44:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E2C2B3A9F for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:44:53 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHGinch015159 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:44:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHGing14762; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:44:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:44:49 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217114449.AAB14728@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Problem building the mk from Tclkit 8.4.5 In-Reply-To: <20031217075011.AAB12439@cas.org> of Wed, 17 Dec 2003 07:50:11 -0500 (EST) To: Starkit list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:44:59 -0000 Just in case someone comes along , sees my notes, and says "hey, I'm having that problem as well" Here's how I have solved my problem. With gcc 3.3.1, at least as installed here at my site, I had to remove the two -W flags, both from my environmental setup AND from the latest genkit, before mk and kitsh would build properly. I have no idea whether this is something with the newer g++, something the person who built and installed gcc has done, or what. $ ldd tclkit-lwv26awu libdl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libdl.so.1 libsocket.so.1 => /usr/lib/libsocket.so.1 libstdc++.so.5 => /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libstdc++.so.5 libm.so.1 => /usr/lib/libm.so.1 libgcc_s.so.1 => /vol/gnu/gcc/lib/libgcc_s.so.1 libc.so.1 => /usr/lib/libc.so.1 libnsl.so.1 => /usr/lib/libnsl.so.1 libmp.so.2 => /usr/lib/libmp.so.2 /usr/platform/SUNW,Sun-Blade-100/lib/libc_psr.so.1 Unfortunately, the result is that my tclkit is no longer portable ... So it works, but only for me and won't work at other sites. That was the whole reason to have that static in there. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From tpoindex@nyx.net Thu Dec 18 00:50:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 363D7B3A8D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:50:22 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXS7Xins for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:50:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from anubis.nyx.net (anubis.nyx.net [206.124.29.22]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FF4AB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:50:18 +0800 (WST) Received: from nyx1.nyx.net (nyx1.nyx.net [206.124.29.11]) by anubis.nyx.net (8.12.10/8.12.10/fnord) with ESMTP id hBHGoFHQ029926 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:50:15 -0700 Received: (from tpoindex@localhost) by nyx1.nyx.net (8.12.9/8.12.9/Submit) id hBHGoEpa023539 for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 09:50:14 -0700 (MST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:50:14 +0000 From: Tom Poindexter To: starkit@equi4.com Message-ID: <20031217165014.B22980@nyx.net> References: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com>; from jcw@equi4.com on Wed, Dec 17, 2003 at 05:16:08PM +0100 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:50:22 -0000 I found one unexpected difference between Unix and Windows starkits. I'm including binary extensions (SQLite and my own, built with Critcl) inside my starkit, and trying to do so in a platform independent method. Using the info from the Beyond Tclkit paper and wiki pages, I have a 'platform' proc defined, which is used by pkgIndex.tcl files to load the correct extension from the correct directory: # main.tcl proc platform {} { global tcl_platform set plat [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0] set mach $tcl_platform(machine) switch -glob -- $mach { sun4* { set mach sparc } intel - i*86* { set mach x86 } "Power Macintosh" { set mach ppc } } switch -- $plat { AIX { set mach ppc } HP-UX { set mach hppa } } return "$plat-$mach" } package require starkit starkit::startup if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return package require sqlite package require app-myapp myapp_main # end of main.tcl in lib/sqlite/pkgIndex.tcl, I have: # pkgIndex.tcl package ifneeded sqlite 2.0 \ [list load \ [file join $dir [platform] libtclsqlite[info sharedlibextension]] sqlite] I also have directories in ./lib/sqlite for ./Linux-x86/, ./Windows-x86/, and ./AIX-ppc/, and in each directory the platform dependent libtclsqlite.so (or .dll for windows). This all works fine in Linux and AIX, but when I built and ran under windows, the starkit (actually a starpack) immediately crashed with and obscure windows popup. I believe that the Windows Tclkit seems to be doing a 'package require' before main.tcl is executed, thus the [platform] reference in ./lib/sqlite/pkgIndex.tcl was not found. I fixed the problem by including the platform proc directly in the ./lib/sqlite/pkgIndex.tcl file. Also, it would be nice to have a standardized 'tclkit::platform' command as part of Tclkit itself, maybe buried inside of init.tcl or somesuch place that will guarantee it's availability before any package require. Best, Tom -- Tom Poindexter tpoindex@nyx.net http://www.nyx.net/~tpoindex/ From jcw@equi4.com Thu Dec 18 01:03:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 075EBB3A8D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:03:16 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXY0jvzz for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:03:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B5ABB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:03:14 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 3229683C27; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:03:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E38A183914 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:03:10 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:03:10 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:03:16 -0000 Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > But I'd start with the simple qwrap example. [etc] > I think there's a progression from the very simple to the complex and > tremendously useful. I agree. There's in fact quite a story to tell - because once you get this far, new issues are bound to pop up: - cross-platform code - starpacks, and wrapping starpacks cross-platform - customizing the tclkit icon - tbcload - and so on... I'm not sure I'm quite up to writing all of that down :) Yeah, there's a lot to say. Pages like this new one, and getting Steve Landers Tclkit paper in web HTML form are simply some steps towards that greater, not too clearly defined, goal... And getting rid of some stale/obsolete info is probably just as important. -jcw From dgporter@verizon.net Thu Dec 18 01:41:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CD24B3A8C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:41:09 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXM2mjAL for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:41:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from out012.verizon.net (out012pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.137]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6054B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:41:06 +0800 (WST) Received: from verizon.net ([129.6.88.137]) by out012.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20031217174105.LBXY38.out012.verizon.net@verizon.net>; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:41:05 -0600 Message-ID: <3FE09530.6060709@verizon.net> Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:41:04 -0500 From: Donald G Porter User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030730 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tom Poindexter Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. References: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <20031217165014.B22980@nyx.net> In-Reply-To: <20031217165014.B22980@nyx.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [129.6.88.137] at Wed, 17 Dec 2003 11:41:04 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: dgporter@verizon.net List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:41:09 -0000 Tom Poindexter wrote: > I found one unexpected difference between Unix and Windows starkits. I suspect this might really be a difference between Tk-enabled and Tk-disabled starkits, and the platform distinction is sort of a coincidence due to different default settings. Tk does a [package require msgcat] to support localized widgets. > # pkgIndex.tcl > package ifneeded sqlite 2.0 \ > [list load \ > [file join $dir [platform] libtclsqlite[info sharedlibextension]] sqlite] Let me intrude on this with unsolicited advice. Anyone who's going to be writing pkgIndex.tcl files ought to have a look at http://wiki.tcl.tk/5900 for advice on things to do and things not to do. In particular, pkgIndex.tcl files need to be written extra carefully so that they never raise an error. In this example, an error is possible whenever [platform] hasn't been defined. Thus, the [platform] command should not be used except after its presence is established. The best way to establish the presence of a command is to check for the presence of the package that provides it. In your example, it's not provided by a package, and as you observe, things might be nicer if a package like "tclkit" did provide it. With no package providing [platform], you should at least fall back on a check for command existence. So, the better pkgIndex.tcl file would be: # pkgIndex.tcl if {![package vsatisfies [package provide Tcl] 8]} {return} if {[string match {} [namespace which platform]]} {return} package ifneeded sqlite 2.0 [list load \ [file join $dir [platform] libtclsqlite[info sharedlibextension]] \ sqlite] If sqlite-2.0 needs to support Tcl 7, a modification using [info commands] instead of [namespace which] is also possible. -- | Don Porter dgporter@verizon.net | | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" | | -- Adam West as BATMAN | |______________________________________________________________________| From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Thu Dec 18 01:52:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76CBCB3A91 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:52:33 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX0JybuB for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:52:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net [216.34.191.37]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89A62B3A8C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:52:28 +0800 (WST) Received: from int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-2 [3.159.232.66]) id hBHHqOAe026736 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:52:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlef04.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id hBHHqN7u027360 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvem06.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.77]) by cinmlef04.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:52:22 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6537.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:51:44 -0500 Message-ID: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF06E830A@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. Thread-Index: AcPExRp7FkP4pQGhR+K4iCgWSz2UBQAALmjg From: "Schofield, Bryan (TRANS)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Dec 2003 17:52:22.0465 (UTC) FILETIME=[85D8C310:01C3C4C6] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:52:33 -0000 I noticed that the lastest starkit.tcl contains this: # the following proc was copied from the critcl package: # return a platform designator, including both OS and machine # # only use first element of $tcl_platform(os) - we don't care # whether we are on "Windows NT" or "Windows XP" or whatever # # transforms $tcl_platform(machine) for some special cases # - on SunOS, matches for sun4* are transformed to sparc # - on all OS's matches for intel and i*86* are transformed to x86 # - on MacOS X "Power Macintosh" is transformed to ppc # proc platform {} { global tcl_platform set plat [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0] set mach $tcl_platform(machine) switch -glob -- $mach { sun4* { set mach sparc } intel - i*86* { set mach x86 } "Power Macintosh" { set mach ppc } } switch -- $plat { AIX { set mach ppc } HP-UX { set mach hppa } } return "$plat-$mach" } ---- % package require starkit 1.3 % starkit::platform Windows-x86 > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On > Behalf Of Donald G Porter > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 12:41 PM > To: Tom Poindexter > Cc: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. >=20 >=20 > Tom Poindexter wrote: > > I found one unexpected difference between Unix and Windows starkits. >=20 > I suspect this might really be a difference between Tk-enabled and > Tk-disabled starkits, and the platform distinction is sort of a > coincidence due to different default settings. >=20 > Tk does a [package require msgcat] to support localized widgets. >=20 > > # pkgIndex.tcl > > package ifneeded sqlite 2.0 \ > > [list load \ > > [file join $dir [platform] libtclsqlite[info=20 > sharedlibextension]] sqlite] >=20 > Let me intrude on this with unsolicited advice. >=20 > Anyone who's going to be writing pkgIndex.tcl files ought to have > a look at http://wiki.tcl.tk/5900 for advice on things to do and > things not to do. >=20 > In particular, pkgIndex.tcl files need to be written extra carefully > so that they never raise an error. In this example, an error is > possible whenever [platform] hasn't been defined. Thus, the > [platform] command should not be used except after its presence > is established. >=20 > The best way to establish the presence of a command is to check > for the presence of the package that provides it. In your example, > it's not provided by a package, and as you observe, things might > be nicer if a package like "tclkit" did provide it. With no package > providing [platform], you should at least fall back on a check > for command existence. So, the better pkgIndex.tcl file would be: >=20 > # pkgIndex.tcl > if {![package vsatisfies [package provide Tcl] 8]} {return} > if {[string match {} [namespace which platform]]} {return} > package ifneeded sqlite 2.0 [list load \ > [file join $dir [platform] libtclsqlite[info sharedlibextension]] \ > sqlite] >=20 > If sqlite-2.0 needs to support Tcl 7, a modification using > [info commands] instead of [namespace which] is also possible. >=20 > --=20 > | Don Porter =20 > dgporter@verizon.net | > | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" =20 > | > | -- Adam West as BATMAN =20 > | > |_____________________________________________________________ > _________| >=20 > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit >=20 From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Dec 18 02:49:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E306B3A9A for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 02:49:17 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXef2G0U for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:49:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 173BDB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 02:49:15 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:49:01 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:49:01 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:49:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:49:17 -0000 I've added http://wiki.tcl.tk/BuildYourFirstStarkit to http://wiki.tcl.tk/starkit My first inclination was that bwdemo.kit might make a nice example of a pure-tcl application. Its got multiple tcl source files and even a couple of .xbm files. But once I unwrap it, I see that the demo code is not part of app-bwdemo. It just cd's to 'bwdiget-1.3.0/demo' and sources 'demo.tcl'. Is there a better, pure Tcl, demonstration kit? Or would a good example consist of downloading bwidget-1.6.0.tar.gz, and creating bwdemo.vfs, main.tcl, and app-bwdemo by hand? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From cferril@mchsi.com Thu Dec 18 03:07:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B147B3A9E for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:07:54 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXtnV0we for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:07:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from sccimhc02.asp.att.net (sccimhc02.asp.att.net [63.240.76.164]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9614EB3A9D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:07:52 +0800 (WST) Received: from 192.168.2.100 (12-218-32-245.client.mchsi.com[12.218.32.245]) by sccimhc02.asp.att.net (sccimhc02) with SMTP id <20031217190750im2003ldr0e>; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:07:50 +0000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. From: Chuck Ferril To: Tom Poindexter In-Reply-To: <20031217165014.B22980@nyx.net> References: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <20031217165014.B22980@nyx.net> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1071688147.15002.32.camel@wcferril.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.3 Date: 17 Dec 2003 13:09:07 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:07:54 -0000 If it is of any help, I just uploaded to my website a starkit for both tclsqlite and vfs that I have been using. I created my own version of code for loading platform dependant binaries based on the example you refer to below that has worked well for me. It follows how tcllib extends the auto_path with the various sub-extensions, except that it extends it with the platform. You can then easily copy any existing platform extension into the sub-directories without having to modify them for multi-platform support. In fact, I use this to quickly convert all my TclDevKit libraries from Linux and Windows into single multi-platform libraries. I nearly always create cross platform starkits and the extra baggage doesn't bother me. Ultimatly I would like to teach SDX to wrap only the platform related to the output type. For instance, creating a starkit would include all platforms, while creating a starpack would only include the platform that relates to the runtime it is being wrapped with. Download vfs1.2.kit and unwrap it. Then look at the vfs1.2.vfs/lib/vfs1.2/pkgIndex.tcl file. It does nothing more than extend the auto_path based on the platform, the standard files of the extension are contained in the directories below it. http://wcferril.home.mchsi.com/index.html Chuck Ferril P.S. The vfs.kit has my patch that allows reading of compressed files within a zip file, in case any of you happen to need that functionality, I know I did. On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 10:50, Tom Poindexter wrote: > I found one unexpected difference between Unix and Windows starkits. I'm > including binary extensions (SQLite and my own, built with Critcl) inside my > starkit, and trying to do so in a platform independent method. Using the info > from the Beyond Tclkit paper and wiki pages, I have a 'platform' proc defined, > which is used by pkgIndex.tcl files to load the correct extension from the > correct directory: > > > # main.tcl > > proc platform {} { > global tcl_platform > set plat [lindex $tcl_platform(os) 0] > set mach $tcl_platform(machine) > switch -glob -- $mach { > sun4* { set mach sparc } > intel - > i*86* { set mach x86 } > "Power Macintosh" { set mach ppc } > } > switch -- $plat { > AIX { set mach ppc } > HP-UX { set mach hppa } > } > return "$plat-$mach" > } > > package require starkit > starkit::startup > if {[starkit::startup] eq "sourced"} return > > > package require sqlite > package require app-myapp > myapp_main > # end of main.tcl > > > in lib/sqlite/pkgIndex.tcl, I have: > > > # pkgIndex.tcl > package ifneeded sqlite 2.0 \ > [list load \ > [file join $dir [platform] libtclsqlite[info sharedlibextension]] sqlite] > > > > I also have directories in ./lib/sqlite for > ./Linux-x86/, ./Windows-x86/, and ./AIX-ppc/, and in each directory > the platform dependent libtclsqlite.so (or .dll for windows). > > This all works fine in Linux and AIX, but when I built and ran under > windows, the starkit (actually a starpack) immediately crashed with > and obscure windows popup. > > I believe that the Windows Tclkit seems to be doing a 'package require' > before main.tcl is executed, thus the [platform] reference in > ./lib/sqlite/pkgIndex.tcl was not found. I fixed the problem by > including the platform proc directly in the ./lib/sqlite/pkgIndex.tcl file. > > Also, it would be nice to have a standardized 'tclkit::platform' command as > part of Tclkit itself, maybe buried inside of init.tcl or somesuch place that > will guarantee it's availability before any package require. > > Best, > Tom From lvirden@cas.org Thu Dec 18 03:19:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66AD0B3A9A for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:19:13 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXkSiex8 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:19:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 518E5B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:19:09 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBHJJ5ch006480 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 14:19:05 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBHJJ6E11347; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 14:19:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 14:19:06 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031217141906.AAB11319@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. In-Reply-To: <1071688147.15002.32.camel@wcferril.local> of 17 Dec 2003 13:09:07 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:19:13 -0000 From: Chuck Ferril > P.S. The vfs.kit has my patch that allows reading of compressed files > within a zip file, in case any of you happen to need that functionality, Have you considered submitting your patch to the tclvfs maintainers to see if perhaps the patch might be included in the standard distribution? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Dec 18 03:23:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01D92B3A9A for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:23:25 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXf7sUVb for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:23:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDB4CB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:23:22 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id C69B683C27; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:23:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B28F83914 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:23:19 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <78B8090F-30C6-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:23:19 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:23:25 -0000 Bob, > Is there a better, pure Tcl, demonstration kit? Or would a good > example > consist of downloading bwidget-1.6.0.tar.gz, and creating bwdemo.vfs, > main.tcl, and app-bwdemo by hand? No immediate suggestion comes to mind, but images always seem to capture the imgination, and the img extension might be a nice and useful extension to add as you expand the example. Another idea, much more techie-oriented, would be to add tbcload binaries and show how to store encoded scripts and run them on several platforms. But that won't be as sexy as something that shows off Tk. -jcw From cferril@mchsi.com Thu Dec 18 03:25:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D05DDB3A9A for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:25:00 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX9FqLCl for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:24:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from sccmmhc02.asp.att.net (sccmmhc02.asp.att.net [204.127.203.184]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B54B5B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:24:58 +0800 (WST) Received: from 192.168.2.100 (12-218-32-245.client.mchsi.com[12.218.32.245]) by sccmmhc02.asp.att.net (sccmmhc02) with SMTP id <20031217192457mm2008dnose>; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:24:57 +0000 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. From: Chuck Ferril To: "Larry W. Virden" In-Reply-To: <20031217141906.AAB11319@cas.org> References: <20031217141906.AAB11319@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1071689174.16088.3.camel@wcferril.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.3 Date: 17 Dec 2003 13:26:14 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:25:01 -0000 yup...never heard anything back... On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 13:19, Larry W. Virden wrote: > From: Chuck Ferril > > > P.S. The vfs.kit has my patch that allows reading of compressed files > > within a zip file, in case any of you happen to need that functionality, > > Have you considered submitting your patch to the tclvfs maintainers to > see if perhaps the patch might be included in the standard distribution? From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Dec 18 03:44:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EE12B3A8D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:44:27 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXmIZgo1 for ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:44:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DCBFB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 03:44:23 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:43:41 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:43:40 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 13:43:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 19:44:27 -0000 > > Is there a better, pure Tcl, demonstration kit? > > No immediate suggestion comes to mind, but images always seem to > capture the imgination, and the img extension might be a nice and > useful extension to add as you expand the example. How about using sdx.kit as an example? Its got lots of files in lib/app-sdx. Its got packages like ftp and md5, and even some graphics in gbutton. Its even got wikit in a library, and online docs in sdx.vfs/doc. (OK, the docs need a little work.) Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Dec 18 08:37:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91481B3A8C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:37:44 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXAhYUta for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 01:37:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from digitalsmarties.com (gw.digitalsmarties.com [202.72.154.181]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id AC08BB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:37:40 +0800 (WST) Received: (qmail 10340 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2003 00:26:28 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (127.0.0.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (127.0.0.1) with ESMTP; 18 Dec 2003 00:26:28 -0000 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <5F4A0DB6-30F2-11D8-A7D7-000A95C5097A@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:37:34 +0800 To: "Techentin, Robert W." X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:37:44 -0000 Bob, > Is there a better, pure Tcl, demonstration kit? Or would a good > example > consist of downloading bwidget-1.6.0.tar.gz, and creating bwdemo.vfs, > main.tcl, and app-bwdemo by hand? This may not be the right answer, but I've used tkdiff to produce customer "data comparisons" for customers who are having data problems. Export the old and new version of a database table or spreadsheet to csv, run diff manually, and store both copies plus the diff in a slightly modified tkdiff starkit (modified in that it doesn't invoke the unix diff command, it just reads the data file). I wrap that as a windows starpack and send to the customer. To make this generally applicable we'd need to incorporate something like Kevin Kenny's "diff in Tcl" so it can work on windows. Or, better still, a compiled diff library (if one exists) to demonsrate including binary code. But ideally we'd find a generally useful, somewhat unique and appeals to both technical and non-technical people ;-) Steve From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Dec 18 15:19:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27403B3A8D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:19:47 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX7p7I4N for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:19:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A160B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:19:45 +0800 (WST) Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA28457 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:19:45 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA27858 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:19:36 +0100 (MET) Sender: Arjen.Markus@wldelft.nl Message-ID: <3FE15508.C85D2A4F@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:19:36 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits References: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 07:19:47 -0000 Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > Robert W. wrote: > > > But I think you're making it too complicated. "Getting started" > > should be a > > dead-simple example. You should be telling the novice users to get a > > Tclkit, get sdx.kit, and qwrap "Hello, world!" > [...] > > I like the example at "How to assemble a starkit" at > > http://www.equi4.com/188 > > > > Add direct pointers to tclkits (including Mac OSX, Linux, and "other") > > and > > unix tclkit fixups, and you're there. > > Yes, I see your point. > > It now occurs to me that we may addressing two categories of people > here: > > qwrap = I'm a Tcl/Tk programmer, just want to add Starkits to my tool > kit > fractal = I'm starting on Tcl/Tk, make me hit the ground running, > please > Fascinating: I hope you all have noticed the tutorial I am putting together on the Wiki - How to make a Tcl application. I have made room for an expose on Tclkit (and wrappers like freewrap), but with this I can simply leave out the details! Regards, Arjen From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Thu Dec 18 15:28:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A63CFB3A8D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:28:13 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXgVtkuj for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:28:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C28F8B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:28:11 +0800 (WST) Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id IAA15305 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:28:11 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA15094 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:28:03 +0100 (MET) Sender: Arjen.Markus@wldelft.nl Message-ID: <3FE15703.91D6B58A@wldelft.nl> Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:28:03 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits References: <5F4A0DB6-30F2-11D8-A7D7-000A95C5097A@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 07:28:13 -0000 Steve Landers wrote: > > Bob, > > > Is there a better, pure Tcl, demonstration kit? Or would a good > > example > > consist of downloading bwidget-1.6.0.tar.gz, and creating bwdemo.vfs, > > main.tcl, and app-bwdemo by hand? > > This may not be the right answer, but I've used tkdiff to produce > customer "data comparisons" for customers who are having data problems. > > Export the old and new version of a database table or spreadsheet to > csv, run diff manually, and store both copies plus the diff in a > slightly modified tkdiff starkit (modified in that it doesn't invoke > the unix diff command, it just reads the data file). > > I wrap that as a windows starpack and send to the customer. > > To make this generally applicable we'd need to incorporate something > like Kevin Kenny's "diff in Tcl" so it can > work on windows. Or, better still, a compiled diff library (if one > exists) to demonsrate including binary code. > > But ideally we'd find a generally useful, somewhat unique and appeals > to both technical and non-technical people ;-) > I have some experience wrapping up a starkit with tktable. I suppose a little spreadsheet-like application with tktable could do. I have not got anything like that right now, but give it a thought :) Regards, Arjen From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Dec 18 22:54:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C9ADB3A9C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 22:54:59 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX8Dq1M1 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:54:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D191B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 22:54:57 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:54:10 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:54:10 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:54:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 14:55:00 -0000 I'm not so interested in the application. I don't care so much if it is appealing, or cute, or even a good demo. I was looking for something to illustrate the internals of the starkit, with multiple application source files, a pure-tcl library, and maybe a couple of non-script data files. Peeking inside of many of the starkits at http://mini.net/sdarchive/, I see some that meet these criteria, but they're not all of the same format that you'd get from 'sdx qwrap'. The lovely description at http://www.equi4.com/191 (Anatomy of a Starkit) shows that you should have main.tcl at the top level, and your killer app goes into vfs/lib/app-killer as a package. Maybe wikit.kit would be a good, more complex, pure-tcl starkit example. Its got app-wikit, some tcl libraries, gbutton has some .gifs, internal documentation, and its even got httpd embedded. And to boot, it's an example on http://www.equi4.com/191 Hmmmm. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From lvirden@cas.org Thu Dec 18 22:59:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07545B3A9D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 22:59:29 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX0hjn4x for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:59:27 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D20B2B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 22:59:26 +0800 (WST) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) hBIExNch008991 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:59:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)hBIExNc18066; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:59:23 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:59:23 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20031218095922.AAB18048@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits In-Reply-To: of Thu, 18 Dec 2003 08:54:01 -0600 To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 14:59:29 -0000 From: "Techentin, Robert W." > I was looking for something to > illustrate the internals of the starkit, with multiple application source > files, a pure-tcl library, and maybe a couple of non-script data files. Is this the second of three examples you are envisioning, where the third will include at least binaries for a couple of platforms? The one thing I ask is that whatever examples are used, hopefully the code and directory structure will be considered of the 'best practice' nature - not a dictate that one must do this, but for the novice with no pre-determined needs, an example which won't leave them stuck with many potential problems. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Dec 18 23:12:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16221B3A9D for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:12:28 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXEcqRCS for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:12:25 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1034AB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:12:25 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:12:19 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:12:19 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:12:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:12:28 -0000 > From: Larry W. Virden [mailto:lvirden@cas.org] > > Is this the second of three examples you are > envisioning, where the third will include at > least binaries for a couple of platforms? Yes, exactly. > The one thing I ask is that whatever examples > are used, hopefully the code and directory > structure will be considered of the 'best > practice' nature - not a dictate that one must > do this, but for the novice with no > pre-determined needs, an example which won't > leave them stuck with many potential problems. That is my intention. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Dec 18 23:32:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9546EB3A9C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:32:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXAe5HQy for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:32:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A48DDB3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:32:11 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:32:00 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:32:00 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:31:54 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:32:15 -0000 > Maybe wikit.kit would be a good, more complex, > pure-tcl starkit example. Its got app-wikit, > some tcl libraries, gbutton has some .gifs, > internal documentation, and its even got httpd > embedded. And to boot, it's an example on > http://www.equi4.com/191 Hmmmm. But now that I look more closely, I see that wikit.kit includes ".so" shared libraries for jpg, png, tkimg, and zlib libraries. What's that about? It looks like experimental code for local-mode images, but its certainly not cross platform, and doesn't follow the anatomy description. Is tkimg and friends the future for wikit.kit? Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From jcw@equi4.com Thu Dec 18 23:48:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8084B3A9C for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:48:59 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXDzbZ0M for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:48:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30508B3A89 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:48:54 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 4199A83C27; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:48:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C010283914 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:48:50 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:48:49 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:49:00 -0000 Techentin, Robert W. wrote: >> Maybe wikit.kit would be a good, more complex, >> pure-tcl starkit example. Its got app-wikit, >> some tcl libraries, gbutton has some .gifs, >> internal documentation, and its even got httpd >> embedded. And to boot, it's an example on >> http://www.equi4.com/191 Hmmmm. > > But now that I look more closely, I see that wikit.kit includes ".so" > shared > libraries for jpg, png, tkimg, and zlib libraries. What's that about? > It > looks like experimental code for local-mode images, but its certainly > not > cross platform, and doesn't follow the anatomy description. Spot on. You caught me ... > Is tkimg and friends the future for wikit.kit? I don't know. I stopped short of actually adding all those things officially to wikit for that reason. It would be nice to keep wikit a small pure-Tcl system, usable in various contexts and for various purposes. One idea (which does introduce more machinery, though), would be for wikit to look next to itself for say "wikit-extras.kit" and source that if present. That could contain image binaries for different platforms. Or one could go totally overboard on this and use such an approach for a "wikit-plugins.kit" - but to be honest, I think wikit is not quite up to such ambitions without a pretty massive re-write/re-design first. It it were not for wikit's somewhat "shabby" state, IMO it would indeed make a pretty neat demo - if I may say so - from local Tk use to a CGI module to an embedded httpd server to an embeddable help system. -jcw From tom.krehbiel@cox.net Fri Dec 19 00:28:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71DF4B3A9C for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:28:37 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXh9YsPd for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:28:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04813B3A89 for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:28:30 +0800 (WST) Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id hBIGSSJq020533 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:28:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from dad ([163.14.20.93]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with SMTP id hBIGQHDU008558 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 10:26:18 -0600 Message-ID: <008001c3c583$77e09360$020aa8c0@dad> From: "Tom Krehbiel" Cc: References: <52B65DFE-30AC-11D8-918F-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <20031217165014.B22980@nyx.net> <1071688147.15002.32.camel@wcferril.local> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:24:52 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 12:13:03 +0100 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:28:37 -0000 FYI, my $.02 If you target the wrap for a platform (as I do) it would eliminate most of your problems. My 'Makefile' builds for the platform I'm on by default but if I want to target the linux os then I just do "gmake build-linux". Putting multi-platform stuff in sdx seems like a waste of time to me because your still going to have to deal with multi-platform issues at the C level which gets you back to a Makefile or something similar. I have toyed with the idea of sending out a multi-platform distro (as you are doing) but, in my case at least, I think the file size would be unreasonably large. If I did do a multi-platform distro then I think an install process should be built in which can trim the package down to size base on a target platform. Tom K. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Ferril" To: "Tom Poindexter" Cc: Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 12:09 PM Subject: Re: [Starkit] Interesting behavior Unix vs. Windows. > If it is of any help, I just uploaded to my website a starkit for both > tclsqlite and vfs that I have been using. I created my own version of > code for loading platform dependant binaries based on the example you > refer to below that has worked well for me. > > It follows how tcllib extends the auto_path with the various > sub-extensions, except that it extends it with the platform. You can > then easily copy any existing platform extension into the > sub-directories without having to modify them for multi-platform > support. > > In fact, I use this to quickly convert all my TclDevKit libraries from > Linux and Windows into single multi-platform libraries. I nearly always > create cross platform starkits and the extra baggage doesn't bother me. > > Ultimatly I would like to teach SDX to wrap only the platform related to > the output type. For instance, creating a starkit would include all > platforms, while creating a starpack would only include the platform > that relates to the runtime it is being wrapped with. > > Download vfs1.2.kit and unwrap it. Then look at the > vfs1.2.vfs/lib/vfs1.2/pkgIndex.tcl file. It does nothing more than > extend the auto_path based on the platform, the standard files of the > extension are contained in the directories below it. > > http://wcferril.home.mchsi.com/index.html > > Chuck Ferril From tom.krehbiel@cox.net Fri Dec 19 00:50:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21C78B3A9C for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:50:21 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXKUXh1f for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:50:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from motgate8.mot.com (motgate8.mot.com [129.188.136.8]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B6CCB3A89 for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:50:18 +0800 (WST) Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate8.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id hBIGoGY5028194 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:50:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from dad ([163.14.20.93]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with SMTP id hBIGjLDU028792 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 2003 10:45:22 -0600 Message-ID: <008d01c3c586$21fbde70$020aa8c0@dad> From: "Tom Krehbiel" To: "Starkit list" References: Subject: Re: [Starkit] Getting started with starkits Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:43:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 12:13:03 +0100 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:50:21 -0000 Jean-Claude, I've been thinking about using Tkhtml for the local mode wikit interface. What are your thoughts on this? Wouldn't this eliminate the need for the libraries you mention (because they are in Tkhtml)? Tom K. > Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > > >> Maybe wikit.kit would be a good, more complex, > >> pure-tcl starkit example. Its got app-wikit, > >> some tcl libraries, gbutton has some .gifs, > >> internal documentation, and its even got httpd > >> embedded. And to boot, it's an example on > >> http://www.equi4.com/191 Hmmmm. > > > > But now that I look more closely, I see that wikit.kit includes ".so" > > shared > > libraries for jpg, png, tkimg, and zlib libraries. What's that about? > > It > > looks like experimental code for local-mode images, but its certainly > > not > > cross platform, and doesn't follow the anatomy description. > > Spot on. You caught me ... > > > Is tkimg and friends the future for wikit.kit? > > I don't know. I stopped short of actually adding all those things > officially to wikit for that reason. It would be nice to keep wikit a > small pure-Tcl system, usable in various contexts and for various > purposes. One idea (which does introduce more machinery, though), > would be for wikit to look next to itself for say "wikit-extras.kit" > and source that if present. That could contain image binaries for > different platforms. Or one could go totally overboard on this and use > such an approach for a "wikit-plugins.kit" - but to be honest, I think > wikit is not quite up to such ambitions without a pretty massive > re-write/re-design first. It it were not for wikit's somewhat "shabby" > state, IMO it would indeed make a pretty neat demo - if I may say so - > from local Tk use to a CGI module to an embedded httpd server to an > embeddable help system. From harald.oehlmann@elmicron.de Tue Dec 23 18:43:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9024FB3A8C for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:43:05 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXZIegcg for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:43:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.g-bag.baycix.de (mail.g-bag.baycix.de [212.72.65.2]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF9A2B3A87 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:43:04 +0800 (WST) Received: from delphine.elmicron.de (pD9020FD8.dip.t-dialin.net [217.2.15.216]) (authenticated bits=0)hBNAh37b012816 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:43:04 +0100 Received: by delphine.elmicron.de (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.1 (i386), from userid 501) id 280D628A48; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:33:14 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])id C9546301AB for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:33:14 +0100 (MET) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:33:14 +0100 (MET) From: Harald Oehlmann X-X-Sender: oehhar@delphine.ibo.local To: TCL Starkit Submit to mailing list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] fcopy -command bug X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 10:43:05 -0000 Dear list, I have registered a bug about starkits but forgot my name below it. The problem is: fcopy $h1 $h2 -command Event If h1 and h2 are file handles, Event is never fired when packed in a Starkit/pack. I already wrote about it but now I added a script to reproduce it (I hope). Andreas and Jeff had pointed out that this might be a fileevent bug corrected in 8.4.5. Anyway, I still have the bug. Mery christmas, Harald Oehlmann From jcw@equi4.com Tue Dec 23 19:43:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1E7BB3A87 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 19:43:09 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXpXb17x for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 12:43:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20314B3AA3 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 19:43:07 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id D0FEE83C26; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 12:43:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E46183914 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 12:43:04 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <2C45A4D9-353D-11D8-A82A-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] fcopy -command bug Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 12:43:05 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:43:10 -0000 Harald Oehlmann wrote: > I have registered a bug about starkits but forgot my name below it. Thanks. Yes, I see it's at: http://www.equi4.com/BTS.cgi/BTS/editbugs?bugid=82 > The problem is: > fcopy $h1 $h2 -command Event > If h1 and h2 are file handles, Event is never fired when packed in a > Starkit/pack. This appears to be the same issue as SF Tcl bug #719790. > I already wrote about it but now I added a script to reproduce it (I > hope). > > Andreas and Jeff had pointed out that this might be a fileevent bug > corrected in 8.4.5. Anyway, I still have the bug. The bug is real. My attempts to nail it down - and even to verify that it has been resolved in 8.4.5 have been inconclusive so far. I can't reproduce it on Linux, and my Windows test setup is not available right now, so I'll have to wait before looking into this again. There is a known workaround, when you know how many bytes are going to be transferred. Just add "-size [file size $srcfile]" to the fcopy, and things should work. That's not always possible, but it does seem to do the trick. -jcw From yaryantua@yahoo.gr Wed Dec 24 01:43:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E947DB3A91 for ; Wed, 24 Dec 2003 01:43:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXH8aSA1 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:43:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from web60706.mail.yahoo.com (web60706.mail.yahoo.com [216.109.117.229]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3711CB3A87 for ; Wed, 24 Dec 2003 01:43:12 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20031223174311.51473.qmail@web60706.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [62.38.239.72] by web60706.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 17:43:11 GMT Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 17:43:11 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-7?q?andrian?= To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] metakit and UTF-8 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 17:43:15 -0000 On Tue, 23 Dec 2003 12:43:01 +0100 Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > andrian wrote: > > > I created a metakit database using "Mk4tcl 2.4.9.2". > > I have saved the script file with the data to populate > > the db in UTF-8. However, the stored data appear to > > be corrupted. > > I understand that according to Metakit's specification > > UTF-8 is supported. Furthermore, I use Wikit, where I > > have, succesfully, stored UTF-8 data. > > What can be the cause of this problem? > > UTF-8 can definitely be stored in MK (sorting is another matter). > > Can you create a test script which shows the problem? Without it, I > have no way of helping or even reproducing the problem, I'm afraid. > FWIW, I have not heard of a problem with UTF-8 before. > > If you use Mk4tcl, then you may want to consider posting to the Starkit > mailing list, which has many more Tcl susbcribers than this list: > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > Though I read and respond to both, of course :) > > -jcw Thanks for the quick response! ---- This a sample script saved as UTF-8: package require Mk4tcl mk::file open db de_el.mk -nocommit set vw [mk::view layout db.de_el {de el}] mk::row append $vw de "verschönern" el "åîùñáúæù" mk::file commit db ---- Database consists of two fields: "de" and "el". "de" stores characters from Basic Latin (\u0000-\u00FF). "el" stores characters from Greek (\u0370-\u03E1) Unicode Bloc. I give the values of "de" and "el" in Universal Character Name (UCN) de "\u0076\u0065\u0072\u0073\u0063\u0068\u00f6\u006e\u0065\u0072\u006e" el "\u03b5\u03be\u03c9\u03c1\u03b1\u03ca\u03b6\u03c9" This is the result metakit (opened as UTF-8): JL rverschönern  εξωÏαϊζω #de_el[de:S,el:S] b  M I give the values (of the above metakit) of "de" and "el" in UCN: de "\u0076\u0065\u0072\u0073\u0063\u0068\u0393\u00b6\u006e\u0065\u0072\u006e" el "\u039e\u00b5\u039e\u038e\u039f\u2030\u039f\u0081\u039e\u00b1\u039f\u008a\u039e\u00b6\u039f\u2030" Finally, I also tried to enter the values as UCN: package require Mk4tcl mk::file open db de_el.mk -nocommit set vw [mk::view layout db.de_el {de:S el:S}] mk::row append $vw de "versch\x00f6nern" el "\x03b5\x03be\x03c9\x03c1\x03b1\x03ca\x03b6\x03c9" mk::file commit db But no...lack. ---- Platform is Windows XP (which as I know is unicode-aware). Tcl is ActiveTcl 8.4.4.0 ---- Also, I checked a Wikit database, containing UTF-8 characters, I have created and everything is fine. ---- Thanks and Regards, andrian ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? ÁðïêôÞóôå ôç äùñåÜí @yahoo.gr äéåýèõíóç óáò óôï http://www.otenet.gr From yaryantua@yahoo.gr Tue Dec 30 10:35:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EDC8B3A87 for ; Tue, 30 Dec 2003 10:35:35 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXyp759h for ; Tue, 30 Dec 2003 03:35:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from web60703.mail.yahoo.com (web60703.mail.yahoo.com [216.109.117.226]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 9DAA8B3A9A for ; Tue, 30 Dec 2003 10:35:30 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20031230023527.48366.qmail@web60703.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [62.38.239.143] by web60703.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 30 Dec 2003 02:35:27 GMT Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 02:35:27 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-7?q?andrian?= To: mk , sk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Re: [Metakit] metakit and UTF-8 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 02:35:35 -0000 This email is to undo my previous posting. Unicode support in 'Mk4tcl' is just a matter of setting the proper encoding using the 'fconfigure -encoding' Tcl command. There is a howto page with more details here: http://www.tcl.tk/doc/howto/i18n.html I cannot overemphasize the merits of building a multilingual database with such tools as tcl and metakit. Thanks and regards, andrian ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? ÁðïêôÞóôå ôç äùñåÜí @yahoo.gr äéåýèõíóç óáò óôï http://www.otenet.gr From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jan 1 00:13:47 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9C6FB3A97 for ; Thu, 1 Jan 2004 00:13:46 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX5zJxug for ; Wed, 31 Dec 2003 17:13:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5B6AB3A89 for ; Thu, 1 Jan 2004 00:13:40 +0800 (WST) Received: from eq195.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.125.195] helo=kocjan.org) by dq.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Abj0G-0002Hj-00 for ; Wed, 31 Dec 2003 17:15:24 +0100 Message-ID: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 17:14:12 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: [Starkit] dqkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 16:13:47 -0000 Hello. Since many of you people have always asked for BLT-enabled tclkit, I've decided to put my new and improved "dqkit" (as JCW asked me not to call it tclkit :-). It was known as "bikit" (which was more of a private project :-). What's cool is the new build system, which does dependency checks (builds Tk if it needs to build Itk or BLT) and appends the vfs part using tclvfs - copying only required parts. The project currently includes building tcl, tk, mk, vfs, zlib, tclx, itcl, itk, iwidgets, blt, tbcload, tclsqlite and openssl+tls. I plan to add some tcl-only extensions so that they are or are not wrapped. This is a lot, but I've decided to build a system where I can compile everything my software needs to run with just one line. It also will support building with multiple versions (ie tcl 8.4.3 or 8.4.5), which helps in debugging and testing (it's usually quite hard The url for downloads of source and binary version: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=65692&package_id=105324 -- WK From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 3 02:53:09 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 130B5B3A9E for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 02:53:09 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXeYaFCY for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 19:53:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CA93B3A9D for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 02:53:07 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 49BC183C26; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 19:53:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7FFC83914 for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 19:53:02 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] dqkit Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 19:53:02 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 18:53:09 -0000 Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > Since many of you people have always asked for BLT-enabled tclkit, > I've decided to put my new and improved "dqkit" (as JCW asked me not > to call it tclkit :-). It was known as "bikit" (which was more of a > private project :-). [...] > The url for downloads of source and binary version: > http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php? > group_id=65692&package_id=105324 Great! Thanks for sharing. What does "dqkit" stand for? The geek in me keeps telling me it must be an acronym... -jcw From wojciech@kocjan.org Sat Jan 3 03:30:30 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B4E9B3A9E for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 03:30:30 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXhqJD5g for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 20:30:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8BD4B3A9D for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 03:30:23 +0800 (WST) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AcV1m-0007U0-00 for ; Fri, 02 Jan 2004 20:32:10 +0100 Message-ID: <3FF5C6EE.8040109@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 20:30:54 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] dqkit References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 19:30:30 -0000 Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > >> Since many of you people have always asked for BLT-enabled tclkit, >> I've decided to put my new and improved "dqkit" (as JCW asked me not >> to call it tclkit :-). It was known as "bikit" (which was more of a >> private project :-). > Great! Thanks for sharing. :-) > What does "dqkit" stand for? The geek in me keeps telling me it must > be an acronym... DQ stands for DataQuest, the company's name. Which in turn is a combination of fact that we process data, and the founder's nickname is "quest" ;-) -- WK From will@wjduquette.com Sat Jan 3 04:11:13 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 136D1B3A9F for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 04:11:11 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX288erW for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 21:11:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from bittern.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bittern.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.119]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67144B3A9E for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 04:11:10 +0800 (WST) Received: from pool0290.cvx25-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.217.35] helo=[10.0.1.2]) by bittern.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AcVdh-00023E-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 02 Jan 2004 12:11:21 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: starkit@equi4.com From: Will Duquette Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 12:11:03 -0800 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Metakit errors while using Starkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 20:11:14 -0000 Howdy! A few days ago I released a new Starkit of my Notebook application (see http://www.wjduquette.com/notebook for notebook2.0.1.kit). Bryan Oakley gave it a try on Mac OS X with X11, using a Tcl/Tk 8.4.5 version of tclkit, and sent me this report: I (Bryan Oakley) just downloaded 2.0.1.kit. When I run it on my mac I get a multitude of errors that look like I/O error during commit while executing "mk::file commit $db" (procedure "::mk4vfs::periodicCommit" line 4) invoked from within "::mk4vfs::periodicCommit mk4vfs1" ("after" script) These happen whenever I "do something", such as click in the search box. I have write permission on the starkit. Others have seen it on Linux with tclkits for several different versions of Tcl/Tk. Any ideas? Will ------------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | Catch our weblog, http://foothills.wjduquette.com | The View from the Foothills From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 3 04:24:30 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6196DB3A9F for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 04:24:30 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXBa6Mmi for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 21:24:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2B55B3A9E for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 04:24:28 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 99D7883C26; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 21:24:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFFBC83914 for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 21:24:24 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Metakit errors while using Starkit Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 21:24:24 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 20:24:30 -0000 Will Duquette wrote: > I/O error during commit while executing "mk::file commit $db" > (procedure "::mk4vfs::periodicCommit" line 4) invoked from within > "::mk4vfs::periodicCommit mk4vfs1" ("after" script) > > These happen whenever I "do something", such as click in the > search box. I have write permission on the starkit. The fact that commits are scheduled means you're writing into the starkit - is that your intention? Did you wrap with "-writeable"? Actually, I can answer that (just downloaded your starkit): nope, it ain't wrapped in a way which allows writing. Solution, redo as: sdx wrap notebook2.0.1.kit -writeable (Explanation: MK needs to be told very early on that it has to open a file as r/w, before the starkit is mounted - the "-writeable" flag generates a starkit header which does the right thing) -jcw From will@wjduquette.com Sat Jan 3 09:36:43 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CD84B3A9E; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 09:36:43 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXYNqY4e; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 02:36:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net (swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.123]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5281B3A92; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 09:36:42 +0800 (WST) Received: from pool0625.cvx1-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.178.130.115] helo=[10.0.1.2]) by swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AcaiW-0002Jg-00; Fri, 02 Jan 2004 17:36:40 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <446B862C-3D8D-11D8-95B6-000A956F0A58@wjduquette.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] Metakit errors while using Starkit Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 17:36:35 -0800 To: Jean-Claude Wippler X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2004 01:36:44 -0000 Jean-Claude, Yeah, just after I sent that I figure out that I was writing to the starkit accidentally; I fixed that, and then the problem went away. It seems to me, though, that this reveals a problem with either tclvfs or the tclvfs/Metakit interface--it seems like I should have gotten an error when I tried to open a file for writing, and I didn't. Thanks for looking into it! Will On Jan 2, 2004, at 12:24 PM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Will Duquette wrote: > >> I/O error during commit while executing "mk::file commit $db" >> (procedure "::mk4vfs::periodicCommit" line 4) invoked from within >> "::mk4vfs::periodicCommit mk4vfs1" ("after" script) >> >> These happen whenever I "do something", such as click in the >> search box. I have write permission on the starkit. > > The fact that commits are scheduled means you're writing into the > starkit - is that your intention? > > Did you wrap with "-writeable"? Actually, I can answer that (just > downloaded your starkit): nope, it ain't wrapped in a way which allows > writing. Solution, redo as: > sdx wrap notebook2.0.1.kit -writeable > > (Explanation: MK needs to be told very early on that it has to open a > file as r/w, before the starkit is mounted - the "-writeable" flag > generates a starkit header which does the right thing) > > -jcw > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > ------------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | Catch our weblog, http://foothills.wjduquette.com | The View from the Foothills From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 3 19:59:45 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08CB7B3AA6 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 19:59:45 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXm8kdsx for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:59:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C05AB3AA3 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 19:59:43 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 9D4D583C26; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:59:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73AC183914 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:59:39 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <446B862C-3D8D-11D8-95B6-000A956F0A58@wjduquette.com> References: <446B862C-3D8D-11D8-95B6-000A956F0A58@wjduquette.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4E1D7927-3DE4-11D8-9DB7-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Metakit errors while using Starkit Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:59:37 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 03 Jan 2004 11:59:45 -0000 Will Duquette wrote: > Yeah, just after I sent that I figure out that I was writing to the > starkit accidentally; I fixed that, and then the problem went away. > It seems to me, though, that this reveals a problem with either > tclvfs or the tclvfs/Metakit interface--it seems like I should have > gotten an error when I tried to open a file for writing, and I didn't. Yes, there are some hairy issues, and it isn't right yet. The tricky detail is that MK supports "translucent changes" (for want of a better term): you can make changes which never make it to disk. Such changes can be serialized to a new file as a snapshot, even though never committed, and that includes any type of change, including restructuring the database. It sounds esoteric, and probably is for basic uses, but it really opens up some very effective options (such as opening a starkit read-only, turning it into a catalog, and sending the results over a socket, as starsync/starchive do). Closer to home: someone recently mentioned that you can copy more encodings into a running tclkit and then use them, even though it cannot be written while running. It gets even more unusual when you use MK's "commit-aside" feature, which lets you commit changes to a second file (e.g. commit to a datafile stored on CD-ROM, with differences saved on a local disk but completely transparent in application use). These design options have not been worked out yet, so for now they are just confusing gimmicks in the context of starkits. There has been some work by Vince Darley and me to get the r/o vs. r/w vs. translucent modes to work better for simple cases, making it fail for write actions when open r/o in a "normal" way, for example. Apparently, something is still amiss. -jcw From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Fri Jan 9 05:59:49 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C73E0B3AED for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 05:59:48 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXv5QFyq for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 22:59:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41902.mail.yahoo.com (web41902.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.153]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 62055B3A8D for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 05:59:47 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040108215946.12780.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41902.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 08 Jan 2004 13:59:46 PST Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 13:59:46 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 21:59:50 -0000 Is there any documentation somewhere or do you have any tips on how to improve: - The time it takes to add files to starkit - Reducing the size of starkit I am adding the files to the starkit using something similar to: foreach f $files { file copy $f $mountedStarkit } The starkit has been mounted with compress option set to 1 So, if I take /usr/lib in my Linux system it is 622Mb If I do tar cvfz lib.tgz /usr/lib it takes 9 minutes and its size is 220Mb If I pack it in the starkit it takes 50 minutes and its size is 405Mb Any hints on how to reduce the size of the starkit or make the process faster so it is comparable to tar + gzip ? Thanks __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri Jan 9 06:35:05 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62A24B3AED for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 06:35:05 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX6QUOUf for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 23:35:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 194C6B3A8D for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 06:35:02 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 16:34:56 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 16:34:56 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: guacamole1234@yahoo.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 16:34:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 22:35:06 -0000 From: Guaca Mole [mailto:guacamole1234@yahoo.com] > > I am adding the files to the starkit using something > similar to: > > foreach f $files { > file copy $f $mountedStarkit > } > ... > > Any hints on how to reduce the size of the starkit or > make the process faster so it is comparable to tar + > gzip ? Not sure about the speed, but compressing lots of little files takes up more space than compressing a single large tar file. Tar+gzip is just more efficient. I don't think you're going to get better space utilization out of the starkit. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From jahbini@romantictrances.com Fri Jan 9 06:56:40 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08161B3AED for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 06:56:39 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXzCf731 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 23:56:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from ns2.romantictrances.com (rrcs-west-66-91-154-154.biz.rr.com [66.91.154.154]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDF19B3A8D for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 06:56:34 +0800 (WST) Received: from romantictrances.com (unknown [10.0.0.2]) by ns2.romantictrances.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AB8BB0089 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 17:56:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3FFDE021.6040201@romantictrances.com> Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 12:56:33 -1000 From: Jim Hinds User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en; Stable) Gecko/20020826 Beonex/0.8.1-stable X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Starkit] starkit & mingw Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------010905080607050107060300" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: jahbini@lava.net List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 22:56:41 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010905080607050107060300 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wolfgang Grossbauer had the following problem: Did anyone have a fix? I'm running into a showstopper when with the link step for kitsh: RUN: g++ -o kitsh.exe pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl84s.a ../vfs/libvfs12.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a ERROR: child process exited abnormally There are lots of unresolved referances: most notably: kitInit.o(.text+0x1e7):kitInit.c: undefined reference to `Dde_Init' kitInit.o(.text+0x1fd):kitInit.c: undefined reference to `Registry_Init' ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o)(.text+0x12): In function `ZN12SiasStrategy8Dat aReadElPvi': C:/kit/build/MAUI/mk/../../../src/mk/tcl/mk4tcl.cpp: undefined reference to `_im p__Tcl_EvalObjEx' ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o)(.text+0x313): In function `Z11mkEventProcP9Tcl _Eventi': C:/kit/build/MAUI/mk/../../../src/mk/tcl/mk4tcl.cpp:255: undefined reference to `_imp__Tcl_NotifyChannel' ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o)(.text+0x33c): In function `Z11mkCheckProcPvi': C:/kit/build/MAUI/mk/../../../src/mk/tcl/mk4tcl.cpp:267: undefined reference to `_imp__Tcl_Alloc' ... and lots more Thanks. Jim Hinds --------------010905080607050107060300 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="mailbox-message://jahbini@localhost/starkit#5026723" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="mailbox-message://jahbini@localhost/starkit#5026723" >From wg@magro-soft.com Thu Sep 18 16:58:14 2003 Received: from magro-soft.com (ip18429.hera.net [213.244.184.29] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8ILwDD14756 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 16:58:13 -0500 Received: from magro-soft.com (MAGRO1.sbg [212.41.236.140]) by magro-soft.com (8.8.8) id XAA25584; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:58:14 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3F6A2A71.5060102@magro-soft.com> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:58:09 +0200 From: Wolfgang Grossbauer User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030808 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] starkit & mingw Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, is there a way to build tclkit on a win2000 using mingw? Or some other envoronment *except* MSVC6? All my builds fail at building kitsh. After fumbling in genkit (tar statement), all other modules build ok. I need a patched tk Version of tclkit-win32.upx.exe. I had *no* problems at all compiling on Linux... Wolf -- Wolfgang Grossbauer ................... Tel: +43 662 856669 11 MAGRO Software Engineering & Design ... Mob: +43 676 780 1405 Holunderstr. 481 ...................... Mail: wg@magro-soft.com A-5071 Wals / Salzburg ................ http://www.magro-soft.com --------------010905080607050107060300-- From jcw@equi4.com Fri Jan 9 07:54:25 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04835B3AEE for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 07:54:25 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXgYVNgf for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 00:54:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2C5CB3A8D for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 07:54:22 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 2D1B483C26; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 00:54:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.252] (10.0.1.252 [10.0.1.252]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E09DA83914 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 00:54:17 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <20040108215946.12780.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040108215946.12780.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 00:54:17 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 23:54:25 -0000 Guaca Mole wrote: > So, if I take /usr/lib in my Linux system it is 622Mb > If I do tar cvfz lib.tgz /usr/lib > it takes 9 minutes and its size is 220Mb > > If I pack it in the starkit it takes 50 minutes and > its size is 405Mb Not bad! You're comparing C code versus scripted code and single compression versus per-file compression. It's unlikely that speed can be improved substantially without a major rewrite of the Mk4vfs driver and the compression logic used (there's more copying going on than strictly needed). I'd be interested to hear about acces/unpack performance comparisons, if you have any. W.r.t size the comparison is not quite fair: starkits (and zip archives) support instant access to individual files, tar/gzip does not. If you want a more meaningful comparison, you should compare starkits to zip archives. I wouldn't be surprised if starkits can open+fetch a single file faster than zip archives, btw - that's where the database should kick in - but then again I've never done any measurements. Having said that, it may well be that your starkit contains free space from multiple commits made while it is being created. I've just added a new subcommand to "sdx" to pack any Metakit datafile optimally (hence also starkits/starpacks): sdx mkpack Only light testing so far, but it's relatively simple code so it should be ok. On a similar note, I recently also added an "sdx mksplit" command which splits starkits and starpacks in two, i.e. a head (script or exe) and a tail (Metakit data). Can be of use to splice and muck with starkits and starpacks at times. You can get the new SDX as usual, the home page is http://www.equi4.com/sdx.html -jcw From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Fri Jan 9 18:10:27 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 103E4B3A95 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 18:10:27 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXDytUWR for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 11:10:25 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41905.mail.yahoo.com (web41905.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.156]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C92F5B3A8D for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 18:10:24 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040109101023.60700.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41905.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 09 Jan 2004 02:10:23 PST Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 02:10:23 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: RE: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: "Techentin, Robert W." , starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 10:10:27 -0000 > Not sure about the speed, but compressing lots of > little files takes up more > space than compressing a single large tar file. > Tar+gzip is just more > efficient. I don't think you're going to get better > space utilization out > of the starkit. Yes, I know, I was hoping for some little tip along the lines of "set mk4vfs::compressionLevel 3" for an extra 10% savings but I guess it is not possible :) My brainstorming ideas right now: - Would it be possible to replace zip vfs with a bzip2 vfs ? - Would it be possible to have two vfs one inside the other? have a tar vfs inside a zip vfs? - Some other way of making the starkit payload be a .tar.gz archive instead of a metakit database ? __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Fri Jan 9 18:49:25 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABCBEB3AF4 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 18:49:25 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXuCKtpT for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 11:49:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41904.mail.yahoo.com (web41904.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.155]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C35D9B3AF2 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 18:49:23 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040109104922.90528.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41904.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 09 Jan 2004 02:49:22 PST Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 02:49:22 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 10:49:26 -0000 > > > > If I pack it in the starkit it takes 50 minutes > and > > its size is 405Mb > > Not bad! Yes, but not enough for my needs. I want tclkit to replace distribution of potentially .tar.gz files, cant do that if resulting archives is double size :( > You're comparing C code versus scripted code and > single compression > versus per-file compression. Yes, just looking for ways of improving the tclkit side of things > It's unlikely that speed can be improved > substantially without a major > rewrite of the Mk4vfs driver and the compression > logic used (there's > more copying going on than strictly needed). I'd be > interested to hear > about acces/unpack performance comparisons, if you > have any. I havent timed it, but unpacking time is reasonable > W.r.t size the comparison is not quite fair: > starkits (and zip > archives) support instant access to individual > files, tar/gzip does > not. The idea is to use starkit for selfcontained distribution of files as opposed to .tar.gz This works ok for small number of files, but differences are just way too big when number of files increases (for the reasons you mention) > Having said that, it may well be that your starkit > contains free space > from multiple commits made while it is being > created. I've just added > a new subcommand to "sdx" to pack any Metakit > datafile optimally (hence > also starkits/starpacks): > sdx mkpack > Only light testing so far, but it's relatively > simple code so it should > be ok. It helps a little bit. Just tried it on a 26.9Mb file and went down to 26.1Mb Cheers __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Fri Jan 9 19:43:05 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3F7CB3AF2 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 19:43:04 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXJDR4DM for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 12:43:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from digitalsmarties.com (gw.digitalsmarties.com [202.72.154.181]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 2B0CDB3A95 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 19:43:01 +0800 (WST) Received: (qmail 23066 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2004 11:32:20 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (127.0.0.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (127.0.0.1) with ESMTP; 09 Jan 2004 11:32:20 -0000 In-Reply-To: <20040109104922.90528.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040109104922.90528.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 19:42:54 +0800 To: Guaca Mole X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Jean-Claude Wippler cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 11:43:05 -0000 >>> >>> If I pack it in the starkit it takes 50 minutes >> and >>> its size is 405Mb >> >> Not bad! > > Yes, but not enough for my needs. I want tclkit to > replace distribution of potentially .tar.gz files, > cant do that if resulting archives is double size :( But you're comparing apples with oranges ... At some point the tarball will need to be uncompressed otherwise you can't use it - correct? This implies that space is only critical during the download/distributes - so why not just create the Starkit with compression turned off, and put it into a tarball or zip? Steve From Wolf-Dieter.Busch@gmx.de Thu Jan 8 02:20:23 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71C0EB3A9A for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 02:20:23 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXGY85gg for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2004 19:20:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id E7DB9B3A8E for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 02:20:22 +0800 (WST) Received: (qmail 14187 invoked by uid 0); 7 Jan 2004 18:20:22 -0000 Received: from 145.254.198.253 by www27.gmx.net with HTTP; Wed, 7 Jan 2004 19:20:22 +0100 (MET) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 19:20:22 +0100 (MET) From: "Wolf-Dieter Busch" To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-Authenticated: #20431421 Message-ID: <14938.1073499622@www27.gmx.net> X-Mailer: WWW-Mail 1.6 (Global Message Exchange) X-Flags: 0001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:09:50 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] crash on exit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2004 18:20:23 -0000 Hi everybody, with my actual project "One Hand Content", I've got this problem: On my PC (Win95), everything works fine, but when running in Win2K, it crashes on exit (in most cases). I'm a little bit desperate because I don't see any chance to fix it. Another reason of being *not such* happy is the fact that I realized this problem quite lately such that my code is quite increased :-( Is there any known problem around which could lead to a helpful suggestion? If so, thank you very much! Yours Wolf-Dieter Busch http://home.arcor.de/wolf-dieter.busch/ From jahbini@66.91.154.154 Fri Jan 9 09:56:35 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97F41B3AEE for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 09:56:35 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX96K9a4 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 02:56:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from ns2.romantictrances.com (rrcs-west-66-91-154-154.biz.rr.com [66.91.154.154]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2ABAB3A8D for ; Fri, 9 Jan 2004 09:56:33 +0800 (WST) Received: from 66.91.154.154 (unknown [10.0.0.2]) by ns2.romantictrances.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A99DAB0089 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2004 20:56:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3FFE0A50.1000208@66.91.154.154> Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 15:56:32 -1000 From: Jim Hinds User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en; Stable) Gecko/20020826 Beonex/0.8.1-stable X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: [Fwd: [Starkit] starkit & mingw] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------030600070401090804050008" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:09:50 +0100 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Starkit list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 01:56:36 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030600070401090804050008 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Most of the link problems go away if the 'mk' module is compiled with the 'STATIC_BUILD' macro defined for the mk4tcl step. Otherwise, the windows default is to grab the tcl API stuff from some .dll. When building starkits (with tcl and tk statically linked in) the names get mangled from Tcl_EvalObjEx to _imp__Tcl_EvalObjEx, for example. The current CVS sources for mk do NOT have STATIC_BUILD in any of the config or make mechanism. I found the 'most convenient' place to splice this macro into the build was in the 'mk wing of the genkit build: mk { config mk/unix --with-tcl=$S/tcl/generic --disable-shared run sh -c "CXX=\"g++ -DSTATIC_BUILD\" $X(make) -e libmk4tcl.la" } I tried other ways to do this (via the env array) but mingw doesn't export properly under windows. Jim PS I'm still working on the 'Init_dde' unresolved referance. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [Starkit] starkit & mingw Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 12:56:33 -1000 From: Jim Hinds Reply-To: jahbini@lava.net To: Starkit list Wolfgang Grossbauer had the following problem: (see attachment) Did anyone have a fix? I'm running into a showstopper when with the link step for kitsh: RUN: g++ -o kitsh.exe pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl84s.a ../vfs/libvfs12.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a ../zlib/libz.a ERROR: child process exited abnormally There are lots of unresolved referances: most notably: kitInit.o(.text+0x1e7):kitInit.c: undefined reference to `Dde_Init' kitInit.o(.text+0x1fd):kitInit.c: undefined reference to `Registry_Init' ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o)(.text+0x12): In function `ZN12SiasStrategy8Dat aReadElPvi': C:/kit/build/MAUI/mk/../../../src/mk/tcl/mk4tcl.cpp: undefined reference to `_im p__Tcl_EvalObjEx' ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o)(.text+0x313): In function `Z11mkEventProcP9Tcl _Eventi': C:/kit/build/MAUI/mk/../../../src/mk/tcl/mk4tcl.cpp:255: undefined reference to `_imp__Tcl_NotifyChannel' ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a(mk4tcl.o)(.text+0x33c): In function `Z11mkCheckProcPvi': C:/kit/build/MAUI/mk/../../../src/mk/tcl/mk4tcl.cpp:267: undefined reference to `_imp__Tcl_Alloc' ... and lots more Thanks. Jim Hinds --------------030600070401090804050008 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="mailbox-message://jahbini@localhost/starkit#5026723.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="mailbox-message://jahbini@localhost/starkit#5026723.eml" >From wg@magro-soft.com Thu Sep 18 16:58:14 2003 Received: from magro-soft.com (ip18429.hera.net [213.244.184.29] (may be forged)) by trixie.triqs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8ILwDD14756 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 16:58:13 -0500 Received: from magro-soft.com (MAGRO1.sbg [212.41.236.140]) by magro-soft.com (8.8.8) id XAA25584; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:58:14 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3F6A2A71.5060102@magro-soft.com> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:58:09 +0200 From: Wolfgang Grossbauer User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030808 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Starkit] starkit & mingw Sender: starkit-admin@equi4.com Errors-To: starkit-admin@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi all, is there a way to build tclkit on a win2000 using mingw? Or some other envoronment *except* MSVC6? All my builds fail at building kitsh. After fumbling in genkit (tar statement), all other modules build ok. I need a patched tk Version of tclkit-win32.upx.exe. I had *no* problems at all compiling on Linux... Wolf -- Wolfgang Grossbauer ................... Tel: +43 662 856669 11 MAGRO Software Engineering & Design ... Mob: +43 676 780 1405 Holunderstr. 481 ...................... Mail: wg@magro-soft.com A-5071 Wals / Salzburg ................ http://www.magro-soft.com --------------030600070401090804050008 Content-Type: text/plain; name="file:///tmp/nsmail-1.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="file:///tmp/nsmail-1.txt" _____________________________________________ Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit --------------030600070401090804050008-- From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 10 18:18:08 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59D40B3A93 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:18:08 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX1IM6Te for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:18:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E19BDB3A88 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:18:06 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 7E1B683C26; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:18:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E71C883914 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:18:02 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <14938.1073499622@www27.gmx.net> References: <14938.1073499622@www27.gmx.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4566435A-4356-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] crash on exit Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:18:01 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 10:18:08 -0000 Wolf-Dieter Busch wrote: > On my PC (Win95), everything works fine, but when running in Win2K, it > crashes on exit (in most cases). I'm a little bit desperate because I > don't see > any chance to fix it. Another reason of being *not such* happy is the > fact that > I realized this problem quite lately such that my code is quite > increased > :-( If "tclkit myapp.kit" crashes, does "tclkit myapp.vfs/main.tcl" crash as well? (You need to have an unwrapped copy, i.e. "sdx unwrap myapp.kit") Do you write files in the starkit while it is running? The best thing you can do is remove code from your app until it is really simple, yet still crashes. That is probably the only way to identify the problem. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 10 18:26:14 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25357B3A93 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:26:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXWVtoVG for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:26:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 328D4B3A88 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:26:12 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id E8F2183C26; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:26:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0942683914 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:26:08 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <3FFE0A50.1000208@66.91.154.154> References: <3FFE0A50.1000208@66.91.154.154> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <6768DF10-4357-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Fwd: [Starkit] starkit & mingw] Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 11:26:08 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 10:26:14 -0000 Jim Hinds wrote: > Most of the link problems go away if the 'mk' module is compiled with > the 'STATIC_BUILD' macro defined for the mk4tcl step. Otherwise, the > windows default is to grab the tcl API stuff from some .dll. When > building starkits (with tcl and tk statically linked in) the names get > mangled from Tcl_EvalObjEx to _imp__Tcl_EvalObjEx, for example. > > The current CVS sources for mk do NOT have STATIC_BUILD in any of the > config or make mechanism. I found the 'most convenient' place to > splice this macro into the build was in the 'mk wing of the genkit > build: > > mk { > config mk/unix --with-tcl=$S/tcl/generic --disable-shared > run sh -c "CXX=\"g++ -DSTATIC_BUILD\" $X(make) -e libmk4tcl.la" > } > > I tried other ways to do this (via the env array) but mingw doesn't > export properly under windows. Hm... weird that this never has been a problem before. I build tclkit for windows myself using MSVC6. Could this be added permanently to all builds of genkit? > PS I'm still working on the 'Init_dde' unresolved referance. That means the DDE extension was not linked in - it probably has to do with the same reason: that I never used genkit with Windows (dde and registry are windows-specific - both are part of Tcl itself). > is there a way to build tclkit on a win2000 using mingw? > Or some other envoronment *except* MSVC6? Google for dqkit - or go here: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php? group_id=65692&package_id=105324 AFAIK it was built with mingw, and all sources and build scripts are included. > I need a patched tk Version of tclkit-win32.upx.exe. -jcw From wojciech@kocjan.org Sun Jan 11 01:19:08 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77620B3A97 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 01:19:08 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXg6F2J7 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:19:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9255FB3A88 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 01:19:07 +0800 (WST) Received: from er30.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.236.30] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AfMnM-0003zH-00 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:21:08 +0100 Message-ID: <40003431.3020606@kocjan.org> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 18:19:45 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] starkit & mingw References: <3FFDE021.6040201@romantictrances.com> In-Reply-To: <3FFDE021.6040201@romantictrances.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 17:19:09 -0000 Jim Hinds wrote: > Wolfgang Grossbauer had the following problem: > > Did anyone have a fix? I'm running into a showstopper when with the > link step for kitsh: Have a look at dqkit, available from: http://sourceforge.net/projects/dqsoftware/ It's a tclkit-like project and Windows builds are done on mingw. It also has a bit cleaner build script (at least in my opinion :-). -- WK From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Jan 12 03:21:09 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9D62B3AE6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:21:08 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXbhJcWz for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 20:21:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41904.mail.yahoo.com (web41904.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.155]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 8EB65B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:21:07 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040111192106.72429.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41904.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:21:06 PST Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:21:06 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 19:21:09 -0000 > > Yes, but not enough for my needs. I want tclkit to > > replace distribution of potentially .tar.gz files, > > cant do that if resulting archives is double size > > But you're comparing apples with oranges ... > > At some point the tarball will need to be > uncompressed otherwise you > can't use it - correct? Yes, actually the point is to get rid of the tarball, so the user only has to download the tclkit and double-click it. The tclkit copies the files some place in the system and runs a series of actions. This replaces the typical tar xvfz program.tar.gz cd program more README [run a number of scripts] > This implies that space is only critical during the > download/distributes Correct, specially with files potentially several hundred megabytes big > - so why not just create the > Starkit with > compression turned off, and put it into a tarball or > zip? The tclkit performs other actions apart from being a transport. I can tell the users to run those scripts and perform a few substitutions in configuration files, but you will be surprised to learn how many different ways users can find to shoot their own feet :) so this would be a way of automating the process. I can do the opposite : store a tar.gz in the tclkit and then copy out and extract it. But this does not work that well if the tar.gz several hundred megabytes (because you need double the space) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From will@wjduquette.com Mon Jan 12 05:21:35 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E31F9B3AE6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 05:21:34 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXqCBWSz for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 22:21:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11100B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 05:21:34 +0800 (WST) Received: from pool0307.cvx13-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.33.52] helo=[10.0.1.2]) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Afn1V-0006t2-00; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:21:30 -0800 In-Reply-To: <20040111192106.72429.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040111192106.72429.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v606) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <25239216-447C-11D8-B1D2-000A956F0A58@wjduquette.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:21:39 -0800 To: Guaca Mole X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.606) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:21:35 -0000 So put the tar.gz file into the starkit as a normal file, don't worry about compression, and have the starkit expand the tar.gz file onto the host filesystem. Will On Jan 11, 2004, at 11:21 AM, Guaca Mole wrote: >>> Yes, but not enough for my needs. I want tclkit to >>> replace distribution of potentially .tar.gz files, >>> cant do that if resulting archives is double size >> >> But you're comparing apples with oranges ... >> >> At some point the tarball will need to be >> uncompressed otherwise you >> can't use it - correct? > > Yes, actually the point is to get rid of the tarball, > so the user only has to download the tclkit and > double-click it. The tclkit copies the files some > place in the system and runs a series of actions. > This replaces the typical > > tar xvfz program.tar.gz > cd program > more README > [run a number of scripts] > >> This implies that space is only critical during the >> download/distributes > > Correct, specially with files potentially several > hundred megabytes big > >> - so why not just create the >> Starkit with >> compression turned off, and put it into a tarball or >> zip? > > The tclkit performs other actions apart from being a > transport. I can tell the users to run those scripts > and perform a few substitutions in configuration > files, but you will be surprised to learn how many > different ways users can find to shoot their own feet > :) so this would be a way of automating the process. I > can do the opposite : store a tar.gz in the tclkit and > then copy out and extract it. But this does not work > that well if the tar.gz several hundred megabytes > (because you need double the space) > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > ------------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | Catch our weblog, http://foothills.wjduquette.com | The View from the Foothills From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Jan 12 05:51:10 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78F7CB3AE6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 05:51:10 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXuo6jil for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 22:51:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41906.mail.yahoo.com (web41906.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.157]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 536B1B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 05:51:09 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040111215108.20348.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41906.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:51:08 PST Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:51:08 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: Will Duquette In-Reply-To: <25239216-447C-11D8-B1D2-000A956F0A58@wjduquette.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:51:10 -0000 > So put the tar.gz file into the starkit as a normal > file, > don't worry about compression, and have the starkit > expand the tar.gz file onto the host filesystem. I already thought about it (see below). No problem if small files but can be a problem if file is several hundred megabytes. The problem with tar file is that I would require 3 times the space: One for the Tclkit, one for extracting the tar to the filesystem and one for extracting the contents. Unless it is possible to layer VFS inside each other (open a vfs::tar file inside mk4vfs::vfs) ? > process. I > > can do the opposite : store a tar.gz in the tclkit > and > > then copy out and extract it. But this does not > work > > that well if the tar.gz several hundred megabytes > > (because you need double the space) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 12 06:06:56 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A174B3AE6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 06:06:56 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXbI2JRO for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 23:06:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FED1B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 06:06:54 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id E0E4A83C26; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 23:06:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C4BC83914 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 23:06:50 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <20040111215108.20348.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040111215108.20348.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <7476184E-4482-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 23:06:49 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 22:06:56 -0000 Guaca Mole wrote: > The problem with tar file is that I > would require 3 times the space: One for the Tclkit, > one for extracting the tar to the filesystem and one > for extracting the contents. Unless it is possible to > layer VFS inside each other (open a vfs::tar file > inside mk4vfs::vfs) ? Open VFS tar/gz file, open a pipe to tar/gz, and fcopy. No temp space at all. Or save as tar and let starkit do the compression (slower, as you mentioned), then do the above. Same effect, and if you want to totally get rid of outside dependencies you could even do the tar-decode-and-unpack-to-files in Tcl. FWIW, SDX has a "tgz2sdx" sub-command, which contains all the essential logic to decode TAR files in Tcl, so it should be simple to re-use some of that. Summary: if you let the VFS layer decompress, you could have your TAR inside the starkit, compressed as a single file (i.e. better than ZIP), and you could decompress through the normal starkit mechanism and extract files, all from Tcl, no external applications, 100% portable. Or look at the zlib extension (see http://www.equi4.com/critlib/ for a Critcl version), and redo it with bzip2. Should be very easy, since the API's of the two are very similar. There's no rocket science in any of these approaches. It just takes some elbow grease. -jcw From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Jan 12 06:41:33 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51C72B3AF6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 06:41:33 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXDmxD4k for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 23:41:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41904.mail.yahoo.com (web41904.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.155]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3F19CB3AE6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 06:41:31 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040111224130.34661.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41904.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 11 Jan 2004 14:41:30 PST Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 14:41:30 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit list In-Reply-To: <7476184E-4482-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 22:41:33 -0000 > > for extracting the contents. Unless it is possible > to > > layer VFS inside each other (open a vfs::tar file > > inside mk4vfs::vfs) ? > > Open VFS tar/gz file, open a pipe to tar/gz, and > fcopy. No temp space > at all. Ah nice! Although I probably can make tar and gzip a dependency on Linux, it would not work for Windows and not a sure thing either for other OS such as HP-UX or Solaris (native tar has some limitations in path length, etc.) I guess I could build or find binaries for those architectures and bundle them, but I dont have access to many of those architectures so, for practical purposes I need to use something already bundled with Tclkit or pure Tcl (As vfs::tar) > Or save as tar and let starkit do the compression > (slower, as you > mentioned), then do the above. I just checked and vfs::tar is read only access, unfortunately > Same effect, and if > you want to totally > get rid of outside dependencies you could even do > the > tar-decode-and-unpack-to-files in Tcl. FWIW, SDX > has a "tgz2sdx" To eliminiate packing time dependencies I would need a vfs::tar or sdx2tar in pure Tcl [snip] > Or look at the zlib extension (see > http://www.equi4.com/critlib/ for a > Critcl version), and redo it with bzip2. Should be > very easy, since > the API's of the two are very similar. The problem here is external dependencies, I could only do it in those architectures I have access to (mainly x86 at this point). If a vfs::bzip2 layer was written which improved compression ratios over current tcl zlib, would you consider it for Tclkit? > There's no rocket science in any of these > approaches. It just takes > some elbow grease. Yes, and this is important for me. So the solutions right now with minimal external dependencies are: a) Write vfs::tar that can create tar files (or depending on how complex that will be, a simple tar-like vfs that stores all the info in one file and the offsets in another file) b) Write a vfs::bzip2 and convince you to bundle it with Tclkit so it gets built for platforms I dont have access to :) or, compromise architecture for the time being : c) Find and bundle a static tar binary with Linux and Windows (that should cover 90% of my users) and do nothing in the rest of architectures. In most cases my users do not have such big files, but when they do the difference with tar.gz is significant. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From jcw@equi4.com Mon Jan 12 07:31:02 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C44BB3AE6 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 07:31:02 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXwIcu6w for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:31:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D2EEB3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 07:31:00 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 3218F83C26; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:30:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27FF083914 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:30:55 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <20040111224130.34661.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040111224130.34661.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <33E931AA-448E-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:30:55 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 23:31:02 -0000 Guaca Mole wrote: > If a vfs::bzip2 layer was > written which improved compression ratios over > current tcl zlib, would you consider it for Tclkit? No. But you can always add them yourself. > a) Write vfs::tar that can create tar files Look at a little plain-Tcl script called "zipper" in critlib. It creates a zip archive on the fly, a similar approach should work for tar. For tar/gz, you'll need to either buffer/save it all and compress in one sweep, or implement streaming compression (VFS does stream de-compression only). I'm a bit lost by now on what you're trying to do. But that's ok - don't mind me, probably too much task switching. Good luck with the compress/decompress stuff. -jcw From vince.darley@eurobios.com Mon Jan 12 16:19:22 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF1DAB3A91 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:19:21 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXt6tNuK for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 09:19:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector3.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector3.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.159]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55F54B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:19:21 +0800 (WST) Received: from turing.eurobios.com (ACBA7EE6.ipt.aol.com [172.186.126.230]) 3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id BPF90226 (AUTH vincedarley); Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:19:19 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.0.20040112081730.01fc8d68@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:19:16 +0000 To: Starkit list From: Vince Darley Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance In-Reply-To: <20040111224130.34661.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> References: <7476184E-4482-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <20040111224130.34661.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:19:22 -0000 At 22:41 11/01/2004, Guaca Mole wrote: >I just checked and vfs::tar is read only access, >unfortunately It's all pure Tcl. Why not add writing capbility yourself? a) Write vfs::tar that can create tar files >(or depending on how complex that will be, a simple >tar-like vfs that stores all the info in one file and >the offsets in another file) But you've seen that possibility already. cheers, Vince. From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Jan 12 17:12:03 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 317B0B3A91 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 17:12:03 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXQBQKB0 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 10:12:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41903.mail.yahoo.com (web41903.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.154]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1DAB3B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 17:12:01 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040112091159.79608.qmail@web41903.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41903.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 01:11:59 PST Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 01:11:59 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.0.20040112081730.01fc8d68@mail.wolfbusiness.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 09:12:03 -0000 > >I just checked and vfs::tar is read only access, > >unfortunately > > It's all pure Tcl. Why not add writing capbility > yourself? Yes, from all the feedback so far that looks like the best solution. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Jan 12 17:25:18 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85748B3A91 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 17:25:18 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXOm2sCi for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 10:25:18 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41903.mail.yahoo.com (web41903.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.154]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 46018B3A8A for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 17:25:17 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040112092516.83548.qmail@web41903.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41903.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 Jan 2004 01:25:16 PST Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 01:25:16 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Improving Tcl compression and performance To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <33E931AA-448E-11D8-A456-000A9588127E@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 09:25:18 -0000 > Look at a little plain-Tcl script called "zipper" in > critlib. It > creates a zip archive on the fly, a similar approach > should work for > tar. For tar/gz, you'll need to either buffer/save > it all and compress > in one sweep, or implement streaming compression > (VFS does stream > de-compression only). I will have a look. I am cofused with what streaming compression means in this context. I guess it means that if I am writing to a file, all changes and write calls are buffered by tclkit until I close the file descriptor, then everything gets compressed and written ? > I'm a bit lost by now on what you're trying to do. > But that's ok - > don't mind me, probably too much task switching. Oh no, it is my fault for providing the information piecemeal. I guess what I am trying to do can be summarized as : * Reduce the amount of space it takes to pack a great number of small files (several hundred megabytes) in a tclkit * Secondarily, reduce the amount of times it takes to put those files into the tclkit. Constraints: * Needs to work in all platforms Tclkit does, but that I dont have access to. That means no external dependencies or compiled libraries. Either use what is already in Tclkit or bundle a pure tcl solution * Since space taken by the files can be big, do not have an intermediate extraction step. Everythign should be from tclkit to final destination in disk. > Good luck with the > compress/decompress stuff. I will need it :) Thanks for all the feedback. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From gclts-starkit@m.gmane.org Wed Jan 14 08:00:52 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D705B3A9E for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:00:52 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXPLbMPg for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 01:00:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from main.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.224.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2AE4B3A8A for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:00:43 +0800 (WST) Received: from root by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgYSg-0003bd-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 01:00:42 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from sea.gmane.org ([80.91.224.252]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgXnM-0003DN-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 00:18:00 +0100 Received: from news by sea.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgXnM-0008R4-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 00:18:00 +0100 From: Hafer Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:18:00 +0000 (UTC) Lines: 51 Message-ID: References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 209.217.153.219 (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)) Sender: news X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:29:30 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Re: dqkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 00:00:52 -0000 Jean-Claude Wippler equi4.com> writes: > > Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > > > Since many of you people have always asked for BLT-enabled tclkit, > > I've decided to put my new and improved "dqkit" (as JCW asked me not > > to call it tclkit . It was known as "bikit" (which was more of a > > private project . > [...] > > The url for downloads of source and binary version: > > http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php? > > group_id=65692&package_id=105324 > > Great! Thanks for sharing. > > What does "dqkit" stand for? The geek in me keeps telling me it must > be an acronym... > > -jcw > > The dqkit is very nice and is almost exactly what I have been looking for. I have wanted to create a Windows tclkit.exe that contained BLT. However, dqkit contains many other packages that I do not need making the .exe larger than I would like it to be. So.... Instead of just asking someone to create a tclkit.exe with the BLT package included in it (unless this has already been done and is posted somewhere). I would like to learn how to create it. I am very new to this so I am a little overwhelmed. I have read the info on the wiki.tcl.tk page but I can't seem to follow some of it. I have never compiled the Tcl core or any other packages I have always just used what was available to me. I have used tclkit.exe and the sdx utility to qwrap, unwrap and wrap myapp.exe so I am not completely new to the tclkit ideas. I just would like to learn the steps of how to create a tclkit.exe that is exactly the same as the tclkit-win32.upx.exe located here http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ but with the BLT package included also. I realize that the BLT package is not like some other Tcl extension packages because it is not stubs enabled but I still would like to learn more about tclkits. Thanks in advance. From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Wed Jan 14 18:09:16 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F696B3A9F for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:09:16 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXM3x2Fc for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:09:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41905.mail.yahoo.com (web41905.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.156]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3A1B0B3A8A for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:09:15 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <20040114100914.54589.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41905.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 02:09:14 PST Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 02:09:14 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit To: Hafer , starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:09:16 -0000 > The dqkit is very nice and is almost exactly what I > have been looking for. [...] > However, dqkit > contains many other packages that I do not need > making the .exe larger than I > would like it to be. So.... [...] > I have never compiled the Tcl core or any other > packages I have always just > used what was available to me. I have used > tclkit.exe and the sdx utility to > qwrap, unwrap and wrap myapp.exe so I am not > completely new to the tclkit > ideas. > > I just would like to learn the steps of how to > create a tclkit.exe that is > exactly the same as the tclkit-win32.upx.exe located > here > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ but with the BLT > package included also. You mention you knoe the sdx utility. Why dont use it to unpack the dqit, remove anything you dont need and pack again? that saves you from having to recompile anything. Cheers __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From wojciech@kocjan.org Wed Jan 14 18:29:41 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04D60B3A9F for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:29:41 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXstpTYS for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:29:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C257B3A8A for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:29:40 +0800 (WST) Received: from eq165.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.125.165] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgiJL-0008O0-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:31:43 +0100 Message-ID: <40051904.7020406@kocjan.org> Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:25:08 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit References: <20040114100914.54589.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20040114100914.54589.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:29:41 -0000 Guaca Mole wrote: > You mention you knoe the sdx utility. Why dont use it > to unpack the dqit, remove anything you dont need and > pack again? that saves you from having to recompile > anything. This is not exactly true. First of all, the packages are compiled static, not linked in the vfs. This means that they cannot be removed. What, however, can be removed is the iwidgets library in the vfs. To save some space, it should be unwrapped, the executable should be stripped from the vfs layer, and wrapped again. This should save about 200kB without recompiling everything. I'm only guessing that stripping the vfs layer would require finding the beginning of vfs layer, probably something like this should work (I'm just improvising now :-): set binary ./dqkit.exe set fh [open $binary r]; fconfigure $fh -translation binary set fc [read $fh]; close $fh regsub "LJ.{4,10}.*\$" $fc "" fc set fh [open $binary w]; fconfigure $fh -translation binary puts -nonewline $fh $fc; close $fh -- WK From wojciech@kocjan.org Wed Jan 14 18:52:01 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 129B4B3A9F for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:52:01 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXBMsVCD for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:52:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 181FBB3A8A for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:52:00 +0800 (WST) Received: from eq165.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.125.165] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Agiez-0008UO-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:54:05 +0100 Message-ID: <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:47:41 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:52:01 -0000 Hafer wrote: > The dqkit is very nice and is almost exactly what I have been looking for. I > have wanted to create a Windows tclkit.exe that contained BLT. However, dqkit > contains many other packages that I do not need making the .exe larger than I > would like it to be. So.... BTW now the project is available at http://sourceforge.net/projects/dqsoftware Understandable. dqkit-Win32-i386-all.exe has many extensions, since I wanted to have a binary that has everything our company ever uses/used. It is too big (2MB) for most smaller projects. > Instead of just asking someone to create a tclkit.exe with the BLT package > included in it (unless this has already been done and is posted somewhere). I > would like to learn how to create it. I am very new to this so I am a little > overwhelmed. I have read the info on the wiki.tcl.tk page but I can't seem to > follow some of it. Ok, assuming that you have similar Windows configuration to mine (that is cygwin and mingw, mingw set in PATH before cygwin), and tcl 8.4 (I have activetcl 8.4.5.0), building a custom dqkit is just as easy as: cd V:/dqkit tclsh gen/buildkit build -tk -blt -resfile=current -binary=custom It should build something with name bin/$host/dqkit-custom.exe :-) Cygwin can be set up from many FTP sites - just download setup.exe and follow instructions. Be sure to overwrite bin/bash.exe as bin/sh.exe, since otherwise I've noticed that some scripts may fail. Be sure to also install upx, since it is needed to compress the binary before adding the vfs libraries - http://upx.sourceforge.net/download/upx124w.zip should prove helpful. MingW can be downloaded from www.mingw.org. However, I have put my mingw snapshot at dqsoftware project on sourceforge, so you can just download the zip from there. > I have never compiled the Tcl core or any other packages I have always just > used what was available to me. I have used tclkit.exe and the sdx utility to > qwrap, unwrap and wrap myapp.exe so I am not completely new to the tclkit > ideas. Using tclkit and compiling it are two different things. I used tclpro and freewrap for years before I managed to compile (without failing :-) > I just would like to learn the steps of how to create a tclkit.exe that is > exactly the same as the tclkit-win32.upx.exe located here > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ but with the BLT package included also. That's impossible with tclkit, but with dqkit. The main difference is that dqkit does not allow changing icons the way sdx can do. The only way > I realize that the BLT package is not like some other Tcl extension packages > because it is not stubs enabled but I still would like to learn more about > tclkits. Yes, BLT is very painful to use. Also note that I'm using blt 3.0 from the CVS (although it seems to work the same as 2.4z :-). -- WK From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 14 19:23:55 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F857B3A9F for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 19:23:55 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXo0GNrF for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:23:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29DD3B3A8A for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 19:23:53 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id DFF2A83C27; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:23:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C721683914 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:23:34 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <16733B42-4684-11D8-BA7C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:23:33 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Adding encodings to Tclkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:23:55 -0000 FYI, there's a new documentation page on how to add more Unicode encodings to Tclkit (or any variant thereof): http://www.equi4.com/tkunicode.html I thought about adding that as a new feature in SDX, but it would have increased its size by some 400 Kb, which is too much bloat for people who just use SDX to wrap and unwrap kits and packs. It should in fact be quite simple to create a separate starkit which carries all the encoding files with it and modifies a tclkit binary in place (not the one running) by mounting, copying, unmounting. Note the use of the new "sdx mksplit" command to easily dissect and re-assemble starpacks. -jcw From jcw@equi4.com Wed Jan 14 21:04:57 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6660CB3AE9 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:04:57 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXA0xshZ for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:04:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 384C9B3AA1 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:04:54 +0800 (WST) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 2EF1683C27; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:04:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BEDE83914 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:04:50 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <40051904.7020406@kocjan.org> References: <20040114100914.54589.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> <40051904.7020406@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <3C44BF5C-4692-11D8-BA7C-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:04:49 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 13:04:57 -0000 Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > I'm only guessing that stripping the vfs layer would require finding > the beginning of vfs layer, probably something like this should work > (I'm just improvising now :-): No need to with recent sdx: $ sdx unwrap dqkit.exe 272 updates applied $ sdx mksplit dqkit.exe dqkit.head: 1486336 bytes dqkit.tail: 692445 bytes $ rm -rf dqkit.vfs/lib/iwidgets4.0.2 $ ls -l dqkit.exe -rw-r--r-- 1 jcw staff 2178781 11 Jan 12:29 dqkit.exe $ sdx wrap dqkit.exe -runtime dqkit.head 209 updates applied $ ls -l dqkit.exe -rwxr-xr-x 1 jcw staff 1881556 14 Jan 14:02 dqkit.exe $ -jcw From gclts-starkit@m.gmane.org Thu Jan 15 01:28:49 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9507B3A9F for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 01:28:48 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXW1hanG for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:28:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from main.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.224.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47714B3A8A for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 01:28:47 +0800 (WST) Received: from list by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Agoow-0003ym-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:28:46 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from sea.gmane.org ([80.91.224.252]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Agoov-0003ye-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:28:45 +0100 Received: from news by sea.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Agoov-0001O2-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:28:45 +0100 From: Hafer Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:28:45 +0000 (UTC) Lines: 14 Message-ID: References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 209.217.153.219 (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)) Sender: news X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:24:52 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Re: dqkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:28:49 -0000 Thanks to everyone that has provided feedback. This is the most help I have received on this subject ever. I will attempt the steps you have suggested. One last question though.. The last statment is missing: The only way... Is there a way to change the icon? It would be nice to be able to do. Again Thanks for the feedback From gclts-starkit@m.gmane.org Thu Jan 15 04:51:53 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 538ABB3A9F for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 04:51:53 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXVj2jKJ for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:51:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from main.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.224.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56DFCB3A8A for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 04:51:51 +0800 (WST) Received: from list by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgrzS-0005z7-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:51:50 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from sea.gmane.org ([80.91.224.252]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgrzR-0005yz-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:51:49 +0100 Received: from news by sea.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AgrzR-0002BB-00 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:51:49 +0100 From: Hafer Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:51:49 +0000 (UTC) Lines: 64 Message-ID: References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 209.217.153.219 (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)) Sender: news X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:24:52 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Re: dqkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:51:53 -0000 Again thanks for the help.... Ok here is what I have done in preperation for creating a dqkit-custom.exe 1) I have downloaded Cygwin and installed it to C:/Cygwin 1.1) I tried to "overwrite bin/bash.exe as bin/sh.exe". However, a sh.exe file was already in the directory. Is that right? 2) I downloaded the dq mingw snapshot (and unzipped it)from sourceforge. 2.1) Placed it in C:/mingw Is the location correct? 3) I downloaded the 15 Meg dqkit-sources-0.2.tar.gz file (unzipped it) from sourceforge and placed it in C:/dkkit. 3.1) Is the location correct? 4) Activetcl 8.4.5.0 was already installed on the machine. I opened a tcl wish and did the following to attempt to create a dqkit-custom.exe: 1) cd C:/dqkit 2) tclsh gen/buildkit build -tk -blt -resfile=current -binary=custom ( I am guessing this will build a kit with tk and blt only, right?) and got the following: Beginning compilation steps: options, setupdirs, tcl, mk, tk, itcl, blt, res, zlib, vfs, link, finalize. [ 1/12] options [ 2/12] setupdirs [ 3/12] tcl sh autoconf couldn't execute "sh": no such file or directory while executing "exec >@file88a218 2>@file88a218 sh autoconf" ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval [concat [list exec >@$fh 2>@$fh] $cmd]" (procedure "out::oexec" line 5) invoked from within "out::oexec {sh autoconf}" (procedure "dirconfigure" line 13) invoked from within "dirconfigure 1 1 C:/dqkit/src/tcl-8.4.5/win C:/dqkit/build/AUSPC056/tcl ... ... ... yada yada yada ... I am certain I have done something very wrong. But what? I think I have not placed all of the files into the correct locations or something along those lines. Can anyone inform me of my mistake? Again I hate to sound so helpless here but I tend to learn by experience not by reading lol. One final thing. I noticed that in the directory C:/dqkit/src/res there is a dqe.ico file. Can I replace that file with my own so that it appears in the final dqkit-custom.exe? Thanks again. From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jan 15 18:16:02 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAEEBB3A91 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:16:01 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXKH94qq for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:16:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2543B3A8A for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:16:00 +0800 (WST) Received: from eq165.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.125.165] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Ah4ZR-0003R3-00; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:17:49 +0100 Message-ID: <4006674C.5060201@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:11:24 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Hafer Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:16:02 -0000 Hafer wrote: > Thanks to everyone that has provided feedback. This is the most help I have > received on this subject ever. I will attempt the steps you have suggested. > > One last question though.. > > The last statment is missing: The only way... Is there a way to change the > icon? It would be nice to be able to do. If you manage to compile it, see the src/res directory, it has *.res files which describe all the information contained in the exe - not only the icons, but also text information (ever annoyed by "Tclkit, a standalone runtime for Tcl/Tk" description? :-). I have provided several configurations as an example, just copy the one you want to use as current.res or supply -resfile=yourname if you named the file yourname.res. btw If you manage to compile dqkit, you are welcome to write documentation on how to compile it ;-) -- WK From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Jan 15 18:21:57 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2190EB3AEE for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:21:57 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXkBg0KV for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:21:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE55BB3A91 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:21:55 +0800 (WST) Received: from eq165.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.125.165] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Ah4fR-0003TB-00; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:24:01 +0100 Message-ID: <400668C0.4040008@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:17:36 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Hafer Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:21:57 -0000 Hafer wrote: > Again thanks for the help.... > > Ok here is what I have done in preperation for creating a dqkit-custom.exe > > 1) I have downloaded Cygwin and installed it to C:/Cygwin > 1.1) I tried to "overwrite bin/bash.exe as bin/sh.exe". > However, a sh.exe file was already in the directory. Is that right? I noticed that cygwin's default sh.exe fails at some configure scripts. Not sure why and never got too curious about it, since bash.exe works fine ;-) Also, try to create C:/cygwin/etc/profile.d/mingw.sh with the line: export PATH=/cygdrive/c/mingw/bin:$PATH > I opened a tcl wish and did the following to attempt to create a > dqkit-custom.exe: You could do that in cmd.exe/command.exe. > 1) cd C:/dqkit > 2) tclsh gen/buildkit build -tk -blt -resfile=current -binary=custom > ( I am guessing this will build a kit with tk and blt only, right?) > > and got the following: > [cut] Ooops. > I am certain I have done something very wrong. But what? I think I have not > placed all of the files into the correct locations or something along those > lines. Can anyone inform me of my mistake? Again I hate to sound so helpless > here but I tend to learn by experience not by reading lol. I guess that you do not have cygwin in your path. Here's an example that can (but does not have to :-) work: C> path %PATH;C:\mingw\bin;C:\cygwin\bin C> cd c:\dqkit $ tclsh gen/buildkit build -tk -blt -resfile -current -binary custom And see if it works. > One final thing. > I noticed that in the directory C:/dqkit/src/res there is a dqe.ico file. > Can I replace that file with my own so that it appears in the > final dqkit-custom.exe? It's in the other mail. Edit current.res, save as yourfile.res to use different icons (yourfile1.ico, yourfile2.ico, ... ;-), you can even send them back to me to have them in the distro. -- WK From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Thu Jan 15 21:27:08 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11E31B3AED for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 21:27:08 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX9SCgAy for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 14:27:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-1.online-age.net [216.35.73.163]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAC18B3A8A for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 21:27:05 +0800 (WST) Received: from int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-4 [3.159.236.68]) id i0FDR3aO000942 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 08:27:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlef05.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id i0FDR2pD023576 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 08:27:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvem06.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.77]) by cinmlef05.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 15 Jan 2004 08:27:02 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6541.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 08:27:01 -0500 Message-ID: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF06E8326@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Re: dqkit Thread-Index: AcPbUJ1NEDuHLjBfT+eTUT7mhKxynwAGiyOw From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Jan 2004 13:27:02.0044 (UTC) FILETIME=[42840DC0:01C3DB6B] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Custom description (Was Re: dqkit) X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 13:27:08 -0000 It would be swell if sdx could modify the starpack description at wrap = time, much in the same way it can replace the icon. Perhaps the = inclusion of "tclkit.res" in the .vfs directory could do the trick. What would it take to make that work? > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On > Behalf Of Wojciech Kocjan > Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 5:11 AM > To: Hafer > Cc: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit >=20 >=20 > Hafer wrote: > > Thanks to everyone that has provided feedback. This is the=20 > most help I have=20 > > received on this subject ever. I will attempt the steps=20 > you have suggested. =20 > >=20 > > One last question though.. > >=20 > > The last statment is missing: The only way... Is there a=20 > way to change the=20 > > icon? It would be nice to be able to do. >=20 > If you manage to compile it, see the src/res directory, it has *.res=20 > files which describe all the information contained in the exe=20 > - not only=20 > the icons, but also text information (ever annoyed by "Tclkit, a=20 > standalone runtime for Tcl/Tk" description? :-). >=20 > I have provided several configurations as an example, just=20 > copy the one=20 > you want to use as current.res or supply -resfile=3Dyourname if=20 > you named=20 > the file yourname.res. >=20 > btw If you manage to compile dqkit, you are welcome to write=20 > documentation on how to compile it ;-) >=20 > --=20 > WK >=20 > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit >=20 From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Fri Jan 16 00:29:15 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23601B3A93 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:29:15 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXdS9dRf for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:29:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 238D8B3A8A for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:29:12 +0800 (WST) Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id i0FGT38n010467 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 09:29:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.104.118]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id i0FGNoaI022743 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:23:50 -0600 Message-ID: <4006BF16.6000200@motorola.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 09:25:58 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 16:29:15 -0000 Hafer, I haven't been following this thread very closely, but it seems strange to me that your trying to use both cygwin and mingw. When I ask what to use on tkchat they recommended mingw. Tom K. > Again thanks for the help.... > > Ok here is what I have done in preperation for creating a dqkit-custom.exe > > 1) I have downloaded Cygwin and installed it to C:/Cygwin > 1.1) I tried to "overwrite bin/bash.exe as bin/sh.exe". > However, a sh.exe file was already in the directory. Is that right? > > 2) I downloaded the dq mingw snapshot (and unzipped it)from sourceforge. > 2.1) Placed it in C:/mingw Is the location correct? > > 3) I downloaded the 15 Meg dqkit-sources-0.2.tar.gz file (unzipped it) > from sourceforge and placed it in C:/dkkit. > 3.1) Is the location correct? > > 4) Activetcl 8.4.5.0 was already installed on the machine. > > > > I opened a tcl wish and did the following to attempt to create a > dqkit-custom.exe: > > 1) cd C:/dqkit > 2) tclsh gen/buildkit build -tk -blt -resfile=current -binary=custom > ( I am guessing this will build a kit with tk and blt only, right?) > > and got the following: > > Beginning compilation steps: options, setupdirs, tcl, mk, tk, itcl, blt, res, > zlib, vfs, link, finalize. > > [ 1/12] options > > [ 2/12] setupdirs > > [ 3/12] tcl > sh autoconf > couldn't execute "sh": no such file or directory > while executing > "exec >@file88a218 2>@file88a218 sh autoconf" > ("eval" body line 1) > invoked from within > "eval [concat [list exec >@$fh 2>@$fh] $cmd]" > (procedure "out::oexec" line 5) > invoked from within > "out::oexec {sh autoconf}" > (procedure "dirconfigure" line 13) > invoked from within > "dirconfigure 1 1 C:/dqkit/src/tcl-8.4.5/win C:/dqkit/build/AUSPC056/tcl ... > ... > ... > yada yada yada ... > > I am certain I have done something very wrong. But what? I think I have not > placed all of the files into the correct locations or something along those > lines. Can anyone inform me of my mistake? Again I hate to sound so helpless > here but I tend to learn by experience not by reading lol. > > One final thing. > I noticed that in the directory C:/dqkit/src/res there is a dqe.ico file. > Can I replace that file with my own so that it appears in the > final dqkit-custom.exe? > > Thanks again. From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri Jan 16 00:53:16 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A6DAB3A93 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:53:16 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXkn8wiR for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:53:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08BD3B3A8A for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:53:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:52:58 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:52:57 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: dqkit Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:52:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 16:53:16 -0000 > > I haven't been following this thread very closely, but it seems > strange to me that your trying to use both cygwin and mingw. When > I ask what to use on tkchat they recommended mingw. > > Tom K. Mingw has everything you need for configure and make. But if you back it up with cygwin in your path, then you have easy access to all those nice unix command line utilities that you miss under Windows. (grep, wc, etc.) Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Jan 16 00:57:46 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C83D7B3A93 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:57:45 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX8mlmmw for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:57:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3302B3A8A for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:57:43 +0800 (WST) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AhAqO-0004mG-00 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:59:51 +0100 Message-ID: <4006C565.6060804@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:52:53 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit References: <3FF2F5D4.9040707@kocjan.org> <40051E4D.4070201@kocjan.org> <4006BF16.6000200@motorola.com> In-Reply-To: <4006BF16.6000200@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 16:57:46 -0000 Tom Krehbiel wrote: > Hafer, > > I haven't been following this thread very closely, but it seems strange > to me that your trying to use both cygwin and mingw. When I ask what to > use on tkchat they recommended mingw. Well, I use cygwin not only because of compiling. I can't afford to live by the rule "if I want unix environment, I use linux". I really love grep/awk/wc, tab completion (I don't have XP yet, and readline does it a lot better than any Windows :-). Also, cygwin compiles much more things than mingw, especially concerning networking. ps. It's my computer and I'll decide what's installed on it ;-) -- WK From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Fri Jan 16 01:17:48 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF1A3B3A93 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 01:17:47 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXtyb6nu for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:17:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3335B3A8A for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 01:17:46 +0800 (WST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0HRJ00901K1G64@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:17:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from jhuapl.edu (piper.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.27]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0HRJ007MNK1BH8@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:17:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ([128.244.28.6]) by piper.jhuapl.edu with ESMTP ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:16:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (jhz@localhost)for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:16:51 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:16:50 -0500 (EST) From: john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: dqkit In-reply-to: X-Sender: jhz@aplexus.jhuapl.edu To: starkit@equi4.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Authentication-warning: aplexus.jhuapl.edu: jhz owned process doing -bs X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:17:48 -0000 I downloaded the linux version of dgkit and I don't get most of the BLT commands. I'm rusty on tcl/tk so maybe someone can tell me what's wrong. Here's a session in which I require BLT, import blt::*, and list the commands. The list includes blt commands like vector, spline, bgexec, watch, but not graph, barchart, htext, table. Are these now under a sub namespace or different namespace? Am I doing something obviously wrong? Wrong download? [zouckjh1@isspcp027045pcs downloads]$ ./dqkit-all.bin % package require BLT 2.4 % namespace import blt::* % join [lsort [info commands]] "\n" after append array auto_execok auto_import auto_load auto_load_index auto_qualify bgexec binary bltdebug break case catch cd clock close concat continue crc32 encoding eof error eval exec exit expr fblocked fconfigure fcopy file fileevent flush for foreach format gets glob global history if incr info interp join lappend librarypath lindex linsert list llength load lrange lreplace lsearch lset lsort namespace open package pid pkg_compareExtension pkg_mkIndex proc puts pwd read rechan regexp regsub rename return scan seek set socket source spline split string subst switch tclLog tclPkgSetup tclPkgUnknown tell time trace tree unknown unset update uplevel upvar variable vector vwait watch while zlib % On Thu, 15 Jan 2004, Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > > > > I haven't been following this thread very closely, but it seems > > strange to me that your trying to use both cygwin and mingw. When > > I ask what to use on tkchat they recommended mingw. > > > > Tom K. > > Mingw has everything you need for configure and make. But if you back it up > with cygwin in your path, then you have easy access to all those nice unix > command line utilities that you miss under Windows. (grep, wc, etc.) > > Bob > -- > Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu > Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 > 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 > Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ > > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > ============================ John H. Zouck The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory ============================ From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Fri Jan 16 02:43:31 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67316B3AEC for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 02:43:31 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXOE1Jwe for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 19:43:27 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68C91B3A95 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 02:43:27 +0800 (WST) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:43:24 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:43:24 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: dqkit Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:43:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:43:31 -0000 > I downloaded the linux version of dgkit and I don't get most > of the BLT commands. I'm rusty on tcl/tk so maybe someone can > tell me what's wrong. Here's a session in which I require > BLT, import blt::*, and list the commands. The list includes > blt commands like vector, spline, bgexec, watch, but not > graph, barchart, htext, table. Are these now under a sub > namespace or different namespace? > If you 'package require BLT' without 'package require Tk', then you get only the non-Tk parts of BLT. That way the vector and bgexec work with tclsh applications. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Fri Jan 16 03:02:40 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32E5AB3A95 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 03:02:40 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXu3fAJ7 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 20:02:38 +0100 (CET) Received: from isspcp027045pcs.jhuapl.edu (ISSpcp027045pcs.jhuapl.edu [128.244.152.67]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67139B3A8A for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 03:02:38 +0800 (WST) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) i0FJ2ZjJ007836 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2004 14:02:35 -0500 Subject: RE: [Starkit] Re: dqkit From: John Zouck To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1074193355.7563.10.camel@isspcp027045pcs.jhuapl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.2 (1.2.2-4) Date: 15 Jan 2004 14:02:35 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 19:02:40 -0000 That works and makes sense. Many thanks. On Thu, 2004-01-15 at 13:43, Techentin, Robert W. wrote: > > I downloaded the linux version of dgkit and I don't get most > > of the BLT commands. I'm rusty on tcl/tk so maybe someone can > > tell me what's wrong. Here's a session in which I require > > BLT, import blt::*, and list the commands. The list includes > > blt commands like vector, spline, bgexec, watch, but not > > graph, barchart, htext, table. Are these now under a sub > > namespace or different namespace? > > > > > If you 'package require BLT' without 'package require Tk', then you get only > the non-Tk parts of BLT. That way the vector and bgexec work with tclsh > applications. > > Bob From gclts-starkit@m.gmane.org Fri Jan 16 07:56:14 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CA68B3A95 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 07:56:14 +0800 (WST) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXxdatyk for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:56:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from main.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.224.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 047E4B3A8A for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 07:56:13 +0800 (WST) Received: from list by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AhHLQ-0003BV-00 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:56:12 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from sea.gmane.org ([80.91.224.252]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AhHLO-0003BN-00 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:56:10 +0100 Received: from news by sea.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AhHLO-0000gJ-00 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2004 00:56:10 +0100 From: Hafer Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 23:56:10 +0000 (UTC) Lines: 14 Message-ID: References: <1074193355.7563.10.camel@isspcp027045pcs.jhuapl.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 209.217.153.219 (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)) Sender: news X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:30:43 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Re: dqkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 23:56:15 -0000 I am becoming a pest on this page (sorry about that) but.. I see an issue, check it out... () 2 % package require BLT 2.4 () 3 % package forget BLT () 4 % package require BLT can't find package BLT Why is the package lost? From jcw@equi4.com Sat Jan 17 11:34:51 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F944B3AF2 for ; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:34:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXKNQq8g for ; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:34:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD7C9B3A88 for ; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:34:49 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 6709783C27; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:34:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id A31D783914; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:34:41 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: References: <1074193355.7563.10.camel@isspcp027045pcs.jhuapl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:34:40 +0100 To: Hafer X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 10:34:51 -0000 Hafer wrote: > I see an issue, check it out... > > () 2 % package require BLT > 2.4 > () 3 % package forget BLT > () 4 % package require BLT > can't find package BLT > > Why is the package lost? This is probably more a question for BLT, not the starkit mailing list? (don't want to cut anyone short in answering, of course) -jcw From will@wjduquette.com Sat Jan 17 16:44:09 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EEFAB3AF2; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:44:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXYVmoH3; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:44:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78090B3A88; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 16:44:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from pool0342.cvx35-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.13.87] helo=[10.0.1.2]) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AhscH-0002ZR-00; Sat, 17 Jan 2004 07:44:05 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: <1074193355.7563.10.camel@isspcp027045pcs.jhuapl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Will Duquette Subject: Re: [Starkit] Re: dqkit Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 07:44:01 -0800 To: Jean-Claude Wippler X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 15:44:09 -0000 It's a BLT thing. I was looking at the BLT code some months ago; I wanted to use bgexec in both the main Tcl interpreter, and in a slave, and tried to "package require" it both places. It doesn't work because the C code that defines the BLT commands sets a flag so that it will only be called once no matter how many times BLT is loaded. Why it does that, I've no idea. Will On Jan 17, 2004, at 2:34 AM, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > Hafer wrote: > >> I see an issue, check it out... >> >> () 2 % package require BLT >> 2.4 >> () 3 % package forget BLT >> () 4 % package require BLT >> can't find package BLT >> >> Why is the package lost? > > This is probably more a question for BLT, not the starkit mailing list? > > (don't want to cut anyone short in answering, of course) > > -jcw > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > > ------------------------------------------------------------- will -at- wjduquette.com | Catch our weblog, http://foothills.wjduquette.com | The View from the Foothills From yppbf2001@yahoo.com Sun Jan 18 16:29:50 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D6F2B3AE7 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 2004 16:29:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXj1e0bb for ; Sun, 18 Jan 2004 16:29:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from web14918.mail.yahoo.com (web14918.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.225.223]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 69D25B3A88 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 2004 16:29:48 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040118152947.92245.qmail@web14918.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [213.45.35.86] by web14918.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 18 Jan 2004 07:29:47 PST Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 07:29:47 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Young To: Starkit list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] A Starpack application under Citrix Metaframe is shown as "main.tcl" X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 15:29:50 -0000 Hello! I am now using an application packaged as a Starpack under Citrix Metaframe. Through the Console of this system all the starpack applications, once running, are named "main.tcl". Im guessing that this is due to the SDX utility: is there any option to set this file name to a "user defined" one? Thanks! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From jeffh@ActiveState.com Mon Jan 19 20:35:15 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D764B3AF4 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 2004 20:35:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXAOWJ1T for ; Mon, 19 Jan 2004 20:35:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB52BB3A88 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 2004 20:35:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) i0JJV23W021597; Mon, 19 Jan 2004 11:31:02 -0800 (envelope-from jeffh@ActiveState.com) Received: from rayo (rayo.activestate.com [192.168.4.222]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i0JJV18H005381; Mon, 19 Jan 2004 11:31:01 -0800 From: "Jeff Hobbs" To: "'Paul Young'" , "'Starkit list'" Subject: RE: [Starkit] A Starpack application under Citrix Metaframe is shown as "main.tcl" Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 11:30:58 -0800 Organization: ActiveState Message-ID: <057c01c3dec2$c57cad90$de04a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <20040118152947.92245.qmail@web14918.mail.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 19:35:16 -0000 > I am now using an application packaged as a Starpack > under Citrix Metaframe. Through the Console of this > system all the starpack applications, once running, > are named "main.tcl". > > Im guessing that this is due to the SDX utility: is > there any option to set this file name to a "user > defined" one? tk appname "foobar" Jeff Hobbs, The Tcl Guy http://www.ActiveState.com/, a division of Sophos From yppbf2001@yahoo.com Tue Jan 20 15:03:47 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDBE8B3A91 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:03:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXXdStZT for ; Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:03:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from web14916.mail.yahoo.com (web14916.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.225.229]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0222EB3A88 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:03:46 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040120140344.3901.qmail@web14916.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [82.48.25.39] by web14916.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 20 Jan 2004 06:03:44 PST Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 06:03:44 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Young Subject: RE: [Starkit] A Starpack application under Citrix Metaframe is shown as "main.tcl" To: Jeff Hobbs , 'Starkit list' In-Reply-To: <057c01c3dec2$c57cad90$de04a8c0@activestate.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 12:01:48 +0100 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 14:03:47 -0000 --- Jeff Hobbs wrote: > tk appname "foobar" It works. Thanks! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From tmohr@s.netic.de Sun Jan 25 17:32:15 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BD18B3A8B for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:32:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXwJcK8i for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:32:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.s.netic.de (mail.s.netic.de [212.9.160.11]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2D57B3A88 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:32:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from host-212-9-162-43.dial.netic.de ([212.9.162.43] helo=schleim.qwe.de) by mail.s.netic.de with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AknBG-000D2E-EJ for starkit@equi4.com; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:32:14 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by schleim.qwe.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AD61A3CDC for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:12:38 +0100 (CET) From: Torsten Mohr Organization: Qwe Inc. To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:12:37 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200401251712.37795.tmohr@s.netic.de> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Building Tclkit from "kit.exe" X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:32:15 -0000 Hi everybody, i downloaded all the sources to build the latest TclKit. Building "kit.exe" worked fine, except that i had to delete the line in win/tclWinPipe.c where TCL_PIPE_DLL is mentioned, as it wasn't defined in the VC++ build environment. So building "kit.exe" worked. But how do i go on from here? If i start it, i just get the message that "setup.tcl" isn't found anywhere. And that's right, it is not anywhere in the sources. How do i build "TclKit.exe"? Thanks for any hints, Torsten. From wojciech@kocjan.org Sun Jan 25 17:54:22 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41E45B3A8E for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:54:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXnb2l8G for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:54:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3876EB3A8D for ; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:54:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from eq22.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.50.125.22] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AknYY-0000Pr-00; Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:56:18 +0100 Message-ID: <4013F4B1.4060902@kocjan.org> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:54:09 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Torsten Mohr Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building Tclkit from "kit.exe" References: <200401251712.37795.tmohr@s.netic.de> In-Reply-To: <200401251712.37795.tmohr@s.netic.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:54:22 -0000 Torsten Mohr wrote: > Hi everybody, > > i downloaded all the sources to build the latest > TclKit. Building "kit.exe" worked fine, except > that i had to delete the line in win/tclWinPipe.c > where TCL_PIPE_DLL is mentioned, as it wasn't defined > in the VC++ build environment. > > So building "kit.exe" worked. > > But how do i go on from here? > > If i start it, i just get the message that "setup.tcl" > isn't found anywhere. And that's right, it is not > anywhere in the sources. > > How do i build "TclKit.exe"? Compress it using UPX (or any other executable compression software) and append runtime.kit at the end. -- WK From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Mon Jan 26 23:21:30 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8EFFB3A8C for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:21:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXFKqrQC for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:21:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41903.mail.yahoo.com (web41903.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.154]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 96E88B3A88 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:21:28 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040126222127.13881.qmail@web41903.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41903.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:21:27 PST Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:21:27 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:21:30 -0000 I have a problem extracting files from starkit if the destination file exists and is not writable. file copy -force f1 f2 works when f2 is not writable but f1 and f2 are in the regular filesystem. It fails when f2 is not writable and f1 is inside a tclkit. f2 is in the filsystem My current workaround is to change the permissions of f2 before copying. Is this a bug? Am I doing something wrong? tcltest::test copy1 {Copy file no permissions} {} { foreach f {f1 f2} { set $f [file join $::tcltest::testsDirectory $f] file delete -force $f maui::file::write $f $f } file attributes $f2 -permissions 0000 maui::file::copy $f1 $f2 set result [maui::file::read $f2] file delete -force $f1 $f2 set result } {f1} # For some reason, if both files in disk no problem, if origin in tclkit, it fails tcltest::test copy2 {Copy file from tclkit to disk no permissions} {} { set kitFile [file join $::tcltest::testsDirectory test.kit] ::vfs::mk4::Mount $kitFile $kitFile set t $::tcltest::testsDirectory set f2 [file join $t f2] file delete -force $f2 maui::file::write $f2 f2 set f1 [file join $kitFile f1] maui::file::write $f1 f1 file attributes $f2 -permissions 0000 maui::file::copy $f1 $f2 ::vfs::unmount $kitFile set result } {f1} __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From andreask@ActiveState.com Mon Jan 26 23:39:38 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4B3CB3A8D for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:39:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXyI8c30 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:39:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C982B3A8C for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:39:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) i0QMS03W001932; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:28:00 -0800 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.4.239]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id i0QMS0qZ014272; Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:28:00 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Guaca Mole" , Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:28:00 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 In-Reply-To: <20040126222127.13881.qmail@web41903.mail.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:39:38 -0000 When files are in different filesystems the tcl core will use a tcl procedure to perform the copying. IMHO this procedure has a bug if it doesn't handle -force. When you say 'it fails', do you see a tcl error message ? If yes, which message ? Do you get a tcl stack trace ? (global variable 'errorInfo' contains such a trace, if existing). -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com, a division of Sophos Tel: +1 604 484 6491 > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On > Behalf Of Guaca Mole > Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 2:21 PM > To: starkit@equi4.com > Subject: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with > test cases) > > > > I have a problem extracting files from starkit if the > destination file exists and is not writable. > > file copy -force f1 f2 > > works when f2 is not writable but f1 and f2 are in the > regular filesystem. > It fails when f2 is not writable and f1 is inside a > tclkit. f2 is in the filsystem > > My current workaround is to change the permissions of > f2 before copying. Is this a bug? Am I doing something > wrong? > > > tcltest::test copy1 {Copy file no permissions} {} { > foreach f {f1 f2} > set $f [file join $::tcltest::testsDirectory $f] > file delete -force $f > maui::file::write $f $f > } > file attributes $f2 -permissions 0000 > maui::file::copy $f1 $f2 > set result [maui::file::read $f2] > file delete -force $f1 $f2 > set result > } {f1} > > # For some reason, if both files in disk no problem, > if origin in tclkit, it fails > tcltest::test copy2 {Copy file from tclkit to disk no > permissions} {} { > set kitFile [file join $::tcltest::testsDirectory > test.kit] > ::vfs::mk4::Mount $kitFile $kitFile > set t $::tcltest::testsDirectory > set f2 [file join $t f2] > file delete -force $f2 > maui::file::write $f2 f2 > set f1 [file join $kitFile f1] > maui::file::write $f1 f1 > file attributes $f2 -permissions 0000 > maui::file::copy $f1 $f2 > ::vfs::unmount $kitFile > set result > } {f1} > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! > http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit > From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Tue Jan 27 11:52:09 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 596EDB3A8F for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:52:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXk26o5R for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:52:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41905.mail.yahoo.com (web41905.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.156]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 37892B3A8D for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:52:00 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040127105158.55958.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41905.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 02:51:58 PST Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 02:51:58 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="0-1356708098-1075200718=:54011" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:52:09 -0000 --0-1356708098-1075200718=:54011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Id: Content-Disposition: inline > When you say 'it fails', do you see a tcl error > message ? If yes, which > message ? Do you get a tcl stack trace ? (global > variable 'errorInfo' > contains such a trace, if existing). ==== copy1 Copy file from tclkit to disk no permissions FAILED ---- Test generated error; Return code was: 1 ---- Return code should have been one of: 0 2 ---- errorInfo: error copying "/tmp/test.kit/f1" to "/tmp/f2": permission denied while executing "file copy -force $f1 $f2" ("uplevel" body line 11) invoked from within "uplevel 1 $script" ---- errorCode: POSIX EACCES {permission denied} ==== copy1 FAILED I am also realizing that my original post depended on a couple of procedures not present. I attach a standalone test.tcl file that reproduces the above. Just run tclkit test.tcl -verbose ve > When files are in different filesystems the tcl core > will use a tcl > procedure to perform the copying. IMHO this > procedure has a bug if it > doesn't handle -force. I think so, but I wanted to check, since it was more lilkely I am doing something wrong that Tcl having a bug like this one :) Thanks! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ --0-1356708098-1075200718=:54011 Content-Type: text/plain; name="test.txt" Content-Description: test.txt Content-Disposition: inline; filename="test.txt" ==== copy1 Copy file from tclkit to disk no permissions FAILED ---- Test generated error; Return code was: 1 ---- Return code should have been one of: 0 2 ---- errorInfo: error copying "/tmp/test.kit/f1" to "/tmp/f2": permission denied while executing "file copy -force $f1 $f2" ("uplevel" body line 11) invoked from within "uplevel 1 $script" ---- errorCode: POSIX EACCES {permission denied} ==== copy1 FAILED --0-1356708098-1075200718=:54011 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="test.tcl" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Description: test.tcl Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="test.tcl" CnBhY2thZ2UgcmVxdWlyZSB0Y2x0ZXN0CnBhY2thZ2UgcmVxdWlyZSBtazR2 ZnMKCgoKCiAgICBwcm9jIHdyaXRlRmlsZSB7ZGVzdCB0ZXh0fSB7CiAgICAg ICAgc2V0IGYgW29wZW4gJGRlc3Qgd10KICAgICAgICBwdXRzIC1ub25ld2xp bmUgJGYgJHRleHQKICAgICAgICBjbG9zZSAkZgogICAgfQoKICAgIHByb2Mg cmVhZEZpbGUge2Rlc3R9IHsKICAgICAgICBzZXQgZiBbb3BlbiAkZGVzdCBy XQogICAgICAgIHNldCByIFs6OnJlYWQgJGZdCiAgICAgICAgY2xvc2UgJGYK ICAgICAgICByZXR1cm4gJHIKICAgIH0KCgojIEZvciBzb21lIHJlYXNvbiwg aWYgYm90aCBmaWxlcyBpbiBkaXNrIG5vIHByb2JsZW0sIGlmIG9yaWdpbiBp biB0Y2xraXQsIGl0IGZhaWxzCnRjbHRlc3Q6OnRlc3QgY29weTEge0NvcHkg ZmlsZSBmcm9tIHRjbGtpdCB0byBkaXNrIG5vIHBlcm1pc3Npb25zfSB7fSB7 CiAgICBzZXQga2l0RmlsZSBbZmlsZSBqb2luICQ6OnRjbHRlc3Q6OnRlc3Rz RGlyZWN0b3J5IHRlc3Qua2l0XQogICAgOjp2ZnM6Om1rNDo6TW91bnQgJGtp dEZpbGUgJGtpdEZpbGUKICAgIHNldCB0ICQ6OnRjbHRlc3Q6OnRlc3RzRGly ZWN0b3J5CiAgICBzZXQgZjIgW2ZpbGUgam9pbiAkdCBmMl0KICAgIGZpbGUg ZGVsZXRlIC1mb3JjZSAkZjIKICAgIHdyaXRlRmlsZSAkZjIgZjIKICAgIHNl dCBmMSBbZmlsZSBqb2luICRraXRGaWxlIGYxXQogICAgd3JpdGVGaWxlICRm MSBmMSAgICAKICAgIGZpbGUgYXR0cmlidXRlcyAkZjIgLXBlcm1pc3Npb25z IDAwMDAKICAgIGZpbGUgY29weSAtZm9yY2UgJGYxICRmMgogICAgOjp2ZnM6 OnVubW91bnQgJGtpdEZpbGUKICAgIHNldCByZXN1bHQKfSB7ZjF9IAoK --0-1356708098-1075200718=:54011-- From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jan 27 12:58:18 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4124DB3A8F for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 12:58:18 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXNtChwZ for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 12:58:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84A1CB3A8D for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 12:58:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from turing.eurobios.com ([62.244.183.98])3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id AUC57703 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:58:05 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127115047.028f9558@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:58:05 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) In-Reply-To: <20040127105158.55958.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040127105158.55958.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:58:18 -0000 This error will be in the Tcl command tcl::CopyDirectory or the C function CopyRenameOneFile (tclFCmd.c), I think. Not sure which. Obviously something isn't handling the 'force' flag correctly. A brief reading of the code suggests that tcl::CopyDirectory should always over-write if the destination exists (since its caller will already have thrown an error if -force wasn't given), but this hypothesis needs careful testing. Vince. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jan 27 17:01:37 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49200B3A8F for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:01:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX6axesk for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:01:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector3.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector3.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.159]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CECA8B3A8D for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:01:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from turing.eurobios.com ([62.244.183.98])3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id BQW78175 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:01:33 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127160033.028dd650@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:01:33 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) In-Reply-To: <20040127105158.55958.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040127105158.55958.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:01:37 -0000 I believe tcl::CopyDirectory (in init.tcl) is buggy. Try this: proc tcl::CopyDirectory {action src dest} { set nsrc [file normalize $src] set ndest [file normalize $dest] if {[string equal $action "renaming"]} { # Can't rename volumes. We could give a more precise # error message here, but that would break the test suite. if {[lsearch -exact [file volumes] $nsrc] != -1} { return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ \"$dest\": trying to rename a volume or move a directory\ into itself" } } if {[file exists $dest]} { if {$nsrc == $ndest} { return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ \"$dest\": trying to rename a volume or move a directory\ into itself" } if {[string equal $action "copying"]} { # We used to throw an error here, but, looking more closely # at the core copy code in tclFCmd.c, if the destination # exists, then we should only call this function if -force # is true, which means we just want to over-write. So, # the following code is now commented out. # # return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ # \"$dest\": file already exists" } else { # Depending on the platform, and on the current # working directory, the directories '.', '..' # can be returned in various combinations. Anyway, # if any other file is returned, we must signal an error. set existing [glob -nocomplain -directory $dest * .*] eval [list lappend existing] \ [glob -nocomplain -directory $dest -type hidden * .*] foreach s $existing { if {([file tail $s] != ".") && ([file tail $s] != "..")} { return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ \"$dest\": file already exists" } } } } else { if {[string first $nsrc $ndest] != -1} { set srclen [expr {[llength [file split $nsrc]] -1}] set ndest [lindex [file split $ndest] $srclen] if {$ndest == [file tail $nsrc]} { return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ \"$dest\": trying to rename a volume or move a directory\ into itself" } } file mkdir $dest } # Have to be careful to capture both visible and hidden files. # We will also be more generous to the file system and not # assume the hidden and non-hidden lists are non-overlapping. # # On Unix 'hidden' files begin with '.'. On other platforms # or filesystems hidden files may have other interpretations. set filelist [concat [glob -nocomplain -directory $src *] \ [glob -nocomplain -directory $src -types hidden *]] foreach s [lsort -unique $filelist] { if {([file tail $s] != ".") && ([file tail $s] != "..")} { file copy -force $s [file join $dest [file tail $s]] } } return } From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Tue Jan 27 18:28:37 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5F49B3A8F for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:28:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXEBKo7P for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:28:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41901.mail.yahoo.com (web41901.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.152]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id A9DABB3A8D for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:28:34 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040127172833.13536.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.55.10] by web41901.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 09:28:33 PST Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 09:28:33 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127160033.028dd650@mail.wolfbusiness.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:28:37 -0000 Hi Vince, I just tried it, replacing all tcl::CopyDirectory and still get the same error. This procedure is for copying directories, not files? So maybe is the Core code Andreas mentioned? --- Vince Darley wrote: > I believe tcl::CopyDirectory (in init.tcl) is buggy. > Try this: > > proc tcl::CopyDirectory {action src dest} { > set nsrc [file normalize $src] > set ndest [file normalize $dest] > > if {[string equal $action "renaming"]} { > # Can't rename volumes. We could give a more > precise > # error message here, but that would break the test > suite. > if {[lsearch -exact [file volumes] $nsrc] != -1} { > return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ > \"$dest\": trying to rename a volume or move > a directory\ > into itself" > } > } > if {[file exists $dest]} { > if {$nsrc == $ndest} { > return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ > \"$dest\": trying to rename a volume or move > a directory\ > into itself" > } > if {[string equal $action "copying"]} { > # We used to throw an error here, but, looking > more closely > # at the core copy code in tclFCmd.c, if the > destination > # exists, then we should only call this > function if -force > # is true, which means we just want to > over-write. So, > # the following code is now commented out. > # > # return -code error "error $action \"$src\" > to\ > # \"$dest\": file already exists" > } else { > # Depending on the platform, and on the current > # working directory, the directories '.', '..' > # can be returned in various combinations. > Anyway, > # if any other file is returned, we must signal > an error. > set existing [glob -nocomplain -directory $dest > * .*] > eval [list lappend existing] \ > [glob -nocomplain -directory $dest -type > hidden * .*] > foreach s $existing { > if {([file tail $s] != ".") && ([file tail $s] != > "..")} { > return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ > \"$dest\": file already exists" > } > } > } > } else { > if {[string first $nsrc $ndest] != -1} { > set srclen [expr {[llength [file split $nsrc]] > -1}] > set ndest [lindex [file split $ndest] $srclen] > if {$ndest == [file tail $nsrc]} { > return -code error "error $action \"$src\" to\ > \"$dest\": trying to rename a volume or move a > directory\ > into itself" > } > } > file mkdir $dest > } > # Have to be careful to capture both visible > and hidden files. > # We will also be more generous to the file > system and not > # assume the hidden and non-hidden lists are > non-overlapping. > # > # On Unix 'hidden' files begin with '.'. On > other platforms > # or filesystems hidden files may have other > interpretations. > set filelist [concat [glob -nocomplain > -directory $src *] \ > [glob -nocomplain -directory $src -types > hidden *]] > > foreach s [lsort -unique $filelist] { > if {([file tail $s] != ".") && ([file tail $s] != > "..")} { > file copy -force $s [file join $dest [file tail > $s]] > } > } > return > } > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jan 27 19:07:12 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE690B3A92 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:07:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXcWZcpr for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:07:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector4.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector4.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.160]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2642B3A8F for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:07:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from turing.eurobios.com ([62.244.183.98])3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id BKV12082 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:07:06 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127180539.028f5cc0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:07:06 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) In-Reply-To: <20040127172833.13536.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> References: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127160033.028dd650@mail.wolfbusiness.com> <20040127172833.13536.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:07:13 -0000 At 17:28 27/01/2004, Guaca Mole wrote: >I just tried it, replacing all tcl::CopyDirectory and >still get the same error. >This procedure is for copying directories, not files? >So maybe is the Core code Andreas mentioned? Feel free to try to diagnose in your debugger; I just don't see a bug in the core C code in that area. I've even added a test to Tcl's test suite (not yet committed) to test file copying across filesystems, and it seems to pass ok. cheers, Vince. From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Tue Jan 27 19:14:15 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C13FAB3A9E for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:14:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXWEWYui for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:14:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41905.mail.yahoo.com (web41905.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.156]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4A1D0B3A92 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:14:14 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040127181413.66502.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.55.10] by web41905.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:14:13 PST Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:14:13 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) To: Vince Darley , starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127180539.028f5cc0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:14:16 -0000 > Feel free to try to diagnose in your debugger; I > just don't see a bug in > the core C code in that area. > > I've even added a test to Tcl's test suite (not yet > committed) to test file > copying across filesystems, and it seems to pass ok. Did the test I sent pass for you? Can you send me the test so I can try it? Thanks __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jan 27 19:28:39 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD1C4B3AE9 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:28:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXVooJrh for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:28:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector4.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector4.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.160]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E958CB3AE8 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:28:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from turing.eurobios.com ([62.244.183.98])3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id BKV15679 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:28:34 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127181721.029196c8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:28:35 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) In-Reply-To: <20040127181413.66502.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> References: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127180539.028f5cc0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> <20040127181413.66502.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:28:40 -0000 Ok, I've looked more closely. Your test does this: file attributes $f2 -permissions 0000 file copy -force $f1 $f2 where $f1 is inside the starkit and $f2 is outside. My reading of Tcl's man 'file copy' documentation suggests that the behaviour you are seeing could be considered correct. The difference between 'file copy' and 'file copy -force' is: "Existing files will not be overwritten unless the -force option is specified." Now, there's no mention of 'file copy -force' adjusting permissions to make sure the copy takes place, so I think the error you are getting is not unreasonable. Anyway, I don't really have strong feelings about this, so if someone does want to change it, then Tcl will have to adjust the permissions directly, probably for both the file and directory cases, which should happen here: tclFCmd.c:line 672 for the file case: if ((result != TCL_OK) && (errno == EXDEV)) { // insert code here to adjust 'target' permissions if 'force' is true result = TclCrossFilesystemCopy(interp, source, target); } and tclFCmd.c:line 628 for the directory case: if (errno == EXDEV) { /* * The copy failed because we're trying to do a * cross-filesystem copy. We do this through our Tcl * library. */ // insert code here to adjust 'target' permissions if 'force' is true You will ideally need to query and modify the permissions using: Tcl_FSFileAttrsGet(NULL, 2, target, &perm); // get Tcl_FSFileAttrsSet(NULL, 2, target, perm); // set and this should only happen on Unix, which probably means wrapping the code in: #if !defined(__WIN32__) && !defined(MAC_TCL) cheers, Vince. p.s. no need to reply to me direct, I am on this list. From vince.darley@eurobios.com Tue Jan 27 20:31:12 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4E85B3AE9 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 20:31:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX98RiPw for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 20:31:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2505EB3A92 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 2004 20:31:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from turing.eurobios.com ([62.244.183.98])3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id AUD98508 (AUTH vincedarley); Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:31:09 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127192559.02918888@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:31:09 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127181721.029196c8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> References: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127180539.028f5cc0@mail.wolfbusiness.com> <20040127181413.66502.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040127181721.029196c8@mail.wolfbusiness.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:31:13 -0000 A related issue is what Tcl does in the case where you try to copy a file into a directory for which you have no permissions: file mkdir foo file attributes foo -permissions 0000 close [open testcopy w] file copy -force testcopy foo I assume this throws an error? For me it gives: error copying "testcopy" to "foo/testcopy": permission denied Also: file mkdir bar file copy -force bar foo gives: error copying "bar" to "foo/bar": permission denied and these are completely equivalent to the situation you are describing.... My summary, therefore: '-force' needs to be better documented so you don't make the mistake of assuming it changes permissions, which it doesn't (neither for native filesystems nor for virtual filesystems). Vince. At 18:28 27/01/2004, Vince Darley wrote: >Ok, I've looked more closely. Your test does this: > > file attributes $f2 -permissions 0000 > file copy -force $f1 $f2 > >where $f1 is inside the starkit and $f2 is outside. > >My reading of Tcl's man 'file copy' documentation suggests that the >behaviour you are seeing could be considered correct. The difference >between 'file copy' and 'file copy -force' is: > >"Existing files will not be overwritten unless the -force option is >specified." From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Wed Jan 28 10:35:14 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29DA6B3A91 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:35:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXt3l8cN for ; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:35:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41902.mail.yahoo.com (web41902.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.153]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id BA8ABB3A8D for ; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:35:12 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040128093511.75209.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.217.60.122] by web41902.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 01:35:11 PST Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 01:35:11 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127192559.02918888@mail.wolfbusiness.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 09:35:14 -0000 > A related issue is what Tcl does in the case where > you try to copy a file > into a directory for which you have no permissions: [...] > and these are completely equivalent to the situation > you are describing.... Not exactly, the error above will occur when both files are in the same native filesystem and for VFS to native copy. The one I reported occurs when the origin is in virtual filesystem but does not occur when origin is in native filesystem > My summary, therefore: '-force' needs to be better > documented n so you don't > make the mistake of assuming it changes permissions, > which it doesn't > (neither for native filesystems nor for virtual > filesystems). No, it does, thats the problem :) It is ok -force not changing permissions ever or with -force changing always permissions. It makes no sense that it acts differently whether the origin file was in VFS or not. In any case, no big deal, I can wrap all copy calls and change permissions there. My main aim was to figure out if I was doing something wrong or it was Tcl. I will report the inconsistency in SF Thanks for your help! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From vince.darley@eurobios.com Wed Jan 28 11:00:05 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E0A7B3A8D for ; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXO9pOrg for ; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from msgdirector4.onetel.net.uk (msgdirector4.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.160]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D001DB3A8A for ; Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from turing.eurobios.com ([62.244.183.98])3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id BKV72287 (AUTH vincedarley); Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:00:02 GMT Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040128095808.028f5840@mail.wolfbusiness.com> X-Sender: vincedarley@mail.onetel.net.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:00:02 +0000 To: starkit@equi4.com From: Vince Darley Subject: RE: [Starkit] Error when copying files from startkit to disk (with test cases) In-Reply-To: <20040128093511.75209.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> References: <6.0.1.1.2.20040127192559.02918888@mail.wolfbusiness.com> <20040128093511.75209.qmail@web41902.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:00:05 -0000 At 09:35 28/01/2004, Guaca Mole wrote: > > A related issue is what Tcl does in the case where > > you try to copy a file > > into a directory for which you have no permissions: >[...] > > and these are completely equivalent to the situation > > you are describing.... > >Not exactly, the error above will occur when both >files are in the same native filesystem and for VFS to >native copy. >The one I reported occurs when the origin is in >virtual filesystem but does not occur when origin is >in native filesystem Ok, this is true for files (but not for directories). This is indeed an inconsistency. You should file a bug report on sourceforge and if it is possible, provide a patch, ideally, to fix the problem. Vince. From tmohr@s.netic.de Thu Jan 29 18:56:40 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F89DB3A91 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:56:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXIb24An for ; Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:56:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.s.netic.de (mail.s.netic.de [212.9.160.11]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F37EEB3A8D for ; Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:56:38 +0100 (CET) Received: from host-212-9-162-62.dial.netic.de ([212.9.162.62] helo=schleim.qwe.de) by mail.s.netic.de with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AmGP5-000LjX-2J for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:56:35 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by schleim.qwe.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25BB8A3CDC for ; Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:36:37 +0100 (CET) From: Torsten Mohr Organization: Qwe Inc. To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Building Tclkit from "kit.exe" Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:36:36 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200401251712.37795.tmohr@s.netic.de> <4013F4B1.4060902@kocjan.org> In-Reply-To: <4013F4B1.4060902@kocjan.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200401291836.36775.tmohr@s.netic.de> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 17:56:40 -0000 Hi, thanks for that hint, but i have to admit that i don't really understand it. As i understand it, i need to build TclKit.exe from kit.exe. I thought i need to just execute kit.exe, that's not true? Thanks for hints, Torsten. > Torsten Mohr wrote: > > Hi everybody, > > > > i downloaded all the sources to build the latest > > TclKit. Building "kit.exe" worked fine, except > > that i had to delete the line in win/tclWinPipe.c > > where TCL_PIPE_DLL is mentioned, as it wasn't defined > > in the VC++ build environment. > > > > So building "kit.exe" worked. > > > > But how do i go on from here? > > > > If i start it, i just get the message that "setup.tcl" > > isn't found anywhere. And that's right, it is not > > anywhere in the sources. > > > > How do i build "TclKit.exe"? > > Compress it using UPX (or any other executable compression software) and > append runtime.kit at the end. From lvirden@cas.org Fri Jan 30 14:41:18 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD121B3A8A for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2004 14:41:17 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXmSYCbX for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2004 14:41:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2834FB3A8D for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2004 14:41:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) i0UDfDfk029350 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2004 08:41:13 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)i0UDfCA18053; Fri, 30 Jan 2004 08:41:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 08:41:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20040130084112.AAB18022@cas.org> To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Struggling to build the current tclkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 13:41:20 -0000 Okay, I downloaded the current source files and genkit to build tclkit. My 'friendly' local gcc maintainer has, once again, built the latest gcc, and it seems once again genkit/tclkit and gcc differ on how to build here on my SPARC Solaris 8 environment. However, this time it's a bit different. RUN: g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4. a ../vfs/libvfs1.3.a ../zlib/libz.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a -L/ldatae/tclkit/ins tall/lwv26awu/lib -ltcl8.4 -ldl -lsocket -lm -static -lstdc++ -dynamic -lgcc_s /vol/gnu/gcc-3.3.1/bin/ld: cannot find -ldl collect2: ld returned 1 exit status ERROR: child process exited abnormally while executing "run g++ -o kitsh pwb.o kitInit.o zlib.o rechan.o tclAppInit.o ../tcl/libtcl8.4. a ../vfs/libvfs1.3.a ../zlib/libz.a ../mk/.libs/libmk4tcl.a -L/ldatae/t..." ("eval" body line 1) invoked from within "eval run $X(g++) -o $target [glob *.o] $L" ("kitsh" arm line 37) invoked from within "switch $target { tcl { config tcl/$X(unix) --disable-shared #run $X(make) genstubs run $X(make) binaries LD_SEARCH_FLAGS= CC_SEARC..." is the error I am getting (after hacking things so that the script no longer tries to statically link gcc_s - which, alas, appears to not be available as a static library any longer - not your problem; just thought I would pass along the experience in case someone else does so as well. However, that "cannot find" has my puzzled - I certainly see /lib/libdl.so - which would g++ not see that? Anyone ever experience that before? -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Sat Jan 31 14:14:24 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC637B3A90 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 2004 14:14:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXjmEtSD for ; Sat, 31 Jan 2004 14:14:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41901.mail.yahoo.com (web41901.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.152]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 796B1B3A8D for ; Sat, 31 Jan 2004 14:14:22 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040131131421.40894.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.1.237] by web41901.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 31 Jan 2004 05:14:21 PST Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 05:14:21 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole Subject: Re: [Starkit] Struggling to build the current tclkit To: starkit@equi4.com In-Reply-To: <20040130084112.AAB18022@cas.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 13:14:24 -0000 --- "Larry W. Virden" wrote: > Okay, I downloaded the current source files and > genkit to build > tclkit. > > My 'friendly' local gcc maintainer has, once again, > built the latest > gcc, and it seems once again genkit/tclkit and gcc > differ on how > to build here on my SPARC Solaris 8 environment. [snip] > is the error I am getting (after hacking things so > that the script > no longer tries to statically link gcc_s - which, > alas, appears to not > be available as a static library any longer - not > your problem; just > thought I would pass along the experience in case > someone else does so as > well. I run into this before. It seems in gcc 3.x there is no gcc_s, you need to splictly link to libgcc_eh.a That solved it for me on Red Hat 8.0, 9.0 Let me know if it also works for Solaris Best regards __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From lvirden@cas.org Mon Feb 2 13:54:39 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F498B3A8C for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:54:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXFZUn8Y for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:54:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23258B3A8B for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:54:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) i12CsXfk012083 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 07:54:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)i12CsWZ29140; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 07:54:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 07:54:32 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20040202075432.AAB28528@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Struggling to build the current tclkit In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 31 Jan 2004 05:14:21 -0800 (PST) To: starkit@equi4.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 12:54:40 -0000 From: Guaca Mole > I run into this before. It seems in gcc 3.x there is > no gcc_s, you need to splictly link to libgcc_eh.a > That solved it for me on Red Hat 8.0, 9.0 > Let me know if it also works for Solaris When I change genkit so that it references gcc_eh instead of gcc_s, the build of tclkit works! Thanks! -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 2 20:33:42 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8852EB3A8B for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXUfdsMd for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96D04B3A8C for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:39 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 2058C83C26; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C22CF83914 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:31 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <8A745BF0-55B6-11D8-99FC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Starkit list From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:32:30 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Relational algebra package X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 19:33:43 -0000 For some time now, I've been working on a new framework to manipulate structured data. It's based on relational algebra operations, i.e. things like select/join/project, the usual set operations, and more. The key distinction is that this lets you operate on data as a whole, in a set-wise fashion, instead of having to loop and iterate all the time. I've set up a technology preview of "Ratcl 0.8" (pronounced "radical") in case you are interested to see what it's about at this early stage. As you will see, Ratcl has some resemblance to Oomk, but is not tied to a database - it's about data manipulation, i.e. independent of storage choices. Ratcl 0.8 is set up as starkit for Windows, Mac OS X, and Linux, though each build is a self-contained shared library (and should work with any Tcl 8.4 installation). I'm making it available to let you know what I've been up to, and to find out whether others consider this approach a good fit for Tcl. Both in terms of functionality and in how convenient this design maps into the language. See http://www.equi4.com/ratcl.html for documentation, examples, downloads, etc. -jcw From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Mon Feb 2 21:40:06 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEF1EB3A8E for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:40:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXZmEjVZ for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:40:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-3.online-age.net [216.35.73.165]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F209B3A88 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:40:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from int-nj2gw-4.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-4 [3.159.236.68]) id i12Ke0aL004514 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:40:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id i12Kdx6H017454 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:40:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvem06.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.77]) by cinmlef02.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:39:58 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6541.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [Starkit] Relational algebra package Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:39:49 -0500 Message-ID: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF001FC3FBD@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Relational algebra package Thread-Index: AcPpw4QtpO+0nZy6R9mTFATUNAmGzwAAXqsA From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" To: "Starkit list" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 20:39:58.0930 (UTC) FILETIME=[B961CB20:01C3E9CC] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 20:40:07 -0000 Bah! I wish I'd had this about 6 months ago to use in my current = project! In all seriousness, this looks very nice. I one minor comment = for you to do with as you wish regarding the join operation. [ from http://www.equi4.com/raintro2.html ] Relational join is a workhorse for many purposes, the above "join1" = drops unmatched rows, while "join0" returns rows which did not match in = the join. -- I think the commands "join1" and "join0" could perhaps be more clearly = named. Here are some possible alternatives: join1: join -match 1 equijoin matchjoin join0: join -match 0 nonequijoin mismatchjoin I find "[T join -match 1 U] print" easier to understand than "[T join1 = U] print". I have duplicated this comment on the Ratcl wiki, under the suggestion = page. Anyway, thanks for hard work. -- bryan > -----Original Message----- > From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On > Behalf Of Jean-Claude Wippler > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 2:33 PM > To: Starkit list > Subject: [Starkit] Relational algebra package >=20 >=20 > For some time now, I've been working on a new framework to manipulate=20 > structured data. It's based on relational algebra operations, i.e.=20 > things like select/join/project, the usual set operations, and more. =20 > The key distinction is that this lets you operate on data as a whole,=20 > in a set-wise fashion, instead of having to loop and iterate all the=20 > time. >=20 > I've set up a technology preview of "Ratcl 0.8" (pronounced=20 > "radical")=20 > in case you are interested to see what it's about at this=20 > early stage. =20 > As you will see, Ratcl has some resemblance to Oomk, but is=20 > not tied to=20 > a database - it's about data manipulation, i.e. independent=20 > of storage=20 > choices. >=20 > Ratcl 0.8 is set up as starkit for Windows, Mac OS X, and=20 > Linux, though=20 > each build is a self-contained shared library (and should=20 > work with any=20 > Tcl 8.4 installation). >=20 > I'm making it available to let you know what I've been up to, and to=20 > find out whether others consider this approach a good fit for Tcl. =20 > Both in terms of functionality and in how convenient this design maps=20 > into the language. >=20 > See http://www.equi4.com/ratcl.html for documentation, examples,=20 > downloads, etc. >=20 > -jcw >=20 > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit >=20 From jcw@equi4.com Mon Feb 2 22:15:23 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59415B3A8E for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXsjqsoh for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2B74B3A8B for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:17 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 9639D83C26; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC73783914 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:13 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF001FC3FBD@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> References: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF001FC3FBD@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:14:12 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 21:15:23 -0000 Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation) wrote: > Bah! I wish I'd had this about 6 months ago to use in my current > project! In all seriousness, this looks very nice. I one minor comment > for you to do with as you wish regarding the join operation. Thanks (too bad about the timing...). I've responded on the Ratcl wiki - http://www.equi4.com/forum/rawiki/21 -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Mon Feb 2 22:43:24 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72E66B3A8E for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:43:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXv41kVm for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:43:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from jessie.jhuapl.edu (jessie.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.61]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0EACB3A8D for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:43:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by jessie.jhuapl.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i12Lh4sa019559 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:43:04 -0500 Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package From: John Zouck To: Starkit list In-Reply-To: <8A745BF0-55B6-11D8-99FC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> References: <8A745BF0-55B6-11D8-99FC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1075758184.17455.92.camel@jessie.jhuapl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.2 (1.2.2-4) Date: 02 Feb 2004 16:43:04 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 21:43:24 -0000 This kind of reminds me a little of the apl language...Great work jc! On Mon, 2004-02-02 at 14:32, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > For some time now, I've been working on a new framework to manipulate > structured data. It's based on relational algebra operations, i.e. > things like select/join/project, the usual set operations, and more. > The key distinction is that this lets you operate on data as a whole, > in a set-wise fashion, instead of having to loop and iterate all the > time. > > I've set up a technology preview of "Ratcl 0.8" (pronounced "radical") > in case you are interested to see what it's about at this early stage. > As you will see, Ratcl has some resemblance to Oomk, but is not tied to > a database - it's about data manipulation, i.e. independent of storage > choices. > > Ratcl 0.8 is set up as starkit for Windows, Mac OS X, and Linux, though > each build is a self-contained shared library (and should work with any > Tcl 8.4 installation). > > I'm making it available to let you know what I've been up to, and to > find out whether others consider this approach a good fit for Tcl. > Both in terms of functionality and in how convenient this design maps > into the language. > > See http://www.equi4.com/ratcl.html for documentation, examples, > downloads, etc. > > -jcw > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From lvirden@cas.org Tue Feb 3 13:18:01 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8A19B3A8C for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:18:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXiVeaIj for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:17:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B08DB3A8B for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:17:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) i13CHufk028961 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:17:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)i13CHuA01436; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:17:56 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:17:56 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20040203071756.AAB1146@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:39:49 -0500 To: "Starkit list" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 12:18:01 -0000 From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" > [ from http://www.equi4.com/raintro2.html ] > Relational join is a workhorse for many purposes, the above "join1" drops unmatched rows, while "join0" returns rows which did not match in the join. > -- > > I think the commands "join1" and "join0" could perhaps be more clearly named. Here are some possible alternatives: If I understand the description above, the situation is this: By default, the join operation says "take the items from this column of table A, look those values up table B, and return columns from table A and B". This is sort of like the Unix join command. In join(1)'s terminology, there are unpairable rows in the two files as well. There are 4 options: 1. ignore the rows which have no match 2. include the matches and the rows from table 1 which have no match 3. include the matches and the rows from table 2 which have no match 4. include the matches and the rows from both tables which have no match It looks to me like join1 corresponds to option 1 and join0 is option4 - is that correct? In sql, option 1 is the way that join normally works, right? Perhaps, if an alternate syntax is sought, a join where that is the default would be defined. This is similar to set theory's "intersection" operation. To include everything would be similar to set theory's union operation - typically in set theory, if there are two items in the two groups being unioned, these 'collapse' into a single occurance: if set A contained "a b c" and set B contained "e d c" then typically in set theory the union of the two would be "a b e d c", not "a b c e d c". With ratcl's union do you get "a b e d c" or "a b c e d c" ? With ratcl's join0, joining on the 3rd column, what do you get? I don't have a platform available where I can test out the ratcl.kit, so I have to ask. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Tue Feb 3 14:01:02 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B287B3A8C for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:01:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXzDRuVD for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:01:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16065B3A8B for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:01:00 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id A11B383C26; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:00:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBA3B83914 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:00:46 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <20040203071756.AAB1146@cas.org> References: <20040203071756.AAB1146@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:00:45 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 13:01:02 -0000 Larry W. Virden wrote: > [...] If I understand the description above, the situation is this: Answered at http://www.equi4.com/forum/rawiki/23 -jcw From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Feb 3 16:54:58 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6E7EB3A8B for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:54:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXznZqdf for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:54:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F78DB3A88 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:54:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id i13FsnkR028792; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:54:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com (arbok.sps.mot.com [172.16.7.187]) i13Fmtl2002774; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:48:56 -0600 Sender: rna020@az33exr01.mot.com Message-ID: <401FC37D.63D73FD2@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:51:25 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel Organization: MOTOROLA/SPS/T&M/DMO X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; HP-UX B.11.00 9000/785) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Larry W. Virden" Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package References: <20040203071756.AAB1146@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 15:54:58 -0000 FWIW, here a MySQL example I put together some time ago. It may be helpful in this discussion. ================================================================= Create test case DROP TABLE A ; DROP TABLE X ; CREATE TABLE A ( P varchar(20) NOT NULL default '', A varchar(20) NOT NULL default '', B varchar(20) NOT NULL default '', PRIMARY KEY (P) ) TYPE=MyISAM; CREATE TABLE X ( P varchar(20) NOT NULL default '', X varchar(20) NOT NULL default '', Y varchar(20) NOT NULL default '', PRIMARY KEY (P) ) TYPE=MyISAM; INSERT INTO A VALUES ('P1','A1','B1'); INSERT INTO A VALUES ('P2','A2','B2'); INSERT INTO A VALUES ('P3','A3','B3'); INSERT INTO A VALUES ('P4','A4','B4'); INSERT INTO X VALUES ('P1','X1','Y1'); INSERT INTO X VALUES ('P2','X2','Y2'); INSERT INTO X VALUES ('P5','X3','Y3'); INSERT INTO X VALUES ('P6','X4','Y4'); ================================================================= SELECT * FROM A ; +----+----+----+ | P | A | B | +----+----+----+ | P1 | A1 | B1 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | | P3 | A3 | B3 | | P4 | A4 | B4 | +----+----+----+ SELECT * FROM X ; +----+----+----+ | P | X | Y | +----+----+----+ | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | P5 | X3 | Y3 | | P6 | X4 | Y4 | +----+----+----+ ## cross product joins SELECT * FROM A CROSS JOIN X ; SELECT * FROM A JOIN X ; SELECT * FROM A, X ; +----+----+----+----+----+----+ | P | A | B | P | X | Y | +----+----+----+----+----+----+ | P1 | A1 | B1 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P3 | A3 | B3 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P4 | A4 | B4 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P1 | A1 | B1 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | P3 | A3 | B3 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | P4 | A4 | B4 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | P1 | A1 | B1 | P5 | X3 | Y3 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P5 | X3 | Y3 | | P3 | A3 | B3 | P5 | X3 | Y3 | | P4 | A4 | B4 | P5 | X3 | Y3 | | P1 | A1 | B1 | P6 | X4 | Y4 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P6 | X4 | Y4 | | P3 | A3 | B3 | P6 | X4 | Y4 | | P4 | A4 | B4 | P6 | X4 | Y4 | +----+----+----+----+----+----+ ## inner joins SELECT * FROM A NATURAL JOIN X ; SELECT * FROM A INNER JOIN X ON A.P=X.P ; SELECT * FROM A, X WHERE A.P=X.P ; +----+----+----+----+----+----+ | P | A | B | P | X | Y | +----+----+----+----+----+----+ | P1 | A1 | B1 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | +----+----+----+----+----+----+ ## left joins SELECT * FROM A NATURAL LEFT JOIN X ; SELECT * FROM A LEFT JOIN X ON A.P=X.P ; +----+----+----+------+------+------+ | P | A | B | P | X | Y | +----+----+----+------+------+------+ | P1 | A1 | B1 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | P3 | A3 | B3 | NULL | NULL | NULL | | P4 | A4 | B4 | NULL | NULL | NULL | +----+----+----+------+------+------+ ## this returns values in A but not in X SELECT * FROM A LEFT JOIN X ON A.P=X.P WHERE X is NULL ; +----+----+----+------+------+------+ | P | A | B | P | X | Y | +----+----+----+------+------+------+ | P3 | A3 | B3 | NULL | NULL | NULL | | P4 | A4 | B4 | NULL | NULL | NULL | +----+----+----+------+------+------+ ## right joins (recommend don't use) SELECT * FROM A RIGHT JOIN X ON A.P=X.P ; SELECT * FROM A NATURAL RIGHT JOIN X ; +------+------+------+----+----+----+ | P | A | B | P | X | Y | +------+------+------+----+----+----+ | P1 | A1 | B1 | P1 | X1 | Y1 | | P2 | A2 | B2 | P2 | X2 | Y2 | | NULL | NULL | NULL | P5 | X3 | Y3 | | NULL | NULL | NULL | P6 | X4 | Y4 | +------+------+------+----+----+----+ ## notice that a right joins is not require SELECT * FROM X NATURAL LEFT JOIN A ; +----+----+----+------+------+------+ | P | X | Y | P | A | B | +----+----+----+------+------+------+ | P1 | X1 | Y1 | P1 | A1 | B1 | | P2 | X2 | Y2 | P2 | A2 | B2 | | P5 | X3 | Y3 | NULL | NULL | NULL | | P6 | X4 | Y4 | NULL | NULL | NULL | +----+----+----+------+------+------+ ================================================================= -- Tom.Krehbiel@motorola.com Software Developer Design to Manufacturing Solutions Semiconductor Products Sector From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 4 00:37:53 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4F6DB3A8B for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:37:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXy8LQp4 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:37:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9181FB3A88 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:37:49 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id A1A6B83C26; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:37:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 473F083914 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:37:45 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <401FC37D.63D73FD2@motorola.com> References: <20040203071756.AAB1146@cas.org> <401FC37D.63D73FD2@motorola.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:37:45 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:37:55 -0000 Tom Krehbiel wrote: > FWIW, here a MySQL example I put together some time ago. [...] See Ratcl equivalent at http://www.equi4.com/forum/rawiki/30 -jcw From sealj@indy.raytheon.com Wed Feb 4 20:46:58 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD118B3A8A for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:46:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXE6Hshi for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:46:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from bos-gate3.raytheon.com (bos-gate3.raytheon.com [199.46.198.232]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21A62B3A88 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:46:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from ds02e00.directory.ray.com (ds02e00.directory.ray.com [147.25.130.245])i14JkNRH025883 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:46:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ds02e00.directory.ray.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) i14JkLPk008179 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 19:46:22 GMT Received: Received: from email1.ind.us.ray.com ([147.159.145.6]) i14JkG9u008103 sender sealj@indy.raytheon.com for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 19:46:17 GMT Received: by email1.ind.us.ray.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id <1105X6LT>; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:46:12 -0500 Message-ID: <9246F3DA68E47E4EB2AB54C9D315061D0157477F@mailb.ind.us.ray.com> From: "Seal, John J" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:46:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB57.88599E04" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 19:46:58 -0000 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB57.88599E04 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" That sounds so perverted, doesn't it? I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) can wrap a starpack for another platform (Solaris Sparc). When I wrap a native starpack with sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime tclkit-win32.upx.exe I get an executable that works OK. When I wrap a cross-platform starpack with sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary mode, of course) it says Cannot execute binary file. ./dtr.app; Exec format error There were only two oddities that I observed during the cross-wrapping process. First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said just dtr, it tried to execute bits of my code! Second, to get the Solaris tclkit I ungzipped tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip. It asked me what the name of the file contained inside should be, and suggested "tclkit-solaris-sparc." with a trailing period. I tried removing the period (no extension) and adding upx, but they both behaved the same. Is WinZip somehow corrupting the .gz file when it expands it? Is cross-wrapping possible? Am I doing something wrong? John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon (MS-44) O- sealj (at) indy.raytheon.com | 6125 East 21st Street phone:317-306-4838 fax:317-306-3643 | Indianapolis, IN 46219-2058 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB57.88599E04 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sdx cross-wrapping

    That sounds so perverted, doesn't it?

    I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) = can wrap a starpack for another platform (Solaris Sparc).  When I = wrap a native starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime = tclkit-win32.upx.exe

    I get an executable that works OK.  When I wrap = a cross-platform starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime = tclkit-solaris-sparc

    I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary mode, = of course) it says

        Cannot execute binary file.
        ./dtr.app; Exec format = error

    There were only two oddities that I observed during = the cross-wrapping process.  First, I had to say dtr.app; if I = said just dtr, it tried to execute bits of my code!  Second, to = get the Solaris tclkit I ungzipped tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using = WinZip.  It asked me what the name of the file contained inside = should be, and suggested "tclkit-solaris-sparc." with a = trailing period.  I tried removing the period (no extension) and = adding upx, but they both behaved the same.  Is WinZip somehow = corrupting the .gz file when it expands it?

    Is cross-wrapping possible?  Am I doing = something wrong?



    John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon = (MS-44)         O-
    sealj (at) = indy.raytheon.com         &= nbsp; | 6125 East 21st Street
    phone:317-306-4838    = fax:317-306-3643 | Indianapolis, IN 46219-2058  

    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB57.88599E04-- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Feb 4 21:01:38 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F003BB3A8F for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:01:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXMoUnAZ for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:01:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 762F6B3A88 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:01:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate3.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate3) with ESMTP id i14K0Aa4004278 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:00:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.104.118]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id i14Jvdkw010243 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:57:42 -0600 Message-ID: <40214F53.6060909@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 13:00:19 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping References: <9246F3DA68E47E4EB2AB54C9D315061D0157477F@mailb.ind.us.ray.com> In-Reply-To: <9246F3DA68E47E4EB2AB54C9D315061D0157477F@mailb.ind.us.ray.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:01:38 -0000 John, <..snip..> > I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) can wrap a starpack > for another platform (Solaris Sparc). When I wrap a native starpack with Yes, I do it all the time. > sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime tclkit-win32.upx.exe > > I get an executable that works OK. When I wrap a cross-platform > starpack with > > sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc > > I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary mode, of course) it says > > Cannot execute binary file. > ./dtr.app; Exec format error The above looks a little strange. Normally you wrap a vfs directory. Are dtr.exe and dtr.app both vfs directories? If not then that might be your problem. Also when you wrap a starpack remember the runtime file (tclkit-win32.upx.exe above) cann't be the same file used to run sdx, it must be a copy. Tom K. From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Feb 4 21:01:56 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74D9EB3A95 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:01:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXlKXPfx for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:01:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (ext-nj2gw-2.online-age.net [216.35.73.164]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A7FDB3A94 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:01:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from int-nj2gw-2.online-age.net (int-nj2gw-2 [3.159.236.66]) id i14K1kkB010780 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:01:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlef04.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id i14K1irM009914 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:01:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvem06.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.77]) by cinmlef04.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:01:44 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6541.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB59.825A535C" Subject: RE: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:00:16 -0500 Message-ID: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF001FC3FBF@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping Thread-Index: AcPrV7DyevUGoyQdSNGDg5Y4dZzpTQAAEq1g From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" To: "Seal, John J" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Feb 2004 20:01:44.0204 (UTC) FILETIME=[B671E4C0:01C3EB59] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:01:57 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB59.825A535C Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It's definitely possible, I develop on solaris and deploy packs on = windows, solaris, and linux. =20 Your command "sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc" looks just = fine, though I think is more common to not include a file extension on = unix (sdx wrap dtr -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc). =20 This may seem like a silly questions, but... - Once ftp'd over, does dtr.app have executable permissions?=20 - Your not wraping for sparc architecture and deploying on intel based = solaris, are you? - It may be possible that WinZip mangled your tclkit. Have you ftp'd = just the plain tclkit-solaris-sparc over and tried running that? =20 =20 Regards -- bryan =20 -----Original Message----- From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On = Behalf Of Seal, John J Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 2:46 PM To: 'starkit@equi4.com' Subject: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping That sounds so perverted, doesn't it?=20 I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) can wrap a starpack = for another platform (Solaris Sparc). When I wrap a native starpack = with sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime tclkit-win32.upx.exe=20 I get an executable that works OK. When I wrap a cross-platform = starpack with=20 sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc=20 I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary mode, of course) it says = Cannot execute binary file.=20 ./dtr.app; Exec format error=20 There were only two oddities that I observed during the cross-wrapping = process. First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said just dtr, it tried to = execute bits of my code! Second, to get the Solaris tclkit I ungzipped = tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip. It asked me what the name of the = file contained inside should be, and suggested "tclkit-solaris-sparc." = with a trailing period. I tried removing the period (no extension) and = adding upx, but they both behaved the same. Is WinZip somehow = corrupting the .gz file when it expands it? Is cross-wrapping possible? Am I doing something wrong?=20 John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon (MS-44) O-=20 sealj (at) indy.raytheon.com | 6125 East 21st Street=20 phone:317-306-4838 fax:317-306-3643 | Indianapolis, IN 46219-2058 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB59.825A535C Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sdx cross-wrapping
    It's definitely = possible, I=20 develop on solaris and deploy packs on windows, solaris, and=20 linux.
     
    Your command = "sdx=20 wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc" looks just fine, though = I think=20 is more common to not include a file extension on unix (sdx wrap dtr = -runtime=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc).
     
    This may seem = like a silly=20 questions, but...
      - Once = ftp'd over,=20 does dtr.app have executable permissions?
      - Your = not wraping=20 for sparc architecture and deploying on intel based solaris, are=20 you?
      - It may = be possible=20 that WinZip mangled your tclkit. Have you ftp'd just the plain=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc over and tried running that?
     
     
    Regards
    --=20 bryan
     
    -----Original Message-----
    From: = starkit-bounces@equi4.com=20 [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Seal, John=20 J
    Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 2:46 PM
    To:=20 'starkit@equi4.com'
    Subject: [Starkit] sdx=20 cross-wrapping

    That sounds so perverted, doesn't it?

    I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) = can wrap a=20 starpack for another platform (Solaris Sparc).  When I wrap a = native=20 starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime=20 tclkit-win32.upx.exe

    I get an executable that works OK.  When I wrap = a=20 cross-platform starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc

    I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary = mode, of=20 course) it says

        Cannot execute binary = file.=20
        ./dtr.app; Exec format = error

    There were only two oddities that I observed during = the=20 cross-wrapping process.  First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said = just dtr,=20 it tried to execute bits of my code!  Second, to get the Solaris = tclkit I=20 ungzipped tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip.  It asked me what = the=20 name of the file contained inside should be, and suggested=20 "tclkit-solaris-sparc." with a trailing period.  I tried removing = the=20 period (no extension) and adding upx, but they both behaved the = same.  Is=20 WinZip somehow corrupting the .gz file when it expands it?

    Is cross-wrapping possible?  Am I doing = something=20 wrong?



    John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon=20 (MS-44)         O- =
    sealj (at)=20 = indy.raytheon.com         &n= bsp;=20 | 6125 East 21st Street
    phone:317-306-4838    fax:317-306-3643 | = Indianapolis,=20 IN 46219-2058  

    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB59.825A535C-- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Wed Feb 4 21:21:46 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C93E4B3A8C for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:21:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXxbG5gC for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:21:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net [216.34.191.37]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE22FB3A88 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:21:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from int-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-3 [3.159.232.67]) id i14KLc0k000607 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:21:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlef05.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id i14KLbRT022283 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvem06.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.77]) by cinmlef05.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:21:36 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6541.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB5C.7C5EADAC" Subject: RE: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:21:35 -0500 Message-ID: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF001FC3FC0@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping Thread-Index: AcPrV7DyevUGoyQdSNGDg5Y4dZzpTQAAmrUQ From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" To: "Seal, John J" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Feb 2004 20:21:36.0846 (UTC) FILETIME=[7D509EE0:01C3EB5C] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:21:46 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB5C.7C5EADAC Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Since I've only built packs on solaris and deployed on windows I decided = to give it the ol' 2 minute try from the other direction. To no suprise, = it worked just fine. Here's what I did. =20 * Downloaded the 8.4.5 tclkit for windows, solaris sparc, and sdx. * Decompressed tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz with PKZip (I don't have WinZip) = to tclkit-solar-sparc. (Notice no file extension, though that should not = matter.) * Created a file, test.tcl that contained a single line: puts "woot!" * Created an kit: sdx qwrap test.tcl * Unwrapped the kit to get a vfs: sdx unwrap test.kit * Rewrapped the vfs with the solaris runtime: sdx wrap test -runtime = tclkit-solaris-sparc * FTP'd to my Solaris 9 box * > chmod +x test * > ./test woot! =20 * Back on Win2k, wrapped another test pack: sdx test.app -runtime = tclkit-solaris-sparc * FTP'd it over Solaris * > chmod +x test.app * > ./test.app woot! =20 =20 Is it possible that the tclkit-solaris-sparc was built on later solaris = version than your sun machine? Say, built in solaris 8 but you have = solaris 7. =20 -- bryan -----Original Message----- From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On = Behalf Of Seal, John J Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 2:46 PM To: 'starkit@equi4.com' Subject: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping That sounds so perverted, doesn't it?=20 I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) can wrap a starpack = for another platform (Solaris Sparc). When I wrap a native starpack = with sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime tclkit-win32.upx.exe=20 I get an executable that works OK. When I wrap a cross-platform = starpack with=20 sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc=20 I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary mode, of course) it says = Cannot execute binary file.=20 ./dtr.app; Exec format error=20 There were only two oddities that I observed during the cross-wrapping = process. First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said just dtr, it tried to = execute bits of my code! Second, to get the Solaris tclkit I ungzipped = tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip. It asked me what the name of the = file contained inside should be, and suggested "tclkit-solaris-sparc." = with a trailing period. I tried removing the period (no extension) and = adding upx, but they both behaved the same. Is WinZip somehow = corrupting the .gz file when it expands it? Is cross-wrapping possible? Am I doing something wrong?=20 John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon (MS-44) O-=20 sealj (at) indy.raytheon.com | 6125 East 21st Street=20 phone:317-306-4838 fax:317-306-3643 | Indianapolis, IN 46219-2058 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB5C.7C5EADAC Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sdx cross-wrapping
    Since I've only = built packs=20 on solaris and deployed on windows I decided to give it the ol' 2 minute = try=20 from the other direction. To no suprise, it worked just fine. Here's = what I=20 did.
     
    * Downloaded = the 8.4.5=20 tclkit for windows, solaris sparc, and sdx.
    * Decompressed=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz with PKZip (I don't have WinZip) to = tclkit-solar-sparc.=20 (Notice no file extension, though that should not=20 matter.)
    * Created a = file, test.tcl=20 that contained a single line: puts "woot!"
    * Created an = kit: sdx qwrap=20 test.tcl
    * Unwrapped the = kit to get=20 a vfs: sdx unwrap test.kit
    * Rewrapped the = vfs with=20 the solaris runtime: sdx wrap test -runtime=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc
    * FTP'd to my = Solaris 9=20 box
    * > chmod +x = test
    * >=20 ./test
       woot!
     
    * Back on = Win2k, wrapped=20 another test pack: sdx test.app -runtime=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc
    * FTP'd it over = Solaris
    * > chmod +x = test.app
    * >=20 ./test.app
      =20 woot!
     
     
    Is it possible = that the=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc was built on later solaris version than your sun = machine?=20 Say, built in solaris 8 but you have solaris 7.
     
    --=20 bryan
    -----Original Message-----
    From: = starkit-bounces@equi4.com=20 [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Seal, John=20 J
    Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 2:46 PM
    To:=20 'starkit@equi4.com'
    Subject: [Starkit] sdx=20 cross-wrapping

    That sounds so perverted, doesn't it?

    I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) = can wrap a=20 starpack for another platform (Solaris Sparc).  When I wrap a = native=20 starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime=20 tclkit-win32.upx.exe

    I get an executable that works OK.  When I wrap = a=20 cross-platform starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc

    I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary = mode, of=20 course) it says

        Cannot execute binary = file.=20
        ./dtr.app; Exec format = error

    There were only two oddities that I observed during = the=20 cross-wrapping process.  First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said = just dtr,=20 it tried to execute bits of my code!  Second, to get the Solaris = tclkit I=20 ungzipped tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip.  It asked me what = the=20 name of the file contained inside should be, and suggested=20 "tclkit-solaris-sparc." with a trailing period.  I tried removing = the=20 period (no extension) and adding upx, but they both behaved the = same.  Is=20 WinZip somehow corrupting the .gz file when it expands it?

    Is cross-wrapping possible?  Am I doing = something=20 wrong?



    John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon=20 (MS-44)         O- =
    sealj (at)=20 = indy.raytheon.com         &n= bsp;=20 | 6125 East 21st Street
    phone:317-306-4838    fax:317-306-3643 | = Indianapolis,=20 IN 46219-2058  

    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EB5C.7C5EADAC-- From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Wed Feb 4 21:31:10 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B124DB3A8E; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:31:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXVqMxOT; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:31:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from motgate4.mot.com (motgate4.mot.com [144.189.100.102]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3F20B3A88; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:31:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate4.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate4) with ESMTP id i14KUqtH012751; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:30:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from motorola.com ([172.16.104.118])i14KRwkw012967; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:27:58 -0600 Message-ID: <4021566E.8070807@motorola.com> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 13:30:38 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package References: <20040203071756.AAB1146@cas.org> <401FC37D.63D73FD2@motorola.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Starkit list X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:31:11 -0000 Jean-Claude, The ratcl example are good but it is impotent to note that they are not equivalent to the SQL examples. For example the "A join1 X" example is not a left join and thus much less useful than a true left join. It would be nice to see an example of how to produce a true left join in ratcl. Tom K. > Tom Krehbiel wrote: > >> FWIW, here a MySQL example I put together some time ago. [...] > > > See Ratcl equivalent at http://www.equi4.com/forum/rawiki/30 > > -jcw From stefan.vogel@avinci.de Thu Feb 5 08:04:02 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B925B3A8A for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:04:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXQAgbiK for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:04:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp.avinci.de (unknown [81.201.99.101]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F094B3A88 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:04:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from MC01079 (mailix.lufthansa.com [53.122.232.162]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp.avinci.de (8.12.7/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1573xqP006633; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:04:00 +0100 From: "Stefan Vogel" To: "Seal, John J" , "Starkit mailing list" Subject: Re: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:03:44 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C3EBBE.937C5B20" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <9246F3DA68E47E4EB2AB54C9D315061D0157477F@mailb.ind.us.ray.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: stefan.vogel@avinci.de List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 07:04:02 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C3EBBE.937C5B20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit sdx cross-wrappingHi John, I don't know anything about the solaris-package-format, but if you have a "tar"-file in it, Winzip will try to convert "newlines". Maybe it is enough to deactivate "CR/LF Conversion" in "Options->Configuration->Misc". Best regards Stefan -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]Im Auftrag von Seal, John J Gesendet: Mittwoch, 4. Februar 2004 20:46 An: 'starkit@equi4.com' Betreff: [Starkit] sdx cross-wrapping That sounds so perverted, doesn't it? I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) can wrap a starpack for another platform (Solaris Sparc). When I wrap a native starpack with sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime tclkit-win32.upx.exe I get an executable that works OK. When I wrap a cross-platform starpack with sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary mode, of course) it says Cannot execute binary file. ./dtr.app; Exec format error There were only two oddities that I observed during the cross-wrapping process. First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said just dtr, it tried to execute bits of my code! Second, to get the Solaris tclkit I ungzipped tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip. It asked me what the name of the file contained inside should be, and suggested "tclkit-solaris-sparc." with a trailing period. I tried removing the period (no extension) and adding upx, but they both behaved the same. Is WinZip somehow corrupting the .gz file when it expands it? Is cross-wrapping possible? Am I doing something wrong? John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon (MS-44) O- sealj (at) indy.raytheon.com | 6125 East 21st Street phone:317-306-4838 fax:317-306-3643 | Indianapolis, IN 46219-2058 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C3EBBE.937C5B20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sdx cross-wrapping
    Hi=20 John,
     
    I don't know=20 anything about the solaris-package-format, but if you = have
    a "tar"-file=20 in it, Winzip will try to convert "newlines".
    Maybe it is=20 enough to deactivate "CR/LF Conversion" in
    "Options->Configuration->Misc".
     
    Best=20 regards
     =20 Stefan
    -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
    Von:=20 starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]Im = Auftrag von=20 Seal, John J
    Gesendet: Mittwoch, 4. Februar 2004=20 20:46
    An: 'starkit@equi4.com'
    Betreff: [Starkit] = sdx=20 cross-wrapping

    That sounds so perverted, doesn't it?

    I want to know if sdx on one platform (Windows NT) = can wrap a=20 starpack for another platform (Solaris Sparc).  When I wrap a = native=20 starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.exe -runtime=20 tclkit-win32.upx.exe

    I get an executable that works OK.  When I wrap = a=20 cross-platform starpack with

        sdx wrap dtr.app -runtime=20 tclkit-solaris-sparc

    I get no errors, but when I ftp it over (binary = mode, of=20 course) it says

        Cannot execute binary = file.=20
        ./dtr.app; Exec format = error

    There were only two oddities that I observed during = the=20 cross-wrapping process.  First, I had to say dtr.app; if I said = just dtr,=20 it tried to execute bits of my code!  Second, to get the Solaris = tclkit I=20 ungzipped tclkit-solaris-sparc.gz using WinZip.  It asked me what = the=20 name of the file contained inside should be, and suggested=20 "tclkit-solaris-sparc." with a trailing period.  I tried removing = the=20 period (no extension) and adding upx, but they both behaved the = same.  Is=20 WinZip somehow corrupting the .gz file when it expands it?

    Is cross-wrapping possible?  Am I doing = something=20 wrong?



    John Seal, Principal Software Engineer | Raytheon=20 (MS-44)         O- =
    sealj (at)=20 = indy.raytheon.com         &n= bsp;=20 | 6125 East 21st Street
    phone:317-306-4838    fax:317-306-3643 | = Indianapolis,=20 IN 46219-2058  

    ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C3EBBE.937C5B20-- From sealj@indy.raytheon.com Thu Feb 5 14:12:48 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBADBB3A8C for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:12:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXRXlPbP for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:12:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from dfw-gate1.raytheon.com (dfw-gate1.raytheon.com [199.46.199.230]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12252B3A88 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:12:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from ds02c00.directory.ray.com (ds02c00.directory.ray.com [147.25.138.118])i15DCVl5024826 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 07:12:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from ds02c00.directory.ray.com ([127.0.0.1])i15DCUsk001156 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:12:30 GMT Received: Received: from email1.ind.us.ray.com ([147.159.145.6]) i15DCTT5001125 sender sealj@indy.raytheon.com for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:12:29 GMT Received: by email1.ind.us.ray.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id <1105X72J>; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:12:28 -0500 Message-ID: <9246F3DA68E47E4EB2AB54C9D315061D01574784@mailb.ind.us.ray.com> From: "Seal, John J" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:12:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3EBE9.B3A5FFB6" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] RE: sdx cross-wrapping X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:12:48 -0000 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EBE9.B3A5FFB6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:21:35 -0500 > From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" > > > Is it possible that the tclkit-solaris-sparc was built on > later solaris version than your sun machine? Say, built in > solaris 8 but you have solaris 7. I think that's the problem. I ftp'd the gzipped tclkit over to the sparc and ugzipped it there, to avoid WinZip possibly mangling line endings. The resulting tclkit still gave the exec format error. I'm trying to compile a tclkit; the genkit B tcl phase went OK, but the rest is giving lots of errors on my ancient SunOS 4.1.4 laptop (which is Solaris 2.5, isn't it?). I don't have time to debug it this week, but maybe someday.... I still don't know why sdx wouldn't accept a name without an extension. Several people pointed out that unix apps typically don't have one. I initially tried leaving it off, but got the following error: C:\MYDOCU~1\Tcl>sdx version 2003/03/06 11:59:36 56635-48537 C:\MYDOCU~1\Tcl>sdx wrap dtr -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc couldn't open "dtr": permission denied while executing "open $name w" (procedure "writefile" line 2) invoked from within "writefile $out $header" invoked from within "if {!$reusefile} { writefile $out $header }" (file "C:/My Documents/Tcl/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/wrap.tcl" line 188) invoked from within "source [file join $b $a.tcl] " (file "C:/My Documents/Tcl/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" line 53) invoked from within "source {C:/My Documents/Tcl/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl}" ("package ifneeded" script) invoked from within "package require app-sdx " (file "sdx.kit/main.tcl" line 3) invoked from within "source sdx.kit/main.tcl" ("uplevel" body line 1) invoked from within "uplevel [list source [file join $self main.tcl]]" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EBE9.B3A5FFB6 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: sdx cross-wrapping

    > Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:21:35 -0500
    > From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE = Transportation)"
    >       = <Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com>
    > 
    > Is it possible that the tclkit-solaris-sparc = was built on
    > later solaris version than your sun machine? = Say, built in
    > solaris 8 but you have solaris 7.

    I think that's the problem.  I ftp'd the gzipped = tclkit over to the sparc and ugzipped it there, to avoid WinZip = possibly mangling line endings.  The resulting tclkit still gave = the exec format error.

    I'm trying to compile a tclkit; the genkit B tcl = phase went OK, but the rest is giving lots of errors on my ancient = SunOS 4.1.4 laptop (which is Solaris 2.5, isn't it?).  I don't = have time to debug it this week, but maybe someday....

    I still don't know why sdx wouldn't accept a name = without an extension.  Several people pointed out that unix apps = typically don't have one.  I initially tried leaving it off, but = got the following error:

    C:\MYDOCU~1\Tcl>sdx version
    2003/03/06 11:59:36  56635-48537

    C:\MYDOCU~1\Tcl>sdx wrap dtr -runtime = tclkit-solaris-sparc
    couldn't open "dtr": permission = denied
        while executing
    "open $name w"
        (procedure "writefile" = line 2)
        invoked from within
    "writefile $out $header"
        invoked from within
    "if {!$reusefile} {
      writefile $out $header
    }"
        (file "C:/My = Documents/Tcl/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/wrap.tcl" line 188)
        invoked from within
    "source [file join $b $a.tcl]
    "
        (file "C:/My = Documents/Tcl/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl" line 53)
        invoked from within
    "source {C:/My = Documents/Tcl/sdx.kit/lib/app-sdx/sdx.tcl}"
        ("package ifneeded" = script)
        invoked from within
    "package require app-sdx
    "
        (file = "sdx.kit/main.tcl" line 3)
        invoked from within
    "source sdx.kit/main.tcl"
        ("uplevel" body line = 1)
        invoked from within
    "uplevel [list source [file join $self = main.tcl]]"

    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3EBE9.B3A5FFB6-- From lvirden@cas.org Thu Feb 5 16:10:39 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4495EB3A8F for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:10:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX5JAuOc for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:10:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3756BB3A88 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:10:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.40.138]) i15FAZfk000890 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:10:36 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)i15FAZ524108; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:10:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:10:35 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20040205101035.AAB24082@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] RE: sdx cross-wrapping In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:12:27 -0500 To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:10:39 -0000 From: "Seal, John J" > I'm trying to compile a tclkit; the genkit B tcl phase went OK, but the rest > is giving lots of errors on my ancient SunOS 4.1.4 laptop (which is Solaris > 2.5, isn't it?). I don't have time to debug it this week, but maybe > someday.... You may run into a number of problems here - what version of gcc and g++ do you have installed on your SunOS system? > > I initially tried leaving it off, but got the following error: > > C:\MYDOCU~1\Tcl>sdx version > 2003/03/06 11:59:36 56635-48537 > > C:\MYDOCU~1\Tcl>sdx wrap dtr -runtime tclkit-solaris-sparc > couldn't open "dtr": permission denied Weird - normally, under Unix, I'd say your problem was that you didn't have write permission for the directory. But if you are on Windows, I don't know what would cause that problem... -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From jcw@equi4.com Thu Feb 5 20:20:28 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44ACAB3A8E for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:20:28 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXEtD9Zq for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:20:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CC42B3A88 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:20:26 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id AD6DC83C27; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:20:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77B2983914 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:20:17 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <8A745BF0-55B6-11D8-99FC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> References: <8A745BF0-55B6-11D8-99FC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <54D5D11C-5810-11D8-9FCB-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:20:17 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Relational algebra package - Ratcl 0.9 X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 19:20:28 -0000 I've uploaded Ratcl 0.9 - the main change is support for selection expressions and computed columns. This is also a feature freeze until 1.0, although a few syntax/naming tweaks are still likely. The quickest way to see what has been added is to look at this newly inserted page: http://www.equi4.com/raintro3.html On Feb 2, 2004, at 20:32, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > For some time now, I've been working on a new framework to manipulate > structured data. It's based on relational algebra operations, i.e. > things like select/join/project, the usual set operations, and more. > The key distinction is that this lets you operate on data as a whole, > in a set-wise fashion, instead of having to loop and iterate all the > time. > > I've set up a technology preview of "Ratcl 0.8" (pronounced "radical") > in case you are interested to see what it's about at this early stage. > As you will see, Ratcl has some resemblance to Oomk, but is not tied > to a database - it's about data manipulation, i.e. independent of > storage choices. > > Ratcl 0.8 is set up as starkit for Windows, Mac OS X, and Linux, > though each build is a self-contained shared library (and should work > with any Tcl 8.4 installation). > > I'm making it available to let you know what I've been up to, and to > find out whether others consider this approach a good fit for Tcl. > Both in terms of functionality and in how convenient this design maps > into the language. > > See http://www.equi4.com/ratcl.html for documentation, examples, > downloads, etc. -jcw PS. I'll post one last announcement about Ratcl on this mailing when 1.0 is ready. It is not really appropriate for this Starkit mailing list, but I thought there might be enough Tclers interested in this preview to justify the disruption. Once 1.0 is out, I'll announce it more widely elsewhere. Discussion can be directed to http://www.equi4.com/forum/rawiki/Home From rhempel@bmts.com Fri Feb 6 00:00:57 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8E4EB3A8E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:00:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXnQXrXl for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:00:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from cathy.bmts.com (cathy.bmts.com [216.183.128.202]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7DFFB3A88 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:00:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from PC300GL (os-dsl-0142.bmts.com [216.183.152.143]) by cathy.bmts.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i15MjSeD000227 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:45:28 -0500 (EST) From: "Ralph Hempel" To: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:00:44 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Filename Wierdness between Win98 and Win2K X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: rhempel@bmts.com List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 23:00:58 -0000 I'm posting here as well as c.l.t becasue I think this may be a StarKit issue.... > >> That's the difference between NT and 95/98/ME. The difference is > >> documented for how CreateFile() behaves. > >> > >> http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/fileio/base/createfile.asp > > > >Thanks David. I feel a bit sheepish about not looking this up myself. > > It's just one of those weird NT things. I was once playing around with > [open "//./Tape0"] and found I could open my tape drive. I couldn't tell > the drive to locate, but was fun to see it somewhat work. All the //./* > things are NT specific, I think. Maybe com ports above 4 are accessible > that way on Win9x, but I'm not sure. OK, now I've narrowed things down a bit and it looks like Tcl (or TclKit) might be doing something to the filename. Here's what I did: 1. Using MSVC 6 I created a little app (STATICALLY LINKED) that does this as the interesting bit: TowerHandle = CreateFile( "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1", GENERIC_READ | GENERIC_WRITE, 0, NULL, OPEN_EXISTING, 0 , NULL ); 2. Tried running on Win2K machine with no LEGO tower drivers. Returns INVALID_HANDLE_VALUE as expected. 3. Tried running on Win2K machine with LEGO tower drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO software. Returns a HANDLE as expected. 4. Tried running on Win98SE machine with LEGO tower drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO software. Returns a HANDLE as expected. 5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe (1.9MB - I think it's statically linked?) running on Win2K with LEGO tower drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO software and returns a Tcl I/O channel descriptor. 5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe (1.9MB - I think it's statically linked?) running on Win98SE with LEGO tower drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO software and returns: couldn't open "\\.\LEGOTOWER1": no such file or directory Now, I've escaped the name correctly, and Tcl on Win98SE doesn't work and yet a statically linked MFC program opening the EXACT SAME FILENAME does work. Is it possible that the runtime libraries tclkit is linking against are somehow incorrect? Ralph From dgporter@verizon.net Fri Feb 6 00:58:19 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32841B3A8E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:58:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXfTOjnG for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:58:17 +0100 (CET) Received: from out002.verizon.net (out002pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.141]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95A03B3A88 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:58:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from verizon.net ([129.6.88.137]) by out002.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040205235815.TTAJ23576.out002.verizon.net@verizon.net> for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:58:15 -0600 Message-ID: <4022D897.1020201@verizon.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 18:58:15 -0500 From: Donald G Porter User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040116 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out002.verizon.net from [129.6.88.137] at Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:58:15 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Tclkit and TCLLIBPATH ? X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: dgporter@verizon.net List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 23:58:19 -0000 I thought I understood that one use of a Tclkit binary was as a single-file replacement for the tclsh program. However, it appears that Tclkit does not respond in the same way as tclsh to the TCLLIBPATH environment variable. This variable is more imporant when using Tclkit, as the single-file might be placed far from where I happen to have my Tcl packages installed. Is this a known difference? An intentional one? -- | Don Porter dgporter@verizon.net | | "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!" | | -- Adam West as BATMAN | |______________________________________________________________________| From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 6 04:23:57 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B97E4B3A8E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:23:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXl8MqxX for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:23:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83C86B3A88 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:23:54 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 2813A83C27; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:23:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13F4083914 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:23:50 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Filename Wierdness between Win98 and Win2K Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:23:48 +0100 To: Starkit list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 03:23:57 -0000 Ralph Hempel wrote: > I'm posting here as well as c.l.t becasue I think this may be a StarKit > issue.... [...] > OK, now I've narrowed things down a bit and it looks like Tcl (or > TclKit) > might be doing something to the filename. Here's what I did: [...] > 5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe > (1.9MB - [...] May I suggest to first of all get the latest version of Tclkit (8.4.5)? There have been tweaks to VFS and filename handling in the different 8.4.x versions - some of it related to long vs. short filenames and such, which is specific to Windows, and can differ between various Windows versions. Get the latest tclkit.exe here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/ Once you do, can you please follow up and describe how that well/bad worked? -jcw From rhempel@bmts.com Fri Feb 6 05:30:33 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 834C8B3A8E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:30:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX67zRSu for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:30:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from cathy.bmts.com (cathy.bmts.com [216.183.128.202]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3DC0B3A88 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:30:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from PC300GL (os-dsl-0032.bmts.com [216.183.152.33]) by cathy.bmts.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i164GHeD020137 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:16:17 -0500 (EST) From: "Ralph Hempel" To: "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Filename Wierdness between Win98 and Win2K Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:31:31 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: rhempel@bmts.com List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 04:30:33 -0000 > > 5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe > > (1.9MB - > [...] > > May I suggest to first of all get the latest version of Tclkit (8.4.5)? > There have been tweaks to VFS and filename handling in the different > 8.4.x versions - some of it related to long vs. short filenames and > such, which is specific to Windows, and can differ between various > Windows versions. Jean-Claude, I downloaded the latest tclkit (and tclkitsh) and ran them standalone by double clicking on my win98SE machine. Still no luck doing an open on "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1" on the Win98SE machine. Tcl seems to be going out to the network to find the file, as I can see the activity light on the router flickering ONLY when I do the open. So far, I must say that I LOVE StarKits and I wanted to be able to wrap my pbForth console so my users did not have to do a full Tcl install. It works like magic under Win2K, but 98SE is another story entirely, at least as far as this special filename goes. Any other tests you would like me to run? Ralph From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Feb 6 07:41:49 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7714B3A8C for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:41:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXw69UWj for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:41:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03358B3A88 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:41:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Aozix-0006fg-00; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 07:44:23 +0100 Message-ID: <40233718.80001@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 07:41:28 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rhempel@bmts.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] Filename Wierdness between Win98 and Win2K References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 06:41:49 -0000 Ralph Hempel wrote: > I'm posting here as well as c.l.t becasue I think this may be a StarKit > issue.... > > >>>>That's the difference between NT and 95/98/ME. The difference is >>>>documented for how CreateFile() behaves. >>>> >>>>http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/fileio/base/createfile.asp >>> >>>Thanks David. I feel a bit sheepish about not looking this up myself. >> >>It's just one of those weird NT things. I was once playing around with >>[open "//./Tape0"] and found I could open my tape drive. I couldn't tell >>the drive to locate, but was fun to see it somewhat work. All the //./* >>things are NT specific, I think. Maybe com ports above 4 are accessible >>that way on Win9x, but I'm not sure. > > > OK, now I've narrowed things down a bit and it looks like Tcl (or TclKit) > might be doing something to the filename. Here's what I did: > > 1. Using MSVC 6 I created a little app (STATICALLY LINKED) that does > this as the interesting bit: > > TowerHandle = CreateFile( "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1", > GENERIC_READ | GENERIC_WRITE, > 0, NULL, OPEN_EXISTING, 0 , NULL ); > > 2. Tried running on Win2K machine with no LEGO tower drivers. Returns > INVALID_HANDLE_VALUE as expected. > > 3. Tried running on Win2K machine with LEGO tower drivers and tower > attched and confirmed working through other LEGO software. Returns > a HANDLE as expected. > > 4. Tried running on Win98SE machine with LEGO tower drivers and tower > attched and confirmed working through other LEGO software. Returns > a HANDLE as expected. > > 5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe (1.9MB - > I think it's statically linked?) running on Win2K with LEGO tower > drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO > software and returns a Tcl I/O channel descriptor. > > 5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe (1.9MB - > I think it's statically linked?) running on Win98SE with LEGO tower > drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO > software and returns: Try [open \\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1 r+] or with some other access mode. For example: % set fh [open //./A:] file903480 % set fh [open //./A: a+] couldn't open "//./A:": invalid argument % set fh [open //./A: a] couldn't open "//./A:": invalid argument % set fh [open //./A: r+] file90f258 % set fh [open //./A: w] couldn't open "//./A:": invalid argument So as you can see, opening a raw access to A: on NT series needs some access modes. If all of that fails, you can also try doing a dll that does CreateFile and uses Tcl_CreateFileHandler() to create a Tcl file handler. But that should be a last resort. -- WK From arjen.markus@wldelft.nl Fri Feb 6 09:01:45 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 868C7B3A8F for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:01:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXGyHLqF for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:01:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from pophost.wldelft.nl (sunray.wldelft.nl [145.9.132.100]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49903B3A8E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:01:44 +0100 (CET) Received: (from root@localhost) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3vc) id JAA22043 for starkit@equi4.com; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:01:43 +0100 (MET) Received: from wldelft.nl (pophost [145.9.132.201]) by pophost.wldelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA20994 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:01:21 +0100 (MET) Sender: Arjen.Markus@wldelft.nl Message-ID: <402349D1.BDA576F5@wldelft.nl> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 09:01:21 +0100 From: Arjen Markus X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit list Subject: Re: [Starkit] Relational algebra package - Ratcl 0.9 References: <8A745BF0-55B6-11D8-99FC-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <54D5D11C-5810-11D8-9FCB-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 08:01:45 -0000 Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > > I've uploaded Ratcl 0.9 - the main change is support for selection > expressions and computed columns. This is also a feature freeze until > 1.0, although a few syntax/naming tweaks are still likely. > > The quickest way to see what has been added is to look at this newly > inserted page: > http://www.equi4.com/raintro3.html > The solution you chose for avoiding memory leaks is interesting. Sometime ago I was struggling with a very similar thing - this might be a good solution for me too :). The package itself looks nice too - I look forward to an opportunity to really use it. Regards, Arjen From rhempel@bmts.com Fri Feb 6 14:45:35 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABDE1B3A8E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:45:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX7lTmc7 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:45:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from cathy.bmts.com (cathy.bmts.com [216.183.128.202]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5988EB3A8C for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:45:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from PC300GL (cheetah-bar-ppp065.bmts.com [216.183.159.66]) by cathy.bmts.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i16DVGeD001019 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:31:16 -0500 (EST) From: "Ralph Hempel" To: Subject: RE: [Starkit] Filename Wierdness between Win98 and Win2K Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:46:28 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <40233718.80001@kocjan.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: rhempel@bmts.com List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 13:45:36 -0000 > Try [open \\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1 r+] or with some other access mode. For example: > So as you can see, opening a raw access to A: on NT series needs some > access modes. I've gone through that exercise too :-) and it does not work on Win98SE. > If all of that fails, you can also try doing a dll that does CreateFile > and uses Tcl_CreateFileHandler() to create a Tcl file handler. But that > should be a last resort. Agreed. I need to do that eventually anyways to access some of the functions in the DLL that require a Windows HANDLE. I'm using ffidl with the TclKit and it's really amazing how well it all works. Except under Win98 :-( Ralph From rhempel@bmts.com Sat Feb 7 14:57:58 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FACEB3A8F; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:57:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXqPwxVK; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:57:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from cathy.bmts.com (cathy.bmts.com [216.183.128.202]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFE5CB3A8E; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:57:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from PC300GL (os-dsl-0192.bmts.com [216.183.152.193]) by cathy.bmts.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i17DhehG002825; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:43:40 -0500 (EST) From: "Ralph Hempel" To: "Jean-Claude Wippler" , "Starkit list" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Filename Wierdness between Win98 and Win2K Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:59:43 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: rhempel@bmts.com List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 13:57:58 -0000 Jean Claude, It looks like the problem is with Tcl and how it handles filenames that look like network names under Win98.... see below. > Once you do, can you please follow up and describe how that well/bad > worked? > >5. Tried [open "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] under tclkit-win32-8-4-0.exe (1.9MB - > > I think it's statically linked?) running on Win98SE with LEGO tower > > drivers and tower attched and confirmed working through other LEGO > > software and returns: > > > > couldn't open "\\.\LEGOTOWER1": no such file or directory > > > >Now, I've escaped the name correctly, and Tcl on Win98SE doesn't work and > >yet a statically linked MFC program opening the EXACT SAME FILENAME > >does work. I think that TclpObjNormalizePath() may be the culprit here.... If I say [file normalize "\\\\.\\LEGOTOWER1"] Tcl appears to go out to the network, possibly reparsing what look like mount points. It returns: ///LEGOTOWER1 Which is NOT going to open properly - at least not under Win98SE.... On Win2K, it works properly, returning //./LEGOTOWER1 I'm not sure if I should call this a bug in Tcl, or if the LEGO folks are exploiting a bu...ahem...feature in Windows98 here. It looks like this problem is here to stay for a while, at least until Tcl 8.4.6 Ralph From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mon Feb 9 16:23:49 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C82C4B3A97 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:23:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXHHFURI for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:23:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3A82B3A8B for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:23:46 +0100 (CET) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP for starkit@equi4.com; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:23:10 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:23:10 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Tclkit and TCLLIBPATH ? Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:23:02 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 15:23:50 -0000 > From: Donald G Porter > I thought I understood that one use of a Tclkit binary was as > a single-file replacement for the tclsh program. > > However, it appears that Tclkit does not respond in the same > way as tclsh to the TCLLIBPATH environment variable. This > variable is more imporant when using Tclkit, as the > single-file might be placed far from where I happen to have > my Tcl packages installed. > > Is this a known difference? An intentional one? I believe that the intention is that packages would reside inside either tclkit or a starkit, so you shouldn't need an external TCLLIBPATH. So there might be some intentional effort to ignore TCLLIBPATH. But I don't see it documented on http://wiki.tcl.tk/DifferencesBetweenTclkitAndTcl Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Wed Feb 11 18:26:59 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF9B5B3A92 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:26:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXmbrvKZ for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:26:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from dallas.jhuapl.edu (dallas.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.22]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6468AB3A88 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:26:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) id <0HSX00401KGLQA@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:26:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from jhuapl.edu (piper.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.27]) by dallas.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40039) with ESMTP id <0HSX003OFKGF32@dallas.jhuapl.edu> for starkit@equi4.com; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:26:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ([128.244.28.6]) by piper.jhuapl.edu with ESMTP ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:26:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from jessie.jhuapl.edu (jessie.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.61]) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:26:02 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:25:39 -0500 From: John Zouck To: Starkit mail list server Message-id: <1076520339.16023.4.camel@jessie.jhuapl.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Memory limitation problem with sdx wrap on large starkits (mk4) X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:26:59 -0000 I am trying to wrap a vfs tree (edrv.vfs) that contains a fairly large mk4 database file (a little larger than 17 MB), and get the following error: jhz[hanalei:(~/tmp/edrv)]1: sdx wrap edrv unable to alloc 16785416 bytes ^CAbort jhz[hanalei:(~/tmp/edrv)]2: What is the limit on wrapped starkit and how can I make it a bit larger? I'm running on linux redhat 9.0. From jcw@equi4.com Wed Feb 11 18:39:07 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E9AAB3A92 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:39:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXByAyGs for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:39:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BAB2B3A88 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:39:06 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 2D32483C26; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:39:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20FA783914 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:39:02 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <1076520339.16023.4.camel@jessie.jhuapl.edu> References: <1076520339.16023.4.camel@jessie.jhuapl.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <2DCFB5A2-5CB9-11D8-9096-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Memory limitation problem with sdx wrap on large starkits (mk4) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:39:01 +0100 To: Starkit mail list server X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:39:07 -0000 John Zouck wrote: > I am trying to wrap a vfs tree (edrv.vfs) that contains a fairly large > mk4 database file (a little larger than 17 MB), and get the following > error: > > jhz[hanalei:(~/tmp/edrv)]1: sdx wrap edrv > unable to alloc 16785416 bytes > > ^CAbort > jhz[hanalei:(~/tmp/edrv)]2: > > What is the limit on wrapped starkit and how can I make it a bit > larger? There are no hard limits. I routinely create starkits 10x as big. I suspect there is something else going, perhaps a very low "ulimit" setting or extreme mem-/swap-space shortage? Or perhaps you're trying to open an MK file from inside a starkit? Can't be done as is (MK itself does not know about VFS and would not know how to mmap from a possibly compressed starkit file. You need to sidestep MK open's by going through Tcl: mk::file open db set fd [open mydatafile] mk::file load db $fd close $fd Commits need to be done with a full save: set fd [open mydatafile w] mk::file save db $fd close $fd If you don't want compression, then be sure to turn it off: set ::mk4vfs::compress 0 -jcw From john_zouck@jhuapl.edu Wed Feb 11 20:03:29 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85DD6B3A9E; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:03:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXDNjLcN; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:03:27 +0100 (CET) Received: from houston.jhuapl.edu (houston.jhuapl.edu [128.244.26.10]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B0D3B3A88; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:03:27 +0100 (CET) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) id <0HSX00501OXJJD@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:03:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from jhuapl.edu (pilot.jhuapl.edu [128.244.197.23]) by houston.jhuapl.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #40040) with ESMTP id <0HSX002CDOXDD6@houston.jhuapl.edu>; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:03:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ([128.244.28.6]) by pilot.jhuapl.edu with ESMTP ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:02:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from jessie.jhuapl.edu (jessie.jhuapl.edu [128.244.28.61]) by aplexus.jhuapl.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id i1BJ2dd20032; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:02:39 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:02:16 -0500 From: John Zouck Subject: Re: [Starkit] Memory limitation problem with sdx wrap on large starkits (mk4) In-reply-to: <2DCFB5A2-5CB9-11D8-9096-000A9588127E@equi4.com> To: Jean-Claude Wippler , "starkit@equi4.com" Message-id: <1076526136.16023.24.camel@jessie.jhuapl.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <1076520339.16023.4.camel@jessie.jhuapl.edu> <2DCFB5A2-5CB9-11D8-9096-000A9588127E@equi4.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:03:29 -0000 It does seem to be a limitation of the Sun Solaris host (my a apologies for saying I was building on linux Redhat 9.0, but I go back and forth so much I can't keep them straight sometimes. ) I ftp'ed all the files to my desktop linux RH 9.0 and the build went just fine. That's quite a testiment to tclkit technology, since I am building three standalone versions, one each for linux, solaris and ms windows! I'd still like to figure out why solaris is misbehaving. I can compile small c programs that can malloc up to 100 MB, so it does not seem to be an obvious memory limit. ulimit says: jhz[hanalei:(~)]1: ulimit -a core file size (blocks) unlimited data seg size (kbytes) unlimited file size (blocks) unlimited open files 256 pipe size (512 bytes) 10 stack size (kbytes) 8192 cpu time (seconds) unlimited max user processes 1893 virtual memory (kbytes) unlimited jhz[hanalei:(~)]2: A test program runs into malloc problems only above 100 MB: // // main.c - See how much memory we can allocate using malloc() // #include #include #define NTRIES 10 #define CHUNKSIZE 10000000 int main( int argc, char **argv){ int i; void *p; int size = 0; for ( i = 0; i < NTRIES; i++) { size += CHUNKSIZE; printf("Trying to malloc (%d) bytes\n", size); p = malloc( size ); if ( p == NULL ) { printf("ERROR on malloc\n"); break; } printf("Success\n"); free( p ); } } jhz[hanalei:(~/dev/C)]20: gcc -o test main.c jhz[hanalei:(~/dev/C)]21: ./test Trying to malloc (10000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (20000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (30000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (40000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (50000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (60000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (70000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (80000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (90000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (100000000) bytes ERROR on malloc jhz[hanalei:(~/dev/C)]22: On Wed, 2004-02-11 at 12:39, Jean-Claude Wippler wrote: > John Zouck wrote: > > > I am trying to wrap a vfs tree (edrv.vfs) that contains a fairly large > > mk4 database file (a little larger than 17 MB), and get the following > > error: > > > > jhz[hanalei:(~/tmp/edrv)]1: sdx wrap edrv > > unable to alloc 16785416 bytes > > > > ^CAbort > > jhz[hanalei:(~/tmp/edrv)]2: > > > > What is the limit on wrapped starkit and how can I make it a bit > > larger? > > There are no hard limits. I routinely create starkits 10x as big. I > suspect there is something else going, perhaps a very low "ulimit" > setting or extreme mem-/swap-space shortage? > > Or perhaps you're trying to open an MK file from inside a starkit? > Can't be done as is (MK itself does not know about VFS and would not > know how to mmap from a possibly compressed starkit file. You need to > sidestep MK open's by going through Tcl: > mk::file open db > set fd [open mydatafile] > mk::file load db $fd > close $fd > Commits need to be done with a full save: > set fd [open mydatafile w] > mk::file save db $fd > close $fd > If you don't want compression, then be sure to turn it off: > set ::mk4vfs::compress 0 > > -jcw > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From lvirden@cas.org Wed Feb 11 20:34:50 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC1F5B3A92 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:34:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXImieXm for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:34:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E20AB3A88 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:34:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.216.133]) id i1BJYkLA018609 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:34:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)i1BJYj627192; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:34:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:34:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20040211143445.AAB27185@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] Memory limitation problem with sdx wrap on large In-Reply-To: Your message of Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:02:16 -0500 To: "starkit@equi4.com" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:34:51 -0000 I'm using solaris 8 on a sunblade 100. I just tried your C program and here's what _I_ see: Trying to malloc (10000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (20000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (30000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (40000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (50000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (60000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (70000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (80000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (90000000) bytes Success Trying to malloc (100000000) bytes Success -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From gclts-starkit@m.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 05:14:41 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F6F7B3A94 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 05:14:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXy2dX4L for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 05:14:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from main.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.224.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69A60B3A88 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 05:14:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from list by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Ar8FH-00066C-00 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 05:14:35 +0100 Received: from proxy01.legerity.com ([209.217.153.219]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu Feb 12 04:14:35 2004 Received: from steven.hafer by proxy01.legerity.com with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu Feb 12 04:14:35 2004 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: starkit@equi4.com From: Hafer Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 04:14:33 +0000 (UTC) Lines: 16 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 209.217.153.219 (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)) Sender: news X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] exec tclkit.exe << ..... & X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 04:14:41 -0000 I have a question about the exec command and starpacks. I can open wish84.exe and do this to an original tclkit.exe exec tclkit.exe << "puts here" & This command causes the word "here" to appear in the tclkit.exe console window. However, if I wrap up an app with tclkit and then do the same to the new app in the wish84.exe, nothing happens? Why is that? I wrapped a small test script that does nothing more that open the console print out the word complete. I wrapped the small app with a copy of tclkit.exe Thanks for the help From tmohr@s.netic.de Sat Feb 14 21:11:13 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15169B3A8B for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:11:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXOJs40G for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:11:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.s.netic.de (mail.s.netic.de [212.9.160.11]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4206BB3A88 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:11:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from host-212-9-162-23.dial.netic.de ([212.9.162.23] helo=schleim.qwe.de) by mail.s.netic.de with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1As687-000GjJ-RG for starkit@equi4.com; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:11:12 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by schleim.qwe.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D9B35E2C0 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:49:38 +0100 (CET) From: Torsten Mohr Organization: Qwe Inc. To: starkit@equi4.com Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:49:37 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402142049.37812.tmohr@s.netic.de> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Startup Code, boot.tcl, main.tcl X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:11:13 -0000 Hi, i now have a working "kit.exe", when i start it and there's setup.tcl in the same directory, it generates a "tclkit.exe". As i understand it, "boot.tcl" is executed quite early. What's its use? Does it do some basic initialisations? Is it a replacement for "init.tcl"? Also, "main.tcl" can be provided as a main script that is executed, if available. If i provide an empty boot.tcl and a main.tcl that just says something like: button .b -text "hello" -command quit; pack .b; Then the message shows up that no valid "init.tcl" could be found. What do i need to put in "boot.tcl"? Can i provide a normal Tcl script as "main.tcl"? Thanks for hints, Torsten. From jcw@equi4.com Sat Feb 14 21:34:22 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AAE5B3A8C for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:34:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXo0icGl for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:34:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00627B3A88 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:34:21 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id B3C7883C26; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:34:18 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8D5C83914 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:34:16 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <200402142049.37812.tmohr@s.netic.de> References: <200402142049.37812.tmohr@s.netic.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <286FFC46-5F2D-11D8-B7CB-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Startup Code, boot.tcl, main.tcl Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 21:34:16 +0100 To: Starkit mail list server X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:34:22 -0000 Torsten Mohr wrote: > i now have a working "kit.exe", when i start it and there's > setup.tcl in the same directory, it generates a "tclkit.exe". That's an internal pre-8.4 mechanism, really. To create tclkit.exe, the normal steps are to add the "runtime.kit" file at the end, you can get a copy here: http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit It's a starkit, so you can unpack and inspect and change whatever you like. The standard way to create tclkit, is: cat kit.exe runtime.kit >tclkit.exe In Windows, I think the following should also work: copy /B kit.exe+runtime.kit tclkit.exe After that, you can use SDX to create starpacks. -jcw From tmohr@s.netic.de Sun Feb 15 16:46:24 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B77DB3A8B; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:46:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXV7452a; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:46:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.s.netic.de (mail.s.netic.de [212.9.160.11]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCB14B3A88; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:46:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from host-212-9-162-51.dial.netic.de ([212.9.162.51] helo=schleim.qwe.de) by mail.s.netic.de with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AsOTN-0005zi-1H; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:46:21 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by schleim.qwe.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1E645E2C3; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:24:45 +0100 (CET) From: Torsten Mohr Organization: Qwe Inc. To: Jean-Claude Wippler , Starkit mail list server Subject: Re: [Starkit] Startup Code, boot.tcl, main.tcl Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:24:45 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200402142049.37812.tmohr@s.netic.de> <286FFC46-5F2D-11D8-B7CB-000A9588127E@equi4.com> In-Reply-To: <286FFC46-5F2D-11D8-B7CB-000A9588127E@equi4.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402151624.45619.tmohr@s.netic.de> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 15:46:25 -0000 Hi, thanks for those hints. But i still have some issues... LINUX: I compiled tclkit now on my Linux PC, i have some things i'd like to suggest: I've built it with "M.sh". This one needs "kit" to be in the directory hierarchy NEXT TO "Dists" which contains all the needed sources. On windows that's different, maybe it could be made consistent on both platforms? Also, when i unpack all the sources, the directory names are in lower case letters, but in "M.sh", they begin with a capital letter. I was able to create tclkit that way. But when i try the demo code: tmohr@schleim:/tmp> tclkit fractal.kit application-specific initialization failed: unknown encoding "iso8859-1" This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/tclkit/ while executing "error $e" invoked from within "if {[catch { package require starkit; starkit::header mk4 -readonly }]} { set e "This requires a new TclKit release, see http://www.equi4.com/ tclkit..." (file "fractal.kit" line 4) tmohr@schleim:/tmp> WINDOWS: If i (as you recommend below) do a "copy /B kit.exe+runtime.kit ...", i get a tclsh that seems to work. If i use any other *.kit, it doesn't work (setup.tcl missing). I assume that i need to add some files to the kit i use? So adding/changing files to a "file.kit" is a really important thing to do, right? What's the best way to do this in a scriptable way on Windows and Linux? Best regards, Torsten. > > i now have a working "kit.exe", when i start it and there's > > setup.tcl in the same directory, it generates a "tclkit.exe". > > That's an internal pre-8.4 mechanism, really. To create tclkit.exe, > the normal steps are to add the "runtime.kit" file at the end, you can > get a copy here: > http://www.equi4.com/pub/tk/tars/runtime.kit > > It's a starkit, so you can unpack and inspect and change whatever you > like. > > The standard way to create tclkit, is: > cat kit.exe runtime.kit >tclkit.exe > > In Windows, I think the following should also work: > copy /B kit.exe+runtime.kit tclkit.exe > > After that, you can use SDX to create starpacks. > > -jcw > > _____________________________________________ > Starkit mailing list - Starkit@equi4.com > http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/starkit From jcw@equi4.com Sun Feb 15 17:16:16 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04933B3A8B for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 17:16:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX53fuGY for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 17:16:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C081B3A88 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 17:16:14 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 3914B83C26; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 17:16:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45ED283914 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 17:16:10 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <200402151624.45619.tmohr@s.netic.de> References: <200402142049.37812.tmohr@s.netic.de> <286FFC46-5F2D-11D8-B7CB-000A9588127E@equi4.com> <200402151624.45619.tmohr@s.netic.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <441E10A2-5FD2-11D8-9E06-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Startup Code, boot.tcl, main.tcl Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 17:16:09 +0100 To: Starkit mail list server X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 16:16:16 -0000 Torsten Mohr wrote: > But i still have some issues... > > LINUX: > I compiled tclkit now on my Linux PC, i have some things > i'd like to suggest: > I've built it with "M.sh". Don't. Please use genkit. See http://www.equi4.com/218 > So adding/changing files to a "file.kit" is a really important > thing to do, right? > > What's the best way to do this in a scriptable way on Windows > and Linux? See http://www.equi4.com/188 And http://www.equi4.com/208 And http://www.equi4.com/starkit.html And http://www.equi4.com/tkstarted.html -jcw From MichaelL@frogware.com Fri Feb 20 22:07:16 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75D7FB3AE7 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:07:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXYgckZb for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:07:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com (unknown [209.167.184.206]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 941B3B3AE5 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:07:15 +0100 (CET) To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 16:07:09 -0500 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 02/20/2004 04:07:09 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 02/20/2004 04:07:09 PM, Serialize complete at 02/20/2004 04:07:09 PM,was not found, 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 02/20/2004 04:07:11 PM, Serialize complete at 02/20/2004 04:07:11 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Critcl X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 21:07:16 -0000 When I run "tclkit criticl.kit" I get 'error reading package index file ...: expected version number but got ""' errors for cmdline, md5, http, msgcat, opt, and tcltest--basically, all of the packages in the kit. I'm using the 8.4.4 tclkit and a critcl that I downloaded today on Windows. The problem is the way critcl overrides the package command. There are several pkgIndex files that call "package provide" without a version number, in order to get a version number. For example, here's a line from cmdline's pkgIndex file: if {![package vsatisfies [package provide Tcl] 8.2]} {return} The existing code makes Tcl forget the Tcl package itself. To fix the problem I changed this: proc package {option args} { if {$option eq "provide"} { if {![catch {set v [_package present [lindex $args 0]]}] \ && $v ne [lindex $args 1]} { _package forget [lindex $args 0] } } eval _package $option $args } to this: proc package {option args} { if {$option eq "provide"} { if {![catch {set v [_package present [lindex $args 0]]}] \ && ([llength $args] > 1) && ($v ne [lindex $args 1])} { _package forget [lindex $args 0] } } eval _package $option $args } In other words, I only do the version number comparison if the version number is present. From MichaelL@frogware.com Fri Feb 20 22:57:08 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA0EFB3AE7 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:57:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXM9CSxB for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:57:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from evilwitch.frogware.com (unknown [209.167.184.206]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C556B3AE5 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:57:08 +0100 (CET) To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.0.2CF1 June 9, 2003 Message-ID: From: MichaelL@frogware.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 16:57:03 -0500 X-MIMETrack: S/MIME Sign by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 02/20/2004 04:57:03 PM, Serialize by Notes Client on Michael Lenaghan/frogware inc.(Release 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 02/20/2004 04:57:03 PM, Serialize complete at 02/20/2004 04:57:03 PM,was not found, 6.0.2CF1|June 9, 2003) at 02/20/2004 04:57:04 PM, Serialize complete at 02/20/2004 04:57:04 PM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Critcl crosscheck X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 21:57:09 -0000 In the following procedure, 'set platform ""' should occur before the first 'if' statement. If the if statement fails you end up at the second 'if' statement with an uninitialized variable. proc crosscheck {} { global tcl_platform if {![catch {set machine [eval exec "$v::compile -dumpmachine"]}]} { set platform "" switch -glob -- $machine { *mingw* { if {![string equal $tcl_platform(platform) windows]} { set tcl_platform(byteOrder) littleEndian set tcl_platform(machine) intel set tcl_platform(os) "Windows NT" set tcl_platform(osVersion) 5.0 set tcl_platform(platform) windows set tcl_platform(wordSize) 4 set result 1 set v::sharedlibext .dll set v::cache [::critcl::cache] regsub { -fPIC} $v::compile {} v::compile set platform Windows set desc Xmingwin } } } } if {$platform != ""} { puts stderr "Cross compiling for $platform using $desc" } } From jcw@equi4.com Fri Feb 20 23:12:26 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93981B3AE8 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:12:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXQ3k0sS for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:12:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74212B3AE5 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:12:24 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id EAE4283C26; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:12:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1BB583914 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:12:18 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] Critcl crosscheck Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:12:19 +0100 To: Starkit mail list server X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:12:26 -0000 MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: > In the following procedure, 'set platform ""' should occur before the > first 'if' statement. If the if statement fails you end up at the > second > 'if' statement with an uninitialized variable. [...] This shows that the cross-compile code has never been used with anything but mingw... I've just fixed this bug and the previous one you reported - both your changes are now in critcl.kit and CVS. Thanks! -jcw From steffen@maths.mq.edu.au Mon Feb 23 16:16:44 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A639B3AE8 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:16:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXJOB9rb for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:16:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A203B3AE5 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:16:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with SMTP id i1NFGeP10856 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 02:16:40 +1100 (EST) Received: from vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au ([137.111.216.16]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (SAVSMTP 3.1.0.29) with SMTP id M2004022402163916049 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 02:16:39 +1100 Received: from euler.ics.mq.edu.au (root@euler.ics.mq.edu.au [137.111.90.11]) by vacuum.ics.mq.edu.au (8.11.6/8.11.7) with ESMTP id i1NFGch10850; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 02:16:38 +1100 (EST) Received: from maths.mq.edu.au (steffen@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by euler.ics.mq.edu.au (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NFGbNf000999; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 02:16:38 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 02:16:36 +1100 X-Image-Url: http://www.maths.mq.edu.au/~steffen/images/das Subject: Re: [Starkit] Critcl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) To: MichaelL@frogware.com From: "Daniel A. Steffen" In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <45BC9636-6613-11D8-A2DB-000A958518E8@maths.mq.edu.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:16:44 -0000 On Saturday, Feb 21, 2004, at 08:07 Australia/Sydney, MichaelL@frogware.com wrote: > if {![catch {set v [_package present [lindex $args > 0]]}] \ > && ([llength $args] > 1) && ($v ne [lindex > $args 1])} { oj, that looks like a bug I introduced, apologies... Cheers, Daniel -- ** Daniel A. Steffen ** "And now for something completely ** Dept. of Mathematics ** different" Monty Python ** Macquarie University ** ** NSW 2109 Australia ** From guacamole1234@yahoo.com Thu Feb 26 11:06:36 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19EFCB3A93 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:06:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXVDq63z for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:06:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from web41906.mail.yahoo.com (web41906.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.157]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C00C6B3A88 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:06:34 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040226100633.83487.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.216.61.220] by web41906.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:06:33 PST Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:06:33 -0800 (PST) From: Guaca Mole To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Segfault on Linux X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:06:36 -0000 In Red Hat 8.0, with latest tclkit from www.equi4.com If the user "abc" does not exist : % file normalize ~abc Segmentation fault __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools From dgporter@verizon.net Thu Feb 26 14:04:25 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CDC1B3A8B for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:04:25 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXoMooPU for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:04:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from out011.verizon.net (out011pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.135]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5C08B3A88 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:04:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from [141.156.199.251] by out011.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040226130422.WGQG17235.out011.verizon.net@[141.156.199.251]>; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:04:22 -0600 In-Reply-To: <20040226100633.83487.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040226100633.83487.qmail@web41906.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4A466CB8-685C-11D8-89F2-000393A3F786@verizon.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Don Porter Subject: Re: [Starkit] Segfault on Linux Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:04:19 -0500 To: Guaca Mole X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out011.verizon.net from [141.156.199.251] at Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:04:22 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:04:25 -0000 On Feb 26, 2004, at 5:06 AM, Guaca Mole wrote: > In Red Hat 8.0, with latest tclkit from www.equi4.com > > If the user "abc" does not exist : > > % file normalize ~abc > Segmentation fault Tcl Bug 858937. Fixed for Tcl 8.4.6. From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Mar 2 01:29:42 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57DE7B3AE7 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXiiXuSt for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:29:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D15AEB3AE6 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:29:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from il06exr02.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate) with ESMTP id i220TdnD006069 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:29:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from az33exm31.corp.mot.com (az33exm31.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.145]) by il06exr02.mot.com (Motorola/il06exr02) with ESMTP id i220PExO001322 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:25:14 -0600 Received: from motorola.com (RNA020-02 [172.16.104.118]) by az33exm31.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2657.2) id F5ZGPAZL; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:26:28 -0700 Message-ID: <4043D4B3.2000801@motorola.com> Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 17:26:27 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] env values missing? X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 00:29:42 -0000 I created a starpack for windows that outputs the env array to a file. The result is a blank file. If I run tclkit interactively and do a parray env it returns a list of environment variables. Should the env array be set in a starpack? Tom K. From claird@lairds.com Tue Mar 2 03:17:53 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0D56B3AE7 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:17:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXDc0MBA for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:17:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from ns.purdue.org (ns.purdue.org [206.230.5.18]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25346B3AE6 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:17:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from claird by ns.purdue.org with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1AxzTh-0003o1-00; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 21:17:49 -0500 To: starkit@equi4.com, tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Subject: Re: [Starkit] env values missing? In-Reply-To: <4043D4B3.2000801@motorola.com> Message-Id: From: Cameron Laird Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 21:17:49 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: claird@phaseit.net List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 02:17:53 -0000 > From starkit-bounces@equi4.com Mon Mar 01 19:29:47 2004 > . > . > . > I created a starpack for windows that outputs the env array to a file. > The result is a blank file. If I run tclkit interactively and > do a parray env it returns a list of environment variables. Should > the env array be set in a starpack? > . > . > . YES. While I can't make the time now to investigate this, it sure doesn't sound right to me. In the ab- sence of anyone jumping in to help, I'd recommend you push to narrow down the problem. From valery.sigalov@audiocodes.com Mon Mar 1 21:23:42 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7196AB3AE7 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:23:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XXrluZPl for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:23:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from lodmsg01.corp.audiocodes.com (bzq-179-22-133.cust.bezeqint.net [212.179.22.133]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C106AB3AE6 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:23:40 +0100 (CET) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3FFCA.B4471F64" Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:20:56 +0200 Message-ID: <9F4AA302E98BC14B924C6036FBAF7A64954278@lodmsg01.corp.audiocodes.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Starkit dependency on external dll Thread-Index: AcP/yboRlFV5jrwiTTKqA715jElt/g== From: "Valery Sigalov" To: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 11:31:50 +0100 Subject: [Starkit] Starkit dependency on external dll X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 20:23:42 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3FFCA.B4471F64 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, We ran into a problem trying to create a Starpack for our TCL extension = on Windows. Our TCL extension is implemented as dll, which have a = dependency on tcl84.dll. Is there a possibility to include a tcl84.dll = in a Starpack and to use it from there (by configuring env(PATH) = variable or some other way)?=20 We use a workaround - copying the tcl84.dll from the Starpack to the = directory that contains the Starpack, but it not seems to be a good = solution. Thank you in advance, Valery.=20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3FFCA.B4471F64 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Starkit dependency on external dll

    Hello,
    We ran into a problem trying to create a Starpack for our TCL extension = on Windows. Our TCL extension is implemented as dll, which have a = dependency on tcl84.dll. Is there a possibility to include a tcl84.dll = in a Starpack and to use it from there (by configuring env(PATH) = variable or some other way)?
    We use a workaround - copying the tcl84.dll from the Starpack to the = directory that contains the Starpack, but it not seems to be a good = solution.
                &= nbsp;           &n= bsp;   Thank you in advance, Valery.

    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3FFCA.B4471F64-- From schlenk@uni-oldenburg.de Tue Mar 2 11:45:05 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3214B3AEB for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:45:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from by localhost (amavisd-new, port ) id XX3kyeIR for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:45:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from physnet.physik.uni-oldenburg.de (physnet.physik.uni-oldenburg.de [134.106.31.103]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7700EB3AE7 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:45:03 +0100 (CET) Received: from uni-oldenburg.de (physnet.physik.uni-oldenburg.de [134.106.31.103])with ESMTP id i22AiwH1023070; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:44:59 +0100 Message-ID: <40446791.2080801@uni-oldenburg.de> Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 11:53:05 +0100 From: Michael Schlenker Organization: =?windows-1252?Q?Universit=E4t_Oldenburg?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: de-de, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Valery Sigalov Subject: Re: [Starkit] Starkit dependency on external dll References: <9F4AA302E98BC14B924C6036FBAF7A64954278@lodmsg01.corp.audiocodes.com> In-Reply-To: <9F4AA302E98BC14B924C6036FBAF7A64954278@lodmsg01.corp.audiocodes.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 10:45:05 -0000 Valery Sigalov wrote: > Hello, > We ran into a problem trying to create a Starpack for our TCL > extension on Windows. Our TCL extension is implemented as dll, which > have a dependency on tcl84.dll. Is there a possibility to include a > tcl84.dll in a Starpack and to use it from there (by configuring > env(PATH) variable or some other way)? > We use a workaround - copying the tcl84.dll from the Starpack to the > directory that contains the Starpack, but it not seems to be a good > solution. > Best way to do it would be stubsification of your .dll, so it does not depend on tcl84.dll but only on tclstub8.4.lib. If you do it you can load your dll in a starkit without problems. Look at: http://wiki.tcl.tk/stubs for some links to documentation. Michael From lvirden@cas.org Tue Mar 2 12:56:56 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4CDCB3AEB for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:56:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailhost.cas.org (srv01s4.cas.org [134.243.50.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 048A5B3AE9 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:56:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from lwv26awu.cas.org (lwv26awu [134.243.216.133]) id i22BurKX000892 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:56:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lvirden@cas.org) Received: (from lwv26@localhost)i22Buqj03812; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:56:52 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:56:52 -0500 (EST) From: "Larry W. Virden" Message-Id: <20040302065652.AAB3783@cas.org> Subject: Re: [Starkit] env values missing? In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 01 Mar 2004 17:26:27 -0700 To: Starkit mailing list X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 11:56:57 -0000 Tom, just as a sanity point: I'm using tclkit and sdx on sparc solaris: $ sdx.kit version 2004/01/08 23:51:38 11244-55184 $ sdx.kit version /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit 2003/04/02 11:45:13 37473-20079 /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit $ cat penv.tcl parray env $ sdx.kit qwrap penv.tcl 5 updates applied $ sdx.kit wrap penv.kit -runtime /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit 4 updates applied and the resulting starpack outputs the contents of env. -- Tcl - The glue of a new generation. Larry W. Virden Even if explicitly stated to the contrary, nothing in this posting should be construed as representing my employer's opinions. -><- From STEVE.COOK@NEXTIRAONE.COM Tue Mar 2 14:35:44 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC404B3AEB for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:35:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from wcsntrcsoe01.wilcom.com (wcsntrcsoe01.wilcom.com [169.206.50.124]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24EC6B3AE8 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:35:42 +0100 (CET) Received: by wcsntrcsoe01.nextiraone.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:35:39 -0600 Message-ID: <2582DD061F06D748976E651F8B1248A1095ECE@wcghoue105.wcg.williams.com> From: "Cook, Steve" To: "'starkit@equi4.com'" Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:35:52 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] re: env values missing? - wrap this code and try X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 13:35:44 -0000 Qwrap the following code, it should work on any windows platform, it will produce a file in the current working directory called envtest_results.txt that contains all the environment information contained in the env array. I tested it on Win2000. wm withdraw . proc runtest {} { set wfp [open [file join [pwd] envtest_results.txt] w] foreach {key value} [array get ::env] { puts $wfp "$key = $value" } close $wfp } if {[catch {runtest} err]} { tk_messageBox -icon error -type ok -message "Error encountered -> $err" } else { tk_messageBox -type ok -message "envtest_results.txt built" } exit From tom.krehbiel@motorola.com Tue Mar 2 16:41:22 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 974BFB3AEC for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:41:22 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92484B3AEB for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:41:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from az33exr04.mot.com (pobox4.mot.com [10.64.251.243]) by ftpbox.mot.com (Motorola/Ftpbox) with ESMTP id i22FfIao015782 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:41:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from az33exm31.corp.mot.com (az33exm31.corp.mot.com [10.64.65.145]) by az33exr04.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr04) with ESMTP id i22FfGh1024316 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:41:16 -0600 Received: from motorola.com (RNA020-02 [172.16.104.118]) by az33exm31.corp.mot.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2657.2) id F5ZGPB7C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:41:15 -0700 Message-ID: <4044AB1A.9050704@motorola.com> Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 08:41:14 -0700 From: Tom Krehbiel User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Starkit mailing list Subject: Re: [Starkit] env values missing? References: <20040302065652.AAB3783@cas.org> In-Reply-To: <20040302065652.AAB3783@cas.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 15:41:22 -0000 Larry, False alarm, my bad. I was using the parray command to dump the env array to a file. I thought the parray command "returned" the contents of the array. After reading the man page I realized that it actually prints to stdout. If I read the env array with a foreach and array names command everything looks good. Tom K. > Tom, just as a sanity point: > > I'm using tclkit and sdx on sparc solaris: > $ sdx.kit version > 2004/01/08 23:51:38 11244-55184 > $ sdx.kit version /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit > 2003/04/02 11:45:13 37473-20079 /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit > > $ cat penv.tcl > parray env > $ sdx.kit qwrap penv.tcl > 5 updates applied > $ sdx.kit wrap penv.kit -runtime /usr/tcl84/bin/tclkit > 4 updates applied > > and the resulting starpack outputs the contents of env. From makotosato2@yahoo.co.jp Thu Mar 4 05:48:55 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EE84B3AF2 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:48:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.jp.viruscheck.net (smtp3.jp.viruscheck.net [154.33.69.54]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF297B3AE6 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:48:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from scan3.jp.viruscheck.net ([154.33.69.38] helo=mail1.jp.viruscheck.net) by smtp3.jp.viruscheck.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1Aykmw-00045M-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:48:50 +0900 Received: from [203.112.30.5] (helo=yahoo.co.jp) by mail1.jp.viruscheck.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1Aykmv-0002Jv-00 for starkit@equi4.com; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:48:49 +0900 Message-ID: <4046B4DF.9060704@yahoo.co.jp> Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:47:27 +0900 From: Makoto Satoh User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; ja-JP; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: ja, en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Self-updatable Starkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 04:48:55 -0000 Hi, I'm new to Starkit. I found the description about the self-updatable Starkit on http://www.equi4.com/. For achieving it, do I just write my script to compare the timestamp of the scripts in vfs and the latest ones at somewhere on my site and if the scripts in vfs are older, replace them with the newer scripts retrieved from the site? Or is there any configuration to automate it? --makoto From steve@DigitalSmarties.com Thu Mar 4 06:03:44 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 263D4B3B0E for ; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:03:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from digitalsmarties.com (gw.digitalsmarties.com [202.72.154.181]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 20D57B3AF2 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:03:40 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 16203 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 04:51:30 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO [IPv6:::1]) (127.0.0.1) by gateway.digitalsmarties.com (127.0.0.1) with ESMTP; 04 Mar 2004 04:51:30 -0000 In-Reply-To: <4046B4DF.9060704@yahoo.co.jp> References: <4046B4DF.9060704@yahoo.co.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4A0786A9-6D99-11D8-B819-000A95C5097A@DigitalSmarties.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Steve Landers Subject: Re: [Starkit] Self-updatable Starkit Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:03:34 +0800 To: Makoto Satoh X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 05:03:44 -0000 On 04/03/2004, at 12:47 PM, Makoto Satoh wrote: > Hi, > > I'm new to Starkit. > > I found the description about the self-updatable Starkit on > http://www.equi4.com/. > > For achieving it, do I just write my script to compare the > timestamp of the scripts in vfs and the latest ones at somewhere > on my site and if the scripts in vfs are older, replace them > with the newer scripts retrieved from the site? > > Or is there any configuration to automate it? You could consider using Starsync ... have a look at this page http://www.equi4.com/papers/skpaper7_2.html for further information Steve -- Steve Landers Software Design Solutions Digital Smarties steve@DigitalSmarties.com Perth, Western Australia DigitalSmarties.com From btheado@rrohio.com Wed Mar 10 04:55:56 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B34BBB3AF2 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:55:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from email-out-01.biz.rr.com (email-out-01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.26]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B51ECB3A93 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:55:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from fep01.biz.rr.com (fep01.biz.rr.com [24.30.200.200]) i2A3tq6l019943 for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:55:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from rrohio.com ([24.92.142.47]) by fep01.biz.rr.com with ESMTP id <20040310035552.NSMP1302.fep01.biz.rr.com@rrohio.com> for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:55:52 -0500 Message-ID: <404E91C2.90404@rrohio.com> Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 22:55:46 -0500 From: Brian Theado User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit@equi4.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Mime type issue for starkits on sourceforge X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 03:55:57 -0000 FYI for anyone who distributes starkits on sourceforge. I entered the following support request last fall and it now seems to be fixed in the one instance I tried: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&atid=200001&aid=792884&group_id=1 Previously .kit extensions were being served as text/plain and now (for my project at least--http://tkoutline.sourceforge.net) they are being served as application/octet-stream. Brian From sealj@indy.raytheon.com Wed Mar 10 14:59:52 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 194A6B3AF2 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:59:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from dfw-gate4.raytheon.com (dfw-gate4.raytheon.com [199.46.199.233]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6287B3AF0 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:59:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from ds02c00.directory.ray.com (ds02c00.directory.ray.com [147.25.138.118])i2ADxZBb028635 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:59:35 -0600 (CST) Received: from ds02c00.directory.ray.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) i2ADxV8e012228 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:59:35 GMT Received: Received: from maila.ind.us.ray.com ([147.159.5.201]) i2ADxNCd012158 sender sealj@indy.raytheon.com for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:59:29 GMT Received: by maila.ind.us.ray.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 08:59:22 -0500 Message-ID: <9246F3DA68E47E4EB2AB54C9D315061D0157483C@mailb.ind.us.ray.com> From: "Seal, John J" To: "Starkit (E-mail)" Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 08:59:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C406A7.D3AEB9C8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Do starpacks cache things? X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:59:52 -0000 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C406A7.D3AEB9C8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I have an application that normally runs distributed across a large unix system (Solaris & HP-UX). I created a starpack on WinNT4 to run the code on a single machine for training purposes. Now I have a new Win2KPro laptop, and the starpack runs but behaves differently at startup. I can't recall if I've rebuilt the starpack on Win2K or not, but if I did, then I'm certain I used the same tclkit-win32.upx.exe that I used under WinNT. The first time I launched it under Win2K it behaved as expected. Every subsequent launch gives a sequence of four errors, but the app seems to work correctly after that. The title of the error window in each case is MenuWindow: matrix.exe - Bad Image and these are the four errors: The applicatoin or DLL C:\TEMP\TCL141.tmp is not a valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation diskette. The applicatoin or DLL c:\temp\TCL141.tmp is not a valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation diskette. The applicatoin or DLL C:\TEMP\TCL142.tmp is not a valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation diskette. The applicatoin or DLL c:\temp\TCL142.tmp is not a valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation diskette. The next launch complains about files numbered 14E and 14F, so it looks like it increments by 13 each time. What's going on? Is the starpack caching something between runs? Is there some cleanup I should do at exit? John Seal, Principal Software Engineer Raytheon Technical Services Company LLC 317-306-4838 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C406A7.D3AEB9C8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Do starpacks cache things?

    I have an application that normally runs distributed = across a large unix system (Solaris & HP-UX).  I created a = starpack on WinNT4 to run the code on a single machine for training = purposes.  Now I have a new Win2KPro laptop, and the starpack runs = but behaves differently at startup.  I can't recall if I've = rebuilt the starpack on Win2K or not, but if I did, then I'm certain I = used the same tclkit-win32.upx.exe that I used under WinNT.

    The first time I launched it under Win2K it behaved = as expected.  Every subsequent launch gives a sequence of four = errors, but the app seems to work correctly after that.  The title = of the error window in each case is

    MenuWindow: matrix.exe - Bad Image

    and these are the four errors:

    The applicatoin or DLL C:\TEMP\TCL141.tmp is not a = valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation = diskette.

    The applicatoin or DLL c:\temp\TCL141.tmp is not a = valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation = diskette.

    The applicatoin or DLL C:\TEMP\TCL142.tmp is not a = valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation = diskette.

    The applicatoin or DLL c:\temp\TCL142.tmp is not a = valid Windows image. Please check this against your installation = diskette.

    The next launch complains about files numbered 14E = and 14F, so it looks like it increments by 13 each time.  What's = going on?  Is the starpack caching something between runs?  = Is there some cleanup I should do at exit?

    John Seal, Principal Software Engineer
    Raytheon Technical Services Company LLC
    317-306-4838 <sealj@indy.raytheon.com>

    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C406A7.D3AEB9C8-- From lordsoth0@yahoo.com Wed Mar 10 23:01:50 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED399B3AEB for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:01:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from web13126.mail.yahoo.com (web13126.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.163]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C9990B3AE5 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:01:46 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20040310220145.92836.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [192.19.195.27] by web13126.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:01:45 PST Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:01:45 -0800 (PST) From: Jason Latshaw To: starkit@equi4.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-829534956-1078956105=:92724" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] Itk & Iwidgets X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 22:01:50 -0000 --0-829534956-1078956105=:92724 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, I am a newbie to TclKit and StarKits. I have done some reading on both and have been able to get simple Tcl/Tk scripts to wrap with not too much trouble. Before using TclKit I had built version 8.3 of Tcl/Tk on my Solaris machine with BLT, Tix, Itcl, Itk, and Iwidgets packages that I could load when I needed them. My question is how do go about getting specifically Itc3.2l, Itk3.2, and Iwidgets4.0 into TclKit or make these packages into StarKits? Thanks in advance. Jason --0-829534956-1078956105=:92724 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
    Hi, I am a newbie to TclKit and StarKits.  I have done some reading on both and have been able to get simple Tcl/Tk scripts to wrap with not too much trouble.  Before using TclKit I had built version 8.3 of Tcl/Tk on my Solaris machine with BLT, Tix, Itcl, Itk, and Iwidgets packages that I could load when I needed them.  My question is how do go about getting specifically Itc3.2l, Itk3.2, and Iwidgets4.0 into TclKit or make these packages into StarKits? 
     
    Thanks in advance.
     
    Jason
     
    --0-829534956-1078956105=:92724-- From Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com Thu Mar 11 19:35:49 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EE09B3AEB for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:35:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net (ext-ch1gw-3.online-age.net [216.34.191.37]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6584BB3AE6 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:35:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from int-ch1gw-2.online-age.net (int-ch1gw-2 [3.159.232.66]) id i2BIZfGi000795 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:35:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlef04.e2k.ad.ge.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id i2BIZeqi018350 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:35:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from cinmlvem06.e2k.ad.ge.com ([3.159.213.77]) by cinmlef04.e2k.ad.ge.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:35:39 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6541.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C40797.A636C968" Subject: RE: [Starkit] Itk & Iwidgets Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:35:38 -0500 Message-ID: <5333C1976D7E6D44BD657D77B2131BF001FC3FE5@CINMLVEM06.e2k.ad.ge.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Starkit] Itk & Iwidgets Thread-Index: AcQG62Bb6tUasUzaRO2X3hcoxk3JLwAqj8Hg From: "Schofield, Bryan (GE Transportation)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Mar 2004 18:35:39.0684 (UTC) FILETIME=[A705AE40:01C40797] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:35:49 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C40797.A636C968 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If you want these packages only in a starkit or starpack, you can simple = place them in your app's vfs lib directory: =20 yourapp.vfs/lib/BLT youapp.vfs/lib/Tix =20 and so on. =20 If you want these packages into tclkit itself, then the easies way to = do this in unwrap tclkit and stick them in tclkits vfs lib directory: tclkit.vfs/lib/... =20 Then re-wrap it. =20 Keep in mind a couple of things: * tclkit provides IncrTcl 3.3, but that may not work with IncrTk 3.2 so = you might have to explicitly require 3.2 in scripts. =20 * All compiled extensions need to be "Stubs" enabled. If I need a = compiled extension, I'll copy it from my ActiveTcl distro because they = compile everything stubs enabled as far as I can tell. =20 * If you unwrap and rewrap tclkit, or anyother starpack for that matter, = remember that the tclkit executable doing the wrapping can not be the = same file used as the runtime. What works for me is keeping a directory = of runtimes for various platforms and specifying them when building = starpacks including a duplicate of the tclkit for my development = platform. =20 ~/bin/tclkit ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-win32.exe ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-solaris-sparc ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-linux-x86 =20 > sdx wrap something -runtime ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-solaris-sparc =20 =20 Hope this helps. -- bryan =20 -----Original Message----- From: starkit-bounces@equi4.com [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On = Behalf Of Jason Latshaw Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 5:02 PM To: starkit@equi4.com Subject: [Starkit] Itk & Iwidgets Hi, I am a newbie to TclKit and StarKits. I have done some reading on = both and have been able to get simple Tcl/Tk scripts to wrap with not = too much trouble. Before using TclKit I had built version 8.3 of Tcl/Tk = on my Solaris machine with BLT, Tix, Itcl, Itk, and Iwidgets packages = that I could load when I needed them. My question is how do go about = getting specifically Itc3.2l, Itk3.2, and Iwidgets4.0 into TclKit or = make these packages into StarKits? =20 =20 Thanks in advance. =20 Jason =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C40797.A636C968 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    If you want = these packages=20 only in a starkit or starpack, you can simple place them in your app's = vfs lib=20 directory:
     
       =20 yourapp.vfs/lib/BLT
       =20 youapp.vfs/lib/Tix
     
    and so=20 on.
     
    If you want = these packages=20 into tclkit itself,  then the easies way to do this in unwrap = tclkit and=20 stick them in tclkits vfs lib directory:
      =20 tclkit.vfs/lib/...
     
    Then re-wrap=20 it.
     
    Keep in mind a = couple of=20 things:
    * tclkit = provides IncrTcl=20 3.3, but that may not work with IncrTk 3.2 so you might have to = explicitly=20 require 3.2 in scripts.
     
    * All compiled = extensions=20 need to be "Stubs" enabled. If I need a compiled extension, I'll copy it = from my=20 ActiveTcl distro because they compile everything stubs enabled as far as = I can=20 tell.
     
    * If you unwrap = and rewrap=20 tclkit, or anyother starpack for that matter, remember that the tclkit=20 executable doing the wrapping can not be the same file used as the = runtime. What=20 works for me is keeping a directory of runtimes for various platforms = and=20 specifying them when building starpacks including a duplicate of the = tclkit for=20 my development platform.
     
    ~/bin/tclkit
    ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-win32.exe
    ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-solaris-sparc
    ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-linux-x86
     
    > sdx wrap = something=20 -runtime ~/tclkit-runtimes/tclkit-solaris-sparc
     
     
    Hope this=20 helps.
    --=20 bryan
     
    -----Original Message-----
    From: = starkit-bounces@equi4.com=20 [mailto:starkit-bounces@equi4.com]On Behalf Of Jason=20 Latshaw
    Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 5:02 = PM
    To:=20 starkit@equi4.com
    Subject: [Starkit] Itk &=20 Iwidgets

    Hi, I am a newbie to TclKit and StarKits.  I have done some = reading=20 on both and have been able to get simple Tcl/Tk scripts to wrap with = not too=20 much trouble.  Before using TclKit I had built version 8.3 of = Tcl/Tk on=20 my Solaris machine with BLT, Tix, Itcl, Itk, and Iwidgets packages = that I=20 could load when I needed them.  My question is how do go about = getting=20 specifically Itc3.2l, Itk3.2, and Iwidgets4.0 into TclKit or make = these=20 packages into StarKits? 
     
    Thanks in advance.
     
    Jason
     
    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C40797.A636C968-- From techentin.robert@mayo.edu Thu Mar 11 19:52:58 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0EECB3AF3 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:52:58 +0100 (CET) Received: from mhro1.mayo.edu (mhro1.mayo.edu [129.176.212.21]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F14FB3A8B for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:52:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from sidious.mayo.edu (sidious.mayo.edu [129.176.215.130]) by mhro1.mayo.edu with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:52:37 -0600 Received: by sidious.mayo.edu with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:52:37 -0600 Message-Id: From: "Techentin, Robert W." To: Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com, starkit@equi4.com Subject: RE: [Starkit] Itk & Iwidgets Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:52:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:52:59 -0000 > If you want these packages only in a starkit or starpack, > you can simple place them in your app's vfs lib directory: > > yourapp.vfs/lib/BLT > youapp.vfs/lib/Tix This works for many extensions, but not for BLT. Unfortunately, BLT is not stubs enabled, so it won't work with tclkit. But Wojciech Kocjan created "dqkit." http://sourceforge.net/projects/nstclhttpd/ Dqkit is like tclkit on steroids. It includes tcl, tk, mk, vfs, zlib, tclx, itcl, itk, iwidgets, blt, tbcload, tclsqlite and openssl+tls. Bob -- Bob Techentin techentin.robert@mayo.edu Mayo Foundation (507) 538-5495 200 First St. SW FAX (507) 284-9171 Rochester MN, 55901 USA http://www.mayo.edu/sppdg/ From wojciech@kocjan.org Thu Mar 11 19:59:07 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E765B3AF7 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:59:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 432B2B3AF6 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:59:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B1VRk-0008GI-00; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:02:21 +0100 Message-ID: <4050B6E2.5050600@kocjan.org> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:58:42 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Techentin, Robert W." Subject: Re: [Starkit] Itk & Iwidgets References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: Bryan.Schofield@trans.ge.com cc: starkit@equi4.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:59:07 -0000 Techentin, Robert W. wrote: >> If you want these packages only in a starkit or starpack, >>you can simple place them in your app's vfs lib directory: >> >> yourapp.vfs/lib/BLT >> youapp.vfs/lib/Tix > > > This works for many extensions, but not for BLT. Unfortunately, BLT is not > stubs enabled, so it won't work with tclkit. But Wojciech Kocjan created > "dqkit." http://sourceforge.net/projects/nstclhttpd/ Dqkit is like > tclkit on steroids. It includes tcl, tk, mk, vfs, zlib, tclx, itcl, itk, > iwidgets, blt, tbcload, tclsqlite and openssl+tls. Yeah, I'll clean it up today. It's now on http://sourceforge.net/projects/dqsoftware/. I'll put 0.4 soon, when I have time to compile against 8.4.6, check if things still work ;-) and then patch Thread and put my quickhack to use Threads and VFS. Really messy, but seems not to cause errors for now :> -- WK From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Mar 12 18:52:40 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1032B3AE6 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:52:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E82CFB3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:52:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from bg18.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([80.54.178.18] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B1qtB-0008Iu-00 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:56:05 +0100 Message-ID: <4051F8F2.9020300@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:52:50 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: starkit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com Subject: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 17:52:40 -0000 Hello. Perhaps this should go to some other mailinglist, if so, tell me where to resend this. I'm working on improving TclVFS support for threads, all of this started with mk4vfs and starkits/starpacks. TclVFS has some major bugs which need to be fixed, but I'm wondering if mk4tcl allows accessing the same file from more than one 1 thread at once? Mostly read-only. -- WK From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 12 19:09:05 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1717DB3AF7 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:09:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0C43B3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:09:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) i2CHwG19020588; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:58:16 -0800 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.4.239]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id i2CHwFDu009176; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:58:15 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Wojciech Kocjan" , "starkit" Subject: RE: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:58:15 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <4051F8F2.9020300@kocjan.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:09:05 -0000 > Hello. > > Perhaps this should go to some other mailinglist, if so, tell me where > to resend this. There is a metakit mailing list which might also be interested. Mainly in the low-level thread-safety of metakit I guess. For the tclvfs etc this ML should be fine, given that tclvfs/mk4vfs is an important part of the tech underlying starkits. > I'm working on improving TclVFS support for threads, all of this started > with mk4vfs and starkits/starpacks. > > TclVFS has some major bugs which need to be fixed, but I'm wondering if > mk4tcl allows accessing the same file from more than one 1 thread at > once? Mostly read-only. I can't say anything about the thread stuff, but am interested to know the major bugs you have discovered. Are they filed in the tclvfs project on SourceForge ? -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com, a division of Sophos Tel: +1 604 484 6491 From jcw@equi4.com Fri Mar 12 19:10:15 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93FF3B3AF9 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:10:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from madder.xs4all.nl (madder.xs4all.nl [80.126.24.9]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1ACCB3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:10:13 +0100 (CET) Received: by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix, from userid 101) id 9365D83C26; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:10:11 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (biggie.equi4.local [10.0.1.4]) by madder.xs4all.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B54E583914 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:09:47 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <4051F8F2.9020300@kocjan.org> References: <4051F8F2.9020300@kocjan.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <727E7430-7450-11D8-BBB8-000A9588127E@equi4.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jean-Claude Wippler Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:09:47 +0100 To: starkit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:10:15 -0000 Wojciech Kocjan wrote: > Perhaps this should go to some other mailinglist, if so, tell me where > to resend this. It's starkit specific, so I'd think this is the right spot. The other list would be the Metakit one, see http://www.equi4.com/mailman/listinfo/metakit > I'm working on improving TclVFS support for threads, all of this > started with mk4vfs and starkits/starpacks. Great. > TclVFS has some major bugs which need to be fixed, but I'm wondering > if mk4tcl allows accessing the same file from more than one 1 thread > at once? Mostly read-only. Yes, Mk4tcl is thread-safe, also r/w. The one important detail is that the mk::open call must include the "-shared" flag to have a db handle show up in all interpreters. There is more to it though, since the mk4vfs.tcl VFS driver is plain Tcl and does more things, such as caching and running a timer to commit periodically when used r/w. So I'd say that with Mk4tcl's -shared, all the pieces are there to safely share starkits across interps, and also threads, but the mk4vfs driver was not written with such uses in mind and may require a bit fo work to make this work fully. Another idea might be to create a new VFS driver which reflects all calls to a master interp, and have that master do the actual work. Haven't thought such an approach through, though. -jcw From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Mar 12 20:03:43 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB362B3AE6 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:03:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6002B3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:03:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B1rzW-0000ds-00; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:06:42 +0100 Message-ID: <40520967.2000402@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:03:03 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:03:43 -0000 Andreas Kupries wrote: > I can't say anything about the thread stuff, but am interested to know the > major bugs you have discovered. Are they filed in the tclvfs project on > SourceForge ? 1/ thread A initializes (using thread A's interpreter) VFS to call that interpreter's Tcl code whenever init.tcl (or any other file) should be read. 2/ thread A's interpreter gets initialized, reads init.tcl and so on. Everything works great. 3/ thread A creates thread B 4/ thread B gets initialized, using *process global* VFS, therefore calling (without any proper locking and from another thread!) thread A's Tcl interpreter 5/ sometimes you get a panic about shared objects, sometimes just SEGV, sometimes no visible error (but some corruption may occur) The easiest way to see the problem is to create a VFS handler (a simple open wrapper will do), make the open command do the following: set ::threadid [thread::id] Then, for example: (assume that we have RAM: installed) set fh [open RAM:test w]; puts $fh TEST; close $fh puts "ORIGINAL THREAD ID: $::threadid" set tid [thread::create] thread::send $tid {open RAM:test r} puts "NEW THREAD ID - $::threadid" In my case this would dump: ORIGINAL THREAD ID: 1024 NEW THREAD ID - 2051 So as we can see, VFS calls interpreter created by main thread from the child thread. ps. AFAIR this bug is known for a long time, however, noone had the time to work on it. I'll work on it some more and file a bug report when I have some idea of a sensible solution. -- WK From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 12 21:01:37 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2D5FB3AE6 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:01:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 191BEB3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:01:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) i2CJwP19029262; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:58:25 -0800 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.4.239]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id i2CJwPDu000335; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:58:25 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Wojciech Kocjan" Subject: RE: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:58:25 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <40520967.2000402@kocjan.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:01:37 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Wojciech Kocjan [mailto:wojciech@kocjan.org] > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 11:03 AM > To: Andreas Kupries > Cc: starkit > Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads > > > Andreas Kupries wrote: > > I can't say anything about the thread stuff, but am interested > to know the > > major bugs you have discovered. Are they filed in the tclvfs project on > > SourceForge ? > 4/ thread B gets initialized, using *process global* VFS, therefore > calling (without any proper locking and from another thread!) thread A's > Tcl interpreter Ahhhh, ok, so tclvfs completely non-thread-safe as it is written now. I wrote a bit about reflecting a channel driver into Tcl and had the same issues. I declared them to be out-of-scope and forbidden. Luckily that is not process-global, so I can actually do that in this way. -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com, a division of Sophos Tel: +1 604 484 6491 From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Mar 12 22:48:14 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85ECDB3AE8 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:48:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EB6CB3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:48:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B1uZA-0002h0-00; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:51:41 +0100 Message-ID: <40522FDF.2060802@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:47:11 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit cc: Zoran Vasiljevic X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:48:14 -0000 Andreas Kupries wrote: >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Wojciech Kocjan [mailto:wojciech@kocjan.org] >>Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 11:03 AM >>To: Andreas Kupries >>Cc: starkit >>Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads >> >> >>Andreas Kupries wrote: >> >>>I can't say anything about the thread stuff, but am interested >> >>to know the >> >>>major bugs you have discovered. Are they filed in the tclvfs project on >>>SourceForge ? > > > > >>4/ thread B gets initialized, using *process global* VFS, therefore >>calling (without any proper locking and from another thread!) thread A's >>Tcl interpreter > > > Ahhhh, ok, so tclvfs completely non-thread-safe as it is written now. Not quite true. The problem is that tclvfs mounts should be thread-local (not bound to interpreter, since slave interpreters can use their master's vfs code). For testing purposes, I've added a simple ThreadId checking, messed around with Thread and managed to initialize a thread that uses its own tclvfs clone. As jcw advised, I added -shared in mk::open in kitInit.c. Here's the tclvfs patch. It is a hack, since it should be used as a TSD: --- vfs-1.2/generic/vfs.c Fri Mar 12 17:55:32 2004 +++ vfsorig-1.2/generic/vfs.c Thu Jun 19 20:52:42 2003 @@ -256,5 +256,4 @@ Vfs_InterpCmd interpCmd; struct VfsMount* nextMount; - Tcl_ThreadId threadId; } VfsMount; @@ -473,5 +472,4 @@ return TCL_ERROR; } - newMount->threadId = Tcl_GetCurrentThread(); strRep = Tcl_GetStringFromObj(mountPoint, &len); newMount->mountPoint = (char*) ckalloc(1+len); @@ -483,5 +481,4 @@ } - printf("AddMount: %s\n", strRep); strcpy((char*)newMount->mountPoint, strRep); newMount->interpCmd.mountCmd = mountCmd; @@ -613,5 +610,4 @@ VfsMount *mountIter; char *mountStr; - Tcl_ThreadId currentThreadId; if (pathMount == NULL) { @@ -627,9 +623,7 @@ Tcl_MutexLock(&vfsMountsMutex); - currentThreadId = Tcl_GetCurrentThread(); mountIter = listOfMounts; while (mountIter != NULL) { if (mountIter->mountLen == mountLen && - mountIter->threadId == currentThreadId && !strncmp(mountIter->mountPoint, mountStr, mountLen)) { Vfs_InterpCmd *ret = &mountIter->interpCmd; I guess that Tcl_CreateExitHandler() should be changed to some other function - perhaps Tcl_CreateThreadExitHandler()? Also, some differences in boot.tcl (when used in starkits): 1/ add [load {} Mk4tcl] and [load {} zlib] (since one cannot assume it is loaded :-) 2/ change from 'if {[info exists tcl_rcFileName]}' to 'if {![file exists [file join $noe config.tcl]]}' These two could be applied independently. -- WK From andreask@ActiveState.com Fri Mar 12 22:56:26 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35CB0B3AE8 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:56:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.ActiveState.com (gw.activestate.com [209.17.183.249]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CF17B3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:56:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3.ActiveState.com (latte.activestate.com [192.168.4.252]) i2CLsG19005185; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:54:16 -0800 (envelope-from andreask@ActiveState.com) Received: from axle (axle.activestate.com [192.168.4.239]) by smtp3.ActiveState.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id i2CLsFDu022004; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:54:15 -0800 From: "Andreas Kupries" To: "Wojciech Kocjan" Subject: RE: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:54:15 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <40522FDF.2060802@kocjan.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit cc: Zoran Vasiljevic X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:56:26 -0000 > > > >>4/ thread B gets initialized, using *process global* VFS, therefore > >>calling (without any proper locking and from another thread!) > thread A's > >>Tcl interpreter > > > > > > Ahhhh, ok, so tclvfs completely non-thread-safe as it is written now. > > Not quite true. The problem is that tclvfs mounts should be thread-local > (not bound to interpreter, since slave interpreters can use their > master's vfs code). > > For testing purposes, I've added a simple ThreadId checking, messed > around with Thread and managed to initialize a thread that uses its own > tclvfs clone. As jcw advised, I added -shared in mk::open in kitInit.c. I am not sure how good that will work out. The whole VFS core in the Tcl core might assume that filesystem mounts are process global. Vince Darley should know. Your code tries to make the tclvfs mounts thread-global IIUC. What happens in your patch if you act on a directory which was mounted by a different thread ? > Here's the tclvfs patch. It is a hack, since it should be used as a TSD: -- Andreas Kupries Developer @ http://www.ActiveState.com, a division of Sophos Tel: +1 604 484 6491 From wojciech@kocjan.org Fri Mar 12 23:24:29 2004 Return-Path: X-Original-To: starkit@equi4.com Delivered-To: starkit@equi4.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5698B3AE6 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 23:24:28 +0100 (CET) Received: from dq2.dataquest.pl (dq2.dataquest.pl [195.116.54.236]) by dizzie.triqs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6794AB3AE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 23:24:27 +0100 (CET) Received: from hesus.nowiny.net ([195.82.181.6] helo=kocjan.org) by dq2.dataquest.pl with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B1v8I-0003ET-00; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 23:27:58 +0100 Message-ID: <4052388E.4050002@kocjan.org> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 23:24:14 +0100 From: Wojciech Kocjan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; pl-PL; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031007 MultiZilla/1.6.0.0 X-Accept-Language: pl, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andreas Kupries Subject: Re: [Starkit] mk4tcl and threads References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at triqs.com cc: starkit cc: Zoran Vasiljevic X-BeenThere: starkit@equi4.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about Starkits, Starpacks, and TclKit List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 22:24:29 -0000 Andreas Kupries wrote: > I am not sure how good that will work out. The whole VFS core in the Tcl > core might assume that filesystem mounts are process global. Vince Darley > should know. Your code tries to make the tclvfs mounts thread-global IIUC. > What happens in your patch if you act on a directory which was mounted by a > different thread ? No. I never claimed that this patch alone is a good way. It solves the problem in *certain situations* (where all threads have same mountpoints). It would be much better if tclvfs would use an interpreter that is bound to current thread (hashtables on ThreadId?) and perhaps allow initialization code to be registered along with